Talk:Black Lives Matter

Why is there no mention of the riots, anarchy and violence conducted by BLM protestors?

mostly just WP:NOTHERE WP:NOTFORUM

For the most obvious reasons I think the majority of people can agree that BLM is a movement however no one can deny that violence, arson, property damage, and anarchy were a recurring aspect in 2020 after the death of George Floyd. I don't understand why this isn't mentioned in the article, are the editors of Wikipedia in complete denial of criminal acts committed by BLM activists? Or do the editors have a biased leftist agenda when it comes to certain controversial topics like this. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Paok117 (talk • contribs) 15:27, 8 January 2022 (UTC) They're peaceful protestors Espngeek (talk) 15:35, 8 January 2022 (UTC) If you have information that is supported by reliable sources, add it. That's how Wikipedia works. Or at the very least, please include links to the sources that you think are missing here. That way, other editors can review to determine whether they should be added, and add them if they have the time. As a reminder, this is a space to talk about issues with the article. It's not a space to talk about editors or launch accusations. Please stop. Dax Kirk (talk) 16:13, 8 January 2022 (UTC) @Paok117: According to this study by ACLED, 93% of BLM protests were peaceful. Another study by Harvard Radcliffe Institute said "Black Lives Matter Protesters Were Overwhelmingly Peaceful". ––FormalDude talk 19:46, 8 January 2022 (UTC) Your source that says 7% were violent. That should be included in the article. Baxter329 (talk) 01:02, 22 January 2022 (UTC) Please see archive 10 for the most recent discussion of this topic, under 2 months ago. The Crab Who Played With The Sea (talk) 01:07, 9 January 2022 (UTC) I wouldn’t really call them “peaceful protesters” tbh they nearly burnt Minneapolis to the ground had it not been for the US national guard being deployed to stop the rioters the city would have been destroyed. They also caused $2 billion dollars worth of property damage in June 2020 alone. What is the definition of a “reliable source” btw it sounds pretty biased and censors media publications and tabloids that aren’t aligned with the political left. I’m not going to provide a reference for a news article about this because it will be discredited and censored. Paok117 (talk) 06:31, 10 January 2022 (UTC) "What is the definition of a “reliable source” btw" How long have you been editing Wikipedia? See Wikipedia:Reliable sources for the content guideline. For a list of specific sources which have already been discussed, see Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Perennial sources. Dimadick (talk) 11:11, 10 January 2022 (UTC) @Dimadick: already tried explaining this. Take a look at their talk page. They aren't going to accept Wikipedia's views on sources. Doug Weller talk 15:20, 10 January 2022 (UTC) More than 500 shops and restaurants in Minneapolis and St. Paul have reported damage when protests on five nights turned violent over the death of George Floyd at the hands of Minneapolis police. Dozens of properties burned to the ground. Owners and insurance experts estimate the costs of the damage could exceed $500 million. Source: https://www.startribune.com/twin-cities-rebuilding-begins-with-donations-pressure-on-government/571075592/ Baxter329 (talk) 00:58, 22 January 2022 (UTC) Dr. Birx Says George Floyd Protests Have Resulted in the Destruction of 70 Covid-19 Testing Sites Source: https://www.yahoo.com/news/dr-birx-says-george-floyd-151449109.html Baxter329 (talk) 01:08, 22 January 2022 (UTC) Minneapolis vandalism targets include 198-unit affordable housing development The apartments were expected to hit the market later this year. June 27, 2020 The under-construction affordable housing development that burned in the widespread violence in south Minneapolis late Wednesday and early Thursday was to be a six-story rental building with 198 apartments for low-income renters, including more than three dozen for very low-income tenants. Construction began last fall on Midtown Corner, which was expected to be completed and ready for occupancy this year. Late Wednesday the wood-framed upper floors of the building were fully engulfed in flames, with thick plumes of smoke that figured prominently in widely viewed photos of the riots. By Thursday morning, what had been an active construction site was reduced to a pile of smoldering ashes atop what was left of the concrete first-floor commercial space. Source: https://www.startribune.com/minneapolis-vandalism-targets-include-189-unit-affordable-housing-development/570836742/ Baxter329 (talk) 01:12, 22 January 2022 (UTC) At least 11 killed during U.S. protests seeking justice for George Floyd, many of them African Americans Source: https://ktla.com/news/nationworld/at-least-11-killed-during-u-s-protests-seeking-justice-for-george-floyd-many-of-them-african-americans/ Baxter329 (talk) 01:16, 22 January 2022 (UTC) Baxter329, spamming this talk page with news stories is not going to accomplish anything. It looks like you want George Floyd protests in Minneapolis–Saint Paul, where all of this is detailed. – Muboshgu (talk) 01:17, 22 January 2022 (UTC) I don't know why you refer to my sources as "spam." These are reliable sources, and are a direct answer to the person who started this section of the talk page. Baxter329 (talk) 01:21, 22 January 2022 (UTC) Baxter329, because you're spamming the talk page with them. This page is for the broad Black Lives Matter movement. The George Floyd protests have their own pages. – Muboshgu (talk) 01:23, 22 January 2022 (UTC) All of those articles are about BLM protestors. Therefore, they are not "spam." Baxter329 (talk) 01:40, 22 January 2022 (UTC) Baxter329, nothing that you copy-pasted here says the damage was caused by BLM protestors. You're neglecting the violence committed by right-wing groups. – Muboshgu (talk) 01:53, 22 January 2022 (UTC) It wasn't "right wing" groups who protested against the murder of George Floyd. Those were BLM protestors. Baxter329 (talk) 02:06, 22 January 2022 (UTC) And the boogaloo bois and other right-wingers used the protests to stir up violence.[1][2] – Muboshgu (talk) 02:21, 22 January 2022 (UTC) 14 Days Of Protests, 19 Dead June 8, 2020 Though curfews are lifting and protests remain predominantly peaceful, the death toll from two weeks of demonstrations over the death of George Floyd continues to creep upward, with at least 19 people—a majority of whom are black—now dead. Source: https://www.forbes.com/sites/jemimamcevoy/2020/06/08/14-days-of-protests-19-dead/ Baxter329 (talk) 01:18, 22 January 2022 (UTC) That article makes no mention of "Black Lives Matter". --Jayron32 16:13, 26 January 2022 (UTC)

Anti-Semitism

There needs to be a section in this article concerning the founder's statements on the Jewish-American, and Jewish populations around the world. Framing them as warriors against racism and neglecting to add a full list of their controversies may lead readers to assume they do not hold racist dogmas. — Preceding unsigned comment added by FactChecker200000 (talk • contribs) 17:45, 31 January 2022 (UTC)

FactChecker200000, and what reliable sources do you have regarding the founder's statements on the Jewish-American, and Jewish populations around the world? – Muboshgu (talk) 17:49, 31 January 2022 (UTC)

Here are some reliable sources that address this topic:

https://www.politifact.com/article/2020/aug/24/ask-politifact-black-lives-matter-anti-semitic/

https://www.npr.org/2021/06/07/1003872848/the-complicated-history-behind-blms-solidarity-with-the-pro-palestinian-movement

https://time.com/6014631/israel-apartheid-hrw-washington/

Did you even bother to read that article? Or did you just google a couple of likely terms and WP:REFSPAM? The only mention of BLM in the whole article is They are more likely to favor civil rights for minorities, whether it’s the ‘Black Lives Matter’ movement in the U.S. or overseas. FDW777 (talk) 19:02, 31 January 2022 (UTC)

https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/jewish-allies-condemn-black-lives-matters-apartheid-platform-1.5421194

https://www.vox.com/world/2021/5/26/22452967/palestine-gaza-protests-black-lives-matter-blm-solidarity-israel

Baxter329 (talk) 18:17, 31 January 2022 (UTC)

I do not have the time right now to read these links, but I can say that supporting Palestinians does not equal anti-Semitism. – Muboshgu (talk) 21:54, 31 January 2022 (UTC)

Here are some sources I believe hold water, thank you for your quick response. These come from a variety of international sources, including the US, UK and Israel.

https://nypost.com/2021/05/21/blms-aggressive-tactics-and-rhetoric-have-led-to-attacks-on-jews/ https://spectator.org/jews-black-lives-matter-letter/ https://blogs.timesofisrael.com/black-lives-matters-jewish-problem-in-their-own-words/ https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/blm-should-look-to-martin-luther-king-not-malcolm-x-for-inspiration https://forward.com/news/456863/did-protesters-at-northwestern-use-an-antisemitic-slur-against-the/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by FactChecker200000 (talk • contribs) 18:59, 31 January 2022 (UTC)

• See WP:RSP. New York Post is not a reliable source, especially for politically sensitive subjects. The Spectator is primarily an opinion-based publication, and should not be used for facts stated in Wikipedia's voice. Blogs are not normally reliable sources. The last one only says that someone accused them of antisemitism, not that they were anti-Semitic. --Jayron32 19:10, 31 January 2022 (UTC)
• Blogs and unreliable sources aside, many of these sources make no mention of antisemitism or Jewish people and only comment support for Palestine or criticisms of the actions of the government of Israel. We cannot use them to throw together a subsection about antisemitism in the BLM movement. User:FactChecker200000 might come back with another dump of articles to look at, but searching through the depths of the internet to find the perfect source to make the article say what you want it to say is kind of the definition of cherry-picking, isn't it?  Vanilla  Wizard 💙 17:37, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

I did indeed read said articles, the three sources you provided me were three of the most liberal publications available. Yet when I provide a variety of sources, both corporate and personal, domestic and international, you claim I am cherry-picking? In regard to your apologist sources, they dismiss any and all accusations of antisemitism as fringe groups of people involved in said protests, denying the fact that they held such beliefs, instead turning to their endorsements from Jewish advocacy groups. In your own "PolitiFact" sources, even the TLDR section states the discontent many Jews feel towards the movement. This is specifically in the graffiti and defamation which occurs during riots. And, while leaders may downplay Anti-Semitic acts, it most certainly does not speak for the group as a whole. My point in making this thread was to point out the controversies surrounding BLM. I didn't come to argue with you, rather state the obvious. My feeling here is that you are more concerned with defending BLM than including the factual information, which is the controversy surrounding how many Jews feel towards BLM rhetoric. To say there is no tension between BLM and Jewish-Americans would imply there to be little or no mention of the phenomena in major news outlets. But there is. Therefore, we must only assume there is precedence for people seeking answers on the topic. Wikipedia's job is to document a full catalogue on a particular topic, controversies very much included. The fact we are even having this conversation right now and were both able to pull from mainstream news sources to defend are case is, in fact, evidence of controversy. I am sorry you may not feel the same way as me, but I respect your right to your own opinions. However, Wikipedia is not your opinion piece, as I mentioned it is to serve as a guide to a topic, and a branch to other sources. To ignore this controversy over one of the biggest movements in history in favor of your own political beliefs is a disservice to the platform, and the reader. Thank you for your time. — Preceding unsigned comment added by FactChecker200000 (talk • contribs)

• I think the more obviously appropriate title of this section is pro-Palestine. Espngeek (talk) 22:34, 1 February 2022 (UTC)

• Here are some relevant reliable sources:

+ https://www.npr.org/2021/06/07/1003872848/the-complicated-history-behind-blms-solidarity-with-the-pro-palestinian-movement (pro-Palestine) + Talking Points on Anti-Semitism and Black Lives Matter https://www.jewishpublicaffairs.org › (Some feel it is anti-semitic, but BLM can actually align with Jewish anti-anti-semitism) + https://www.politifact.com/article/2020/aug/24/ask-politifact-black-lives-matter-anti-semitic/ (over 600 Jewish groups support BLM; some groups associated with BLM have been called anti-semitic by some Jewish groups.) + ==> I don't know if this is an acceptable source. https://www.afr.com/world/europe/why-black-lives-matter-protests-are-a-catalyst-for-anti-semitism-20200623-p555ch (""... the Black Lives Matter protests have gone on producing potent outbreaks of anti-Semitism.") + https://www.newsweek.com/anti-semitism-derail-black-lives-matter-movement-1519728 ("Black and Jewish activists say charges of anti-Semitism are being used to undermine the Black Lives Matter movement.")164.47.187.32 (talk) 00:45, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

Central Park birdwatching incident

Is the Central Park birdwatching incident actually relevant to this article? The only place BLM is mentioned in that article is in the BLM template and category, there's nothing in the article body. FDW777 (talk) 21:23, 17 February 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 20 February 2022

Could this article be listed in further reading: https://lawtutor.co.uk/black-lives-matter Lw00sjn (talk) 11:30, 20 February 2022 (UTC)

No. It's a commercial website selling law tutoring services. See WP:EL 10mmsocket (talk) 11:51, 20 February 2022 (UTC)

Unaccounted donations

The California Department of Justice says the organization is in violation of state law over the failure to disclose financial records and that its leadership could be personally liable for fines for failing to account for $60 million in donations. and Amazon has suspended BLM donations over the handling and reporting of donations by the group's leadership.https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/opinion/black-lives-matter-s-finances-deserve-the-scrutiny-they-re-finally-getting/ar-AAU3xmf?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531 24.177.167.113 (talk) 03:25, 21 February 2022 (UTC)

That's an opinion piece EvergreenFir (talk) 03:39, 21 February 2022 (UTC)

Other sources:

This is form National Review, which was founded by the late William F. Buckley Jr., who had his own show on PBS called Firing Line: https://www.yahoo.com/video/black-lives-matter-suspends-online-185305692.html

New York Post https://nypost.com/2022/02/17/amazon-suspends-black-lives-matter-from-its-charity-platform/

Toronto Sun https://torontosun.com/news/world/amazon-suspends-black-lives-matter-from-charity-platform

Washington Examiner https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/amazon-boots-black-lives-matter-off-amazonsmile-as-scrutiny-intensifies

Baxter329 (talk) 19:54, 21 February 2022 (UTC)

BBC article

I'm copying and pasting the beginning of this BBC article. You can read the entire thing at the link. I think this information should be added to the article. What do others here think?

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-60392196

US candidate 'traumatised' by bail for gun suspect

A US mayoral candidate who was shot at during a campaign meeting this week has blasted the decision to grant bail to his alleged would-be assassin.

Nobody was injured in Monday's gun attack on Louisville city hall contender Craig Greenberg.

Quintez Brown, a 21-year-old left-wing activist who has pleaded not guilty to attempted murder, was bailed out by a Black Lives Matter fund on Wednesday.

Baxter329 (talk) 19:57, 21 February 2022 (UTC)

Also, the target of the would be assassin is Jewish. Sources:

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/louisville-mayoral-candidate-outraged-campaign-office-shooting-suspect-rcna16786

https://www.jpost.com/diaspora/antisemitism/article-696614

https://www.thedailybeast.com/quintez-brown-of-louisville-alleged-craig-greenberg-wannabe-assassin-started-as-promising-activist

https://www.wtvq.com/police-louisville-mayoral-candidate-unharmed-in-shooting/

https://www.timesofisrael.com/jewish-louisville-mayor-candidate-traumatized-by-release-of-suspect/

Baxter329 (talk) 20:06, 21 February 2022 (UTC)