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MilkyDefer (talk | contribs)
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::* [https://www.gamechosun.co.kr/ Game Chosun]
::* [https://www.gamechosun.co.kr/ Game Chosun]
::I have no knowledge of Korean, but I believe this could help. [[User:MilkyDefer|<span style="color:#09C">Milky</span>]][[User talk:MilkyDefer|'''<span style="color:#F09">Defer</span>''']] 05:20, 18 October 2023 (UTC)
::I have no knowledge of Korean, but I believe this could help. [[User:MilkyDefer|<span style="color:#09C">Milky</span>]][[User talk:MilkyDefer|'''<span style="color:#F09">Defer</span>''']] 05:20, 18 October 2023 (UTC)
:::And it is a pity that the Korean source claiming that Mintrocket is not an indie, is not in that list. I think we cannot jump to the conclusion that the site is unreliable -- we might need to find someone familiar with Korean games. [[User:MilkyDefer|<span style="color:#09C">Milky</span>]][[User talk:MilkyDefer|'''<span style="color:#F09">Defer</span>''']] 05:23, 18 October 2023 (UTC)


== Restructured Requests page ==
== Restructured Requests page ==

Revision as of 05:23, 18 October 2023

New Articles (September 25 to October 1)

Main page: Wikipedia:WikiProject Video games/New article announcements
 A listing of all articles newly added to the Video Games Wikiproject (regardless of creation date). Generated by v3.16 of the RecentVGArticles script and posted by PresN. Bug reports and feature requests are appreciated. --PresN 18:09, 2 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

September 25

September 26

September 27

I removed the WikiProject tag. There's nothing about video games in the article, I think it comes from Nishikawa being in the band Dreams Come True, which Sonic the Hedgehog composer Masato Nakamura was also a member of. soetermans. ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 04:17, 3 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
@Soetermans: Yup, sorry about that. I grabbed the project tags from Nakamura and must have missed removing the VG tag. Thanks for catching that! ···日本穣 · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe · Join WP Japan! 16:39, 3 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Nihonjoe no worries! It was an interesting read, thanks for creating the article. soetermans. ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 11:09, 4 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

September 28

September 29

September 30

October 1

Yep I went through the exact same process. I added a few of the meatier refs in the article to help out anyone hoping to expand it. Ben · Salvidrim! ✉ 19:46, 2 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move at Talk:Mirror's Edge (2010 video game)#Requested move 26 September 2023

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:Mirror's Edge (2010 video game)#Requested move 26 September 2023 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. ModernDayTrilobite (talk • contribs) 14:23, 4 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

State of "Martha Is Dead"

I'm not very familiar with the page, but if the following request is more suited to WikiProject Cleanup, please let me know.

Earlier this year, a new account whose contributions have been solely for this article, created a draft for Martha Is Dead, apparently without realising an article for the game already existed. As the existing article was pretty thin and the draft was a lot more extensive, the decision was made to merge the draft into it. A review was then proposed to ascertain whether the merging has been done appropriately, and a template for cleanup added around the same time.

I don't know if the template was in response to this, but the article is now in a pretty poor state due to much of what was written for the draft being unnecessary, poorly-sourced (or using questionable sources), and often violating WP:NPOV, typically through puffery; I have outlined the main problems in more detail on the article's talk. Wikibenboy94 (talk) 19:25, 4 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Wikibenboy94, I tried going over it but the article was in a horrible state. I've reverted back to before the bloat. I haven't got the time to help improve it further, but I believe there was very little worth salvaging from the most recent revision. soetermans. ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 20:13, 4 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks, and my thoughts exactly. I would have reverted it myself but thought there might have been opposition to such a bold move. Wikibenboy94 (talk) 21:17, 4 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Ranboo page

Some of the Dream SMP members have pages on them, and Ranboo should have one. 98.97.32.22 (talk) 18:23, 5 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Only if he can be shown to meet our notability guideline for biographies. QuicoleJR (talk) 18:36, 5 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Age of Civilizations II

A old game, but please, can you create this article. Got have on Turkish wiki: tr:Age of History II СтасС (talk) 00:22, 6 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

There is currently a draft at Draft:Age of History II. – Pbrks (t • c) 01:38, 6 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you!--СтасС (talk) 01:39, 6 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Doubt about the featured article New Super Mario Bros.

Hello, I want to report here this discussion: Talk:New Super Mario Bros.#Tree Redjedi23 (talk) 18:31, 9 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

New Articles (October 2 to October 8)

Main page: Wikipedia:WikiProject Video games/New article announcements
 A listing of all articles newly added to the Video Games Wikiproject (regardless of creation date). Generated by v3.16 of the RecentVGArticles script and posted by PresN. Bug reports and feature requests are appreciated. --PresN 15:09, 12 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

October 2

October 3

October 4

October 5

October 6

October 7

October 8

Was out of town, so later than usual. --PresN 15:09, 12 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I'm glad WPVG finally acknowledged Ruffles! They're my favorite snack. Panini! • 🥪 16:44, 12 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Splitting "year in video games" lists?

Articles like 2022 in video games tend to get very long. I propose that these articles be split into two articles. 2022 in video games can be about the general overview, awards, major events, the industry, video game tech, film adaptations, etc. Then the actual super long list of games can be split to List of video games in 2022 or List of 2022 video game releases. This would make both the general summary and the list easier to access and read without the other getting in the way. I suggest splitting all of the articles from 2001 in video games through 2024 in video games like this. Thebiguglyalien (talk) 22:52, 12 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

It would certainly be a logical split, considering 2022 and 2023 are currently the 15th and 25th longest pages on Wikipedia, respectively, with over 500k bytes each. 2016, 2017, and 2021 are also in the top 500 with over 350k. – Rhain ☔ (he/him) 22:59, 12 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
What if I suggested that... we could just link to the categories instead. Self-populating, saves considerable effort. -- ferret (talk) 23:04, 12 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Sadly, that split would do quite little to solve the issue. It might produce one nice-looking article about that year in gaming, but the big list would remain just as big. These big lists do seem functional and reasonable to have distinct from categories... ~Maplestrip/Mable (chat) 08:55, 13 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The lists do have more info than the categories, but I agree with Ferret that splitting the pages just ends up with two pages that need updating, and doesn't actually solve the list length issue (as the list of video games is the heaviest section of the pages by far.) Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs talk 09:08, 13 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The list of games released is often plagued with inclusion of random indie games that don't get any larger coverage, as well as re-releases (not remasters/remakes) of a game on different systems. There's lots of ways to trim those lists, and it should be considered impossible today to list every major game release. Masem (t) 13:15, 13 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Some sort of minimum criteria would make it more workable, though I don't know what that would be. Units sold comes to mind, but that can be hard to source, and it would exclude well-known free games. Then there's a certain number of independent reviews, but even one reference per game is already a huge load on the page. And then of course, as said above, there's always removing the lists entirely. Thebiguglyalien (talk) 17:41, 13 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
One could always reduce the load on the page by adopting the same method or a similar one that "Deaths in YEAR" lists do: References should be in <ref>[url & title]</ref> format, as full citations make the page too slow to load, and too big to edit. Making everyone manually type out the citation information instead of using the template wouldn't solve the length issue, but it would decrease the page load while still allowing for references that are being used for the inclusion criteria. ~Cheers, TenTonParasol 18:06, 13 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I've created a script to do just this in case this is something we would like to do. – Pbrks (t • c) 00:42, 14 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The usual starting point for many LISTCRITs is to require the entries to be independently notable, with perhaps an except for those that nearly meet the bar with reliable secondary sourcing beyond simple announcements. List of Nintendo Switch games follows this, because of the sheer amount of shovelware available now on the eShop. That list does not allow primary sourcing, requiring entries to have their own article or secondary sourcing to back the entry. At the same time, the Nintendo Switch list reveals the scope of the problem. Even with the LISTCRIT limitation, for the last 3 years, the Nintendo Switch list totals well over 1500kb and is incomplete even with the LISTCRIT limitation. "B" alone had to be split and has 200kb. That means for 2021-2023, Nintendo Switch alone represents 1500kb of entries for the 3 year articles. -- ferret (talk) 18:13, 13 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I believe that the lists should be deleted entirely without any split. The categories already exist, and notable game releases are already covered in the core article if they received a Metacritic score of 90 or higher. The article is impossible to read or edit on laptops and mobile devices due to its length and a split would not help. NegativeMP1 19:52, 13 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
It seems we're divided between splitting and deleting the lists. Splitting could also involve setting inclusion criteria for the lists. Is it possible for us to settle on one of these solutions? Thebiguglyalien (talk) 15:32, 17 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
My two cents: I don't personally believe this will end up being deleted if its sent to WP:AFD. I think you'd get a lot of "Keep - Of course the cross-section of video games and years is notable" comments just because there are so many "(Year) in (Subject)" articles out there. Regardless of whether or not that's true or a valid argument, it tends to be how it goes for these sorts of lists. I think it would be better to try to get some inclusion criteria going or something. Trimming out games that don't have their own dedicated articles, trimming out late ports/basic remasters, splitting out platforms like PC or mobile, etc. (Just brainstorming, I'm sure there's pitfalls to any of those examples listed.) Sergecross73 msg me 16:16, 17 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
My understanding of the delete option wasn't AFD the whole article but deleting the list section from the article. ~Cheers, TenTonParasol 18:52, 17 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Dave the Diver

There's been a running dispute at Dave the Diver over whether Mintrocket, a subsidiary of Nexon, is an indie developer. Reliable sources, who have acknowledged that Mintrocket is a subsidiary of Nexon, have nevertheless said they're an indie developer and this is an indie game. However, this issue seems to have become a big issue to some people on Reddit. Someone recently removed several reliable sources and said it's not an indie game, cited to an interview on a Korean website. Does anyone know if this source is reliable and thus the interview might be trustworthy? And would a machine-translated interview with the developer overrule what third-party reliable sources say? WP:VG/OFFICIAL seems to apply here, but one could also invoke WP:ABOUTSELF and say that this is correcting a mistaken belief by the press. NinjaRobotPirate (talk) 02:46, 13 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Looks like they only removed the videogames.si source in that edit, keeping all the other sources prominently describing it as an indie game in the title. If we can confirm that the interview is properly legitimate, I think it's reasonably to at least omit "indie" from the lede section. We can still write about it having indie aesthetics for sure, using indie as a sort of movement of game design. ~Maplestrip/Mable (chat) 08:51, 13 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I would tend to agree it is not an indie dev. First, there is the quote posted on the talk page. Through my own research, I found a separate quote directly from Nexon saying that Mintrocket is an in-house division. "Had 'P3' been developed normally inhouse, it would have been presented to users under the name Mint Rocket". It appears this could be a case of an editorial mistake by Sports Illustrated because of the game's indie-esque appearance.
Obviously this is problematic but per WP:IAR, Wikipedia is not required to state anything a source says if there's clear evidence it could be wrong. I would err on the side of removing the indie game mentions and referring to it as a Nexon subsidiary. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 12:58, 13 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I think you misunderstand. I don't care whether individual Wikipedians think Mintrocket is an indie developer. There is no question that they are a subsidiary of Nexon; however, that is irrelevant to the question of whether they are an independent developer. On Wikipedia, the only relevant criteria is whether reliable sources identify them as such, and multiple reliable sources have said this is an indie game, and one explicitly identified them as an indie developer. Eurogamer themselves have said that it is an independent game made by a Nexon subsidiary; this is cited directly in the article. So, we don't need editors to come to their own personal conclusions. Eurogamer has already done it for us. What I am asking is not "do you think this is an indie developer?" I am asking if the Korean website is a reliable source. If it isn't, then the interview could be faked. NinjaRobotPirate (talk) 03:46, 14 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Ignoring the question of whether the talk page interview is an RS, because I am unsure, and looking purely for English sources that might be relevant, there is an alternate Eurogamer article in which Eurogamer says: "Do you find it as fascinating as I do how every now and then you get a whiff of VERY NOT INDIE BUDGET peering out from behind its indie facade? [...] It's published and perhaps made by Nexon, right, who are completely huge? I would love to know how this game came to be!" It's possible that when Eurogamer said "indie RPG" they meant "indie-style RPG" or that they simply contradicted themselves due to a misunderstanding. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 04:28, 14 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Speaking of Korean sources, I am currently working on Blue Archive, another Korean game, in my home wiki. A quick glance of the kowiki shows that they list the following websites:
I have no knowledge of Korean, but I believe this could help. MilkyDefer 05:20, 18 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
And it is a pity that the Korean source claiming that Mintrocket is not an indie, is not in that list. I think we cannot jump to the conclusion that the site is unreliable -- we might need to find someone familiar with Korean games. MilkyDefer 05:23, 18 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Restructured Requests page

Wikipedia:WikiProject Video games/Requests has gone under a complete restructuring.

  • The list was reduced from 486 to 190 requests
  • The plain text list was replaced with a table to help with filtering and navigation
  • Requests that are over a year old and are composed only of simply reviews, previews, and release information are now moved to a new archive page. This is to keep the main page focused on new requests and those with developer interviews or other interesting analysis. Archived requests are still valid and can be assessed there.

Please take a look. TarkusABtalk/contrib 19:25, 15 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

New Articles (October 9 to October 15)

Main page: Wikipedia:WikiProject Video games/New article announcements
 A listing of all articles newly added to the Video Games Wikiproject (regardless of creation date). Generated by v3.16 of the RecentVGArticles script and posted by PresN. Bug reports and feature requests are appreciated. --PresN 20:40, 16 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

October 9

October 10

October 11

October 12

October 13

October 14

October 15

Title move discussion for Luigi's Mansion: Dark Moon

Discussion is here. Many of the original voters were already on the fence of using the Dark Moon subtitle. Panini! • 🥪 19:07, 17 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

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