Wikipedia:Reference desk/Miscellaneous

Welcome to the miscellaneous section
of the Wikipedia reference desk.

skip to bottom

Select a section:

• Computing
• Entertainment
• Humanities
• Language
• Mathematics
• Science
• Miscellaneous
• Archives

Want a faster answer?

Main page: Help searching Wikipedia

   

How can I get my question answered?

• Select the section of the desk that best fits the general topic of your question (see the navigation column to the right).
• Post your question to only one section, providing a short header that gives the topic of your question.
• Type '~~~~' (that is, four tilde characters) at the end – this signs and dates your contribution so we know who wrote what and when.
• Don't post personal contact information – it will be removed. Any answers will be provided here.
• Please be as specific as possible, and include all relevant context – the usefulness of answers may depend on the context.
• Note:
  • We don't answer (and may remove) questions that require medical diagnosis or legal advice.
  • We don't answer requests for opinions, predictions or debate.
  • We don't do your homework for you, though we'll help you past the stuck point.
  • We don't conduct original research or provide a free source of ideas, but we'll help you find information you need.

Ready? Ask a new question!

How do I answer a question?

Main page: Wikipedia:Reference desk/Guidelines

• The best answers address the question directly, and back up facts with wikilinks and links to sources. Do not edit others' comments and do not give any medical or legal advice.

See also:

• Teahouse
• Help desk
• Village pump
• Help manual

March 20

Music Artist with the most fans of all time?

Which music artist, current or historical, had the most (greatest number) fans during their careers? Many websites put the Beatles as #1, but I'm inclined to think it's Teresa Teng due to the sheer population volume of Asian countries that revered her. Acceptable (talk) 01:31, 20 March 2013 (UTC)

Define your criteria! Do fans mean people buying her records or attending her concerts? Something else? We do not make windows into men's souls. μηδείς (talk) 01:36, 20 March 2013 (UTC)

It's not a perfect metric, but List of best-selling music artists has some ways to quantify this. --Jayron32 02:36, 20 March 2013 (UTC)

those seem US/English language centric? Gzuckier (talk) 17:50, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

Umm_Khultum#Death_and_funeral? Gzuckier (talk) 17:47, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

I had heard that this honour was held by Asha Bhosle from the Bollywood side. --TammyMoet (talk) 09:10, 22 March 2013 (UTC)

Right tool for the job ?

I need to remove a zip tie from a bundle of wires. Unfortunately, it's very tight, leaving no room to get the blade from a pair of scissors under it. The zip tie is also much tougher than the wires, so I'm worried about damaging them. I can only get a pin or needle underneath the zip tie. I also considered cutting off the place where the zip tie joins with itself, but that's even thicker and tougher. Do I need to use bolt cutters on this spot ? StuRat (talk) 08:56, 20 March 2013 (UTC)

Can't those things be loosened if you pull the end of the tie sort of downward? ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 09:02, 20 March 2013 (UTC)

The end of the tie was cut off. StuRat (talk) 09:04, 20 March 2013 (UTC)

My description might not be great here, but bear with me - it works... Right, the square housing for the zip tie contains a gap for the tail to go through, and the ratchet style flap that hangs down and digs into the teeth of the ziptie itself... If you can get the blade of a knife UNDER the flap, you should be able to lift it up from the teeth and thus free the tail to fall out... Does that make sense?! Alternatively, if there is anyway of pulling one of the wires out (If they are wires for plugs, maybe take the plug off the end of the wire (if you know how to) and then pull the wire through. This should create enough space to slide some scisors into... Hope either of these methods help... gazhiley 10:02, 20 March 2013 (UTC)

Thanks, I'll try that. StuRat (talk) 17:36, 20 March 2013 (UTC)

You shouldn't need a knife, I've done this before with a small flatnose screwdriver, you're basically holding up the ratchet which holds the cable tie in place. Our article actually mentions this method. Nil Einne (talk) 23:08, 20 March 2013 (UTC)

i have better luck with something like a needle or pin or safety pin or hatpin. Gzuckier (talk) 17:58, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

Presumably the zip tie is running orthogonal to the cables, no? I would try using just the very tip of a pair of wire cutters, slipping the blades just between two of the cables. You should have just enough room to at least nick the zip tie repeatedly and eventually cut it. Someguy1221 (talk) 10:16, 20 March 2013 (UTC)

I tried this, the zip tie slips out without making a nick. StuRat (talk) 17:36, 20 March 2013 (UTC)

Unless it is a thick zip tie made with harder plastic, you should be able to cut right through the square connector with a pair of side cutters. I've also just squeezed the connector with pliers and twisted - it breaks surprisingly easily, and shouldn't damage the wires. 38.111.64.107 (talk) 11:32, 20 March 2013 (UTC)

Yep - I second that. 196.214.78.114 (talk) 11:43, 20 March 2013 (UTC)

It is a thick zip tie made of harder plastic. StuRat (talk) 17:36, 20 March 2013 (UTC)

Wouldn't scoring it with a Stanley knife or razor blade do the trick? You can be very precise with it. --Dweller (talk) 15:24, 20 March 2013 (UTC)

One slip and I'd damage the wires. StuRat (talk) 17:36, 20 March 2013 (UTC)

How about taking a pair of needle-nose pliers and basically twisting and turning the "buckle" part until it breaks. Then the whole thing should fall apart and free up the wires. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 21:38, 20 March 2013 (UTC)

Wrap the bundle with a piece of paper near the tie, then slide the tie over the paper sleave and melt it with a hot razor blade. Or put the bundle in an oven set at 200 F until the plastic gets soft enough to stretch, and then cut. Increase temperature by small increments if that is not hot enough. Dominus Vobisdu (talk) 18:05, 20 March 2013 (UTC)

Boiling is an alternative to ovening. μηδείς (talk) 20:50, 20 March 2013 (UTC)

i see you're familiar with my wife's cooking Gzuckier (talk) 18:10, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

What I normally do is use a knife with a sharp blade that ends in a simple acute-angled point (no fancy overhangs or bevels), hold the knife so that the back of the blade is against the cable and perpendicular to it, and gently push against the tie-wrap. If the knife is sharp enough, it can cut through the tie-wrap in one go - if not, it'll at least distort it sufficiently so that you can get a pair of side-cutters between the cable and tie-wrap. If you think there might be a risk of damaging the cable with the back of the knife, slip a thin piece of plastic under the tie-wrap where you're going to cut it. Tevildo (talk) 16:23, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

rub the tie with grease from highly spiced meat and infest with rats Gzuckier (talk) 17:58, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

Actually, one can perform (and one has performed) Bugs' procedure (twist the ratchet until it breaks) with one's teeth if no suitable tools are available. Tevildo (talk) 18:36, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

another alternative; get something with a curved or hooked blade where the inside is the sharp side, like a linoleum knife, or I believe there are xacto knife blades like that, and insert the tip of the knife under the tie between the wires so you're pulling out. Gzuckier (talk) 18:13, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

In this situation John McClane usually chooses to break some glass, barefoot of course, and proceed to cut the zipties, behind his back for good effect. If glass isn't available perhaps there's some scrap metal doubling as gold bullion that you could fashion into a lever. Shadowjams (talk) 18:46, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

Use a wire cutters to cut the buckle crossways. It will destroy the locking mechanism while not harming the wires. Dismas|^(talk) 00:02, 22 March 2013 (UTC)

UPDATE: I found a way to do what I needed with the wire bundle without removing the zip tie. I will keep all these suggestions in mind for the next time the issue comes up, though. Thanks ! StuRat (talk) 03:10, 22 March 2013 (UTC)

Resolved

March 21

Duplicated people in very old photos

Hello, a while back I saw some old photographs, I think online, but possibly in print. I think they were related to the USA civil war, but they could also be any old (i.e. ~1850-1900-ish) group photos. Because of the very long exposure times (or maybe some type of tracking shot or slit-scan?), people figured out that they could appear on both ends of the wide shot photograph by running behind the photographer to the other side of the group (after they'd already been registered in their first location). Can anyone help me track down some instances of this available online? Thanks, SemanticMantis (talk) 19:32, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

After more searching, I've found this [1] example, though it is much more recent that what I'd found previously (it even mentions the use of an old-at-the-time camera). Still interested in older examples. SemanticMantis (talk) 19:37, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

It's not all that antiquated. Or maybe it is. But as recently as 1969, someone did that on my junior high class picture -- panoramic pictures required a rotating lens setup. See Widelux. --jpgordon^{::==( o )} 20:38, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

Still in use in the late 1980s on our class Washington, DC trip. Rmhermen (talk) 20:52, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

Holy crap. We had a teacher do the same thing during OUR Washington, DC class trip in 1989. Weird. Yeah, I have a picture stashed away someone, a panoramic picture, and one of the teachers ran from one side to the other to end up in the photograph twice. --Jayron32 22:15, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

Happened in my school trip to D.C. in 1995. I think we might be on to something here :) Ditch ∝ 22:17, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

I don't want to get off subject here, but there was a recent T.V. show about some old photograph in a library where the method used to take the picture produced an effect where, when zooming in with modern methods, very, very small details in the background could be clearly seen, similar to what we have now with digital photography. Anyway, just an aside if your interested in such things. I'll see if I can find a link. Ditch ∝ 22:22, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

I can't find a copy online but at the George Eastman Museum in Rochester, New York, there is such a photo where, if I remember right, Eastman himself appears at both ends of a panoramic staff photo. Dismas|^(talk) 23:59, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

Thanks! Assuming you're right, then the technique could have easily been around during the US civil war. SemanticMantis (talk) 00:16, 22 March 2013 (UTC)

• Thanks all. This is a difficult concept to search for, and I'm still interested in other old examples or further info. I only found my link above by using the 'wrong' term: "double exposure"! Perhaps specific photographic terms would help. From what I can tell from the links above, this process must be similar to slit-scan, in that different portions of the film are exposed at different times. But this panorama technique is also different, because either the lens (newer) or the camera (older) must also move in order to allow for "duplicate people." SemanticMantis (talk) 00:16, 22 March 2013 (UTC)

yeah, it's pretty well known that with current camera/phones that have the panaromic thing which takes a shot, you rotate a bit and align the marks, takes another shot, etc. you can do that sort of thing, even accidentally. I have a totally inadvertent shot of a street with 4 identical women pushing identical strollers. Gzuckier (talk) 15:03, 22 March 2013 (UTC)

People who never grow up

Back in college, there was a young lady who always ate by herself in the cafeteria, and who had the appearance of a 12-13 year old, prepubescent girl. We (my friends and I) assumed at first that she was the child of a professor, but then we would see her around campus in some of our classes, so we realized she was a student. One day my friend (male) approached her in the cafeteria and invited her to eat with us (a group of males and females). I can assure you this was a perfectly friendly invitation because we felt bad that she always ate alone (though, I’ll admit we were also curious to find out her story). She declined. My friend then mentioned that she looked too young to be in college (an inappropriate comment in my opinion, but he didn’t mean in that way…I think he thought she was some sort of child prodigy or something). She responded that she was in fact 19 years old, but had a developmental disease where she would never mature, and that she didn’t like to talk about it because she attracted “weirdos.” The insinuation was that she considered my friend to be in this category. So that was the end of their conversation. So, my question is, what was her likely condition? “Never mature” seems unlikely. Perhaps she meant “slow to mature”? Also, her comment about attracting “weirdos” intrigues me. Would a person with pedophilic tendencies, in the traditional sense, actually desire a relationship with a person who looked like a child, but with the mind of and adult? I think “no”…but it’s become a point of contention in a recent discussion after I repeated this story. Others say that this would be, perhaps, the most desirable situation- the “best of both worlds” if you will (not for her, but for the pedophile). I think this is totally off base. Sorry, I know this is a weird set of questions. Ditch ∝ 22:07, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

Maybe a type of Growth hormone deficiency? --Jayron32 22:13, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

I have known people who had the physical appearance of a middle-schooler in their mid-20s, without any disease to blame it on. If you had a situation like that, combined with a growth defect that caused a very small/slight stature, that could easily produce phenotype you describe. Someguy1221 (talk) 07:48, 22 March 2013 (UTC)

Being of small stature myself I tend to attract others similarly built, and I have two friends who are very similar in height (4ft 9in) and looks. One is physiologically normal, the other has many medical conditions, one of which is Hashimoto's thyroiditis which she has had from a child. So "her likely condition" could be anything - or nothing. --TammyMoet (talk) 09:08, 22 March 2013 (UTC)

Kallmann's Syndrome, perhaps? Tevildo (talk) 10:32, 22 March 2013 (UTC)

A related case, though more extreme, is Brooke Greenberg, who, though 20 years old, still looks and acts like a toddler. Doctors just call her medical situation "Syndrome X." Nicky Freeman, mentioned in Brooke's article, the 40-year-old Australian man who still looks like a boy, may be closer to what you're talking about. 20.137.2.50 (talk) 13:50, 22 March 2013 (UTC)

Turner syndrome causes girls to mature very slowly, I know a 16 year old who looks about 9-10. She is short, prepubescent and has a few distinctive facial features. Roger (talk) 19:44, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

March 22

Odd architectural design in France

I recently travelled past the building in this picture. While not common, I did see some other examples of this kind of thing elsewhere in the region. What possible reason would you have for extending upper floor rooms out in such a manner and supporting them on slender concrete columns? I can imagine perhaps doing it if built on a steep hill or over a cliff, but the examples I saw (including the one in my example) were in relatively flat areas. Astronaut (talk) 20:27, 22 March 2013 (UTC)

I wonder if it's a zoning/taxation issue. For example, if they are assessed based on the square footage of the ground floor, this approach might make sense. StuRat (talk) 03:01, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

Is that a watercourse at the bottom right of the picture? It might be a protection against potential flooding. -- Arwel Parry (talk) 10:27, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

It's relatively common in English Tudor houses, where the arrangement was known as a jetty. The exact reasoning behind building houses like this seems to have been lost, but it certainly offers the benefit of a wider space in the street below (especially when houses are built right up to the street edge), as well as meaning that a larger living area can be placed on a plot of a given size. This would be an advantage in the medieval cities where space was at a premium and the cost per square foot quite high. As Stu mentions, if the tax was based on the size of the plot, that would be an additional incentive to keep the ground floor as small as possible and put the largest space above.

As for the house in your picture, though, I can't see any particular feature necessitating a small ground floor, and since it seems to be in the country I doubt if land prices are the reason. As it looks a relatively modern house (at least the upper parts do - maybe C20th additions?) my own money would be on the design simply being like that for its own, aesthetic, sake. - Cucumber Mike (talk) 11:00, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

It's on top of a river that swells dramatically when the snows melt. The house is squeezed between the highway and the river; it must be a thrilling view to be atop the big river when it's roaring. --jpgordon^{::==( o )} 14:56, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

Oh, cancel that! From fr:Livet-et-Gavet, translated by Google: "the office of Charles Albert Keller, from which he could observe all of its workshops and factories located on both sides of the river.". Keller was a 20th century industrialist; his factories produced calcium carbide for acetylene. --jpgordon^{::==( o )} 15:04, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

Houses with jetties

The "jetty" structures in medieval european buildings did indeed come from an effort to increase the living area of the upper floors of the building where land was scarce. In some cities, the jetties stuck out so far that they'd be within 6" of meeting over the center of the street! However, this modern version doesn't seem to be that. SteveBaker (talk) 20:07, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Do you by jetties mean flying butresses? μηδείς (talk) 23:09, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

No, I've found you a picture. Our Jetty (disambiguation) page directs you to Overhang (architecture) which is rather American-centric. I was told that it served to stop the middle of the upper floor from sagging. I'll look for a source. Alansplodge (talk) 13:24, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

Oh, I missed Jettying that tells all. Apparently, a house with this feature is called a Garrison house in the US. Alansplodge (talk) 13:53, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

va benifits

I was in the u.s. department of commerce coast and geodetic survey, I would like to know if I'm eligble for veterans hospital benifits? I was in from june 1961 to sept. 1963. thanks1 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 166.137.116.40 (talk) 20:57, 22 March 2013 (UTC)

You can check your VA benefits elegibility HERE. It looks like it requires that you are a veteran of either active or reserve duty military. Livewireo (talk) 21:56, 22 March 2013 (UTC)

March 23

Company Wurth Illinois Inc. Bensonville, Il.

I worked for a company in Bensonville, Il. from 1990 to 1993, I know the corporation has been closed, but I need proof that the corporation disolved. As a manager, I had a company cellular phone, and was allowed to keep the service, but know the carrier wants proof that the company no longer exisit, so I can now place the phone in my name.66.94.205.192 (talk) 01:48, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

The Illinois Chamber of Commerce web site lists them as still existing -- see http://il.chamberocommerce.com/member/6355309/Wurth_Illinois_Inc_400_Eastern_Ave_Bensenville_IL_60106. The web page gives a phone number -- you can try calling it for more information, I guess. Looie496 (talk) 02:36, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

Scaring your kids

What kinds of real or fictional critters do parents/babysitters in western Europe invoke to scare kids in order to make them behave? In the English-speaking world, I know, the Boogieman is the most commonly invoked for this purpose; in Russia, it's variously Baba-Yaga, the wolves, the owls, or (less commonly) a mythical, presumably wolverine-like creature called the Dzhomolunga; and in some gangster families, according to urban legends, it's Kaiser Soze. So what equivalent critters do they scare their kids with in western Europe (France, the Netherlands, etc.)? 24.23.196.85 (talk) 05:09, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

Huh? How does Mount Everest scare anyone? Particularly someone in Russia? -- Jack of Oz ^[Talk] 05:38, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

• The fear of snipers? I dunno. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 05:49, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

Original research: This has to do with my father's nanny, who was reportedly a well-educated woman with lots of miscellaneous knowledge (frankly, I think she might have been a geography teacher out of a job). Anyway, her favorite phrase that she'd tell him was, "If you don't behave yourself, the Dzhomolunga will get you!" And while we're at it, how would a preschooler know that Dzhomolunga is the Chinese name for Mount Everest? 24.23.196.85 (talk) 05:51, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

Did you link the word to Mount Everest above because you were told that it has that connotation when used to scare children, or because you knew separately that it (or something that sounds sorta like it) is the Chinese name for the mountain? If the latter, that link is very misleading because, as you point out, no non-Chinese pre-schooler would ever make the mental association (and probably very few Chinese ones either). Fwiw, I checked with my ex-wife, a native Russian speaker, and it meant nothing to her. I know from hanging around Russians for ages that many families have their own made-up names for all manner of things, names that would mean nothing to anyone outside the family, and my gut tells me this Dzhomolunga thing is in that category. -- Jack of Oz ^[Talk] 19:33, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

Did you not notice your first linked article includes somewhat unsourced mentions of France, Netherlands, Germany.... Nil Einne (talk) 06:01, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

Yep, I've just read through it -- in the Netherlands, they would scare their kids with "Black Peter", and in France, with the "Hand-Cruncher". So this article more-or-less answered my question. 24.23.196.85 (talk) 06:39, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

How about an unspecified "monster" ? StuRat (talk) 07:01, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

In Bern, Switzerland there is a fountain dedicated to Der de:Kinderfresser who eats children (Note: The English interlanguage link from that article comes back to Boogieman but then doesn't mention Kinderfresser). And slightly off topic, as a teacher of moral lessons there is Struwwelpeter. Dismas|^(talk) 07:05, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

One time i was thte airport and a woman told a kid to behave or THAT MAN (pointing at me) is going to hurt you (or get you or take you away, i can't recall exactly what she said). She was a complete stranger. I felt very wronged.--There goes the internet (talk) 08:04, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

It could have been worse. What if you were one of her kids? Wouldn't that suck, big time? ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 22:01, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

The aurora borealis, or northern lights were and still are used to scare Inuit children. The belief is that if you whistle the lights will come down and chop off your head, and possibly play soccer with them. When I was a kid it was the Romani people, called Gypsies then. Sometimes you hear parents tell kids that if they don't behave "that man" or the more direct Kabloonak (non-Inuit), is going to get them. It's usually aimed at an authority figure, which is great because it excludes me, such a RCMP, teacher, government official or store worker. CambridgeBayWeather (talk) 08:07, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

Boogieman? Nope. Bogeyman was the UK spelling. I found this cool site for you. When I was a girl I was told the policeman would come and take me away if I misbehaved. And of course there's the Child Catcher from Chitty Chitty Bang Bang. --TammyMoet (talk) 11:23, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

In French Canada, the scary creature who takes away misbehaving children is called the "Bonhomme Sept-Heures" ("Seven o'clock Man"), which is supposedly a corruption of the English "bonesetter", who became a creature of fear because his work made people scream in pain. In France, there is the "croque-mitaine" [2] as a generic term for this type of scary creature. I see they're both listed in the bogeyman article, which has a number of other examples from around the world. --Xuxl (talk) 15:11, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

Thanks, everyone! 24.23.196.85 (talk) 19:20, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

Krampus --Viennese Waltz 22:29, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

• My mother always simply warned us, "Wait til your father gets home!" μηδείς (talk) 01:59, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

I wasn't told about Bogeyman, but I did get the full on British, don't talk to strange men with 70's haricuts. Sfan00 IMG (talk) 20:39, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

I still say that to my other half every single time he leaves the house. -- Jack of Oz ^[Talk] 21:52, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

I think ArbCom..... Rich Farmbrough, 21:59, 25 March 2013 (UTC).

Historically in England, children were threatened with whoever was the national enemy at the time. One speculative etymology for "Bogey" is that it was a corruption of "Boney". I've read of children being told that the Kaiser would get them. Whether anyone has been threatened with Bin Laden, I don't know. Alansplodge (talk) 15:40, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

Car Insurance in the UK

Sorry for this off beat question but I don't know where else I might find an answer. I believe that some car insurance companies offer a discounted price if the car has a device that films the journey, giving continuous GPS location details, vehicle speed, direction, and will automatically call for help in event of an accident. What I want to know is which companies offer such policy discounts. I have such a programme on my iPhone called 'Witness' which I can highly recommend. Can anyone help please?85.211.138.47 (talk) 12:25, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

A quick search on the standard price comparison sites would seem to indicate that lots of insurance companies operate such a system - "telematics" is a useful search term. It looks as though you'll need to use a tracker box that's installed/approved by the insurance company, rather than using your own, though. Tevildo (talk) 12:40, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

Chrome

Moved to Computing desk. Tevildo (talk) 16:43, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

Betray

If I were to write a sentence like this: "He tried to hide his anger and failed, his irritation betraying itself by the sound of the keyboard being hit too violently." Would 'by' be the correct preposition here? With? At? 14.99.179.58 (talk) 20:22, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

I would say "in" - a quick google search gives us examples from Elizabeth Gaskell ([3]) and Nietzsche ([4]) Tevildo (talk) 20:40, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

You have one word too many for the sentence structure to be coherent. Try "He tried to hide his anger and failed, betrayed by the sound of the keyboard being hit too violently." "By" is the correct preposition here, and only choice. Dominus Vobisdu (talk) 21:09, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

"Through" or "via" would also work, I think, but really the sentence feels awkward regardless. It's one of those cases where an active construction with the weight carried by noungs and verbs would work better than a passive construction with the weight carried by an adjective: "He tried to hide his anger, but the crash of his fingers striking the keyboard betrayed it." Looie496 (talk) 21:51, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

By and in or even through are okay, but as an American I would use with, second to by. Via also works but sounds very forced. μηδείς (talk) 22:35, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

Only "by" works in the version I gave. In the original version, nothing really works. It is an apparently reflexive costruction with a second agent tagged on, compounded by the fact that the recepient should be "he", the subject of the sentence. The irritation is first "betrayed" by itself, and then by the playing. Big problems all around.

Obviously an attempt at a word for word translation from another language, carried out with the help of a dictionary and an imperfect understanding of English grammar, especially the use of grammatical voices. I suspect that the foreign word translated by "betrayed" here means something more like "reveal" or "show". My guess is that the OP picked the wrong option from the dictionary.

As a matter of fact, if you substitute "revealed" for "betrayed" in the orginal sentence, it almost works.... if translated word for word into Polish, but not English. I suspect the OP's own language (he's apparently from India) has an instrumental case and handles grammatical voices a lot more like a highly inflected language such as Polish than a minimally inflected one such as English. Dominus Vobisdu (talk) 01:48, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

I tend to agree "by" is needed in your sentence, but it's not the one the OP gave, is it? His was workable, and he had various options, some better than others, to convey the instrumental case. μηδείς (talk) 01:57, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

Funny. I'm a girl. You guys should probably use 'they' when referring to the OP. And yeah, I'm an Indian, but I wasn't translating really. I guess the sentence does sound awkward though. But "He tried to hide his anger, but the crash of his fingers striking the keyboard betrayed it." doesn't sound nearly graceful enough 14.96.2.246 (talk) 08:26, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

Sorry about that, many of our users do assume male gender when they shouldn't. Anyway, "betrayed by" is the common construction in US English for this type of thing. For a re-wording closer to the original, how about "He tried to hide his anger and failed; his irritation (was) betrayed by the sound of the keyboard being hit too violently." (to me it's the "itself" that makes it awkward. The "was" is optional, and I like semicolons). SemanticMantis (talk) 16:28, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

No apologies from me. He is the default singular animate pronoun, and has been for over a millennium. An OP is always free to register an account and declare his gender if he wishes. μηδείς (talk) 03:18, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Yes, thanks! That works perfectly! Thing is, I use constructions which sound awkward but I can't pinpoint exactly how until someone else tells me from a fresh point of view, and then it seems obvious to me. Thanks again! (= 117.227.5.59 (talk) 21:22, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

'by the sound of the keyboard being hit too violently' can be shortened to something like 'by his thumping on the keyboard' Dmcq (talk) 00:51, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Except that "betraying" has the connotation that someone else is involved, and they would probably be aware of the thumping only by the sound it makes. -- Jack of Oz ^[Talk] 12:17, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

March 24

please give me legal advice

possible trolling, sufficiently answered
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.
I asked for legal advice on the reference desk of Wikipedia, and they gave me advice, and it turned out badly. Can I sue wikipedia? They gave me medical advice as well. Can I sue them for malpractice. This didn't really happen it's just a hypothetical question.--There goes the internet (talk) 00:18, 24 March 2013 (UTC) bonus question: has anyone ever try to sue wikipedia.--There goes the internet (talk) 00:18, 24 March 2013 (UTC) You can sue anyone you like. You can sue the milkman for delivering one bottle instead of the two you ordered. But whether you'll be successful is another matter entirely. -- Jack of Oz [Talk] 00:22, 24 March 2013 (UTC) why would be unlikely to be unsucessful. i followed there advice and it ruined my life and i can prove it.--There goes the internet (talk) 00:24, 24 March 2013 (UTC) We can't answer this question. Hypothetical or not...but in any case, I did what the people on the internet said I should do probably isn't likely to be such a great defense. It might be right up there with I was drunk and thought the kid was another person at the party. --Onorem♠Dil 00:30, 24 March 2013 (UTC) (a) Yes, which is why you're not allowed to ask that sort of question. (b) See List of litigation involving the Wikimedia Foundation. Tevildo (talk) 00:27, 24 March 2013 (UTC) thank you that is an interesting article. it doesn't sound like wikipedia ever had to cough up any money to the people who sued it! not even once! they must have good lawyer and things like this.--There goes the internet (talk) 00:30, 24 March 2013 (UTC) Wikipedia is an encyclopedia. It is a source of information. It is not a source of advice; users should not be accessing it on that basis, and editors should not be responding to questions on that basis. If anyone here does recommend a course of action, and you decide to follow it, and it doesn't go well, you would have no more comeback than if you'd asked some passing random stranger in the street the same question and accepted their advice blindly. You are responsible for your life; the passing random stranger is not, and anyone at Wikipedia is not. -- Jack of Oz [Talk] 01:33, 24 March 2013 (UTC) it doesnt sound like wikipedia would be in much danger if u answered a few legal advice question. like when has anyone ever sue them and won? very few times, if ever. but i still think it's a good policy because its unethical to give ppl advice if u dont know wut youre talking about.--There goes the internet (talk) 00:35, 24 March 2013 (UTC) Has anyone sued Wikipedia and won is fine as a question. Can I sue Wikipedia in (random case) is not fine as a question. --Onorem♠Dil 00:38, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

crash landing search

Few years ago, a pilot crash landed a fighter plane. The nose and most of the cockpit had disintegrated when the plane came to the halt. Somewhat uncertain details are: plane was Harrier, landed on an american highway, and the picture depicted a rescue man helping him open the seatbelts. The pilot's face was bloody. I have been incessantly trying to hunt that image and details about that incident but I cannot find it. The image was particularly shocking because the pilot seemed alive even when most of the fwd part of the plane had disintegrated around him. Are there any military/airforce/airplane enthusiasts who remember that incident? —  Hamza  ^{[ talk ]} 02:23, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

Here's a list of Harrier crashes outside of combat. [5] Most say the pilot ejected, or hit a non-populated area. Do have any further info on what year or where the crash happened? RudolfRed (talk) 02:31, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

Given the list is exhaustive, it couldn't have been Harrier. The headline also mentioned the name of that highway. Again, my memory about that incident is very blurry. It was probably some interstate/highway named something like I8. I have been googling with different combinations of words, no luck yet. —  Hamza  ^{[ talk ]} 02:37, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

We have a list that may help: List of accidents and incidents involving military aircraft (2000–present). Searching it for a few keywords didn't help, but you may have better luck. You can click back to previous decades as well. 38.111.64.107 (talk) 18:01, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Could it have been an AV8-B? That's the variant of the Harrier that the US Marines used for a while. They more often call them "AV8-B" than "Harrier" - and news reports may well have labelled it as such. SteveBaker (talk) 20:03, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Country Satellite Codes

As we all know today navigation had become advanced with the use of satellite technology.In the 9 digit Maritime Mobile Service Identity number the first three digits are the Marine Identification Digit or the MID . This MID is allotted to each country,like India got MID 419 so the MMSI number will be 419230001 for example. Like wise Ships resisted in India got the SAT_C number starting with 4419 which is the code for India. Kindly let me know such satellite codes allotted to each country. OR where can i find them. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 115.254.56.61 (talk) 04:18, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

Maritime identification digits Rojomoke (talk) 05:18, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

History of knitting

I am interested in learning about the History of knitting. I am 79 years old and have knit since I was a teenager. I have always asked questions ie:who made the first knitting needles and where were they developed?. I read a short article about an Archaeological project called "Sock It". It was developed by the Petrie Museum in London, England. It also talks about a sock that was made circa A. D. 400 to 500. It was called "the Two Toed" Coptic sock. This was the only information that was given. I wonder who did the knitting during that period? I would be interested to know more about this project. If anyone could direct me to learn more about my questions it would be very much appreciated. Dorothy Atkinson — Preceding unsigned comment added by Grannylrns (talk • contribs) 09:27, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

Nålebinding is our article on the socks in question, and Timeline of clothing and textiles technology is a list of articles on the history of textiles. There's Petrie Museum of Egyptian Archaeology for the museum, and, of course, knitting itself might be of interest. Tevildo (talk) 10:05, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

See http://www.dmoz.org/search?q=knitting.

—Wavelength (talk) 14:35, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

We do have a History of knitting article which notes that single needle nalebinding predates two needle knitting techniques. Rmhermen (talk) 16:19, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

The German and Scandinavian articles on Nålebinding indicate that this ancient technique is is still in use and can be learned. Here is a short article on the Coptic Sock it project (probably the one you mention). --Cookatoo.ergo.ZooM (talk) 23:07, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

does the christian scientist monitor say you shouldnt go the doctor

trolling by indef'd user
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.
also does it have articles about medicene, or are these kind of articles ban? this is a newspaper. i sometimes read articles about new medical treatment and i am wondering if this type of article is allow.--There goes the internet (talk) 22:21, 24 March 2013 (UTC) Our article on teh Christian Science Monitor specifically says that the paper does not promote the doctrine of the church, so that does not preclude medical coverage, but I don't see anything browsing the archives that covers a specific drug trial or anything. The paper is not a mouthpiece for the religion, though it is owned by it. Mingmingla (talk) 01:10, 25 March 2013 (UTC) that interesting that you couldn't find anything. i heard this is a very good newspaper with good journalists. it would be a shame if they weren't allowed to cover this aspect of the scientific world.--There goes the internet (talk) 01:18, 25 March 2013 (UTC) Why don't you call them and ask them? Here[6] is their "Contact us" page. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 02:03, 25 March 2013 (UTC) I am scared of talking to religious people. But if one of the secular people answered me I could email them I guess.--There goes the internet (talk) 04:35, 25 March 2013 (UTC) "Afraid of talking to religious people?" Come on. You can come up with a better excuse than that for continuing your trolling. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 05:17, 25 March 2013 (UTC) Yeah, one time these missionary knock on my door and they said i would go to hell and it gave me nightmares.--There goes the internet (talk) 05:18, 25 March 2013 (UTC) Since you're a non-believer, why would you worry about "hell"? ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 05:20, 25 March 2013 (UTC) Stop trolling or I'll run a checkuser on u.--There goes the internet (talk) 05:22, 25 March 2013 (UTC) Feel free. You better hurry, though, because you'll soon be blocked again. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 05:24, 25 March 2013 (UTC) We don't read newspapers for users. If you have a request for references please make it μηδείς (talk) 02:28, 25 March 2013 (UTC) They have asked a question. If you don't like it, ignore it or come up with a better reason for disputing its validity. --Onorem♠Dil 02:47, 25 March 2013 (UTC) soory for delete the comment too much.--There goes the internet (talk) 02:50, 25 March 2013 (UTC) WP:DUCK. μηδείς (talk) 02:56, 25 March 2013 (UTC) I ask good questions. maybe ur made out of a duck.--There goes the internet (talk) 02:58, 25 March 2013 (UTC) A duck named "Timothy", maybe? ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 03:07, 25 March 2013 (UTC) If there's an actual request for a reference here it can be made without baiting neutral observers. μηδείς (talk) 03:15, 25 March 2013 (UTC) You aren't a neutral observer. You are a completely unnecessarily antagonistic and disruptive observer. Frankly, I don't care if the OP is a duck quacking into a megaphone--you're comments in this section aren't helping and aren't welcome. Ryan Vesey 03:43, 25 March 2013 (UTC) I was referring to bugs, not myself. I am never neutral in regard to my own opinions, duh. It seems the troll has gotten the rise he was looking for. He'll either disappear or be blocked. This is sooooooooooooooooooooo boring. μηδείς (talk) 04:07, 25 March 2013 (UTC) you seem surprisingly interested in commenting on a topic that bores you.--There goes the internet (talk) 04:09, 25 March 2013 (UTC) And that's a wrap...--Jayron32 04:30, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

heron bird

do they actually transport snakes and fish from pond to pond — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.195.5.219 (talk) 23:43, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

Herons are carniverous and will eat a variety of aquatic prey including snakes and fish. I don't know for sure - there are many species with varying diet and behavoirs - but I can certainly imagine a scenario where a heron catches prey and flies away, but then drops the prey over another pond. The prey might survive capture and being dropped. Astronaut (talk) 00:05, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

This has certainly happened I believe more or less as Astronaut describes. Whether it is ecologically significant I don't know. Rich Farmbrough, 04:29, 25 March 2013 (UTC).

What would be even more interesting is if herons have evolved the tendency to do this specifically to stock those ponds with prey species. StuRat (talk) 04:57, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

March 25

birds of prey as game fowl

trolling by indef'd user
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.
Does any humans cook and eat birds of prey like owls and eagles. How do they taste. If they were not endangered, could we hunt them?--There goes the internet (talk) 04:59, 25 March 2013 (UTC) There is a problem with eating top predators, due to bioaccumulation and subsequent biomagnification of toxins. For a specific example, DDT tends to biomagnify in eagles, causing thinning of their egg shells. StuRat (talk) 05:13, 25 March 2013 (UTC) They probably taste like uncooked, room-temperature chicken, and with similar side effects. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 05:18, 25 March 2013 (UTC) Only if eaten uncooked and at room temperature. StuRat (talk) 05:44, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Birth identity

Say you gave birth to triplets, and one died in a fire. Are the remaining two children now called "twins" or still "triplets"? Do their birth identities change because of the third sibling's death? ☯ Bonkers The Clown \(^_^)/ Nonsensical Babble ☯ 12:38, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Ask the siblings themselves what they want to be called. It isn't my position to tell them what they want to refer to themselves as. --Jayron32 12:51, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

From a genealogist's point of view, if three babies are born at one time then they are triplets, regardless of whether one, two or all 3 die at birth. --TammyMoet (talk) 13:01, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Or at any later time. If one or more die, however many are left are surviving triplets. That's the line genealogists would take, but the child itself may not. If two of them died at birth, the surviving one would be raised as if it had come from a single birth, and if they had no other siblings from other births, they could well be effectively an only child. It would be odd for such a child to regard itself as one of a set of triplets in any practical sense. They might never even know they were one of three, but even if they did, by the time they were given this information it might mean as little to them as knowing their mother had miscarriages or stillborn siblings from other births, and they might rarely if ever mention it. -- Jack of Oz ^[Talk] 21:48, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Considering the wording of the question, the correct answer is that it depends whether you ask Klaus Baudelaire or Mr. Poe... הסרפד (call me Hasirpad) (formerly R——bo) 14:10, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Tee hee. ☯ Bonkers The Clown \(^_^)/ Nonsensical Babble ☯ 14:54, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Looking for imaginative answers here

Hi all, someone I know of has to worry about some funny safety procedure as part of his research at uni. In the metropolitan area, when interviewing someone off-campus, he has to phone someone from the uni both before and after, to let them know he's ok. This appears to be a silly procedure borrowed from off-road or country field trips, where it would make sense, because there is no one around for miles. In the city, if they have an accident, if a passerby can't find them, I don't know how someone from the uni can come and find them. There is a lesser version of the same procedure, that is more common: if you visit a stranger's home, you have to do the phone call system, to "tag on" and "tag off", but you don't have to do it if you aren't going to people's homes. Again, it seems rather odd, because if a problem happens while you are in the people's homes, and you can't call to "tag-off", I can't see what on earth they can do to help you. They can call the police, but the police will probably want you to file a missing persons report. If you are missing for any length of time, of course the people whose house you were at will become suspects. But the simple point is that if the strangers are going to kill you or harm you, sending someone out looking for you isn't going to help much. The strangers/ baddies will get their nasty business out the way before anyone gets there, so it appears the only useful thing is making sure someone knows where you are going, so the police will have a lead if you get murdered. So, long-winded intro, but the question is twofold: Firstly, can anyone give me a reasonable scenario (be as creative as you like, but keep it plausible) where this could work in either case (i.e. going to public places or actually going to people's homes)? Secondly, since it's a ref desk, does anyone know of any cases where this has actually helped in practice? IBE (talk) 16:02, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Safety works both ways. It is very rare that a person is killed or even attacked when visiting a stranger's house for any reason, whether to do research, read the utilities metre, perform repairs, etc. What if something happens to the owner of the house when the visitor (your friend) has left? You would need some element of proof in order to show that your friend was not present when the owner fell down the stairs, or collapsed of a head injury, or whatever it may have been. This may be part of the reason. KägeTorä - (影虎) (TALK) 17:59, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Very reasonable suggestion - yes, good comparison with meter readers, repairs people etc. You do have a point about their safety, but they require police clearance for that reason. I have heard of stories about things going missing when people visit people's homes even for uni research, although it is only a claim - still, the rule seems fairly common, and not unreasonable. But the phone procedure is only for your safety, no more, and is always expressed as such. IBE (talk) 18:56, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Reminds me a little bit of the police procedure to call in a license plate and location before approaching the car during a traffic stop. That way if something happens there's a record of the car and where the officer is. Shadowjams (talk) 19:46, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Not quite sure what your point is - this procedure makes sense to me, as does leaving details of where you are going (but not so for the tag on - tag off procedure). Are you just making a side observation? IBE (talk) 19:51, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

It's quite common in the UK to have something similar in place, usually as part of a lone working procedure. It's usually phrased as "for your own safety", not as "just in case the person you visit dies and you become a suspect". --TammyMoet (talk) 20:29, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Interesting, although it appears to make more sense if you really are working alone - eg on a farm or something. IBE (talk) 06:18, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

Trains reversing

According to Ascot to Guildford Line, trains at Aldershot "reverse".

I've looked at the lines on Bing's OS maps and as far as I can see, it is a smooth track from Ascot to Aldershot and a smooth line from Aldershot to Guildford, albeit with a large chord to get across to the North Downs line.

If that is the case then the train changes directions at Aldershot. Is this what is meant by "reverses"? Does the driver get out of the cab and walk to the other end of the train and get into a different cab?

I saw a train once overshoot the platform by about 100 metres and it took over half an hour to get things set up for it to reverse back into the station at slower than walking speed. So this can't be what is meant by "reverse".

A similar thing happens at Redhill on the North Downs Line from reading to Gatwick. Is this managed the same way? -- SGBailey (talk) 16:13, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

If that is the case then the train changes directions at Aldershot. Is this what is meant by "reverses"? - Yes

Does the driver get out of the cab and walk to the other end of the train and get into a different cab? - Yes

Trains in Britain nowadays rarely 'reverse' - as in drive backwards - they are nearly always set up with either a locomotive or a driving cab at each end so that the train can be driven 'forwards' from either position. When you need to change direction, as you suspected, the driver simply jumps out and jogs down the platform to the other end. Or, if a particularly speedy change is needed, a replacement driver can be carried in the rear cab, or can be waiting on the platform at the right end to hop on when the train arrives - a process known on the London Underground as 'stepping back': here, drivers arrive at a station and get out, leaving the train in the care of another driver. The first driver goes to the other end of the platform and picks up the next train.

The reason you saw a train take so long to turn round is in the fact that it overshot the platform - presumably running a red signal (known as a SPAD) into the bargain. This is A Bad Thing, and the driver would have needed to contact the signalman or line controller, explain what had happened and go through a procedure for resetting the signal and any train protection devices before continuing. He may also have had to be replaced by another driver pending investigation into the overshoot. This all takes a long time, so it's nowhere near as simple as just banging the engine into reverse and backing into the station. - Cucumber Mike (talk) 17:38, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

(EC) I think 'reverse' here is used to mean 'goes back in the other direction' rather than, literally, 'goes backwards' with the driver guiding it using the rear view mirror. As said above, trains routinely have a driver's compartment at both ends - most terminals do not have a facility for the trains to 'turn around'. KägeTorä - (影虎) (TALK) 17:45, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

By the way, I don't know about Bing's maps, but if you look at Google Maps, it's quite clear that a train traveling from Ascot to Guildford by way of Aldershot has to reverse direction in Aldershot. There is no through line passing through Aldershot. The same is true at Redhill on the route from Reading to Gatwick. The previous two editors are correct on how this is done. Marco polo (talk) 19:00, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Another reason why an overshoot take a long time to resolve, is because typically lines aren't signalled bi-drectionaly except in specific locations. Also points (US switches) may be involved. Sfan00 IMG (talk) 20:34, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Looking at the track diagram in the article and the lines on a map, it is easy to see what is going on here. Even though Aldershot is a through station, trains on the Ascot to Guildford line do not travel from Aldershot through to the next station at Farnham - that line terminates at Alton and goes nowhere near Guildford. Instead, to get to Guildford they must go back the other way and round the curve to Ash station. Astronaut (talk) 14:42, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

Thanks -- SGBailey (talk) 15:36, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

I just had a look at how to get from Farnborough main to Farnborough North and was amazed it said zero changes and 17 minutes for the first route, but then I saw a pedestrian walking symbol beside it! You have to do two changes to do this by train and it takes 56 minutes. I was hoping this would take a shorter route through Aldershot but no luck, they seem to have problems finding routes. ;-) Dmcq (talk) 16:31, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

Hospital

I do not see any reference to a hospital in Bella Vista, AR community. Do they have one close by???? Ralph Neill — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.81.87.138 (talk) 17:40, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Google seems to think there are quite a few. KägeTorä - (影虎) (TALK) 17:47, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Rewards Checking Accounts in U.S>

Who owns the money in a U.S. rewards checking account? Does the bank have ownership and the depsitor only have an I.O.U. from the bank? Thanks Tom 184.21.157.163 (talk) 19:10, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Banking law is complicated by a lot of interweaving legal issues involving insurance, banking regulation, and basic contract law. But at its most basic, yes, when you deposit money into a bank you're exchanging a right for the bank to pay you back in the future for your money. That's why when if a bank fails the depositors are out their money (notwithstanding depository insurance). Shadowjams (talk) 19:43, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Not sure what "the depositors are out their money" means, Shadowjams. -- Jack of Oz ^[Talk] 21:29, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

That if the bank fails, the depositor does not own any of the money he may have deposited; rather, he is in the position of a creditor attempting to recover the debt owed. As Shadowjams further notes, though, many (most?) countries have some form of deposit insurance at the government level intended to protect average depositors against bank failures. In the US, that's the FDIC and the NCUA (depending on the variety of banking institution), and they protect deposits up to $250,000 in value -- but if, say, you've got $1 million deposited in the bank and it fails, there's no guarantee you'll see the remaining $750k above the insurance threshold. — Lomn 21:37, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Mr. of Oz may be referring to the colloquialism of "I'm out <object>", meaning that "I have lost <object>". Regards, Orange Suede Sofa (talk) 21:43, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

That's an expression I've never come across, hence my query. I've heard "I'm out of <something>", meaning "I've used <something> up and need to replenish my supply". But the expression without the "of", meaning "I've lost <something>", is new to me. What parts of the anglosphere use it? -- Jack of Oz ^[Talk] 22:17, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Commonly-used colloquialism in the US. "I lent the guy a C-note, and he split town, so now I'm out a hundred bucks." ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 23:38, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Or "The insurance company is going to pick up the bill for most of the damage and I'm only out my deductible." I can attest that it's common in the Midwest and Northeast. I would suspect other areas of the US as well. Dismas|^(talk) 00:24, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. -- Jack of Oz ^[Talk] 10:51, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

info. on the existence of a company named Pinnacle incorp., Bloomingdale,NJ. Do they exist;is it a scam; what line of business are they in

Is Pinnacle incorporated an actual brick and mortar business or a bogus scam business set up to fleece someone. The physical address is listed as 1612 Matheson Street, Bloomingdale, NJ. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Triangularstrength (talk • contribs) 20:33, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

No such address exists at google maps. We can't advise you on whether a company is involved in crime, seek a lawyer if you have a legitimate complaint. μηδείς (talk) 20:37, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Resolved

Meat in desserts

I am aware of bacon ice cream and Burger King's bacon sundae, but I'm curious as to whether there are any desserts that feature meat. If there are, do any cultures commonly use meat in their dessert items? Ryan Vesey 21:55, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

There's chicken with chocolate sauce, but it's usually served as a main rather than a dessert. -- Jack of Oz ^[Talk] 22:11, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

(you need to change the header; I thought this was about meat conservation in dry places Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 22:12, 25 March 2013 (UTC))

Yet another example of the strange but common (or common but strange) practice where a person spells a word one way in one place and a different way in the very next sentence. I see it often, but I have yet to get to the bottom of it. -- Jack of Oz ^[Talk] 22:21, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

I actually spelled it incorrectly all three times, caught myself, and only changed it twice. Ryan Vesey 22:26, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Obligatory PBF reference. Tevildo (talk) 23:26, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

I guess it it means that you define dessert=sweet. Many people eat crackers and cheese after the main dish; and some include sausage... but I guess that's not the point here, is it? Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 22:32, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Mince meat pie. RNealK (talk) 22:35, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Although modern mincemeat rarely contains any meat. Alansplodge (talk) 16:03, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

Suet (raw beef or mutton fat) is the basis for many traditional British puddings, as well as mince pies. - Cucumber Mike (talk) 22:50, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Gelatin is a common dessert ingredient, and would be considered a "meat product", although not actually meat. Tevildo (talk) 23:26, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

The same can be said of rennet. Regards, Orange Suede Sofa (talk) 00:52, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

The Romans were found of fish sauce, garum, even in desserts (and deserts, too) Rmhermen (talk) 23:48, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Sweetbreads. I also found a recipe in Mrs Beeton's Cookery Book (1911, p. 163) for pork cheese.--Auric talk 00:07, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

The second paragraph of the article on blancmange mentions chicken as an ingredient in the past and a contemporary Turkish dessert with chicken in it. 83.104.128.107 (talk) 13:49, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

On a trip to Japan, a friend once found raw tuna in a sweet custard - a dish he had initially assumed was dessert. I would not be surprised to find it has a proper name and was not just some oddity served up by that particular restaurant. Astronaut (talk) 14:13, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

If we ignore when it is served, and just look at high sugar content, then quite a few meat dishes might qualify as desserts. For example, BBQ sauce is often high in sugar, and glazed hams are, too. StuRat (talk) 16:26, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

March 26

Non-cheese meaning of cheese

In researching the Meat in desserts question, I came across two recipes using the word cheese in the title, but involving no milk products. These are Pork cheese (p. 163) and Damson cheese (p. 295). The Cheese article was unhelpful, as was the Jam article. This link[7] suggests it's about firmness, but I'm not sure. Can anyone explain this usage better?--Auric talk 00:35, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

My guess is that "Pork cheese" is head cheese or souse, which, as you'll note, contains no cheese but does contain a lot of pork (mostly bits around the head). Not sure about the other one. --Jayron32 00:41, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

The more general meaning is "cheese-like", and, in particular, "fatty". StuRat (talk) 03:54, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

As far as the fruit cheese meanings go, there are two related products: fruit butter, and fruit cheese. They are both made in the same way, which is by boiling a fruit with sugar, sieving it to form a puree, and reboiling it. If the resulting preserve is spreadable like butter, then it is called a butter: if it goes solid and can be sliced like cheese, it is called a cheese. My reference for this is not online, it's Marguerite Patten's "Basic basics: jams, preserves and chutneys". --TammyMoet (talk) 10:51, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

See also "Pindakaas" - literally "peanut cheese" - the Dutch word for peanut butter. There's a brief explanation in peanut butter#Other names. Astronaut (talk) 14:09, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

And also liver cheese. 109.99.71.97 (talk) 18:08, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

Best car for under 2-3K USD?

I'm looking to buy a cheap, reliable car for under 2000-3000 USD for driving in the NYC area. My priority is reliability, but I would also prefer a model that is fun to drive (of course, within reasons of my financial limitations). The only requirement is that it be manual transmission. Any recommendations or any recommendations for a car forum where I can find more information? Thanks. Acceptable (talk) 00:55, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

I'm thinking for that price range, something has to be wrong with it. That could be high age or miles, either of which will mean decreased reliability, or perhaps having been in an accident or flood, which also mean decreased reliability. To get that price without decreased reliability, perhaps a car that's just ugly might work, like one with a different color hood/door or a car in need of a paint job. Would some interior damage be OK, like torn upholstery ? You can always add seat covers. StuRat (talk) 03:51, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

I got a 2002 Dodge Neon for that price range a couple of years ago. It's a decent car, not ugly, decent torque, not too much maintenance. I got it from a police auction so it came with whiskey plates, but it's certainly a good way to get cheap cars. Ryan Vesey 03:54, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

Well, that would have made it about 9 years old, which is where reliability becomes a concern. StuRat (talk) 03:58, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

This would just be like a car for driving around during college; I'm not picky about the condition of the interior. What are some general guidelines as to the upper limit of age or mileage that you should not surpass when buying a used car? Acceptable (talk) 04:34, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

There's no strict limit, as a car just gets steadily less reliable with age and miles. However, a good rule of thumb might be to look at the original warranty offered when the car was sold new. They generally try to set those so they expire just before major problems will start to occur. So, when the factory warranty has expired, you're into the danger zone. Also, "highway miles" are a lot easier on a car than stop-and-go, especially on dirt roads. However, determining what kind of miles a car has on it isn't always easy. But, if the owner lives on a dirt or gravel rod, that probably means the vehicle is more worn out than the age and miles would indicate. StuRat (talk) 14:28, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

I also recommend buying a car directly from the owner, not from used car lots. You can get ripped off by either, but you're extremely unlikely to get a good deal from a used car lot, between the dealer mark-up and them being "experts" who know exactly what the car is worth. Private owners will often sell a car at below market value just to get rid of it. Do lots of phone work first, to eliminate as many cars as possible, and make sure they will allow a test drive. If possible, don't set a specific time for the test drive, to prevent them from warming it up first, which can disguise problems like a difficult to start vehicle. Then, during the test drive, try out everything you can, like the turn signals, lights, heat, A/C, radio, etc. Aim for potholes, not away, to see how it handles them. StuRat (talk) 14:33, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

If you buy from the owner, ask if you can have the car checked out by a mechanic of your choosing before making the purchase. You will have to pay a few hundred for that service, but that could be a good investment. Any owner with nothing to hide should agree to have the car checked. If you don't want to do this, at least run the car's VIN through an online lemon check such as this one. Marco polo (talk) 15:42, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

Some mediocre advice in this thread. Having a car checked by a mechanic shouldn't cost a few hundred dollars, $75-100 tops, but I'd definitely recommend it. StuRat also offers some dodgy advice about looking for cars with different color hoods or doors. This is a good indication that the vehicle has been improperly repaired following an accident, if the owner didn't bother to get the paint done who knows what mechanical issues they've neglected to repair as well. The same can go for damaged interiors. If the owner isn't careful about maintaining the interior, they probably aren't careful about getting regular maintenance. A car dealer friend of mine once said that the only inspection he did on cars he bought was looking in the trunk. If it was clean then the owner probably took good car of the car (probably being a bit facetious). StuRat's advice on getting a vehicle with a remainder of a manufacturer's warranty (or anything close to that) is not going to work given the price range. Most factory warranties are bumper to bumper (covering the entire car) for 3 yrs/30k miles, some have extended powertrain warranties up to 60k or 100k. At $2-3k you're looking at buying a car closer to 100k and probably around 10 years old.

Cars in this price range will need regular work as various parts fail (you are not buying a new car) so you must be able to budget a few hundred a year for repairs. What you want to avoid are big ticket expenses like transmission replacements and everyday reliability problems that will leave you stranded. It's for this reason that I'd recommend a manual transmission; while clutches need replacement, they cost no where near what a automatic transmission replacement will run. Look for a car that has been well maintained, a complete set of service records is gold. Regular fluid changes are extremely important and you'd be surprised how many owners skip stuff like like this. Finally, make sure that you are not buying a salvage title vehicle, avoid them like the plague as they are almost guaranteed to have poorly repaired accident damage.

The choice between private party and dealer is not an easy one. Private party purchases can be a huge hassle if you don't have a lot of free time. People will jerk you around and try to rip you off left and right. You'll be driving all over your area looking at cars you wont be buying. (StuRat is right about doing lots of phone work to save yourself time.) And if you do get ripped off by buying something with serious, but unseen issues, you have little recourse. Dealers do charge more, some will try to rip you off as well and their selection at this price range is limited. On the other hand, you wont have to drive all over to look at multiple vehicles and if they do seriously misrepresent the condition of the vehicle they can be taken to small claims court much more easily. Unless you know of a good small dealer who you can trust, I'd stick with large brand name dealers. Most new car dealers have used car lots with vehicles of many brands. Customer satisfaction is important to places like this, I've worked at one before and you'd be surprised how far we went to make customers happy if problems arose shortly after purchase.

As for make and model, it's harder to say. Japanese brands like Toyota and Honda have reputations for reliability, but unfortunately it's not a secret and their used vehicles command high prices. While old examples luxury brands like BMW or Audi can be tempting, avoid them as repairs can be outrageously expensive. Here's an example of what I'd look for [8], Foresters are surprisingly fun to drive, but you should be flexible and make prior maintenance history a priority. Good luck! --Daniel(talk) 17:38, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

Superpowers that could require nudity to be useable

I'm writing a very tasteful and refined masterpiece of literature involving a collection of teenage girls who each develop a superpower, but those superpowers inherently involve nudity due to their functions. For example, the power to turn invisible, or to pass through solid objects/walls (Clothes can't turn invisible, or they'll fall off when she turns intangible.)

Can anyone think of other superpowers I can grant that are in that vein? 169.231.42.222 (talk) 01:04, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

As a writer of masterpieces, you can certainly think of them yourself. How about: any. Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 01:12, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

(Before this gets hatted)

• Flight / Ability to run at high speed (aerodynamics)
• Super-swimming (hydrodynamics)
• Ability to resist fire (clothes will burn)
• Ability to resist cold (see Logan's Run (film))
• Shapeshifting / Ability to change size
• Ability to photosynthesize (not much of a superpower, admittedly, but see Swamp Thing)

Tevildo (talk) 01:19, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

...oh yeah, and

• Ability to procreate...

Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 01:23, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

• • I was making a joke about it being a masterpiece, as if anything with the given premise could be any good...trust me, I am not a writer and it will not be very good at all :D 169.231.42.222 (talk) 01:27, 26 March 2013 (UTC)
    • If you're not attempting to write a smut novel, I'd suggest giving the characters uniforms that have the ability to work with their ability (that seems to be common practice in superhero novels/movies). If you are writing a smut novel, then most of the above should be okay; however, the readers would be more disbelieving if you tried to strip down a character for aerodynamics or hydrodynamics than other options. Ryan Vesey 01:34, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

Nudity is not smut. And the fact that certain "powers" require nudity has been used efficiently in fiction already; e.g. in Trueblood (the shapeshifters all become nude, which makes it hard to transition into "normal" life again immediately after shifting). --Mr.98 (talk) 03:02, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

I never stated that nudity is smut. Searching specifically for powers that will require nudity for teenage girls does imply that it is probably going to be a smut novel. Ryan Vesey 03:23, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

How about turning inside out or removing your skin? Maybe light absorption / emission (not the same as photosynthesis). And then there are hair grow / shrink powers...--Auric talk 01:41, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

I have always found it utterly impossible to practice clairvoyance while even lightly clothed. μηδείς (talk) 01:59, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

Hmm. My superpower is to become a better singer while in the shower, which seems to be related, as I seldom shower with clothes on. See bathroom singing. WHAAOE, you know. Matt Deres (talk) 02:44, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

In the Adventures of Superman episode called "The Mysterious Cube", Superman is able to pass through a solid wall and his famous circus suit goes right along with him, cape and all. Of course, the suit is not ordinary cloth; it was made in Krypton, so it is as invulnerable as Superman himself. And in "The Phantom Ring", all the villains use a machine (later employed by Superman himself) to turn totally invisible, clothes and all. One case where nudity was required was in The Terminator, where the deadly robot was sent back in time nude. However, Superman never had any trouble going back in time fully clothed. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 09:52, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

13 million American Buffalo (Bison)

I was watching a fascinating UK TV Historical Programme tonight about the development of America from the signing by President Lincoln of an authorization to construct a coast to coast railway line to the present day. It covered the construction itself, the subsequent construction of towns, cities, cowboys, prairie wars, Indian wars etc., etc. But who counted the 13 million heads of Bison back around 1865? 77.99.122.161 (talk) 02:51, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

Wildlife populations aren't measured by counting all of the individual members of the species. The most effective way of measuring wildlife population in an area that I remember from Bio was a capture-recapture method. Members of a species in a certain area would be captured and tagged. Later, a recapture would be done. Through some formula, measuring the percentage of members of the species in the recapture that had not previously been tagged, the population can be extrapolated to give an estimate of the entire region. Ryan Vesey 02:54, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

Here's a wikipedia article on what I roughly described Mark and recapture. Ryan Vesey 02:57, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Near as I can find, the seminal work in this area was done by William Temple Hornaday, so you may want to start with him to do your research into historic bison populations. It's worth noting that you don't have to actually count the number of bison directly to get an estimate on their population; wild populations can be estimated by noting the range and density of wild bison: if you know that a wild population of bison are distributed such that X acres of land can support Y bison, it's a simple calculation to estimate the wild populations prior to their widespread decline. No idea if this is what was actually done, but just one possibility for how to make such an estimate. --Jayron32 02:57, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

Then there's the time-tested scientific estimation method of determining total population by "how far can I walk before I step in buffalo poo ?". :-) StuRat (talk) 03:44, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

The slaughter and near extinction of the American Bison is a disgraceful part of American history. Even anecdotal accounts before the 1700s talk about literal miles of buffalo. That they were reduced to near extinction levels (and now are not extinct, but nowhere near what they once were) is a sad fact. How one measures any wildlife is not all that different today than it was then. you take samples you use statistics, and you fill in the blanks as best you can. Shadowjams (talk) 05:18, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

How do you think we feel in the UK? We have hardly any wildlife left at all, besides birds, rabbits, squirrels, a few isolated deer here and there, and a snake that isn't poisonous. If a couple of people see a fox or two in the same year, it's all over the TV as some sort of epidemic, and the men in red coats on horses start getting the dogs ready. KägeTorä - (影虎) (TALK) 07:10, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

We're tripping over foxes here in London - I'll arrange to have some sent north for you. Sadly, our squirrels are American and our deer are Chinese. Alansplodge (talk) 15:33, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

The difference could be that Britain's wildlife wasn't slaughtered for the purpose of conquering an ethnic group. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 09:44, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

Was slaughtering of buffalo part of a deliberate policy to conquer, or just a byproduct of greed for money by selling meat, skins, etc? Astronaut (talk) 13:36, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

I believe it was. Specifically, depriving Native American "plains Indians" of their livelihood was a means to get them to accept living on reservations "on the dole". StuRat (talk) 14:45, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

I wonder if the large bison population was also a result of human interference, when early Native Americans wiped out large predators, like the saber-toothed cat. StuRat (talk) 14:45, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

The (excellent and worth reading) 1491 by Charles C. Mann summarises a very good argument that the peak bison population of c. 17-1800 was indeed a byproduct of human interference, albeit unintentional human interference with other human populations. The theory is that the wave of disease which spread rapidly ahead of European settlement and massively decimated the Native American population had the knock-on effect of sending ecosystems haywire; balanced animal populations which had previously been managed by hunting spiralled out of control once the hunters vanished, and by the time Europeans reached the plains they found massive herds of bison and pigeons which simply hadn't been there before 15-1600. Andrew Gray (talk) 15:38, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

CIMA STUDY PACK/MODEL QUESTIONS

From where can I find CIMA study pack, Model question papers and past papers either free download or on payment? thank you.111.223.154.199 (talk) 07:59, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

If you want the hard copy books, they are available here [9]. I don't think they are available for download as electronic versions. --Viennese Waltz 08:30, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

weird picture to ID

What the heck is going on here? I tried a tineye search, but all the other sites look to be similar style collections of random photos. Was the building constructed around the whatever-it-is? Or is something bursting out? Avant-garde art installation? Matt Deres (talk) 11:23, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

Yes, an art installation created from plywood by artist Henrique Oliveira "whose irregular forms devour large spaces".[10]--Melburnian (talk) 12:29, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

This [11] shows a better view.--Auric talk 12:30, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

Great! Thanks! Matt Deres (talk) 13:12, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

homeschooled children in sports

I am curious as to when hoeschooled children were allowed to participate in public school sports program.14:42, 26 March 2013 (UTC)96.255.105.27 (talk)

It will vary depending on the jurisdiction you live in, but if you type the exact sentence you just typed above into http://www.google.com you will get plenty of answers to your question. --Jayron32 15:53, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

Do hoeschooled students attend an agricultural college ? :-) StuRat (talk) 16:37, 26 March 2013 (UTC)