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Archive 1Archive 2Archive 3

Edit warring

There are two ongoing edit wars. The first is over the external links, and the second is over the tagging of the popular culture section. This is disruptive, and it looks to me as if there are ownership issues here. No one owns this article. And content disputes are, by definition, not vandalism, so please stop characterizing them as such.

Please discuss the changes rationally here before reverting any more, otherwise I would not be surprised to see this article receive full protection for edit waring, and rather soon. And then the article will be in a state unwanted by someone. — Becksguy (talk) 12:16, 29 April 2008 (UTC)

Indeed. Floyd, you and the other RL residents of Utqiaġvik , Alaska are going to have to resign yourself to the fact that several comic books and a movie have referred to the town. Clearly, no one is going to think Barrow is a place that Vampires vacation in - any more than people expect to see the Blues Brothers in my city of Chicago (or vampires for that matter, as per White Wolf Games' book, Chicago By Night. While it is understandable that you would take umbrage at the insinuation, your argument is with the writers of the comic and the makers of the film, not the editors who are adding it because of its notable usage outside of a Chamber of Commerce brochure. As the information is cited, please stop edit-warring the trivia tag in. You are incorrect to utilize it here, and the inherent conflict of interest should pretty much make it clear that you cannot speak neutrally to the statements. Leave it be. - Arcayne (cast a spell) 00:38, 1 May 2008 (UTC)
For many, the issue is not that there's a vampire novel set in Barrow, stuff happens, but the gross inaccuracies, like that once the sun goes down, the town plunges into pitch black darkness from mid-November until around Groundhog Day. The truth is, even without the sun, the twilight makes it almost like there's a small amount of sunlight. At least that's what I think the problems would be. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.162.61.43 (talk) 07:55, 13 April 2012 (UTC)

Trivia was wrong

Barrow has a "damp" law, not a "bone dry" law. I live here (Barrow), I know. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Big Bot (talk • contribs) 09:29, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

You have to refine the misconception from Flying Wild Alaska, Floyd. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.122.34.11 (talk) 17:54, 16 April 2012 (UTC)

The Mayor is not current

Need to update the mayor. Her name is not there. 198.123.56.217 (talk) 20:58, 13 July 2012 (UTC)

Contradiction

"Beginning on around May 11 or 12 the sun remains above the horizon the entire day, there is a increasing amount of twilight each day, and on the summer solstice (around June 21 or June 22), civil twilight in Barrow lasts for more than 3 hours and the phenomenon known as the midnight sun is observed." -- How can there be any twilight in the summer if the sun is up all night long? 24.23.196.85 (talk) 02:04, 20 August 2012 (UTC)
I see that this issue has (finally!) been resolved. I'm removing the contradiction tag. Thanks, whoever you are! 24.23.196.85 (talk) 06:31, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Requested move 27 January 2017

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Moved. The previous move was made without discussion, so I have reverted that per request at WP:RMTR. If anyone wants to go ahead and propose a move to Utqiaġvik, they are welcome to do so.  — Amakuru (talk) 21:58, 29 January 2017 (UTC)


Utqiaġvik, Alaska → Barrow, Alaska – Per WP:COMMONNAME. I will repeat my argument from above: If Bangalore, a city with 1,996 times the population of Barrow and much more well known around the world, is still commonly being referred to as "Bangalore" despite the official name change to "Bengaluru" over 2 years ago, there is no way Barrow is all of a sudden being called "Utqiagvik" – an even more obscure and difficult-to-pronounce name than "Bengaluru" for most English-speakers – a mere two months after the name change. — Sunnya343✈ (háblame • my work) 23:51, 27 January 2017 (UTC)

  • You really need to drop the stick about this Bangalore nonsense. I am very sorry that the consensus of the Bangalore move discussions have not resulted in that article being moved to Bengaluru, but the proper way to challenge that consensus is to start a discussion Talk:Bangalore, not try to force entirely unrelated articles to use the wrong name to set an example. 28bytes (talk) 00:36, 28 January 2017 (UTC)
  • I believe you are being WP:INVOLVED. "In general, editors should not act as administrators in disputed cases in which they have been involved." In my opinion, your WP:G6 deletions are rash and improper. It is not "uncontroversial maintenance" when editors have raised concerns about moving the page.
That aside, I see absolutely no difference between Bangalore/Bengaluru and Barrow/Utqiagvik. Ten move discussions have kept the article at Bangalore all these years. I think we need to have patience here. — Sunnya343✈ (háblame • my work) 17:34, 28 January 2017 (UTC)
  • Keep it at Utqiaġvik, per WP:COMMONNAME. Alaska Daily News and other media that cover the area have switched to Utqiaġvik. The name change is official and the sources Wikipedia relies on are now using the official name. 28bytes (talk) 00:36, 28 January 2017 (UTC)
  • Neutral, but current state of the article cannot stand. Similar to the Bangalore/Bengaluru situation, Barrow/Utqiaġvik is a city known by two names. The article should reflect this by providing both names and pronunciations in the lede, but should otherwise refer to it by whatever its common name is. The current state of titling the article as Utqiaġvik but otherwise referring to the city as Barrow isn't acceptable as a long-term solution.  ONR  (talk)  00:52, 28 January 2017 (UTC)
  • Neutral, for now, leaning Oppose, due to lack of evidence favoring either side, much less the proposal itself. We need evidence of usage in recent reliable sources; period. --В²C ☎ 01:52, 28 January 2017 (UTC)
  • Oppose, noting lack of driving evidence, of this being largely a preference. The proposal is contrary to a decades old trend to reverse the renaming of things with non-English sounding names with crude Anglicisations, or simply renames after British politicians very tenuously connected to the place (as in this case). --SmokeyJoe (talk) 02:53, 28 January 2017 (UTC)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Move to change name of article to "Utqiagvik, Alaska" following newly approved ordinance

http://www.ktuu.com/content/news/Barrow-voters-narrowly-approve-ordinance-to-rename-city-to-Utqiagvik-396998551.html

BARROW, Alaska (KTUU) - Voters in Barrow have narrowly approved an ordinance to rename the city Utqiaġvik, according to final results from the city clerk’s office.

Following this change, I believe the article should be re-titled and names adjusted throughout the article. Azotochtli (talk) 16:35, 14 October 2016 (UTC)

  • Absolutely not – An article subject's common name trumps its official name every time, an issue the community seems to have trouble coming to grips with judging from the wildly inconsistent attitude I've seen exhibited towards that over the years. Recent past instances of eradicating English names in favor of indigenous names based merely on press releases, news stories or similar announcements with little or no discussion was bad enough. Please note that relevant policy/guidelines for this English-language encyclopedia cover common usage across the breadth of English-language sources, not just basing decisions on cherry-picking one particular source which may have been a trending topic on one particular day. If you're really concerned about indigenous languages, it would help to point out that ik.wiki, the Inupiat-language encyclopedia, has been in piss-poor shape for quite some time now. I'm not the one with the expertise to do something about it, and when I've brought it to the attention of those who may be able to help, have been met mostly with excuses and/or lip service. RadioKAOS / Talk to me, Billy / Transmissions 19:42, 14 October 2016 (UTC)

It should be changed. It IS the common name of the community, and has been for centuries. Barrow is far more recent, and the recent vote is reverting back to the common name for the community. The official name is the common name. People should respect the will of the community to call their community by its real name. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Naulagmi (talk • contribs) 05:59, 15 October 2016 (UTC)

Firstly, you should really read WP:AT. Even glancing at it for a few seconds would tell you that this runs totally afoul of that policy. The policy covers recognition in sources, not recognition by a small subset of people particular to the article subject. Once again, an article subject's common name trumps its official name every time. As you can see by the redlink, we don't even have a redirect entitled Metlakatla Indian Community, let alone are considering calling Metlakatla, Alaska by that name. Secondly, the story in the source provided mentions a rather pertinent aspect near the very bottom. I realize that many folks these days lack the proper attention span and therefore may have missed it, so I'll repeat it here: "The ordinance is now on the desk of Lt. Governor Byron Mallott, who has 45 days to approve the name of Alaska’s northernmost city. Once that’s completed the city can begin the process of changing signage and maps to reflect the new name." This isn't even official yet, so there's also WP:CRYSTAL to take into account. I very much doubt that Mallott would reject this, but there's always that possibility. There's also the aspect of how far this will be recognized. 27 months ago, Anchorage Daily News was changed to Alaska Dispatch News almost immediately following the announcement of the pending name change, despite the fact that the name "Anchorage Daily News" had been in use since at least the 1950s. To this day, people still refer to the newspaper as the "Anchorage Daily News". If I go to the airport and see that Alaska Airlines has "Utqiaġvik" rather than "Barrow" listed on its arrivals / departures board, I may have reason to believe that this is being taken seriously by people other than local residents and perhaps also state government. The message we're sending with this is that we're not here to be an encyclopedic reflection so much as we're here to be a part of a social media strategy for article subjects, among other negative messages. RadioKAOS / Talk to me, Billy / Transmissions 22:04, 15 October 2016 (UTC)

@VonWoland:@Kmoksy:In the interest of discussing this instead of engaging in move warring, would you please explain why you moved this while a move discussion was ongoing and no consensus had been reached, as can be seen above? Once again, please read WP:AT, which is the operative policy regarding this issue. Whenever I've said something in the past which others interpreted as applying IAR to established policy because I may not have necessarily agreed with that policy, I've been called on the carpet about it. I don't see how this is any different. Boldly moving the article like this reveals numerous problems. The biggest problem is that it suggests that our primary purpose is to blindly respond to yesterday's headlines and to provide a venue for advocacy on issues. If you bothered to look beyond the headline, you would have seen that this doesn't become official until December 1. That is mentioned in the very first sentence of the story. Are you assuming that this needs to be done now because people will have forgotten about it in another month? That's been the case in countless other instances where we reflect headlines and trending topics without regard to actual happenings when the two don't necessarily occur at the same time. Furthermore, like with any name change, it will take quite some time for it to sink in among the general public, as I mentioned above in the case of the ADN. The story indicated that the percentage of Iñupiat residing in the community exceeds the percentage by which the question passed by at least several percentage points. That says that no clear consensus exists in the real world, just as no clear consensus had been established here beforehand as is customarily expected. All this is important in terms of delineating the difference between an encyclopedia which is supposed to trade in facts and a news site which peddles headlines "while they're hot" and doesn't necessarily follow up to factual happenings at the appropriate time. Regardless of all that, WP:AT and specifically WP:COMMONNAME still applies whether the name change were to take effect immediately or in another month. I don't like repeating myself, but I suppose it's important to reiterate that common names trump official names every time. A clear indication of this topic's common name can be found in the simplest Google search:

  • Barrow, Alaska – 5,000,000 hits without quotes surrounding search string, 414,000 hits with quotes surrounding search string
  • Utqiagvik, Alaska – 10,200 hits without quotes surrounding search string, 648 hits with quotes surrounding search string
  • Utqiaġvik, Alaska – 5,230 without quotes surrounding search sting, 112 hits with quotes surrounding search string

Methinks you would have a better chance of walking to the North Pole from Barrow Utqiaġvik ? than you would in overcoming a chasm like that. This is all too reminiscent of past moves from English names to indigenous names merely based on announcements, press releases and the like without regard for official or common recognition or even common sense. The main difference here is that this article is a little higher profile than many others which have been moved in like fashion, so it needed a more thorough discussion first before any thoughts of moving occurred. RadioKAOS / Talk to me, Billy / Transmissions 20:10, 31 October 2016 (UTC)

alaKSa → alaSKa ["Kmoksy moved page Utqiaġvik, Alaksa to Utqiaġvik, Alaska"] --Kmoksy (talk) 01:25, 1 November 2016 (UTC)

Avoiding the point. You're still a party to something which lacks not only consensus, but really a leg to stand on, as I've already pointed out. Wikipedia:Other stuff exists doesn't explicitly mention page moves. However, the principle of that page still applies in that other folks have gotten away in the past with moving pages under the same reasoning with little to no discussion or consensus, which leads to a further lack of discussion or consensus in other cases because folks start to believe that this is the way things work. Part of being neutral and encyclopedic involves not caving in to the agendas of the article subject or those related to it, which can be summed up in one of the above rationales in favor of the move. RadioKAOS / Talk to me, Billy / Transmissions 04:13, 1 November 2016 (UTC)

Change it back - you jumped the gun on this one. Legally it is still Barrow, so set it back ASAP. The name should not be changed again until after Governor Byron Mallott approves the name change. The state is the legal authority that approves the name of a city, and until the governor authorizes it, legally it is still Barrow. For American city names in Wikipedia, we are suppose to use the legal name in the format of "City, State" for the Wikipedia article name. The 3 main sources that should be used for name references is GNIS / IRS Census / US Post Office, but their databases will lag after a name changes. • Sbmeirow • Talk • 04:49, 1 November 2016 (UTC)

Keep as Barrow. The city has been known as that since before there was a written Iñupiaq language. Activist (talk) 20:26, 20 November 2016 (UTC)

While the article itself should clearly be moved to Utqiagvik, someone was clearly overzealous in doing a find-replace in the article. Historical references to the city from 1850-2016 or so should still say "Barrow" IMO, at least if that was the word used at the time - it's weirdly bizarre to see, say, that an Agents of SHIELD episode released surely before the name change should say "Utqiagvik". (Unless they actually used that phrase for some reason.) SnowFire (talk) 22:15, 20 November 2016 (UTC)

It is now the official name of the community (as of December 1st), and statewide media is now referring the the community as Utqiagvik in their news articles. (Alaska Dispatch News, Alaska Public Media). Seems to be the common name now used in government, media and people of Utqiagvik themselves. Time to move wikipedia page to Utqiagvik? --Naulagmi (talk) 04:42, 6 December 2016 (UTC)

Yes, it should be moved. I moved it to Utqiaġvik on Dec. 1 once the name change became official but someone reverted me. I explained the situation to them and gave them the chance to self-revert as a courtesy, but they have so far failed to do so. 28bytes (talk) 04:56, 6 December 2016 (UTC)
@28bytes: If you could please wait a little longer, I would like to review the lengthy Denali name change discussions. Also I think we should have a requested move discussion as this issue seems very similar to the Bangalore/Bengaluru situation, where consensus remains to keep the old name, two years after the official change. — Sunnya343✈ (háblame • my work) 05:36, 6 December 2016 (UTC)
Yes, please review those, and let us know your thoughts. I think you will find the Denali situation more relevant, both culturally and geographically. Bangalore/Bengaluru really has little similarity other than "place with a Wikipedia naming dispute." 28bytes (talk) 23:50, 6 December 2016 (UTC)

Change it. The current title has the unfortunate honor of being both racist and wrong. This is supposed to be an Encyclopedia. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.7.131.80 (talk) 07:50, 14 January 2017 (UTC) — 58.7.131.80 (talk) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.

See WP:NOTADVOCACY and WP:RIGHTGREATWRONGS. The only thing these shadowy advocates have going for them is that "Utqiaġvik" is favored in current media style guides and therefore a factor in gaming search results in favor. Still, numerous news stories since the change became official have not only shown no rigid consistency in the use of Utqiaġvik versus Barrow, but this discussion has conveniently avoided acknowledging the ongoing court case regarding the use of Utqiaġvik versus "Ukpeaġvik" (see here). I've seen no news that the case has been resolved. This follow-up story, the top story of a Sunday edition, affirms my earlier contention that there's an attempt to force consensus here on the encyclopedia where none exists in the real world. In practical terms, I'm around Iñupiat every day of my life (my last two housemates were Iñupiaq) and there is no traction for this whatsoever among the rank and file. Someone who performs music at the churches I attend talked about the name change very briefly to the congregation one Sunday. Apart from that, I don't hear anything but "Barrow". RadioKAOS / Talk to me, Billy / Transmissions 04:12, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
Utqiaġvik is currently officially and commonly used by the City, Borough, State of Alaska and by all Alaskan, national and international media. See here, here, here here, here, here, here, here and here. Your talk about Iñupiat only using "Barrow" is completely anecdotal; nearly all the Iñupiat I know all now use Utqiaġvik. Neither of our personal anecdotal stories of what we "hear" people say can be considered valid evidence for what the commonly used name is. The only real "poll" we have is the actual vote, in which Utqiaġvik won. You write that Wikipedia is not supposed to work in advocacy, however you seem to be advocating "Barrow" over "Utqiaġvik" based on a certain political agenda, when the State of Alaska, the City of Utqiaġvik, the North Slope Borough, and all state, national and international media are referring to Utqiaġvik as its common name, Utqiaġvik. Anecdotal evidence is not sufficient. Vote to move the page to Utqiaġvik. --134.87.158.22 (talk) 18:56, 24 January 2017 (UTC)— 134.87.158.22 (talk) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
This is getting ridiculous. 134.87.158.22, you are absolutely correct, the name change has been official for almost two months, and has been widely accepted by the independent media. There is no legitimate policy basis for continuing to use the old name, so I am moving it to the new name, which should have been done long ago. 28bytes (talk) 06:06, 26 January 2017 (UTC)
I'll tell you what's ridiculous. It's these IPs and SPAs who have come here expressly to policy-shop and cherry-pick sources and take us away from reflecting human knowledge because they're more interested in trying to influence it. I'm looking at WP:AT right now. The first section, WP:CRITERIA, begins with "Article titles are based on how reliable English-language sources refer to the article's subject". The second section, WP:COMMONNAME, elaborates on that by stating "as determined by its prevalence in a significant majority of independent, reliable English-language sources". Nowhere in any of that does it refer to giving weight to one particular subset of reliable sources at one particular point in time, which is exactly what I see reflected in all the linkspam they've provided. Even the subsection WP:NAMECHANGES and the passage "we give extra weight to sources written after the name change is announced" says nothing about giving "extra weight" to one particular subset of sources, which is what news stories are. This is supposed to be an encyclopedia. Allowing a style guide change on the part of the media to prevail here means that we're really nothing more than another media outlet. There is a difference between a media outlet and an encyclopedia, namely with respect to the bigger picture.
Reference the Google hits towards the beginning of this thread. Three months later, the majority of that being after this has taken effect, the number of Google hits for "Barrow" has increased more than two-dozen-fold compared to "Utqiaġvik", whether with or without the diacritic. Do you honestly expect anyone to believe that there are no reliable sources whatsoever within those 5,000,000+ links? Or do you honestly expect folks to believe that such is irrelevant and whatever's in the news today controls the direction of our coverage? Because "whatever's in the news today" is certainly at the very core of what's driving this. Who cares that it took this tanik to point out that "Kuukpik = Colville River" after the article had existed for slightly more than a decade (see here), or that ik.wiki is still in a deplorable state despite seeing non-bot-related editing activity within recent weeks. They're latching onto this because it's "popular" and because they have the media on their side. They also appear to have an WP:INVOLVED admin on their side, judging from the comment "Yes, it should be moved" made on December 6. RadioKAOS / Talk to me, Billy / Transmissions 05:21, 27 January 2017 (UTC)
I agree 100% with User:RadioKAOS. If Bangalore, a city with 1,996 times the population of Barrow and much more well known around the world, is still commonly being referred to as "Bangalore" despite the official name change to "Bengaluru" over 2 years ago, there is no way Barrow is all of a sudden being called "Utqiagvik" – even more obscure and difficult to pronounce than "Bengaluru" for most English-speakers – a mere two months after the name change. — Sunnya343✈ (háblame • my work) 08:12, 27 January 2017 (UTC)
Actually, doing a Google News search for Barrow for the last month, even using the search term "Barrow", the stories with the most hits mostly use Utqiagvik. Some exceptions are an article about the Never Alone game, which would make sense to use Barrow, because the game was produced when the city was named Barrow. I found three articles (here, here and here) that refer to the Barrow sports teams. (This also would make sense since the high school is still called Barrow High School). There is one an article from WaPo that uses Barrow in the title rather than Utqiagvik, but mentions the official name later on. These are the exceptions to the Utqiagvik tendency that I could find. There are actually more hits for Barrow in total, but this is because virtually every article uses Utqiagvik (formerly known as Barrow) in the article. I really don't think the Bangaluru example is relevant in Alaska. I would take the Denali name change as a more relevant example. --134.87.159.153 (talk) 19:39, 28 January 2017 (UTC)
I feel the Bangalore/Bengaluru example is perfectly relevant. Regarding Denali, I understand that the mountain was widely known as "Denali" not just by many Alaskans, but also by climbers and others around the world. This is per reliable sources. I find no source indicating that "Utqiagvik" is preferred to "Barrow." In the first place, I don't think many English-speakers the world over even know about Barrow, let alone its new official name. The situation is undoubtedly different for the highest mountain in North America. — Sunnya343✈ (háblame • my work) 22:49, 28 January 2017 (UTC)
Actually, you are mistaken about Denali. The mountain was known as Denali to Alaskans, but rarely did tourists or out-of-staters refer to the mountain as Denali. Many visitors or climbers coming to Alaska did take up the term Denali after being informed of the true name when visiting Alaska. Much like Denali, Utqiagvik is a regionalism gaining wider credence after it became official. -134.87.159.153 (talk) 01:39, 29 January 2017 (UTC)

What I said is based on what I read here. You say, "Much like Denali, Utqiagvik is a regionalism gaining wider credence after it became official." Looking at some non-Alaskan sources, that doesn't appear to be the case, and I doubt it has gained wider credence only two months after the name change. I feel we just need to be patient and wait for more sources, as I explain further in the below RM discussion. — Sunnya343✈ (háblame • my work) 04:37, 29 January 2017 (UTC)

  • @RadioKAOS: I'd urge patience as well. As RadioKAOS notes, there is a court case brought by UIC, the local Native corporation, challenging the name change. The name "Ukpeaġvik" (or less frequently, "Ukpiagvik") is one I've heard referred to for 25 years, and referred to the downtown area as being "the place to hunt snowy owls," an Iñupiaq name that puts birders off, of course. In the summertime, the owls nest not in town, but rather heavily in the tundra along the gas well road somewhat southeast of Browerville. The Presbyterian church, with the original place name, "Utqiaġvik" also spells it, alternatively, "Utkeaġvik," and the Utkeaġvik Church Manse (the dark colored building in the foreground), constructed in 1929 and on the National Register of Historic Places, has an article about it on Wikipedia The vote to change the name was apparently not well publicized and only prevailed by about six votes. The city mayor, Fannie Suvlu, is a Native speaker of the language and had an "Iñupiaq word of the day" segment on the local radio station, KBRW, for many years. The KTOO article, [1] regarding the change, picked up by AP I think, had numerous misspellings of English words, as well as the novel rendition "Utkqiaġvik" (sic) so I wouldn't put much stock in it. IMHO there are lots more pressing issues to be addressed in Wikipedia. Activist (talk) 01:12, 30 January 2017 (UTC)

Requested move 30 January 2017

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Not moved (for now). (closed by non-admin page mover)  Paine Ellsworth  u/c 11:40, 6 February 2017 (UTC)

Barrow, Alaska → Utqiaġvik, Alaska – Official name change discussed previously here and here above. —  AjaxSmack  03:28, 30 January 2017 (UTC)

Survey

Feel free to state your position on the renaming proposal by beginning a new line in this section with *'''Support''' or *'''Oppose''', then sign your comment with ~~~~. Since polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account Wikipedia's policy on article titles.

Discussion

Any additional comments:
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

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Article Name

If the name has been officially changed from Barrow, why do we still use Barrow here? Upjav (talk) 18:48, 2 September 2017 (UTC)

Requested move 12 November 2017

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: not moved.(closed by non-admin page mover) ʍaɦʋɛօtʍ (talk) 07:03, 20 November 2017 (UTC)


Barrow, Alaska → Utqiagvik – I read the discussions above and they chose not to move because it wasn't the common name yet, fair enough. I did a quick google news search and all recent sources use Utqiagvik ([2], [3]) etc... The name should be Utqiagvik since that is the official name, the name of the official website, and the references in the news. If someone is to search this place after reading about it, they would be redirected to an old name that is not in use in the media. It has been stable for over a year now with the new name, so it's here to stay. Just like we should no longer use Leningrad for St. Petersburg even though there are many historical references to Leningrad, it's always best to match the current use in the media. Mattximus (talk) 14:25, 12 November 2017 (UTC)

Shouldn't the target be Utqiaġvik, Alaska, per WP:USPLACE? —  AjaxSmack  19:48, 12 November 2017 (UTC)

Support per my nomination explanation. Mattximus (talk) 14:26, 12 November 2017 (UTC)

  • Support move to Utqiaġvik, Alaska When a place or organisation is renamed, per WP:NAMECHANGES we give extra weight to reliable sources after the renaming. No editor above has addressed the fact that much of the WP:RS sourcing since the renaming has actually clearly favoured Utqiaġvik. For example, Lonely Planet is favouring Utqiaġvik with Barrow as an alternative. This article from CBS News in October, relating to a seal lounging on an airport runway used the new name clarifying in the article that Utqiagvik is the "town formerly known as Barrow". Sources as diverse as the Indian Express and Fox News (not known as a bastion of progress) have adopted the new name. I am very disappointed that some of the !votes above mostly rely on arguments to avoid and fail to actually provide rationale for their !votes. AusLondonder (talk) 15:55, 14 November 2017 (UTC)
    Sure, try a google news search for the past 30 days. Weather sites [4], major news organizations [5], all use the new term. Some say "formerly known as Barrow". It is the official name of the municipality. Mattximus (talk) 14:22, 18 November 2017 (UTC)
  • Support move to Utqiaġvik, Alaska per WP:NAMECHANGES. Although not everything that previously used the old name has been updated with the new name. Most media written since the name change has used the new name. (Including this recent article from ADN). AjaxSmack in his oppose argument used the fact that Barrow Highschool's name didn't change. Although this is true, and it is still called Barrow Highschool, the contact address at the bottom of the page uses Utqiaġvik: "Barrow High School, P.O. Box 960 Utqiaġvik, AK 99723; Phone: (907) 852-8950" (This is also an example of many mailing addresses that do use Utqiaġvik).--JuliaEKingston (talk) 05:36, 15 November 2017 (UTC)
    • Additional evidences: All current news including sources like USA Today and Daily Mail use the new name. The North Slope Borough is in the process of updating their website and the link supplied by AjaxSmack pointing to Barrow doesn't work anymore. Lonely Planet uses both names for titles with the new name first Utqiaġvik (Barrow), but in the articles just uses Utqiaġvik. Though Google Maps is a little bit slow to update, Apple Maps has updated to the new name, though still putting the old name after it in brackets: Utqiagvik (Barrow).--JuliaEKingston (talk) 00:02, 18 November 2017 (UTC)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Meaning of Utqiagvik

Wikipedia and the article cited says the meaning of the name is "place for gathering wild potatoes." USGS geonames says it meant "high place for viewing". Which is correct? It would be good if a native Inupiaq speaker could comment on this.--JuliaEKingston (talk) 09:58, 17 November 2017 (UTC)

It means a place for gathering wild roots It comes from the Inupiaq word utqiq which means root, which the Inupiaq language now also uses for potato (potatoes not being food plants indigenous to the North Slope of Alaska.) The translation of the name given by the USGS is incorrect:
In the U.S. Geological Survey Dictionary of Alaska Place Names, the original name for Barrow was given as Utkiakvik, reflecting an earlier spelling, but the book provides an entirely different meaning, "high place for viewing."
That is not correct, said Inupiaq language experts Fannie Akpik and Jana Harcharek, who agreed that the old name refers to edible roots. The latter is Qaiyaan's mother and Inupiaq education director for the North Slope Borough School District.
Source: Demer, Lisa (2016-10-29). "Barrow's new name is its old one, Utqiaġvik. Local Iñupiaq leaders hope its use heals as it teaches." Alaska Dispatch News. (Note: Alaska Dispatch News was just re-renamed back to Anchorage Daily News over the past weekend; but at the time this article was written, it was still Alaska Dispatch News.)
Barrow officially became Utqiaġvik on December 1, 2016. (Caldwell, Suzanna (2016-11-19). "Sun sets in Barrow for the last time till Jan. 22." Alaska Dispatch News.) Yksin (talk) 18:37, 21 November 2017 (UTC)

Name change to Utqiaġvik became official Dec 1, 2016 — litigation is over & Alaska state officialdom complying

[Note: I'm making some corrections/addendums to my original posts here after realizing I mistook the date of a newspaper story. Corrections are all in italics/square brackets.] — Yksin (talk) 21:13, 21 November 2017 (UTC)

I was late here for the arguments about whether the article's name should change from Barrow to Utqiaġvik or not. Personally I think it's appropriate for it to be Barrow until the name change becomes official — which will be the end of next week, on December 1 [correction: last year on Dec 1], as all litigation about the name change has been settled. [This is a current correct detail: I got this from an official email from an Alaska Court System source.] Regardless of when the article name change happens here, it's inevitable.

Alaska government entities are already in the process of changing the name in government publications and websites. More recently: the Alaska Supreme Court has issued [Alaska] Supreme Court Order No. 1916 effective January 1, 2018 "approving revisions to the [Alaska Court System] venue map and community chart referenced in Criminal Rule 18 to address the renaming of Barrow as Utqiagvik." The court site there will no longer be Barrow Superior Court — it'll be Utqiagvik Superior Court.

[The Alaska Supreme Court's order appears to be in direct response to litigation about the name change having finally been settled. I'm looking for further details about the litigation.]

Good news for Alaska Natives! As a (white) Alaskan, I'm very happy on your behalf, & to respect the choice of Utqiagvik residents to have their home called by the name they called it by long before us European Americans came along. — Yksin (talk) 19:32, 21 November 2017 (UTC)

Further signs of change: The North Slope Borough's official website no longer has a page for a community called "Barrow" — but it does for a community called Utqiaġvik. (That's a change from the last "requested move" discussion just a week ago (November 12), when AjaxSmack pointed out North Slope Borough still called it Barrow.) The page's actual text still uses Barrow, but I'd expect the website editor to change that soon. The city's official website calls the city Utqiaġvik. Businesses can call themselves whatever they want to, but once the USPS catches up, the city they do business in will be Utqiaġvik, too. But I'm okay with waiting for consensus here to catch up to the various official sources that are already catching up. Name changes take time to implement.
This is the third community name change back to a traditional Alaska Native name that I remember — previously English Bay to Nanwalek in 1992 & Sheldon Point to Nunam Iqua in 1999. In 2015 we also had a name change to a census area, Kusilvak Census Area which had formerly been named after the slaveowning Confederate general Wade Hampton III, who never (thank god) set foot in Alaska. — Yksin (talk) 20:21, 21 November 2017 (UTC)
And another sign: AjaxSmack in the Nov. 12 "requested move" discussion also noted that the local high school is still called Barrow High School. But high schools can also have names different from the city they're found in. But look at the contact info: Barrow High School's mailing address as given on its website is "P.O. Box 960, Utqiaġvik, AK 99723." North Slope Borough School District, of which Barrow High School is part, also gives its mailing address city as Utqiaġvik. — Yksin (talk) 20:47, 21 November 2017 (UTC)

History & result of litigation: City is & will remain Utqiaġvik

Okay, I've done my research on the litigation, which is the thing that up till now has been holding up changes in official government websites to the city's name.

Result of litigation: It's a done deal. The city is & will remain Utqiaġvik. The court dismissed the anti-name change lawsuit "with prejudice" in early October 2017. Changes to USPS and city, state, and federal websites will follow.

Summary of litigation: After the vote in October 2016 to change Barrow's name to Utqiaġvik, the local Native corporation, Ukpeaġvik Iñupiat Corporation (UIT for short, & here's their website), sued the City of Utqiaġvik to put off the name change, claiming that the city hadn't properly followed ordinances about proper notice before taking the vote & had also picked the wrong name for the city. UIT claimed the city rename should have been to the same name the corporation uses, Ukpeaġvik, which UIC claimed was the real ancient name of the area. It means 'place to hunt snowy owls' (whereas Utqiaġvik means 'place to gather wild roots'). (The second Lisa Demer story below dated 2016-12-17 goes into considerable detail about this.) UIT also sought a second vote to turn back the name, but the Utqiaġvik City Council blocked that in February 2017. On March 9, 2017, Judge Paul Roetman heard arguments in the dispute, and ruled the following day that UIT had failed to prove its case and that Utqiaġvik could continue the work it was doing to change its name — such as working with state and federal authorities, including the U.S. Postal Service. This wasn't a final decision, but his ruling on March 10 was a strong indicator that the name change would stick. Alaska state authorities, meantime, had been holding off from doing big changes while they waited for this whole dispute to play out.

Then, on October 10, Utqiaġvik Mayor Fannie Suvlu announced that UIT and the City of Utqiaġvik had reached a settlement in the name change lawsuit. According to an October 13 "in brief" item in the Arctic Sounder (see full list of stories below):

"After the court issued a final judgment dismissing the case with prejudice, the parties agreed to settle the entire lawsuit," she wrote. "Dismissal with prejudice means the case was adjudicated on the merits in favor of the city and that UIC cannot bring the same lawsuit against the city and the city officials in the future."
Suvlu noted the corporation also agreed to pay a portion of the city attorney's fees as part of the settlement. [Emphasis added]

A longer story appearing in the Arctic Sounder on October 20:

The city and the council members named in the suit were absolved of wrongdoing in the change, following a final judgment by the court dismissing the case with prejudice.
"The City is glad to have this controversy behind it and will continue to embrace its new name," Mayor Fannie Suvlu said in a release on Oct. 10, announcing the settlement.
For the last year, disagreements have happened on the street, on social media and within families, as to whether the town should be called Barrow or Utqiaġvik, and in some cases, Ukpeaġvik, the third name often held as true.
Many have embraced the name with pride. In the interim, the city has changed its logo and it now matches the language and culture of its new and old name, highlighting the proud Inupiat culture of its residents.

As I noted previously, one result of the litigation now having been settled with finality is [Alaska] Supreme Court Order No. 1916 effective January 1, 2018 "approving revisions to the [Alaska Court System] venue map and community chart referenced in Criminal Rule 18 to address the renaming of Barrow as Utqiagvik." The court site there will no longer be Barrow Superior Court — it'll be Utqiagvik Superior Court.

Meanwhile, Alaska news sources including the Alaska Dispatch News (which just in the past few days has returned to its own earlier name the Anchorage Daily News), Alaska Public Media, the Fairbanks Daily News-Miner, the Juneau Empire, and the Arctic Sounder, among others, have already for months been routinely calling the city Utqiaġvik in their stories, often without bothering to explain that it was formerly known as Barrow. (Though Barrow is still used sometimes, especially in reference to events that happened there prior to the name change.) Gov. Bill Walker also routinely calls the city by its chosen name, such as in this disaster declaration for the North Slope Borough from November 14 where he refers to "low-lying area flooding in Utqiagvik" — again, no reference to anyplace named "Barrow."

Newspaper stories about litigation (chronological) 

— Yksin (talk) 23:33, 21 November 2017 (UTC)

The Name Of This Article Shouldn't Be Barrow

Barrow should be redirected and the new city name should be the actual title of the article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:642:C104:9290:5526:170E:9B4B:B16F (talk) 17:57, 3 March 2018 (UTC)

I have recently gone through and corrected everything in the article to the new name, and I would agree that the name of the article should be changed. This situation is similar to Frobisher bay being renamed to Iqaluit or Mt. McKinley being renamed to Denali. The GNIS says Utqiaġvik is the official name. Howpper (talk) 21:16, 26 March 2018 (UTC)

Requested move 27 March 2018

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: procedural close, reverted to stable title per WP:RMTR; the page was moved on March 26 without discussion after several previous move discussions. Please open a new move discussion if a move to either Utqiaġvik or Utqiagvik is desired. See WP:RM#CM for details. Dekimasuよ! 18:12, 27 March 2018 (UTC)


Utqiaġvik, Alaska → Utqiagvik, Alaska – WP:COMMONNAME in English does not use a dot over the "g". See, for example, the official website, some news articles, and this google trends graph. Chessrat (talk, contributions) 12:33, 27 March 2018 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

A new Google census of name useage

Shortly after the voters of Barrow first voted to change Barrow's name to Utqiaġvik, RadioKAOS did a Google count of hits on variations of the town's name. Here's what was reported on October 31, 2016:

  • Barrow, Alaska – 5,000,000 hits without quotes surrounding search string, 414,000 hits with quotes surrounding search string
  • Utqiagvik, Alaska – 10,200 hits without quotes surrounding search string, 648 hits with quotes surrounding search string
  • Utqiaġvik, Alaska – 5,230 without quotes surrounding search sting, 112 hits with quotes surrounding search string

A little more than a year later, I thought it would be useful to do a recount. I also searched on each city name by itself (without Alaska added). 'Barrow' of course is has other meanings, so gets a lot of hits on its own even when it has nothing to do with Alaska or the particular city in Alaska (even if Alaska otherwise appears on the webpage), so I'm not sure that means anything really meaningful in this discussion.

Search term 31 Oct 2016 21 Nov 2017 % increase/decrease
Barrow [not counted] 12,500,000 n/a
Barrow, Alaska 5,000,000 1,660,000 - 66.8%
"Barrow, Alaska" 414,000 443,000 + 7.0%
"Point Barrow" [not counted] 281,000 n/a
Point Barrow, Alaska [not counted] 351,000 n/a
"Point Barrow, Alaska" [not counted] 96,100 n/a
Utqiagvik [not counted] 28,600 n/a
Utqiagvik, Alaska 10,200 24,100 + 136.3
"Utqiagvik, Alaska" 648 12,800 + 1,875.3%
Utqiaġvik [not counted] 19,400 n/a
Utqiaġvik, Alaska 5,230 10,700 + 104.6%
"Utqiaġvik, Alaska" 112 14,600 + 12,935%

Utqiagvik/Utqiaġvik in its variations has had an incredible uptick since October 2016, whereas "Barrow, Alaska" has had only a very modest increase. (I think something must have been awry with last year's count with Barrow, Alaska not inside quotes — even now I had a difference of 60,000 between a search an hour ago and a search just now). It's also obvious from above that a lot of the hits on Barrow, Alaska and "Barrow, Alaska" come from Point Barrow — which is a point of land, not synonymous with the city.

It'll take awhile for Utqiagvik/Utqiaġvik to overtake Barrow in total hits — but I think there's a probability it's already overtaken it in NEW uses since the name change just went into effect. Barrow was in use as the city name for much longer, and a lot of those pages will still be online, whereas Utqiaġvik and Utqiagvik (without the thingy over the g) were not used much until just over a year ago. It's already more commonly used in the Alaska press. It'll be interesting to see what it'll be a year from now. — Yksin (talk) 02:14, 22 November 2017 (UTC)

​A year from now or sooner, we can probably move the article, but Wikipedia should reflect a change in usage and not lead it. —  AjaxSmack  05:01, 2 December 2017 (UTC)
I doubt it'll take a year. At any rate, Alaska usage in the media has already changed; usage in government is in process of changing, & consensus here will inevitably catch up. Count my earlier entries as observations of the signposts along the way. — Yksin (talk) 09:33, 2 December 2017 (UTC)

Mount McKinley's article was changed to Denali... Iqaluit was renamed a long time ago from "Frobisher Bay" Leaving the article with the old name is just going to make people get it wrong longer. Barrow isn't even listed in the GNIS anymore. https://geonames.usgs.gov/apex/f?p=138:2:0::NO:RP: (talk) 13:09, 13 December 2017 (UTC)

NOT, isn't the "Alaska press name", "Barrow" now is just the previous name, there is a strong supremacist bias in the community. --Annothumaho (talk) 01:14, 21 July 2018 (UTC)

This name is really hard to spell

I think the above search tally is missing a confounding variable: this name is really difficult to spell. Most people, even in Alaska, are not going to have a ġ key on their keyboard, and those few who do may still be difficult to search for because of the very subtle difference between ġ as a composed character and ġ as a unitary character. (Both resolve identically inside Wikipedia, but I cant guarantee that the same is the case for Google). Even aside from that issue, the name is also difficult to spell for English speakers who are not able to distinguish between /k/ and /q/ and who may not pronounce t he /ġ/ at all.(cf YouTube clips of the name being spoken in English) . I know that we've corrected fore that by searching for variant spellings, but i think that many people unsure of the spelling while typing out a webpage will just stick with "Barrow" out of comfort. Only way to correct for this anomaly would be to restrict the type of webpages we search on to govt publications etc, which are likely already leaning towards the new name.

I suspect this will cause the name to be perceived as foreign in a way that Denali never was,and artificially hold back the time at which the search engine results pull even. —Soap— 19:40, 27 January 2018 (UTC)

I don't see why it would ever surpass Barrow in total hits. Barrow is notable historically, now it's just like any other city. People will just google Barrow instead of learning a new name to a city that will likely not affect their lives. --‡ Єl Cid of ᐺalencia ᐐT₳LKᐬ 04:37, 29 January 2018 (UTC)

Pronunciation

I would like to see an official English pronunciation , and will be looking to try to find one on an official site. YouTube results are inconsistent.—Soap— 20:04, 27 January 2018 (UTC)

cf Arizona

Some towns in Arizona have 2 names. e.g. St._Johns,_Arizona is, in Navajo, Tsézhin Deezʼáhí. Albuquerque is Beeʼeldííl Dahsinil. Most foreign languages do not translate or substitute placenames, but I'm told that Navajo is exceptional here in that they not only have separate names, but they have coined new native names for places that did not exist until settled by colonists. Likewise, Prudhoe Bay, Alaska is known as Sagavanirktok. However, Barrow/Utqiaġvik seems to be unique in that the Inupiaq name has completely supplanted the English, such that even though their website is available in English only, it has no mention of the name Barrow. —Soap— 20:00, 30 January 2018 (UTC)

Requested move 20 September 2018

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: moved. (page mover nac) Flooded with them hundreds 11:31, 27 September 2018 (UTC)

Barrow, Alaska → Utqiagvik, Alaska – The name has been officially changed for two years, the lawsuit about the name change has been dropped, so it is extremely unlikely that the name will ever go back to Barrow. Local, national and international media now almost invariably refer to the town as Utqiaġvik or Utqiagvik. Doing a Google News search in the last year of "Utqiagvik, Alaska"/"Utqiaġvik, Alaska", there are just as many results as for "Barrow, Alaska" (15 pages of results each). (Barrow would likely have even less except for the common practice of stating Utqiagvik (formerly Barrow) in such news reports, as well as the continued use of Barrow High School, covering sports reports). Finally, there is significant evidence that people (including Governor Bill Walker, Sen. Lisa Murkowski, Utqiaġvik's mayor and other officials) have begun to commonly refer to Utqiaġvik as such. There is even an now established English pronounciaton of the name: UUT-kee-AH-vik. Of course, not every one uses Utqiagvik yet, but there is evidence that Utqiagvik is the preferred name for any official discourse and commonly in the community and within Alaska. In previous discussions, people have rightly suggested waiting until the dust settles, but it has been two years and the name Utqiagvik has now been cemented. 65.74.123.242 (talk) 01:13, 20 September 2018 (UTC)

The correct spelling is common enough. [8]. —SmokeyJoe (talk) 08:12, 21 September 2018 (UTC)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Reference 16

This reference is posted as 'insecure' by IE11. I'm guessing it actually isn't, but as a matter of course should such references be removed? Silas Stoat (talk) 18:12, 3 March 2019 (UTC)

Not as far north as Zenith Point in Murchison Promontory

This article's lede claims "Nearby Point Barrow is the country's northernmost point. It is also the northernmost point of the entire American mainland landmass that begins at the very southernmost tip of South America. To go any further north, you would either have to venture into the icy expanse of the Arctic Ocean, or go to the islands of the Arctic Archipelago." However, the article for Point Barrow claims that Murchison Promontory is further north. And comparing the latitudes listed on the Point Barrow (71°23′20″N) and Murchison Promontory (72°00′00″N) articles supports that the latter is further north. I will remove the incorrect part of the claim in the lede. --Presearch (talk) 19:54, 10 August 2019 (UTC)

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