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Something Fishy in Camp Wiganishi

I find it interesting that I have submitted for review, twice now (after an edit), an article on musician Scott Nolan following as a template similar already published articles on musicians of a similar stature. Each time, the day before having the article rejected I've been approached by persons telling me that my article was rejected and offering their services to help. I let this sit for a bit but today was contacted by a person offering to help me fix the article and post it directly through his moderator account. Seems to me like WikiPedia has been hijacked. WPGIan (talk) 22:22, 24 January 2024 (UTC)

It's not a hijacking, but it is a scam. More information here. Valereee (talk) 22:36, 24 January 2024 (UTC)

Pray tell us more, WPGIan. Maybe start by choosing the funniest example and quoting it in toto. (A self-styled "moderator" sounds promisingly incompetent.) -- Hoary (talk) 00:33, 25 January 2024 (UTC)

"Declined" (what the Reviewers posted) is less severe the "Rejected". In a second note, I recommend deleteing the Tours and Festivals table. David notMD (talk) 04:06, 25 January 2024 (UTC)

Do you really think the tours and festival tables are the root of the issue? There's a website where fans and bands list their shows: https://www.concertarchives.org/bands/scott-nolan?page=1#concert-table WPGIan (talk) 20:15, 25 January 2024 (UTC)

You should remove all citations to concertarchives.org and any content that is solely supported by such references. That site hosts user-generated content and is therefore not reliable. The site is also mentioned here. CodeTalker (talk) 00:18, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

@WPGIan, everything you post on Wikipedia can be seen by other people, including dishonest people, and if you give them access to personal information so they can contact you off-site and ask for money this way, they'll do it. Nothing has been hijacked, this is just how Wikipedia - and people - work. 57.140.16.1 (talk) 14:54, 25 January 2024 (UTC)

Thank you. Fortunately I am cautious by nature and have seen this sort of thing before on other platforms. What was different in this case is that I started receiving these inquiries before my submissions were rejected. It seemed they had inside knowledge. I wasn't surprised then to be offered assistance by a 'moderator' who, for a fee, would approve the article directly through their moderator account. I'm a WikiPedia noob so wonder if that might be a thing. WPGIan (talk) 19:54, 25 January 2024 (UTC)

Not a thing. No ethical administrator would contact you asking for money, and no knowledgeable editor would call administrators "moderators". Valereee (talk) 00:46, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

@WPGIan, I am wondering whether the supposed 'moderator' is just going through the Articles For Creation listings and sending spam messages to everyone, knowing that a lot of drafts will be declined. That would explain how they seemed to have inside knowledge; it's just a numbers game, like so many scams, and they're hoping new editors whose drafts do get declined will fall for their scam. I'm very happy you saw through the ruse!

Like the other editors who have replied to you, I can confidently agree that any administrator/'moderator' who engaged in this kind of practice would be very swiftly relieved of their duties and banned from en-Wiki. Wikipedia has extremely strict rules about paid editing and the community keeps a very close eye out for it! StartGrammarTime (talk) 07:15, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

Thank you. WPGIan (talk) 21:12, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

@WPGIan, there is no need to have a 'moderator' account (which doesn't even exist) to approve articles; in fact, if an admin started stepping in to approve iffy drafts which had been previously declined - not to mention rejected - a lot of side-eye would be directed their way very quickly! I agree with StartGrammarTime above, they're probably just watching the queue, spamming anyone they can contact, and hoping the odds bring a few marks their way. 57.140.16.1 (talk) 18:40, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for your thoughts on this. Makes me feel better to have been cautious. WPGIan (talk) 21:12, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

Link articles into "languages"

Hi, I want to add an article, Ilya Oberyshyn, with the Russian, Ukrainian, and Estonian "other language". This could be seen when you press languages in the Ukrainian or Russian version of the article linked in the page above. How do I do it? Thanks, Wikiexplorationandhelping (talk) 03:03, 25 January 2024 (UTC)

@Wikiexplorationandhelping: When you view the article, in the top right corner you should see a drop down menu titled "Add languages". ~Anachronist (talk) 03:25, 25 January 2024 (UTC)

I don't see it, unfortunately. I am trying to add the page into Wikidata items. Otherwise the other languages do not show when a user presses "view this page in other languages". Wikiexplorationandhelping (talk) 17:26, 25 January 2024 (UTC)

@Wikiexplorationandhelping I can diagnose the problem but as I'm not an expert with Wikidata, someone else will have to fix it. The article Ilya Oberyshyn links to Q124303574 on Wikidata. However, the other-language articles all link to Q4329162. The solution will be to merge Q124303574 into Q4329162. Mike Turnbull (talk) 16:12, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

@Wikiexplorationandhelping @Michael D. Turnbull: I've merged the two items so now the interlanguage links should work properly. --bjh21 (talk) 17:13, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

Ok, appreciate your help! Wikiexplorationandhelping (talk) 19:29, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

How about a general answer for those of us who do not see the drop-down menu. Years ago, it was easy to link to other languages. Now, I can't figure it out. At the moment, I'm trying to link the English article on Heinrich Steinhöwel to the existing articles in other languages, but I'd like to know for the future as well. Kdammers (talk) 21:34, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

@Kdammers: In the "Tools" menu, you can click "Add interlanguage links". There is more info at Help:Interlanguage links. GoingBatty (talk) 21:39, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Where is the "Tools" menu?Kdammers (talk) 21:45, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

@Kdammers: At the top right of every page to the right of to "View History". GoingBatty (talk) 21:51, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

I am on a laptop. I don't see a "View History" tab. On the top right, I see "log out."Kdammers (talk) 21:57, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

@Kdammers: I'm on a laptop too. On this page, the "Tools" menu is to the right of "Read", "Edit source", and "View history". You can see the "Tools" menu on this screenshot if you zoom in and look to the right of "Read", "View source", and "View history". GoingBatty (talk) 22:23, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

What is going on? Even on the screen shot, I don't see what you're talking about. I see "Read," "Edit" [not "Edit source"], "History" [without "Edit"] and a star that doesn't yield anything that I can interpret at as adding language links. Kdammers (talk) 22:33, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

I've circled the "Tools" menu.

@Kdammers: Check out the cropped version of the screenshot I've added to the right here. I've circled the "Tools" menu for you.

Maybe we're using different skins. On Preferences > Appearance, what skin are you using? (I'm using Vector (2022).) On what page do you see "Read", "Edit", "History" and the star? GoingBatty (talk) 22:53, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

MonoBook Kdammers (talk) 23:29, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Okeh, I've changed to Vector (2000). I now see "Tools," but I don't see anything about adding links to other languages. Where should it be? Kdammers (talk) 23:35, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

@Kdammers: In MonoBook, go to the bottom left corner of the screen under "languages" and click the pencil icon that states "Add links". In Vector (2022), click on the word "Tools" and then scroll down the menu and click on "Add interlanguage links". GoingBatty (talk) 23:46, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

NOW (maybe a refreshing issue?), I see stuff about adding language links. At the bottom left, there is "Language links are at the top of the page." When I went up there, under "Add languages," I clicked on "Open language settings," I got something with only "Display language

Change the language of menus. Content language will not be affected." and the original page. Kdammers (talk) 00:21, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

@Kdammers: Now that you're using Vector (2022), do you see the Tools menu? If so, do you see "Add interlanguage links". If so, how does that work for you? GoingBatty (talk) 00:34, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Not very well! I typed in "German"in the language box, but how do I type the page name in the page box?Kdammers (talk) 00:40, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

@Kdammers: "German" isn't a valid value. Try typing "dewiki" instead, and then you'll be able to type in the "Page" field. GoingBatty (talk) 01:36, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Thanks. (How is an editor supposed to know that the English word "Language" calls for a non-English entry?) I appreciate your patience. This was ridiculously complicated, with all sorts of stumbling blocks that were not present ten or so years ago. I hope any easier set-up can be put in place. Kdammers (talk) 02:05, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

@Kdammers: By typing slowly in the "Language" field and seeing the suggestions pop up? GoingBatty (talk) 02:07, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Sam Williams (record producer)

hello there, i need to reinstate Sam's page, as he is a client of mine. But very time I make an edit it gets removed and redirected to Mark Gardener's page - why? I am so confused - can anyone help me to add some info on Sam and remove the redirect? Thank you, Laura Laura eley (talk) 08:25, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

Laura eley Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. First, you must formally disclose your relationship with Mr. Williams; please see the paid editing policy for instructions- this is a Terms of Use requirement. Instructions have also been placed on your user talk page.

As the edit summary of the removal indicates(which you may have missed, it's easy to do so), you should create a draft and then submit it for a review, please visit the Article Wizard to do so. It will need to be very different from what you wrote, though. Creating an article is the most difficult thing to do on Wikipedia, even without a conflict of interest as you have. With one it's even harder- you need to set aside everything you know about Mr. Williams and all materials he puts out, and only write summarizing what independent reliable sources with significant coverage choose to say about him and how he meets the definition of a notable creative professional narrowly, or a notable person more broadly. References need to be in-line with the text, see Referencing for Beginners. 331dot (talk) 08:43, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

I have restored an earlier version of an existing article about him: Sam Williams (record producer). Because he is a client of yours, you must first declare your paid connection (see WP:PAID, and you are prohibited from editing the article. Instead, you must propose a series of modest-sized additions or changes on the Talk page, with each request containing properly formatted references. David notMD (talk) 10:12, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

@David notMD, that article is really crappy from the WP:N perspective as currently written. IMO, restoring it as such was not a good idea. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 10:19, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

There seems to be a coordinated effort to edit about this man, see Wikipedia:Help Desk#Sam Williams ( UK Record Producer/Artist) Page Deletion. 331dot (talk) 10:20, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

He may be notable, but off-Google digging could be necessary. Here's a BBC bare mention:[1]. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 10:27, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

The article was created in 2016. At one point back in 2016 it had a lot more content (dozens of albums produced) - subsequently deleted for lack of references. Laura eley clearly has access to information. If she wants to earn her pay then she must work via the Talk page route, but in my opinion the version I restored can be the starting point. David notMD (talk) 10:33, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

You could have put it draftspace for later submission. Oh well, there's always afd if things don't improve. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 10:49, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

It's a Stub now, and I agree could be AfD'd if not improved. The Sam Williams website does show he produced more than 20 albums, so it should not be impossible to confirm his notability. David notMD (talk) 10:58, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

He is definitely mentioned here and there, but I can't find anything substantial about him, except perhaps this (assuming it's RS). M.Bitton (talk) 13:55, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

I started a thread on sources at Talk:Sam Williams (record producer). The Stephen Budd Music Management is clearly not independent, so it doesn't help with WP:N. The Billboard is the best I've seen so far. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 14:04, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

Nominated for deletion. Refs 3 and 5 are to his website, so not contributing to notability. Ref 4 text mentions him as in a band, not as producer. David notMD (talk) 02:00, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

References

Site now requires login: dead url?

There is a URL in a web reference in an article that now requires a login to view the page. It is not "dead" per se, and so I am wondering if it is appropriate to set |url-status=dead since it is "effectively" dead? This would swap the default displayed link in the ref popup/References section to use the archive url instead of the "dead" url. I am adding the |archive-url= either way. Kimen8 (talk) 13:49, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

@Kimen8 See the template documentation at {{cite web}}, for example. If the URL has become paywalled or requires login, it is not "dead" and that parameter should not be used. You can of course archive the URL anyway, as that is helpful if the archive link gives access to our readers directly without login or payment. For journals cited via their Digital object identifier, there are various parameters that can be used to state the exact conditions for access using |doi-access= (see {{cite journal}}). Mike Turnbull (talk) 15:55, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

Thanks! Kimen8 (talk) 20:17, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

If the reference doesn't have a digital object identifier you can still use the various URL access indicators, as documented at WP:URLACCESS. Reconrabbit 20:38, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

Raymond Dawson, Sinologist 1923-2002

My brothers and I had discovered that our father was missing from the Wikipedia list of UK Sinologists so we set too using a couple of obituaries from an ex-colleague who has himself since died and an obituary from the Times. We have completed an article which we hope would be suitable for an entry to the list but now that I have logged into Wikipedia it seems a bit complicated. Would it be possible to send the article to someone to have a look at? With thanks Quartetplayer (talk) 16:55, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

Hi @Quartetplayer, welcome to the Teahouse. If you create Draft:Raymond Dawson (just follow that link, paste in your content and click publish), then folks here at the Teahouse will be able to look at it and give you some pointers. A warning, just in case: please do not copy content directly from any of those obituaries, lest you wander unwittingly into copyright violation territory. Just include summaries of what they say, followed by citations. 57.140.16.1 (talk) 17:17, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

Hello, Quartetplayer, and welcome to the Teahouse. I'm afraid you have strayed into a difficult area here: while editing Wikipedia in general is not too hard, writing a new article is one of the most challenging tasks, and an article about somebody you know or knew even harder.

My standard advice to new editors is to not even think about create an article until they have spent a few months learning the craft of editing Wikipedia, and in particular learning about verifiability, reliable sources, neutral point of view, and notability. I get that you probably don't want to do this, as your concern is getting your father into Wikipedia; but to be honest, if you try it too soon you are likely to have a frustrating time, and it is possible that your purpose is actually contrary to that of Wikipedia - if your father does not in fact meet Wikipedia's criteria for notability, then your effort will all be in vain.

I see that you recognise that sources are important; but an obituary from an ex-colleague is probably not an independent source, and so will not count towards establishing notability. ColinFine (talk) 19:05, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

Are external links references?

Do external links count as a general source for the entire article, or are they simply an extra little thing you can check out? For example, on this article, it's tagged as needing additional sources to be verifiable despite the fact it has no references or citations meaning it should have the unreferenced tag instead. However, there is one external link to the official website. I don't know whether it counts as a source or if the person who put the maintenance tag made a mistake. TheWikiToby (talk) 16:57, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

@TheWikiToby "an extra little thing you can check out" pretty much hits the nail on the head. However, in this particular case, you can probably use parts of that website as a WP:ABOUTSELF source, adding it as citations.. It doesn't help with WP:N, but it's good for stuff like Ihor Tsependa being rector. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 17:25, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

Sometimes I use the external links section to list things that may be useful as references later. I do this especially for articles that I create and develop. Eventually I remove these external links after I have incorporated them as citations. ~Anachronist (talk) 17:59, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

Sometimes those might go as General references, emphasizing that they are refs for the topic and might be cited during future expansion of the article. DMacks (talk) 18:10, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

According to the guideline at WP:General references, a general reference is already a citation that supports content, but is not an inline reference. I put things that could be useful references later in a WP:Further reading section. StarryGrandma (talk) 21:06, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

It would be nice to see BC and AD dates everywhere on Wikipedia.

So full disclaimer, I'm a Christian. And I realize that not everybody is a Christian. But it would be nice if there was an option on Wikipedia, to change the preference in settings in your account, to format all dates to the dating format you prefer, and doing so would update the way dates appear on every page throughout Wikipedia.

Currently in account settings, under preferences, you can set the format of dates, but it does not give the option to control if it shows BC and AD, instead of BCE and CE, or vice versa. NeedHymn (talk) 18:25, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

Awesome idea, I’m a Muslim and I want to see Hijri dates. Cometkeiko (talk) 18:31, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

I've heard worse ideas, though whatever gadget is installed needs to see stuff like "ad hoc", people named "ad-din" etc. Consider asking someone to make you a WP:JAVASCRIPT, Wikipedia:Village pump (idea lab) maybe the place to ask first. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 18:38, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

I guess that wouldn't hurt. And yes, you can probably get a fairly simple JavaScript program to do it for you. 🌺 Cremastra (talk) 22:36, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

...and I think I've figured out how to do it! @NeedHymn and Gråbergs Gråa Sång: the code here, based off the examples at W3 schools, replaces all instances of the string "CE" with "AD". It could hopefully be expanded to turn "C.E." to "A.D.", and so on. Doing Hijri dates is harder, because you have to actually convert the numbers (thus somehow converting the string into a numerical value and then back into a string) but someone who actually understands JS should be able to do it. NeedHymn, you can copy the code into your common.js and it should work. 🌺 Cremastra (talk) 22:50, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

I haven't tested this, but it seems to me that that code is going to change every "CE" to "AD", regardless of whether it's part of another word. So "CENTER" would be changed to "ADNTER", "ANNOUNCE" would be changed to "ANNOUNAD", etc. At the least you'd want to make the regular expression be "/\bCE\b/g", but as Gråbergs Gråa Sång noted above, it will be tricky to make this work correctly in every case. CodeTalker (talk) 01:56, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

Darn, you're probably right. 🌺 Cremastra (talk) 12:57, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

NeedHymn, for some historical context: while this wasn't precisely the change, it was attempted to have some aspects of dates or other data pages localized automatically, and it was undone due to complexity and complications with users without accounts. While a personal solution per above seems reasonable, it feels worthwhile to note this class of functionality has been explored for the whole site before. — Remsense诉 13:28, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

It is technically quite similar to {{Convert}} (unrelated to religious conversion) and the debate about localised reading experience. Since we're here, I recommend this essay Wikipedia:Systemic bias. ~ 🦝 Shushugah (he/him • talk) 19:10, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

That's about as impractical as an option to switch between varieties of English spelling based on preference. Logically, Wikipedia is a secular project so we should be using BCE and CE everywhere, eliminating BC and AD entirely, for consistency. ~Anachronist (talk) 19:53, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

I agree, but I don't think accommodating a single user's preference that doesn't affect others is that harmful. I would fervently oppose a proposal to actually use BC and AD in articles as the norm, but this seems OK. 🌺 Cremastra (talk) 20:04, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

Curious about IMDb

Nothing directly to do with Wikipedia, but I've been curious about IMDb. I don't have an account there, and I wonder, if you did have an account, are you able to see the provenance of additions to that database? (On Wikipedia, I sometimes cross-check between different articles; e.g. OK, John Doe article *does* say he attended Lorem Ipsum University... how long has that been the case... Oh, four minutes before the suss article was changed. A couple of times, I've been able to see this happen at IMDb because I periodically checked the page.) So can a registered user there see more than the rest of us, regarding when items were added? _signed, Willondon (talk) 18:57, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

@Willondon welcome to Teahouse! Questions unrelated to English Wikipedia should not be asked here. That said, I looked it up and doesn't seem possible, but I am not certain. ~ 🦝 Shushugah (he/him • talk) 19:07, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

Documentaries as sources

Hello, I'm wondering how good of a source are documentaries about things I want to write about, especially if the link of the source would be a youtube video (of the documentary)? Does it make a difference if the youtube channel is from a verified or non-verified (official) account?

Thanks in advance. --~~~~A flurry of stars A flurry of stars (talk) 23:34, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

A flurry of stars, audiovisual sources like documentaries are themselves equally capable of being reliable as written sources are. I would recommend reading the guideline page I've just linked to learn more about how we judge the reliability of sources in general. An important point is that reliability is judged on a spectrum and depends on context.
Here, if you are using a documentary as a source, it is very possible that it is perfectly reliable. If you are watching an unofficial upload on YouTube—that is not considered relevant for our purposes, as long as it is reasonable to assume that you are watching the documentary in question. However, I would not link an unofficial YouTube upload on Wikipedia—instead, I would leave the citation without a link, or with an official link corresponding to the documentary. Directly linking to an unofficial upload runs the risk of copyright trouble, see this policy for more info. — Remsense诉 23:51, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

Thank you very much for the quick and detailed explanation. Best of wishes! A flurry of stars (talk) 13:35, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

Editing a Page

hello all, I need help with a new page I've been working on. I'm still new with editing. Kadiamakeovers (talk) 01:56, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

Is this about Draft:Tamika Lamison? So far, Declined twice for not adequate referencing. David notMD (talk) 02:06, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

How do I show additional significant coverage in my film article

I apologize as this is my first time creating an article, specifically about films. Earlier, my article Draft:Head Burst was rejected because it didn't show significant coverage that are published from reliable, secondary sources.

I tried to make sure I added reliable sources for my article, even adding an IMDB link below it. Obviously I didn't add enough sources which is why it probably got rejected which is why I'm asking for help. How do I find more reliable sources, is there any mistakes in my article I should fix? Any help is appreciated as I want to contribute to Wikipedia's growth Virp2022 (talk) 03:58, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

@Virp2022: Welcome to the Teahouse! You could provide sources where you read the information that I have tagged with {{citation needed}}. You could also try asking at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Film/German cinema task force. GoingBatty (talk) 07:15, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

The problem is that you wrote the article WP:BACKWARD. You should have written it forward, and then you wouldn't be having this problem. Start by collecting reliable sources first, and then write your article based on what the sources say, not based on what you know. IMDB is user-generated content and not considered a reliable source. See WP:Golden Rule to get an idea of what's required. ~Anachronist (talk) 19:48, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

Oops

So I forgot to check Wikipedia for any existing pages and turns out I forgot to check for redirects. I ended up creating this draft, which isn't well developed yet. How do I delete it? TWOrantula^TM (enter the web) 04:45, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

@TrademarkedTWOrantula, hello! You can put {{db-g7}} at the top of an article to request its good faith deletion per the G7 criterion for speedy deletion, which is for when the sole author of a page wants to make a request like this! Remsense诉 04:48, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

General question!

Hey, my question is Padma Shri, Padma Bhushan and Padma Vibhushan awardee are eligible for a biographical article on Wikipedia? According to WP:ANYBIO these peoples are eligible! please guide me. Youknowwhoistheman (talk) 12:21, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

As that guideline states, "People are likely to be notable if they meet any of the following standards. ... meeting one or more does not guarantee that a subject should be included." Having any of these awards will most probably help, but it's not necessarily the final word. Personally, I always aim for WP:GNG when I start an article. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 12:50, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

From looking at the lists of recent awardees of Padma Vibhushan and Padma Bushan, most (all?) of the recipients are subjects of existing articles. For Padma Shri, not all. To me, this suggests that award recipients are potentially worthy of creating and submitting a draft, with referenced descriptions of their accomplishments - including the medals. For any new medal awardee, it is possible that an article already exists. My guess is that you are asking because the 2024 awards were just announced. David notMD (talk) 14:24, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

Thanks you @Gråbergs Gråa Sång and @David notMD, Have a good day. Youknowwhoistheman (talk) 18:25, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

how can i verify my page as a musician?

i am a musician and i want to very my page Ex-boy france (talk) 15:19, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

Hello and welcome. You will have to inquire with various social media and search engines to see what their verification requirements are. Some of them permit the presence of a Wikipedia article as one possible means of verification. However, that is not a concern of Wikipedia. If you meet the definition of a notable musician, as shown with significant coverage in independent reliable aources, someone will eventually write about you. You should not do this yourself, see WP:AUTO. 331dot (talk) 15:24, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

The content you created on your User page has been Speedy deleted with no record of it having existed except to Administrators. User pages are not the place to create articles (Wikipedia does not have profiles, is not social media). Furthermore, articles that succeed in being created are not 'owned' by the creator or the subject. The proper path for an attempt is explained at WP:YFA. Attempts at autobiography almost always fail. Absolute requirments include references that are indepedent from the subject, and all content in a submitted draft must be verified by said referencs. David notMD (talk) 20:12, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

See entry below this for more detailed guidance. David notMD (talk) 20:13, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

wikipidia reject

today i submit my page for review it was reject what is the reason User:Hyder1977/sandbox Hyder Ali (talk) 16:08, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

@Hyder1977: Welcome to the Teahouse! The draft is overly promotional and does not have any independent reliable sources. Please carefully read the boxes at the top of the draft, which explain why the submission was declined and why it has been nominated for deletion. There are many links in those boxes to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines.

WP:AUTO explains that Wikipedia strongly discourages autobiographies. Creating a new Wikipedia article can be quite challenging, especially when you have a conflict of interest (COI). To learn how to edit, I suggest you start at Help:Introduction. I suggest spending a significant amount of time editing existing articles to hone your skills. When you're ready to create an article, you would gather multiple published independent reliable sources that have provided significant coverage of you, and determine whether they demonstrate that you meet Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion, called "notability". If so, you could create an account and declare your COI on your user page. Then follow the instructions at Help:Your first article and summarize what the sources have published, and be prepared for a process that may include months of waiting for review, declines, and rewrites, before an article is accepted. If you are successful, then you could never edit the article directly due to your COI, but could submit edit requests on the article talk page. Hope this helps. GoingBatty (talk) 16:14, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

my user page

someone who doesn't have their own user page has thanked me for the creation of mine.... I find that a little weird. can someone explain what that would be about? WikiTikiTavi63 (talk) 17:22, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

@WikiTikiTavi63 welcome to Teahouse. I agree with you it is confusing. From a technical point of view, it is possible to have an account without a User page, or a User talk page. For such users, you can search Special:Contributions/Example and ping them {{reply to|Example}}.

User Experience wise, I personally would support every new User account creation also automatically including a User page, to make it easier for newbies to communicate. You can boldly create their User talk page for them. But they can request to delete it as well. ~ 🦝 Shushugah (he/him • talk) 18:37, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

WikiTikiTavi63, I have no idea why anyone (A) would thank any other person (B) for the creation of that person's (B's) user page; and so I don't know why anyone else would thank you for having created "WikiTikiTavi63". As for Shushugah's comment, creating a user talk page for somebody else isn't at all bold; it's how user talk pages are normally created. But in almost all circumstances creating a user page for somebody else isn't merely "bold", it's presumptuous and arrogant. And I for one would oppose the automatic creation of user pages. -- Hoary (talk) 22:23, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

No idea. User has 17 edits since 2018. Just strange randomness, I guess. 🌺 Cremastra (talk) 14:45, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Roman Rostokin

Hello! I am trying to create a Wikipedia page about a professional football player from Odessa, Ukraine. He is the top goal-scorer of Moldovan Cup 2021/2022 and it is wrong that it shows that he is Moldovan player. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cupa_Moldovei https://en.m.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Roman_Rostokin&action=edit&redlink=1 It's appreciated a lot you will help me to create this page about him. P.s. I also wrote the same article but in Russian language Роман Ростокин https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A0%D0%BE%D1%81%D1%82%D0%BE%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%BD,_%D0%A0%D0%BE%D0%BC%D0%B0%D0%BD Also you can use a picture like that from the public domain for his profile: https://www.instagram.com/p/BET9eBgh_tQ/?igsh=MXB4OW5jOHl6MWhkdw== Thank you. Kawasaki00 (talk) 17:43, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

@Kawasaki00 the image is not public domain in the copyright sense, but let's focus on the Encyclopedia article part for now. Generally everyone here has different artists, so if you think an article is missing, then write it! I am not sure if he meets notability guidelines for Football players...see WP:NFOOTBALL, but if you think he does, I would recommend making more edits first. Creating a new article from scratch is extremely challenging, and new editors are strongly recommended to spend a few months learning how Wikipedia works, by making improvements to some of our existing six million articles before trying it. When you do decide to have a go at a new article, you are highly encouraged to read WP:Your first article. If you haven't already also check out WP:TUTORIAL; it's a lot of fun! Happy editing! ~ 🦝 Shushugah (he/him • talk) 18:30, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

Dispute resolution and Javascript

I don't have a dispute right now, but this is for future potential disputes:

For some reason, I cannot request a dispute resolution in the dispute resolution noticeboard. A message pops up and says that this page requires javascript to use the form tool. I don't know what javascript is required. Please help? Thanks, Wikiexplorationandhelping (talk) 17:52, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

@Wikiexplorationandhelping welcome to Teahouse. Technical questions are better suited for WP:VPT. You don't need to download any Javascript (every modern web browser is able to run it), but sometimes web-browsers disabled allowing any javascript to run for security reasons. I would google "enable javascript [name of your browser]" to find instructions. Happy editing and resolving disputes! ~ 🦝 Shushugah (he/him • talk) 18:26, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for your help! Unfortunately, when I tried disabling and re-enabling Javascript for Safari, and pressing the "Request dispute resolution" again, nothing happened. I also tried this on Chrome browser to no avail. I'll continue to request help at WP:VPT. In the meantime, if, and when, a dispute happens, and I want to use the DRN noticeboard, how can I submit a dispute resolution request? Any alternatives? Thanks, Wikiexplorationandhelping (talk) 15:44, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

change user name

I want to change my user name from Sedlescombe46 (it's been compromised) to Runagood (a name I have trademarked) but I'm being blocked (on 27 Jan 24) because someone took that name on 24 Jan 24 (it was me!) So what now? Sedlescombe46 (talk) 17:59, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

@Sedlescombe46 you can request a new password for User:Runagood but if you cannot access it, there is nothing you can do about it. You have only made 3 edits with your current account, two of them about changing usernames. I would gently suggest you focus on improving Wikipedia. The usernames do not matter otherwise. ~ 🦝 Shushugah (he/him • talk) 18:22, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

@Dedlescombe46: If you have associated an email account with that name, you ca request a password reset. Otherwise, there may be a possibility at Wikipedia:Changing username/Usurpations. You'd basically be usurping your own username that you cannot access. Bear in mind that it would be blocked as a violation of Wikipedia:Username policy if it's the name of a product or company. In that case, you're better off without that trademarked name. ~Anachronist (talk) 00:35, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

looks like at least one product or company. 🌺 Cremastra (talk) 14:42, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Flagicon of the world

Hi! I need to indicate that a virtual event happened worldwide and so I would like to include a flag of the world in the flagicon format, but I cannot find it. I tried {{flagicon|World}} {{flag|World}} {{flagicon|world}} {{flag|world}} but nothing worked... any suggestion? Thanks --Larry.europe (talk) 19:27, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

@Larry.europe: There is no such flag. It isn't needed. Even if there was such a flag, its meaning in any usage I can imagine would be ambiguous, and therefore unnecessary. ~Anachronist (talk) 19:39, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

Thanks so much for your friendly welcome User:WillKomen. I can't wait to start editing! Walkerabroad (talk) 20:21, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

@Larry.europe: Are you referring to the article International Conference on Computational Intelligence Methods for Bioinformatics and Biostatistics? It seems to me that the flags shown there are MOS:FLAGCRUFT. GoingBatty (talk) 15:43, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

creating a page

I want to make a page about football player he is 6 years old and I have made an article about him but it have been speedily Deletion , how can i make one for him please help me DilovanAli (talk) 21:15, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

@DilovanAli Welcome to the Teahouse. Wikipedia is an encyclopaedia of 'notable things'. So, does this 6 year old meet Wikipedia's NOTABILITY CRITERIA FOR PEOPLE? In other words, can you supply three or more links or citations to nationally recognised newspapers, books or magazines that have talked about this person in detail and in depth? If so, then it may be possible. But, if not, then Wikipedia is not here to promote every young person who loves football and who has simply been mentioned in a local newspaper or local TV news programme once or twice. By the same token, you must stop trying to create an article about yourself, too. These have been speedily deleted as there was no evidence that you meet our notability criteria, either. You might try using Facebook or some other social media platform to create a profile about yourself - this encyclopaedia is not here for that purpose! Regards, Nick Moyes (talk) 21:22, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

Please advise me on how to reduce the weight of draft.

Hi, I am a Japanese Wikipedian. I am currently translating an article I wrote for the Japanese version of Wikipedia, "チュアベトナム", into English at "Draft:Chua_Vietnam_(Japan)" and am in the finishing stages before submission.

I recently received very valuable advice about this draft from@GreenMeansGo at teahouse.

"you veer off into other subjects that are related, but not directly the subject of the article."

I think this advice is probably absolutely right. I intentionally included quite a bit more peripheral information on this subject because there are not that many sources, but I do think the focus should still be on the subject.

I have researched all the online sources on this subject, so I cannot add any more sources or significantly more information on this subject. Therefore, the only thing I can do now to improve the quality of the article is to shave off the extra fat.

In the draft space, it seems that the lead author is the only one who can do the heavy slash. Being a subject without so many sources, it must be done carefully so as not to damage its notability. This requires courage.

I have made a rough draft of my own ideas on how to reduce the weight of the articles. Can anyone compare these two articles and give me thoughts and advice?

Draft:Chua_Vietnam_(Japan)

User:狄の用務員/Chua Vietnam (Japan)

The modifications are as follows

About the "Religion in Vietnam" block.

In the Japanese Wikipedia, this paragraph was added because there is no article on Buddhism in Vietnam, but in the English Wikipedia, there is a full article on Buddhism in Vietnam, so I removed the entire block. There is a link to "Vietnamese Buddhism" in the Infobox of the article template, should there be a link in the article as well?

About the explanation of "Tam Quan" in the "Architecture" block

Since there is a separate entry for "Tam Quan" in the English Wikipedia, I substituted a link to "Tam Quan" in the photo caption.

About the photo captions in the "Annual Events" block

I removed the ancillary explanations and reduced the captions to the bare minimum.

about the "Geography" block

This is the most difficult part. For the time being, I reduced the amount of text to less than half and removed the pie chart. Some may think that this entire block is unnecessary, but I personally think it is better to have it. The high percentage of foreigners in Aikawa is one of the reasons why the town was chosen as the location for the temple setup. and the acceptance of Indochinese refugees has increased the number of Vietnamese residents and provided an economic base for temple operations, and the concentration of Indochinese temples, including Vietnamese, in this small town is very rare. I would appreciate any comments on the publication of this block. The first and third paragraphs of this block seems could be compressed a little more without changing the amount of information, but it is difficult with my English skills.

About the "Related articles" Block

I removed the description.

That's all for the proposed revision. If there is any advice, even if unrelated to weight loss, I would love to hear it. 狄の用務員 (talk) 02:11, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

狄の用務員様, as I'm rather tired today, I'm sidestepping your request; but perhaps if you look at some changes I made, you will find them of use. Other tips: Remove the address and opening hours: en:Wikipedia articles normally skip these, which can more reliably be obtained from the institution (here, temple) itself. 頑張ってね！ -- Hoary (talk) 05:14, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Meanwhile, 狄の用務員様, a couple of points:

1. Different versions of the same title should not be concatenated after "title=". For this source (as an example), you have: title=国際色豊かな神奈川県愛川町の魅力は？グルメに異国文化体験 地球の歩き方コラボシリーズ（2）/What is the charm of the cosmopolitan town of Aikawa in Kanagawa Prefecture? Gourmet food and exotic culture experience Chikyū no Arukikata Collaboration Series (2). Sorry, but that's wrong. As stated in Template:Cite_web/doc#Title, it should instead be title=Kokusai-shoku yutaka na Kanagawa-ken Aikawa-chō no miryoku wa? Gurume ni ikokubunka taiken: Chikyū no Arukikata korabo shirīzu (2) | script-title=ja:国際色豊かな神奈川県愛川町の魅力は？グルメに異国文化体験 地球の歩き方コラボシリーズ（2）| trans-title=What is the charm of the cosmopolitan town of Aikawa in Kanagawa Prefecture? Gourmet food and exotic culture experience: Chikyū no Arukikata Collaboration Series (2)
2. "author=" must never be followed by two or more people's names. The recommended method for two people is first1= | last1= | first2= | last2=; see Template:Cite_web#Authors. Offhand I don't how to deal with Vietnamese names. (I thought I might be able to infer this from the references supplied for Vietnam-related featured articles, but disappointingly few of their authors appear to be Vietnamese. The best place to ask is probably Help talk:Citation Style 1.)

-- Hoary (talk) 06:58, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

@Hoary: Thank you very much for your corrections and advice.

I have removed the address, opening hours and transportation.

I probably understand how to title the source and how to fill in the author. I have only corrected about a third of it, but I will revise all of it soon.

Since I do not understand Vietnamese at all, cannot identify Vietnamese first, last, or middle names, and have no knowlage about Vietnamese sounds, I will expect someone else to correct the Vietnamese source.

If you have any idea on the inclusion of descriptions such as "Religion in Vietnam," "Tam Quan," "Annual Events," "Geography," etc., please let me know. 狄の用務員 (talk) 08:02, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

狄の用務員, let's take Võ Nguyên Giáp (ヴォー・グエン・ザップ) as an example. The article starts: "In this Vietnamese name, the surname is Võ. In accordance with Vietnamese custom, this person should be referred to by the given name, Nguyên Giáp." (Incidentally, though this isn't the same as the correct practice for most Icelandic names, it has similarities.) I think that all Vietnamese names are given in this order, so we know which part is the surname. The question is of the meaning of "first" and "last" in the context of citation templates. So, Võ was the man's first name (you'd write and say it first), and Nguyên Giáp was his last name, but do these correspond to "first" and "last" for use in citation templates? If so, any work by him would be indexed first by "Nguyên Giáp" (good), but might give the impression that Nguyên Giáp was his surname (wrong). ¶ Although Wikipedia calls 谷崎潤一郎 "Jun'ichirō Tanizaki", not "Tanizaki Jun'ichirō"), it presents the first name of Tsubouchi Shōyō (坪内逍遥) as Tsubouchi, but if a citation template were to describe a book by him, I'm pretty sure that it would do so "last=Tsubouchi | first=Shōyō". -- Hoary (talk) 08:48, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

@Hoary: Thank you very much for your kind explanation with examples. I have rewritten the sources for the two papers by Vietnamese. I am not sure if this is the correct answer, I hope this bet is correct.

I can't find the Vietnamese language code on the help page, should I not write "VI"? 狄の用務員 (talk) 09:18, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Yes, List of ISO 639 language codes says that it's "vi" (which perhaps should be lowercase [小文字] for this purpose). -- Hoary (talk) 10:00, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

I am so sorry, I have tried both lower case vi and vie for the source of the temple website, but they all give me an error. If you don't mind, could you please fill in one successful example? 狄の用務員 (talk) 10:59, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Thank you very much for your numerous corrections and suggestions. Although I am Japanese, I do not have an accurate understanding of Hepburn, but I will revise it all to Hepburn on my own soon. 狄の用務員 (talk) 11:47, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Fair Use under Wikimedia Commons

Hello,

I created an infobox for this page where I used an image from Wikimedia Commons. What else do I need to do to ensure it does not get taken down? BajaChikn (talk) 04:00, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

@BajaChikn: Commons does not allow fair use. But the image in the article is marked as being under a CC license. Please clarify what you are asking. RudolfRed (talk) 04:03, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Is there anything else I need to do to make sure it does not get taken down for copyright infringement BajaChikn (talk) 04:06, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

@BajaChikn: Please clarify what image you are referring to, I think we might be talking past each other. File:2022,_20,_Brady_Oliveira.jpg was uploaded in 2022 and does not seem to be in danger of being deleted. I wonder if you are referring to a different image. RudolfRed (talk) 04:11, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

@RudolfRed That's the right image, I was just confused on how properly adding images on Wikipedia worked and wanted to make sure I wasn't violating any rules as far as CC and licensing goes. BajaChikn (talk) 04:15, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

@BajaChikn: That image says it was uploaded by another user, Cmm3, who also says they created the image themselves and chose to release it under the right licence. It is in no danger of being deleted from Commons. I ran a TinEye search and it is very unlikely to be a copyright violation. 🌺 Cremastra (talk) 14:40, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Awesome! Thank you so much! BajaChikn (talk) 17:25, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

No worries. 🌺 Cremastra (talk) 18:02, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Create an article that was created by a new user and was deleted

Hi, i would like to ask that a article which i was about to create about an Famous youtuber named Ducky bhai (Saad ur rehman) the template told that it had been created and deleted by a user stating it had no significance or importance.

now that i went to the talk page to discuss it with the user who deleted it, i found out unfortunately the user is no more in this world and his account is inactive.

Now in this case should i create the article directly or within draft, also to the addition that the Guy Saad ur rehman has joined politics and people are Searching about him, making his page feels necessary as this news is attracting alot of people and makes him an important figure. Rahim231 (talk) 07:37, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Rahim231, on 12 September '20, the article Ducky bhai was deleted by Ritchie333. I'm surprised by your comment "the user is no more in this world and his account is inactive". As recently as the 26th, Ritchie333 made so many edits that I can't be bothered to count them. -- Hoary (talk) 09:01, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

I see there that you got confused for another user here is the article [2]

and the user [3]. Rahim231 (talk) 09:18, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Coverage exists, I'll say that much.[4][5] Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 09:30, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

So i should refrain from making his article or so ? Rahim231 (talk) 09:35, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

@Rahim231 Since it has been deleted at least a couple of times, my advice is, if you have the WP:GNG sources and want to try again, write a DRAFT, take your time, and when you're ready, submit it for review. You can start a draft here. WP:BLP is very important, and there's good advice at WP:BACKWARD and WP:FLOWERY. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 10:27, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for guiding me. Rahim231 (talk) 10:55, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Help with notability & adjusting tone

Hi, I would like some feedback on this draft page - Draft:Don Samarasinghe. In particular, how to improve the tone and meet the notability criteria for an academic. Any suggestions? Thanks in advance. Nzkaioshin (talk) 09:51, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

As he is only a Senior Lecturer, this is probably too soon (WP:TOOSOON) for him to have a notable career. At a list of academic staff of Massey University, the great majority of people who are subjects of articles reached full professor there or elsewhere. Some of your refs are to his achievements, but few (none?) are about him, at length. The refs to capable.nz are to articles not written by him. Rather, he was interviewed and used for quotes. David notMD (talk) 10:50, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Broken link

Hi everyone. I found a broken link. When I click on it, it says page not found. I found another relevant source that I can include instead. How can I change the citation? Kamila376 (talk) 14:03, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

@Kamila376 I can help you, but it would be much easier if you can tell us the source you found and the article you're looking at. References with dead urls are generally not removed. Have you tried looking in The Wayback Machine for an archived copy of the website?

If you found a second, useful, source, then you can add it in to the article after the sentence which it verifies following the instructions at WP:REFVE. 🌺 Cremastra (talk) 14:36, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

I wrote something and can't find it>

I guess it didn't post, I guess I don't know how to post. Is it gone? Cookei1002 (talk) 18:28, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Hi Cookei1002, welcome to the Teahouse. This post is the only saved edit by your account. PrimeHunter (talk) 18:58, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

@Cookei1002 Welcome to Teahouse. Either it didn't publish correctly, or you posted it while logged out, in which case your it would publish an edit with your IP address. Sometimes your local browser has saved the draft edit, but I would simply edit and publish more regularly. See WP:TUTORIAL to get started! ~ 🦝 Shushugah (he/him • talk) 19:27, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Wikilinks to articles in non-English Wikipedias

I an looking at an article (Toast Hawaii) that contains a small number of wikilinks to German language wikipedia articles, within the main body of the article. I have not verified this yet, but I am guessing that the contributor did this because there was no English language equivalent article. My question is whether there are guidelines related to this? Ike9898 (talk) 19:33, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Ike9898, yes, there is H:FOREIGNLINK, which offers a number of alternatives, chief of which is using Template:Interlanguage link. The article should not link directly to German Wikipedia via a piped link, but use {{ill|Hans Karl Adam|de}} instead. Mathglot (talk) 19:42, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Thank you! I am putting your guidance to use! Ike9898 (talk) 20:12, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Hello everyone. I have a question about notability criteria for swimming sportsmen.

I have two draft articles about Ukrainian swimmers, which are declined some times. I kindly accepted the notability criteria for them, but they are being declined. What sources can be considered as notable for swimmers? Thanks!! Ілля Криворучко (talk) 20:15, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Note: Related discussion can be found here. --Finngall ^talk 20:36, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

@Ілля Криворучко: the policy is WP:NATHLETE. Don John McLongdong (talk) 00:22, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Thanks, but there is no criteria for swimmers, so I asked that question. Ілля Криворучко (talk) 00:24, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Ілля Криворучко, there is no specific notability guideline for swimmers. The notability guideline for athletes in general is at Wikipedia:Notability (sports). A swimmer who has received significant coverage in multiple reliable sources that are entirely independent of the swimmer is considered notable and eligible for a Wikipedia article. Cullen328 (talk) 00:20, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Thanks!!! Ілля Криворучко (talk) 00:27, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Draft:Voices from Ukraine

Hello, is it possible for someone to check the page and publish it? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Voices_from_Ukraine Den22890 (talk) 22:21, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Hello, Den22890. Your only reference is a primary non-independent source, written by the organization itself. That is not adequate. Wikipedia articles must summarize the significant coverage that reliable sources completely independent of Voices for Ukraine devote to the group. Your draft has vast swathes of unreferenced content, which does not comply with the core content policy Verifiability. It cannot be accepted in its current form. Please study Your first article. Cullen328 (talk) 22:32, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Hello, Den22890, and welcome to the Teahouse. I have added a header to your draft allowing you to submit it for review. But do not do this yet, as it will certainly not be accepted. It has only one reference, and that is to the organisation's own website.

Wikipedia has little interest in what the subject of an article says or wants to say about themselves, or what their associates say about them. Wikipedia is almost entirely interested in what people who have no connection with the subject, and who have not been prompted or fed information on behalf of the subject, have chosen to publish about the subject in reliable sources. If enough material is cited from independent sources to establish notability, a limited amount of uncontroversial factual information may be added from non-independent sources.

You need to find several such sources, and cite them. ColinFine (talk) 22:32, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

I quote from the draft: "On September 17, in collaboration with Flixbus, we were invited to the Ukrainian festival "Family Day for Ukraine" in the Dutch town of Veenendaal, where we brought Ukrainian singer Serafyn" (my emphases). I quote from the template atop the draft: "It is strongly discouraged to write about yourself, your business or employer. If you do so, you must declare it." The latter has links that show you how and where you should make the declaration(s). Please do it, now. -- Hoary (talk) 22:42, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Den22890, thank you for your candor on your user page. -- Hoary (talk) 22:56, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Den22890, which one of Draft:Fundacja "Voices from Ukraine" and Draft:Voices from Ukraine do you want to work on? Whichever it is, somebody here (perhaps me) will turn the other into a redirect. -- Hoary (talk) 22:53, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Draft:Voices from Ukraine Den22890 (talk) 22:55, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Thank you, Den22890. I've turned the other into a redirect. If you go here you'll find a link to the history of the now-redirected page, and will be able to look at earlier versions. -- Hoary (talk) 23:02, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

thank you, does it possible to delete from name (Draft:) Draft:Voices from Ukraine

and link to Ukrainian version? https://uk.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voices_from_Ukraine Den22890 (talk) 23:10, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

No, Den22890, it is not possible to delete "Draft:" until Draft:Voices from Ukraine is good enough to be an article. If you read what's written above, and think about it, you will realize that no it is not good enough to be an article. It's not even close. One major problem is that there's no indication in the draft that the organization is notable (as this is understood by and for en:Wikipedia). (This has nothing to do with the worthiness of the organization itself.) No, there will be no link from the draft to any Wikipedia article (e.g. in Ukrainian) on the same subject. First, you need to improve the draft, very radically. You have to base it on what reliable sources unrelated to Voices from Ukraine have said about Voices from Ukraine. These sources don't have to be in English; they may be in Polish, Ukrainian, Russian, German, Romanian, Slovakian, Hungarian, etc. -- Hoary (talk) 23:20, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Den22890, I note that uk:Voices from Ukraine cites just three sources: Voices from Ukraine, a tweet, and something posted to Instagram by Voices from Ukraine. Perhaps uk:Wikipedia permits this kind of article; en:Wikipedia does not. Please look for solid material, for example articles within the websites of reputable newspapers. -- Hoary (talk) 23:32, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

I have many of them, but it not gives me permission to edit references( Den22890 (talk) 23:35, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

I don't understand you. If Zeit Online, for example, has usable material, then you may summarize what the material says, of course attributing it to the particular page within Zeit Online. In order to do this, you don't need permission from either Zeit Online or Wikipedia. (Of course you must not simply copy material from Zeit Online -- doing so would both be plagiarism and also violate copyright. I'm talking about summarizing in your own words.) -- Hoary (talk) 23:43, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

thanks Den22890 (talk) 00:49, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Amazon no longer valid for source for uploading image book covers?

i upload a variety of book covers under non-free use guidelines. Amazon.com was often a valid source for finding these book covers, but now two uploads that I have tried have failed and have listed my linking to amazon as "SPAM" or something to that effect? i do not know what changed in the last day or so. Iljhgtn (talk) 23:25, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Iljhgtn, I suggest that you try Google Books instead, or the publisher's website. Cullen328 (talk) 23:39, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

i am fine with going to other sources and places, but i just found that it only started listing this link as spam within the last 24 hours or so, so i was a tad surprised. Iljhgtn (talk) 00:00, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Unrelated to spam, but one problem with using covers from Amazon is that new printings with new covers are published quite frequently, and Amazon will usually switch to the latest, current version, whereas in Wikipedia the illustration captions often specify a particular edition (often the first). Popular, frequently reprinted books can accumulate a surprisingly large historical array of covers in a comparatively short time. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 90.205.103.187 (talk) 08:17, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Active voice or passive voice

Should I write articles in active voice or passive voice? Abigbagel (talk) 23:29, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Whichever. (Did some silly book or teacher condemn the passive? If so, and if you'd like to spend ten to twenty minutes to understand the matter, I warmly recommend "Fear and Loathing of the English Passive".) -- Hoary (talk) 23:36, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Abigbagel, hello! Above all else, you should accurately represent what the reliable sources say. There are no firm guidelines in the Manual of Style regarding grammatical voice. My personal advice applies to use of the passive voice in general:

• All else being equal, active voice is the most natural form in English, and should be used most of the time, as is the case across most English language writing.
• A primary purpose of passive voice is to avoid asserting a strong causality or intentionality regarding an event. This can be used accurately and intentionally, but often results purposelessly in unclear writing, or serves the above function in a way that is considered empirically inaccurate or dishonest.

If one took the philosophy of David Hume to its extreme, one should never use the active voice because strict causality cannot ever be proven in the real world. But to write like that would be misleading and unpleasant in almost all circumstances. Hume wouldn't do that, and neither should you or I. Much scientific literature uses the passive voice much more often—this is the area where you should pay special attention, and represent what the sources say accurately, as previously stated.
Cheers! — Remsense诉 23:49, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

I also largely agree with @Hoary—it's not that big of a deal. But it is a deal. — Remsense诉 23:51, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Note that in order to express what they wanted to say, Remsense used four instances of the passive ("be used", "is considered", "be proven", and "stated"), and the result is none the worse for it. "People can use it accurately and intentionally", "that people consider empirically inaccurate or dishonest" and so forth would have merely bulked up the prose. The passive voice is just a handy way to change the valency of a verb, best used when the agent is of no concern (or unknown). -- Hoary (talk) 00:09, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Hoary, agreed. — Remsense诉 00:10, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

The Manual of Style does mention the topic briefly at MOS:PASSIVE: "The passive voice is inappropriate for some forms of writing, but it is widely used in encyclopedia articles, because the passive voice avoids inappropriate first- and second-person constructions as well as tone problems." CodeTalker (talk) 00:51, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Need Help

With Makeing a wikipedia With sources 985thelou (talk) 00:43, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

@985thelou: If you are trying to create an article, read WP:YFA and WP:REFB for help on how to create an article and cite your sources. RudolfRed (talk) 00:57, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Okay Can You Make It For Me? For i Will Not conflict Wikipedia 985thelou (talk) 01:01, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

no. we won't make articles for you. ltbdl (talk) 01:08, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Teahouse Hosts are here to advise, but not author or co-author. There is a place to propose article topics, but the reality is a huge backlog and minimal success. There is a way to proceed with drafting and submittal of a draft despite haveing a conflict of interest. David notMD (talk) 02:33, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Question regarding inclusion of criminal charging in BLP

Hey - looking for some advice here from people who know the policies/guidelines better than I do :)

On the BLP Ben Eager, I noticed that a single-sentence paragraph that mentioned the subject being charged with a crime in 2012 was removed with the edit summary Defamation. The sentence appeared to be sourced (albeit with a dead link), and I have since found additional (seemingly reliable) sources from the time that support the statement (as well as finding an archived copy of the dead link). However, I'm looking for guidance regarding whether I should reinsert the sentence into the article (proposed version below).

I've found WP:BLPCRIME & WP:BLPPUBLIC, and my understanding based on what I've read is that the subject is a public figure for those purposes. (re. BLPPUBLIC, I've searched Google a bit, but haven't been able to find anywhere where the subject has responded to the charges - or what happened with them in the end at all.) I also think that a single sentence on this apparently well-reported-at-the-time incident is keeping in line with WP:DUE. However, as I'm not as familiar with BLP policies as I'd like to be (as well as being unfamiliar with how DUE is applied in these sorts of cases), I'm looking for a second opinion as to whether or not this should be reinserted.

Proposed sentence
In October 2012, Eager was charged with assault, assault with bodily harm and assault with a weapon, after allegedly beating up the doorman at a pub in the Rosedale neighbourhood of Toronto. References

Let me know if you have any queries, and/or if I've explained anything poorly. All the best, ‍—‍a smart kitten_[meow] 01:17, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

A smart kitten, as you're looking for advice from people who know the policies/guidelines better than either of us does, you should instead ask at Wikipedia:Biographies of living persons/Noticeboard. -- Hoary (talk) 04:22, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Being charged with a crime (as in this case) generally does not warrant mention in an article on a person. Being found guilty of a serious crime does warrant mention. (If reliable sources state that he was charged, but don't mention that he was found guilty, it's likely that he was not found guilty.) Maproom (talk) 08:33, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

copyrights for historical photos

Can I upload a commercial photograph from the 1940s whose photographer is unknown?

Draft: Anna Istomina 57.140.16 1 Boat Scherzo (talk) 02:21, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Boat Scherzo, unfortunately photos taken after 1927 whose creators are unknown are assumed to be under copyright. However, there are certain cases where non-free content can be acceptably used—these guidelines are stricter than "fair use", though. See this page for Wikipedia's acceptable use guidelines for images. Cheers! — Remsense诉 02:28, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

That depends, Boat Scherzo. c:File:Portrait of Teikō Shiotani.jpg is a photo taken in 1934 or 1935, yet in the public domain and legitimately at Commons (of course with no claim of "fair use"). So where was this "commercial photograph" taken? -- Hoary (talk) 03:35, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Arab Wikipedia Financial exploitation

There are many problems in the Arab Wikipedia, including financial exploitation in creating biographical articles Mohamed Alsananni (talk) 03:11, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

@Mohamed Alsananni: Welcome to the Teahouse! Each Wikipedia site operates independently, so the volunteers here at the English Wikipedia have no more sway at the Arabic Wikipedia than you do. It seems the Arabic Wikipedia have their own version of the Teahouse at ar:ويكيبيديا:بوابة المشاركة, where you can provide details about your concerns and request assistance. GoingBatty (talk) 03:21, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Page move

Hello, I just wanted to state that I moved a page from Save the Kids Token to Save the Kids. I did not provide a rationale, but this was entirely accidental (I forgot to write in there -- silly me). Does this need to be reverted? I am asking because I do not want this to appear like I was being malicious or acting unilaterally against consensus. I try to be bold, but I really should have been more careful here. I apologize for any inconvenience, I will open a requested move if it needs to be reverted back. Thank you. JeffSpaceman (talk) 03:22, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

@JeffSpaceman: Welcome to the Teahouse! If you like, you may post your rationale at Talk:Save the Kids, where you'll see a previous discussion about moving the article. Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 03:25, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

@GoingBatty: Thank you for this. I was really worried that people would be upset with me. As much as I try to be bold, I actively try to avoid editing against consensus, and I wasn't sure how this would be taken. I will leave a rationale on the page, and if anyone feels the need to revert, I will let them. I appreciate your swift response. JeffSpaceman (talk) 03:28, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Need help with sourcing

Hi. I recently made edits to a personality page - Sanjay Jain (advocate) - Wikipedia. My edits were reverted to original by @Tenryuu citing a lot of unsourced content. Please help me understand how to fix the issue. Gazalsancheti (talk) 04:36, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

@Gazalsancheti: Verifiability is a core Wikipedia principle. See WP:V for more info on that. You need to cite your sources when you information into an article. See WP:REFB for some tips on how to do that. RudolfRed (talk) 04:57, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Guest Appearances bulleted list

Hello

On Jimmy Carr I'm not sure what type of feature the "guest appearances" bulleted list is at the bottom. I have a number of items to add, but don't want to blunder in and break it (still feeling my way with edits). Can someone point me at the relevant help page, please?

Thx SecretSquirrel9 (talk) 07:02, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

seeking help, my article was declined.

good day, i am having challenges with an article and got a referral to Teahouse. can i talk to someone please?

i need to fix the errors or at least know what can be done Or Mbajor (talk) 08:46, 29 January 2024 (UTC)