Talk:Syrian civil war

Issues

The whole article needs a rewrite, it for example lists allied forces as bellingerents. And it's locked so that nobody can actually do anything to deal with its problems.— Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.78.207.102 (talk) 07:02, 15 October 2019 (UTC)

I suppose that just as consensus can change, so can allies change. Feel free to use {{Edit semi-protected}} here to suggest specific edits. – wbm1058 (talk) 01:13, 18 October 2019 (UTC)

Indeed, needs to be re-written. Starting with the title that reads "CIVIL" war. When foreign forces unlawfully invade and annihilate your country, it is not a civil war. It is a hostile and aggressive attack we call today terror. Calling it a "civil" war is a misleading political statement. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 115.70.29.185 (talk) 09:22, 22 October 2019 (UTC)

It's quite common for foreign forces to intervene in a civil war. That doesn't (necessarily) change the internal aspect of the war. — kwami (talk) 08:19, 24 October 2019 (UTC)

I would support the notion that this was not a civil war but a proxy war. Mercenaries, foreign or national, fighting a proxy war for foreign powers, paid, armed and guided by those foreign powers, among which the CIA, do not qualify as a local uprising and part of a civil war. Mregelsberger (talk) 17:04, 28 September 2022 (UTC)

For the people who are defending USA and NATO, USA with the help of turkey, they posioned syrian civillians by dropping posion gas from airplanes. If that is not a war crime then I do not know what is. 155.4.141.62 (talk) 21:09, 2 March 2023 (UTC)

Guardians of Religion Organization

I have removed this group from main belligerents at the infobox, its inclusion doesn't appear to have been discussed and there are no sources reporting it as a main belligerent to the conflict alongside SAA, FSA, ISIS and SDF. Ecrusized (talk) 12:11, 8 December 2022 (UTC)

Hello Ecrusized, I have modified the infobox with Al-Qaeda in Syria and its defunct branches. Although Hurras al-Din isnt powerful as its former iterations, it is appropriate to include it seperately under Al-Qaeda; which was a key actor in the conflict Shadowwarrior8 (talk) 16:58, 12 December 2022 (UTC)

@Shadowwarrior8: Your changes are inappropriate as they do not cite any sources. Al Qaeda central command was never involved in Syria, you have added Al Qaeda to the infobox without citation. Al Nusra front which is the Syrian branch of Al Qaeda changed its name Jabhat Fatah al-Sham in 2016, and then to Tahrir al Sham in 2017. This information is already included by notes at the bottom of the infobox. Hurras Ad Din is a minor organization and it is not the direct descendent of Al Nusra. Ecrusized (talk) 09:40, 13 December 2022 (UTC)

@Ecrusized

I hope you actually dont believe what you are suggesting, but it is obvious that Al Qaeda central command is involved in Syria. Central command is one thing, organisation is another. Al-Qaeda's syrian branches are part of Al-Qaeda and what is your rationale for seperating it from "Al-Qaeda"?? Provide sources for your assertion. Furthermore, core leaders in the central command were active partcipants in Al Nusra. [1].

Also, Tahrir al Sham is not an affiliate of Al-Qaeda. It was formed as a merger between Jabhat Fath al Sham and 3 other Islamist militias in 2017. It bans Al-Qaeda activities in its area of control. 2 Shadowwarrior8 (talk) 13:53, 13 December 2022 (UTC)

You are adding WP:SYNTH material. Al Qaeda leaders did not declare the towns in Syria they occupied to be under the flag of Al Qaeda central command, instead they declared Al Nusra. Even if you believe they did it doesn't matter as you cannot add your opinions to Wikipedia, you need to cite sources which explicitly state the argument. Ecrusized (talk) 14:16, 13 December 2022 (UTC)

@Ecrusized

Dont engage in strawman arguments (see WP:TPG), because I already provided the source for Al-Nusra being loyal to AQC. You are promoting Fringe Theories. Every regional branch of Al-Qaeda is Al-Qaeda and is described as such in any article. Be it Somali Civil War, Mali War, Yemeni civil war, etc.

Also you claimed Tahrir al-Sham is part of Al-Qaeda without sources; while I provided clear sources for them banning Al-Qaeda activities and arresting AQ leadership. Shadowwarrior8 (talk) 14:51, 13 December 2022 (UTC)

Ok well, I really don't care that much. You have been warned by half a dozen users about adding original research before and some other user will probably revert your changes. Ecrusized (talk) 16:07, 13 December 2022 (UTC)

For the most part I agree with @Ecrusized:. Currently the infobox is a misleading mess and the revision prior to the recent round of edit warring more accurately reflected the main belligerents of the war. The biggest issue is that Jabhat al-Nusra and Jabhat Fatah al-Sham are the previous names of the organization now known as Hay'at Tahrir al-Sham. This is even part of a note. Placing them and their commanders on separate columns is completely illogical.

While Hurras al-Din is notable enough to include, putting it in the same column as the Islamic State also doesn't make sense given that al-Qaeda continues to oppose IS. HaD has come into conflict with HTS several times, but the conflict isn't a major, continuous one; HaD and HTS are currently co-belligerents against the Syrian government. It would be more accurate to place them on the same column, but with a divider line between them to show that they're not necessarily allies, while still on the same broad side. Lightspecs (talk) 03:17, 31 December 2022 (UTC)

Syrian Civil war starts March 15 2011

Syrian Civil war starts March 15 2011 Jonathan555568 (talk) 03:07, 3 February 2023 (UTC)

Infobox size

The infobox of this article is way too large compared to the prose. The new default skin Vector 2022 limits text width, which exacerbates the issue. My suggestion is to have it collapsible so that readers can stop looking at needle-like paragraphs. Carpimaps (talk) 01:15, 17 February 2023 (UTC)