User talk:Bishonen

Please post at the foot of the page!

My saved bits, Second subpage

Archive 1, Archive 2, Archive 3, Archive 4, Archive 5, Archive 6, Archive 7, Archive 8

Good evening Bishonen!

Permission to spam? El_C

Glad to see you're home. I have replied on my user page, As this page is far too long as it is!

You're right, it was. Good grief, you've got a ventriloquist act with the goat now? Bishonen | talk 01:21, 10 August 2005 (UTC)

Awwww! What a cute baby goat! Is it Cecilia's? Bishonen | talk 01:36, 10 August 2005 (UTC)

Spam..? Sure, hit me! Bishonen | talk 01:38, 10 August 2005 (UTC)

I'm not sure, but sure! I feel bad ruining your perfectly clean, recently archived page. The temptation is great, though! El_C 02:02, 10 August 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for unblocking me after that self-blocking weirdness :) Secretlondon 18:59, 10 August 2005 (UTC)

Very nice to meet you, Secret! Bishonen | talk 19:05, 10 August 2005 (UTC)

Bisgh, I am kind of mentally different and like to do things that people dont approve of necessarliy but how would you like it if you were locked in your parents big house all alone most of the time either with just a computer and a TV?? I DO have friends but they have to come over and see me most of the time and I can't go see THEM without supervision. If have some money from my parents but can't really live alone yet and I don't know when. So a lot of my time is just sitting here :( Now Lucky wants to banish me for doing drugs. Well what would you do if it was after midnight and you hadn't gone out in 2 days either? I"m sorry, do what you have to do but please try to undrestand me.Wiki brah 02:39, 3 September 2005 (UTC)

Profuse gratitude

Thank you so very much for your flower! I'm going to send you some more goats, these are wild ones I photographed in Egypt, just as soon as I have the time to scan them. Hope the holiday was a success, so brave of you to try scuba diving, and snorkelling, in the fjords so unfashionably far north. Giano | talk 22:27, 10 August 2005 (UTC)

And what is wrong with the inqquisition? Giano | talk 05:55, 15 August 2005 (UTC)

Länsteater

I have been pointed in your direction for either a translation, or an explanation of the word "länsteater" and similar. My question arouse because of Gävleborgs Folkteater mentioned in the article Anders Norudde. Do you know if there is a generally accepted translation of this proper name? If not, do you have a suggestion on a not too lenghty explanation of what a "länsteater" is? / Habj 14:41, 11 August 2005 (UTC)

Sorry to cause you such trouble! Since I was pointed in your direction, I assumed you had something to do with Swedish-related stuff... I've corrected the dating info on the play/the forming of the group. "County theatre" sounds great, tax-sponsored institution is indeed what it is - but not very "folkrörelse", just paid by the tax. As we don't know of an official English namn, I think that addition explains enough. "People's theatre" to me sounds a bit too much like China. / Habj 07:19, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

Bishonen knows a lot about theatre, and about Swedish-English translation, which is why I suggested that you ask her. Anyway, I think this is the type of translation issues that is likely to come up more often with better coverage of Swedish institutions and organisations. Sometimes a translation is obvious and straightforward and may even end up as an English term actually used for a similar type of institution. In other cases a translation sounds strange and may even be misleading. (Politically loaded terms are particularly problematic - how do you translate "Frisinnade folkpartiet" or "Lantmannapartiet"?) As for theatres, I just thought of an article I wrote a while ago on the architect Axel Anderberg, who built a number of theatres:

"His first significant commission was the new Opera House in Stockholm (1889-1898), which replaced the gustavian opera building. After having won the contest for the building he spent additional time abroad for the particular purpose of studying theatre architecture. He later designed the city theatres in Karlstad (1893), Linköping (1902-1903) and Kristianstad (1906) and the Oscarsteatern in Stockholm (1906)."

I am not asking you to see this as a model, just as an example of my spontaneous reaction when confronted with a list of Swedish theatres. "Stadsteatern i X" was easy enough to translate and probably not misleading, but I felt that Oscarsteatern was a bit too much of a proper noun to translate (and I couldn't find an official translation). I left it in Swedish but in italics, which warns a reader that "here comes one of those long compound Swedish words, beware of stumbling!". Having thought about it a bit more, I think I would probably treat Gävleborgs folkteater much as Oscarsteatern; even though it is on the surface easy to translate, the translation looks a bit odd and possibly misleading. Generally speaking I would be more inclined to use a Swedish name as an article title (like Riksdag, for instance), where it can be explained and alternative English translations offered at the beginning of the article, but to use a reasonably good English translation (like Swedish parliament) in text, pipelinked or redirected, to avoid the "stumbling" effect of stacking to many foreign terms into an English text. --Tupsharru 08:06, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

Now I'm not sure how to do... continue on Bishonen's talk page? Maybe we can move it from here later, if we think we find something worth saving on an article talk page? Or to mine, if we want to avoid disturbing Bishonen.

I completely agree on the riksdag/parliament example. The problem is the cases where no suitable English translation exist. I find your exemple with the theatre buildings smooth, your way of writing it avoids pretending that the English description are English proper nouns.

When reading texts about foreign things, a certain amount of foreign proper names can be expected. My idea of how to avoid the stumbling effect is to wrap it up in an explanation, if possible put before the foreign proper name. "The stage play Den stora vreden", for instance. If mentioned several times in the text, it can be referred to as "the play" - or Vreden, short and nice and the word that people do use when they talk about it. Actually, I would do something similar in your theatre building example if I only knew a good description in english of "privatteater" (not funded by tax money, owned by a person or a company, usuall if not only found in big cities, usually playing popular stuff like musicals and comedies that attract a larger crowd). I know it is not "private theatre", but for the sake of the example... "He later designed the city theatres in Karlstad (1893), Linköping (1902-1903) and Kristianstad (1906) and the private theatre Oscarsteatern in Stockholm (1906)." This gives rougly the same information that Swedish readers can extract from the nature of the very names of the various theatres, and is more smooth than just stating the name. / Habj 11:17, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

Disturbing Bishonen? Heh heh, you guys are very welcome here. I may even chip in. :-) Bishonen | talk 11:23, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

One or the other

Don't look for me on IRC or the various policy/talk pages. I'm about done with this place. It occurs to me more and more every day that not only will quality get swamped by bulk, but that, increasingly, there isn't even the smallest island for quality, so merely retreating to writing solid article and letting the rabid and distempered gradually agree that Wikipedia should be Everything2 isn't an option. I may go on full break. I haven't decided, yet, but I care less and less about how successful people can be at eliminating any deletion, any featured status, any standards at all. Quality, it seems, is only desired in the abstract, but having one great orgy of self-expression is demanded in the here and now. Geogre 16:48, 11 August 2005 (UTC)

Oh, gosh: first Fil; now you, Geogre. Please don't go permanently - where would we be without stellar articles like Augustan literature? Don't let the buggers get you down, for goodness sake. It sounds like taking some time away from the madhouse to recharge of batteries is in order. -- ALoan (Talk) 17:08, 11 August 2005 (UTC)

Yes I was very distressed to see Fil go (although he told me in an email that he would probably be back — I sure hope so, its been awhile now). I would also be very distressed to see Geogre leave. I think we are suffering from growing pains and have scaling issues but I believe they can all be managed. I think it is especially hard on the people who have been with the project for the longest time. But whatever we can do to keep great editors like Fil and Geogre, we should. Let me know if I can help in any small (or not so small) way. Paul August ☎ 18:49, August 11, 2005 (UTC)

Func's RfA :)

Func( t, c, e,  ) 19:11, 11 August 2005 (UTC)

All right already! Bubble gum pink, isn't it? Bishonen | talk 19:19, 11 August 2005 (UTC)

Bishonen | talk 01:27, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

Func( t, c, e,  ) 01:42, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

JRM · Talk 11:20, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

--Bishonen | talk 11:41, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

It's

quite

simple,

really

this

particular

box

was

stolen

from

the

old-style

box

template

and

I

tried

to

find

the

yuckiest

shade

of

purple

possible.

If

you

want

the

ultimate

in

box

customizability,

though

your

only

recourse

is

to

learn

CSS.

JRM

12:01, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

Oh, boy, that's a lot of code. Silly me, here was I thinking you'd simply stolen Sam Spade's sig. Bishonen | talk 13:52, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

All those pastel boxes are nice, but there's just... something missing. Some roundness to balance the angularity of the boxes. Oh, I know: File:Madhappyfaceblob.gif

Mindspillage (spill yours?) 16:57, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

/me sighs

I suppose all you wonderful people realize I archived TWO DAYS AGO??? Oh, hey, though, now I know what I want: round text boxes! There's a challenge! Bishonen | talk 18:01, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

hmm, that's really not much of a challenge, though you can't just go ahead and write any old thing then. Oh wait, you meant the box...

JRM · Talk 18:18, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

Hmm...are we getting closer? :) Func( t, c, e,  ) 18:43, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

OK... thank you both (/me sighs slightly again). To recapitulate, we have the ace of diamonds and a sort of trompe l'oeil, uh, roundedness. I expect I'll ... settle. Bishonen | talk 18:57, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

I won't stop until I get it right.... Func( t, c, e,  ) 19:23, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

Bishonen | talk 19:54, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

I don't understand. Where's the parameter that lets me specify the color? JRM · Talk 20:57, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

[Hastily] Yes, yes, that's excellent, finally something tasteful, you can stop now! Bishonen | talk 21:15, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

I'm not at all sure this particular talk page shouldn't be VfD'ed, for the sake of the project. JRM · Talk 21:40, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

Indeed, and the page's primary author, someone called Bishonen, should be blocked. Func( t, c, e,  ) 21:42, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

That would be a blessed releif, if it wasn't for the new way blocks work: I would still be able to edit this page. Only this page. It would be like being in some existentialist play. :-( The unfortunate Bishonen | talk 21:51, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

You win the award...

File:Emmy.jpg

See? It's the "weird talk page" award.

or is it a ... El_C 09:08, 13 August 2005 (UTC)

...for weirdest talk page ever. Andre (talk) 07:27, August 13, 2005 (UTC)

Oh, I daresay you were an accessory to it. Andre (talk) 08:01, August 13, 2005 (UTC)

Apparently. It's 4 am and I have nothing else to do but edit Wikipedia, but it isn't curing my insomnia. Andre (talk) 08:04, August 13, 2005 (UTC)

Pas de problème. Andre (talk) 08:18, August 13, 2005 (UTC)

$A=\bigcup _{i=1}^{m}\psi _{i}(A)\bigcup _{i=1}^{m}\psi _{i}(V)\subseteq V\lambda _{m}(E)=2^{-m}{\frac {\pi ^{m/2}}{\Gamma ({\frac {m}{2}}+1)}}H^{m}(E)H_{\delta }^{s}(E)=\inf {\Bigg \{}\sum _{i=1}^{\infty }\operatorname {diam} (A_{i})^{s}{\Bigg \}}$ El_C 09:08, 13 August 2005 (UTC)

Oh, El! You've reinvented the wheel! Bishonen | talk 16:06, 13 August 2005 (UTC)

I (re?)invented something! El_C 01:06, 14 August 2005 (UTC)

Looking at this page, I can't help but think...

slightly timid. El_C 07:30, 14 August 2005 (UTC)

Don't bother archiving any of this. In fact, if it were me, I'd just redirect my talk page to the Sandbox and lock it. JRM · Talk 11:26, 13 August 2005 (UTC)

Hello, JRM, would you happen to have a chamois cloth I could use to polish my new award? You'd hardly have any use for it, would you? Bishonen | talk 11:42, 13 August 2005 (UTC)

You get an award essentially for encouraging me to spend time on your talk page and calling me an idiot, and then you've got the nerve to take a swipe at me?

Lady, there isn't an ArbCom in history who wouldn't ban you for trolling. JRM · Talk 11:46, 13 August 2005 (UTC)

Aww...! Germie...! I didn't realize the issue was so sensitive for you. Look at your userpage, you'll see something nice and shiny of your very own! Bishonen | talk 16:01, 13 August 2005 (UTC)

One day I'll go back to anonymous editing. But not today. JRM · Talk 17:10, 13 August 2005 (UTC)

I'd say something snippy, but a. I'm unsure what that means; b. I don't want to get on JRM's bad side! /hides in the dark El_C 01:06, 14 August 2005 (UTC)

Oh, he's not such an ogre! Just call him Germ and he thaws right out! Bishonen | talk 07:18, 14 August 2005 (UTC)

Okay, but I remain slightly timid nonetheless. El_C 07:30, 14 August 2005 (UTC)

Motorvag

E70 is explaining that he's tired of me at Talk:Motorväg. I don't think he'll ever actually read the VfD, my argumentation or even applicable policy, so could you give a hand?

Peter ^Isotalo 15:13, 15 August 2005 (UTC)

Many Thanks

Thanks for supporting my RFA and your kind words there. It couldn't have happened without your effort. FeloniousMonk 17:45, 15 August 2005 (UTC)

Barnstar

It may seem a bit silly to give an admin one for doing their duty, but good job on being patient with me on the stupid articles. >.> -- A Link to the Past 20:03, August 15, 2005 (UTC)

Seeking an opinion

File:Tv sesame street Beautiful Day.jpg

Hi Bish - paths haven't crossed for a while, trust all has been well with you. I'm just wondering if you might care to have a look at Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Zambezi and associated comments on Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates - I incorporated a lot of 1911 Britannica text into the article, which has raised questions about whether it can be considered an example of Wikipedia's best work. I seem to recall you've done quite a bit with lavish 1911 prose so would be interested to hear your views. Also, I just put Surtsey up on FAC.

As it seems obligatory to leave splash of colour and/or a silly picture with comments on this page, here you go. Worldtraveller 14:09, 16 August 2005 (UTC)

Obligatory? Argghh. Compare this post! Hmmm. Well, I'm kind of prejudiced against the 1911, to tell you the truth. All I tend to do with text from it is replace it, actually. I mean, even though the editors were very enlightened for their time, you can imagine their basic POV for Restoration drama, namely "Disgusting!" Not much I can use that for, so I make a fresh start. (If you mean I've written some lavish 1911-type prose, OTOH, you may have a rather worrying point there. ;-P.) The Zambesi would be a whole different case, naturally. I certainly will take a look and try to come up with a thought. Surtsey? Surtsey!! I'll run, not walk, to that one! You know how to draw a girl in! Bishonen | talk 14:30, 16 August 2005 (UTC)

Yes, that 1911 POV does rear its head on a lot of subjects! With Zambezi, there's luckily not too much of a colonial attitude you can bring in to describing the course of a river, so most of my alterations were just trimming the luxuriant prose into something more toned down. Some time soon I'm going to tackle Andes, which is just a horrible 1911 mess at the moment, and severely handicapped by the fact they didn't believe in continental drift back then. ETPH, it must be said, perhaps verges on 1911EB proportions of hyperbole and descriptiveness, otherwise I think your writing is acceptably modern :) Anyway, look forward to your thoughts on Zambezi and Surtsey! Worldtraveller 17:32, 16 August 2005 (UTC)

Oh noes, I was too late to vote on Zambezi. Well, I've posted a missed-the-party thought on the FAC talk. Bishonen | talk 12:53, 17 August 2005 (UTC)

admin request

Hi pretty boy.

Could I bother your admin powers with removing the images created by http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/Dankell  ? Dankell has been moving images from wikimedia commons to wikipedia :-). Doing it now will save someone the trouble of doing it later.

--Fred-Chess 08:33, August 17, 2005 (UTC)

Sure, Fred, thanks for letting me know. I've dropped a message on Dankell's Swedish page, since he seems to be a lot more active there. I think it would be polite to give him a day or so to respond before I delete them, if he wants, even though his uploading of the images was clearly a mistake. I'll zap 'em tonight or tomorrow morning. Cheers, Bishonen | talk 09:38, 17 August 2005 (UTC)

suggestion

If you're going to throw your weight around, may I suggest you do a little research first? 212.101.64.4 15:14, 18 August 2005 (UTC)

Don't worry, I did, thanks. The User contributions feature makes it easy. Bishonen | talk 15:27, 18 August 2005 (UTC)

From your comment, it doesn't look like it. It looks like a standard knee-jerk reaction to something someone doesn't like. However, if that's how things work around here, perhaps there should be a page on how to avoid such problems. btw, what happened to "first warning" (and maybe even second)? 212.101.64.4 15:32, 18 August 2005 (UTC)

We skip those in egregious cases. And we do have special pages explaining the concepts of civility and personal attack, if you'd like to learn more. Most people know what's insulting without needing to be told, though, and I think you do too: I was interested to note that after I removed your personal attack at Din, you reposted a clean version, without any "crap", "wankers", "idiots", "saddos", "sadgits" or other of your favourite expressions in it. Please keep it up with the reformed style and you'll be most welcome to contribute, and nobody will want to block you. Bishonen | talk 16:11, 18 August 2005 (UTC)

wow, I am utterly humbled by your amazing condescension 212.101.64.4 16:19, 18 August 2005 (UTC)

That's more like it! :-) Bishonen | talk 16:22, 18 August 2005 (UTC)

You are -Ril- and I claim my five pounds [1]. --cesarb 17:22, 18 August 2005 (UTC)

Norwegian anon acting up

The anonymous Norwegian user is at it again at talk:Norwegian language. He tried reverting back to the SIL classification and now he's claiming that the letter from a representative from Norsk Språkråd is not neutral because she's writing in Nynorsk. His POV here seems to be that he's a proponent of a) Eastern Norwegian and b) Riksmål and is just generally not listening to argumentation. Can I really RfAr the guy or is this something you or other admins can deal with?

Peter ^Isotalo 15:41, 18 August 2005 (UTC)

Oh, groan, that's bad. In the first place, it's impossible to follow, both because the anon doesn't sign, and becauses everybody posts all over the place, there is no chronlogy. And in the second place, that's a lot of ad hominem and poisoning of the well going on there. I have posted (I just realized I forgot to ask everybody to for \¥¶¢‰{∏Œ˜Ü{\ sakes post at the FOOT of the page), I hope it has some effect, but if not, I think you should go ahead with the RFAR. It's an important article, after all, we can't have everybody abandoning it because editing it has become too unpleasant. Bishonen | talk 17:45, 18 August 2005 (UTC)

I'm very unnerved about contributors saying they want to leave, that's for sure, and I'm guessing others are not going to like this either. Naturally, he once again reverted to the SIL classification, even though he doesn't even understand the difference between East/West and Insular/Mainland. I'm going to start preparing the RfAr. Scaring off others is where I draw the line.

Peter ^Isotalo 19:33, 18 August 2005 (UTC)

It usually takes more than one individual to make a harsh discussion. I won't excuse anyone's personal attacks, but it appears to me that you have a special ability to end up in controversy. If you hold your finger off the trigger for just a second, I will try and appeal to the anon to reach an agreeable solution. I may still spend less time on the article than I'd like, but hopefully something may come out of it.
Bishonen, sorry for trampling into you page, it just seemed like the best place at the moment. --Eddi (Talk) 10:04, 19 August 2005 (UTC)

Uppsala University

Bish, could you take a look at Uppsala University, please. There are still another couple of centuries of history to write before I can take it to peer review, but it is already at 35kb and I really need someone else to take a look at the article for suggestions as to structure, and what possibly to move over to sub-articles. I haven't added any references yet, but most of the article is based on Sten Lindroth's little history of the university from 1977. Tupsharru 10:48, 19 August 2005 (UTC)

Well, i was thinking it could become a FA eventually. Have a nice weekend in the Sharegawrd! The review can wait until you come back, unless the Uppsala University article is suddenly speedily deleted as being about a non-notable school in the remote, non-English speaking arctic, of course. Tupsharru 14:13, 19 August 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for your appreciation of the article! With the present disposition, the history section will get quite a bit longer, as it needs the addition of the period from 1800 until now, and the location bit needs expansion too, as do other things... A History of Uppsala University article could be spun off and be even longer. I still think it is important to keep focus on the history in the main page. Too many of the university articles around here seem to be written for presumptive students rather than anyone else.

Other spin-off articles may be possible (music, nations, history of student life in general). The organisation looks very dull, but I wonder if it can really be an article all of its own; perhaps one could de-list it and make it more like narrative text, perhaps with a list in a table on the side. The locations/buildings section is really just a draft; it could probably be spun off into an article of its own, but it needs more content first, and I don't really have images for many of the places (I have no camera at the moment). The Royal Academic Orchestra and Allmänna Sången need articles, as does the Uppsala Botanical Garden. The university hospital could probably be spun off into an article all of its own. There are some alternative and unused images on commons (see commons:Category:Uppsala). Tupsharru 17:36, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

Fil's leaving

Hi Bishonen. I presume you are aware that Filiocht has decided to leave the project (see: User talk:Filiocht#Why I won't be back any time soon. It seems to me that his leaving should not go unremarked upon. I would like to honor him in some way for all his excellent contributions to the project. I would be willing to try to write something on my own, but I believe that you knew him better and longer than I did, And you are certainly a better writer. And I also thought you might want to have the honor of writing something? Perhaps there are others who should be involved? I would be happy to try to help organize and fashion some kind of tribute. Paul August ☎ 13:17, August 19, 2005 (UTC)

Well, a Wikipedia:Signpost article would not go amiss (Ta bu shi da yu had one when he went and when he came back, IIRC). But there are lots of Missing Wikipedians. -- ALoan (Talk) 13:54, 19 August 2005 (UTC)

I was thinking more of a paean or a panegyric, preferably in verse ;-) Paul August ☎ 16:37, August 19, 2005 (UTC)

A paean sounds just right! :-) I think Geogre would be the man to write it (perhaps in sonnet form). Since Geogre isn't currently editing so much, I've dropped him an e-mail about Fil's farewell visit, to make sure he doesn't miss it. Bishonen | talk 16:47, 19 August 2005 (UTC)

• Yes poor old Fil, he is no more, of his own choice, his obituary is written. A Loan has placed him on Wikipedia:Missing Wikipedians. He is after all still in the land of the living - C'est la vie! (as we don't say in Italy). We can do no more - So upwards and onwards. Have you seen today's front page Blaise Pascal. I had always thought she was that model who was a great friend of Caroline de Monaco, it seems I could be wrong, before I edit, and correct the main page heavily of whom is it I am thinking, she's lovely, I fantasise all the time, come on who is she, my day was wrecked when I tuned in full of anticipation to the Blaise featured here. Giano | talk 20:49, 19 August 2005 (UTC)

I would like to be called "Blaise" instead of Cecilia, but just here for a graze (geddit?)

Aw, Cecilia, come to momma! Bishonen | talk 23:01, 19 August 2005 (UTC)

Well for what it is worth I thought it might be nice to collect some stuff together that Fil accomplished while he was here. These are things I knew about or found out by poking around a bit, I would guess there are more:

Featured articles

• Samuel Beckett
• James Joyce
• William Butler Yeats
• Abbey Theatre
• John Millington Synge
• Lady Gregory
• George A. Moore
• H.D.
• Irish theatre
• The Cantos
• Modernist poetry in English

Featured list:

• List of cultural references in The Cantos

Other contributions:

• Founding member: Wikipedia:Literature collaboration of the fortnight
• Created: Wikipedia:Featured lists, Wikipedia:Featured list candidates
• Actively contributed to: Wikipedia:Featured article candidates

Perhaps we could call the paean Filiochts Wake? Paul August ☎ 23:10, August 19, 2005 (UTC)

• I think its a nice, well meaning idea to celebrate Fil's achievements, but I have one big problem with such a plan, well two or three actually. Firstly Fil was/is very modest and would probably hate such a show. Secondly, his work stands for itself as his talent. Finally and most importantly, if one buries some-one with a final goodbye, one makes it very hard for that person to exhume themselves should they wish, and I sincerely hope he will one day have such a wish. Lets remember the reality, Fil is alive and kicking in the Emerald Isle, he has merely (hopefully, just for the time being) ceased to operate here. Giano | talk 11:41, 20 August 2005 (UTC)

Bad and good handling of literature, and the antidote to Britanica

I just saw The Plain Dealer for the fist time (the article, I mean; I've never seen the play acted, but I've read it more than once). It is exactly that kind of nonsense with which we should not up put. You and I like to annihilate it when we see it in our field, and this particular article is certainly in your way, but it occurs to me that one of the things that Filiocht did before he took his name was offer serious, sober, and balanced articles on 19th century British and Irish authors. These are the writers second most likely to be distorted by those abortions planted all over Wikipedia: the public domain encyclopedia. I understand that folks mean well when they plant those corpses in our garden, but it only makes me more wish for a Wiki-pager system. "Thinking of dropping teh literature bomb? Call 555-18TH first!" Filiocht gave us comprehensive, and precise articles. You and I have done what we could as we have had time and inclination, but few will know and fewer care the amount of good this does when we are working on a "I got there first!" project. Geogre 20:39, 21 August 2005 (UTC)

Well, perhaps I should be off the list, as my prose is "leaden." (sigh) Here I thought I could feel my own prose and was not blinded by aesthetic distance. As Billy Pilgrim says, so it goes. Geogre 11:45, 22 August 2005 (UTC)

Neither of us should be listed, really: you write leaden prose and I contribute to the poisonous atmosphere. In any case, I have a suggestion: I think it would be a good idea if people copied their Filiocht tributes to Fil's own page, since that, rather than this, is where others would expect to find them. Also they'll probably stay visible longer there, as my page gets archived quite frequently. Bishonen | talk 17:54, 22 August 2005 (UTC)

Good idea. I, of course, was not writing a tribute but filing a complaint and trying not to mention the offenders. I did this only because I hadn't before agreed with you enough about how awful the 1911 incursions are, and I saw on The Plain Dealer that your edit summary had mentioned it. A graceless segue, perhaps, but not an actual tribute. Geogre 18:03, 22 August 2005 (UTC)

Block

You know, I've used the mop (rollback button) and bucket (deletion/undeletion) hundreds of times, but I hardly ever reach for the shield of steel (page protection) or sawn off shotgun (blocking). -- ALoan (Talk) 15:20, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

your question

just wanted to let you know that I responded to your question on my RFA page. I also jumped through a hoop while writing it for good measure :). Jtkiefer ^{T | @ | C} ----- 15:57, August 23, 2005 (UTC)

Thanks—lovely jump, but I've responded with a bit of a question mark. Bishonen | talk 16:25, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

I replied on the page to your question, I admit that I haven't had many notable content disputes since much of the content work I do is an add here, a copyedit there, a subtraction here and there as needed but I'm in the process of trying to get more involved with content without slacking on my current participation on other areas of the wiki. Jtkiefer ^{T | @ | C} ----- 18:16, August 23, 2005 (UTC)

Tudorbethan

Thank you for restoring Tudorbethan, unfortunately User: Neutrality has now moved it yet again, this time to Tudorbethan architecture again with no discussion. Is this common Wikipedia practice? I note Neutrality is an arbitrator! Giano | talk 10:08, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

• No don't bother, I realy can't be doing with all this continual backwards and forwards, he has not bothered to respond to the message I left on his talk page, and is obviously an authority on architecture, so let him have his own way - life is too short. Obviously not a lot doing for him on arbitration. I am pondering the whole subject of architectural definitions at the moment anyway - I just write it let those who understand it name it. Giano | talk 12:20, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

• Hmph! Giano | talk 12:49, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

• Would you mind giving Baldassarre Lanci a quick copy edit. I expect you will want to link it to many of your pages - it's quite all right I don't mind in the least!!! Giano | talk 15:01, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

• I haven't edited for ages, I added an image about an hour or so ago, save your edit and I will sort it out, its your English I want! Giano | talk 16:38, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

• That's great, thanks. I've made one weeny alteration, but how can I see your queeries if they are inviseable (you're becoming far too computerised for your own good)You must paste it in or you won't be on the history record when this reaches the dizy heights for which it is destined! Giano | talk 17:54, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

• The questions are "commented out", meaning that they're visible in edit mode only. Open the edit field of this post that you're reading, and you'll see some "commented out" comments! Bishonen | talk 18:04, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

Yes Yes, I see all of that, but I've already done that, what are the questions you are asking! Oh f**** this secrecy I am losing the plot. Thanks for the copyedit - are you by any chance a freemason (@*!"ZZB^£ wink wink, nudge nudge) funnily enough I am not, but I beleive they go in for something similar. Giano | talk 21:14, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

I had begun to think I was going mad. The prose did seem to have that familiar golden sunkissed flow, which I so admire. I though I had finaly taught you some writing skills! Giano | talk 07:10, 25 August 2005 (UTC)

AOL Autoblock/August 24th

Hi! I'm back again. I would appreciate the favor of another release, if you happen to be onsite. Thanks. WBardwin 16:30, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

Your user name or IP address has been blocked by Olivier. The reason given is this: Autoblocked because your IP address has been recently used by "WikiNazi". The reason given for WikiNazi's block is: ""i am WikiNazi. i want you all to join me in vandalizing wikipedia"". Your IP address is 205.188.117.69.

JRM and Bishonen -- Thank you, valiant warriors. Good luck against the threat of the Hun! WBardwin 17:21, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

Bless you. :-) At this rate, AOL will end up giving me quite a collection of wall decorations. WBardwin 17:52, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

August 25th -- different IP address this time. Are you available for another release? Thanks. WBardwin 22:50, 25 August 2005 (UTC)

Your user name or IP address has been blocked by Ryan Delaney. The reason given is this: Autoblocked because your IP address has been recently used by "Mickey663". The reason given for Mickey663's block is: "Sock puppet". Your IP address is 64.12.116.7.

Thank you for trying. It's nice to have someone to blame, isn't it. So --- I blame... Mozilla for all these blocks. (Is Mozilla part of Wiki's software, by chance? That would be appropriate!) Appreciate your help. WBardwin 00:19, 26 August 2005 (UTC)

Three Guineas

Bish, I think that's a marvelous idea making that thing a redirect. I've never seen these vandal bots override an existing article. It's always a pleasure seeing your words smiling back at me on my talk page. You are, of course, welcome anytime. Ciao for now.  :) - Lucky 6.9 22:11, 25 August 2005 (UTC)

Elizabeth Boutell

Hi Bish. I have added my source to the references section. I am not sure on the style we use for journal articles so it might look a little goofy. Rje 00:26, August 26, 2005 (UTC)

Nicktunney/tunney./whatever

The autoblocker should be left to do its work unless we can show it's actually hurting people, otherwise folks would log out and go straight on with editing (effectively requiring you to watch out and do every block twice). Unless we know this yokel has an AOL account, there's no need to worry. JRM · Talk 19:26, 26 August 2005 (UTC)

Helpful Offer on Blocking

Thank you for your continued help and willingness to watch out for me. Frankly, I don't recall seeing a time on the "Block" page, but next time I'll copy the whole thing and paste it here. I really am getting used to this obstruction. But, as my time here will be in more discreet blocks in the relatively near future, the time wasted in getting a block cleared will be more important. Appreciate you. WBardwin 00:37, 27 August 2005 (UTC)

block

Of course I don't mind. Feel free. Enjoy yourself. Sing a little song, even.  :-) Joyous (talk) 00:53, August 27, 2005 (UTC)

after a 24 hours ban, vandalizing again

In case you didn't notice, User:213.237.21.6 vandalize again Talk:Bogdanov Affair with the same personal attacks and garbage. --YBM 13:45, 27 August 2005 (UTC)

I did notice, I've been trying to make sense of the page. I've written a warning on User talk:213.237.21.6, and will be keeping an eye on Talk:Bogdanov Affair. It's difficult for an outsider to understand what people are referring to, and also hard to tell whether some of the anons are actually the same user, so I feel a little overwhelmed. I've a good mind to lock the talk page along with the article..! But I'll definitely re-block Sophie if there's more yelling and name-calling. Bishonen | talk 14:24, 27 August 2005 (UTC)

AFAIK, there were not much anons being actually the same user (Well, Igor/Grichka Bogdanov first edited under IP, then on the User:Bogdanov name). The discussion is in fact running quite well between EE, CatherineV and me. The only real problems is that "Sophie Petterka" (under IP) floods the page with garbage (*not* a word on the issue) every day, Laurence67 is somethimes giving an opinion between two personal attacks against me, but could in the future participate constructively (I guess). --YBM 15:27, 27 August 2005 (UTC)

BTW, you should contact a french wikimedia administrator Céréal Killer, who's is believing absurd Sophie's claim to have been banned from en.wikipedia some days ago by a 'hacked admin accout' (supposed to be "Céréal@Killer"), this guy (not very computer fluent I guess), even posted this on the wikipedia french mailing list without checking first with the admins... --YBM 15:27, 27 August 2005 (UTC)

I just posted to you on your page without checking here first, sorry. A "hacked admin account"..? What rubbish. Are you the one supposed to have hacked this admin account? How about you send Cereal Killer some links to relevant posts here, for instance mine and Cesarb's on WP:AN, and mine to Sophie on her page? That should teach him not to believe everything he's told. Bishonen | talk 16:09, 27 August 2005 (UTC)

I'll follow the advice you've sent to me, with the likely support of the sane contributor of the discussion page. Meanwhile, "Sophie" is vandalizing again the page. As predicted she is now accussing me to have "INFILTERED WIKI WEBSITE AND DELEETED MY BLOG AND BANISHED ME FROM IT ILLEGALLY BY STEALING THE IDENTITY OF AN ADMINISTRATOR" (sigh) --81.64.153.216 02:58, 28 August 2005 (UTC)

• Blog? Oh my! If there's a blog on Wikipedia, I want to know about that. I like to delete blogs. (Wasn't there a book about all these prehistoric hanging victims they found in Wales called The Blog People?) Geogre 03:27, 28 August 2005 (UTC)
  • OK, Geogre, sorry to disappoint you, there's no blog. (Like you haven't seen newbies calling their talk page a "blog" or "site" before, riiight.) YBM, I've posted on Talk:Bogdanov Affair, to try to defuse matters. If it doesn't help, the option of blocking remains. I understand that the situation is frustrating for you, but I hope you'll still work with me in trying to not wind up Sophie. Bishonen | talk 11:19, 28 August 2005 (UTC)

• Of course. I just couldn't resist being a wag. I do sort of think though that these unconscious mistakes by new users betray something deeper. They're lapsus scriptiae. The troublesome users seem to share the belief that a communication of theirs on a hosted website like this one is just exactly like an e-mail. Therefore, when what they say is deleted, it's "censorship." When someone follows them around to undo the damage they make, it's "stalking." There is a really, really fundamental misunderstanding there: this is not the public space, and no one owns the words. I'm not sure how we could make the welcomes explain it any better, but I do see most of the totally unhinged folks sharing that one misapprehension. Geogre 11:54, 28 August 2005 (UTC)

• • And then the U.S. users start in on how their constitutional right to free speech is being violated. Actually, the next time I see an anon lay claim to an infringement of the First Amendment, I think I will suggest that they petition for Jimbo's impeachment. :) Func( t, c, @, ) 15:06, 28 August 2005 (UTC)

In case you didn't notice "Sophie Petterka" (aka User:213.237.21.6) is now back as XAL and is providing great fun (and some abuses against you and I) on Wikipedia:Mediation Cabal --YBM 13:54, 8 September 2005 (UTC)

Aha, thanks. No, I didn't know, I don't have any way of finding a name account from an IP (this is a deliberate wiki feature, for privacy reasons), and nobody else told me about it, so I appreciate your information. I've put a note with a couple of links on the Mediation Cabal page now, to give other people a chance of understanding what it's all about. Bishonen | talk 15:14, 8 September 2005 (UTC)

You Won!!!

Thank you for the release --- appreciate you watching out for me. WBardwin 19:37, 27 August 2005 (UTC)

My award

Bishonen, thank you so much for my Zola, and for fixing that damn user page of mine, which is a real mess. :) I'm planning to refactor it into some useful subpages, based on your extraordinary example. :) Thanks, Func( t, c, @, ) 02:21, 28 August 2005 (UTC)

The Divine Right of Admins

Until one of them can cure scrofula by touch, I won't believe they deserve absolute power. I think I figured out and articulated why the recent business has me so livid. Unfortunately, I posted it on user talk:Radiant. Basically, I see trepidation over saying anything harsh to Tony as being of a single piece with timidity about addressing Ed Poor. Geogre 03:23, 28 August 2005 (UTC)

Excellent. Why unfortunately? You can repost it in all sorts of places, if you want. Maybe you should. Bishonen | talk 11:19, 28 August 2005 (UTC)

Thanks

For blocking the nasty vandal. How did you manage to interpret the Flemish? JFW | T@lk 21:11, 28 August 2005 (UTC)

Flemish is a Dutch dialect, but the use of "ge" instead of "je" or "U" as a personal pronoun gave this anti-Neerlandicist away. Gracias. JFW | T@lk 07:51, 29 August 2005 (UTC)

"North" anon

I encountered a very good reason to stop respecting the SIL-style of infobox layout at user talk:Karmosin#Slovenian or Slovene. If anyone get's so easily confused by nonsense classification like "South" and then "Western", even if it's easy to check, there's clearly something wrong with that layout. The anon has, of course, auto-reverted at sight with the motivation "it looks ugly". It's annoying beyond belief. Could you lend a hand or something?

Well, I'd really like to have something on the Talk page to refer to, how about you writing something linguistic and pithy? Bishonen | talk 15:13, 1 September 2005 (UTC)

Peter ^Isotalo 07:16, 1 September 2005 (UTC)

On top of this AxSkov, whom I still suspect of being behind those anons, has now moved on to to make quite inappropriate copyedits of harpsichord and not respecting reverts of certain changes. I'm almost getting the sense that there's mild stalking going on. I'd like to RfC pronto, but I don't know how to meet the two-person criteria. Any suggestions?

Peter ^Isotalo 07:39, 1 September 2005 (UTC)

It's ludicrous to go to a different word to avoid the Br/Am spelling wars—what an idea! But believe it or not, I've seen that suggested in all seriousness on some policy talk page, and getting some support, too. Unbelievable. Still, don't you think you need a bit more than that for an RFC? But maybe you've got more? If so, I'll be glad to endorse or whatever it's called. Not for stalking, though. See the history tab of Wikipedia:Stalking, now mercifully a redirect, and mind you don't get people associating you with galloperande enfald och hyckleri. This is my opinion of wikistalking: ignore it. Don't talk about it. The contribs button is there for a purpose. If you're being harrassed by means of stalking, complain about the harrassment, not the stalking. Bishonen | talk 15:13, 1 September 2005 (UTC)

Spelman/pelimanni

I was thinking about writing a short article about the concept of spelman/pelimanni. The question is, what word should be the title. It's spelman in Swedish, pelimanni in Finnish, in Norwegian I honestly don't know nor do I know if they have the word in Danish... The concept is the same throughout the Nordic Folk genre. I don't really think there is a good, accepted term in English. My dictionary says "folk musician, fiddler" and neither is a good description - of course a spelman can be a fiddler, but (s)/he could also play accordeon, nyckelharpa etc.

When Swedish folk music is exported, as far as I can see they usually leave the concepts spelman/spelmansmusik out, and just talk about folk musik but this is less precise. Kulning, spilopipa, instruments made from cow's horns, and songs... these are Swedish folk music, but not "spelmansmusik". Finnish pelimanni music (JPP etc) tend to mention the word pelimanni in their PR material when exported, maybe because Finland has several other strong folk music traditions that are not higly pelimanni related (kantele, rune chanting). Maybe "pelimanni" as a concept is more spread in English than "spelman?" Still, it this case to me it feels a bit odd to choose a Finnish word over the Scandinavian ones... I might be biased here, of course.

It's like, what ever title I choose for it it will be wrong. The least bad version, maybe, is to randomly pick either "spelman" or "pelimani" as the title, and make a redirect from the other version. Whoha, I have already written more text here than I suppose the first version of the article will be... comments are welcome. / Habj 11:10, 1 September 2005 (UTC)

Hi, Habj. The Norwegian is speleman or spelleman--I suppose that'll be bokmål and nynorsk respectively. The Danish is spillemand. A few redirects for you there...! Anyway, I've got a reason to suggest for picking pelimanni, kind of a superficial, practical reason: pelimanni is the one that's not an anglophone proper name. Try googling for "spelman" on English-language pages, and you'll see what I mean. Spelman seems to be quite a common name, as well as having some famous representatives who give lots of hits. Speleman is a fairly common name also. Whereas pelimani seems free from such taint. And pelimani is kind of... I hope I don't sound patronizing to Finnish speakers... but it's a really cute word! :-) Hope this nonsense helps. ;-) Bishonen | talk 17:33, 1 September 2005 (UTC)

Arts Towns entry

Please reread the entry as you went into the page and tried to shut it down while it was being edited.

Might be a good idea to give any new page you see a fast glance AND THEN go back a day later before you make a snap judgment on deletions.

Please - not every edits everything at once.

This means extra work for many people who now have to write in and vote for the page to be saved.

Please, consider other people's work, and their time before you make snap decisions.

Hi, please note that you can sign a message on a talkpage by typing four tildes, like this: ~~~~. Well, I didn't make any kind of decision, the community will make the decision. I'm afraid a new page with an unencyclopedic name and little information will always run the risk of being listed on Votes for Deletion, so it's a safer method to create the page with a little more information right away. Votes for deletion aren't majority decisions, btw: pages are most often kept if they get even a few Keep votes (from established users). It takes a Delete majority of 75—80% for a page to be deleted, so if even a sizable minority of voters approve of your page, it'll stay.

Please feel free to vote and comment, as the creator of the page. But I would really appreciate it if you don't ask people who're not wikipedia users to "write in and vote". That's frowned on, and it distorts the voting process if a sudden influx of new users appear merely in order to vote "Keep" on a particular article. (They're welcome to post comments on the vote page, though.) I'm sorry I upset you. Best wishes, Bishonen | talk 20:11, 1 September 2005 (UTC).

Drury Garden/Covent Lane

Uhhh, I'm out of my depth, here. First, I found out that the place I'm working has a library that has the new DNB. Is that good news? Well, yeah, sort of. The Gould entry, for example, is taken entirely from Sloane and from some uncited source. However, the thing here is that I wrote Robert Gould, and I got in a mess. Late, late, late in the article, there is a bit about his attempted tragedies. Rival Sisters is no problem. I've got that nailed. The question is Innocence Distress'd. He tried to hand it to Betterton and Barry, which was stupid, but he probably had no choice (probl because of his patron). Do I lie in the article? Any corrections appreciated, when time and energy permit. Geogre 19:47, 1 September 2005 (UTC)

Having the new DNB is a lot better than having nothing (which is my own case) but for minor 17th-century figures, it's just having the old DNB. I suppose that can't be totally true if they use Sloane for Gould, but it's my general impression. I don't have access and can't check, but I think the Vanbrugh entry is still full of errors and takes no account of the 1980s standard biography. Just like the latest EB, if it comes to that. (Whereas Wikipedia's Vanbrugh entry is cutting edge.) But alas, me, I know even less. You remember how brilliantly well-informed I used to be, back in May-June? That was because I had trial access to the wonderful EEBO full-text database. That's been disconnected—it's just like they disconnected part of my brain. :-( And I don't even have The London Stage at home any more, the library has most unfairly recalled it, in defiance of the Squatters' Rights principle. Not that I'd expect to find much in them, but being able to look woould be something. How about you post me, or attach to an e-mail or something, what exactly the DNB says about Innocence Distress'd? Because it sounds very fishy. There was only one company in 1689, the United Company. Betterton was the unofficial manager, he ran things, he could probably have put on any play he wanted. Barry was just an actress. There wasn't a theatre called Covent Garden. The Drury Lane playhouse was in the Covent Garden *area*, I guess. But it was just a house, one of the company's two playhouses, as far as I know. The one where they put on legit plays. The whole business about asking Betterton and Barry in 1689 just sounds wrong. That ought to have happened in or after 1695. The whole report comes from Gould himself, I suppose? (Judith Milhous: "a particularly unreliable reporter where his own work was concerned"). You don't have Sloan, do you? I don't know where to look. It's an unpublished play. :-( I can get the text of it all right, from the 1737 edition, but what use is that? Sorry. Bishonen | talk 00:24, 2 September 2005 (UTC)

See, that was the problem. I ended up lying with my own voice, there. The new DNB is pathetically brief with Gould. Everything they have is Sloan, of course, except for one "fact" I've never heard before -- that Gould was the "friend" of John Oldham. They merely say that Inocence Distress'd was never performed. I wanted to specify that the guy tried really hard to get it performed, that he tried, and he was furious when he was held to account for having pointed out what B&B's parents did for a living. So, there I was, trying to guess where he took it, and I don't know the theaters. In essence, then, you've already answered my question. It was The United Company, run more or less by Betterton. Gould reports that Barry had a lot to do with Betterton nixing the play, though he gives Betterton full credit for being (in his opinion) petty. In a way, RG might be a good eye witness to how much power she already had at the time, if not about his own works. Geogre 06:03, 2 September 2005 (UTC)

Oh, and I was delighted to take a poke at Nussbaum in the article. Geogre 06:04, 2 September 2005 (UTC)

Arts Towns

Google has the following citations of a term you call a "neologism".

Results 1 - 10 of about 5,490,000 for arts towns. (0.49 seconds)

The entry on arts towns has been expanded, and you are redirected to reappraise your vote for deletion of this article based on the materials that were included. Small towns in America have a very tough time attracting tourists, and there are at least 50,000 artists in these art towns in North America who earn a living based on tourism, and their works being known. Please support this work, and please realize that cutting flowers off before they grow is not likely to make a beautiful garden.

thank you.

Please be aware that Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a vehicle for promotional interests, however worthy they may be. Bishonen | talk 00:42, 2 September 2005 (UTC)

Thank you

Bish, thank you for your support, your kind words, and for my Tightrope Award, which now has pride of place on my user page, and which I'll treasure. I've put it next to the gun El C awarded me for when people are too heavy or too annoying for my shoulders. ;-D Best, SlimVirgin ^(talk) 21:08, September 1, 2005 (UTC)

Faberge egg

A long time ago you gave me a certain award, "for all your great work". It's pretty and I treasure it. I don't know whether you have your own ideas about it and whether you have awarded it to others. I would like to give this award to a very small number of people, just one at first, who have humbled me with their grace. I am not capable of producing such pretty pictures myself, but I hope that the idea will strike you as a worthy one. I intend to pass on the torch as a recognition of greatness of spirit. Not mine to pass on, in all honesty, but perhaps a way by which we might encourage the best in one another. I would pass the award to someone who demonstrated graceful attributes that I could only aspire to. --Tony Sidaway^Talk 23:30, 2 September 2005 (UTC)

Help!!!

Oh, am I ever glad I caught you over on "recent changes!" User:Wiki brah is either developmentally disabled to the point of no return or a malicious Internet troll of the worst kind. Bish, I tried to be this guy's friend and all he's done is disrupt the site. One moment he can't type a coherent word, the next he claims to be high on cocaine. Take a look at his RfC page and please tell me I'm justified in yanking this account immediately: Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Wiki brah. Thanks! - Lucky 6.9 02:28, 3 September 2005 (UTC)

I think I love you. I'm on the verge of a long wikivacation over this guy myself. Wave bye-bye to the nice troll. - Lucky 6.9 02:34, 3 September 2005 (UTC)

Bisgh, I am kind of mentally different and like to do things that people dont approve of necessarliy but how would you like it if you were locked in your parents big house all alone most of the time either with just a computer and a TV?? I DO have friends but they have to come over and see me most of the time and I can't go see THEM without supervision. If have some money from my parents but can't really live alone yet and I don't know when. So a lot of my time is just sitting here :( Now Lucky wants to banish me for doing drugs. Well what would you do if it was after midnight and you hadn't gone out in 2 days either? I"m sorry, do what you have to do but please try to undrestand me.Wiki brah 02:41, 3 September 2005 (UTC)

Well, you don't seem very blocked. Lucky, I've blocked him myself, what are you waiting for? Bishonen | talk 02:50, 3 September 2005 (UTC)

All done. I'm sorry to drag you into this, but this guy has been wreaking havoc for two weeks and goes for the sympathy card every time he's called out. Thanks for the support. I hope I've done the right thing and not overstepped my bounds. - Lucky 6.9 02:48, 3 September 2005 (UTC)

OK, so we've both blocked him, we'll go down together. :-) You did the right thing, Ralph. I saw, I've been following it somewhat, even. I saw you falling for the sympathy card, like the too-nice sap that you are! ;-) Seriously, though, a guy who'll exploit people's nicest instincts like that needs to be off the wiki. Bishonen | talk 02:57, 3 September 2005 (UTC)

Bish, you are the best. I am so sorry to have dragged you into this, seeing as how I'm such a sap.  :) Seriously, I hope not to take a fall and I'm sure you won't either. I just don't want a reputation as a "rogue administrator" because of this user's shenanigans. - Lucky 6.9 02:59, 3 September 2005 (UTC)

Nono, it's "rouge admin"! :D Bishonen | talk 03:03, 3 September 2005 (UTC)

Perhaps, but it would get in my moustache! Wokka-wokka! - Lucky 6.9 03:27, 3 September 2005 (UTC)

LIBRIS

To make a permanent link to a LIBRIS post, click on "Länka till posten" (in the middle below the entry), and use the URL given on that page. You can link to a search result list the same way ("länka till träfflistan"). Tupsharru 13:30, 3 September 2005 (UTC)

Oh, cool, thanks! Do you know of a trick for the Library of Congress also? Bishonen | talk 13:39, 3 September 2005 (UTC)

Sorry, no, there seems to be no way to do that there. Tupsharru 12:56, 4 September 2005 (UTC)

Bogdanov Affair

Bishonen,

just to let you know that the "consensus" and unprotection was reached when i was either gone or not paying attention. i fixed a few technical things (regarding the name of the relevant newsgroup, and a pointer to it). but i have to object to "Some claim it to be a hoax, while others claim it to be simply sloppy work plagued by errors, and some theoretical physicists think highly of their theories" as not reflecting accurately the bonafide position of the physics community. like Intelligent Design, there is very little debate regarding the quality of Bogdanoff's papers. more than 95% of theoretical physicists believe their "work" to be literally "bullshit". saying "Most physicists understand it to be a hoax or at least to be sloppy work plagued by numerous errors, while some theoretical physicists think highly of their theories." is granting a lot of consideration to the brothers. more than they deserve. r b-j 15:33, 3 September 2005 (UTC)

Hi, Rbj, I'll reply on Talk:Bogdanov Affair. Bishonen | talk 17:23, 3 September 2005 (UTC)

Move page

Hello again Bishonen. Could you please move Uppsala municipality to Uppsala Municipality? Thanks.

Fred-Chess 23:16, September 3, 2005 (UTC)

Sure. Bishonen | talk 01:30, 4 September 2005 (UTC)

Requesting comment(s)

Hi, I was just reading your user page and thought maybe you might be interested in the vfd for Bifauxnen that I filed recently. Any comments would help. Thanks. —Tokek 03:46, 4 September 2005 (UTC)

Please block this teenage troll

Please block HelloMyNameis (talk · contribs) / 202.156.2.58 (talk · contribs) I have already reverted him three times on Åland (history), where he has been adding nonsense on a war between Åland and Luxembourg in 1993. See this message on my talkpage for identity between username and IP. Oh, and another lovely message left on my talkpage here. Tupsharru 13:47, 4 September 2005 (UTC)

Move articles 2

Hi again. I think that all "x municipality" articles should be moved for conformity because we have decided to treat "X Municipality" as a administrative term and not as a translation of the name.

I think this can be safely done to all municipalities. City of Västerås -> Västerås Municipality.

Further: Kalmar municipality, Arjeplog municipality, Grästorp municipality, Götene municipality, Linköping municipality , Landskrona municipality, Norrköping municipality, Övertorneå municipality. Sorry to bother you correcting my mistakes, but I think it needs to be done at some time...

Fred-Chess 19:34, September 4, 2005 (UTC)

Nemas problemas. Done. Bishonen | talk 20:52, 4 September 2005 (UTC)

Ok good. Thanks. Fred-Chess 21:23, September 4, 2005 (UTC)

Do you know if there is a bug reason why it doesn't show on my watchlist? Fred-Chess 21:24, September 4, 2005 (UTC)

The more I think about it, the more I don't think I ever have seen a page move show up on my own watchlist. Maybe they just don't. It is a little odd, though. They do show up in the article history, and in my "Contributions", so in a sense they clearly count as "edits". Bishonen | talk 21:38, 4 September 2005 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Featured article removal candidates/Matthew Brettingham

I see nothing essayish about Saleiri and Mozart, merely a revelation that the author is a cultivated, sophisticated, rather stylish and educated intellectual, with an appreciation of fine music.

In a crocodile suit. Bishonen | talk 13:04, 5 September 2005 (UTC)

Apart from that thank you for you valued support during this fraught difficult and troubled time of worry. Giano | talk 12:59, 5 September 2005 (UTC)

The flaming dil-- does

Well, I added the infamous passage to Robert Gould and put up an unedited Love Given O'er on Wikisource. The way I figure it, that just means fewer people will seek out the also totally unedited Grove reprint of the poem, "edited" by Felicity Nussbaum. It will increase the desire for an annotated version, and especially one that can compare the 1689 and 1709 versions. So...ha! (And, incidentally, I do not fret over charges of indecency, as the lines use clever dashes, so children will never figure out what's being described.) Geogre 02:37, 6 September 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for the edit. One of the strange things about Wikipedia is that one does end up having substantial power to start things. Putting in the dig at Nussbaum will, actually, have some power -- at least so far as 18th c. Britlit currency goes. Geogre 14:07, 7 September 2005 (UTC)

Standardising templates

In regards to a valuable contributor leaving (dare I say it) - as none of my contributions seem to be valued, it might not be only Giano who leaves. If you want to see how ridiculous this site is getting, have a look at the GNAA FAC and check out what Kosebame has written. He is objecting to the article reaching FA status because he says that the GNAA are only notable on Wikipedia! How one person can get things so wrong is beyond me.

As for standardising things: if we want the site to look and be as professional as the EB, some standardisation is going to have to happen. Looks like noone wants to do this, so it looks like we'll look like shit when it comes to presentation. - Ta bu shi da yu 07:14, 7 September 2005 (UTC)

I'm sorry you felt you had to delete your pages, and I'm trying hard, in view of your posts on Talk:John Vanbrugh and above, to not view it as an act of petulance. I'm also sorry you think John Vanbrugh looks like shit. I don't own it, but I put a lot of work into it. Bishonen | talk 08:15, 7 September 2005 (UTC)

Oh gosh - some of my favourite editors falling out :( I respect you all: please everyone take a deep breath and count to 10. The number of good authors and editors who leave is quite depressing: I would not want to see the body count increase.

Ta bu, of course we value your contributions, but I am sure that you are aware that Bishonen and Giano have also produced (in my opinion) some of the best articles on Wikipedia. Of course they don't "own" their articles: in my experience, they are quite open to anyone copyediting, formatting, adding extra information, etc, so long as it enhances an article. As you are in Exploding whale, also one of my favourite articles. But their opinion should surely count for something, particularly as they are the primary authors. Edit warring is just daft.

Despite the effort you have put into it, I sorry to say that I really can't see the merit in GNAA: suffice it to say that I am not the only one, and many others have spent enough time on that subject already.

Given the concidence of the above, I suspect that you may be suffering from some wikistress at the moment: would it help to take a wikibreak for a short while? It often surprises me how things move on in my absence, almost always for the better, and RealLife puts it all back into to some context. -- ALoan (Talk) 11:19, 7 September 2005 (UTC)

Cartoon physics

You should take a look at this.

Peter ^Isotalo 09:52, 7 September 2005 (UTC)

Said the chicken to the chicken

Hi Bishonen, I don't know if you still remember, but once, a long time ago, you said to me "ain't nobody here but us chickens"^ref. Well, I feel "lonely chicken" on this one, a new guideline I happen to think might be an asset to Wikipedia: Wikipedia:Naming conventions (people). I see you're very busy, nonetheless I'd welcome any criticism (positive or negative) on the talk page of that proposed guideline! --Francis Schonken 14:03, 9 September 2005 (UTC)

About the WP:ANI:

• I was aware of it.
• See for example: User_talk:Scimitar#Hi_Scimitar.2C, and then User_talk:Francis_Schonken#Sockpuppetry
• Least stirred, the better, I suppose for the time being.
• That was one of the detractors for getting started with Wikipedia:Naming conventions (people). They're all so comfy in their endless disputes, that someone trying to cut that short is being shot at (that's an oversimplification, nonetheless true).

About your other problem:

• Wikipedia:Naming_conventions_(people)#Ordinals has "for monarchs this is often combined with the previous"
• "the previous" being "<First name> of <Location>" format - was that not clear?

--Francis Schonken 04:32, 10 September 2005 (UTC)

Well, yes, but the example made me think there was something I wasn't getting. It's perfect now, thanks. Have you heard the music hall song "Henry VIII", supposed to be sung by the eighth husband of an inveterate Henry-marrier?

"She was married seven times before,

Every one was an 'Ennery,

'Ennery the Eighth I am,

I'm 'er eighth ole man!"

Or words to that effect. Best, Bishonen | talk 06:56, 10 September 2005 (UTC)

Seems a fun song - I imagine it in the vein of the "Rudolph the red-nosed reindeer" song. Just popping by to tell you that I copied (a small part) of our conversation to Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (people)#The unclarity for royals issue (continued) - Hope that's OK?

So everything set for further in-depth commentaries to the guideline, if you'd still have any.

I think about proceeding as follows:

• Put it on Wikipedia:naming conventions, in the "Conventions under consideration" section

and/or

• file it on RfC/Wikipedia:Current_Surveys#Discussions

What'd you think? Or would it still be too early for such steps?--Francis Schonken 15:01, 10 September 2005 (UTC)

Hi again

Before you sigh too loud, Bishonen, I'm not doing this for my own amusement, and secondly, it doesn't seem as though I have become an admin yet, so what can I do? :-)

Articles move request:

• vänersborg municipality -> Vänersborg Municipality
• kiruna municipality -> Kiruna Municipality
• Munkedal municipality -> Munkedal Municipality
• Östra Göinge -> Östra Göinge Municipality
• Solna -> Solna Municipality
• Sollentuna municipality -> Sollentuna Municipality

I was hesitant about Solna and Östra Göinge because we might warrant separate articles about those anyways, but this is not certain, and it would look wrong to have them in that format when every other article is not. The others I had missed in the list of municipalities.

Thanks again. // Peace Fred-Chess

To relieve Bish from carrying around all these heavy webpages (don't forget she is busy caring for the two goats Giano has left in her userspace), I moved all but one of these. They did not require being an admin to do so. If the move target only contains a redirect to the "movee", and has only been edited once (a redirect created from scratch or through a previous move of the page with all its history), there are no problems making the move. --Tupsharru 05:27, 10 September 2005 (UTC)

Cool, thanks, Tups, Östra Göinge moved also, you and I make a great removal team. No problems, Fred, we all appreciate your looking out for naming consistency. The baby goat above actually isn't as Sicilian as you'd think, it comes from that inveterate one-man petting zoo, El C. :-) Bishonen | talk 06:43, 10 September 2005 (UTC)

• Well El C like cat's better, so I'm going to kid-napp it - geddit? Giano | talk 06:50, 10 September 2005 (UTC)

Good Evening

At last ten minutes to return and have a look around, as usual I go away for five minutes and return to chaos. Why exactly is John Vanbrugh protected? - how many more have to make their feelings felt on that subject, and as for poor old Matthew Brettingham he is still languishing on FARC, and "Ta bu whatsit" who caused all the problems is flouncing around the encyclopedia like a second-rate prima donna in a tawdry tu tu declaring Garboesque he wants to be left alone, but still editing from a number which everyone know is him - all very confusing! Well, I think, he's jolly lucky no-one spotted him breaking the three revert rule on John Vanbrugh or he would be alone for a while. Did he leave for half an hour because of me or that horrible "Gay nigger thing", will one ever know - do you suppose? I'm back properly on Monday, so will pick the goats up then, give them a pat. Have fun. Giano | talk 06:31, 10 September 2005 (UTC)

TBSDY got stressed by those things and more, I gather. Just ignore the FARC, not a single soul has voted remove on Matthew Brettingham, so what do you care if it sits there for a while? I'd remove it myself, except I don't feel very welcome on that page. When I saw that Netoholic was continuing TBSDY's edit war at John Vanbrugh on behalf of the box, I mentioned it on IRC and asked for some uninvolved admin to take a look at the history and see if they thought the page ought to be protected (note that I didn't by any means ask for protection, which would hardly have been proper), and Phroziac did. I may add that he seemed quite indignant at TBSDY's actions as seen in that history. Since there is surely consensus on the talk page, and Netoholic reverted against that consensus without giving any argument or explanation, let him try to work it out. Bishonen | talk 07:11, 10 September 2005 (UTC)

Perhaps the poor thing needs a long soothing wiki break, or some guidance from a caring sharing admin. (no not you Dear); but I shall give the choice some thought. Although in the long run does one really care? - It's late I'm going to bed. Giano | talk 07:20, 10 September 2005 (UTC)

Hi

I was just following some links and wondered why the fabulous User:Bishonen/European toilet paper holder had been deleted. It was a fabulous piece. Was it saved somewhere else ? Anthere

Oh. Cough. Well, no, it wasn't. I asked Mark to delete it because the joke got old, and because I'd acquired some personal associations that made me like it less. I consulted Giano (see above), who wrote a lot of it, and he agreed. The third main contributor has left the project, and I can't believe he'd care. It's true that other editors got into the spirit of the joke and contributed, and I do appreciate that and am grateful to them for the fun and games, but, well, it is a userpage, or it was. I hope I haven't hurt their feelings, or those of any of the nice people who've told me it made them laugh. There's nothing to stop any admin who cares from undeleting it temporarily and sticking a copy in their own space, or whatever — I have no objection. Any non-admin only has to ask me, and I'll do it for them. Maybe we'll see some forks. :-) Bishonen | talk 07:53, 10 September 2005 (UTC)

I need your help

Hey Bishonen, its been a long time since I've had a moment to stop and chat with you on IRC. I want to make sure that everything is OK with you before I go on to ask you for your help. It seems that User:Karmosin has decided that since his proposal for the introparagraph of the Hong Kong article was rejected on the talk page, he is going to take the argument to articles for deletion. Would you mind going to take a look at the argument going on there about the article Pronunciation of Hong Kong? The argument is here: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Pronunciation of Hong Kong. Thank you! Páll ^{(Die pienk olifant)} 18:15, 11 September 2005 (UTC)

Order of the Flaming, Dancing Hellpot to Bishonen

Order of the Flaming, Dancing Hellpot to Bishonen

I would like to award you the Order of the Flaming, Dancing Hellpot for your ability to sniff out troublemakers (like our logo-loving friend from L.A.) and your willingness to send them where they belong. paul klenk 20:01, 11 September 2005 (UTC)

Ditto! Thank you!!

Fairly soon after I started editing I ended up involved in the Netoholic RFAR, which in my opinion went on way too long, and the ArbComm was way too lenient on him. His mentorship lasted longer than I would have predicted, but it still failed in the end. I almost quit editing the Wikipedia after that RFAR. Since the I have tried, for the most part, to stay away from difficult editors and controversial articles. Still, even when I was deliberately trying to keep a fairly low profile, I ended up having to deal with a problem editor. It's rather discouraging and makes me wonder what the social dynamics of the Wikipedia are going to be like in a couple of years, in 5 years, in 10 years. BlankVerse ∅ 20:50, 11 September 2005 (UTC)

You're welcome! Glad it brought a smile. paul klenk 21:11, 11 September 2005 (UTC)

Interesting...more fun than the average Barnstar! Got your message, kiddo. Excellent idea. I'll mention it on the VfD for that current one. Some freaking vacation.  :) - Lucky 6.9 02:40, 12 September 2005 (UTC)

• Bish, check your e-mail if you would. I just left a private message there. THanks. - Lucky 6.9 02:52, 12 September 2005 (UTC)

Bish, send me an e-mail with a link to the IRC thing - I tried to find it the other day but was unsuccessful. paul klenk 16:28, 12 September 2005 (UTC)

Bish, in case you're wondering where the flaming hellpot came from, take a look at this page which I authored: New_York's_Village_Halloween_Parade paul klenk 15:00, 13 September 2005 (UTC)

Very cool article! :-) Have you thought of grooming it for WP:FAC? Please see Wikipedia:Make only links relevant to the context, though: avoid linking such general concepts as child, United States, or friends (er, that one leads to the sitcom). Bishonen | talk 15:47, 13 September 2005 (UTC)

Thanks. I will tone down the wiki, thanks for pointing it out. Also, one day I will present it for FAC, but right now I am compiling and formatting my many sources. Glad you like it. paul klenk 16:02, 13 September 2005 (UTC)

List of books with the subtitle "Virtue Rewarded"

Hi there. Thought you might be interested to know that I've added a (very) little bit more information to this article, and a couple of useful links to talk. It might be possible to work up a better synopsis of the Phelps play from Google hits - it seems to be popular with am dram groups - but given the quality of the rest of this article, I'm reluctant to rely just on that. OpenToppedBus - Talk to the driver 08:33, September 12, 2005 (UTC)

Kammerlader

Hi. I applogies for 'spamming' your talkpage like this, but some time ago you was helpfull with comments on one of 'my' other articles on old Norwegian rifles and I wondered if you might be interested in helping out peer reviewing the article on the Kammerlader. Thank you for your time. WegianWarrior 11:23, 12 September 2005 (UTC)

Bogdanov Affair again

Hi, Igor Bogdanov is (again) multi-reverting the page tonight... I'd guess it's time to block the page for some time on your last version. --YBM 21:54, 12 September 2005 (UTC)

Excuse me?

When have I trolled and made personal attacks recently? I beg to differ. If calling out admitted sockpuppets with sockpuppet warnings is trolling, then their is a serious issue with the system. Please provide someting showing that I was giving you justification for a block. Have a good day! 67.18.109.218 19:20, 13 September 2005 (UTC)