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Revision as of 00:57, 24 June 2010

Deletion Sorting
Project

This is a collection of discussions on the deletion of articles related to Sportspeople. It is one of many deletion lists coordinated by WikiProject Deletion sorting. Anyone can help maintain the list on this page.

Adding a new AfD discussion
Adding an AfD to this page does not add it to the main page at WP:AFD. Similarly, removing an AfD from this page does not remove it from the main page at WP:AFD. If you want to nominate an article for deletion, go through the process on that page before adding it to this page. To add a discussion to this page, follow these steps:
  1. Edit this page and add {{Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/PageName}} to the top of the list. Replace "PageName" with the relevant article name, i.e. the one on the existing AFD discussion. Also, indicate the title of the article in the edit summary as it is particularly helpful to add a link to the article in the edit summary. When you save the page, the discussion will automatically appear.
  2. You should also tag the AfD by adding {{subst:delsort|Sportspeople|~~~~}} to it, which will inform editors that it has been listed here. You may place this tag above or below the nomination statement or at the end of the discussion thread.
There are a few scripts and tools that can make this easier.
Removing a closed AfD discussion
Closed AfD discussions are automatically removed by a bot.
Other types of discussions
You can also add and remove other discussions (prod, CfD, TfD etc.) related to Sportspeople. For the other XfD's, the process is the same as AfD (except {{Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/PageName}} is used for MFD and {{transclude xfd}} for the rest). For PRODs, adding a link with {{prodded}} will suffice.
Further information
For further information see Wikipedia's deletion policy and WP:AfD for general information about Articles for Deletion, including a list of article deletions sorted by day of nomination.


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See also: sports-related deletions, people for deletion


Sportspeople

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. T. Canens (talk) 01:22, 29 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Derby Carillo

Derby Carillo (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD • AfD statistics)
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Player is non-notable soccer player with no professional experience, and no relevant collegiate history. Fails WP:GNG, WP:ATH and WP:FOOTY/N JonBroxton (talk) 01:38, 22 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. -- Cirt (talk) 01:03, 30 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Bobby Stroupe

Bobby Stroupe (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD • AfD statistics)
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Notability is questionable, no sources Jweiss11 (talk) 22:43, 23 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was keep. No arguments for deletion aside from the nominator. (non-admin closure) Ron Ritzman (talk) 00:09, 28 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Adis Obad

Adis Obad (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD • AfD statistics)
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This guy does not meet notability criteria. No English language sources refer to him. No reliable source in any language say anything about him as a person; he is only marginally mentioned as a football player. That's why the article consists of an infobox and one sentence. Per WP:ATHLETE, this article shouldn't exist. The article is unreferenced, even though it is a biography of a living person. Curiously enough, he lives about ten metres away from me and I was shocked when I saw an article about him on Wikipedia. Surtsicna (talk) 16:59, 21 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was no consensus. Shimeru 00:21, 14 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Mohammad Fanaei

Mohammad Fanaei (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD • AfD statistics)
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This man is apparently notable for only one event - being an assistant referee for the 1994 FIFA World Cup Final. Linesmen are not typically notable unless they go on to become proper referees. Even Fanaei's other claims to notability are not that special, as there were several other linesmen at the 1992 Summer Olympics and the 1995 King Fahd Cup, and others have been named AFC Linesman of the Year. – PeeJay 14:10, 21 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

  • Well, yes he does fail ATHLETE. Because he isn't an athlete and that guideline has nothing about referees in it. Stephen Hawking fails ATHLETE but you wouldn't delete him. BigDom 08:49, 9 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Ron Ritzman (talk) 00:02, 28 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment. I would take issue with the relevance of the nominator's statement that "linesmen are not typically notable unless they go on to become proper referees", as nobody gets to be a linesman at the World Cup, let alone at the final, without being an experienced "proper referee" in a national league. Phil Bridger (talk) 22:55, 29 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    • This is not true. The English linesmen at the 2010 World Cup, Darren Cann and Mike Mullarkey, are not full-time referees in one of the English national leagues; they are linesmen. That said, I don't know about the situation of the other linesmen at the World Cup, nor can I comment on previous World Cups. Nevertheless, I have seen no evidence that Mohammad Fanaei has ever been a proper referee, either in Iran or in a FIFA match. – PeeJay 02:31, 30 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
This is from Associated Press. According to AP Fanaei is a a leading soccer referee.Farhikht (talk) 11:09, 30 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, NW (Talk) 14:29, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep: I see no reason to delete this page. The man has obviously made certain accomplishments. This is information which someone in the world may be seeking -- which I believe is the general purpose of Wikipedia. Whether or not this person has reached a specific ranking or position to allow him a Wikipedia page should not be an issue. If he does later on go on to become a referee, then this page will be made again, and the research will have to be repeated. Is Wikipedia running out of hard drive space?? Ksaraf (talk) 14:57, 12 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    • Wikipedia's purpose is to cover notable topics, not to provide information that "someone in the world may be seeking". We have specific notability criteria for sportspeople, and it seems that this fellow does not meet those criteria. Oh, and if the article does need to be recreated in the future, an admin can simply restore the page, so no-one would need to re-research the topic. – PeeJay 15:05, 12 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was delete. Lots of SPA comments duly disregarded per usual practice. T. Canens (talk) 23:55, 28 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Andrew Giallombardo

Andrew Giallombardo (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD • AfD statistics)
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Player is non-notable soccer player with no professional experience, and no relevant collegiate history. Fails WP:GNG, WP:ATH and WP:FOOTY/N JonBroxton (talk) 07:23, 21 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

  • Delete per nom. Actually, it could have even been speedied. — Luxic (talk) 14:13, 21 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football-related deletions. GiantSnowman 23:15, 21 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete - fails WP:ATHLETE and WP:GNG; was not eligible for a speedy as some degree of notability is implied. GiantSnowman 23:17, 21 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep - Comparable players have profiles, see Nikolas Besagno , Jason Cascio, teammate Oscar Moens among many others. Obviously this is a contextual point. But on another consideration all the PDL teams have pages with rosters full of red-links. Pursuant to WP:IAR we need make this better. Nothing is more frustrating to wikipedia's users than to see articles on a topic riddled with red -- if we are covering the PDL on Wikipedia, and it seems we are, the key players should have profiles. Also, Andrew played for Southampton FC which, at the time, was Championship Division in England. He is quite young, but is in the early stages of a very promising career. —Preceding unsigned comment added by MKS1923 (talk • contribs) 19:56, 22 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    • As far as I can see, Besagno has played for Real Salt Lake of the MLS and Moens has played professionally in the Dutch Eredivisie; they're not exactly comparable to Giallombardo. While that other guy, Cascio, seems to fail WP:FOOTY/N too. Anyway, red links should be use only to indicate [...] that an article should be created for the topic because it would be notable and verifiable. So, if you don't want to have rosters full of red links, simply delink the currently non-notable players (see A.C. Milan Primavera to see what I mean). — Luxic (talk) 21:38, 22 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
      • Actually (and this is completely unrelated to this AfD), but I'm begging you please DON'T delete the redlinks on the PDL squads. This is because the redlinks are used not just for article creation, but also for career-tracking when the players turn professional. There is currenly no way using other sources to follow a player's PDL career - the USL website doesn't do it, and there is no other information source which keep track of all the PDL teams a player has played for prior to turning pro. When he turns pro his article is usually created via his pro team's roster; by keeping the redlinks, we can use the "What links here" toolbox to track back and see which PDL team(s) the player has played for, and be able to put together a proper career history. It's a vital way of keeping track of this info, and why the redlinks exist in these instances. (Oh, and BTW, Jason Cascio passes WP:ATH having played for the Seattle Sounders in the USL First Division, while Giallombardo never played a senior game for Southampton) --JonBroxton (talk) 00:20, 23 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
      • There is an argument, I think, that our Athlete notability guidelines are not in line with current Wikipedia practice. PDL is the highest "amateur" level of soccer in the US and many of its athletes have profiles. Since all its teams have redlinked rosters it might improve the user experience to adapt to expectations. Maybe WP:FOOTY/N should be a little less restrictive. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.151.208.130 (talk) 19:14, 23 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
        • Except that soccer is not an amateur sport. The "highest amateur level" guideline of of WP:ATHLETE only applies where there is no professionalism in the sport, which is clearly not the case here. The guidelines at FOOTY/N are perfect, as they allow for the creation of thousands and thousands of articles on professional soccer players. Adapting them to also allow for the creation of thousands and thousands of articles on amateur soccer players would open the floodgates for anyone to create an article on anyone, which would make the WP:FOOTY project entirely unmanagable. If Giallombardo is good enough, he will turn professional at some point anyway, and will be eligible for an article then. --JonBroxton (talk) 19:53, 23 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Note: This debate has been included in the list of Sportspeople-related deletion discussions. -- • Gene93k (talk) 19:41, 23 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Keep -Andrew is promising player who has already established a quite successful career —Preceding unsigned comment added by Etochihara (talk • contribs) 20:13, 23 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The following was added to the talk page of this AfD by an IP, I move it here for completeness.... -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 20:37, 23 June 2010 (UTC): Keep - Though it may not seem newsworthy to some, being able to track PDL players is extremely beneficial to those of us that keep track of the United States National Teams from the youth level moving forward. There is no harm from a player of Giallombardo's caliber (Southampton, US National Team U17 Captain) having a wikipedia page, as I believe the original guidelines were probably meant to keep out "frivilous" players. Though he may not be Landon Donovan, his name is recognizable within American soccer circles.[reply]
  • Delete - never played professionally. Personally I think the last thing we need to do is to make our notability guidelines for sportspeople less restrictive, a lot of editors think they're already far far too lax as it is...... -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 20:37, 23 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete - fails WP:ATH and WP:FOOTY/N since he has no professional experience. Whether he is promising is irrelevant to the question. The last thing we need is to relax the guidelines - there are already far too many articles on footballers. While some may regard Giallombardo as a high caliber player, the Wikipedia standard is whether he has played a professional game: if he has, he is deemed good enough to be included; if he has not, he is not good enough YET and he should not have a page to himself YET. While some may want to track Giallombardo's career, Wikipedia is not the medium for it. Craddocktm (talk) 11:34, 24 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Strong Keep - per WP:GNG. The subject received "significant coverage" from two reliable sourced international newswires that are "independent" of soccer associations or websites. Additionally, there are enough secondary sources to indicate no original research is needed as per WP:GNG to "extract the content". The coverage as WP:GNG is significant because he was mentioned by name in the articles' titles and filled the reports. ----moreno oso (talk) 12:50, 24 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I don't know about WP:OTHERSTUFF. This one meets WP:GNG. ----moreno oso (talk) 20:09, 24 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Actually, WP:GNG also says that significant coverage in reliable sources establishes a presumption, not a guarantee, that a subject is suitable for inclusion. Editors may reach a consensus that although a topic meets this criterion, it is not appropriate for a stand-alone article. — Luxic (talk) 07:50, 25 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep - It meets WP:GNG and seems that the argument for deletion is premised on some default of deleting any American soccer player not in MLS. That is a false standard. Even if we don't elect to write articles for all "the thousands of other amateur players" as Moreno Oso pointed out, that is WP:OTHERSTUFF and the absence of articles for every amateur player does not mean this one should likewise be deleted. It looks fairly substantial at this point. The presumption is established, and personally I have to disagree with a strict deletionist perspective here. We can't include everyone, but we can include an unlimited number of notable persons. Treko (talk) 14:26, 25 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Don't see how you can call WP:ATH and WP:FOOTY/N "false standard", when these guidelines are generally accepted by the Wikipedia community. If they are false standard, one may similarly call WP:GNG "false standard". At any rate, if one frames the argument as "since there is no articles on other amateur players, so we should not have an article on Giallombardo", that would necessarily be WP:OTHERSTUFF; however, that is to focus on a side argument and ignore the main one, which is: WP:ATH and WP:FOOTY/N establish that only professional players are deemed notable and Giallombardo has not played a professional game. That is NOT WP:OTHERSTUFF.
I don't think it would be a balanced argument to ignore WP:GNG or WP:ATH or WP:FOOTY/N since they are all relevant to the argument. To be fair, all the relevant guidelines should be read together. My interpretation of the guidelines is this: if reliable third party sources can be found on a certain subject, there is a presumption that that subject is notable. However, presumptions can be rebutted by certain facts. In footballer articles, the presumption may be rebutted by the failure to have achieved professional status. Whether the rebuttal will be successful depends on the strength of the presumption: the more reliable sources you can cite, the stronger the presumption. The failure to achieve professional status would rebut a weak presumption but not a strong one. In the case of Giallombardo, only 2 reliable sources offer significant coverage. The presumption tends to be weak and is easily rebutted by the failure to achieve professional status.Craddocktm (talk) 18:17, 25 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Keep"---I strongly reccomend this article should be kept as it has value and merit. Andrew is a strong player with a bright future. I have followed his career since his time in residency and I see his potential. This player was signed to a professional with Southampton FC. In addition the Dayton Dutch Lions are thought to be promoted to USL next season. Furthermore, numerous players who were in residency in Bradenton, who play for comparable clubs in other countries and the US, have their own wikipedia pages. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.73.172.212 (talk) 11:24, 25 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was delete. Wizardman Operation Big Bear 04:46, 4 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Neil Wagner

Neil Wagner (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD • AfD statistics)
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Appears to fail WP:ATH guidance. Fæ (talk) 07:00, 21 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was Delete Sarah 03:03, 2 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Robert Stambolziev

AfDs for this article:
Robert Stambolziev (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD • AfD statistics)
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Has not played in profesional league, not notable. Contested PROD. First AfD was never transcluded or even referenced on the article page.   — Jeff G. ツ 14:44, 20 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Ron Ritzman (talk) 00:04, 27 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Well, WP:GNG states that significant coverage in reliable sources establishes a presumption, not a guarantee, that a subject is suitable for inclusion. Editors may reach a consensus that although a topic meets this criterion, it is not appropriate for a stand-alone article. As far as I know, consensus is to follow WP:ATHLETE and WP:FOOTY/N, when it comes to footballers. So, unless it's proved he's notable for something else other than his football career, I can't see why he should be on Wiki. — Luxic (talk) 18:30, 28 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Actually ATHLETE and FOOTY state A person who fails to meet these additional criteria may still be notable under Wikipedia:Notability, so they do not trump GNG. Nobody disputes that Stambolziev fails these dubious criteria but I contend that he passes GNG, specifically by recieving significant coverage in third-party, reliable secondary souces. In the sources supplied he certainly gets "more than a trivial mention" though he "need not be the main topic of the source material" in any event. Eliteimp (talk) 18:59, 28 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Luxic certainly provides a novel interpretation of the policy, but I remain convinced that if WP:GNG is met then the article is notable and should remain. Contributions here which evince a preference for WP:ATHLETE, while doing nothing to dispute or even address the claim to WP:GNG don't carry much weight in my eyes. I'm sure the closing admin will note that no-one here has credibly challenged the WP:RSs or the claim to WP:GNG when they hand down their judgement. Eliteimp (talk) 15:53, 29 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • I've been on this site for years and as far as I recall, footballers failing WP:FOOTY/N have always been deleted, regardless of any significant coverage of their youth/amateur careers. So, rather than a novel interpretation of mine, I'd call it consesus (which, of course, you may not agree with). — Luxic (talk) 16:45, 29 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete per the lack of significant coverage in reliable sources. Of the sources listed in the article, I looked at a few, and all were either passing mentions or broken links. In this Google News Archive search, I was unable to find significant coverage that discussed Stambolziev's life. I consider this article from the BBC, though about Stambolziev, to be insufficient to establish notability because it lacks depth. If Eliteimp can provide links to two reliable sources that provide significant coverage about Stambolziev (and more depth than the BBC article I mentioned above), I will reconsider my position. Cunard (talk) 06:21, 28 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment In these discussions there is a tendency to override WP:GNG by pretending any and every source supplied is "trivial". In addition to the those in the article, I found [4] and [5] within a couple of minutes. I don't understand your request for coverage discussing Stambolziev's life in depth - surely the notability attaches to his career as a footballer? As far as I can see there are numerous reliable third-party sources which are wholly and/or explicitly to do with that. Eliteimp (talk) 17:21, 28 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Those sources are not enough to cause me to change to keep in that they contain little information about his life and seem to be news reports that contain little depth (for example, little of this article contains little secondary information about Stambolziev himself — I count three sentences about him and the rest of the article being composed of excerpts from an interview). However, these sources are enough to cause me to strike my delete vote and switch to neutral. Cunard (talk) 05:38, 29 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete. In my view, Luxic is absolutely right. We have to remember that both WP:ATH and WP:GNG are guidelines that give rise to presumptions, not guarantees of notability. With that in mind, neither "trumps" the other. This person clearly fails WP:ATH, which is the community's most generous inclusion criterion. On the other hand, his case on GNG is marginal at best - the sources appear provide isolated sports news coverage of events in his career rather than in depth biographical material. So in my view any presumption caused by the subject meeting the GNG - which is weak - is outweighed by his clear failure to meet the objective criteria of WP:ATH. Only with this approach can we mitigate the randomness and unpredictability of the GNG with sensible objective standards of notability. At the end of the day, notability is about being "worthy of note", and it is only in special cases that a non-professional footballer in England is likely to be worthy of note.--Mkativerata (talk) 06:17, 29 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete per nom and Mkativerata. Orderinchaos 10:12, 29 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was delete. -- Cirt (talk) 00:59, 30 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Freddie Weinke

Freddie Weinke (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD • AfD statistics)
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Questionable notability, article was created by User:Fjwinks, who is likely the subject of this article. Jweiss11 (talk) 07:00, 23 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. -- Cirt (talk) 01:00, 30 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Chris Hawkins (coach)

Chris Hawkins (coach) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD • AfD statistics)
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Don't think Chris Hawkins (coach) meets notability guidelines. He's a high school coach and media coverage on him seems to be only local. Coaching one player who later made it to the NFL, Charlie Frye, isn't enough to establish notability alone. Jweiss11 (talk) 03:06, 23 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. NW (Talk) 14:34, 5 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Shannon Dawson

Shannon Dawson (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD • AfD statistics)
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Not sure if Shannon Dawson meets notability requirements. Also, the article as it stands is in very bad shape. It is poorly formatted, not properly categorized, lacks any citations, and much of its content seems to have been copied and pasted from http://sfajacks.cstv.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/dawson_shannon00.html or similar web page. Jweiss11 (talk) 02:40, 23 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Shimeru 08:02, 26 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Manfred Hamilton

Manfred Hamilton (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD • AfD statistics)
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Wikipedia is not a memorial site, but that's what this article feels like, even after continued cleanup. The subject's claim to fame is winning a "Mr. Universe" title in the over 60 category in 2004. However, it does not appear to be a notable competition, as neither WFF Universe nor GMV Bodybuilding has an article. The only source that corroborates the title is the sponsor's website. Not even the illustrations can be relied upon, as they're created by a member of the subject's family. Finally, speaking of member of the subject's family, Jizzom (talk · contribs) (note: user is requesting a username change to grumet_kaz (talk · contribs)) admitted to being the subject's son, so there is a severe conflict of interest on the part of the main contributor. —C.Fred (talk) 02:55, 19 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]


Im not sure If I'm allowed to write here? Im new to this, But I just trying to stop This article is being considered for deletion in accordance with Wikipedia's deletion policy. I would just like to leave the artical as is, I know how you feel that its not a Memorial Page But I've tried to make it less, with just Infomation. And will leave as is(I have contacted NABBA/WFF) Friends of Manie and are wating on their site to update with list of all tittles untill then I would love to just leave as is. And keep Manfred Hamilton. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jizzom (talk • contribs) 03:37, 19 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. -- Cirt (talk) 03:53, 25 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Stefan Payne

Stefan Payne (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD • AfD statistics)
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Article on young footballer who has not played at a fully professional level as required by WP:ATHLETE. Originally PROD'ed by myself on these grounds, disputed by creator who said the following: "Payne has played numerous reserve team games for Fulham; I know that he is certainly Football League standard and would be surprised not to see him playing for Gillingham next season. No, he hasn't had a proffessional game quite yet, but I am sure he is to very soon too. Also, he was part of a Premier League team. Even if it was only at reserve level, it's still the best league in the world. As soon as his signing for Gillingham was officially announced, an IP came and added it to the page, this shows that there is interest in this player's WP article. If there are any more concerns I would be happy to answer them. Thanks". Thus I bring it here. As an aside, it's refreshing to see a PROD being removed and an explanation actually being given as to the reasoning behind it for once......... ChrisTheDude (talk) 11:47, 18 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Comment - It's also nice to see someone take the effort to explain why the PROD tag was removed, rather than it just being removed without comment. DitzyNizzy (aka Jess)|(talk to me)|(What I've done) 15:48, 18 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was delete. –MuZemike 00:10, 26 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Zsolt Pölöskei

AfDs for this article:
Zsolt Pölöskei (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD • AfD statistics)
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WP:HOAX, also fails WP:GNG and WP:ATHLETE. Specifically: the two articles listed are almost identical copies of each other. Both make claims for notability (appearances for MTK Hungaria and membership of the Hungary national football team which are not supported by sources: here is the FIFA report for the Hungary match the two players supposedly played in. There's no suggestion on the website of MTK Hungaria that either player has appeared in the first team. And finally, on the day they both supposedly played for Liverpool reserves against Crewe reserves, Liverpool were playing Manchester City. Page created by serial page creator. Pretty Green (talk) 08:43, 18 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I am also nominating the following related page, which is essentially a copy of the first and contains the same false information.:

Krisztián Adorján (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) --Pretty Green (talk) 08:51, 18 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete both. Pölöskei played youth level for Hungary and only reserve football for LFC, but that is all - does not seem to have appeared for first team at MTK Hungaria. Not sure if Adorján has ever played serious football for anybody. Youth representation does not confer notability and reserve football certainly doesn't. --ClubOranjeT 10:16, 18 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete both - not hoaxes, but certainly not notable - both fail WP:ATHLETE and WP:GNG. GiantSnowman 18:47, 18 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I should point out that I mention WP:HOAX under the context of it's first sentence: A hoax is an attempt to trick an audience into believing that something false is real. This article, by claiming the players have appeared for MTK and have been in the Hungary national team, is doing such. --Pretty Green (talk) 10:35, 21 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was delete. -- Cirt (talk) 03:51, 25 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Anastasia Gavrylovych

Anastasia Gavrylovych (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD • AfD statistics)
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fails WP:ATHLETE, has not competed at the top amateur level which would be World Figure Skating Championships. LibStar (talk) 01:08, 18 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. –MuZemike 00:41, 25 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Keisuke Fujiwara

Keisuke Fujiwara (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD • AfD statistics)
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Fails WP:MMANOT Paralympiakos (talk) 11:31, 16 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

He's fought in DREAM which is notable--KEWLONION (talk) 18:40, 18 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

One fight does not make you notable. Papaursa (talk) 00:14 ta19 June 2010 (UTC)

Alright, but I want to know if I can bring up the issue about DEEP and ZST being notable somewhere, can someone help me where to debate that --KEWLONION (talk) 18:41, 19 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The place to bring this up is Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Mixed martial arts. The goal there is to find consensus about what constitutes a "notable" MMA organization (besides UFC). Papaursa (talk) 01:01, 22 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was keep. The rough consensus indicates that the general notability guideline has been met, the main reasons given for retention. –MuZemike 00:07, 25 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Jameson Taillon

Jameson Taillon (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD • AfD statistics)
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Fails WP:ATHLETE This article was WP:PRODed but its creator removed the PROD. Fails both criteria of WP:ATHLETE as:

  1. The subject "has not competed at the fully professional level of a sport, or a competition of equivalent standing in a non-league sport such as swimming, golf or tennis, except for those that participated only in competitions that are themselves non-notable."
  2. The subject "has not competed at the highest amateur level of a sport, usually considered to mean the Olympic Games or World Championships.

While the subject may have received reliable sourced press, that does not make him notable per the higher standards of WP:ATHLETE." --moreno oso (talk) 03:58, 17 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Strong Keep: The PROD was removed because it was not applicable. I concede that the subject appears to fail WP:ATHLETE, but that is NOT sufficient reason for deletion. WP:ATHLETE does not supersede WP:GNG. If you look earlier in WP:ATHELTE, you will see the following: "Failure to meet these criteria is not conclusive proof that a subject should not be included; conversely, meeting one or more does not guarantee that a subject should be included." Given that, no justification at all has been presented for deletion. The subject passes WP:GNG due to the significant coverage he received from the likes of MLB, ESPN, and Baseball Prospectus. Mickeyg13 (talk) 04:08, 17 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Per WP:WAX, the deletion of Machado's article is not sufficient justification to delete this one. Also, not playing professionally is not enough justification. The issue to debate is NOT whether Taillon meets WP:ATHLETE (we agree he does not), but whether he satisfies WP:GNG. We contend that the significant, nontrivial, verifiable coverage he has received from independent, national sources (MLB, ESPN, Baseball Prospectus, Baseball America, etc.) satisfy this criterion. For what it's worth I disagree with the decision to delete Machado's article for these same reasons, but that is not relevant here. Mickeyg13 (talk) 16:44, 17 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
That's not an argument. Yes we all know that he is not yet a professional athlete. Nonetheless he has received significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject, so by WP:GNG he qualifies for an article. Specifically:
  • "Significant Coverage": He received pre-draft coverage in the following links referenced on his page: [8], [9], [10], [11], [12], and [13]. Post-draft he received the following coverage: [14], [15], [16], and [17].
  • "Reliable sources": ESPN, MLB, Baseball America, and Baseball Prospectus are among the most reliable sources available for baseball content. If they don't count as reliable sources for baseball then I have no idea what does and would love to be educated about it. I think the other links also count (Fangraphs is very well-respected in sabermetric circles for instance), but I'm more certain about ESPN, MLB, BA, and BP.
  • Independent of the subject": The aforementioned sources have no affiliation with Taillon aside from covering baseball. I'd disagree but be willing to listen to an argument discounting the sources from local newspapers or the the team that drafted him, but ESPN, MLB, Baseball America, and Baseball Prospectus are certainly independent.
So which of the above points do you disagree with? Or do you agree that he satisfies all the criteria for WP:GNG? If he does satisfy WP:GNG, why does he not warrant a page? Mickeyg13 (talk) 23:02, 19 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was delete. T. Canens (talk) 02:44, 30 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Eric Frimpong

Eric Frimpong (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD • AfD statistics)
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Only played in amateur football, was drafted without ever playing. As for the criminal case, it is rather an argument against having the article (per WP:BLP) than for having it. Geschichte (talk) 21:19, 16 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete: as for his football/soccer career, he clearly fails WP:ATHLETE and WP:FOOTY/N; as for the rape conviction, he seems to fail WP:NTEMP as well. — Luxic (talk) 12:41, 24 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was delete. Spartaz Humbug! 17:20, 24 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Bren Powers

Bren Powers (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD • AfD statistics)
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Non notable athlete. Has yet to compete in the highest levels of strongman competition. Millbrooky (talk) 19:05, 16 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

  • Delete. I contested speedy deletion of this article as it contains a minimal claim of importance, with a reference to a local newspaper, but I can't find any evidence that the subject passes either WP:ATHLETE or the general notability guideline. Phil Bridger (talk) 19:19, 16 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete I tagged it for SD (this reminds me of 'Who killed Cock Robin'...) as I didn't feel the standard of competition and the success therein reached was high enough under WP:ATHLETE - and I wasn't too happy about the sponsor link. I've explained my position at reasonable length to the creator after he contacted me, but nothing seems to have happened. There seems to be potential in the subject - but potential is future stuff. If he gets to the finals of the UK Strongman, there might well be a strong case. I wish him well in the next qualifiers, anyway. (Got to - he's bigger than me.....) Peridon (talk) 21:11, 16 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • I'm going to say userfy on this one, as the creator seems to be a well-intentioned new editor who's picked up on a toppic that isn't quite notable enough but may be in the near future (incidentally, to keep up the Cock Robin analogy, I'm the one who moved the article to the correct capitalisation...). Alzarian16 (talk) 22:37, 16 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I won't disagree with that suggestion. Peridon (talk) 16:09, 17 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, but that's one of the things Wikipedia is NOT for. For promoting someone, try LinkedIn and aboutus and so on. We're for recording stuff, not for making it happen. Good luck, anyway. Peridon (talk) 20:10, 21 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
That's certainly true, but on the other hand if the guy's been covered in local papers lots of times then he mightbe notable under WP:GNG or WP:ANYBIO. Perhaps Peter could scan some of the offline articles and upload them as images so we can see if they qualify as significant coverage in reliable sources. Alzarian16 (talk) 16:28, 22 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was delete. T. Canens (talk) 02:42, 30 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Marsel Efroimski

Marsel Efroimski (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD • AfD statistics)
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not sure if WP:ATHLETE applies to chess players but simply being an under 14 world champion should not mean notability. does not extensive coverage [18]. LibStar (talk) 07:20, 16 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. -- Cirt (talk) 00:57, 30 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Aston Taminsyah

Aston Taminsyah (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD • AfD statistics)
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not sure if WP:ATHLETE applies to chess. not simply being an under 7 world champion should not guarantee you notability. fails the greater WP:BIO with no extensive recognition [19]. LibStar (talk) 06:58, 16 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was Keep ---Balloonman NO! I'm Spartacus! 02:48, 25 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Fabiano Scherner

Fabiano Scherner (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD • AfD statistics)
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Does not cite any reliable sources. Contested PROD.   — Jeff G. ツ 03:38, 16 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

  • Note Google turns up just over 900 results on a search for Fabiano "Pega-Leve" Scherner. Some of these sources seem to be respected within MMA circles, but I won't make any claim to kow this for sure, or claim that they defintely do stand up as reliable resources. Darigan (talk) 11:10, 16 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Some links on article talk page Darigan (talk) 11:13, 16 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Keep Subject has multiple fights in high level promotions (UFC and IFC) make him notable, IMO. The article does need a lot of cleanup, removal of "rumors" and most especially references added. --TreyGeek (talk) 13:43, 16 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Keep - not the most comfortable keep ever, but the fighter does JUST make WP:MMANOT on the organisational level. Is worth noting that the fighter has competed against a handful of really notable fighters. Paralympiakos (talk) 23:17, 16 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Just a p.s., I'm watchlisting him (can't believe I hadn't before) and will go about sourcing/cleanup once safety is confirmed (don't want a load of unneeded deleted edits). Paralympiakos (talk) 23:36, 16 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep – It's difficult to determine at what point an MMA competitor is notable since there are so many organizations, many of them at a minor level. Reminds me of boxing, with its many titles, only a few of which are really important. In this case, I believe that given his UFC appearances, the subject is notable under WP:ATHLETE. I wouldn't make that argument for fighters who've only competed in low-level promotions, but the UFC is the highest level of the sport, and multiple appearances there (including one on a main card) are enough to convince me of his notability. Giants2008 (27 and counting) 00:24, 17 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment Article has also been tagged as an unreferenced BLP. Personally, I think he's just short of notability according to a strict reading of WP:MMANOT. However, if his world championships in Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu can be sourced, then he's clearly notable. Papaursa (talk) 02:04, 17 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Weak keep. Can't take a position on whether he meets the WP:MMANOT or more general WP:ATHLETE standard, but the Google News numbers (and the sources listed therein) may be enough to meet the general notability guidelines.--PinkBull 01:57, 25 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was keep. He played at the highest level of the sport. (curling) therefore passing WP:ATHLETE NativeForeigner Talk/Contribs 00:36, 25 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Jimmy Carroll

Jimmy Carroll (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD • AfD statistics)
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Subject does not meet WP:BIO. Provided references are not establishing notability and are profiles of the person on not reliable sources. Former Speedy A7 was declined by the author. — Zhernovoi (talk) 20:02, 9 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

  • Question - What is considered the highest level of competition in hurling? I have no knowledge of hurling at all, and to me this question is very important for determining the notability of this person. If one or both of the leagues he played in were top-level and fully professional, the page would likely meet athlete notability standards. If not, I don't think sufficient notability is established by the sources, though I do note that the first is apparently to an official organization, which may not establish notability but is not necessarily unreliable. Again, my lack of knowledge of the sport precludes me from being sure in that regard. Giants2008 (27 and counting) 23:19, 9 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep - Subject has played at inter-county level of hurling in Ireland. Inter-county level is the highest level of competition in hurling, which is an amateur sport with no professional competitions. Thus, subject meets WP:Athlete Criterion 2: People who have competed at the highest amateur level of a sport usually considered to mean the Olympic Games or World Championships. - Teester (talk) 11:10, 12 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
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  • Keep - he's nationally notable by our modest provincial standards, but could we have the actual years instead of "1970s and 1980s".Red Hurley (talk) 13:42, 16 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment - I don't think every player to ever compete in inter-county hurling is inherently notable. It's paradoxical that the bar for notability should be placed so low simply because hurling is such an obscure sport and no higher levels of play exist. If this individual is or was particularly well known within the hurling community, there should be sources attesting to that fact.Minnowtaur (talk) 06:06, 18 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I understand that. The situation (and see my comments on the AFD below) is that just about everything is notable in Wikipedia:WikiProject Gaelic games that would not be notable otherwise on mainstream wikipedia. If someone were to set up a "WikiProject Irish tiddleywinks", it seems that they can then describe all the players of that amateur sport as notable. I don't know where wikipedia draws the line - does anyone?Red Hurley (talk) 08:51, 19 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was no consensus. T. Canens (talk) 23:26, 28 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Durrell Summers

Durrell Summers (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD • AfD statistics)
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College athlete, fails WP:ATHLETE. No indication of meeting either the general or athlete specific notability requirements. TexasAndroid (talk) 18:29, 7 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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  • Second relist rationale. The article is a BLP. --Ron Ritzman (talk) 00:02, 21 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete An elite-level college basketball program such as Michigan State will garner more than it's fair share of "coverage". Players on these teams will frequently be the subject of "feature" articles for no other reason than their presence on the team. That does not guarantee that the player is notable. There is no indication that this player has won any postseason awards or was picked for All-America status. DarkAudit (talk) 00:34, 21 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
To the contrary - their presence on the team and subsequent extensive media coverage indicates their notability and meeting of WP:GNG. -Drdisque (talk) 03:43, 22 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
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  1. ^ http://www.iranseda.ir/FullItem/?g=488629
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