User talk:Alanmak/Archive 2

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Hey there Alanmak, I just wanted to let you know that your photograph of Isla Vista has been added to UCSBWiki under the terms of the GFDL! It is a great picture, especially for our new website, and I would like to thank you for releasing it under a copyleft license.

Doopokko 21:06, 19 January 2006 (UTC)



is there any reason you changed class="toccolours" (copied from Toronto Star) to class="white"? Now the box does not have a border, and it looks really weird on my screen. (I don't know if it looks weird on your computer, though. Sometimes something looks weird here but looks ok on Windows.)—Gniw (Wing) 08:18, 1 December 2005 (UTC)

Jyutping vs IPA[edit]

My thoughts about jyutping and IPA is that we should always use jyutping and not IPA. If jyutping is too weird (which I agree) or not friendly for any other reason, then we should fix the jyutping article to make it immediately usable as a pronunciation key. But we must avoid IPA for Cantonese at all costs, because the combination of current Wikipedia IPA guidelines and Cantonese IPA conventions have together made IPA transcriptions for Cantonese close to completely meaningless in Wikipedia.

My reasoning is stated in my user page and in Instantnood's talk page. Obviously, by now you know my writings are very disorganized, so you'll have to have some patience reading my reasoning. I don't expect you to understand what I write, however; Instantnood obviously didn't.

When I have some time I might try to reorganize my reasoning and post it here, but I'm not doing this now; I'm hours past my sleep time and I am supposed to be looking for some (paper) document that I still haven't found.—Gniw (Wing) 08:39, 1 December 2005 (UTC)


Re your edit summaries: [1] [2]: I did suggest what we can do to allow readers to choose which of the pronunciation guides to be displayed by setting .css. Please kindly spend some time reading, give me a response, rather than keep lying around that I didn't suggest anything. Thanks. — Instantnood 20:36, 1 December 2005 (UTC)

As far as I know such a button is not possible. Please don't remove pronunciation guides when there's only two, or when they've already been there before you started to complain. There are other romanisation systems for Mandarin other than Pinyin, and for some articles the other systems are included. Meanwhile, please mind your language. — Instantnood 18:17, 5 December 2005 (UTC)

Lo mai kai[edit]

I'm that sure, but from the google test result has shown that lo mai kai has a greater popularity. I thought it's the common rountine to use the more common name in Wikipedia. On the other hand, there're some problems I'd like to ask you. You would find that the Chinese phoenix is redirected to fenghuang. Is that legitimate? In the Japanese cuisine, they use Shabu-shabu instead of Japanese hotpot. Why can they do so? -- Jerry Crimson Mann 07:54, 5 December 2005 (UTC)

Because the English language has an inherent POV of favouring Japanese terms, and there is no concensus among Chinese people what romanization to use. When in doubt, the Westerners use Japanese romanizations even for Chinese concepts, such as “kishotenketsu".—Gniw (Wing) 18:15, 12 December 2005 (UTC)
Could you please elaborate a bit what kishotenketsu is? Thanks. :-) — Instantnood 18:42, 12 December 2005 (UTC)
“Kishotenketsu” is the Japanese romanisation for “起轉結".—Gniw (Wing) 19:00, 12 December 2005 (UTC)

Slow revert wars[edit]

fyi, Most of the articles being reverted repeated are "topics about China" [3]. Revert warring is inappropriate. SchmuckyTheCat 19:55, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

Let readers to choose..[edit]

In response to your edit summary [4]: It was you who complained the pronunciation guide is too long, and that was the reason why I've invited you to help figure out how we can let readers to choose what to display by setting .css. You did not respond, and have insisted to remove a transliteration method arbitrary from articles, including those already having only two [5]. Please let me know what you want, and please stop removing things you don't like in an arbitrary manner. Thanks. — Instantnood 09:48, 10 December 2005 (UTC)

Macau map in Portuguese[edit]

Congratulations for the Portuguese version of the Macau map [Image:AdministrativeDivisionOfMacao-Portugese.png]. However, there are a few typos that it would be nice if you could correct:

  • The tittle should be: "Divisão Administrativa (not AdministrativO) da Região Administrativa (again, not AdministrativO) Especial de Macau da República Popular da China".
  • Add an acute to "António" in "Freguesia de Santo António" and in the legend for nr. 7 put "(Território ainda não atribuído a qualquer freguesia)".
  • It should be "Ponte da (not "de") Amizade". The neighbouring bridge should be "Ponte Governador Nobre de Carvalho" and not "Ponte Nobre Governador Carvalho". "Nobre de Carvalho" was the name of the governor.
  • Finally there is also an acute missing in the word "Lótus" in "Ponte Flor de Lótus". Thanks and keep on the good work! -- 13:39, 23 December 2005 (UTC) Manuel de Sousa

Define vandallism[edit]

I hope you do understand what vandalism is. A revert war is not considered as a good example of vandalism as the rules of Wikipedia have stated. -- Jerry Crimson Mann 08:11, 11 December 2005 (UTC)

Who has moved my lo mai gai?[edit]

Stop it. The google test has shown my point of view. -- Jerry Crimson Mann 17:53, 12 December 2005 (UTC)

More to add, you're rather stubborn, sad to say. -- Jerry Crimson Mann 17:57, 12 December 2005 (UTC)


I do appreciate your effort of adding Pinyin around in Hong Kong-related articles. But I'm afraid what you've been doing is creating more confusions to less-well-informed readers that they may think Putonghua is common and popular in Hong Kong, and the names are of Putonghua or Mandarin origins. Please kindly consider adding Cantonese transliterations simultaneously, or refrain from adding Pinyin for the time being. Alternatively you may put up a list to request other editors, so that they know where they have to add the Cantonese counterparts. Thanks. — Instantnood 20:24, 22 December 2005 (UTC)

I'm afraid you've missed my point. I do not object adding Pinyin to these articles. It is, nevertheless, my concern that you're possibly confusing or misleading many readers. You may consider creating a list to inform other editors, e.g., I myself, so that they add the Cantonese romanisations for you.

Meanwhile, the status of Shanghai dialect in Shanghai and Cantonese in Hong Kong is hardly comparable. The governor there doesn't speak in Wu or the Shanghai dialect publicly in official situation.

I don't think my ethnicity or linguistic background is of any relevance to the discussion here, and I do consider myself familiar enough with the social settings of the place I currently reside in. — Instantnood 21:05, 23 December 2005 (UTC)

The same old trouble again [6]. Please consider dropping a message at the user talk page of other wikipedians, or, at least, leave a short note in the edit summary. If it's like the above mentioned edit, nobody has any clue you've in fact requested for it. — Instantnood 20:53, 11 January 2006 (UTC)


I realise he is determined to show his sheer patriotism. It's always fair in war and love--loving your country, eh? PS Add an explanation in the talkpage of oyster omelette. You're informed that horjai is the Minnan (Fujian's and Taiwan's dialect) name for doulai (oyster). I'm not Hong Kong-centric, but you're just misleading the readers. -- Jerry Crimson Mann 12:36, 23 December 2005 (UTC)

I only want to make one point to this "message." I don't agree with the sentence "I realise he is determined to show his sheer patriotism." Only some people who is dwelling in a Chinese territory and holding a foreign citizenship have phobia for China. :-) Anyway, your point is pretty interesting. -- Alanmak 14:37, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
Who's holding a foreign nationality? And why is it relevant here? — Instantnood 21:06, 23 December 2005 (UTC)

Sorry for me butting into your talkpage, Alan, but I am rather intriged by the "I realise he is determined to show his sheer patriotism" statement. Was he directing that at you...or?--Huaiwei 15:36, 23 December 2005 (UTC)


Although I would usually reply on your talk page, I've replied on my talk page due to the number of participants. enochlau (talk) 21:29, 23 December 2005 (UTC)

Picture of the day[edit]

Hi Alan,

Just to let you know that your photo Image:Fog&Sunny.png is due to make an appearance as Pic of the Day on the 29th December. If you get a chance, you can check and improve the caption at Wikipedia:Picture of the day/December 29, 2005.

Page move of char siu[edit]

Your page move of char siu to barbecued pork was unwarranted, and I have reverted it. Barbecued pork and char siu are not by any means synonymous to English speakers. To most English speakers, "barbecued pork" means something entirely different, that is, smoked meat in the style of the southern United States. (See the barbecue article.) Char siu may be a type or example of one type of barbecued pork, but they are not the same thing.

Please do not gratutitously move pages without discussion on the Talk page.

Thank you, MCB 06:23, 29 December 2005 (UTC)


Don't forget to link the images you've uploaded to Wikimedia Commons from one of the Hong Kong-related galleries or categories there. Meanwhile, where in Sai Kung is the typhoon shelter in that picture? Thanks. — Instantnood 19:49, 29 December 2005 (UTC)

Just put the images to the gallery for Hong Kong or one of its children galleries. I can't find that typhoon shelter on maps, and I don't recall it's a typical typhoon shelter with dams, that I thought it's just a natural body of sheltered water where ships and boats are buoyed. :-P — Instantnood 08:52, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

A Dove[edit]

This Peace Dove is given to Alan and Jerry, both highly-talented young men dedicated to Wikipedia, from K.C. Tang, in the hope of ending the unhappiness caused by editing HK-related article. (KC)

I'm not too informed of the controversy, but I'm sure that every one acts on good faith. Talented people are often impatient, and impatience usually caused misunderstanding, and hence unhappiness. We hope that everything can be solved in a friendly way. Wikipedia is, after all, a place for fun and friendship. ^-^ (Forgive me if my words sound silly). --K.C. Tang 06:54, 6 January 2006 (UTC)

The country names China and Taiwan[edit]

I've added my opinion on this issue at Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (Chinese)#The country names China and Taiwan. Please feel free to provide your opinion and engage in discussions. Chanheigeorge 08:24, 8 January 2006 (UTC)

List of languages[edit]

Hi Alanmak,

Just to notify you that both you and Instantnood have reached your 3RR limit for this article.

The page history is starting to look like a script from the Three Stooges. I'm not saying that you are the one to blame, but I would appreciate it if you would refrain from bringing your ongoing fight to this article.

kwami 19:15, 14 January 2006 (UTC)

Alan, what you've added to the Chinese entry is good information. However, we simply don't have room for that much detail in the language list. There are similar details for every language in every country. Sould we also describe the Mandarin/Taiwanese issue in Taiwan? The official switch to Mandarin in Singapore? The standardized spelling of Cantonese in Chinese communities in Canada and the US? Where's the limit? We would quadruple the size of the article if we followed this level of detail for every language in every country, and it isn't fair to do this only for Chinese in mainland China. For most languages, we haven't even distinguished between national and official languages. You've supplied good info, but it belongs in the articles on China and Chinese, just as the details of other countries and languages belong in their articles. kwami 19:38, 21 January 2006 (UTC)

Classified information[edit]

Could you and Instantnood join the discussion on the talk page for this article?--agr 23:36, 14 January 2006 (UTC)

Category:Transportation in China[edit]

I wasn't making any comments on whether that was the right version, all I know is that Instantnood was stirring up an old debate with that edit. I reverted the edit and banned him from editing that category. What is done from there is up to people who are not on probation. --Wgfinley 19:52, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

  • Hello, Wgfinley. Thank you for your effort on solving the edit dispute. I was not intending to accuse you of making comments on whether that was the right version. The comment that I made about "some anti-China Wikipedians are pushing their POV" is not pointing to you. I pointed that out in the edit summary, just because some Wikipedians from Hong Kong have been demonstrating their high degree of anti-China sentiments in their edits, and have been trying their best to separate Hong Kong from all articles about China. In some situations, I agree that Hong Kong should have a separate article from the same topic for China. But this practice is not really necessary in ALL situation. Again, Thank you for your effort on solving the edit dispute. - Alanmak 20:05, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
    Not a problem, I just wanted to make sure my revert wasn't misinterpreted. I also appreciate your kind comments, thanks. --Wgfinley 20:13, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Age of Consent[edit]

Hi Alanmak, thanks for your contribution to the AoC page with regards to the Chinese states. Could I ask that you also find and cite the relavant legislation (if available in english?) as requested in each section's header and in the talk page 'AoC Chalenge'. This would help us turn this page from heresay to a properly authoritive article. Thanks Monotonehell 11:03, 28 January 2006 (UTC)

Capitol of the ROC[edit]

Hi, I'm reverting a series of edits about the capitol of the ROC. It's not exactly set in ROC law. It's a debate that has been held before on Wikipedia and nobody can actually cite a reference to an official capitol other than "the capitol is where the Yuan are". You can read about it here: Template talk:Republic of China infobox. If you can find a citation in ROC law, that'd be great. SchmuckyTheCat 01:58, 29 January 2006 (UTC)

Regarding War And Beauty[edit]

  • I am not being biased against Mainlanders when I say that they are not able to read the page. What I mean is that due to censorship, they have troubles accessing Wikipedia, full stop. To say that I am biased without any evidence other than your perception is, to honestly and bluntly say it, offending, especially for a person who has never talked to you. I would suggest that you take a look at what I have wrote on the discussion board on that page. Arbiteroftruth 04:04, 14 February 2006 (UTC)
  • In response to your comments, I know it should be in Hanyu Pinyin, but my problem with this is that the programme we are talking about is a Hong Kong production, and should we stick to the spelling which appeals to the audience it was intended for? Arbiteroftruth 14:19, 14 February 2006 (UTC)


Hi - I've just reverted your change of icon on {{China-geo-stub}}. As it clearly says at the top of the full list of stub templates: Several of the stub categories relate to controversial issues For this reason, many of the icons have been chosen carefully so as not to cause offense or appear biased. If you wish to change any stub icon, please clear the icon change at both Wikipedia:WikiProject Stub sorting/Proposals and at any WikiProject associated with the stub category first.

Specifically, maps are deliberately not used where there is a controvery relating to national boundaries, which there clearly is in the case of China. It took a considerable amount of debate before the neutral icon of the first part the name of China was chosen. Please - unless you have a more neutral suggestion for a possible icon, don't chnge it. If you do know of a more neutral icon, please discuss it at WP:WSS/P first! Grutness...wha? 09:27, 16 February 2006 (UTC)

Country templates[edit]

After a quick glance at Wikipedia:country referencing templates I'm having an impression that the first critera is the ISO 3166 standard. We may create {{HKG-IOC}} or {{Hong Kong, China}} (and {{Macao, China}} too) for designations by the IOC and for other situations (e.g. WTO), and in fact {{HKG-PRC}} and {{MAC-PRC}}, which was actually the result of compromise, is already serving that purpose. Please kindly do not make changes to templates that affects lots of articles before discussions (and I'd recommend restoring them before discussion is fruitful). Thanks. — Instantnood 05:58, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

Bet you've forgotton the possibility that the same would be happening, that people will be using the template you've modified without being aware of "Hong Kong, China" or "Macao, China" would be displayed for situations that are not necessary. However your position is, you should have stopped, restored them, and sought opinion from the community. Personally I won't mind reserving {{HKG}} and {{MAC}} for IOC and/or international organisation designations, but only after seeking community consensus, notes are adequately provided (with the <noinclude> tag), and their applications are closely monitored. — Instantnood 18:23, 19 February 2006 (UTC)
In my opinion, {{HKG}} should display Hong Kong and {{HKG-PRC}} Hong Kong, China, as that's been what's in use for quite some time now, and I see little reason to change it. —Nightstallion (?) 10:20, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

Cut-and-paste edit war[edit]


This message is for both Alanmak and Instantnood.

Never user cut-and-paste to "rename" a page. Page moves should always be made by using "move", never by cut-and-paste, because cut-and-paste does not preserve the article's history.

Also, viewing "what links here" shows that most pages link to Template:HK, which was presumably the original name for the article. So I've moved it there. If you want to propose a change to Template:HONG KONG, try Wikipedia:Requested moves. Please be sure that this name change would be consistent with other similar templates.

In summary, please don't edit war, please don't do cut-and-paste "moves", and especially don't edit war over templates, because this can leave articles that use the templates in a damaged condition (especially if you carelessly create double-redirects, which was the case here). -- Curps 23:30, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

Because of all the templates that have been renamed and redirected to one another (Template:HKG, etc), it's difficult to sort out what's used for what and who originated what and who reverted to what. Please contact Wikipedia:Mediation Committee if necessary, or other steps of Wikipedia:Dispute resolution. Please don't edit war, especially over templates. -- Curps 23:40, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

Instantnood, I see you have a pending Arbitration case, and one of the aspects concerns edits to Hong Kong-related pages. This is really not a good time for you to be edit-warring. -- Curps 23:43, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

Referencing templates[edit]

Re: [7] - Hello Alan. I've a message for Curps and you at user talk:Curps. Instantnood 05:20, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

Changes to Template:Navy related tags[edit]

Is there a particular reason you felt the need to alter the tag names for these? Now a bunch of links are broken on pages such as List of naval ship classes in service which use those tags. The standard for the Template:Navy tags is the same as for the Template:Country tags (where I got the format by the way): ISO 3166-1 3-digit country codes. If you really want to use your own alternative names for these places, then please use redirects or something that does not result in breaking a bunch of otherwise working links. Thanks! Josh 04:16, 22 February 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the fix. Josh 04:36, 22 February 2006 (UTC)


Please be reminded to take a look at, and as you wish, to respond to the messages I've left on a few talk pages regarding your edits. Thanks in advance. — Instantnood 08:42, 28 February 2006 (UTC)

Log deletion nominations[edit]

Please kindly log your nominations at Wikipedia:WikiProject Deletion sorting/Hong Kong and Hong Kong wikipedians' notice board, as well as other relevant sorting projects and notice boards whenever appropriate and necessary. Thanks. — Instantnood 08:42, 28 February 2006 (UTC)

Request for edit summary[edit]

Hi. I am a bot, and I am writing to you with a request. I would like to ask you, if possible, to use edit summaries a bit more often when you contribute. The reason an edit summary is important is because it allows your fellow contributors to understand what you changed; you can think of it as the "Subject:" line in an email. For your information, your current edit summary usage is 21% for major edits and 25% for minor edits. (Based on the last 150 major and 150 minor edits in the article namespace.)

This is just a suggestion, and I hope that I did not appear impolite. You do not need to reply to this message, but if you would like to give me feedback, you can do so at the feedback page. Thank you, and happy edits, Mathbot 07:00, 3 March 2006 (UTC)


User:SchmuckyTheCat/Mick Jagger, Wikipedia:Administrators'_noticeboard/Incidents#Instantnood.2C_post_Arbcom SchmuckyTheCat 09:12, 25 March 2006 (UTC)

Blocked for 48[edit]

I have blocked you for 48 hours because the majority of your edits in the last few days are reverts. Revert wars do not improve articles. If Instantnood is being mean and nasty to you, you must discuss it with him or ask for outside help before doing massive reverts; grudges are not allowed on Wikipedia. Ashibaka tock 01:01, 26 March 2006 (UTC)


You recently reverted my substitution of GoldenBauhiniaSquare.png with the JPEG version GoldenBauhiniaSquare.jpg. I had made the substitution in accordance with Wikipedia:Image use policy#Format, which says that photographs should be in JPEG format. There are good technical reasons for this recommendation: for example, the thumbnail at Golden Bauhinia Square takes seven times more bandwidth to download in PNG format than in JPEG format.

I agree that the PNG version looks slightly better at small sizes — this is to some extent due to a recent change to the JPEG thumbnail generator which emphasized compression over quality, perhaps excessively so. Nonetheless, JPEG remains the approriate, and recommended, format for photographic images on Wikipedia. If you'd like to see the quality of JPEG thumbnails on Wikipedia increased, it would be more productive to propose doing so at WP:VPT rather than replacing JPEG images with PNG versions. —Ilmari Karonen (talk) 23:07, 30 March 2006 (UTC)

What vandalism[edit]

You "reverted vandalism" with this edit -- yet I don't see any vandalism there... ? --Chris (talk) 08:21, 31 March 2006 (UTC)

Re: Resolution[edit]

As a good sign, you should restore the deleted comments and your user talk page, and respond to them. You should also revert the undiscussed and unexplained edits you have made to the many articles across Wikipedia, and explain at the corresponding talk pages. Settlements on Wikipedia should not be brought private. In my opinion, jau gwei warrants its own article. Finally, I find it offensive to see your reminder at my talk page requesting me not to be offensive, for I've never ever done anything that was offensive to you. — Instantnood 15:12, 1 April 2006 (UTC)

Who's accussing who? You implied I did, and I just meant to clarify I didn't. Permission is never necessary on Wikipedia, and I suppose it's generally accepted that when something is disputed, the original state should be restored. You should have proposed it in the discussion page before making edits you already know they're controversial, and you should have known that history of all activities on Wikipedia are open to everyone. — Instantnood 14:13, 8 April 2006 (UTC)

what is vandalism[edit]

IMO Instandnood's contribution [8] is not WP:Vandalism . Tobias Conradi (Talk) 00:47, 24 April 2006 (UTC)

Blocked for 48[edit]

I am once again blocking you for 48 hours in order to prevent more massive revert warring. You are involved in a dispute with Instantnood, so you don't have the right to play the cop with edit summaries such as:

If you continue to vandalise this page, you will be blocked. [9]

And again, we have a very thorough dispute resolution process. I don't have any expertise in this subject but I don't think it would be very hard to ask for help. Ashibaka tock 01:42, 24 April 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, no kidding, we do have a dispute resolution process, and Instantnood is the one under Arbcom sanction for POV pushing. Did you miss that part? Instantnood is the one making totally asinine edits and carrying on revert wars, and you are blocking Alanmak. I have no defense for Alan, I don't agree with all of his edits. I'd like it if Alan paid more attention to his reverts to not remove intervening edits by uninvolved editors. However, there is no way in hell that blocking Alan and not 'nood is appropriate. SchmuckyTheCat 02:21, 24 April 2006 (UTC)
Instantnood is already page blocked, by Tony Sidaway no less. I have seen no evidence that this is a one-sided conflict. Ashibaka tock 02:33, 24 April 2006 (UTC)
Yet the revert wars continue. He's not page blocked on the revert wars he did today is he? Why not? SchmuckyTheCat 02:44, 24 April 2006 (UTC)

Your attempt earlier to discuss and find a mutual agreement with Instantnood was laudable. I was just about to file a RFC against you when I saw that and was impressed. But just because Instantnood did not respond in kind and was being unreasonable does not mean you should allow things to degenerate back into this cycle of revert wars. No one wins in a brute force revert war, as you might have realized by now. Try discussing things, like you had proposed with Instantnood, and if that doesn't work out, move further down the wikipedia:dispute resolution process, be it a RFC or mediation. You don't need to get yourself banned for this senselessness. --Jiang 08:10, 24 April 2006 (UTC)

SCMP and U Magazine interview[edit]

Hi Alan, I am a HK Wikipedian mostly active at zh: . Two journalists, one from the South China Morning Post and the other from U Magazine, want to interview some HK Wikipedians about our experience at wp. The SCMP interview would be held on this Saturday (29 April) and the location is up to us. While the time and place for the U Magazine interview are not yet confirmed (it would probably in this week also). So are you interested? What time and place would be convenient for you? Thanks a lot :) --Lorenzarius 15:23, 25 April 2006 (UTC)

Your notice[edit]

Re " If [Instantnood] doesn't give up pushing his biased and separatist view points to the articles,.. " [10] - Don't judge simply by your feelings. We're editing an encyclopædia. What we need is evidence. I have demonstrated, for many times, I am not a separatist, nor am I pro-handover/reunification/whatever you call it. I acknowledge only the status quo, as well as what have actually happened. — Instantnood 20:12, 27 April 2006 (UTC)


Hi, I noticed that you seem to be having a bit of troubles with Instantnood. I suggest that you try some of the dispute resolution methods on WP before getting into an edit war with him. Repeated reversions won't achieve anything whilst discussion hopefully will be more fruitful. novacatz 03:42, 28 April 2006 (UTC)

Considering that Instantnood has already been to ArbCom twice, what method of dispute resolution do you suggest for Alanmak? What similar smart words of advice do you have for Instantnood? SchmuckyTheCat 06:47, 28 April 2006 (UTC)
I suggest as a first step for Alan to knock off the revert wars. It isn't like coming off a 48 hr block and then immediately resuming reverting Instant's changes is going to fix anything. I would say exactly the same thing to Instant as well. novacatz 07:00, 28 April 2006 (UTC)

Despite your notice at the top that you don't particularly like administrators doing dispute resolving kind of stuff, I'm going to offer to (informally) mediate between you and Instantnood, as suggested by Ashibaka. There is no obligation on you to agree to this, but it would be best for everyone if some dialog were to be had between the affected parties. I'm going to offer to this as a normal user - I will not block you or Instantnood for the duration of any mediation, so there's nothing to be afraid of. Cheers. enochlau (talk) 03:29, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

Alan, are you coming to the table or not? enochlau (talk) 06:45, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
Thanks for your reply. I can see that you are sincere about resolving the situation.
Firstly, let me explain why I am involved. I think Ashibaka called me in because I had previously offered, on Instantnood's talk page, to mediate any disputes involving him. As someone from (although not in :P) Hong Kong, and as someone who follows issues related to Hong Kong a little more closely than perhaps your average administrator, I think I might be able to provide some insight into any mediation. Furthermore, I had previously dealt with Instantnood, Huaiwei and ShmuckyTheCat, in often acrimonious arguments, so I have some idea as to where the issues lie.
I think that it's important to keep the dialog continuing, even if one party is uncooperative. Unless Instantnood leaves Wikipedia, he is someone that all of us will have to work with, and it is to everyone's best interest to come to some kind of resolution. What I propose we actually do is that all interested parties attempt to justify or explain their reasoning behind certain questionable edits over the past days/weeks - it's been happening in the edit summaries, which isn't ideal at all. From this, we should then seek, with input from other Hong Kong Wikipedians, to see if we can amend Wikipedia:Naming conventions (Chinese), which currently has a big NPOV tag stuck onto the Political POV section, to finalise, for once and for all, what we should call these things. Although it may seem as if we're going to a lot of effort for something that appears unnecessary, if we can formalise things a little, it'll make it easier for everyone in the end as there is some policy we can point to and guide us along.
Edit warring by anyone is bad, either by Instantnood, yourself or anyone else. Unfortunately, there is no real way to stop someone from edit warring except by blocking them - unless we stop it at the source by having some coherent policy framework we can lean on.
Keep up the good work and the thing to keep in mind is just never to lose your cool. I lost my cool once with Huaiwei, and it wasn't nice. But at the end of the day, it's just Wikipedia. enochlau (talk) 10:35, 30 April 2006 (UTC)

WP:POINT on Germany[edit]

Hi Alan! I noticed that you have at least twice removed the German "Bundesrepublik Deutschland" from Germany, apparently because you are upset about the outcome of a poll (and the subsequent nehaviour of some editors) on UN-related articles. I didn't get the details, but AFAIK this poll does not apply to individual countries. Whatever your opinion, or the other editors opinion, please don't disrupt any articles to make a point. Thanks!. --Stephan Schulz 22:06, 30 April 2006 (UTC)

Getting admin help[edit]

Though it often results in listening to the crickets sing, this page might be helpful for bringing up problem users. Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Arbitration enforcement. SchmuckyTheCat 01:15, 2 May 2006 (UTC)


Re " Since that dude is still bringing up excuse to deny the fact that Hong Kong is a part of the country China, no compromise. His messages may not be responsed any more. " [11] - In what way did I deny the fact that Hong Kong is constitutionally defined as "an inalienable part" of a sovereign state officially known as People's Republic of China? If there's any such case(s), please cite it/them whenever you're accusing. Thanks. — Instantnood 04:34, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

Sai Sha Road[edit]

[12] [13] Could you please kindly explain what exactly do you disagree with? Thank you. — Instantnood 14:03, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

Re:Districts of Hong Kong[edit]

The first sentence has been edited to remove any potential source of conflict as the new sentence structure precludes any argument as to how the links should be formulated. I hope you find this version acceptable. enochlau (talk) 03:44, 9 May 2006 (UTC)

Legislative Yuan[edit]

In the article on the Legislative Yuan, Yuan is translated with court. In the List of legislatures by country you deleted this translation. I don't speak Chinese, so could you provide me with the literal translation of the Chinese word Yuan? Electionworld = Wilfried (talk 09:13, 12 May 2006 (UTC)

"Some users frequently make edits that require reverting"[edit]

Please remove this section from your user page, or at least rework it. It's phrased in such a way that it could easily be construed as a personal attack, and gives the impression the you're sufficiently intent on "following around" those individuals in such a way that you might be accused of "wikistalking" (as wretched a piece of terminology as that is). Alai 18:30, 18 May 2006 (UTC)

Original file?[edit]

Hi Alan, would you still have the original file to Image:ChinaGeography.png? I would like to translate it into Chinese. Thanks. -- tonync (talk) (講) 16:05, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

I wanna spit blood[edit]

I'm trying to fix the page Bus uncle and the redirect page Uncle bus. Despite the fact that it's grammatical inaccurate, the Google test has shown that the former term is more popular, Even more, several English newspaper use the term "Bus uncle" too. But there's a user keeps on reverting my fix! Wanna spit blood at one!!! -- Jerry Crimson Mann 17:15, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

Image Tagging for Image:Underground-Railway-in-China-icon.png[edit]

Thanks for uploading Image:Underground-Railway-in-China-icon.png. The image has been identified as not specifying the source and creator of the image, which is required by Wikipedia's policy on images. If you don't indicate the source and creator of the image on the image's description page, it may be deleted some time in the next seven days. If you have uploaded other images, please verify that you have provided source information for them as well.

For more information on using images, see the following pages:

This is an automated notice by OrphanBot. For assistance on the image use policy, see Wikipedia:Media copyright questions. 02:42, 17 June 2006 (UTC)


Some maps made by you, e.g., Image:ChinaGeography.png have been tagged as POV maps. Please make necessary corrections. deeptrivia (talk) 03:56, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

Also on the one above noted, it says "Northeastern Plan"—I'm assuming it should be "Northeastern Plain"?

Great pic at Commons[edit]

Hi, I've just seen your lovely pic Image:Laundromat-SolarCell.png at Commons. Any chance you could add a bit more description to the image page, eg what country it's in? People want to know! :-) JackyR | Talk 12:59, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

"POV maps"[edit]

you may wish to partake in the discussions at Image talk:PR China-SAR & SEZ-English.png and Image talk:ChinaGeography.png regarding the accuracy and neutrality of these maps.--Jiang 06:23, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

You have been temporarily blocked for violation of the three-revert rule. Please feel free to return after the block expires, but also please make an effort to discuss your changes further in the future.

--WinHunter (talk) 09:45, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

HK district emblems[edit]

Where did you find the Sha Tin district emblem on a white background[14]? I want to upload the other district emblems but couldn't find them on a white background like that. - Hong Qi Gong (Talk - Contribs) 03:26, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Replied - Hong Qi Gong (Talk - Contribs) 05:15, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

zh-Hant and zh-Hans language codes[edit]

I just noticed you reverted my edits to Template:Chinese. Please, note that the language codes recommended by the W3C for Simplified and Traditional Chinese are zh-Hans and zh-Hant respectively, and not zh-s and zh-t. See Specifying Language in XHTML & HTML Content — Best Practice 13: Use Hans and Hant codes. Best regards --surueña 09:03, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

Thank you for your explanation. The reason why I reverted your edit was that, in the zh-Hans mode, some Chinese characters appeared to be smaller than the others. It just didn't look very nice. Is there any other way to deal with this problem? - Alan 22:25, 21 September 2006 (UTC)
Strange… maybe some tweaking of MediaWiki:Common.css will be needed. In which fields happens this problem? (Please, write below an example) What's your browser and OS? --surueña 08:01, 22 September 2006 (UTC)
PS: I'm watching your talk page, so it's better to have the entire discussion in one place and not breaking the conversation.
Sorry, I can't really find a good example for the problem. But what happened was that some Chinese characters look smaller than the others. I am using Internet Explorer 6.0 and Windows XP. - Alan 08:39, 22 September 2006 (UTC)
Inside the same block of text, or between different rows? Do you see any difference in the next table? (In Firefox and Opera 9.02 under Linux I see no difference at all):
Asian font test
Edit this table and put the characters you want (I don't know Chinese). And also try changing your personal style sheet: go to User:Alanmak/monobook.css and add the following code:
:lang(zh)       {font-family: PMingLiU,MingLiU, serif;}
:lang(zh-Hant)  {font-family: PMingLiU,MingLiU, serif;}
:lang(zh-Hans)  {font-family: SimSum-18030;SimHei, serif;}
However, probably in IE6 this doesn't make any change.--surueña 10:24, 22 September 2006 (UTC)


Hi, I found that the boundary for Hong Kong is incorrect in this map you uploaded. See for the correct boundary. I wonder if you would correct it? Otherwise it may be deleted sooner or later, because it gives wrong information. --minghong 16:44, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Image:MainlandChina.png listed for deletion[edit]

An image or media file that you uploaded or altered, Image:MainlandChina.png, has been listed at Wikipedia:Images and media for deletion. Please look there to see why this is (you may have to search for the title of the image to find its entry), if you are interested in it not being deleted. Thank you. minghong 15:16, 4 October 2006 (UTC) minghong 15:16, 4 October 2006 (UTC) .

Chinese Dragon (addition of box)[edit]

Alanmak, I think it was you who added the box for Chinese Dragon. I suggested this change way back in April, then went to China where it was impossible to continue editing. After all this time it is great to see someone who will roll up their shirtsleeves and actually go in and improve an article, rather than sniping from the sidelines. Thanks!

Bathrobe 08:54, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

hong kong[edit]


I do not understand why you have changed the Hong Kong article so that "Hong Kong is a city" AND "Largest City: Sha Tin". They can't be both classified as cities, right?
  • never mind about this! my mistake here =)

Why are you removing the historical note about the capital city of Hong Kong territory? I have re-added it, with clarification that it is for the historical Hong Kong territory.

I am not sure about the language; I will leave that alone. What happened to de facto Cantonese?

You reverted my revision to the note in parentheses. Parentheses are informal and I will rewrite the note about the scrapped GST plan.

Finally, the category English-speaking countries only includes countries.

--PeregrineAY 10:27, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

China Railway Network[edit]

For the Image:ChinaRailwayNetwork.png, the latest version should be included the Qingzang railway. The present version can be kept to descripe the previous development of the railway system. And, I would like to learn how to edit a map like that, or if you prefer to make a new one. One thing else, could you please state the map you for the Image:ChinaRailwayNetwork.png?! Sorry for my poor English. Best wishes! Stewart~惡龍 15:54, 5 February 2007 (UTC)

what about thr Kowloon-Canton RailWays (KCR)?


hello, could you perhaps make a map of Jeju like you did for Hong Kong and Macau? -- 22:57, 19 March 2007 (UTC)


Hi, my name is Orel Zion, and I member of the hebrew Wikipedia. You asked for someone to translate the Macou map that you have made. so, I'll try my best. but I have one problem, I realy don't know how yo traslate concelho (although I understand the meaning), can I just write municipality (עירייה)? if so, so I need to change it, so let me know. by the way, you realy did a good job, I think you have the credit for that.

any way, well, the title is האזורים המנהליים במחוז המנהלי מקאו של הרפובליקה העממית של סין
drawn by... - שורטט ע"י אלן מק לשימוש וויקיפדיה
Macou peninsula - חצי-האי מקאו
concelho of macou - של מקאו ???
our... - אזור פטימה גבירתנו
st. an... - אזור אנטוני הקדוש
st. laz... - אזור לזרוס הקדוש
st. law... - אזור לורנס הקדוש
ca... - אזור הקתדרלה
conchelo of the islands - של האיים ???
our lady carmo - אזור כרמו גבירתנו
not yet... - עדיין לא הוכרז רשמית
st. fran... - אזור פרנסיסקו קסבייר הקדוש
Macou International Airport - שדה התעופה הבינלאומי של מקאו
sai van bridge - גשר סאי ואן
governer... - גשר נורבה דה קרבלחו המושל
sino... - גשר הידידות סין-פורטוגל
taipa island - האי טאיפה
cotai... - שטחים שנדרשו מחדש
lotus bridge - גשר הלוטוס
coleane island - האי קולין
city of zhuhai... - העיר ג'וחאי שבמחוז גואנגדונג

—The preceding unsigned comment was added by (talk) 01:23, 21 March 2007 (UTC).

Image:ChinaGeography.png typo[edit] , which you created, has a typo in the upper right corner. What you have written as "Dahinggangling" should in fact be "Daxing'anling". The Chinese characters are 大興安嶺 or 大兴安岭. I see the CIA Factbook map, at , has also introduced a spurious initial h. Thanks for your labor, though. Charmii 01:24, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

Copyright violation[edit]

Please remove Wikipedia logo from these images, as it is copyrighted see: Image:Wikipedia-logo.png

--Vaya 13:25, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

Fog & Sunny FP delisting candidate[edit]

Dear Alanmak, I have listed your picture of Fog & Sunny at Featured picture delisting candidates. Sorry. I do not believe that it meets the FP criteria as they currently stand.

If you want to, have a look at the nomination here: Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/delist/Fog & Sunny and comment.

Best, Witty Lama 22:45, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

Map of Macao in the German Wikipedia[edit]

Hi Alan, I found some little mistakes in the German translation:

  • Please replace "Verwaltungsbezirke der Macao Sonderverwaltungszone" by "Verwaltungsbezirke der Sonderverwaltungszone Macao""
  • "Brücke von Freundschaft" by "Brücke der Freundschaft"
  • "Brücke von Nobre Governador Carvalho" by "Nobre-Governador-Carvalho-Brücke"
  • "Brücke von Lotos" by "Lotos-Brücke"
  • "Cotai (Neu künstliche Aufschüttung)" by "Cotai (Neue künstliche Aufschüttung)
  • "Unsrer" by "Unserer"
  • "(Keine Gemeinde ist noch zugeteilt)" by "(Ist noch keinem Gemeindebezirk zugeteilt)"

But I repeat, these are really irrelevant mistakes with no consequences for the understanding, just for the sake of completeness. Otherwise I have to praise your work ;-)

Greets, Bastian 22:15, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

I have corrected the captions of Image:AdministrativeDivisionOfMacao-German.png. --Salocin Flag of Bremen.svgFlag of Germany.svgTalk 17:58, 20 August 2008 (UTC)

Double Fifth[edit]

Alan, at Duanwu Festival you've added a 'citation needed' tag after the statement that it is also known as the Double Fifth.

I am not sure why you added this notice. If you do a quick Google, you will find a number of websites that refer to the festival as the Double Fifth. The addition of a 'citation needed' tag adds nothing and actually detracts from the article. (At the very least I think you should have queried the name on the talk page before adding the 'citation needed' tag).

What is worse, though, Double Fifth is the name of the disambiguation article (see Double Fifth). It is quite strange reading the article to find the title of the disambuation article queried in the article itself.

The reason I am bringing this up is because I am concerned at the way in which many editors recently are adding 'citation needed' tags on anything that they don't agree with or have personally never heard of. Many people seem to find it much easier to add such a tag than it is to check sources or rewrite something that is factually wrong. And adding the tag, of course, discredits what someone has written in the article.

Bathrobe 12:49, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

Template talk[edit]

Hi. I am starting a conversation for template discussion here. Please join in, I think you are working on those chinese templates. Benjwong 19:53, 7 July 2007 (UTC)


Information icon.svg

Hello, this is a message from an automated bot. A tag has been placed on Template:Cjk, by Benjwong (talk · contribs), another Wikipedia user, requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. The tag claims that it should be speedily deleted because Template:Cjk fits the criteria for speedy deletion for the following reason:

As per Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style (China-related articles) discussion, Template:cjk is to be deleted in favor of Template:Chinese

To contest the tagging and request that administrators wait before possibly deleting Template:Cjk, please affix the template {{hangon}} to the page, and put a note on its talk page. If the article has already been deleted, see the advice and instructions at WP:WMD. Feel free to leave a message on the bot operator's talk page if you have any questions about this or any problems with this bot, bearing in mind that this bot is only informing you of the nomination for speedy deletion; it does not perform any nominations or deletions itself. --Android Mouse Bot 2 02:25, 10 July 2007 (UTC)


Maybe you should go to Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style (China-related articles) and talk with User:Badagnani. Benjwong 07:51, 10 July 2007 (UTC)


I am making a number of changes to my own sandbox. You can see the "template Sandboxtest3", you have to look at the picture captions at User_talk:Benjwong/Sandboxtest2. When finished this should be the best combined feature of Template:Chinese and Template:Chinesename. I can understand some of the concerns he has. When finished I have no idea if it is better or worse. Benjwong 00:39, 14 July 2007 (UTC)

AfD nomination of Royal Park Hotel[edit]

Royal Park Hotel, an article you created, has been nominated for deletion. We appreciate your contributions. However, an editor does not feel that Royal Park Hotel satisfies Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion and has explained why in the nomination space (see also "What Wikipedia is not" and the Wikipedia deletion policy). Your opinions on the matter are welcome; please participate in the discussion by adding your comments at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Royal Park Hotel and please be sure to sign your comments with four tildes (~~~~). You are free to edit the content of Royal Park Hotel during the discussion but should not remove the articles for deletion template from the top of the article; such removal will not end the deletion discussion. Thank you. Russavia 18:02, 29 July 2007 (UTC)

Hong Kong FAR[edit]

Hong Kong has been nominated for a featured article review. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. Please leave your comments and help us to return the article to featured quality. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, articles are moved onto the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Remove" the article from featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. Reviewers' concerns are here. --Joowwww (talk) 11:46, 4 May 2008 (UTC)

Image wanted[edit]

Hi. I noticed you commented on this engine image. You may like to comment on the planned new image here Cuddlyable3 (talk) 12:11, 16 July 2008 (UTC)

Speedy deletion of Image:KMBTrainingBus-interior.png[edit]

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A tag has been placed on Image:KMBTrainingBus-interior.png requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under section I8 of the criteria for speedy deletion, because it is available as a bit-for-bit identical copy on the Wikimedia Commons under the same name, or all references to the image on Wikipedia have been updated to point to the title used at Commons.

If you think that this notice was placed here in error, you may contest the deletion by adding {{hangon}} to the top of the page that has been nominated for deletion (just below the existing speedy deletion or "db" tag), coupled with adding a note on [[ Talk:Image:KMBTrainingBus-interior.png|the talk page]] explaining your position, but be aware that once tagged for speedy deletion, if the article meets the criterion it may be deleted without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag yourself, but don't hesitate to add information to the article that would would render it more in conformance with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. Lastly, please note that if the article does get deleted, you can contact one of these admins to request that a copy be emailed to you. Sdrtirs (talk) 02:27, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Speedy deletion of Image:NWFBTrainingBuses.png[edit]

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A tag has been placed on Image:NWFBTrainingBuses.png requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under section I8 of the criteria for speedy deletion, because it is available as a bit-for-bit identical copy on the Wikimedia Commons under the same name, or all references to the image on Wikipedia have been updated to point to the title used at Commons.

If you think that this notice was placed here in error, you may contest the deletion by adding {{hangon}} to the top of the page that has been nominated for deletion (just below the existing speedy deletion or "db" tag), coupled with adding a note on [[ Talk:Image:NWFBTrainingBuses.png|the talk page]] explaining your position, but be aware that once tagged for speedy deletion, if the article meets the criterion it may be deleted without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag yourself, but don't hesitate to add information to the article that would would render it more in conformance with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. Lastly, please note that if the article does get deleted, you can contact one of these admins to request that a copy be emailed to you. Sdrtirs (talk) 02:27, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Image source problem with Image:TibetanPlateau.jpg[edit]

Image Copyright problem

Thanks for uploading Image:TibetanPlateau.jpg. I noticed that the file's description page currently doesn't specify who created the content, so the copyright status is unclear. If you did not create this file yourself, you will need to specify the owner of the copyright. If you obtained it from a website, then a link to the website from which it was taken, together with a restatement of that website's terms of use of its content, is usually sufficient information. However, if the copyright holder is different from the website's publisher, their copyright should also be acknowledged.

If you have uploaded other files, consider checking that you have specified their source and tagged them, too. You can find a list of files you have uploaded by following this link. Unsourced and untagged images may be deleted one week after they have been tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If the image is copyrighted under a non-free license (per Wikipedia:Fair use) then the image will be deleted 48 hours after 18:36, 25 August 2008 (UTC). If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. Calliopejen1 (talk) 18:36, 25 August 2008 (UTC)

Image:TibetanPlateau.jpg listed for deletion[edit]

An image or media file that you uploaded or altered, Image:TibetanPlateau.jpg, has been listed at Wikipedia:Images and media for deletion. Please see the discussion to see why this is (you may have to search for the title of the image to find its entry), if you are interested in it not being deleted. Thank you. Calliopejen1 (talk) 18:37, 25 August 2008 (UTC)