Wikipedia:Teahouse

AlanM1, a Teahouse host

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Help Wikipedia

Creating a page

Lou Stallman was is very successful songwriter of the 1950s and 60s and although he is mentioned as a song collaborator on some pages, there is not one on the man himself. I am a screenwriter who has been asked to write a story about him. There is also a biography currently in the works about his life. He has had over 15 songwriting hits and is an important public figure for there is little information. How would I go about creating a page about him on Wikipedia? MusicMyThing (talk) 16:29, 9 June 2022 (UTC)

Start by gathering sources. Wikipedia is intended to be a compendium of the information found elsewhere. What published sources do you have? (So, for instance, that "biography currently in the works" won't count until it is in fact published.) DS (talk) 16:39, 9 June 2022 (UTC)

@MusicMyThing, since you mentioned that you've been asked to write an article, I think you should take a look at our policy on editing with a conflict of interest - here's a link to a simplified guide: link. The more complicated page is at WP:COI. Please ask if you have any questions. Lou Stallman does get mentioned in a lot of articles, he may very well meet our standards for notability, but if not much has been written about him - yet - there's not much to build an article around. 199.208.172.35 (talk) 16:57, 9 June 2022 (UTC)

Should I wait to pursue after his biography or feature film about him comes out? MusicMyThing (talk) 17:43, 9 June 2022 (UTC)

@MusicMyThing, that's probably a good idea. Note that we can't use a feature film as a reliable source to base an article on, but we could have an article on the film itself if it meets our notability standards (outlined at WP:NFILM). Also, here's some general reading about creating your first article: Your first article. Always feel free to ask questions here at the Teahouse. 199.208.172.35 (talk) 17:51, 9 June 2022 (UTC)

Thanks. MusicMyThing (talk) 18:54, 9 June 2022 (UTC)

I'd say it depends on whether your research turns up sufficient already-published information, or if you'll be sourcing from interviews and unpublished primary documents, MusicMyThing. Either way, best luck for your film! ⁓ Pelagic ( messages ) 10:21, 10 June 2022 (UTC)

Thanks. Yes I have extensive interviews with him as does his biographer now as well. The author has a major publisher, so when either Lou's biography or the feature film comes out, I think that will be the time to create a page on him because of heightened public awareness. MusicMyThing (talk) 12:11, 10 June 2022 (UTC)

@MusicMyThing The point about interviews is that they cannot be used to show a subject's notability. 73.127.147.187 (talk) 03:07, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

That makes sense. MusicMyThing (talk) 12:06, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

History of 138 Dutoitspan Road, Kimberley South Africa

Good afternoon. I am the Manager of Cecil John Rhodes Guesthouse in Kimberley, South AFrica. I am trying to find more history tying Cecil John Rhodes with our Guesthouse, 138 Dutoitspan Road, Kimberley. Is there perhaps anyone available to assist me? 41.163.0.52 (talk) 14:03, 10 June 2022 (UTC)

Hello fellow IP, welcome to the Teahouse. Wikipedia has an article on Cecil Rhodes with many, many useful sources listed at the end, but for a more specific idea of where to look for such information, you could try asking at one of our reference desks - Wikipedia:Reference desk/Humanities seems like the best fit. 199.208.172.35 (talk) 14:10, 10 June 2022 (UTC)

Asking someone at the McGregor Museum in Kimberley is probably your best option. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 12:23, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

Hang on let me check something first

will get back to you Ember Tesfaye (talk) 08:28, 11 June 2022 (UTC)

Hi Ember Tesfaye and welcome. Next time check it first then ask the question. `~HelpingWorld~` ^(👽🛸) 19:27, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

1914 United States House of Representatives

Hi, on this page, I've been wondering whether I should keep copy the special election results from Alabama's 8th into the Alabama infobox instead of having the general election results.

Could someone please give me some feedback on what way to do this would be correct? PoliticallyPassionateGamer (talk) 15:45, 11 June 2022 (UTC)

Keep it the way it is because it pretty much gives further detail into the election itself. `~HelpingWorld~` ^(👽🛸) 19:25, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

Thank you so much! I was worried I made an error there. :) PoliticallyPassionateGamer (talk) 20:47, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

Lots of UserBoxes

Why there are many users of Wikipedia/WikiMedia who have a lot of UserBoxes? and by a lot, I mean a LOT. is it some kind of WikiPedia/WikiMedia joke? 186.137.76.153 (talk) 18:37, 11 June 2022 (UTC)

I don't think there's a better general answer than "It seemed like a good idea at the time." Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 20:20, 11 June 2022 (UTC)

With so many reverts taking place and some things so simple that it could be corrected without much difficulty your assessment just might be the answer. Is there a mechanism within WP to create your own boxes? I do not get too involved in some of these mechanics because I am not that vested in WP except for the general obvious things like misspellings and run on sentences.2603:8000:D300:D0F:D5D:8295:289E:24F5 (talk) 21:39, 11 June 2022 (UTC)

I kind of agree with the IP/OP and with Grabergs. I probably say more than I should about myself on my User Page. Think of it as getting caught up in the novelty of things when I was new. Yes, I made several of the Userboxes myself (about my being a nudist and an art school model, and the countries I have visited--those edited from existing boxes), but it was many years ago, and I just sort of stumbled through it and finally got them to work more by accident than anything else, so I couldn't really tell you how it's done.

One thing that's incredibly important though: If you think of editing a Userbox for yourself, DO NOT edit the code at the template itself--you will then edit it for everybody else who uses it. Copy the code onto the edit portion of your own User Page and make the changes there. And hope they come out the way you had in mind. Uporządnicki (talk) 21:57, 11 June 2022 (UTC)

Perhaps Wikipedia:Userboxitis can help. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 14:33, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

I find all userboxes (and barnstars and other such things) to be jokes that I would be glad to see expunged from WP. --User:Khajidha (talk) (contributions) 16:11, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

Why are the hyperlinks dead when I click on them?

I'm used to the hyperlinks allowing me to deep search a tropic. But today they are not working. I created an account just now thinking that was a new requirement but still no luck! FiberBundle (talk) 00:55, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

@FiberBundle: Can you give examples of what links you're trying to click? —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 01:07, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

And if you are trying to click on a red link, it will not work. Kpddg ^(talk) 09:14, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

Discord post as a citation

Hi! I'm a very new editor and I've run into an issue that I can't really find a consensus on. For an article, I'd like to find a citation for a major event in the history of the game. The problem is that I can only find one official source on the event, a Discord post from the game's lead community manager. The game was never very big, and this event occurred some time after development was stopped and the game was removed from Steam, so I am unable to find any news articles relating to the topic. I understand this is very much a edge case, but would it be better to add this as a citation or to leave the statement uncited? If the former, would it be more proper to add a link to the message (requires the user to have a Discord account, and be in the game's Discord server) or to take a screencap of the message?

Sorry for such the strange case! Like I said earlier, I'm very new, so if there's any other information I can provide to help please let me know :)

Link to the article: Hellion (video game) GTink911 (talk) 03:19, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

@GTink911: I'm afraid if something never got beyond the stage of a discord post from a primary source connected with the article's subject, then it's not appropriate to include it in the article at all. I am also very much afraid that I'm far from convinced that Hellion (video game) should even be in Wikipedia; it looks like a very non-notable game that barely made it into the world before disappearing again, and that hasn't generated more than a handful of routine press-release-inspired reviews. If you've got strong feelings about the game, I'd keep quiet, tiptoe away, and hope no one notices the article exists... Elemimele (talk) 09:05, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

Contributions are not getting updated

My recent contributions including new article creation and the related changes-its assessment are not getting updated in the summary of my user page.! This is to seek any guidance & support.! Thanks.! Thirukannan (talk) 05:28, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

Not sure if this is relevant, but XTools seems to have replication lag right now. If you go to xtools:ec/en.wikipedia.org/Thirukannan, it says that there is replication lag, so contributions from the last two days might not be counted. (They didn't get counted for me.) weeklyd3 (message me | my contributions) 05:30, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

Thank you so much.! Thirukannan (talk) 08:29, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

Dead interwiki links

Hello from german wikipedia! For the german wikipedia I wrote some script to identify dead interwiki links, now after 2 month almost all those "redlinks" are gone. So maybe the english wikipedia (or others) are interested in such a list. Currently I find 3,706,692 interwiki links to 401 wikis and there are 129,018 "redlinks" in 39,420 articles (I did not check namespace draft). So 3.5 % of those interwiki links are not working, in german wikipedia we had about 3 % such dead links, so there is no big difference. If you are interested, I can create it. --Wurgl (talk) 07:41, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

@Wurgl Try asking this at Wikipedia:Village pump (technical), it's probable that editors with deeper understanding hang around there. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 09:03, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

√ Done. Thanks. --Wurgl (talk) 09:11, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

Incomplete List of Sundown Towns

I am contacting Wikipedia to suggest that it cross references this list of sundown towns and counties with another massive list. The following database has a more complete list of sundown towns and counties, and it could help Wikipedia make a more complete list.

https://justice.tougaloo.edu/sundown-towns/using-the-sundown-towns-database/state-map/

The following is the page that needs to be edited.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Sundown_towns_in_the_United_States_by_state The Troth (talk) 13:02, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

I challenge the accuracy of the proposed additions. I have been writing about the history of Maynard, MA for 12 years (newspaper column and three books). There is no evidence whatsoever that Maynard was a Sundown Town, but it is listed in that Tougaloo document. David notMD (talk) 16:01, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

Help

Hello community Wikipedia (En), Please I prefer to creat Santrinos Raphael. He is an a Togolese singer. Who can I state ?

==Noel Tchallagassou (talk) 13:26, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

@Noel Tchallagassou, could you specify your question? Does this page help? Kpddg ^(talk) 13:33, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

According to BBC, "In four years of professional career, the singer has established himself as one of the most essential artists on the music scene in Togo." An article on him may be possible. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 14:37, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

Draft:St Thomas Aquinas Catholic Primary School

I am once again asking for this page to be published. I have added reference and more depth to the page. Here it is: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:St_Thomas_Aquinas_Catholic_Primary_School — Preceding unsigned comment added by QCS 2020 (talk • contribs) 11:54, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

There are 2,924 pending submissions waiting for review. Please be patient, what is the hurry? Theroadislong (talk) 15:42, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

Hello, QCS 2020. The vast majority of primary schools are not notable. Only those of exceptional historical or architectural significance are notable. Your draft requires several references to reliable sources that are independent of the school and that devote significant coverage to this specific school. Currently, there are none. You have primary sources, passing mentions and database entries. That is not good enough. Please read WP:SCHOOLOUTCOMES. Cullen328 (talk) 17:06, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

article creation

need help with article creation Dcmpedia (talk) 16:13, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

Courtesy link: Draft:Ashfaque nabi. 97.113.167.129 (talk) 16:19, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

Hello, @Dcmpedia, and welcome to the Teahouse! Are you referring to your draft article on Ashfaque nabi? If so, please bear in mind the feedback the reviewer left. The draft has been declined twice because the reviewer, KylieTastic, found that the draft does not demonstrate that the subject is notable, and therefore doesn't qualify for a Wikipedia article. Unless you can prove that the subject is notable by providing multiple reliable, independent, secondary sources which cover the subject in non-trivial detail, your draft is unlikely to be accepted into the mainspace. Regardless, have a great day! HenryTemplo (talk) 16:29, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

Tea house

' 41.138.73.8 (talk) 16:59, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

Hi 41.138.73.8 and welcome. Do you have any question? GenuineArt (talk) 17:04, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

I think this guy is a troll. Leahnn Rey (talk) 13:22, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Her

Singer from Vallejo cal. Not listed in musicians from Vallejo California. 2600:1700:7800:A720:9D46:B2F1:5380:4A75 (talk) 17:21, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. In order for that to happen, she must merit a Wikipedia article, and in order to do that, she would need to meet the special Wikipedia definition of a notable musician. 331dot (talk) 17:27, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

She is indisputably notable. She has won several Grammy Awards and an Academy Award. I spend a lot of time in Vallejo since I own a home nearby. The biography is at H.E.R.. Cullen328 (talk) 17:44, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

I have added H.E.R. to Category:Musicians from Vallejo, California. Cullen328 (talk) 17:50, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

article about Wahabi Islam

In the text from citation (104). It says, "the 9/11 attacks on New York and the Pentagon". There should be a year obviously, (01 or 2001), and the sentence, should also include something, in reference, to the downing, of the jetliner in a Pennsylvania field. As I live in Pennsylvania, and have visited the memorial site. I consider a jetliner, being used by a missile, after the killing of innocent stewardesses, and pilots, and then all the passengers including babies, an attack, on the Unites states also.207.44.34.110 (talk) 21:26, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

It says "September 11, 2001", so I am not clear why you think the year is missing. And the linked article about the attacks has information about the Penn. part also. You can discuss suggested changes on the article's talk page. RudolfRed (talk) 21:43, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

I edited the dates for clarity. Personally, I do not see the need to mention the crash near Shanksville, Pennsylvania in this article about a theological movement. If you disagree, the proper place to make your case is at Talk:Wahhabism. Cullen328 (talk) 21:47, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

Adding a name.

Re: Wiki list "Friends Seminary Notable Graduates." First let me say that I'm 84. and happy when my toaster works. This is whom I tried to add to the aforementioned list, my late daughter, Christiana Ley Parker, author, equestrian, humanitarian. [https://www.christianaparker.org The website mentioned is my privately funded charitable entity in her memory. Additionally, I endowed her non-sectarian "Christiana Ley Parker '92 Humanitarian Award" at Friends Seminary; which, in perpetuity, has and will provide a yearly grant to that person, as chosen by the school, "Who went their own oft-times lonely way with goodness and grace" as she did. Chris was the co-author with me of "Camp Off The Wall" and "A Horse In New York" published by Avon, combining our initials as CaM Parker. It was our way of spending time together during school holidays or waiting for camp, when her ongoing efforts to save the world and every horse in it allowed. The listing is not all that important I suppose, to any save me, but it would be nice. Be and stay well. Mtnpkr821 (talk) 22:28, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

Mtnpkr821, I don't doubt that your adding the name of your late daughter would give you great satisfaction. You should note, however, that names added to lists of notable alumni need to have an article written about them on Wikipedia. Otherwise, they are subject to either immediate or eventual removal from the list. In order for an article written about Chris to be published on Wikipedia, she must qualify as notable, which Wikipedia defines as having been discussed in depth in multiple, published, reliable sources (i.e., sources in no way connected to her or her family, friends, etc.). If you wish to go down that road, please read Your first article and the articles to which it links. --Quisqualis (talk) 22:50, 12 June 2022 (UTC)

Thank you for your reply. My Latin studies were eons ago, but "What is this" rings a bell. Thanks again. 71.230.172.147 (talk) 01:02, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Mtnpkr821. I am so sorry that you lost your daughter and I can see that you are trying to commemorate her. I am 70 and I lost a loved and expected and eagerly anticipated first grandson at birth 6-1/2 years ago, and it was devastating. In response, I wrote and expanded articles like Now I Lay Me Down to Sleep (organization) and Rainbow baby and Zenith Radio Nurse and Baby rattle. So, I suggest to take your valid and legitimate grief about your daughter's death, and work to neutrally improve articles that do not mention your daughter, but instead have to do with the things you loved about her and the things that she loved. I am very fortunate to now have a 4-1/2 year old granddaughter, so that motivates me as well. She makes life worth living for me. I wish you well. Cullen328 (talk) 06:26, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Thank you for your reply. If anyone knows your feelings of loss, and that of your grandson's parents, I certainly do. Mine was 15 years ago, but I relive that awful day each and every day; and I suppose I shall until I too am no longer around. Chris was born in what might be considered late in my life, and that in itself was a miracle I treasured. I appreciate your article suggestions, but since her death have chosen to perpetuate her memory by continuing her good works in the only meaningful way I know of, via financial arrangements for the benefit of those who deserve recognition for traits that reflect her goodness and concern for others. Adding Chris' name to the list of her Alma Mater's "Notables" isn't really important. There, via her endowed fund's yearly grants in perpetuity, Chris will remain a kind of living presence long after I as well as all now, or in the future, alive are long gone. It was just something that occurred to me when coming upon same. Keep well, and please accept my best wishes for the health and happiness of you and yours. 71.230.172.147 (talk) 18:20, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

My edits are not saved

I am trying to edit this page - Viber, and I am adding words/sections that are updated about the company, including relevant sources, and its still always reverted back and not saved. I am always providing reasons and links, and its still not saved. Who can I speak to in order to solve this? CKWiki1818 (talk) 07:06, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

This edit did save, but it was reverted because the citations were incorrectly formatted. It looks as though your edits at Viber did save, but were reverted for various reasons.--♦IanMacM♦ ^{(talk to me)} 07:22, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Is there anyone who is an official representative from Wikipedia that I can speak with? CKWiki1818 (talk) 08:50, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

CKWiki1818, here's one of your additions: "One of Viber’s very first collaborations was with the BBC. In 2016, the news channel launched a public account on the app. In its public account, the news channel delivered real-time news to its subscribers and gave them access like never before to breaking stories." It's completely unsourced. It has an external link, but this isn't a reference for any proposition. Additionally, in-text external links are frowned on, and "like never before" sounds promotional. Had I seen this addition, I too would have reverted it. But the matter can be discussed in Talk:Viber. -- Hoary (talk) 07:27, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Okay, but what about the rest of the edits? I added more things, more sections, with sources, and everything is reverted. Is there any way to check the reasons for the rest of the unsaved edits? Also, is there anyone who is an official from Wikipedia that I can speak with? CKWiki1818 (talk) 07:34, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

You also added an unsourced section which said "Viber works closely with global brands across various industries to help users connect with their favorite brands, and teams, or get access to essential information." that was VERY promotional and correctly removed. Theroadislong (talk) 08:14, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Is there anyone who is an official representative from Wikipedia that I can speak with? CKWiki1818 (talk) 08:41, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

CKWiki1818 We are all official representatives- Wikipedia has no paid staff involved in day to day operations. You may ask any questions you wish here. Please also see your user talk page for important information. 331dot (talk) 08:55, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

You can try to find something at Wikipedia:Contact us, but they will point you to WP:CONSENSUS and WP:DR. If WP:COI applies to you, follow the guidance there. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 08:59, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

You have removed valid references and added hyperlinks, which are not valid references. Your content and your 'sources' reverted because those are not sources. Learn how to reference from Help:Referencing for beginners. David notMD (talk) 01:07, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Trams in Ostrava

This is both a rant and a question about the Trams in Ostrava article.

A rollbacker and a page mover admin completely ignored my contribution on the article. Their argument on my talk page was that the article wouldn't pass WP:V. I read about WP:V and admittedly, there wasn't many references to the article, and as a beginner, I was 1. practising my articles whilst openly contributing 2. providing in depth translations and 3. working on references. But wouldn't millions of articles on Wikipedia currently not pass WP:V?

For example, the article now reads more succinctly (congratulations to the editor), but there's no information on steam trams that has been completely rubbed out. Surely not every sentence on Wikipedia has to have a corresponding reference? I find it unlikely that this would be possible.

I risk highlighting Trams in Košice article for the same reason; yet there are a few books available on it. While I can speak a bit of Czech, Slovak is a little different; I don't understand some words or context to be able to cite the book properly. Kmlbon (talk) 07:21, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

It's hard to tell which of your contributions you are talking about. Could you give us a diff? And this isn't really the place to raise such issues. Deb (talk) 08:38, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Trams_in_Ostrava&diff=next&oldid=1092492798 Kmlbon (talk) 08:44, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Hello, Kmlbon. Unfortunately we have thousands and thousands and thousands of seriously substandard articles, which would not be accepted if they were created today in the form they are. Our standards have become significantly higher since the project began. Ideally somebody would go through these improving them or deleting them if they cannot be made acceptable; but not many of our volunteer editors are intersted in spending their time in this way. When somebody does work on one of these articles, it tends to bring it to other editors' attention, and the result is sometimes that the article gets moved to draft, or deleted. Please look at WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS.

It is true that Wikipedia's policies do not require that every statement be cited; but they do require that every statement be citeable - that is, that a reliable published source exist for every claim; and reviewers nowadays tend to strongly prefer that the citations be present (after all, if there is a source, why not cite it?). If there is no reliable published source for a piece of information, then that information should not be in a Wikipedia article - period. ColinFine (talk) 09:12, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Thanks for the explanation, I will endeavour to improve my referencing Kmlbon (talk) 12:17, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Whilst this was possibly not the place to discuss this, compare Trams in Ostrava where not a lot of citeable references in journals and books are available: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euro_Truck_Simulator_2. How is the Trams in Ostrava article different to this, where equally, only web sources are mainly available? Two different categories of articles, for sure, but if context can be only referenced by web content, why should it be declined? Am I missing a Wikipedia policy I haven’t read? Or should the policy be reviewed to differentiate between articles that have bibliography available, and those which don’t? “Reliable sources” is a very vague guideline for some articles. Objectively, this is still a good article including contributions from others. Would Wikipedia guidelines or certain administrators stipulate for this article be removed? Few of the articles I created have been moved to Draft because of this. Should the policy be modified to include the exception of certain geography (because of its lack of popularity, and interest; less people study to reference, and live for example in Ostrava compared to say, Prague, where references are widely available), or a completely seperate universe, in case of the Euro Truck Simulator 2 article? Kmlbon (talk) 18:14, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

I'm struggling a bit to understand what you're saying, @Kmlbon. Being offline or online doesn't affect whether a source is reliable. Euro Truck Simulator 2 might be a bit over-sourced to the dev blog, and unsourced in spots, but otherwise it's not a bad article. Our policy on reliable sources applies across the board; it's true that this leads to less coverage on Wikipedia of less popular or less populated article subjects - see the essay on systemic bias. There are people and projects trying to combat this, but so far, there has been no consensus to relax our standards. Policy can change, but changing it is a long and complicated process. 199.208.172.35 (talk) 20:19, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

I trying to make page but I can't

How to make page? 156.213.93.184 (talk) 08:27, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

See Help:Your first article for instructions. Deb (talk) 08:36, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

(ec) Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. We call pages in the encyclopedia "articles". New accounts and IP users cannot directly create articles, and need to use Articles for Creation to create and submit a draft article for review by other editors. Be advised that successfully creating a new article is the most difficult task to perform on Wikipedia, and it's a good idea to first gain experience and knowledge by editing existing articles in areas that interest you, to get a feel for how Wikipedia operates and what is expected of article content. Whether you prefer to do that or to dive right in to article creation, please read Your First Article. 331dot (talk) 08:38, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

along with Your first article, I advise you to also read Notability (or whatever notability guideline is appropriate for your subject) and Reliable sources, which show what subjects can have an article and what sources can be used to prove claims in the article respectively. happy editing! 💜  melecie  talk - 09:11, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Where to get started on Counter-Vandalism

Hi!

I've been reading about Counter-Vandalism here on WP and would like to contribute. Do you have any pointers for me? Where do I start? What tools do I use?

Thanks! Kvoou (talk) 08:46, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

hi @Kvoou and welcome to the teahouse! I'd advise you to take a look at Counter-Vandalism Unit and read as many policy articles as you can, starting with Vandalism and Disruptive editing (and make sure to know the difference between both! vandalism is deliberate disruptive editing, while disruptive editing can be unintentional or caused by them not knowing the policies). you might also want to get a script to help with your CVing, I advise RedWarn and Twinkle. happy editing! 💜  melecie  talk - 09:08, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Hello @Melecie! Thank you for the welcome. I will definitely do that! I'm going through the TWA right now. --Kvoou (talk) 09:21, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Any way to contact an editor who might be wasting their time?

Due to a misunderstanding, an editor I was involved in a dispute with is now implementing what they consider to be the consensus. It's not. This is affecting 57 articles and presumably a lot of work for them. I've left a message on their talk page but fear they haven't seen it and are now in an editing trance. Is there any non-etiquette-breaching way I can contact that editor and suggest they stop?

IpseCustos (talk) 09:50, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

IpseCustos, you'll be more likely to get a helpful answer if you link to the dispute, so that Teahouse hosts can assess what is happening. Maproom (talk) 10:02, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

This seems to be a dispute at Talk:Oxygen about high-energy oxygen, with spillover here (and on many other pages). 199.208.172.35 (talk) 13:57, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

The more wide-ranging discussion is at WP:Fringe_theories/Noticeboard#Chemical energy and related articles. Mike Turnbull (talk) 14:25, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

@IpseCustos, it wouldn't be wiki-illegal to e-mail them if they've attached an address to their account, though doing it repeatedly would obviously cross a line. It's generally best to keep things on-wiki as much as possible. They're aware of the various discussions, you've taken things to a noticeboard and started an RfC, seems like it would be best to let things play out until a consensus is reached, then implement it. If they then go against it, there's a different problem to be dealt with. 199.208.172.35 (talk) 14:57, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Thank you very much for your responses and advice. I shall try to be more patient and see where things go.

As a very minor nitpick, it's not "high-energy oxygen" we're arguing about (i.e. oxygen species that are more reactive than ordinary oxygen), it's about calling ordinary old oxygen a "high-energy" molecule. About 2 food calories in a deep breath, in case you're wondering (though I suppose we ought to call them air calories). IpseCustos (talk) 15:36, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Thanks for the correction, @IpseCustos - I was just copying the title of the RfC, since chemistry is far from my area of expertise. Unfortunately this looks like it's going to be a complicated issue, with some WP:COI flavoring on top, so much patience will no doubt be needed! 199.208.172.35 (talk) 16:21, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

why my article has declined?

Hi there,

this is my first article on wikipedia,

it's been declined, the question is why?

this is just a name that people use for their Girl in Kurdistan and the reference for that is a physical dictionary. I'm wondering if the referencing is the case how can I reference it? Yuseferi (talk) 10:58, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

hi @Yuseferi and welcome to the teahouse! the problem is that the sole reference is a dictionary which does not really establish notability (there are lots of words in a dictionary, not all of them deserve separate articles since we're not Wiktionary), not that the dictionary is physical. not all names are automatically notable for Wikipedia. you could make it a disambiguation and show links to all notable people with the name Gashin (for example, see Lucy (disambiguation)), although if you want to make it a full article detailing the etymology, history, and notability of the name Gashin, you have to prove it meets the general notability criteria, see Anastasia for an example of such article. happy editing! 💜  melecie  talk - 11:19, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Hi @Melecie,

thank you for your message. the problem is that there is no any English reference for this name, nobody has added anything to this name in English. and in the Kurdish alphanet are different.

I'm wondering in case that someone like me wants to add a Article for the first time which there is no English reference for that what should he/she do? I found some news in English with people with Name Gashin. like https://www.rudaw.net/english/middleeast/iran/19102013 . is that something that I can use as reference? Yuseferi (talk) 13:33, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Yuseferi, the great majority of personal names are not of encyclopedic significance. Imaginably Gashin is an exception; but your draft doesn't start to suggest that it is. -- Hoary (talk) 13:41, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

@Melecie, sorry I didn't get that. what can I do know?

could you please help me how can I improve it and make it published. at the moment what I have is translation of it from Kurdish to Persian and I translated it from Persian to English.

I have a reference from Kurdish to Persian in the top kurdish-persian dictionary. ( it's pdf file of this Abdurrahman Sharafkandi person).

that is. Yuseferi (talk) 13:49, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

@Yuseferi, sources do not have to be in English, that is not one of our requirements. The problem is that one dictionary entry isn't enough to build an article on - it doesn't demonstrate that a word is notable by our standards. If you wanted to make a disambiguation page, you could use the dictionary entry to support a sentence about the name's meaning and/or origin, but right now there don't appear to be any articles which need disambiguation on enWP. Gashin redirects to Gasin faith, which is the main context for the word in articles here. 199.208.172.35 (talk) 14:48, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

@Melecie,

but this Gashin is different with Gasin faith,

I have reference for Gashin, it's a paper book. ( of course it's pdf is around). if I upload it somewhere and add it as a reference will be approved? Yuseferi (talk) 14:53, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

(Note: I am not Melecie) @Yuseferi, you don't need to upload it. You just need to cite it. See {{cite book}} for how to do that. If it's online as a pdf, you might be able to use {{cite web}}. One book is probably not going to be enough for an article, though, especially if it's just a dictionary. 199.208.172.35 (talk) 15:01, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

we don't mind that sources are not online, we accept paper sources or sources in other languages when they are available, however what we are looking for are sources that are not just dictionaries, ones that actually show that the name gashin is notable for wikipedia standards.

however unless if the book was published a long time ago (very early 1900s or before) please do not upload the full book at all, just citing the book is fine. happy editing! 💜  melecie  talk - 15:01, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Got it. I just need ti cites it. I will update it. thank you very much for time and clarification Yuseferi (talk) 15:10, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

hey

hey 2601:2C5:4200:C440:68E0:47D:9E27:9F02 (talk) 13:38, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

hi IP user! do you have a question regarding editing wikipedia? 💜  melecie  talk - 13:58, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

I think this guy is a troll. Leahnn Rey (talk) 13:23, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Adding the page "Teenage pregnancy in fiction".

Hi, there is an extended user (@Bonedea ) who moved my page that I created, Teenage pregnancy in fiction, it says: Not ready for mainspace, incubate for draft space because the page is not suitable as written to remain published due to just an indiscriminate list with a poorly written and unsourced introduction. It needs more citations from reliable, independent sources for the lead section or somewhere in my page. It's a good thing if someone can help me for my page, just like this one, List of highest-grossing films based on video games. Fortunewriter (talk) 15:10, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Hi, Fortunewriter! To create an acceptable Wikipedia article, it's not sufficient just to show that something merely exists, even if you can provide a long list of examples. An article needs to show that the subject is Notable in Wikipedia's sense of the term. That is, that other people have discussed the subject in some depth in well-edited, published Reliable sources.

In this case, instead of just creating a list of examples (which by itself is bordering on Original research or at least Synthesis, Wikipedia no-nos), you need to find examples of, for example, literary and film critics discussing teenage pregnancy in fiction, how it has been portrayed and used in fiction, and what significance these uses have. You then need to base the article mostly on summaries of what these sources say, and cite them appropriately. The list (which is well constructed using notable works – well done on that aspect) can form a useful part of such an article, but it's insufficient on its own.

Using the argument that "Other stuff exists" is not a good idea – other articles may themselves be substandard (in part because Wikipedia's standards have become higher over the years), and there's a lot that should really be either improved or deleted if only there was the editorial time available. Also, some list-based articles (like the one you mention) at least have hard numbers that can be measured and compared (money is always significant to some points of view).

I suggest that you look at the articles about your list entries and see if any of the sources used in them lead you to discussions of the titular topic (which could easily be the subject of PhD or D.Litt theses), and if writers of those sources have also published other articles about it. Good luck! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.193.131.154 (talk) 15:48, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Looking for a post by Jimbo

Hi! Not sure if I should be using the Teahouse for this question, but some months ago, I came across a post by Wikipedia co-founder Jimmy Wales where he pointed out how the ratio of unreviewed Wikipedia pages was on the rise (he also shared a graph showing this). I remember the comment thread was pretty active then. Can someone share that post here? Thanks in advance! Toofllab (talk) 15:23, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

@Toofllab, are you referring to this? A corresponding message from the newsletter is also present in some user talk pages, like this one....Kpddg ^(talk) 15:37, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Yes! This is the (somewhat alarming) graph. I remember Jimbo referring to it in a post. Any idea where I can find that? Toofllab (talk) 16:17, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

@Toofllab, is it this discussion? Kpddg ^(talk) 16:28, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

@Toofllab: (edit conflict) I think you'll find the discussion in Jimbo's recent archive User_talk:Jimbo_Wales/Archive_248#New_Page_Patrol_on_its_last_legs. Mike Turnbull (talk) 16:34, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Ah this seems to be it! Thanks a lot @Kpddg and @Michael D. Turnbull! Toofllab (talk) 16:50, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Kpddg ^(talk) 04:48, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Hi everyone

What would be a good first article to edit here? This encyclopedia is so big and I'm a little overwhelmed. 96.31.192.54 (talk) 17:44, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

• Go to the top left column and click "Random article". I used to enjoy that. Drmies (talk) 17:44, 13 June 2022 (UTC)
• Hi, IP editor, and welcome to the Teahouse! In addition to random articles, you can also look at the Community Portal (also in the top left column). It has a section near the top titled "Help out" which has lists of articles that need improving. If you're interested, you can also create an account, and you'll then get a 'homepage' that will suggest articles you can improve for you. Happy editing! Perfect4th (talk) 17:50, 13 June 2022 (UTC)
• See if you find something you like at Wikipedia:Task Center. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 19:04, 13 June 2022 (UTC)
• Another suggestion is to ask yourself what specialist interests you have, and what reference books you might have on your shelves at home that could be used as sources that maybe other editors haven't got access to. Then go check out some articles that interest you - perhaps about your home region, or your hobbies. For example, one of my interests has been climbing the highest summits in the Alps over 4,000m. I have many guidebooks on those topics, and I find that many Wikipedia articles about these mountains (with a few exceptions) are usually very short and incomplete. So I might go and look at a few I know and whether I have some good climbing guides I could use. I'd consider what content is currently missing from that article and use those books to add additional information.

We have lots 'WikiProjects' here, which are simply groups of editors who come together to work on specific topics. So, in my case I'd visit WikiProject Mountains of the Alps. They have a table of all relevant articles there (3,097 of them), and all listed by importance and by their quality (=completeness). To have the greatest impact, I might choose to look at all the 'High' Importance articles that are really short (we call them stubs). The table shows me there are currently 22 of them. By clicking the number in the cell, I get list of those articles, and can visit each in turn to see whether I have anything I could add to them from my reference books. I can't base what I write on my own personal experience of them, and must be able to cite published books or other reliable online sources to support everything I want to add. I suspect you don't have the same interests as me, so why not visit the full list of Projects. Most WikiPrtojects have similarly helpful Article Assessment Tables, and I hope you might find one that inspires you to edit. I hope this helps a bit. Regards, Nick Moyes (talk) 21:56, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Thank you so much, everyone! These answers were really helpful and I look forward to contributing here! 96.31.192.54 (talk) 19:36, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

That didn't last long. IP address now blocked - suspected block evasion. Nick Moyes (talk) 20:48, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Oilphase

Hi. I would like to ask if it is possible for me to create and publish a wikipedia page for a past company called Oilphase (Oilphase Sampling Services Ltd., to be precise). It could link to the reference of "Oilphase" on this other company's page (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schlumberger). I only ask as if Wikipedia has a policy of not publishing pages for past companies or anything like that, since if it does then I would rather not waste my time. Otherwise, I will try to compose something of value. Oilphase was/is notable in the oil & gas industry for revolutionizing bottom-hole sampling technology in the mid-90's in North Sea oilfields. It then soon grew and oil & gas companies around the world were using their tools in their wells. The technology, single-phase sampling, has since been adopted by several other service companies (Halliburton, Baker Hughes, etc). Thanks & regards for your time and consideration, Chris Batzer. 216.227.241.182 (talk) 21:04, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Hi, Chris, and welcome to the Teahouse! To answer the question generally, any article (not page) can exist on Wikipedia if it follows the relevant guidelines. For your specific question, an article could be created for the company if it is notable by Wikipedia's definition. The article would also need to be neutral and verifiable. If you wish to create an article, you should look at Your first article, which describes the process. However, if you are connected with the company in any way, you should first read the conflict of interest guideline before editing about the company. Happy editing, Perfect4th (talk) 21:23, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Hello Chris. To add to what Perfect4th said above, you would have to be confident that Oilphase met our very specific notability criteria for businesses. You can find them with this shortcut: WP:NCORP. Whilst there are millions of companies that someone might deem notable within that field, our definition used by Wikipedia is that you would need evidence that the world at large has already taken note of that business, and that people independent of the company and of the sector have written in detail and in depth about the company. If you can find three books, newspapers or major publishers which have written about that company, and supply us with links, we can take a look at them and advise further. You would need to exclude all insider business sources, press releases, social media posts and blogs. It's a hard ask, so unless you can unearth some really good sources, there would be no chance of an article here. Nick Moyes (talk) 21:32, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

How do you know if a source is reliable

I've been making an article about one of the battles fought in the Philippine-American war, i was looking for sources and found bunch, however, most of them seem fake. There were either no proof or classification. They looked like sketchy websites. I don't know if one source is reliable and i don't wanna get blocked from editing. Leahnn Rey (talk) 23:08, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

For the Phillippine-American war, I expect the best sources are actually going to be scholarly books, not websites. But as a rule, I apply a five-prong test, as follows:

1. Does the source discuss the subject at some length?
2. Is the source not something that would exist as a matter of course in the first place? (i.e. routine business news)
3. Does the source have any direct connexion to the subject or their surrogates? (i.e. was it written, filmed, said, etc. by them?)
4. Is the source attributed to an identifiable author?
5. Has the source been fact-checked to within an inch of its life?

Note that we accept offline sources, if cited properly. We also accept non-English sources and offline non-English sources. —Jéské Couriano v^_^v ^{a little blue Bori} 23:37, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

Wouldn't that get me blocked? There are some hosts here that checks/verifies the citation. If they come across a non-english reference would i get blocked? Leahnn Rey (talk) 13:27, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

@Leahnn Rey: Wikipedia:Offline sources, though an essay, reaffirms the validity of sources that aren't online. Non-English sources are also allowed to be used, and neither would warrant an editor getting blocked. That being said, both offline and non-English sources may be contested by other editors more frequently, but a relevant WikiProject or Resource Exchange might be able to help. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 15:42, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

• @Leahnn Rey: In addition to the fact that giving non-English sources is correct... Simply doing some incorrect edits will not get you blocked. What can get you blocked is either outrageous conduct towards fellow editors (calling them racial slurs etc.), or repeated incorrect edits (= doing the same thing over and over even when other editors told you to stop and why it’s wrong). Failure to conform to arcane Wikipedia guidelines will never get you blocked; at worst, it will cause your draft to be rejected. Tigraan^{Click here for my talk page ("private" contact)} 16:34, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

On the page of protected titles. Why is the first entry "Category:Motherfuckers"?

The first entry is Category:Motherfuckers. most other entries make sense, as they are basic functions or pages that would be created often, but this isn't the case for this entry, did something happen? AccountantOfGrillers (talk) 00:29, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

My guess is WP:BLP concerns. —Jéské Couriano v^_^v ^{a little blue Bori} 00:40, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

@AccountantOfGrillers: From that title's page log, it has been protected against re-creation since 2007 for being an attack page. If you need more details than that, you will need to contact one of the administrators who were involved. Having said that, it's more than a bit odd that the first edit you made with this account is about an obscure category page that has been protected against re-creation for almost 15 years for being an attack page. If you created a new account just to ask about this one particular page, it would probably be wise to just move on to something else before someone tries to figure out why this is of interest to you. -- Marchjuly (talk) 00:46, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Why is it the first entry? Protected titles are listed in the order they were protected. Simply, it probably struck someone as a good and obvious place to start. There are plenty of other inappropriate titles further down in the list. -- zzuuzz ^(talk) 00:56, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Relationship limits

1. Is there a policy for mentee-mentor relationship on Wikipedia? Or a list of what a mentor is not supposed to do?
2. What does a third person do, if a mentor appears to be abusing their role and harassing a third person in order to protect their protege?

--Armatura (talk) 00:41, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Hi Armatura. All editors are expected to comply with Wikipedia's behavioral policies and guidelines, and being a mentor doesn't mean one can do as they please when it comes to their mentee. Mentor–mentee relationships tend to be quite informal and are basically entered into by mutual consent. Neither party is obligated to continue their participation if they choose not to, unless perhaps one of those involved (usually the mentee) has agreed to do so under certain conditions as the result of previous discussion about their behavior. I'd image that most users wanting to be mentors do so because they want to help others and not because they want to exert some control over others. If you feel a mentor's behavior is questionable, perhaps posting a polite note on their user talk page to express your concerns might OK. It could be that there's something else going on between mentor and mentee that you're not quite aware of, and the mentor will clarify their actions. -- Marchjuly (talk) 00:55, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Title change

We want to change Founders Day Ghana Writing Contest to Founders Day Ghana Writing Contest- Decolonizing the Internet. This is because the earlier title was wrong. This year we are creating Founders Day Ghana Writing Contest as title on a meta page and we are wondering whether its possible. Kindly show as how we can go about it.Jwale2 (talk) 01:16, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

You have to ask a administrator to do article name changes. Wikipedia:Administrators is how to find one, happy editing!`~HelpingWorld~` ^(👽🛸) 03:40, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

An admin isn't necessary to perform the page moves, autoconfirmed users can move pages on Meta-Wiki. Baggaet (talk) 04:38, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Jwale2, you can use the "move" function by clicking the "More" tab to move the page to the appropriate title, see m:Help:Moving a page. Baggaet (talk) 03:53, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Hi everyone, thanks for the reply, I have successfully performed the move, Baggaet Is it possible to perform a move for the sub-pages too. Thanks Jwale2 (talk) 13:40, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

On Meta-Wiki, only admins can perform such moves. I think you should revert your move and ask an admin to move the page along with its subpages on m:WM:RFH, for the ease. --Baggaet (talk) 16:21, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

"Live edits"?

What is a live edit? SatireisUnderrated (talk) 02:43, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

@SatireisUnderrated: AFAIK live edits are those to pages that aren't deleted, although I could be wrong. weeklyd3 (message me | my contributions) 02:55, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Rules on reverting

There is a user who reverts my main space article edits, and I have collected some evidence that they reverted my edits without reading the content. I left a comment on their Talk Page regarding this issue, but they also reverted the section I created on their Talk page. I looked at their Talk Page history, and they also reverted other editors' comments on their Talk Page about edit warring, etc.

1. Is it appropriate for me to revert their revert to restore my message on their Talk Page?

2. Is there any rule against editors deleting criticism from their Talk Page?

3. Is there any rule against editors reverting others' edits without reading them? TechnophilicHippie (talk) 03:24, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

So the first question is it is appropriate because users are not allowed to revert warnings on your talk page.

2 is depends on the situation so like if a user was critisizing your article or anything then you cant, but if they are doing it for no reason then you can

3 is yes because if you that would be WP:VANDALISM. `~HelpingWorld~` ^(👽🛸) 03:44, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

The revert reason they gave was "undue weight", but there is evidence that was not the reason, because their comments later indicated that they were unfamiliar with the content that they reverted and had made incorrect assumptions about what it was about. Is this vandalism? TechnophilicHippie (talk) 04:12, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

I started to revert and got this message:

This edit seems to be restoring a comment to a user's talk page.

Policy does not prohibit users, whether registered or unregistered, from removing comments from their own talk pages, although archiving is preferred. If a user removes material from their talk page, it is normally taken to mean that the user has read and is aware of its contents. There is no need to keep them on display, and usually users should not be forced to do so. It is often best to simply let the matter rest if the issues stop. If they do not, or they recur, then any record of past warnings and discussions can be found in the page history if ever needed, and these diffs are just as good evidence of previous matters.

For a list of exceptions, see Wikipedia:User pages § Removal of comments, notices, and warnings. If you believe it is appropriate to restore this content, please click "Publish changes" or "rollback" again, and report this error.

That link says that most warnings can be removed from Talk Page after all. TechnophilicHippie (talk) 04:26, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

World's response is wrong. Users are allowed to delete almost anything from their own talk page. There are very limited exceptions, and warnings, criticism, or comments from other editors are not among them. You should not restore such material if it has been blanked. See WP:UOWN and WP:BLANKING. Meters (talk) 04:27, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

As for reverting main space edits without reading them, it's not a good idea, but that does not mean it is necessarily vandalism, as World claims. Vandalism requires an intent to harm the content. If an editor is in the middle of reverting continuous vandalism from another editor, sometimes the assumption is made that the latest edit is also vandalism, and it gets reverted without being read, even if it's a good edit. As I said, it's not a good idea, but it's a mistake and disruptive, but not vandalism. And how did you determine that the other editors was not reading the edit first? Meters (talk) 04:46, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

I left the reasons on their Talk page (which is now reverted). Basically, they left comments on the Talk page saying that two paragraphs was too long, so that's why the whole thing was deleted. However, it was only 3 sentences. They also said something else in another section of their bulk rollback was deleted entirely because it was too long. When someone else complained, they restored it and said their copy edit was the correct due weight, just two sentences. However, what I added originally was only two sentences, and what they restored after the other person complained was almost the same was what I had added originally. It was my wording, but a reference was moved to the end, and some small detail was removed. TechnophilicHippie (talk) 06:43, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

I don't see that as evidence that they didn't read it. Meters (talk) 07:45, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

The context is that they deleted many sections on the Elon Musk page and moved them to the Views of Elon Musk page, saying that the main Elon Musk page's Views section should be summary style. For summary style, important parts should be mentioned (not entirely missing) but in short form, so I was restoring some in short form. They rolled back everything under the assumption I was restoring the original long form they deleted. This is because they assumed I was undoing their change and didn't even read my edits to find out they were in short form. TechnophilicHippie (talk) 07:59, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

A question about refs

Alright, I am trying to cite a congress document because it gives the info about the observance being accepted. (Draft:National Military Appreciation Month) and the source is https://www.congress.gov/bill/106th-congress/senate-resolution/33/text I don't know what cite I should do like Web, Journal, News or Book. `~HelpingWorld~` ^(👽🛸) 04:34, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

HelpingWorld, of the four, "cite web" would be most appropriate.--Quisqualis (talk) 05:06, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

But wouldn't this be a primary source? Kpddg ^(talk) 05:13, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Hello, HelpingWorld. Yes, this is a primary source. That does not mean it cannot be used at all as a source. It needs to be evaluated by uninvolved editors, and primary sources should be used in very limited ways. And primary sources are never acceptable for establishing notability. Cullen328 (talk) 05:50, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

So, what other sources can I use to show that the month was accepted by congress because it certainly was?`~HelpingWorld~` ^(👽🛸) 06:30, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

You can search for secondary, reliable sources about this event. Kpddg ^(talk) 07:48, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Perhaps you can use Template:USBill. In this case it would be {{USBill|106|sr|33|which=y|site=y}}, resulting in S.Res. 33 (106th Cong.) at Congress.gov. Aithus (talk) 08:01, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Problem with spacing

Regarding the Sound film article, there's a huge space above both the "Transition - Asia" and the "Cinematic Turn" sections. I went to the edit page, and the spacing there appeared normal. Any suggestions? -- Pete Best Beatles (talk) 07:20, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

@Pete Best Beatles, I think I have fixed the problem in this edit. Kpddg ^(talk) 07:53, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

@Kpddg:It didn't take on the space above "Cinematic form". I tried to recreate what you did on the other one, but it didn't work for me. -- Pete Best Beatles (talk) 08:20, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Did the same one with the cinematic form one...someone had a {clear}- template put in there, probably to make the pictures more discernible. Lectonar (talk) 08:29, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Denied article

Please I wanted to ask why my article was denied because I had good evidences and proof that I am real I even added my LinkedIn profile Boluwatife Samson (talk) 07:38, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Boluwatife Samson Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. Wikipedia is not a place for people to tell the world about themselves, that is what social media is for. Wikipedia is for summarizing what independent reliable sources with significant coverage have chosen on their own to say about you, showing how you meet Wikipedia's special definition of a notable person. Please also read policy on autobiographies. 331dot (talk) 07:45, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

There is more explanation on your Talk page as to why the references do not meet Wikipedia requirements. David notMD (talk) 11:08, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

COPYRIGHT INFRINGEMENT: The Career section of User:Boluwatife Samson/sandbox is a copy of content from the Alabama, Newstime ref (access since changed to blocked by firewall or antivirus software), so expect the entire draft to be deleted soon. David notMD (talk) 11:08, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Reworked a declined article for Draft:International Professional Security Association (IPSA)

Hi,

I had written and submitted an article on IPSA (International Professional Security Association) a while ago that was rejected with feedback of seeming advertising with lack of a neutral point of view and that it needed better references.

I have now completely reworked the article based on the feedback and would like to get some feedback on it before i submit it to Wikipedia again.

Link: Draft:International Professional Security Association (IPSA) Ihsnavihs (talk) 08:08, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

It's still hopelessly promotional. From the first few paragraphs alone we have irrelevant phrases such as the following which have no place in an encyclopedia: "globally recognised membership body", "companies that resonate with the association's values and beliefs", "4500+ Individual Members from all over the globe. These members enjoy a long list of membership benefits". "celebrated its great milestone, the Golden Jubilee in 2008 with an event at the House of Lords", "a strong advocate for the welfare of security professionals and women in security throughout his career in the industry". Please read the advice you have already been given and also WP:COI. Shantavira|^{feed me} 08:33, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

• (edit conflict) @Ihsnavihs: Please give a look at WP:NORG before working any further on that draft. Promotional language is a problem that can always be fixed, but there’s no point doing the huge work of fixing it if the draft is going to be declined later. Lack of notability cannot be fixed (within Wikipedia at least).

The article still contains highly promotional language. For instance:

1. the only UK based security association established to acknowledge, support and represent the front-line security workers - "acknowledge" means nothing, "support" is vague (and not detailed in the body of the article), and there is a word for associations that "represent" workers, it’s "union".
2. IPSA's membership consists of security individuals and companies that resonate with the association's values and beliefs - as opposed to other associations that gather aliens and plants that disagree with the association’s values and beliefs?
3. IPSA is a courageous body of professional, experienced, and influential members of the security industry that are working together - similarly: as opposed to cowardly, sloppy, unexperienced and obscure members of the industry? As opposed to sabotaging one another?

Basically, that is the kind of stuff you find in a statement of purpose or other promotional materials, that aim to make people want to join, or support, or have good feelings about the association. The ideal Wikipedia article is more like a technical manual, using the clearest possible words with the least emotion attached to it. That’s not to say it should be boring, but it’s better to be boring than overly emotional. Tigraan^{Click here for my talk page ("private" contact)} 09:37, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Separate from all that, tables of peoples' names and corporations does not belong in an article, so removed, again. David notMD (talk) 11:24, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

User:Muhammad Muzammil Khan

It seems to me that this user is not editing in good faith:Muhammad_Muzammil_Khan, and most importantly, all their edits are not timely identified by bots. 2001:9E8:25BC:2800:6E06:D1F7:6F60:F4C0 (talk) 10:23, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Thanks, IP user. I have warned that new editor and will watch out for their future contributions. Mike Turnbull (talk) 11:02, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Draft help

Hello all, would love some help regarding Draft:Daniel Edelson From some reason the draft is declined again although I have sourced it out and added many cites. As can be seen, there are links to his own work and links about him from and in realible sources. To map it out, here are a few on him which most are in Hebrew:

• https://simania.co.il/bookdetails.php?item_id=997753 - biggest books site
• https://b.walla.co.il/item/1868975 - big news magazin site
• https://b.walla.co.il/item/2539721 - another one
• https://www.ke.hku.hk/spotlight/technology-transfer-office/all/page - on what he developed
• https://www.stmus.com/prod/product_info.php?cPath=2&products_id=8646 - his book
• https://www.ybook.co.il/book/7758/%D7%91%D7%99%D7%AA-%D7%94%D7%AA%D7%94-%D7%A2%D7%9C-%D7%A4%D7%A1-%D7%94%D7%9E%D7%95%D7%95%D7%AA - another on his book
• https://timeout.co.il/%D7%A2%D7%AA%D7%99%D7%93-%D7%94%D7%AA%D7%99%D7%90%D7%98%D7%A8%D7%95%D7%9F-%D7%91%D7%AA%D7%9C-%D7%90%D7%91%D7%99%D7%91/ - very big and popular site
• https://www.tel-aviv.gov.il/Pages/MainItemPage.aspx?WebID=3af57d92-807c-43c5-8d5f-6fd455eb2776&ListID=81e17809-311d-4bba-9bf1-2363bb9debcd&ItemID=1371&utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_content=theater&fbclid=IwAR1e6tywnG3eRHbD4KRlpTTxHKFOAunJyQhOK9VZzX0Wf2GLVsO17adTuSg - the tel aviv municipality site

How come it gets declined? is it because privious draft? I created a new one and fixed all asked.

Thank! Polysaccharides (talk) 10:56, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Polysaccharides, I clicked on the first item in your list of links above. It appears to be a retailer's sales page for the man's novel. "Biggest books site", you say; but (i) I doubt that it's as big as Amazon, and (ii) that doesn't matter, because a sales page on Amazon is unusable too. Perhaps I'm lazy, but I'm not going to slog through all the other links. What would you say are the three best sources about Edelson? -- Hoary (talk) 11:43, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

And please remember, Polysaccharides, when you reply to Hoary's question, that your answer must not contain anything said, written, published, or commissioned by Edelson, his publisher, his agents, or those who sell his work. Wikipedia is not interested in what the subject of an article says or wants to say about themselves, or what their associates say about them. Wikipedia is only interested in what people who have no connection with the subject, and who have not been prompted or fed information on behalf of the subject, have chosen to publish about the subject in reliable sources. ColinFine (talk) 13:54, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

draft not getting published

Hello,

There is a omax token draft and there are so many references and other key aspects and also its been trensing on google search engine but still its not getting published.

Could anyone please help.

here is the link Draft:OMAX TOKEN OMAXCHAIN (talk) 12:37, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

OMAXCHAIN Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. Have you read the advice left by reviewers? Editing about cryptocurrencies has special rules due to being a topic area with significant disruption. I posted information about this on your user talk page. If you are associated with the topic, please read WP:COI and WP:PAID. 331dot (talk) 12:42, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

"celebrity endorsements from celebrities": as opposed to celebrity endorsements from who, I wonder. Which celebs, OMAXCHAIN, and what evidence can you present for their endorsements? Don't your use of "whopping" and "massive" suggest some commentary? Also, I notice a certain resemblance between "OMAX TOKEN" and your username: any comment on that? - Hoary (talk) 12:47, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Assisting A Volunteer To Recover Wikipedia Account

The Nana Darkoaa has had issue in accessing her wikipedia account in other to get her editing, we have tried password recovery and sign in's but she is not able to access her account. She is not blocked. A quick help on this would be great. Thanks Jwale2 (talk) 13:48, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Hello, Jwale2. As far as I can tell there has never been a user called User:Nana Darkoaa, or an article called Nana Darkoaa . Is she perhaps looking for User:Nana Darkwa? (I'm only guessing: that user has no user page, so the link appears in red, but they made one edit in 2015). ColinFine (talk) 14:02, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Also, if there is no e-mail backup, and you have forgotten the password, then you unfortunately cannot recover the account. Kpddg ^(talk) 15:34, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Managing Conflict of Interest

Hello!

I am a journalist who covers the music scene for a few of the larger publications. I decided to write an article about one of the bands I have covered in the past. It's not original research, just news reporting. I wasn't asked or paid to write the Wikipedia article, nor am I part of the band's management or PR team, I just wanted to write about the band. Some of the sources are my own writing, I am also listed as a source on others band's articles (not ones I wrote, just cited as a source) because the publications I work for are considered "reliable sources" since everything is vetted for accuracy by my editor. Like I said, I wasn't asked or paid by the band, I have just covered them. I don't have any kind of relationship with them. Is this a conflict of interest? And, if so, what is the appropriate way to declare it? CorinneWestbrook (talk) 15:57, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Hello, CorinneWestbrook. From what you describe, it is not a conflict of interest for you to write about the band, but it is a conflict of interest for you to cite your own works. This doesn't mean you cannot do it, but you need to be circumspect.

If you put a statement like the one above on your user page, that should be adequate as a declaration.

If you wanted to edit existing articles about bands, citing your own publications, I would advise you to make edit requests on the articles' talk pages - see the link for the details. If you want to create a new article, then you should use the articles for creation process (which is recommended for newer Wikipedia editors anyway. and cite other independent publications as well as your own, and (especially if those publications disagree with your own conclusions), do your best to treat them all evenly. (If you cannot find any other independent publications about the band, they probably do not meet Wikipedia's criteria for notability anyway). --ColinFine (talk) 16:08, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

CorinneWestbrook It is OK to add a limited number of cites to your work directly, per guidance at WP:SELFCITE but if a draft is going to be based mainly on such sources to the exclusion of others (e.g. because there are few others) then Colin's advice is very relevant. Mike Turnbull (talk) 16:48, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Thank you both so much!! I appreciate that. I had quite a number of sources, and the article was accepted and has been published, but it has the COI flag on it right now. I will add my statement to my profile. I generally don't make edits based on articles I write, this was just my first page so a couple (out of 30 or so) sources were mine. Do I leave the COI flag or does that get removed? CorinneWestbrook (talk) 16:54, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Courtesy link: Ludovico Technique (band). 199.208.172.35 (talk) 16:59, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Looking for an editor familiar with non-free use image policy

I'd like to grab a still frame from a copyrighted video to illustrate an article. I believe there's probably a good non free use reason to make it OK. But I could use some help from someone who knows how all that works. Thanks! NewsAndEventsGuy (talk) 16:33, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

@NewsAndEventsGuy: Welcome, and thanks for asking about the copyright use. I suggest you ask at WP:MCQ, which is where editors familiar with copyright and non-free usage answer questions like this. RudolfRed (talk) 16:38, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

(edit conflict) NewsAndEventsGuy Welcome to the Teahouse. The guidance at WP:NONFREE is, I agree somewhat arcane but it is very necessary. As a starting point, what is the article in question and what is the video? If it is for a draft article, forget about doing anything until it gets accepted. Mike Turnbull (talk) 16:40, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Thanks, RudolfRed! I did not know about that resource. And thanks, Michael, I'll include a ping when I post at the place R suggested. Thank both of you for serving the TeaHouse! NewsAndEventsGuy (talk) 16:43, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Citing Out-of-Print Publications?

I am working on an article about a living person. Most of my attempts to publish have been rejected, due to a lack of "reliable sources, independently of them,...published material of substantial length about them." I have since uncovered articles in publications where my subject is mentioned, or is featured, but there is no "online" access, they are photocopies of articles. How can I cite these to Wikipedia standards? Thanks, Terra H. Terre Hominum (talk) 17:41, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Hello @Terre Hominum and welcome to the Teahouse. For an offline newspaper article, the best choice would likely be {{Cite news}} - click on the link to see what parameters it uses. Basically we'd want the name of the paper, article title, publication date, and anything else you can fit into one of the parameter fields, so a reviewer can easily go search for the article in various archives. You can see a list of many other citation templates at Help:Citation Style 1#General use. 199.208.172.35 (talk) 17:49, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

@Terre Hominum To quote WP:SOURCEACCESS Do not reject reliable sources just because they are difficult or costly to access. It is completely acceptable to use offline, out of print or otherwise difficult to access sources in articles. 192.76.8.94 (talk) 17:58, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

I was coming here to ask the exact same thing as @Terre Hominum! I have photocopies of articles written from Out of Print publications. I am brand new to Wikipedia, so my related question is this: Is it enough to cite the above information that I do have (Name of the paper, article title, publication date, etc.) without risk of page deletion, or is there some way to create a gallery of the relevant photocopies that makes access to their existence easier? JustTheFacts815 (talk) 18:05, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

@JustTheFacts815, you'd immediately run into copyright issues if you tried to upload scans of the articles. Citing them is enough - reviewers have many different ways to access newspaper archives (and not just reviewers, regular editors can get access to a lot of good stuff too, through, for example, WP:RX). 199.208.172.35 (talk) 18:11, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Very helpful, thank you! I did not even consider the issue of copyright for this. JustTheFacts815 (talk) 18:23, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Possibly wrong info with unusable source

Hello,

So the page for Kamehameha Highway on Oahu lists a distance that cannot be verified as the source is a Google map that is not of the complete route.

That information is in the big important info box at the very beginning

What gets done when that happens? Stormplatter (talk) 18:32, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Stormplatter Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. If the Google Map is accurately cited, but in error, you will need to contact Google to report the error and get them to issue a correction. If you have a different reliable source with the correct information, you may offer it on the article talk page. 331dot (talk) 19:01, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

(moved from my talk) Hi 331dot,

In the question about Highway 99 on Oahu, the problem isn't with Google Maps. The problem is that the map the user linked to was of the wrong thing.

I am not sure how to add this to our discussion without messing the posts there up, so I contacted you instead.

Thanks for your answer before. Stormplatter (talk) 19:17, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Stormplatter Okay, I misunderstood your question. If the map is the wrong map, please point this out on the article talk page, an editor there my replace it with the correct map or otherwise fix it

To respond, just edit this existing section of this page, placing your comment below. There may be an "edit" link in the header to facilitate this(depends). 331dot (talk) 20:37, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Capitalizing qualifiers

I was curious if anyone was aware of a specific policy or guideline that explicitly discusses the capitalization of qualifiers. When looking at the title Atom (Web standard), should "Web" be capitalized? TipsyElephant (talk) 19:07, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

@TipsyElephant, I knew the rule had to be written down somewhere - here it is, Wikipedia:Disambiguation#Format. 199.208.172.35 (talk) 19:16, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

As for whether "web" is a proper noun in this case or not... there seems to be a great deal of debate on the subject. Usage has generally shifted from "yes" to "no" (web page, not Web page, for example), but I can't find anything in the MOS about it. 199.208.172.35 (talk) 19:30, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Benefits of joining?

Hi. I just made an edit and seen notices about getting an account. It says that will hide my IP address but I'm not really bothered about that. Is it definitely free to join and what are the main benefits? Also, are there any constraints? I just followed a link here so hope I'm in right place and filled this in right. 79.73.27.91 (talk) 20:34, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Registering and maintaining an account is indeed free. Registered accounts can, given enough time and activity, get the autoconfirmed and extended confirmed userrights, which allow them to edit thru some forms of protection. —Jéské Couriano v^_^v ^{a little blue Bori} 20:40, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Hello,

I can tell you that it is definitely free to join Wikipedia- in fact, you don't even have to use an e-mail to join. You are in the right place. As for constraints, I don't think there are too many. If you create an account and edit it often you can edit semi-protected pages, which is something you cannot do not signed in and without many edits. Having an account means that someday you can become a Wikipedia administrator. All in all, if you only do one or two edits and you do not care about your IP address being shown then I would say that it is perfectly okay to edit not signed in. Otherwise, I would definitely recommend creating an account. Thanks! 𝙷𝚎𝚕𝚕𝚘𝚑𝚎𝚊𝚛𝚝 (𝚃𝚊𝚕𝚔) 20:43, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Hi, Jéské and Helloheart. Hope you are both well. Thank you for your answers that give me food for thought. Much appreciated and best wishes. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.73.27.91 (talk) 20:52, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

I would add to the good comments above that if you do not provide an email address to an account, it is not possible to recover your password if you forget it. 331dot (talk) 21:03, 14 June 2022 (UTC)

Hi, 331dot. I'm surprised an email address isn't mandatory for a membership. It is at many other sites. If I decide to join, I'll bear that in mind. I'm always forgetting passwords. Thank you and best wishes. 79.73.27.91 (talk) 21:16, 14 June 2022 (UTC)