Talk:Elon Musk: Difference between revisions
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This is what I'd expect when describing the Kennedy's. It's a bizzare opening considering just how inconsequential Elon's family was. His father had an $80k share in an emrerald mine? But even that's disputed. [[User:Tikaboo|Tikaboo]] ([[User talk:Tikaboo|talk]]) 03:18, 30 March 2024 (UTC) |
This is what I'd expect when describing the Kennedy's. It's a bizzare opening considering just how inconsequential Elon's family was. His father had an $80k share in an emrerald mine? But even that's disputed. [[User:Tikaboo|Tikaboo]] ([[User talk:Tikaboo|talk]]) 03:18, 30 March 2024 (UTC) |
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== "In one incident, after having called a boy whose father had committed suicide "stupid", Elon was thrown down concrete steps." == |
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I don't understand the relevance of the father suicide comment. There's no indication in the sources that the father's suicide had anything to do with Elon calling the boy stupid. The source of this is Elon's father and he only mentions it as a reason why he didn't go hard on the boy who attacked his son. [[User:Tikaboo|Tikaboo]] ([[User talk:Tikaboo|talk]]) 03:21, 30 March 2024 (UTC) |
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Q1: Can I write a message to Elon Musk here? (No.)
A1: No. The "Talk:Elon Musk" page is not for writing messages to Musk. It is only for discussing changes to the Wikipedia article about him. Writing a message to Musk here is pointless and disruptive, and such messages will be removed as an improper use of the page. Q2: Can you update the article to call Musk a "business magnet"? (No.)
A2: No. Musk once suggested in an interview that his Wikipedia article be changed to describe him as a "business magnet." The tone of that interview was not very serious; he also claimed to be an alien.[1] Wikipedia doesn't have to do what Musk says, and this request has been made and declined dozens of times already. New requests may be removed without a response so that other discussions are not disrupted. Q3: Should Musk be identified as South African in the opening sentence?
A3: Musk is a US citizen (since 2002) born and raised in South Africa, and also acquired Canadian citizenship via his mother. Including these nationalities in the opening sentence in a balanced way would be complex, and the consensus is that they should instead be explained later in the lead. Q4: Can you change "Tesla CEO" to "Tesla Technoking"?
A4: No, because he is still CEO according to company records and that is a common corporate title that readers will understand, while "Technoking" is a vanity term. The goal of the article is to inform people, and not to raise a technicality that would confuse them. Q5: What is the deal with Musk's father supposedly having partly owned an emerald mine?
A5: Both Elon and Errol have said as much in the past but recently changed their stories, leaving the facts murky. In terms of prior confirmation, journalists with access to them have reported it as part of Elon's background. Specifically, a 2014 report originally printed in the San Jose Mercury News (and cited in the article) stated that Errol Musk had "a stake in" a mine. Elon affirmed his father's mine involvement in an interview with Jim Clash, a career interviewer of public figures, that was published by Forbes and withdrawn without explanation a few months later. Elon biographer Ashlee Vance likewise confirmed Errol's mining interest, with Elon's objections but not denials, in a 2020 interview report with Elon. While today Elon disputes almost everything about the story, Errol has stated that he received hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of emeralds from his dealings. Q6: Should "Bachelor of Arts in Physics" be "Bachelor of Science" instead?
A6: No. Although it may seem counterintuitive, "Bachelor of Arts in Physics" is the degree that the University of Pennsylvania (among other schools) awards. Q7: Should the article acknowledge doubts about Musk's academic record?
A7: Wikipedia policy on biographies of living persons requires that negative information about a person must be attributed to reliable published sources, and excludes both self-published sources (e.g. Twitter threads) and court trial records. The article states that sources disagree about when Musk obtained bachelor degrees, and that he did not attend Stanford for any significant amount of time. Any doubts beyond this require appropriate sources. Q8: Is Musk an engineer?
A8: Musk is chief engineer of SpaceX, a title that applies within the company and that the press regularly mentions. He is not a professional engineer, a distinction within engineering that carries certain legal privileges in the United States, nor has he completed an engineering training program, nor has he ever been hired as an engineer. The article therefore does not include any of these claims. It does note that, from time to time, Musk has made initial product proposals at his companies that his trained engineers then research and develop. He does hold IEEE Honorary Membership. Q9: Why doesn't the article identify Musk as co-founder of PayPal?
A9: Because that could mislead readers that Musk was involved in the creation of the PayPal service and brand, when he was not. Instead, as the article states, he co-founded a company (X.com Corporation) that acquired the company that had developed PayPal (Confinity Inc.) and then renamed itself as PayPal, Inc. Q10: Why does this page include criticism of Musk's actions and stances?
A10: Musk is criticized/praised a lot in many reliable sources, and as such we need to talk about these criticisms and praise. To quote from Wikipedia's policy on a neutral point of view, articles must represent "fairly, proportionately, and, as far as possible, without editorial bias, all the significant views that have been published by reliable sources on a topic." Q11: Why is this a "good article" when some people consider Musk a bad person?
A11: "Good article" on Wikipedia refers to the way the article is written, not what kind of person Musk is. Good articles have been found to satisfy Wikipedia editorial standards for accuracy, verifiability and balanced presentation. Q12: Why doesn't this page call Musk African American?
A12: African Americans are an ethnic group of Americans with total or partial ancestry from any of the Black racial groups of Africa. Musk does not have ancestry from the Black racial groups of Africa; his ancestry is European. References
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Heard
Allegations that Amber Heard abused Elon Musk in their relationship are not mentioned, although they gained widespread media attention when Musk's biography was published. In that biography, several of his family members testified that Heard was abusive to him during their relationship.
https://metro.co.uk/2023/09/12/elon-musk-biography-relationship-amber-heard-brutal-19488551/
https://pagesix.com/2023/09/12/elon-musks-brother-grimes-friends-hated-amber-heard-bio/
https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/elon-musk-amber-heard-friends-dating-reaction-b2409694.html
https://nypost.com/2023/09/12/elon-musks-friends-hated-amber-heard-new-bio/
https://www.geo.tv/latest/511896-amber-heard-toxic-and-abusive-to-elon-musk-a-nightmare
https://radaronline.com/p/elon-musk-friends-family-hated-ex-amber-heard/ Eenchantedd (talk) 17:24, 14 March 2024 (UTC)
- A quote saying she abused him from one of the few RS here would be nice. Slatersteven (talk) 17:33, 14 March 2024 (UTC)
- Biography writer Walter Isaacson claims the Tesla CEO was drawn ‘into a dark vortex’ around the time they made things official. He added: ‘That lasted more than a year and produced a deep-seated pain that lingers to this day.’
- According to The Los Angeles Times, Isaacson further claimed that Musk’s ‘brother and friends hated her with a passion’ and described it as a ‘hellacious’ period.
- Kimbal Musk, Elon’s brother, said his brother ‘falls in love with these people who are really mean to him’, calling it ‘very sad’. The chef added: ‘They’re beautiful, no question, but they have a very dark side and Elon knows that they’re toxic.’
- Isaacson claims that the SpaceX founder admitted the relationship ‘was brutal’ while Heard confessed she still loves him ‘very much’. The Danish Girl actress added: ‘Elon loves fire, and sometimes it burns him.’
- Aware of his own downfalls, Musk said: ‘I’m just a fool for love. I am often a fool, but especially for love.’
- https://metro.co.uk/2023/09/12/elon-musk-biography-relationship-amber-heard-brutal-19488551/ Eenchantedd (talk) 21:08, 15 March 2024 (UTC)
Child Elon didn't read a book published in 2003
He probably read Benjamin Franklin's autobiography, not the Walter Isaacson book 100.4.180.238 (talk) 01:24, 15 March 2024 (UTC)
- You are absolutely right. He didn't. The source said he was inspired by Ben Franklin as a child and read the book (presumably as an adult unless he got an advance copy ;)). Removed. Schierbecker (talk) 06:31, 15 March 2024 (UTC)
Some of the sources in this article are ridiculously bad
I don't get how this article seriously can have something like that as a source: https://newrepublic.com/article/177695/elon-musk-scoundrel-year-2023-new-republic
It's literally a straight up hater article on the level of an angry reddit user, where they claim he is the ultimate evil and make statements that almost hurt from it's stupidity like this one "The rockets from his rocket company, SpaceX, keep exploding".
It apparently does not matter what quality a source has, as long as it supports the point of view of the (generally left leaning) Wikipedia editors. Lrzw (talk) 22:57, 16 March 2024 (UTC)
Remove FAQ Q5: Why does the article state that Musk's father partly owned an emerald mine, which Musk has disputed?
I recommend we remove the question
Q5: Why does the article state that Musk's father partly owned an emerald mine, which Musk has disputed?
and its answer:
A5: Because journalists with access to them have reported it as part of Elon's background. Specifically, a 2014 report originally printed in the San Jose Mercury News (and cited in the article) stated that Errol Musk had "a stake in" a mine. Elon affirmed his father's mine involvement in an interview with Jim Clash, a career interviewer of public figures, that was published by Forbes and withdrawn without explanation a few months later. Elon biographer Ashlee Vance likewise confirmed Errol's mining interest, with Elon's objections but not denials, in a 2020 interview report with Elon.
My reason:
- The article now reads: "Despite both Musk and Errol previously stating that Errol was a part owner of a Zambian emerald mine, in 2023, Errol recounted that the deal he made was to receive "a portion of the emeralds produced at three small mines."
ReferenceMan (talk) 01:04, 18 March 2024 (UTC)
- Or we change the article back? Slatersteven (talk) 11:48, 18 March 2024 (UTC)
Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 19 March 2024
This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Change the sentence "A member of the wealthy South African Musk family" to "A member of the South African Musk family." There is no evidence that the family was wealthy, and in fact, his father declared bankruptcy at some point. 72.80.249.97 (talk) 03:14, 19 March 2024 (UTC)
- Not done: present-day, inclusive. Hyphenation Expert (talk) 04:33, 19 March 2024 (UTC)
- No, it's not present-day inclusive. The sentence is about his birth and early life. If the family wasn't wealthy in South Africa at that time, then saying "wealthy" is flagrantly misleading. 2601:642:4600:D3B0:4C96:F586:9E76:D8D0 (talk) 21:19, 28 March 2024 (UTC)
Is Musk a US citizen?
In the info box he is apparently a RSA - Canada - US citizen; but there is no reference cited for his US naturalization. Cross Reference (talk) 03:38, 19 March 2024 (UTC)
"A member of the wealthy South African Musk family"
This is what I'd expect when describing the Kennedy's. It's a bizzare opening considering just how inconsequential Elon's family was. His father had an $80k share in an emrerald mine? But even that's disputed. Tikaboo (talk) 03:18, 30 March 2024 (UTC)
"In one incident, after having called a boy whose father had committed suicide "stupid", Elon was thrown down concrete steps."
I don't understand the relevance of the father suicide comment. There's no indication in the sources that the father's suicide had anything to do with Elon calling the boy stupid. The source of this is Elon's father and he only mentions it as a reason why he didn't go hard on the boy who attacked his son. Tikaboo (talk) 03:21, 30 March 2024 (UTC)
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