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Of course, everything changed with the Partitions of Poland, when some nobles (though very few) indeed became aristocrats, but not "Polish aristocrats", only Russian, Prussian and Austrian, no? --[[User:SylwiaS|SylwiaS]] | [[User talk:SylwiaS|talk]] 15:15, 14 July 2010 (UTC)
Of course, everything changed with the Partitions of Poland, when some nobles (though very few) indeed became aristocrats, but not "Polish aristocrats", only Russian, Prussian and Austrian, no? --[[User:SylwiaS|SylwiaS]] | [[User talk:SylwiaS|talk]] 15:15, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

== Using XIX and early XX century sources from German Empire in articles about Polish cities about their history? ==

A user has added among others works produced in German Empire to claim that statemants made by Polish authorities from XXI century are wrong:
[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Kowary&diff=prev&oldid=373765419]
The works in question are
Theodor Eisenmänger, Geschichte der Stadt Schmiedeberg im Riesengebirge, Verlag May Woywod, Breslau, 1900, p.1
Allgemeine Deutsche Biographie, Band 23, page 261, Markgraf, Duncker & Humblot, 1886

I do not believe works from XIX and early XX century can speak about what was written in XXI century(obviously this is not possible). In any case should such works be used in articles about Polish cities as statements of fact?
--[[User:MyMoloboaccount|MyMoloboaccount]] ([[User talk:MyMoloboaccount|talk]]) 11:37, 16 July 2010 (UTC)

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Piotrus' to do list #1

So I am back, if in a limited fashion. Thanks to all who helped with that, and thanks to all who kept this project alive in the meantime. Over the next days I will be suggesting a bunch of edits here, for your consideration. Please strike them out if you carry them; or let me know if you think they are unnecessary/unhelpful. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 06:13, 6 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Extended content
Task 1

Task 1: rescue useful images listed at the bottom of User talk:Witkacy (User_talk:Witkacy#File_source_problem_with_File:Roman_Sanguszko.jpg and below) and User talk:Emax (User_talk:Emax#File_source_problem_with_File:Kazimierz_Poniatowski_.281721-1800.29.jpg and below) by finding sources. A simple way of doing this is to use Google Images search, try to find a source, and then replace the no source template in the image with the link to the source. Please let me know who is willing to do take care of that. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 06:13, 6 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Welcome back if in a limited way. I google Roman Sanguszko but with no luck. I found Kazimierz Poniatowski here [1] Jniech (talk) 15:43, 8 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Task 2

Task 2: ~weekly analysis of Portal:Poland/New article announcements (batch: French demonstration of 15 May 1848 started at 23:35, 28 April 2010 - Koralli started at 07:09, 5 May 2010)

Task 3

Task 3: varia

  • please remove the signature breaking assessment template at Talk:Polish Corridor
    • too much was removed, please replace it with {{WikiProject Poland|class=C|importance=mid}}

So... who is taking care of this? Don't be shy, post here. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 14:27, 8 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Task 4

Task 4: ~weekly analysis of Portal:Poland/New article announcements (batch: Polski Izvor started at 11:57, 5 May 2010 - Bernardo Kliksberg started at 20:47, 6 May 2010)

  • PL-Grid - multiple copyedit issues, appropriate tags: {{notability}}, {{unreferenced}}, {{uncategorized}}, {{external links}} and {{Context}}
  • Mateusz Masternak - main article: {{Poland-boxing-bio-stub}}, talk: assess as stub and low importance for our project, add {{WPBiography|class=stub|importance=low||living=yes}}
  • Grzegorz Proksa - rate as stub for our project on talk
  • Military Ordinariate of Poland - add [[pl:Ordynariat Polowy Wojska Polskiego]] (if the bot hasn't), talk: tag with {{MILHIST}}. It is a borderline stub, consider adding {{Poland-mil-stub}} and {{RC-stub}}
  • Beauty Festival - main article, appropriate tags: {{unreferenced}}, {{uncategorized}}, talk: {{WikiProject Poland|class=start|importance=low}}, {{WikiProject Beauty Pageants|class=start|importance=}}
  • please welcome and invite to the project the following user(s): User talk:Henryk Borawski

--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 17:35, 9 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Task 5

Task 5: ~weekly analysis of Portal:Poland/New article announcements (batch: Milan Vučićević started at 11:31, 7 May 2010 to List of military aircraft operational during World War II started at 03:10, 11 May 2010)

  • Polish Mexican (main: {{Poland-stub}}, {{Mexico-stub}}, talk: {{WikiProject Poland|class=stub|importance=low}) {{WikiProject Mexico|class=stub|importance=low}})
  • Józef Kowalczyk - please consider T:TDYKing it with {{subst:NewDYKnom | article=Józef Kowalczyk | hook=... that the latest [[Primate of Poland]], '''[[Józef Kowalczyk]]''' received a diploma of archivist of the [[Vatican Secret Archives]]? | status=new | author=Kpalion | nominator=Piotrus}}
  • Polish Festival @ Federation Square - main: {{notability}}, {{uncategorized}}, {{unreferenced}}
Comment

Comment: so... am I just creating a list of tasks for my self to do in x amount of time? Also, T:TDYK nominations are on timer, so if nobody is moving them, there is no point for me to come up with hooks here :( PS. Jniech - thanks for helping, I know you don't have much time, what you did is appreciated. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 02:21, 14 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I'm sorry I haven't been keeping up with your suggestions, Piotrus, especially the DYK nominations. I'm afraid they're past the 5-day limit now. I'll stay on top of them in the future. — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk 18:16, 14 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]
It has been my experience that DYK reviewrs are often lenient with the 5-day deadline. I'd suggest using the DYKs, just add a note for the DYK reviewer that they may be a bit older than usual - and let them decide if they are worth using. Thanks for the help, --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 18:41, 14 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]
 Done. — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk 18:57, 14 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Excellent. As you know, reward for a job well done is... :) Expect more stuff around Sunday! --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 05:56, 15 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Task 6

Those are some of the gnomish edits I noticed need to be made as far back as in January. As always, those are suggestions, use your best judgment and start a discussion if you have any questions/comments. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 16:11, 15 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

  1. Mongol invasion of Poland - Update the following sentence with correct dates and requested reference: There were also later, smaller Mongol invasions of Poland (1259-1260 and 1287-1288).<ref>{{pl icon}} Jacek Kawecki, [http://www.futurum.pl/historia/najazd.doc Najazd mongolski na Polskę w 1287 roku]</ref>
  2. Ulryk Hozjusz - [[Category:1455 births]], [[Category:1535 deaths]], [[Category:Polish nobility]]
  3. Władysław Pobóg-Malinowski - [[Category:1899 births]], [[Category:1962 deaths]], [[Category:Polish Army officers]], [[Category:Polish historians]]
  4. Liuboml - add {{commonscat|Liuboml}}
  5. Ryksa - disambig - link Richeza of Lotharingia as this the person noted in the second disambig choice ("Blessed Rycheza or Ryksa (around 1063), Queen of Poland, wife of King Mieszko II (1025-1031).")
  6. Wacław Kostek-Biernacki - reassess as start, add File:Wacław Kostek Biernacki.jpg
  7. Minsk Ghetto - restore [[Image:Map of the Minsk Ghetto.jpg|thumb|300px|Map of the Minsk Ghetto by professor [[Barbara Epstein]]]] (OTRS permission received, see image's page)
  8. Workers Defense Committee - create redirect: #REDIRECT [[Workers' Defense Committee]]
  9. New Year's Day (song) - add [[Category:Solidarity (Polish union movement)]]
  10. create redirects: Wilenska Brygada Kawalerii and Wileńska Brygada Kawalerii to #REDIRECT [[Wileńska Cavalry Brigade]]
  11. add [[Category:The Enlightenment]] to Russian Enlightenment
  12. add [[Category:Christianity]] to Christ of Europe
  13. redirect Polish Embassy in Washington #REDIRECT [[Embassy of Poland in Washington, D.C.]]
  14. add interwikis: Battle of Ancona (Bitwa o Anconę); Arbeitslager (Arbeitslager), John Ward (RAF officer) (John Ward), Military Ordinariate of Poland (Ordynariat Polowy Wojska Polskiego), Second Infantry Fusiliers Division (2 Dywizja Strzelców Pieszych),
  15. assess: Christ of Europe (talk: {WikiProject Poland|class=start|importance=low}} {{WPReligion|class=start|importance=low}}
  16. Sondergerichte (main: {{wikify}} {{globalize}} talk: {{WikiProject Germany|class=start|importance=low}} {{WikiProject Law|class=start|importance=low}} )

Minor update. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 07:49, 16 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

  1. Władysław II the Exile - reassess to start
  2. Black Procession - assess as start
  3. Richeza of Lotharingia - reassess as start
Task 7

New batch. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 19:20, 19 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Weekly analysis of Portal:Poland/New article announcements (batch: List of military aircraft operational during World War II started at 03:10, 11 May 2010 to Poznan, Ohio started at 17:49, 17 May 2010)

  1. Stańczyk (painting) - main: {{Poland-stub}} ; talk: {{Visual arts|class=stub}} {{WikiProject Poland|class=Stub|importance=Low}}
  1. Also add {{Poland-stub}} to Battle of Grunwald (painting)
  1. Electric power supply of Polish State Railways - main: {{notability}} {{Cleanup-link rot}} {{unreferenced}} and {{Poland-stub}}. Talk: {{WikiProject Poland|class=Stub|importance=Low}}
  2. Maciej Kozłowski - Talk: {{WPBIO|class=Stub|living=no}} {{WikiProject Poland|class=Stub|importance=Low}}
  3. Tomasz Dobiszewski - main: {{notability}} and {{Poland-artist-stub}}. Talk: assess as stub
  4. King Matt the First - please consider nominating at T:TDYK with {{subst:NewDYKnom | article=King Matt the First | hook=... that the 1923 [[Children's literature|children's novel]] '''[[King Matt the First]]''' is as popular in Poland as [[Peter Pan]] is in the English-speaking world? | status=new | author=Nbarth| nominator=Piotrus}}
  5. Kosciuszko Park (Chicago) - please inform the author (User talk:Orestek) that only a minor expansion is needed for T:TDYKing
  6. The Farm 51 - main: {{Poland-stub}}, {{Company-stub}}, {{notability}}
  7. PESA 120Na - main: {{Poland-stub}}
  8. Józef Śliwiński - talk: {{WPBIO|class=Stub|living=no}} {{WikiProject Poland|class=Stub|importance=Low}}
  9. Maciek Fronski - move to Maciek Froński. Main: {{Poland-bio-stub}} , talk: {{WPBIO|class=Stub|living=yes}} {{WikiProject Poland|class=Stub|importance=Low}}
  10. Please replace instances of use of File:Jerzy Ossolinski.jpg with File:Jerzy ossolinski.jpg.
  11. Please speedy delete File:Zygmunt I Stary.jpg - a better version is already on Commons under the same name: commons:File:Zygmunt I Stary.jpg
  12. Please speedy delete File:Zygmunt Pulawski.jpg - a better image is already on Commons under the same name: commons:File:Zygmunt Pulawski.jpg
  • DYK - is exactly on the 7 day deadline, so I say yes, go for it.
Regarding the file, we can wait - but I don't think anybody but me has ever provided a source for Emax/Witkacy's images so... --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 22:53, 20 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]
The DYK deadline is 5 days, not 7, but I submitted it anyway. — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk 23:00, 20 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Ha, I always thought it was around 7. Anyway, as DYK does have a backlog (now, roughly 20 days) I tend to see adding things to the backlog as fine. That said, I may be wrong - I will raise this on DYK talk in the near future. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 23:18, 20 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Task 8

New batch, trying to keep them semi-weekly so they are not overwhelming (ha, you should try doing it every two weeks :D). --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 17:30, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

Weekly analysis of Portal:Poland/New article announcements (batch: Aleksandra Stadniczenko started at 20:06, 17 May 2010 to European Paralympic Committees started at 18:09, 19 May 2010)

  1. Aleksandra Stadniczenko - Talk: {{WPBIO|class=Start|living=yes}} {{WikiProject Poland|class=Start|importance=Low}}
  2. all articles created by Starzynka need a WikiProject Poland project tag (stub) on their talk; here's a list:
  1. Jakub M. Godzimirski - as above, +{{Poland-academic-bio-stub}}
  2. Lower Silesian-Markish Railway - {{nofootnotes}}, please inform the creator (User talk:Grahamec) that if he were to add inline references, his article would classify for T:TDYK
  3. Ekstraliga Kobiet - talk: Poland and {{Football|class=stub|importance=mid}} WikiProject tags
  4. Hate speech laws in Poland - main: {{wikify}}, talk: {{WikiProject Poland|class=start|importance=mid}} {{WikiProject Law|class=Start|importance=low}}
    Also, assess Talk:Law of Poland for WPLAW project as mid
    I hesitate to nominate this for DYK because of the glaring error in the first body paragraph. Polish constitution does indeed have a provision that protects the freedom of speech - Art. 54 ("The freedom to express opinions, to acquire and to disseminate information shall be ensured to everyone." and "Preventive censorship of the means of social communication and the licensing of the press shall be prohibited.", see [2]). This should be corrected in the article before it can be DYKed.
  5. Antoni Blusiewicz Haftka - restore hoax template, see AfD - deleted, all's fine now
  6. Jan Berdyszak - main: [[pl:Jan Berdyszak]], [[Category:1934 births]], [[Category:Polish artists]]talk: Poland project bio, start, also WP:BIO|class=start|living=yes
  7. Sławomir Rawicz - correct bolden name in lead; correct instances of Glinski to Gliński in text, add {{Refimprove}}
  8. User talk:OGUREK - please invite to our project
Task 9

Weekly analysis of Portal:Poland/New article announcements (batch: Ernst Born started at 20:29, 19 May 2010 to Bárbara Leôncio started at 02:57, 23 May 2010)

  1. Voivodeship Road 430 (Poland) - {{WikiProject Poland|class=Start|importance=Low}}
    Roads and expressways in Poland, National roads in Poland and Voivodeship road - assess as start
    Expressways of Poland - reassess as start, more than just a list
  2. Tadeusz Jasiński - main: add [[pl:Tadeusz Jasiński]], {{Poland-bio-stub}}, [[Category:1926 births]], [[Category:1939 deaths]]. Talk: {{WPBIO|class=Stub|living=no}} {{WikiProject Poland|class=Stub|importance=Low}}
  3. Dorota Nieznalska - Talk: {{WPBIO|class=Start|living=yes}} {{WikiProject Poland|class=Stub|importance=Low}}. T:TDYK: {subst:NewDYKnom | article=Dorota Nieznalska | hook=... that works of the Polish artist '''[[Dorota Nieznalska]]''' stirred a religious controversy and charges of [[blasphemy]] in Poland? | status=new | author=Zloyvolsheb | nominator=Piotrus}}
  4. Mariusz Adamski - T:TDYK: {subst:NewDYKnom | article=Mariusz Adamski | hook=... that Polish aerial photographer '''[[Mariusz Adamski]]''' is known for shooting aircraft from unusual perspectives? | status=new | author=Starzynka |author2=Morenooso | nominator=Piotrus}}

Small batch, this time, but two DYKs on a timer! --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 18:56, 25 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Task 10

Weekly analysis of Portal:Poland/New article announcements (batch: Verbuendungshaus fforst started at 13:13, 23 May 2010 to Reichswerke Hermann Göring started at 05:50, 25 May 2010

  1. Teodor Jeske-Choiński - Talk: {{WPBIO|class=Stub|living=no}}
  2. Squadron 303 (book) - Talk: add MILHIST template
  3. German–Soviet military parade in Brest-Litovsk - please update all project assessments to B, per MILHIST assessment
  4. Silesian Uprisings - same
  5. Gambling in the CIS - add {{uncategoprized}}, {{unreferenced}} and {{wikify}}
  6. The night of culture - add [[Category:Lublin]] [[Category:Festivals in Poland]], {{refimprove}}. Talk: Poland wikiproject tag, assess as start
  7. Moshe Flinker - add {{uncategorized}}, {{notability}} (shouldn't this be just merged with the book?), also, {{bio-stub}}
  8. Young Moshe’s Diary: The Spiritual Torment of a Jewish Boy in Nazi Europe - as above + {{unreferenced}} and the stub is {{nonfiction-book-stub}}
  9. 1997 Oder Flood - consider moving to Millennium Flood or proposing such a move on talk
  10. RosaSport Radom - main: [[Category:Radom]], talk: Poland and basketball wikiproject tags, stub
  11. Casimir Zagourski - please move to Kazimierz Zagórski; add the iwiki link to pl wiki [[pl:Kazimierz Zagórski]], add a photo from pl wiki, talk: WP Poland and BIO projects (living=no)

Another small batch. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 17:10, 27 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Task 11

Very minor:

--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 19:11, 29 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Main: weekly analysis of Portal:Poland/New article announcements (batch: Constantine Corniaktos started at 10:46, 25 May 2010 to Philip Wolfhagen started at 01:59, 29 May 2010

  1. Skrzydlata Polska - fix stub (split)
  2. Talk:Janusz Iwański and [Talk:Jerzy Miller (politician)]] - add WP:POLAND stub project tag
  3. Polska Tales - {{notability}} {{uncategorized}} - also note ongoing AFD
  4. Waldemar Dubaniowski - {{Poland-politician-stub}}, {{uncategorized}}, talk: POLAND and BIO wikiprojcts
  5. Rick Pierchalski - {{wikify}} {{uncategorized}}; talk: as above, also {{WikiProject Pennsylvania|class=start|importance=low}}
  6. Marcin Dziuba - tag as stub
  7. Iwan Tyszkiewicz - Poland-noble-stub, talk: POLAND and BLP living=no tags
  8. Kazimierz Iwiński - add [[p:Kazimierz Iwiński]], stub, tak page - poland and bio living tags
  9. Lidia Wysocka - poland and bio (living=no) talk page projects

--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 21:25, 30 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Another minor update:

--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 20:58, 31 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Task 12

Main: weekly analysis of Portal:Poland/New article announcements (batch: Summer storms of 2010 started at started at 12:42, 29 May 2010 to Manuel Olmedo started at 10:17, 4 June 2010

  1. Jakub Sienieński and Jan Niemojewski - {{Poland-noble-stub}}, talk: {{WikiProject Poland|class=stub|importance=low}}, WP:BIO |living=no
  2. Krzysztof Morsztyn Jr., Andreas Volanus and Martin Seidel - {{Poland-bio-stub}} (as I cannot confirm they were nobles), talk as above
  3. Lech Szczucki - talk: WPPOLAND project, stub, low importance, add |living=yes
  4. Gdanskie Wydawnictwo Oswiatowe - move to Gdańskie Wydawnictwo Oświatowe, and pl interwiki ([[pl:Gdańskie Wydawnictwo Oświatowe]]), {{unreferenced}}, [[Category:Publishing companies of Poland]] and [[Category:Gdańsk]], talk: WP:POLAND, start, low importance
  5. University of Economics and Computer Sciences in Warsaw (UECS) - add pl iwiki [[pl:Wyższa Szkoła Ekonomiczno-Informatyczna]], {{wikify}}, [[Category:Educational institutions established in 1996]], [[Category:Universities and colleges in Poland]], [[Category:Education in Warsaw]] talk: WP:POLAND (start, low importance) and {{WikiProject Universities|class=Start}}
  6. Kashubian studies {{Poland-stub}}, talk: WP:POLAND (low, stub) and {{WikiProject Languages|class=stub}}
    Also assess Slavic studies as {{WikiProject Languages|class=stub}}
  7. Marcin Szyszkowski - [[Category:Polish nobility]], [[Category:1554 births]], [[Category:1630 deaths]], [[Category:Bishops of Poland]], talk: WP:POLAND and BIO (living=no) tags, start/low
  8. Mieczysław Mąkosza - {{Poland-bio-stub}}, {{chemist-stub}}, talk: Poland, BIO projects, |living=yes
  9. Józef Skrobiński - add iwiki to [[pl:Józef Skrobiński]], Poland-artist-stub, talk: POLAND and bio living=no
  10. Antoni Baranowski (general) iwiki to [[pl:Antoni Baranowski (generał)]], {{Poland-mil-bio-stub}}, [[Category:Polish nobility]], [[Category:Polish generals]], [[Category:1760 births]], [[Category:1821 deaths]], talk: {{WPMILHIST}}
  11. Mała Moskwa (Little Moscow) - move to Mała Moskwa. Categories: [[Category:Films set in Poland]], [[Category:Films shot in Poland]], [[Category:2008 films]]
    Note: Category:Legnica doesn't exist, but probably should be created; consider doing so and populating the category
    Created the category. I'll try to figure out what belongs in it, but I would appreciate suggestions.
  12. Ignacy Ścibor Marchocki - iwiki [[pl:Ignacy Ścibor Marchocki]], [[Category:1755 births]], [[Category:1827 deaths]], [[Category:Polish nobility]],{{Inappropriate tone}}. talk: Poland and bio (living=no), start, low.
    This article is could be rewritten to DYK with a little effort (tone, needs few more refs for a good hook).
    Unfortunately, a large portion of the article was copied and pasted from another website.

General note: I am no longer looking at article about sportsmen, I consider the flood of footballer and like articles to be close to spam.

Also, a naming discussion may be appropriate to start at Talk:Casimir Zagourski (his Polish name is much more popular than the latinized one: [4] vs [5]. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 19:36, 6 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I discussed it briefly with the article's creator. See this and this (and this too). — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk 02:49, 7 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I am not sure what the confusion is. Our Casimir Zagourski is pl:Kazimierz Zagórski. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 03:58, 7 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Task 13

Main: weekly analysis of Portal:Poland/New article announcements (batch: Michał Brzozowski started at 10:52, 4 June 2010 to Jorginho Paulista started at 19:11, 8 June 2010

  1. SHL (motorcycle) - talk: POLAND project, and {{Motorcycling|class=start|importance=low}}. T:TDYK: {{subst:NewDYKnom | article=SHL (motorcycle) | hook=... that the Polish '''[[SHL (motorcycle)|SHL brand of motorycles]]''' was [[nationalization|nationalized]] after [[WWII]] and closed in the 70s? | status=new | author=Pibwl | nominator=Piotrus}}
  2. Trześniówka - {{Poland-geo-stub}}, rate as start/low on talk
  3. Maria Kaniewska - Poland-actress-stub, talk: Poland, bio projects, stub, low, living=no
  4. please invite User talk:Foszko to our project
  5. Nad Niemnem - talk: Poland and {{NovelsWikiProject|class= Start|importance= mid}} projects
  6. Nysa's monuments - add {{orphan}}, talk: rate as low
  7. The Lesser Polish Way - Poland project and {{WikiProject Christianity|class=start|importance=Low}}
  8. Przegląd Tomistyczny - Poland-journal-stub, or split / create as needed
  9. New Julfa Armenian Cemetery - could use rewrite from copyvio if anybody's interested
  10. The Polish Rider - talk: Poland and {{Visual arts|class=start}} T:TDYK: {{subst:NewDYKnom | article=The Polish Rider | hook=... that there is a controversy regarding who is the subject of [[Rembrandt]]'s painting '''[[The Polish Rider]]'''? | status=new | author=Proxima Centauri | nominator=Piotrus}} ; please note that the article may be just few sentences short of a DYK minimum lenght - please consider either expanding it or asking the creator to do so (as I expect lenght is going to be brought up by the DYK reviewer)
  11. Orzeł bielik - [[Category:Commemorative coins of Poland]], Poland-stub, talk: Poland and {{Numismaticnotice|class=low|importance=mid}}. Consider renaming?
  12. Piotr Stoiński Jr. - Poland-bio-stub, talk: Poland and BIO projects, stub, low, living=no

Sportsmen I don't care enough to examine: Michał Brzozowski, Paweł Lisowski, Patryk Stefański, Grzegorz Goncerz, Damian Świerblewski, Jakub Jesionkowski, Katarzyna Kowalska, Antoni Franz, Alfred Staszewicz, Teodor Zaczyk, Rajmund Karwicki, Kazimierz Szempliński, Jaroslaw Trochanowski, Antoni Sobik, Wojciech Szymanek, Sebastian Madera, Przemysław Oziębała, Mikołaj Zwoliński, (if somebody would like to volunteer to take care of them, it would be nice). --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 20:14, 10 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Task 14

Main: weekly analysis of Portal:Poland/New article announcements (batch: Kotlet schabowy started at 04:21, 9 June 2010 to Szybowcowy Zakład Doświadczalny started at 23:22, 12 June 2010

  1. Kotlet schabowy - {{Poland-stub}}, {{unreferenced}}, {{food-stub}}, talk: WPPOLAND and {{WikiProject Food and drink|class=stub|importance=mid}} tags
  2. Church of Mary Magdalene in Tarnobrzeg - talk: WPPOLAND, and {{ChristianityWikiProject|importance=low|class=stub}}, {{WikiProject Architecture|class=low|importance=stub}}
  3. Maciej Zien - move single ref to external links, add {{refimprove}}, {{Poland-bio-stub}}, talk: POLAND and BIO templates (stub, low, living)
  4. Piotr Pustelnik - talk: POLAND project (stub, low)
  5. PWS-52 - talk: Poland project. T:TDYK: {{subst:NewDYKnom | article=PWS-52 | hook=... that '''[[PWS-52]]''' [[monoplane]] prototype was intended to be flown around the world? | status=new | author=Pibwl | nominator=Piotrus}}
  6. Szybowcowy Zakład Doświadczalny - talk: Poland and {{WPAVIATION}} projects (start, low). project (stub, low), T:TDYK: {{subst:NewDYKnom | article=Szybowcowy Zakład Doświadczalny | hook=... that Polish '''[[Glider Experimental Works]]''', created after [[WWII]], became the main Polish centre of designing gliders? | status=new | author=Pibwl | nominator=Piotrus}}
  7. Mammal Research Institute of the Polish Academy of Sciences - add a sentence on its location in Białowieża.
  8. :Also, assess Białowieża as start, mid importance
  9. Kielce pogrom - correct error in the first sentence of last para in lead - it was "the deadliest pogrom against Polish Jews" (per the information in the table in Anti-Jewish_violence_in_Poland,_1944-1946#Number_of_victims, the source for the table should be added as a reference to the revised sentence).

Sports articles: RTP Unia Racibórz, 2010 ZRE Katowice Bytom Open, KSW XIV

--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 17:37, 15 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Task 15

Main: weekly analysis of Portal:Poland/New article announcements (batch: Global storm activity of 2010 started at to Karolina Szarubka started at 18:52, 17 June 2010 (bot seems to have been down between 12 and 15 June)

  1. Michal Wisniowski - move to [[Michał Wiśniowski]], add {{notability}} talk: Poland projject, start, low
  2. Zbigniew Jagiełło - add pl interwiki [[pl:Zbigniew Jagiełło]], {{DEFAULTSORT:Jagiełło, Zbigniew}} [[Category:1964 births]], date of birth to lead, talk: POLAND and bio projects, living, low, start
  3. Unity Line - {{Poland-company-stub}}, talk: POLAND, business and transport wikiprojects
  4. Topolski Century - {{UK-museum-stub}}

Sport articles: 2009 Polska Energia Open, Warsaw GAA, Grzegorz Panfil

Note: I left Michal Wisniowski under that name, because he uses the Latinized spelling on his website. Also, I tagged the article for refimprove rather than notability because it has two independent references. — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk 18:14, 19 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Given that the subject himself uses the latinised spelling, shouldn't the article also use it? Varsovian (talk) 14:33, 21 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Not sure if this is his official name, art name, or a westernized simplification, and I am not sure what are our policies on using artistic names in article titles. But, frankly, I don't care much (and I still think he may not pass WP:N). What has he done that makes him notable, again? --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 15:15, 21 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Task 16

Main: weekly analysis of Portal:Poland/New article announcements (batch: Sparrow Feature Film 2010 started at 20:12, 17 June 2010 to Cisy Nałęczów started at 07:44, 21 June 2010

  1. Erazm Otwinowski - borderline, but I think {{Poland-noble-stub}}, talk - regular: {{WikiProject Poland|class=stub|importance=low}} and {{WPBiography|class=stub|importance=low||living=no}}
  2. Jerzy Bolesławski - unreferenced living BLP, also talk needs project poland
  3. Maria Grzegorzewska - discussion project templates same as Eraz above
  4. Benedykt Wiszowaty - {{Poland-bio-stub}}, discussion project templates same as Eraz above
  5. Wyższa Szkoła Filologiczna - {{Poland-university-stub}}, [[Category:Universities and colleges in Wrocław]], [[Category: 2002 establishments]]; talk: Poland and {{WikiProject Universities|class=stub}} tags
    On that note, assess University of Wrocław as start, mid; Wrocław University of Economics as stub, low, Wrocław University of Technology (needs Poland project tag) as start, mid, Tadeusz Kościuszko Land Forces Military Academy (stub also add MILHIST), Jewish Theological Seminary of Breslau (start, doesn't need Poland project), Wroclaw University of Environmental and Life Sciences (stub, needs stub template), Wrocław Medical University (stub, talk page templates)
  6. Great Theatre, Poznań - if Poznań-stub doesn't exist (we really should create stubs for major Polish towns), {{GreaterPoland-geo-stub}} will do for now
  7. Tramways in Kraków - Poland, we really need to create Kraków and Warsaw wikiprojects... sigh talk needs Poland and {{TrainsWikiProject|class=start|importance=mid|Streetcars=yes}} template; please notify User talk:Zyx that his article would be eligible for DYKing if he were to add more inline refs
  8. Maćków - prod? doesn't seem like a notable disambig, or ref stub...
  9. PWS-5 - DYK nom: {{subst:NewDYKnom | article=PWS-5 | hook=... that only five models of '''[[PWS-5]]''', a Polish [[liaison aircraft]], were produced? | status=new | author=Pibwl | nominator= Piotrus}}
  10. Polish referendums, 1996 - Poland, politics project tags; not enough content to DYK, unfortunately - consider telling this to the creator (User talk:Kubek15) and inviting him to our project
  11. PWS-6 - DYK nom: {{subst:NewDYKnom | article=PWS-5 | hook=... that '''[[PWS-8]]''', was the the first Polish aircraft fitted with [[slats]] - but only one model (the prototype) was ever made? | status=new | author=Pibwl | nominator= Piotrus}}
  12. Abraham Blum - talk: start, low. DYK nom: {{subst:NewDYKnom | article=Abraham Blum | hook=... that '''[[Abraham Blum]]''', a Polish-Jewish activist, was one of the leaders of the [[Bund]] in the [[Warsaw Ghetto]]? | status=new | author=Radeksz | nominator= Piotrus}} (I saw that Radeksz is going to nominate this himself)

Sport articles: Jakub Kosecki, Czarni Sosnowiec, Daniel Gołębiewski, Damian Jaroń , Krystian Feciuch, Daniel Ciach, AZS PWSZ Biala Podlaska, TS Mitech Żywiec , TKKF Gryf Szczecin , ZTKKF Stilon Gorzów Wielkopolski , Praga Warszawa , Gol Częstochowa, Atena Poznań , Jan Nawrocki, Bolesław Banaś, Jerzy Wójcik, Irena Nawrocka, Cisy Nałęczów . On that note, many entries in List of football clubs in Poland are missing Poland WikiProject, and some even the {{football|class=|importance=}} one.

Popmusic articles (which I also find utterly not inspiring to even look at): Mgła, --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 12:17, 24 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Task 17

Main: weekly analysis of Portal:Poland/New article announcements (batch: Fundamental Rights Agency started at 22:15, 23 June 2010 to Ryszard Wójcik started at 22:54, 25 June 2010

  1. Wrocław Walking Pilgrimage - talk: Poland and Christianity project tags
  2. Hieronim Moskorzowski - {{Poland-noble-stub}}, talk: Poland and BLP project tags, living=no
  3. Naval Air Squadron - add iwiki [[pl;Morski Dywizjon Lotniczy]] and [[Category:Military units and formations of the Polish Air Force]], talk: WPMILHIST template, Polish taskforce - {{WPMILHIST|class=stub|Aviation=yes|Polish=yes}}
  4. Luba Blum-Bielicka - assess as start, low; I presume Radek will expand and DYK it himself (Can somebody ask him if this is the case?)
  5. Tadeusz Dąbrowski - Poland-artist-stub
  6. Jaroslav Lev of Rosental - generic copyedit template for that mess, unless we want to get more specific...
  7. Robert B. Lisek - another copyedit template, plus {{peacock}} as well, regular talk templates, categories need cleanup - Year of birth unknown (also on pl wiki), Polish artists...
  8. Category:Katyn Massacre Victims - needs a maintenance rename (via WP:CFD) to Category:Katyn Massacre victims proposed rename to Category:Katyn massacre victims since main article is Katyn massacre

Popmusic: Black'N'Roll

Sport: Ryszard Wójcik

Brought to you by --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 13:43, 27 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, I was hoping to nominate Abrasza and Luba together. Working on tracking down additional sources for Luba right now.radek (talk) 21:20, 27 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Task 18

Main: weekly analysis of Portal:Poland/New article announcements (batch from Riverine Air Escadrille started at 01:19, 27 June 2010 to Frank Curto Park started at 08:07, 1 July 2010

  1. Riverine Air Escadrille - [[Category:Military units and formations of the Polish Air Force]], talk: WPMILHIST template, Polish taskforce - {{WPMILHIST|class=stub|Aviation=yes|Polish=yes}}
  2. State Higher Vocational School in Skierniewice - {{Wikify}}, talk: Poland and educational wikiproject tags
  3. Boleslaw II the Generous (the Bold) - fork, please redirect to Bolesław II the Bold
  4. Do dzwonka - Poland-stub, tv-stub
  5. Katyń Memorial - {{NewJersey-stub}}, talk: MILHIST

Popmusic: Jerzy Pławczyk , Brunette models

Sport: Jerzy Pławczyk , Agnieszka Gortel, Marcin Malinowski

A few this time... --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 15:51, 3 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

IMO "State Higher Vocational School in Skierniewice" sounds a bit awkward in English. Any suggestions for a better translation?  Dr. Loosmark  16:48, 3 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Task 19

Main: weekly analysis of Portal:Poland/New article announcements (batch from Charles-Louis Bazin started at 09:22, 1 July 2010 to Henry C. A. Damm started at 21:45, 3 July 2010

  1. Anti-Fascist Bloc - Poland-party-stub, WWII-stub, Category:1942 establishments, Category:Warsaw Ghetto, talk: Poland project, stub, low (please ask Radek if he will expand/ref it)
  2. Józef Padewski - Category:1984 births, Category:1951 deaths, talk: Poland and bio projects
  3. ORP Wilia - talk: stub, low, add MILHIST project (Poland and maritime task forces)
  4. Mariusz Kotowski - talk: POLAND, consider some Polish-American or American categories
  5. Albin Siekierski - BIO, Poland talk pages tag, start, low
  6. Polish legislative election, 1969, Polish legislative election, 1972, Polish legislative election, 1976, Polish legislative election, 1980
  7. Wincenty Wodzinowski - BIO, Poland talk pages tag, stub, low
  8. Janusz Krupski - BIO, Poland talk pages tag, C, low (Radek has already nominated this for DYK)
  9. Krzysztof Ostorodt, Andrzej Wojdowski - BIO, Poland talk pages tag, stub, low
  10. Henryk Cederbaum - remove stub, start-class: BIO, Poland talk pages tag, start, low. {{subst:NewDYKnom | article=Henryk Cederbaum | hook=... that '''[[Henryk Cederbaum]]''', Polish lawyer in the early 20th century, was known for his opposition to the [[Russian partition|Russian authorities]]? | status=new | author=Halibutt | nominator=Piotrus }}
  11. Auschwitz-Birkenau Foundation - fix image in infobox, category cleanup: Category:2009 establishments, Category:Auschwitz concentration camp, Category:Foundations based in Poland
    the Category:Foundations based in Poland needs creating with the following parent categories: [[:Category:Foundations by country|Poland]] and [[Category:Organisations based in Poland]], tag with {{populate}} (or just do it)
  12. Karol Grycz-Śmiłowski - talk: Poland, start, low
  13. Bolesław the Forgotten - tag as unreferenced, author (User talk:Mix321) needs to be notified about the need for referencing his works, and informed about T:TDYK
  14. Top Model. Zostań modelką - notability (upcoming show...)
  15. Teodora Matejko - stub, notability (is probably notable per pl wiki...), author (User talk:Johnello) should be informed about the need to make the articles notable
  16. Maria Teresa Sobieska - as above, but I am less sure she is notable
  17. Anna Komorowska - stub, could be expanded for a DYK (please notify the author: User talk:KEdE52), I guess being the First Lady of Poland makes one notable...
  18. List of banks in Poland - main for Category:Banks of Poland, talk: Poland project, list Nominated for speedy deletion as COPYVIO
  19. ORP Czajka - Poland-ship-stub, mil-ship-stub, talk: POLAND, MILHIST stub, low

Sport: Jacek Kuranty , Adrian Klepczyński, Waldemar Sobota , Łukasz Gikiewicz , Łukasz Tymiński, Robert Wojsyk , Piotr Kulpaka , Piotr Tomasik, Dariusz Jarecki , Adrian Chomiuk, Mariusz Przybylski

About a week of work, this time :) --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 13:52, 11 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Regarding List of banks in Poland copyvio - I recall that I read somewhere that lists cannot be copyrighted... perhaps we should ask an expert, like User:Moonriddengirl? --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 18:07, 11 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I've asked User:Moonriddengirl for her opinion. In the meantime, I'll remove the CSD tag. — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk 18:35, 11 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Spelling of Mme. Hanska's Name

Hello, folks working on Poland-related articles! I'm setting out to FA-ify (eventually) the article on the wife of Honoré de Balzac, Madame Ewelina Hańska. First on my radar is the spelling of her name. As I've noted over at the article talk page, every book I've read about M. de Balzac spells her name "Eveline". (And always without the accent on the "n" in Hańska.) I'm wondering why the Wikipedia article is so different, and if anyone would mind a move (or provide a citation for the spelling as we see it here). Thanks in advance for your help! Scartol • Tok 22:35, 29 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The name seems used, including in English works, see Google Book Search and search for "Ewelina Hańska" (wiki doesn't like the Google Book Search URLs anymore, I am afraid, they seem broken recently). --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 23:22, 29 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, it's used, but it's much less common (certainly in the texts which focus on her life) than Eveline. WP:EN says the following: "If one name is clearly most commonly used in the English-language references for the article, we should probably use it." Ergo, it seems to me that "Eveline Hańska" would be the one to go with. Scartol • Tok 23:45, 29 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
True. I was never that fond of the application of common names to people (diacritics, for example, are not that common, due to technical reasons), but she is an aristocrat, and those are a class (of problems, naming wise) in themselves. I would not oppose a move (I assume the old name will be kept in the lead as the second bolder alternative), and I might support it if it could be shown that best sources about her use the spelling you discuss. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 09:37, 30 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I think in this particular case "Eveline" is indeed used by majority of English language sources, though "Ewalina" is not infrequent either. I believe Britannica uses "Eveline". I think moving it to "Eveline Hańska" and including "Ewalina" in the lead of the article is fine.radek (talk) 10:06, 30 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"Ewelina".Xx236 (talk) 06:49, 1 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Okay, sounds good. I'll make the move later, when I've written the article itself. =) Thanks for your feedback. Scartol • Tok 11:14, 30 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

German names for Polish villages

user:HerkusMonte started a mass campaign to add German names into the lead of small Polish villages: [6], [7], [8], [9], [10], [11], [12], [13], [14], [15], [16], [17] , [18] , [19] , [20] , [21] , [22] , [23] , [24] , [25] , [26] , [27] , [28] and so on and so forth. I have never seen such a mammoth size campaign before and I believe it should have been discussed first. I think it's especially problematic that he also adds into the lead separate names which were invented in 1938 by Nazi Germany. I think we should discuss and try to reach a consensus about this. I will invite user:HerkusMonte to give his opinion on the matter.  Dr. Loosmark  17:56, 4 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

What do you think is problematic about this? It seems standard practice. It's your reverts that I don't see any reason for.--Kotniski (talk) 18:29, 4 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I think as well, it is a standard practice for villages, which has been historically part of Prussia/Germany or were inhabited by German minority. It is used throughout the WP in articles about villages from various countries - Darwinek (talk) 18:42, 4 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Standard practice? To have names invented in the Nazi period (1938) in the lead? Interesting practice I have to say... I wonder if German wiki has them as well.  Dr. Loosmark  18:44, 4 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Neo-Nazi propaganda or attempt to provoke Polish users? Adding names invented by the Germans Nazis for Polish towns and villages during the Nazi occupation of Poland is a pure Nazi propaganda or bloody provocation. Urgent admin. attention is required here. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.254.80.90 (talk) 18:53, 4 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
While giving Germanised names for Polish cities that were under German control before 1945 is allowed per rules of Wikipedia, adding in the lead names given by Nazis seems very inappropriate. Using that logic, we would have to give German names to ALL cities in Poland as it was fully under German control in WW2-for instance Warschau for Warsaw, Litzmanstadt for Łódż and so on.I would prefer to mention Nazi changed name in the proper context of the name change(germanisation campaign or honours for Prussian/German Empire/Nazi leaders) in the main text rather than in the lead.--MyMoloboaccount (talk) 18:55, 4 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Well I would assume good faith and wouldn't speculate on the reasons. However I'd like to know under what circumstances were those villages renamed in Nazi Germany in 1938, and what exactly is the rationale of having those names, which were used only for a brief period (1938 to 1944/45), in the lead. Those aren't exactly some historical names.  Dr. Loosmark  19:01, 4 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
(ec)The first sentence is where readers are likely to be looking for past names. Another possibility, if the naming situation with a particular place is more complex, is to create a separate section of the article (and put something like "(see Names below)" in the first sentence to draw readers' attention to it), but I don't see any particular point in doing that here. As long as it's made clear in the first sentence that these names applied only for a limited time, I don't think readers are going to be misled or significantly distracted. But removing the information altogether can't be right to the encyclopedia. (I made exactly the same point the other day to another editor who was removing Polish names from Lithuania-related articles - it would be good if editors of different nationalities worked together in cooperation or friendly rivalry to make the encyclopedia better, not keep seeing conspiracy every time information is added by the "enemy".)--Kotniski (talk) 18:57, 4 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Polish names in Lithuania are historical, the ones introduced around 1937 were part of Nazi policy and replaced historical ones.

Xx236 (talk) 07:02, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I think that while Germanised names can stay, those given during Germany's Nazi period should be moved to the main text with explanation. Notice that Łódż doesn't have Litzmanstadt in its lead.What do you think?--MyMoloboaccount (talk) 19:02, 4 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Nazi names for occupied Polish places are probably not interesting enough in themselves (unless they were notorious for a concentration camp or something), but for long-time German places, once you've given the established German name - which undoubtedly does belong in the lead - I find it misleading to omit the Nazi/de-Slavicized one, since otherwise we're giving the false information that "the" German name was X. (We really need articles on these various name-changing campaigns, to link to to explain the context of the name changes. We don't need another battleground.)--Kotniski (talk) 19:05, 4 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Kotniski, I am not advocating removing the Nazi name altogether, but rather removing it from the lead of the article. Otherwise soon somebody will add "Stalinogród" into Katowice's article lead.  Dr. Loosmark  19:08, 4 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I am not for removing it, but for placing it in the main text of the article, along with explanation as to the nature of the change, don't you think that move would actually improve encyclopedic value of the article? Also I am interested in source of the information HerkusMonte is putting into those articles. Perhaps we should ask for sources to ensure these names are correct.--MyMoloboaccount (talk) 19:13, 4 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

For places in East Prussia it makes sense to have the old German names. However, there is no good reason that I can think of to have the Nazi German names - where they differ from the older ones - in the lede. I can see in articles that have already been adequately developed including the fact that the names were changed under the Nazis, as well as an explanation as to why. So what was the motivation for changing those names? Why did "Zawoyken" become "Lilienfelde" (both German names) or "Wujaken" become "Ohmswalde"? Were the previous names just not-German-enough-too-Slavic sounding or something? Which administrative unit in the Nazi government made these kinds of decisions? Etc. On that note, I'd also like to note that none of these changes have been sourced.radek (talk) 03:43, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I think that while Germanised names can stay - if only the Wikipedia Lithuanian editors were as reasonable and willing to compromise as that. If we were to follow their example, then we'd simply remove all references to the German names (or Germany for that matter) with edit summary of "undo" and no other explanation. Alas, I agree with Kotniski and MyMoloboaccount here and personally I favor consistency and fairness.radek (talk) 03:43, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

1.Well, Radeksz, that's exactly what Loosmark did, full reverts without explanation or with a simple comment: "unnecessary info" [29]
2.WP:PLACE#General guidelines is absolutely clear about historic names: "#The lead: The title can be followed in the first line by a list of alternative names 2)... used by a group of people which used to inhabit this geographical place are permitted and should be listed in alphabetic order".
3.We should not mix up the situation in pre-war Germany and occupied Poland. A lot of names of villages and towns were already changed before 1933, e.g. 47 % of all village names in the district of Lötzen were already changed in the Weimar Republic (see also: Andreas Kossert: Mazury, Zapomniane południe Prus Wschodnich)
4.The "Nazi names" were the official names and somebody born in that area will still find this name in his passport. These names are still in use and that's why it's necessary to mention them.
5.The source is M. Kaemmerer, Ortsnamenverzeichnis der Ortschaften jenseits von Oder u. Neiße, ISBN 3-7921-0368-0.[30] HerkusMonte (talk) 06:16, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Many Nazi crimes were also legal. "Hitlersee" isn't legal in Poland and has been removed from a monument in the village. Xx236 (talk) 06:57, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Re#1&2 - In my experience I find that that particular guideline is not followed closely, or much at all in fact, especially when it comes to Polish or Yiddish names being the "alternative names". Loosmark was following general practice, as she exists. It seems like the guideline is only applied when it comes to foreign names in Polish places, but never vice versa. Sort of like some folks enforce the Gdansk/Danzig vote when it comes to putting in German names in Polish historical articles, but never the other way around.
Re#4 - it's not necessary, though in some cases it may be interesting enough to include. But no reason for it to be in the lead. Put it in the article text. And explain why and how.
Re#3&5 - Do the sources discuss why the names were changed from previous German names to new German names?radek (talk) 06:39, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I think the guideline is followed quite widely, and certainly should be, since it helps give readers key information clearly. That there may have been nasty campaigns to remove Polish names from articles on places to the east is no reason to "retaliate" by removing German names from articles on Polish places - the problem of Polish-name removal needs to be addressed in itself. I still don't see any particular problem with these Nazi-era names being in the first sentence (though that's not the only alternative); like I said before, giving only one German name could be misleading.--Kotniski (talk) 06:57, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I agree with you that the guideline should be followed, though I disagree on the extent to which it actually is. And I don't think the problem of Polish-name removal CAN BE addressed separately, particularly since sometimes it's the SAME editors who support adding the German names and removing the Polish names, and support each other. The whole thing should be dealt with comprehensively, otherwise these silly little disputes are going to keep flaring up.radek (talk) 08:54, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
This Wikipedia seems to be divided into several projects, in one Germans are "expelled", in another one Poles are "repatriated, transferred or resettled". Gdańsk can be "Danzig" but Vilnius is always Vilnius. The "letters contain the first unambiguous reference to Vilnius as the capital" - Vilnius? The letters are available in Lithuanian (originally Latin), so I am not able to verify.Xx236 (talk) 10:37, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • So the truth is I do not understand what is this discussion about. Place names in other languages we have in interwiki.

I did not notice any recommendations that the articles about the Polish towns are to be translated into German. If we give the name in German, why can not be given, equally, in the English language, Russian, or Arabic? The reasons are purely subjective and I do not think that can be resolved.

I propose to add a table with the names of places in other languages and colloquialisms, or dialect. Otherwise, I see no point in naming the outside of the original.--WlaKom (talk) 11:27, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Some users unfortunately still see a problem having a German name in the lead for villages, which has been in Poland only since 1945. Also please, do not mix up terms "German" and "Nazi". - Darwinek (talk) 11:02, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I don't understand your point about mixing up the terms "German" and "Nazi". Please note that some of those villages were added 2 names: one "historical" German and another German which was changed to in 1938 (well allegedly, as no sources were provided). Now unless you can demonstrate that the entity which existed in 1938 was not Nazi Germany I am not quite sure what you mean.  Dr. Loosmark  11:35, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
To made myself very clear. Original German names should stay for sure, no opinion though on WWII-era Nazi names. Those are two different issues. - Darwinek (talk) 11:45, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Original German names should stay for sure - for East Prussia, sure. But a lot of time this kind of thing is taken farther, for example with Bydgoszcz or Poznań which were only under German rule during the partitions and during the Nazi occupation. Or the German name is peppered throughout the article without regard to style or aesthetics just to "mark it". Or the word "German" occurs 7 times in a single sentence in the lead, just so you know... etc. (In fairness, some of these quite real examples were due to a now banned anon editor - though I keep finding his "work" in many articles still).radek (talk) 12:00, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Well, not only for East Prussia. Going to the times before partitions is ridiculous, in this manner, no "foreign" names could be applied for 90% of articles about villages of most European countries. Polish people unfortunately forget often that these territories were not only under German administration but they were ethnically mostly German or mixed. That's why plenty of names are used in the lead - because of factual demographic presence of other ethnic group than Poles. That's why e.g. Lesko has Yiddish name in the lead, though the town was never administered by Jewish state entity, nor Jews live there today. - Darwinek (talk) 12:17, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, but I didn't say "only" East Prussia. Rather, the point was that there are some places where German names probably belong in the lead, and then there are other places - which currently have them - where they don't but they're there essentially due to nationalistic POV pushing and German irredentism. Of course there's a good number of places (in Silesia, Pomerania (or Pomerelia or whatever)) where it's in between and somewhat of a judgement call. And again - the important thing is that whatever the reason for inclusion, it is spelled out clearly and it gets followed consistently when it comes to other places, like present day Lithuanian towns with historically large Polish populations.radek (talk) 12:56, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
You are right. Still I think some "unified stance" could not be achieved due to very nature of Wikipedia. You are right also pointing out the correct example of Polish names for Lithuanian municipalities. Attitude of Lithuanian editors is largely worrying and I've never met similar stance of such extent throughout the WP. "Minority names" are not a problem in articles about Swedish, German, Austrian, Czech, Slovak or Hungarian towns. The only problem seems to be with Lithuania. - Darwinek (talk) 13:12, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
The problem also happens with double naming for East Prussian cities-for example giving the name Królewiec in case of events connected to Polish history or people.--MyMoloboaccount (talk) 13:44, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
The partitions are very specific events and to going to the times before the partitions is not at all ridiculous. It's one thing that a city or town has a historical demographic presence and quite another if the demographic presence is that of just an occupier. (and the partitions were de facto an occupation). Imagine if somebody would suggest to put the Japanese names into the lead of the Chinese cities which were occupied by the Japan.  Dr. Loosmark  12:38, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, this is the reason why I don't think Nazi names should be in the lead.radek (talk) 12:56, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Absolutely agreed. That's why I think demographic presence is much more important in these cases, than historical allegiance. The problem however also seems to be the extent of certain article. If it's a well-established longer article, e.g. Bydgoszcz, it could benefit from a "Name" section. However, most of articles here are still tiny stubs. In such cases, it should be mentioned in the lead I think. - Darwinek (talk) 12:48, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah, ok, but supposing that there is a "Names" section in an article, does the non-Polish name - already mentioned in that section - ALSO belong in the lead or not? Or is just a "See Names" link sufficient. Again, this has arisen in regard to naming elsewhere.radek (talk) 12:59, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I see your point. In such a case, I think using common sense and/or consensus should be used. "Names" section of some large city can contain dozen names in dozen languages, but the lead should probably reflect historically or "ethnically" the most important ones. - Darwinek (talk) 13:07, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
So you're saying "Wilno" in lead of "Vilnius", right? Honestly, I don't think "common sense" is going to help us much here as some people appear to have a quite different interpretation of what is common or what makes sense. And the last, I dunno, five, six, years on Wikipedia have pretty much shown that you're not gonna get a clear consensus on many places - and even if you do, two or three dedicated editors are quite willing to stonewall any kind of implementation of the said consensus.radek (talk) 13:11, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, I'm saying "Wilno" in lead of "Vilnius". :) For most users, it shouldn't be a problem but as you said, a few dedicated ones will always stonewall the rest. - Darwinek (talk) 14:03, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
So... you brave enough to go and try to add it, per the guideline given by Herkus (funny that it takes bravery to actually follow Wikipedia guidelines)? Or maybe Herkus could do it, since he brought the guideline up. Or, start the RfC on the naming?radek (talk) 00:15, 6 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
My comment was related to the subject name. Discussion name is "German names for Polish villages" not "Nazi names for Polish villages". If different, please move the discussion to the name below. --WlaKom (talk) 11:44, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

A minor comment: controversial names, if left in lead, could be followed by a note ... I don't have strong feelings here, as long as the names are reliably referenced, bolded and present somewhere in the article. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 11:46, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

More generally, let me restate that this issue needs to be dealt with comprehensively. Part of the problem is that there are guidelines but sometimes they are enforced, sometimes they are invoked, sometimes they are ignored, sometimes they are misrepresented etc. A lot of it DOES depend on whether you're talking about Polish-German issues or Polish-Lithuanian issues. And quite often the editors which take one position in a particular debate have no problem what so ever, completely flipping their reasoning and taking an opposite position in the next debate, when the shoe's on the other foot. That kind of a mess is basically an invitation for edit wars, disputes, accusations and battlegrounds. What is needed is an all around consistency, fairness and CLARITY in regard to policy. This is why you can't just try to address these flare ups locally (i.e. an article at a time). Also, since this is WP:Poland but it obviously involves broader issues, I suggest that a general RfC on naming for Polish-German-Lithuanian places be opened, rather than continuing the discussion here.radek (talk) 12:06, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

  • I would suggest to open the separate discussion under the new heading "Original names of cities in Poland and former Polish territories" from misleading current one. --WlaKom (talk) 13:04, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Well, the thing is that the discussion should be probably taken to a different venue so that editors other than members of this project can comment and participate.radek (talk) 00:17, 6 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Source seems to be self-published

I checked the source given by HerkusMonte and it seems to be self-published. Its publisher specialises on printing books on demand [31] Per Wiki Reliable Sources [32] Anyone can create a website or pay to have a book published, then claim to be an expert in a certain field. For that reason self-published media—whether books, newsletters, personal websites, open wikis, blogs, personal pages on social networking sites, Internet forum postings, or tweets—are largely not acceptable. --MyMoloboaccount (talk) 13:37, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The source in question is a standard companion republished several times since the 1950s by various publishing houses and abundantly referred to by reliable sources. Skäpperöd (talk) 14:15, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Please present reliable publications then, this one is self-published and thus doesn't fulfill the criteria needed for reliable sources on Wikipedia.Your personal views and opinions about this book can't be taken as proof without sources backing them up.--MyMoloboaccount (talk) 14:29, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Rautenberg is not a bod publisher, I don't know how such an idea could arise. HerkusMonte (talk) 14:40, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Rautenberg link gives form for anybody interesting in publishing his book. If not publisher on demand than what kind of publisher is it? I am willing to change my mind If reliable sources are presented, or if it is a reliable publishing house(confirmed by sources)--MyMoloboaccount (talk) 14:45, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
WP:OR, please provide a reliable source, which claims Rautenberg is a bod publisher. However, that website is Rautenberg Druck (printing), you might charge them to print some advertising flyers, not books. Books are published by Rautenberg Verlag (publishers), specialized on Eastern European history, guidebooks etc. A respected publishing house, you will find some of their books in every German bookshop. HerkusMonte (talk) 14:56, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Ok, thanks for the correction. I understand that the author is credible as well reading from the text of another version of the book. Does she/he write why the location names were changed during Nazi rule in Germany? Personally I know in general that many were to be named in more "German" versions to hide their Polish and Slavic origins-is this the case here? --MyMoloboaccount (talk) 15:09, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
It's hardly possible to explain in one or two sentences why many Masurian placenames were changed in the 1920s/30s. In an abridged version, after WWI and the East Prussian plebiscite, the Masurians wanted to show their loyalty towards Germany and erase any "un-German" traditions. HerkusMonte (talk) 15:17, 5 July 2010 (UTC) P.S.: here's another source, a dissertation at the University of Osnabrück.[reply]
after WWI and the East Prussian plebiscite the Masurians wanted to show their loyalty towards Germany and erase any "un-German" traditionsSource? The plebiscite happened in 1920, the names you gave are from 1933 onwards from what I can see. Why would Masurs wait 13 years to rename their towns and villages? I was under the impression those name changes were made under the direction of the Nazi party? Is that incorrect?--MyMoloboaccount (talk) 15:20, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
The Nazis ordered a batch rename in 1938. While some renames were spelling adaptations and the like, and I guess that and occasional earlier changes is what HM refers to, others were fantasy names especially in the border regions, made without any historical sense and motivated only by Hitler's and Koch's attempted re-definition of "German". Skäpperöd (talk) 19:14, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Great, this is exactly the kind of information I was asking about. Do you have a (English lang - my personal curiosity is piqued) source which discusses this? Was Koch in charge of the renaming? This is definitely the kind of context that is needed if the "Nazi names" are to be included in article text.radek (talk) 00:14, 6 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Nazi names for Polish places

On the inclusion of these, I think an important issue which should be clarified first and which can shed some light on what to do about it, is the question I raised above: why were already German names changed by Nazi Germany (or even, according to Herkus above, Weimar Germany). What was the motivation behind this renaming, who or what body was responsible for carrying it out, etc. Generally, however, since these names were in use only shortly, and under what might be termed "extraordinary circumstances" (i.e. Nazi party in power in Germany) I don't think they belong in the lede, though they might very well be significant enough to discuss, along with the proper context, in the body of relevant articles.radek (talk) 12:21, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I tend to agree: in my personal opinion changes made for purely political reasons don't really belong in the lede. However, we do mention all the names for Rastembork, Łęk, Żądzbork, Lec and Wartembork in the lede. That last one even mentions the other politically-driven name used for the town. So it very much seems that my personal opinion flies in the face of what has become accepted here. Varsovian (talk) 14:04, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Hmmm, the obvious difference here is that the present names of the places do belong in the article title or lead.radek (talk) 20:33, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I entirely agree. My point is that neither Rastembork, Łęk, Żądzbork, Lec nor Wartembork are the present names and that Wartembork was politically-driven name change (as was Nowowiejsk) but it is still in the lede. Varsovian (talk) 15:35, 6 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Katyn redirects

Hello, I'd like to gather some comments and suggestions (especially from Piotrus as the original poster) for the redirect structure over there. Basically, if it's okay to move the contents of Katyn (disambiguation) to Katyn, make Katyn redirect to the massacre directly, or maybe create some novel solution for the Wikipedia:MALPLACED problem. --Illythr (talk) 20:48, 7 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Tentatively I have no objections. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 16:36, 9 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Mass renames

One other thing: yesterday, an IP and two users (probably the same person) have renamed a bunch of articles about events in Ukraine using modern Ukrainian names (e.g. "Battle of Lwów (1918)" to "Battle of Lviv (1918)"). I have reverted some of the more obvious (to me) moves (WW2 battles), but don't feel confident enough to revert the others (Polish wars). Perhaps someone knowledgeable in how these events are called in modern English can take a look? --Illythr (talk) 22:48, 8 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Unnecessary redirects

Could somebody take a look at why those articles (Provisional Council of State, Regency Council, and Polish Border Strip), the first two of which are certainly notable, were recently redirected? --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 16:34, 9 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I'm gonna undo these redirects as I see no justification for them offered and I can't think of one myself. I'll also raise this at the editor's talk page, since these kind of redirects essentially amount to deleting articles without a proper AfD process. I might also, if I find a bit of time expand them a bit.radek (talk) 18:54, 9 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Good. In that case, here's a similar (if a bit older) situation: some articles from Template:Administrative division of Poland were turned into redirects. Administrative division of Duchy of Warsaw was merged to Duchy of Warsaw; Administrative division of Congress Poland was merged partially into Congress Poland and partially into Privislinsky Krai (which was then deleted and redirected to Vistula Land, with part of the merged content lost). I suggest fixing this mess by restoring both "administrative..." articles, and summarizing/moving parts of Duchy of Warsaw and Congress Poland articles back to them. Similarly, some articles on notable institutions were redirected: Namiestnik of the Kingdom of Poland (again, part was merged to deleted PK article), Administrative Council of Congress Poland (this one by Malik). Please note that each of those articles had a number of associated redirects that, if the merger is reverted, need to be retargeted as well. I think those article were notable stubs with potential for proper expansion. Thoughts? --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 18:20, 11 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Additional eyes needed

I have just reblocked User:Rivenburg, who was blocked back in 2007 for strongly biased editing of Michel Thomas. Ultimately, his block was reviewed, and was reduced to a ban on editing that specific article (talk page editing permitted). He has recently returned and edited the article using the Rivenburg account; however, a review of the article's history compared with available checkuser data strongly indicates that he has continued editing while logged out for much of the time of his topic ban.

This article needs review by people with some knowledge of the historical period involved, and I will cross-post this to the Polish and Military History wikiprojects; however, in the interim, it would be very helpful if a few folks would add this page to their watchlist and keep an eye out for further biased logged-out edits. Thanks. Risker (talk) 06:22, 12 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I suggest also posting to WikiProject France, and Biography. His connection with Poland seems rather small. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk 09:43, 12 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Princes and Aristocrats

Hi All,

I was reading the very nice article about Elżbieta Sieniawska. For some reason though, Sobieski's children there are called "princes". Perhaps it should be made clear in some place that the children of Polish kings (barring the Piast dynasty) were not allowed to use the title of "prince". "Królewicz" doesn't have an English equivalent. Either it should be always said that a Sobieski was a son of the king, or perhaps it'd be better to create an article about królewicz and królewna, and use the titles in reference to the kids. What do you think?

Another problem are the "aristocrats". Thankfully, a great number of Wiki articles use the word "magnate", but from time to time one can spot a "Polish aristocrat". Shouldn't it be somehow standardized to have clear rules about what Polish nobles can or cannot be called? After all the early abolishment of aristocracy was one of Poland's major achievements.

Of course, everything changed with the Partitions of Poland, when some nobles (though very few) indeed became aristocrats, but not "Polish aristocrats", only Russian, Prussian and Austrian, no? --SylwiaS | talk 15:15, 14 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Using XIX and early XX century sources from German Empire in articles about Polish cities about their history?

A user has added among others works produced in German Empire to claim that statemants made by Polish authorities from XXI century are wrong: [33] The works in question are Theodor Eisenmänger, Geschichte der Stadt Schmiedeberg im Riesengebirge, Verlag May Woywod, Breslau, 1900, p.1 Allgemeine Deutsche Biographie, Band 23, page 261, Markgraf, Duncker & Humblot, 1886

I do not believe works from XIX and early XX century can speak about what was written in XXI century(obviously this is not possible). In any case should such works be used in articles about Polish cities as statements of fact? --MyMoloboaccount (talk) 11:37, 16 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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