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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by 216.227.90.17 (talk) at 04:21, 13 May 2022 (→BC and AD are not the correct terms: new section). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

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Good articleAlexander the Great has been listed as one of the Warfare good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.
Article milestones
DateProcessResult
January 19, 2004Refreshing brilliant proseNot kept
September 11, 2006WikiProject A-class reviewNot approved
January 25, 2007Good article nomineeNot listed
February 8, 2011Good article nomineeNot listed
December 24, 2011Good article nomineeListed
Current status: Good article

BC/AD

This article uses the Christian designations BC and AD to number years rather than BCE and CE as most other Wikipedia articles do. Would anyone object to making this change? Billfalls (talk) 04:32, 15 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I would support it, but I think you’ll find the idea is not uncontroversial. Cheers. Dumuzid (talk) 04:35, 15 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I support the change also, for the following reasons:

1. The majority of the world's population is not Christian.

2. The BCE/CE naming system was created by Christians as an alternative to BC/AD (and was later taken up by non-Christians and tolerant Christians) long before the 20th century, as may be read here: https://talesoftimesforgotten.com/2021/12/05/a-history-of-the-common-era-bce-ce-dating-system/ .

3. Jesus Christ was not born in 1 BC or 1 AD, but around 4 BC, meaning that the calendar is not accurate relative to his birth.

174.95.75.38 (talk) 21:52, 16 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia is not a platform controlled by any Christian missionary. It must be safe and unobjectionable to everyone. So I would suggest using BCE/CE in place of BC/AD. Vimaljadoun (talk) 3:41PM IST, 02 December 2021.

  • MOS:ERA raises that either BC/AD or CE/BCE are applicable so long as the use is consistent within the article. The majority of sources for Alexander use BCE/CE, so I would support this case; however, for Julius Caesar and other Roman articles, for example, the common practice is to use BC/AD, so that is most applicable there. It is a very case-by-case basis. Curbon7 (talk) 22:01, 16 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • I oppose the change. Most regular people still use BC/AD. CE/BCE is dated the same way, so the three reasons given by the anon above seem to be poor arguments Nate Hooper (talk) 17:30, 11 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • I'd say this is pedantry at its finest and absolutely no change is required. The "two" systems are one and the same, and which abbreviation is used has little to no impact anyway - people will understand what is being talked about, anyway. As with most things which can be done in different valid ways, there is no need for change so long the article is self-consistent. In this case it appears to be, so this whole section seems more to be virtue signalling than any request for a meaningful change to encyclopedic content. RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 16:02, 24 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • I support the change, as the former system is explicitly religious in nature and explicitly based on misdating. Also, as a virtue-signaling pedant, I suppose it is just my way. Cheers, all, and pray for peace. Dumuzid (talk) 16:19, 24 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Both systems are based on the same misdating, and removing the reference to religion is really more of a bowdlerism than anything else - of course, appearances are something, but fact is, the world didn't change overnight between -1 and 1, and the only difference between the "two" systems (which are, as I said, one and the same) is that one of them makes it explicit what (fictional, misdated, legendary, or however one pleases to describe) event it is referring to while the other hides it behind a bland abbreviation (which could also be taken to stand for "Christian era", if one was particularly obsessive about it). RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 16:39, 24 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Still, what would the other virtue-signaling pedants think of me if I were to recant now? I suppose I'll just have to maintain my stance nonetheless. Cheers. Dumuzid (talk) 16:42, 24 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose per NateHopper and RandomCanadian. Labeling it 'common' doesn't make Wikipedia less of a 'Christian missionary' platform since it is essentially the same convention; and calling a thing what it actually is is an inherently good principle. Avilich (talk) 17:14, 24 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 24 February 2022

Change "was a king of the ancient Greek kingdom of Macedon.[a] A member of the Argead dynasty, he was born in Pella—a city in Ancient Greece" and much more stating that he was a Greek king as it's even stated in the name of the country that he ruled over that he was a MACEDONIAN KING. 95.180.194.33 (talk) 15:42, 24 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 15:49, 24 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Picture of Bust of Alexander, again

Deedman22, I think it would help all involved if you would enunciate your reasoning for your change here rather than in edit summaries. You might even find people who agree with you. Cheers. Dumuzid (talk) 22:01, 6 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@DumuzidYes, this is an encyclopedia, not instagram. In that we are trying to be as accurate as possible with the representation of Alexander's appearance, not here to achieve aesthetic appeal. The best way to achieve accuracy is to use as bust that was created during/close to his lifetime. Two busts were created during his lifetime: the Leochares bust (previous) and the Lysippos portrayal. Both busts have historical context and are relevant i.e. are likely to be accurate in their depiction. The one you are proposing has no historical relevance whatsoever, so please explain why it should be used. Cheers. Deedman22 (talk) 22:10, 6 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Deedman, by my lights, Alexander's cultural and literary legacy form an important part of the article, and for that reason, I think it is entirely appropriate to have a piece of art representing him that comes from this tradition. I would politely ask that you stop edit warring for your preferred version. Cheers. Dumuzid (talk) 22:42, 6 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@Dumuzid Okay, great, and both busts fit that mold. though one happens to have been made closer to his lifetime and is likely to be a more accurate portrayal. Which would also make it more appropriate as the lead image. Any other busts can be put further down in the article. Cheers. Deedman22 (talk) 22:53, 6 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
On this we will have to agree to disagree, but if you achieve consensus, then so be it. Have a nice day. Dumuzid (talk) 22:55, 6 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@Dumuzid: if the cultural significance argument is favoured, the most natural portrait of Alexander is that of the Alexander Mosaic. I suggest we change for this picture, which is also a featured picture on Commons. T8612 (talk) 00:33, 7 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
T8612, assuming you mean the detail of Alexander's face, and not the whole work, for me that is largely a wash with the current picture. I would be just fine with it, but I don't know that I'd say it's an improvement. Something of a lateral move. Still, I understand and appreciate your reasoning. Cheers! Dumuzid (talk) 01:37, 7 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oh, we've had this discussion already. The arguments against changing to the "contemporary bust" are that A) there's already a depiction of such a bust lower in the article B) the image is definitively a worse image than the existing one C) whether the bust if contemporary or not does not have such a drastic effect on the "accuracy" of the portrayal (and in fact, for the lead, we're better using an image which is more recognisable, even if there are slight differences from what the most accurate depiction could be). On that last point, MOS:PERTINENCE says quite clearly that Images should look like what they are meant to illustrate, whether or not they are provably authentic. - I reckon that both images look like Alexander, due to the differences being only minor, and due to the fact that knowing how exactly Alexander looked is not possible. The second concern is MOS:IMAGEQUALITY, and on that one the existing image wins hands down. I wouldn't be opposed to the mosaic, on the same grounds: it depicts the right subject, and image quality is satisfactory. RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 00:46, 7 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 29 April 2022

In the table for Battle Record, the 8th column stating modern day country is missing an opening parentheses. Theilenman (talk) 23:14, 29 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

 Done – thank-you for pointing this out, Theilenman. Wham2001 (talk) 08:00, 30 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Place of death

I dont believe it was known as the Hellenic Empire when he passed away. The Hellenistic Empire began in 280BC 70.49.57.99 (talk) 11:17, 1 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I also have my doubts about the term, its reliability, and whether it is being anachronistically applied. Iskandar323 (talk) 11:48, 1 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Place of death 2

Parallel with the listed birthplace, a more accurate way to list his place of death would be: Babylon, Babylonia, Ancient Mesopotamia 70.49.57.99 (talk) 08:48, 2 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Or just Babylon, Persian Empire Iskandar323 (talk) 09:35, 2 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

A simple solution is just to remove the final bit (in both cases). Listing and linking "Ancient Greece" doesn't add anything; and well the other page doesn't even mention Alexander... RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 15:01, 2 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

BC and AD are not the correct terms

Everytime BC appears it should be B.C.E. and AD should appear as C.E. 216.227.90.17 (talk) 04:21, 13 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

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