Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2007 September 24

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
Help desk
< September 23 << Aug | September | Oct >> September 25 >
Welcome to the Wikipedia Help Desk Archives
The page you are currently viewing is an archive page. While you can leave answers for any questions shown below, please ask new questions on one of the current Help Desk pages.

September 24[edit]

renaming 'edit this page' tab via user scripts[edit]

I would like change the text of the 'edit this page' tab to simply 'edit'. I know I can do this through User scripts, but I'm not exactly sure how. I know it would be something along the lines of: ca-edit.innerHTML = 'edit'; but this does not work. What am I doing wrong? - SigmaEpsilonΣΕ 02:06, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

I experimented around myself and found that this code:
addOnloadHook( function (){
    var edit_tab = document.getElementById('ca-edit');
    var talk_tab = document.getElementById('ca-talk');
    edit_tab.firstChild.innerHTML= 'edit';
    talk_tab.firstChild.innerHTML= 'talk';
does the trick. (I also renamed 'discussion' to 'talk'.) - SigmaEpsilonΣΕ 03:30, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
I'd suggest a slightly more cautious approach:
addOnloadHook( function (){
    var edit_tab = document.getElementById('ca-edit');
    var talk_tab = document.getElementById('ca-talk');
    if (edit_tab) edit_tab.firstChild.innerHTML = 'edit';
    if (talk_tab) talk_tab.firstChild.innerHTML = 'talk';
That way, you won't get JavaScript errors (which can prevent other scripts on the page from running normally) on pages that don't have those tabs (such as Special: pages). —Ilmari Karonen (talk) 18:18, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Oh. Good idea. Thanks. - SigmaEpsilonΣΕ 23:22, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

registration required - need to notify?[edit]

I need to cite a website where registration is required to read the information. This is the only place the information is avaliable. Is it necessary to notify readers that the site requires registration? I'm asking because my personal preference is to be made aware if I need to register, 'cos then I don't click the link. So using the {{citeweb}} template, how would I include that note? -- Matthew Edwards | talk | Contribs 02:44, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Well, I don't know if it conforms to the MoS, but you could always do something like this: [1]

  1. ^ A whole lot (September 24, 2007). "Wikipedia". Note: Requires registration. Retrieved September 24, 2007. 

Or any variation thereof, but I don't think it's necessary. Into The Fray T/C 03:25, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Thankyou. I agree it's not necessary, but it's just nice to be forewarned, I feel. :) -- Matthew Edwards | talk | Contribs 03:59, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Deleted Mayflower Compact line - not sure if I did it correctly.[edit]

There was inappropriate/irrelevant use of language on the site for the Mayflower Compact. Since I have assigned my students to study this document, I tried to edit it by deleting that line. I don't know if I edited it correctly. Also, after I deleted it, I noticed that my info might be availabe to anyone. Is it? If so, can you delete my home info?


Meredith —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 03:02, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Hmm. I'm not sure what you mean. There has apparently been a lot of recently vandalism to Mayflower Compact but, beyond that, I couldn't find any edits by a username approaching Meredith, nor any from your IP (or one close to it) in the past couple days. Can you elaborate on what information you feel that your edit contained? Into The Fray T/C 03:19, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia Toolbar?[edit]

Are there any plans of creating a Wikipedia Toolbar (like the Google or MSN or Yahoo Toolbar)? 03:08, 24 September 2007 (UTC).

There's some Wikipedia-related software at -- this [1] for instance. Into The Fray T/C 03:12, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Though, really, most of what's there seems to be written for now largely obsolete versions of the popular web browsers. If you're running a current version of IE or Firefox, you can always alter the default search bar in order to use/add Wikipedia as your default/secondary search engine. Into The Fray T/C 03:14, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
There's a Windows Vista gadget that allows you to search WP. Now if there was an RC gadget... Marlith T/C 04:14, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

High School Application Volunteer[edit]

I am going into High School and writing applications. Would it be appropiate to list the countless hours I have spent on Wikipedia as volunteer work? If so, how could it be proven? Marlith T/C 04:13, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Not really. Although you are a volunteer working to improve Wikipedia, I can't imagine a school treating it on the same level as other forms of community service, such as working at the library, or participating in a trash cleanup on a beach. I would think they would criticize you for staring at a screen more than doing the aforementioned activities, but then again, that's my viewpoint. If you really are intent on doing this, then you can prove it via using a edit counter. Interiot's edit counter is one of the more popular ones. Insert your user name and it will display the number of edits you have made, to which mainspace, and the articles that you have edited the most. Print that out for proof I guess (seeing as you can input any user's name in there, it isn't exactly a reliable source). Sephiroth BCR (Converse) 04:19, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
If we line up all Wikipedians end to end, we'd probably all point in different directions, and the direction I point is the diametrical opposite of any school which would disparage editing on Wikipedia. If I were the Supreme Commander/Big Kahuna/Grand Mufti of the Known Universe, I would not only encourage editing on Wikipedia by students, I would mandate it (although for completeness, I would generalize this to include editing on other wikis which accept a wider range of content, such as original work and local interests). Face it, if we send generations of kids to pick up trash on beaches, we will still have trash on beaches in the future, so what did that accomplish? At best, we would just be running in place. With wikis, we can create entirely new forms of value, and prepare the next generation to face the extreme challenges that await them - challenges their parents seem barely able to comprehend. When petroleum runs low, business as usual simply isn't going to cut it. Today's kids desperately need to learn how to create value without having to drag so many human brains back and forth every day just to move information (drive to work, sit in front of computer, go to meetings, shuffle paper, drive home, next day: repeat). Transportation in the United States consumes about a third of our energy, but unlike the other energy-consuming sectors, transportation is extremely dependent on petroleum, an increasing fraction of which has to be imported from showcases of stability and gratitude such as Iraq. But even military conquest can't put more oil in the ground. With Hubbert's curve making transportation steadily more expensive (in every way), and Moore's law making telecommunication steadily less expensive (also in every way), the priority now must be to substitute telecommunication for transportation everywhere possible. Telecommuting has struggled for years to become a serious contender, but here comes Wikipedia almost out of nowhere with a formula that actually works. Millions of perfect strangers have managed to generate a product of value and complexity rivaling perhaps anything coming out of the corporate world. That is to say, if we can build this without having to put on suits and waste gasoline and travel time or kill people on highways in the process, what couldn't be built this way? Of course I am aware of the extreme irony that the Founder of Wikipedia loves to jet around the world. But the jetting around is irrelevant to the vast bulk of the actual work of building the encyclopedia.
What a student will learn by editing on Wikipedia will probably be more valuable and relevant in his or her career than anything else they teach in high school. It borders on tragedy that more teachers haven't learned enough wiki editing to grasp this.
Of course, students who edit on Wikipedia will (or should) learn that Wikipedia is not a soapbox, so I would ask anyone who feels offended by the above soapboxing to simply revert your personal memory of having read it. So anyway, Marlith, if you run into resistance from your educators about recognizing the value of your Wikipedia contributions, and you need someone to present irrefutable arguments on your behalf, perhaps in a manner just slightly over the top (but really, can we overstate the importance of the collapse of civilization? And a touch of gallows humor never killed anyone), just leave a note on my talk page. --Teratornis 05:21, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Adding/editing message[edit]

I opened an account tonight and tried to leave a message for user name "geology guy". My user name is Maugham7. My message is at the bottom of his page and appeared as an edit to someone elses message, and was too wide to fit into the format. I can't find any edit tools to correct the width or make a seperate topic. Maugham7 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Maugham7 (talkcontribs) 04:30, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

I've made the required edit to User talk:Geologyguy. The problem was that you used a couple of space-bands (spaces) at the beginning of each paragraph. As a general rule, if you start each paragraph without those spaces (flush left), your paragraph will be formatted correctly. If you wish to indent the entire paragraph, start it with a colon (:). If you wish to create a bulleted list, begin your paragraphs with an asterisk (*). I hope this helps. If there's something further you need help with, you can leave a message here or on my talk page. Accounting4Taste 04:38, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
I've also rearranged the material you wrote on that talk page so that it forms a separate section with a heading, as you requested. If you are on a talk page, you can use the "Post a comment" link at the left of the page and it will create two boxes, one above the other -- the box on top will automatically be formatted as a heading, or a "new topic", and the box below will be correctly formatted as text.
If you'd like a way to test this and other types of formatting, you can follow the link [[2]] and create a sub-page off your own user page called a "sandbox", following the directions there. A sandbox is a page where you can experiment with the appearance of things you type, and you won't be bothering anyone. I'm going to start your talk page off with a welcome message that will get you started with some useful Wikipedia tools. If there's anything further you need, you can leave a message here or on my talk page. Accounting4Taste 04:47, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Thank you, you have been most helpful. Maugham7 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Maugham7 (talkcontribs) 04:50, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

You may want to bookmark the cheat sheet which lists the most common editing commands, which we call wikitext markup. Wikitext markup is purposely compact, to maximize editing speed by experienced users, but to gain this compactness requires making things like leading spaces part of the formatting commands. This has the unfortunate side effect of tripping up some new users, but most people can learn enough in a few hours to edit productively. For more information on the formatting problem you ran into, see: Help:Wikitext examples#Just show what I typed. --Teratornis 05:53, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Heruka article question[edit]

Heruka comes from the words, "hey!" and "-ruka"?

If you read this edit followed by the next one, you'll know what I mean. The first edit seems ridiculous and both this one and the second edit (by the same IP address) is unsourced, but after others' contributions, it now has links and now has its own section. Any suggestions? --JDitto 04:31, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

It seems the vandalism to that page has already been reverted. Further, since that IP ( has been on a vandal spree lately, I'll report it to Administrator intervention against vandalism. In the future, you can take this sort of thing there directly. Best, --Bfigura (talk) 05:14, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Say what?? It wasn't changed! It still says,

The name "Heruka" is made up of the prefix "he-" meaning "hey!" and "ruka", a rich term implying many levels of subtle meaning...

at the first section. I've refreshed it several times to even make sure. --JDitto 04:11, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

Page deleted?[edit]

Gah! My page was deleted "california_akia" before I even had a chance to do anything with it!

It seems that the article was deleted by an administrator, who cited the extremely short nature of the article and the fact that you were the only contributor for his deletion reasoning. If you wish to recreate the page, then I would recommend working on it by making a page in your user space (see WP:USER#How do I create a user subpage?), and then moving that article into the main space. Sephiroth BCR (Converse) 06:44, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
There's also an {{underconstruction}} tag. --h2g2bob (talk) 10:27, 24 September 2007 (UTC)


Please visit Talk:Autism for the question please, I can't seem to have this page working well, thank you. Ishad Lamar Jackson —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 08:19, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

I've visited Talk:Autism and can't see your name or your IP number there, and I've looked at the Autism article and can't see any formatting problems. Could you please be more specific about what it is you want to do, and make a specific reference to a specific section of the talk page that contains your question? Accounting4Taste 14:53, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Original research[edit]

I might have the chance to personally interview someone, but I have nowhere to publish this information. I'm assuming that interviewing someone about something they've experienced counts as original research. However, I'd have to say that the information is correct unless the person lies to me. So, my question is, if I get an interview with this person and then publish it somewhere, perhaps on a personal website or something, does that count as a reliable source? If it's not, what could I do to make it a reliable source? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Davidovic (talkcontribs) 12:40, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

It's still Original Research to interview the person. To make it acceptable here, the information derived has to be published in a reliable source publication, of the kind which does its own fact-checking (people do lie to interviewers). A blog or personal website would not qualify.--Orange Mike 14:21, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
I have two observations:
  • There are many other wikis which accept original research, for example WikInfo. Also check WikiIndex for wikis that specialize in the topic area of your interview subject's interests.
  • Given all the ideas that have been published so far, on so many topics, it's difficult for anyone to be entirely original. There's a good chance your interview subject's ideas have been published before, in whole or part; perhaps your subject is not fully aware of the extent of the relevant literature. After you publish the interview on another (hospitable) wiki, you might search for published sources for your subject's "original" work. If Wikipedia does not already have article(s) about those ideas, you might try to create them (bearing in mind the high risk that new articles by new contributors may end up getting deleted). If your interview subject is not notable enough to have been written about already (the person in addition to the ideas), you might have a better chance of writing an article that "sticks" here if it is about the published ideas rather than about your interview subject (the person) specifically.
If you could give us information about your interview subject and the content of his or her ideas, we could reply specifically rather than hypothetically. --Teratornis 16:15, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
The subject is William Nessen, a journalist who reported in Aceh during the separatist conflict there. As far as I know, he was the only reporter to spend time with the rebels. There are several stories about him but they only cover basic details. I'm working on it for The Black Road and possibly for an article about Nessen himself. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Davidovic (talkcontribs) 21:58, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
I don't see anything about interviews in WP:RS or WP:VERIFY. The key factor in assessing the reliability of a source is the degree to which the publisher checks its facts (that is, to the degree that the publisher is reputable). For an interview to count as a reliable source, the interview would have to be published by a reputable organization, or the factual claims in the interview would have to have been so published. You might be able to find a news outlet that would publish your interview and/or re-interview the subject; then you would have a published interview to cite. I'm curious as to why the journalist you interviewed would not have published whatever factual claims he made in the interview. Journalists get paid to write their findings, after all. You might see Wikipedia:WikiProject Fact and Reference Check to see if someone can possibly find published sources to corroborate some or all of the interview content. In the meantime, my advice on trying other wikis stands. You can develop your articles on some other wiki with the sources you have now, and having it available online might enable others to help you verify it. You can also edit your material as user subpages on Wikipedia. --Teratornis 05:32, 1 October 2007 (UTC)

Keeping history of searches[edit]

How do I create a history of topics that I've looked up? I'm always being interrupted partway through a reading and then I forget the trail of words/topics that I've covered. At the very least, I'm looking for the equivalent of a post-it note so I can remember to "start here" in my big encyclopedia book. Thanks!

Pengbe 12:50, 24 September 2007 (UTC)Belinda Peng

PS I'm not sure how I'm supposed to find the response to this question. Still a newbie!

Some browsers will automatically save a search history for you. If your browser doesn't, then one way to remind yourself to go back to a page is to 'watch' it using the 'watch' tab on the top of the page; you can then look at your watchlist to see which pages you're watching, and changes to those pages. You could also use your browser's bookmarking or favourites function; your browser probably also has a 'history' function (that's different from Wikipedia's page history) that lets you know which pages you've been visiting recently. Hope that helps! --ais523 13:17, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
In your web browser (normally Internet Explorer or Firefox) you can check the history (by pressing and Ctrl+H), or bookmark any interesting pages. Information on these features on Firefox: [3][4]. --h2g2bob (talk) 13:20, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Also see:
By editing your own "Reading list" section on your user page, you can teach yourself more about wikitext markup. --Teratornis 16:21, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

SBI (talk · contribs) isn't Sbi (talk · contribs) ?[edit]

Since when is it possible for 2 different users to register the same name with different patterns of CAPS? I realize both accounts are over a year old (at least) and there didn't used to be a system to prevent people from registering similar names, but for all intents and purposes, aren't these identical names? Ie. shouldn't the software have disallowed this from the start?--VectorPotentialTalk 13:04, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

This sort of thing isn't allowed any more - it used to be allowed, but the software now forbids names which can be confused easily. Usernames are like page names (first letter doesn't matter; the rest do). --h2g2bob (talk) 13:08, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Deleting pages[edit]

Please delete these pages.,,, --Socal gal at heart —Preceding signed but undated comment was added at 13:10, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Hi. :) The deletion policy may be helpful to you, as it explains the criteria for which articles are commonly deleted and the processes for requesting or suggesting that they should be. --Moonriddengirl 13:31, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Apparent markup problem in editing a Wiki article[edit]


I am trying to add a few paragraphs, with citations to authority, to the Wiki article entitled "History of Special Relativity",, at the end of the Criticisms of Relativity Theory section. In fact, the new paragraphs have already been added. The trouble is, firstly, some of them are in grey text boxes, unlike the rest of the article. Secondly, also unlike the rest of the text, the added paragraphs have almost no right margin. And thirdly, the section notes are in paragraph format, not listed by number as notes usually are.
I have spent a few hours studying Wiki editing tutorials, FACs, etc, without success.
Can someone there help me to edit this article correctly?
RAmesbury 13:18, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
The easiest way to avoid that is to not add spaces before each line, in wiki-markup, that creates a box. If you want to have a space at the start of a sentence, use a : It will create the space without also creating the box. --VectorPotentialTalk 13:21, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
On a related note, you may also want to read up on WP:MOS#Sources, for a better idea of how to format your citations in keeping with wikipedia style conventions. --VectorPotentialTalk 13:29, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

How to copy and paste pictures and formulas strings[edit]

I did not successfully copy and paste the pictures & formulas into my word document.

The other is ok to me.

WOuld you pls help me copy & paste those pictures & formula onto my word files?


Alfred —Preceding unsigned comment added by Lokca (talkcontribs) 13:33, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Which article are you trying to copy and what happens when you try? Leebo T/C 14:45, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Wikipedia:Tools#Export: Conversion to other formats has some links but there doesn't appear to be something for Word. Maybe you can export to html and read that with Word, but some things would probably convert poorly or not at all. PrimeHunter 01:07, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

Need Admin to LOCK Plácido Domingo article asap[edit]

To admin, please look at the revision history on the edit warring. The anonymous editors have getting out of hand, it is hard for us to protect the article day and night. We would be appreciate if the article could be locked from anonymous editors, at least for a week. On behalf of Wikipedia:WikiProject Opera- Jay 15:26, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

You can request this sort of thing at Wikipedia:Requests for page protection (WP:RFPP). --ais523 15:29, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Advertising vs. Informing[edit]

Hello out there,

We are trying to create a Wikipedia page for the Social Thought and Political Economy program at UMASS-Amherst. We keep running into the problem of "creating an ad", which is not what we're trying to do. We're looking to include a history of the program, including campus and offcampus activism, student projects, and some of the ways STPEC is a dynamic and unique program at the University (for example, this entire project is student run, as is the program, from picking classes to making staff decisions). Any help on this would be much appreciated, Thanks! STPEC 15:30, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

You might want to read some of Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. Firstly, the way you are saying "we" and use the acronym of the group as your username, it seems like it's a "role account" (accesible by more than one person). Role accounts are not allowed. Next, there are guidelines for notablility that must be met for a subject to have an article. It's a conflict of interest for the group to create an article about itself, which is where the "ad" description is coming from. Leebo T/C 15:34, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Also, if you read the deletion log, the page was deleted as a copyright infringement of this page. You can't copy over text from other sources to use as Wikipedia articles. Leebo T/C 15:37, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Also, why are you trying to create your article on Wikipedia? Thousands of other wikis exist, including several which are specifically about education - and lo, it appears that your august institution operates its very own wiki. The fact that Wikipedia is the only wiki most people have heard of doesn't make Wikipedia the best choice for every type of writing. Wikipedia has some of the most stringent requirements of any wiki for its content. A wiki which specializes in a particular topic typically allows a wider range of articles about that topic than Wikipedia does. It looks like UMassWiki wants your article because it already lists STPEC as a red link - so click here and start editing. --Teratornis 16:39, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

What's happened to tags?[edit]

What's happened to all the tags? things that {{clean-up}}, {{db-band}} etc no longer seem to have a border around them to make then stand-out on the page. why? --Fredrick day 15:34, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

If you're talking about the standardization of templates, see Wikipedia:Article message boxes and Wikipedia talk:Article message boxes. Leebo T/C 15:39, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
If you don't see a border at all, it's possible you have an old cached stylesheet; try bypassing your cache. (The new templates do have a border in the current version of the stylesheets, but some old stylesheets don't have the code for the borders in them.) --ais523 15:42, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Sportster piston removal[edit]

I am trying to remove the piston from a harley sportster engine. I am having trouble getting the wrist pin retaining circlip. I tried a small screwdriver and an awl but I can't get under it to pop it out. How can I get it out? Also, can I reuse the circlip or should I make sure to get a new one? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Pilotbob (talkcontribs) 15:35, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Have you tried Wikipedia's Reference Desk? They specialize in knowledge questions, and will try to answer any question in the universe (except how to use Wikipedia, since that is what this Help Desk is for). Just follow the link, select the relevant section, and ask away. I hope this helps. Leebo T/C 15:41, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Please do NOT ask the Reference Desk. You should contact your local mechanic or Harley dealer. We can't offer advice for anything other than how to use Wikipedia, especially if there is a regulated and licensed profession for that purpose. Please see our disclaimers. Hersfold (t/a/c) 15:42, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Hersfold is right. Lapse in judgment. Leebo T/C 15:44, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Google:harley sportster piston removal finds some authors who seem to have issued mechanical advice on this topic; whether they should issue such advice, I do not know. While it may be a safe assumption that because the questioner can afford a computer and Internet access, he probably inhabits a jurisdiction which does have a suitably licensed and regulated profession to service motorcycles, we lack the information to be sure of that. Perhaps he writes to us from an untamed land, where the personal freedom to tinker with one's own ride at one's own risk using information supplied by pseudonymous strangers over the Internet remains uninfringed. --Teratornis 16:02, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Acceptible Sources[edit]

Some editors are claiming that Fox News and blogs which print reports are not accptible sources. Is this true?Kirin4 15:45, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Some editors feel that Fox News is a biased and unreliable source; others disagree. Blogs are not generally considered reliable sources for reports; a good blog (regardless of affiliation) will have a link to the original report, which should be sought and used instead. See WP:RS and WP:WEB for more details. --Orange Mike 15:55, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Some people feel Fairness and Accuracy in the Media FAIR is a bias source yet it used frequently. Fox is the leading U.S cable new network how can that be biased. If so how can the NY Times with their recent fiasco and the recent Jason Blyare be used. It looks like liberal political correctness to me.Kirin4 16:47, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Fox being the most popular network has nothing to do with quality - the highest-selling newspapers in the United Kingdom are tabloids but are frowned upon as reliable sources on Wikipedia. And a couple of incidents does not destroy reliability. TIME often prints corrections in its next issues if it finds any in previous ones - yet TIME is still established as reliable. That said, all sources, even reliable ones, can be disputed and discussed on, and the reliability of various media can be disputed on the talk page of reliable sources. I'm not really an expert on these things but you should get a better response there. x42bn6 Talk Mess 16:57, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Relliablle sources seems to have a majority that say Fox is relliable one dissenter. Who decided relliable?Kirin4 18:34, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Fox, regardless of it's POV, is a major broadcaster, so it probably qualifies as reliable under WP:RS, assuming that you're citing published content. That said, if an article only cited Fox, and did so with a bias, it could be tagged for not following the neutral point of view policy. As for blogs, no, they're generally not considered reliable (see here). Hope that clears things up some. --Bfigura (talk) 18:45, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

New template problems[edit]

I'm trying to create a set of music templates to use as a standard for musical artists. Located right HERE, the templates are nearly complete. The only thing that need to be tweaked is the header. I need to center to center the header so it aligns with the main body (i.e. center the "name" part with "discography", "singles", etc.). I don't want to use {{tnavbar-collapsible}}. Could somebody fix that for me? (Oh, BTW, if there's a reply to this, could you reply on my talk page. Thanks!) MITB LS 15:56, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Aren't there already templates for this? LaraLove 17:37, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Template:Navbox musical artist. Have improvements been made to this? LaraLove 17:39, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Yes, but... I feel that one single template can't support all templates of different genres. Cause many templates (of this same navbox) are structured differently from each other, I feel that it may be appropriate to have separate templates for each (notable) genres, but with the same standard structure. Improvements to the current Navbox can be made (to support non-mainstream genres/miscellaneous genres). I'll work to try to get as many templates to this code. Anyway, I came for one question: IS there a code to center the header with the body of the template? MITB LS 00:11, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

Continuous column numbering[edit]

Is it possible to have continuous column numbering for the 50 wards of the Template:Chicago City Council rather than having the numbers restart at 1 in each column?--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 16:39, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Since it is already using the navbox template, I don't see how to use the multi-column numbered list template also. So, I suggest replacing the wikipedia #'s with <ol> and <li> where you can change the starting number of each column's ol. -- kainaw 16:43, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Thanks.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 17:20, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Pronunciations are garbled characters[edit]

Pronunciations on wikipedia are garbled chracters, often including strange little squares, etc. Obviously my computer is not set up properly. But I have not been able to find how to fix this. It seems like this would be a common question, but apparently it isn't. Any ideas? Thanks. Melizg 16:46, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

It's quite possible that your computer doesn't have any font installed that's capable of displaying the symbols. Many Web browsers will automatically try to select a font that can display them; Internet Explorer doesn't, so Wikipedia sends it a list of fonts to try. Here is the list; do any of these fonts exist on your computer?

"Chrysanthi Unicode", "Doulos SIL", Gentium, GentiumAlt, Code2000, "TITUS Cyberbit Basic", "DejaVu Sans", "Bitstream Cyberbit", "Arial Unicode MS", "Lucida Sans Unicode", "Hiragino Kaku Gothic Pro", "Matrix Unicode"

If any of those fonts are there, then for some reason your browser isn't automatically selecting the right font, and you can fix the display for your username by writing
.IPA {font-family:"name of font here"}
in Special:Mypage/monobook.css (a page that you have that contains user-specific style overrides) and bypassing your cache. If none of them are there, it seems probable that your computer is incapable of displaying the characters because it doesn't know what shape they should be; in such a case, you'll have to install new fonts. Hope that helps! --ais523 16:52, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Problem at footnote section[edit]

In the page: Status of religious freedom in Malaysia, what is wrong with footnote number 6? I can't get rid of the brackets. kawaputratorque 17:05, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

User:Fuhghettaboutit fixed it. It was a line break in the link text itself. x42bn6 Talk Mess 17:12, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Ah i see. Thanks! kawaputratorque 17:19, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
As noted above, any line breaks, extra spaces—things of that nature—can mess up the formatting. If you write offline, and then try to import here, you have to check for such things. One easy way to do so is, once in edit mode here, do a search (on many computers cntrl+f) for double spaces and then remove them.--Fuhghettaboutit 17:21, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
It is duly noted. Thanks. kawaputratorque 17:59, 25 September 2007 (UTC)


why is wikipedia in script on my computer? —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 18:02, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

It's possibly one of your settings on your browser. See Tools > (Internet) Options and poke around to see what your default font is. It might be set to Script - Wikipedia does not set default fonts, it goes by the browser's settings - which are typically Times New Roman and Arial. x42bn6 Talk Mess 18:04, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
(edit conflict) The only instructions about the font that Wikipedia sends (except in some special cases) is 'font-family:sans-serif'; that is, it requests that your browser uses a font without serifs, but otherwise doesn't specify what it is. Your browser seems to be interpreting this request in an unusual way (maybe its default sans-serif font is set to something weird); what browser are you using? --ais523 18:06, 24 September 2007 (UTC)


How can I see the photo's I've uploaded?

OhSoSofaay 18:26, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

You can go to your contributions (the 'my contributions' link at the top of the screen), select 'Image' as the namespace, and then click on the image's name. Or you could just look at a page/article that you've added them to. --ais523 18:28, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
You can also take a look at your log page; it shows all the pictures you've uploaded, among other things. GlassCobra 21:37, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

How to make new edits show up upon search[edit]

Good afternoon.

I made a change to a page on "FreeLife" today and still see the old page pop up first.

How do I get my new changes to show over the old information? Right now, in order to see my new changes, I have to click on the link at the top of the page that says, "redirected from FreeLife, where I am then able to click the FreeLife link and see my new changes.

I'd like my changes to be the front facing page instead. Can you help me to fix the page?

Thanks! —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 19:05, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

I removed the leading ">" characters from your message which were messing up your (probably) intended formatting. It's hard to tell from your question what the problem is. FreeLife is an article; Freelife is a redirect to FreeLife (page titles on Wikipedia are case sensitive after the first letter, so FreeLife and Freelife are distinct pages, although one is a redirect to the other). The IP Address under which you posted your question shows no other edits (see: Special:Contributions/; did you make your edits under some other user name or IP Address? The revision history of the FreeLife article suggests a revert war is in progress. That may be why your edits are not appearing. --Teratornis 21:31, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Thank you for the explanation. Is it possible to have all search options, "FreeLife, Freelife, freelife, free life, Free Life," to direct to the current "FreeLife" site created under my IP Address?

Thanks! —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 22:44, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Your original problem may have been that you needed to bypass your cache. Freelife is a redirect to FreeLife in the Wikipedia sense of a redirect but not in the html sense. Freelife leads to (lower case l in URL) and FreeLife leads to (upper case L in URL). Wikipedia should generate the same page except for details like a redirect message on the former, but it's possible your computer had cached an old version of the former URL and not of the latter URL.
FreeLife does not have a space in its name and many articles contain the consecutive words "free life" with a space [5], so I don't think it would be a good idea for Wikipedia to redirect "free life". PrimeHunter 00:45, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

Editing Wikipedia Pages[edit]


I attempted to edit the Wikipedia page for Ovi(Nokia's internet services). I followed the instructions and the changes appeared on the screen. I did press save. However, 30 minutes later, those changes were no longer found on the page. The information I am trying to input is: "The brand name OVI was created for Nokia by Lexicon Branding." I was also trying to input an external link -

Can you please explain why this is happening and what I can do to correct this problem?


Kaley —Preceding unsigned comment added by SailBoat1982 (talkcontribs) 19:30, 24 September 2007 (UTC) SailBoat1982 19:31, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Someone disagreed with your edit and removed what you added. Check the history. You could try discussing it with them. Leebo T/C 19:32, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
(edit conflict) Looks like another user reverted your changes. Promotional external links aren't allowed here. GlassCobra 19:34, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

trying to locate Right / left wing Radio in Canada[edit]

Trying to find Right and Left Wing Radio shows in Canada -unavailable. So does someone or you add this topic.? —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 19:51, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

I'm not sure if we can help you there. Wikipedia does not readily categorize radio shows as "right wing" or "left wing" because of the neutral point of view policy. Shalom Hello 21:35, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Wikipedia would not itself apply subjective labels, but we could cite someone else's published labelings. However, Wikipedia is not a directory, although we do have a number of list-type articles. That basically means we don't try to list everything, but some people do list a lot of things. See WP:LIST for the guidelines about what sorts of lists are appropriate here. You might also check Wikipedia:WikiProject Canada and Wikipedia:WikiProject Radio to see if there is any activity about political radio in Canada. Also look for other wikis; try: wikiindex:Category:Canada, wikiindex:Category:Radio, and wikiindex:Category:Politics. If you want to create a new article you must register an account, but be aware that Wikipedia deletes lots of articles for failing to comply with our complicated policies and guidelines, and thus it can be difficult for new users to create new articles that "stick." Aspiring contributors should spend a few months editing existing articles before creating new ones, to learn how Wikipedia works. Be aware that many other wikis have much more lenient policies for article content, and are often better for people who aren't ready to write encyclopedically yet. --Teratornis 21:44, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

when johnny comes marching home[edit]

Hi, I added a fact to this page. Now it is asking for the citations of where the information came from. I have no problem providing the information but can not figure out how to add it to the page. Please help Captorourke 20:01, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Perhaps the guideline on citing sources will contain the information you need. If it doesn't, please let us know, and we'll be happy to help further. :) --Moonriddengirl 20:31, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
A example ref, <ref>{{cite web||title=The Example of Examples|accessdate=2007-09-24}}</ref>. Insert the right info and that should do it, assuming your ref is a web ref. --Тhε Rαnδom Eδιτor 21:39, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Making Wikipedia my homepage.[edit]

How can I make Wikipedia my homepage? Whenever I need to go on it, it gets really annoying typing the address in or opening my favourites and would be a lot easier and more useful if it opened up every time I start the internet. —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 20:58, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

It depends on your web browser. Usually, you can go to the Options/Preferences dialog box, and type your home page there. Titoxd(?!? - cool stuff) 21:00, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
If you use Mozilla Firefox, for example, you can also select View | Toolbars | Bookmarks toolbar, and bookmark Wikipedia into your Bookmarks Toolbar Folder. Also, technically, you do not "start the Internet" - rumor has it Al Gore already did that. --Teratornis 21:07, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Or if you have IE 7 right click on the icon. There should be a properties selection, left click it. Then there will be a area to set your homepage set it to --Тhε Rαnδom Eδιτor 21:37, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Why the main www page? Wouldn't it be easier to set it to GlassCobra 21:39, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
And I'll jump into the fray (har, har) with a note that you can set up IE (7.0, at least) with multiple home pages. Tools > Internet Options > General Tab > add in the box at the top. It will open with multiple tabs. Into The Fray T/C 22:16, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Article moved by a third party before WP:RM processed ended[edit]

I nominated Lean Mean Fat Reducing Grilling Machine to be moved to Foreman Grill on WP:RM. However, today, User:Neil, before reading my RM discussions on the talk page, moved the page "arbirarily"[6]. Should I move it back to its original place? And should I leave something warning-like to User:Neil?--Samuel di Curtisi di Salvadori 22:33, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

To be honest i think it was a straight forward page move. I don't think neil should be templated, especially since his comment about not realising there was a move. Neil is a very experienced editor. I don't think you would be able to move it back anyway, it needs an admin to go over a redirect. As he says, if there are any objections to the move then it should be discussed then. Woodym555 22:39, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Also is the problem how to make the RM nomination speedy ended and put a boilerplate over the discussion on talk...--Samuel di Curtisi di Salvadori 01:57, 25 September 2007 (UTC)


I have made numerous attempts at attaching a photograph on to the article I am writing on José Bernal, artist. Sometimes I have failed, but sometimes I have been successful in the upload of the photograph. Presently I have uploaded the photo, but it does not show on the article that I am writing. Why is that? I need to know what to do to have it appear on the article. Also, I am just about finished with writing it and want to know what I must do to submit it for approval so that it can be made available to the public domain of WIKIPEDIA under JOSÉ BERNAL. Thank you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Labs1950 (talkcontribs) 22:52, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Hi there, Labs1950. You appear to be working on your article on your user page. I added the image there, rather quickly and hamfistedly to show you at least the basic image conventions. For more indepth coverage, I recommend WP:IMAGE. But you might also want to find and use a good infobox template such as the one on Salvador Dalí. That's generally what I've done in the past. Also, you're probably better off working up articles at User:Labs1950/sandbox rather than on your own user page.  :) Cheers! Into The Fray T/C 23:06, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
First the article's name should be José Bernal, as article names do not take all caps. The article can be created by moving your userpage to that name, which would preserve the page history. Note that for future reference, it's a better practice to work on draft articles at a subpage, rather than at your userpage proper. Though it is not an absolute bar, you should be aware of our strong discouragement of users writing articles about themselves and people they know, as such articles present a conflict of interest and inevitably are not written from a neutral point of view, which we require for encyclopedia articles. Indeed, looking over the draft article, there are neutral point of view issues. In any event, there is no approval process. You can simply move it as I have advised. Note that upon moving the article, the software will automatically create a redirect from your userpage to the article. That should be quickly edited to no longer be a redirect.--Fuhghettaboutit 23:11, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

I added a reference to an article, but reference does not appear.[edit]

I am in the process of adding information on university endowments (in the little infobox thingie) to a number of college and university articles along with a reference (using a template I found on another page). It worked fine on the article for Gannon University, for instance. But when I did the same thing for the University of Akron, the endowment figure appears in the Infobox but the reference info does not appear anywhere, even though there is a link to a footnote in the infobox on the live page. I hope that makes sense.

Am I missing something really obvious? Please let me know if I am doing something wrong. (I noticed there is not a References section on the University of Akron page, but when I tried adding it, the page preview did not automatically put the reference there underneath it, so it didn't seem like that mattered.)

Thanks....I'm still pretty new, as you see. --Brianwantium 23:24, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

And it's there now.....that was, uh, magical. Nevermind. Maybe it takes a minute for the References section to be created? --Brianwantium 23:28, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Hi there: I've just fixed University of Akron. You were close to solving your problem, I think. If you look at the very last entry on the page, after the famous alumni and before the categories, you'll see a heading surrounded with double-equals-signs that says References, and then below it a tag in double curly brackets that says Reflist. It's the Reflist tag that's the crucial part; it accumulates all the references cited above it on the page in numerical order. I viewed it and there is now a reference cited there, so it looks like everything else is okay. If I can help more, let me know. Accounting4Taste 23:30, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Oops. Apparently mine overwrote yours without edit conflict! I'm guessing because I edited a section only? One of the mysteries of Wikipedia. Since I prefer {{reflist}} myself, I'll restore yours. :) --Moonriddengirl 23:32, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Hi. Everybody is pretty new at one time or another. :) University of Akron did not have a "reference" section where the footnote can be recreated. I've put one in, so the reference shows up. A simple guideline for this can be found at Help:Footnotes. Basically, you create a section which you name something like notes or references, ==Footnote==. Beneath that, you put <references/> or, if you like small text in notes and have a lot of them, {{reflist}}. A longer description is available at Wikipedia:Footnotes. :) --Moonriddengirl 23:31, 24 September 2007 (UTC) people rock. I understand now. --Brianwantium 23:31, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

LOL now do you think you could explain edit conflicts to us? I have no idea what happened either. Glad you got the information you needed, no matter how. Accounting4Taste 23:34, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Help:Edit conflict#Prevention says: New since v.1.3 is CVS-style edit conflict merging, based on the diff3 utility. This feature will only trigger an edit conflict if users attempt to edit the same few lines. See also [7]. PrimeHunter 00:24, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

Two Million[edit]

I see we have recently passed our 2 millionth article. Any idea what the 2 millionth was?--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 23:35, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

See Wikipedia:Help desk#2,000,000th article? and Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2007 September 10#What was the two millionth article?. It is currently considered to be El Hormiguero. Note that the actual article may vary because of deletions etc. Woodym555 23:42, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
The Wikimedia Foundation agrees, see foundation:Wikipedia Reaches 2 Million Articles. --h2g2bob (talk) 01:23, 25 September 2007 (UTC)