Q: Why have you reduced the size of my file? A: In accordance with Wikipedia:Non-free content criteria 3(b): An entire work is not used if a portion will suffice. Low, rather than high-resolution/fidelity/bit rate, is used (especially where the original could be used for deliberate copyright infringement). If you believe I have made an error in reducing the image, please let me know. If there was no error is the lowering in the resolution, please keep the image reduced and keep it tagged until an administrator has deleted the larger versions of the image.
Q: Why have you tagged my file as {{di-bad fair use}} 10(c)? A: I have tagged it as in violation of Wikipedia:Non-free content criteria 10(c): The name of each article (a link to each article is also recommended) in which fair use is claimed for the item, and a separate, specific non-free use rationale for each use of the item, as explained at Wikipedia:Non-free use rationale guideline. The rationale is presented in clear, plain language and is relevant to each use. Meaning, provide a fair use rationale on the file description page, every time you use it on a different article. Otherwise it does not meet criteria for inclusion and it can be nominated for deletion.
Q: Why have you removed my image from an article because of 10(c)? A: The file does not have a fair use rationale on the file description page for why it is on that article. If you add a rationale, you are free to use the image on the article once again.
Q: Why have you tagged my file as {{di-bad fair use}} 10(a)? A: I have tagged it as in violation of Wikipedia:Non-free content criteria 10(a): Identification of the source of the material, supplemented, where possible, with information about the artist, publisher and copyright holder; this is to help determine the material's potential market value. A source for where the image was taken from needs to be specified, otherwise it will be marked for deletion.
Q: Why have you added {{deletable image-caption}} to an article? A: This is to notify users that the image next to the caption is a candidate for speedy deletion in a number of days due to problems specified on the image description page.
Q: Couldn't you just fix this image problem yourself? A: While I tag and re-sizing images, I do keep a look-out for things I can fix, rather than tag it for fixing. There is somewhere near 340,000 non-free images on Wikipedia, so I can't do this alone.
Q: Are you an administrator? A: No, I am not an administrator here. I can not protect or delete pages, move over redirects, or block users. For a full list of privileges I have, and projects where I have them, see this page. Also, if you offer to nominate me for adminiship, I will probably decline. I have had a few nominations in the past, the last being in 2006. If I ever run again, it will be a long time from now.
Welcome to my talk page. Here are some tips to help you communicate with me:
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This page-
Drama free days
4354
Keith Beavers
Sorry Moe that was my little sister. But I do know Beith Beavers and in fact he is my swim coach so if u could add he know coaches at Kingston Blue Marlins (KBM) that would be great! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.64.170.180 (talk) 00:54, 20 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I added the Max Wright edit as I thought it was strange to name his earlier DUI charges and find it very strange that this scandal is curiously absent from his bio. It is referenced and verified. 60.224.160.192 (talk) 02:31, 20 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
According to the hidden note in the article, other editors are well aware of the situation which you are trying to insert. Before adding material to Wikipedia, we have to be sure it is not liable or defamation according to our policy on biographies of living people. Go to Talk:Max Wright and discuss the change first if you want it inserted. Regards, — MoeEpsilon02:40, 20 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Why so many reverts to good faith edits that make an article better?
This is a bit disturbing to see all these edits of good faith contributions which actually improve the article. Maybe your bot is going crazy? --Jeffmcneill (talk) 05:59, 20 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Most edits that are "good faith" that I revert may intent to make an article better, such as inserting a url as an image, or placing words in inappropriate places in the article such as the very bottom, or between table brackets that break it. Those are the reasons I revert, there is no bot, just a script that helps me see it. If there is a specific edit that I've made that you feel needs checking, then feel free to link me. Regards, — MoeEpsilon06:08, 20 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
This edit doesn't appear to be helpful for what we consider normal article content. The length of a ride on a rail is something subjective to many things, it doesn't have a source and it's relevance is almost none to the topic (as a list of transportation in that section.) Regards, — MoeEpsilon06:36, 20 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
The user who added it below said that he took the ride several times and linked to a site with links that equates to testimonials of people who have rode it, saying that it takes about four hours. I guess it could be relevant if you found a reliable source, but there are several problems with that, namingly: It is original research, the time is not consistent, factual information (something that is a must for an encyclopedia) and that it's trivial. So what if it takes four hours? I think the article would benefit from information on when it was built, the location of it and the endpoints, and other information that is verifiable, instead. Regards, — MoeEpsilon07:26, 20 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
The original reason I reverted was because the entire content added was in all capital letters, marked as good faith. I've went ahead an restored it with normal capitalization after researching it a bit. Regards, — MoeEpsilon06:36, 20 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Why was my first edit on Wikipedia removed on good faith?
I live in Bangkok and have made the journey from by train to Pattaya - it takes about four hours.
Other people have had the same experience http://thailandbytrain.com/Pattaya.html
Hello, welcome to Wikipedia. Your personal experiences and others on the length of a train ride is not encyclopedic content. The article is giving a brief list of transportation in Pattaya. While it might be of relevant, maybe even true, it's trivial. Equating a personal experience also lends itself to our policy on no original research. The reference provided is "some people"s experience, which is not factual and your own experience on the train doesn't mean it needs to be added on either. Take a look around Wikipedia and explore our relevant policies and guidelines on what should be added to Wikipedia. If you need anything, let me know. Regards, — MoeEpsilon06:47, 20 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
While you have been reverted, again, I have went ahead and removed the entire section as unreferenced. Your contributions were not appropriate, nonetheless. Regards, — MoeEpsilon08:45, 20 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
SuperSE143
I saw your note on User Talk: SuperSE143. I had previously blocked the user indefinitely for copyright violation, but another admin unblocked soon after after the user promised to stop. Since SuperSE143 obviously hasn't, I've asked for that admin to reblock the user (I can't myself per WP:WHEELWAR). Qwyrxian (talk) 12:12, 20 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks, I pinged King of Hearts earlier and he left him a note on the Commons, but he just came back today and resumed the same activity, so I think a block might just be best. Regards, — MoeEpsilon12:22, 20 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
David Ward (university president)
Thanks for the correction for a better Wikipedia. But this IP address is actually shared by thousands of people, so I don't know who contributed to the page.
Thanks, it's not much of a problem, since the edit was just random letters added to the page. It's assumed to be a test edit to see if they could make it, so it's not much harm done. Thanks for letting me know. Regards, — MoeEpsilon03:17, 21 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Charles Schultz - Sonoma County Airport
How in the world is including an edit about the deal the airport worked with Alaska Airlines to allow a free case of wine in checked baggage not constructive? In this era of pervasive bag fees, this is a huge deal - especially given the weight of wine. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.236.74.151 (talk) 16:04, 22 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hello, Moe Epsilon. Please check your email; you've got mail! It may take a few minutes from the time the email is sent for it to show up in your inbox. You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{You've got mail}} or {{ygm}} template.
The mistake you made was allowing opinions and word of mouth on a page that should only contain facts. Massad Ayoob, Marshall and Sanow, none of them are valid sources, in fact they've all been proven wrong and cited that they make things up to sell a certain type of ammunition or improve the popularity of a particular caliber when it suits them. For example, the Illinois State Police did use a 115-grain jacketed hollow point, but the US Air Marshals and the Border Patrol never have. The Air Marshals use .357 caliber SIGs and Glocks, which has even been stated by a spokesman in the case where 2 Air Marshals shot a man in the terminal some 5 or 6 years ago. The border patrol has used Beretta 96s in .40 S&W nearly since the .40 S&W came out. I have heard they use 155-grain hollow points, but I will not stand by that since I have never actually pulled and measured one. Additionally, in the section of "9mm NATO", they state that the 9mm NATO is an overpressure variant of the 9mm Luger which is not true. NATO measures case pressure mid-case, not at the case-mouth. Measuring mid-case will show a pressure increase of 8,000-10,000 psi, taking that into account, the pressures of 9mm NATO, 9mm Luger to SAMMI specs and 9mm Luger to CIP specs are all within the margin of error for each other and are therefore equivalent. One thing people seem to site when "proving" that NATO or CIP ammunition is "hotter" is the published muzzle velocity, however, most of the published muzzle velocity for european and NATO 9mm ammunition is from 7.5 inch test barrels as opposed to the 4 inch barrel used for SAMMI specifications, the M882 in particular is measured out of a Beretta M9 with a 4.9 inch barrel, thus giving a published muzzle velocity of 1263 +/-5 fps, which is exactly what it was designed for. If you put that same round in a 4 inch barrel, the bullet will lose approximately 75-100 fps per inch of barrel less it travels through and it will be exactly the same as any SAMMI standard pressure 9mm 112-115-grain Full Metal Jacket "Target Load". I'm sure there's more incorrect on this page as well as many of the other pages of various calibers, but I'll have to check them later. My hope is that you will not be promoting invalid sources, because these people are still around and still write books. And they change their mind as often as police departments chang their caliber/ammunition of choice. The reason is because they market for whomever pays them better at a given time. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 8000Shooter (talk • contribs) 21:43, 25 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
The mistake you made was this. If you find there are inaccuracies on the page, then address it at the Talk page of the article or you can simply fix the mistake by providing reliable sources and making the correction yourself. Adding the message about the articles inaccuracy isn't inappropriate and was rightly reverted. Regards, — MoeEpsilon22:48, 25 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Unfortunately for the reputation of Wikipedia, I don't find it SO important as to take 12 hours out of my day to rewrite the entire article citing VALID sources such as the US Army field manual, ballistic tests, news articles from 6 years ago etc. Let me make one thing clear AGAIN though, gunwriters are NOT valid sources, they're salesmen; if you insist on noting valid sources per topic, it should be just as important to confirm that they ARE. Massad Ayoob was a police officer and Marshall and Sanow were doctors... they print what they call "Street Results". One article written by Massad Ayoob claimed he witnessed an autopsy of a man shot directly in the heart with a Cor-Bon 115-grain +P+ 9mm and alleged the heart of the departed had been "shredded like burrito filling". To start with, that can't happen to your heart from a gunshot because the bullet will simply pass through it, it will not stop exactly in your heart and spin like a blender. As well, somebody who had actually witnessed what a bullet did inside a person would likely not be so childishly graphic about it... which he obviously has not seen the 30,000 autopsies he has claimed... if any. Anyway, the reason he claimed this is because Cor-Bon is or was at the time, a sponsor of Guns & Ammo and Handguns and their 9mm +P+ load is always being marketed as it is one of the most expensive factory 9mm loads on the market, much like the Glaser Safety Slug, also made by Cor-Bon. The point I'm making is these are no more valid sources thana kid who plays video games and tells you what brings the bad guys down. Do your job so Wikipedia stays factual. And for good measure, here is a copy of the small caliber field manual listing the 9mm NATOs mid-case pressure, bullet weight, velocity etc http://www.kmike.com/Ammo/tm%2043-0001-27.pdf 9mm is on page 12 and there are various other sources such as IDF easily attainible to civilians. You can also start on the other military calibers with this copy of the manual, after all, you're getting paid to verify information rather than attest that something was written in a magazine, right? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 8000Shooter (talk • contribs) 07:33, 28 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Unfortunately, no, we are all unpaid volunteers. I'm not going to lie and say I'm an expert at 9x19mm Parabellums, ballistics or any kind of weaponry. All I saw when I visited the article was you placing "this is inaccurate" at the top of the article and I reverted, since our websites policy to discuss inaccuracies and changes on the related talk page (in this case, it is at Talk:9×19mm Parabellum). However, to be more direct about the topic, if there are inaccurate sources on the article and you can provide more reliable sources (something we can cite in the references), you don't necessarily have to spend twelve hours re-writing the article. If you can tell me which sentences are inaccurate, tell me what it should say and provide me a reference I can put into the article, I can help you that way. I'll make a note at the talk page of you saying there might be inaccurate sources, of you listing the kmike source for use, and for someone to review it for accuracy. Regards, — MoeEpsilon11:14, 28 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
This is directed toward 8000shooter, Massad Ayoob is a former law enforcement officer, a professional witness, long time firearms instructor and has authored over 20 books, 1,000 articles and testified in hundreds of court cases on these very subjects. You may not like him or may disagree with him, but he is a valid source and certainly more reliable than some anonymous user who posts on Wikipedia under a screenname. If you want to challenge any material or introduce something new, please bring forth your sources. If it takes 12 hours to write a few sentences and give a credible, reliable source supporting your point of view; perhaps you should find something less daunting. Bullets can perform differently when they hit certain targets, if reading about a shredded heart offends you or a case where a felon took 11 rounds to the face and literally blew one out of his nose with a puddle of blood before he walked to the ambulance makes you squeamish, maybe you need to read articles about bullseye shooting instead. I do believe the one thing you may be correct about is that the picture in the article is not a 9mm. When I get a moment I will take a picture of a few 9mm rounds and replace it.--Mike - Μολὼν λαβέ17:45, 30 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
James Collins
I am pointing out a fact that James Collins does in fact have ginger hair. I will NOT appreciate you deleting this, it is a fact.
I would be grateful if you'd mind your own business.
The fact that he does or doesn't is irrelevant, it is not encyclopedic nor does it belong in the lead, so stop adding it. Regards, — MoeEpsilon14:15, 26 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
About "Charm School"-album of Roxette
First: I appreciate that you contacted me for say me that whae you say. Thank you!. Second: You say that some of the changes I made to artítulo entitled "Charm School" are not constructive; but you don't say what those changes that I made... I would like to know specifically what those cambinos not constructive of which you speak. Thank you!. — m3c4n013:06, 29 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hello. Sorry, I gave a generic template message which didn't explain exactly the details of why I reverted. I looked over your edit, if you hadn't since I reverted, and I think it should be clear why I reverted. Could you explain why you removed what you did? You removed the references section, the categories, the interwiki links and several other things vital to the article. These are normal things found at the bottom of the article on all of Wikipedia, and if you saw the version you left it at, it was a less than desirable appearance. Regards, — MoeEpsilon21:17, 29 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Jared Padalecki Protection
Hello,
I don't know if you're aware of why the Jared Padalecki page had been edited so much, but I feel I can inform you. Editing Jared's page is a task included on the list of items to obtain as part of the Greatest International Scavenger Hunt the World Has Ever Seen, which is run in part by Misha Collins who is a good friend and co-worker of Jared's. The page must be edited to include team names and to mention that Jared loves Misha. None of the edits are meant to do any harm and will have no lasting effect on the page's quality as the hunt itself ends in five days.
I feel that Jared wouldn't mind if his page was altered a bit for the sake of this hunt, but I can understand if you feel differently. However, with the page under protection, many teams now cannot complete this task. I am asking that you remove the protected status and allow teams to continue working their way through the list of challenges.
After a bit of researching what the GISHWHES is, you are in essence requesting a page be unprotected so you can change it for the purpose of inserting misinformation and general silliness. While you are correct that it leaves no lasting effect on the page, that is not a valid reason for unprotecting, so I'll decline your request to see the page unprotected. The page will be open for editing in about a week, by then your contest will have come to a close, though. Regards, — MoeEpsilon18:11, 30 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
In regards to the Thomas Peterffy, I feel it is partially my responsibility to remove personal opinions in a space designated for facts. Since Wikipedia is not an opinion column, or a forum for far left-wing rants, lets stick to the facts or at bare minimum put this brainless drivel in the criticism section.
Hi, I initially reverted you because you did not indicate why you were removing content, and removing large sections of content triggers a filter for unproductive editing. I reviewed the content and how long it had been there, and I agree with your removal. See that you leave an edit summary in the future indicating what you are doing when you edit Wikipedia so other editors can see. Thanks. Regards, — MoeEpsilon12:27, 31 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
How is telling facts a personal attack? May i ask which country you come from?
This is your only warning; if you make personal attacks on other people again, as you did at User talk:Moe Epsilon, you may be blocked from editing without further notice. Comment on content, not on other contributors or people. ZappaOMati 03:54, 1 November 2012 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.84.149.240 (talk)
I'm in the United States. And yes, I saw what ZappaOMati posted to your talk page, so why did you post it here? To answer you, the personal attack was calling me a "kid." If you have a problem with my editing, then please comment on that. Regards, — MoeEpsilon04:18, 1 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Manhattan
How is that not constructive? I didn't delete anything. It could be removed for "original research" since my source was hearing about the drink, rather than reading about it in an article. But in what sense is that possibly "not constrictive"???? 209.6.89.16 (talk) 12:32, 2 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hello. Sorry for the language of the warning I sent you, since it can be unclear at times. After looking at your edit, without a source (given the events of Hurricane Sandy on the Manhattan area of New York) it did not appear to be a constructive edit rather than a legitimate drink. If you can provide a source for the drink, by all means, provide one. Without one though, it's best left off until one can be provided. Regards, — MoeEpsilon12:40, 2 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Looking at the source, it does not appear to be reliable. That link is to a blog, which generally do not fall under are guidelines for citing information. Regards, — MoeEpsilon23:21, 2 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Shaken not stirred
I find it rather amusing that you would suggest that my additions weren't "constructive", as you put it. The information I provided clearly contributed to the subject matter. Furthermore, my second addition to the article was done in a manner to leave the original information, out of respect for the original contributor. The information you decided to leave there is still blatantly incorrect and is contradicted by earlier information in the same article. So if your attention to detail is as rigid as you would like to make it appear, I'd appreciate more consistency and less unsolicited condescension. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.226.4.14 (talk) 02:22, 5 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Edits like this are and shouldn't be encouraged. The proper way to dispute material on an article is going to the talk page (i.e Talk:Shaken, not stirred) and to dispute it there. In mid-article in all capital letters, is not how it is done. If you have references for unsourced material yourself, feel free to provide reliable sources and source the article yourself. Regards, — MoeEpsilon02:33, 5 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I am responding to your message that you edited the Wikipedia entry for “Hobbit” and your request for comments concerning the accuracy of your changes. Please note that your changes are, in fact, inaccurate and a violation of Wikipedia’s terms of service.
The Saul Zaentz Company owns numerous trademark registrations in the United States and around the world for Hobbit and marks that incorporate Hobbit. For many years the public has associated Hobbit exclusively with the iconic characters created by J. R. R. Tolkien, and the myriad of movies, goods and services our company and its licensees have marketed and sold under that trademark.
We are not aware of instances where our trademark Hobbit is used in non-Tolkien books but please let us know if you have examples of such use. But please note that, even if a third party were to make an unauthorized use of the trademark Hobbit that would not negate our global trademark rights or otherwise support your proposed Wikipedia edits.
As noted, by issuing numerous trademark registrations the United States Patent and Trademark Office and trademark offices around the world have for many years acknowledged the validity of the trademark Hobbit and The Saul Zaentz Company’s ownership of that trademark. Your attempts to edit the Wikipedia entry for Hobbit – by alleging that it is a generic term or “genericized trademark” - are therefore both factually and legally inaccurate.
As you know Wikipedia prohibits users from knowingly editing entries to include inaccurate or misleading information. We assume the foregoing information demonstrates that your proposed edits are both inaccurate and misleading and you will refrain from making any further similar edits. I assume you share our interest in resolving this matter amicably and without needing to request intervention from Wikipedia. To that end please let me know if you have any questions.
I have reverted your additions again, however, I have removed the sentence stating that there was a genericized trademark since it was unsourced. Regards, — MoeEpsilon18:40, 9 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hobbit (word)
Hi Moe,
Just curious as to why you feel it is necessary to hide the fact that the word, Hobbit, is in fact a registered trademark of the Saul Zaentz Company. Wikipedia is a place for individuals to hopefully find actual facts. Please explain yourself.
There are many words that are registered trademarks on Wikipedia, we don't need to identify the owner of every trademark word and/or insert the owner into the lead of the article. Please don't insert it again. Regards, — MoeEpsilon19:32, 9 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I'd just like to remind both of you of the three reverts rule. You've both been edit warring about the lead section, so please solve this first by discussing instead of reverting back and forth. It would also be helpful to use the article's talk page so other editors can voice their opinion. De728631 (talk) 22:58, 9 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I didn't plan on going back to the article any time soon, but considering his repeated edition of the same material has been reverted by five other editors, it is not a welcomed edition. Regards, — MoeEpsilon23:06, 9 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Should be, seemingly, since he started editing over disputing the text:
No matter the origin, it has since become a [[genericized trademark]] {{fact|date=November 2012}}, with hobbits appearing in non-Tolkien related works for several decades.
Thanks for tidying my revert [1]. I did it quickly from an ipad because I was scared I would forget it, meaning the material would remain deleted, and I could see it was not controversial. Just to clarify: I never added the material or noticed the tags. But I have read Peter Green's book, which I have a copy of somewhere, and I think the material should be fine.--Andrew Lancaster (talk) 14:17, 10 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Oh, it's no problem, I never deleted the text anyways. I simply wrapped the citation needed template around the text needing a cite instead of having it tacked on to the end of the sentence. :) The second sentence is still there on the article, but it appears like this[citation needed] in the article. Regards, — MoeEpsilon17:02, 10 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I appreciate your enthusiasm, but to avoid edit-conflicting the closing bureaucrat, you may consider waiting a couple of minutes after the RfA has been closed before updating the chronological tables. Thanks, 28bytes (talk) 23:55, 13 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Derp. I hadn't realized you closed it so close to me editing the table. By force of habit, I click the chronological listing after realizing it had been removed and figured I'd make the change. Sorry for the edit conflict. Regards, — MoeEpsilon23:59, 13 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
On a related note, why did you threaten Intoronto1125 with striking their RfA vote? You know, I suppose, that you have no authority to do so. I find their unexplained opposes irksome, but they have a right to do that, just as we have a right to ask for an explanation--but we have no right to strike their vote. Regards, Drmies (talk) 23:15, 16 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Someone who serially trolls RFA with opposes deserves to have their !vote striken if they don't provide a valid rationale. He has done so on many, many RFAs. And it's not an issue of whether I would or not, maybe I didn't phrase it correctly. The wider community would decide whether his vote would be stricken, not me. We (and I) have no authority to do so because we permit this kind of behavior, and it's about time people start standing up to people who persist. Regards, — MoeEpsilon23:19, 16 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Oh, I don't dispute the trolling part! Well, I've seen admins remove votes occasionally, but it's a rare thing. I suppose I could remove this one, but it doesn't seem to derail the RfA. You could consider getting a topic ban, I suppose, and that would prevent future mishap (since marking out votes in itself is kind of disruptive). Drmies (talk) 01:14, 17 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I suppose we could ask for a community ban, but since he went back and provided a rationale to the last RFA and to the most recent one, I'll hold back for now. I just find it frustrating that so little people are willing to challenge voters when they persistently do things like this and the most we are generally allowed to do is kindly ask them for an explanation they hardly ever give. At some point we have to discourage the behavior rather than frown upon it. Regards, — MoeEpsilon01:24, 17 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hmm, that's strange, NFL.com didn't list the stats of Gabbert or Skelton like they normally would when quarterbacks change mid-game. Regards, — MoeEpsilon04:49, 19 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, I think you made a mistake in your revision of List of waterfalls of England. You "identified as test/vandalism" my edit, which is erroneous. Therefore, your revision is without basis and may be construed as test/vandalism. Your reversion has been reverted. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.69.44.137 (talk) 04:16, 25 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
A list of another countries waterfalls not existing is not a valid reason for deletion. See Category:Lists of waterfalls for all other articles on lists of waterfalls as well. Not only that, but blanking an article does not propose it for deletion. If you feel it should be deleted, go through the process of WP:AFD if you really think it should be deleted. If you don't, stop blanking the article. Regards, — MoeEpsilon04:26, 25 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Congratulations
100000 Edits
Congratulations on reaching 100000 edits. You have achieved a milestone that very few editors have been able to accomplish. The Wikipedia Community thanks you for your continuing efforts. Keep up the good work!
If you like you can add this userbox to your collection.
This user has been awarded with the 100000 Edits award.
stop fucking editing my posts like you know what you are talking about. i have direct affilitation with the program and you keep erasing stuff. go find another article to fuck with man because i know what i am talking about you 8=D like who the fuck are you man? stop messing with our page. please it was constructive cause the comment was a motherfucking cunting lie!
what the motherhell are you talking about? i deleted the lacrosse lie? you son need to get your facts straight i do not stand for this bullshit pigshit and treason.. no taxation without motherfucking representation son! Broad
I was letting my younger brother use my laptop earlier, seems he edited the Wes Craven article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ash Loomis (talk • contribs)
Hold on a sec. This really shouldn't be done unless it's using a bot account. Every time you edit a User talk: page you're going to trigger the new messages banner, whereas a bot won't. Legoktm (talk) 00:49, 28 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Most of these appear to be user talk archives and User subpages for awards, so I'm not terribly worried about triggering a ton of new messages. Regards, — MoeEpsilon00:51, 28 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
(edit conflict) @Legoktm: It's easier to find a user with AWB available than an open bot that has been approved for miscellaneous jobs. I was doing these manually, so I was bringing up the new messages banner as well.
For the pages I skip, I'll avoid using AWB and do it manually, but like Homer said, that will be a new message to a user regardless. Regards, — MoeEpsilon00:55, 28 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
That really doesn't make sense either. If there's a reason not do something with AWB, there's probably a reason it shouldn't be done manually.
The reason I wouldn't use AWB to do it is because it is a rapid-pace, automated tool, compared to a slow, human edit. Regardless, I won't bother with the user talk pages if you actually think it's going to be a problem. User pages, talk page archives and barnstar subpages won't trigger a message to the user, so my entire queue of AWB edits lined up are those pages. Once that is over, if you think there is a better solution to not trigger messages, we can do that. Regards, — MoeEpsilon01:07, 28 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
So I did some digging and CommonsDelinker does in-fact rename files. In fact, this image file is currently waiting in the queue. So there is really no point in doing this manually. Legoktm (talk) 01:13, 28 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Oh, well in that case, since it's already in the queue on Commons, I'll let the bot do it. I know we have CommonsDelinker, but I assumed since it was requested here it was a local issue. Regards, — MoeEpsilon01:17, 28 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I don't believe so. Since it's not a particularly pressing matter, there's no reason to worry. It might be 24 hours, but it will all get replaced. :) Regards, — MoeEpsilon02:04, 28 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I didn't think it could, but didn't hurt to ask. :) With the userpages and subpages taken care of, having a couple left isn't a biggie for 24 hours. :) Thanks again for your help Moe. :) - Neutralhomer • Talk • 02:11, 28 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
No problem :) Yeah, probably better that way. If you come across a red-link by chance, feel free to correct it, but it will get done soon regardless. Regards, — MoeEpsilon08:56, 28 November 2012 (UTC) (We wants it. We needs it. Must have the precious!)[reply]
Unsure. Like most bots, I'm sure it would try to remove it from a protected article. I'm unsure of the permissions of this particular bot. Regards, — MoeEpsilon12:33, 28 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
We'll see. Even if it is successful, this would still look ridiculous. "What I stand I stand for" implied "for the photographer", who was blocked then and is missed now. Even if the file name was not a good choice, to just delete it distorts history now, on hundreds of pages. Do you see a solution? Is there a soft redirect for pictures? Could a similar one be uploaded under the old name, without getting renamed? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:46, 28 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Oh, I see what you are getting at now. Unfortunately, no. The lineage of prior revisions are subject to current and future changes, at least in regards to images. The User Page Design Center suffered a lot from this, in the case of showing off prior designs, images, etc. that were considered the best in their Hall of Fame :/ I'm praying for software updates to the site that take a sort of screenshot rather than just spitting up the prior code. As far as I know, there is no soft redirect for images. We could always keep a local copy of the image at the old file name, but that is only typically done at the current file name at Commons, and for other reasons than what we need. Regards, — MoeEpsilon13:02, 28 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you for the answer, I think I got it. Anyway, the user did it manually, and the bot started working, never mind the edit summary (pear-shaped distinguished that pic from the others showing a Yogo sapphire, and the German WP laughed a lot about "cornflower blue" when I translated the article. I will look over there myself, only a few links, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:52, 28 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I don't understand how, but now a redirect seems in place, great! - Precious: I wanted to give it to you, looked up your marvellous contributions, 100.000 edits, thought about the heading "wrestling technology expert gnome", - but then saw that you supported the ban of the designer. May I ask you to scroll over his archive ad contribs, for a quick check if such a user should have been banned? - Then ask Neutralhomer to give you Precious ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:44, 28 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
The redirect was a nice fix, I just saw that. I don't necessarily support he ban of Jack Merridew (and I've always said that he made excellent article contributions), but there was problems with the sockpuppeting and all that - mostly that he continued on after he said he wouldn't, which was the most disappointing. I think if he stuck to one account like he said he would, there wouldn't have been a reason to ban him at all. I fully admit to tagging all of the sockpuppet userpages to categorize them into one category for full clarification of all the accounts he once used; I was not gravedancing his departure. Regards, — MoeEpsilon00:04, 29 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Oh Malleus.. With ArbCom sanctions getting harsher recently, I fear him going down the same slippery slope as Merridew for the civility thing. :/ Regards, — MoeEpsilon00:37, 30 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Oh, well the Jack Merridew name was probably the one the was first highly publicized during the whole fiasco when it first started, making it the most "popular". Davenbelle is the oldest account though. I guess it's just a formality; it would be weird to mark the older account as a sockpuppet of a newer account. Regards, — MoeEpsilon17:01, 30 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Had a read of the Wikipediocracy article a while back, just to get different perspectives on the banning (I'm more level-headed than most outside forums portray me, maybe I always wasn't always the best guy in the past, but I digress). Thanks for the tasty treats. Regards, — MoeEpsilon22:53, 30 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I purged the cache of the archive page you linked me and it seems fine. Probably a left over from it being moved, then a redirect, then having to be transcluded again. If you purge the pages you see, then it should come up normal. Regards, — MoeEpsilon08:40, 3 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hi Rubin. The Commons "Move and Replace" feature now allows for the user to replace the files themselves if the amount of files is small using the local wiki account. If the number of file usage is large (from what I've seen, about 30-40 or more) then the task is sent to CommonsDelinker. Regards, — MoeEpsilon16:55, 30 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Ok, I didn't rename images on Commons for a quite long time and didn't know about this feature. I've granted you 'autopatrol' right in ru.wiki to keep from mess in 'recent changes'. Thank you for explanations :) Rubin16 (talk) 10:16, 2 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Why did you remove my information given on Mario Gotze, i was letting people know that he is happy and now in a relationship, which is more than you can do, please give me a sensible reason you removed my post. And i dare ask you if i was lying? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.175.96.218 (talk • contribs)
It's fine, a lot of people don't understand the policy on non-free images. Most websites that take photographs like that are copyrighted to the publisher or the photographer. Notability turns out to have little to do with the policy. For images of living individuals, the picture must be released under a free license, because Wikipedia doesn't take images of living people that are copyrighted. When you visit the site, it says "Photo by Larry Busacca/Getty Images for Clear Channel". If it is marked as by Getty Images, then it's copyrighted unless stated otherwise. For the article, we can probably add images of the performers from their main articles since those images are under free licenses. Regards, — MoeEpsilon05:27, 13 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]
guidance
i don't know whether to write here . i need your guidance. i edited outline of sports. you undid it. i require guidance how to do correctly.
i found google and many wikipedia articles. i like to play youtube video on "outline of sports" page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Xtremefans (talk • contribs) 13:48, 14 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hello. I went back to check what you meant and I saw that I undid your edit. Currently it is not possible to embed YouTube videos onto Wikipedia, so there isn't any amount of guidance I can provide in this area. If you would like to see how videos are used on Wikipedia, you can take a look at Wikipedia:Videos for more information. I wouldn't try to get that video onto Wikipedia however, unless you knew it was free of copyright (see the link I provided), lest you may waste a lot of time trying to get it uploaded to Wikipedia. Regards, — MoeEpsilon17:23, 14 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Im thinking of editing the page. I need to show this young man's contributions to the world. He has been central in Ardfert's sporting and social successes. With your permission id like to create a page for him and edit Ardfert's with him in it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 93.107.98.121 (talk) 12:01, 16 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hello. If you are interested in creating an article, I would suggest heading over the Articles for Creation (see also requested articles), following the instructions there, and providing some kind of evidence of his notability (why he deserves an article). Once you do, and he passes the criteria, then an article can be made. Regards, — MoeEpsilon12:13, 16 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Courtly love
The page is being edited by a class at some college, and the students are obviously inexperienced with WP. I've been letting them be for the time being and figure that I will deal with the material they've contributed when the class ends. Since the edit you re-added was originally contributed by the same person who removed it, I'm going to undo your edit. Deor (talk) 21:29, 17 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hi brother, it's me again. I just love my country. I could not resist the temptation. Sorry again. Happy Xmas. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.139.42.98 (talk • contribs)
You want to challenge what I said. Then read all my sources on theoi. You asked for it. I am going to give you every source. I read, read what I said slowly. Nothing I put in is false. Zeus returns Asclepius and the Cyclopes from Hades. What I put in about why Zeus returned Asclepius and the Cyclopes. Is what I read. My statement about Hades holding the dead prisoner in the underworld is true. Very few people go back into the world above. Read about Dionysus returning his mother from Hades. Read about Orpheus returning Eurydike. Why failed Hades didnt want to give her up. Also read about Hercules returning Alkestis from Hades. Also read about Hercules freeing Theseus. Read the story of Asclepius and why he died. As far as you deleting what I put in about Hades and Poseidon also defeating the titans with Zeus. That is a fact. You have no right to delete anything that is a fact. Like I said Wikipedia is a free domain. You dont make the rules. Your a vandal. Read what I said slowly. Have fun reading all my sources. If you want to challenge what I put in.
Orphic Hymn 18 to Pluton (trans. Taylor) (Greek hymns C3rd B.C. to 2nd A.D.) : "To Plouton [Haides]. Plouton, magnanimous, whose realms profound are fixed beneath the firm and solid ground, in the Tartarean plains remote from sight, and wrapt for ever in the depths of night. Zeus Khthonios (of the Underworld), thy sacred ear incline, and pleased accept these sacred rites divine. Earth’s keys to thee, illustrious king, belong, its secret gates unlocking, deep and strong. ‘Tis thine abundant annual fruits to bear, for needy mortals are thy constant care. To thee, great king, all sovereign earth assigned, the seat of gods and basis of mankind. Thy throne is fixed in Haides’ dismal plains, distant, unknown to the rest, where darkness reigns; where, destitute of breath, pale spectres dwell, in endless, dire, inexorable hell; and in dread Akheron, whose depths obscure, earth’s stable roots eternally secure. O mighty Daimon, whose decision dread, the future fate determines of the dead, with Demeter’s girl [Persephone] captive, through grassy plains, drawn in a four-yoked car with loosened reins, rapt over the deep, impelled by love, you flew till Eleusinia’s city rose to view: there, in a wondrous cave obscure and deep, the sacred maid secure from search you keep, the cave of Atthis, whose wide gates display an entrance to the kingdoms void of day. Of works unseen and seen thy power alone to be the great dispending source is known. All-ruling, holy God, with glory bright, thee sacred poets and their hymns delight, propitious to thy mystics’ works incline, rejoicing come, for holy rites are thine."
PALACE OF HAIDES "There, in front [at the ends of the earth], stand the echoing halls of the god of the lower-world, strong Hades, and of awful Persephone. A fearful hound guards the house in front ... keeps watch and devours whomsoever he catches going out of the gates of strong Hades and awful Persephone." - Hesiod, Theogony 767 "The shadowy place of the dead and passed the black gates which hold back the souls of the dead, for all their protestations." - Greek Elegaic Theognis, Frag 1.703 "The Stygian city and the cruel court of swarthy Dis [Haides]. Countless broad entrances that city has and portals everywhere open ... There the Umbrae (Shades) wander without flesh or blood or bones; some gather in the central square; some throng the courts of Tyrannus Imus (Hell’s King) [Haides]." - Ovid, Metamorphoses 4.437 "What of him who holds sway over the dark realm? Where sits he, governing his flitting tribes? There is a place in dark recess of Tartarus [i.e. in Haides], which with a heavy pall dense mists enshroud. Hence flow from a single source two streams, unlike: one, a placid river (by this do the gods sear), with silent current bears on the sacred Styx; the other with mighty roar rushes fiercely on, rolling down rocks in its flood, Acheron, that cannot be recrossed. The royal hall of Dis [Haides] stands opposite, girt by a double moat, and the huge house is hid by an o’ershadowing grove. Here in a spacious cavern the tyrant’s doors overhang; this is the road for spirits, this is the kingdom’s gate. A plain lies round about this where sits the god, where with haughty mien his awful majesty assorts the new-arriving souls. Lowering is his brow, yet such as wears the aspect of his brothers and his high race; his countenance is that of Jove, but Jove the thunderer; chief part of that realm’s grimness is its own lord, whose aspect whate’er is dreaded dreads." - Seneca, Hercules Furens 707 "Beneath our pole [the earth] cut off from the things of the upper world, deep down lies the palace of the Tartarean Father [Haides]; never would it share the fate of the toppling sky, even if the mass were sent rolling ... wide-mouthed Chaos lies, so huge that it would swallow all matter, wearied with its own burden, and the falling universe. Here are the twin doors of the Shades below; one [the gate of Haides], by stern law ever open, receives nations and kinds ... by the left gate, how many monstrous creatures stand upon the threshold." - Valerius Flaccus, Argonautica 1.830 "The lord of Erebus [Haides], enthroned in the midst of the fortress of his dolorous realm." - Statius, Thebaid 8.21 "Himself [lord Haides] I behold, all pale upon the throne, with Stygian Eumenides [Erinyes] ministering to his fell deeds about him, and the remorseless chambers and gloomy couch of Stygian Juno [Persephone]." - Statius, Thebaid 4.520
KEYS OF HAIDES "Aiakos, even after death, is honoured in the company of Plouton [Haides], and has charge of the keys of Hades’ realm." - Apollodorus, The Library 3.159 "[Depicted on table made by Kolotes at Olympia] On the other are Plouton [Hades], Dionysos, Persephone and Nymphai ... As to the key (Plouton holds a key) they say that what is called Haides has been locked up by Plouton, and that nobody will return back again there from." - Pausanias, Guide to Greece 5.20.2-3 "Earth’s keys to thee, illustrious king [Haides], belong, its secret gates unlocking, deep and strong." - Orphic Hymn 18 to Pluton
HAIDES ATTENDANTS: ROYAL COURT Haides was enthroned in Erebos surrounded by a court consisting of the three Judges of the Dead, the Erinyes (Chthonian Vengeance Demons), the Moirai (Fates), the Keres (Death-Demons) and Thanatos (Death), as well as the personified underworld Rivers. "The lord of Erebus [Haides], enthroned in the midst of the fortress of his dolorous realm, was demanding of his subjects the misdoings of their lives, pitying nought human but wroth against all the Manes (Shades). Around him stand the Furiae [Erinyes] and various Mortes (Deaths) [Thanatoi or Keres] in order due, and savage Poena (Vengeance) thrusts forth her coils of jangling chains; the Fatae (Fates) [Moirai] bring the Animas (Souls) and with one gesture [literally “thumb” as in the amphitheatre] damn them; too heavy grows the work. Hard by, Minos with his dread brother [Rhadamanthys] in kindly mood counsels a milder justice, and restrains the bloodthirsty king; Cocytus and Phelgethon, swollen with tears and fire, aid in the judgement, and Styx accuses the gods of perjury." - Statius, Thebaid 8.21 "Himself [lord Haides] I behold, all pale upon the throne, with Stygian Eumenides [Erinyes] ministering to his fell deeds about him, and the remorseless chambers and gloomy couch of Stygian Juno [Persephone]. Black Mors [Thanatos god of death] sits upon an eminence, and numbers the silent peoples for their lord; yet the greater part of the troop remains. The Gortynian judge [Minos] shakes them [the ghosts of the dead] in his inexorable urn, demanding the truth with threats, and constrains them to speak out their whole lives’ story and at last confess their extorted gains." - Statius, Thebaid 4.520
HADES & THE HERO ORPHEUS When Orpheus came to the underworld seeking the return of his dead love Eurydike, Haides and Persephone were moved by his pleas and agreed to let her return. Pseudo-Apollodorus, Bibliotheca 1. 14 (trans. Aldrich) (Greek mythographer C2nd A.D.) : "When his [Orpheus'] wife Eurydike died from a snake-bite, Orpheus descended into Haides’ realm with the desire to bring her back up to earth, and persuade Plouton [Hades] to release her. Plouton promised to do this if on the return trip Orpheus would not turn round before reaching his own home. But he disobeyed, and turned to look at his wife, who thereupon went back down again." Pseudo-Hyginus, Astronomica 2. 7 (trans. Grant) (Roman mythographer C2nd A.D.) : "Orpheus . . . was passionately devoted to music. It is thought that by his skill he could charm even wild beasts to listen. When, grieving for his wife Eurydice, he descended to the Lower World, he praised the children of the gods in his song." Ovid, Metamorphoses 10. 8 ff (trans. Melville) (Roman epic C1st B.C. to C1st A.D.) : "The new-wed bride [Eurydike, wife of Orpheus] . . . fell dying when a serpent struck her heel. And when at last the bard Rhodopeius [Orpheus] had mourned his fill in the wide world above, he dared descend through Taenaria’s dark gate to Styx to make trial of the Umbrae (Shades); and through the thronging wraiths and grave-spent ghosts he came to pale Persephone and him, Dominus Umbrarum (Lord of the Shades) [Haides], who rules the unlovely realm, and as he struck his lyre’s sad chords he said : `Ye deities who rule the world below, whither we mortal creatures all return, if simple truth, direct and genuine, may by your leave be told, I have come down not with intent to see the glooms of Tartara, nor to enchain the triple-snaked necks of Medusaeum [Kerberos], but for my dear wife’s sake, in whom a trodden viper poured his venom and stole her budding years. My heart has sought strength to endure; the attempt I’ll not deny; but love has won, a god whose fame is fair in the world above; but here I doubt, though here too, I surmise; and if that ancient tale of ravishment is true, you too were joined in love. Now by these regions filled with fear, by this huge Chaos, these vast silent realms, reweave, I implore, the fate unwound too fast of my Eurydice. To you are owed ourselves and all creation; a brief while we linger; then we hasten, late or soon to one abode; here on road leads us all; here in the end is home; over humankind your kingdom keeps the longest sovereignty. She too, when ripening years reach their due term, shall own your rule. The favour that I ask is but to enjoy her love; and, if fate will not reprieve her, my resolve is clear not to return: may two deaths give you cheer.’ So to the music of his strings he [Orpheus] sang, and all the bloodless spirits wept to hear; and Tantalus forgot the fleeing water, Ixion’s wheel was tranced; the Belides [Danaides] laid down their urns; the vultures left their feast, and Sisyphus sat rapt upon his stone. Then first by that sad ringing overwhelmed, the Eumenides’ [Erinyes’] cheeks, it’s said, were wet with tears; and the queen [Persephone] and he whose sceptre rules the underworld could not deny the prayer, and called Eurydice. She was among the recent ghosts and, limping from her wound, came slowly forth; and Rhodopeius [Orpheus] took his bride and with her this compact that, till he reach the world above and leave Valles Avernae [Valleys of Hell], he look not back or else the gift would fail. The track climbed upwards, steep and indistinct, through the hushed silence and the murky gloom; and now they neared the edge of the bright world, and, fearing lest she faint, longing to look, he turned his eyes--and straight she slipped away. He stretched his arms to hold her--to be held--and clasped, poor soul, naught but the yielding air. And she, dying again, made no complaint (for what complaint had she save she was loved?) and breathed a faint farewell, and turned again back to the land of spirits whence she came. The double death of his Eurydice stole Orpheus‘ wits away . . . He longed, he begged, in vain to be allowed to cross the stream of Styx a second time. The ferryman [Kharon] repulsed him. Even so for seven days he sat upon the bank, unkempt and fasting, anguish, grief and tears his nourishment, and cursed Erebus’ cruelty." Seneca, Hercules Furens 569 ff (trans. Miller) (Roman tragedy C1st A.D.) : "Orpheus had power to bend the ruthless lords of the shades [Haides and Persephone] by song and suppliant prayer, when he sought back his Eurydice. The art which had drawn the trees and birds and rocks, which had stayed the course of rivers, at whose sound the beasts had stopped to listen, soothes the underworld with unaccustomed strains, and rings out clearer in those unhearing realms. Eurydice the Thracian brides bewail; even the gods, whom no tears can move, bewail her; and they [the Erinyes] who with awful brows investigate men’s crimes and sift out ancient wrongs, as they sit in judgment bewail Eurydice. At length death’s lord [Haides] exclaims : `We own defeat; go forth to the upper world, yet by this appointed doom--fare thou as comrade behind thy husband, and thou, look not back upon thy wife until bright day shall have revealed the gods of heaven, and the opening of Spartan Taenarus shall be at hand.' True love hates delay and brooks it not; while he hastes to look upon his prize, ‘tis lost. The realm which could be overcome by song, that realm shall strength have power to overcome." Statius, Thebaid 8. 21 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "Must I [Haides] so oft endure the profanation of Chaos by living strangers? . . . It shames me too, alas! how Tartarus opened a way to the Odyrsian plaint [Orpheus]; with my own eyes I saw the Eumenides [Erinyes] shed base tears at those persuasive strains, and the Sisters [the Moirai or Fates] repeat their allotted task; me too--, but the violence of my cruel law was stronger."
II) HERAKLES & ALKESTIS Herakles was sometimes described as battling Haides for the life of Queen Alkestis, who had agreed to die in place of her husband Admetos. Pseudo-Apollodorus, Bibliotheca 1. 106 (trans. Aldrich) (Greek mythographer C2nd A.D.) : "[Apollon] obtained from the Moirai (Fates) a privilege for [King] Admetos, whereby, when it was time for him to die, he would be released from death if someone should volunteer to die in his place. When his day to die came . . . [his wife] Alkestis died for him. Kore [Persephone], however sent her back, or, according to some, Herakles battled Haides and brought her back up to Admetos."
HADES WRATH : PIRITHOUS & THESEUS The hero Peirithoos sought to abduct Persephone, the bride of Haides. As punishment the god trapped him on a stone chair and eternal torment. Theseus, who accompanied him on the expedition, was freed at the request of Herakles. Pseudo-Apollodorus, Bibliotheca E1. 23 - 24 (trans. Aldrich) (Greek mythographer C2nd A.D.) : "Theseus and Peirithoos agreed with each other to marry daughters of Zeus, so Theseus with the other’s help kidnapped twelve-year-old Helene from Sparta, and went down to Haides’ realm to court Persephone for Peirithoos . . . Theseus, arriving in Haides’ realm with Peirithoos, was thoroughly deceived, for Haides on the pretense of hospitality had them sit first upon the throne of Lethe (Forgetfulness). Their bodies grew onto it, and were held down by the serpent’s coils. Now Peirithous remained fast there for all time, but Herakles led Theseus back up." Pseudo-Apollodorus, Bibliotheca 2. 124 (trans. Aldrich) (Greek mythographer C2nd A.D.) : "As he [Herakles] approached the gates of Haides’ realm [in his quest to fetch Kerberos], he came across Theseus along with Peirithoos, who had courted Persephone with matrimonial intentions and for this reason was held fast as was Theseus. When they saw Herakles they stretched forth their hands as if to rise up with the help of his strength. He did in fact pull Theseus up by the hand, but when he wanted to raise Peirithoos, the earth shook and he let go." Diodorus Siculus, Library of History 4. 63. 4 (trans. Oldfather) (Greek historian C1st B.C.) : "Peirithoos [after helping Theseus abduct Helene] now decided to seek the hand of Persephone in marriage, and when he asked Theseus to make the journey with him Theseus at first endeavoured to dissuade him and to turn him away from such a deed as being impious; but since Peirithoos firmly insisted upon it Theseus was bound by the oaths to join with him in the deed. And when they had at last made their way below to the regions of Haides, it came to pass that because of the impiety of their act they were both put in chains, and although Theseus was later let go by reason of the favour with which Herakles regarded him, Peirithoos because of the impiety remained in Haides, enduring everlasting punishment; but some writers of myths say that both of them never returned." Diodorus Siculus, Library of History 4. 26. 1 : "Herakles then, according to the myths which have come down to us, descended into the realm of Haides, and being welcomed like a brother by Persephone brought Theseus and Peirithoos back to the upper world after freeing them from their bonds. This he accomplished by the favour of Persephone, and receiving the dog Kerberos in chains he carried him away to the amazement of all and exhibited him to men." Plutarch, Life of Theseus 31.2 & 35. 1 (trans. Perrin) (Greek historian C1st to C2nd A.D.) : "[Theseus] to return the service of Peirithoos, [who helped him abduct Helene] journeyed with him to Epiros, in quest of the daughter of Aidoneus the king of the Molossians. This man called his wife Phersephone, his daughter Kora, and his dog Kerberos, with which beast he ordered that all suitors of his daughter should fight, promising her to him that should overcome it. However, when he learned that Peirithoos and his friend were come not to woo, but to steal away his daughter, he seized them both. Peirithoos he put out of the way at once by means of the dog, but Theseus he kept in close confinement . . . Now while Herakles was the guest of Aidoneus the Molossian, the king incidentally spoke of the adventure of Theseus and Peirithoos, telling what they had come there to do, and what they had suffered when they were found out. Herakles was greatly distressed by the inglorious death of the one, and by the impending death of the other. As for Peirithoos, he thought it useless to complain, but he begged for the release of Theseus, and demanded that this favour be granted him. Aidoneus yielded to his prayers, Theseus was set free, and returned to Athens, where his friends were not yet altogether overwhelmed." Aelian, Historical Miscellany 4. 5 (trans. Wilson) (Greek rhetorician C2nd to 3rd A.D.) : "Benefits were remembered, and thanks for them given, by Theseus to Herakles. Aïdoneus king of the Molossians put Theseus in chains when he came with Pirithous to kidnap the king’s wife [i.e. Persephone]. Theseus did not want to marry the woman himself but did this as a favour to Pirithous. Herakles came to the country of the Molossians and rescued Theseus, in return for which the latter set up an altar to him." Pseudo-Hyginus, Fabulae 79 (trans. Grant) (Roman mythographer C2nd A.D.) : "When Jove [Zeus] saw that they [Theseus & Peirithous] had such audacity [kidnapping Helene] as to expose themselves to danger, he bade them in a dream both go and ask Pluto on Pirithous’ part for Proserpina [Persephone] in marriage. When they had descended to the Land of the Dead through the peninsula Taenarus, and had informed Pluto [Haides] why they had come, they were stretched out and tortured for a long time by the Furies. When Hercules came to lead out the three-headed dog, they begged his promise of protection. He obtained the favor from Pluto, and brought them out unharmed." Ovid, Heroides 2. 67 ff (trans. Showerman) (Roman poetry C1st B.C. to C1st A.D.) : "With record of his [Theseus'] deeds. When men shall have read of . . . the knocking at the gloomy palace of the darksome god." Seneca, Phaedra 93 ff (trans. Miller) (Roman tragedy C1st A.D.) : "Through the deep shades of the pool which none recrosses is he [Theseus] faring, this brave recruit of a madcap suitor [Peirithoos], that from the very throne of the infernal king [Haides] he may rob and bear away his wife [Persephone]. He hurries on, a partner in mad folly; him nor fear nor shame held back. And there in the depths of Acherontis [i.e. the underworld] he seeks adultery and an unlawful bed." Seneca, Phaedra 147 ff : "Suppose that Theseus is indeed held fast [in the underworld], hidden away in Lethean depths, and must suffer Stygia [i.e. the underworld] eternally." Seneca, Phaedra 222 ff : "Trust not in Dis [Haides]. Though he bar his realm, and though the Stygian dog [Kerberos] keep guard o’er the grim doors, Theseus alone finds out forbidden ways." Seneca, Phaedra 625 ff : "The overlord of the fast-holding realm and of the silent Styx has made no way to the upper world once quitted; and will he let the robber [Theseus] of his couch go back? Unless, perchance, even Pluton sits smiling upon love!" Seneca, Phaedra 951 : "[Theseus was] in depths of Tartarus, in presence of dread Dis [Haides], and imminent menace of hell’s lord." Seneca, Phaedra 1149 ff : "Theseus looks on sky and upper world and has escaped from the pools of Stygia, chaste one, thou owest naught to thine uncle, the all-devouring; unchanged the tale remains for the infernal king [i.e. he keeps his bride]." Seneca, Phaedra 1217 ff : "[Theseus returned from the underworld laments his unhappy lot :] `Alcides, give back his boon to Dis [Haides]; give me up again to the ghosts whom I escaped. Impiously, I make vain prayers for the death I left behind.; " Statius, Thebaid 8. 21 (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "Must I [Haides] so oft endure the profanation of Chaos by living strangers? The rash ardour of Pirithous provoked me, and Theseus, sworn comrade of his daring friend [when the pair attempted to abduct Persephone]."
HADES WRATH : ASCLEPIUS Diodorus Siculus, Library of History 4. 71. 3 (trans. Oldfather) (Greek historian C1st B.C.) : "It was believed that he [Asklepios] had brought back to life many who had died. Consequently, the myth goes on to say, Haides brought accusation against Asklepios, charging him before Zeus of acting to the detriment of his own province, for, he said, the number of the dead was steadily diminishing, now that men were being healed by Asklepios. So Zeus, in indignation, slew Asklepios with his thunderbolt." Aesop, Fables 133 (from Chambry & Babrius, Fabulae Aesopeae 75) (trans. Gibbs) (Greek fable C6th B.C.) : "[This fable by Aesop contains an allusion to the story of Asklepios :] There was once a doctor who knew nothing about medicine. One of his patients was feeling quite weak, but everyone insisted, 'Don't give up, you will get well; your illness is the sort that lasts for a while, but then you will feel better.' The doctor, however, marched in and declared : `I'm not going to play games with you or tell you lies: you need to take care of all your affairs, because you are going to die; you are not going to last more than another day.' Having said this, the doctor did not even bother to come back again. After a while the patient recovered from his illness and was venturing out of doors, although he was not yet fully steady on his feet. When the doctor ran into the patient, he greeted him, and asked how all the people down in Haides were doing. The patient said, `They are taking it easy, drinking the water of Lethe. But Persephone and the mighty god Plouton [Haides] were just now threatening terrible things against all the doctors, since they keep the sick people from dying. Every single doctor was denounced, and they were ready to put you at the top of the list. This scared me, so I immediately stepped forward and grasped their royal sceptres as I solemnly swore that this was simply a ridiculous accusation, since you are not really a doctor at all."
Homer, Iliad and Odyssey (Greek epic C8th B.C.) : References to Haides in the Iliad and Odyssey, which mostly describe passage to the underworld, can be found on the Realm of Haides I page. Hesiod, Theogony 453 ff (trans. Evelyn-White) (Greek epic C8th or 7th B.C.) : "Haides, pitiless in heart, who dwells under the earth." Theognis, Fragment 1. 244 ff (trans. Gerber, Vol. Greek Elegiac) (Greek elegy C6th B.C.) : "When you go to Aides’ house of wailing, down in the dark earth’s depths." Anacreon, Frag 405 (from Scholiast on Hesiod) (trans. Campbell, Vol. Greek Lyric II) (C6th B.C.) : "Theos Khthonios [i.e. Haides] may mean god of the lower world or sullen god." Aeschylus, Agamemnon 1372 ff (trans. Weir Smyth) (Greek tragedy C5th B.C.) : "Klytaimestra [describes how she murdered Agamemnon] : Twice I struck him, and with two groans his limbs relaxed. Once he had fallen, I dealt him yet a third stroke to grace my prayer to the infernal (khthonios) Zeus, the savior of the dead (nekrôn sôtêr). Fallen thus, he gasped away his life." Aeschylus, Eumenides 273 ff : "For Haides is mighty in holding mortals to account under the earth, and he observes all things and within his mind inscribes them." Aeschylus, Libation Bearers 355 ff : "A ruler of august majesty [King Agamemnon], distinguished even beneath the earth, and minister of the mightiest, the deities who rule in the nether world [Haides and Persephone]. For in your life you were a king of those who have the power to assign the portion of death [i.e. a king has the power of death over his subjects], and who wield the staff all mortals obey." Aeschylus, Prometheus Bound 153 ff : "Haides, the entertainer of the dead (nekrodegmôn)." Aeschylus, Suppliant Women 227 ff : "And how can man be pure who would seize from an unwilling father an unwilling bride? For such an act, not even in Haides, after death, shall he escape arraignment for outrage. There also among the dead, so men tell, another Zeus [Haides] holds a last judgment upon misdeeds. Take heed and reply in this manner, that victory may attend your cause." Aeschylus, Doubtul Fragment 243 (from Hesychius, Lexicon s.v. empedês) : "May Haides, whose portion is the earth, seize and fetter thee!" Aesop, Fables 133 (Chambry 133 & Babrius, Fabulae Aesopeae 75) (trans. Gibbs) (Greek fable C6th B.C.) : "[A fable told in jest :] Persephone and the mighty god Plouton [Haides] were just now threatening terrible things against all the doctors, since they keep the sick people from dying." Plato, Cratylus 400d & 402d - 404b (trans. Fowler) (Greek philosopher C4th B.C.) : "[Plato constructs philosophical etymologies for the names of the gods :] Sokrates : Let us inquire what thought men had in giving them [the gods] their names . . . The first men who gave names [to the gods] were no ordinary persons, but high thinkers and great talkers . . . Let us, then, speak of his [Zeus] brothers, Poseidon and Plouton, including also the other name of the latter . . . Plouton, he was so named as the giver of wealth (ploutos), because wealth comes up from below out of the earth. And Haides--I fancy most people think that this is a name of the Invisible (aeidês), so they are afraid and call him Plouton. I think people have many false notions about the power of this god, and are unduly afraid of him. They are afraid because when we are once dead we remain in his realm for ever, and they are also terrified because the soul goes to him without the covering of the body. But I think all these facts, and the office and the name of the god, point in the same direction . . . Please answer this question : Which is the stronger bond upon any living being to keep him in any one place, desire, or compulsion? Hermogenes : Desire, Socrates, is much stronger. Sokrates : Then do you not believe there would be many fugitives from Haides, if he did not bind with the strongest bond those who go to him there? . . . Apparently, then, if he binds them with the strongest bond, he binds them by some kind of desire, not by compulsion . . . There are many desires, are there not? . . . Then he binds with the desire which is the strongest of all, if he is to restrain them with the strongest bond ... And is there any desire stronger than the thought of being made a better man by association with some one? . . . Then, Hermogenes, we must believe that this is the reason why no one has been willing to come away from that other world, not even the Seirenes, but they and all others have been overcome by his enchantments, so beautiful, as it appears, are the words which Haides has the power to speak; and from this point of view this god is a perfect sophist and a great benefactor of those in his realm, he who also bestows such great blessings upon us who are on earth; such abundance surrounds him there below, and for this reason he is called Plouton. Then, too, he refuses to consort with men while they have bodies, but only accepts their society when the soul is pure of all the evils and desires of the body. Do you not think this shows him to be a philosopher and to understand perfectly that under these conditions he could restrain them by binding them with the desire of virtue, but that so long as they are infected with the unrest and madness of the body, not even his father Kronos could hold them to himself, though he bound them with his famous chains? . . . And the name 'Haides' is not in the least derived from the invisible (aeides), but far more probably from knowing (eidenai) all noble things, and for that reason he was called Haides by the lawgiver." Callimachus, Epigrams 2 (trans. Mair) (Greek poet C3rd B.C.) : "Haides, snatcher of all things, shall lay his hand [upon you]." Callimachus, Fragment Frag 478 (from Etymologicum Florentine s.v. Klymenos) (trans. Trypanis) (Greek poet C3rd B.C.) : "[Persephone] the spouse of Klymenos [Haides], host of many (polyzeinos)." Pausanias, Description of Greece 5. 20. 2 (trans. Jones) (Greek travelogue C2nd A.D.) : "[Amongst the scenes depicted on a table by Kolotes dedicated in the temple of Hera at Olympia :] Plouton [Haides] holds a key, they say that what is called Haides has been locked up by Plouton, and that nobody will return back again there from."
Ovid, Metamorphoses 2. 260 ff (trans. Melville) (Roman epic C1st B.C. to C1st A.D.) : "Earth everywhere splits deep [when Phaethon scorches the earth] and light strikes down into Tartara (the Underworld) and fills with fear Rex Infernus (Hell’s monarch) [Haides] and his consort [Persephone]." Ovid, Metamorphoses 5. 354 ff : "The land [of Sicily] quakes [as Typhoeus the Giant buried beneath it tries to escape] and even the king who rules the land of silence (Rex Silentum) [Haides] shudders lest the ground in gaping seams should open and the day stream down and terrify the trembling Umpire (Shades). The tyrant (Tyrannus) had left his dark domains to and fro, drawn in his chariot and sable steeds, inspected the foundations of the isle." Seneca, Hercules Furens 603 ff (trans. Miller) (Roman tragedy C1st A.D.) : "I [Herakles] have seen places unapproached by any . . . those gloomy spaces which the baser pole hath yielded to infernal Jove [Haides]; and if the regions of the third estate pleased me, I might have reigned." Seneca, Hercules Furens 658 ff : "All the world’s holy powers, and thou [Haides] who rulest the all-holding realm, and thou [Persephone] whom, stolen from Enna, thy mother [Demeter] sought in vain, may it be right, I pray, boldly to speak of powers hidden away and buried beneath the earth." Seneca, Hercules Furens 707 ff : "What of him who holds sway over the dark realm? Where sits he, governing his flitting tribes? . . . A plain lies round about this where sits the god [Haides], where with haughty mien his awful majesty assorts the new-arriving souls. Lowering is his brow, yet such as wears the aspect of his brothers and his high race; his countenance is that of Jove, but Jove the thunderer; chief part of that realm’s grimness is its own lord, whose aspect whate’er is dreaded dreads." Seneca, Phaedra 625 ff : "The overlord [Haides] of the fast-holding realm and of the silent Styx has made no way to the upper world once quitted." Seneca, Troades 402 ff : "Taenarus and the cruel tyrant’s [Haides] kingdom and Cerberus, guarding the portal of no easy passage." Statius, Thebaid 4. 520 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "Himself [lord Haides] I behold, all pale upon the throne, with Stygian Eumenides [Erinyes] ministering to his fell deeds about him, and the remorseless chambers and gloomy couch of Stygian Juno [Persephone]. Black Mors [Thanatos, death] sits upon an eminence, and numbers the silent peoples for their lord; yet the greater part of the troop remains. The Gortynian judge [Minos] shakes them [the ghosts of the dead] in his inexorable urn, demanding the truth with threats, and constrains them to speak out their whole lives’ story and at last confess their extorted gains." Statius, Thebaid 8. 21 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "The lord of Erebus [Haides], enthroned in the midst of the fortress of his dolorous realm, was demanding of his subjects the misdoings of their lives, pitying nought human but wroth against all the Manes (Shades). Around him stand the Furiae [Erinyes, furies] and various Mortes [Thanatoi, deaths] in order due, and savage Poena (Vengeance) thrusts forth her coils of jangling chains; the Fatae [Moirai, fates] bring the Animas (Souls) and with one gesture [literally “thumb” as in the amphitheatre] damn them; too heavy grows the work. Hard by, Minos with his dread brother [Rhadamanthys] in kindly mood counsels a milder justice, and restrains the bloodthirsty king; Cocytus and Phelgethon, swollen with tears and fire, aid in the judgement, and Styx accuses the gods of perjury. But he [Haides], when the frame of the world above was loosened [i.e. when the earth opened up and swallowed the hero Amphiaraus] and filled him with unwonted fears, quaked at the appearing stars, and thus did he speak, offended by the gladsome light: ‘What ruin of the upper world hath thrust the hateful light of day into Avernus? Who hath burst our gloom and told the silent folk of life? Whence comes this threat? Which of my brothers makes war on me? Well, I will meet him: confusion whelm all natural bounds? For whom would that please more? The third hazard hurled me defeated from the mighty heaven, and I guard the world of guilt; nor is even that mine, but lo! the dread stars search it from end to end, and gaze upon me. Does the proud ruler of Olympus spy out my strength? Mine is the prison-house, now broken, of the Gigantes, and of the Titanes, eager to force their way to the world above, and his own unhappy sire [Kronos] : why thus cruelly doth he forbid me to enjoy my mournful leisure and this untranquil peace, and to hate the light I lost? I will open all my kingdoms, if such by my pleasure, and veil Hyperion [Helios the sun] with a Stygian sky. I will not send the Arcadian [Hermes] up to the gods--why doth he come and go on errands between realm and realm?--and I will keep both the sons of Tyndareus [i.e. the Dioskouroi who divided their days equally between Olympos and the Underworld]. And why do I break Ixion on the greedy whirling of the wheel? Why do the waters not wait for Tantalus? Must I so oft endure the profanation of Chaos by living strangers? The rash ardour of Pirithous provoked me, and Theseus, sworn comrade of his daring friend [the pair attempted to abduct Persephone], and fierce Alcides [Herakles], when the iron threshold of Cerberus’ gate fell silent, its guardian removed. It shames me too, alas! how Tartarus opened a way to the Odyrsian plaint [Orpheus]; with my own eyes I saw the Eumenides [Erinyes] shed base tears at those persuasive strains, and the Sisters [Moirai, fates] repeat their allotted task; me too -, but the violence of my cruel law was stronger. Yet I have scarce ventured one stolen journey, nor was that to the stars on high, when I carried of my bride [Persephone] from the Sicilian mead: unlawfully, so they say, and forthwith comes an unjust decree from Jove [Zeus], and her mother [Demeter] cheats me of half a year. But why do I tell all this: Go, Tisiphone, avenge the abode of Tartarus! if ever thou hast wrought monsters fierce and strange, bring forth some ghastly horror, huge and unwonted, such as the sky hath never yet beheld, such as I may marvel at and thy Sisters [the Moirai] envy. Ay, and the brothers [Polyneikes and Eteokles] rush to slay each other in exultant combat; let there be one [Tydeus] who in hideous, bestial savagery shall gnaw his foeman’s head, and one [king Kreon] who shall bar the dead from the funeral fire and pollute the air with naked corpses; let the fierce Thunderer [Zeus] feast his eyes on that! Moreover, lest their fury harm my realms alone, seek one who shall make war against he gods [Kapaneus] and with smoking shield repel the fiery brand and Jove’s [Zeus’] own wrath. I will have all men fear to disturb black Tartarus no less than to set Pelion on top of leafy Ossa.’ He finished, and long since was the gloomy palace quaking at his words, and his own land and that which presses on it from above were rocking: no more mightily does Jupiter [Zeus] sway the heaven with his nod, and bow the starry poles. But what shall be thy [Amphiaraus’] doom,’ he cries, `who rushest headlong through the empty realm on a path forbidden?’ As he threatens, the other draws nigh, on foot now and shadowy to view, his armour growing faint, yet in his lifeless face abides the dignity of augurship inviolate, and on his brow remains the fillet dim to behold, and in his hand is a branch of dying olive. `If it be lawful and right for holy Manes (Shades) to make utterence here, O thou to all men the great Finisher, but to me, who once knew causes and beginnings, Creator also! remit, I pray, thy threatenings and thy fevered heart, nor deem worthy of thy wrath one who is but a man and fears thy laws; ‘tis for no Herculean plunder--such wars are not for me--, nor for a forbidden bride--believe these emblems--that I dare to enter Lethe: let not Cerberus flee into his cave, nor Proserpine [Persephone] shudder at my chariot. I, once the best beloved of augurs at Apollo’s shrines, call empty Chaos to bear witness--for what power to receive an oath has Apollo here?--for no crime do I suffer this unwonted fate, nor have I deserved to be thus torn from the kindly light of day; the urn of the Dictean judge doth know it, and Minos can discern the truth. Sold by the treachery of my wife [Eriphyle] for wicked gold, I joined the Argive host, not unwitting - hence this crowd of new-slain ghosts thou seest, and the victims also of this right hand; in a sudden convulsion of the earth--my mind still shrinks in horror--thy darkness swallowed me up from the midst of thousands . . . content am I to receive my Shade [Amphiaraus was not yet dead but dropped alive into Haides], nor remember my tripods any more. For what avails thee the use of prescient augury, when the Parcae [Moirai, fates] spin thy commands? Nay, be thou softened, and prove more merciful than the gods. If ever my accursed wife come hither, reserve for her thy deadly torments : she is more worthy of thy wrath, O righteous lord!’ He [Haides] accepts his prayer, and is indignant that he yields." Statius, Thebaid 11. 410 ff : "Thrice from the regions of doom thundered their [the Erinyes'] impatient monarch [Haides], and shook the depths of the earth [at the commencement of the War of Thebes] . . . The king of Tartarus [Haides] himself orders the gates to be set open [i.e. to receive the legions of the slain]." Statius, Thebaid 11. 444 ff : "The Warden of the Larvae (Shades) [lord Haides] and the third heir of the world, after the lot’s unkind apportioning, leapt down from his chariot and grew pale, for he was come to Tartarus and heaven was lost for ever." Statius, Silvae 3. 3. 21 (trans. Mozley) (Roman poetry C1st A.D.) : "Let him [the shade of a father] come, and approach the awful throne of the silent monarch [Haides] and pay his last due of gratitude and anxiously request for his son a long life." Valerius Flaccus, Argonautica 3. 380 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "Celaeneus [the Black, Haides], sitting sable-shrouded and sword in hand, cleanses the innocent from their error." Apuleius, The Golden Ass 7. 24 ff (trans. Walsh) (Roman novel C2nd A.D.) : "I was pulled out of the hands of Orcus [Haides] [that is, saved from death]." Tryphiodorus, The Taking of Ilias 568 ff (trans. Mair) (Greek poet C5th A.D.) : "And Haides shuddered [at the slaughter of the Sack of Troy] and looked forth from his seat under earth, afraid lest in the great anger of Zeus Hermes, conductor of souls, should bring down all the race of men." Nonnus, Dionysiaca 36. 97 ff (trans. Rouse) (Greek epic C5th A.D.) : "Then Zeus Khthonios (Zeus of the Underworld) [Haides] rumbled hearing the noise of the heavenly fray above [as Poseidon and Apollon entered battle when the gods took sides in the war of Dionysos and his army against the Indians]; he feared that the Earthshaker [Poseidon], beating and lashing the solid ground with the earthquake-shock of his waves, might lever out of gear the whole universe with his trident, might move the foundations of the abysm below and show the forbidden sight of earth’s bottom, might burst all the veins of the subterranean channels and pour his water away into the pit of Tartaros, to flood the mouldering gates of the lower world. So great was the din of the gods in conflict, and the trumpets of the underworld added their noise." Nonnus, Dionysiaca 36. 200 ff : "[During the War of Dionysos against the Indians :] Lethe was choked with that great multitude of corpses brought low and scattered on every side. Aides heaved up his bar in the darkness, and opened his gates wider for the common carnage; as they descended into the pit the banks of Kharon’s river echoed the rumblings of Tartaros." Nonnus, Dionysiaca 12. 213 ff : "[Dionysos transforms his dead friend Ampelos into a grape vine at death :] `For you Haides himself has become merciful, for you Persephone herself has changed her hard temper, and saved you alive in death for brother Bakkhos. You did not die . . . You are still alive, my boy, even if you died." Stesichorus, Fragment 232 (trans. Campbell, Vol. Greek Lyric III) (C7th to 6th B.C.) : "Mourning and wailing are the portion of Hades." Aeschylus, Seven Against Thebes 864 ff (trans. Weir Smyth) (Greek tragedy C5th B.C.) : "Cry out the awful hymn of the Erinys [i.e. the shrieks and cries of the grieving women] and thereafter sing the hated victory song of Aides [i.e. the funeral dirge]." Plato, Republic 427b (trans. Shorey) (Greek philosopher C4th B.C.) : “The burial of the dead and the services we must render to the dwellers in the world beyond to keep them gracious.” [I.e. the gods of the dead and the ghosts of men.] Diodorus Siculus, Library of History 5. 69. 5 (trans. Oldfather) (Greek historian C1st B.C.) : "Of Haides it is said that he laid down the rules which are concerned with burials and funerals and the honours which are paid to the dead, no concern having been given to the dead before this time; and this is why tradition tells us that Haides is lord of the dead, since there were assigned to him in ancient times the first offices in such matters and the concern for them." Statius, Thebaid 12. 557 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "The father of the Eumenides [i.e. Haides, father of the Erinyes] and the ferryman of Lethe’s stream [Kharon] debars them [i.e. the souls of the unburied] from the Stygian gate and keeps them hovering doubtfully between the worlds of heaven and hell (Erebus)."
I) NECROMANCY OF ODYSSEUS Odysseus was instructed in the art of necromancy by the witch Kirke so that he might commune with the prophetic ghost of the seer Teiresias. According to the author of the Odyssey the rites were performed on the borders of the Underworld. Later authors, however, say that Odysseus visited the Nekromanteion (Oracle of the Dead) at Cumae in southern Italy. Homer, Odyssey 10. 495 ff (trans. Shewring) (Greek epic C8th B.C.) : "[Kirke instructs Odysseus in necromancy, the summoning of ghosts :] `You must visit the house of dread Persephone and of Haides, and there seek counsel from the spirit of Theban Teiresias. The blind seer’s thought is wakeful still, for to him alone, even after death, Persephone has accorded wisdom; the other dead are but flitting shadows . . . And when you have sailed through the river Okeanos, you will see before you a marrow strand and he groves that are Persephone’s--the tall black poplars, the willows with their self-wasted fruit; then beach the vessel beside deep-eddying Okeanos and pass on foot to the dank domains of Haides. At the entrance there, the stream of Akheron is joined by the waters of Pyriphlegethon and a branch of Styx, Kokytos, and there is a rock where the two loud-roaring rivers meet. Then, lord Odysseus, you must do as I enjoin you; go forward, and dig a trench a cubit long and a cubit broad; go round this trench, pouring libation for all the dead, first with milk and honey, then with sweet wine, then with water; and sprinkle white barley-meal above. Then with earnest prayers to the strengthless presences of the dead you must promise that when you have come to Ithaka you will sacrifice in your palace a calfless heifer, the best you have, and will load a pyre with precious things; and that for Teiresias and no other you will slay, apart, a ram that is black all over, the choicest in all the flocks of Ithaka. When with these prayers you have made appeal to the noble nations of the dead, then you must sacrifice a ram and a black ewe; bend the victims' heads down towards Erebos, but turn your own head away and look towards the waters of the river. At this, the souls of the dead and gone will come flocking there. With commanding voice you must call your cmorades to flay and burn the two sheep that now lie before them, killed by your own ruthless blade, and over them to pray to the gods, to resistless Haides and dread Persephone. As for yourself, draw the keen sword from beside your thight; then, sitting down, hold back the strengthles presences of the dead from drawing nearer to the blood until you have questioned Teiresias. Then, King Odysseus, the seer will come to you very quickly, to prophesy the path before you, the long stages of your travel, and how you will reach home at last over the teeming sea."
Homer, Odyssey 11. 10 ff : "[Odysseus travels to the Underworld to consult the ghost of the seer Teiresias :] The vessel came to the bounds of eddying Okeanos, where lie the land and city of the Kimmeroi, covered with mist and cloud. never does the resplendent sun look on this people with his beams . . . dismal gloom overhangs these wretches always. Arriving there, we beached the vessel, took out the sheep and then walked onwards beside the stream of Okeanos until we came to the place that Kirke had told us of. There, Perimedes and Eurylokhos seized the victims and held them fast, while I myself drew the keen sword from besie my thigh and cut a trench a cubit long and a cubit broad. Round it I poured a libation for all the dead, first with milk and honey, then with sweet wine, then with water; over this I sprinkled white barley-meal. Then with earnest prayers to the strengthless presences of the dead I promised that when I came to Ithaka I would sacrifice in my palace a calfless heifer, the best I had, and would load a pyre with precious things; and that for Teiresias and no other I would slay, apart, a ram that was black all over, the choicest in all the flocks of Ithaka. When with my prayers and invocations I had called on the peoples of the dead, I seized the victims and cut their throats over the trench. The dark blood flowed, and the souls od the dead and gone came flocking upwards from Erebos--brides and unmarried youths, old men who had suffered much, tender girls with the heart's distress still keen, troops of warriors wounded with brazen-pointed spears, men slain in battle with blood-stained armour still upon them. With unearthly cries, from every quarter, they came crowding about the trench until pale terror began to master me. Then with urgent voice I called my comrades to flay and burn the two sheep that now lay before them, killed by my own ruthless blade, and over them to pray to the gods, to resistless Haides and dread Persephone. As for myself, I drew the keen sword from beside my thigh, seated myself and held back the strengthless preseences of the dead from drawing nearer to the blood before I had questioned Teiresias." Homer, Odyssey 11. 210 & 11. 386 : "[Odysseus performs the necromantic rites and is approached by the ghost of his mother. He questions her :] `Is this some wraith that august Persephone has sent me to increase my sorrowing and my tears?’ So I spoke, and the queen my mother answered me : `Alas, my child, ill-fated beyond all other mortals, this is no mockery of Persephone’s; it is all men’s fortune when they die. The sinews no longer hold flesh and bones together; these are all prey to the resistless power of fire when once the life has left the white bones; the soul takes wing as a dream takes wing, and thereafter hovers to and fro . . .' Meanwhile there appeared a whole company of women [before Odysseus], sent by Persephone the august; and these were the wives or the daughters of great men. They gathered flocking round the dark blood [of the sacrificed black sheep] all together. So they came forward one after another, and each in turn told me her lineage, for I left none of them unquestioned . . . Then, when chaste Persephone had dispersed this way and that the souls of those many women, there came before me in bitter sorrow the soul of Agamemon . . . Then there came before me the soulds of Akhilleus and Patroklos, of noble Antilokhos and of Aias . . . The soul of the fleet-foot son of Peleus went pacing forth over the field of asphodel . . . Other souls of the dead and gone still stood there sorrowfully, each of them questioning me on whatever touched them the most . . . Indeed I might then have seen [more of] those men of past days I wished to see, but before I could, there came before me with hideous clamour the thronging multitudes of the dead, and ashly terror seized hold of me. I feared that august Persephone might send against me from Haides’ house the Gorgoneion (the gorgon's head) of some grisly monster. I made for my ship at once, telling my comrades to step aboard and to loose the cables." Pseudo-Apollodorus, Bibliotheca E7. 7 & 34 (trans. Aldrich) (Greek mythographer C2nd A.D.) : "He [Odysseus] sailed Okeanos, and offered sacrifices to the souls, and by Kirke's advice consulted the soothsayer Tiresias, and beheld the souls both of heroes and of heroines. He also looked on his mother Antikleia and Elpenor, who had died of a fall in the house of Kirke . . . [Upon returning to Ithaka, Odysseus slew the suitors and then :] After sacrificing to Haides, and Persephone, and Teiresias, he journeyed on foot through Epiros, and came to the Thesprotians, and having offered sacrifice according to the directions of the soothsayer Teiresias, he propitiated Poseidon." Lycophron, Alexandra 697 ff (trans. Mair) (Greek poet C3rd B.C.) : "The grove of Obrimo [i.e. the grove of Persephone near Avernos in Italia], Kore (Maiden) who dwells beneath the earth, and Pyriphleges (the Fiery Stream), where the difficult Polydegmon hill [in Italy] stretches its head to the sky . . . and the lake Aornos [i.e. lake Avernus near Cumae in Italy] rounded with a noose and the waters of Kokytos wild and dark, stream of black Styx . . . he [Odysseus] shall offer up a gift to Daeira [Persephone] and her consort, fastening his helmet to the head of a pillar."
II) NECROMANCY OF TEIRESIAS In Statius' Thebaid the seer Teiresias performs necromancy to commune with the dead when King Oidipous would learn the reason for the plague inflicting Thebes. Seneca, Oedipus 395 ff (trans. Miller) (Roman tragedy C1st A.D.) : "[The seer Teiresias declares that he will perform necromancy :] `We must unseal the earth, must implore the implacable divinity of Dis [Haides], must draw forth hither the people [ghosts] of infernal Styx.'" Statius, Thebaid 4. 410 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "He [the seer Teiresias] prepares the rites of Lethe [i.e. nekromankia], and makes ready beforehand to evoke the monarch [Haides] sunk below the confines of [the river] Ismenos where it mingles with the deep, and makes purgation all around with the torn entrails of sheep and the strong smell of sulphur, and with fresh herbs and the long mutterings of prayer . . . [Teiresias] bids the dark-fleeced sheep and black oxen be set before him . . . Then he entwined their fierce horns with wreaths of dusky hue, handling them himself, and first at the edge of that well-known wood [i.e. one sacred to the goddess Hekate] he nine times spills the lavish draughts of Bacchus into a hollowed trench, and gifts of vernal milk and Attic rain [i.e. honey] and propitiatory blood to the Shades below; so much is poured out as the dry earth will drink. Then they roll tree trunks thither, and the sad priest bids there be three altar-fires for Hecate and three for the maidens born of cursed Acheron [the Erinyes]; for thee, lord of Avernus [Haides], a heap of pinewood though sunk into the ground yet towers high into the air; next to this an altar of lesser bulk is raised to Ceres of the Underworld [Persephone]; in front and on every side the cypress of lamentation intertwines them. And now, their lofty heads marked with the sword and the pure sprinkled meal, the cattle fell under the stroke; then the virgin Manto [daughter of Teiresias], catching the blood in bowls, makes first libation, and moving thrice round all the pyres, as her holy sire commands, offers the half-dead tissues and yet living entrails, nor delays to set the devouring fire to the dark foliage. And when Tiresias heard the branches crackling in the flames and the grim piles roaring--for the burning heat surges before his face, and the fiery vapour fills the hollows of his eyes--he exclaimed, and the pyres trembled, and the flames cowered at his voice : `Abodes of Tartarus and awful realm of insatiable Mors [Thanatos, death], and thou, most cruel of the brothers [Haides], to whom the Shades are given to serve thee, and the eternal punishments of the damned obey thee, and the palace of the underworld, throw open in answer to my knowing the silent places and empty void of stern Persephone, and send forth the multitude that lurk in hollow night.'" Statius, Thebaid 4. 520 ff : "[The blind Teiresias while performing necromancy declares :] `Himself [lord Haides] I behold, all pale upon the throne, with Stygian Eumenides [Erinyes] ministering to his fell deeds about him, and the remorseless chambers and gloomy couch of Stygian Juno [Persephone].'"
III) NECROMANCY OF AESON & ALKIMEDE Aeson and his wife, the Thessalian witch Alkimede, perform necromancy to learn the fate of their son, the hero Jason, and to bring down the curse of the dead upon King Pelias, who is plotting their death. Valerius Flaccus, Argonautica 1. 730 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "[Alkimede the mother of Jason, who has departed on his quest for the Golden Fleece, uses necromancy to summon the ghosts of the dead :] Unto the lord of Tartarus [Haides] and unto the Stygian ghosts was Alcimede [i.e. the mother of Jason] bringing holy offerings in fear for her mighty son [Jason, if Shades summoned forth might give her surer knowledge. Even Aeson [her husband] himself, who shares her anxiety but who hides such unmanly fears in his heart, yields and is led by his wife. In a trench stands blood and plenteous offering to hidden Phlegethon and with fierce cries the aged witch calls upon her departed ancestors and the grandson of great Pleione [i.e. Hermes, guide of the dead]. And now at the sound of the spell rose a face, insubstantial, and [the ghost of] Kretheus [the father of Aeson] gazed upon his mournful son and daughter-in-law, and when he had sipped the blood he began to utter these words . . . [The ghost tells him that Jason is safe, but King Pelias is plotting Aeson’s death.] He [Aeson] returns to the holy rites [i.e. the necromancy]. Beneath the gloom of an ancient cypress, squalid and ghastly with darksome hue, a bull still stood, dark blue fillets on his horns, his brow rough with the foliage of yew; the beast too was downcast, panting and restless, and terrified at the sight of the shade. The witch [Alkimede], according to the custom of her evil race had kept him, chosen above all others, to use him now at last for these hellish practises. When Aeson saw that the bull still remained at the hour of the awful rites unslain, he dooms him to death, and with one hand upon the horns of the fated victim speaks for the last time `O ye [ghost of Kretheus] who received from Jupiter [Zeus] your reign and the light of life not idly spent . . . my father, summoned forth from the shades to view my death and to endure again the forgotten sorrows of men on earth, O grant me entry to the abode of quiet [Haides], and may the victim that I send before me win favour for me in your dwelling. Thou, O maid [Dike lady Justice], that dost report guilty deeds to Jove [Zeus], who lookest down upon earth with unerring eyes, ye avenging goddesses [Erinyes], thou Divine Law, and thou Retribution (Poena), aged mother of the Furiai [Erinyes], enter into the sinful palace of the king [Pelias], and bring upon him your fierce torches. Let accursed fear ravish his maddened heart; nor let him deem that my son alone will come with grim weapons in his bark . . . [and take vengeance on the king.]' Then he appeased the goddess of triple form [i.e. Hekate, goddess of earth-bound ghosts], and with his last sacrifice offers a prayer to the Stygian abodes, rehearsing backward a spell soon, soon to prove persuasive; for without that no thin shade will the dark ferryman [Kharon] take away, and bound they stand at the mouth of Orcus [Haides]."
IV) NECROMANCY OF MEDEA Witches such as Medea were practitioners of the necromantic rites. Medea employs these powers in a spell to restore youth to Aeson. Ovid, Metamorphoses 7. 242 ff (trans. Melville) (Roman epic C1st B.C. to C1st A.D.) : "[Medea uses her magic to restore Aeson's youth :] Two turf altars she built [for the ritual], the right to Hecate, the left to Juventas [Hebe, the goddess of Youth], wreathed with the forest’s mystic foliage, and dug two trenches in the ground beside and then performed her rites. Plunging a knife into a black sheep’s throat she drenched the wide ditches with blood; next from a chalice poured a stream of wine and from a second chalice warm frothing milk and, chanting magic words, summoned the Deities of Earth (Numina Terrena) and prayed the sad shades’ monarch (Rex Umbrarum) [Haides] and his stolen bride [Persephone] that, of their mercy, from old Aeson’s frame they will not haste to steal the breath of life . . . [and she then applied her potions to the body of the man.] And Aeson woke and marvelled as he saw his prime restored of forty years before."
V) THE NECROMANCY OF WITCHES Not only Medea and Alkimede (above) but witches in general were regarded as practitioners of the necromantic rites. Statius, Thebaid 3. 140 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "The gloomy councils of the Shades complain [at being summoned from Haides by a witch], and black Avernus’ sire [lord Haides] waxes indignant
VI) THE ORACLES OF THE DEAD The Oracle of the Dead or Nektromanteion in Thesprotia was a shrine dedicated to the gods Haides and Persephone. The oracles of the daimones Amphiaraus and Trophonios in Boiotia were also necromantic in nature. I) ERINYES & THE VENGEAFUL GHOST Aeschylus, Libation Bearers 380 ff (trans. Weir Smyth) (Greek tragedy C5th B.C.) : "[A supplication to the ghost of the murdered king :] This has pierced the earth and reached your [the ghost's] ear as if it were an arrow. O Zeus, O Zeus [here Haides, the Zeus of the underworld], who send long-deferred retribution up from below [i.e. in the form of the Erinyes] onto the reckless and wicked deeds done by the hands of mortals." Seneca, Hercules Furens 100 ff (trans. Miller) (Roman tragedy C1st A.D.) : "Begin, [Erinyes] handmaids of Dis [Haides], make haste to brandish the burning pine." Valerius Flaccus, Argonautica 3. 380 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "We [the souls of the dead] are not dissolved into the breezes or into mere bones at the last: anger abides and grief endures. Thereafter when they are come to the throne of Awful Jove [Haides] and have set forth all the sorrowful story of their dreadful end, the gate of death is opened for them and they may return a second time [i.e. to the earth as vengeful ghosts]; one of the Sisters [i.e. the Erinyes] is given them as a companion, and they range together over lands and seas. Each involved in penalties the guilty souls of his own foes; they rack them with various terrors after their deserving. But those whose hands have dripped with blood unwillingly--or were it cruel mischance, though nigh to guilt, that swept away the wretches - these men their own minds harry in divers ways, and their own deeds vex the doers; languid now and ventureless they decline into tears and spiritless alarms and sickly sloth [i.e. in their grief at having accidentally killed someone]: such thou dost here behold . . . Celaeneus [Haides], sitting sable-shrouded and sword in hand, cleanses the innocent from their error, and remitting their fault unwinds a spell to appease the angry Shades. He it was who taught me [the seer Mopsos] what lustrations should be made to the slain, he of his good pleasure opened the earth to Erebus below. When therefore the orient sets the crimson seas aflame, do thou summon thy comrades to sacrifice, and bring two steers to the mighty gods; for me were it wrong meanwhile to approach your gathering, until I spend the night in cleansing prayers [i.e. in preparation for the ceremony of purification to cleanse a man of the crime of murder, which drives away the haunting Erinyes and the avenging ghost of the dead]." Statius, Thebaid 8. 21 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "[Haides commands the Erinys :] `Go, Tisiphone, avenge the abode of Tartarus! if ever thou hast wrought monsters fierce and strange, bring forth some ghastly horror, huge and unwonted, such as the sky hath never yet beheld, such as I may marvel at and thy Sisters [the Moirai] envy.'"
II) VENGEAFUL GHOSTS ON THE BATTLEFIELD Valerius Flaccus, Argonautica 4. 258 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "At their [ghosts of the men slain by the wrestler Ampycus] entreaty father Tartarus [Haides] sends forth in a hollow cloud the Shades of the slain to view at last the well-earned retribution [Ampycus’ own death]; the mountain-tops grow black with them." Statius, Thebaid 11. 410 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "The king of Tartarus [Haides] himself orders the gates to be set open [ready to receive the legions of newly dead from war], and the Ogygian Manes (Ghosts) to attend their kindred’s monstrous deeds [in the internecine War of the Seven Against Thebes]. Seated upon their native hills they pollute the day with grisly band, and rejoice that their own crimes should be surpassed."
III) CURSE OF THE ERINYES Homer, Iliad 9. 450 ff (trans. Lattimore) (Greek epic C8th B.C.) : "I [Phoinix] first left Hellas . . . running from the hatred of Ormenos' son Amyntor, my father; who hated me for the sake of a fair-haired mistress. For he made love to her himself, and dishonoured his own wife, my mother; who was forever taking my knees and entreating me to lie with this mistress instead so that she would hate the old man. I was persuaded and did it; and my father when he heard of it straightway called down his curses, and invoked against me the dreaded Erinyes that I might never have any son born of my seed to dandle on my knees; and the divinities, Zeus Khthonios (of the underworld) [Haides] and Persephone the honoured goddess, accomplished his curses." Homer, Iliad 9. 565 ff : "Meleagros lay mulling his heart-sore anger, raging by reason of his mother’s [Althaia’s] curses, which she called down from the gods upon him, in deep grief for the death of her brother, and many times beating with her hands on the earth abundant she called on Haides and on honoured Persephone, lying at length along the ground, and the tears were wet on her bosom, to give death to her son; and Erinys, the mist-walking, she of the heart without pity, heard her out of the dark places." Apollonius Rhodius, Argonautica 3. 401 ff (trans. Rieu) (Greek epic C3rd B.C.) : "[Khalkiope addresses her sister Medea :] `I implore you . . . not to stand by while they [her sons, who are accompanying the Argonauts] are mercilessly done to death. If you do so, may I die with my dear sons and haunt you afterwards from Haides like an avenging Erinys (Fury) . . . ’ [Medea replies to Khalkiope:] `Sister you left me speechless when you talked of curses and avenging Erinyes (Furies).'" Valerius Flaccus, Argonautica 7. 311 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "[Medea] wearies heaven above and Tartarus beneath with her complaints [about her love for Jason]; she beats upon the ground, and murmuring into her clutching hands calls on the Queen of Night [Hekate] and Dis [Haides] to bring her aid by granting death, and to send him who is the cause of her madness down with her to destruction." Statius, Thebaid 1. 46 ff (trans. Mozley) (Roman epic C1st A.D.) : "[Oidipous blinded himself upon learning that he had slain his father and married his mother. His sons then treated him with cruel disdain and so he summons the Erinyes to punish them :] Oedipus with avenging hand probed deep his sinning eyes and sunk his guilty shame in eternal night . . . yet with unwearied wings the fierce daylight of the mind hovers around him, and the avenging Dirae [Erinyes] of his crimes assail his heart. Then he displays to heaven those empty orbs, the cruel, pitiful punishment of his own lie, and with blood-stained hands beats upon the hollow earth, and in dire accents utters this prayer : `Gods [Haides, Persephone and the Erinyes] who hold sway over guilty souls and over Tartarus crowded with the damned, and thou O Styx, whom I behold, ghastly in thy shadowy depths, and thou Tisiphone, so oft the object of my prayer, be favourable now, and further my unnatural wish . . . Sightless though I was and driven from my throne, my sons, on whatever couch begotten, attempted not to give me guidance or consolation in my grief . . . and they mock my blindness, they abhor their father’s groans . . . Do thou at least, my due defender, come hither, and begin a work of vengeance that will blast their seed for ever!'" Suidas s.v. Persephone (trans. Suda On Line) (Byzantine Greek lexicon C10th A.D.) : "Persephone : An Underworld spirit (katageios daimon). Elektra says : `O house of Haides and Persephone! O Hermes of the Underworld and holy Ara (Curse) and divine Erinnyes (Furies)! You who watch over those dying unjustly and those being robbed of a marriage bed: Come! Help avenge the murder of our father!'"
IV) CURSE-OATHS BOUND BY HAIDES & THE ERINYES When Haides was invoked in an oath, the connotation was "let me be cursed, if I dare to break the oath." Apollonius Rhodius, Argonautica 2. 259 ff (trans. Rieu) (Greek epic C3rd B.C.) : "[King Phineos swears an oath to the Argonauts :] `By the Powers below [i.e. Haides, Persephone and the Erinyes]--and may they blast me if I die forsworn--that you will not incur the wrath of Heaven by helping me.'" Seneca, Oedipus 247 ff (trans. Miller) (Roman tragedy C1st A.D.) : "[King Oidipous swears an oath :] `Now at Heaven’s command let the crime be expiated [i.e. the murder of king Laios]. Whoever of the gods dost look with favour upon kingdoms--thou [Zeus], thou whose are the laws of the swift-revolving heavens; and thou [Helios the sun], greatest glory of the unclouded sky . . . and thou, his sister [Selene the moon] . . . thou [Poseidon] whom the winds obey . . . and thou [Haides] who dost allot homes devoid of light--do ye all attend: Him by whose hand Laïus fell may no peaceful dwelling, no friendly household gods, no hospitable land in exile entertain.'" Seneca, Oedipus 868 ff : "[Oidipous curses himself when he learns that he has killed his father and married his mother :] `Yawn, earth! And do thou [Haides], king of the dark world, ruler of shades, to lowest Tartarus hurl this unnatural interchange ‘twixt brood and stock.'"
HELM OF HAIDES The magical helm of Haides was crafted for the god by the elder Kyklopes to use as a weapon in the Titan-War. It bestowed complete invisibility upon the wearer (making him indiscernable even to gods). SCEPTRE OF HAIDES Haides wielded a royal sceptre, a magical death-dealing staff which could sunder the earth, creating a passage between the world of the living and the world of the dead. PALACE OF HAIDES The golden palace of Haides lay in the dark, dank realms of the Underworld. THRONE OF HAIDES Haides sat dispensing fate upon the newly dead, from a golden throne in the hall of his palace, surrounded by the three Judges. KEYS OF HAIDES The Gates of Haides were securely locked to prevent the escape of souls. Haides (or his doorman Aiakos) held the golden keys. HOUND OF HAIDES The gate of the house of Haides was guarded by the ferocious three-headed, monster-dog Kerberos. [See KERBEROS] ORCHARDS OF HAIDES Near the palace of Haides lay the god's famed orchard of pomegranate trees. From one of these came the fruit which trapped Persephone in the Underworld (permanently but for a special dispensation from Zeus which allowed her to return to the world of the living for part of the year). CATTLE OF HAIDES King Haides possessed a herd of immortal, sable-black cattle which roamed the asphodel fields of Haides under the care of the daimon herdsman Menoetes
Moe Epsilon, I hope you have a Merry Christmas and hope your day is full of the true spirit of the day. Plus, good food, good family and good times. :) Have a Great Day! :) - Neutralhomer • Talk • 07:32, 24 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Spread the joy of Christmas by adding {{subst:User:Neutralhomer/MerryChristmas}} to their talk page with a friendly message.
Well under my username SWD316, I had 4 attempts between 2005 and that fifth attempt with Moe Epsilon in 2006. It was a rather unpleasant experience, with one user creating around 30 sockpuppets to disrupt my RFAs and to vandalize to the point they had to keep being restarted (mostly out of frustration, myself). Sure, I'd like to run again some day, but after all of that mess and then a continuing career at Wikipedia, it's almost to the point where I've gained too many detractors to be successful. I have a (very) tentative date to give it a try: on the ten-year anniversary of me registering on Wikipedia, on July 10, 2015. Regards, — MoeEpsilon02:19, 26 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hi Moe, I noticed you've been classifying using STiki today. I similarly noticed that your revert percentages were quite low (relative to your own average, and that of the tool in general). Any intuition on what you've been seeing? I guess it is holiday break for many, perhaps the vandalism rates have fallen as a result? Thanks, West.andrew.g (talk) 02:06, 29 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Hey Andrew. I noticed the amount being particularly low too, and I stopped using it a while ago once I got to "edits from 100 days ago". I haven't even seen a report on STiki from today; the latest entry was from 1 day ago. My intuition is telling me either a group of users are doing a high-speed vandalism work as it's coming (using STiki or maybe another tool), or that vandalism isn't just very high right now. Regards, — MoeEpsilon02:20, 29 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Congratulations from STiki!
The Gold STiki Barnstar of Merit
Congratulations, Moe Epsilon! You're receiving this barnstar of merit because you recently crossed the 25,000 classification threshold using STiki.
We thank you both for your contributions to Wikipedia at-large and your use of the tool.
Hi. I added the line to the article about the Cercopes because I had read about the detail in at least two separate sources on the myth, and believed it contributed to the general tone of their story (goofy and slightly bawdy). - Salkafar 1/1/'13 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.85.98.164 (talk) 23:47, 1 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I just noticed, you are implying that my writing on one of the serbian politicians Čedomir Jovanović s' wiki page is not constructive, kind sir, i beg to differ. I just wrote the statistics that are based on true and real facts, and i wrote them as they were displayed on the Serbian national magazine "Novosti". I am not the one responsible for the Serbian People s' negative opinion towards him, i am just writing the facts, and the facts are, that according to the enquête held in Serbia, over 90% of the population had negative opinion on Čedomir Jovanović, and i passed the truth to the wikipedia.
i think that wikipedia is a free page, on which the free speech is a necessity in order to bring true and correct information to any,and all viewers. I hope you can reverse you decision about deleting my fact on this politician s' wiki page, and restore it the way it used to be, thank you.
I looked over the revert I did and I am inclined to keep it exactly the way it is. Unless you have a source as to an opinion poll or a similar method of determining opinion in Serbia, proving that a negative view is held by 90% of the population is "true and real", then your edit can not be restored. You will also note, that Wikipedia is not a place to exercise a freedom of speech, and Wikipedia does not acknowledge any said right. Article content is based on verifiable and reliable sources, not through what is considered a necessity. Regards, — MoeEpsilon23:34, 2 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for your replay, i will not pursue this anymore. after all, 90% already hate him, so there is no point to post it on wiki,as people are already aware of this fact, thanks anyway. Ninoslav — Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.223.110.216 (talk) 15:48, 3 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Miz Grand Slam
Hey, Moe:
As someone who has been a main editor on the Grand Slam Championship page, I would like to run something by you.
When you click on the MORE tab on Miz's bio, you'll see that Miz is billed as a Grand Slam Champion, having won the WWE, I-C, U.S. and Tag Team titles.
I would think that this is the long elusive source that WWE counts the U.S. Title as part of the Slam (in the #3 slot equal to the European and Hardcore titles).
I think it would be apparent that WWE either wrote this bio for Miz or at minimum collaborated with ION to put it together.
Anyway, I'd like you to give it a look-see, because if this flies, it has all sorts of ramifications, as Edge, Dolph Ziggler, and Chris Benoit would then also be U.S. title version Slam winners (so could Ric Flair and Steve Austin if you want to throw in their WCW reigns with the belt...WWE makes no differentiation amongst reigns, they just list whether you held the belt or not.)
Hey Vjmlhds. I would say the source is fine, but the Grand Slam (and Triple Crown) articles have some issues with sourcing and prose in general that have to be dealt with. I'd rather see the article aplit (not separate articles, two lists on the same artile) from one list of all definitions to a list based on the original definition, then separate lists (on the same article) based on reliable sources that change the definition. Regards, — MoeEpsilon05:11, 4 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I amended "folk" to "filk" because they are separate styles of music - Duncan and I both have songs published in the "Old Grey Wassail Test" http://www.lxnen.com/rogerbeccon/B/3comealong.html , which is a book of filk songs written by British SF fans in the 1980s and published by Beccon Publications (The word "filk" was originally a typo for "folk" from an old SF convention programme, but the accidental neologism was gleefully seized upon as a handy label to distinguish the styles - back in the day, filk music was originally "folky" in style, but nowadays filk can be written in any musical style.
Thanks for the message. Sorry, reverting and making sure editors aren't being misleading with their edits can be difficult, especially when the correct edit is intended to be a typographical error. Regards, — MoeEpsilon15:08, 10 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for the messages guys. I got one eye I can see perfectly from, so I guess that's enough to contribute with now. :) Regards, — MoeEpsilon19:30, 2 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Hi when I created a profile in order to edit a page, I noticed that my old school's page had been edited by you - apparently to remove some racial slurs about gypsies - which in turn seem to have come from my own IP address.
I was horrified when I read the edits and assume that these were made by my teenage son, with whom I shall be having a frank conversation when he returns from school.
I also removed a reference (presumably to a current pupil or staff member) which was pornographic.
Here's a kitten for you, from a newbie wiki-editor.
Thanks for the kitten! Thanks for keeping an eye on Wikipedia articles, it's appreciated of new editors and readers to monitor the site. I'll keep vigilant. :) Regards, — MoeEpsilon
Truthifarianism
Hi Moe,
I'm confused why you undid my edit of adding Truthifarianism as a branch of Atheistic Satanism. It is indeed a real religion I assure you, and I thought that my contribution would help inform those that were curious about it. If I wrote it wrong/offensively I'd like to know so I can rewrite the description without offending anyone. Please get back to me.
Thanks
MrGrimGamer (talk) 02:51, 25 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Aqua Adventure
Hi Moe,
I'm confused why you undid my edit of adding information to the Aqua Adventure page. It is indeed a real religion I assure you, and I thought that my contribution would help inform those that were curious about it. If I wrote it wrong/offensively I'd like to know so I can rewrite the description without offending anyone. Please get back to me.
Thanks
Jesus