Talk:Mary Anne MacLeod Trump

This article was nominated for deletion on 30 January 2017. The result of the discussion was keep.

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please review

Hi Checkingfax can you please review this page. thanks ScotKreek (talk) 12:24, 19 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Hi, ScotKreek. Sure. What would you like me to review? I found a typo and fixed it. Ping me back. Cheers! {{u|Checkingfax}} {Talk} 06:43, 22 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

The DOB-DOD for her parents given in the text do not match the dates given in the box to the right. 146.199.34.113 (talk) 01:34, 17 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Add picture

Here's a couple of nice pictures if someone can add them please.^[1] thanks ScotKreek (talk) 12:31, 19 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

References

^ http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=105719970

Hi, ScotKreek. You will need to seek a Creative Commons license for those photos or show that they are in the public domain, and then you may upload them to the Wikimedia Commons. Ping me back. Cheers! {{u|Checkingfax}} {Talk} 06:46, 22 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 26 November 2016

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: ~~not moved~~ no consensus. The names "Anne" and "MacLeod" serve as natural disambiguators, and the supporters of this move have not sufficiently demonstrated that the shorter version is the WP:COMMONNAME. There is no consensus to move this article, and no consensus on where exactly to move it, so we'll leave it here for now. (non-admin closure) Brad v 13:35, 1 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Mary Anne MacLeod Trump → Mary MacLeod Trump – per WP:COMMONNAME – Mrs. Trump (née MacLeod), mother of U.S. President-elect Donald Trump is not known by her full name (including her maiden name) as most subjects are not. Per Wikipedia guidelines, we use the subject's common name. She is known as Mary MacLeod Trump in multiple news sources (DailyMail Express UK US Weekly Irish Central) with 276,000 results on Google Search. The reason to move to the proposed title is that Mary Trump and Mary Anne Trump, though also common name for his mother, is easily ambiguous as her daughter is also named Maryanne Trump, thus the proposed title is the best title for the subject and most common. CookieMonster755 𝚨-𝛀 23:52, 26 November 2016 (UTC)--Relisting. —UY Scuti ^Talk 03:52, 4 December 2016 (UTC) --Relisting. — JFG ^talk 06:58, 15 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Strong Support per CookieMonster. MB298 (talk) 00:16, 27 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support move to Mary Trump. As far as I can tell, Maryanne Trump Barry is rarely, if ever, referred to as "Mary Trump", and that is the mother's common name by a large margin. A hatnote will suffice to Barry if necessary. Nohomersryan (talk) 03:03, 27 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Rename to Mary Trump per WP:COMMONNAME and per Nohomersryan. Timrollpickering 22:25, 27 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Strong Support Likely to be confused with Maryanne Trump Barry. - CHAMPION ^{(talk) (contributions) (logs)} 05:09, 28 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support per CookieMonster755.LM2000 (talk) 15:16, 28 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support per nomination. —Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 22:15, 4 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]
~~Support~~ now Oppose per nom (and added information below, sources which actually use her full name). If the page is moved then still retain her maiden name MacLeod per nom. Randy Kryn 18:28, 9 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose Appears that several sources, including sources used the article, refer to her as Mary Anne. Some sources omit the "Anne", but not enough. Common Name is the name most commonly used in sources. Sources use the full name. JOJ ^Hutton 21:05, 11 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Comment – I was pondering closing this request but most Support advocates are just relying on the nominator's assertion that "Mary MacLeod Trump" is the common name, while the lone Oppose voice points out that many sources also use the full name and current title. As the discussion stands, I don't see much CN proof either way. I would encourage both sides to please provide some analytics to back up their sourcing claims. And other arguments based on WP:CRITERIA for article titles would be welcome too. — JFG ^talk 06:58, 15 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose – I just noticed that her mother was called "Mary McLeod", so that her full given names "Mary Anne" served to distinguish her from her mother. This fact should weigh at least as strongly as the assertion that she could be confused with her daughter Maryanne Trump Barry. Given a mixed record of sources, WP:PRECISION dictates that we should keep the full name. — JFG ^talk 09:08, 17 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support - per nom. Unreal7 (talk) 22:17, 29 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

1930 census

1930 census was 1930-APR-23. If she arrived 1930-MAY-02, the person in census is not her.--JimWae (talk) 00:04, 22 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

The subject of the article, Mary Anne MacLeod Trump, left Glasgow Scotland on May 2, 1930 according to "Alien Passenger list -SS Transylvania, May 2, 1930".. According to 1930 US Census, only 1 Mary MacLeod born in Scotland in 1912 appears in New York. The date of this census page is April 23, 1930. "1930 US Census - Manhattan (Districts 0501-0750), New York, New York, United States". As Mary Anne MacLeod Trump was not in the country for the 1930 Census, it is not the same person. I have amended the article to reflect this and added source. CBS527^Talk 04:21, 19 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

MacLeod or Mac Leod

In this article it is spelt MacLeod but on the birth certificate of her son[1] there is a space and it is written Mac Leod. This could explain the discrepancy discussed in the section above. Emir of Wikipedia (talk) 14:49, 20 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Most sources spell her name "MacLeod", and that's consistent with the usual spelling of Scottish Gaelic names. Donald Trump's birth certificate is a primary source on which the clerk may have simply made an honest mistake. Unless secondary sources spell it "Mac Leod" too, we should not entertain a change. — JFG ^talk 21:19, 20 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Avoiding editorial pieces when writing historical biographies

There is a source currently being used to label the subject of this article an "economic migrant". The source is titled, "Donald Trump's Scottish roots: How a tiny island could shape a President" - it is clearly about Donald Trump primarily, not his mother. The first line reads, "It may surprise many to learn that Donald Trump, having campaigned so fiercely on the issue of curbing immigration, is himself the son of an economic migrant." It is clearly an editorial piece written to highlight the fact that Trump's mother may have come to seek a better life in the US. It also makes the point that this was universal for her generation - I quote: "She was categorically an economic migrant, her whole generation were,"

I believe using that source to state, as is currently phrased, In doing so she became what would later be termed an economic migrant, is adopting a political POV from the editorial piece and has nothing to do with the details of her own life and times. It is therefore retro-fitting loaded language onto what should be a neutral article. I believe the phrase "economic migrant" must go.

Samsara 01:23, 9 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

[1] ttp://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=105719970

[1]