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Need help with rogue editor. Was referred here by dispute resolution.

This is about the page, The Palmer Report. I was told when I lodged a complaint on the dispute board, to come here. There is an edit war raging and luckily, it stopped in July. But a rogue editor has stirred the pot again and locked the page down and "talk" as well. Palmer Report is a Left-wing blog. It offers Political news and often analysis.

The founder once ran a site called "The daily News bin." The editor I refer to is Dr. Swaglordphd. I do not wish to speak bad of him but he is the one who will not let this go. Apparently, Swag changed PR header to say it is a fake news site. This produced hard feelings. Swag did say in his edit "feel free to revert." The problem is he's got alot of friends on here and some editors were pissed that this started up again so they locked the talk page. I read every comment, I made some of those comments and no threats were made, just pleas to please take "fake news" out of the header. This is not a fake news site and in fact was just featured on MSNBC the other night with Brian Williams. MSNBC is a recognized source. It would appear to me that some are just interested in "winning" versus really thinking about the issue. If you look at the talk page, several editors agree with me. Several. One even went so far as to say by stating that calling PR fake news one is basically calling them b-sh#t. This is not a non-biased thing and anyway Dr. swag must have known this since when he did his edit he invited anyone to revert it back. Dr. swag has also been complained about by Raw story for basically doing the same. They are also left-wing.It would seem he wants to as one complaint put it, push down the good stuff and push the bad stuff upward. I am hoping SOMEONE will take this seriously and even if the term fake news must remain there is no reason why it must remain in the header. I invite anyone to read what has been going on there and lastly -- Dr. swag now wants to change it AGAIN and wipe out the word "website" explaining that PR has always been the daily bin and that they are the exact same thing. This does not come from a reliable source. It comes from Dr. swag's preconceived notions. In fact I am and was a reader of both and they are two completely different sites. Here are his words that speak for themselves.I ask for help from a kind and non-biased editor or editors.

Swaglord: 4) For all intents and purposes, Daily News Bin is the Palmer Report. There is no difference in content or ownership between the two. Palmer literally just changed 2600:6C65:7E7F:B93E:3992:37A7:BB99:C937 (talk) 22:56, 24 August 2021 (UTC)

Courtesy link: Palmer Report. Karenthewriter (talk) 23:02, 24 August 2021 (UTC)

Person using a very long IP number, your post above is very long. I confess that I haven't read it with care. (I really doubt that anyone will. In order to be persuasive, you must first be read; and in order to be read, you must maximize the signal/noise ratio.)

• You seem to have a content dispute. There have been content disputes about the article in its talk page, Talk:Palmer Report. You don't seem to have participated. Participate, persuasively. (Tip: Before hitting "Publish changes", try reading what you've written, aloud. Cut the flab.) If the discussion is problematic, look at Wikipedia:Dispute resolution for tips on what to do and how to do it.
• Incidentally, while you're free to participate without being logged in, it's likely that what you say will be taken more seriously if you are logged in as such-and-such a user ID.
• In recent days, you (or somebody resembling you) have twice attempted to bring this up on Wikipedia:Dispute resolution noticeboard. The first time, you were told "the filing editor did not correctly list any other editors and did not notify any other editors". That shows that you ignored (or didn't bother to read) the instructions at the top of that noticeboard. But that comment seems to have had no effect on you, because the second time: "Closed for failure to read instructions or follow the listing rules." Transporterman added: "The filing party [that's you] is obviously struggling with limited resources and the complexity of Wikipedia and is advised to seek help at the Wikipedia Teahouse which is intended to help newcomers." (I'll attempt to help by suggesting that you get a user ID, log in under it, and participate in the discussions on the page Talk:Palmer Report.) Meanwhile, don't kid yourself that the "Dispute resolution noticeboard" offers a way to avoid the need for meticulously worded statement. See "Psychology" on that noticeboard for an example of how a complainant should set out a case there.

-- Hoary (talk) 05:08, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

Complaints about rogue editors in Wikipedia are common, and usually have either of two effects. Either they are simply ignored, or they result in a boomerang being thrown back at the complaining editor for the personal attack. Civility is the fourth pillar of Wikipedia, and does not just consist of the avoidance of "bad words", but of treating other editors with a minimum amount of respect and dignity because they are human beings. Robert McClenon (talk) 05:25, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

@Hoary: I would remind you that IPs are human too, even when they use IPv6 (person using a very long IP number). Furthermore, one should not have to register an account (never seen the term "user id" before btw) to get taken seriously; if some people are dismissing OP’s queries based on their IP status, they are the ones in the wrong. Of course, your other points about brevity still stand. Tigraan^{Click here for my talk page ("private" contact)} 12:14, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

Tigraan, I do understand that IPs are human too; I dismissed the detail of this effusion not because its writer wasn't logged in but because of its prolixity. (As I glance below, I get the impression that you and I agree at least partially.) I didn't dismiss it as a whole; indeed, I responded to it (or anyway to certain aspects of it). -- Hoary (talk) 12:31, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

OK. I am going to respond and this post maybe long but that's just the way it is. You do not have to read if you choose not to. First off, I have participated so you are wrong about that. They locked the talk-page down. Then I went to dispute and was referred here. All rules followed! I DID let editors know. Wiki said to go to their talk-pages and that is exactly what I did. There was one editor who seemed to be anonymous but I posted on at least three editors talk-pages. I have said (about 50 times now) that I am recovering from a broken knee. I am not asking for sympathy for that but that IS the reason I cannot spend alot of time on here and the only reason I keep speaking about my broken knee is because everybody keeps ignoring me and asking me to create an account. I cannot due to the knee and the fact that the person whose computer I use is frankly not a fan of Wiki and does not want me to make an account using his computer which, being a kind and understanding soul, I understand.I am grateful he let me use it at all. I have tried being polite and kind and specific and I do not like nor do I understand being accused of a personal attack on an editor. I am sure he is a very nice person. I have a disagreement with him. I asked for help. That's all. It also boggles my mind. Free speech is a thing. Are you telling me that questioning an editor's judgement is considered a personal attack? So, this place that is supposedly opened to the world is in reality not because if one cannot have meaningful discussions and communications without being scolded then where is the free speech? I am on here because two blogs I love--Palmer Report and Raw Story--are being lied about. Sorry to be politically incorrect but when I am sweet and docile and polite I am labeled as not being courteous to the editors. An analogy would be like complaining there's a big in your food and being scolded by the manager for being impolite to bring it up. I am educated and as such I know when avoidance is happening. I think that is called the strawman's argument? I wrote with politeness and instead of actually addressing the issue you make it into something else. I read every comment including from many people who are not me and all I saw were many generalizations and no addressing the core principle--which is the heading of the article itself. A few )brave) editors tried but there seems to be a "good ole" system going on. It is quite a disillusionment. Did you know when I went to write this, a request from Wiki for money popped up? You have rules that are to deep, corporate and unyielding for any non-regular to be able to follow coherently. It is an exercise in futility. The fact that nobody has still addressed my question nor answered complaints on Raw Story as well as Palmer Report tells me the general consensus is non-caring about fairness and frankly honesty. Many of the editors on here are very smart and have been around quite a long, long time. That does not make my opinion any less valid. This is not said with anger but I understand it will be labeled as such because there appears to be no way to have an honest and fair conversation with many of the editors on here. (Not all.) In closing, ask yourself this: why are less and less people giving to your organization? Why is Wiki's reputation so awful? Why are there so many unresolved complaints? Even the smartest people have competency issues. I obviously cannot go to talk on a locked-down page and obviously if you had given even a cursory glance at my first post you'd know and understand that. I resent being called unwilling to learn---I came on here for one question. And it never was answered. In closing I will not bother you again but you will most likely continue to receive complaints, continue to rebuff anyone new or unaware of how the system works (or lacking in the means to spend much time learning.) I hope this is not considered an attack. It is not. You know what it is? It's called feedback. Yes, even Wikipedia editors are not immune from that. And sometimes feedback involves length and specific answers to questions which you seem to interpet as not being polite. I will leave you to your loftiness and please refer to this post if you ever want feedback, not anger. Bye, Someone who tried. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2600:6c65:7e7f:b93e:3992:37a7:bb99:c937 (talk) 06:24, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

There is no freedom of speech on Wikipedia, any more than freedom of speech lets me rewrite an article in CNN when I don't like it. This is a privately owned website and the owners, the Wikimedia Foundation, just so happen to be kind enough to let the Wikipedia community decide by consensus what the boundaries for acceptable communication are. — Bilorv (talk) 10:05, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

• Writing long posts when one could have shortened them is not being polite. It has been part of the etiquette of letter-writing for centuries that you should take time to shorten what you write out of respect for the time of the reader. In the case of internet forums, this effect is even stronger because what one person writes is read by many, therefore the one person should be aware that whatever waste of time they cause is multiplied by the number of people reading.

Here’s what your first post here should have been: I have an edit dispute with User:Dr.Swag_Lord,_Ph.d at the page Palmer Report. They changed the header [lead] to say it is a fake news site. The page was locked [semi-protected] afterwards. I have an MSNBC source proving that the Palmer Report is not fake news, but Dr. SwagLord will not allow it because they have a bias.

I added in [brackets] the Wikipedia-jargon terms, but it is OK to not know these. Notice how this "summary" drops any discussion of the inner motives of other editors (left/right-wing bias, preconceived notions, etc.) which is irrelevant in any case, or the detailed history of the dispute (which can be found on the talk page of the article). Notice also how it is one short paragraph and will be read entirely by anyone coming across this noticeboard.

I suspect your latest post was also particularly ineffective. If I may do some mind-reading of Bilorv, they appear to have read up until your mention of "free speech" and then typed their reply without reading the rest. Having read the rest of your post, I know that the free speech thing (while a bit silly) could have been safely ignored; however, you only know that if you commit to reading the whole thing, which is not a very productive use of one’s time.

Finally, you said I came on here for one question. And it never was answered.. If you can cite a part of your initial post that is less than 50 words and that asks a question, I would be very impressed, because I do not see it. Tigraan^{Click here for my talk page ("private" contact)} 12:14, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

I read both DRN requests, I've read the entire talk page, and I've read your post here. It was a lot of reading. And here is my take on the situation- you are convalescing, and have a deep personal passion for this page. You have pled your case to the editors- and they were not persuaded. That doesn't mean you're wrong and they're right- however- WP operates by consensus and consensus is against you. When you were told that- you continued to post unnecessarily long paragraphs on the talk page demanding that your POV be enacted and calling anyone who disagreed with your names "Rouge" etc. At that point- it was determined you were being disruptive (you were) and the Talk was locked down so you could go cool off. You came back and resumed the same thing and opened two DRNS without reading the rules of that page or following our very simple instructions.

My advice is this. Stop now. Consensus is against you. Multiple other editors disagree with you. Move on, find another passion- be it here on WP or elsewhere. But you are beating a dead horse at this point and consensus is unlikely to change the longer you do so. What is likely to happen is you being completely removed from WP. I would much rather see you learn to become a useful contributor to this project. But you cannot continue the way you have been. Be like Elsa and Let it go friend. Nightenbelle (talk) 15:21, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

I've been observing this article and Nightenbelle's summary is accurate, in my opinion. The only thing I would add is that the Talk page was locked, in part, because of real-world editor safety concerns. The owner of the website about which this article is about has been using his large Twitter following to dox WP editors, to threaten to sue editors, to make even more extreme personal threats beyond lawsuits, and to exhort his followers to flood Wikipedia Talk spaces with complaints about WP editors as part of a "war of attrition" [sic] against Wikipedia. Chetsford (talk) 15:28, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

I want to begin by thanking Tigraan, Nightenbelle and Chetsford for speaking with humility and not scolding me.I appreciate the kindness and all of your thoughts. Tigraan, that "how it should have looked" post was perfect and you nailed exactly what I wanted to say. I cannot thank you enough.I am referring to this below:

"I have an edit dispute with User:Dr.Swag_Lord,_Ph.d at the page Palmer Report. They changed the header [lead] to say it is a fake news site. The page was locked [semi-protected] afterwards. I have an MSNBC source proving that the Palmer Report is not fake news, but Dr. SwagLord will not allow it because they have a bias."

Chetsford-I knew about the threats of a lawsuit but I deeply hope and pray no personal threats were made because that would be horrific and they would lose my support if that happened.

Nightenbelle-thank you. You are correct. Palmer Report AND Raw Story are my two favorite websites. I feel I have debated all I can and simply cannot do anymore. For Palmer Report, I have a feeling they will be featured on many more "reliable sources" besides MSNBC so in time perhaps things will change. With Raw Story they were labeled a "tabloid" not fake news, it seems someone within the company complained so will leave it to them. As for DoctorSwagLordPHD I would not attack or bully him or any editor. I thank you again for educating me and I hope things work out for both websites. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2600:6c65:7e7f:b93e:5ccf:f891:888d:5c08 (talk) 19:28, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

Now that was much more readable! If you want to stick around, consider WP:REGISTER. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 12:04, 26 August 2021 (UTC)

@2600:6c65:7e7f:b93e:5ccf:f891:888d:5c08 My apologize, But i rather "unsucessfully" grasp most of the points from your explanation... perhaps it's too long, even for me. but i guess, and hopefully, i understood the important things that you mention. But first of all, tq the "They are also "left-wing." It would seem he wants to as one complaint put it, push down the good stuff and push the bad stuff upward. I am hoping SOMEONE will take this seriously and even if the term fake news must remain there is no reason why it must remain in the header." At first, i thought this is some political conflict that you were invoulved. But i think it's not the case. You did mention the thing about the correspondant Contributor whos Put the term "Fake News" there, and the Correspondant said "feel free to revert". I've alread read some discussion there, and some statements on the page stated that this Contributor was a Rogue Editor. Actually quite many do supported this claim. But Consensus is consensus, if the consensus has been reached, then it is the best choice for now. Plus there are several valid Sources that backed the argument about the status of that blog (PR) being as it is, mentioned on the Article. @Chetsford also mentioned about The owner of the correspondant website blog (PR) about which this article is describing. They has been using their large Twitter following to dox Wikipedia editors/contributors. So overall, i dont have any positive thing to say about this blog (PR), also the Wikipedia article itself covering the blog is well sourced and has many valid sources cited in it. 海之 16:41, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Hello, :C937. I'm sorry to hear about your knee, and hope it heals well. I think your friend may be mistaken about the dangers of using his computer to create an account, but, his PC = his rules, right? As someone who works in IT for my day job, I would suggest that you use a separate (and non-admin) user account on his PC. If that's not possible, at least use a separate web-browser profile to keep all the cookies, history, and login tokens apart. Apologies that you are being repeatedly told to create an account, it's because having one makes it a lot easier for us to communicate with you. I won't go into detail now, but if you want to know, ask. ⁓ Pelagic ( messages ) 07:31, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Ecological Overshoot

I submitted 'Ecological Overshoot' as a new topic on August 10, no response as yet, I'm wondering whether I submitted it properly Global Aspiration (talk) 11:16, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

 Courtesy link: Draft:Ecological Overshoot ― Qwerfjkltalk 11:19, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

Hi, as the notice at the bottom of the article says,
This may take 2–3 weeks or more, since drafts are reviewed in no specific order. There are 846 pending submissions waiting for review. ― Qwerfjkltalk 11:22, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

Global Aspiration First, you will be asked to change your User name, as User names are not allowed to be organizations or companies, etc. Second, your draft will be declined. It is a wall of text with very few references. Sprinkled throughout are hyperlinks. Hyperlinks are now allowed. It may be possible to convert some to references. At the end, there is a long paragraph in quotes, without a ref. Try to fix as much as you can before a reviewer declines it. If declined, resolve what the reviewer identified as problems before resubmitting. David notMD (talk) 12:53, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

As a separate, important issue, the last two paragraphs, including that long quoted paragraph, appear to be via hyperlink to your own website. This is a no-no. Your website can be an external link, but not a ref. David notMD (talk) 13:03, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

@Global Aspiration As well as agreeing with the points above (though I am unclear whether your username is actually a company or organisation, or just a gentle awareness-raising name to reflect your interest?), try to split the article up into different elements. In particular, the very first sentence should define what the subject is, rather than starting with the preamble. It's not a bad start for a new article, but there's a fair bit of work to do to get it into shape for an encyclopaedic article, and making it look less like a university essay. (Oh, and if you are directly involved with any of the organistions mentioned, do please follow the guidance at WP:COI to help you declare any conflicts of interest you might have.) Good luck. Nick Moyes (talk) 13:14, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

It appears this is their 2nd username that they've had. Blaze The Wolf | Proud Furry and Wikipedia Editor (talk) 14:04, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

Yes, first name was the person's website. I suppose this one can stick, but still problems with citing and quoting own website. David notMD (talk) 21:04, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Notable enough?

I want to create a wiki page for singer/songwriter Tom Fairnie. Can anyone tell me if he’s “notable” enough for inclusion based on these links please?

https://www.eastlothiancourier.com/news/18514008.singer-releases-new-album-following-trip-lifetime-usa/

http://www.haddstock.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/Tom-Fairnie-Band-Exclusive-Making-of-Lightning-In-The-Dark.pdf

https://hudba.proglas.cz/noklasik/folk/tom-fairnie-skotsky-pisnickar-hraje-americanu/

m.sn-online.de/amp/news/Schaumburg/Sachsenhagen/Woelpinghausen/Tom-Fairnie-bringt-Mel1425 (talk) 12:03, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

No I'm not going to look at all of those, and I doubt that anyone else will, sorry. (Life's too short.) Please indicate which among this list are the best three; then someone here will look at those three. -- Hoary (talk) 12:07, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

Without even clicking the links, I can predict that some of those will fail at least one of the criteria at WP:GNG: darrensmusicblog.com and timepastandtimepassing.wordpress.com are likely to be blogs written by some random guy/gal and therefore not considered "reliable"; localbarsfinder.com or edinburghfestival.list.co.uk sound like listings of stuff (bars or Edinburgh festival events) that are never considered "significant coverage". On the other hand, I know the The Scotsman is a reputable newspaper, so a review in it might be quite a good source proving notability (but I would need to click the link to be sure it is an actual in-depth, independent review of the subject of the draft article). Tigraan^{Click here for my talk page ("private" contact)} 12:23, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

You've done the right thing, by collecting possible references first. I suggest you create a short draft with a handful of what you think are the strongest reliable source references. Be sure that those are ABOUT him, as confirming his musical output, or what he has said in interviews, or what concerts per performed at, or who with, adds naught to confirming notability. (Music output worth listing, but not enough in and of itself to confirm notability.) David notMD (talk) 13:14, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

To explicate what David notMD said, Mel1425 (since I had to read it three times before I was clear that he was saying what I thought he intended): "confirming his musical output, or what he has said in interview, or what concerts [he has] performed at, or who with" are all things that don't contribute to establishing that he is notable. Wikipedia has little interest in what the subject of an article says or wants to say about themselves, or what their associates say about them. Wikipedia is almost entirely interested in what people who have no connection with the subject, and who have not been prompted or fed information on behalf of the subject, have chosen to publish about the subject in reliable sources. If enough material is cited from independent sources to establish notability, a limited amount of uncontroversial factual information may be added from non-independent sources. --ColinFine (talk) 14:34, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

Yeah, that. David notMD (talk) 14:43, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

Thank you all. I was just doing what wiki suggested by asking in Talk and I’m (obviously) not a seasoned user. I didn’t expect anyone to read all of the links. You’ve been most helpful, appreciated. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mel1425 (talk • contribs) 15:05, 25 August 2021 (UTC)

Mel1425 I read all the links, as I'm having a similar problem - at first I didn't have enough notable links, so I added more, now I'm told I have too many - but 'notable' is what you need to look up. Many of these are just references to something related to this dude or an album. As per above, pick 3 to start - but remove all that aren't write ups about him. So the prominent industry magazines or journals are notable, but the link to him playing at some festival, less likely. Media interviews by outlets that are hard to get on where they've typed up the conversation, larger city newspaper articles, separate these out and remove the rest, you will have a stronger short list. Broad coverage is also a criteria, and a google search wikipedia notable sources will likely bring up a few options. By the way, I'm completely unqualified to answer this, and even I can see several of your references are grasping at straws. You can still start the page and build it, just read up on the reference criteria. Best, Victor (talk) 06:41, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Thanks Victor. Yes. As a complete beginner on Wikipedia page creation, I read that the best place to start when wondering if someone was notable enough was to ask here. I should have read more on wiki first - but I don’t find it easy to navigate around the creator/editing pages. Now I know what’s required and that what I have is not sufficient. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mel1425 (talk • contribs)

Mel1425 has been advised to not edit Talk comments after other people have responded. David notMD (talk) 17:46, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Mel1425, added a little welcome template to your talk page with some of the helpful hints and links you might find useful. Good luck! --ARoseWolf 17:54, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Eric Clapton article

The article had outdated representations of Claptons political views. I wrote a couple of paragraphs on his updated views which he has presented numerous times in interviews about his anti-brexit views and his embracing of immigrants.

Somebody has deleted most of this, and replaced it with a curt summary which suggests otherwise, using terminology such as he 'insists' he is pro immigration, undermining Claptons changed views.

Can this deceitful piece of editing be removed please and my original edit which is more accurate, detailed and objective, be returned?

Many thanks MangoTree VeMangoTree (talk) 21:24, 26 August 2021 (UTC)

VeMangoTree, you made one edit, a month ago. On the face of it, it seems a reasonable edit. ("On the face of it", because it cites a Youtube video that I haven't bothered to look at.) However, it does seem rather wordy for its purpose; and Youtube links are automatically suspect unless carefully described. You don't seem to have attempted to discuss, on Talk:Eric Clapton, the fate of your edit. That's where you should go. If the current text seems deceitful, then say so there, giving your reasons (and remaining polite). -- Hoary (talk) 21:46, 26 August 2021 (UTC)

@VeMangoTree: Welcome to the Teahouse! Instead of citing a YouTube video of a radio interview, maybe you can find a secondary reliable source that reports what Clapton said in the interview. Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 01:43, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

User:VeMangoTree - It is not helpful to describe another editor's contribution as a "deceitful piece of editing" (even if you believe it is a deceitful piece of editing). When I look through the Teahouse, questions that insult the work of other editors stand out for me, and not in a favorable way. My advice is to tone down your complaint, and then I will give the same advice as User:Hoary, to discuss on the article talk page. Assume good faith, such as that editors are not trying to deceive. Robert McClenon (talk) 15:39, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Museum Images

Some videogame articles contain copyrighted images (like for example the Minecraft article that has this image), all this under "fair use", the same could be done for museum photographs?, in this case the official website of the Kenya National Museums page contains photos of the museum buildings, this could be considered as fair use? Seb { 💬 Talk + 📝 Edits } 00:42, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Hello, JSeb05. Please read the policy language about use of non-free images which is enforced strictly. I cannot imagine how the photos you describe would be acceptable. Any Wikipedia editor in Kenya could take freely licensed photos of those buildings. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 01:07, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Hi JSeb05. There's a difference between fair use and non-free content when it comes to using images on Wikipedia; so, it's important to understand that the two are not exactly the same as explained here and here, and avoid mixing them up whenever possible. Non-free content needs to satisfy Wikipedia's non-free content use policy for it to be considered OK to use, and there are ten criteria which need to be met for each use of non-free content. Whether photos appearing on the museum's website can be uploaded and used largely depends on whether those photos would satisfy non-free content use criterion #1. Since there appears to be freedom of panorama for architectural works such as buildings in Kenya under Kenyan copyright law, then (as Cullen328 points out above) pretty much anyone could take a photo of the museum's buildings and uploaded it under a free license that Wikipedia accepts; therefore, it would really be hard to try and justify uploading and using copyrighted images taken by others unless you can get their WP:CONSENT to do so. If you're looking for more recent photos of the museum but are unable to take any yourself, maybe try asking for help at Wikipedia:WikiProject Kenya. Perhaps one of the members of that WikiProject lives close to the museum and can take some photos of its bulidings. -- Marchjuly (talk) 02:20, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

@Cullen328 and Marchjuly: I think the problem is that the Kenya portal is a bit inactive and the talk page mentions about this (Other portals related to Kenya such as the Nairobi and Mombasa portals have been removed for being inactive). In the talk page of the Malindi museum there is a template that says "It is requested that a photograph be included in this article to improve its quality.", I think maybe I should include this template in the pages of other regional museums in Kenya, maybe it will work, anyway thanks for telling me and explaining me the difference between non-free content and fair use. -Seb { 💬 Talk + 📝 Edits } 15:13, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Mark 14 torpedo article minor error

I have noticed a small error in the article https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_14_torpedo and I don't know who to report it to. Since I don't have the references to know what numbers are correct I didn't try to edit them myself. The problem is with the weights given in the specifications table at the start of the article. It says:

Mod.0:3,000 lb (1,400 kg) Mod.3:3,061 lb (1,388 kg) As you can see, weight in pounds is higher for the Mod.3 version but mass in kg is higher for the Mod.0 version. (Excuse me for being pedantic, but in physics courses I had drilled into me that pounds are a unit of weight while kilograms are mass.) If one model is heavier in one set of units it should also be the heavier in the other units, no?

A quick conversion gives me that 3000 lb should be about 1361 kg.

Thanks ---bill rogers 47.224.51.236 (talk) 02:51, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

The explanation is that the wikitext has "| weight = Mod.0:{{convert|3000|lb|abbr=on}} Mod.3:{{convert|3061|lb|abbr=on}}". The conversion uses more sig figs for the mod 3 because the input is to more sig figs. Obviously a source is needed, then appropriate changes can be made. --David Biddulph (talk) 03:41, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Along with that, you're actually wrong (but also right) in stating that pounds are a unit of weight while kilograms are mass. In the US this is true, but practically everywhere else it isn't. In other countries kilograms are used to measure weight as well as mass (it's called the metric system). Don't worry, it's confusing. Blaze The Wolf | Proud Furry and Wikipedia Editor (talk) 13:22, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Strictly speaking, most practical weighing scales (spring, piezo) do measure weight (force of the object due to gravity), but are marked in mass units (g or kg) not force units (N), and assume a standard value for g. (Some electronic scales might have two- or even three-point calibration, so they don't need to assume, but it's been a long time since I used one of those for analytical chemistry, and my memory's a bit hazy.) Since I'm not in the US, I can happily avoid the whole lb-force vs. lb-mass thing. ;) ⁓ Pelagic ( messages ) 10:06, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Hi, Bill, if you're sure it's within 3000 ± 10 lb, you can use {{convert|3000|lb|abbr=on|sigfig=3}} thus: 3,000 lb (1,360 kg). ⁓ Pelagic ( messages ) 10:13, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

A couple of citation questions

1. Is it considered acceptable to report the current number of members of a facebook group? Or must I reference a reliable source reporting a somewhat out-of-date number? (Seems like the former should be obvious, but previous editors of the page I'm working on did the latter.)

2. A section entitled "contents" summarizes the contents of a (wildly popular, contested, and influential) self-published article. Must it cite reliable secondary sources that summarize its contents, or may the editor summarize the self-published article? (same situation as #1.)

Thanks! Artemisia-californica (talk) 05:48, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

@Artemisia-californica Welcome to the Teahouse, and good questions. I'll give you my opinion. I'm guessing this is about Deep Adaptation.

1. Go with the out-of-date "nearly 10,000 members as of March 2020". Any numbers primary sourced to FB is out of WP:PROPORTION (and possibly a bit WP:PROMO).

2. Tricky. We have something called MOS:PLOTSOURCE, which doesn't really apply since that's about fiction. Secondary sources would be my preference, but the devil is in the details. The "risk" is that you (being human) put emphasis on the bits you think important. Use your best judgement, be WP:BOLD and see what happens. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 07:25, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Sandbox content ready but can't search it in wikipedia page

Hi Wiki experts,

I prepared a wikipage about ISCN (International Standard Content Number) in my sandbox and would like to publish it so more people can find out the info. however, trying different way to publish (including submission for draft review) but still can't make it happen. Can anyone help further here?

many thanks!

Exodus21 Exodus21HK (talk) 07:26, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

@Exodus21HK, hello! As you can see at Draft:International Standard Content Number, your submission was declined. See WP:GNG for what is demanded for a stand-alone article and WP:TUTORIAL/WP:REFBEGIN on how to reference properly, this is essential. Wikipedia:WikiProject Cryptocurrency could be of interest. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 07:41, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

You had it nearer to being right at User:Exodus21HK/sandbox, but then you seem to have copied the rendering of it to the draft article and thus lost some of the syntax and content. Instead of the browser's rendering of the page, you need to copy the wikitext, (or move the page to draft namespace rather than copying). You do need to provide references to published independent reliable sources. --David Biddulph (talk) 08:06, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

I see that you have now made further updates to your sandbox, but apparently still not read WP:REFBEGIN. You need to do that before trying to submit the draft for review. And, in particular, you need to find reliable sources independent of the company. If there are no such independent sources, there is no point in wasting further time on the draft. --David Biddulph (talk) 13:49, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Why the Ukrainian-language Wikipedia always block me while I never say any bad things and include reliable sources

Hello. I would like to plead you for making me easy.

Although I changed to a new account named Malay833, in the Ukrainian-language Wikipedia, it always blocked me? Why it always block me? I don't understand Ukrainian completely. I never mean to say anything bad and I indeed will bring reliable sources. Why the Ukrainian-language Wikipedia always block me from editing new pages? Discuss with the Ukrainian-language Wikipedia not to block me and to allow me editing new pages. I cannot understand why the Ukrainian-language Wikipedia blocked me although I changed my account to be much better by not saying anything bad and I do include reliable sources.

Thank you. Malay833 (talk) 08:54, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Is it impossible to create new pages relating to people and things with bringing reliable sources

Hello. Do you think it's wrong for me to edit new pages about different things until I never say any bad things and bring reliable sources. I never say any bad thing, and the Ukrainian-language Wikipedia always blocked me with my new account, as I never say anything bad and I indeed bring reliable sources. In fact, when I go to the Ukrainian part, I don't understand Ukrainian completely, I'm very new and I'm from Malaysia. I'm just a learner of that for 2 years since 2019. Can you please help me to deal and discuss with the Ukrainian-language Wikipedia to unblock me so that I can create many new pages with bringing reliable sources and not saying anything bad?

Thank you. Malay833 (talk) 09:02, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

• @Malay833: This is English Wikipedia, and we're pretty much totally independent from Ukrainian Wikipedia, so we can't do much to help you get unblocked there. The main advice is to speak to the issue that led to the block and own anything you did; see WP:Guide to appealing blocks for more. {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 09:14, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Mykola7, care to comment? Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 09:18, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Hi Mykola7 Malay833. It's not clear why you wish to contribute to the Ukrainian wikipedia if you "don't understand Ukrainian completely". I'm sure that they will have a policy similar to the one on Englidh Wikipedia that competence is required. I assume that your native language is Malay, so why don't you first become familiar with editing on the Malayan-language version of Wikipedia, where I'm sure your efforts would be valued? As you probably know, its Main page is at ms:Laman_Utama. Mike Turnbull (talk) 09:25, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

@Malay833:, Mykola7. Apologies, wrong person pinged. Mike Turnbull (talk) 09:31, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

In fact, I'm more developing based on other languages than Malay, my native language. My mind is more based overseas. So that's why I'm more to edit in the Ukrainian-language Wikipedia. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Malay833 (talk • contribs) 10:33, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Hello. Malay833 aka 833AdamAsrul aka Adamdaniel864 was blocked for violating WP:SOCK. Ckeckuser decision. The user Adamdaniel864 was restricted from being able to create new pages for constant unread machine translation. --Mykola7 (talk) 09:45, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

(edit conflict) @Malay833: you were blocked at Ukrainian Wikipedia because you have abused multiple accounts. You should never create a new account when your previous account has been blocked. That is also true at English Wikipedia. Blocks apply to you, the person, not to the user login. Because User:Adamdaniel864 has been blocked, you are not allowed to edit English Wikipedia. (Nor are you allowed to edit Croatian Wikipedia, since another account of yours, User:Слов'янська, has been blocked there.) --bonadea contributions talk 09:54, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

In fact, I have to change my own account to make sure that the pages that I created has its own reliable sources and no bad things. I never mean to say or do anything that is bad. I'm just creating new pages in Wikipedia that is related to something outside Wikipedia with bringing its reliable sources. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Malay833 (talk • contribs) 10:20, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

@Malay833: Nobody thinks that you mean to say or do anything bad. But you need to understand that when an account is blocked, the person who had that account is not allowed to create a new one. That is true for everybody, not just you. --bonadea contributions talk 10:38, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

If you keep creating new accounts, they will be blocked too. If you want to be unblocked on en-WP, follow the instructions at Wikipedia:Guide to appealing blocks. If you want to be unblocked on other WP:s, follow their instructions. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 10:39, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Dispute Resolution

Someone has reverted my edits here. How do I get someone to add it back or get Admin help for its addition?-- Baamiyaan2 (talk) 09:55, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

What are the dispute resolution mechanisms here?--Baamiyaan2 (talk) 10:09, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

@Baamiyaan2: Your post is a little misleading – nobody has reverted your talk page posts, which you linked to above. Your edits to the article were reverted. The situation is as follows: you made an edit request on the article talk page on 18 August, which generated a fairly long discussion. The consensus in the discussion was that your suggested edit was not supported by the source you provided, and so the content was not added. You then asked about it here at the Teahouse, here and here. Today, you added text to the lede, saying "See talk page discussion", and another editor (very properly) reverted it, with a comment that the talk page discussion did not show any consensus for adding the claim, especially not in the article lede. It looks like there is still ongoing discussion on the article talk page. Admins are not allowed to use their special admin tools in content disputes. --bonadea contributions talk 10:23, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

@Bonadea:, sorry I meant to say that I have linked to a discussion on the talk page about a reversion. Now the editor who reverted the sentences feels that one sentence is fine and another believes that if we use the words, "According to......" everything is fine, so what is to be done next, a Request for Comments?--Baamiyaan2 (talk) 11:14, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Crypto Nomads

Seeking some peer opinion on my draft Crypto Nomads. I discovered the 'term' and found strong references on the web, but no wiki article. Seemed interesting enough to appeal to Wiki followers yet may be 'trendy' and need discussion. TIA. CaliBuds (talk) 11:33, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

As I understand or misunderstand your draft, it tells me that a person describable as a "crypto nomad" is "not at any one place at any one time". I don't understand how this is possible for any person (e.g. at this one time this particular person is at one place: at a computer on a black-painted table in suburban Tokyo). If, verifiably, a "crypto nomad" can be at two or more places at one time, then you definitely have "DYK" material here. -- Hoary (talk) 12:20, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

HA good point regarding the 'decentralized' theory. Thanks @Hoary I will try to clarify that explanation in the article. CaliBuds (talk) 13:21, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Yes, a better expression might be "citizens of nowhere" (a quote from Theresa May) or something along the lines of the descriptions of nomads we already know about. The references you already have look likely to reach the threshold for notability, so good luck with expanding the draft. Mike Turnbull (talk) 17:10, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Excellent suggestion @Michael D. Turnbull thank you! CaliBuds (talk) 11:38, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Question

please i am trying to create an article

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Godday_Success

please what should i add or remove to make it approved? Mickel jack (talk) 13:07, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Well first, you haven't actually submitted the draft yet (another editor will have to add the correct template to allow you to do so). Second, you'll have to actually make sure the subject you're trying to make an article on meets Wikipedia's notability guidelines, otherwise the article has no chance of getting approved. If you havent already I would recommend checking out this guide on creating your first article. Blaze The Wolf | Proud Furry and Wikipedia Editor (talk) 13:17, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Mickel jack Your own website cannot be used as a reference. Things you have published do not establish notability. What is required is that people with no connection to you are publishing articles about you. Be aware that Wikipedia frowns on attempts at autobiography. See WP:AUTO. Or, let's assume this is not an attempt to create an article about yourself. The website of Godday Success cannot be used as a reference. What is required is that people with no connection to that person are publishing articles about that person. Expect the submitted draft to be Declined, if not Rejected. David notMD (talk) 13:26, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

@David notMD while highly discouraged, Wikipedia:Autobiography is not strictly forbidden if created through Wikipedia:Articles for creation. Your point about Wikipedia:No original research certainly stands, which Godday Success certainly isn't. ~ Shushugah (he/him • talk) 18:27, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

"Not an article" deleted. Can I have that removed from my page history?

Hello,

I was making a list of article ideas in my draft space a few days ago and somehow managed to start an empty article. I am not a new editor. It was quickly noticed and put up for deletion/deleted and I was notified what had happened. I responded to the editor on my talk page, that this non-article was just an error on my part working in my draftspace. I was not trying to create a new article. My question: I have created 221 new articles to date with 0 deletions ( proud of the 0 deletions) and I see this deleted article/clerical error as a weird anomaly. Is there a way that I can remove "Marlow Warlord grave" from my page history or make a request to have that done? Or will this be my permanent page history? thx MauraWen (talk) 13:23, 27 August 2021 (UTC) MauraWen (talk) 13:23, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

This is permanently in your contributions (not page history). Your contributions cannot be straight up deleted. The closest thing to deleting contributions is having the contents of them hidden by an Oversighter, but even then they aren't truly deleted. Deleting contributions can screw up some stuff related to the history of things which is why we don't do that. Blaze The Wolf | Proud Furry and Wikipedia Editor (talk) 13:25, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

@MauraWen: Forgot to ping [[User:@MauraWen:|Blaze The Wolf | Proud Furry and Wikipedia Editor]] (talk) 13:27, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

@Blaze The Wolf: Ok, I understand. thx MauraWen (talk) 13:29, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

@Blaze The Wolf: No problem! If you're listing all the stuff you have done on your user page, you could probably just add a category for "accidents" and list it there. Blaze The Wolf | Proud Furry and Wikipedia Editor (talk) 13:31, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

@Blaze The Wolf: Good idea! That will teach me not to edit when I am tired! MauraWen (talk) 13:39, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

I just realized I managed to ping myself in my own comment @MauraWen: Ya that's always a good idea. Blaze The Wolf | Proud Furry and Wikipedia Editor (talk) 13:41, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Suggestbot no longer giving new suggestions after archived

Hello! So I started using suggestbot, and then I started archiving my talk page and I'm not sure if Suggestbot is working properly after being archived. Can anyone take a look and make sure it's working and if not help me fix it? Blaze The Wolf | Proud Furry and Wikipedia Editor (talk) 13:52, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Your problem was that you had placed the {{User:SuggestBot/config}} template within one of the threads on your user talkpage, so when that thread was archived & deleted from the page, you no longer had the SuggestBot set up for your page. Put the configuration string at the top of your page before the first of the talk threads. --David Biddulph (talk) 14:19, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Ah ok thanks! Blaze The Wolf | Proud Furry and Wikipedia Editor (talk) (Stupidity by me) 14:38, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Template for Sources

I came across a template on a talk page a while back and I can't remember what it's called. It allowed people to list potentially useful sources at the top of the talk page. Does anyone know which template it is? TipsyElephant (talk) 13:53, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

@TipsyElephant: See {{Refideas}}. Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 14:25, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Declined

FYI

 – Added section header. GoingBatty (talk) 14:48, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Why the bloody hell was my fricking article declined! Dudeddddd 2405:201:4009:903C:D01B:B81E:EC02:6B0C (talk) 14:41, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Hello User with the IP 2405:201:4009:903C:D01B:B81E:EC02:6B0C and welcome to the Teahouse. You do not appear to have created a draft under this IP, could you please tell us how the draft is named? Victor Schmidt (talk) 15:17, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Hello! I understand having an article deleted is frustrating, could you please provide us with some more details so we can help you understand? Blaze The Wolf | Proud Furry and Wikipedia Editor (talk) (Stupidity by me) 15:17, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Using profanity in asking about a page that we cannot find is not helpful. Did you use profanity in your draft article? Your IP address has shifted, which is a reason to register an account, and also a reason to tell us the name of the declined article. But if you want your article to be accepted, it will be helpful to be civil to other reviewers. Robert McClenon (talk) 15:42, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

I agree with all the advice above. But the thing which none of the repliers mentioned is that your first article is a good guide to how to go about writing a Wikipedia article. Doing so is much more difficult than it appears. If you try it without having done quite a lot of editing on Wikipedia, you are like somebody who tries to build a house without having ever done much building work. And if you try it without first finding the independent reliable sources necessary to establish that the subject is notable, then you are like somebody who tries to build a house without building foundations or even checking if the ground is stable. --ColinFine (talk) 16:29, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Why the bloody hell did my fricking roof land on my TV? TimTempleton ^{(talk) (cont)} 18:46, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

What is the criteria of accepting articles?

What is the criteria of accepting articles? Nandkoli (talk) 16:02, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

I can see that the reasons were well-elaborated already in the rejection statements.

This submission reads more like an essay than an encyclopedia article. Submissions should summarise information in secondary, reliable sources and not contain opinions or original research. Please write about the topic from a neutral point of view in an encyclopedic manner.

If you click on those links, you can see the specific ways your article draft does not qualify. Feel free to review those and try again. Pyrrho the Skeptic (talk) 16:22, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Wiki sisters

Who also uses Fandom wiki & Miraheze wiki ? KENNY STEWART 6284 (talk) 16:05, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

@KENNY STEWART 6284: Hello! Teahouse is really for questions relating to Wikipedia. But I will give you my answer, I used Fandom at one point but I got banned (for reasons I won't elaborate on). I then used Miraheze and then forgot about it and never used it again. Blaze The Wolf | Proud Furry and Wikipedia Editor (talk) (Stupidity by me) 16:19, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

I'm not familiar with Miraheze, actually, but I've used Fandom a lot. I recommend it sometimes as a good way to repurpose content that is too specific or fancruft-like: I set up Taskmaster Wiki, which has now become very successful due to the hard work of those who built on my initial work, and I've moved some old content we used to host on QI to QI Wiki. I think it's also a great way to learn wikitext, some wiki norms and how to work in a collaborative atmosphere. — Bilorv (talk) 17:33, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

As @Blaze The Wolf said WP:Tea House is for questions related to editing Wikipedia. While the Wikimedia Foundation does maintain the software MediaWiki that makes most Wiki projects possible, Fandom and Miraheze organizationally have nothing to do with English Wikipedia or any of its affiliated Wikimedia projects. I personally only learned recently that WikiVoyage is distinct from WikiTravel. Shushugah (he/him • talk) 18:20, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Is there any format to create articles?

Is there any format to create articles? Nandkoli (talk) 16:05, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

See WP:YFA for process. David notMD (talk) 17:19, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

@Nandkoli: Welcome to the Teahouse! The format for Wikipedia articles is laid out in great detail in the Wikipedia:Manual of Style. Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 17:35, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Can admins please elaborate reasons of deleting articles?

Can admins please elaborate reasons of deleting articles? Nandkoli (talk) 16:06, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Nandkoli Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. You were given a reason for deletion on your user talk page, User talk:Nandkoli. Specifically, what you wrote was a blatant advertisement, which is not permitted on Wikipedia. Please read the five pillars to learn more about Wikipedia; you may wish to use the new user tutorial to learn more about Wikipedia. 331dot (talk) 16:14, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Nandkoli, added a welcome message to the top of your talk page (User talk:Nandkoli) which references many of the links already given to you and offers additional links that you might find helpful. Wish you the best and good luck! --ARoseWolf 16:24, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Nandkoli, your deleted content was not an encyclopedia article. It was a how-to guide. It was unreferenced and contained a link to a copyrighted website, presumably yours. The content was very similar to that website, so your draft was a copyright violation. Please read What Wikipedia is not, which says While Wikipedia has descriptions of people, places and things, an article should not read like a "how-to" style owner's manual, cookbook, advice column (legal, medical or otherwise) or suggestion box. This includes tutorials, instruction manuals, game guides, and recipes. Please also read and study Your first article. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 16:30, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Nandkoli You asked a similar question above, and it was answered. Please do not ask the same thing twice - it takes time away from the volunteers, time that could be spent better educating others about Wikipedia's notability requirements. TimTempleton ^{(talk) (cont)} 18:45, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

False positives

What does the term "false positives" mean on Wikipedia? Peter Ormond 💬 17:04, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

One context is when a report to WP:AIV says: "This user was automatically reported by Huggle due to reverted vandalism after a final warning. Please verify their contributions carefully, it may be a false positive." In this situation it presumably means that the editor making the report has not bothered to check the situation, and that by leaving it to the Huggle software the report may have been made when no actual vandalism has occurred. - David Biddulph (talk) 17:18, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Additionally, an edit may falsely trigger an automatic filter, in which case, it would be false positive, and can be reported as such. Pyrrho the Skeptic (talk) 17:28, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

@Peter Ormond: In most cases a false positive is exactly what it says. A positive result that is actually false. There's also something called a false negative which is the same thing except it's a negative result. Blaze The Wolf | Proud Furry and Wikipedia Editor (talk) (Stupidity by me) 18:57, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Looking for Sources

When formulating a search query to find the most relevant sources, I would like to limit the results to webpages that contain a specific word X number of times or more. For example, if I wanted a useful source for Apple I would like to limit my results to webpages that contain the word a half dozen times at least to make sure the results are more than a passing mention of the subject.· Is it possible to do that? TipsyElephant (talk) 17:10, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

@TipsyElephant: I've not fully tested but I think insource:"apple"*"apple"*"apple"*"apple"*"apple"*"apple" is returning what you're looking for, per H:INSOURCE (take a look at regular expression if you're not familiar with the concept). — Bilorv (talk) 17:30, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

The problem with the "apple" example is that the word refers to a fruit, a record label founded by the Beatles, and a technology company that used to be run by Steve Jobs. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 17:39, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

That could potentially be solved by adding: AND "technology", I think. Pyrrho the Skeptic (talk) 17:42, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Or by combining with "incategory", or other ways of narrowing searches. But I think "apple" was just a generic example. — Bilorv (talk) 17:56, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

@Cullen328: Since insource searches are case sensitive, the example above shouldn't find articles that refer to Apple Records or Apple Inc. GoingBatty (talk) 17:39, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Can you please put a pic of Yuya on list of Yugioh Arc V characters

 PRINCESS Ropa (talk) 18:29, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

@PRINCESS Ropa: You can request this yourself on the talk page of the article you want the edit to be made on. Blaze The Wolf | Proud Furry and Wikipedia Editor (talk) (Stupidity by me) 18:34, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

@PRINCESS Ropa Welcome, you can make a request at the talk page which I linked here Talk:List of Yu-Gi-Oh! Arc-V characters. Happy editing! Shushugah (he/him • talk) 19:54, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

In this particular case, PRINCESS Ropa, it looks like there already is a depiction of Yuya in the main image, alongside other main characters. Since images of fictional characters are copyrighted and non-free, and Wikipedia is Creative Commons licensed, we strictly limit the non-free images we use to those that meet some rigid criteria. I do not think a second depiction of Yuya in the same list would pass our criteria. — Bilorv (talk) 00:26, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

moldova

 Focus34 (talk) 18:35, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

@Focus34: I would take the warnings on your talk page seriously, or you might be blocked from editing. Do you have a question for the Teahouse? TimTempleton ^{(talk) (cont)} 18:42, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

 Courtesy link: Moldovan language

Hello @Focus34: and welcome to the Teahouse! I'm looking at your contributions and I am guessing you are inquiring about why your edits to Moldovan language were reverted. Wikipedia requires that we include a citation to a reliable source when we add information to an article. It appears you did not do this when editing the article and that is why it was reverted. Just prior to this you removed sourced information from the article which is not acceptable. If you find yourself in this situation I would suggest you refer to WP:BRD which further explains how you are to proceed once reverted. I also added a welcome template to your talk page with some useful links to things new editors need to review before making edits here. Hopefully this helps. Good luck! --ARoseWolf 18:57, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

user indef'ed.. Meters (talk) 19:03, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Thanks, Meters --ARoseWolf 19:07, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Question About Using a Source

Hello, I am considering creating an article for a director. I want to use this source: [1], but I am not sure if it's reliable under Wiki policy. Specifically, would I be able to use said source for the director's date of birth? And if not, would I be able to use it for any other purpose (e.g. establishing notability)?

Thanks for the help. Koikefan (talk) 19:07, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

@Koikefan: You might want to ask this at WP:Reliable Sources/Noticeboard as thye might have the answer to your question because they focus on reliable sources. Blaze The Wolf | Proud Furry and Wikipedia Editor (talk) (Stupidity by me) 19:47, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Good to know, I will post there. Thank you. Koikefan (talk) 19:59, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

@Koikefan: After reading the source you posted and the related About Us page, I would say that you can use that article to soruce the information, since it's non-controversial, but it won't help to demonstrate notability, because it appears to be a promotional, non-journalistic site. TimTempleton ^{(talk) (cont)} 21:46, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

removal of false information from a protected wikipedia page

how do i remove false information published in a protected wikipedia page? 117.195.120.250 (talk) 21:01, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse, IP editor. You can submit an edit request explaining what information is false, and provide a reliable source that says otherwise. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 21:09, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

About "Grunge-pop"

Hello, Teahouse!

I have editing the pages for various albums released currently. This year I have seen many musicians release recordings infused with heavy rock genres, from hardcore (see:Turnstile's GLOW ON), pop-punk (see: Willow's lately I feel EVERYTHING, Meet Me @ The Altar's Model Citizen EP), and also the unusual "grunge-pop" (see:Indigo De Souza's Any Shape You Take, Halsey's If I Can't Have Love, I Want Power). The reason I bring this up is because I think that making a section for the Grunge music page about and/or a separate page about this new genre name could be valuable. This year seems to have welcomed a new subgenre of alternative rock, but no publications I know have written specifically about it.

This is ultimately a thought for something that I think could be neat. But until this can be talked about more, I'll let it sit.

With thanks,Quail & Metal (talk) 21:11, 27 August 2021 (UTC) Quail & Metal (talk) 21:11, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse! It's a great question and one that should be asked on the talk page for Grunge. I hope you do! Happy editing. Pyrrho the Skeptic (talk) 21:21, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

the battle was lost in one hour

how was a battle started and lost in the space off one hour? i cant quiet understand? Jonperez1985 (talk) 21:12, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

What article are you referring to? Please provide that information so we can attempt to help you. Thanks! Pyrrho the Skeptic (talk) 21:23, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Possibly refers to Anglo-Zanzibar War linked from the current Main Page entry under "On this day". 71.175.88.163 (talk) 21:49, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Yep. On the front page, in any section, clicking on the bold link will take you to an article that elaborates on the fact given. — Bilorv (talk) 00:24, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Incorrectly accused of having multiple accounts.

I made an edit to Physicians for Patient Protection. This was the immediate response:

"Quit your agenda I see you've logged into another account of yours now your vandal one has been banned. If you continue your disruptive editing on that article further investigation will be carried out against you and all the other accounts you use DiamondInTheRug. Inexpiable (talk) 21:35, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

WP:Single purpose account, WP:Sockpuppet, WP:MEAT Inexpiable (talk) 21:36, 27 August 2021 (UTC)"

I have one and only one account. ReasonAndScience (talk) 21:54, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

How can I resolve this? ReasonAndScience (talk) 21:55, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

ReasonAndScience, the editing surrounding the Physicians for Patient Protection article has been very unusual recently. Your account is almost three years old, but apart from the six edits you made in 2018, all of your edits have been made in the past week, and all of them have concerned that article. There are a couple of other accounts that have either been created recently purely to edit that article, or which were created a while ago and have suddenly become very active at that article. That kind of thing often happens when one person decides to make multiple accounts to make it look like they are multiple people.

Would you mind explaining why you suddenly decided, after all this time, to start editing that article very prolifically? Was there some sort of posting on social media or similar that attracted your attention? Girth Summit _(blether) 22:20, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

I was directed to this by a friend (a fellow physician) who introduced me to "PPP". I was referred when I discussed with them about an infected olecranum bursitis that I had treated. Unable to find a physician to drain it, I ended up in the ER. There, I "midlevel"(a physician assistant) was unable to drain the fluid and I had to teach her how to do it (on myself!). As I am retired, I was not previously aware of midlevels and as I had recently moved to a new part of the country, I learned that there are few physicians, most replaced by lesser trained individuals. On this site, I saw all kinds of frankly derogatory information about physicians in general. When I review the references, it was apparent that the references did not say what the text was. I was (am!) highly motivated by this recent poor treatment and (having had some experience, as you note, a few years ago), I began to make edits to reflect some balance. ReasonAndScience (talk) 22:51, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Inexpiable seems to me to be too fast to accuse sockpuppetry against anyone editing that article. I did see that separate from your edits, Bonafidemd79 is blocked, mostly for being in an edit war. My advice - carry on. Given that the article has been nominated for deletion, you can express your opinion there. (you commented, but did not express a Keep or Delete. David notMD (talk) 03:49, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

How do I mark an edit request as completed?

I made my first edit request contribution at [2]. (Had to add a recent assistant coach hire). I found the request at [3]. After I complete the edit request, am I supposed to update that page as having completed the task? It still shows as an uncompleted request. Dick Stamford (talk) 23:22, 27 August 2021 (UTC) Dick Stamford (talk) 23:22, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Welcome, and thanks for helping with the edit requests. When you have completed a request (or turned it down), edit the request by setting answered=yes in the request. I did this one for you, as an example: [4] RudolfRed (talk) 23:47, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Thank you! I see it now. Appreciate the quick answer. Dick Stamford (talk) 23:59, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

How to can i move Dfrat to main article space

Hey Guys, I have created my wikipedia account for 4 days ago and i have already an experience on add article to wiki page, but recently when i created this account i did not see the option of "move" wish is mean that my account are not confirme yet or i have something going on i check every thing on my account and i didn't something skeetchie so all i ask is help me out with some info that could help me move some of my articles to main space. Thanks you <3 talk 02:08, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

You won't have the "move" option until your account is autoconfirmed. You won't satisfy the 4 day criterion until later today. Please be patient; there is no deadline. --David Biddulph (talk) 03:25, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Given that you are a new editor who has created or edited four draft article, with two Declined and none accepted yet, I strongly advise against moving any of these to mainspace. Be aware that articles are looked at by the New Pages Patrol, at which time could be flipped back to draft or nominated for deletion. David notMD (talk) 04:06, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Is a document on Wikisource a reliable source?

Wikipedia is not a reliable source and can't be cited. But, what about documents which have been uploaded onto Wikisource? Can they be cited in citations in a Wikipedia article? Mr Serjeant Buzfuz (talk) 03:37, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

@Mr Serjeant Buzfuz: they're not reliable (and don't become reliable) on account of being uploaded to Wikisource, but lots of things on Wikisource are reliable. For instance, Ramanujan's Squaring the circle is a reliable source (an expert mathematician who published the paper in a peer-reviewed journal) and it happens to be hosted on Wikisource. The template {{Cite wikisource}} exists for this purpose and is a nice way to support our sister project. Does that answer your question? — Bilorv (talk) 11:21, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Thanks, that’s good. I wasn’t meaning that they automatically are reliable sources, but wanted to be sure there’s no rule against it, like there is for Wikipedia. A matter of judgment based on each document, like other internet sources. Mr Serjeant Buzfuz (talk) 12:58, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Font Problem

I want to edit article of my language. But how can I get the required font? It was easy while using mobile but now I am using PC. Kushal Dev Wiki (talk) 05:04, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

There is only one font for articles, unless you are talking about signatures. Please clarify. TimTempleton ^{(talk) (cont)} 05:30, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Hello, Kushal Dev Wiki. It sounds as if you are saying that you haven't got a font with the character set for that language installed on your PC. You will need to install a suitable font. If you don't know how to do that, I suggest asking at the Computing section of the Wikipedia Reference Desk. --ColinFine (talk)

Hi, Kushal, international font support is pretty good on most modern OSs. Are you using Windows, and may I ask which language/script? I suspect this question might be about typing the characters rather than showing them, if so, look for an on-screen soft keyboard (e.g. in Windows 10 this can be activated on desktop as well as on tablets.) The various MediaWiki editing interfaces also have means to select characters in a variety of scripts. ⁓ Pelagic ( messages ) 03:58, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

From the OP's global contribs, it seems they have been contributing in Nepali Wikipedia and Wikisource. ⁓ Pelagic ( messages ) 04:04, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Regarding editing of images in Wikipedia

Can you provide me with the information how to remove or add any image in any Wikipedia page Shyam ji Rana (talk) 05:59, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Most images are added with the wikitext [[File:Example...]]. If you are using the source editor, si.ply remove it add that text. If you are using the VisualEditor, press the delete key to delete it. ― Qwerfjkltalk 11:21, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

For removing, more of a question of Why rather than How. Are there images in articles that you believe do not belong? Can you provide examples? David notMD (talk) 11:36, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Should articles with foreign-language titles use the Lang template?

According to MOS:FOREIGNITALIC and MOS:FOREIGNTITLE, the {{Lang}} template should be used whenever foreign-language text is mentioned in the article. I was wondering if this also applies to the bold reiteration of the article title in the lead? Or to the article title itself? I'm asking because it feels like it should, but I never actually see this happen in articles. ―Jochem van Hees (talk) 11:08, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Oh and while I'm at it, what about section headers? Using templates in section headers is disallowed by MOS:HEADINGS. ―Jochem van Hees (talk) 11:18, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

please i need your opinion

I created this article - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Daryl_Tucker#article_submission_process

I submitted it for a while now, please I would like to know if there is anything i would need to change, so as to speed up the approval process. I would definitely appreciate any form of constructive criticism. Thank you. Prosperhaven (talk) 12:36, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

You have received feedback, on the draft page and on your user talk page. In addition to the points raised there by the reviewer, you also ought to address the problem of numerous links to disambiguation pages. The links ought to be changed to specific links to the intended targets. In identifying the unintended links to dab pages, you may find it convenient to highlight the problematic links in orange using the relevant preference at Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-gadgets. --David Biddulph (talk) 13:17, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

@Prosperhaven, hello and welcome to the Teahouse, I’m sorry for the tone used by David Biddulph which came off as a tad bit snappy, our job here is voluntary and telling people the same thing over and again can take its toll. So basically David Biddulph is correct, you indeed have received feedback from Theroadislong. If you have any further questions other than what has already been answered we are here to assist you. Celestina007 (talk) 15:51, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

@Prosperhaven: Welcome to the Teahouse! Movie titles should be italicized per WP:ITALICS. Also, please check the authors last and first names in the references - they should not be duplicated or in all capital letters. Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 17:47, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

FYI - There are always hundreds of drafts waiting for reviews. Once submitted, it clearly states could be weeks. The system is not a queue. I cleaned up your draft a bit, but there is still unreferenced content. David notMD (talk) 18:08, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

@Prosperhaven: If you know Tucker or work for Tucker, you have a conflict of interest that you must disclose on your user page - see WP:DISCLOSE for information. Thanks! GoingBatty (talk) 00:19, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

What to do about a possibly spurious footnote?

Recently User:Sapphorain did some well-needed pruning of the plot section in the article Bring the Jubilee, and I was eager to contribute to this by removing a reference to Jules Verne's Propeller Island, which had been practically orphaned in the article. Sapphorain disputed my decision, however, and this exchange of words took place. I am not quite sure what to make of this all, and I don't want anyone to start edit-warring over this, so I thought I could inquire about this here. Prospero One (talk) 13:12, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

The correct place for discussing the matter is the article talk page, to which you have linked in your question. If you fail to reach a consensus there, the options include WP:3O and WP:DR. --David Biddulph (talk) 13:20, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Thanks, will refer to those two. --Prospero One (talk) 13:44, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Notability of the Maharashtra Lokayukta

If I understand correctly, "Maharashtra Lokayukta" is a state-wide office of a federal country. Do I correctly understand that Draft:Sanjay Bhatia (administrator) is about a person presumed to be notable per WP:NPOLITICIAN? ~ ToBeFree (talk) 15:59, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

I have accepted the declined and rejected article now; feel free to nominate it for deletion if I'm completely incorrect about this. I'll notify Dan arndt and Hatchens. ~ ToBeFree (talk) 20:12, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Not clear why you are mentioning this at Teahouse. Article in question, as draft about Sanjay Bhatia, was Declined, then Rejected, then proposed for Speedy deletion, that quashed, creating editor extensively edited, and you have accepted as article. Conscientiously, you notified the editors who D'd, R'd and SD'd. David notMD (talk) 22:43, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

David notMD, thanks for having had a look and providing two additional eyes; that's basically what I was looking for. I wondered whether I'm overlooking something, asked what I perceived to be a pretty newbie-type question about notability here, answered it myself by digging further and chose to move the article myself, relying on AfD instead of potential Teahouse objections for consensus. I could alternatively have removed my question in the moment I moved the page to mainspace. ~ ToBeFree (talk) 00:56, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

ToBeFree At least for U.S., there is a bias against appointed positions justifying notability except at highest levels (Supreme Court, President's Cabinet). David notMD (talk) 02:01, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Ah, thanks. ~ ToBeFree (talk) 02:34, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Help

please my article has been declined and i am new

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Godday_Success

please what should i do? Mickel jack (talk) 16:23, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Hi Mickel jack, an (over)simplified summary of the problem can be found at WP:42. Generally speaking, if these criteria are not met, there can't be a Wikipedia article about the person. Does this already answer the question? ~ ToBeFree (talk) 16:26, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

You should read the feedback, which you can see both on the draft page and on your user talk page. The words in blue are wikilinks to specific guidance which you ought to read. --David Biddulph (talk) 17:01, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

@Mickel jack: If you like, you may add independent reliable sources to your draft to demonstrate how the person meets Wikipedia's notability guideline, and resubmit the draft. Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 18:00, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

You posted here about this draft yesterday, and the reply was that as submitted, all of the references are to the website of the person Godday Success. None of those support notability. It is possible that in time this person may be notable, but for now, probably WP:TOOSOON. Information on your Talk page explains how to tag your draft so that it will be deleted by an Administrator. David notMD (talk) 18:13, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

TikTok app

I added some information on Tiktok but someone reverted it, the user who did it says that their are spelling mistakes. But if ther are he or anyone can do copyediting, change tone, how you can revert proper cited information. I provided the source of info there. It's not my OR, it's published in NY Times, India Today news websites. If the info is reliable according to all of you hosts keep it, otherwise ommit , no problem. Newton Euro (talk) 19:26, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

I think part of the problem was that when the reverting editor reached that article, it appeared to have two paragraphs that were confusingly similar. Perhaps there is a compromise to be made here: that some of the information could be reinserted, with its sources, but taking care only to say the most essential facts, and once only. You are right that it was somewhat harsh of the reverting editor to complain about your English; no, it isn't perfect, but it was quite comprehensible and could have been copy-edited. I'd suggest writing a simplified version on the article's talk-page, and pinging the reverting editor to ask them (and anyone else!) whether they find your simplified version more acceptable? If they don't respond, you can always transfer your new text back into the article in a few days, on the grounds that you've invited discussion, and no one has raised any objections. Elemimele (talk) 19:43, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Draft:Timothy Heffner

I need to obtain a copyright release for the first of three photos for this article, as it was taken by Madia Photography. The photographer is willing to release the photo, but wishes to accomplish this task via a letter. Is it possible to upload the release letter and is there a standard format suitable for Wikipedia? The photographer is not computer saavy and is unfamiliar with Wikipedia. Pghmedicine (talk) 20:24, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

@Pghmedicine: Welcome to the Teahouse! You may ask the photographer to review Wikipedia:Donating copyrighted materials. Thanks, and happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 00:21, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Pghmedicine, the photographs would, if the copyright problems were resolved, be uploaded to Wikimedia Commons, not to Wikipedia. This is something you should ask about there, not here (not because it's ill-mannered or whatever to do so here, but because people there will be far better informed): you could simply copy your question above and paste it to Commons:Village pump/Copyright. (You should first log in there; you can use the same username and password that you use here.) -- Hoary (talk) 00:25, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

When an article's subject dies, what updates need to occur?

I just implemented an edit request at Lester Coleman where it was reported the person died. Is there anything else that should be done? S0091 (talk) 20:26, 28 August 2021 (UTC) S0091 (talk) 20:26, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

@S0091, if reliable sources confirm his death, then minor changes like wordings should be implemented for example “is” may be changed to “was” then you can adjacent his name put Mr xyz born (xxxx to xxxx) then perhaps adjust categories like removing them from the BLP category. Celestina007 (talk) 20:36, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

In this edit I have corrected categories for years of birth & death. --David Biddulph (talk) 00:25, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Also, the article would now qualify for a fair-use portrait photo? (In general, S0091, we may also change the lead photo when the subject dies, as we did at Prince Philip.) ⁓ Pelagic ( messages ) 02:02, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

My contribution to the article Tenor horn is being continuously erased

My contribution to the article "Tenor horn" is being constantly erased

I agree that my first few attempts to edit a section in the site named "Tenor Horn" were disruptive, due to my indignation. But after I read your notices to me, I crafted my last version which is pasted below. It too was erased, which implies that no matter what I post on the theme of tenor horn, they will keep erasing, because someone is irritated with the fact that I am expressing a different opinion. Freedom of expression can always be suppressed under the pretext of "offensive language". Please, tell me what is disruptive in the paragraph below:

"The tenor horn (It. Corno di tenore; Ger. Bassflugelhorn) – it is an instrument in B-flat. Tenors and baritones are alike, they are both in B-flat, have the same range, and may substitute for each other. The difference lies in the slightly larger bore of the baritone, which also affects the timbre. The tenor horn shall not be confused with an alto horn (It. Flicorno alto; Ger. Althorn), which is in E-flat and much smaller in size. The latter corresponds to the French horn in E-flat, still traditionally used on some European wind orchestras. To summarize, the tenor and baritone horns correspond to the tenor/baritone voice in the choir, while the alto horn corresponds to the alto voice. A short informative video from the Prince Regent’s Band: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=78qCc9xk18Q"

Thank you. I wish you well, and I look forward to hearing from you. I hope you will allow this passage to be inserted into the Tenor horn article.

Best

Mutaeditor Mutaeditor (talk) 20:49, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

@Mutaeditor, hello, I haven’t read anything meticulously but I can give you a blanket response, you see, if you add something to an article and it is removed multiple times chances are what you may be adding is already in the article or your input may not be deemed constructive, not too worry we all went through that phase in your spare time you can read WP:CTW. Celestina007 (talk) 21:14, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

@Mutaeditor basically you're getting reverted because, so far as I can see, you're wrong. Everyone apart from the Germans seems to have a horn in E-flat, which some call a tenor horn, and some call an alto horn, and which is the subject of the article. The Germans also have a horn in B-flat which they call a tenorhorn, which means some people refer to a horn in B-flat as a "German tenor horn" (e.g here [5]), but everyone else calls a B-flat baritone. The best I can think is this: nomenclature of brass instruments is such a hideous mess that no one outside the brass world really has the foggiest idea what's going on (and quite a few people inside the brass world would feel equally befuddled). For those of us who play sensible, non-transposing instruments, we just shake our heads in disbelief and ignore these strange metal items. So what Wikipedia probably greatly needs is this: an article on the nomenclature of brass instruments, explaining the potential confusions. We have an article on Brass_instrument but it doesn't really tackle the full name-and-pitch issue. Maybe get some talk-page discussion going, and see if there is such an article (it's just I haven't found it), or if there isn't, see if anyone is interested in collaborating with you to make one? Elemimele (talk) 22:15, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Lots of good points here. I have tried, quite nicely I hoped, to explain about WP:ENGVAR and the way that one person's terminology may not suit another, and how we try to work together on it, but I am not sure I have been heard. So, here is Sheona White, an eminent player of the tenor horn, in E-flat, in British English (BrE). Here is a shop selling tenor horns, in E-flat, also in BrE. We bought about 40 of those: they are quite good. Tenor Horns. In E-flat. I teach tenor horn, in E-flat, in BrE, to about 40 children, and if I were playing in the wrong key I might perhaps have noticed by now (or maybe not) but then I am not an RS, am I? And yes it's a horrible terminological mess and wildly inconsistent across the globe, but the article was coping with it quite well until this B-flat crusade started. Best wishes to all, DBaK (talk) 22:53, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

@Mutaeditor: Welcome to the Teahouse! Thank you for your efforts to improve the Tenor horn article. Unfortunately, having an edit reverted can be a common experience on Wikipedia. Per the Wikipedia:BOLD, revert, discuss cycle, your best next step is to have a conversation like the one above on the article's talk page: Talk:Tenor horn. There will be additional knowledgeable editors who monitor that talk page that don't come to the Teahouse. Thanks to those who contributed to the conversation above. Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 00:29, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Ida Lupino edit needed

Need TV director credit added for Ida Lupino.

pi 2600:6C44:F7F:9FBD:4C75:A12:3C0D:39E (talk) 20:54, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

I noticed that an episode of "Have Gun--Will Travel" was directed by Ida Lupino. That episode is not yet in her TV credits section. The episode is "The Golden Bar" from 3-18-61 according to TitanTV. It was episode 26 of season 4.

Welcome to the Teahouse! Thank you for noticing that the Ida Lupino article could be improved. I suggest you post your request on the article's talk page: Talk:Ida Lupino. If you have a URL for the TitanTV resources, please provide that as well. Thank you, and happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 00:31, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Would Like To Create A Page For The American Basketball Hall Of Fame

Hello,

I was asked about creating a page for The American Basketball Hall Of Fame. However, creating pages and rules on what can be published is something I'm not at all familiar with so any help or if someone could create the page for me or give me any help with this, it would be greatly appreciated. Listed below is what the page will look like. Dusties907 (talk) 21:51, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Condensed for brevity
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.
American Basketball Hall of Fame American-Basketball-HOF-logo_Ink.png Established 2019 Location Inkster, Michigan Type American Basketball Hall of Fame Founder LaMont "ShowBoat" Robinson Website www.americanbasketballhof.org The American Basketball Hall of Fame is an American history hall of fame that will be located in the city of Inkster, Michigan. It will honor and tell the full history of basketball. The American Basketball Hall of Fame was founded by LaMont "ShowBoat" Robinson who played 28 years of barnstorming from 1987-2015. Robinson played in Denmark and the USBL, then with several barnstorming teams Meadowlark Lemon Harlem All-Stars, 1989 Harlem Globetrotters and Washington General Tour, ShowBoat Robinson's Harlem Road Kings, ShowBoat Robinson's Harlem Clowns. Robinson has been nominated to the Naismith Memorial Basketball Hall of Fame in 2018, 2019, 2020, and 2021. He was inducted into the American Basketball Hall of Fame Class of 2021. The American Basketball Hall of Fame will honor basketball men and women as well as coaches and give players another chance to be inducted into a national hall of fame. The American Basketball Hall of Fame will look closely at high school legends, playground hoopsters, small college players, oversea players, barnstorming players and teams, ABA, CBA, EBA, USBL, Harlem Globetrotters, Harlem Clowns, Harlem Wizards etc... The American Basketball Hall of Fame will not just honor major college and NBA players. The American Basketball Hall of Fame hosted its inaugural class on Sunday October 13, 2019 in the city of Detroit, Michigan and due to covid-19 the 2020 and 2021 live ceremonies were canceled. The American Basketball Hall of Fame did host two classes 2020, 2021 of posthumous players, that was virtual. The Goal of the American Basketball Hall of Fame is to build a state-of-the-art world class hall of fame that will be 80,000 sq. ft. that will be also one of the top premier basketball facilities in the world, with track, weight room, film room, classrooms, dormitory rooms, basketball theme restaurant and the basketball field-house will feature 6-8 basketball courts for camps, clinics, AAU tournaments and summer leagues etc... To date the American Basketball Hall of Fame has inducted 50 players, coaches and contributors. 2019 Class Sam Jones Derrick Coleman Spencer Haywood Vinnie “Microwave” Johnson Willie Burton Jalen Rose Archie Clark LaMont “ShowBoat” Robinson Al Gibson Howard White Stanly Ruffin George Blaha Curtis “Flint” Bloxson Coach Will Robinson Tim McCormick John Long Antoine “The Judge” Joubert Coach Perry Watson 2020 Posthumous Class . Dr. James Naismith . Coach John Thompson . Earl "The Goat Maguigut . Wilt Chamberlain . Abe Saperstein . Meadowlark Lemon . Curtis Jones . Kobe Bryant . John Havlicek . Marques Haynes . Pete Maravich . Coach Pat Summitt . Len Bias . Coach John McLendon . Gianna Bryant 2021 Posthumous Class Tony Tolbert Fred "Curly" Neal Roy Tarpley Howard Garfinkel Paul Westphal Connie Hawkins Dwayne "Pearl" Washington Louis "Red" Klotz John Wooden Raymond Lewis Bob Douglas Holcombe Rucker Coach Al McGuire William "Pop" Gates Edwin B. Henderson Tyron "Alimoe" Evans Terry Dudrod "Jumpin" Jackie Jackson Coach Clarence "Big House" Gaines

Dusties907 Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. When you say you were "asked", do you work for this organization? If so, please see your user talk page for important information. Please understand that a Wikipedia article about an organization must summarize what independent reliable sources with significant coverage have chosen on their own to say about the organization, showing how it meets Wikipedia's special definition of a notable organization. Wikipedia has no interest in what an organization wants to say about itself. If you are able to summarize what others say about the hall of fame, you may use Articles for creation to create and submit a draft. Please read Your first article. 331dot (talk) 22:03, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Hi, Dusties907. I note that you are in competition with the Naismith Memorial Basketball Hall of Fame, but this is not a problem on Wikipedia; provided you have sources supporting an ABHoF article they can both co-exist, and ABHoF can be added to the Basketball Hall of Fame (disambiguation) list.

I would also point out that only those players/coaches notable enough (by Wikipedia's standards for basketball) to have an article about them in Wikipedia should be listed in an ABHoF article. Of course, if some are notable enough, but there are no articles yet, feel free to create the articles.--Verbarson (talk) 10:18, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Dick Sweeney

The name of this person is not Dick Sweeney. It is Richard Sweeney. I need the title of this article renamed. Can somebody do this for me?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dick_Sweeney Joshuastrode89 (talk) 23:42, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

@Joshuastrode89:It looks like all the sources refer to him as Dick Sweeney, so this seems to be a case of WP:COMMONNAME. RudolfRed (talk) 23:46, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Ok. How do we change the name? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Joshuastrode89 (talk • contribs)

@Joshuastrode89: We don't, unless sources change it. The opening sentence states his real name. Everything is in order for Wikipedia. PrimeHunter (talk) 23:58, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Title left as is. First line of Lead now starts with Richard 'Dick' Sweeney David notMD (talk) 02:08, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Adding a second leader in info box. YMCA Queensland Youth Parliament

Hi All,

So I'm working on Draft:YMCA Queensland Youth Parliament. I added an info box but wish to put in a second leader (there is a Youth Governor and a Coordinator). How would I go about doing this? I tried editing the template but that didn't work. Tomorrow and tomorrow (talk) 02:14, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

@Tomorrow and tomorrow: Welcome to the Teahouse! Per the documentation at Template:Infobox organization, you could use |leader_title2= and |leader_name2=. Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 04:09, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Repeating Dates

Should repetitive dates (As of [Date], such is true...) be updated daily, or just with new sources in terms of new/high importance articles? The question is for Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan–United States relations. There are a few dates in the article like the US not recognizing IEA as a country/government yet that start with "As of (date)", and I want to know how often to update those dates. Elijahandskip (talk) 03:07, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

@Elijahandskip: Welcome to the Teahouse! I suggest you update the date as often as you update the reliable source for the sentence. Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 04:12, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Elijahandskip, there cannot possibly be a universal standard and obviously this article is an exceptionally prominent article now. It depends entirely on how often reliable sources update the specific information, and how motivated editors are to update properly. I was editing a related article that contained the death count from the Surfside condominium collapse about two months ago. Initially, the confirmed death count was increasing frequently, and editing of the article was frenzied as well. The time came when the count of 98 dead stabilized, the most obvious information stabilized, and editing of the article declined significantly, although I am sure that improvements will be made for years to come. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 04:38, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

I do not authorize a wiki page: Dorothy Ruiz Martinez

Hello, how do I report a wiki page? I do not authorize the page, it is using my personal information, and I want to remove it from Wikipedia. The page is Dorothy Ruiz Martinez. I tried to make edits to the page at least to protect my privacy, and to remove innacurate information, but every time I publish the final edits, it reverts back to the original article. Some user Molly Polly is reverting back the page. I do not authorize any personal information on this page. How do I remove it?

Thank you! Rafaela Mars (talk) 05:27, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

@Rafaela Mars: Welcome to the Teahouse! I'm sorry you're having problems with the Dorothy Ruíz Martínez article. The information at Wikipedia:Contact us/Article subjects might be helpful. It's common for people to find that their edits have been reverted. Per the Wikipedia:BOLD, revert, discuss cycle, it's helpful to share your concerns on the article talk page: Talk:Dorothy Ruíz Martínez (with reliable sources, if possible). Since you have a conflict of interest, I suggest using the {{request edit}} template to ask other editors to help you improve the article. Thanks! GoingBatty (talk) 06:04, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

@MollyPollyRolly, please remember to respect the privacy of personal information when dealing with non-public figures. The edit by @Rafaela Mars appears to have removed only unnecessary private information that is not of benefit to the reader, in addition to condensing down some parts that were overly wordy. If you have a problem with their edit, I suggest recovering the portions you don't agree with removing, rather than undoing their entire edit. ––FormalDude talk 06:08, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Thank you! GoingBatty — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rafaela Mars (talk • contribs) 06:14, 29 August 2021 (UTC) −

Hello, Rafaela Mars. Authorization by the subjects of Wikipedia biographies is not required and there is no process for that. Wikipedia contains biographies about people that Wikipedia editors conclude are notable, and we summarize what reliable, published sources say about various people. At this point, we have no way to verify that you are actually Martinez. If you want to verify your identity, you can contact Wikipedia:Volunteer Response Team. You are free to leave an edit request at Talk:Dorothy Ruíz Martínez as mentioned above noting inaccuracies in the article or anything that genuinely violates your privacy. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 06:25, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Questions about Pictures. YMCA Youth Parliament

Hi folks, and thank you for always being so helpful.

So I'm working on Draft:YMCA Queensland Youth Parliament and have tried to put 2 pictures in, the logo and a swearing in ceremony.

The first one was removed by a bot, I believe in error (Logos are stated as an exemption to non-free policy)

The second one is File:Queensland Youth Parliament Swearing In.png. I'm a bit lost about the whole liscnencing thing but I feel like this should be allowed. Can someone please have a look and put the correct licencing.

I understand that some pictures cannot work so if that's the case please tell me. I just want to make a good article, I'm not trying to breach copyright or get deleted.

Thank you! Tomorrow and tomorrow (talk) 07:06, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Hello, Tomorrow and tomorrow. Non free logos and non free images in general are not permitted in drafts. They are permitted in main space encyclopedia articles only if they are in full compliance with all the conditions of WP:NFCI. As for the photo, the copyright status is dubious. If you are "a bit lost about the whole licencing thing" then how can you possibly "feel like this should be allowed"? Copyright status has to do with complicated verifiable facts and not feelings. If you want to use the image, then it is up to you to be 100% sure that the licensing status is completely correct. Images are not required and other issues are vastly more important when writing an acceptable draft. Images or the lack thereof have no effect on the acceptance of a draft. They can always be added later. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 07:52, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Hi Tomorrow and tomorrow. Logos are not an exemption to non-free policy at all. Non-free logos can be used and are often OK to use per item 2 of WP:NFCI, but each use of such a logo would still need to comply with all ten non-free content use criteria listed here. Non-free content is not allowed to be used in drafts per non-free content use criterion #9 and Wikipedia:Drafts#Preparing drafts; so, that's why the bot removed the file. Since File:Queensland Youth Parliament emblem.png is currently unused, it also fails non-free content use criterion #7. This means that it will be tagged (most likely within the next day or so) for speedy deletion per speedy deletion criterion F5. A notification about this should be added to your user talk page once that happens, but don't panic and re-add the image when it does. Once the draft has been approved as an article, you can re-add the logo. If you try to do so before then, the file will keep getting removed. If you try to do so too many times, you might find yourself being blocked by an administrator. If the file ends up deleted before the draft is accepted, don't reupload the file. Files which are deleted aren't gone forever, but rather are only hidden from public view. Files deleted for F5 reasons can be restored (usually quite easily) by either posting a request at WP:REFUND or by asking the administrator who deleted to do so by posting a message on their user talk page. As for the other photo, as Cullen328 posted above, if you're not reasonably sure about an image's copyright status, don't upload the file. It won't be the end of the world if you do and it turns out you're wrong, but you probably should try to avoid that whenever possible. Instead, try seeking other opinions at WP:MCQ or c:COM:VPC. My personal opinion is that it's probably going to be quite hard (near impossible) to justify File:Queensland Youth Parliament Swearing In.png as non-free content; so, I don't think that's a realistic option and a consensus can be established for such a license. That means it's sort of a free license or bust kind of thing in which you're going to need to get the WP:CONSENT of the person who took the photo, unless there's some reason this might be within the public domain per c:COM:AUSTRALIA. -- Marchjuly (talk) 10:29, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

empty tables policy

Is there a policy about adding tables with no information? Govvy (talk) 09:52, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Hi Govvy I don't know if there's a specific policy or guideline other than what you might find at MOS:TABLES, but there seems to be no encyclopedic value in doing so much in the same way there isn't (at least in my opinion) any encyclopedic value in adding empty sections (i.e. section with only headings and no content). Some people don't like to work in their user sandboxes and instead prefer to "create" content in stages in the article namespace. So, it could be a case where someone adds the table syntax one day, but intends to come back the next day and fill in the table. In such a case, it might be best just to hid the syntax until the table is complete (or at least partially complete). On the other hand, if the table has been "empty" for quite sometime, being WP:BOLD and removing it seems reasonable. The syntax will still be in the page history and can be easily restored as needed at some later date; so, no information will really be lost. Regardless of whether you hide or remove, you probably should make your reasons clear in an edit summary and also possibly on the article's talk page. It's also something that's unlikely going to be considered an exemption to three-revert rule; so, I wouldn't edit war over it. If you're reverted, start a discussion on the article talk page and try and resolve things that way. One last thing would be that there's some editor simply going around adding empty tables to articles without any rhyme or reason. In this case, you'll have to assess whether this is just a new editor (not only a new account but also not an very experienced editor) who might mean well. If that's the case, perhaps a friendly message of their user talk page would be a good first step instead of a more scary sounding user warning template. If there's no response and they keeping on doing the same thing, then perhaps more serious warnings and then seeking administrator assistance would be warranted. -- Marchjuly (talk) 10:42, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

I believe this link is corrupted. I'm interested.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sagar_Films I believe the link to this official website from the Wikipedia page is corrupted to usurp the rightful owners being paid.2600:1005:B11B:515F:6448:1E92:F0B4:80F6 (talk) 10:56, 29 August 2021 (UTC) 2600:1005:B11B:515F:6448:1E92:F0B4:80F6 (talk) 10:56, 29 August 2021 (UTC)