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Melecie, a Teahouse host

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Help Wikipedia

How close to employment can/should I edit?

I work for the Denver Public Library. As you might guess I'm hugely interested in libraries, literature, and history. It is 100% clear that I should NEVER edit the page for DPL or its history, however would it be okay for me to, for example, add references to the List of Carnegie libraries in Colorado or eventually to create a List of libraries in Colorado as long as I get someone else to add or edit the Denver branches? Or should I stay away from Colorado entirely?

Relatedly DPL is not fully independent of the City and County of Denver. Our library board and city librarian are appointed by the mayor. Does this mean I should avoid editing Timeline of Denver since Denver is sorta my employer and that page is somewhat the history of my employer as a public servant? Should I also avoid editing Colorado or even United States of America since we get grants from them at times? I have read over WP:COI and it seems to say that I can edit topic like that, but I should do it through making a draft or posting to the talk page first and disclosing my COI. Is that correct?

My inclination is to create a draft AfC List of libraries in New Mexico that announces I work for Denver Public Library, but that I am not being paid to write the article and that I'm doing it on a purely volunteer basis in my free time and requesting critiques of what I have written before I post it. Then moving on to Wyoming and only then adding Colorado so that is is clearer that I'm not just editing to promote DPL or even Colorado libraries in general. ColfaxLibrary (talk) 15:43, 10 October 2023 (UTC)

From what I understand, as long as you disclose COI and edit with full neutrality and without bias, you should be fine. If you believe your COI will be triggered, only avoid the articles related to your COI. And no, living in a country does not automatically apply your COI to everything in that country, I would only disclose the COI on the pages related to your field of work. Nobody expects the UnexpectedSmoreInquisition (talk)! 16:21, 10 October 2023 (UTC)

ColfaxLibrary. You can certainly revert obvious vandalism to Denver Public Library. You can also make formal edit requests at Talk: Denver Public Library. Personally, I think you can edit Timeline of Denver with few restrictions, since that is about the broad history of the city, rather than just the history of the city government. Lots of the entries lack references to reliable sources, which should be very easy for you to find. I see no problem with you editing about libraries in New Mexico or Wyoming. I do have a problem with your user name, though. It implies that anyone working for that branch library can use the account, which would be a policy violation. It implies that it is an "official" library account. I recommend that you change it to something like "Barbara at Colfax Library" or something similar. Cullen328 (talk) 17:56, 10 October 2023 (UTC)

ColfaxLibrary, I now see that you are discussing the username issue with 331dot on your talk page. Carry on. Cullen328 (talk) 18:01, 10 October 2023 (UTC)

No problem @Cullen328, I'm actually glad I made this mistake so I could see how the renaming process works and I can explain it to other users. Very simple and easy. The big advantage, as I see it is that it preserves a record of my mistakes instead of hiding them in an unused account. Plus general neatness of not leaving a cobweb account. It was also very fast today.

If you have any advice about managing events beyond reading the page on them it would be great. I'm aiming at running public Wikipedia editing event here at the Gonzalez Branch in January of 2024. MatthewFromColfaxLibrary (talk) 18:11, 10 October 2023 (UTC)

One last thing I feel that I should add, is that if you haven't already read this, you should before coordinating an event. Cheers, Nobody expects the UnexpectedSmoreInquisition (talk)! 18:28, 10 October 2023 (UTC)

MatthewFromColfaxLibrary, please read Wikipedia:How to run an edit-a-thon, and feel free to ask additional questions as you plan your event. Cullen328 (talk) 19:00, 10 October 2023 (UTC)

I like your ordered attitude - very fitting :) Stanstaple (talk) 07:16, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

(:D) Nobody expects the UnexpectedSmoreInquisition (talk)! 10:52, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Why are templates different between different languages?

As my first experience as a Wikipedia editor, I have recently translated a couple Wikipedia articles from English to French, and recently I've been confused why the "Infobox Character / Infobox_Personnage_(fiction)" template is different between the two Wikipedias (and, for that matter, why any template would be different across languages anyways). Shouldn't Wikipedia be sharing consistent information, and wouldn't that mean that templates should be consistent, with the same fields and layouts across languages? Am I missing something here? GuyInFridge (talk) 01:28, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

hi @GuyInFridge and welcome to the Teahouse! different-language Wikipedias operate separately for the most part (except for having the same goal and being hosted in the same place). the templates are different as it is possible French Wikipedia copied them from here at another time and adapted them for their language, and the template just doesn't update simultaneously with the template here (because technically, I don't think there is a way to do that, and any further updates to it would have to be done manually which may be unnecessary for them), so basically it becomes a fork of the template here. happy editing! 💜  melecie  talk - 01:57, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Interesting, good to know! If I wanted to update the French template, my understanding is I could do so on their Wikipedia, and then if they want to revert my changes or discuss them, then that discussion would be had on the discussion page of the template I just edited? Do I have that right? GuyInFridge (talk) 02:02, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Hello, GuyInFridge. That is the way it would happen in English Wikipedia (accordingh to WP:BRD). I would guess that that is how it would happen in French Wikipedia, but again, they could have different procedures. ColinFine (talk) 10:36, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Oddity about US state capitols

An odd coincidence:multi-word capitals All of the 9 states whose capitals have multiple-word names comprise a contiguous group. 2 of the states touch at a single point, but I believe that qualifies as contiguous. The states are:

Minnesota (St. Paul)
Iowa (Des Moines)
Missouri (Jefferson City)
Arkansas (Little Rock)
Louisiana (Baton Rouge)
Oklahoma (Oklahoma City)
New Mexico (Santa Fe) *
Utah (Salt Lake City) **
Nevada (Carson City)

• both state and capital multi-word
  • only 3-word capilal

I happened to discover this and thought it a remarkable coincidence. ShamelessSaemus (talk) 02:47, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Hello, @ShamelessSaemus and welcome to the Teahouse. Do you have a question about editing Wikipedia? Grumpylawnchair (talk) 02:50, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

I am attempting to add the above info to the wiki knowledge base and need to know how to do it. ShamelessSaemus (talk) 16:14, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

@ShamelessSaemus: if it's a discovery that you personally made, then it usually falls under the umbrella of original research, which isn't the type of material that Wikipedia publishes. As an encyclopedia, Wikipedia hosts information that is summarized already in reliable sources. - Astrophobe (talk) 16:20, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

See also Wikipedia:What Wikipedia is not#Non-encyclopedic cross-categorizations and Wikipedia:What Wikipedia is not#Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate collection of information. Solomon Ucko (talk) 19:01, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Contacting Business representatives

In relation to my earlier talk "Updating a building photo", is it ok/recommended to contact a building or business representative for photos or information for the purpose of putting it up on Wikipedia?

e.g. Asking and receiving rights to a photo taken by a companies PR team? Loupedecker (talk) 05:42, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Yes, that's perfectly fine. See Wikipedia:Requesting copyright permission for more info. ––FormalDude (talk) 07:03, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Problem using Template for Cite Book

I have a book to hand. Put Author, Publisher, Title, Edition into Template. Could not get the ISBN Autofill to do anything. So put in the ISBN myself. Does the ISBN Autofill work? BlueWren0123 (talk) 06:31, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

ISBN numbers should work in the VisualEditor autofill. Ca ^{talk to me!} 14:48, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

It works the other way around: click on the citation button (quotation mark icon), click on the "Automatic" tab, type the ISBN into the box, and submit it. It should try to automatically fill in the other information. Solomon Ucko (talk) 14:55, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Invoking a File Upload with an Alt+U hotkey goes through a redirect

I've just noticed that when I push Alt+U the Wikipedia:File upload wizard opens with a note:

Redirected from Wikipedia:File Upload Wizard

(capitalized). How can I make (or: who can make) the hotkey to invoke the appropriate page directly? --CiaPan (talk) 10:31, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

PS. Technical context: desktop, Windows 10, Google Chrome 117, skin MonoBook. --CiaPan (talk) 10:53, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Same behaviour in Windows 10 with Edge and current default vector 22 skin. Mike Turnbull (talk) 11:08, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

PS.2. Pinging UtherSRG who moved the page. --CiaPan (talk) 10:57, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Ten months ago or so. And it works fine for me on Vector legacy 2010. Who can we ping from the Skin team? - UtherSRG (talk) 11:30, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

No wait, it works fine for me on all Skins except Minerva, where it doesn't do anything, but I believe that's expected. I'm on a Win 10 Enterprise desktop using Google Chrome 117. - UtherSRG (talk) 11:34, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Publishing a page

Dear Wikipedia . I submitted a page for publication in may this year . How can I check the status? On 1st October I received an email saying the copyright of the image was not stated . I added the copyright owner but I am not sure it got logged correctly. the image was subsequently deleted and the page was not published. how can I find the status and how can I reinstall the image with the correct copyright? Kaffkas (talk) 10:35, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

If you mean your user page, then that is the wrong place to create an article, and you have never submitted it for review. I suggest you use the article wizard to create a draft Draft:Shivani Mathur, and copy the source text from your user page to there. Then when it is ready for review, you can submit it.

However, at present the references are not formatted usefully, and most of them are not independent, and so do not establish that Mathur meets Wikipedia's criteria for notability. Please read your first article, and WP:REFB. ColinFine (talk) 10:44, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Adding to the above that your userpage, User:Kaffkas, is meant to, if you want, write something about yourself and what you like to do on Wikipedia. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 10:56, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Hi @Kaffkas, welcome to the Teahouse. About the image - are you trying to upload an image you took of this person, or one taken by someone else? The photographer is typically the copyright holder and must be the one to release an image for use. You can't simply add their name, they must grant permission in writing to Wikimedia Commons. 57.140.16.56 (talk) 12:48, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

please help regarding my AFC submission(Bajrang Baan) Article

Cancersign9/sandbox Cancersign9 (talk) 13:30, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

 Courtesy link: Draft:Bajrang Baan - 57.140.16.56 (talk) 13:37, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

@GoingBatty first off all hello and thank you for your immediate reply, the problem is resolved now there is a no issue, again thank you for yours instant help, much appreciated. Cancersign9 (talk) 14:44, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

@Cancersign9: Welcome to the Teahouse! You subverted the AFC process by moving the draft to articlespace. What specific help are you requesting? GoingBatty (talk) 14:16, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

I really want to become genuine Wikipedian Contributor, How can i improve my articles and writing skills, how can i correct my mistakes error in articles, kindly tell me. regarding this, thank you in advance. Cancersign9 (talk) 14:51, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

I have trimed some unsourced inappropriate content from your article, it is very poorly written and clearly sets out to praise the topic. Theroadislong (talk) 15:00, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

i will try to improve the article with your highlighted points, and definitely trying hard to get geniune references which meets articles standerd policy. the question aries that this article of mine is worth to publish main space or should i improve this article in draftspace what is your geniune thought on this? Cancersign9 (talk) 15:11, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

@Cancersign9: You might find it helpful to review Wikipedia:Neutral point of view and Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Words to watch. Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 15:03, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Wikipedia punishment

Why would sanctions against editors not be allowed to punish users. Administrators should have the right to punish vandals and users who are about to get banned? Like for example, for a user who keeps changing names of pages to inappropriate names and then gets banned indefinitely, administrators should be allowed to vandalize that user's page as punishment. 97.71.234.50 (talk) 14:24, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

An eye for an eye? The obvious answer is no one wants vandalism on any page, vandals get blocked and the problem is solved. No need for any further action. Polyamorph (talk) 14:26, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

But vandals who get banned indefinitely do deserve to have their userpage vandalized, that should be their punishment. Or better yet, administrators can harass that vandal or even give them personal attacks. 97.71.234.50 (talk) 14:29, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

I didn't accept the admin tools to dole out punishment or harass anyone and I have better things to do than vandalize anything. 331dot (talk) 14:31, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

I know, but you don't understand. What I'm trying to say is that vandals who keep vandalizing Wikipedia or doing other things that they are banned from and then they get banned indefinitely do deserve to be harassed or even get personal attacked as punishment for doing things they've been banned from. 97.71.234.50 (talk) 14:35, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

please please please PLEASE tell me you're trolling. ltbdl (talk) 14:37, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Never mind Wikipedia, there is the issue of basic human decency and morality. An eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind. 331dot (talk) 14:37, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

That is actually a very wrong mindset. Why should admins harass already blocked users? Davest3r08 ^(talk) 14:37, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Alright that's enough. Other editors have already pointed it out but, harassment or personal attacks against others (even against vandals) is not allowed! 🛧Midori No Sora♪🛪 ( ☁＝☁＝✈) 14:40, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

"it would be funny" would have been a better excuse than trying to rationalize and justify vandalism ngl cogsan • (give me attention) • (see my deeds) 17:34, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Not an admin. It seems to me that most vandals are desperate for attention. Whether it's posting porn, or posting on help pages, they are almost crying out 'me me me'. The worst thing you can do, in their eyes, is ignore them and move on. Knitsey (talk) 14:40, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Excuse me but, why on earth do you think that is an acceptable thing for an admin to do. Vandals get blocked by the admins. Period. No further action is needed. 🛧Midori No Sora♪🛪 ( ☁＝☁＝✈) 14:33, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

If admins constantly abused their power, Wikipedia would become an unsuitable place for editors. Davest3r08 ^(talk) 14:34, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Additionally, Wikipedia would have a FAR worse reputation. Davest3r08 ^(talk) 14:35, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Perennial candidates

What are the notability guidelines for perennial candidates? Casper king (talk) 14:38, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

@casper king: perennial candidates for what? ltbdl (talk) 14:40, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Politicians Casper king (talk) 14:42, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

@Ltbdl Casper king (talk) 14:43, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

There are not specific guidelines for perennial candidates for public office- it's WP:BIO as with any other person. 331dot (talk) 14:43, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

@Casper king: See also WP:POLITICIAN. GoingBatty (talk) 15:06, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Conflict of interest and notoriety

Good morning! I submitted a page for publication a couple months ago (Draft:Sean Stegall), which was rejected for a conflict of interest and is potentially flagged for notoriety. I have disclosed my affiliation with the organization related to the article's subject, but am not sure if there are any other steps I can take to improve the article's likelihood of publication. Other than working for the same organization as the article subject, I do not have any personal relationship nor compensation for creating this article; I've strictly used my research and prior knowledge of the subject to craft it. I have compared my entry to a few other city manager/town manager pages and they seem to contain a similar amount and type of information as this one.

As far as notoriety, I'd also love some help in explaining what is lacking that can help support the creation of the article.

Any help or advice would be most appreciated. Cwriter71 (talk) 15:30, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

It was NOT tagged for notoriety? Your draft was declined, not rejected, it doesn't show how the person is notable. Theroadislong (talk) 15:47, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Hi @Cwriter71, welcome to the Teahouse.

The test for articles about politicians would be WP:NPOLITICIAN. Sean fails #1 as a Town Manager is not on that list of criteria. #2 is more tricky, but I think he would just about fail it as there is not significant coverage as your secondary sources are local newspapers. I would be willing to see what other reviewers think, though.

You haven't yet submitted this for review, so maybe submit (click the big Submit draft for review!) button, and then it'll go into the pool to be reviewed, and you might get some more thoughts from other reviewers. Qcne (talk) 15:51, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Welcome to the Teahouse, @Cwriter71! You might be confusing "notability" with "notoriety". Davest3r08 ^(talk) 16:34, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

How do I edit

how to edit Lvl15 MEGAMERNUT (talk) 17:52, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Hi, @Lvl15 MEGAMERNUT! You can check out Help:Introduction or The Wikipedia Adventure. But please don't make unconstructive edits to Wikipedia. Happy editing! Tails Wx 17:56, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Review and suggestions for articles

Hello team, I had my article - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Bernard_Sarfo_Twumasi rejected by user Tutwakhamoe citing sources as the problem. However, the data includes recognized news articles and also links to the official Football Federation's Website.

Any tips on how to resolve this? 84.215.16.205 (talk) 18:25, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Hi IP editor, did you read the comment left by the reviewer under the decline notice? It explains why the article was declined (not rejected). Articles about professional sports people need to pass WP:SPORTBASIC, and there wasn't evidence of meeting that criteria from your sources. Qcne (talk) 19:01, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Video titles

Danstarr69's reply to 1AmNobody24's question about YouTube videos included the phrase "correcting titles (as sometimes they're different to the title in the story itself ...)" suggesting that a video's title is that on the video itself rather than the title above/below the video on the page where the video appears. The former may only be visible for a few seconds whereas the latter is more obvious and may be the title in search snippets and referred to in articles.

Maybe the solution is to include both titles. Is there a way of doing that using VisualEditor and Source Editor?

The specific case prompting my question is one of the numerous videos by Nuseir Yassin/Nas Daily but has wider application. Mcljlm (talk) 19:32, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Mcljlm I thought this was regarding another post I replied to recently, as it's not just Youtube and News Stories that do it, Film and TV companies do it to.

One example is Dune (2021 film) which is actually called "Dune: Part One" on screen, yet they advertised it everywhere as just Dune. I randomly found out that "Dune: Part Two" is on the way soon recently, and I suspect they'll advertise it with the correct title this time.

The BBC and Channel 4 have countless productions which don't match what appears on screen, most of which seem to be in the documentary/reality TV genres. I can't think of a specific example, as I haven't updated any for a while, but there's many as I said.

A Youtube example I noticed last night, when looking for a short film to check if it's credits were correct (I can't remember why now), is the film Ecstasy (2021) which it's official Youtube distributer Omeleto has titled "A young man tries to buy ecstasy for his disabled father. The reason why is heartwarming. | Ecstasy" It's just a short plot outline, like with most Youtube titles on films distributed by similar channels. Danstarr69 (talk) 20:56, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

So it is a more general problem Danstarr69. Is there a way for a citation to include the more frequently used title as well as what may be the correct title? Mcljlm (talk) 22:40, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Mcljlm Manually.

Like I said on that post, if I knew how to make references say what they're supposed to say automatically, I would, although I know that's not possible with BFI Collections, which as I said, would be replacing BFI - Film, TV, People pages, which were all deleted last week (apart from some BFI funded/produced productions which were redirected to different pages on the BFI), so now there's 3,500+ dead BFI external links on here, not to mention the countless dead BFI references.

I don't know why the BFI have deleted them all now, as BFI Collections stops working occasionally for minutes/hours for no reason, plus it's very very slow when you try to use the Advanced or Expert Searches to narrow down the results, so it clearly isn't the finished article yet.

Back to Wikipedia, I add each reference automatically in visual mode, add anything that's missing, correct anything that needs correcting, then switch to source mode to give the reference a name if I'm likely to use it more than once. Danstarr69 (talk) 23:38, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

References

Draft: Brian. E. Kinsella

Hi Everyone,

I am working on my first article on WP and am ran into some snags, resulting in my first draft being declined for seeming promotional. Draft:Brian E. Kinsella.

I've edited the text yesterday, and am still hoping for some feedback, on whether this meets the encyclopedic tone standard. I’ve also corrected link references. If you have the time, I'd appreciate any advice and comments, before I try to resubmit).

Thank you so much in advance! I really appreciate any help.

Best, Mwikiforce (talk) 20:11, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Looking over for tone: it still seems rather promotional or too positive. WP:Euphemism might be helpful documenting his death. ✶Mitch199811✶ 21:18, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Thank you SO much Mitch, I have been removing all the text I thought could come across promotional. But if there’s more I need to do, I’ll just keep working at it. I was removed from the category of: being paid, and promoting content, so that’s a really good start. - still learning! Mwikiforce (talk) 22:55, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

A brief look at your sources looks good. One other area of possible promotional tone, the career section seems too congratulatory for him helping out in Afghanistan. It might be fine assuming that is what reliable sources say but it is something to keep in mind. Finally, I apologize for confusing Kinsella and his roommate in my previous comment. ✶Mitch199811✶ 23:08, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

No worries Mitch! Thank you so much for taking the time. Yeah, I removed all that seemed promotional to me, but I can give that another look. I was relying on WSJ on Afghanistan, and it does seem like a pretty historical event to me, so it’s hard for me to tell if it’s congratulatory, or just the mere facts. I’ll definitely look at it again.

Thank you again! Much much appreciated!

best, Mwikiforce (talk) 00:47, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Hello. How do I make the map for the coordinates I entered on this article display? Jõsé ^hola 22:14, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

@Josedimaria237 Welcome to the Teahouse. The coordinates you added are displaying OK. (visible in the top right side of the page, just above the Infobox).

However, they're obviously incorrect, as they appear way out in the ocean, in the Gulf of Guinea. Are you able to fix this? Nick Moyes (talk) 22:41, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

@Nick Moyes: sorry, I meant displaying inside the infobox.

Jõsé ^hola 23:06, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

@Josedimaria237: There was no Mapframes map in the infobox because you didn't put the {{coord}} template in the |coordinates= field in the infobox. I've moved the template there, and now there's a map. Deor (talk) 00:04, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Infobox map discrepancy

Hi All,

In the article https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ronan_Point, I see an apparent problem: The page shows Ronan Point's location at two (2) different map coordinates, depending on which link on the page one uses. (This is obviously not optimal.)

Compare the location icons displayed on maps at these 2 URLs:

• The full-screen map accessible from this page's Infobox:

URL A: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ronan_Point#/map/0

• A map sourced from the Geohack URL near the "Coordinates:" section at the top of the same page:

URL B: https://www.openstreetmap.org/?mlat=51.512852&mlon=0.021505&zoom=15#map=15/51.5129/0.0215

(Note that both maps reference OpenStreetMap as their source.) I claim that only URL B has its icon in the CORRECT location, consistent with the coordinates stated on the Wikipedia page (51.512852°N, 0.021505°E). By contrast, the icon on the map at URL A is well off this mark — about 110 meters northeast of URL B’s icon.

Assuming you agree with the above, what is the best way to correct this page so that this page's maps display consistently? It's not at all obvious to me where the (problematic) coordinates used by URL A are coming from. Also, it looks as though the problem could be fixed easily by adding URL B’s coordinates to the Infobox definition:

| coordinates         = {{Coord|51.512852|N|0.021505|E}}

However, the downside of this approach is that it duplicates the coordinates that are already on the page.

Any advice/pointers would be appreciated.

Thanks. Marnofaldi (talk) 22:59, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

@Marnofaldi: I think I've fixed this, hopefully to your satisfaction. "The (problematic) coordinates used by URL A" were coming from Wikidata, which supplies the map used in the infobox when no coordinates are specified in the infobox itself. I've moved the {{coord}} template from the bottom of the article into the infobox (trimming the overprecise coordinates), so the infobox map and the maps on the Geograph page should now be showing the same location. Deor (talk) 23:57, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

@Deor: Your revision is exactly what I was looking for. Also, until now I hadn't realized that entering the coordinates in just the infobox would cause them to appear in two places on the page. Thanks. Marnofaldi (talk) 02:07, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

For historic completeness, Wikidata had originally imported it from english Wikipedia in 2017 at which time they were already incorrect. A user corrected the coordinates in the article but these corrections were not made to Wikidata. —TheDJ (talk • contribs) 17:15, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Wanting to make lists of rugby union results more digestible/clean them up

Hello, I was wondering what the most acceptable way to redo some of the pages for lists of rugby union results - as the sheer volume of results, to me, is not easily digestible and difficult to read. Specifically, I had wanted to start with making the list of Wales results look something like the pages for England - with a 'hub' main page and several pages listing the results by decade. Eventually, the hope would be to have uniformity across the pages for the results of national rugby union teams.

Understandably, my draft for a list of Wales rugby union results between 1881 and 1889 was rejected due to currently being redundant. I just wanted to know what is the best way to go about trying to achieve creating a hub page for Wales results with links to smaller, more digestible, pages like my draft, without getting rid of the current list page that otherwise makes my draft pages redundant. I wouldn't want to edit the current page to remove what would make my draft page redundant until my draft page was approved, as then there would be no way to access the results in question - if that makes any sense.

Thanks for any help in advance! WalesRugbyGuy (talk) 23:12, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

Hi WalesRugbyGuy. Have you tried asking about this at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Rugby league, Wikipedia:WikiProject Rugby union or both? Since WikiProjects have often established guidelines with respect to list articles like the ones you've mentioned above, it might be a good idea to seek input from relevant WikiProject before embarking on what sounds like a pretty massive cleanup effort. You might also find others willing to help out. -- Marchjuly (talk) 01:26, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

I don't get me blocked

I will not get blocked; but, I want to become an Administrator. - Thomasfan1916 (talk) 23:40, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

@Thomasfan1916: It takes a large amount of Wikipedia experience to become an administrator, plus a demonstrated need for the admin tools. Almost everything can be done without being an admin. Focus on making contructive edits that improve the encyclopedia. In a few years, if you are still interested, you can consider applying at WP:RfA RudolfRed (talk) 00:11, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Videos and images

how do you post videos and images on a wikipedia article?

Evergreen tenal (talk) 00:13, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

@Evergreen tenal: Probably the best place for you to start would be to carefully read through Wikipedia:Image use policy since that page either covers pretty much everything related to image use on Wikipedia. If you've still got questions after looking at the page, feel free to post them here at the Teahouse. -- Marchjuly (talk) 01:31, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Ping was misformed, repinging Evergreen tenal 💜  melecie  talk - 01:34, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Class Assignment Questions

Hello! I'm curious about how I can best locate sources for a project. For this assignment, we have to make changes to/improve upon an existing Wikipedia article. I have been assigned the Music Psychology Wikipedia article, but I am stumped about what changes I could possibly make to improve this article. I was intent on improving sourcing, or rectifying dead links held within the article. So, my questions are:

Could anyone give me any tips on how to find solid sourcing?

What is a good way to verify that the sources being used in the article are still reputable?

Thank you so much!

RealSpill27 (talk) 01:04, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Hi RealSpill27. Your class was assigned two Wiki-Ed advisors (User:Helaine (Wiki Ed) and User:Ian (Wiki Ed)) and I'm sure that either Helaine or Ian would be more than happy to answer any questions you have. You can post questions on their user talk pages. I believe your class also has access to various Wiki Ed modules/tutorials specifically designed for students such as yourself that you also might find helpful. However, you can find some general information about "reliable sources" in Wikipedia:Reliable sources. As for ways to improve the "Music psychology" article, you might want to propose some things at Talk:Music psychology to see if you get any feedback. You could also start a discussion about the article Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Psychology to see whether any members of that WikiProject have any suggestions. That particular article looks at first glance to be fairly well developed; so, it might be better to be a bit WP:CAUTIOUS instead of diving right in and making lots of major changes. -- Marchjuly (talk) 01:19, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Hello, RealSpill27. I suggest a slight expansion of what is called the "controversial Mozart effect" to clarify that this "effect" is not valid according to the best sources, and to enable the reader to better understand what the theory was. Also, there is what appears to me to be an inappropriate red link in the subsection "Affective response". Main article links should only include articles that exist, and non-existent articles should not be included. To be frank, I doubt that Cognition and the Evolution of Music: Pitfalls and Prospects should ever exist. That is a source, but I do not think it likely that there should be a Wikipedia article about that source. Cullen328 (talk) 02:23, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Redirect

How to you make a redirect in editing? 74.132.203.31 (talk) 02:06, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Hello, IP editor. Help:Redirect should give you the information that you need. IP editors and newly registered editors cannot create redirects. In order to do so, you will need to register an account and make at least ten edits over at least four full days. Please read WP:AUTOCONFIRM for more details. Cullen328 (talk) 02:29, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

You can also go to Wikipedia:AFCRC to request that the redirect be made. NW1223<Howl at me•My hunts> 02:32, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Thanks. 74.132.203.31 (talk) 03:13, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

i could make it for you if you need Iljhgtn (talk) 03:19, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Thanks, but I think I can do it. 74.132.203.31 (talk) 03:21, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

ok Iljhgtn (talk) 03:22, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

birthdate is wrong

how do I change my birthdate? EstherWoj (talk) 02:08, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

You will need to request the change on the article's talk page since you have a COI with the subject. NW1223<Howl at me•My hunts> 02:35, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Hello, EstherWoj. I have removed the claimed date of birth from Esther Wojcicki because I spent 6-1/2 minutes watching the YouTube video used as a reference and the birth date was never mentioned. Using that video as a reference for your date of birth is against policy, although it enabled me to learn more about your classroom philosophy. If you want an accurate birth date mentioned, then post a formal edit request at Talk: Esther Wojcicki. No date of birth should be in the article unless accompanied by a reference to a reliable source that verifies the date. Cullen328 (talk) 03:55, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

@Cullen328: I adjusted the article's categories as well. GoingBatty (talk) 15:40, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

New Page on wikipedia

How can I create a new page on wikipedia? Tanafza (talk) 09:20, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Hi, @Tanafza, and welcome to the Teahouse. Have a look at Help:Your first article for some assistance on creating your first article. ContributeToTheWiki (talk • contribs) 09:32, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Page rejected

Hi! My wiki username is MaBo01Cel. I just got my article rejected but I don't understand why. I wrote an article about a company and I think the references I have added are good. I compered my article to other similar company articles such as Sysmex Corporation, and I cannot understand why Sysmex Corporation article was accepted but not mine about CellaVision. Could you please help me? MaBo01Cel (talk) 09:30, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

 Courtesy link: Draft:CellaVision Your draft was declined, not rejected. The template at the top of the article claims that the you created the article in return for undisclosed payments, which is against Wikipedia's terms of use. Also, have a look at the feedback that the draft-reviewer left on your draft. ContributeToTheWiki (talk • contribs) 09:51, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Hi @MaBo01Cel: the draft was declined for the reasons given in the decline notice (those grey boxes inside the large pink one), namely that it does not demonstrate the subject's notability, as it only cites close primary sources. And given that this is therefore not based on what independent sources have said, but only on what the company wants to say about itself, the draft is inherently promotional (see WP:YESPROMO). HTH, -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 10:00, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Of the four refs, two are the company and one is of the aquisistion of another company, the latter type not seen as contributing to notability. Many existing articles are not to Wikipedia standards, so pointing at an example (Sysmex) is meaningless. David notMD (talk) 12:31, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Please, aprove this draft

There is a draft of a soundtrack ;Draft:Fantastic Beasts: The Secrets of Dumbledore (soundtrack) and it hasn't been aprroved since April of this year, it has everything to be aproved. 201.188.148.103 (talk) 10:08, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Correction for the record: its most recent submission was ten days ago. -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 10:31, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Hi there! While you are waiting another review, I suggest you replace the {{citation needed}} template in the "Background" section with a reliable source. Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 15:25, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Done 201.188.148.103 (talk) 01:55, 14 October 2023 (UTC)

My mother wants to start editing Wikipedia

Hello, fellow Wikipedians.

Recently, my mother sent me a Tweet (or whatever it's called nowadays) about information on Wikipedia about the the recent conflict between Israel and Hamas, and she said she wanted to start editing about that kind of stuff.

I told her about policies and guidelines, contentious topics, neutrality, notability, etc.

Anyways, what other advice do you have to give us? How do I disclose that I have this type of relationship with another editor? Do I need to?

Cheers, QuickQuokka ^{[⁠talk • contribs]} 10:43, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

 Comment: Forgot to add title. Whoops QuickQuokka ^{[⁠talk • contribs]} 10:45, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

@QuickQuokka Unless you both start edit-warring or debating with other editors, I don't think so. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 11:13, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Please don't. Yes, one can be very passionate especially when tragedy strikes home. But there are many reasons not to jump into this article and the related ones.

First, many of these articles are considered as contentious topics and are protected just a step below an admin lock. Only accounts with 500 edits and age of 30 days old can edit. Editors of these accounts are usually more aware of the policies and guidelines, not only theoretically and also practically.

This brings me to the second point, the experience editing on Wikipedia. While we generally assume good faith, there is only so much rope one may have when an inexperienced editor jumping into the deep end without learning to swim. Please build up your experience in non contentious topics first. Find other non contentious topics (or ones with relatively lesser contention) relating to Israel and Jews first, like neighborhoods, famous people, other notable events. Learn about the consensus building process , discard any 'my way or the highway' attitude if there's one.

Third, you may be emotionally charged, and more often than not there will be arguments by other editors that may make your blood boil, especially in this emotional state. And emotional charged people may end up writing an extremely biased work.

Direct your energies to other mundane articles first, get the hang of contributing to Wikipedia and/or other related projects first. Hopefully by then, the dust may be somewhat settled for a new level headed editor to work on. – robertsky (talk) 11:20, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

@Robertsky: Yes, I did warn her that this is a very contentious topic and that many articles are protected, but she seems adamant. QuickQuokka ^{[⁠talk • contribs]} 11:23, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

I suggest she reads about Wikipedia:Edit requests. Shantavira|^{feed me} 11:32, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Also to ward off sock accusations, {{User shared IP address}} template be useful. – robertsky (talk) 13:35, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

About My Draft Article Panchmukhi Hanuman

@WJ94 respected, I didn't know that Wikipedia's editor supervisors also make mistakes, my draft which I am still correcting, and references are yet to be given in it, and I did not even submit it, without reading it properly and seeing the title of the article. How correct is it to make nomination without direct deletion? Granted, this happened by mistake on your part, but it was a little disrespectful to me. Cancersign9 (talk) 11:14, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Hi Cancersign9, thanks for your message. To clarify, I am not a supervisor at Wikipedia - I am a normal editor, just like you. I perhaps have a little more experience around here, so one of the things I sometimes do is look through recently created articles and drafts to check they meet our policies and guidelines. Some pages get nominated for speedy deletion - this occurs when they meet some very strict criteria that the community has decided can be deleted without further discussion (for example, blatant vandalism or promotional material). In this case, I had multiple tabs open on my computer and accidentally clicked the button to nominate your draft for speedy deletion instead of the one I had intended to - I reverted this as soon as I realised. My apologies for this honest mistake - no disrespect was intended at all. Best of luck working on your draft - my advice would be to look for some reliable sources which you can base your work on. WJ94 (talk) 11:27, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Thank you for your opinion, and I agree with everything you said, it may happen. I would also like to apologize to you if I have caused you trouble. Respected editor, I am currently working on this article in other ways, I am thoughtfully working on how it can be made better, as soon as the draft is edited, I will add context to it at the end and submit it to AFC. I am also a medical doctor, from the way you speak you seem to be a nice person. And also as a doctor and a PhD graduate like you, I have increased my respect for you. Best wishes to you. Cancersign9 (talk) 12:09, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Help me make my very first wiki article perfect!

Hey fellow wiki mates!

I recently published my very own wiki article, i was quite nervous the entire time. At the time of publishing, i felt it seemed almost perfect to me but for some reason, i have this feeling that it could have been better, can you kind fellas help me with it please? Also do appreciate some tips along the way! Looking forward to contribute along with you!

Article Link PikaBoo (talk) 13:14, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

I have moved it to here Draft:zkEVM to incubate it, it was clearly not ready for mainspace and was likely to be deleted. Theroadislong (talk) 13:20, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Hello PikaBoo. I don't know anything about the machine you've written about, but the article reminds me of an advertisement, with a section on how zkEVM is better than its competition. The sources you used as references are not familiar to me, though they may be reliable and well-respected. Have you looked at Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Perennial sources? That's my go to help when I've come across an Internet source for what I'm writing about, and I'm not sure if the source is trustworthy.

Best wishes on your Wikipedia projects. And don't worry about whether your article is "almost perfect." As long as it is an accurate summary of a noteworthy subject others can come along and do some editing to improve the article. Karenthewriter (talk) 14:56, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Some obvious questions, not answered by the draft: What is a zkEVM? Hardware, software, or something else? Can I buy one? What does it do? OK, it's a "scaling solution", two almost meaningless buzzwords. Maproom (talk) 15:01, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Uzazi article reliability

Hi, Teahouse.

I'm somewhat new to editing en.wiki, I'm more active on Simple.wiki (well, was, anyway) and ran into this article while doing research for a project for school. After doing a few google searches I can't seem to find anything else about it online.

Is this article notable enough to be on en.wiki and if so, can we try and find more sources unrelated to Wikipedia? Derpdart56 (talk) 15:28, 7 October 2023 (UTC)

Hi @Derpdart56! The "more citations need tag" that has been present (since 2007 😭) is certainly valid. A spice is almost certainly notable (unless it's a complete hoax), so the question is finding the sources out there. {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 15:40, 7 October 2023 (UTC)

I added a talk header to the article's talk page that has some links that may help with finding sources. Cheers, {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 15:43, 7 October 2023 (UTC)

I think that this poorly referenced article may be based on a misspelling. This Nigerian newspaper article is about a spice called "uziza" there, and we have an article about it, Piper guineense. Cullen328 (talk) 18:06, 7 October 2023 (UTC)

Hmm, it seems to have a different scientific name, but maybe. Would be helpful to have input from subject-matter experts if anyone knows where to ping. {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 20:57, 8 October 2023 (UTC)

I found some more sources; the first eight all attest that "uzazi" refers to the fruit/berry of the Zanthoxylum/Fagara tessmannii/gilletii plant: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Uzazi&oldid=1179800262. I have no idea if it could have originally been a typo, but it's now used in various official (e.g. EU food regulations) and unofficial sources. Solomon Ucko (talk) 14:42, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

P.S. I found most of those sources by searching Google for "Uzazi Zanthoxylum tessmannii" (without quotation marks); it may be possible to find more sources by searching for other synonyms of the genus or other descriptive words.

Here are some more URLs to considering looking into, along with some comments about them:

• Verbatim copy of an old version of the Wikipedia article, with "(stews)" removed: https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=143684802312048&paipv=0&eav=AfaQhI-AFBG_c-qKc_T9kWTvWrspdKcVUb3t8g_HTkm9uUsqoo8gtIC1T-sTGtC8aYc&_rdr
  • The copying is apparently declared in the mobile version of the page: http://web.archive.org/web/20231012180026/https://m.facebook.com/profile.php?id=143684802312048
  • It looks like there was been much edit warring over "Uzazi" vs "Uziza", and this got caught in the middle of it, using "Uzazi" in the title but "Uziza" in the name
• Describes "Uziza" in a way that matches Piper guineense: https://www.nigerianfoodtv.com/difference-between-utaziokazi/
• Identifies "Fagara tessmannii", "Zanthoxylum tessmannii", "Uziza" (Nigeria), "Trade olon" (Liberia), "Ewoungea" (littoral region of Cameroon), and "Bongo" (littoral region of Cameroon) as synonyms: https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/and.13509

I'm sure there's more, but I'd rather not spend too much more time on this.

Solomon Ucko (talk) 18:20, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Anyway to run wikipedia userscript in Android browsers

Hi, Is there a way to run https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Ohconfucius/script/MOSNUM_dates in an Android phone or any alternatives for mobile edits. I want to convert mdy to dmy in an article. Anoop Bhatia (talk) 15:52, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

@Anoopspeaks: I don't have an Android phone, but this seemed to work on an iPhone:

1. Install the script (see User:Ohconfucius/script/MOSNUM dates#Installing the script)
2. On your phone, open the article in a browser in desktop mode (not mobile view)
3. Click the "Edit source" tab
4. In your Tools menu, click "DATES to dmy"
5. Review the changes and make any necessary tweaks
6. Click the "Publish changes" button.

For further questions about the scripts, I suggest posting at Wikipedia:Date formattings/script/MOSNUM dates/bugs. Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 16:40, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

@GoingBatty: Thanks, but clicking on "DATES to dmy" didn't changed anything on the editor. It act like null click. I tried it on Chrome and firefox mobile.Anoop Bhatia (talk) 17:02, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

@Anoopspeaks: Which article are you trying to edit? GoingBatty (talk) 17:18, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

@GoingBatty: Tamannaah Bhatia.Anoop Bhatia (talk) 17:26, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

@Anoopspeaks: I just made the edit on my iPhone in the Safari browser. Again, I suggest posting at Wikipedia:Date formattings/script/MOSNUM dates/bugs for assistance from more people who use the script. GoingBatty (talk) 19:29, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

@GoingBatty: Thanks 😊 —Anoop Bhatia (talk) 19:48, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

I am trying to correct false information on Wikipedia and someone keeps undoing my corrections

Dear friends, On this wikipedia page Stéphane Dujarric the photo is not that of Stephane Dujarric (who the page is about). The photo provided is of someone else. I tried to change it so many times, and eventually brought proof that that photo of the person on the page is a photo of a different man, eventually the friends in Wikipedia were convinced and accepted the changes. Now someone changed it back to where it was! I am not sure who is insisting on publishing false information on Wikipedia. Can I get some help please! Shrn.yassin (talk) 18:12, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Shrn.yassin Hello and welcome. I've fixed your link to a proper internal link so that readers are taken to the version of Wikipedia that they use(desktop or mobile/app).

Please do not edit war and continually restore your edit, even if it is correct. This is considered to be disruptive. Please first discuss your concerns on the article talk page, Talk:Stéphane Dujarric so that other editors may understand your reasoning. 331dot (talk) 18:20, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

@Shrn.yassin: Also, to see who is making certain edits to an article, click the "View history" tab at the top right of the article. Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 19:23, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

@Shrn.yassin: The photographs you uploaded aren't your own work. They are copyright violations. Therefore, they cannot be used in the article. ~Anachronist (talk) 01:38, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

When I uploaded the photo in wikimedia, I provided the name of the photographer who took the photo. I didn't say it's mine. Shrn.yassin (talk) 13:37, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Unfortunately, naming the photographer is not enough. You need to provide evidence that they have released the photograph they took under one of the licenses that is acceptable to Wikipedia Commons. You cannot do that on their behalf. If you are in contact with them, you can ask them to donate the material, using the method described at c:Commons:Volunteer_Response_Team Mike Turnbull (talk) 13:49, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Question about a certain article

Hello Teahouse,

This article, Joseph Boyse, has no citations for it. Would you happen to know what the best course of action is? Geko72290 (talk) 20:38, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

@Geko72290: Hi there! I added {{no footnotes}} to the top of the article and fixed the layout a bit. I suggest the following:

1. Move the existing footnotes from the bottom of the article to the appropriate locations within the article (and use them more than once if appropriate).
2. Add footnotes for the Dictionary of National Biography (maybe with {{cite DNB}}).
3. For any remaining unsourced sentences, find additional sources or tag them with {{citation needed}} or remove them.

Hope this helps! GoingBatty (talk) 20:57, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

company

if a company or organization has a logo out there, how do we at it to a page without violating copyright? i was trying to figure out how to add the organizational logo of Secure Community Network for example. It is on their website, but i don't know how we add it without it being a cr problem????? Iljhgtn (talk) 23:24, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

@Iljhgtn: It is possible by using the non-free content criteria. You can learn more at Wikipedia:Logos RudolfRed (talk) 23:39, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

@Iljhgtn:  Added by following these steps.

1. I went to their website.
2. I scrolled down to where the logo is in the middle of the page, right clicked on it, and chose "Open image in new tab"
3. From that page, I right clicked on it, and chose "Save image as", and saved it to my PC.
4. I opened my default editor, and reduced the size to 220px.
5. I went to Wikipedia:File upload wizard and clicked "Upload a non-free file"
6. I uploaded the file from my PC, filled out the fields, and clicked "Upload"
7. The wizard created File:Secure Community Network.png
8. I edited the Secure Community Network article to add the logo to the infobox.

Hope this helps, and happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 01:47, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

It's done. Pocket Noodle (talk) 02:47, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

this is super useful information. i want to save this conversation somehow so i can refer back to it when i need this again. thank you for helping me Iljhgtn (talk) 14:47, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

i added this thread to my list of tools here, let me know if I missed anything. User:Iljhgtn/Tools Iljhgtn (talk) 14:54, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Blitzes.

Although I've participated in a Blitz before, I've never really understood the rules 100% clearly. (Like if you play a game without home rules for the first time, you understand the basic objective, but the rules are a bit disorienting.)Could someone *sort of* simplify the rules for me? Thanks, JustAnotherUndertaleFrantic -- Talk 23:52, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

@JustAnotherUndertaleFrantic: Do you mean Wikipedia:WikiProject Guild of Copy Editors/Blitzes? If so, I would ask at its talk page. ‍ ‍ Relativity ‍ ‍ 00:00, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Confusion about Iron Lung "Bibliography" heading

On the manual of style it seems to say multiple times that a Bibliography heading should be avoided, MOS:BIB. On the Iron lung page It has this heading and then lists a bunch of books that mention polio. I'm not sure what this section should be renamed too or if it should exist at all. My best guess is that it should go into the see also section? Thank you for the help Knaughty1234 (talk) 00:09, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

You probably want to use the Further Reading header. WelpThatWorked (talk) 00:18, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Thank you, I will do that --Knaughty1234 (talk) 00:35, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Editing the Chicago page

Hey guys! I'm trying to add an extension to the chicago Wiki page, However, I am unable to as I cannot publish any changes, is there a way to do that or do I need some admin approval? Imoutofchoices (talk) 00:40, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Chicago is only semi-protected, so you should be able to edit so long as you are logged in. Double check you are on the tab with the editor. If you are logged in, are you getting any particular message when you try to submit or does the button have no effect? WelpThatWorked (talk) 00:45, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Very Dumb Question

So uh this just came out of my mind but who has the most wikipedia edits? SupersaurYT (talk) 02:27, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

@supersauryt: wikipedia:list of Wikipedians by number of edits ltbdl (talk) 02:35, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Thanks! SupersaurYT (talk) 02:37, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

SupersaurYT, please be aware that raw edit count is not an accurate assessment of how useful or productive an editor is. Many of the most prolific accounts are bots instead of human beings. Other editors use semi-automated tools to make a large number of relatively minor edits in rapid succession. Thst's all useful if done right. On the other hand, I use no automated tools and ponder every edit that I make. I recently hit the 100,000 edit benchmark. It took me over 14 years of editing at least a little almost every single day. In my view, quality is more important than quantity. Cullen328 (talk) 08:58, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

SupersaurYT For an entirely different criteria for contributions, Wikipedia:List of Wikipedians by good article nominations lists editors by successful Good Article nominations. David notMD (talk) 09:29, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Where to go to get help with a poorly written article?

I've been adjusting/removing bits of articles that are poorly formatted or simply don't make sense whenever I see them, but with Raa Atoll I don't even know where to start! Is there a dedicated area where I can go to get help? MikuFan39 (talk) 03:42, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

@MikuFan39: Welcome to the Teahouse! Talk:Raa Atoll is that dedicated area for that article. Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 03:53, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Teahouse "ask question" stuck on "loading"

Evidently this is a "bug" I keep falling for.

I start at "Wikipedia:Teahouse". Instead of just clicking "Ask a question", I click on "Question forum", then I realize I should have clicked on "Ask a question". and it displays "Loading ..." ... forever!

Was I just lucky to discover this tonight? Or is it a well-known bug that's been around forever?

Just in case it matters, I'm running Chrome on a Windows laptop. Fabrickator (talk) 07:28, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Hi @Fabrickator. I'm running Chrome on a Windows 64 bit PC and tried a test post using the route you described. It worked OK for me with no problems - see 'Test post' two below this one (now removed). Do you get the same issue after doing a reboot of your device? Nick Moyes (talk) 08:47, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Hi, do you have any kind of adblocker / scriptblocker / content blocker plugins installed on your browser? The "Ask a question" button seems to conflict with some plugins. Ca ^{talk to me!} 09:43, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

I have noticed that I can reproduce this in Edge as well. I must be logged in, and the last thing I do before clicking on "Ask a question" is to click on "Question Forum". I'm pretty sure I'm not using an adblocker or similar, though just the fact that I have to be logged in would seem to suggest that it's something peculiar to my user profile. Fabrickator (talk) 09:49, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

I did have Ghostery ad blocker active in Chrome when I tested this issue, and it didn't seem to cause a problem. I suggest waiting 24 hrs to see if other technically-minded Hosts can offer advice here. Then, if not resolved, it could be worth asking at WP:VPT. Nick Moyes (talk) 10:00, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

"Historical Dictionary of School Segregation" external links spam

I have seen a bunch of recently-added links for "Historical Dictionary of School Segregation and Desegregation: The American Experience" ... appears to be about 20 such links, mostly in "external links" section of pages, within the past 24 hours.

1. Does this count as spam? 2. Is there someplace I should report this, or should I fix it myself? 3. Should I be more aggressive, pointing out that the same user has been doing similar spammy stuff for a couple of months or more, and take it upon myself to delete all of the other spammy links this user has added? Fabrickator (talk) 07:39, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

I assume you mean the edits by User:Rjensen. They look fine to me, not what I would call WP:SPAM. Shantavira|^{feed me} 08:34, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

In the last few weeks I have been creating or expanding articles on "education in xxx" where xxx is a US state or major city. School segregation is a major subtheme and I have found the book "Historical Dictionary of School Segregation and Desegregation: The American Experience" is a very useful scholarly reference. See online copy Its author Jeffrey Raffel is a well-regarded professor at the U of Delaware; we have never been in contact in any way. I have zero connection or conflict of interest to any of these "Education in xxx" articles or to any of the scholarly books and articles in the "Further reading." I have followed the rules regarding spam especially: " Spam is the inappropriate addition of content to Wikipedia with the intention of promoting or publicizing an outside organization, individual or idea." Rjensen (talk) 15:03, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

WP:Spam#External link spamming provides a more nuanced interpretation of the situation, e.g. repeatedly adding links will in most cases result in all of them being removed. Of course, I'm not alleging that you're obtaining any sort of personal gain or advantage, but adding links to as many articles as you can rationalize is maybe somewhat counterproductive. FWIW, this was already included in Bibliography of the history of education in the United States.

While this source can surely be a helpful for relevant content, that can probably be said about hundreds of other sources, and it may be better or worse than those other sources. It just seems to be that one of the "themes" regarding "further reading", "bibliographies", and the like is that we should avoid overdoing it. If we really want to have extensive bibliographies, then I'm fine with that, but our policy ought to clearly reflect that. Fabrickator (talk) 21:06, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

After working with that book I concluded it was the single best source available for our readers on the topic of school segregation at the local level. So I added it to the numerous articles dealing with racial segregation. In university history classes (and in many high schools) the students have to write research papers, and many turn to Wikipedia for help in finding useful sources. Professors do not want them to depend on the text in Wiki articles, but they do encourage them to use our bibliographies. I had those students in mind. If instead they go to Google Scholar, they will find over 600,000 links! listed here As for my academic experience in making judgments about the usefulness of history books see Richard J. Jensen. Back in the 1970s I had major grants from the National Institute of Education to study the history of education in USA; to this day I try to follow the academic literature on that topic. Rjensen (talk) 22:50, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

COI

Hello all Respected Wikipedians im here back with one more new Question I work as an spot boy in the Hindi and Marathi film industry, due to which I know many of the artists of the Hindi and Marathi film industry and their cast and crew very well, that why I have writen about them on Wikipedia.But for this I do not take any money from anyone, whenever I have time, I contribute it to Wikipedia.So does this come under WP:COI? Rajmama (talk) 10:14, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Hello @Rajmama, and welcome to the Teahouse. Having a Conflict of Interest through knowing someone is nothing to be ashamed of, but for the sake of openesss, it should be declared. So, yes, is the answer to your question, but please don't let that stop you! Textual content you add still needs to be sourced from properly published media, and not from things you "happen to know" or get told by them. If it cannot be Verified from a Reliable Source that someone else can check from the other side of the world, then it really should not go on Wikipedia at all.

If you make a small edit, you could simple include a COI note in your Edit Summary (e.g. "COI note: I do know this person but have only added neutral content based on published sources") If you are thinking of making many larger sets of edits about a notable actor, you should follow the instructions at WP:COI and add a COI template to your userpage linking to that article.

Have you considered the great position you are in to take and upload some stunning photos of your own of these actors to Wikimedia Commons? That is not a conflict of interest at all, yet could be incredibly helpful where an article has no suitable image.

Does this response address your concerns? Regards from the UK, Nick Moyes (talk) 10:53, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

@Nick MoyesIf I use that COI template in my user page, it will not mean that I am a paid contributor? Rajmama (talk) 18:23, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

@Rajmama No, it doesn't automatically mean that. If I chose to write an article about my (famous and notable) next door neighbour, I would have a WP:COI because we know each other well, and I might only select sources that put him in a good light. I would not be being paid, though. If I wrote about my workplace (even in my own time) I would definitely have a COI, and I guess I am taking a salary so I am being paid. Even paid editing is permitted if it is declared. However undeclared paid editing is forbidden and editors get blocked when they are found out. So openness is the key, I would suggest. Nick Moyes (talk) 18:31, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

One more thing I created a draft Sangramsingh Thakur some months ago, and it had declined three times because of sources, but I added proper sources and moved to Article Space, but CNMALL41 nominated this article for deletion. but I'm told to remove it from the article to draft space instead of deletion. So let me know it is possible to remove the article to draft space instead of deletion. Rajmama (talk) 19:51, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Citation with a title containing |

Hi. If one wants to cite a source whose title contains the vertical bar character, |, is it possible to include this in the title, considering the same character is used to separate parameters for citations? (e.g. between access-date, title, url, citation type). ButterCashier (talk) 10:46, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

@ButterCashier Great question! I went away and checked, and it looks like you would need to use the {{pipe}} template to create the | character without it being treated as a genuine pipe or vertical bar which acts as a field separator.

There is further advice here and at Template:Pipe. I hope this helps, Nick Moyes (talk) 10:59, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Mahsa Amini protests

The demonstrations are over. But in the infobox of the article it's still in progress! (That article is about demonstrations)

Of course the "Woman, Life, Freedom movement" is still alive by not wearing hijab in public places.

We should have a separate article for the movement and put an end date to the protests article which is about demonstrations (just like the Persian Wikipedia articles). Aminabzz (talk) 10:57, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

@Aminabzz Welcome to the Teahouse. I see you are already contributing to a discussion in absolutely the correct place over at Talk:Mahsa Amini protests#Are the protests over?. So there is little point asking the same question here. Please continue over there until a consensus amongst editors is reached. Thank you. Nick Moyes (talk) 11:04, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Able to edit from Windows laptop but not from iPad?

When I edit from my Windows laptop I am able to edit as normal. But when I switch to my iPad it's saying that it's blocked. Anything I should do to edit from the iPad? I am using them both on the same network. MaximumCruiser2 🚢 (talk) 13:51, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Hi, @MaximumCruiser2; my tablet is Android but I have similar problems because the Visual Editor is not designed for tablets. It isn't blocked for me, but it works poorly. When editing with the tablet, I switch from Desktop View (at the bottom of the page) to Mobile View. This also brings in the Source Editor which is inconvenient for some purposes but I guess it will have to work this way until the software is improved. This is why I, too, do most my editing on the Windows laptop. Far as I know, it seems to be difficult to make editing software for tablets that's able to work well with Wikipedia features. Jim.henderson (talk) 14:05, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

@MaximumCruiser2: Welcome to the Teahouse! Have you tried logging out of the iPad and logging back in? GoingBatty (talk) 15:05, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

@MaximumCruiser2 ... and have you tried accessing Wikipedia on a different browser, or ensured you were already logged in before trying to edit Wikipedia? If you aren't logged in when editing, then either your own IP address, or that of any VPN your browser might use, could also be blocked. Perhaps you could specify exactly what the message states, and at what point in the logging on/editing process you saw it? Nick Moyes (talk) 15:27, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Hi @Nick Moyes, what I noticed now is that in Safari, I saw "there are multiple blocks against your IP address" in chrome and Wikipedia app everything is OK and no block appears. I guess if I edit from iPad I will just use the app then. Thanks! MaximumCruiser2 🚢 (talk) 23:28, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

How do I get someone to review an article?

I found an article on here that is not reviewed (I have installed a script for that), but is still up for some reason. How can I find a page reviewer to check it? Davest3r08 ^(talk) 14:01, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Welcome. A new page reviewer will review it eventually, making it indexed by search engines. Feel free to improve it in the meantime. Happy editing! NotAGenious (talk) 14:35, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

No stashed content

Can somebody please fix the "No stashed content found" glitch? Please? TDmile567 (talk) 14:55, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

@TDmile567: Welcome to the Teahouse! I suggest posting your request at the Wikipedia:Village Pump (technical) with as much details as you have so others can try to replicate your issue. GoingBatty (talk) 15:08, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

The best articles to start editing?

Hello! Recently, I have really started to try my hands at editing! And of course, editing syntax and grammar is easy and has been very fun. However, I would like to eventually try harder edits, like adding more to short pages or cleaning up messy pages. I wanted to know what pages would both benefit from this, while being relatively easy to research for beginners. Thank you! Iatethecheese (talk) 16:08, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

@Iatethecheese: Welcome to the Teahouse! At the Community portal, the Help out section shows various ways that you may contribute, in addition the syntax and grammar you mention. Best, JoeNMLC (talk) 16:50, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

I'm glad you're having a good time. You might also benefit from WP:TASK. NotAGenious (talk) 17:43, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Hello Iatethecheese. I have to be interested in an article to have the ambition to edit it, so I look for articles on what I like. I often come across a stub article and want to share more of the story, so I start hunting up reference books or other reliable sources, and decide what should be added. Or an article reads well, but most of it is unreferenced, so another reference hunt begins to provide good sources for what others have written. (I have a small collection of reference books on favorite topics.) Since I’m researching what is important to me it’s not work to improve an article, it’s looking up things that I want to know more about, and I assume many others will be interested in what I’m able to find. That’s how I go about doing my small part in improving Wikipedia. Karenthewriter (talk) 19:31, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

How to change an obviously biased article?

I understand that perfect neutrality is impossible, but when editors like me try to nudge certain clearly slanted pages toward neutrality, our edits are — if the page is important — simply reverted. They're not modified. Appropriate or usable bits aren't kept. There's no respect or consideration, just an assumption of malice and total reversal of the article — "be bold" really comes with a big asterisk: Unless you have the slightest ideological or political disagreement with the lean of the article and try and move it forward more balance, even just towards neutrality — then all edits by you, even the most banal, will be deleted in bulk, you slapped with sanctions or a total block if you argue (and that's after we get done condescending to you).

It's just… So incredibly frustrating. As soon as your politics are detectable as somewhat dissident from whatever the Wikipedia vibe is, you're just persona-non-grata and an idiot to be dismissed and buried with red-tape excuses.

Like even here, I feel certain this question won't be taken in good faith at all. I'm even worried about getting blocked for asking it. But I'll have enough good faith to post it anyway and see what happens.

It's just so tempting to give up. To effectively block myself. To simply refrain from improving any of the most important articles, stick to adding a few commas here and there on more trivial matters.

I know Wikipedia doesn't want to be this way. It doesn't want to be a space where new editors are hazed. And it definitely doesn't want to be an ideological echo chamber.

Help!

Help me help you not continue to become one. Destrylevigriffith (talk) 18:06, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Hello, Destrylevigriffith. I recommend that you refrain from ranting and axe-grinding and POV pushing, and instead focus on discussing actual, specific reliable sources and how to best summarize what they say. Also, write more concisely. Do not waste people's time with endless philosophizing and speculating. Get to the point. Cullen328 (talk) 18:24, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

@Destrylevigriffith You would need to give WP:DIFFS to demonstrate your genuine concerns if you expect a response to the above statement. Thanks. Nick Moyes (talk) 21:04, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

How To Improve My Article, I've Followed the Submission Guidelines.

My article was denied about a professional hockey player turned musician.

For the reasons below: in-depth (not just passing mentions about the subject) - all of the articles were based on the subject and not just in passing. reliable - actual newspapers online, and NHL websites. independent of the subject - they were not written by the subject or anyone associated with them. Thecodmother (talk) 18:28, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Hello, Thecodmother. Is your draft about a rock band or a former hockey player? It has to be one or the other, but frankly, neither seems notable to me. Remove external links from the body. Remove the detail about the record label and its founder. Format your bare URLs into informative references. See Referencing for beginners. Cullen328 (talk) 18:40, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Hi!

It's a musician who was a former professional hockey player. Thecodmother (talk) 18:42, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

also not notable to you may be notable to others, is it not subjective? what makes one pro hockey player more notable than the other? one band more notable than the other as well? Thecodmother (talk) 18:43, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

@Thecodmother: Wikipedia has inclusion criteria called "notability" for sportspeople and musicians, as well as a general notability guide. Please read these and improve Draft:Boston Levi to demonstrate how Levi meets any of these criteria. Thanks, and happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 18:57, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

I understand that, Thecodmother, but you frame your draft as being about a rock band. Then you swerve to focusing on one member of the band, and his past career, ignoring the other members of the band. Articles should be about one topic, not two topics. Also, the NHL source is not significant coverage. It is just a bunch of statistics with no prose.

As for what makes one rock band notable and another not notable, it is the depth of coverage in multiple independent reliable sources. Notable bands have hit records, tour extensively, win awards, and are extensively covered by independent media outlets. Same for notable hockey players. They play for major teams, have long careers, and are written about extensively in reliable sources. Cullen328 (talk) 18:55, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Rogan article

Joe Rogan article being continuously reverted even over small, blandly factual edits — appears to be malicious (reverting any edits by me) or an unconscious edit war by editor Bon courage.

Assuming they mean well, their persistent reversions of my edits to the Neil Young section and Rogan against trans men in women's sports section, make no sense.

Next steps? Arbitration? Editor appears to be preserving the article as-is without regard to edit quality (effectively admin-locking the article). Destrylevigriffith (talk) 18:49, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Destrylevigriffith, please be aware that Bon courage is not an administrator. You must gain consensus for any changes you want to make. Discuss specific language accurately summarizing specific reliable sources. Lengthy, unfocused talk page ranting accomplishes nothing. Cullen328 (talk) 19:13, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Yes, and note there's a thread open at WP:FT/N#Joe Rogan: controversies or misinformation? to get wider input even. Bon courage (talk) 19:47, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Why do you keep reverting the blandly factual edits that I made?

I already made my case when I made the edits to the Neil Young section and the Rogan against trans women in women's sports section. Anybody who cares about actually following Wikipedia policy will go look up those edits, see that my reasoning is perfectly within Wikipedia policy, that the language is exactly neutral, and tell Bon courage to leave them be.

I'm done falling for this game. Destrylevigriffith (talk) 21:54, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

And anybody who understands how Wikipedia works will realise that being right is not enough. Wikipedia works by consensus, and if another editor disagrees with your edit, it is up to you to try to persuade them, or (more generally) to try and achieve consensus. Asserting that you are right and they are wrong is not usually an effective strategy: see WP:BRD. ColinFine (talk) 22:25, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Draft article changes

Hello, I just completely rewrote an old draft article that was never published. The entire thing is different. Will Wikipedia know to reconsider it? or will it just sit dormant? 1236now (talk) 19:24, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. I've added the information to allow you to submit the draft. 331dot (talk) 19:26, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Do you mean that you were somehow see my draft? 1236now (talk) 19:49, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

@1236now: Yes, we can see your Draft:Sallie Ellington Middleton. GoingBatty (talk) 19:57, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

oh, ok thank. you 1236now (talk) 20:27, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

@1236now: Before you submit the draft for review, please fix the footnotes. See WP:EASYREFBEGIN for assistance. Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 19:37, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Including addresses in articles

It strikes me as odd whenever I'm reading Wikipedia pages for a business or organisation and it lists the address of the organisation. A recent example I came across was on the article for Yeshiva V'Kollel Beis Moshe Chaim, where it reads "The yeshiva is located at a converted Howard Johnson located on the corner of Alton Road and 41st Street."

I've tried to find any pages about this in the MOS or elsewhere and haven't been able to find anything, so I was wondering if anybody could provide some insight as to whether or not it's recommended to have (non-notable) addresses included in Wikipedia articles. Thanks! – Insincere Giraffe (talk) 23:33, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

Hello, Insincere Giraffe. I took a fresh look at five articles that I have written concerning buildings. They are 1973 Miami Beach firebombing and Cayetano Juarez Adobe and Holy Virgin Cathedral and 1986 San Francisco fireworks disaster and Whoa Nellie Deli. In three of five cases, I gave street addresses. In the other two cases, I described the locations with precise descriptions of street intersections similar to your example. No one has ever objected, and to be frank, I do not see any problem with including addresses, as long as an address is not associated with promotional content. Cullen328 (talk) 00:00, 14 October 2023 (UTC)

Notability

I was helping out an IP with articles related to the Sankebetsu brown bear incident (namely Moritake Kimura ja:木村盛武, Mika Muramatsu ja:村松美香, Yellow Fangs ja:リメインズ 美しき勇者たち, Heikichi Yamamoto ja:山本兵吉, Haruyoshi Ōkawa ja:大川春義). I don't think any of them are notable, but I was wondering if I could get another opinion. Thanks, ayakanaa ( t · c ) 00:36, 14 October 2023 (UTC)

Avoiding Mistakes

Does anyone have tips on how to avoid making mistakes when helping on Wikipedia? Cwater1 (talk) 00:45, 14 October 2023 (UTC)