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October 21

road bridges consstruction

i would to know , a form three students i have been asked this question in the exam and failed to answer it, the questions is :

why are road bridges often built one end fixed and other free to move rollers —Preceding unsigned comment added by 168.167.184.13 (talk) 09:58, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

The materials that they are made of expand and contract with changes of temperature. If the bridge was fixed at both ends, with no ability to accommodate such changes, then the stresses could cause the bridge to deform and possibly even break. Another way to solve the problem is with expansion joints. the wub "?!" 10:17, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

Bridges must also resist loads from wind loading and the weight of traffic on the bridge; the operators of the Forth Road Bridge explain the bridge's expansion features here, saying "Articulated trains slide over curved girders, allowing the suspended deck to expand and contract as required by temperature, wind loading and weight of traffic." (p4 on that site) -- Finlay McWalter ☻ Talk 12:39, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

Incidentally, PTFE pads are often used in place of rollers, in order to better distribute the load.--Shantavira|^{feed me} 15:18, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

Series of numbers on book's title page

On the title page of some books, there is a series of presumably small numbers. They aren't necessarily in order, and in the last 5 minutes of searching, I've only noticed them in books with several editions. These aren't ISBNs, LCCNs, Dewey-Decimal numbers, etc... For example, this title page has "10 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 1". Any idea what this is for? It would be nice to find a RS and add this info to the title page article. Thanks. Haus^Talk 17:12, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

See printer’s key. The lowest digit generally gives you the edition number. ---Sluzzelin talk 17:16, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

That's been bothering me for years!! Thanks, Sluzzelin. --Ouro (blah blah) 18:54, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

The lowest digit is not the edition number but the printing number. Typically, little or nothing changes from one printing to the next; whereas changes are made from one edition to the next. For the first printing, publishers may order just enough copies of a publication for sales and sampling purposes. Once they have a better idea of initial demand, they may order a second printing sufficient to meet anticipated demand for the next, say, 6 months. (There is a cost-benefit calculation between the cost of foregoing interest on the outlay until all copies are sold and other warehousing costs on the one hand, and the overhead cost for each printing on the other.) Assuming the second printing is about to sell out, the publisher will order a third printing to meet anticipated demand for a subsequent period, and so on. All of these printings will be of the same edition. If a new edition is issued, there will be a new ISBN and a new sequence of printings, beginning with 1 (the first printing). Marco polo (talk) 20:35, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

The other thing to correct is that this is not normally seen on the title page, but on the copyright page, which is usually the next nonblank page. --Anonymous, 23:01 UTC, October 21, 2010.

WHAT they are has been addressed, WHY it's done this way has not. The answer is: before everybody had an inkjet printer on their desk, documents with large print runs were printed using Offset printing. Metal (usually aluminum) plates have a positive image on them. You print your first 5000 copies, take the plate off the press, clean it up and file it away in case it's needed again.

When it is needed again, you pull the plates out of the file, ERASE the last and lowest digit from the plate, and print. Thus, the plate for that page doesn't have to be remade for each subsequent printing -- all you have to do is plan ahead the first time through.

(Minimum wage was $1.60/hr in the U.S. when I was running a press as a summer job...) DaHorsesMouth (talk) 03:39, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

How did you physically remove the last number? File? Hammer? --Sean 17:31, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

Most books were printed with "hot type" which is raised. Removing a number requires just removing a small amount of lead from the type, thus making any further impressions of that number impossible. Offset was not generally used for large print runs. You can easily see whether a book is "offset" by looking to see if the letters are impressed into the paper. Offset letters are completely level with the paper without any indentations. Removing letters from an offset plate requires almost no effort at all -coating the letter with almost anything will prevent it from holding ink (which then would get transferred to a printing blanket of some sort). Collect (talk) 18:00, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

Subculture vs. Islam

Is there a website where it shows about Islam vs. Rock and Roll subcultures like skinhead Shia, riot grrrl in burqas and mohawk Sufis based on the novel "The Taqwacores"? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.31.22.37 (talk) 20:17, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

According to our article on The Taqwacores, the 'Islamic punk' scene depicted in that book is fictional, not real. -FisherQueen (talk · contribs) 23:26, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

According to that article, though, the book seems to have helped spark into reality a whole music genre and subculture:

"Some of the most popular taqwacore bands are: The Kominas, Al-Thawra, Secret Trial Five, Fedayeen, and the Sagg Taqwacore Syndicate. The novel has also been credited by Asra Nomani as first presenting her the idea for woman-led prayer, leading to a historic woman-led congregation on March 18, 2005 with Amina Wadud acting as imam."

Which is actually kind of interesting actually; I might even read the book! WikiDao ☯ (talk) 23:46, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

Perhaps the film No One Knows About Persian Cats might be helpful if one was interested in what Islamic rock subcultures look like in real life. Timbouctou 23:37, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

french naval history

I would like to know if a french naval vessel left the port of st. malo france onnov. 6th 1762 bound for st. johns newfoundland with a captain villiers and a pierre la mont as his bosin,,thank you,,hayward —Preceding unsigned comment added by 142.163.12.67 (talk) 23:09, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

Likely related to the French capture in June 1762. and British recapture in Sept 1762. [1]. By the time November rolled around, the French ship likely did not land there - making it harder to setermine which ship it was from the Canadian records side. Many of the French records may have been destroyed circa 1789. The name is likely "Le Mont" by the way. As a coincidence, Alan Villiers was a noted seaman. Collect (talk) 10:42, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

October 22

Names of British nobles

In reading articles about important British people, I notice some of them have names and titles that change throughout their life. For example, Henry Fitzalan-Howard, Earl of Arundel was, according to our article, known as Lord Maltravers until 2002 and presumably will become Duke of Norfolk if he outlives his father.

Don't all of these changes cause logistical issues? When a nobleman gets a new title, does he have to get a new driver's license? What about all of his banking or medical records? Do they still get phone calls under their old names and have to keep telling people, "I'm not Lord Maltravers anymore, I'm now the Earl of Arundel?"

I know name changes are common, especially when women marry. But it's typical for women who are well-known professionally (such as politicians) to keep using their old name, on business cards if not also in fact. I suppose the same thing happens with members of the peerage? -- Mwalcoff (talk) 00:36, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

I'm pretty certain that titles aren't used on official documents. HM's drivers' licence doesn't, I think, say "Queen Elizabeth II." It probably says either 'Elizabeth,' 'Elizabeth R' (R for Regina, queen, comparing with e.g. Charles signing his marriage register as Charles P), or 'Elizabeth Windsor' if her own ministry required a last name to be used. Further, if one is the sort to be addressing nobility by their title, one is likely to keep up to date on what the correct title is. → ROUX ₪ 00:46, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

Brenda doesn't have a driving licence. She does drive, but she doesn't have to have a licence. DuncanHill (talk) 00:51, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

Her name is Elizabeth. And actually, "For her private use The Queen drives a Daimler Jaguar saloon or a Vauxhall estate. Like every other qualified driver, The Queen holds a driving licence." (from an old version of royal.gov.uk; since they have changed their site layout I have no idea where to find the same page now, it was page5022.asp). → ROUX ₪ 01:01, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

She's my Queen, I'll call her what I damn well please, as is every Englishman's right! Our article states she does not require a driving licence, reference is to a 2003 press release from DVLA, not now available on the web. DuncanHill (talk) 01:09, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

My Queen too, actually, twice. And 'is not required' is not the same as 'does not have.' She is likewise not required to pay taxes on her income, but she does anyway. And I would take what the royal website has to say about such a mundane detail, particularly when it unequivocally states that she does indeed possess one, over a press release that says merely she is not required to have one. → ROUX ₪ 01:15, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

Prince William has a driver's license. Wonder what it says. -- Mwalcoff (talk) 01:21, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

I would imagine it says William Wales, following the precedent he set at school and in the Forces, and the apparent (new) tradition of the younger royals using their father's territorial designation as a functional last name when needed. → ROUX ₪ 01:28, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

It raises an interesting point though. I presume she got her licence before becoming Queen. But if she had to sit a re-test (are these sometimes needed above 70? The UK licencing website doesn't seem top suggest so) how would the tester feel about failing her? Nil Einne (talk) 12:58, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

(ec)Driving licences don't have a person's noble title on them, Henry Arundel's would have "Henry Miles Fitzalan-Howard" on it. Also, courtesy titles (like Lord Maltravers, or Earl of Arundel) are just that - matters of courtesy. He isn't really the Earl of Arundel, it's just that the courtesy of England calls him that. If you had such a person's phone number, the chances are you'd also know when his father, grandfather or whoever died and his title changed. I suspect the Norfolks have someone to answer most calls - and friends would just call him Henry (or Harry, or Hal, or whatever his friends call him). If you meet a nob, and aren't quite sure how to address him, just ask - if they mind being asked, they aren't proper nobs. DuncanHill (talk) 00:49, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

Here's a Charlie Rose interview of Henry's late grandfather and his grandmother. Rose asks, "In London, what do people call you?" The duke responds, "Well, they call me Miles!" That said, I wonder where he would be listed in the phone book if he was in the phone book? (You'd be surprised at the people who you'd think would be unlisted that are actually in there.) -- Mwalcoff (talk) 01:21, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

From personal experience, in social settings proper nobs introduce themselves by their forename. titles tend to be reserved for formal occaisions, e.g. opening fêtes or being patrons of charities. DuncanHill (talk) 01:26, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

QE2 drove during WW2 in aid of the war effort, while a mere Princess. She presumably had a driver's license. Did it say "Princess Elizabeth," "Elizabeth Windsor," or what? When she became Queen in the early 1950's did she surrender her driver's license, get a new one, or what? Edison (talk) 04:19, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

Already answered that, above. → ROUX ₪ 04:39, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

If Chales and his children use Wales as a surname, and other nobles can use the place that they are lord of as a surname, presumably Elizabeth can use "United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland" as a surname. I wonder how many characters are allowed on British drivers licences. —Arctic Gnome (talk • contribs) 05:07, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

Or indeed "Elizabeth Canada". Or "Elizabeth Tuvalu". Etc. Ghmyrtle (talk) 08:44, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

What's all this "license" rubbish? UK people have licences. James Bond's Licence to Kill retained the UK spelling even for the US market. -- Jack of Oz ... speak! ... 05:51, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

Next time you're talking about something that happened in China, I'll expect you'll describe it in Chinese and not your own native language?APL (talk) 06:09, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

Not at all.  :) -- Jack of Oz ... speak! ... 10:02, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

Ha! And I always thought they made a spelling error on my DVD box! Googlemeister (talk) 13:16, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

and by the way, they're "driving licences" not "driver's licences". --ColinFine (talk) 22:50, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

That depends on where you are. The Ministry of Transportation of Ontario uses "driver's licence". —Arctic Gnome (talk • contribs) 21:02, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

That is surprising. The spelling of "licence", I mean. I assumed Canada follows US custom in such matters. -- Jack of Oz ... speak! ... 05:48, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

The Canadians I've known and worked with typically spell the British way (colour, favour, etc.) and also say PRO-gress and SHED-ule instead of PRAH-gress and SKED-ule as Americans do. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 08:02, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Mel Gibson

Why was he not mentioned in the Wkipedia on famous Actors or Entertainment Celebrities. I fact probably the most famous, even more than Nicol Kidman and Errol Flynn. Is it due to his recent notoriety?

Thanks.

Mathew Dickson —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.71.93.67 (talk) 14:42, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

Where, specifically, are you looking? Wikipedia has a great many lists of actors, organized on various topics. Depending on where you looked, Mel Gibson may not meet the criteria appropriate for Nicole Kidman or Errol Flynn. I find it unlikely that he's excluded because of "recent notoriety"; Wikipedia is not censored and covers many socially uncomfortable topics. — Lomn 14:47, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

Strangely, we have many Lists of actors by nationality but no List of American film actors (it was deleted recently) and no List of Australian film actors.

Mel Gibson is listed at List of film and television directors, btw. WikiDao ☯ (talk) 15:23, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

A search currently finds 10 articles mentioning Nicole Kidman and Errol Flynn but not Mel Gibson. None of them are called anything resembling "famous Actors or Entertainment Celebrities" so I don't know what you refer to. PrimeHunter (talk) 20:25, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

• 10 articles with all three names
• 83 with Nicole and Mel but not Errol
• 12 with Mel and Errol but not Nicole

WikiDao ☯ (talk) 20:37, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

Well List of stars on the Hollywood Walk of Fame may be close in concept even if not in name, but Mel Gibson not being there is not our fault Nil Einne (talk) 01:44, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

Name of small tropical island inhabited by caucasian/European descendants

I am trying to find the name of a small tropical island inhabited my descendants of fair Europeans. They fish for lobster and do quite well. They marry young and build very nice mini mansions on the island. The men leave the island during lobster season. The people of the island are religious and attend the local church. The island may be in the Caribbean and the second part of the island's name may be Cay or Cays. 67.186.184.116 (talk) 16:00, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

Pitcairn Islands, populated by descendants of the Bounty mutineers and the Tahitians? Haus^Talk 16:07, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

Cayman Islands? Googlemeister (talk) 16:49, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

I just found it. It is Spanish Wells, Bahamas. Thanks anyway.67.186.184.116 (talk) 17:15, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

Our article is at Spanish Wells. It is worth noting that at 25°4′N, it is not quite tropical. Most of the Bahamas is subtropical, though those Out Islands south of George Town, Exuma are tropical. -- 124.157.218.132 (talk) 04:54, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

poem rest of the words and name and author

"i've a wee dead frog in alcohol, but he really isn't a frog at all. He's a prince enchanted, who can not tell the magic word to break the spell. Maybe he earned the wrath of witches by laying drunken in the ditches, maybe —Preceding unsigned comment added by Memoriestgs (talk • contribs) 16:31, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

I can't answer the question, but a Google Books search finds the phrase "wee dead frog in alcohol" on page 26 of Columbia Poetry volume 1932, published by Columbia University in 1936. It's possible that the author was somebody named Hall, but that might be wrong. Looie496 (talk) 18:51, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

Material Things

If I were to compile a list of, say, 42 material things, what would be at the top? Some qualifiers: a pair of socks is 1 material thing (as well as other 'pairs,' like shoes); some things belong to other things, i.e. 100 books is 1 material thing or 25 pencils is 1 material thing. Lastly, if I were to compile a list of currently-owned material things and wished to rid myself of some of these burdens, what would be a good route of dispossession? Also, any relevant articles I can be pointed to? Thanks Wikipedians! schyler (talk) 19:18, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

What would be at the top? Really, you're going to have to give us a little more to go on, Schyler. What sort of criterion are you using? Alphabetic order? Cost? Volume? Usefulness? Weight? Edibility? Wearability? Availability? -- Jack of Oz ... speak! ... 19:44, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

For dispossessing things, consider charitable giving (see article) which includes the act of giving money or goods to the unfortunate. Cuddlyable3 (talk) 22:03, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

One fashionable neologism is decluttering, which lacks a Wikipedia article but you can Google it if you want to read many articles with tips on ridding yourself of clutter. Comet Tuttle (talk) 23:35, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

I'm not sure if this is what you are getting at, but orders of magnitude states "various sources estimate the total number of fundamental particles in the observable universe in the range 10⁸⁰ to 10⁸⁵" - so, provided you count fundamental particles as material things, that is the largest quantity that can exist of any material thing. Warofdreams talk 01:23, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

Well, no. That's just in the observable universe. There could be many more things than that; they're just causally disconnected from us. --Trovatore (talk) 07:58, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

It rather depends on your definition of material things, but you have a point. Warofdreams talk 22:20, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Jack, you're right. "At the top" would mean to me the most necessary, like underwear, a pair of shoes (arguable) and hygienic products (one material thing). "Necessary," that is, where I live; walking on concrete without shoes is uninviting. I am about to do that Google search you mentioned Comet Tuttle, thanks. schyler (talk) 03:24, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

The answer will, of course, be culturally dependent. You might be interested in seeing Peter Menzel's 1994 photo essay Material World: A Global Family Portrait. -- 124.157.218.132 (talk) 04:26, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

Food, then clothing, then shelter.--Shantavira|^{feed me} 08:27, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

The last two may depend on what type of shelter and what type of clothing. In the dead of winter in Alaska, I would guess a heated or very well insulated house would be better or more important then a t-shirt and short pants. Nil Einne (talk) 12:52, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

Freecycle or Freegle are good places to give unwanted things away on. In the UK there are many charity shops, but I think they are sometimes deluged with stuff that they cannot sell. If you just left things outside your home with a sign saying they were free to take, they would probably disapear quickly. In the UK there are companies that collect unwanted clothing and (apparantly) sell them on to the third-world. It woyuld be better not just to give things away, but to give them away to where they are most needed. 92.24.178.5 (talk) 11:11, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

What do monks or nuns have? Apart from the religious things, they would probably be the essentials. 92.24.178.5 (talk) 11:20, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

One could always be a "Fool for Christ" and give it all away... WikiDao ☯ (talk) 00:43, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

I think Maslow's hierarchy of needs and related articles are probably of interest to you. AlmostReadytoFly (talk) 11:57, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

October 23

Towel bars in bathroom design

These days homes usually have two full bathrooms, sometimes more, so fewer occupants are sharing the same bathroom. In older constructions, there's one bathroom for the whole family, so five or six people may need to share the same bathroom. However, there's usually only one pre-installed towel bar. That seems to be an obvious design flaw. But how could it be so common? Did people not hang their towels in the bathroom when those homes were built? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.114.146.113 (talk) 09:08, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

I have to disagree. There probably aren't many bathrooms in DR Congo for example. 92.24.178.5 (talk) 11:42, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

In our house,there was one hand towel hung up for everyone to use.It was changed every day,the spares were kept in an airing cupboard.If you wanted a bath,you got the first clean bath sheet out of the airing cupboard and used that.Hotclaws (talk) 12:44, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

As in many other areas, people had to be more creative and cooperative. If you've only got one towel rack and multiple towels you can do things like fold the towels vertically before hanging them, or bunching them up once on the rack. Of course you don't really want to hang a wet towel like that, so you need to dry it elsewhere, outside or on an airing rack. --jjron (talk) 14:42, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

We hang our towels on the shower curtain rail, there is easily enough room there, and they can be taken down when the shower is in use. 148.197.121.205 (talk) 19:19, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

I have seen in stores multiple towel bars which hang from the official installed towel bar. Towel bars can also easily be installed on the inside of the wooden bathroom door. Folding damp towels up to fit several on one towel bar would invite mildew. Edison (talk) 20:02, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

Does the OP assume that in bygone days every member of a family had his or her own towel(s)? People shared towels back then. (Some still do.) — Michael J 22:06, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

Agree that one towel in the bathroom, used by whomever took a bath or shower on a given day, was likely many decades ago. Edison (talk) 04:15, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

(OP posting from another IP) I didn't know that people used to share towels in a family. It seems like such a bad idea. If one family member has a skin infection, it could spread to the others through the towel. Also, the person who gets "second dip" of a towel gets a damp towel, which feels cold when it touches your skin. It's not very pleasant. --173.49.9.250 (talk) 12:29, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Yes, there was a risk of cross-infection, but as to the damp towel... People did not bathe as often, so it would be quite possible for different members of the household to have different bath nights, and so have a dry towel. Less possible when heating the water for the bath was a big deal, and so people tended to share bathwater too. In those times, people would typically wash daily using a bowl of (possibly cold) water and a flannel, either individual or (for poorer households) shared. If your choice is between washing at all, or not washing, concerns about contagious skin diseases have to go by the wayside. 86.163.212.182 (talk) 17:48, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

aminoglycosides

how does genetic variation affect aminoglycosides side effects?41.138.174.168 (talk) 18:49, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

Why did you post this question again 10 minutes after posting it the first time? Were you expecting an instant response? -- Jack of Oz ... speak! ... 20:34, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

And you should have posted it on the Science ref desk? Rojomoke (talk) 22:59, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

No i wasn't. Did not do it intentionallay, new here. sorry.41.138.174.102 (talk) 23:03, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

Do you mean genetic variation of the bacteria or the host? Millions and millions of bacteria, generating millions more offspring at rate X and generating mutations at every reproduction can lead to enough genetic variation that at least some of them can make it through the killing effect of the antibiotic in question if it is not potent enough to kill of the bacteria -- perhaps that's a quick and easy response, if not perhaps somewhat inaccurate for the sake of time. DRosenbach ^{(Talk | Contribs)} 00:31, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

The general topic you should look at is pharmacogenetics. A known side effect of aminoglycoside antibiotics is hearing loss, and a mitochondrial DNA mutation called A1555G significantly increases the risk of developing hearing loss in people exposed to aminoglycosides. Keep in mind that this is a very rare genetic variant. There may be other more common genetic variants that subtly influence the risk for side effects. --- Medical geneticist (talk) 01:33, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

i meant genetic variation of the host, how it increases the occurance of the side effects. okay, i'l look up pharmacogenetics. thank you for the help.41.138.174.231 (talk) 12:19, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

USS Valley Forge LPH-8 ships log for the year beginning Jan.30,1969 to Sept. 30,1969

I am trying to find the date that the USS Valley Forge LPH-8 anchored in Da Nang Harbor, and allowed ships company to dis-embark for a Party. I think the name of the beach was "White Beach" Ships company was divided into three liberty sections. We were taken on shore for a cookout and party for some R&R. I am trying to find what day and date that happened. I would think that somewhere in the ships log, that would be noted. Thank you

I'm not sure how you get the imformation back to me, but my e-mail address is <Removed> 71.55.178.67 (talk) 22:00, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

You'll have to come back here for any responses. We don't leave email addresses on this page to save you from spam. Rojomoke (talk) 23:04, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

Logs older than 30 years but dated later than 1941 are available from:

Modern Military Branch, National Archives
8601 Adelphi Road,
College Park, MD 20740-6001 
Telephone (301) 837-3510

Cheers. Haus^Talk 23:47, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

October 24

Islam vs. White slaves

Lion's Blood and Zulu Heart are books dealing with White slaves from Europe and non-whites being rulers and slave owners. Is there any books that has this thing? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.92.152.204 (talk) 01:59, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Well, we have an article on Islam and slavery that you may be interested to read. WikiDao ☯ (talk) 03:18, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Mr. 65's looking for Alternate history stories where Africans come out ahead of Europeans. [2] is generally a pretty good place to look for alternate history stuff. Relatives, by George Alec Effinger, is described as a world where "Europe never colonized Africa or America". "Bula Matari. La pantera y el escarabajo" is about an Africa where Carthage isn't wiped out by Rome, and the Zulus become powerful. "The Lions are Asleep This Night" talks about African slaves in America rebelling early, leading to a white decline worldwide. Buddy431 (talk) 03:49, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

As our article explains, up until the nineteenth century the Barbary corsairs, operating out of North Africa, frequently raided European villages in order to capture Christian slaves for the African market. The sailors they captured were also usually sold into slavery. Miguel de Cervantes, the author of Don Quixote, spent five years as a slave in Algiers after being captured by pirates. Byron's hero Don Juan also becomes a slave in Istanbul in the course of his adventures. Looie496 (talk) 04:26, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

For northern Europe, see Sack of Baltimore, The Turkish abductions, etc. AnonMoos (talk) 07:57, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

The Islam and slavery page doesn't mention the Ottoman practice of Devşirme, which was a tax levied on Christian families; their eldest son was enslaved at the age of 10. Not very popular that one. Alansplodge (talk) 08:50, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

We also have an article about Arab slave trade which may be informative. It needs work. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Zoonoses (talk • contribs) 16:36, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Is there a Harrison Ford dealership in any city named Harrison?

See Harrison. There are several cities named that. Are there Ford auto dealerships in the towns named Harrison? If so, are they named Harrison Ford? --70.179.178.5 (talk) 03:35, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

So far, the closest I've found is a Cronin Ford in Harrison, Ohio but I've only looked at those "Harrison"s listed in the US. You can take your list and go to Google Maps. Type in "Ford dealerships near" and then enter the town name. Dismas|^(talk) 03:50, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

There's T.C. Harrison Ford in the U.K. -- Mwalcoff (talk) 04:01, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

There also used to be a Harrison Ford in Melton, Australia, but now they only sell Toyotas. -- Mwalcoff (talk) 04:02, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

There's a Harrison Ford Mercury dealership in Wellington, OH... --Ludwigs2 04:28, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Dave Letterman sometimes says that he bought his first car from a Harrison Ford dealership in Indiana (probably not in a town named Harrison, though). AnonMoos (talk) 07:55, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Here are quite a few of them. --Sean 15:30, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

On a related note, Canberra, Australia has two suburbs planned called Harrison and Forde quite close to each other.[3] Someone is really happy that they got away with it. Steewi (talk) 01:54, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Plop, plop, fizz fizz

Oh, what a relief it is!

I have no scientific proof of this but I can tell you that it's incredibly noticeable. Fresca loses its fizz much faster than other sodas. Anyone know why? Something to do with the flavorings?--141.155.156.196 (talk) 04:08, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Could someone explain this shirt?

I don't understand the significance of what someone's shirt says. The video that I'm getting this from is here (20 seconds in and then repeated throughout).

The front of the shirt reads:

M.S. Golden Dragon

Shanghai, China

76 Persons

9.4M x 3.5M

Lifeboat No.2

Thanks, Dismas|^(talk) 05:28, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

I assume it refers to the Motor Ship Golden Dragon, which is regustered in Shanghai. It further relates to one of several lifeboats. This is number 2. It holds 76 persons and is 9.6 x 3.5 metres long and wide. Why these facts are blazoned on a T shirt I do not know, but lots of odd things are put on shirts.Froggie34 (talk) 12:33, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

My guess is it would be some sort of memorial, perhaps for a sunk boat where someone he knew was lost, but I have no idea of the incident and could find nothing in a quick search. For example in Australia some survivors and families of those lost in the 2002 Bali bombings got 202/88 tattoos or had this symbol put on clothing, etc (this symbolised the number of total deaths/Australian deaths) which wouldn't mean much to anyone that didn't know, and I've heard of similar things as memorials for 9/11. Looking at the T-shirt, it hardly looks like just a random fashion design, but it may be that too. But as I say I'm just guessing. --jjron (talk) 15:43, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Could it be from a batch of samples where the manufacturers just printed whatever they could find on it? I saw some shirts with somewhat strange wording in a discount retailer here in NZ, I'm not sure but I think these were some sort of samples, although they had details which were more suggestive of that. On the other hand since the person wearing it is appears to be a fairly unconventional artsy type it may just be a random fashion design. Nil Einne (talk) 16:52, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

What do we think about the patch on his left arm? Was that originally part of the shirt, or did Mr. Paterson sew that on himself? Otherwise, I'm willing to buy the "unconventional artsy type" explanation. The letters look like they could have been applied himself; they look shiny, like some sort of iron on material, rather than printed or sewn on. Buddy431 (talk) 02:34, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Strange, the text reads like something you'd expect to be printed on the #2 lifeboat itself. Perhaps it's just supposed to be some sort of absurdist out of place text. I've seen shirts that are just the ingredients off a Coca-Cola bottle.

But it seems more likely that he's trying to draw attention to some incident. (Especially since the shirt looks homemade.) Google searches show me that there's been a number of ships named "Golden Dragon". (One sank in 1656.) Here's a Youtube video of the US Coast Guard rescuing people off of a boat named "Golden Dragon" that looks like it might fit those measurements. APL (talk) 03:27, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Could it fit 76 people? I'm not so sure looking at the video. Are the measurements actually supposed to be for the original ship or the life boat? Nil Einne (talk) 11:39, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

imagination visualize

You know when books or therapists say "close your eyes and visualize a lovely peaceful day with sunshine bla bla bla" I close my eyes and see nothing. Do normal people actually see the sunny day or whatever they're told to visualize? I've tried and tried and I just see darkness. Do I lack an imagination? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 180.224.139.251 (talk) 09:57, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

As someone once said to me: "If you can't see the scene, just imagine what it would look like if you could see it". That works a treat. -- Jack of Oz ... speak! ... 11:25, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

I tend to see dazzles. But I presume the idea is to help you relax in any way that best suits you. Some people do have a visual memory, I am told, but I do not.Froggie34 (talk) 12:30, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

It doesn't mean you lack imagination. See mental image. Some people (especially children) are better at this than others. Practice can improve the ability.--Shantavira|^{feed me} 13:33, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

So some people can actually close their eyes and see something as though they were actually standing there looking at it? strange. I suppose it doesn't count if you screw your eyes up really tight and catch glimpses of random images in the bright glow? 148.197.121.205 (talk) 16:43, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Certainly. Although I think there are different forms of it. For example, if you are folding a net into a solid shape in your head, you might only be visualising the relevant information: for me, it ends up almost like drawing with glowing grey on black, and I label things with 'thought colours' rather than actual, real colours. Which is a bit hard to explain. On the other hand, especially when I'm on the boundary between sleeping and waking, I can indeed close my eyes and see something exactly as though I were actually standing there looking at it. Is it only the second of these that you are asking about, or do you experience neither of these? 86.163.212.182 (talk) 17:35, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

I agree with all that. My spatial imagination works fine for logic with 3D objects, but it isn't vivid. Every once in a while though, on the boundary of sleeping and waking, as you say, I'll imagine the most intensely realistic and detailed image, usually of a naked lady. These images seem to be filled with insights into proportions and subtle cues of realism (I'm an artist), but of course by the time I'm awake I am (mostly) unable to remember these insights, which makes me suspect the impression of realism might be greater than the actual correspondence of the image to reality, and the impression of detailedness might be greater than its actual level of detail. It's characteristic of the dreaming mind to fail to object to incongruity, and to accept facts (such as "I see detail") without testing them. 81.131.4.93 (talk) 21:31, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

For me, it's not about physically seeing a scene, it's about pretending I'm there. (Did you play "let's pretend" or "doctors and nurses" when you were a child?) I think of a time when I was actually on the beach, or walking in a wood or a garden or wherever it is, and try and remember it. It's like dreaming really. You try and remember the sensations: the warmth on your skin, the breeze on your face, the light in your eyes... if you don't have a visual memory, the sensations might help. --TammyMoet (talk) 20:45, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Everyone's different. I'm not so good at visualization (it's more that I know how things are arranged than that I see them in any visual sense), but I can play back entire conversations in my head, or remember large sections of symphonies, just as though I were listening to a CD (the down side is that when I do that I mostly lose track of my surroundings - faintly embarrassing if someone I know by). --Ludwigs2 21:03, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Individual sugar packets

Does anyone know why on individual sugar sachets/packets there's often a number on the back? E.g. in a Cafe yesterday I idly flicked through the bunch of sachets and there were some 8, some 7 some 9 etc. but they were all the same thing (White sugar). They always seem to be in the 1-15 number range so assumed not batch-numbers but maybe. Anyhoo, anybody? ny156uk (talk) 12:12, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Some sugar makers wrap catering sugar with interesting facts, games, scenes, etc. Sometimes a series of lump sugar can be assembled to make a larger picture (as in a jig saw). It is a marketing activity to add interest. With numbers one to fifteen a sixteen space random puzzle could be made. Then, by sliding, the numbered lumps could be moved into sequence.Froggie34 (talk) 12:28, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Most likely case is that, as Froggie34 mentioned, each packet has a fact/saying/etc. on them, and the number denotes which (saying 8 in the series, etc.). Another possibly is that it has to do with production lines. I know that with plastic pieces you often see otherwise identical pieces with different numbers molded into them. These are mold numbers - there is an array of identical molds to produce the piece, and each has a different number etched into them, so if there is a consistent defect in the parts, they know which mold is the culprit. This is also the reason for the series of raised dots at the bottom of glass bottles. -- 174.31.221.70 (talk) 18:05, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Need Help For My Dog.

My Dog is not eating his food for 10 days....i don't know why he is not eating....but help me out please as he is not eating his food he became a very thin.....my dog is a Pomeranian adult dog and his age is about 7 years....Waiting For answers..Rastogiakshay (talk) 13:28, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

It is impossible to say, but it is important that you take your dog to a vet immediately.--Shantavira|^{feed me} 13:34, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Web md has an article on it. Albacore (talk) 14:25, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Note the linked ref says "Even though most dogs can go a couple of days without food without significant repercussions, it is best to address the problem as early as possible." Nil Einne (talk) 11:35, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

data entry jobs

Hey I'm looking for data entry jobs --preferably within New York-- i can do from home. Anybody who knows of any can give me a link. I'm only getting transcription jobs. Anybody with a trusted work from home legit job link please help. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 41.212.86.244 (talk) 14:21, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

metallic fastners (nuts)

When did the heagonal nut debut? Square nut vs hex nut in terms of years? I always assumed the square was first and not just a financial decission-unlike today some items are supplied with crude square nuts. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.224.114.29 (talk) 15:22, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

This forum thread claims that hex heads were used in the 15th century for armour, but sadly doesn't give a source to back it up. It does establish that hex nuts date back to at least the 1830s though (with James Nasmyth inventing a milling machine for them). the wub "?!" 21:37, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

enfield 303 No.4 rifle

I would like to know what the small auxiliry spring in the magazine is for in this rifle.

 Philip Atkinson--90.196.122.244 (talk) 16:20, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

That's a fairly specialized question, and may require a specialist to answer (I don't even know to what small auxiliary spring in the magazine you may be referring). In the meantime, though, we do have a general article on the Lee Enfield No. 4 Rifle. WikiDao ☯ (talk) 16:37, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

I have a WWII Home Guard manual. Apparently the Rifle No 4 magazine is identical to the Rifle No 1 Mk III (the classic SMLE). There is a paragraph describing "To remove magazine platform and spring for cleaning" and another, "To replace magazine platform and spring". Is this the spring that you're asking about? It sits under a steel plate in the mag and pushes the rounds upwards. Sorry, I can't find a reference to any other magazine spring. Alansplodge (talk) 22:02, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Metal in bones in airport security

If you have had surgery where your bones have been fixed with metal, does it set off the metal detectors at airport security? JIP | Talk 18:08, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Personal research, but no, definitely no with a titanium hip joint. Richard Avery (talk) 18:12, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

My Grandpa has a metal knee, which does set off the metal detectors. He has a doctor's note, and has to get waved with a hand-held detector going through security. Buddy431 (talk) 19:57, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

It depends on the type and site of implants, the number of implants, and the sensitivity setting used on the metal detector at the airport. Small plates, nails, and screws used for fracture fixation tend not to trigger detectors, but larger or more extensive implants, prosthetics, or joint replacements may raise flags. See Basu, Packer & Himstedt "Detection of Orthopaedic Implants by Airport Metal Detectors" J. Bone Joint Surg. (1997). TenOfAllTrades(talk) 13:47, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

It was the small plates, nails, and screws used for fracture fixation that concerned me. If it's true that they don't trigger the metal detectors then I'm happy with that. JIP | Talk 18:21, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Well, I can't make any guarantees; the level of paranoia has been rather high during the last decade, and objects that used to pass without comment now trigger secondary screening. Generally the smaller and deeper the metal object is (and the less ferromagnetic — so titantium is likely going to be less detectable than steel) the less likely it is you'll get caught. That said, it's no big deal if your surgical pins do trip the magnetometer. The security staff will generally just 'wand' you, and you can explain the location of any metallic implants. They're used to it. It helps if you're wearing loose-fitting clothing so that you can show them you're not concealing anything (and they can see you have a surgical scar), or you're good to go if you don't mind a brief pat-down. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 19:05, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

The technology is much different in different airports. An item may set off bells at DAC and sail through YYZ, or vice versa. Haus^Talk 19:33, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

fictional war

some time ago an entire fictional war was created and given an article on wikipedia as a huge hoax. Does anyone know what this was and where I can find out about it? 148.197.121.205 (talk) 21:43, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Teenagers make up things on Wikipedia every day; most hoax articles are deleted in a matter of seconds or minutes. Can you tell us anything more- like where you heard about this article? Was it covered on a TV news show, or written about in a newspaper that you read? -FisherQueen (talk · contribs) 21:45, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

I read about in on here somewhere. it was famous, apparently, stayed there for months before anyone noticed it had never happened. 148.197.121.205 (talk) 21:47, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

I found [Upper Peninsula War]; could that be the article you are thinking of? -FisherQueen (talk · contribs) 21:48, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Blast, beaten to it! That was what immediately sprung to my mind as well. Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Upper Peninsula War has discussion of it, and further research establishing that it was indeed a hoax. the wub "?!" 21:51, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

BTW if you are thinking of that, the article in question was created on 2 May [4], prodded with the suggestion it probably didn't exist on 7 May [5], nominated for deletion on 9 May [6] (although mention it may not be real was removed in the process), properly labelled as a probable hoax on 11 May [7] and finall deleted because of the AFD [8] and then moved as a result of a request on 15 May [9]. It was recreated a few times later although I don't know how long it lasted each time (my guess is not long). So it's not true the article existed for months undetected. Nil Einne (talk) 05:01, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Remove before flight

Hi all,

I work in an airport and I often see passengers or pilots having a key ring attached to their bag reading 'remove before flight'. I've also seen it on lanyards. It obviously has a link with aviation, but what it is? Could you maybe create a article with pictures about it? Thanks a lot. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.113.106.151 (talk) 23:30, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

It comes from various covers and things that need to be removed before the aircraft is to fly but are used when the aircraft is in storage. For instance, there is often a cover on the pitot tube that keeps dust and other crud out while the aircraft is in the hanger. These covers must be removed before flight, so they have big tags on them that say "Remove before flight". Dismas|^(talk) 23:48, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

I don't see how that would apply to "a key ring attached to their bag".--Shantavira|^{feed me} 08:51, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Because it becomes a bit of kitsch. It's the same as someone having a key ring that says NYFD. They're probably not actually part of the New York Fire Department but they think it looks cool. Someone with a "remove before flight" key ring is probably just an aircraft enthusiast or an actual pilot. Dismas|^(talk) 10:50, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

It's just become a piece of daft aviation culture, and appears on all kinds of things, including (fnarr fnarr) underwear -- Finlay McWalter ☻ Talk 11:06, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

I've seen these key-fobs being given out at trade shows. Or rather, I've been at trade shows where these were being given out, but they're always gone by the time I get to that booth. They're definitely modeled on the flags that you see all over a parked airplane, but small enough to pocket. APL (talk) 22:26, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

The Cessna aircraft I learned to fly in 30-odd years ago had control locks, gadgets that kept the control surfaces from flopping around in the breeze. It was a challenge to take off with the control lock in place: It was big and red and said "Remove Before Flight" and obstructed the ignition switch. The Piper aircraft at the FBO next door had no such locks. Procedure was to haul the passenger-side yoke back and belay it with a seat belt. It was easy for a careless pilot to take off with the belt in place. Made for short flights. PhGustaf (talk) 22:50, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

As this guy found out [10]. He put the yoke lock on the co-pilot's control, and forgot to remove it, or do control range checks for fouled controls before taking off. Needless to say, alcohol was involved. CS Miller (talk) 09:27, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

October 25

Deli meat (turkey breast) vs. ground turkey breast (packaged)

How is it that the former costs $7-10 a pound, while the latter, with no added salt as an option, can cost just over $2 a pound and seems to come sliced as well. 67.243.7.240 (talk) 02:16, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

The price (usually) depends on the quality of the meat that goes into the product. Who knows what goes into the ground meat? Dbfirs 07:47, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Ground meat often contain a bit of filler too to make it mechanically stable, and it can use other, cheaper cuts of meat to produce. --antilived^{T | C | G} 07:50, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

It may contain mechanically separated meat.--Shantavira|^{feed me} 08:59, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Also the deli meat has been seasoned (probably marinated) and then cooked for hours; the ground meat is just flung into a grinder and ground up. Looie496 (talk) 22:26, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

How to open a bar/club in Australia?

How do you open or manage a bar or club in Australia? What are the steps, money, qualifications, licenses you need etc? --124.254.77.148 (talk) 10:04, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

A basic thing to know is that Australia is a federation of states, and alcohol/liquor licensing laws are a matter for each individual state. So, which state ? HiLo48 (talk) 10:08, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Victoria. --124.254.77.148 (talk) 10:18, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

OK. I certainly don't claim any particular expertise, but being familiar with names of local bodies, I can point you at this...

http://www.justice.vic.gov.au/wps/wcm/connect/DOJ+Internet/Home/Alcohol/

Let's know how you go. I could be your first customer! HiLo48 (talk) 10:37, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

I'd suggest going to a local bookstore. When my wife started her own business, there were guides available which detailed what agencies she needed to file with and what forms needed to be filed. I would suspect that an author in Australia would have created something similar. Dismas|^(talk) 10:45, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

A very useful site: Business Victoria. Will give you the answers to pretty much everything you've asked, or tell you where to look. --jjron (talk) 13:03, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Ancient square holes

Drilling a square hole in a metal plate becomes an expensive operation if the corner radii are to be small. I don't think they can be reduced to zero. If the Antikythera mechanism is correctly dated, square holes were made about 150-100 BCE but how? Cuddlyable3 (talk) 10:06, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

You need only drill one, or perhaps four, holes, and then square it off with a file. Anyone hoping to hand-make anything clockwork would have to be very skilled with a file. -- Finlay McWalter ☻ Talk 10:37, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Depending on the character and thickness of the metal, you could also achieve a square hole with a punch, although (particularly for precision work) drill-and-file is more likely. In a modern workshop you could use a punch press, but that requires pressures that classical Greek workers couldn't really have developed. -- Finlay McWalter ☻ Talk 10:46, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Indeed, I can do these things but only because a tool shop sells me drills, files and punches made of tool steel which was hard to come by in ancient Greece.Cuddlyable3 (talk) 08:30, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

I don't know a lot about steel, tool steel or otherwise. But it seems that Wootz steel, Crucible steel, and other apparently high quality steels (for ancient times) were available in Greece around the time of the Antikythera mechanism. Certainly there was a high volume of trade between the Greek and Indian worlds at the time. Would this level of quality suffice? Pfly (talk) 09:36, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

I'll bet they drilled a round hole and used a file to square it off. They would have used a file for the teeth of the gears anyway. Very painstaking work. APL (talk) 16:17, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

buehler turboccraft litature

I viewed file no. buehler64009,jpg. I could not read the specifications shown as they were too blurry. Can I somehow get a larger or clearer picture, or have you email me the specs??? Thanks [email removed] —Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.101.88.60 (talk) 16:00, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

I can't find that file in either wikipedia or wikicommons. Can you give us the exact file name you were looking at? Rojomoke (talk) 18:46, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

If the information is about a product of Bühler Motor in Germany, that corporation has a website at www.buehlermotor.com that includes contacts for information. Here are pictures of buehler turbocraftand a full description of one model. Cuddlyable3 (talk) 08:25, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

NCAA Football, LSU vs Georgia 2010

LSU at the end of the game scored. LSU (2010) lines up for a two point try after a touchdown. They try, but miss; but then the officals count the defenders and fine 13 defensive players on the field. They called it illegal substitution and award another try to LSU with ball now on the 1-1/2 yard line. LSU makes the two points and wins.

Do the rules require the referees to stop the play before the first try, or should they drop the flag and let the play go on, and then assess the penalty, ( if the offense wants it ), after the play, like they do with off-sides.  ? ?

R. D. O'Connor —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.199.236.78 (talk) 17:10, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Looking online, it seems there is a bit of confusion over whether illegal substitution is a dead ball foul or a live ball foul. In that particular instance, however, the referees did not know that Georgia had 13 mean on the field until they reviewed the play, so in theory, it should have been illegal participation which is a 15 yard penalty. But, since it was on a 2 point conversion, it would be accessed as half the distance to the goal. Basically, it depends on when the refs see that there are more than 11 people on the field. If there is just one person running off the field and they didn't quite make it, the ref throws the flag, but lets the play go before they enforce the penalty, making it a live ball foul. Tex (talk) 17:59, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

LSU and Georgia don't play in the 2010 regular season (see here for LSU's schedule and here for Georgia's). Are you thinking about LSU vs Tennessee 2010 (recap here)? In that game there was a controversial last second illegal participation call that gave LSU a final chance to score the go-ahead touchdown. I don't think that in general coaches like to make any last-second intentional penalties just to get a look at the defensive scheme. Those kinds of things will tend to backfire more often than not. --- Medical geneticist (talk) 23:12, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

This is a tricky question. From my understanding, in the NCAA, if there are 12 men in the huddle, the refs are supposed to immediately blow the whistle and assess a 5-yard penalty for illegal substitution. However, if a team manages to start a play with 12 or more men on the field without the refs throwing a flag ahead of time, it is illegal participation, which is a 15-yard live-ball foul. Because the extra Tennessee players ran on the field right before the play started, the refs did not blow it dead ahead of time. -- Mwalcoff (talk) 23:34, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Yes, sorry, it was Tennessee. I must have just said Georgia because the OP did. Tex (talk) 19:23, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Becoming an engineer in the UK

What are the differences between M.Eng and B.Eng? I know that M.Eng is a year longer and enough to become a chartered engineer without further education, but that omits everything about how things work in practice. My country's system isn't similar so I have no idea. --62.142.167.134 (talk) 18:48, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

One is graduate level (i.e. standard university degree level) and one is post-graduate (i.e. generally requires a degree to be able to take the course). The Master of engineering is 'higher' (scholarly speaking). As for what difference one of the other makes in practice i'm not sure - but a quick search of the jobs market for engineering should let you see how 'standard' a requirement one or the other (if either) is. ny156uk (talk) 20:33, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Actually, the MEng is a master's degree but not a postgraduate qualification (a complexity of the UK system). My advice is to aim for the MEng, because if you want to be an engineer, you want to be a chartered one. Even if you enrol first for the BEng you will probably want to take the further year for MEng. For more advice, ask the universities - they will be very happy to advise an international student. Itsmejudith (talk) 22:16, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

NCAA Football, LSU vs Giorgia 2010

Part II

Thank you Tex (talk) 17:59, 25 October 2010 (UTC) for your answer on the two point try. So if I am the coach for the defense on the extra point, then you set up to go for two, I would be smart to take 5 off and put in 6.

• If I get caught before the play starts I loose 1 1/2 yards but I got a sneak peak at your formation. Right ?
• If I do not get caught and the offense makes it anyhow; then so what ?
• If I do not get caught and we stop the 2 points; we win. !
• If the offense fails and then I get caught, well they get 1 1/2 yards and a second play. But we have had an almost free look and may have seen your secret play !

From now on I think I will play the 2 point conversion with twelve men ! See OU vs MU game 10-23-10 to see how GOOD it works for the defense. ! Solution : Drop the flag (like off-sides) let them play. then the penalty if needed. Even if the refrees saw the extra players on the field in the LSU game; I think the no-call, let-them-play is the best punishment for the Defense. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.199.236.78 (talk) 22:53, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

I've fixed your formatting above. I don't think your plan will work. Firstly, if you have 12 in the huddle, the refs are supposed to throw a flag within a few seconds of you breaking the huddle. If the refs allow the play to go on, you're essentially giving the offense two chances to convert -- the second from the 1.5-yard line. A better idea would be to call a timeout after the other team lines up. -- Mwalcoff (talk) 23:40, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Also you shouldn't assume that the play you got a look at is the one that will be run. From three yards out, most teams will pass; from one-and-a-half, the quarterback sneak is a viable option. Knowing that the QB sneak is coming is not a lot of help in stopping it, either. --Trovatore (talk) 07:19, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Malfunctioning smoke alarm

I've got a problem: the smoke alarm in my corridor is malfunctioning. It's old (it came with the house) and doesn't go cheep-cheep-cheep like the new white ones, but emits a loud, low BLAAARE at intervals, and it is the worst sound you could hear in the middle of the night, scaring the sh*t out of you. Pressing reset just makes it madder, and even though I had been up since 5 the previous day I immediately didn't feel like sleeping anymore that night. When I tried to remove it in the morning I found a nasty surprise: it was connected directly to the house's power supply, and obviously I don't want to cut the wire. My question is: why would it be malfunctioning? It is connected to the house power supply so it's not saying there's no battery. This was about 2 in the morning so no one had been showering or cooking for a few hours. Also, how can I disconnect it or disable it or remove it? Thanks —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.92.78.167 (talk) 23:52, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Mine is connected to the mains and has a battery; the battery is there so the detector works during a power cut (and runs flat even though there isn't one). Open it and replace the battery - it's probably either a couple of AAs or a single 9V PP3. -- Finlay McWalter ☻ Talk 00:02, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Smoke detectors do not last forever. Airborne contaminants build up in the ionization chamber making it more likely to go off accidentally. Supposedly the electronic componants can also become less reliable. (Contrary to popular belief nuclear decay is not a major factor in smoke detector aging. AM has a half-life of centuries. )

You're supposed to replace them every 10 years. I'm afraid I don't know how to disconnect it from the mains, though. You might consider asking at a hardware store (When you buy the replacement!). APL (talk) 03:11, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

What Finlay says: Replace the back-up battery. Make sure all the mains connectors are secure before replacing the unit, otherwise the battery will continue to drain. Mine has a faint but steady green light on the underside to indicate it's working properly. If that doesn't work replace the whole unit.--Shantavira|^{feed me} 08:26, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

If it's older than ten years (and it sounds like it is) you should replace it regardless of whether or not you can figure out a way to shut it up. The light just indicates that the thing is active, it doesn't necessarily indicate that it will successfully detect a fire. APL (talk) 15:54, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Ditto all the above. FWIW, I've had better luck with mine since I started giving them regular passes with the vacuum cleaner. Matt Deres (talk) 13:20, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

It doesn't have a backup battery: I opened it up and checked :( —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.92.78.167 (talk) 23:32, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

October 26

Doubtful paramedic story

Hello my uncle is a paramedic and recently told me a story that I very much doubt. He was telling me that recently he had responded to a call and upon arriving at the house and being let in by a hysterical wife he found someone on the ground bleeding profusly, after bringing him to the ambulence the man started to cough out his a large amount of blood and some organ or something. I dont remember what he told me it was that affected this poor gentleman but I would like some help proving or disproving this story, thanks. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Beenrunman (talk • contribs) 01:16, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Would it not have been some form of clotted blood, rather than an organ? Dbfirs 07:09, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Coughing is a process that involves the lungs and associated airways. Coughing is a reflex or concious action to clear the airways of an obstruction or irritation. The lungs, bronchi, trachea and pharynx are a self-contained system that do not have or give access to any other organ system - except at the throat where it shares a common orifice with the digestive system. Clearly it is not possible for another organ to enter the lungs from below (so to speak) so it is difficult to see how any other organ could have been coughed out. It is not unknown for people who have a serious distressing cough to vomit as they strain to cough. Something vomited may have added to the idea that an organ was vomited. Finally I wonder what organ would or could be coughed out (if it were remotely possible) that did not cause a serious problem to the person. In my experience there are certain professions who have a fund of interesting stories with which to impress the awed listener. Interestingly there has been a report in southern England recently about the fallibility of the medical emergency services.[11] Richard Avery (talk) 07:55, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Your uncle would seem to be the person in the best position to give you the full details.--Shantavira|^{feed me} 08:43, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

I've heard this one before. What happened is that the patient either vomited or coughed up a blood clot. Sometimes a large clot will look like liver. Gross I know, but there you go. It's my experience that paramedics will keep a stock of these stories as Richard says, and will embellish them to suit the (usually gullible) audience. --TammyMoet (talk) 11:03, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

He told me today that it wasnt a bloodclot and that it was a kidney so I dont know if its true —Preceding unsigned comment added by Beenrunman (talk • contribs) 16:51, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

As mentioned above, there's really no process by which a kidney could find its way either into the lungs, or into the digestive system and be coughed or vomited up. He is most definitely adding horrible details that he hopes you'll believe. ~ mazca ^talk 17:17, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Concur with Mazca, this is utter rubbish. He is behaving unprofessionally and displaying a frightening level of ignorance - and you should tell him!! Richard Avery (talk) 17:43, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Sounds like the guy was coughing up a lung. Of course, coughing up a lung is just an expression for coughing uncontrollably. Googlemeister (talk) 18:24, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Unusual Rarity for Populous DS

Populous DS is only two years old yet it can't be found at many retail outlets in the United States. Why? Is it because the game was only given a very limited production run? --Arima (talk) 03:33, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

I think it just didn't sell very well. Two years would be long enough that most "box stores" like Best Buy would have phased it out unless it was popular. Gamestop dot com has it on sale for $15 new and $7 used. $15 is pretty cheap, even with shipping. APL (talk) 04:13, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Ah. Thanks, APL. I'm VERY glad to hear that it's still available online and at such a low price. --Arima (talk) 04:49, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Populous III world shape

The above question led me to read Populous:_The_Beginning, where I learn that the planet "is actually a real projective plane rather than a usual sphere". What shape is this, in practice? Apparently "The projective plane cannot be embedded in three-dimensional space. However, it can be immersed..." and Boy's surface is an example of this. Boy's surface looks like a horribly mutated cochlea. I'm fairly certain the planet-shape in Populous III can't be that complicated. 81.131.18.104 (talk) 09:11, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

The projective plane doesn't have to look that complicated. It only looks that strange when you try to immerse it in three-space. It's actually fairly easy to picture, without that requirement; it looks something like this:

   ------->>>---------
   |                 |
   |                 |
   v                 ^
   v                 ^
   v                 ^
   |                 |
   |                 |
   ------<<<---------

where you fold this thing up in such a way that the edges on opposite sides are glued together, with the directions of the arrows matching. Of course you can't do that in ordinary physical space, but that's not important right now. --Trovatore (talk) 09:38, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Oh, OK. So that's just a particular kind of wrapping-around. If it wasn't for the arrows thing it would result in what I think Civilization II called a "doughnut world"; and it's easy enough to incorporate the arrows into that concept. This would be fine for a 2D map, but the Populous game apparently models this planet in 3D, and even "allows the player to zoom out to see the entire world." There is a picture of this on the article: it looks round. I guess that's some kind of cheat, where a section of the map is projected onto a sphere? This only raises further problems, because projecting a flat surface onto a sphere (or hemisphere) causes severe distortion. Perhaps what's actually visible in zoomed-out view is not even a hemisphere, just a slight dome? 81.131.18.104 (talk) 09:57, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

12volt 110amp Liesure battery

Can anyone tell me why I can not use a car battery for a caravan in place of a liesure battery —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.26.73.134 (talk) 11:11, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Lead-acid batteries come in two designs. High-current and deep-discharge. A high-current battery can regularly withstand drains of 100amps (for a few seconds) without the plates buckling from the heat. A deep-discharge battery can withstand being fully discharged regularly without being damaged. A car battery is the former; they should never be allowed to go flat. CS Miller (talk) 11:47, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

... so the answer is that you could use the car battery, but you risk damaging it or at least shortening its life if you regularly allow it to discharge more than about half-way before recharging. Dbfirs 17:33, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

For confirmation about MAQ Oil & Gas company

Dear Sir,

Recently, I have received an contract agreement and an offer letter from MAQ Oil & Gas company. They had offer me 8000 US$ for the position of Civil Engineer. I would just like to know if this is fake.

Our Ref: MGASIA09542 Office Address: MAQ Oil & Gas (U.K.) Ltd. London Square, Cross Lanes Guildford, Surrey GU1 1UJ Phone: 44(0) 7031744579 Fax: 44(0) 709745607 Email: info@maqoils.com Website: www. maqoils.com

Thank you very much.,

Felovic Leal —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.98.123.19 (talk) 15:43, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

See the response to this kind of thing from MAQoils themselves [12], this is probably attempted fraud. Mikenorton (talk) 15:52, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Confusing that they quote two different URLs as the only valid domain.

"genuine correspondence from MAQ Oil & Gas originates from an maqoils.com domain"

"All our emails and internet pages are hosted via MAQ Oil & Gas.com. "

Rojomoke (talk) 17:07, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

knuckle popping

in some comics, I see characters who appear to clench their fingers without completing the fist, which appears to pop their knuckles. just out of curiosity, is that physically possible in real life? or are they doing some different? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.241.18.130 (talk) 16:01, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

I've known people that could do that. They could crack their knuckles just by tensing the muscles in their fingers. I'm not sure why you would want to, but apparently once you acquire the talent you're compelled to do it all the time. APL (talk) 16:09, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

If I half-clench my hand as if I was holding an apple-sized object, then deliberately tense all the muscles in it while slowly straightening out my fingers, I can definitely get a few of the finger joints to pop. They're very quiet but I'm sure someone with less squidgy knuckles than me could make a nice unpleasant sound. ~ mazca ^talk 17:04, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

A trio of questions about Katherine Philips...

Yesterday, I've stumbled upon the article of King Charles I and I read the section of it about his execution.I've read that several poets had written poems to express their displeasure of the execution. One of them that caught my attention was Katherine Philips' "Upon the Double Murder of King Charles". I've read the poem, and from my looking up a bit of information, I had three questions on my mind about Katherine Philips:

1. Why did Katherine Philips refer to the execution as a "double murder" in the poem?

2. I've read on a site that Katherine compared the execution to a lion being attacked by a group of donkeys, and it showed the esteem in which she held the King. How deep is Katherine's esteem for King Charles?

3. I've read in the article of King Charles that Katherine questioned the human race over the execution. I've read on another site that "Philips has a sense of foreboding that if men are willing to overthrow their king how far will they go in an attempt to change things for the better. Philip’s hints that men might be willing to overthrow their own religion should such revolutionary fervour continue." About this, had Katherine actually had her faith in humanity shaken, and what event had made her believe in humanity in a positive tone again?

I want thoroughly explained answers so I could understand. Thank you. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Sirdrink13309622 (talk • contribs) 18:40, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Wikipedia has an article about the poem Upon the Double Murder of King Charles. Cuddlyable3 (talk) 19:17, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

If you read the article Charles I of England, did it not answer your 1st question in In her poem, Phillips describes the "double murder" of the king; the execution of his life as well as the execution of his dignity. ? Cuddlyable3 (talk) 19:59, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

paternity leave

If I make lots of women pregnant, is there a limit on how much paternity leave I could be granted? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.142.8.232 (talk) 20:00, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

That is going to depend greatly on what country you are in. Googlemeister (talk) 21:21, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Good luck with the Child support. APL (talk) 21:35, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Does Paternity leave#Europe currently imply that Austria grants 1 - 3 years of paid paternity leave? -- 124.157.254.112 (talk) 22:05, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

My impression is in many countries only one parent can take the leave at a time. I don't know how it's divided if there is disagreement, I presume it may depend on a custody agreement. Nil Einne (talk) 23:20, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

October 27

Multiple questions, 2 main subjetcs, Thanks

I have been watching Cheers, and some how have managed to make it to season 5. 1. Who is the actress that plays Loretta Tortelli, the blond wife of Nick Tortelli the ex husband of Carla Tortelli the barmaid? Loretta seems to be the only woman in the show that is even vaguely appealing physically. Which leads directly to 2. When looking at the clothes the women are wearing, men to but specifically the women, and looking at their haircuts and general fashion sense, I am appalled! I realise that Cheers is a comedy, all be it a very poor one (it has not stood the test of time at all!!) But were the female characters dressed so ridiculously on purpose or was this really the fashion in the 80's? They look terrible! In one scene, Diane Chambers is actually wearing a sailor suit, the type seen on small boys in black and white photos from the 1900's. What was society in general thinking?! Or was this all part of some lame joke by the writers of this dross? I have not seen a single woman in 5 seasons besides Loretta Tortelli, who I can even imagine as beautiful. 3.Has the perception of beauty really changed that much since then? Even the hot babes that Sam Malone is supposed to pick up, are rarley more than not very ugly. 4.How could Cheers have been so popular? There is zero character development. I am on season 5, that right, 5 years and the same storyline is still going on, will Diane and Sam fall in love, there is no imagination at all! The writers were stuck in some sort of time loop, doing the same thing over and over and over again. The only saving grace is Norman Peterson who incidentally is one of the few actors I have never seen in anything else. 5. How can that be explained? The best character, and best actor, Kelsey Grammar not included, never went anywhere with his career? 6. While watching this crap, I started to think about just that. Sorry to change the subject but... I remembered learning in school about the life cycle of the tape worm and how it emerges from the anus and lays its eggs around the rectum. It may not have been the tapeworm, upon reflection but it was some sort of human dwelling worm, and the following has bothered me ever since. One end is attached to the lining of the intestines, while the other is reaching out to the rectum to lay its eggs, would it be possible, and or feasible to, for want of a better term, to catch it in the act, and pull it out of your bum, if indeed this is possible, would it be advisable? Would it tear the intestinal wall? Sorry if this seems like I am trolling, but I would really like an answer to these questions, they have been bothering me for some time, and where should one turn to get answers to well nigh unanswerable questions such as these if not to you good people on the reference desk. Thank you wholeheartedly.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.3.145.145 (talk) 00:37, 27 October 2010 (UTC)