Talk:Douglas Bader

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Former good article nominee Douglas Bader was a Warfare good articles nominee, but did not meet the good article criteria at the time. There are suggestions below for improving the article. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.
January 11, 2011 Good article nominee Not listed

Circumstances of Death[edit]

This article, with citation, states he died on his way after attending a tribute to Sir Arthur Harris at the London Guildhall. However I notice, in its answer to the question Where is Douglas Bader Buried?, states he passed on 5 September 1982 from a mild heart attack after a golf tournament. Did the match and tribute happen same day?Cloptonson (talk) 05:59, 3 May 2013 (UTC)

The London Times reported that he collapsed on his way home from the Guildhall, he and his wife was being driven through Chiswick on the way to their Newbury home when he collapsed and died, no mention of Golf. MilborneOne (talk) 11:10, 3 May 2013 (UTC)

Shell Aircraft[edit]

The section "Post-war career" says: "Bader assumed control of Shell's aircraft group, which employed around 250,000 people." Following this sentence, someone had written: "Shell only employs 90,000 people in 2013 so this is likely to be a factual error. Provide source." I've replaced this comment with a {{dubious}} template, and I'm bringing the comment here to be discussed. DoctorKubla (talk) 09:21, 20 June 2013 (UTC)

The phrase should be deleted as no evidence forthcoming SovalValtos (talk) 19:34, 15 May 2014 (UTC)
I have tweaked it and provided a reference that he was managing director, we dont have a reference for the number of employees and it is not really relevant but I suspect it would have been more like 250! MilborneOne (talk) 21:25, 15 May 2014 (UTC)
Good SovalValtos (talk) 08:31, 16 May 2014 (UTC)

Related to Kenneth More?[edit]

Did I dream this? Just in the last week, I'm sure I read somewhere that the actor who played him, Kenneth More, was a second cousin or some such. I can't find any mention of this online. Was I dreaming? -- Jack of Oz [pleasantries] 12:03, 20 September 2013 (UTC)

Can someone please sort out the quote in the Personality section I've added from Alan Clark's diaries.....[edit]

Sorry. Never used a quote before, and I'd like it to look better but I don't know how to.

It's a great anecdote, though, and really adds to his personality as well as confirming his use of bad language.

Many thanks.

(And if someone could explain what type of quote style would work best here, and tell me what extra I need to type, it would be much appreciated and will help me in future.)

Ganpati23 (talk) 03:01, 16 November 2013 (UTC)

I know you added this in good faith but somebody elses biography is not really a reliable source for what Bader said only for what Clark did and said. (Also note that other versions said to quote Bader are slightly different!) I have removed it for now until a better source can be found. MilborneOne (talk) 09:11, 16 November 2013 (UTC)
ok. Firstly, The Douglas Bader Foundation have the quote (though it's not attributed.)
Surely if they are accepting the quote as fact, wiki should at least make the readers aware that this quote has been attributed to him, and the DBF think it's true?
Secondly, Alan Clark talks Richard Ryder recounting the anecdote (one of Ryder's favourites according to AC) to him. So Ryder, who was debating with Bader at Roedean, obviously believed that's what Bader said and was happy for it to be known that he was the source of this story.
Assuming AC's not lying and RR has told this story on many occasions (and if it were true, it is the sort of story you'd tell again and again), can we at least not say 'According the AC, and accepted by the DBF, RR recounted an anecdote of a debate he had with DB at Roedean...{Quote}'?
This means we make the readers aware of an hilarious anecdote which reveals DB's personality (if true - and it ties in with the preceding para's stuff about bad language), while making clear that although it's commonly accepted, this source just comes from RR recounting the story again to AC which he mentioned in his diaries.
If DB did say this, then he'd love C21st wiki-readers to know. Just because the only published evidence is 3rd hand (AC via RR), it appears no-one's disputed it. Surely if we make the sourcing clear, then it allows everyone to judge for themselves given we know the primary source is AC's diaries, referring to lunch with RR, many years after the incident. My view's always been that the more information the better, as long as it's properly sourced, so people can judge the historiography for themselves. And as I say, if it's on the DBF site, that must count for something. Couldn't we just say 'According to the DBF.....'?
Finally (off topic) how do I set it so I know when I get a reply? When I logged on tonight, it had a zero by my log-in name, so I was unaware of your reply. Is there any way to set it so you know when you've been replied to? I only came to the page as I was editing something else and had forgotten how to do italics.
Cheers anyway, mate. Please let us know what you think. Ganpati23 (talk) 23:31, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

I have met people who knew Bader. They all described him as being a deeply unpleasant person; a psychopath who would certainly have committed a serious crime if the war had not offered a channel for his aggression. — Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 01:46, 26 March 2017 (UTC) A relative who received a serious leg injury in the French campaign in 1940 mentioned being hospitalised in the same ward with Bader. This must have been sometime in 1940 or early 1941, before he was captured - perhaps Bader had issues with his old crash injuries which necessitated a hospital stay. My relative said he found Bader to be quite overbearing, especially towards the hospital nurses. It seems to me the intense drive which helped him overcome his serious injuries had its less pleasant side. That often seems to be the case with famous people - the energy that makes them famous does not make them nice people.Hythlodaeus24 (talk) 07:54, 25 April 2017 (UTC)

Thelma Edwards[edit]

The article describes Thelma Edwards as 'a waitress', but she was in fact a well-bred middle-class lady temporarily helping out the tea-shop proprietors, who were related to her, during a staff shortage. Bader, given the class-bound social conventions of Britain at the time, is highly unlikely to have married a waitress. Brickhill's Reach For the Sky explains Thelma's respectable background. — Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 08:50, 23 May 2014 (UTC)

    • Brickhill further explains that Thelma's temporary job was a working holiday as therapy for her while she was grieving for a pet dog that had died. Captain Pedant (talk) 09:32, 7 June 2014 (UTC)
It is not clear from the references who had the least respectable background and why it should affect their marriage. It might be suitable to describe her as 'undergoing therapy by being a waitress after the death of a dog' SovalValtos (talk) 20:59, 8 June 2014 (UTC)

"German" Luftwaffe?[edit]

Is there/was there another air-force in the world outside Germany named the Luftwaffe? If not, is not the phrase 'German Luftwaffe' a tautology? (talk) 09:01, 23 May 2014 (UTC)

Switzerland. MilborneOne (talk) 21:09, 8 June 2014 (UTC)

castle TV show[edit]

Castle is my favorite programme and i am addicted i can't stand it when i don't watch it everyday. can't wait for season 7 — Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 15:57, 16 June 2014 (UTC)

"Cutting off the Hienkel's nose"[edit]

In case anyone is puzzled by the explanation of my edit to the Battle of Britain section saying that Bader was tempted to cut off the Hienkel's nose with his propeller, "nose" was a careless slip for "rudder". So sorry.--Mabzilla (talk) 06:23, 23 July 2015 (UTC)

What is an Hienkel? Do you mean Heinkel? — Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 01:42, 26 March 2017 (UTC)

"Tin Legs" Bader[edit]

I can't believe that no-one has updated this entry with the above nickname by which Douglas Bader was known after he received his artificial legs. Will be updated soon. --johnr_roberts (talk) 07:00, 21 April 2016 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk)

I certainly knew of him as "Tin-Legs Bader" when I was a child, but don't know of any "sources" to back this up. (talk) 00:46, 27 April 2017 (UTC)

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The article lists only British honours. According to Brickhill, he also received from France, both Légion d'Honeur, and Croix de Guerre. They should be included. Ptilinopus (talk) 08:24, 20 March 2017 (UTC)

If you have a reliable reference then you are welcome to add these to the list. MilborneOne (talk) 19:54, 20 March 2017 (UTC)