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May 18

Image use policy

Hi, yesterday I had this conversation on my talk page about an image insertion I reverted on the frequently vandalised article, Mewing (orthotropics). Essentially, the editor had uploaded an image of a minor onto Commons and then placed that image in an article on English Wikipedia. I reverted that insertion, partly because I thought it was vandalism (given the edit history of that page), and mostly because I was concerned about the image. I asked the editor if they had the consent to post such an image of a minor. They said they knew the minor depicted in the image, but did not gain consent from the minor's guardians yet. I advised them to delete the image until consent via a model release was obtained.

Today, another user probably did something very similar and we had (or are still having) a conversation about it on the article's talk page, which can be viewed here.

I was surprised WP:IUP (and WP:CHILDPROTECT) had no definitive and explicit language about consent and images that deal with minors in this type of scenario. I did try to quickly look through those policies' talk pages and the talk pages of here, WP:Teahouse, and WP:VP to find other similar cases. I was going to post this on WP:VPP requesting an update to the policy language in the image use policy, but before I do, I want to make ensure I am not overlooking some other EN Wikipedia/Commons policy or past discussion where this is addressed?

I do see on WP:YOUNG (which is just an essay), "Never upload or post photos of yourself, your friends, or your family."

Do you think my actions were logical in this scenario? Did it follow policy? If so, which policies? What would you have done here? Thank you in advance, --Classicwiki (talk) If you reply here, please ping me. 03:49, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

P.S. Disclosure: I did post this yesterday at Teahouse, but my questions have gone unanswered and now with the second occurrence of this situation, I would really like to find some clarity. --Classicwiki (talk) If you reply here, please ping me. 03:51, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

If there's PII in the metadata might be worth chucking it at WP:OS or c:COM:OS, Classicwiki. That's all I can think of off the top of my head. Not sure if an Oversighter might be able to clarify the exact bounds of what they'd usually supress. Alpha3031 (t • c) 13:48, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

@Classicwiki: The images have been deleted from Commons. Can you clarify what more you are asking for? Also, please be patient, it can sometimes take time for a question to get a reply. RudolfRed (talk) 18:43, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

@Classicwiki I saw your post at the Teahouse but didn't reply then as I couldn't point you to a relevant policy. I did look at the images in question and thought that you were over-reacting. Commons hosts thousands of pictures categorised as children, many of them much younger than the ones you objected to. Many, no doubt, were uploaded by their parents, who consented to their use on Wikipedia and elsewhere by licensing them. Model release is, I believe, only relevant for commercial use of an image, so irrelevant for use within a Wikipedia article. That said, it would be useful to establish best practice in this area. Mike Turnbull (talk) 13:18, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Dabney Coleman

Someone added a random A after 1960. Can it be removed?

Coleman was a character actor with roles in well over 60 films and television programs to his credit. He trained with Sanford Meisner at the Neighborhood Playhouse School of the Theatre in New York City from 1958 to 1960.a

Thank you. 2601:18C:9083:A9D0:31FA:CB5E:D902:8412 (talk) 10:55, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

Done, thank you for spotting this. TSventon (talk) 11:02, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

How to disclose a COI and what is allowed.

I am a former intern for the organization Fairvote. Am I allowed to edit 1. Articles about voting systems in general and 2. Articles about Fairvote itself; and what is the proper disclosure. A Tree In A Box (talk) 15:07, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

Hi @A Tree In A Box. You can definitely edit articles about voting systems in general: it is normal for editors to edit in topic areas that they have experience or interests in.

You probably should not edit the Fairvote article yourself. Although you are no longer an intern you will still have a CoI. It would be best to disclosure this on your User Page by following the instructions at WP:COI. Then if you wanted to make any edits, do it via the WP:EDITREQUEST system.

Hope that helps. Qcne (talk) 15:51, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

So like, for example, the Ranked-choice voting in the United States has a giant 'article may have been paid for' disclaimer. It makes me apprehensive about adding stuff to the article that might be seen as 'on-brand', for example mentioning states that use a ranked choice ballot for overseas military voters to automatically participate in a runoff. I don't know if it's appropriate to just make those edits, or inquire to why the tag is there?

A Tree In A Box (talk) 06:34, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

Hey again @A Tree In A Box. I see you asked the user who added the tag on their Talk Page their rationale for adding the tag, that's the right thing to do.

I would suggest be bold but be careful. As long as you are sticking to factual text backed up by reliable sources, you should be okay. Qcne (talk) 08:09, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

"Billionaire" in lede sentence

Should the world "billionaire" be used in the lead sentence for BLPs, say for example "Harry Triguboff is a Chinese-born Australian billionaire real estate developer" or should it generally be omitted? Articles of notable billionaires (e.g. Bill Gates) generally don't include such but many others do, such as the example above. Zinderboff(talk) 16:06, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

If there are reliable and independent sources referring the subject as a billionaire, then it's justifiable to include the term in the lede. Tutwakhamoe (talk) 20:24, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

In the lead is normal to reference wealth, especially if there is reliable, independent sources referring to them as such. However I was wondering whether it should be mentioned in the first sentence, since many extremely famous wealthy individuals don't have "billionaire" as part of its title, even though it is certain that many sources refer to them as such. Zinderboff(talk) 05:48, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

@Zinderboff The manual of style has some guidance here which I would interpret as saying that you only need to mention the wealth in the first sentence if that is the principal reason the person is notable. In many cases (Gates included) the person is notable for their accomplishments and their wealth is incidental. Mike Turnbull (talk) 12:51, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Noted, thank you! Zinderboff(talk) 13:06, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Athlete from my school won a state title

What is the best way to record in on the local HS page. DMc75771 (talk) 16:16, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

I'm not sure I would unless the student themselves merits a Wikipedia article, and that depends on the coverage they receive in independent reliable sources. 331dot (talk) 17:18, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

change title of page

Our church has changed it's name and the title needs to be corrected from St Mark's Episcopal Church to St. Martin de Porres Episcopal Church StMartinAlex (talk) 16:50, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

Please request a page move at Requested Moves. 331dot (talk) 17:16, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

@User:StMartinAlex Be sure to say which St. Mark's Episcopal Church. A quick look turned up articles on 37 different St. Mark's Episcopal Churches. Uporządnicki (talk) 17:26, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

@User:StMartinAlex And are you sure you didn't mean to write St. Martin's Episcopal Church, rather than St. Mark's? That might be the church wanting to make it clear which St. Martin--de Porres, or of Tours. I did third grade in a classroom in a Catholic Church building, in which the classrooms had saints' names rather than room numbers. I was in Blessed Martin de Porres classroom. And during the school year, Blessed Martin was canonized, thus becoming Saint Martin. Sister made a lesson out of that, and taped a sheet of paper saying "Saint" over the "Blessed" on the door, until the door could be repainted. Uporządnicki (talk) 17:35, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

thank you for your help - St. Mark's Episcopal Church (Alexandria, Virginia) is the title of the page (I had updated the body a couple of months ago). Our new name is St. Martin de Porres Episcopal Church (Alexandria, Virginia). StMartinAlex (talk) 17:38, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

@StMartinAlex: I have moved St. Mark's Episcopal Church (Alexandria, Virginia) to St. Martin de Porres Episcopal Church. We only add data like "(Alexandria, Virginia)" to titles when it's necessary to distinguish from other Wikipedia articles like all the St. Mark's Episcopal Church. PrimeHunter (talk) 18:01, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

thank you! StMartinAlex (talk) 20:23, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

What is the WP:ARBECR policy for talk page discussions?

If a page is restricted to extended-confirmed editors, you can still make constructive edit requests on the talk page. Wikipedia:Arbitration Committee/Procedures#Extended confirmed restriction My question is: if a discussion ensues on the talk page after you post your initial edit request, can you constructively participate in this ensuing discussion on that talk page if you are not an extended-confirmed user?

I've made edit requests on talk pages, discussion ensued, then when I tried to participate, my edits were removed, with the citation to WP:ARBECR. But the policy itself is unclear. The policy says "Non-extended-confirmed editors may use the "Talk:" namespace only to make edit requests related to articles within the topic area, provided they are not disruptive." Is it saying they may use "the Talk: namespace only," as opposed to the main article? Is it saying they may use the Talk: namespace "only to make edit requests," as opposed to other types of posts (or participating in ensuing discussions)? Or is it saying that the edit requests must be only related to articles within the topic area, and not to other articles or topics? Y2K-96 (talk) 17:30, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

I would assume that the use of the word only was deliberate. Just Step Sideways ^{from this world ..... today} 17:34, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

Yes, but what is the word "only" applying to? That was my question. Does it mean only the talk page? Only edit requests? Or only related to articles in the topic area? The previous sentence is "The restriction applies to all edits and pages related to the topic area, broadly construed, with the following exceptions," so I would lean to interpreting it as saying all pages, except the talk page only, with only referring to only the talk page. Also, are discussions about an edit request considered part of the edit request? Is there any specific precedent we can look at that makes the policy more clear? Y2K-96 (talk) 17:37, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

If it requires further discussion then it will be discussed by extended-confirmed editors. Further input by non-ec editors is not allowed. The stipulation of the talk namespace only is to make it clear that you cannot take part in project discussions in the Wikipedia namespace or other discussions. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 18:02, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

Y2K-96, the "Edit requests only" language was adopted following a discussion at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Clarification and Amendment/Archive 125 § Clarification request: Extended confirmed restriction. Hopefully that clarifies the intent for you. Folly Mox (talk) 21:47, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

Thanks, this was exactly what I was looking for! Yet somehow it adds more layers of confusion. It is now clear to me that the "only" is referring to "only edit requests," but it is still unclear to me if a discussion about the very edit request you made is included in the edit request. In the original motion, permissible edit requests were contrasted with "internal project discussions" that "include, but are not limited to, AfDs, WikiProjects, RfCs, RMs, and noticeboard discussions (which non-ec users cannot participate in)." Participating in the discussion of your own non-formalized edit request seems very different than these other "internal" examples. Also, the "Tamzin" proposal which was adopted was characterized as a policy to "limit the exception to nondisruptive edit requests and provide enforcement discretion for other nondisruptive talk page posts." There was a lot of talk about leaving room to allow good faith editors to make innocuous contributions, and to target the policy against sock accounts derailing discussion. My contributions that were removed were clearly nondisruptive and arguably a part of the edit request, so it seems like they shouldn't have been removed. Anyways, I will refrain for now on anything except the initial request until there is more consensus on what the policy actually is. Y2K-96 (talk) 06:46, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

The whole point of the restriction is to save the hassle of having to make judgement calls about what is and what isn't a disruptive edit and the ensuing debates and disagreements about them. As already explained by SFR, if an edit request requires further discussion, then it will be discussed by EC editors (with no further input by non-EC editors). M.Bitton (talk) 23:15, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Why is the mobile page not currently the one offered when searching for an article on google?

Basically, when searching for pages in a browser, or for Wikipedia itself, the desktop page is the one being shown on mobile safari currently, and I must manually edit the link to give myself the mobile site. Is this something more as a result of a Wikipedia issue, or a Google one? Class444SWRail (talk) 19:11, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

Did you scroll to the bottom and click "mobile view"? 331dot (talk) 19:34, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

@Class444SWRail: Wikipedia should normally remember your choice of "Mobile view" or "Desktop" at the bottom of pages. That's the official way to switch between mobile and desktop, not by editing the url. PrimeHunter (talk) 19:48, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

Some mobile browsers (Firefox on Android for sure) will ignore taps on links at the very bottom of the view window, presumably to avoid following links from mistaps where users intended to select the address bar. I haven't been able to switch between mobile and desktop view using the link at the bottom of a page since like 2022, and always have to edit the url. Folly Mox (talk) 21:36, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

@Folly Mox: I haven't heard of that before. If it's a common problem then it should be reported somewhere if it isn't already. The switch works for me in mobile Safari like Class444SWRail has. Maybe you can use User:PrimeHunter/Mobile view.js to switch from desktop to mobile. PrimeHunter (talk) 22:10, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

I should clarify that I am able to switch to mobile view in Firefox 126.0, since elements containing the WMF and Mediawiki logos are forced to the bottom of the page, but I'm unable to switch to desktop view because the Terms of Use, Privacy policy, and Desktop view links are all the way at the bottom. I never considered this might be a bug and not just a browser thing, but it's extremely consistent. Folly Mox (talk) 22:26, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

As someone who uses mobile view constantly, check that your browser doesn't have a "Desktop Site" option. On Chrome it's on the settings (kebab menu). It is not Google (or whatever site you are using) that is forcing a different version. Your phone is smart enough to go to the mobile version unless it's been told not to. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 23:30, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

Hmm. I've never had this particular issue (also Firefox Android) but I did sometimes have footnotes hidden by the address bar in mobile view. I'm assuming it may be a bug, but with Firefox, since the option with the browser UI at the bottom of the screen is probably comparatively less tested and has fewer users to report bugs. Just my speculation though. Alpha3031 (t • c) 04:00, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

I have tried this, it does not move me to the mobile site if I switch between the two Class444SWRail (talk) 08:15, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

It has not been for about a week on my version of Safari, and will refuse to leave the desktop site unless I directly modify the url Class444SWRail (talk) 08:16, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

I have selected mobile view, but I am remaining on the desktop site regardless Class444SWRail (talk) 08:15, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

@Class444SWRail: Are you saying that you see a "Mobile view" link at the bottom of pages but you don't even view the current page in mobile if you tap the link? What if you tap this link: Mobile view. PrimeHunter (talk) 10:02, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Defunct WikiProjects

WikiProject Tamil civilization is currently believed to be inactive. The thing is, shouldn’t it be defunct? Most departments have been deleted including all categories. There’s basically nothing about the project that is substantial and there is already WikiProject Tamil Nadu which is active and WikiProject Tamil Eelam is defunct. Do I have permission to make Tamil civilization defunct as well? 48JCL (talk • contribs) 21:27, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

48JCL I suggest asking at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Council. There may be a process that you should follow. TSventon (talk) 10:01, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

May 19

Cast order when no actors in credits

Kalloori Vaasal (1996) article puts Ajith Kumar's name first but the film is remembered for Prashanth's performance (as shown by a source in the production section [1] ) as a rowdy college student although both have similar screen time. The article probably puts his name second due to the fact that he is not popular anymore while Ajith Kumar still is. Protocol? At the time of release, Prashanth had more hits (at least three) as lead while Ajith Kumar only was noticed in 1995 a year before. This [2] puts Prashanth's name first. DareshMohan (talk) 00:44, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

I believe the default convention is to list the cast alphabetically, in whice case Ajith Kumar's name would be first. What the film is remembered for (by whom?) and who is the more popular are irrelevant. Shantavira|^{feed me} 08:16, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

@DareshMohan, @Shantavira: For the infobox, the documentation for the starring parameter of {{Infobox film}} states in general, use the billing block of the poster for the film's original theatrical release as a rule of thumb for listing starring actors. If unavailable, use the top-billed actors from the screen credits. This sometimes leads to an unexpected order, such as on Gandhi (film). Bazza 7 (talk) 09:04, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

@User:Bazza_7 A quick Google search shows that the actors' names were omitted from the posters. [3]. DareshMohan (talk) 07:28, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

@DareshMohan: Have you tried following "If unavailable..." then? Bazza 7 (talk) 07:33, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

The screen credits only credits the crew i.e. makeup man, editor, cameraman, writer, producer and director. Full movie is on YouTube. [4] (Google Translate on Mobile easily translates it). DareshMohan (talk) 07:34, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

@DareshMohan: What reliable source is used in the article to verify who the actors are? If no such information has been published then, at the very least, the article needs tagging with {{Citation required}} and the order of names left as is. Bazza 7 (talk) 19:28, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

Cinesouth is used [5]. The Hindu review mentions that both of the 2 lead actors roles are equal. Ajit Kumar, riding a success wave now, matches Prashant in every move [6]. DareshMohan (talk) 00:21, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

Richard Dawson (1855–1923)

I have accidently added a file (photo) and it is TOO large. Please fix and add the caption underneath "Dawson attended Hertford College, Oxford".

Thank you and my apologies 101.182.31.143 (talk) 02:01, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

I see no image there. It is not until the fifth sentence of that brief article that the reader learns that Dawson was a Member of Parliament, which is his valid claim of notability. That's bizarre and disconcerting. Cullen328 (talk) 09:35, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Richard Dawson (1855–1923)

I have accidently added a file (photo) and it is TOO large. Please fix and add the caption underneath "Dawson attended Hertford College, Oxford".

Thank you and my apologies Srbernadette (talk) 07:30, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

I have removed it, it was an irrelevant photograph. Theroadislong (talk) 07:50, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Copyright tag

I want to upload a still image from the 1949 motion picture Eureka Stockade. What would be the correct one to use? Robbiegibbons (talk) 02:23, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Hi Robbiegibbons In principle, you should assume the image is protected by copyright and then work from there. Given the date of the film, everything depends on whether the still is still (no pun intended) under copyright protection. Did you find the image somewhere online? If you did, then please provide a link to it. Since this is a British film, c:COM:United Kingdom is relevant. In the US, for example, stills for films from that time period were quite commonly provided by movie studios to movie theaters for publicity purposes and many of these stills were either released without a valid copyright notice or had a notice but the copright wasn't subsequently renewed as required under US copyright law at the time, which means they either never were or no longer are eligible for copyright protection (ie. they're considered to be within the public domain). So, it's quite possible the still itself is within the public domain even if the film it comes from under copyright protection. However, in order to assess this, the image needs to be seen because the required copyright notice often appeared either in the border or on the back of such images, and such things are often cropped out when the stills end up being used online. Many people selling such stills on sites like ebay do, on the other hand, often provide full uncropped version (front and back) of these photos as a way to allow other to verify their authenticity. So, if there's something similar allowed under British copyright law, then it's possible the stills are within the public domain. Otherwise, if there's no way to verify the copyright status of the image, it will likely need to be treated as non-free content, which makes things much more complicated because non-free images are much more harder to use in that they need to satisfy Wikipedia's non-free content use policy. -- Marchjuly (talk) 04:25, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

TK give me

Kutupalong 103.242.23.191 (talk) 04:13, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Do you have a question about editing Wikipedia? There is a search box at the top of every page that may help you. We have an article about Kutupalong. Shantavira|^{feed me} 08:11, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

"and" in artists' collaborations

In the Eurovision Song Contest 2024, Ukraine was represented by Alyona Alyona & Jerry Heil (ignoring stylized lowercase), Estonia by 5miinust x Puuluup. In the article, we write both Alyona Alyona and Jerry Heil, and 5miinust and Puuluup. Are there conventions to unify it in this way, instead of using their original glyphs? --KnightMove (talk) 09:06, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

@KnightMove: As "&" is being used to simply mean "and", but does not seem to be part of a band name, then MOS:AMPERSAND applies. The same applies to the bizarre use of "x", which might also be covered by the beginning of WP:BANDNAME; MOS:TMRULES covers similar styling of trademarks and the like. Bazza 7 (talk) 09:24, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Is there a wikiword...

For being driven straight up a tree by references that are *not* in numerical order, (for example, if a sentence is followed by [8][3][2])Naraht (talk) 13:13, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Hello @Naraht, I find your question vague.

Please reply with a clearer explanation, as some may not understand the question, and wait for someone who can answer this question to help. Thanks! Garethphua (talk) 13:25, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

@Naraht WP:CITEORDER specifically says you shouldn't edit war over such trivia, so I guess the correct word might be WP:WikiKing, or take your choice from other WP:WikiFauna. Mike Turnbull (talk) 13:40, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

(ec) This question actually makes a lot of sense to me (maybe the unclear part is the "drive up a tree" idiom). I don't know a name for this situation, but WP:CITEORDER mentions it. Even if they start out in order, edits to other sections can cause them to wind up differently ordered if re-using named references defined in those other sections. DMacks (talk) 13:42, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

@Naraht: The purpose of your post is unclear but maybe you wonder why it happens. References are normally numbered in order of first use on the page, not in order of the definition if they are named and reused. It would be possible to swap references which are at the same content until their numbers are in numerical order at that place but we don't do that. PrimeHunter (talk) 15:55, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

We actually had a rather large conversation somewhere (that I started, can't remember if it became an RfC or not), but it became pretty clear that we should not be putting references into numerical order. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:57, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

I do also find this very irksome (more round the bend than up a tree) but I can see that it would not be helpful to spend much time on it. If you feel compelled to rearrange citations, I would suggest doing it as part of a materially constructive edit. -- D'n'B-t -- 17:46, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Actually the discussion (I'll see if I can find it to link it) specifically said not to change references purely on a numerical basis. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 18:44, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Found the chat - it was never an RfC, but maybe some helpful reading: Wikipedia talk:Citing sources/Archive 53#Reference order Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 18:52, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Reason

Sort of a passive-agressive way to find out if there is *any* justification to "sorting them". BTW, which way do they do it in text?Naraht (talk) 15:18, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

References

STARTING A NEW ENTRY

I have translated an entry into English on Word. I now want to transfer the text to English Wikipedia. Are there templates, or one tempate, that provides the skeleton for the correct way to present a Wikepedia article? Resignation793 (talk) 13:57, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

I don't write articles myself, so others will have better advice, but one tip I can give you is to first copy the text into a non-formatted program like Notepad. This will strip out the 'invisible' Word formatting codes which, if copied into Wikipedia, can cause unforseen problems and complications. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 94.2.67.173 (talk) 14:13, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

There is no such universal template. MOS:STRUCTURE lists the main sections and links to describe each. For the body itself, different subjects have different typical article structures. If you tell us more specifically what your article is, maybe someone will recognize a similar existing article as a model you can use. DMacks (talk) 14:22, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

There is some rather brief guidance at Help:Translation. The most important thing to do is check that the subject meets English Wikipedia's notability guidelines as if the subject is not suitable for an article, the article is likely to be deleted, however well written. TSventon (talk) 14:23, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

correct numbers in Israel Hamas War

Currently the article on the Israel Hamas war continues to quote Hamas funded sources. The United Nations recently released their estimations on the civilian casualties of the war, these numbers being half of what the Gazan Health Ministry claims. Could these numbers also be included in the article in order to show the multitude of differing sources that disprove the GHM and its Hamas backers? 71.244.253.88 (talk) 14:02, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Editing about anything related to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, including the war with Hamas, is restricted- IP users are limited to proposing specific changes as edit requests on article talk pages. Anything else requires an account with at least 500 edits that is at least 30 days old. If you have a specific edit to propose, please make an edit request(click the link for instructions). 331dot (talk) 15:52, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Help With Editing

Hi, let me tell you a scenario. I want to create a battle but I'm not sure how to add references in the battle infobox. Could you please tell me? I want to use a reference i got for the infobox, and for something else. Basically, I'm going to reuse the reference i put in the battle on other paragraphs as well. Thanks. Also, what is the difference between footnotes, references and sources? Thanks so much and have a good day! :) Fauji Enthusiast (talk) 17:30, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Also asked at Wikipedia:Teahouse. Fauji Enthusiast please do not ask in more than one venue as it wastes volunteer time. TSventon (talk) 17:35, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Random page in subcategories

Is there a way to get the functionality of {{random page in category}} to include pages in that category's subcategories? (In particular I think it would be a nice option to have in category:CS1 errors). -- D'n'B-t -- 17:40, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

@DandelionAndBurdock: I think you can use "type=subcat" for that, which will return a random subcategory, if I understand the example correctly. RudolfRed (talk) 20:54, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

nevermind, rereading your question I don't think that is what you want. RudolfRed (talk) 20:55, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Archived record of a request for comment

Once a request for comment has been archived is there any way to open a complaints or appeal process against the decision/conclusion made by the person that has achieved the discussion? Helper201 (talk) 17:52, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

I think you are looking for Wikipedia:Closing discussions#Challenging other closures, which says that review should not be used as an opportunity to re-argue the underlying dispute, and is only intended for use when there is a problem with the close itself. TSventon (talk) 19:01, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Question

I want to upload a file, but i unfortunately cannot access wikimedia commons. Could anyone help me? DANGA14^talk 18:48, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

You don't appear to be blocked over there so I'm not sure why you wouldn't be able to access it. this is the upload wizard, but if you are using your phone the mobile app is actually an easier way to upload images. Just Step Sideways ^{from this world ..... today} 20:04, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Referencing Issue

Hi there,

I wanted to ask if someone is able to help me with a referencing issue. I translated a page from the Russian Wikipedia and published it, but realized the page for whatever reason has the references section to the right of the page. I tried looking into it and seeing how to resolve it, but nothing seems to be fixing it. Can someone help with this? The page in question is Draft:Vacío (rapper). Thank you in advance for the assistance. Losipov (talk) 20:08, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

I think it may have something to do with the ref being named ":2". The colon may be causing some sort of parsing error. Just Step Sideways ^{from this world ..... today} 20:15, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

@Losipov: You had a {{div col}} that wasn't closed with a {{div col end}}. Fixed it here. DuncanHill (talk) 20:26, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

@DuncanHill Thank you very much! Same to you @Just Step Sideways! Losipov (talk) 20:34, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

I had a feeling someone with a better eye for code would come along and find the actual problem. Just Step Sideways ^{from this world ..... today} 20:40, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Gringer canada

Gringer canada 77.149.55.50 (talk) 21:01, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Do you have a question about using Wikipedia? PrimeHunter (talk) 21:30, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

dark?

where change to dark ...white too bright 99.121.205.136 (talk) 21:05, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

If you create an account, you can enable either the dark mode gadget in your preferences or the dark mode beta feature in your preferences Wikipedia:Village_pump_(technical)#Dark_mode_is_available_in_Vector_2022_as_a_beta_feature RudolfRed (talk) 21:10, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

May 20

Suggest a wikipedia entry

How can I suggest that wikipedia entry be written about my organization, which is a notable entity with many online references on it? I want somebody else to write about it since I have a conflict of interest. Haneen Adwan (talk) 08:35, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

Haneen Adwan Please make the disclosure asked by the conflict of interest policy. If you are employed by the organization, the Terms of Use require you to make the stricter paid editing disclosure.

My advice is that you forget that Wikipedia exists and go on about the work of your organization. If your organization truly meets the special Wikipedia definition of a notable organization, an independent editor will eventually take note of significant coverage of your organization in independent reliable sources and choose to write about it. That's the best indicator of notability. Wikipedia is not a place to merely tell about an organization and what it does- any article about it must summarize significant coverage- coverage that goes beyond documenting the activities of the orgnanization and goes into detail about what they see as important/significant/influential about the organization. Such sources do not include press releases, interviews, brief mentions, announcements of routine activities, or other primary sources.

There is a place to suggest an article, but it is backlogged to the point of uselessness and any request you make likely won't be acted on for some time, if ever. 331dot (talk) 08:41, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

Libraries in Australia, question archived without answer

Hello, I asked a question a few days ago but my question got archived without being answered. Is it okay to re-ask? -- NotCharizard ^🗨 09:14, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

You asked for opinions on possibilities of rearranging a fairly obscure list article. Probably no-one had any strong thoughts about the matter one way or another.

I suggest that you WP:Be Bold and go ahead with your intention, correctly announced on the Talk page and with no response in 4 days, of revising the article how you think best. If anybody disagrees with what you do, they can perform the Revert part of the WP:BRD process and you can all proceed with the Discussion. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 94.2.67.173 (talk) 12:12, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

Complaint against administrator of Ukrainian Wikipedia

[Serious attacks on named user redacted] Baibuzy1 (talk) 09:30, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

You need to present your evidence on the Ukrainian Wikipedia. If you have off wiki evidence you should present it to their arbitration committee. Cabayi (talk) 09:37, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

Thank You, Cabayi, for help, I'll do it — Preceding unsigned comment added by Baibuzy1 (talk • contribs) 10:40, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

Reducing the words in my article

OIOP Movement ( A movement fot One India One Pension ) registered in Pathanthitta, Kerala, India registered under A Charitable Organization registered under Societies Act 1860 section 3 for demanding equal justice forall who complete 60 years.:This organizations registerd in Pathanthitta, Kerala, India this year under society act Number PTM/TC/45/2024 223.185.249.39 (talk) 15:42, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

Do you have a question about using Wikipedia?

Sage or something (talk) 15:54, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

IP editor. We have articles about Pensions in India and One Rank, One Pension (also in India). If you have suggestions about how these could be improved, please make them on the Talk Pages of these articles, including reliable, published sources. Mike Turnbull (talk) 15:56, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

Balance of content

OK, this is not about WP:BALANCE. but what is the guidance/policy on ensuring that an article has a suitable degree of balance between covering different aspects that fit within the article's overall subject matter? For instance, suppose there was an article on 19th century ships and it was largely about warships and very little about merchant ships (of which there were many more), the article would be deficient by having unbalanced content. ThoughtIdRetired _TIR 15:59, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

Hi there! There is no policy that I could find, however, it it probably best to find a reasonable balance of information. Sage or something (talk) 16:43, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

@ThoughtIdRetired: We have two "meta-policies" to use when there is no relevant guideline or policy: editorial judgement and consensus. You are an editor. If you feel that an article should be modified to make it more encyclopedic, then make the improvement. If another editor disagrees, they can revert your change, and you can then discuss the change on the article's talk page to try to reach a consensus. See WP:BRD. If you think your change needs to be discussed before you make it, then start on the the article's talk page. In the early days we tried hard to avoid prescriptive or proscriptive guidelines and to rely on the two meta-policies, adding new guidelines only when experience made it clear they were needed. For your hypothetical case, You could propose to split the article into three, converting the main article into a brief overview and adding separate articles for the warships and the commercial ships. -Arch dude (talk) 17:54, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

Recently Deceased

Is there any guidance as to how to deal with transitioning a BLP to recently deceased and why deceased people have fewer privacy rights than living persons which is generally true legally as well, right? Technophant (talk) 17:26, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

There doesn't seem to be any WP essay concerning the transition from BLP to recently deceased article. If it takes too long to make appropriate changes to articles (verb tenses, changes in categories, etc.), Template:Recent death can be placed on top of the article to avoid edit conflicts. As for the question about legal privacy rights, well, that's out of scope for this help desk. Tutwakhamoe (talk) 22:11, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

Use of anchor links to refer to additional info within the same article

Is there a guideline for using internal anchor links to connect related info within the same article, like an internal "see also" link? Or is this discouraged?

Example:

Para A: "Info about some Thing. (See also: [#link]Para B[/#link])"

Para B (elsewhere in the article): "More info about the Thing."

Thanks. Tsavage (talk) 17:47, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

I haven't found a policy on the question. Template:See also makes clear that this is possible. There might be something in MOS:LINK, but I didn't see anything on a quick scan. ColinFine (talk) 10:43, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

@Tsavage: Help:Self link mentions that it can be: [a] useful application is links from article leads or overview sections to detail sections buried deeper in the same article if it happens to be a rather large one, but as nearly each article has its own table of contents, it's usually redundant. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 13:30, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

Thanks! Seems to be largely a use-common-sense situation. Help:Self link is useful to keep in mind. In the case at hand, making the ToC a quite granular, and moving the bulk of info on a particular subject to one location while keeping any other references brief seems to have mostly solved things so far. But there may be cases where the same info fits in more than one place, and would be redundant if repeated, so maybe self-links. Anyhow, question answered and thanks again! Tsavage (talk) 15:21, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

Great Lakes articles

Why article Great Lakes, as well as articles of individual lakes in this system, use imperial units first, despite that all lakes except one are also in Canada, a country that uses metric units? Should articles that have strong historical ties to Canada use metric units first? --40bus (talk) 19:50, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

Please discuss concerns about a particular article on its talk page; Talk:Great Lakes. 331dot (talk) 19:54, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

I did in January, but I still have got no answer. --40bus (talk) 20:08, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

Censur of Jehovahs Witnesses

Hvad blev der lige af Jehovas Vidner i den danske udgave af Pittsburgh?

Her fra den engelske! Pittsburgh is additionally where Jehovah's Witnesses traces its earliest origins, and was the host of the 2009 G20 Pittsburgh summit.

Der er da vist nok en redaktør der skal skiftes ud.

Venlig hilsen Søren Olsen, Danmark 2.108.45.190 (talk) 20:01, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

Hi IP Editor. This is the English Wikipedia. If you have any questions about the Danish Wikipedia, please go to https://da.wikipedia.org/ Qcne (talk) 20:18, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

I happen to be Danish and can read your post but this help desk is for the English Wikipedia. Wikipedia languages and their articles are edited independently. Concerns about the Danish Wikipedia belong there, not here. The English article Pittsburgh is 32 times larger than the Danish da:Pittsburgh so I'm not surprised this isn't mentioned in Danish. I see no reason to suspect censorship and you can edit it yourself by clicking one of the "Redigér" links. They do have an article about Jehovah's Witnesses: da:Jehovas Vidner. The infobox says founded in Pittsburgh. PrimeHunter (talk) 20:28, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

"Electoral District" table makes the whole page appear smaller.

Here: John Kasich, the "Electoral District" table extends to the right, beyond all other text on this page. This reduces the size of all the other text/ images to accommodate the extra wide table. Can this table's width be equal to all other text, so that the whole page renders normal size? Thank you, -- Ooligan (talk) 22:38, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

@Ooligan: There is no "Electoral District" in John Kasich. Do you mean John Kasich#Electoral history? It looks normal to me in Firefox and three other tested browsers. If the window is too narrow for the whole table then the text size doesn't change but I just have to scroll right to see the right side of the table. Maybe you activated a zoom function in your browser. Does it help to log out, or press Ctrl+0 if you have a Windows browser? PrimeHunter (talk) 23:51, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

@PrimeHunter, Yes, Electoral History. I now see the table has "hide" on the top right. When I hide the table, the page displays normally. Can the table "default" setting start at hiding the table with a choice by the to expand the table if they wish? --Ooligan (talk) 00:13, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

@Ooligan: Hiding by default is against MOS:DONTHIDE, and I have never heard of your problem. What is your browser and operating system, and does it help to log out? PrimeHunter (talk) 00:37, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

May 21

Is there a way to reset default preferences

I can't see the button to reset my default preferences. One of them is breaking elements of the site, so I wish to revert the preferences to fix it. Lordseriouspig (talk) 00:46, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

@Lordseriouspig: There should be a "Restore all default preferences" link in Preferences → User profile. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 00:59, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

Thank you, I don't know how I didn't see that lmao. Lordseriouspig (talk) 01:03, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

User:Thebas1

I recently received a WikiLove message from a new user Thebas1. The message was random gibberish. Checking their global account, they've made eight similar edits on Wikimedia Commons, and also vandalized the talk page of a picture of Winston Churchill.

I do not know how to approach this issue, and what actions should be done; and is there a better place to report this? Roasted (talk) 02:13, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

If you are certain that the user is a Vandalism-only account, you can make a request at Wikimedia steward request for global blocks/locks. Tutwakhamoe (talk) 11:56, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

Château de Jouy-en-Josas

Dear all. I hope you are doing well. Please may I kindly request your help for the following article : Draft:Château de Jouy-en-Josas. It is a French castle and the article is a translation of the French one : fr:Château de Jouy (Jouy-en-Josas). Please do not hesitate to modify directly the article. Thanks a lot in advance. Kind Regards and have a nice day. 2A01:CB01:101C:5CF5:A402:D189:D2B4:C1AE (talk) 06:53, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

It has been declined because of sourcing problems. Also, there are way too many images. These may look nice, but per WP:NOTGALLERY there should not be multiple images just for the sake of it. Images should be integrated with the text.--♦IanMacM♦ ^{(talk to me)} 07:25, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

"Canal" is not the right word for that body of water. Maybe "lake" or "pond"? Maproom (talk) 07:56, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

One of the references is to a PDF, seemingly publicity material for a school. But the PDF is at some family's website. This is rather surprising. -- Hoary (talk) 12:22, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

Wrong information given in article of religious violence in India

In it was written that Hindu activities start violence in India but the truth is that Hindu activities just motivate people to follow their religion and rituals. It is depicted wrong in article of religious violence in India. The truth is that Muslim activities, politician, priest motivate Muslims of India to increase their population and follow to Muslim Emperors' ideology of Gazwa-e-Hind means conversation of all Hindus to Muslim and capture the territory, wealth, etc. through violence. 2409:40D4:2008:3242:7E:69FF:FEB0:29F8 (talk) 08:24, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

If you have concerns about a particular article's content, you should raise those concerns on the article talk page(seems to be Talk:Religious violence in India). Articles summarize what independent reliable sources say about a topic. If those sources are not accurately summarized, please detail the specific errors. If the sources are accurately summarized, but in error themselves, you will need to raise that with the sources, or offer more current sources. Be aware that transferring a religious conflict to Wikipedia won't be tolerated. We all must work together. 331dot (talk) 08:29, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

I want my company to be added to wikipedia

We are seeking a skilled and experienced Wikipedia content writer to create a comprehensive and well-referenced Wikipedia page for our company, Gamateks. The ideal candidate will have a proven track record of writing and editing Wikipedia articles, a deep understanding of Wikipedia’s guidelines, and the ability to produce high-quality, neutral, and verifiable content. Korkutaydinli (talk) 13:11, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

Read Wikipedia:Notability (organizations and companies). AndyTheGrump (talk) 13:19, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

I don't have time to do it myself I was looking for some one to do it for me Korkutaydinli (talk) 13:22, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

Nobody is going to do anything unless it can be established that your company meets our notability criteria. READ IT. AndyTheGrump (talk) 13:26, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

I have read it and I believe that it does meet your notability criteria Korkutaydinli (talk) 13:36, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

I'm not seeing English-language sources that would attest to Gamateks' notability. You'll probably to find someone who can read Turkish. But please be aware that most people offering to create a Wikipedia article for payment are scammers. Maproom (talk) 14:22, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

There is some useful advice here Wikipedia:Articles for creation/Scam warning. Theroadislong (talk) 14:32, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

Reset password/assign email address to account using previous password?

Hello - it looks like my password was changed, and I don't remember changing it (but I probably did per Occam). Assuming I did it, my browser password manager either didn't save the password properly, or it went to the wrong account, and I've not been able to find the new one. I still have access to my old password, and I'm signed in on one specific computer, but I can't find a way to reset my password or bind an email address (I could have sworn this was tied to my old personal email, but I appear to have never set that up...).

I've only gotten back into editing recently as a way to keep my research skills sharp; I could just make a new account, but I'm a bit attached to this one since it's a chance to redeem some of my teenage idiocy from when I first made it back in the noughts.

Is there a way to attach an email address or to use my old password to set up a new one? Thanks! Fishsicles (talk) 13:23, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

@Fishsicles: There should be a section in your preferences called Preferences → User profile → Email options, which should have a button that allows you to change an email address; presumably it'd also allow you to add one. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 13:35, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

I'd already tried this; unfortunately it requires my current password. Fishsicles (talk) 13:38, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

Dollar sign in section header

In the article Jet Lag: The Game, the section header Season 10 reads "Au$tralia" but renders as "Au\$tralia" in the table of contents for me. Apparently this isn't universal (LouisOrr27 said it looked fine on their end), so I'm not exactly sure what can cause this sort of glitch to occur. Any help would be appreciated. Cerebral726 (talk) 13:56, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

@Cerebral726 It certainly looked like a $ to me, so I changed it. Mike Turnbull (talk) 14:06, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

The intent is that it is supposed to be a "$". The problem is that it renders as "/$". So I guess I'm the only one who sees it as "/$" which is odd. Cerebral726 (talk) 14:12, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

Why is it supposed to be a $? I would have thought that the name of the season would be the same as the name of the country it was set in. However, you are welcome to revert my edit if there is some reason it is intentional: it was added on 8 May in this edit by User:SnowyNix. Mike Turnbull (talk) 14:19, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

The season is titled Au$tralia because it is a gambling themed season. Cerebral726 (talk) 14:27, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

OK, after your revert I see the TOC correctly in the current default WP:VECTOR22 skin. Which skin are you using? Mike Turnbull (talk) 14:32, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

I'm using the Vector Legacy (2010) skin. Swapped to Vector22 and it looks fine in the sidebar TOC, swapped back to Vector2010, looks wrong in the box TOC. Cerebral726 (talk) 14:39, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

It's an issue with the Vector Legacy (2010) skin, I use Vector 2022 and it is fine but when I switched to Legacy (2010) it appeared as "/$". LouisOrr27 (talk) 14:44, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

Someone's already written a bug report: phab:T365413. Rummskartoffel 15:23, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

Awesome, thanks for the link. Cerebral726 (talk) 15:34, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Zealand_Law_Society

Their are a number of other wikipedia.org web pages too that need to be included I'm asking that you check what I say is true first - Their are no gift cards sold in New Zealand for the purpose of presenting identity and lawyers registration with the government enables them to witness identity of New Zealand citizens passports for over sea's banks to use. I'm asking that be included on relevant web pages please some how by the correct person to do that. 115.189.135.164 (talk) 15:30, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

Hello there IP! If you think that a page needs something added, but don't want to do it yourself, try posting it on the talk page for that article. Sage or something (talk) 15:37, 21 May 2024 (UTC)