User talk:FourTildes

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If it had been anyone else I probably would have taken it out:) You are correct of course that he is a Japanese citizen whereas all the others since Tochiazuma – Asa, Hakuho, Harumafuji, Osh and Baruto – are not, so it is perhaps notable, but as I believe the JSA always goes by the birthplace listed on the banzuke in regard to whether someone is 'foreign' or not it is a little confusing. But it's not a big deal, I'm not going to take it out now and I doubt anyone else will. I'm delighted for Tenho of course but I can't help thinking that a Kisenosato or Tochiozan victory would have been great for sumo and they've both blown a chance that may not come again for quite some time. Saw your new articles, excellent as always, and the fighting style sections will be added shortly. --Pawnkingthree (talk) 11:12, 23 May 2012 (UTC)

Just as a follow up, interesting that this article in the Japan Times also highlights the issue. I've added it as a reference.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 11:34, 30 May 2012 (UTC)

Active kinboshi earners[edit]

Nice addition there. Interesting that Wakanosato and Kyokutenho have earned only two kinboshi each despite both being around for donkey′s years. Just makes you appreciate all the more what a marvellous record Akinoshima′s is.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 02:04, 28 March 2013 (UTC)

I fixed the sansho list for you - sorry for the delay. Looks good - the only comment I would make is that when you do the sort for the individual prizes it doesn't necessarily show who has the most. Say for example a wrestler had four fighting spirit prizes but no others; he wouldn't appear in the table at all but really he should be at number three for fighting Spirit. Of course, the same is true of my "List of sumo record holders" table as well.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 00:00, 31 March 2013 (UTC)

Ōsunaarashi Kintarō[edit]

Hi FourTildes,

I just wanted to draw your attention to [1] photo of Oosunaarashi which I took last Friday and uploaded to Commons. As the article is still "yours" in a way, I would not like to change the photo you included without asking you, but find the other one a bit more personal. Phlyz (talk) 15:54, 31 May 2013 (UTC)

Hi, the only other photos I had taken of him I would have had to cut out people standing next to him etc. posing, so I snapped that one on the dohyo because I knew I was going to make an article. The one you have shows him standing by himself and it is higher quality so let's use it. I'll put it in if you don't mind. FourTildes (talk) 21:31, 31 May 2013 (UTC)
To be honest I had to cut out one of the enavitable admiring old ladies as well... ;-) Go ahead an put it in!Phlyz (talk) 12:36, 1 June 2013 (UTC)

Basho not held[edit]

I see you've been changing the Xs in the tourney table to Not Held, which is good, but unfortunately you've been adding explanatory notes to the top of the table when there is already one at the bottom (which I don't remember doing actually, maybe Kaiketsu did it?), causing a lot of duplication. I started removing some of them but rapidly got bored:)--Pawnkingthree (talk) 01:06, 9 June 2013 (UTC)

Great work putting all the pre 1958 tourney tables. A have a question about some changes though - why not complete records for Wakakoma Kenzo, Kanenohana Takeo, Iwakaze Kakutaro and Tochihikari Masayuki? It seems odd to me to lose information.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 22:27, 10 June 2013 (UTC)

June 2013[edit]

Edits to rikishi article[edit]

In the course of making some minor edits, somehow this article got mangled ;-) and I don't want to mess up the work you have been doing. Please look at the following edit diff:

This is supposed to be me, but in fact I only intentionally altered the top couple of paragraphs. So how did "Lifestyle of rikishi" turn into "...promotion and demotion..." - I have no idea. I will revert back to your last version (as best I can), then make the changes I intended: please check the result. Thanks! Imaginatorium (talk) 04:31, 23 June 2013 (UTC)

Musashigawa stable[edit]

I see that an admin has deleted Musashigawa stable, which was previously a redirect to Fujishima stable (2010), so you can redo your article on the new Musashigawa stable. But Musashigawa stable should really be a disambiguation page, like Fujishima stable, as both incarnations are likely to be searched for under that name. I hope you′d consider putting your article at Musashigawa stable (2013) instead.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 01:43, 16 July 2013 (UTC)

Hey FourTildes, I sent an email to the Musashigawa stable, don't know if I'll get a reply though, asking if the satble is a brad new stable or a continuation of the old one. Also, should Mienoumi Tsuyoshi be included as the 1980 to 2010 owner of the stable, as per tradition. Or maybe you accidentally deleted that section by copying and pasting. Either way, what do you think. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Leveni (talkcontribs) 04:40, 20 August 2013 (UTC)

Hey again. I've mentioned your name in an article I wrote on the admin's board, hope you don't mind. But, I feel it wrong that your original article was removed. [The link is here.]--Leveni (talk) 06:18, 20 August 2013 (UTC)

A cup of tea for you![edit]

Meissen-teacup pinkrose01.jpg Your article Tokyo Camii has been reviewed. I find it very useful. You deserve a cup of tea! Vanjagenije (talk) 17:41, 27 July 2013 (UTC)

Osunaarashi translation, and...[edit]

i went ahead and moved that translation into the lead paragraph~ after having read through the article now a couple of times i notice a few things i'd like to point out to you, seeing as you seem to be monitoring the article... all about the name:

  • mention of his name hops between "Osunaarashi" and "Osuna-arashi" (with and without the dash)...
  • also hops between spelling it with "O" and "Õ" (with and without the length-dash over the O)...
  • also hops between referring to him by his sumo name and his birth name... (should use the name he's publicly credited as)
  • at least once refers to him by the nickname (Budi?)... (isnt such informal referencing within the article a no-no?)

the spelling used in an article's title is what i've been taught to use within the article itself; the current title is WITH the bar over the Õ and withOUT the dash... you might want to give some consideration to WHICH is best for posterity~ NOTE: Japan Times reports his name WITHOUT EITHER; no bar, no dash =you may actually wanna consider moving/renaming the article to reflect JT's official spelling?? just advising as per encyclopedic formatting~

one more thing though: i'm not sure if theres special precedence for sumo names but... usually for famous people who are known by different names, the article TITLE is their ring/stage/pen-name, but THEN: the first usage of their name in the article is their BIRTH name followed by the "better known by/as ring/stage/pen-name" instead of the way youve got Osunaarashi credited in the first sentence... as i said, i'm not too sure if this should be the case for sumo but i've been corrected in the past when dealing with entertainer articles~ that might require ALL sumo articles to be re-formatted that way: for one, i noticed the Gagamaru article currently names him in the first sentence same as Osunaarashi~

!dont mean to bog you down with details! hope its helpful; let me know if i can assist any way in the future~ Japanglish (talk) 05:03, 8 February 2014 (UTC)

THANKS for your reply FT; you seem to know what youre doing, didnt mean to interrupt~ i'm a fan, often attend Tokyo bashos & refer to wikipedia for background & facts which is how i'm aware of this & the other articles... i hop around on wikipedia contributing quality control on Japanese topics; keep up the good work~ Japanglish (talk) 03:54, 11 February 2014 (UTC)

Sumo pics[edit]

Did some searching in Japanese + the fact that anything from 1956 and backwards is free. The US Library of Congress has some really nice, high resolution, ukiyo-e woodcuts as well. Kaiketsu (talk) 12:56, 10 February 2014 (UTC)

Sumo - good article[edit]

The content is very good but whole sections have little or no references. That I think is the reason it lost its GA ranking in the first place. I actually think that the references listed could cover all sections but they would have to be placed. If that could be done it would be a simple mater to put the article up for GA which has the added bonus of critiquing what else is wrong.Peter Rehse (talk) 11:11, 15 March 2014 (UTC)

Re:More records[edit]

Those are interesting tables, but I do wonder if it would make the article too bloated if they were included. (I actually don't think the "most tournaments to reach makuuchi" record should really be there either, as it's scarcely a record one would be proud of, but that was an indulgence of mine.) Would be OK in a Sanyaku article though. Maybe one should be spun out from the glossary? I also wonder if rikishi from the eighteenth and nineteenth centuries should actually even be included, as they're not really comparable. Should we possibly restrict such tables to the six-tournament-a-year era, as the NSK do (I think)? BTW thanks for today's update - extraordinary that Hakuho has reached a figure in 13 years that took Akinoshima 23 years! Just shows how dominant he has been.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 11:53, 17 March 2014 (UTC)

Interesting that Kotonowaka holds the all-time maegashira record. Terao must be up there too. And let's not forget Kyokushuzan, who holds the record for most consecutive tournaments at maegashira following his one stint at komusubi. The tables are fine in the makuuchi article, although we will have to remember to update it every tournament (I'm assuming Hakuho is going to be around a while longer!).--Pawnkingthree (talk) 15:49, 19 March 2014 (UTC)
I realize I am just creating more work for myself with the tables in the future, but that's okay. It's a small piece of extra work compared to the tourney tables. For some reason, I find tracking small, incremental change over time a worthy use of time. Yes, I did know Kyokushuzan's consecutive record (from the wiki article!) and it would be nice to show that somewhere. Perhaps another table! FourTildes (talk) 23:00, 19 March 2014 (UTC)

outside the box sumo topics?[edit]

if you've got any sumo-writing-with-attitude which may not have an outlet elsewhere, checkout and contact us there~ best. Japanglish (talk) 06:18, 12 May 2014 (UTC)

  • got your reply, thanks for taking the time~ ive been the one in contact with you; i'm OL, though it was LM who put together our sumo listings and may continue to do so... we were actually unsure as to how to refer to Kakuryu's cheap win; uwatenage didn't seem to us to be quite correct, but we ran with that in keeping with the officials decision... should we amend our listing? we'll continue coverage in July using the same daily-summary/slideshow format (you mightve noticed we were a few days late getting the page up during hatsu-basho, but now its in place) & the invitation to contribute is open at your availability... send contributors our way as well, any topics, maybe youve noticed the scope so far; we're still expanding~ best. Japanglish (talk) 00:31, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

thanks very much for the input, highly appreciated~ i'm top man on a small totem pole so if i don't catch oversights or misinfo it's readers like you who do~ amended the Ozeki typo (embarrassed that went "live"), will tend to Kakuryu timely! Japanglish (talk) 12:11, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

June 2014[edit]

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Kyokutenhō update[edit]

I don't understand this update. Is it supposed to say "oldest makuuchi wrestler" instead of "first wrestler"? I also don't understand the citation, as it doesn't seem relevant and the access date is 5 years before the event in question. (talk) 00:05, 24 November 2014 (UTC)

Hi. I replied to you question on your Talk page. ~ ~ ~ ~ (talk) 01:40, 24 November 2014 (UTC)


Just a heads-up that I've asked on the talk page if there are any other reasons behind his sudden retirement at just 26. Obviously we don't want unsourced speculation in the article but I would really appreciate it if you could do a little digging if you have the time :) --Pawnkingthree (talk) 14:19, 17 December 2014 (UTC)

Nishonoseki stable[edit]

I don't really have a strong opinion on the Nishonoseki stable vs Nishonoseki stable (1935) "controversy" that seems to be raging but I do think that Nishonoseki stable, which is currently a redirect, should instead be a dab page if Nishonoseki stable (1935) is going to exist. Thoughts?--Pawnkingthree (talk) 20:29, 3 January 2015 (UTC)

So let me get this straight - the information from the old Nishonoseki stable article was cut and pasted into a new article, Nishonseki (1935) and Matsugane stable became Nishonseki (2014), and then the old Nishonoseki stable page was changed to a redirect? Is that what happened? I'm a bit confused. Right now, the revision history to the article on the original Nishonoseki stable has been lost, so that needs to be fixed.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 16:21, 4 January 2015 (UTC)
I'm not blaming you for the page history thing by the way, it's just a consequence of an action by another user that I don't think was justified.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 16:49, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

What I decided to do was undo the cut and paste moves, and then make a formal request to move Nishonoseki stable to Nishonoseki stable (1935) at Wikipedia:Requested moves. I think this is the proper thing to do as there has been an objection. The reason for the delay is that I've not done this before and I wanted to get it right – I'm unsure, for instance, whether I need to ask for the disambiguation page to be done at the same time. This all seems rather more complicated than it needs to be :(--Pawnkingthree (talk) 02:30, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

I have now opened the discussion - go to WP:RM or the talk page.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 20:25, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

Yes I always take an interest in what goes on round here even if I'm not editing as often and I'll back you up if necessary!--Pawnkingthree (talk) 01:51, 8 January 2015 (UTC)

Global account[edit]

Hi FourTildes! As a Steward I'm involved in the upcoming unification of all accounts organized by the Wikimedia Foundation (see m:Single User Login finalisation announcement). By looking at your account, I realized that you don't have a global account yet. In order to secure your name, I recommend you to create such account on your own by submitting your password on Special:MergeAccount and unifying your local accounts. If you have any problems with doing that or further questions, please don't hesitate to contact me on my talk page. Cheers, —DerHexer (Talk) 13:07, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

Re: Updates[edit]

Oh, ok - I wasn't aware of that (I don't think you did mention it before.) I thought that date was just for the infobox. I'll change it in future.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 17:46, 19 January 2015 (UTC)

I'm sorry, you did mention it, back in July. I'd completely forgotten.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 20:41, 19 January 2015 (UTC)
Dammit I forgot to do this AGAIN with my recent updates. I really do have a mental block on this one. Sorry.--Pawnkingthree (talk) 12:15, 31 March 2015 (UTC)

I hadn't noticed. I did notice Tiger Boy didn't. That's okay. You are thinking about it anyway. I don't mind if you wait until next time around when you are updating something. To be honest it is even more useful for checking whether or not the bio is up to date, as the career record is easier to see if it has been updated or not at a glance. FourTildes (talk) 13:41, 31 March 2015 (UTC)


Thanks for getting opinions. I do prefer the guinea pig example. Good job. Sundayclose (talk) 19:27, 4 March 2015 (UTC)


I know you did some work on this a while back, and I'm reluctant to start fiddling with the template before getting your opinion. I noticed when I added in Kakuryu's kyujo for this basho in the tourney template, that it shows at 0-0-0. Shouldn't it be 0-0-15? 0-0-0 should be either for cancelled tournaments or post-intai tournaments.

I see what I did now - I just copied and pasted from the original March entry which also had "absent=0" for some reason. Thanks for clearing that up!--Pawnkingthree (talk) 12:15, 12 May 2015 (UTC)

Some bubble tea for you![edit]

Bubble Tea.png Thank you for your cleanup on Takanonami article. I loved him too. Aphaia (talk) 17:31, 22 June 2015 (UTC)


I have created Hidenoumi Takuya. Please take a look as it's my first attempt at a Sumo article and I'm sure there are lots of improvements needed. Tigerboy1966  14:21, 18 July 2015 (UTC)