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How to post information that is confirmable but difficult to source

The location of a radio station's transmitter was given to me by a friend with local knowledge (who asked me to make the update). I was able to confirm it on Google Maps but could not find a static source to use as a reference. The location currently on the web site (that presumably was correct at some point but no longer is) is also unsourced. I tried to update the information but my edit was reverted because it was not referenced. I tried finding the information on the FCC's web site and the radio station's but was not able to.

As noted, the information in the current page is also not referenced. What is the best way to handle this?

In addition, is there a good source for answers to questions like this or generally a guide for people, like me, with experience editing occasionally over the years but not educated about nuances or tools that might make editing easier. Jreiss17 (talk) 14:24, 23 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello, Jreiss, and welcome to the Teahouse. If the location cannot be sourced by a reliable soruce (which in this case would not need to be indepedent) then it should be removed. ColinFine (talk) 14:50, 23 May 2023 (UTC)

I am not sure. This may be a WP:BLUESKY situation that doesn't need sourcing. The coordinate location of a radio station is verifiable by anyone with a smartphone GPS who goes to the station to verify its coordinates. ~Anachronist (talk) 14:56, 23 May 2023 (UTC)

Probably stupid question. How do you know where to go to do so, if you don't already know the coordinate location of the transmitter? {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 90.199.210.77 (talk) 16:46, 23 May 2023 (UTC)

You call, or go to the radio station's physical office address and ask them where you can have a look at the transmitter, if it's in a different location than the radio station. The verifiability burden isn't much different from going to a library to look up a book. ~Anachronist (talk) 21:09, 23 May 2023 (UTC)

Oookay. Until I retired I worked for a company who carried out emergency repairs on UK mobile phone antennae (which are often mounted on masts for other things, like radio broadcasting, as well as on their own dedicated masts, or on roofs or walls of large buildings, or inside church steeples, or disguised as trees, etc.). Our company alone averaged around 100 visits a week, and we weren't the only ones in the business. A good few of those repairs were made necessary by vandalism and sabotage – stealing the cables to sell for scrap is an international criminal operation, and you might be surprised at how many people think phone/radio masts are part of a sinister government plot to infect everyone with cancer and/or Covid (yeah, really), and try to set fire to them.

While mast and other cellphone etc. antenna locations are obviously not secret, and of course within the industry we necessarily had all the information (did you know there are/were around 100,000 sites in the UK – the companies are trying to consolidate and share sites, but it's a slow process), if a random member of the public starts asking about transmitter mast locations, eyebrows might be raised and the police might want to take an interest, just in case. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 90.199.210.77 (talk) 08:41, 25 May 2023 (UTC)

If it's a problem, then we simply don't include it in the article. The geolocation of the company is more relevant than the location of the transmitter. ~Anachronist (talk) 14:24, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Biden assassination attempt article?

Somebody should create an article about the guy who crashed his U Haul truck near the White House and tried to kill the US President Joe Biden

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/05/23/us/politics/truck-crash-white-house.html

https://www.cnn.com/2023/05/23/politics/dc-uhaul-crash-charges/index.html Onion1981 (talk) 04:39, 24 May 2023 (UTC)

@Onion1981: Somebody might, if the event meets the criteria for a stand alone article (WP:NEVENT). Otherwise it may end up as part of the article on Joe Biden. RudolfRed (talk) 04:44, 24 May 2023 (UTC)

To me, it looks like a minor triviality at this point. but future coverage may justify an attempt to create an article. ~~\\

Onion1981, he talked about it, but DID he try to kill Biden? I have the impression he didn't get past the security barrier--a long way short of reaching Biden. Uporządnicki (talk) 14:25, 25 May 2023 (UTC)

He clearly attempted something, I'm pretty sure if POTUS wasn't the most guarded person in the world, he would be dead, js. Onion1981 (talk) 14:40, 25 May 2023 (UTC)

@Onion1981: I don't think it's really worth creating an article. It hasn't really received much coverage, and isn't very notable as a standalone topic. It would be best to have a sentence or two somewhere in the Joe Biden article. JML1148 (talk | contribs) 22:58, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

You know, when I first saw this, I supposed there's no article here on that guy who crashed his small plane into the White House when Clinton was president. But they I found out, there is! Uporządnicki (talk) 01:55, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

'Course, there's also one on that kid who flew a small plane from Germany, and with no permission at all, landed it right by the Kremlin. But that was pretty remarkable. Uporządnicki (talk) 01:55, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Is there any way to cite the Ethereum blockchain for historical accuracy of NFTs?

Citations of public blockchains. Snarflakes (talk) 23:23, 24 May 2023 (UTC)

No, you can't cite blockchains. You can cite other sources that discuss the blockchain. RudolfRed (talk) 23:46, 24 May 2023 (UTC)

Thanks for the response. Citing on-chain Ethereum transactions would be an excellent objective historical documentation strategy. To the powers that be here. Snarflakes (talk) 23:56, 24 May 2023 (UTC)

It would seem to me that a blockchain is merely a WP:PRIMARY source, and therefore subject to the same kind of caveats as other primary sources, but by the same token could be used for the same purposes. Tigraan^{Click here for my talk page ("private" contact)} 11:49, 25 May 2023 (UTC)

Related to what Tigraan says, any particular blockchain is just a data storage system. We may know it's harder to tamper with but that doesn't make it a WP:RELIABLESOURCE using our definitions. If, say, the New York Times, decided to start publishing work on a public blockchain, we could potentially cite and use that as a reliable source, but perhaps more discussion on-wiki would need to take place. But the vast majority of content on any blockchain is WP:PRIMARY and/or WP:SELFPUBLISHED and so is subject to those restrictions. Skynxnex (talk) 20:51, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

Thanks for the clarity. Specifically regarding NFT artwork, the date of the transaction of the deploying of the original artwork contract(intention being perhaps setting a timeline of provenance) is immutable because not only is it timestamped, but the unchangeable contract itself carries permanently blockchain coded descriptors of the artwork. Therefore that source can never be reversed on a legacy established chain like Ethereum or Bitcoin which again has never had a historical transaction reversed or changed. Snarflakes (talk) 21:02, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

Whether the data is immutable is not the point. Data published by, for example, the US Census Bureau or the US Patent Office may also be immutable, but it is still considered a primary source that in most cases requires interpretation by secondary sources before it can be used as a reference on Wikipedia. We could theoretically use data in a blockchain to support the fact that that data is indeed in the blockchain, but interpretation of what that implies as far as real world actions by real world people should be left to secondary sources. CodeTalker (talk) 01:31, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

I see, I was in fact wondering which editors would be equipped in wikipedia to actually review the blockchain to confirm the claims made. That job is left to the secondary sources in the current system. Nonetheless, I think a small team of wikipedia editors could actually do that with minimal effort, but that maybe too much responsibility/turst given to those individuals... Snarflakes (talk) 02:48, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

If what you're actually asking is creating a system where editors on Wikipedia could review primary sources and effectively create a "secondary" source that's suitable for us to cite... I'm not sure that's likely given the past history. And it'd require amending Wikipedia:No original research (which WP:PRIMARY is a part of). Which isn't impossible but seems unlikely. And I think putting it within the context of blockchains is even less likely to work since, as far as I know, the amount of information that's only on a chain that'd be worthwhile to analyze/interpret is fairly small. Is there a particular article you think would be improved by providing a reference to the Ethereum blockchain? Sometimes specifics can be helpful to clarify what you want. Something like the date of a transaction may be okay to cite per #3 in WP:PRIMARY but I'm not having an easy time thinking of when we'd want to discuss such a thing but no secondary sources mention/discuss the date. Skynxnex (talk) 00:01, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Is my Article notable? + Trouble at making the Article itself

Hello, ive written an Article for the Actor Bryan Zampella, which hes also speculated to be the next actor for the next gta game. Ive written everything but i think my grammar is bad. Ive researched so much and it was so hard to do on Mobile. I think i just need help. Anyone want to help/give advice?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bryan_Zampella Ayyyple2 (talk) 16:45, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

Hi Ayyyple2, and welcome to the Teahouse. The most important thing you need to do for this article is to include inline references: have a look at WP:Referencing for beginners to find out how to do this. You also don't need the Hacking in the 2020s navigational template, one template is usually enough. I'm reformatting the article slightly to conform with other biographies of living persons, but you will still have to place the references in the article, supporting each statement (WP:BLPRS might help in this instance).

Also remember that Wikipedia is not a crystal ball, and that Wikipedia is not a collection of product announcements and rumors.

Hope that helps! ContributeToTheWiki (talk) 17:07, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

Ayyyple2, I agree with ContributeToTheWiki. Rumors do not belong in a biography of a living person, so please remove all that speculation. Unless this person has received significant coverage in several reliable, independent sources, he is not notable. Actors who have had only minor roles are rarely notable. Cullen328 (talk) 17:24, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

I mean he did not only play minor roles Ayyyple2 (talk) 17:51, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

@Ayyyple2 In its current state, the article will not pass the review by the new page patrollers and they will draftify it or possibly reject it altogether. I urge you to move it back to draft space yourself before that happens. You seem to have a huge bunch of unused references at the end, which don't appear to belong in the article at all. Mike Turnbull (talk) 17:24, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

 Comment: Article moved to draftspace: Draft:Bryan Zampella ContributeToTheWiki (talk) 17:37, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

I did add how it is not confirmed it is him, i really tried my best. There's also : https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Alexandra_Cristina_Echavarri

But im really bad at this, sorry Ayyyple2 (talk) 17:50, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

@Ayyyple2 Looking at your Talk Page, you have a history of creating poor articles in mainspace and having them draftified by others, including myself for Draft:Alexandra Cristina Echavarri. You appear to have abandoned these drafts but gone on to create other mainspace articles on different topics. This is causing unnecessary work for other editors and you should in future always use the WP:AfC process. Mike Turnbull (talk) 19:40, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

I apologise for my behavior mike, i really am trying my best but i write all of this on my phone which can be hard, sure i have time, but im a beginner... i dont even know how to create Drafts, is my article even notable? Ayyyple2 (talk) 21:47, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

one of my modt notable articles id Francisco lugo viña molina Ayyyple2 (talk) 21:47, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

No, Draft:José de Lugo-Viña y Molina has multiple issues. As to "know how to create drafts", why don't you just click on the WP:AfC link I have already supplied and all will be revealed! Mike Turnbull (talk) 21:51, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

Oh im not talking about jose, his brother francisco https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Francisco_Lugo-Vi%C3%B1a_Molina Ayyyple2 (talk) 22:01, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

Theres also the Soybooru one, i thought this was easy... what do you recommend me doing now? Ayyyple2 (talk) 22:12, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

I agree that Draft:Francisco Lugo-Viña Molina is better: you are using the correct AfC process for that and it has already had many helpful edits from others including myself. My suggestion is that you now slow down and return to those drafts which need more work before you start anything new. Mike Turnbull (talk) 22:20, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

Thank you.. ill try to citate stuff if possible.. on phone its a bit of a mess Ayyyple2 (talk) 10:01, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Takatomi Senge

Is it normal to have subjects covered at Simple Wikipedia but not here? Can someone copy it over with attribution? Start an entry on it? I already have an extensive backlog and none of my AfC drafts are getting reviewed. It's ridiculous we don't have coverage of subjects like these and are blocking their addition. FloridaArmy (talk) 16:46, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

Hi @FloridaArmy, welcome to the Teahouse. Someone certainly could do that - you might have more slightly more luck asking at a relevant WikiProject, rather than here. There's even Draft:Takatomi Senge. I'm not sure what you mean by "blocking their addition" though, since the title isn't create-protected. 199.208.172.35 (talk) 16:51, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

@FloridaArmy It seems like you believe that your drafts are more important and should get reviewed first, which is excusable for a newcomer but you have a hundred-thousand edits? The Tips of Apmh 17:15, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

Please don't put words in my mouth User:The Tips of Apmh. I never said that. Clearly the system is broken. Clearly it shouldn't take months for notable subjects to be added. Clearly the response to people pointing out the problem shouldn't be false and aggressive personal attacks. I asked if someone can copy the existing entry over or start and entry for this subject it as I am unable to do it in a timely manner. Don't be part of the problem, be part of the solution. FloridaArmy (talk) 19:26, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

FloridaArmy Are you aware that the AFC process is voluntary?(unless you have some editing restriction or topic ban) If you are confident your drafts would survive an AFD discussion, you can certainly move them to mainspace yourself. There are thousands of drafts awating review and very few reviewers to look at them. The list of needed reviews is not a queue; reviewers pick drafts to review. 331dot (talk) 19:29, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

331dot, FloridaArmy has an editing restriction requiring the use of AfC and limiting the volume of their submissions. Cullen328 (talk) 19:46, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

Thank you for that clarification, I suspected that but hadn't checked. FloridaArmy, you are just going to have to be patient until such point when you are able to get your editing restriction lifted. 331dot (talk) 19:49, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

FloridaArmy, simple:Takatomi Senge was written by Immanuelle, who may wish to create Senge Takatomi here in en:Wikipedia. (Yes, his surname was Senge, he was Japanese, and he was born before 1868; so MoS prescribes the Japanese name order.) -- Hoary (talk) 12:00, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

@FloridaArmy I'm not territorial with topics. There is a requirement for attribution from simple english wikipedia though, but there's a template for that in talk pages. Immanuelle ❤️💚💙 (talk to the cutest Wikipedian) 18:44, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

user:Immanuelle I'm not familiar with the policies or the template involved. Would you be willing to copy it over. Of note, there is also Draft:Senge Takatomi if there's anything useful there to use. FloridaArmy (talk) 19:19, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

@FloridaArmy Here's info on the rules of translation Wikipedia:Translation. Simple english isn't really another language but it requires attribution since it is another wikipedia.

You would put this template on the talk page of the article to indicate attribution. Change it depending on the article. Just saying you took it from the simple english wikipedia article (or whatever other wikipedia) in edit history is helpful too, especially if it is unclear which parts are translated and which are original.

In the particular draft of Draft:Senge Takatomi I would be happy for your help in working on it. I haven't been working on it lately. He's a pretty notable figure and it's hard to find english language sources on him. You can read about him more in the articles Sect Shinto and Izumo-taishakyo. I'm quite surprised no movie was made about his life. He was born to an ancient line of priests, had his family shrine confiscated by the government, and his father died when he was relatively young, he was censored in numerous occasions, but managed to be an influential advocate for religious freedom, and all of this happened while Japan was industrializing, and his family shrine was only returned decades after his death in 1945. Immanuelle ❤️💚💙 (talk to the cutest Wikipedian) 19:56, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

FloridaArmy, your user page points to a long list of drafts. I looked at what appears to be the oldest one, Draft:Richard H. Wells. To be fair, this has not been submitted as a candidate for an article. It consists of two short sentences: "Richard H. Wells was a state legislator in Florida. He represented Leon County, Florida in the Florida House of Representatives from 1868 to 1872." (I don't think that anything would be lost if this were instead simply "Richard H. Wells represented Leon County, Florida in the Florida House of Representatives from 1868 to 1872.") And how did he represent it: lazily, energetically? Any significant achievements? Any praise or criticism from other politicians or the press? The draft tells us nothing whatever. It does come with a reference: "Florida's Black Politicians by Canter Brown Jr. page 148" (no italics). I infer that Wells was Black; he's starting to sound potentially interesting. This book: Its publisher, ISBN? I go to Worldcat. Looking for au:canter brown AND ti:black politicians brings ... zero. I'm glad that this draft hasn't been submitted. Please point me to one that is submitted, and I'll review it within 24 hours. -- Hoary (talk) 12:17, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

User:Hoary thanks for your response. What does au:... mean? It shows up as a bluelink but clicking on it doesn't seem to work. Googling that yields this so I'm not sure what issue you're raising? Here are my submitted drafts. FloridaArmy (talk) 12:32, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

You enter that search string in at WorldCat, not Google. au = author; ti = title. Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 12:40, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

FloridaArmy, its history will show that I've just spent some time on Draft:Mayor of Fayetteville, Arkansas. Two of the references were bare urls: I fixed one, now you fix the other. In the citation templates, we provide the name of the website, not its domain name, after website= (thus not website=nytimes.com but instead website=New York Times). I fixed one or two instances of this; now (i) you do the rest, and (ii) I go to bed. If the draft looks pretty good tomorrow morning (my time), I'll happily promote it. -- Hoary (talk) 13:09, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Can this search function somehow have an exception and be removed?

The search function I am mentioning is that when you type CS:GO into the search bar it sends you to the Czech(?) Wikipedia on the GO disambiguation page. Is there any way there could be made an exception? (on the Bulgarian Wikipedia) Thanks RadoGaming7 (talk) 19:17, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

(for those unaware of what CS:GO is)  Courtesy link: Counter-Strike: Global Offensive ContributeToTheWiki (talk) 20:00, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

@RadoGaming7 Typing "CS:GO" into the search bar of vector 22 (the current default skin on English Wikipedia) gives the Counter-Strike article as its first suggestion. If Bulgarian Wikipedia does something different, you'll have to complain there.... Mike Turnbull (talk) 20:53, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

@Michael D. Turnbull: On the other hand, if you press ↵ Enter after typing CS:GO into the search field, it will bring you to the Czech Wikipedia as described. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 22:37, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

@RadoGaming7: Exceptions are not possible. cs is the interlanguage prefix for Czech. If you enter or click CS:GO or anything else starting with cs: in any capitalization then you are taken to the Czech Wikipedia. It:Chapter Two goes to "Chapter Two" at the Italian Wikipedia instead of the article It Chapter Two. I once placed an English note linking to the English article. I don't know whether the Czech Wikipedia would allow something similar. Such a note cannot depend on which wiki a user came from. Counter-Strike: Global Offensive is an American game with an English title and the English Wikipedia is the largest so if a note is made then it should point to the English Wikipedia and not the Bulgarian. Species:The Awakening. PrimeHunter (talk) 23:39, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

I was WP:BOLD and added a link to the English page, but it seems that the local concensus is against that. Carpimaps ^{talk to me!} 08:56, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Creating a Carus Chemical Company Wikipedia page

Hello, I need help creating a Wikipedia page for the Carus Chemical Company. Can someone please help write/finish such an article? Thank You Bond000777 (talk) 04:08, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

@Bond000777: Welcome to the Teahouse. I see you've asked this exact same question at a user's talk page and a tangentially related article's talk page, as well as starting a draft on the subject. There might be a WikiProject like Wikipedia:WikiProject Disaster management where an interested editor might be willing to help out. It would help if you could secure secondary sources that are reliable (preferably three). —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 04:33, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Teahouse hosts are here primarily to advise, not to co-author. You've started a draft. Do not proceed unless you think you have at least three references. David notMD (talk) 15:17, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Can't certain kinds of letters be used as references?

I know that Wikipedia frowns on using letters as references. But what about letters written to the subject of an article from (1) a important public figure such as a country's prime minister, and (2) a noted religious leader — both held in general high esteem and respect?

Augnablik (talk) 06:08, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

@Augnablik: Welcome to the Teahouse. The reason why Wikipedia frowns on using letters as references is because they're limited in use and don't establish notability as Wikipedia defines it. The examples you've given would be primary sources due to their direct connection with the subject, and one could only state what was written in those letters; any interpretation, analysis, evaluation, etc. on the editor's part is forbidden by the no original research policy and its subsection synthesis.
In short, you can write about the contents of the letter, but not any further in what it means unless you have a secondary source that is reliable that makes such observations.
The question here is: what would your intention in using them be? —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 06:17, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello, Augnablik. If these letters written by an important public figure such as a country's prime minister and a noted religious leader — both held in general high esteem and respect are worthy of discussion on Wikipedia, then surely these letters have been studied and analyzed by historians. If so, cite the historians. If not, then these letters are not as significant as you think. It is not the job of a Wikipedia editor to decide which primary sources are important and deserving of attention. That is the job of the authors of the reliable, secondary, independent sources that we summarize. Cullen328 (talk) 07:07, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Well, no, the letters haven't been studied and analyzed by historians ... the subject of the article died fairly recently, and although he was notable in several areas, I'm not sure how likely it would be for general historians to delve into them. Historians within the areas in which he was notable, perhaps at some point.

I knew the letters might not past muster, given WP:RS, but I wasn't sure if there were exceptions and that was my question. Augnablik (talk) 16:04, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Outer Manchuria

Hey, I'm not sure where to go with this, but there's a serious issue with Outer Manchuria: that word never referred to the areas ceded by China to Russia until the Wikipedia article was created in 2004! I'm not sure what should be done now, but I see this as citogenesis. Any guidance appreciated! See also: Wiktionary's Outer Manchuria entry. Please ping me here if you have any advice for me. Geographyinitiative (talk) 06:36, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello, Geographyinitiative. Start by describing your concerns at Talk:Outer Manchuria. I agree that the article is poorly referenced, but Manchuria also describes "Outer Manchuria" as territory under Russian control along its easternmost border with China. I have no expertise with the topic. Cullen328 (talk) 06:58, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Krishna Singh Thakur

Hello, why my articles was not approved? Itsthakurrr (talk) 11:14, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

On Draft:Krishna Singh Thakur:

1. Lack of "significant coverage (not just passing mentions) about the subject in published, reliable, secondary sources that are independent of the subject". If you disagree, then please (here, in this message thread) provide links to the best three of the sources.
2. Junk such as "Krishna Singh Thakur is an emerging artist of the Indian pop music industry. He is an absolute heart throb who is destined to rule this industry in upcoming years."

If he's emerging, it may be better to wait till he has emerged. -- Hoary (talk) 11:32, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

@Itsthakurrr I see some similarity in subject surname and your user name. By chance direct or indirect connection with subject Draft:Krishna Singh Thakur then read WP:COI. Also read WP:RS there in WP:SPONSORED mentions "..Sponsored content is generally unacceptable as a source, because it is paid for by advertisers and bypasses the publication's editorial process.." For example this thePrint news (used as source in your draft article) is press release since PR is written with word ANI. (Ref). Bookku (talk) 11:40, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Note they admitted they are the subject here KylieTastic (talk) 12:05, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

@Itsthakurrr You might like to read the recently-created article Mizzy (TikToker) to discover that an article in Wikipedia is not always a good way to gain publicity Mike Turnbull (talk) 12:11, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello, Itsthakurrr. Like many people, you are mistaking Wikipedia for a platform where promotion is appropriate. Wikipedia is something completely different. Wikipedia is not interested in what the subject of an article says or wants to say about themselves, or what their associates say about them. Wikipedia is only interested in what people who have no connection with the subject, and who have not been prompted or fed information on behalf of the subject, have chosen to publish about the subject in reliable sources. ColinFine (talk) 12:17, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Oh dear, indeed: Despite his growing fame, Thakur remains grounded and believes in humility. Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 12:20, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

 Note: OP has been indefinitely blocked for not being here to build an encyclopedia. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 12:55, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Article split discussion

Hi, Can someone close these particular discussions:Talk:Bheemili Assembly constituency#Split new article, Talk:Machilipatnam Assembly constituency#Split new article and there are few others as stated here:User:456legend#Constituency splits. I don't know how to close these discussions. 456legend(talk) 13:13, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

@456legend: Welcome to the Teahouse. You're looking for closure requests. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 13:56, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

@Tenryuu Thank you for the input but unfortunately I do not understand how to request it close the discussion. I will take some more time to understand it myself. Thank you. 456legend(talk) 15:45, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Moving my own drafts to userspace

I am slightly stressed about some drafts that I don't intend to work on before the 6-month limit, namely Draft:Gino Menconi and Draft:Villa Triste. I certainly intend to work on them at some point, but they're not a priority. I usually create my drafts in userspace in order to avoid autodeletion. Am I allowed to move those two to User:Festucalex/Draft:Gino Menconi and User:Festucalex/Draft:Villa Triste respectively? To add, I know I shouldn't have created them in the first place. I was a bit of a n00b when I created them back in February. I know better now. 〜 Festucalex • talk 14:39, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

• Hi Festucalex, yes you can move them to your user area, or you can make a trivial edit to reset the 6 month clock - which I just did by fixing the links. I would say it depends on if you would appreciate help from others as when in draft they are more locatable. Cheers KylieTastic (talk) 14:49, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

  @KylieTastic: Thanks mate! 〜 Festucalex • talk 14:53, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Why do obscure topics not mean non-notable, as per guideline?

For point of reason, I searched up through essays about notability and I found this one. Notability depends on relevance, significant coverage, and where it is featured in awards. However, there are some topics, that are not well-known, but stays in that article due to this page. Plus, obscure topics are the least likely to get deleted, and salted. For example, a single page has few edits or interest a limited a number of people, but it met notability guidelines. Therefore, those articles on Wikipedia are accessible by anyone, but lack common interest. I knew that a topic has only interest to a small number of people, but why those obscure topics deserve to stay in Wikipedia, although it does not seem to be notable? Why does obscurity not mean non-notable? Would you love to explain why and elaborate? /EnjoyBrowser557 (userpage) (talk) (contributions) 15:31, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

@enjoybrowser557: the only determinant of notability is having independent, reliable sources that document the subject significantly. "obscurity" has no bearing on the notability of an article. lettherebedarklight晚安 15:40, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Further explanation: Why does obscurity not have bearing on the non-notability of an article? Wikipedia is accessible to all readers, but why do articles about obscure topics remain in online encyclopedia? /EnjoyBrowser557 (userpage) (talk) (contributions) 15:44, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Because obscurity is irrelevant. As lettherebedarklight said, obscure ≠ non-notable. Notability is the minimum standard for an article. Valereee (talk) 15:49, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

EnjoyBrowser557 obscurity is a personal judgement, what is obscure to you may be a daily topic for thousands or hundreds of thousands of people. The consensus on Wikipedia has decided that if a topic manages to show notability then it is not obscure. What do you deem not obscure? should a subject be popular and known to the mainstream public - if so that would exclude the majority of articles. KylieTastic (talk) 15:53, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

@EnjoyBrowser557 – put it this way—an article's subject may be extremely obscure, but if you dig out your sources throughly, you may find out that yes, the subject is in fact covered in multiple reliable secondary sources independent of the subject. — 3PPYB6 ^{(T / C / L)} — 16:24, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

@3PPYB6 You got it, next time we should dig in through the sources if we believe that the article based on the topic is obscure. /EnjoyBrowser557 (userpage) (talk) (contributions) 18:15, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Obscurity is irrelevant. Valereee (talk) 19:42, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

@Valereee Did not know that obscurity has nothing to do with notability guidelines, so that means that we should let the articles with limited general interest, completely accessible to professionals and future readers. /EnjoyBrowser557 (userpage) (talk) (contributions) 22:14, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Automatically change image

Is there a bot or template that will automatically change an image. For example, currently File:Neusiedler Lake satellite.png is used about 70 times on various articles, most about Lake Neusiedler. I just uploaded a much higher res satellite image of the lake at File:Lake Neusiedl.jpg. Instead of manually going in and changing all 70 images, is there a way I could do that automatically. Thanks PalauanLibertarian^🗣️ 16:17, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Instead of uploading it as an another file, you can update the original file. Carpimaps ^{talk to me!} 17:05, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

@PalauanLibertarian: I think the images are too different to overwrite the original file. They also have different source and license, and it's not possible to overwrite a png with a jpg. PrimeHunter (talk) 20:40, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

@Carpimaps@PrimeHunter I agree, so is there any way to do it without overwriting the file PalauanLibertarian^🗣️ 22:36, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

@PalauanLibertarian: I haven't tried it but see commons:Commons:GlobalReplace. PrimeHunter (talk) 22:51, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Thanks PalauanLibertarian^🗣️ 22:56, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Sub-bullets

I want to format the sub-bullets in an article differently from the main bullets. It's very confusing for readers to see black dots at both levels. But when I go to the bullet formatting, I don't see an option to do this. Am I missing something?

Below is an example in the article of what I'm talking about.

• Lyuli, in central Asian countries.
• Romanlar in Turkey, Turkish-speaking Muslim Roma in Turkey, also called Çingene or Şopar, with all subgroups, who are named after their professions, like:
  • Cambazı (acrobatics and horse trading)
  • Sünnetçi (circumciser), like a mohel

Augnablik (talk) 17:08, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello, Augnablik. If it is necessary, you can do it with HTML - see MOS:BULLETLIST. But I would urge you to consider whether the information should be presented as a list at all: see WP:PROSE. ColinFine (talk) 17:57, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

If I understand your point here, ColinFine, you mean that because the list has accompanying tex,t it would be better to make the information just plain text, unbulleted — which WP:PROSE suggested. Well, perhaps, though the list in this article is really long. It would be quite a task to unbulletize everything.

Thanks for responding to my question. Augnablik (talk) 12:12, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Help adding copyright tag to photo

Hello! I am new to the editing community and want to to contribute positive edits and updates where it is needed. I recently uploaded a file that is a more-recent image of a public figure and used an image someone photographed. In their Instagram bio, they say that their work can be used as long as credit is given. I am having trouble with finding an appropriate tag for the image, which can be found here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:SamiZayn_2022_KimberlassKick.jpg

It is the profile picture for https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sami_Zayn

Is there anybody that might be able to clarify or assist with making sure I am respecting the author's work and using this image fairly?

Thank you! Wwe wikihelper (talk) 18:08, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello, Wwe wikihelper. Simply saying "that their work can be used as long as credit is given" is not adequate. The photographer must release the image rights under an acceptable free license. Please read Wikipedia:Donating copyrighted materials for complete details. Cullen328 (talk) 18:38, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

What happened with this page and its attribution?

Yesterday I made the page Draft:Jessica Watkins (Capitol rioter) under the name Draft:Jessica Watkins (Oath Keeper) and something confusing happened and it ended up split into two pages and one Jessica Marie Watkins is in mainspace. What is the story behind this? Immanuelle ❤️💚💙 (talk to the cutest Wikipedian) 18:40, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello, Immanuelle. On 26th at 22:26 UTC, you created Draft:Jessica Watkins (Capitol rioter). Twenty hours later CT5555 created Draft:Jessica Watkins (Oath Keeper), and then five minutes later they moved it to main space as Jessica Marie Watkins, leaving their original draft behind as a redirect.

I suggest the two of you get together (perhaps on Talk:Jessica Marie Watkins) and agree how to pool your work on the article. ColinFine (talk) 18:49, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Jessica Watkins - entirely different person - has a note at top "For the Capitol rioter, see Jessica Marie Watkins". David notMD (talk) 18:52, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

I am not convinced that "rioter" is a WP:NPOV description, but I see no better wording ("Oath Keeper" is incomprehensible to someone who is not intricately familiar with contemporary US politics). Tigraan^{Click here for my talk page ("private" contact)} 12:16, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

account merge

I'm trying to merge two users on wikipedia.org.

After reading as much as I could find, it looks like I have to have someone with Bureaucracy capabilities do it for me. I am pretty sure I have this correct, assuming I need to do a merge.

I'm not even 100% sure there are two users because they are "Todd" (my first name) and "Bezenek" (my second name) and I remember seeing "Todd" in places where I now see "Bezenek", but on some old posts, I see "Todd" on the signature, so it is always possible. I did the obvious thing and searched for "User:Todd" and I find someone who is obviously not me based on their edit history that the search found.

Where do I go and/or who do I need to contact?

Thank you in advance,

Todd Todd (talk) 19:14, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

@Bezenek: Your username is Bezenec but your signature shows Todd. If User:Todd is not your account please change the your signature so it is not confused with the other one. In any case, accounts cannot be merged. Just pick one account to use and abandon the other one. Leave a note on your user page saying "This user previously edited under the account of (name)" RudolfRed (talk) 19:37, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Edited, since I read the question better. RudolfRed (talk) 19:41, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

@Bezenek: You probably entered "Todd" in the "Signature" field at Special:Preferences in 2021. It has never been your username. You can remove it to sign as your username "Bezenek". You could also enter "Todd Bezenek" to display your full name but "Todd" alone is confusing. There is a user called Todd and Special:Listusers/Todd has thousands of names starting with "Todd". PrimeHunter (talk) 20:34, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello PrimeHunter,

That's a great answer. Thank you.

I have a unique name, so if I use my full name, everyone will know everything I do. But, this is Wikipedia, and the point is to be open, so I'll use my full name.

Thank you for the suggestion. You made it easy to decide. Bezenek (talk) 06:23, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

@Bezenek: Keep in mind that if people need to ping you, they're going to use your account name, Bezenek, regardless of what you put in your signature. If you would like to change your account name to your full name, you can submit a name change request. User:Todd Bezenek doesn't seem to be in use. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 13:40, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

The page I created was declined.

The page I created was declined. Amr Ali Salem al-Bidh (talk) 21:03, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Amr Ali Salem al-Bidh You edited your user page, which is not article space or space to draft an article. You may create a draft via Articles for creation. Since you seem to be writing about yourself, please read the autobiography policy. 331dot (talk) 21:08, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Formatting question in 1979 Easter flood

Hi everyone!

Just a little while ago (10 or 15 minutes or so) made an edit to the leader of the article 1979 Easter flood. In doing so, I decided to, at the same time, try to clean up a formatting imperfection in the preceding paragraph, which is the first paragraph in the leader. I was interested to see that there is an automated mechanism that displays the translated-into-current (or the desired updated target date, anyway) dollars value (in this case, the damages of a disaster) of the thing being referenced. Unfortunately, the way that the coding for that mechanism is written into the coding for the article ends up breaking up that line of text, or at least it does on a laptop view. It makes it look like a couple of different things: 2 paragraphs (instead of one), an incomplete sentence, or at least sub-par editing. I tried doing a couple of things to try to correct that to make the paragraph display properly without the line break, but to no avail. Is there anybody who can tell me how to fix this? Please and thank you.

QuakerIlK (talk) 23:57, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello QuakerIlK! The unwanted break in the lede paragraph was caused by the placement of the Coord Template, that places geographical coordinates at the top of the page across from the article title (not displayed on mobile). According to the template documents & WP:ORDER it should have been placed at the bottom of the article, above Categories. So I moved it there & now the lede paragraph is unbroken. Hope this helps! LooksGreatInATurtleNeck (talk) 01:14, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Wow! Thank you, LooksGreatInATurtleNeck. Such a brief, simple edit I was making, yet in the process of trial-and-error and inquiry, I learn not one but two things - although I am not sure I will ever actually apply that knowledge. Just FYI (and in case anybody else is looking in), I was born and raised in Jackson, so I have a memory (faint as it may be because I was only 4) of the flood. It didn't reach our house, but our dead-end street was blocked as the adjacent street was flooded in at the next intersection, so we couldn't go anywhere for a few days, although my maternal grandparents were about as hard hit as anybody else with 5 feet of water in their house. I made it cross-referential both on its page as well as on the 1979 Red River Valley tornado outbreak page because I recently received a book on the 1979 Easter flood as part of the personal effects of a uncle of mine who died a few months ago. In reading the introduction, I was stunned to learn that both were caused by the same storm system. I had also long known about the Wichita Falls, TX tornado that was part of that outbreak because in the mid 1990s, the secretary (who was a nice lady) of the academic department I was working for, as a student worker, in North Texas told me about it. IIRC, she was from that area, although if not, it was practically local history as it was only about a 1.5 hour drive from where we both worked at the time. She described the 1.5 mile-wide multi-vortex system and its devastation and, this being before the internet had really proliferated that much, I'd never heard of such a thing. I always remembered it, and I have read up about it on the internet over the years, as well as watched the rather good documentary/documentaries about it on Youtube. So, when I discovered a few days ago that they were both connected in such a way, I was surprised and it made an impression on me. I don't know that my making this edit and making it cross-referential on both pages will serve any larger purpose, but since I was so surprised to learn of it and since I discovered that neither page made mention of the other, I thought that it wouldn't hurt to make the edit, as least from my information junkie perspective.

Cheers,

QuakerIlK (talk) 16:15, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Becoming an auto confirmed user

How do I become an auto-confirmed user after creating a new account? What features can I access after becoming an auto-confirmed user? ClimateForest35 (talk) 03:28, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

@ClimateForest35: Welcome to the Teahouse. Accounts become autoconfirmed when the account is both at least four days old and at least ten edits have been made. There's more information in the aforementioned link, but users gain the ability to move pages and edit semiprotected articles, among other features. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 03:53, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Oh, thank goodness for knowing that level. Auto-confirmed is 4 days and 10 edits. Gratias agimus tibi! ClimateForest35 (talk) 04:56, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Help

Can anyone help me with this Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Raj sahu z I didn't know that he was a blocked user. I revert only some parts of his text which seem neutral and have a reliable source. But he, again and again, reverted my every edit without any explanation. I am a newcomer so I don't know how to handle this investigation Bruhh is here (talk) 03:41, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

User:Bruhh is here is suspected of bing a sockpuppet at Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Raj sahu z and is edit warring at Jabbar Singh Sankhala and elsewhere. My advice - stop all article editing until the sock investigation is resolved. It is clear that an editor is watching all of your contributions and reverting all as being from a suspected sock. David notMD (talk) 10:32, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Alright, I will not edit until the investigation resolve. Bruhh is here (talk) 11:13, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Podcast as a reliable source

Are podcasts a reliable source? May I please cite them on articles after inserting content with discovered information? If not, explain? How can they be used wisely? 12.139.168.130 (talk) 03:45, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

This may be an unsatisfying answer, but it depends on the podcast. If you link it here, and link the article you'll get more concrete feedback. Questions to ask are:

• Is this podcast a primary or secondary source? (Primary sources are allowed but should be used differently, see: Wikipedia:Primary Secondary and Tertiary Sources)
• Are the people in the podcast regarded as experts on the subject of the article?
• Would you consider the podcast self-published? If not, who is the publisher?

Additionally, Wikipedia's policy is here: Wikipedia:Reliable sources

And you can get expert opinions on specific sources here: Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Noticeboard

And sometimes here: Wikipedia talk:Reliable sources

I hope that helps, Rjjiii (talk) 03:59, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

@Rjjiii what about ones in Apple podcast store? 12.139.168.130 (talk) 04:16, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

It still depends. Think of the Apple podcast store like a book store. If the podcast is being released by its creators, the kind of thing where you would consider a book self-published, then the next question would be are the hosts, guests, interviewees, etc. experts or primary sources related to the article. If they're neither, then the source would not be considered reliable. Rjjiii (talk) 04:43, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

I wanna point out that this IP was blocked for disruptive editing. LilianaUwU ^{(talk / contribs)} 04:51, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Looking for tools to fix harv, sfn, and bibliography citations

I am currently going through an article that uses {{harvnb}} and was in rough shape. I've stripped out a bunch of material that had inline citations to Atlantis books. I need to check if I have any short footnotes that have harvnb templates pointed to a full citation that doesn't exist, and I also need to check which full citations are no longer referenced by harvnb or {{harv}}. I feel pretty sure that I've heard other editors do this in some kind of automated way, but I don't know where to look. I don't see any tools to check this out linked from the harv, harvnb, or {{sfn}} documentation. If anybody can point me in the right direction, I would appreciate it, Rjjiii (talk) 03:52, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Answered here: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Help_talk:Citation_Style_1&diff=prev&oldid=1157533013 Rjjiii (talk) 08:17, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Why is social media very unreliable and non-credible media?

If social media, blogs, forums, wikis, and self-published websites are forbidden to cite on Wikipedia, would you give me a reason why is this unreliable? How much content are in social media altogether? Can you utilize it? 12.139.168.130 (talk) 03:54, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

TL;DR: people can just say unverifiable things on social media. LilianaUwU ^{(talk / contribs)} 03:56, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Social media allows anyone to post anything they want. For example, I can say that the Earth is flat on Twitter. However, that does not mean that is true. Reliable sources need to be correct almost all of the times. Carpimaps ^{talk to me!} 11:33, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Why are talk page not forum?

If you use it as a forum for general, it gets removed. Why is talk pages only for discussing improvements, not general forum? 12.139.168.130 (talk) 04:04, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

hi ip user! basically Wikipedia is an encyclopedia first and foremost, not the place for general discussion about a topic, there are other places to discuss about these topics. happy reading! 💜  melecie  talk - 05:17, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Why BFDI has no article?

Why did BFDI got deleted on Wikipedia and salted after multiple attempts? How did they do that? 12.139.168.130 (talk) 04:05, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

This page has some information about BFDI on Wikipedia. DanCherek (talk) 04:09, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

To summarise the essay, BFDI is no longer permitted on Wikipedia because it has been established many times by the community that it isn't notable. This is because sources relating to it are often too short or are passing mentions. Fans repeatedly recreated the article and topics relating to it, wasting the time of editors, to the point that the topic was banned entirely. JML1148 (talk | contribs) 05:02, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

This essay might be relevant as well: Wikipedia:Guidance for younger editors. CactiStaccingCrane (talk) 11:09, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

I want this IP address blocked from editting.

This is a shared IP address; and historically we've always been blocked from editting. I recently had a message that someone from this IP address has vandalised a page about gun control. My current IP address needs to be blocked from editting. 131.242.30.40 (talk) 04:14, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

You can always create an account to avoid this problem. LilianaUwU ^{(talk / contribs)} 04:15, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Previous blocks appear to have been on the < /19 IP range>, and maybe somewhere else. I do not know if there is a central report somewhere, but perhaps contacting the admins who made the previous blocks (@Tamzin() or @Drmies) in their talk pages might have more success?

– 2804:F14:80E1:6601:E08B:1D0A:20A:6132 (talk) 04:32, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Can I insert slang words into articles?

Since I want the article to have a variety of vocabulary words, are slang words acceptable on Wikipedia articles when editing? If not, why? 12.139.168.130 (talk) 04:16, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello, and welcome to the Teahouse. Slang words are not usually permitted in the prose of the article on Wikipedia, as articles must have a formal, encyclopaedic tone. However, there are exceptions, such as quotes. JML1148 (talk | contribs) 04:58, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Best name for new article name taken

I created a sandbox article User:Eagledj/Sandbox/Jeff Taylor (musician), but I couldn't move it to the mainspace. Another person had claimed the title Jeff Taylor (musician). However, the latter is not an actual article, but a redirect to 16volt. There, a "Jeff Taylor" is mentioned in a list, not Wikified. I then published my article as Jeff Taylor (musical artist), accepting a less-descriptive title with hopes of later correcting it to (musician). Will you help me resolve this please? Many thanks, Eagledj (talk) 18:39, 25 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello @Eagledj. You could make a technical move request at Wikipedia:Requested moves/Technical requests, just hit "Add a new request". The Tips of Apmh 21:33, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Hi @Eagledj! When a conflict like that happens, presuming that both musicians are very roughly the same popularity, the way we resolve it is through more specific disambiguation. It looks like both of them are multi-instrumentalists to a degree, which makes it a bit trickier. I'd perhaps go with Jeff Taylor (industrial rock musician) and Jeff Taylor (Western swing musician). Since "Jeff Taylor (musician)" and "Jeff Taylor (musical artist)" could be either, I'd redirect both of those titles (after the move) to the disambiguation page Jeff Taylor#Other. You can learn more about disambiguation at WP:DAB. Also include {{Other people}} disambiguation notes at both. Cheers, {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 21:42, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Semey Medical University

I am drafting the article about Semey Medical University. I would be thankful if someone can help in this process. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Semey_Medical_University Ruth Dahle (talk) 14:18, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Hi, Ruth Dahle and welcome to the Teahouse. Firstly, the article needs references. See WP:GOLDENRULE. Above all, though: the content should be written to reflect what is actually said in reliable sources, rather than saying what you want to say and then hunting around for references to back you up.

You may find parts of Help:Your first article useful. Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 14:42, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Thank you for reminding me of the importance of adhering to the guidelines and maintaining the integrity of the information presented. I appreciate your feedback and will ensure to incorporate appropriate references in future revisions. Ruth Dahle (talk) 14:52, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Lesser issues: there are no wikilinks to other Wikipedia articles, and we use "Sentence case" not "Title Case" for headings. Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 15:01, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

@Ruth Dahle: Welcome to the Teahouse. The draft written at this time is unsuitable to be on Wikipedia. Aside from the issues Esowteric has pointed out, it is blatantly promotional. The encyclopedia requires that articles be written from a neutral point of view; they should not praise or disparage the subject. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 16:00, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

I appreciate the suggestions and welcome further comments and inputs. Due to my busy schedule with professional work, there may be a significant delay in publishing this Wikipedia page. Consequently, I would greatly appreciate any additional assistance you can provide. Thank you in advance for your continued help. Ruth Dahle (talk) 13:20, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

I added some basic edits to the page and some edits based on some of the comments in this section. The draft will definitely need some references. There is also now an Infobox on the page, so any details to add for the university will be helpful. A good picture added to the article can be important as a quick search in Commons did not show any images available. Adam MLIS (talk) 23:17, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Thank you very much. There is a photo of the university here: https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9C%D0%B5%D0%B4%D0%B8%D1%86%D0%B8%D0%BD%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B9_%D1%83%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%B2%D0%B5%D1%80%D1%81%D0%B8%D1%82%D0%B5%D1%82_%D0%A1%D0%B5%D0%BC%D0%B5%D0%B9. How can it be used on this Wikipedia page? Ruth Dahle (talk) 13:13, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Ruth Dahle as the image is on c:commons it can be used directly here. I've added to show you. If was being used automatically in the Russian version from the Wikidata Semey Medical University (Q2324449). Cheers KylieTastic (talk) 13:16, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Thank you very much for your help. Ruth Dahle (talk) 13:22, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

I want an article to be deleted

A person from Nigeria created an article called Akorede Alli on my behalf to use it for his own gain, I am not affiliated to the article as the creator of the page wants to control the page for his own benefit. I don't want the person to create a page for me because his plan is to control me. How can this page article be deleted?. Akorede Alli (talk) 15:10, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Hi, Akorede Alli, and welcome to the Teahouse. Please look at WP:AFDHOWTO for instructions on how to nominate an article for deletion. ContributeToTheWiki (talk) 15:15, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

 Courtesy link: Akorede Alli ContributeToTheWiki (talk) 15:19, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Okay Thank you. Akorede Alli (talk) 15:28, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. The subject of an article does not generally get a say as to whether an article about them exists, no more than a subject could prevent the New York Times from writing about them. Articles can exist if the topic meets our notability criteria and it summarizes what independent reliable sources say about them. If you wish to argue that you are not notable, a deletion discussion may be started.

I'm not sure how someone can control you with an article, but if there is a behavioral issue here, please bring this up at WP:ANI. 331dot (talk) 15:17, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Hi Thank you.

I understand that an article can exist and articles can be edited on here by anyone, However when the article is been edited the creator goes back to edit it to what he did and not letting other editors add to the article, that's control and his own version doesn't fully represent the subject. As it says on wiki Articles can be edited by other editors, but he blocks others from touching the article. Akorede Alli (talk) 15:38, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

@Akorede Alli If you are the subject of the article Akorede Alli, then by policy you should not be editing it, since contrary to what you might think you do not own it. I note that between 3 and 5 May you did in fact make large additions which served to add a number of press releases in the form of external links. It is not surprising that these were removed. Subjects of articles should only suggest changes via {{edit request}}s on the Talk Page, in general. For information, the creator of the article in 2022 was Ibjaja055 but he has not edited it at all in 2023. All that being said, it is likely the article will indeed be deleted after the deletion discussion ends. Mike Turnbull (talk) 16:05, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

@Michael D. Turnbull Thank you for the clarification. It seems @Akorede Alli joined purposely to enlarge his article. However, I will advise him to read the guidelines of Wikipedia. Ibjaja055 (talk) 16:24, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

@Ibjaja055 You can't simply say why I joined, I can speak for myself. I joined to add to edit the article you created for me without contacting me,you knew my name so that means you can find me before doing it. If you you did it in good faith. The policy says the subject can't edit their own article but you knew that and I didn't. I think the first thing that would come to one's head after seeing an article that is not fully correct and can be "edited" is to make corrections so no harm in that. I am sure you'd do the same. Nobody has done anything wrong here. Is just getting the Article right that's all and since you the creator you can do that. Akorede Alli (talk) 17:00, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

I didn't know about the article to begin with, Someone called me to let me know and I called my PR here in the state because I thought he was the one who created the article, and he advised that I can create a profile and edit the article in a good faith which I did, and I should add thing about me on it. I didn't know by policy I couldn't do that, so I stopped. Thank you for spotting the creator. Akorede Alli (talk) 16:49, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

How to add a Babel

Hello, I’ve done about 15 edits, and so I don’t know much about Wikipedia. Will you please teach me how to add Babels to my user page? Thank you! Flora Tribe 612 (talk) 18:21, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Babel should give the necessary instructions.

Wikipedia:Babel

en-5This user can contribute with a professional level of English.

de-3Dieser Benutzer hat sehr gute Deutschkenntnisse.

jaこの利用者は日本語を母語としています。

---

This user can speak Japanese.

sw-2Mtumiaji huyu aweza kushiriki kwa Kiswahili cha kiwango cha wastani.

Search user languages

Basically, one types {{Babel|<!--Abbreviation of language 1-->|<!--Abbreviation of language 2-->}}. The language abbreviations (basically the ISO language codes) are followed by a hyphen and a number between 1 and 5 to indicate how fluent an editor is in that language. Not adding a hyphen and a number will lead to the template to state the editor is a native speaker, a fluent speaker, or some variation thereof. For example:

{{Babel|en-5|de-3|ja|sw-2}} would yield the results shown to the right. The Babel box is automatically aligned (floated) to the right side of the page. I hope this helps. Edward-Woodrow :) _[talk] 18:40, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Barnstar Topicon

How to I make a Topicon for my barnstar? ✠ Robertus Pius ✠ (Talk • Contribs) 19:54, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

@Orson12345, Barnstars don't generally have topicons, but you would use the {{Top icon}} template. {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 21:26, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Ok

It have link it to Wikipedia Fandroidfan2002 (talk) 21:07, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

@Fandroidfan2002 Hello, what do you need help for? The Tips of Apmh 21:18, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

unbelievably situational editing conundrums

this is the second time i come here with two questions of equal importance at once, and the second time of two that that importance is not very high

• when writing a list in a biography (like the musical instruments korn's members have been known to eat), is there any real concern with order, like keeping it alphabetical or chronological?
• can anyone leave afc comments on drafts, or just people with the ability to review and publish them?

cogsan • (give me attention) • (see my deeds) 21:35, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

@Cog-san I can answer the first. Not knowing the exact context: it would make the most sense if it was in the order it was in the original citation that supports it. The Tips of Apmh 22:16, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

@Cog-san, at the WP:Wikiproject Articles for Creation page, it states that

If you want to ask the submitter a question, or just make a comment on a submission, click the Comment option from the Review tab. Some premade templates of common responses can be found in Category:AfC comment templates.

It doesn't seem to say anything about non-reviewers placing comments. So, I'd say you have two options:

1. You can be WP:BOLD and place a comment on the submissions page. I mean, what's the worst that's going to happen? A reviewer could just revert your comment, and you don't do it again. End of story.
2. Or you could leave a comment on the draft creator's user talk page and see if they respond.

It might be helpful to have a courtesy link, or you could ask at Wp:Wikiproject Articles for Creation. Hope this helps -- ‍ ‍ Helloheart ‍ ‍ 22:34, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

they're both general questions, so i don't think examples would be really necessary

but if they're actually needed, it's for bill wurtz and salvatore ruocco (currently a draft) respectively

and thanks cogsan • (give me attention) • (see my deeds) 23:45, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Cog-san, you ask about "the musical instruments korn's members have been known to eat". Korn turns out to be a pop group. (They wear black and have long hair.) Is "eat" a typo for "play"? Anyway, the lists currently in this long article are short, so I wouldn't worry about it. How about working on the prose? It's ponderous. Random example: "Shortly prior to the release of Requiem, Davis revealed in an interview with Music Feeds that the band were already in the process of working on a follow-up studio album." How about, say, "Shortly before the release of Requiem, Davis told Music Feeds that the band were already working on another studio album"? -- Hoary (talk) 22:41, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Cog-san I see no issue with using the AfC comment template to leave a comment and have seen others do so. The main purpose of the template is it is removed automatically when articles are accepted, it adds no claim of rights or permissions etc. Regards KylieTastic (talk) 22:51, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

no, it was on purpose

just as an example of something that could be listed in an article

i know even less about korn than most pop (actually nu metal) bands, so i don't think i'll be trying to edit their article any time soon cogsan • (give me attention) • (see my deeds) 23:39, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Creating article

 Courtesy link: Draft:Virgo

Hello, I would like some assistance in creating an article please. WonderDoy (talk) 23:23, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

hi @WonderDoy and welcome to the Teahouse! what do you plan to write about? I recommend reading Notability, Reliable sources and Your first article; these contain guidelines on writing articles (namely what can have an article, what sources can be used to back up claims in an article, and actually writing an article). happy editing! 💜  melecie  talk - 23:37, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

I would like to write an article about a singer name Virgo. I am new here, so please help me with a template or layout for me to get started. WonderDoy (talk) 23:55, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

@WonderDoy: That isn't how you get started. You are indending to write the article backward; see WP:BACKWARD. What you do to get started is first see if the singer Virgo even merits an article. Does she meet any of the criteria listed in WP:MUSICBIO? If not, then it's probably too soon and you shouldn't waste further effort. If you believe she meets any of those criteria (especially the first), then you must gather all the published sources you can find about the singer Virgo. These sources must meet the criteria described in WP:Golden Rule. Directory listings, interviews, press releases, none of those matter. We need significant coverage by reliable sources that are independent of Virgo.

Only after you have gathered your sources can you even consider starting to write the article, based on what the sources say. When you're ready to start, go to WP:AFC and follow the instructions there. But don't start until you find sources. Without those, your article won't be accepted for publication on Wikipedia. ~Anachronist (talk) 02:33, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello, @WonderDoy. There seems to be an article for your subject already at Romain Virgo. The Tips of Apmh 03:07, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Reasonable Waiting Time for Feedback from Other Editors

I plan to do some edits on this article and this article that involved deleting large chunks of text. I solicited the opinions of other editors in the talk pages, but I have received no replies so far. How long is a reasonable time to wait for feedback before implementing the changes myself?

LaivineOrodrim (talk) 00:20, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

I've waited anywhere from two weeks up to one year. If I got no response, I just make the edit. If I get reverted, then that usually causes discussion, particularly if I'm deleting something and someone adds it back, because the WP:BURDEN is on the editor adding material to gain consensus for it. ~Anachronist (talk) 00:40, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

At the top of an article's talk page, you're likely to find templates advertising relevant "WikiProjects". If you get no response in a week or so, then write on the talk page of one or more of these WikiProjects, inviting people to participate in the discussion that you've started. Word the invitation in such a way that it doesn't encourage readers to start a duplicate discussion on the WikiProject talk page itself. -- Hoary (talk) 01:18, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Creating a Wikipedia Page.

Good morning from the land down under. Brisbane Australia. I am hoping to connect with someone who can help me "Create" a Wikipedia Page. If someone is keen - I will give you all the information. I have run a successful Sporting Community of some 100k of followers for some 12 plus years. Its completely self funded, and done great things. It deserves in my humble opinion, to be on Wiki. If someone is keen to help with this - please let me know. Dave KahuKiwi (talk) 01:09, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

KahuKiwi, you'd better wait till one or more people not connected with this "successful Sporting Community" will want to create an article about it, without being nudged to do so. (Why the rush?) -- Hoary (talk) 01:17, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

hi @KahuKiwi and welcome to the Teahouse! is this related to the (now-deleted for inactivity) draft Kahu the Kiwi Rugby and World Sports? I don't recommend creating articles for things you run (or are in any way affiliated with) yourself, as this is a difficult process given your connection to the subject and the many policies we have regarding conflict-of-interest editing (which you should also read), and besides, there are some reasons why you may not want one. I also strongly discourage searching for someone to write an article on your behalf, as that would then bind them to the same restrictions as you, and if you're paying for editing services, it's most likely that it would be a scam. happy editing! 💜  melecie  talk - 01:18, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

@KahuKiwi: Do you have any reliable sources that are independent of your organization that provides significant coverage of your organization? If not, then your community cannot have an article here. See Wikipedia:Golden Rule to get an understanding of the kind of sources required.

Only after you have collected multiple qualifying sources, then you can try to write an article, following the instructions at WP:AFC because that is the only venue Wikipedia offeres for people with a conflict of interest (as you clearly have) to write an article.

Nobody is going to write an article for you based on information you personally provide. We need published sources independent of your organization. Everything that appears in the article must be verifiable by those published sources.

Bear in mind that Wikipedia is not to be used for publicity purposes, ever. Increasing exposure or "getting the word out" is incompatible with Wikipedia's goals. ~Anachronist (talk) 01:21, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Jabal Sawdah

Hello I am trying to change a name of a page to correct it to the right one, not sure why it doesnt not get validated Nmahmoudi22 (talk) 03:11, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

@Nmahmoudi22 Welcome to Wikipedia! You cannot change the title because you do not have enough experience. Instead you can follow the instructions here: Wikipedia:Requested moves/Controversial. You place the template on the talk page and then change the text to what is needed. The Tips of Apmh 03:17, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Nmahmoudi22, as has been pointed out to you, you have a conflict of interest and therefore shouldn't edit the article Jabal Sawda or "move" (retitle) it. Please make any suggestion for the article on its talk page, Talk:Jabal Sawda. -- Hoary (talk) 04:55, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

The article Jabal Sawda refers to the "Soudha mountains". with a link to Al Souda, which uses the spelling "Soudah". Some consistency would be an improvement. Maproom (talk) 07:04, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Changes have been removed

Hello All,

I spent a lot of time updating changes to a page by adding the correct references based on my research. These have been removed. Can you please advice me on what to do - ignore, keep persisting (it is too time consuming to redo these) or ?

Thanks! UAAMAZ (talk) 07:21, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

 Courtesy link: Kaikhosru Shapurji Sorabji Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 07:26, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

@UAAMAZ Welcome - you should go to the talk page, discuss with the person who reverted the edits (as they said in their edit summary.) The Tips of Apmh 07:29, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Thank you for the advice. I have written to Esowteric. All best! UAAMAZ (talk) 07:32, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello, UAAMAZ, and welcome to the Teahouse. The first thing to note is that your work is not lost: it is there in the history of the article: another editor has reverted it, so you need to reach agreement with that other editor and any other editors who are concerned, but if the consensus is that some or all of your changes are improvements, then the changes are still there in the history and can easily be retrieved.

In fact, if you look at the history of the article, you will see that it was Toccata quarta who reverted your edits, with the comment Rv recent edits (due to some factual errors and consistency issues); please take to talk. So they are directly inviting you to discuss it on the talk page. (I have pinged Toccata quarta here, so they should see this discussion anyway). Please see WP:BRD for background to how this works. ColinFine (talk) 08:32, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Thanks very much ColinFine - I am new to this and am aim is to correct as many references as I can so its a relief to know that my recent edits are still there. Will have a chat with Toccata quarta. All best! UAAMAZ (talk) 08:56, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello!

I submitted a page for review over a month ago. I was wondering if someone else could also review the article and let me know if its good. Also wondering how much longer until it will be approved. Thank you Kennyod (talk) 07:58, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello, Kennyod. Draft:Clemzy was declined on 5 April 2023 and is not currently waiting for review. Your draft only has two references and both are interviews. They are not independent sources and do not contribute to notability. Your draft needs a major rewrite with much better references. Cullen328 (talk) 08:10, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello. That is not the draft I was referring too. I have submitted another one that is still under review. Kennyod (talk) 08:20, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello, Kennyod, and welcome to the Teahouse. I'm afraid that the answer to your second question is that nobody in the entire universe knows how long it will take until your draft is reviewed: reviewers, like all editors, are volunteers, and choose what they want to work on. What I can say is that leaving your references as bare URL's makes the draft much less appealing for a reviewer. When a reference is properly formatted, a reviewer can see at a glance the publisher, date, author, title, and form a likely opinion of how useful it will be as a source (that opinion might be wrong, of course, but generally it isn't). With bare URLs that's harder to do.

So what you are saying to reviewers is "I'm not going to make it easy for you to review this, but please will you review it anyway".

I've explained this in order to clarify why I strongly advise you to reformat all the citations: please see WP:REFB. ColinFine (talk) 08:37, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

There are now 21 discrete references; reformatting each of the 21 would take an unnecessary amount of your time and lead to unnecessary bulk. Instead, combine (i) ColinFine's (excellent) advice with (ii) "named references" (explained in WP:REFB). -- Hoary (talk) 08:55, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

 Courtesy link: Draft:Yung Willis ContributeToTheWiki (talk) 08:21, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Thank you very much. I will do that. Kennyod (talk) 08:56, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Kennyod, the first thing any reviewer will do is to check whether the draft establishes that the subject is notable. But none of the first four sources cited is independent of the subject. That's a discouraging start. Maproom (talk) 09:00, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Is it possible for a topic to be notable in one language version but not notable in another?

I ask because there’s a music group that fulfils WP:NMUSIC, is very popular, has reliable sources that report on it and has an article on the Japanese Wikipedia, but I’m afraid it might be rejected for being non-notable if I create an English version because of heuristics and editors not being able to verify Japanese. Zipgyros (talk) 14:19, 29 May 2023 (UTC)