Wikipedia:Teahouse

Nick Moyes, a Teahouse host

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One of the big editors

Header added by ColinFine (talk) 17:21, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

How do you get to be one of the big editors — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mattwags323232 (talk • contribs) 13:53, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

The only way I know is by making a lot of useful edits, Mattwags323232. --ColinFine (talk) 17:23, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

Life Time Abstract

Works And Tensions — Preceding unsigned comment added by Shekhar Niroula (talk • contribs) 15:26, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

Sorry, Shekhar Niroula, I have no idea what your question is about editing Wikipedia. --ColinFine (talk) 17:25, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

Do I use a 3-book 2D image, or a complete 7-book 3D image?

I've been trying to look for a 2D image of a complete box set for a book series article, but I've only been able to find 3D images (for example, https://store.scholastic.com/content/stores/media/products/42/9781338045642_default_pdp.gif). However, I've been able to find a 2D image of a 3-book box set. Which one is preferable in this scenario? The Verified Cactus 100% 16:31, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

That link just puts me to Scholastic's site, The Verified Cactus, so I can't tell what image you are referring to. But it seems to me that the relevant policy is WP:NFCC no 8: "Contextual significance. Non-free content is used only if its presence would significantly increase readers' understanding of the article topic, and its omission would be detrimental to that understanding." Unless one of them passes this test and the other fails, then I don't think it makes any difference. --ColinFine (talk) 17:31, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

ColinFine is on the right track, but not entirely correct. If the article is about 1 book only, using the covers of all 3 makes it fail WP:NFCC#3. Additionally, using a 3D image of 2D objects (book covers) makes the image fail WP:FREER (for some rather technical copyright reasons, but they have been tried and tested nonetheless and proven correct). – Finnusertop (talk ⋅ contribs) 18:14, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

Article deletion and how I can improve the article

My draft for the movie, "Hakwe's Vengeance" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Hawk%27s_Vengeance) has been deleted due to "Recreation of a page that was deleted per a deletion discussion." Can someone explain what this means? is there a way around it? It looks like in the past, it was not notable, but I have added more sources that I found online. How can I improve it in order to be accepted? Is there any site that cen be recommended?SpiritofFire (talk) 15:31, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

I want Wikipedia to be like google

I want Wikipedia to be almost like Google but more of an encyclopedia version.

Time235236 (talk) 09:34, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

@Time235236: Hi there.

Wikipedia mostly concentrates on being a great Encyclopaedia, not a search engine. Other companies, such as Google, do searching so much better.

You can use Google to search only on Wikipedia, by putting "site:en.wikipedia.com". For example, try googling site:en.wikipedia.com Thailand

The Wikimedia Foudation (Wikipedia's host company) have done some work on developing a search feature called the Knowledge Engine - but it's quite controversial. 86.20.193.222 (talk) 11:56, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

Is there a list of news sources deemed 'reliable' somewhere?

In particular, is Buzzfeed ok or not? In searching the web, I happened across http://www.businessinsider.com/wikipedia-has-banned-the-daily-mail-as-an-unreliable-source-2017-2, which interestingly cited Buzzfeed for "The decision by Wikipedia comes amid widespread debate over the rise of fake news, which has widened to include concerns about misleading information in traditional publications. A recent BuzzFeed analysis claimed that there was “little appetite” for completely fabricated “fake news” in the UK because the country already had a highly partisan press." Humanengr (talk) 05:50, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Noticeboard is the central place to discuss this sort of issue. I checked the archives there, and see multiple notes that Buzzfeed is generally not reliable. Maybe for some cases light/noncontroversial social/societal topics. DMacks (talk) 05:57, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

Wikipedia has its own internal magazine, called "Signpost", which has quite good coverage of that, in Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2017-02-27/In the media.

Of course, that is not a reliable source. But it does point to some.86.20.193.222 (talk) 12:04, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

Shouldn't the page name begin the 10th Panchen Lama?

Why is there a "redirect" from the very common name people use to a seldom used given religious names to talk about this reincarnate? Edit history shows what appears to be a re-occuring issue. See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Choekyi_Gyaltsen,_10th_Panchen_Lama

This lama is most commonly called the "10th Panchen Lama," which references a unique individual incarnate within a particular timeframe. People seldom use or even know the actual given religious name of each individual reincarnation. Tibetans and non-Tibetans alike, usually refer to the various Panchen Lamas by their numeric titles, infrequently their given religious names.

An related Tibetan example is the world-wide recognition and common use of the name "Dalai Lama,"while infrequently used is his religious given name of "Tenzin Gyatso." So, people then differentiate between his reincarnations by commonly refering to the "Dalai Lama: with the addition of the incarnation's numeric embodiment, such as the The Great 5th Dalai Lama, the 6th Dalai Lama, the seventh Dalai Lama, the Great 13th Dalai Lama, etcetera. Thank youA ri gi bod (talk) 05:22, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse, A ri gi bod. This is an issue that should be decided by editors with an interest in the topic, and with a degree of familiarity with the reliable sources that discuss the person. The general principles are discussed at WP:COMMONNAME, but any discussion about moving the article to a different name should take place on the article's talk page. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 07:33, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

HOW TO ADD A PERSON

Hello I have a person that I want to add to wikipedia how do I do this? FlaggTyokea (talk) 00:45, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

Hi FlaggTyokea. Has the person been written about in some depth by reliable sources, that are entirely independent of the person? What is your connection to the person, if any?--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 01:37, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

no he has not

FlaggTyokea (talk) 02:21, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

I have no personal connection to this person. I just looked him up and did not find a wikipedia. I thought it was strange seeing how he contributed to a part of american culture but he has not been written about in depth

FlaggTyokea (talk) 02:23, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

FlaggTyokea, the nature of an encyclopedia is we write about what has been written about a subject, not about the subject itself. So if nothing has been written about this person, there is nothing to write here. John from Idegon (talk) 02:57, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

how do it the others?

hallo, i try to do what others people do it, but i done in the wrong way... can you explane to me, step by step, how can i do it in the right way? for example i give you this link https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dario_Tamburrano how can i have a page like this? i can do it by my self? i need someone else help me? thank you, very, very, much! Fabdrbor (talk) 17:45, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Hello, Fabdrbor. You need to read the links that Marchjuly has put on your User Talk page. Put simply, the article Fabrizio Bortolon (which I presume is about you) does not belong to you, you do not have any control over its content, and essentially nothing that you say or want to say is relevant for the article, unless it has been published in a reliable source by somebody with no connection to you. You are welcome to suggest changes to the article, on its talk page Talk:Fabrizio Bortolon; but unless you back them up with references to reliable published sources independent of you, it is unlikely that anybody will execute your suggestions. The article it:Dario Tumburrano is of no relevance: I don't know whether or not it meets the standards of it.wiki, but it certainly has not got adequate references to meet the standard for a biography of a living person on en.wiki. --ColinFine (talk) 17:15, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

I've been here two minutes and already getting deleted!

Hello I am trying to write a page. It was deleted for being an ad. I had only written two sentences and still very much learning. I though the sandbox is where you play around until you get it right so why the deletion. It was not a real page yetAngrylittleminx (talk) 16:09, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Hello and welcome. I'm sorry you are having difficulty. Advertising is not permitted anywhere on Wikipedia, even in Sandboxes. Since I cannot see the page I cannot tell you exactly why it was deleted, but many Wikipedia users have a low tolerance for what seems to be advertising. For clarification, you could ask the user who nominated the page for deletion(their name is on your user talk page) specifically what the concern was. 331dot (talk) 16:12, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Cannot advance past "Click here to go back and make an edit" in Wikipedia Adventure

I get stuck on a loop in the Wikipedia adventure when asked to Edit summary, and Save. I click Save and it doesn’t appear to ‘take’ or save. Instead, I am returned back to the instruction box that says “Click here to go back and make an edit.” I have to X out of the Wikipedia adventure then to stop this loop. Is this happening to anyone else? How do you get out of this loop? Is it a problem with my java? Dnoelle (talk) 16:04, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

deleting users

Is it possible to delete users? The garmine ^(talk) 14:32, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Hi The garmine. User accounts cannot be deleted but users can be renamed and their user pages can be deleted. See more at Wikipedia:Courtesy vanishing. PrimeHunter (talk) 14:36, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

PrimeHunter- I see. That is a smart idea,because then new users might have a larger selection of names availible. The garmine ^(talk) 14:40, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

@The garmine: if you want another username, and that user account has not edited, or only a bit and it was a long time ago, you can request to "usurp" it. But you need to read carefully the page I linked to, it is not a trivial process. Tigraan^{Click here to contact me} 15:04, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

I see,Tigraan The garmine ^(talk) 15:06, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Six days, two pages created, multiple edits, and still no user page?

I started my new Wikipedia account six days ago. In that time I have submitted two pages for approval - and done numerous edits on each. One page has been redirected (I'm not sure what that means) and the other is in my sandbox#2. The latter is not publicly accessible. The redirect was for a while after I completed it, but now it isn't, for whatever reason.

When I log in, it tells me my user page does not yet exist. It's been six days now and probably at least 2 dozen edits cumulatively over the 2 pages. I have met both thresholds as far as I can see. What is the problem?

BMacmillan (talk) 13:32, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

@BMacmillan: Hello. I don't believe the thresholds have anything to do with your ability to create a userpage. Simply click on your username at the top of the screen(or even in your signature above) and post some content to your userpage; you may wish to review the Userpage guidelines for what types of content are permitted on user pages. Hope this helps you and good luck 331dot (talk) 13:34, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Yes, you could have created a user page at any time. Your first sandbox article is now at Draft:Marc Di Saverio where Sister Twister is giving you advice. That sandbox page can now be re-used for any other purpose. Dbfirs 13:55, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

@BMacmillan: As others indicate, a user page has to be created by the user (other editors can do it but that's rare). See Wikipedia:User pages for some of the things you can place on it. It's not required to make a user page. The page history of your sandbox [1] shows it was moved to another name. That automatically leaves behind a redirect to the new location. It's possible to edit redirects. See Help:Redirect#Creating and editing redirects. Your sandbox has already been edited to remove the redirect. All saved pages are publicly accessible unless they are later deleted by an administator. Click "Contributions" at the top right of any page to see your edits. Others see the same as you at Special:Contributions/BMacmillan and User:BMacmillan/sandbox2. Userspace pages are excluded from search engines by default and very few people will usually see a user sandbox. I have added {{User sandbox}} to User:BMacmillan/sandbox2 to give some helpful links and a submit button. You are free to remove {{User sandbox}} if you don't like it. PrimeHunter (talk) 14:18, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

personal feelings prevailing

if an editor chose to push his personal opinions against what is verifiable, should one just neglect the right up especially if it seems as though it is sponsored against some set, people or tribeStephmoras (talk) 08:31, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Is this about an edit war at MMM (Ponzi scheme company)? Discussion about content should appear on the talk page of that article. Dbfirs 08:41, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

How to manage broken links for citations

I posted this to the talk page, but not sure how those are surfaced. The https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Howard_Jones_(musician) has a number of items that cite a site that no longer exists. How should those be managed? Just pull the link or...? Sensedatum (talk) 06:25, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Hello Sensedatum and welcome to the Teahouse.

If you can't find archive or replacement links, the best thing to do for now is to mark them dead for a while so that other editors can get a chance to fix them. Eventually, content supported only by dead links will probably have to be removed from the article, but the timing of that may have to be discussed on the article's talk page first before anything is actually deleted. — jmcgnh^{(talk) (contribs)} 06:46, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Inquiry to the article posted for Buzuayehu Tadele Bizenu

Hi! I want to know specifically what is wrong with the article posted for Buzuayehu Tadele Bizenu. Most of the items I specify in the article has been supported by sources which came from the web news and journals online. Can you please help me with this? Thank you! RBR Account (talk) 05:44, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Hello and welcome, RBR Account! The AfC reviewer's comment was that the article reads like an ad. To your question, what is specifically ad-like:

• You use glittering generalities: for example, "visionary businessman", "dynamic and vibrant conglomerates", "armed with vision & entrepreneurship" - while these might be appropriate in a press release, they are not appropriate in an encyclopedia article
• Direct quotes: “Growth has no limit in my group,” says Bizenu. “There are lots of immense opportunities in this country. By focusing on two areas like agro-processing and mining, we keep the others as joint ventures and management contracts." - while direct quotes might be acceptable in a journalistic article or a press release, it is extremely unusual to use direct quotes in an encyclopedia article
• Unsourced claims of phenomenal achievements: You make a number of claims of outstanding successes which lack any sources to verify them. For instance, "Mr. Buzuayehu comes from a famous Ethiopian business family.", "It is Ethiopia’s leading tea exporter." These claims need to be supported by reliable sources, otherwise they appear to be marketing spin.

Please let us know if you have any other questions. DarjeelingTea (talk) 07:49, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

image

I have recently finished making the article Tandav (Nepali Movie) Can any admin upload the cover image of the movie,it is located here Here Thanks Sawongam (talk) 05:08, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

You can do so yourself, SawOnGam, with the WP:Upload wizard. You need to make sure the use meets all the criteria in WP:NFCC. But I'm not clear why you are giving a link to a blog-hosted copy of the poster, which may itself be a copyright violation. And in any case, before worrying about trivial pieces of decoration like images, I would advise you to improve the article. See WP:MOSFILMS for ideas. --ColinFine (talk) 12:00, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

I get messed with the blanks that I have to fill while uploading the image .So I requested to do so.ColinFine can you do it for me please see ?? Sawongam (talk) 12:17, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

No, SawOnGam. I've already advised you to spend time on the more important aspects of the article before worrying about the picture. I'm certainly not going to spend time on a picture for an article which may well get deleted. --ColinFine (talk) 13:10, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

It sounds like the image you want to upload would have to be a non-free, fair use exception. Those type of images can only be used on a live article. In other words, you can't use it until the article is published anyway. So don't worry about it. John from Idegon (talk) 06:10, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

How do I file a dispute on the German Wikipedia?

How do I file a dispute on the German Wikipedia? Jroccolv (talk) 04:57, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Follow the advice given here: (obviously in German): https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Konflikte#Konflikte_innerhalb_der_Wikipedia....Lectonar (talk) 08:50, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Rollback?

In case someone with rollback rights cares, I have reverted some humorous vandalism at Horse teeth but have no rollback rights to optimize the result, and undo was not sufficient (multiple edits were involved). I'm not sure if this is considered worth asking, or if this is the right place to request it (if not, please let me know), but here goes. Thanks, PaleoNeonate (talk) 23:32, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

I'll take a look. I have that permission, and that's a topic of interest to me anyway. White Arabian Filly ^Neigh 23:34, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Thank you very much. PaleoNeonate (talk) 23:44, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

@PaleoNeonate: I don't know how you reverted but see Help:Reverting#Manual reverting for a way to restore an old version. I have nominated the used image for deletion at commons:Commons:Deletion requests/File:Horse Teeth.jpg. PrimeHunter (talk) 23:53, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

@PrimeHunter: I initially thought of trying <undo> on every edit, but then decided to just make another edit reverting all the concerned changes. It also seems that I was confusing this procedure you just linked to with rollback. PaleoNeonate (talk) 23:59, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Hi PaleoNeonate. Since your revert did not capture all of the material that was added by the user, if it wasn't clear from the link provided for manually reverting, simply click on any edit in the page history you want to revert to (the date in the page history) → click edit → save. Best regards--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 00:32, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Now that I'm aware this is possible, it's what I'll indeed use in such future cases. Thanks again to all. PaleoNeonate (talk) 00:37, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Resolved

Reporting a suspicious user

I am not working with a vandalist user per se. His behavior is just a little suspicious and I feel that an administrator should at least look at his behavior to assess whether or not it is appropriate. Does anybody know the protocol?LakeKayak (talk) 22:49, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

LakeKayak, you can report at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents. If you're not sure the user is in the wrong though, a post on the talk page would be advisable before filing a full report. White Arabian Filly ^Neigh 23:46, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

I'm not sure if this is the best approach. My problem is really the user's contributions. (I met him through one of them.) He tends to edit almost exclusively on move discussions, and once made a move claiming "name not ambiguous". I feel that an administrator should only look at this and evaluate the appropriate course of action as they seem fit. In the case of this user in particular, I don't think that addressing the issue on the user's talk page will do any good.LakeKayak (talk) 02:36, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

The place to do this would be WP:ANI, LakeKayak, but at the top of that page it says:

• Before posting a grievance about a user here, please consider discussing the issue with them on their user talk page.

and

• When you start a discussion about an editor, you must notify them on their user talk page.

Asking admins to look at somebody without telling the somebody is really not in accordance with Wikipedia's principles. --ColinFine (talk) 11:51, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Fair enough.LakeKayak (talk) 13:18, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Updating an organization entry (article) following a name change

This is solved now, thank you! ~William

Bcrcomms (talk) 22:15, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Bcrcomms (talk) 21:58, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Personally, I would have liked to see this question and resolution kept here instead of replacing the entire entry with "This is solved now". This would allow others who might be in the same situation or just want to learn to read and understand the steps required, without having to post a separate item. - NsTaGaTr ^(Talk) 14:47, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Page access

• Lora Johnson (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Hi...is there any way to stop people from messing up the page about me (Lora Johnson)? Lora Elise (talk) 18:03, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

There doesn't seem to be any obvious problem with this article. Do you disagree with what it says? EdJohnston (talk) 18:08, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Thank you for replying...I made a few fact corrections concerning dates and events (the page is about me) and someone I do not know modified it, causing me to have to correct it again. I k=just added a 'connected contributor' banner at the top but do not know what else may be needed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Lora Elise (talk • contribs) 18:19, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

I would also like to add a photo...how do I do that? Lora Elise — Preceding unsigned comment added by Lora Elise (talk • contribs) 18:30, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Are you referring to these changes by User:RJay (official)? If so why not explain on Talk:Lora Johnson what your concerns are. (The changes seem to be very mild so I don't see what the problem might be). You speak of 'correct it again' as though that person had introduced a mistake. See Wikipedia:Images for how to add a photo. EdJohnston (talk) 18:37, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

The former issues were with something written earlier by someone else, and added back by the more recent contributor. I changed the year from 2005 to 2008 and corrected to better reflect the nature of my transition. Some items in the former content were derived from a Chicago Now blog published last summer, which did not have everything correct. I wish for the Wikipedia entry to be as factually correct as possible. I have also now added a photo and made a few minor grammatical corrections. Lora Elise —Preceding undated comment added 18:48, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Thank you very much for your help! Lora Elise —Preceding undated comment added 18:51, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Hi Lora Elise. Wikipedia articles are, for better or for worse, things that anyone anywhere in the world can edit at anytime, so there's not really anything the community can really do to prevent anyone from editing the article. In certain cases, an article may be protected to prevent serious disruption or vandalism, but those cases are pretty well-defined and only considered to be a last resort. Articles by there very nature are considered to be imperfect and it is hoped that mistakes will be fixed through collaborative editing. In addition, even though the article is written about you, you do not have any sort of final editorial control over the content of the article as explained in Wikipedia:Ownership of content. I suggest you take a look at WP:COIADVICE, Wikipedia:Plain and simple conflict of interest guide and WP:BLPSELF for information about what to do when you find something in error in the article. -- Marchjuly (talk) 12:30, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

How can I improve my article?

My draft "Transmed Holding" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Transmed_Holding) has been deleted for not being notable, I have added additional sources that i found online. However, how can i improve it in order to be accepted? MJHAB (talk) 15:56, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

• Hello MJHAB. The reviewers' comment may seem cryptic to you. You seem to be on the correct path, but I think it is still not enough.

What is needed is to prove that the subject of the article is "notable", which on Wikipedia is roughly equivalent to "independent reliable sources have written non-trivial stuff about them".

An important consideration in your case is also that "notability is not inherited". Many of the sources you use tend to deal in detail with Procter&Gamble, mentioning Transmed only in passing as a distributor. An even clearer example is YES the multipurpose detergent receives the award of product of the year which may be true but Transmed has little to do with it; that sentence should not be in the article at all, and the reference that supports it does not support Transmed's notability. Tigraan^{Click here to contact me} 14:22, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Using the Visual Editor

Hi, is it possible to only use the Visual Editor for major editing on Wikipedia? Mouad888 (talk) 15:14, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Hey Mouad888. Visual Editor has a number of known limitations which can be found listed at Wikipedia:VisualEditor#Limitations. Other than these, and other as yet unknown problems, the answer is probably yes. The feature is still very much in continuing development though, and you can expect new features to be added as times goes on. TimothyJosephWood 18:15, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

You can also set the visibility of both editors (source editor and Visual Editor) in your "Preferences" in the "Editing" - "Editing mode" tab, to prefer either one, or to set both editors as equally accessible, or to remember your last choice. GermanJoe (talk) 18:26, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Thank you, could you give me some more advice please? I am thinking of adding 1-2 paragraphs (100-200 words) to a political party's page. Is that a major edit? Should I propose my edit on the talk page first? and how should I use the the "In use" tag? Mouad888 (talk) 18:36, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Help on "too essay like" for article submission

Hello,A group member and I are trying to create a page on "Media and LGBTQ Youth of Colour" page, but we got rejected because it was said too be too essay like. Would just like any feedback we could get on how we could fix the article and make it a little more neutral. Here's the link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Media_and_LGBTQ_Youth_of_Colour Thank you! Kham88 (talk) 14:29, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Hello Kham88 I recommend to create a article directly rather than a draft.The problem you are facing essay like,Please read WP:NOTESSAY Sawongam (talk) 05:03, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Ah ok, I see. I'll talk a look through that page you sent and give it another read through. Thank you so much Sawongam! Kham88 (talk) 13:46, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

How many siblings did Catherine Dickens née Hogarth have?

The entries for both Catherine Hogarth and her sister Georgina Hogarth state they were from a family of 10 children; yet the article about their father George Hogarth states he had 14 children: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Hogarth

Can anyone give a reputable citation source for either claim? Thanks.

AW2016 (talk) 13:43, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Maybe the father went off and had four children elsewhere? (*They'd still be half-siblings, though...*) - NsTaGaTr ^(Talk) 16:55, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

All three articles currently state that there were 10 children, and a quick google search suggests that this is correct. Leschnei (talk) 13:30, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Oops! my mistake. George still reads '14 children'. I'll dig up a source and change it. Leschnei (talk) 13:41, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Done! Leschnei (talk) 13:42, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Help

Hi again I am preparing a article on a specified topic,so any admins of wikipedia can help me to upload a image related to my article.The image is Here Thanks Sawongam (talk) 13:38, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Hey Sawongam. Looking through your history, it looks like you may not have yet created the article that you intend to use the image on. In order for the image to meet our non-free content criteria, you will need to create the article first, so that you can use the article to justify why we are uploading a non-free image. TimothyJosephWood 13:55, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Ok ! I didn't knew that First i will upload my article and contact with you Joseph Sawongam (talk) 15:33, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Deleted Article

Hello Where I can get the article which was deleted Sawongam (talk) 12:32, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

It depends on the process by which it was deleted. See WP:Requests for undeletion, but read the preamble carefully. --David Biddulph (talk) 13:01, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Assuming it's Hugh Lewin you mean, it read—in full—"Hugh Lewin was an poet and a journalist born in 1939 A.D at Lydenburg,South Africa.Lewin spent a significant part of his life in prison for involving in African Resistance movement. In the early 1960 A.D he was the member of the African Resistance Movement .He played an good role in the African Resistance movement for the rights of black people against the white people,In 1964 A.D he was given jail for the 7 years,And he was exile for 10 years in London,anothe 10 years in Zimbabwe and the returned in 1992.After he returned he became director of the Institute for the Advancement of Journalism in Johannesburg. And he also wrote a famous poem Touch in Pretoria Central Prison in 1970 which shows the imagenary of the hardship faced by a prisoner in a prison,Now he works as a freelance media trainer. He has done lot of contribution for people,due to which he recieved sorts of awards like winner of the 2003 Olive Schreiner Prize and Stones against the Mirror, winner of the 2011 Sunday Times Alan Paton Award.". (I'm not going to restore the article history itself, and nor will any other admin, as previous versions included blatant copyright violations.)

While Lewin almost certainly is "notable" in Wikipedia's particular use of the term, there's really nothing salvageable there; if you're planning on writing a biography of him you're much better off starting from scratch. I strongly recommend reading Wikipedia:Your first article before you do so; writing Wikipedia articles is harder than it looks, as there are particular things you need to get right. This is especially so in the case of articles about living people. ‑ Iridescent 13:21, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Thanks Iridescent where did you get that article ??? Can i know it ?? Sawongam (talk) 10:53, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

You can see it, Sawongam. It's right above. Iridescent is an admin and admin can view deleted articles. John from Idegon (talk) 06:19, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

Disputed Page Content

Dear Forum,

I am trying to respond a dispute, whereby a friend’s Wikipedia page has been (respectfully) removed. I am attempting to work through the apparent issues, in an effort to find a consensus on which sections (or which specific information) has been found to be objectionable. Could I receive your opinion and/or advice? Thank you!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Daniel_J._Arbess

Jcbayley (talk) 10:42, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Hi Jcbayley, if you go to that page, you will see that it now contains the text "Unambiguous copyright infringement of http://www.gcamgroup.com/principals-profiles". We take copyright infringement very seriously here, and you can't just cut and paste from another website, even if you own it. You should digest the information on that page and recast it into your own words. Also, if you know or are employed by Mr Arbess, you should read our Conflict of Interest rules very carefully, and consider whether you should proceed. Rojomoke (talk) 14:35, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

external links

hello i am writing a biographic item and I wanted to know what is the correct way to add some links of things this person wrote for further reading... Tevelbtzedek (talk) 09:30, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Hi there, if you are talking about books/research papers they wrote, ISBN or doi would be standard, if online blogs or newspaper articles link to them, and combine all of it under a heading like Published work? Ischariot ucl (talk) 05:17, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Astronaut name articles - confusion

Hi,I am confused why some astronaut article names don't have their first name listed. Articles like F. Drew Gaffney , L. Blaine Hammond S. David Griggs. Is there a particular wiki reason? Thanks Golan's mom (talk) 07:12, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse, Golan's mom . The title of an article should be the most common name of the topic. Those three people are most commonly referred to by their first initial, middle name and surname, so those names should be the article titles. The article should include the full name in its first sentence, so we learn there that your third example is Stanley David Griggs. The sources in that article use the first initial and so should we. Another example is famous lawyer F. Lee Bailey. H. R. Haldeman was known only by his initials. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 08:23, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Hi Golan's mom. The guideline about it is Wikipedia:Naming conventions (people)#Middle names and initials. Other examples: J. Edgar Hoover, F. Scott Fitzgerald, M. Night Shyamalan. PrimeHunter (talk) 11:43, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Thanks PrimeHunter and Cullen328, how do you know when this is common? other sources list only their middle name (or even in other wikipedia articles they are called differently) Thanks Golan's mom (talk) 12:57, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

@Golan's mom: Editors look for sources considered reliable, often by doing Google searches on different name variations in quotation marks and examine the number and quality of results. Google features to search books and news sources may be preferred over general Internet searches. Some editors are already familiar with the subject and have often seen how sources name them. There is sometimes disagreement among editors in discussions about Wikipedia:Requested moves but when to use initials is rarely controversial. See WP:COMMONNAME for the general guideline about common names in article titles. Wikipedia has millions of articles written by thousands of volunteers and we cannot keep everything consistent. PrimeHunter (talk) 13:16, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

I am a student editor and need to assign myself an article to edit under the tab, but I don't know how to do that? How to I insert my topic beside my name in the students tab?

I am a student editor and need to assign myself an article to edit under the students tab, but I don't know how to do that? How to I insert my topic beside my name in the students tab?Lbates2008 (talk) 01:59, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse. I see that you have now managed to do that at WP:Wiki Ed/Florida Institute of Technology/Molecular Genetics (Spring 2017). --David Biddulph (talk) 03:57, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Template

A musician who I work for has asked me to make a page for him, that looks like someone else's page. What's the best way to copy a template from a preexisting page?UnionDesFemmes (talk) 01:47, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse, UnionDesFemmes. The first thing that you need to do is read about paid editing and conflict of interest. Then, familiarize yourself with our notability guideline for musicians. Then, read Your first article, and use the WP:Articles for Creation process so that experienced editors can review your work for compliance with policies and guidelines before publication. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 05:33, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Use of a reputable opinion

I am wondering if use of the word "fun" is OK in an article about a festival, if it is a quote from an entertainment writer for a national newspaper (specifically, the Chicago Tribune). View my sandbox for a draft of the sentence in question. RM2KX (talk) 00:27, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Hello RM2KX. The normal way to handle a situation like this is to say something like "The Chicaago Tribune described the festival as 'fun'". That way it's clear that we are echoing their opinion, not offering our own.--Gronk Oz (talk) 01:11, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Thanks, User:Gronk Oz! RM2KX (talk) 02:02, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Help with Reference error

Hey all. I am working on a glossary at User talk:Fuhghettaboutit/Glossary of bird terms. It is in the [hidden] category Pages with reference errors, but I am having trouble pinpointing the source. Usually with this issue I expect to see a red error message in the citations list or somewhere on the page but no such luck here, or at least I've scanned the page a few times and haven't seen it. Does anyone see what I'm not, or know how to target a fix? Thanks--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 00:19, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

I see that 38 and 41 are blank references. Is that it? RM2KX (talk) 00:40, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

@Fuhghettaboutit: See if the note at Help:Cite_errors#A_page_shows_in_the_reference_error_category.2C_but_no_cite_errors_show applies. RudolfRed (talk) 00:41, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Fuhghettaboutit, I fixed a typo in the article, which fixed a reference error. (I'm looking for the other one now). But a missing named reference should have generated a red error message. Has something changed in error detection? StarryGrandma (talk) 01:30, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Thanks all. I've fixed the blanks, which I hadn't noticed, which didn't fix the error, but I'm still looking. Per Rudolf's link, I do have some cites nested in other templates like Efn, so I'm going to check each one for equal signs in URLs.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 01:50, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

StarryGrandma: Maybe the the error I'm/we're looking for appears higher in the article to the cites you fixed, and that caused the normal error messages not to display? Just a guess.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 01:52, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Hi Fuhghettaboutit maybe you need to install this Bit of script to see the errors which will then be displayed in green. Regards CV9933 (talk) 09:43, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Thanks everyone for responding. I think I'll have this wrapped up shortly. Per StarryGrandma's note at my talk page, the red error message doesn't display outside the mainspace, and to give everyone the benefit of what she found, you can add span.brokenref {display: inline;} to your common.css to force display in other namespaces. With it installed, the error is shown. I really like the script CV9933 posted above, though for whatever reason it does not find the error the other one does.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 23:08, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

How to submit a photograph related to an already published article.

There is an article about a K-16 sailplane (glider) built by William Frank Kelsey, my father. There are no pictures included with the article, but I have pictures. How do I submit them for inclusion in the article?73.65.221.61 (talk) 23:17, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Hi IP user. If you took the pictures, you can upload them under free license to Wikimedia Commons, our sister site. They can then be used on Wikipedia. White Arabian Filly ^Neigh 23:23, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

...and the link to do this is [2]. Once your image is uploaded, see Wikipedia:Wikimedia_Commons for how to include it in a Wikipedia article. Tigraan^{Click here to contact me} 09:47, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Categories: British or English?

Can someone point me towards the correct style guide when adding categories, where a subject is both British and English. For example British humanists vs English humanists: Lord Dubs, Alf Dubs, Baron Dubs, his nationality is British, yet someone has removed 'British humanists' and changed it to 'English humanists'. I see the same issue constantly for different categories on pages I come across, where one is deleted and the other substituted, so I would like to know the definitive WP answer. To clarify, I am British, English, I live in the United Kingdom and I hail from the British Isles so I have no problem distinguishing between the nuances of the various distinctions :) Thanks in advance Mramoeba (talk) 21:29, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Mramoeba, I'm not 100% sure on this, but it seems to me like somebody who was born and lived their whole life in England would be in the English category, and somebody from a different part of Britain, or who maybe lived in several different parts of Britain, would be in the British category. The categorization seems to be as specific as possible, probably to avoid having 10,000 articles in one category. White Arabian Filly ^Neigh 23:27, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

The general rule is to use the most specific applicable category, see WP:SUBCAT. The reason is not so much to avoid cluttering particular categories, but that the hierarchy of categories makes for a finer sorting. If John Doe is categorized as an "author", someone searching for English authors will fail to find him, while if he is categorized as an "English author" the category tree still knows that he is an author (and will be found by someone searching for authors with no precision about the nationality).

However, in the BvE case it may be difficult to identify whether English is applicable, as discussed below. Tigraan^{Click here to contact me} 09:54, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Is English always a subset of British then? To clarify if I search for British xyz I would always find B and E listings, but if I search for English xyz I will not find them (unless they have been specifically listed in English xyz). Wow, this opens up a whole can of worms. I do not automatically expect someone from another country to appreciate the difference and I am aware, having travelled all over the world, people frequently misapply 'English' to mean from the UK. What's wrong with covering bases and having both categories, does this screw things up? Mramoeba (talk) 10:35, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

WP:SUBCAT says Apart from certain exceptions (...), an article should be categorised as low down in the category hierarchy as possible, without duplication in parent categories above it. (emphasis added). I do not know what happens if you try (my bet is: a bot will come and remove the parent category); but the system is set up so that it is not necessary, it avoids having to include Category:People, Category:Earthling, Category:Solar system life forms, etc. on all biographies (the example is made up, but the point is, it is tedious to add all parent categories).

Category:English artists is a subcategory of Category:British artists, for instance, but maybe there are some English Foo categories that are not a subcategory of British Foo, be it by design or because it was never fixed. I think that English is indeed a subset of British (i.e. that any English X can be described as a British X truthfully) without much doubt but of course other similar cases open a huge can of worms (is Scottish a subset of British, North Irish of Irish, Indian of British, etc.); I have no informed opinion on the subject. Tigraan^{Click here to contact me} 13:36, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

I appreciate your input. This would be problematic in my opinion. Whilst I was born and have spent the majority of my life in England I would never self-identify as English. My partner was born and raised in Scotland and has lived equal time in England but likewise would never identify as Scottish, rather we are both British. The case of humanism is pertinent, there is a British Humanist Association but as far as i'm aware not an English one, although there is a Scottish humanist society. The case of Lord Dubs is more interesting as he was born in Prague and is from former Czechoslovakia and was rescued from the Nazi Kindertransport. Which brings me back to the question of whether or not there is a definitive guide, otherwise are we in the situation of asking every individual what they self identify as? Mramoeba (talk) 23:44, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

This is a contentious topic and has been the subject of a recent thread at ANI (more accurately, an editor's behavior regarding BvE). It seems to me that the general consensus is to go with reported self-identification, and if sources vary, to hammer it out on the article's talk. John from Idegon (talk) 02:22, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

In the specific case of Dubs, I'd go squarely with "British". As a naturalised citizen, he'll have been naturalised as "British", not "English", "Welsh" etc, regardless of where in the UK he happened to live. Standard BrEng usage has long been to describe assimilated immigrant communities as "British" rather than by constituent nation (British Asian, Black British, British Jews etc); the only exception I can think of to this rule (outside the linguistic minefield of Northern Ireland) is the Italian community, where the unusual "people from specific towns in Italy migrated to specific towns in Britain" pattern of immigration meant that English, Welsh and Scottish Italians historically had very different cultural identities. ‑ Iridescent 10:10, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

I would agree. I used Dubs because I thought it was a pretty cut and dried example, but having spent some time in the ANI archives I can see this kind of debate has been running for at least a decade and there is no concensus. So I asked above but in case it got lost, is there an issue with using both categories? I don't have any optimism that there will ever be consensus across UK, the sands also seem to shift with the sociopolitical climate. Mramoeba (talk) 11:03, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

You shouldn't use both, as Category:English humanists is a subcategory of Category:British humanists so anything in the former will automatically also be in the latter. (In all honesty, I wouldn't lose sleep over which category it's in, as anyone searching in one will almost certainly also search in the other.) ‑ Iridescent 11:26, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

what to do about the strange user page User:Melbourne132

Hi again. User:Melbourne132 has created and edited a page I am involved in updating. So, I looked at their user page and found that it is a duplicate of Heterobasidion occidentale (no kidding!) and it was made by Melbourne132, not vandalism! Melbourne132 has been inactive for 2 years. Is this userpage a copyvio, and what to be done about it? Thanks, DennisPietras (talk) 21:16, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

You probably want to look at when each of the pages was created, and at who created Heterobasidion occidentale. --David Biddulph (talk) 21:22, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Yes, it might be unconventional to create a draft of an article on a user page, but there was nothing suspicious going on. Ought there to be a tag on the user page to indicate its status? Dbfirs 21:26, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

@David Biddulph and Dbfirs:Well, that was informative. Looking at the revision histories of both, it appears that this proves the idea that not all newbies are clueless! If it isn't a copyvio, then I guess there is nothing to be done. Thanks, DennisPietras (talk) 22:19, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

@David Biddulph and Dbfirs: Well, even stranger, the user page has now been deleted somehow. Did either of you do it, or know who did? Thanks, DennisPietras (talk) 01:44, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

@DennisPietras: Don't you see the deletion log when you click on the link to User:Melbourne132? It says "23:17, 8 March 2017 Fuhghettaboutit (talk | contribs) deleted page User:Melbourne132 (G6: Housekeeping and routine (non-controversial) cleanup: User inactive for two years. The contentof the userpage used as a draft (i.e. in wrong namepace) was created by user in mainspace)" --David Biddulph (talk) 03:18, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

@David Biddulph and Fuhghettaboutit: Duh. My bad for not reading farther down to find the info. Thanks Fuhghettaboutit for taking care of that account! DennisPietras (talk) 03:30, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Malcolm and Nunitec

Give Nunitec a chance. It is in the registration process.

Thank you all.Princenuni (talk) 18:50, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Please give Malcolm and Nunitec a chance. With warm Regards. --194.95.142.180 (talk) 19:11, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Princenuni, considering that Nunitec is "young" and "being registered", which I'm assuming means that it isn't actually a company yet that is actually doing any business, it does not qualify for a Wikipedia article. It's great that you "aim to reach beyond galaxies", and I'm sure when you accomplish that, there will be a Wikipedia article waiting. We do not make, keep, or "give chances" to articles on businesses which themselves have not already been written about it reliable secondary sources. TimothyJosephWood 19:18, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

How many links should be included?

I'm editing an article that has many notable musicians listed. Should I link every musician? I believe it would make the article hard to read. Soli58 (talk) 18:49, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Do you find blue text harder to read than black text? See WP:Overlink for guidance. Dbfirs 21:29, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

What is the article? How about having a separate section heading: Notable musicians, where the musicians can be added with clickable links, dates etc so that all can be included within the body of the article without detracting from the flow of the text. Would that work? Mramoeba (talk) 21:33, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Perfection of uploaded articles, images and posts

Thanks for the invitation, how do perfect that which i paste, such as the images and referencesPrincenuni (talk) 16:18, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Hello, Princenuni. Welcome to the Teahouse. I'm afraid it appears as if you have done what many people do and plunged straight into the very difficult task of trying to create a new article without having spent time learning how Wikipedia works. I wonder if you have even read the very useful essay called your first article?

For my part, I am not even prepared to look at the wall of text you have presented at Draft:Nunitec Empire and Draft:Malcolm Agyapong-Nuni to see what needs to be done to them. The first thing you need to do is to learn and apply Wikimarkup, so that they become more legible. You also need to read Referencing for beginners, to understand not just how to format references, but also what kind of references we require: references to Wikipedia are never acceptable, because Wikipedia (being a user-generated source) is not reliable in the required sense. Then you need to understand that Wikipedia has essentially no interest in what you (or I) know or think, and very little interest in what a subject says about themselves (or what their associates say about them). A Wikipedia article should be mostly based on what people who have no connection with the subject have published about the subject in reliable places. An article should ideally not contain one single claim that has not been published in a reliable source.

I suggest you don't worry about images until you sort out the more important and fundamental issues of readability and referencing. --ColinFine (talk) 18:06, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

protocols for major changes?

I have revised the existing article “instrumental value,” which has two warnings below its title.

I would like to take 3 major actions: 1) change the title; 2) remove the warning; 3) eliminate two other articles, the contents of which I have included in my revision--“intrinsic value” and “instrumental conception of technology”

my question: Are there established protocols for these 3 actions? Many thanks.TBR-qed (talk) 13:39, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Hey TBR-qed. There's a lot to unpack here.

• Renaming a page is called "moving". For a complete explanation of this process see Wikipedia:Moving a page.
• The warnings at the top of the article are article maintenance templates, which add the article to lists such as WP:BACKLOG which users can visit if they are interested in contributing by fixing specific types of problems. They can be removed basically whenever a problem is fixed, but before they are, you should review the link in the template to make sure you have a good understanding of the problem, and are able to accurately judge whether it's totally taken care of.
• If the other two articles have been merged, (see also WP:MERGE), then they should probably be redirected to the article they've been merged with. For a full explanation of this process, see WP:REDIRECT.
• Finally, looking at the article it looks like you may also benefit from reviewing guidance at WP:LEAD, since the current article doesn't seem to conform to that standard and probably need a good bit of work in that area.

I know I just threw about 50 links at you, so if you have any follow up questions feel free to ask away. TimothyJosephWood 14:13, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

@TBR-qed: You asked twice recently about the format of the {{quotation}} tag and were answered at #new parameter to start quotes? and at #trouble formatting quotes, so please correct the malformatted quotations which you have left in the article. --David Biddulph (talk) 16:54, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Complaint!

I made a lot of football players career changes based on reliable sources. According to user Jaellee, I made one which was not reliable and so he sent me a messsage. In the end I was right but after that message almost all the chenges I had made where cancelled! Now I don't feel like helping again. Sorry... Slash V (talk) 12:02, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

I think the best policy would be to add references for your changes as you make them, then they should not be reverted. Content disputes are best discussed on the respective talk pages of the disputed articles. Dbfirs 21:38, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

International Women's Day vandalism

Can we get some kind of block on the IWD page because it is getting a lot of vandalism at the moment...?Jack Upland (talk) 07:26, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Fixed. Thanks.--Jack Upland (talk) 07:45, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

After one suggests an article change on a talk page, if no response, …

as a general rule, how long should one wait prior to implementing the change? Humanengr (talk) 05:55, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

• Hello Humanengr. The general rule is: zero seconds! Just do it, without even going to the talk page at first; if someone objects, they can "revert" your edit, and then you should both go on the talk page and discuss it, but there is no need to preventively discuss.

Of course, this is the general rule. If you know your edit is likely to be problematic, or if it was already discussed and rejected previously, you should discuss it beforehand. In that case, there is no hard rule on the waiting time (except for codified procedures such as WP:RFC etc.), but I would say no answer for a week is silent consent. Tigraan^{Click here to contact me} 12:40, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

How do I create/edit an s-line template

Hi. I have tried but failed to figure out how to edit the s-line template for several articles, one of which is Sungai Buloh railway station. The rail line for the s-line template has changed, resulting in the name and also the end stations of the lines changing, and would like to bring it up to date. I have in the past managed to figure out many of Wikipedia's features but this template seems to be beyond me. Thanks Slleong (talk) 05:04, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

I realised I didn't end with a clear question. Can someone help me or point me in the correct direction as to how to handle the s-line template, using the s-line template used in the Sungai Buloh railway station page? Slleong (talk) 08:52, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse. These templates are very complicated. After a few false starts I eventually cured your problem by creating a redirect from Template:S-line/KTM Komuter left/Port Klang Line and the equivalent for the right. — Preceding unsigned comment added by David Biddulph (talk • contribs) 10:45, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Thanks so much David Biddulph for helping me out. Truly appreciate it. Any chance of tutoring me on how to handle these templates, which you yourself describe as very complicated? Would like to be able to fiddle with them correctly in the future. Slleong (talk) 10:50, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

I don't think there's a simple answer. The documentation at Template:S-line gives some clues as to which parameters are dependent on which of the sub-templates. Sometimes it is a question of having to look at the source code of each of the sub-templates as you work down the tree to spot where the problem arises. In this case it was made somewhat more difficult by various files having been renamed at different stages. It's a fairly untidy situation, and my solution may not be ideal, but it seems to have done the trick. You need to be careful that your edits don't give rise to further problems. --David Biddulph (talk) 11:00, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Thanks again. Will slowly pick it up and thread carefully.Slleong (talk) 03:39, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

Success. I've been able to fiddle with the s-line templates for the Seremban Line too without messing up. Patch up work too but as you said, seems to have done the trick. Thanks again.Slleong (talk) 16:58, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

The article which I'm currently working on is always rejecting by the reviewers ?

The Article Draft: Gokul Shrinivas - I'm currently working on this article. I have more than 10 reliable sources and His name with photograph mentioned. But I get a review feedback that there are no reliable sources hence rejected. Please someone advice or someone do help me in this regard !!! Or else I won't get a degree.Jonathan629 (talk) 02:35, 8 March 2017 (UTC)jonathan629Jonathan629 (talk) 02:35, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Hello, Jonathan629. Please read WP:Referencing for beginners. Your existing references (at least the first two) are links to copyright violations, and are not permitted. (This is not about the content or quality of your references - which I haven't investigated - but the mechanism). By uploading scans of newspapers you are almost certainly violating their copyright, and Wikipedia does not allow linking to copyright violations. Most major newspapers are now available on line anyway, but even if these are not, you do not need to link to them. For most sources, a URL is nothing more than a courtesy to the reader, and the important bit is the information which will allow a reader to find the source even if it is not online - journal, title, date, author etc. --ColinFine (talk) 08:57, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

OK, Jonathan629. I have removed the forbidden links from the first two references of Draft:Gokul Shrinivas. I can't actually read the scan of the first one to see whether it says anything significant about him, but the second one is merely a listing of his name as a prize-winner, and furthermore is not independent of him, as it appears to be an ad boasting about "our alumni". Looking at the seven references adduced for his winning a prize, the first three, at least, do not mention his name. In the same way that fifty times nothing is nothing, fifty references of no value have no value. Please study WP:42 - and consider the possibility that Shrinivas might not actually currently meet Wikipedia's criteria for notabililty. --ColinFine (talk) 17:47, 8 March 2017 (UTC)--ColinFine (talk) 17:47, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Why the page keeps getting rejected

Our page https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Laurie_Dutcher keeps getting rejected and we are unable to figure out how to not get it to state we are advertising because we are not. Any suggestions on what we can do to get this approved would be greatly appreciated. Thank you Stacy Stacy Harper (talk) 00:29, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Whom is this "our" you speak of? John from Idegon (talk) 01:18, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse, Stacyharper. Your draft article is jam packed with promotional and marketing language, such as "She is passionate about the economic empowerment of women, committed to developing the next generation of entrepreneurs in the U.S. and around the world through small business loans, mentoring and entrepreneurial education. She has lent her voice to many different platforms including, books, magazines, blogs etc." You also include the overtly promotional sentence "“What took you so long?” That was the question on everyone’s lips when Laurie Dutcher finally decided to launch her girls’ apparel line, Secretly Spoiled in 2008." Every single quotation must include a reference for the source of the quote, and that quote is unreferenced. You can only use the phrase "everyone's lips" if it applies to the lips of every human being on the planet. Every paragraph must include a reference to at least one reliable source that backs up the content in that paragraph. Please read and study our core content policy regarding the neutral point of view, and remove every single trace of promotional, marketing and advertising language from your draft. You are trying to write a neutral encyclopedia article, not a LinkedIn profile or a press release.Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 02:03, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

• See also: Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Draft:Laurie Dutcher — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.20.193.222 (talk) 00:19, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Translating an existing article (Joachim Bandau)

Hello, I have been using Wikipedia for many years but I am now getting interested in contributing to/ creating/ helping traslate articles. I have the following question: I would like wikipedia to have a page on german artist Joachim Bandau in English. During the month of February I noticed that he had two pages on wikipedia one in Dutch and one in German. Now there is a new one in French. Can I myself make and english translation of his page? What process do I need to go through in order to do so? Or do I need to ask someone to do so? Thanks! 87.65.78.18 (talk) 11:40, 7 March 2017 (UTC)

• Hello and welcome to Wikipedia. If you are willing and able to translate de:Joachim Bandau into English, please do! If you are not yet completely familiar with article creation, I encourage you do so via Wikipedia:Articles for creation - the process is relatively straightforward.

For cross-wiki translations, there is a specific help page, located at Wikipedia:Translation (parts of that page may be hard to understand for new users though, do not hesitate to come back and ask any question if something is not clear); the two most important things to notice are (1) you should not use a machine translation such as Google Translate without proofreading it; (2) if the content is translated, that must be indicated for copyright reasons (original work must be attributed); the simplest way to do that is to copy-paste the code {{Translated article|de|Joachim Bandau}} at the top of the article. Tigraan^{Click here to contact me} 12:50, 7 March 2017 (UTC)

Yeah that is the errors I get as well so how do I go about fixing that. So would I first need to go into the edit "Languages", then remove the existing link to zh:美食偵探王 by pressing that delete/trash button, then paste my Inspector Gourmet link into the field I just removed and hit the save button? Or are there more steps I need to take? Or is this more of a job for the more senior people or the admins to correct once I notify them? ThanksNoideawhattocallself (talk) 01:49, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

How do I correct the "Languages" sitelink of a wikipedia page?

Hi, I am trying to correct the "Languages" link of a page but don't know how to correct it. I have the correct wikipedia page on hand but I cannot save my correction. On https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inspector_Gourmet, the '中文' language is linking to an incorrect page. It should be to https://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/為食神探.

On the flipside, I also want to add the English language sitelink to the Chinese page. So on https://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/為食神探 I want to add https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inspector_Gourmet to the "Languages".

How does one go about editing that section of a wikipedia page? Thanks.

NoideawhattocallselfNoideawhattocallself (talk) 04:10, 7 March 2017 (UTC)

At the bottom of the list of language links, there is a button labeled "Edit links". There, you can change the links. Hope that helps! --Rlin8 (talk) 06:33, 7 March 2017 (UTC)

I tried but it wouldn't let me save. It either said something like the page was in use by another page or that zhwiki could not find the page. I'm guessing it is my wiki syntax that is incorrect which is why it's not accepting my corrections.Noideawhattocallself (talk) 07:22, 7 March 2017 (UTC)

@Noideawhattocallself: The problem is that those links are in Wikidata and there are currently 2 Wikidata pages involved. Inspector Gourmet is linked on https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q618976, whereas zh::為食神探 is linked on https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q28418970. On the first of these Wikidata pages there have been quite a number of edits shuffling the Chinese links,and you can see these in the history. I can't read the Chinese, nor the 3 other languages (Japanese, Korean, & Thai?), so I can't check the correctness of the various links. You wouldn't be able to add zh::為食神探 to https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q618976 without removing the existing link to zh:美食偵探王, as Wikidata allows only one-to-one links. --David Biddulph (talk) 09:02, 7 March 2017 (UTC)

@David Biddulph: Yeah that is the type of errors I get so how does one go about fixing that. So would I go to the edit "Languages", then remove the link to zh:美食偵探王 by pressing the remove/trash button, then paste the Inspector Gourmet link into the field I just removed, and hit the save button. Or are there more steps I need to take to fix? Or is this more of a job for the senior people or the admin to correct once i notify them.Noideawhattocallself (talk) 01:57, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Feedback for my major edit re: Eugene, Oregon history

I have researched and written an edit for the history of Eugene, Oregon. I will probably want to use the WYSIWYG tool to edit the actual Wikipedia entry, but would appreciate some feedback on what I have written before I attempt any changes.

My edit does not change any of the history post-1856 but adds pre-1856 Native history. I also changed the current first paragraph for flow. But there is no change to its actual content. What I plan to add is currently in my sandbox and includes the footnotes.

How do I go about having it reviewed?Silver Water (talk) 22:57, 6 March 2017 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse. Assuming that you are talking about User:Silver Water/sandbox, the first thing you need to do is to learn about referencing. You need to read Help:Referencing for beginners. --David Biddulph (talk) 23:10, 6 March 2017 (UTC)

Thank you, David Biddulph, for your reply. I have read Referencing for beginners and have begun the process of putting my footnotes in the appropriate form, using the visual editing tool. It will take me a few days to a week to finish this process.

Next, I assume my article can be reviewed for content? Thank you again for your reply. Silver WaterSilver Water (talk) 03:56, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Hello @Silver Water:, to answer a couple questions:

• Fixing your footnotes is the main thing; no hurry, go at your own pace and ask us if you have questions. Note that using "ibid" is discouraged since later edits could change the order of the footnotes and confuse what "ibid" is referring to, so instead you can use the WP:Refname coding when you have repeated footnotes to one source. You also need to WP:Wikilink key terms, and split your section up into WP:Sub-sections
• So far as "review", your best bet would be to post at Talk:Eugene, Oregon and say "hey guys, I want to add the material at User:Silver Water/sandbox to the History section, what do you think?" If you don't get any reply in a few days, I'd say just go ahead and add it in provided your formatting is all good. MatthewVanitas (talk) 21:21, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

@MatthewVanitas Thank you. I do have some questions about footnotes. Would it be better to continue in this thread or start a new thread with that specific topic?

Thank you also for the information about ibid, key terms, and sub-sections. Sounds like I still have a lot to do.63.155.170.196 (talk) 23:00, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Trying to revise https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glenn_Llopis

Glenn Llopis asked me to revise his page on Wikipedia to address issues of neutrality and ad language. I did so as a first round and had another party review but it was dinged again. So I went back in and tried to focus just on the facts and no language that might be deemed promotional. But before I have someone review again I would love feedback on what if anything there is an issue about now so that perhaps the issues won't come back. How do I do that? I have never done this before. I know I can't do anything in writing about the orphan issue. Jim JimmyDonuts (talk) 15:25, 6 March 2017 (UTC)

Hello and welcome JimmyDonuts! After looking at the article I do see several problems:

• Glenn Llopis may simply not meet our notability guidelines. While there are several reliable sources in your references, they are all essentially one-sentence quotes attributed to Llopis. A person who meets GNG for a biography will generally have articles that provide biographical information about them (e.g. where were they born, where did they go to school, are they married, etc.) beyond simply verifying the fact they exist. The sources now only catalog a smattering of 10-15 word inspirational quotes.
• Providing a list of places he's written ("Blogs and Other Platforms") is atypical and should probably be omitted. Also, it appears almost all of his publications are self-published and should probably be indicated as such, grouped into a "bibliography" section. You may want to follow the format and layout used in biographies such as Guy Kawasaki, instead of creating your own; these follow a pretty typical template of "early life", "career", "personal life" (if applicable), "bibliography", "see also", and "external links".
• Three of the four external links appear to have nothing to do with Glenn Llopis other than the fact that they're organizations in which he's involved with in one way or the other. Per WP:EXT, you should probably omit everything except his official site.
• There are a number of claims that have no reliable sources proving their veracity or authenticity, e.g. "In 1997, Llopis launched Luna Rossa Gourmet Foods, which sold vegetables, pasta sauce, and salad dressing under the Luna Rossa and Chef’s Harvest brands."

DarjeelingTea (talk) 20:32, 6 March 2017 (UTC)

THANKS! I have made many of the changes you say. I found the link to the Luna Rossa site that clearly indicates it was created and run by Glenn. Though all the web sites are actually his businesses your point is EXCELLENT and I have omitted them (if it is not clear, GONE). I have added back in his work on the immigrant perspective which was cited in several sources and I have included one now. I have removed the blogs and indicated the books that were self-published. What I would LIKE to do if you think it is warranted is to try and address the two points I CAN address: neutrality and that it is written like an ad. Do you think those have been addressed? I obviously need to go deeper into the notability guidelines as I neither created nor knew why he had a page just doing as a friend. The orphan is not in my control either. JimJimmyDonuts (talk) 01:13, 7 March 2017 (UTC)

HI JimmyDonuts. You're also going to need to provide proof that the original copyright holder of File:Glenn Llopis.jpg has agreed to release under a free license suitable for Wikimedia Commons. In most cases, the photographer is considered to be the copyright holder of any photos they take unless there's been an copyright transfer agreement. -- Marchjuly (talk) 06:16, 7 March 2017 (UTC)

We have removed the photo. Thank you. I was told the release existed. It does not. My apologies. JimmyDonuts (talk) 15:46, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

We? Please read Wikipedia:Username policy#Usernames implying shared use Lectonar (talk) 15:52, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

User:DarjeelingTea, would you mind reviewing for notability again and see if the issue you added could be removed? I realize that in editing I deleted two outside sources that do what you say, the first of which seems to be why Glenn was given the page in the first place as he did not set it up, only added to it. If you think that as is it has no notability merit then we will delete it. I was just trying to update it and make it comply with the issues but better to remove it than have the notability questioned! JimmyDonuts (talk) 15:49, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

When You Edit Why Deleted

I'm nit trying to complain or anything but whenever I add a important fact to something that's true a bot takes it away am I doing something wrong or just crazy and dumb? — Preceding unsigned comment added by FactCheck1723 (talk • contribs) 02:22, 6 March 2017 (UTC)

Your most recent edit to an article was to add "I LIVE HERE" to the article Northumberland County, Pennsylvania. It certainly wasn't constructive. The bot was right to remove it, particularly as you added it to the foundation date of the county. Maproom (talk) 10:50, 6 March 2017 (UTC)

... and your previous edit to Robert Trump looked like vandalism, with a false edit summary. It looks to me as if you are doing things wrong. Do ask if you would like some guidance on genuine editing, but please stop the silly edits. Dbfirs 23:39, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Article for Michael Devin.

Hi. I'm not exactly new to the Wikipedia. I've made one hundred edits and gotten many notable authors, writers musicians with pages.

Anyway, now I'm exasperated because someone is saying I did not respect to adding more notability material when in fact I sure did at lots of references and citations including a People magazine and Rolling Stones. So what's wrong?!

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Michael_Devin Rattletap (talk) 01:21, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Hi there. References are really really important. You will see many articles lack them, but any facts on an article that do not have a referenced can be removed by anyone. So when a draft is reviewed, it's essential that everything is verifiable in an appropriate reliable source.

For example, the "Early Life" section of your draft begins, Devin was born and raised in New England. OK, so, where can we check that that is correct? It needs a reference to a reliable source, such as a book or newspaper article. Like this;

Devin was born and raised in New England.<ref>"Meet Devin", New York Times, 1 April 2017</ref>.

If the reference is online, include the URL and the date you accessed it; for more help see Help:Referencing for beginners.

Next, it says, "At 12, he obtained his first bass guitar and began learning the songs of AC/DC" - OK, so where can we check that that is true? ...and so on, for every fact in the draft.

If you can't provide a reliable source for some of the info, just remove it. And if there's enough references to "substantial" coverage in appropriate reliable sources, it shows the person is notable enough for an article.

Good luck, I hope that helps, 86.20.193.222 (talk) 17:27, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Citing Australian Government Web Archive

Hi all, I want to reference a government report which is no longer hosted by the Department, but a cached version is available through the Australian Government Web Archivewhich is a project of the National Library of Australia (and I would assume a trusted and reputable source). Is it okay to directly link to that? Do I need to put any protoccols in place? And can anyone point me to where I'd find this answer already answered (as I am sure it must have been). Saludos Trishhepworth (talk) 02:17, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

• Hello Trishhepworth,

There is no problem using an archive to reference the document's contents (it could still be problematic for assertions such as "the report was posted on the government website on date X", of course). A reference is a particular document; a web link is merely the means to obtain it. Of course, it is still better to use a reputable archive service such as a national library than other sites because it is less likely to have posted a forged document or to undergo WP:Link rot; but even a link to a personal website would do if there is no better alternative.

To take a purposefully silly analogy: when referencing a book, you give information that identify the text such as ISBN/edition number/etc. but you do not add "borrowed from the Sidney library" or similar - any book with the same edition number will do. Tigraan^{Click here to contact me} 12:31, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Hi, Trishhepworth,

The {{Cite web}} template has fields for the original URL and an archival URL. You may be able to access it from the toolbar above the editing box. Pelagic (talk) 21:51, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Article: South African Social Security Acrticle.

Can anyone who is willing to help me try to help me fix an error on the page mentioned on the subject/headline. I copied a category on a biographical article relating to the page. It looks like I copied the information incorrectly and now I cannot fix the page because it does not display on the edit page and the animated pencil which you can click on does not appear on the sub category ('Social grant controversy'.) May kindly I request for anyone to fix it or try to help me on how to fix it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mkoko Siphamandla (talk • contribs) 07:36, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

This must be about South African Social Security Agency. I see that David Biddulph has already corrected the article. Maproom (talk) 09:33, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Nanny Nkhosi

Hi, I'm Nanny Nkhosi I want to ask a question how to add a picture when you have the free Wikipedia— Preceding unsigned comment added by Nanny Nkhosi (talk • contribs) 16:13, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

@Nanny Nkhosi:

If it is your own picture, it's quite easy.

If it is from the internet, we probably cannot use it, due to copyrights.

Description of the picture goes here

Assuming the copyright is OK,

1. Upload it, by following instructions at Commons:Upload Wizard
2. To add it to an article, put [[File:YOUR-FILE-NAME-HERE.jpg|thumb|Description of the picture goes here]].

For more detailed help, see Wikipedia:Picture tutorial. 86.20.193.222 (talk) 17:15, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

"We could not determine whether this file is suitable for Wikimedia Commons..." I NEED YOUR HELP

Hello guys. i'm trying to upload an article over a YouTube celebrity and i'm trying to use one of his pictures in the article to show how he looks. now when i click on the "i own this content" or something like that because it won't let me continue without checking that box. anyways. is there a possible way i can upload that picture of that celebrity for the viewers to see who i'm talking about? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jeremyxoxx (talk • contribs) 01:54, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

@Jeremyxoxx: Hi there, welcome.

We want Wikipedia to be free, for anyone to copy. So we try to only use 'free' images.

Most images have some kind of copyright which means we can't use them.

If you had a photo that you, personally, had taken then it would be OK, but I'm guessing that you've got a picture from some internet site? In which case, it almost certainly does not have the right permissions.

One thing you could do is, contact the YouTuber, and ask him (or her) to upload a nice picture to Commons, giving his permission.

For more help, see Wikipedia:Finding images tutorial. Best of luck! 86.20.193.222 (talk) 05:01, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Subject Deletion

Wikipedia is deleting my article Zaman Ali and tell the reason of promotion of self published article. But there is nothing incorrect in it. Tell me how to make it not to get delete. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Alvin Erich (talk • contribs) 16:19, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Hello Alvin Erich and welcome to the Teahouse.

The article in question has already been deleted, but from what I can see in the deletion discussion, you attempted to create a promotional article about a subject that does not meet Wikipedia's notability criteria. Being "correct" has very little to do with whether an article will be kept or deleted (though we obviously don't want "incorrect" articles, either). In order to create an article, you must supply references to reliable, independent sources that establish the subject's notability. What the subject says about themselves does not count towards notability because it's not independent.

We recognize that having your initial efforts deleted can be discouraging. Most Teahouse hosts recommend that new editors spend considerable time improving other articles and learning the ropes before attempting the difficult task of creating a new article. Read the information at WP:Your first article to get an idea of what's required. — jmcgnh^{(talk) (contribs)} 07:02, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

It should be noted that this editor is currently under investigation at Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Sheikh Zaman ll. --Drm310 (talk) 14:53, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Query about references

What references required, while editing a page, for justifying it is true? — Preceding unsigned comment added by AJ bro (talk • contribs) 18:13, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Hello AJ bro and welcome to the Teahouse.

When you add information to an article, you must also supply a reference to a suitable source that substantiates the information. Wikipedia requires independent sources and can't just accept that you know something is true. Newspaper and magazine articles are usually acceptable for something like this. You could look at the article Help:Referencing for beginners as an introduction to how to go about it. — jmcgnh^{(talk) (contribs)} 07:07, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

A minor detail: you may use non-independent sources (for instance primary sources) to support uncontroversial factual statements (e.g. "company X's address/legal name is (such-and-such)" can be listed to the company's website). But anything else needs independent sources; otherwise, if warranted, it can also be reported but with attribution (e.g. "politician X claimed that (such-and-such) a thing happened", but not "(such-and-such) a thing happened", can be sourced to the politician's press release/Twitter). Tigraan^{Click here to contact me} 15:01, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Greeting

Hello! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kumba J. (talk • contribs) 01:42, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Hello back atcha, Kumba J. and welcome to the Teahouse. Normally questions are placed at the top of the page, but it doesn't look like you're asking a question yet, so I'll just leave this down at the bottom of the page. — jmcgnh^{(talk) (contribs)} 06:51, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Relevance of information

How to determine which information is relevant for which page? For example, is a celebrity's political opinion relevant and should it be on their page? DylannStormRoof (talk) 08:05, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Hello, DylannStormRoof. There is no easy answer to that sort of question in general: it usually comes down to individual cases. What we can certainly say is that if their political opinion has not been reported in a reliable source, then it shouldn't be in the article. Beyond that, it will depend on the individual case. Have they themselves made a big issue of their politics? Has their opinion been widely discussed, or just mentioned in passing? Has it been reported only in one partisan source (sources that are not neutral may be used as long as they are reliable sources, but if they represent a minority view among the sources, that should be reflected in the prominence given to material from them). By the way, I understand that you are not Dylann Roof, but I find your choice of user name very disturbing, and possibly contrary to the policy in WP:DISRUPTNAME --ColinFine (talk) 11:31, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Reverts without stated reasons or talk.

Hi Tea house please can you help me. My last two edits today on the 'Sri Chinmoy' page have been reverted without reasons or any suggestion of discussion on the talk page. My edits are additions of information from proper published articles already referenced on the article by earlier editors. I have only added factual information not already in the article. Please could you inform me if you are able to, what the actual problem might be that such reverts would be made or allowed? Thank you.Maryanne881 (talk) 09:20, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse. The place for you to discuss any dispute is Talk:Sri Chinmoy. --David Biddulph (talk) 09:53, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

BUSINESS SUPPORT

Good evening,I will write article for you,if you want it.Thanks.