Talk:New York City Subway stations

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History of this article[edit]

Yes, the above is correct. Everything is related to the splitting up of the list to 4 separate articles, see the section below. Things were not done quickly enough, so that's my fault. I also could have organized things better, as I do not keep a dedicated sandbox page; I create subpages whenever I need to test something. I was going to request a history merge on January 9th, but I read the Wikipedia pages concerning WP:SPLICE. I knew this was going to be complicated and thus rejected. Documenting the history like this was something I didn't know how to do, so it's done now. Tinlinkin (talk) 12:08, 17 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

All IRT stations are currently listed[edit]

All IRT stations are currently listed. --SPUI (talk) 23:40, 14 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Revision for station naming convention[edit]

The previous edit relied on the {{sll}} template, which in turn assumed the former naming convention for station pages. A lot of stations were showing up as red links, which in fact had articles.

This revision cures that, but the format is slightly different. Instead of saying:

it just says

The only items that vary from this format is where a station is on more than one line, in which case all of the lines are named in a comma-separated list in parentheses after the link to the station name. Marc Shepherd 15:17, 26 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know, I prefer it if the line had its own link. I don't like having the lines being linked for stations on multiple lines, but not linked for stations on just one line. It's too inconsistent. — Larry V (talk | contribs) 22:57, 26 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]
No problem....hats off for making the edit. Marc Shepherd 23:45, 26 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]
And thank you for going through that whole list. — Larry V (talk | contribs) 01:27, 27 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Merge from accessibility[edit]

I agree; we can place Disabled access next to the stations, and add notes after. --NE2 06:39, 23 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I will post a message to WP:NYCPT seeking more consensus for a major overhaul of this article. Tinlinkin 05:48, 25 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Station sorting[edit]

The sorting function is a useful and important one to use on this page. It is more meaningful to me to be able to sort the stations by street name, not purely by station name. In recognition of the station name issue, may I dare to suggest that the street name should be the sortkey for the "Station" column? Tinlinkin 13:41, 27 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The problem occurs wherever the current station name does not begin with the street name. This includes places where the MTA has put a neighborhood or the name of a landmark before the street name, e.g.:
See also the current proposal, Wikipedia:WikiProject New York City Public Transportation/New York City Subway/Station naming convention, and its associated talk page. I would not object to a standard that the street name always comes first. After all, the MTA has not been very consistent about it anyway. There are multiple occurrences of both "Grand Central–42nd Street" and "42nd Street–Grand Central" in their literature, signage, and platform announcements. Marc Shepherd 14:18, 27 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I'm talking about sorting in the similar sense that articles on people are categorized (last, first). Links to the station articles will be as intended in the proposed convention, and will not use a pipe link. But for sorting, the street name will be attached before the rest. See the following example and click to sort "Stations":
Station Disabled access Division Line Services
242nd StreetVan Cortlandt Park–242nd Street IRT Broadway–Seventh Avenue Line 1 all times
238th Street IRT Broadway–Seventh Avenue Line 1 all times
231st Street Disabled access IRT Broadway–Seventh Avenue Line 1 all times
225th StreetMarble Hill–225th Street IRT Broadway–Seventh Avenue Line 1 all times
042nd StreetTimes Square–42nd Street Disabled access IRT Broadway–Seventh Avenue Line 1 all times ​2 all times ​3 all times
241st StreetWakefield–241st Street IRT White Plains Road Line 2 all times
DeKalb Avenue Disabled access BMT Fourth Avenue Line B weekdays during the day ​D late nights ​N late nights, and limited rush hour service in the reverse-peak direction ​Q all times ​R all times ​W limited rush hour service only
Atlantic Avenue–Pacific Street Disabled access BMT Fourth Avenue Line D all times ​N all times ​R all times ​W limited rush hour service only
Union Street BMT Fourth Avenue Line D late nights ​N late nights, and limited rush hour service in the reverse-peak direction ​R all times ​W limited rush hour service only
009th StreetNinth Street BMT Fourth Avenue Line D late nights ​N late nights, and limited rush hour service in the reverse-peak direction ​R all times ​W limited rush hour service only
Prospect Avenue BMT Fourth Avenue Line D late nights ​N late nights, and limited rush hour service in the reverse-peak direction ​R all times ​W limited rush hour service only
025th Street BMT Fourth Avenue Line D late nights ​N late nights, and limited rush hour service in the reverse-peak direction ​R all times ​W limited rush hour service only
036th Street BMT Fourth Avenue Line D all times ​N all times ​R all times ​W limited rush hour service only
045th Street BMT Fourth Avenue Line N late nights, and limited rush hour service in the reverse-peak direction ​R all times ​W limited rush hour service only
053rd Street BMT Fourth Avenue Line N late nights, and limited rush hour service in the reverse-peak direction ​R all times ​W limited rush hour service only
–Tinlinkin 14:58, 27 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Not sure if anyone still cares but I've "fixed" the sort order without changing any of the names, let me know if further cleanup would be valued. Adam McCormick (talk) 20:32, 10 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks. Now that I have thought it over, I am undecided whether numbered street station names that are prefaced by neighborhood name should have the street number as the key. Looking at the MTA's ordering of station names here, stations such as "Inwood–207th Street" are ordered by letter. I now think that should apply here. (I will comment out such instances in case preferences change later.) Prefixes such as "West" or "Beach" should remain as is, however. Tinlinkin (talk) 03:04, 13 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Future improvements[edit]

When I am finished with (or while I am) dealing with Template:Infobox NYCS, this list is what I want to tackle next. I want to ask people out there what improvements they want to see with this list to make it become a featured list. The most obvious task is to order the list alphabetically by station and to remove the rendering of the table by template. (If anyone thinks the current setup is helpful, I may reconsider.) Someone can find appropriate representative images from our articles. Someone else can write an improved lead section with references. I'm just throwing out this question now; I will begin to edit next week or earlier. Tinlinkin (talk) 12:48, 14 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

On second thought, I would be inclined to remove {{NYCS row}} because the page is approaching Wikipedia:Template limits and I don't think there will be a major reordering of stations, that's not to say there aren't any more issues of ordering, because there are. Tinlinkin (talk) 07:03, 11 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Then again, I think this list is headed for a split one way or another, so the row template could still be useful and manageable. Oh, we'll have to wait and see. Tinlinkin (talk) 08:54, 11 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

East 180th Street (IRT Dyer Avenue Line)[edit]

Is this former station the site of the current East 180th Street Yard? If so, would anybody mind if I redirected that redlink there? ----DanTD (talk) 14:58, 17 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The East 180th Street Yard appears to be east west of the current East 180th Street station and the sister Unionport Yard is to the north.[1] The former NYW&B platform should redirect to the current East 180th Street (IRT White Plains Road Line). Tinlinkin (talk) 03:39, 18 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The East 180th Street Yard is west of the current station, and it's sister Unionport Yard is north-east of the station. The former NYW&B station was a four track express station, still standing, to the east of the current station, south of Unionport Yard with the outer tracks still intact for Unionport Yard yard moves. The tracks formerly extended south, but now end at a bumper block within the station limits. Acps110 (talk) 21:26, 18 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]
That's what I meant. Anyway, the link confirms that the NYW&B platforms are not in that yard. Tinlinkin (talk) 02:38, 22 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Split[edit]

I believe a split of this list is in order. The 467 entries of the list make it difficult to analyze, navigate, and load, and I predict there is still a lot more to say about the stations of the New York City Subway. I need advice on how the split should be done, and I propose three ways of doing it:

  1. List of New York City Subway stations (1–238) and List of New York City Subway stations (A–Z) (alpha list may be split futher for even divisions)
    • Advantages: This split is simply derived from the current version. It allows analysis of the entire system without regard to system of origin, borough, or any factor other than station names. As the list is ordered alphanumerically, this is the best representation of a "master list."
    • Disadvantages: If a featured list is the goal, the lead sections of both will be very similar to each other as there is not much distinction between the two.
  2. List of New York City Subway stations in the Bronx, List of New York City Subway stations in Brooklyn, List of New York City Subway stations in Manhattan and List of New York City Subway stations in Queens
    • Advantages: This offers an analysis by borough. The development of the New York City Subway by borough will be an interesting read. The statistics of MTA ridership use this format.
    • Disadvantages: It is a less accessible way of comparing stations by station name. Ambiguously named stations will need to be mentioned in several places. There are also five (including the parent article) lists to maintain as opposed to three with the other options.
  3. List of New York City Subway stations (A Division) and List of New York City Subway stations (B Division)
    • Advantages: Analysis by divisions of the New York City Subway. (I thought of dividing it as IRT, BMT and IND, but as the BMT and IND are rather integrated with each other, I abandoned that idea. This could still be an option.) Provides insight as to the subway's origins; nuances between the former systems
    • Disadvantages: Generally the same as option 2. This kind of split is probably the most segregated because it "breaks up" the unified NYCS.

What do you think? I don't want to give my preference until others have chimed in. Tinlinkin (talk) 19:49, 14 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I favor Proposal 2 as that is how MTA officially do it.—Chris! ct 05:26, 22 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

This may be a ridiculous question given that I know nothing about the New York subway, but why not split it by line? Geraldk (talk) 12:12, 25 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Splitting by lines is good, too. But I don't know if it would cause come short lists to be made.—Chris! ct 18:38, 25 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]
All the service articles (such as 3 (New York City Subway service)) and line articles (such as BMT Broadway Line) have station listings. Short station lists are found in articles like 42nd Street Shuttle and Archer Avenue Line. The distinction between lines and services is explained fully in New York City Subway nomenclature. I would not like it if the split happens this way; ridership (which I have not incorporated into the list yet) can be compared best in a coherent list—if it is separated by line or service, comparisons can't be easily made. And if other transit systems can have complete station lists, why can't the NYCS? Tinlinkin (talk) 22:03, 25 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

If you know me, you'd know that I want it to be split into as few articles as possible because spreading the information dilutes the quality. Therefore I'd support 3. Otherwise option 2 because 1 is arbitrarily by name. Reywas92Talk 19:37, 25 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Not necessarily. Every subway line has a story, and many of those stories have distinctions by borough. There are books written about specific boroughs, like Brian Cudahy's How We Got to Coney Island (may not be the exact title; I'm going to borrow from the public library again soon anyway). Brooklyn was itself a city before New York's consolidation in 1898 and subway construction targeted specific boroughs. So I don't believe there is a dilution of quality if the split is by borough. In fact, there will be plenty of borough-specific details. Tinlinkin (talk) 22:22, 25 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I can say now that I favor choice 2 for the reasons above and per Chris!. Tinlinkin (talk) 22:38, 25 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

After careful consideration, I support splitting the list into stations by borough (Option 2). The first option would still be far too unwieldy, and option 3 is not friendly to newcomers. One thing I would add, is all station complexes should also be listed in tables on the main "Stations of the NYCTA" page by borough. This would highlight these stations as a good place for a newcomer to start learning. For example, any newcomer is going to want to know about Times Square, Fulton St, Atlantic Ave; these would be prominently listed. Acps110 (talk) 23:30, 25 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think that's a problem. The parent page will still contain a lot of info, no matter which split is ultimately selected. Including a list of "stations with the same name" will be a doozy... I haphazardly began a list at User:Tinlinkin/Subway disambiguation and I gave up after 3 entries. Tinlinkin (talk) 07:26, 27 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Current status: I want to begin splitting the list by around July 20th. So far, the tally is 1-3-2 (including here and here), favoring choice 2. Tinlinkin (talk) 10:57, 4 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I have User:Tinlinkin/List of New York City Subway stations in the Bronx in my userspace. I thought I would have the pages up relatively quickly, but events got in the way. I guess I am doing more preparatory work than I should, resulting in delays (just like the MTA, d'oh!). I swear I will work on it this weekend, as I want to get the station name disambiguation list out there in light of this and similar forum posts.Tinlinkin (talk) 09:42, 23 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Complete The list has now been split following Option 2. The main page now looks much different from other lists of metro stations. Any further advice or constructive criticism of the lists would be appreciated. Tinlinkin (talk) 11:11, 9 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Influence?[edit]

I am happy and horrified at the same time that it seems this page is the inspiration to this Underground Signs website that is offering to replicate NYCS signage. Tinlinkin (talk) 09:32, 23 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

A geographical index[edit]

Ladies & gentlemen,

I am new here (as a registered member), I haven't ever been to the USA, and I don't speak English. But I like user-friendly organized information, and I like subways.

Here, in the English articles about the NYC Subway, I see a serious problem. Along the whole section, about 500 articles, there is no any reference to the real location of each station on the map. It's impossible to add a map to every article, but it is possible to do something like this.

It's a geographical index. It isn't as beautiful as a real map, but this is not the aim. The index is a) clickable and b) searchable. Everyone can press Ctrl+F, find a station and get its article. The existing map doesn't allow that.

Some days ago I created a new article and made a link to it from here. Unfortunately, somebody deleted the article as spam. What is the right way to avoid such a deletion?

Maybe, I can change anything in my index?

Thank you.

Vcohen (talk) 08:14, 30 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

It works well for finding and searching. But I don't think its a very good layout for visualization of the subway system, as it takes a bit of thinking to zoom out and picture the subway map over the grid in your mind. The deletion reason was not that it was spam, but because it was a duplicate of the original list. I don't know how to avoid it, unfortunately. — Train2104 (talk • contribs • count) 19:59, 31 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks a lot. Now I have a direction for thinking.
Vcohen (talk) 20:09, 31 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

A new version is ready. It has become similar to the periodic table of elements. What's wrong now? Vcohen (talk) 11:52, 25 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]

SIR separate from NYCTA[edit]

Caption to illustration at head of article claims that the Staten Island Railway (SIR) is a separate entity from the New York City Transit Authority (NYCTA). The linked article Staten Island Railway states that the SIR is run by the NYCTA. One is clearly incorrect. As neither claim is referenced, I am not in a position to determine which is correct, but unless a valid reference can be found, both claims will have to be deleted as unreferenced. –LiveRail < Talk > 16:27, 16 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

@LiveRail: The SIR is not a separate entity of the NYCTA. The SIR is, however, a separate entity from New York City Subway. Epic Genius (talk) 18:41, 16 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
@Epicgenius: Is there any suitable reference(s) to back that up? The statements are unreferenced at present. –LiveRail < Talk > 12:41, 17 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
@LiveRail: That's actually a good point you brought up. There's a subtle distinction. Legally, the SIR is operated by the Staten Island Rapid Transit Operating Authority, an MTA subsidiary. The New York City Subway is operated by the New York City Transit Authority, an MTA affiliate, which, actually, doesn't manage the SIR at all....[1] (The source was published in 2002, but nothing's changed since then, except Long Island Bus is now Nassau Inter-County Express.) Epic Genius (talk) 13:47, 17 August 2015 (UTC) Actually, the NYCTA does operate the SIR. The NYCTA, which is actually called MTA New York City Transit, says so itself on its website.[2] Epic Genius (talk) 13:50, 17 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Regarless of all that (that the operations of the SIRTOA are managed by the NYCTA), it remains that the SIR is a physically separate system from the New York City Subway, with no physical connections at all. That's why it's separate. oknazevad (talk) 04:31, 2 October 2016 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ http://web.mta.info/mta/investor/pdf/2002app-a-v2.pdf
  2. ^ http://web.mta.info/nyct/facts/ffintro.htm

List of Brooklyn stations[edit]

One section in the List of New York City Subway stations in Brooklyn puzzles me;

"There are 170 New York City Subway stations in Brooklyn (171 if 75th Street – Elderts Lane (BMT Jamaica Line) is included. It is actually located in both Brooklyn and Queens)," per the official count of the Metropolitan Transportation Authority)

But what about Halsey Street (BMT Canarsie Line)? That one is on the Brooklyn-Queens border too. ---------User:DanTD (talk) 16:29, 20 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

There is a whole station complex located on that border: Myrtle–Wyckoff Avenues (New York City Subway). Vcohen (talk) 09:07, 22 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
True, but one of the stations that are part of the complex is in Brooklyn, while the other is split between Brooklyn and Queens. Either way, 75th Street – Elderts Lane isn't the only Brooklyn-Queens border station, and the issue should be addressed on both lists, but especially the Brooklyn one since it's mentioned there. ---------User:DanTD (talk) 01:25, 23 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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Total lengths missing[edit]

  • total length of tunnels
  • total length of route (counting lines on the same route only once)
  • total length of lines
  • total length of track (counting each parallel track on a route)

--Rainald62 (talk) 15:16, 28 June 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Count[edit]

Is there a count of stations by line, for example the A has n number of stations, etc. -Inowen (nlfte) 23:46, 29 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion[edit]

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion:

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 14:36, 14 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Stations with the same name[edit]

I note that in the table in the section headed "Stations with the same name" there are a large number of links to disambiguation pages in the first column. Some of these dab pages just include stations on the NY subway but many include links to other things (eg The dab page for Third Avenue includes a band and an album) or articles about other cities (eg Canal Street includes places in the UK, an album and a jazz festival in Norway) - I am not sure how useful this is to readers. Would those with knowledge of the relevant stations be able to make the links more specific? Currently this article adds lots of entries to Disambiguation pages with links which we are always trying to reduce.— Rod talk 14:34, 29 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Is there any benefit to wikilinking these names? The next column already lists the stations, and its links lead to all the information we have on them. There is nothing else of relevance in the dabs, except perhaps closed stations of that name. We might change the title of the "Lines" column to indicate more clearly that it is a list of stations rather than the lines they happen to lie on. Certes (talk) 09:13, 31 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Lafayette is another particularly bad example, where the stations appear in section 8 out of 10 on the DAB page (along with several other stations, ships, airports, etc.). I cannot see how linking to such a DAB page provides useful information to readers. I can see some merit in retitling the "Name of station" column to "Name" or "Location", and disambiguating to the location only. Narky Blert (talk) 10:02, 31 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The green and red lamps[edit]

I think that it is necessary to clarify about the true meaning of these green and red lamps.

I know that green lamp means ALWAYS a 24/7 entrance, but I don't know if this means also that is it possible to reach the 24/7 booth from that same entrance. Every station in NYC has at least a 24/7 booth, but is it possible to reach the 24/7 booth from every green lamp entrance? In this photo of a green lamp entrance in Times Square (https://www.dnainfo.com/new-york/20130412/times-square-theater-district/man-dies-times-square-subway-station-fdny-says) is possible to read this indication (enter with or buy the MetroCard ALL TIMES. Agent on duty 7.30 am-12pm or see agent at 42 St). Does mean that if a person hasn't a MetroCard and he wants buy it at 3am, must he use another entrance (in this case at 42 St) or is it possible to get to the 24 hour booth at 42 St through this same entrance before of the turnstiles? I think that it is important to know if the green lamp means only 24/7 entrance or also always 24/7 booth!

About the red lamps there is another question. Some red lamps entrances have exit-only, but I noticed that most entrances with red lamps have almost all this indication: enter with or buy the MetroCard ALL TIMES and the agent on duty is part-time (to see for example the photo in this site: https://techsponyc.com/new-york-transport/). Therefore, even these entrance are 24/7 with the MetroCard! In conclusion, what is the TRUE DIFFERENCE between the green and red lamps?

I hope in an exact reply. Thanks. Forza NYCFC !! (talk) 03:09, 30 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

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