User talk:Abraham, B.S./Archive 4

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Start class? What does that mean?

You recently re-evaluated the XB-70 Valkyrie article to start class. What exactly does "start" mean in this context? A multi-page article with dozens of technical references doesn't strike me as "start". Maury Markowitz (talk) 15:09, 31 October 2008 (UTC)

Since when did B class require an in-line in ever para? And then what's the difference between B and A? I think we definitely need something between "start" and "B" if "B" is going to have to meet GA. Maury Markowitz (talk) 12:35, 1 November 2008 (UTC)

Milhist coordinator

You have been mentioned here as a possible coopted Milhist coordinator. You may wish to comment :) --ROGER DAVIES talk 09:20, 3 November 2008 (UTC)

GA Review of George Julian Howell

I have reviewed George Julian Howell and placed the article On Hold until the issues raised in the GA Review have been addressed. Skinny87 (talk) 11:58, 3 November 2008 (UTC)

Hey, no problem. I don't suppose I could be cheeky and ask you to review Operation Biting, which is currently at GAN, in return? If you don't have time, then no worries. Skinny87 (talk) 10:11, 4 November 2008 (UTC)
Thanks very much for the review, cheers! Skinny87 (talk) 10:54, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

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Blair Anderson Wark

I've completed a light copyedit of the above - to be honest it didn't need much interference, although if you're eventually heading FA-wards it will - as do all articles - need more detailed attention. All the best ;) EyeSerenetalk 12:03, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

Thank you very much for the shiny - it's much appreciated! All I really meant by my comment re 'more detailed attention' was a more thorough copyedit, although there are some areas that could do with expansion. As you note though, that's tricky when everything you could find is already there (and of course we can't use primary sources too much). Peer Review might be a useful next step if you're going to take it further, but I agree that A-Class is a very prestigious standard as-is ;) All the best (and I'm sorry you decided to turn down the coordinator role at MilHist; I think you'd have done well. Maybe next time?) EyeSerenetalk 09:54, 7 November 2008 (UTC)
Thanks again. If you need a more intensive copyedit on the article, let me know, though as I said I don't think there's all that much more to do. You've become a fantastic asset both to Wikipedia and to MilHist, and it's always a pleasure to lend a hand to editors such as you. All the best, EyeSerenetalk 11:36, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

High School

I know this doesn't have any relevance to Wikipedia, I just wanted to say that its nice finding another Wikipedian about my age, as I too am in 11th grade. Well just thought I'd come around, bye for now. --CommanderWiki35 (talk) 03:19, 13 November 2008 (UTC)

The Military history WikiProject Newsletter : Issue XXXII (October 2008)

The Military history WikiProject Newsletter
Issue XXXII (October 2008)
Project news
  • Following a lengthy discussion, three new coordinators – EyeSerene, Maralia and the_ed17 - have been coopted. The purpose of the appointments is partly to fill the place left by the retirement of TomStar81 and partly to provide increased/improved coordinator capacity to cover existing coordinator absences and to help with upcoming major projects. As a reminder, coordinators are merely editors who have committed to go the extra mile for the project and that there are very few processes that require coordinator input. Specifically these are closing A-Class reviews, and endorsing two project award nominations. Any editors who wish to help with the nitty-gritty of this busy project (cross-posting A-Class review, peer review and featured article candidate alerts; responding to member questions and queries, helping with drives) are positively encouraged to do so.
  • A workshop has been set up to redesign and improve the newsletter. In our recent competition, a new name was chosen – The Bugle. All editors are welcome to participate, especially those with graphic and design skills!
  • Administrator and Milhist coordinator, Nick Dowling, has changed his user name to Nick-D.
Articles of note

New featured articles:

  1. Albert Speer
  2. Anglo-Zanzibar War
  3. Operation Epsom
  4. Operation Tractable
  5. SMS Von der Tann
  6. TAM
  7. USS Nevada (BB-36)

New featured lists:

  1. List of Knight's Cross recipients of the U-boat service
  2. List of New Zealand Land Wars Victoria Cross recipients
  3. List of Second Afghan War Victoria Cross recipients

New A-Class articles:

  1. Admiralty Islands campaign
  2. Battle of Fort Donelson
  3. Battle of Fort Henry
  4. Battle of Vigo Bay
  5. Clarence Smith Jeffries
  6. Frederick III, German Emperor
  7. Gilbert du Motier, marquis de Lafayette
  8. MS West Honaker
  9. Percy Herbert Cherry
  10. Joseph Maxwell
  11. SS Iowan
  12. Third Battle of Kharkov
  13. USS Constitution
Current proposals and discussions
  • Adoption of C-class remains firmly on the Milhist agenda with discussions approaching their fourth month of debate. More views are sought on this.
Awards and honors

To stop receiving this newsletter, or to receive it in a different format, please list yourself in the appropriate section here.

This has been an automated delivery by BrownBot (talk) 23:23, 13 November 2008 (UTC)


Barnstar-stone2-noback.png The Epic Barnstar
Awarded to Abraham, B.S. for outstanding work on Australian military figures. YellowMonkey (click here to choose Australia's next top model) 03:21, 14 November 2008 (UTC)


Nuvola apps edu languages.svg
Hello, Abraham, B.S.. You have new messages at Backslash Forwardslash's talk page.
You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

Andrew McNaughton Assessment

I was wondering what I should do to make this article better, especially "Referencing and citation" and "Coverage and accuracy". TARTARUS talk 04:24, 15 November 2008 (UTC)

Lionel Dorling

I have no desire to get into an edit war with you but I believe that you are fundamentally wrong on this one, the combination of a CB, CMG and a DSO is by no means given to hundreds as you state. The DSO is an award for bravery as I am sure you are aware whereas the CB holder must be of the rank of Lieutenant Commander, Major or Squadron Leader, and in addition must have been mentioned in despatches for distinction in a command position in a combat situation. The CMG is used to honour individuals who have rendered important services in relation to Commonwealth or foreign nations. People are appointed to the Order rather than awarded it. I entirely agree that we cannot have an article on every Colonel but this individual is very different.Paste (talk) 09:25, 17 November 2008 (UTC)

    • It would seem that you feel rather more strongly about this than I do, we'll leave it with you. Regards Paste (talk) 11:00, 17 November 2008 (UTC)

Colin Hannah

Hi Bryce, I'm ready to put this one next on my list for improvements with pics, citations and additional sources (meaning I may do a fair bit of rephrasing to what's already there). Since you've done most of the work on it so far, as a courtesy I thought I'd just check you didn't have any further plans for it yourself. Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 10:58, 17 November 2008 (UTC)


Original Barnstar.png The Original Barnstar
I just wanted to thank you for the guidance, support, and consistent efforts in improving the Bruce Kingsbury article. \ / () 10:47, 19 November 2008 (UTC)
No worries - there are lots of interesting side facts I've found in working on the article, the Kokoda trail in just an amazing topic in general. If you are looking for a book, The Silent Men by Peter Dornan is a great read. Not only tells the story of Kingsbury and Avery but of the entire section. \ / () 20:07, 19 November 2008 (UTC)

Frank Hubert McNamara‎ & William Ellis Newton

Hi mate, did you have any special plans for these articles in the near future, given your interest in VCs?! I was going to take a little breather from Chiefs of the Air Staff and get these guys to B/GA class some time in the next month or so... Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 09:25, 5 December 2008 (UTC)

The Military history WikiProject Newsletter : Issue XXXIII (November 2008)

The Military history WikiProject Newsletter: The Bugle
Issue XXXIII (November 2008)
Project news
Articles of note

New featured articles:

  1. Battle of Lipantitlán
  2. Battle of Khafji
  3. Richard Williams (RAAF officer)
  4. Tom Crean
  5. Third Battle of Kharkov
  6. SS Mauna Loa
  7. SS Montanan
  8. SS Ohioan (1914)
  9. USS Constitution

New featured lists:

  1. List of Knight's Cross recipients of the Schnellboot service

New A-Class articles:

  1. 13th Airborne Division (United States)
  2. Alaska class battlecruiser
  3. Edmund Herring
  4. Revolt of the Comuneros
  5. Rheinmetall 120 mm gun
  6. SS Black Osprey
  7. Stanley Goble
  8. Tanks in the Spanish Army
Current proposals and discussions
  • Adoption of C-class remains firmly on the Milhist agenda with discussions approaching their fifth month of debate. More views are sought on this.
  • What is a Pyrrhic victory? There's an interesting and lively discussion on this here. (And the short answer is: follow what the sources say.)
  • Can you design logos? We're looking for a snappy new logo to go with the new title of the newsletter. See the ideas so far at the newsletter workshop.
Awards and honors

To stop receiving this newsletter, or to receive it in a different format, please list yourself in the appropriate section here.

This has been an automated delivery by BrownBot (talk) 15:50, 6 December 2008 (UTC)

200 GAs for WP Australia

Hi Bryce. WP Australia is now within striking range of 200 GAs. Last year we had 82 GAs at the start of December and managed to rattle off 24 in one month and got the century up by the end of the year. This year we are again in striking range with 178 GAs, so we are trying at WP:AWNB to strive for 200 by the end of the year or Australia Day. Well, seeing as you have been heaps active recently with the ADF bios, I guess, you would be a trump card in the drive. I hope you join us. YellowMonkey (bananabucket) 01:43, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

Military career of Keith Miller photographs

Hi YellowMonkey, I was having a browze through through the above article you nominated for GA, and was woundering if the Australian War Memorial online collections database had any photos of Miller during the Second World War. Sure enough, I found a few after a bit of a search and thought that you might be interested. The ID numbers are:

  • SUK14661
  • P02218.001
  • UK2968
  • UK2970
  • SUK14459
  • SUK14491
  • SUK14519
  • SUK14520
  • SUK14525
  • SUK14643
  • SUK14645
  • SUK14649
  • SUK14650
  • P02218.004
  • SUK14375
  • SUK14529
  • SUK11623

Well, I hope you find this interesting and/or perhaps helpful. Cheers, Abraham, B.S. (talk) 11:11, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

P.S. the AWM also has an brief article on Miller here. Abraham, B.S. (talk) 11:11, 12 December 2008 (UTC)
Ah thanks, did you spot any oddities about the military stuff that might seem a bit suspicious. The author of that book is very sloppy so I had to fix up some of the cricket info data. Unfortunately, the UK photos go under the 70-year rule so we can't use any of them. YellowMonkey (bananabucket) 04:05, 15 December 2008 (UTC)
I havn't had a good read of the prose, but I bet the information should be fine. Also, it was my understanding that any photo contained in the Australian War Memorial collections would come under either A or E of PD Australia if they were produced before the appropiate dates. If so, the above images should be fine. Cheers, Abraham, B.S. (talk) 05:01, 15 December 2008 (UTC)
Well, yeah, for photos in Australia, then it would be ok if it was pre-1955 regardless, but I thought photos taken in England were 70 years after the photographer died. Or is there some loophole somehwere? The photos are basically all from the Victory Test in England in 1945 or his air base in the UK. YellowMonkey (bananabucket) 05:19, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Heinrich Bär

Thanks for your constructive feedback. Please note that I am not a native English speaking person. Having, said that I encourage/ask you to make possible correction directly in the article. Again thanks for helping out here. 08:13, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for your offer! I made some changes to the early part of his career as well as his after the war life. I would appreciate if you gave the article a thorough rub down in these areas. MisterBee1966 (talk) 09:03, 15 December 2008 (UTC)
I think that the majority of the issues have been addressed. Could you please have another look and let me know what you think now? ThanksMisterBee1966 (talk) 03:36, 16 December 2008 (UTC)
I think I fixed the sentence. Thanks for all your help on this. MisterBee1966 (talk) 13:27, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

WikiProject Australia newsletter, December 2008

The December 2008 issue of the WikiProject Australia newsletter has been published. You may read the newsletter, change the format in which future issues will be delivered to you, or unsubscribe from this notification by following the link. This message was delivered by TinucherianBot (talk) 06:57, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

Pedler Palmer

Hi -

I have noted your interest in Australian Mil history by your edits to James_Ramsay_(Australian_governor). I am interested in that article also.

More that that - have a look at Pedlar Palmer, I have both the books listed as references and he was quite a gent. Departed Sydney at about your age on a sailing ship for ports all over the world. If you can improve this article --- it would be great. He was quite an Australian - who nearly died fighting for the Brits!. I can tell you a lot about him but documenting it (except by his own books) will be harder.

Regards, Ariconte (talk) 04:13, 19 December 2008 (UTC)


Hi there, sorry for that, yesterday evening I had to leave unexpectedly, so I wasn't able to complete the closure of that ACR. Thanks for dealing with it! I'll have look and see if everything's done properly. Cheers, --Eurocopter (talk) 12:25, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

Re ce request

No problems, always a pleasure. I'll add it to the list (just when I thought I was getting through it too!) EyeSerenetalk 09:59, 22 December 2008 (UTC)

Peer Review of Walter Oesau

Hello There!

I appreciate you taking time out to comment on this article. I have incorporated all the review points you had mentioned. So if you were planning on going over it again you may do so. I know I could take it through B class. But importantly what I'd like to know is, given its current material, will it pass the muster of GA-3 (Broad in its coverage) at all. I know I severely lack personal information, but does Wikipedia mandates such information for GA-3 Criteria ? Please let me know. Thanks once again. Perseus71 (talk) 20:24, 22 December 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for the clarification. I am afraid, there's a lot of personal information out there that I can't quote for lack of Primary references. Likewise I am told there are primary references that I don't have access to. I believe as to the professional information, that's all there is out there that I could see. So the question then becomes, based on the professional information given in the article, what are its chances of passing the GA-3 criteria ? Appreciate your time. Thanks Perseus71 (talk) 14:26, 23 December 2008 (UTC)
Now you see my sore Point! I for the life of me was not able to find even that! Its something to do with his flying style. That's all I know. :( Appreciate your time though. Perseus71 (talk) 02:07, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Military Biography

I stumbled across Richard Nelson Gale and noted it's appalling state, and though I'm doing a few articles at the moment I thought I'd stretch myself even further and add more to my workload! When I thought 'Military Biography', I naturally thought of you and your fine work. So, can you help me - what's a good structure for a military biography? Skinny87 (talk) 19:26, 23 December 2008 (UTC)


Well done.
Meanwhile, Merry Xmas, and wishing you a Happy New Year, and Best Wishes for a successful and minimum-stress Year 12.
(My eldest daughter has just survived it with no noticable permanent ill-effects.)
Have you some ideas on what you want to do at Uni? Which Uni? Cheers, Pdfpdf (talk) 14:49, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

Hi Pdf, thank you for the very kind comments. Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to you as well. I have a few ideas at what uni I would like to attend, but I have already decided on a Bachelor of Arts degree in modern history. Cheers, Abraham, B.S. (talk) 23:00, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

I can not express any surprise that you are planning a Bachelor of Arts degree in modern history ;-) I expect that you would thoroughly enjoy it and do very well.
Good luck with Year 12! Cheers, Pdfpdf (talk) 04:01, 31 December 2008 (UTC)


Hey there hows it going. I noticed you have changed a few articles infoboxes to reflect United States of America vice United States|United States of America. Is there a reason why you are doing that. It is creating unecessary redirects. Also, when using AWB to look at a group of articles its easier to look at United States, rather than try and determine all of the different possible combinations of the US. (I.e. US, USA, United States, United States of America, etc).--Kumioko (talk) 20:06, 30 December 2008 (UTC)

Thank you for the comments and I know of the rule you pointed out however that rule has existed since WP had only a few thousand pages and way before the creation of AWB. Although I understand that it seems unnecessary, there are couple reasons why I do it. 1) To provide standardization to the articles, 2) to make it easier to pull in a group of articles as mentioned above. To illustrate this better here is a breakdown of some of the common ones I have found.
  • over 25000 articles that link to United States
  • 16708 to United States of America
  • over 25000 to USA
  • 2565 to US
  • 4106 to U.S.
  • 1434 to U.S.A

so when we that use AWB or some other application want to scan through these we have to try and guess at all the combinations. Therefore making it say United States makes much more sense.-Kumioko (talk)

Happy New Year!

MisterBee1966 (talk) 16:15, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

It's still last year here - just. Pdfpdf (talk) 13:31, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

Oh. No it isn't. Pdfpdf (talk) 13:32, 31 December 2008 (UTC)