User talk:ThatPeskyCommoner/Archive 14

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Archive 13 Archive 14 Archive 15

IG Farben

It was codswallop - I have warned the IP. If he repeats, revert and warn again, back to AIV if he goes past #4 warning. Cheers, JohnCD (talk) 10:35, 7 May 2012 (UTC)

Hehe! I thought it probably was! I only noticed it because that page got left on my watchlist! Vandalism-reverting-stuff isn't something I usually do. Pesky (talk) 10:38, 7 May 2012 (UTC)

Biology and political orientation

a lovely read that has no lede. Penyulap 16:11, 7 May 2012 (UTC)

Fascinating! Here's your homework: work up a possible lede for it, in your sandbox. Cover the basic points from each paragraph / section, and make it read nicely. Then, if you think it's good enough, copy it into the article. Pesky (talk) 20:32, 7 May 2012 (UTC)
Sorry to butt in. Just taken an ultrarapid look. On scientific/encyclopedic grounds, the page looks seriously problematic to me... Then I went to the talk page and saw that this "biology" and ("politics") article is only marked as being of interest to one particular political project. Why? But I don't have the time or inclination to get involved. Just feel the need to point this out. In haste, —MistyMorn (talk) 09:22, 11 May 2012 (UTC)

Ponies having a lot of fun

Some of the gang in high spirits

What fun! New Forest ponies are bred for racing, which has been a pastime of Forest Folks for many, many years. And here you can see the results of that breeding – some of the Home Gang at play, racing for the sheer hell of it ... and merrily churning up the field in the process! [Sigh. Now we will have to roll it ...]. Pesky (talk) 13:07, 8 May 2012 (UTC)

That's really cute actually. I'm going to take a guess that you don't do much riding these days? (I saw the sugery notice at the top) MrLittleIrish (talk) © 13:38, 9 May 2012 (UTC)
I haven't been able to ride for about 18 months, now (mostly due to lack of opportunity, what with being a full-time carer). The biggest pony in that vid. is mostly-broken-in, but will have to do some major revision before he works again, as he hasn't been worked with for years! That's one of this year's projects; along with breaking-in the nearly-black youngster there. Fortunately my son is a good horseman, and has more time on his hands than he has had for a while, so it's looking promising :D He's also lightweight enough that the nearly-black youngster will have no trouble carrying him. Pesky (talk) 06:38, 11 May 2012 (UTC)

re ANI favor (above)

I keep being told there is a communication problem. It seems I'm the only one in-step here and its a lonely feeling. I mean it seems the problem must be me. Please whip off my blinkers and explain, I promise to stand quietly. Sincerely, Eddaido (talk) 04:48, 9 May 2012 (UTC)

Hi Eddaido; I see that thread got archived! I'm copying in here the last bits that I put up there, so it's easier for you to find (instead of having to hunt through archives, which can be a pain!)
Okay, while I'm thinking, here's a project for both of you to do. In your own sandboxes, go through all the bits of your arguments with each other, note the diff, and then write what you thought the other person was thinking about it at the time. Let me know when you've done that. Adding: you both might find it a helpful exercise to read this.

You guys might find Andy / Eddaido interactions and SamBlob /Eddaido interactions and Andy / SamBlob interactions a useful tool. ;P All kudos to SW for creating this research-facilitator.

Communication problems are more common around here than many people think they are! We have quite a high proportion of Asberger's and autism-spectrum editors, as well as people whose first language isn't English (though that's sometimes not easy to spot). Words are strange things; they can mean different things to different people, and some of our most common flare-ups stem from different usage of words. We have words which are used in England far more freely – and with different nuances – than they are in the USA, for example.

Did you go through all the arguments and try to work out what the other person was thinking? That's often a useful start to trying to suss out where things went wrong. We often write things with an expectation of how the other person will react to them, and we sometimes get that wrong. And that works the other way around, as well – we often react very differently from how the other person expected when they wrote something.

The next step, after doing the project mentioned above, is to find out if the other editor can then look at what you thought they were thinking, and tell you what they were actually thinking. Then you can compare the two and see where mistakes were made. Let me know when you've put together your project page, OK? Pesky (talk) 05:11, 9 May 2012 (UTC)

Yes I went through most of those listed interactions and was pleased to see them all like that (and grateful to SW). I decided what I should write on the Andy Dingley interactions and decided on my report. I then considered the likelihood of his doing likewise and decided that was a no-brainer and I would sit tight and wait for a prompt from you when I would respond with "pleased to put mine up when you can confirm he has his ready and will put them up also".
With SamBlob it was a case of one-size-fits-all.
I believe the essential difference here is that whereas I am writing of events and subjects which I (possibly oddly) found fascinating at the time Andy Dingley and SamBlob, I feel sure, are writing of things they regard as remote history upon which Andy Dingley has his own (very often correct) strongly held convictions.
I guess we all tend to assume other people think the way we do (and use language the way we do). I'll pause now and contemplate my unfinished breakfast glass of urine ;) I need to know if I'm heading in the right direction. Your thoughts and instructions please. Sincerely, Eddaido (talk) 09:37, 9 May 2012 (UTC)
The most important part is you working out what other interpretations people might be putting on your words! Ideally, think of at least two possible things they might have been thinking, for each of your comments. It can be very hard for some of us to "see" the other side of an ambiguity. If Andy / Sam doesn't want to join in, you might find input from some of my (many!) talk page stalkers to be useful instead. Sometimes the safest thing to do with edit summaries is to use the built-in multiple-choice pull-down-menu options (which cover most eventualities). If you don't have those at the moment, click on "My preferences" at the top of the page, then go to the tab "Gadgets", you should find an option under the Editing section for "Add two new dropdown boxes below the edit summary with some useful default summaries". Tick the checkbox next to that. Using default edit summaries can avoid a lot of misunderstandings in edit summaries. Pesky (talk) 10:10, 9 May 2012 (UTC)

GA review of New Forest pony

Review's finished now, just a few issues to either deal with or persuade me I'm wrong – stranger things have happened. ;-) You can find it here. Malleus Fatuorum 14:52, 9 May 2012 (UTC)

Hi Pesky - I've just had a quick shufty and enjoyed what I saw. As an equine layman (so not to speak!) I'd be happy to chip in at some point in the GA process, though I might not have time to do much until next week. However, if you'd like me to start a rapid review, I could probably fix something today: my top tip right now would be to provide an introductory sentence at the start of the History section to provide closer focus on the New Forest pony aspect. Best, —MistyMorn (talk) 16:21, 9 May 2012 (UTC)
I'm going to do a run-through too, if I screw up anything, just revert me, but look at the area, as it was tweaked because I though there was an awkwardness or something, my solution might not be the best one, but it will be a flag that something is a little wonky... Montanabw(talk) 05:35, 10 May 2012 (UTC)
Thanks very much guys :D I'm hoping to get that all done today, but it rather depends on Real Life. Mother has got a very nasty chest infection (coughing up gunk the approximate colour of British Army green, eewwwwww), but she's just started on her third day of antibiotics and feels well enough to sit up and listen to the radio downstairs instead of staying in bed. Just as well, as she's also now got a nasty bedsore at the base of her spine (emaciated, so much pressure on bony areas); though it does mean I'll get more interruptions. Pesky (talk) 10:29, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

Pesky Express

Barnstar of Humour Hires.png The Barnstar of Good Humor
I can't eat any of the food, and my experiences on Slamtrak turned me off when it comes to trains, but I still got a kick out of the "Pesky Express". INeverCry 03:14, 10 May 2012 (UTC)
If anybody want their own personalised WikiLove, Penyulap is the guy to ask! He's a wonderful creative genius and can design something to suit your specific tastes and / or sense of humour. All hugz to Penyulap for designing my gourmet train :o) Pesky (talk) 10:26, 10 May 2012 (UTC)


I left another comment in response to your question regarding Messianic Judaism. If I was at all right about one of your possible unstated points, I hope you see fit to respond; if I was wrong, well, that just means I screwed up once again, and my apologies.

And my thanks for your continuing to be an editor at all after a rather serious surgery as that you have recently undergone.

Oh, and regarding your infobox at the top of the page - whatever you do, don't say "meow." User:Meowy and others already have that field covered, although I'm not sure if they are quite as, um, determined breeders as Greebo is. John Carter (talk) 20:30, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

I have left another reply over there. I've often wondered whether Greebo [who "by dint of considerable effort, was every male ancestor for the last thirty generations" for those of you who don't know your Discworld] was a typical Pratchettistic (?) play on Gris Beau, which, like grey malkin / Grimalkin was a witch-cat name. We have a Brynmalkin ... no prizes for guessing what colour he is. Pesky (talk) 21:47, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

Am I doing this correctly?

Regarding the assignment you gave at AN/I, currently at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/IncidentArchive750#Harassment by User:Andy Dingley: While I figure the "both of you" meant User:Eddaido and User:Andy Dingley, the assignment looked interesting (although not nearly as interesting as the resource tools that you made available), and I decided to try it as well. What I have so far is here: User:SamBlob/sandbox#What was Eddaido thinking?

However, I am not sure I am doing this correctly. I had initially thought I was being asked to say what I thought Eddaido was thinking when he made his edits. Now I am not sure. Was I supposed to do that, or was I supposet to say what I thought Eddaido thought when he saw my edits?

Sincerely, SamBlob (talk) 22:55, 12 May 2012 (UTC)

Sam, how great to hear from you! I'm really pleased :D Ideally, try and work out what he (and Andy, too, if you feel up to it!) was thinking both for his / their own edits, and when they were reading yours. I'll take a look through what you've done so far (it's 04:00 here, and I've just woken up ... so I may not get back to you immediately). Scottywong has just pointed me to a new tool he's done,, where you can put in more than two editors. SW is brilliant at making new tools for us – what a brain, eh? You might find that one useful, as well. There are so many things we have to take into account when we're interacting online. The other person's native language may not be English, or it may be a slightly different variety of English (US/ UK/ Aussie, etc.); then there are the various different ways of thinking (we have a lot of autsim spectrum editors here, myself included); they may just be coming to the idea from a different cultural background (and cultural differences have far more effect than many people realise); lastly, of course, we can't see their expressions, or hear their tone of voice! Online interactions are plagued with all sorts of minefields which can make us totally misunderstand where the other person is coming from.

I have a few other WikiJobs to catch up on, as well, and I may be called away at any moment as my mother is very poorly :o( But I promise I'll read through what you've done. The really interesting part, of course, is when you've all done the work, and you each go through and read each others! That's when everything starts to get untangled and everyone starts suddenly to understand each other, and understand what when wrong, and how. Hugz! Pesky (talk) 03:07, 13 May 2012 (UTC)

Thanks a bunch!

Hey thanks a bunch for helping me out on the Aaron Rodgers article. It's my first GA attempt and I can honestly say I've put more work into it then anything else I've done on the encyclopedia.--SKATER Is Back 01:40, 13 May 2012 (UTC)

Hi Skater; I only had a very brief look at it really. As and when I can, I'll look through a bit more, maybe do a few copy-edit tweaks (though I hate sports articles, lol! It will be good for me!) I can totally recommend Malleus to work with; he's so honest and straightforward (and almost always right!) about article stuff. A real gem. I was impressed already by the standard of it, way, waaaaay, waaaaaay better than those disgusting little unreffed stubby things I used to come across while on new page patrol! A whole different league, as it were ;P Pesky (talk) 03:11, 13 May 2012 (UTC)
It wasn't in that bad of shape, though I didn't write much of it. I completely rewrote the backup seasons and added the scouting section but other then that I'm just fixing stuff.--SKATER Is Back 05:21, 13 May 2012 (UTC)


You're from Ringwood? That was one of the towns I visited when I first went to England in 1996, because a friend of mine lived in the area. I got a ton of shite for being a "Yank", but one local liked me because of my FBI hat: he was an X-Files fan. When I went to the next town on my journey, I said I had been to Ringwood, and was met with confused looks. "Why were you in Ringwood? It's a rough town." I thought it was funny; but I sensed the same thing. Cheers... Doc talk 05:03, 13 May 2012 (UTC)

Hehe! I'm not actually from Ringwood, nor do I live there ... but it's not far from us, and our (excellent) local pub stocks their ales. I live about half way between the edge of the Forest and the Solent coastline. Pesky (talk) 05:12, 13 May 2012 (UTC)

I love the area - though I found Penzance to be the ultimate gift on that leg of the trip. Tourists, eh! I believe it was in Dorchester, while I was hunting down an old ancestor who left for the "New World", where I got the "Ringwood" stares. They were perplexed as to why I had even dreamed of going there. Cheers :> Doc talk 05:19, 13 May 2012 (UTC)

Awww, it's not a bad little town, really. I've known far worse. Did you visit Kynance Cove while in Cornwall? Now that's a magical place :D Pesky (talk) 05:23, 13 May 2012 (UTC)
Mullion harbour

I didn't even make it to Saint Michael's Mount, unfortunately. Had some really good mead in Penzance though; you can't get that stuff over here, especially the wonderful flavored meads. I was told afterwards, headed north to Scotland on the train, that Land's End was far better than Penzance, and that we had done the wrong thing by not going there. There's always next time though! Doc talk 05:27, 13 May 2012 (UTC)

Make "next time" soon! And fit in a few days in the New Forest as well. I can introduce you to some areas that most grockles tourists never see, which are much nicer than the well-trodden trails. And "do" the Lizard peninsula – eating fish and chips while sitting on the harbour wall at Mullion Cove is a must-do experience. (And you may see Grey seals and / or Harbour seals there, too.) Pesky (talk) 05:54, 13 May 2012 (UTC)

Do I really look that hungry?

Apparently the cats think so. This morning I have been given a rat and a sparrow. How nice. Pesky (talk) 09:06, 14 May 2012 (UTC)

hehe, get a beehive. Penyulap 15:28, 15 May 2012 (UTC)

Eek, scary!

I've just nominated my first FAC ... probably the scariest thing I've done yet on the 'pedia. Does it being scary make me a sad individual, or just a coward? Pesky (talk) 09:27, 14 May 2012 (UTC)

Don't be sad, don't be scared, go for the ride and enjoy it! - I had the phenomenal luck to have been co-nominated for Messiah by two experts. Talking FA: what do you grandmother think about yesterday's? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:40, 14 May 2012 (UTC)
Was it Mother's Day? I don't take much notice of these things, lol! I don't have spare time for video games; it's all spent on Wikipedia! Pesky (talk) 09:45, 14 May 2012 (UTC)
It was in the US and here, and DYK reflected it nicely. A video game seemed not the best possible choice, as I explained in "the wrong place". - Enjoy your family, any day! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:52, 14 May 2012 (UTC)
I have a different feeling about FAC probably because of FAR, I think that the people I dealt with are all very kind and nice. When you run out of ideas on how to fix up an article and make it even better, they give you ideas. I would think that, given improvement can go on forever, then generally single editors often run out of ideas. Have you run out of new Forest Pony ideas yet :) ? Penyulap 15:44, 15 May 2012 (UTC)
I can't see any baby ponies ! aww? Penyulap 15:47, 15 May 2012 (UTC)
Penyulap, in the meantime, try foal. Montanabw(talk) 21:52, 15 May 2012 (UTC)


Well, If my work on Wikipedia is that big of a damn issue that some editors are just getting irked of for no reason, and then they assume I have bad faith, then fine, SP and Floquenbeam win, I'm out. I hope that satisfies them for all that so-called pain they were having and then they can just leave me alone. It's a project for fucks sake, not a place to hold grudges for what happened in the past. YOu can email me further if you want further inquiries. Khvalamde :   Argue, Scream, Chat, Yell or Shout   11:17, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

I think sometimes we just need to remember that some of the things we do, with the best of intentions, can seriously wind other people up. Fitting in with a community involves sometimes just feeling our way gently to work out what's OK, what's OK for a while but not too much or too often, what's only borderline OK at the best of times, and what's never OK. It's not always easy to work this stuff out. Thing is, if what you;re doing is causing hassles (for you or other well-meaning people), then it's time to do something different. That's usually a pretty easy thing to remember; it's just the noticing-when-you-need-to-change bit that can be tricky sometimes. Anyways, it's not worth you getting het up or upset about. If you want to be happy here, you have to work out how that works; if you;d rather not be here at all (i.e. if the stress levels make the whole thing not worth it), then by all means leave. Nothing stopping you taking a break and coming back later. Here's a thing to remember, though:

Insanity is keeping on doing the same things and expecting different results.

Pesky (talk) 12:50, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Thanks. Well, I certainly don't want stress from this project coming into real life (When it already has numerous amounts), and plus I've got better things to attend to in real life than spend here. True, Wikipedia teaches you good collaboration skills, but it's also home to holding grudges against one another. Anyways, my exams are coming up next week and my final graduation year, and plus, I don't plan on coming here anymore anyways, though I will just treat this encyclopedia as a book rather than an encyclopedia. Anyways, all I can say that if my work on Wikipedia is really causing that much of a hassle, It's none of their business, so why should they even care. I see more people leaving than wanting to register an account here. Forcing upon opinions in a harsh mannerism by Floquenbeam isn't going to help me better, nor will it help him. All I can say is that If my work is that much of a deal, Floquenbeam wins, I'm out, and I hope that my departure satisfies his desires, and he can just leave me alone. After all, he just wanted to get me blocked. Tell you that, tell him to kindly refrain from making contact to me ever again. I am now leaving for good. Now I am utterly convinced that Wikipedia isn't the right place for anyone, and is a project with no future. Khvalamde :   Argue, Scream, Chat, Yell or Shout   13:18, 18 May 2012 (UTC)
I'm sorry you feel that way about it, but you obviously know what is the best thing for you. It's a mistake to think of situations like this as people "winning" or "losing"; it's not supposed to be a battle in here! I've always found Floq to be a real gem, personally; one of those people whose heart is in the right place, but I can appreciate it if you just don't get on with him. We're all different in who we get along with and who we don't. Best of luck with your exams! Don't revise too hard, it only makes you go stale, and remember to eat healthy, make sure you don't get dehydrated, and get out into the fresh air whenever you can. Those things, if you don't take care of them, can stop you being at your best for the exams. Pesky (talk) 13:29, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

The quirky days

It's been one today, but on the other hand I can come up with quirky awards on them slightly faster than they can be deleted, actually so far nothing has been deleted, but I think some of my ideas are strange. like The Donut of DOOM which is going into human testing. Still, maybe tomorrow I can think of something better to do. I give up on useful though, there is too much drama in it. Like I draw the Chinese space station and it disappears, well, blinks on and off, and then OPSEK is like huh ? I'd rather be doing something like that but ooh, the dramas. (but don't say I was talking space stuff) there is quite a circus going on in other places over there. Penyulap 15:27, 15 May 2012 (UTC)

Oh, I got you into a spot of hunting on my talkpage too. Penyulap 15:07, 17 May 2012 (UTC)
I hope you are well. Penyulap 15:09, 17 May 2012 (UTC)
Busy days, full days, quirky days, yes. My mother's condition deteriorated quite badly while she was off on respite care over the weekend. She's picked up a little now, but we've been very busy tied up with all sorts of things. They have a DNR in place on her now, and we've just had a hospital bed installed at home for her (one of those ones where you can change all the angles etc. at the press of various buttons). She probably doesn't have very long to live, now, but there's no way of predicting whether it's weeks, or (more likely) days. My sister and brother-in-law travelled down on Wednesday (four hours' drive each way); sister was very tearful. I seem to have forgotten how to cry.

I love your Do(ugh)nut of DOOM, and the hunting pic! And your explanation of why the horse is running faster than the train had both me and my younger son in fits of giggles. You have one of the most wonderful minds I've encountered in a very, very long time :o) Auties rule, OK! Pesky (talk) 04:45, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

Sorry to hear of your Mother's deterioration. Best wishes. PamD 07:05, 18 May 2012 (UTC)
She's very up-and-down; we never know from one hour to the next where we're at. For example, this morning she was able to call me upstairs and communicate perfectly lucidly (albeit very quietly!) about what she wanted to drink, where she had pain, etc.; then went off into "rambling" mode and I couldn't work out what it was that she was trying to communicate. We have her on Oramorph now, instead of paracetamol, as she has trouble swallowing some textures, and the Oramorph is 2.5ml as opposed to 10 or 20 ml, for much greater effect. One of our biggest emotional challenges is getting my sister to accept that, at this stage, it is very much kinder to Mummy not to go overboard on trying to "treat" things. It's very hard for my sister; she has the whole guilt thing about not having been able to do anything practical, or even see much of Mummy, and she's reliving the distress of never having been able to say goodbye to Daddy before he died (it was very sudden, at the end.) We cope, somehow; just have to take each hour as it comes, and play it by ear. Pain-relief is probably the highest priority in terms of nursing care. Thanks for your best wishes; it really does help having WikiFriends who care. Pesky (talk) 07:19, 18 May 2012 (UTC)
So sorry to hear about your Mum Pesky. I lost mine suddenly a few years ago. It can be both a difficult and joyful time. I wish you ease in this transition time, both for her and for you and your family.(olive (talk) 14:27, 18 May 2012 (UTC))
Thank you for telling me about the giggles, a lot of my humour is very peculiar, not that I mind at all, I'm happy to make jokes even when I'm the only one in the world who will 'get' them, and not care. Van Gough couldn't sell his paintings, but I do like that you and others do like.
I am glad that you and your mother can live together. It is normal for families everywhere, but not in 'western' countries. I just can't imagine how it can work like that, with big empty houses. I cannot see how anything can replace family. Penyulap 18:49, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

New section about new sections

Sorry I uh... I dunno. I felt compelled. Sorry. Equazcion (talk) 14:47, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

Hehehehe! Hugz ... I know all about those compulsive tendencies, lol! Pesky (talk) 19:28, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for trying

Thanks for weighing in on the Messianic Judaism 'discussions.' Your edit was neutral and was a good compromise, but it only lasted 1 hour and 14 minutes before it was reverted with the comment "Which sources support that claim?" And so it goes. POV comments challenging the neutrality of other editors, and bully methods to those that don't comply. Thanks anyway.--DeknMike (talk) 05:11, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

Good grief ... I wasn't trying to call the movement "Modern Messianic Judaism", lol! "Modern" just happened to be the first word in the sentence. If I'd started the sentence with "Today's Messianic Judaism" would they have thought I was trying to name the movement "Today's Messianic Judaism"? Maybe someone should suggest wording along the lines of "Messianic Judaism, as we know it today, emerged" (I would sincerely hope that nobody was quite moronic enough to argue that there is no source which calls it "Messianic Judaism As We Know It Today" ....). Perhaps someone should consider that the use of the word "modern" doesn't actually, really, mean that one is trying to change the name – merely to distinguish modern (descriptor) Messianic Judaism from earlier Jewish Christianity movements / backgrounds / roots which may or may not have used the phrase "Messianic Judaism" in either an official or unofficial way of describing the concept ... do you suppose it would have been reverted if it had started with "Twentieth-century Messianic Judaism", too? Sometimes I run out of suitable words with which to describe (in my own head, though not on Virtual Paper™) the kind of person who is apparently intellectually incapable of recognising the use of a clarifying adjective when they see one. Pesky (talk) 03:06, 22 May 2012 (UTC)
It didn't matter what word you used. They didn't want to listen to any voice that didn't say "Messianic Judaism is an invalid use of the term that was invented in the 1960s to trick Jews into converting to Christianity", and now they're free to rewrite it any way they choose. They banned any source that didn't agree with their notions, and now have banned me to suggesting their preconceived notions might not be true. I racked up so many edits because there was one of me and so many of them. Please look in on it for me from time to time.--DeknMike (talk) 04:28, 22 May 2012 (UTC)
I've put it back on my watchlist. It may be that I'm being over-sensitive (my mother is very close to death; frankly I'm surprised that she didn't die overnight), but I'm getting some "my way or the highway" vibes from over there, as it seems that you found. I'll just read up on a couple of things, and depending on what happens today, may do some hopefully-acceptable tweaks with the problem area. Pesky (talk) 04:49, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

New Page Triage/New Pages Feed

Hey all :). A notification that the prototype for the New Pages Feed is now live on enwiki! We had to briefly take it down after an unfortunate bug started showing up, but it's now live and we will continue developing it on-site.

The page can be found at Special:NewPagesFeed. Please, please, please test it and tell us what you think! Note that as a prototype it will inevitably have bugs - if you find one not already mentioned at the talkpage, bring it up and I'm happy to carry it through to the devs. The same is true of any additions you can think of to the software, or any questions you might have - let me know and I'll respond.

Thanks! Okeyes (WMF) (talk) 13:16, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

Hi Auntie,

A rather robust little critter who can no doubt eat anything, very important in these troubled times. Penyulap

I hope you are holding up well. I'm still making quirky awards with each one just off the target in a way that probably only amuses the two of us, I made another one, a kitten of sorts, I'll give it to you first, I hope it brings a little wiki-cheer when you are taking a break from RL, which I hope is going according to the plans of the universe, a nice broad well worn path would be nice at times like these, rather than a goat trail over a mountain. I hope the pain is no more than it is meant to be. Penyulap 17:27, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

My thoughts are with you and your mother. Penyulap 13:32, 22 May 2012 (UTC)
I know this isn't my page, but, I love love love your awards and this one especially...Its full of magic. And I second your words to Pesky, so beautifully put. I think you've made my Wikipedia day.(olive (talk) 14:27, 22 May 2012 (UTC))

Please comment on Wikipedia talk:The need for coordination

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Hey Pesky. Regardless of anything - I had to stop by here and say hi, I heard some news that was very sad, and I did want to offer you my honest heart and hugs. You are a truly wonderful person - please don't ever change that. You've won an old man's heart, and even if I have NO desire to see your pet snake - I still offer you my warmest and most sincere hugs that I could ever possibly give over the internet. You are a true gift girl. ALLLLLLL my best. k? — Ched :  ?  17:37, 23 May 2012 (UTC)

[Pesky snuggles into the big hugs] Bless you, Ched. I think you're wonderful, as well. Isn't it really bizarre how we can get so fond of people we've never actually met? Pesky (talk) 04:41, 24 May 2012 (UTC)
Comment - As per the nom Erm, I mean my sentiments agree with those of Ched. Look after yourself and don't worry about the stupid stuff that goes on here. - Sitush (talk) 06:52, 24 May 2012 (UTC)


Pesky, I'm not sure if we've ever interacted directly, although I've certainly seen your comments around the site, particularly at Malleus's talk page. In any case, I extend to you my condolences over the loss of your mother. May time bring you peace, and I hope that there are many good memories to cherish. LadyofShalott 23:03, 24 May 2012 (UTC)

Agreed. At times like this I wish I could do more than just say words like this. I do hope that you find some consolation from your family and animal friends. John Carter (talk) 00:11, 25 May 2012 (UTC)
  • I am very sorry for your loss. --John (talk) 17:42, 25 May 2012 (UTC)
Thank you all. Pesky (talk) 04:17, 26 May 2012 (UTC)

The bucket

Normally there seems no end to how happy or sad we can feel about something, for me, especially how long I can go on laughing and smiling about something, or so it seems, but there is a wall, there is a limit where something is still funny or sad or makes you angry but you can't laugh cry or yell anymore. Like driving off the road onto the grass, you keep on going and you notice the road gradually disappeared from under you, but you're still going the same speed and why is that, shouldn't you have stopped or slowed down or something ? And now you're way off the road and it's all different and weird and you hurtle onwards wondering what is going on.

God gave us just a bucket for our tears and that's all, it fills up slow and we can pour them our when we need to but it gets to the end and the tears run dry and we stop crying. The hurt doesn't stop, it keeps straight on the same way and we keep straight on going through the motions with an empty face and no tears and the exact same broken heart.

Just the way that we are made, except I think for that guy who had the hiccups for 25 years straight and is like 'kill me, [hic] kill me [hic] kill me'. In time, the central axis of your emotions just seems to slowly move back across to where it was, but that takes years. Always you will feel the sadness and joy, but the gravity of the situation gets further away. Time. Time is what it takes, and time is inevitable, Penyulap

I'd love to be able to cry; I'm sure it would be good for me. My sister can cry without any problem, but it's one of those things that I find almost impossible to do. I find my best "therapy" is just being busy. I really am glad that she's not suffering any more now. The past eighteen months, since my father died, must have been awful for her. They'd been together for 56 years; neither of them ever had another love, they were just meant for each other, and best friends as well as husband and wife. I like to think that, wherever they are now, they're both back in their prime, as it were. I'm sure there's some kind of a spirit which is no part of the body. And, like they say, if animals don't go to Heaven, then I want to go where they go ;P So would my parents. Pesky (talk) 20:17, 26 May 2012 (UTC)

I'm sorry

I'm sorry to hear of your great loss. I hope that, with time, the pain will wane, and that you'll find something, or someone, else to help fill up the massive hole in your life. Watch this first, though. --Sp33dyphil ©hatontributions 07:32, 28 May 2012 (UTC)

Wonderful song :o) I haven't really had time to miss my father, as we had to move in to look after my mother on the day my father died (which was a full-time job). I have a feeling that both losses will hit me together; but I also have tons of wonderful memories of both of them. Pesky (talk) 08:14, 28 May 2012 (UTC)

Out with the tide

"People can't die, along the coast," said Mr. Peggotty, "except when the tide's pretty nigh out. They can't be born, unless it's pretty nigh in - not properly born, till flood. He's a going out with the tide. It's ebb at half-arter three, slack water half an hour. If he lives till it turns, he'll hold his own till past the flood, and go out with the next tide."

Charles Dickens, David Copperfield

My mother left us this morning, going out with the tide. We're glad she's no longer suffering; she went very peacefully and just looks asleep. Pesky (talk) 05:34, 23 May 2012 (UTC)

I'm glad you were together, so many go out alone Penyulap
My condolences, Pesky. Doc talk 05:59, 23 May 2012 (UTC)
She's at rest now, and you know that you did all you could for her and much more than many people would have done. So glad it was peaceful at the end. PamD 07:36, 23 May 2012 (UTC)
So sad to hear that, Pesky love. At least she's at peace now and won't suffer. Big hugs, and my thoughts are with you and the family. OohBunnies! Leave a message 09:31, 23 May 2012 (UTC)
Condolences here too, —MistyMorn (talk) 10:43, 23 May 2012 (UTC)
Thinking of you. xox Nortonius (talk) 10:47, 23 May 2012 (UTC)
To lose the most important person in one's life is the hardest of knocks ... certainly was for me. Thank you for the splendid quotation. Kindest regards, -- Gareth Griffith-Jones (talk) 11:06, 23 May 2012 (UTC)
Pesky so sorry to hear, my condolences to you and yours on your terrible loss. Zad68 12:48, 23 May 2012 (UTC)
Oh Pesky, I'm so sorry. I know - and she knows/knew - that you made her every bit as happy as you could while she was here. My condolences to your family, and big hugs to you. A fluffernutter is a sandwich! (talk) 14:02, 23 May 2012 (UTC)
My thoughts are with you and your family, Pesky. WormTT · (talk) 14:04, 23 May 2012 (UTC)
(edit conflict)I don't recall that we've ever crossed paths, but even so, I'm sorry for your loss. I wish you and your family the best in this awful situation. :( Writ Keeper 14:06, 23 May 2012 (UTC)
That's really sad to hear, Pesky. Hope you are okay, as well as your family and the menagerie of wonderful creatures you have around you. Stay strong, we love you and are thinking of you. —Tom Morris (talk) 14:13, 23 May 2012 (UTC)
I'm so sorry to hear this Pesky, but I'm happy it was a gentle passing. Sending e hugs.(olive (talk) 14:54, 23 May 2012 (UTC))
Please accept my condolences as well. Intothatdarkness (talk) 15:31, 23 May 2012 (UTC)
  • With you and your OH :(. Sad to see your mother go; she was a lovely woman when I met her, with a wicked sense of humour. Keep thinking about that rather than any other aspect - in my experience it helps :). Okeyes (WMF) (talk) 15:37, 23 May 2012 (UTC)
Thinking of you, with a hug, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 17:06, 23 May 2012 (UTC)

My condolences to you and your family, Pesky.--Gilderien Chat|List of good deeds 17:35, 23 May 2012 (UTC)

  • Near Christmas, I too lost my mother. While I can not fully understand your individual loss, I understand all too well the pain, and I would offer you my deepest condolences. I wish you strength and peace during this difficult time. Dennis Brown - © 22:40, 23 May 2012 (UTC)
Bless you Pesky, you had a rough road there. She is at peace now. Montanabw(talk) 23:38, 23 May 2012 (UTC)

Thanks so much, guys. It is very strange not having her around; I've been so used to keeping one ear open for her all the time, it's weird not having to any more. Very hard to put my current feelings into words; it's more a sort of detached / dissociated quiet emptiness than grief as most people would probably understand it. My family were very touched by all your messages, too. Pesky (talk) 04:38, 24 May 2012 (UTC)

My prayers go out for you and your family Pesky. I hope you are able to get through these troubling times. If you ever want to chat with someone, I'm almost always on IRC. Ryan Vesey Review me! 05:29, 24 May 2012 (UTC)

My condolences and prayers to you and your family; I'm so sorry for your loss... Dreadstar 05:33, 24 May 2012 (UTC)

I'm sorry for your loss. You and your family are in my thoughts and prayers. God bless. AndrewN talk 05:49, 24 May 2012 (UTC)

Very sorry to hear about your loss. Mark Arsten (talk) 07:13, 24 May 2012 (UTC)

I just came to offer my condolences to you and your family. You will surely be in my prayers, as well. I wish you strength in these difficult times. Avicennasis @ 07:46, 3 Sivan 5772 / 07:46, 24 May 2012 (UTC)

Allow me to add my voice to the others above. My deepest condolences on your loss. I've never lost someone close to me so I can't know exactly how you feel, but I can guess that this must be a really tough time for you. Just remember that we are all here for you if you need us. — Mr. Stradivarius (have a chat) 09:50, 24 May 2012 (UTC)

Terribly sorry. Nobody Ent 10:13, 24 May 2012 (UTC)

Cursor blinking, don't know what to write. Wish I could find Wendy Carlos's version of "Sinfonia to Cantata No. 29" on YouTube for you. xxx --Shirt58 (talk) 12:18, 24 May 2012 (UTC)

May I add my condolences too. Sadly, the loss of our parents is something most of us have to face eventually but knowing that doesn't make it any easier. I was thinking of you as I was walking the dog this morning, watching the damsel flies and thinking about the circle of life. Life's a lot shorter for them, at least we get years rather than weeks. Richerman (talk) 12:39, 24 May 2012 (UTC)
I'm very sorry to hear of your loss as well. May your friends and family help you through this difficult time. I'll leave with this. Best Wishes. --  IShadowed  ✰  14:35, 24 May 2012 (UTC)
It gets easier every day, dear Pesky. The sense of loss doesn't go away, but it will get easier. This helped me a lot-when you're ready and if interested [1].(olive (talk) 14:12, 24 May 2012 (UTC))
An alternate version of PJ Harvey's 50ft Queenie here --Shirt58 (talk) 15:11, 24 May 2012 (UTC)
  • I'm late to offer my thoughts here, Pesky, but please accept my sincere condolences for your loss here. I am certain that your assistance, comfort and kindness made her transition to the other side far smoother and peaceful. My thoughts are with you, your other half, and your family. x — foxj 15:35, 24 May 2012 (UTC)
  • I'm also late (and like Lady says down below I don't think you and I have ever interacted), but hearing about your mother made me think "who will hug the huggers"? Well, apparently a whole bunch of people, but I want to also wish my best to you and yours. God bless, Nolelover Talk·Contribs 23:57, 24 May 2012 (UTC)
Condolences, Pesky. Have a hug from this tree. Pine 07:14, 28 May 2012 (UTC)
  • Is there any remover of difficulties save God? Say, Praise be God!. All are his/her servants and abide by God's bidding. ```Buster Seven Talk 20:56, 28 May 2012 (UTC)

Messianic Judaism

I am very happy to see other editors without a clear potential religious bias appearing in the above material. I wish I could point out a few reference books with good articles on the MJs, but the one I am currently most directly working with, for whatever reason, didn't include an article on them, or any real coverage of them so far as I can see. There are a few books on the subject, but most are either written by Jews or MJs, and are not unreasonably potentially biased. But I can try to review the ones available to me again, if there are particular points you might want to see their coverage of.

Oh, yeah, Greebo says "hello." Well, OK, it wasn't actually a "hello". Greebo doesn't really like dogs much. It was more of a "hsss," actually. Anyway, thought you might like to know. John Carter (talk) 22:38, 26 May 2012 (UTC)

BTW, I just realized that the above could be taken as some sort of insult/disparagment. Please believe me that all it was and is is an indication of my own really bizarre sense of humor. Sorry about that. John Carter (talk) 19:03, 27 May 2012 (UTC)
Hehehe! Hugz to you – it didn't strike to me for a moment as insulting; we obviously have a very similar sense of humour :D Pesky (talk) 03:24, 28 May 2012 (UTC)
I literally only just "got" the "dog" thing (I thought it was the wolf thingie). Just adding – one of my various nicknames is The Alpha Bitch (or just AlphaBitch), so Greebo is clearly very perceptive, too ;P Pesky (talk) 09:03, 29 May 2012 (UTC)

Might want to have a word

This was not a very good idea, especially after the editor was recently just being discussed on AN and they did a non-admin close of the previous related discussion. I think it's just going to pass unnoticed -- slow day -- but thought you might want to have a word. Nobody Ent 22:28, 28 May 2012 (UTC)

Ah, sorry; missed that one. It seems to have settled now anyway, and Pen's bright enough to get the hint that it was probably best left alone. Pesky (talk) 08:59, 29 May 2012 (UTC)

Like you need this

Sorry that an edit spat of mine wound up affecting your New Forest Pony article. We need to do some work on the horse tack articles and categories, but this samuraiantiqueworld guy doesn't know what he's doing plus has an axe to grind with me. (Another person who attacks me viciously because I call them on their stuff. This gets old). If you haven't watchlisted saddle and stirrup, would you be kind enough to do so? Montanabw(talk) 18:09, 29 May 2012 (UTC)

I will do that. I'm hoping, once I have some time to spare, to drag my Elwyn Hartley Edwards stuff out of storage (or wherever else it is) and reffing saddle stuff, etc. I'm really beginning to think that a topic ban for anything horse-related, broadly construed, might be in order for SAW. This has been going on for too long, and if I'm getting fed up with it, then it must be bad! Though it's probably not a good idea for me to revisit AN/I to start a thread right now. Maybe Chedzilla could have a look through, using Admin-Eyes. SAW has stayed off my talk since I asked them to, but I think this looks like grudge-bearing (and there's no room for that in the 'pedia; it's not collaborative or productive). Pesky (talk) 13:21, 30 May 2012 (UTC)
Your insight on the matter is valued. I was quite frustrated to be the person who was labeled the bad guy on some talk pages and when I asked for help, then suddenly I was the one who was put under scrutiny. But if they are pissing you off, then I do feel a bit of relief that I wasn't completely off base. Montanabw(talk) 16:45, 30 May 2012 (UTC)
No, I don't see you as being off-base at all. It takes a heck of a lot to break me out of the assuming-good-faith thing. Pesky (talk) 18:14, 30 May 2012 (UTC)


Sorry about the confusion on your refs on RS/N. Originally this }} was missing so I replaced what was there, but still the refs were not showing up so I tried the another format. I didn't see that the format I used had picked up the refs from another thread. (Note to self: check what you've edited more carefully) Anyway, seems fine now(olive (talk) 13:35, 30 May 2012 (UTC))

Heh! Yes, it got a bit glitchy! I'm not sure why the {{reflist}} style didn't work, but nvm. Between us, we seem to have got them sussed out. Pesky (talk) 15:45, 30 May 2012 (UTC)

samuraiantiqueworld on ANI

fyi; I've mentioned you at ANI in relation to user:samuraiantiqueworld and issues relating to New Forest pony and its FAC. See Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents#user:samuraiantiqueworld and false claims of outing. Br'er Rabbit (talk) 19:37, 30 May 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for the heads-up; I've responded over there. Pesky (talk) 08:12, 31 May 2012 (UTC)
  • Also .. I did reply on my talk in more detail - but yes. I agree with your assessment of the situation completely. Chedzilla (talk) 11:51, 31 May 2012 (UTC)

NF Pony origins

Pesky, see the discussion on my talk page, it actually seems more likely that an Iberian link to the UK ponies could easily be made via the Romans; far more likely than the Armada tales. But we are in OR speculation land on that, wanted to toss you the bone, however! I think you are onto something, just not sure what. Montanabw(talk) 18:50, 29 May 2012 (UTC)

Both could likely run into OR to prove one way or the other. Might be best to simply present both origin "stories" (and others if they exist) as possibilities if there are sources that use them. Just my two bits on the whole thing. Intothatdarkness (talk) 16:26, 30 May 2012 (UTC)
You may find it useful to see how we handled origin myths on the articles about Andalusians, Arabians and the Sorraia. See also my new sandbox, in which you all may come and play! (subject to the sandbox rules posted at my talk page) Montanabw(talk) 16:45, 30 May 2012 (UTC)
You might be able to add Morgans there as the breed from which all others in the US originated... ;-). Intothatdarkness (talk) 17:41, 30 May 2012 (UTC)
Heh! But everyone knows that the American horses are primarily descended from Iberians and Britishers ... ;P Pesky (talk) 18:13, 30 May 2012 (UTC)
Chedzilla (talk) 12:14, 31 May 2012 (UTC) <- say all horsey make crunchy tasty treat. Chedzilla (talk) 12:14, 31 May 2012 (UTC)
Apparently Chedzilla, so did the first humans to arrive on the North American continent, as the extinction of the ancient wild horse there correlates very closely in time! Montanabw(talk) 22:52, 1 June 2012 (UTC)

FAC timing

Pesky, saw your comment on the NF pony FAC page and wanted to comment here. It generally takes a minimum of three supports (often more, depending on the article) before the delegates consider there to be consensus to promote. You pretty much just have to be patient, although reviewing other articles on the FAC page can be helpful. Dana boomer (talk) 11:10, 1 June 2012 (UTC)

Gaaarrrrrkkkk! Patience is not my strong point; and right at this moment I don't feel competent to comment on other people's articles. I'm all burned out just now. Pesky (talk) 20:37, 1 June 2012 (UTC)
Maybe a bit more than what you were hoping for and not as rapid as you might like, but I'm doing my best to make any changes that you choose to accept easy to transcibe. Very best wishes, —MistyMorn (talk) 11:28, 2 June 2012 (UTC)
Patience has never been my strong suit either! I did finally get around to leaving comments at Exmoor pony, if you're looking for something horsey to do... Are you feeling burned out on reviewing or all around? If just on reviewing, there are plenty of horsey articles (including a bunch from Britain) that need some TLC... If all around - I know the feeling. As a remedy, I suggest a ride on your favorite pony, a cup of hot chocolate and a good book! :) Dana boomer (talk) 11:35, 2 June 2012 (UTC)
Thanks, guys. Dana, I'm a bit burned out all over; my mother died recently, there's a stack of work I've been needing to do on our land for two years (rebuilding the pound / corral, digging fresh drainage ditch-and-banks, opening up new areas, re-fencing, clearing scrub, thinning woodland, and so on ad infinitum); we're going to have to catalogue all my mother's belongings for probate, get her house ready for sale, move house, and all that stuff. I don't (at the moment) feel competent to review other people's articles (I would probably miss obvious stuff which needs to be done, and there are far, far better reviewers than I am!), though I do feel competent to go in and tweak and rebuild things. All the British native pony breed articles, my aim is to work through them at get them all up to at least GA and ideally FA, in the long term. I would love to go out for a ride on my favourite pony, though due to (my) multiple surgeries and other Real Life commitments (mainly caring for my mother over the past 18 months), I still have to finish breaking and schooling him! And my neurosurgeon has forbidden me even to hold a lead rein (with pony attached) for at least another 6 weeks, let alone getting on top of a pony, let alone getting on top of one who's not been sat on for nearly two years, and will have to start learning all over again, lol! Never mind, it will all come together in the end. Pesky (talk) 07:59, 4 June 2012 (UTC)
ooh, pretty thing to make you happy :)
Can't ride the pony, can't lead the pony with a rope, ask him quite seriously if it is ok to continue as you have been doing the last few days, holding the ponies tail while it leads you about. If he looks at you funny, accuse him of thinking your crazy and demand a refund for dodgy work !!
I'm voting against this image I proposed as a Barnstar. I like it, think of it as a lovely flower to cheer you up (and sorry in advance if it makes you lose your balance and fall over, oops!) Penyulap 08:21, 4 Jun 2012 (UTC)