User talk:Bencherlite/Archive 15

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St Nicks

Thanks for cleaning the church. It's totally new ground for me, and I'd like to get it to FA eventually, so MoS fixes are really helpful Jimfbleak - talk to me? 13:37, 6 October 2011 (UTC)

and Diolch yn fawr too Jimfbleak - talk to me? 13:41, 6 October 2011 (UTC)

My daughter is a stonemason/conservation archaeologist, and was able to lend me a couple of books, inc Pevsner, and point me towards sources, like churchplansonline, that I would never have found myself. It's been a steep learning curve! Jimfbleak - talk to me? 13:59, 6 October 2011 (UTC)

Tell me honestly

Do you think that St Llibio's Church, Llanllibio is better or worse since its GA review? Malleus Fatuorum 02:35, 11 October 2011 (UTC)

I wasn't really sure where to put St Llibio's Church, Llanllibio in the GA listing, so please feel to move it to wherever you think might be more appropriate. Malleus Fatuorum 02:48, 11 October 2011 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

		The Good Article Barnstar
		Thanks Bencherlite for helping to promote St Llibio's Church, Llanllibio to Good Article status. Please accept this little sign of appreciation and goodwill from me, because you deserve it. Keep it up, and give someone a pat on the back today. Sp33dyphil © • © 07:06, 12 October 2011 (UTC)

St Edern's Church, Bodedern

Thanks for the invitation to look at this article. Malleus grants me too great an honour; I'm no expert on churches or architecture, I've just written a lot of (mainly simple) articles on heritage sites (including of course churches and their architecture). Also my experience in getting articles to FA level is limited to two (and I'm not sure I want to go through that experience again). So I do not intend to do a formal peer review, but I will make some suggestions, based more on what I do rather than what "should" be done. Having said that, my computer is misbehaving intermittently, my external backup drive seems to be dead, and my laptop has developed a fault I cannot correct and for which I will need help. So any comments may be sporadic and spread out.

My first comment is that the article is excellent, detailed and well presented, and IMO not far from a FA in its comprehensiveness. One point is that, because of the possibility of thieves using WP as a useful source, I have been dissuaded by another user from including information about valuables owned by a church (silver, etc) in articles, and I have been deleting them from the articles I have written (something similar may apply to lead on roofs, too). This seems a pity, because it makes articles less complete, but it would be bad to learn that an article I had written had led to the theft of a priceless object.

First (trivial) comments: perhaps wikilink medieval and parish church in the first sentence. I'm not sure that Wales needs a link (you have linked it in the infobox, but not elsewhere); if it should, in the first sentence again. In the infobox you have linked Anglesey in the (small print) caption; just wonder if it would be better in the next line instead. In the infobox "status" field you have put Church; I usually put Parish church here (if appropriate), and use Church in the "architectural type" field. For updating costs I usually use "(£{{formatnum:{{Inflation|UK|4000|1788|{{CURRENTYEAR}}|r=-4}}}} as of {{CURRENTYEAR}}),{{Inflation-fn|UK}}". Not sure if this is more or less accurate, but it gives a current cost estimate immediately following the original cost rather than using a footnote. More to come, if I find any, over the weekend. --Peter I. Vardy (talk) 16:24, 13 October 2011 (UTC)

Thanks, Peter, for your kind words and swift reply (I'll reply here in case you have more to add and to avoid fragmenting discussion). I've had one editor (perhaps the same one) raise the issue of silverware with me in the past, although as she raised it in the context of a church now in private hands that had been closed for several years, I wasn't that inclined to think that there was a risk that thieves would read the article and decide to break in on the off-chance that the Church in Wales had left something valuable behind when they vacated... I'll raise it as a specific point at the peer review to see what people think.

I think "parish church" is a useful link, but "medieval" too broad a link term to add much value; I think that one link to "Anglesey" in the infobox is enough, and the first mention is as good a place as any (and avoids an overlink situation when next to "Bodedern"); linking "Anglesey" but not "Wales" in the lead probably keeps the overlink police happy too. I like your tip about the infobox fields, and will use that.

As for updating, I saw Fifelfoo (talk · contribs) get quite forceful at FAC some time ago about people using the {{inflation}} template for updating past expenses without working out first whether the measure of inflation being used was appropriate. He added the warning "This template is only capable of inflating Consumer Price Index values: staples, workers rent, small service bills (doctor's costs, train tickets). This template is incapable of inflating Capital expenses, government expenses, or the personal wealth and expenditure of the rich. Incorrect use of this template would constitute original research" to that template. He and I worked out a form of wording at Buildings of Jesus College, Oxford after it had passed FA and I re-did the inflation updating, so I tend to stick to that... in case he's checking up on me! Longer, of course, and means that the calculation requires manual updating rather than updating automatically, but hey-ho.

Any other thoughts gratefully received! Bencherlite^Talk 16:59, 13 October 2011 (UTC)

I've been involved in similar discussions over these inflation calculations with Fifelfoo, and I now very rarely use that inflation template, and always add a note to justify the basis of the calculation, as in Notes #5 and #6 here for instance. Malleus Fatuorum

I've had another, rather quick, look and have little to offer. I do not have the intensity of FA reviewers, but personally find the article excellent, well detailed, and well explained. Just a few miniscule suggestions: link pulpit; link balustrade; and make the link to the chapel at St Jesus College more specific (with a "#Chapel"). Good luck, enjoy FAC if you can; I shall follow progress with interest. --Peter I. Vardy (talk) 11:20, 16 October 2011 (UTC)

A beer for you

Thankyou for participating in my request for adminship. Now I've got lots of extra buttons to try and avoid pressing by mistake... Redrose64 (talk) 15:56, 14 October 2011 (UTC)

GA Review of St Beuno's Church, Aberffraw

I don't think I've ever had less to say at a review, just one small thing that needs attending to here. Malleus Fatuorum 23:21, 18 October 2011 (UTC)

DYK for St Edern's Church, Bodedern

The DYK project (nominate) 00:03, 21 October 2011 (UTC)

Survey for new page patrollers

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DYK for St Eugrad's Church, Llaneugrad

The DYK project (nominate) 12:03, 29 October 2011 (UTC)

DYK for St Beuno's Church, Aberffraw

The DYK project (nominate) 00:02, 30 October 2011 (UTC)

DYK for St Mary's Church, Llanfair-yng-Nghornwy

The DYK project (nominate) 12:02, 1 November 2011 (UTC)

Many thanks, but an admin's work is never done

Hi, Benchie! Excuse the too-familiar form of address, please. I'm just feeling grateful for your work on this matter, and wanted to express that. But I'm afraid there's a bit more that may need to be done: If no other admin has stepped in at AN/I by the time you see this, perhaps you'd have another look? Btw, I have an editnotice on my talk that says "please keep the conversation on the page where it began", which is my preference, but I'm not dogmatic about it either, so just as you prefer. I'll watchlist here, in any case. Thanks again!  – OhioStandard (talk) 14:13, 5 November 2011 (UTC)

Thanks!

	Thanks!
	Thanks for removing the copyvio on Chihayafuru - I was beginning to think it'd never get done. :) Malkinann (talk) 21:29, 9 November 2011 (UTC)

DYK for St Mary's Church, Llanfair-yn-y-Cwmwd

Panyd^{The muffin is not subtle} 16:01, 16 November 2011 (UTC)

Portals

Those three look like G6 candidates since they're just redlinky skeletons. I nominated the other ones because they had gone stale, but really, haven't all portals? See my RFC here on the "purpose" of the Portal space, which I think is about 110% broken. Ten Pound Hammer • ^{(What did I screw up now?)} 20:32, 16 November 2011 (UTC)

• Yeah, add to WP:CENT. Ten Pound Hammer • ^{(What did I screw up now?)} 20:45, 16 November 2011 (UTC)

Thanks

I just want to say thanks for giving my comment a round of applause :) --Madison-chan (talk) 23:28, 16 November 2011 (UTC)

Churches

Yes I agree with that, although some reviewers insist there must not be any citations in the lead. For strong statements I believe they quite rightly should be given. Old Church of St Nidan, Llanidan looks fine apart from the lead which I feel needs a haircut if you know what I mean. Will review the other article on Nidan shortly.♦ Dr. Blofeld 13:45, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

All done, good job!!♦ Dr. Blofeld 14:26, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

"Welsh saint photoshoot ", haha LOL, I love it!!! Thanks!! In an Austin Powers "work with me baby, grrrrr, you're Tony the Tiger approach". Not sure Nidan would approve of that. LOL.♦ Dr. Blofeld 14:28, 21 November 2011 (UTC)

DYK for St Edwen's Church, Llanedwen

—HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 00:03, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

		The Good Article Barnstar
		Thanks Bencherlite for helping to promote St Nidan's Church, Llanidan, Old Church of St Nidan, Llanidan and Nidan to Good Article status. Please accept this little sign of appreciation and goodwill from me, because you deserve it. Keep it up, and give some a pat on the back today. --Sp33dyphil © • © 07:43, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

No problems, please award a barnstar to a deserved editor today. --Sp33dyphil © • © 07:51, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

DYK for St Cynfarwy's Church, Llechgynfarwy

Orlady (talk) 17:01, 27 November 2011 (UTC) 02:22, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Cynfarwy

Orlady (talk) 17:01, 27 November 2011 (UTC) 02:22, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

DYK's for St Cynfarwy and church

Congratulations on two good articles and on getting the top listing for this morning's DYK. Wikiwayman (talk) 10:01, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

DYK 7-day deadline? Responding to ignorant critiques?

• You closed Girls' games and toys template due to my lack of response after 7 days. Where is that 7-day rule of thumb posted? It isn't in the rules?
• I want to point out that the criticism I failed to respond to in a timely fashion was incorrect, and I would've thought obviously incorrect. The User criticized the hook's source as not being a "journalistic" source -- it is not necessary that it be a journalistic source, and in fact, it's a report by a very well-known and reputable global business and financial analysis firm (Euromonitor International). They easily meet all the rules in WP:Identifying reliable sources; Euromonitor International reports are widely cited in newspapers, television news, etc., (quick Google News search shows many cites for their reports daily by large newspapers) and Euromonitor is considered a reliable source by libraries (Diamond, Wendy; Oppenheim, Michael R. (2004). Marketing Information: A Strategic Guide for Business and Finance Libraries. Haworth Press. p. 257. ISBN 9780789060068.); this firm exists in 80 countries and has been around for 40 years, it even has a Wikipedia article (Euromonitor International)... Business journalism often cites research published by international business analysis firms such as Gartner, Standard & Poors, and so on. They are widely considered to be reliable sources by journalists. Business research is as valid as original research in science fields. This research report wasn't a private corporation doing research on itself, this was a global research firm doing its own arm's-length analysis of a business topic. OttawaAC (talk) 23:16, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

And yet the nominator is expected to check back every day for more than a month to address any random criticisms that might be posted at any time over the course of several weeks with no deadlines placed on the reviewer(s). Not very efficient in my opinion. OttawaAC (talk) 23:50, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

I didn't have a "sanction" in mind; I'm sure there are numerous sound reasons why the DYK thing has been built into the process as it exists now. Can't imagine them, but anyway, I think it'd be better to (a) limit it to a couple of weeks, then let nominations "roll off" the list and expire; keeps the noms recent (b) add a "watch this page" check box to my nominations' template pages so that they show up on my watchlist and I don't have to go back to TDYK scrolling / shift>command>F check the topics every day hell. Well, everyone else's nomination templates can have "watch this page" checkboxes too. As for "Reviewers are in short supply given the history of DYK over the last few months." I have absolutely no idea what that means. OttawaAC (talk) 00:15, 29 November 2011 (UTC)

Re: Deletion of a page you imported from nost

Whoops, I imported it into the wrong namespace! Thanks for letting me know. I've imported the edit properly now. Graham87 00:24, 29 November 2011 (UTC)

DYK for St Nidan's Church, Llanidan

Orlady (talk) 20:10, 28 November 2011 (UTC) 16:02, 29 November 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Old Church of St Nidan, Llanidan

Orlady (talk) 20:10, 28 November 2011 (UTC) 16:02, 29 November 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Nidan

Orlady (talk) 20:10, 28 November 2011 (UTC) 16:02, 29 November 2011 (UTC)

St Edern's Church, Bodedern

Hi. An excellent piece of work, as always. I've just had a quick look for interest at the Peer review. Did you know there's an article on Victorian restoration? I wondered if you might want to link the relevant "restoration" to this. I guess the author will link it sooner or later, but you may want to pre-empt him/her. Good luck at FA; it should pass.

• I only have one question: "He established a church in the area in the 6th century, perhaps on a site about half a mile away ...". Half a mile away from what? The present church or the village? Good luck at FAC. Malleus Fatuorum 20:11, 29 November 2011 (UTC)

Cambridge query

Given that you are pretty knowledgeable about Oxford topics, I thought I'd come to you with this query, despite it being Cambridge based. Looking at a venn entry for a subject I came across this: "(Moral Sci. Trip., 1st Class, 1873)". Do you have any idea what that means? Any help would be appreciated, given I'm stumped! Harrias ^talk 21:43, 29 November 2011 (UTC)

My parents-in-law both went there too; I guess I should have thought to ask them! Thanks for your help, that glossary definitely looks pretty useful! Harrias ^talk 22:06, 29 November 2011 (UTC)

TFA/R

Nice response, as always for you. I suppose you know what is feeding that? TCO has taken aim at Raul's leadership. See Wikipedia talk:Wikipedia Signpost/Newsroom/Opinion desk/Vital articles debate. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 17:36, 30 November 2011 (UTC)

U Thant

Actually, the U Thant article gives both November 30, 1961 (in the infobox) and November 30, 1962 (U Thant#UN Secretary-General, 1st paragraph) as the date when he became Secretary-General (not just acting Secretary-General, which happened on November 3, 1961). Several Wikipedia articles say 11/30/61, but sources like this and almost any source that doesn't rely on Wikipedia says 11/30/62. If so, then it should say "1962 – Burmese diplomat U Thant (pictured) became United Nations Secretary-General, following the death of Dag Hammarskjöld in September 1961." Art LaPella (talk) 19:39, 30 November 2011 (UTC)

Thanks

(: --Kbdank71 02:08, 1 December 2011 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of St Cynfarwy's Church, Llechgynfarwy

The article St Cynfarwy's Church, Llechgynfarwy you nominated as a good article has been placed on hold . The article is close to meeting the good article criteria, but there are some minor changes or clarifications needed to be addressed. If these are fixed within seven days, the article will pass, otherwise it will fail. See Talk:St Cynfarwy's Church, Llechgynfarwy for things which need to be addressed. Jezhotwells (talk) 16:27, 1 December 2011 (UTC)

Raul Lambino

If I'm not mistaken, I removed the prod on this article but somehow returned and you've deleted it. The proper way is for someone to list it in AFD if they want to pursue it. –HTD 06:07, 2 December 2011 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of St Edwen's Church, Llanedwen

The article St Edwen's Church, Llanedwen you nominated as a good article has been placed on hold . The article is close to meeting the good article criteria, but there are some minor changes or clarifications needed to be addressed. If these are fixed within seven days, the article will pass, otherwise it will fail. See Talk:St Edwen's Church, Llanedwen for things which need to be addressed. Harrison49 (talk) 23:09, 2 December 2011 (UTC)

You deleted the page about Smarter Agent.

I have no problem editing that page. But you just deleted the whole thing without even notifying me. I am not a frequent WikiPedia writer, please repost it and I will edit it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.223.243.50 (talk) 23:23, 2 December 2011 (UTC)

I don't know why you think I should have notified you first before deleting Smarter Agent - a "prod" notice had been on the article for 7 days, which is notification enough. In any event, how should I have guessed where to notify you? This is only the second ever edit from this IP address you're using... And the article content is very promotional, so you'd be better off creating a better version from scratch at Articles for Creation, assuming that is that you can find reliable sources to show that this company is notable. Bencherlite^Talk 08:14, 3 December 2011 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of St Edwen's Church, Llanedwen

The article St Edwen's Church, Llanedwen you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:St Edwen's Church, Llanedwen for comments about the article. Well done! There is a backlog of articles waiting for review, why not help out and review a nominated article yourself? Harrison49 (talk) 15:31, 3 December 2011 (UTC)

The Longoford Trust

Why so pedantic? I don't think The Longford Trust will be claiming breach of copyright. Do you? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.9.171.216 (talk) 20:05, 7 December 2011 (UTC)

Church house

hello,

I am trying to translate a featured article from German Wikipedia. I am asking because, are you a good copyeditor? Would you be willing to help building an article about a Catholic church to GA status? Thanks.--♫GoP♫_T^C_N 14:06, 12 December 2011 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Wikipedia:People by year/Reports/Oldest

Hi. I'm puzzled by your closure which referred to 'Klein's rationale'. Did you really mean that? I don't think I offered any rationale. Regards. --Kleinzach 22:52, 15 December 2011 (UTC)

Fixed, thanks. Bencherlite^Talk 22:56, 15 December 2011 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard#Richard Arthur Norton: Revisiting topic ban; Should it be removed or made indefinite?

Hi Bencherlite. You participated in Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Archive228#Richard Arthur Norton copyright violations, in which a one-month topic ban on creating new articles and making page moves was imposed on Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) (talk · contribs). The closing admin has asked for community input about whether to remove the topic ban or make it indefinite at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard#Richard Arthur Norton: Revisiting topic ban; Should it be removed or made indefinite?. Cunard (talk) 08:49, 16 December 2011 (UTC)

Reviving WikiProject PipeOrgan

Hello, Bencherlite! I'm attempting to revive Wikipedia:WikiProject PipeOrgan. As you are a member of the project I hope you would like to participate in its revival if you have time. Kind regards, Danmuz (talk) 11:32, 29 December 2011 (UTC)

Featured portal question

Ironholds said that you were an expert on portals. Could you take a look at Portal:Soviet Union and give me some feedback? For instance, is it of featured portal quality? Thanks. →Στc. 02:12, 4 January 2012 (UTC)

R.W. Dromgold

Looks like we have failed to convince the creator of this article that his preferred layout is incorrect. I have take it to his talk page. – ukexpat (talk) 13:56, 12 January 2012 (UTC)

When are films British, and when are they Welsh, Scottish, English or Northern Irish?

Since another dispute has arisen over the country of origin of Hedd Wyn (film), I think it's high time we agreed on a consistent policy on what counts as a British film, and what counts as a Welsh, Scottish, English, or Northern Irish film. As someone who contributed the last time this came up, would you care to comment? Suggestions on where the broader discussion should happen are especially welcome. garik (talk) 03:42, 21 January 2012 (UTC)

Chuch house 2

hello,

could you take a look at Cathedral of the Immaculate Conception of the Holy Virgin Mary and correct if something is incorrect? You have better knowledge in churches than me (it is currently a GAN, so if you find any prose issues, correct them (the prose is poor as per the reviewer)). Thanks.--♫GoP♫_T^C_N 15:09, 22 January 2012 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for closing the WP:FPORTC for Portal:History. Much appreciated. ;) Cheers, — Cirt (talk) 01:11, 26 January 2012 (UTC)

MSU Interview

Dear Bencherlite,

My name is Jonathan Obar user:Jaobar, I'm a professor in the College of Communication Arts and Sciences at Michigan State University and a Teaching Fellow with the Wikimedia Foundation's Education Program. This semester I've been running a little experiment at MSU, a class where we teach students about becoming Wikipedia administrators. Not a lot is known about your community, and our students (who are fascinated by wiki-culture by the way!) want to learn how you do what you do, and why you do it. A while back I proposed this idea (the class) to the community HERE, were it was met mainly with positive feedback. Anyhow, I'd like my students to speak with a few administrators to get a sense of admin experiences, training, motivations, likes, dislikes, etc. We were wondering if you'd be interested in speaking with one of our students.

So a few things about the interviews:

• Interviews will last between 15 and 30 minutes.
• Interviews can be conducted over skype (preferred), IRC or email. (You choose the form of communication based upon your comfort level, time, etc.)
• All interviews will be completely anonymous, meaning that you (real name and/or pseudonym) will never be identified in any of our materials, unless you give the interviewer permission to do so.
• All interviews will be completely voluntary. You are under no obligation to say yes to an interview, and can say no and stop or leave the interview at any time.
• The entire interview process is being overseen by MSU's institutional review board (ethics review). This means that all questions have been approved by the university and all students have been trained how to conduct interviews ethically and properly.

Bottom line is that we really need your help, and would really appreciate the opportunity to speak with you. If interested, please send me an email at obar@msu.edu (to maintain anonymity) and I will add your name to my offline contact list. If you feel comfortable doing so, you can post your name HERE instead.

If you have questions or concerns at any time, feel free to email me at obar@msu.edu. I will be more than happy to speak with you.

Thanks in advance for your help. We have a lot to learn from you.

Sincerely,

Jonathan Obar --Jaobar (talk) 15:49, 8 February 2012 (UTC)

St Illtyd's Church, Llantwit Major=

Can I tempt you into helping me expand this?♦ Dr. Blofeld 14:57, 19 February 2012 (UTC)

SIPRoutes.com

I was building a writing a page for this and I followed the protocol for unpublished site while editing. What did I do wrong? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Atsig4113 (talk • contribs) 03:15, 1 March 2012 (UTC)

Criticisms of welfare

Thanks for cleaning up Talk:Criticisms of welfare for me. I didn't realize I had made such a huge mess. Sabre ball ^{t c} 16:42, 1 March 2012 (UTC)

Stainer and knighthood categories

Hi there, Bencherlite. This is a very new set of cats and sub-cats, and I expected less than total concurrence about the structure.

See the rules I've set out @ Category:Musicians awarded knighthoods. We can discuss further if you disagree. Cheers. -- Jack of Oz ^{[your turn]} 22:47, 2 March 2012 (UTC)