User talk:Rhododendrites

This is the talk page for User:Rhododendrites.

Your Thoughts...

We have discussed the possibility of expanding THIS... I am seriously considering the creation of a full genre article comparable to stuff like Swedish death metal or West Coast hip hop etc. It would essentially be the narrative of the Don't Think I've Forgotten film in expanded form with robust links and independent sources. I am confident that text and sources for such an article will come together rather easily from our existing artist articles plus Cambodian Rocks and related items on Cambodian history and the war. The problem is I cannot think of a GOOD TITLE!
Cambodian rock might be pretty good but the era of interest will be 1959-1975 and current Cambodian music will be excluded. Cambodian psychedelic rock might also be good because it's a label that is often used by modern fans like Dengue Fever (band) but it implies that psychedelic was the only genre practiced in that scene. Something like 1960-70s rock in Cambodia might be too long and unwieldy for WP:NAMINGCRITERIA. Any thoughts? ---DOOMSDAYER520 (Talk|Contribs) 18:59, 2 August 2018 (UTC)

I've found myself thinking about this a few times now. The best I've come up with so far is "Music of/in/during pre-Khmer Rouge Cambodia", with honorable mentions for "Music of Sihanouk Era Cambodia and the Khmer Republic", "Music of Cambodia, 1960-1975", "Mid-20th century music in Cambodia" and the like. It seems hard to draw a clear line -- musically or politically. I haven't read anything that does much to contrast music under Sihanouk vs. the Khmer Republic. That is, I've read plenty about how Sihanouk fostered music/culture, but not much about what changed between 1970-75. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 19:21, 2 August 2018 (UTC)

Pinging Wikirictor, who wrote most of History of Cambodia, and WilliamThweatt, who has provided some useful insight about related topics in the past. @Wikirictor, since I don't know if you know the context here, we've been working on 1960s-70s Cambodian pop/rock music articles like Sinn Sisamouth, Yol Aularong, Pen Ran, Baksey Cham Krong, Meas Samon, Ros Serey Sothea, etc. (and my gateway to the music, Cambodian Rocks). — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 19:29, 2 August 2018 (UTC)

In the near future I'm ready to write a first draft of such an article on the scene/genre, but I'll take any ideas on what to call the dang thing. ---DOOMSDAYER520 (Talk|Contribs) 20:19, 2 August 2018 (UTC)

Thanks for the ping. As I've noted before, I don't have much time to dedicate to WP these days, so I won't say much. However, I will say that both by its title and in its content, such an article should make it clear that this was (to use Doomsdayer's terms) one specific scene in Cambodian popular music of the era. The "rock" music has been brought to the attention of the Western world in recent times and that may make it seem like it was something more than it really was. But rock music wasn't the only kind of pop music in Cambodia during that era, nor was it likely even the most popular. Among Khmer, Sisamouth and SereiSothea for example, are more well-known for slow ballads like this and this or their myriad rom vong and rom kbach songs. These types of songs were (and are) way more popular among all Cambodian demographic groups than any of the psychedelic or "garage band" type music, which although popular among college and international students at the time for its "western" sound, was/is viewed as not much more than a novelty by most Cambodians. On top of that, in addition to pop music, there were other genres including court music, traditional and folk music that also prospered during this era. And...I've rambled on more than I intended. Suffice to say that the title and the article should put the CambodiaRocks-type music in the proper Cambodian context (i.e. not at all representative of all Cambodian popular music of the time) in addition to noting its new-found, and rather incongruous, popularity among westerners.--William Thweatt ^TalkContribs 07:19, 3 August 2018 (UTC)

Thanks for the helpful reminder, William. Documentaries like Don't Think I've Forgotten and the selection of music that's been imported to the US have definitely shaped my understanding such that I may be of the impression that it was more popular than it was, but I've listened to enough e.g. Sinn Sisamouth and Ros Serey Sothea that I know it's not all western-influenced rock/pop/garage/psych. I don't know specifically what Doomsdayer's article plan is, but I would assume incorporate material about all sorts of pop music if doing an article on that era. Perhaps that just gets too much overlap with the existing article, and perhaps we would run into trouble with two people who don't read Khmer searching for sources on the elements of Khmer music that haven't become popular in the west (I say popular, but it's even more of a niche here :) ). So maybe the most succinct title/scope (which doesn't read as very succinct, but oh well) might be "Rock music of pre-Khmer Rouge Cambodia". — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 14:47, 3 August 2018 (UTC)

William's thoughts indicate why Music of Cambodia should remain the primary article in this area. Unfortunately that article has been in need of expansion for years, and international WP users do not have the expertise, and anyone who does have the expertise is probably not able to use international WP. In the history of the Sinn Sisamouth talk page you can see people popping up occasionally who really are Cambodian (as in an old dispute over how to spell his name), but otherwise we have a bunch of articles written by Americans with material that Americans know about. .......................... It's surely not perfect but the scene/genre has gained international notice that may very well transcend Cambodia itself. Or in other words, Klezmer is enjoyed and talked about worldwide by people who know little about its European Jewish originators and may not have to. "1960s-70s Cambodian Rock" (or whatever title) could survive WP's notability requirements thanks to its international recognition. Any article here must avoid implying that it represents ALL Cambodian popular music, which hopefully can be done with sensitive writing. I envision a tight genre-specific article; consider the article for Jazz fusion which does not imply that it's the only kind of jazz. ---DOOMSDAYER520 (Talk|Contribs) 15:08, 3 August 2018 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Palace of Fine Arts (2020)

An image created by you has been promoted to featured picture status Your image, File:Palace of Fine Arts (16794p).jpg, was nominated on Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates, gained a consensus of support, and has been promoted. If you would like to nominate an image, please do so at Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates. Thank you for your contribution! Armbrust The Homunculus 23:03, 1 March 2020 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/California sea lion in La Jolla

An image created by you has been promoted to featured picture status Your image, File:California sea lion in La Jolla (70568).jpg, was nominated on Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates, gained a consensus of support, and has been promoted. If you would like to nominate an image, please do so at Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates. Thank you for your contribution! Armbrust The Homunculus 22:48, 3 March 2020 (UTC)

New exercise regimen while staying indoors during the pandemic

I'll just leave this here... — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 15:37, 23 March 2020 (UTC)

Outstanding!!! Video now shared with dog owners I know. --cart-Talk 15:52, 3 April 2020 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Mandarin Patinkin

The article Mandarin Patinkin you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Mandarin Patinkin for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already been on the main page as an "In the news" or "Did you know" item, you can nominate it to appear in Did you know. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Kingsif -- Kingsif (talk) 17:41, 12 April 2020 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Alice Gray

The article Alice Gray you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Alice Gray for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already been on the main page as an "In the news" or "Did you know" item, you can nominate it to appear in Did you know. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of The Rambling Man -- The Rambling Man (talk) 09:02, 18 April 2020 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Hudson Yards

An image created by you has been promoted to featured picture status Your image, File:Hudson Yards from Hudson Commons (95131p).jpg, was nominated on Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates, gained a consensus of support, and has been promoted. If you would like to nominate an image, please do so at Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates. Thank you for your contribution! Armbrust The Homunculus 05:46, 2 May 2020 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Fulton Center

An image created by you has been promoted to featured picture status Your image, File:Fulton Center skylight (91420).jpg, was nominated on Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates, gained a consensus of support, and has been promoted. If you would like to nominate an image, please do so at Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates. Thank you for your contribution! Armbrust The Homunculus 16:38, 12 May 2020 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Gowanus Batcave

The article Gowanus Batcave you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Gowanus Batcave for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already been on the main page as an "In the news" or "Did you know" item, you can nominate it to appear in Did you know. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Mujinga -- Mujinga (talk) 11:21, 16 May 2020 (UTC)

Great work on the page! You definitely deserve this. epicgenius (talk) 16:17, 18 May 2020 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Ellis Island hospital

An image created by you has been promoted to featured picture status Your image, File:Ellis Island hospital window mural (01897).jpg, was nominated on Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates, gained a consensus of support, and has been promoted. If you would like to nominate an image, please do so at Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates. Thank you for your contribution! Armbrust The Homunculus 17:59, 20 May 2020 (UTC)

DYK for Orlando Julius

On 31 May 2020, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Orlando Julius, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that Robin Denselow of The Guardian called Orlando Julius (pictured) "one of the heroes of Nigerian music"? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Orlando Julius. You are welcome to check how many page hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, Orlando Julius), and it may be added to the statistics page if the total is over 5,000. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

Cwmhiraeth (talk) 00:01, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

DYK for George Floyd protests in New York City

On 13 July 2020, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article George Floyd protests in New York City, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that amid the George Floyd protests, New York City implemented its first nighttime curfew since the Harlem riot of 1943? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/George Floyd protests in New York City. You are welcome to check how many page hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, George Floyd protests in New York City), and it may be added to the statistics page if the total is over 5,000. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

— Maile (talk) 00:01, 13 July 2020 (UTC)

Reasonable criteria and the "List of fictional vegetarian characters"

So, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of fictional vegetarian characters just closed. I saw you said that you "have no trouble imagining that a reasonable inclusion criteria could be established" and that you have "concerns about the notability of the subject as established by coverage as a group." Can you explain more about that? Since the page is preserved, I want to try and revise it so that another AFD doesn't come up again. --Historyday01 (talk) 22:02, 4 October 2020 (UTC)

@Historyday01: By the former I did not mean that I had one particular set of criteria in mind but that I have no trouble imagining that there are [various] ways that could be accomplished (implying that that doesn't look like a reason for deletion here). By notability, I mean some solid coverage of "fictional vegetarians" as a group, apart from low quality blog listicles, etc. It may exist, but on my cursory look I didn't see much of that. I may be wrong, though; I didn't look all that hard since I was already coming down on the keep side of things. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 22:42, 4 October 2020 (UTC)

Ah, good point there. Yeah, it is hard to find anything on them, but I think that's just a consequence of the fact that far too few people have written about it. That's my thought on it at least.Historyday01 (talk) 23:13, 4 October 2020 (UTC)

Exactly. And whether enough people have written about a subject is what Wikipedia means by notable. :) Anyway, I don't intend on following it up with a new nomination for deletion or anything FYI. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 23:21, 4 October 2020 (UTC)

two cents

I was just thinking, shouldn't you write "my two cents" instead of "$0.02" ! Govvy (talk) 17:21, 26 October 2020 (UTC)

@Govvy: Quite possibly. I've wondered in the past if the meaning might not translate well outside of the US/UK, but within those countries I presume $0.02 would be understood the same way as 2¢ (which I'd write instead if only that pesky ¢ character were more easily accessible)? :) — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 17:43, 26 October 2020 (UTC)

Even know it's American I actually think that "my two cents" has becoming part of the lexican in the UK, although I don't think it's used that much. Govvy (talk) 17:49, 26 October 2020 (UTC)

Featured Picture Trophy

Awarded to Rhododendrites, who scored the most points for Featured Pictures in any individual round of the 2020 WikiCup and in the whole contest.

Congratulations! Cwmhiraeth (talk) 19:01, 5 November 2020 (UTC)

Hatnote on Burberry

Hi, I noticed that you'd removed the hatnote I put on the Burberry article. I put the hatnote there because I found the Burberry article while looking for Barberry, as the two are pronounced almost identically and I'd always thought burberry was the actual name for the plant. I would guess that many other people have this same confusion so I believe the hatnote is justified. RedPanda25 02:37, 24 November 2020 (UTC)

@RedPanda25: Seems like a straightforward WP:NAMB issue. Sounding alike isn't usually a good reason (as far as I'm aware) nor unrelated topics spelled a letter or two away from each other. e.g. we would also need hatnotes at Barbary, Barbery, Bob Berry, etc. If we had some sources which showed there to be confusion between the terms, that might make sense. All this said, it's not something I feel terribly strongly about so if you're in an WP:IAR mood, have at it (I'd just ask that you link to this thread or otherwise contextualize in the edit summary). — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 03:01, 24 November 2020 (UTC)

Revert on Fox News

Hi, you recently reverted my edit on the Fox News article, alleging WP:FALSEBALANCE. Can you please explain what makes you think this rule applies here? As I said in the edit summary, MSNBC article gets no criticism in lead. Fox denies bias in its reporting content (as opposed to commentary). Allegations of bias are addressed at great length where appropriate, more so than comparable articles. Maintain consistent and fair standards. If the most directly comparable left-of-centre cable networks don't have nearly as much (or, in the case of MSNBC, any) mention of alleged or real bias in their article leads yet Fox does, despite a plethora of reliable sources available, there is clear bias. Not to mention, as I said, Fox denies bias or partisanship in their core news content, which is clearly differentiated from commentary content. If you haven't, I encourage you to read an article of two from (or at least visit the homepages of) both Fox and MSNBC; you might be surprised. Kind regards, thorpewilliam (talk) 02:16, 28 November 2020 (UTC)

Hi Thorpewilliam You're looking for balance between amounts of criticisms or kinds of descriptions between MSNBC and Fox (or something else and Fox). Subjects are covered here according to the way that source has been written about in reliable sources. The false balance is saying it should be written about with consideration of summaries of other subjects like MSNBC. If the MSNBC aren't isn't adequately and proportionally summarizing the body of literature about that subject, that's a matter for that talk page. As far as what they say about themselves, Wikipedia typically cares more about what other people say about a company (or most subjects, really) than what they say about themselves. Sometimes it's worth mentioning that a subject disputes characterizations of bias, but the bulk of the article should be summarizing what other reliable sources say. FYI when it comes to using Fox as a source (this is independent of the content of the article), we do differentiate between the news content and the talk shows (see the WP:RSP entries). — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 03:00, 28 November 2020 (UTC)

@Rhododendrites: Duly noted. Thanks for correcting my understanding of the rule. Regards, thorpewilliam (talk) 08:26, 4 December 2020 (UTC)

Media Bias in the US

Hi! I noticed that in the history for the page above you reverted my edit with the comment "business week". This is a Harvard document. Where did you get business week? Was it otherwise published in that journal? I accept the revert but the comment confused me. I will be here on and off throughout the day, so feel free to leave a message here or my talk page. Thanks! Dswitz10734 (talk) 12:51, 1 December 2020 (UTC)

Thanks for the message, Dswitz10734. Here's the revert. Scholar.harvard.edu is where Harvard faculty's personal websites are. Sometimes they upload PDF versions of their publications. If you click through the link, you can see it's a print-out/PDF version of an opinion piece in BusinessWeek, not something published in a journal or by harvard. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 15:07, 1 December 2020 (UTC)

A new page which addresses your concern back in October...

So, back in October, you supported the keeping of the page List of fictional vegetarian characters but only "reluctantly," saying you have "concerns about the notability of the subject as established by coverage as a group, but not quite concerned enough to start scrutinizing that at the end of a snowing AfD." Anyway, the list page has been limited, to the best of my knowledge (although a few characters might have slipped in there) to recurring and main characters. And, I have a page I created today, which I've worked on, off and on, since that deletion discussion, titled Vegetarian characters in fiction, so I thought I'd share that too. --Historyday01 (talk) 03:49, 11 December 2020 (UTC)

note re meetup

Hi. why hasn't a notice gone out of this upcoming meetup?

• Wikipedia:Meetup/NYC/December_2020

--Sm8900 (talk) 00:35, 15 December 2020 (UTC)

@Sm8900: I think that with Wikicon just finishing, it's just nobody's gotten around to it. Thanks for the reminder, though. @Pharos: are you available to do your centralnotice/massmessage wizardry? — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 01:44, 15 December 2020 (UTC)

Presto! — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 02:00, 15 December 2020 (UTC)

terrific! thanks so much! I do appreciate all your amazing work. thanks. --Sm8900 (talk) 15:14, 15 December 2020 (UTC)

Discussion on Growth team "add an image" idea

Hello Rhododendrites! I'm Marshall Miller; I'm the product manager for the WMF's Growth team, which works on features to help retain new editors. Lately, we have been working on this set of ideas called "structured tasks", which break down editing workflows into steps that make sense for newcomers and make sense on mobile devices. We're currently thinking about an idea for a workflow in which newcomers would be recommended images from Commons that might be a good fit for unillustrated Wikipedia articles. One of the community members participating in the conversation recommended you as someone who has a particularly strong grasp on the usage of images in articles. Since this project is in its beginning phases, we really depend on community members to help us think through the feasibility, opportunities, and pitfalls. If you have time, it would be really helpful to us if you could check out the project page and weigh in on the discussion. Thank you! -- MMiller (WMF) (talk) 05:38, 17 December 2020 (UTC)

@MMiller (WMF): Thanks for reaching out. I'd be happy to help in any way I can, though I've been really busy with some off-wiki projects in these last few days so haven't had time to read through those pages. If there are specific questions/elements that would be more helpful for me to jump into than others, let me know; otherwise I'll try to take a look at the general topics soon.

In general, I think there's an incredible opportunity not just to "harness the crowd" but also as a low-investment way to bring new people in. My sense of the other data "games" relating to images have had rather mixed results (suggestededits in the wikipedia app and the one that invites people to add "depicts" statements), so my initial reaction from a Wikipedia standpoint is that there's some risk involved. We'd want articles that don't already have images, probably would want to omit all BLPs, and could use a flag that makes third party review easy as a sort of maintenance tag. SuggestedEdits has an edit filter so I could go through and fix a batch of the problematic ones a few weeks ago, for example, but maybe something even more visible in the article? Just first thoughts -- I look forward to learning more. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 18:05, 22 December 2020 (UTC)

@Rhododendrites: thank you for giving this a bit of thought. I'm glad to hear you think the idea has potential. This idea was, in fact, inspired by the "suggested edits" in the Android app, and we're working with that team on ideating around this. They may wind up building something similar. And the Growth team is actually in the middle of building our first "structured task" for adding wikilinks to articles (note that our team deploys everything on smaller wikis first, and we haven't brought any of our features to English Wikipedia yet). Thinking back to the Android context, I think that something that would set this image task apart from some of the other suggested edits is that they would be edits to Wikipedia, rather than to Commons or Wikidata (e.g. depicts statements). This may be more engaging to newcomers, since they would immediately be able to see and show their impact on real articles. But, as you say, it also comes with risk because the visibility is higher.

We would plan to only offer articles that are totally unillustrated, so that newcomers would be adding the first/only image to the article. And we would also include a tag so that people could monitor and patrol them if needed. I like your idea about excluding BLPs -- I presume because a higher level of care is needed for those articles. I can check to see if it's possible to filter our BLPs without filtering out all biographies (there are a fair number of unillustrated historical biographies with good images in Commons). I definitely look forward to when you have time to check out the whole project page and participate on the discussion page (we're hoping to have the bulk of the discussion in the next four weeks or so). But these are the questions that are top-of-mind right now:

• What rules to use around placing the image into the article? For instance, perhaps we should do something like: if there is an infobox that has a slot for an image, put it in there, otherwise put it below the templates and above the body. But I'm concerned that there would be many edge cases or reasons such a set of rules wouldn't work.
• How could we help newcomers write good captions for the images?
• Given that most metadata from Commons is in English, how might we make a similar experience that could work for people who don't read English in other wikis?
• What other pitfalls should we be concerned about? Where can newcomers go wrong here, so that we can help them?

Thank you for any time you can take on this! -- MMiller (WMF) (talk) 22:10, 22 December 2020 (UTC)

@MMiller (WMF): Out of curiosity, is there any research which estimates the number of opportunities there may be. To demonstrate beyond anecdotal evidence that there is a large enough number of clearly relevant images that need to be placed in respective articles? I'm more often hunting down images off-wiki and uploading than searching Commons for what's already there (or it's possible I just do that without thinking!), so don't have a very clear idea. Those figures would, of course, vary by project/language. As for your questions:

Rules: When there's no image currently in the article, except with a rare BLP case I've never seen it be controversial, no matter the quality or whether it directly or obliquely depicts the subject. That placement sounds fine with me, but some people have their own personal preferences that I don't think you need to worry about. Worst case scenario is an image that isn't actually a good infobox photo (so a person in a large group photo for example, or an unknown interior room rather than the exterior of a building), then someone who isn't new can just move it out afterwards. In short, if there's no image at all and the image found does in some way depict the subject, I don't think you need to worry much.

Captions: It might be nice to have some variable caption advice, perhaps based on the "instance of" whatever the image "depicts" (or perhaps Wikidata won't be involved as much?). So advice for a person, a species, a building, etc. But of course we have a whole long MOS page for captions (because of course we do) which is probably better to summarize than anything I'd say.

Languages: It seems like a useful starting point would be just to see what images are in the corresponding English article? But I guess I'm not sure which data set you're working with. While captions are language-dependent, of course, I wouldn't have thought you'd be using those much. Even in English many captions on Commons are missing or poor. Depicts shouldn't be a problem with language, right?

Pitfalls: Based on what you said to my initial comments it sounds like you've already thought about the major "what can go wrong" stuff. Working only with unillustrated articles, removing BLPs, and having an edit filter/tag/whatnot on the edit to make it easy to review them removes a lot of the concerns I'd have. The rest (captions, placement, etc.) is IMO relatively minor and easy for other people to fix if necessary. I'd be curious about the research into suggestededits, though, because if that's any indication, getting people to understand the task at all and engage with it in good faith seems like the challenge. Anecdotally, when I did a spot check more than half of the edits were wrong/low quality. That kind of error rate kind of defeats the point. I raised it on the suggested edits talk page and at AN there, but didn't get much of a response. FYI. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 15:44, 26 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi Rhododendrites -- I'm sorry for the delayed response; I lost track of your reply over the holidays, but I'm glad I rediscovered it. Here are my responses and follow-up questions:

Number of opportunities: Yes, this is something we looked into early on to make sure we were in the ballpark of having a sufficient number of tasks to offer in any given Wikipedia. You can see some of the rough estimates here, and we're going to make a fresh set of more accurate estimates here. Using English Wikipedia as an example (though we would first try out such a feature on smaller wikis), there are about 2.9 million unillustrated articles, and the algorithm would be able to propose images for something like 300,000 to 400,000 of them (about 10% of the unillustrated articles), with about 36,000 coming from Wikidata's P18 and the majority coming from the images used in the same articles on other language Wikipedias. With hundreds of thousands of images available, I think that's enough opportunity to build a feature for, and enough suggestions that it won't run out quickly. What do you think?

Captions: That's a good idea, to have variable advice for captions, more tailored to the type of article. Or perhaps we could show example captions from images placed on similar articles.

Languages: In running some user tests with our prototypes, it seems like the workflow people go through in doing the task is they look at the unillustrated article (e.g. "St. Paul's Church in Chicago") and see if the image could presumably be that entity (e.g. "yes, this is a church"). Then they look for the title of the article somewhere in the image's metadata to confirm that the image is that specific instance (e.g. "Good, the filename is StPaulsChicago.jpeg"). In these user tests, it looks like the most useful metadata fields from Commons for matching an image are the filename and the description, because those are the ones that have the highest coverage. The Commons captions and depicts are also useful, but are populated a lot less often than the description. And since the Commons image titles and descriptions are usually in English, this causes the challenge in other languages. The main idea I have for this right now is to only offer the task to people who can read English, similarly to how knowledge of two languages is needed to use the Content Translation Tool. This is unfortunate, because it would be best if everyone could use this task, regardless of their language skills.

Pitfalls: I'm glad you have feedback about the Android app's suggested edits. That team has a new product manager who wants to hear community thoughts on how to improve suggested edits. I'll start a new thread on your talk page to introduce her.

Thank you for your help. -- MMiller (WMF) (talk) 00:52, 16 January 2021 (UTC)

@MMiller (WMF): Thanks for following up with this information. I'd love to test it out if/when it gets to that point. Just one more question to follow up: I've noticed, of course, that descriptions on Commons are in English by default (the major exceptions being some subset of featured pictures -- POTDs, POTY finalists, etc. -- and even then only a handful of languages). Is it worth making description-level translations more of a priority? Or is the idea to use Wikidata captions/depicts statements as an alternative? — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 03:42, 27 January 2021 (UTC)

@Rhododendrites: about the testing, we actually have a new plan for how people like you can try it out. The Android team, the same team as JTanner (WMF) below, is going to use the existing suggested edits feed to build an image recommendation feature for learning purposes. Importantly, this "minimum viable product" won't save any edits to Wikipedia. It's just for us to gather data, improve the algorithm, and learn. It will be made clear to users of the app that their work is only being used for learning, not for edits. We'll let you know when you could try it out (if you have an Android device). About the descriptions: we actually recently calculated some numbers around local-language metadata on Commons. In general, local-language descriptions and local-language Wikidata captions are quite rare at this point. When we look at the images we're able to recommend, in most wikis fewer than 5% of them have local-language descriptions or captions. I agree that there's an opportunity there for some "upstream" tasks to encourage people to increase the coverage (like how the Android has a "translate image captions" task), and then that goodness would flow down into the task to put the images on articles. -- MMiller (WMF) (talk) 02:26, 29 January 2021 (UTC)

Thoughts on suggested edits

@Rhododendrites: like I mentioned in the other thread, I'd like to introduce you to JTanner (WMF), who is the new product manager for the WMF's Android app team. I know you had some thoughts and concerns about suggested edits, and I think Jazmin may want to ask you about your experience as she gets onboarded to the team in the next couple weeks. -- MMiller (WMF) (talk) 00:57, 16 January 2021 (UTC)

@Rhododendrites: Hi its nice to connect with you. Thank you for taking the time to flag so many important things about how we should reexamine Suggested Edits and the disruptions it creates for experienced Commons Volunteers. I am new to the Android team but have been at the Foundation for almost 3 years and have always greatly valued volunteers that give us feedback on how to improve. I want to apologize that there has been such a delay in response. I have made improvements to Suggested Edits a priority for the team. Feel free to collaborate with us and follow along as we tackle improvements to this feature https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T271727. I hope to continue to partner with you in improving this experience. JTanner (WMF) (talk) 21:40, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

@JTanner (WMF): Hello, and nice to connect with you, too. Thanks for the update. I've subscribed to the Phabricator ticket. What's been said there so far looks spot-on.

One comment, though: I wouldn't consider the Commons "Depicts" page set in stone. As far as I can tell, it was written/discussed by only a few people and can very likely be changed with some thoughtfully framed discussion/proposals. It seems like discussions about structured data outside the walls of Wikidata (on Commons, on enwp) are often complicated by incomplete or incorrect information, which causes people who have trouble understanding to throw their hands up or err on the side of what's familiar. There are plenty of people more knowledgeable than me, but just in case it would be helpful, I'm happy to help with the community communication stuff. :) — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 04:35, 27 January 2021 (UTC)

@Rhododendrites: This is very helpful! I will add this nuance to the Phabricator task so that we can include it in our discussions. We would actually love the help, thank you for offering. I'm going to ping Johan (WMF) , our team's Community Relations Specialist, who expressed interest earlier this week in connecting with you to discuss community consultation and partnering to get this right. Thank you again for being so helpful as we truly seek to improve this experience. JTanner (WMF) (talk) 01:09, 29 January 2021 (UTC)

Undid of my changes of page https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Central_Park_birdwatching_incident

Mr. Rhododendrites,

are you sure that your bird watching hobby, that is obviously true after looking your twitter account, which is publicly linked to this Wikipedia account, has not affected on your decision to revert my changes on this wikipage of titled incident?

It cannot be that challengeable persons, e.g. persons who share the same hobby IN THE SAME CITY, edit pages to favour one side of the discussed incident.

In Finland, the word is JÄÄVI and you are JÄÄVI in this situation. There is a high possibility that you either know mr. Cooper personally OR favour him sharing the same hobby, in the same city.

The risk of Conflict of Interest is too high. You have no other option, but to revert back. If you like to challenge my words in said wikipage, ask some moderator to look it up and write his decision of this, without any possibility of Conflict of Interest.

2001:14BA:16F6:5500:28C2:A665:E20E:EC10 (talk) 23:36, 5 February 2021 (UTC)

I have never met either of the involved Coopers to my knowledge and no, birding in the same metropolitan area does not give me a COI when it comes to basic Wikipedia policy. Happy to discuss the specifics of WP:OR and WP:WEIGHT on the article talk page. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 23:50, 5 February 2021 (UTC)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judicial_disqualification https://fi.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esteellisyys

The possibility is enough. There is no need to prove or unprove your relationship to mr. Cooper and please do not try to do so, as your personal relationships are not public information. The possibility>0 exists. It is nonzero. See, our local bank had to fire one person from the bank as they married a collague. Nobody even accused them to do anything illegal, but the possiblity had to be eliminated. Two related persons always have a possibility to conspire, but of course they seldom do.

2001:14BA:16F6:5500:28C2:A665:E20E:EC10 (talk) 00:39, 6 February 2021 (UTC)

If you have read the WP:COI policy and those I linked above and feel something is wrong, there is a COI noticeboard where you can make an argument. It's really a straightforward removal though. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 00:55, 6 February 2021 (UTC)

One more question: what is your given approximate probability of that mr. Cooper had an own dog beside him. What is is your given approximate conditional probability that a bird watcher from a city undoes a change made by physics professional at other side of the globe in a wikipage of an incident in said city's bird watching and outdooring place and has no personal interest? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:14BA:16F6:5500:28C2:A665:E20E:EC10 (talk) 01:44, 6 February 2021 (UTC)

If you would like to talk about the article, use the article's talk page. If you would like to pursue COI allegations, use WP:COIN. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 03:49, 6 February 2021 (UTC)

Fleming

Hi Rhododendrites, A couple of things on the Fleming discussion. Firstly, I moved the top of your closed section to leave the note to admin in the open; if you disagree with that, please feel free to move it back to your original position. Secondly, I have !voted in the discussion (at 19:27 UTC today). It is the only !vote I have made, despite the implication made by Hal333. It’s pointless trying to !vote more than once as an IP, as double voting is easily picked up on. As I’ve previously edited as a named account, (and yes, just to be completely open and above board, this is the editor previously known as SchroCat), I know the rules and I’m not so stupid as to try and vote more than once. I’m unsurprised that my !vote has been questioned, particularly by that editor, as I have had problems with them before. Cheers - 213.205.194.6 (talk) 20:17, 6 February 2021 (UTC)

Hi there,

I mildly disagree only because the comment above yours is no longer a duplicate !vote, and thus that note and what follows does not [IMO] add much to the main discussion. That said, I also don't think it's a big deal and don't intend to move it back. Sometimes people archive/collapse/close in order to keep things on track or reduce drama, but wind up doing the opposite when there's a back-and-forth over the archiving/collapsing/closing itself, so I'd assume leave it be. :) — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 21:03, 6 February 2021 (UTC)

Feedback request: History and geography request for comment

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This Month in GLAM: January 2021

This Month in GLAM – Volume XI, Issue I, January 2021 Headlines Belgium report: The Public Domain Tool; Data Donations; Wiki Loves Heritage Belgium 2020 Brazil report: Heading 2021 with new (and renewed!) GLAM-Wiki projects Colombia report: Public domain day in Colombia Finland report: AvoinGLAM France report: #1lib1ref; Training courses; What's next ?; Wikidata and archaeology vocabulary Germany report: Coding da Vinci Niedersachsen wraps up Serbia report: A month in the spirit of references Sweden report: Record numbers of digital museum visits UK report: Protests & Suffragettes - Wikipedia work in 2020; Khalili Collections USA report: Wiki 20 WMF GLAM report: Digital Public Library of America makes an impact in 2020 Calendar: February's GLAM events Read this edition in full • Single-page To assist with preparing the newsletter, please visit the newsroom. Past editions may be viewed here.

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February 17: ONLINE WikiWednesday Salon NYC

February 17, 7pm: ONLINE WikiWednesday Salon NYC

Welcome to Wikimedia New York City! You are invited to join the Wikimedia NYC community for our monthly "WikiWednesday" evening salon (7-8pm) and knowledge-sharing workshop. To join the meeting from your computer or smartphone, just visit this link. More information about how to connect is available on the meetup page. We look forward to seeing local Wikimedians, but would also like to invite folks from the greater New York metropolitan area (and beyond!) who might not typically be able to join us in person! This month will include a discussion of Black WikiHistory Month in February, plans for WikiWomen's History Month in March, and of course the great work that is being done in these topical areas throughout the year. We will also have a relevant demonstration of the Wikipedia:Did you know process. If there's a project you'd like to share or a question you'd like answered, just let us know by adding it to the agenda or responding to this message. Wednesday February 17 WikiWednesday Salon and Skill-Share NYC (optional RSVP on-wiki). 7:00pm - 8:00 pm online via Zoom (optional breakout rooms from 8:00-8:30)

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Thursday Feb 25: ONLINE Black Wiki History Month at the Schomburg Center

Feb 25, 1:30-5pm: Black Wiki History Month at the Schomburg Center

You are invited to join the AfroCROWD and Wikimedia NYC communities for the 7th year of this edit-a-thon, this time being held in a virtual format. More information about how to connect is available on the meetup page, and register on the form to get the Zoom link. We look forward to seeing local Wikimedians, but would also like to invite folks from the greater New York metropolitan area (and beyond!) who might not typically be able to join us in person! Thursday Feb 25 Black Wiki History Month at the Schomburg Center (optional RSVP on-wiki). 1:30pm - 5:30 pm online, register on the form to get the Zoom link

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The Signpost: 28 February 2021

• News and notes: Maher stepping down

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WikiCup 2021 March newsletter

Round 1 of the competition has finished; it was a high-scoring round with 21 contestants scoring more than 100 points. Everyone with a positive score moves on to Round 2, with 55 contestants qualifying. You will need to finish among the top thirty-two contestants in Round 2 if you are to qualify for Round 3. Our top scorers in Round 1 were:

• Epicgenius led the field with a featured article, nine good articles and an assortment of other submissions, specialising on buildings and locations in New York, for a total of 945 points.
• Bloom6132 was close behind with 896 points, largely gained from 71 "In the news" items, mostly recent deaths.
• ImaginesTigers, who has been editing Wikipedia for less than a year, was in third place with 711 points, much helped by bringing League of Legends to featured article status, exemplifying how bonus points can boost a contestant's score.
• Amakuru came next with 708 points, Kigali being another featured article that scored maximum bonus points.
• Ktin, new to the WikiCup, was in fifth place with 523 points, garnered from 15 DYKs and 34 "In the news" items.
• The Rambling Man scored 511 points, many from featured article candidate reviews and from football related DYKs.
• Gog the Mild, last year's runner-up, came next with 498 points, from a featured article and numerous featured article candidate reviews.
• Hog Farm, at 452, scored for a featured article, four good articles and a number of reviews.
• Le Panini, another newcomer to the WikiCup, scored 438 for a featured article and three good articles.
• Lee Vilenski, last year's champion, scored 332 points, from a featured article and various other sport-related topics.

These contestants, like all the others, now have to start again from scratch. In Round 1, contestants achieved eight featured articles, three featured lists and one featured picture, as well as around two hundred DYKs and twenty-seven ITNs. They completed 97 good article reviews, nearly double the 52 good articles they claimed. Contestants also claimed for 135 featured article and featured list candidate reviews. There is no longer a requirement to mention your WikiCup participation when undertaking these reviews.

Remember that any content promoted after the end of Round 1 but before the start of Round 2 can be claimed in Round 2. Invitations for collaborative writing efforts or any other discussion of potentially interesting work is always welcome on the WikiCup talk page. Remember, if two or more WikiCup competitors have done significant work on an article, all can claim points. If you are concerned that your nomination—whether it is a good article candidate, a featured process, or something else—will not receive the necessary reviews, please list it on Wikipedia:WikiCup/Reviews.

If you want to help out with the WikiCup, please do your bit to keep down the review backlogs! Questions are welcome on Wikipedia talk:WikiCup, and the judges are reachable on their talk pages or by email. Good luck! If you wish to start or stop receiving this newsletter, please feel free to add or remove yourself from Wikipedia:WikiCup/Newsletter/Send. Sturmvogel 66 (talk) and Cwmhiraeth (talk). MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 20:27, 1 March 2021 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Yellow-bellied sapsucker

An image created by you has been promoted to featured picture status Your image, File:Yellow-bellied sapsucker in CP (40484).jpg, was nominated on Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates, gained a consensus of support, and has been promoted. If you would like to nominate an image, please do so at Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates. Thank you for your contribution! Armbrust The Homunculus 15:23, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Field sparrow

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Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Glass studio

An image created by you has been promoted to featured picture status Your image, File:Brooklyn Glass (32606)a.jpg, was nominated on Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates, gained a consensus of support, and has been promoted. If you would like to nominate an image, please do so at Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates. Thank you for your contribution! Armbrust The Homunculus 03:43, 4 March 2021 (UTC)

Sat Mar 6: Met Women's History Month Virtual Edit Meet-up

March 6, 12:30pm: Met Women's History Month Virtual Edit Meet-up

You are invited to join the Wikimedia NYC community and the Metropolitan Museum of Art for our The Met x Wikipedia Virtual Edit Meet-up: Women's History Month. We will be partially coordinating with Art+Feminism and all of the International Women's Day and Women's History Month campaigns. Watch and join the livestream! The Metropolitan Museum of Art event on Saturday Mar 6 will host a tutorial and question-and-answer session live on YouTube and other social media platforms. 12:30 pm - 1:30 pm - Presentation 1:30 pm - 2:30 pm - Guidance and Q&A Chat about improving articles! Support will be provided to help guide new editors in this area at Wikimedia Gender Gap Editing Chat for the duration of the campaign. The Met x Wikipedia Virtual Edit Meet-up: Women’s History Month (Metropolitan Museum of Art)

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File:RJ Palacio at BookCon (16102).jpg scheduled for POTD

Hi Rhododendrites,

This is to let you know that the featured picture File:RJ Palacio at BookCon (16102).jpg, which you uploaded or nominated, has been selected as the English Wikipedia's picture of the day (POTD) for July 13, 2021. A preview of the POTD is displayed below and can be edited at Template:POTD/2021-07-13. If you have any concerns, please place a message at Wikipedia talk:Picture of the day. Thank you! Cwmhiraeth (talk) 13:51, 10 March 2021 (UTC)

R. J. Palacio (born July 13, 1963) is an American author and graphic designer. During her career, she has designed hundreds of book covers, including for both fiction and non-fiction works. She is also the author of several novels for children, including the best-selling Wonder, which has won several awards. Palacio is seen here signing a book at the 2019 BookCon convention in New York City.

Photograph credit: Rhododendrites

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DYK for Abolitionist Place

On 11 March 2021, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Abolitionist Place, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that a landmarked house on Abolitionist Place in Downtown Brooklyn may have been a stop on the Underground Railroad? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Abolitionist Place. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page (here's how, Abolitionist Place), and if they received a combined total of at least 416.7 views per hour (ie, 5,000 views in 12 hours or 10,000 in 24), the hook may be added to the statistics page. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

— Maile (talk) 12:02, 11 March 2021 (UTC)

This Month in GLAM: February 2021

This Month in GLAM – Volume XI, Issue II, February 2021 Headlines Albania report: Recruiting two PMs; Budget Report 2020; Wikipedia 20th Bday Australia report: Who do we think we are? Brazil report: New GLAM tutorials in Portuguese Estonia report: WikiMuseum Finland report: Focus on learning Indonesia report: PD Day 2021 in Indonesia, #1lib1ref, Wikisource workshop Netherlands report: Historical Maps; Share your Data on colonial heritage; Knowledge platform for heritage institutions Serbia report: Amazing results of the January #1Lib1Ref campaign Sweden report: Medieval ballads; Project HBTQI Switzerland report: 50 Years Women's Suffrage in Switzerland & More UK report: Khalili Collections USA report: Black History Month and Smithsonian anniversary WMF GLAM report: Project Grants, Analytics for GLAMs, and Shared Citations Calendar: March's GLAM events Read this edition in full • Single-page To assist with preparing the newsletter, please visit the newsroom. Past editions may be viewed here.

About This Month in GLAM · Subscribe/Unsubscribe · Global message delivery · Romaine 16:00, 11 March 2021 (UTC)

Sat Mar 13: Asia Art Archive in America: Art and Feminism Edit-a-thon

March 13, 12-5pm: Asia Art Archive in America: Art and Feminism Edit-a-thon

You are invited to join the Wikimedia NYC community and Asia Art Archive for our fourth annual (and first virtual) Asia Art Archive in America: Art and Feminism Edit-a-thon! Organized by Asia Art Archive in America and NaPupila in collaboration with Asia Art Archive in Hong Kong and supported by Wikimedia NYC, this event brings together participants to discuss, create, share, and improve Wikipedia articles about women and non-binary artists. We will be partially coordinating with Art+Feminism and all of the International Women's Day and Women's History Month campaigns. Register and join the virtual event! 12:00 pm - 5:00 pm - Register ahead of time on Zoom to get the video link P.S. Next WikiWednesday You are also invited to join our March 17 WikiWednesday next week with a Saint Patrick's Day guest speaker from Wikimedia Community Ireland.

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--Wikimedia New York City Team 00:18, 12 March 2021 (UTC)

An enlightening article

Rhodedentrites, I thought you might find this article of interest given the GOP article discussion [[1]]. It's an older article looking at the motives behind opposition to school bussing which tries to methodically test the theory that white opposition to bussing was based on symbolic racist, the idea that opposition is based on a fundamental prejudice vs other motives. The paper starts with noting that, at that time, whites were increasingly rejecting the idea of blatant racism (their example, "blacks are less intelligent"). The symbolic racism theory suggests then that whites were rejecting issues like bussing because it was harmful to blacks or because of some other inherent attitudinal predisposition, rather than because they had or perceived they had a self interested motive for doing so. In the end the paper concluded that perceived threat and applied policy predispositions were the strongest indications or white attitudes towards busing. Basically it was a self interest motive filtered by one's one understanding of the situation. Bringing this back around to our GOP related topic, someone may oppose the notion that one group is superiors to another yet be warry of how a policy, say bussing, may impact them thus they are against bussing. If a politician sees this fear or even shares it and crafts a message that says they are against bussing it's not clear that is an attempt to appeal to racism. This paper certainly suggests that some would claim it to be an example of symbolic racism but others would say, no, this is appealing to a voter's own self interest (or at least what they think is in their self interest). The problem becomes how do you decide what the motive of the politician was? If the politician actually felt they were appealing to someone's inner racist yet this gave it a vail of respectability then it was an intentionally coded message. However, if they simply saw it as something that concerned the voters and an issue compatible with their own current views of what government should/shouldn't do then it's not a coded message or even racially motivated even if the outcome is not race neutral. Interestingly, the Southern Strategy spends a lot of time saying Nixon was crafting these coded messages but doesn't say what they are. This study at least would show that Nixon's opposition to bussing (which I recall was one of the alleged coded messages) probably was not resonating with voters due to any dog whistles. That doesn't mean the politicians weren't mistakenly believing in the dog whistle effect but now we have to prove the motive vs just the message. This is just one study and we can't be certain that other possible dog whistle topics would have similar results. Still, if much of the opposition to bussing was based on inherent self interest, is it fair to say an anti-bussing message was a coded dog whistle and thus evidence of the "Southern Strategy"? Is someone who is warry of a bussing program coming to their school system an outright racist or perhaps just fearful of what the change would bring (racially conservative). Sorry this was a bit long winded and certainly it isn't a clean argument for the GOP talk page but I thought you might find the perspective interesting. Springee (talk) 03:35, 12 March 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for the message. Haven't had a chance to parse it yet (busy few days). Just responding here to say I intend to soon. :) — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 01:05, 16 March 2021 (UTC)

I was re-reading some of this paper and thought a quote in the conclusion was especially poignant when talking about racially conservative vs racism [emphasis from author]:

The symbolic racism researchers set out to establish that the explicitly racial attitudes of whites are related to where they stand on an issue like busing. This is an important proposition that should not be discarded. Nonetheless, to say that racial attitudes help explain opposition to busing is not to say that prejudice is the problem or that realistic group conflict motives are not involved. On the contrary, whites need not hold blatantly stereotypical beliefs or hostile orientations towards blacks in order to justify to themselves and to others their resistance to black demands for change[sources]. Such resistance appears to them as a simple defense of a lifestyle and position they think they have earned and do not question, not as a rejection of blacks as such.

A few things here caught my eye. First is the part about racial attitudes but not "prejudice". I think that speaks to racial conservativism. It's not based on ill will towards others so much as a fear that change will be bad for one's self. Doing a bit more OR of my own, a conservative politician might be against bussing on conservative grounds simply feeling that there have to be limits to what the government should be allowed to do and bussing is the federal government dictating policy at the local level. Such feelings have motivated conservatives to oppose things like federal laws relating to guns, environment, minimum wage, and parts of education that don't have an a clear racial connection. The politician can emphasize a range of issues but sees that voters in the south are mad about bussing Since they are already opposed to bussing they emphasize that message. It's a "southern strategy" since those are new voters. It's not so much a northern strategy since the politico doesn't expect a big shift in northern attitudes. In this hypothetical bussing is not picked because its dog whistle racist. It's picked because it's something that voters are mad about and the reversal is compatible with conservative ideals. However, since bussing is meant to address a race related disparity and, presumably, ending it would harm minorities the opposition can rightly say*, "the conservatives are doing something that harms minorities". Because this harms minorities the opposition can also claim the motive was to hurt minorities (certainly some voters and politicians were motivated by clear racism). That is a claim that is hard to prove since it involves trying to understand true motives but politically branding the conservative side as "racist" is probably sufficient. *"Rightly say" does assume bussing was effective. History has shown it wasn't but is that because it was a bad idea or there was simply too much resistance? I don't know. Having spent a lot of time reading up on the subject a few years back I feel that some variation of the above is more realistic than the idea that most politicians were cynical enough to try to think that a winning plan was to appeal to hidden racism vs simply looking at what issues bothered voters and were compatible with their current platforms. Certainly it has proven great fodder for the other side to claim a stance of anti-bussing is motivated be racism. Anyway, I've taken up a lot of your time but I hope that helps you understand part of why I think some of the terms used by researchers are important and why we need to be careful about accepting some of the claims of dog whistles at face value. Take care! Springee (talk) 04:13, 17 March 2021 (UTC)

March 17: ONLINE WikiWednesday Salon NYC with Wikimedia Community Ireland for St Patrick's Day

March 17, 7pm: ONLINE WikiWednesday Salon NYC with Wikimedia Community Ireland for St Patrick's Day

Welcome to Wikimedia New York City! You are invited to join the Wikimedia NYC community for our monthly "WikiWednesday" evening salon (7-8pm) and knowledge-sharing workshop. To join the meeting from your computer or smartphone, just visit this link. More information about how to connect is available on the meetup page. We look forward to seeing local Wikimedians, but would also like to invite folks from the greater New York metropolitan area (and beyond!) who might not typically be able to join us in person! As this WikiWednesday coincides with Saint Patrick's Day, we will have a guest speaker from Wikimedia Community Ireland, about Irish-language Wikipedia, the efforts of the community in Ireland, and personal work on historical biographies with a special Irish-New York connection. This month will also include a discussion of Black WikiHistory Month in February and WikiWomen's History Month and Art+Feminism in March, and of course the great work that is being done in these topical areas throughout the year. If there's a project you'd like to share or a question you'd like answered, just let us know by adding it to the agenda or the talk page. Wednesday March 17 WikiWednesday Salon and Skill-Share NYC (optional RSVP on-wiki). 7:00pm - 8:00 pm online via Zoom (optional breakout rooms from 8:00-8:30)

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Feedback requests from the Feedback Request Service

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Feedback request: History and geography request for comment

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User:Suffusion of Yellow/hidetopcontrib.js

Hi, Rhododendrites . Can you please remove the line containing User:Suffusion of Yellow/hidetopcontrib.js and uncomment the line containingUser:Markhurd/hidetopcontrib.js in User:Rhododendrites/monobook.js? I did not intend to maintain a fork of that script; that was only for testing purposes and I'd like to delete it. The scripts are identical except for the comments. Suffusion of Yellow (talk) 21:36, 21 March 2021 (UTC)

@Suffusion of Yellow:  Done Thanks. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 13:30, 22 March 2021 (UTC)

Books & Bytes – Issue 42

The Wikipedia Library

Books & Bytes
Issue 42, January – February 2021

• New partnerships: PNAS, De Gruyter, Nomos
• 1Lib1Ref
• Library Card

Read the full newsletter

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Feedback request: Politics, government, and law request for comment

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WikiLoop 2020 Year in Review

Wikipedia mini globe handheld

Dear editors, developers and friends:

Thank you for supporting Project WikiLoop! The year 2020 was an unprecedented one. It was unusual for almost everyone. In spite of this, Project WikiLoop continued the hard work and made some progress that we are proud to share with you. We also wanted to extend a big thank you for your support, advice, contributions and love that make all this possible.

Head over to our project page on Meta Wikimedia to read a brief 2020 Year in Review for WikiLoop.

Thank you for taking the time to review Wikipedia using WikiLoop DoubleCheck. Your work is important and it matters to everyone. We look forward to continuing our collaboration through 2021!

María Cruz
MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 01:35, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Merchandise giveaway nomination

A token of thanks Hi Rhododendrites! I've nominated you to receive a gift from the Wikimedia Foundation. Enjoy! Cheers, {{u|Sdkb}} talk 01:22, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

@Sdkb: I didn't have a great afternoon. While birding by the water I came across an injured red-throated loon down on the rocks below where I was standing. I was excited at first to see a bird close up that I've never been able to get close to, taking pictures before realizing it was hurt. I spent an hour or so contacting knowledgeable people and trying to figure out how to (a) get down to it, (b) without it limping back to the water, (c) how to wrap it up, and (d) how to get it back up... and then how to get it from Brooklyn to the upper west side where the bird rescue is (would a Lyft take me if I had a big waterbird with me?). Anyway, people who know better stopped me and alerted people who know what they're doing, but it's unclear if anyone would come (or if anyone could really do anything). Fun fact: apparently when loons feel threatened they just start stabbing with their beaks, so being prepared also requires wearing heavy gloves and face protection. Sigh.
Anyway, I came home, had some tacos, and saw this message, which was a really nice compliment and a good pick-me-up. Thanks. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 04:06, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Sorry to hear about the loon, but glad to be able to help out your day a little bit! Cheers, {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 04:10, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

@Sdkb: Because I'm very sure you're invested in the loon now :) FYI it turns out a rescue was possible. It had fishing line wrapped around its wing which, in hindsight, is visible in this picture. It's recovering at the bird rescue. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 15:10, 9 April 2021 (UTC)

So glad to hear it! {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 20:34, 9 April 2021 (UTC)

The Signpost: 28 March 2021

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ADL, COI, and The Forward

I posted a link to this section at WP:COIN#Article in the Forward to avoid belaboring something that's more or less resolved there, for better or worse.

Here's the TL;DR version of what I said in response to an inquiry about the ADL case:
So much of the difficulty of editing Wikipedia as an organization or otherwise with a COI is how few bright lines rules there are, and how many shades of skepticism there are among the community such that a range of outcomes are possible for any given situation. That's true of a lot of Wikipedia, but seems particularly pronounced with COI issues. The reception ADL received in the noticeboard thread was IMO harsher than necessary, given they expressed interest in learning the rules, responded to criticism, and seemed to agree to just about everything we asked of them, stopping short of a self-imposed ban on ever adding ADL sources to articles. But while I think that should've led to a second chance, the result of the thread (to the extent there is a result, except to say that I was in the minority and ADL has stopped its editing project) is also unsurprising because -- and it's hard to overstate this -- first impressions are extremely important. If they hadn't edited the ADL article, hadn't only been adding ADL sources, and hadn't created weight problems (in other words, if they started with the guidelines that they've now agreed to), I doubt we would be here. But organizations and people with a COI do not get the same leeway to make mistakes that ordinary volunteers do, and there's a good reason for that. Any organization interested to edit Wikipedia really needs to do a lot of homework about Wikipedia policies and conventions beforehand, err on the side of transparency, and ask questions if they're not sure about something.

In general, I thought the article was a more or less fair summary of something that was likely frustrating for all involved. Hopefully others do, as well. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 14:58, 9 April 2021 (UTC)

To add something I've said in several places at this point (as have others, probably more eloquently than me): if we're going to have vague COI rules in order to allow more room for case-by-case judgment, taking a hardline approach which operates as though the rules are not vague and which leaves no room for making mistakes ultimately discourages transparency and makes volunteers' jobs harder in the long run. Editing with a conflict of interest is never ideal, but it's going to happen, and doesn't always harm the project, so we might as well try to be more consistent with how we deal with it. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 16:39, 9 April 2021 (UTC)

This Month in GLAM: March 2021

This Month in GLAM – Volume XI, Issue III, March 2021 Headlines AfLIA Wikipedia in African Libraries report: Wikipedia in African Libraries Albania report: Wiki Loves Folklore 2021; I edit Wikipedia Brazil report: The Brazilian House is the theme of new GLAM dissemination activities Finland report: Enriching indigenous items in Wikidata Germany report: A virtual exhibition on 20 years of Wikipedia Netherlands report: Wikimedians in Residence for Media Art Project LIMA, Wikimedia and libraries, Wikimedia training related to shared heritage Sweden report: GLAM in Sweden in March UK report: Leeds Museums & Galleries, the British Library and the Khalili Collections USA report: Women's History Month in the US WMF GLAM report: Media Search, Image Suggestion API, and Project Grants Calendar: April's GLAM events Read this edition in full • Single-page To assist with preparing the newsletter, please visit the newsroom. Past editions may be viewed here.

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April 21: ONLINE WikiWednesday Salon NYC with with Environmental focus

April 21, 7pm: ONLINE WikiWednesday Salon NYC with Environmental focus

Welcome to Wikimedia New York City! You are invited to join the Wikimedia NYC community for our monthly "WikiWednesday" evening salon (7-8pm) and knowledge-sharing workshop. To join the meeting from your computer or smartphone, just visit this link. More information about how to connect is available on the meetup page. We look forward to seeing local Wikimedians, but would also like to invite folks from the greater New York metropolitan area (and beyond!) who might not typically be able to join us in person! As this WikiWednesday is just the day before Earth Day, we will have an environmental focus. If there's a project you'd like to share or a question you'd like answered, just let us know by adding it to the agenda or the talk page. Wednesday April 21 WikiWednesday Salon and Skill-Share NYC (optional RSVP on-wiki). 7:00pm - 8:00 pm online via Zoom (optional breakout rooms from 8:00-8:30)

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Merchandise Giveaway Nomination – Successful

A Wikimeida t-shirt!

Hey Rhododendrites,

You have been successfully nominated to receive a free t-shirt from the Wikimedia Foundation through our Merchandise Giveaway program. Congratulations and thank you for your hard work! Please email us at merchandisewikimedia.org and we will send you full details on how to accept your free shirt. Thanks!

On behalf of the Merchandise Giveaway program,

-- janbery (talk) 12:15, 21 April 2021 (UTC)

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The Signpost: 25 April 2021

• From the editor: A change is gonna come

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The Signpost: 25 April 2021

• From the editor: A change is gonna come

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• In the media: Fernando, governance, and rugby

• Opinion: The (Universal) Code of Conduct

• Op-Ed: A Little Fun Goes A Long Way

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• Recent research: Quality of aquatic and anatomical articles

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WikiCup 2021 May newsletter

The second round of the 2021 WikiCup has now finished; it was a high-scoring round and contestants needed 61 points to advance to Round 3. There were some impressive efforts in the round, with the top eight contestants all scoring more than 400 points. A large number of the points came from the 12 featured articles and the 110 good articles achieved in total by contestants, as well as the 216 good article reviews they performed; the GAN backlog drive and the stay-at-home imperative during the COVID-19 pandemic may have been partially responsible for these impressive figures.

Our top scorers in Round 2 were:

• The Rambling Man, with 2963 points from three featured articles, 20 featured article reviews, 37 good articles, 73 good article reviews, as well as 22 DYKs.
• Epicgenius, with 1718 points from one featured article, 29 good articles, 16 DYKs and plenty of bonus points.
• Bloom6132, with 990 points from 13 DYKs and 64 "In the news" items, mostly recent deaths.
• Hog Farm, with 834 points from two featured articles, five good articles, 14 featured article reviews and 15 good article reviews.
• Gog the Mild, with 524 points from two featured articles and four featured article reviews.
• Lee Vilenski, with 501 points from one featured article, three good articles, six featured article reviews and 25 good article reviews.
• Sammi Brie, with 485 points from four good articles, eight good article reviews and 27 DYKs, on US radio and television stations.
• Ktin, with 436 points from four good articles, seven DYKs and 11 "In the news" items.

Please remember that DYKs cannot be claimed until they have appeared on the main page. As we enter the third round, any content promoted after the end of Round 2 but before the start of Round 3 can be claimed now, and anything you forgot to claim in Round 2 cannot! Remember too, that you must claim your points within 14 days of "earning" them (except for at the end of each round, when you must claim them before the cut-off date/time). When doing GARs, please make sure that you check that all the GA criteria are fully met.

If you are concerned that your nomination—whether it is at good article nominations, a featured process, or anything else—will not receive the necessary reviews, please list it on Wikipedia:WikiCup/Reviews Needed (remember to remove your listing when no longer required). Questions are welcome on Wikipedia talk:WikiCup, and the judges are reachable on their talk pages or by email. If you wish to start or stop receiving this newsletter, please feel free to add or remove yourself from Wikipedia:WikiCup/Newsletter/Send. Judges: Sturmvogel 66 (talk) and Cwmhiraeth MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 10:28, 2 May 2021 (UTC)

Books & Bytes – Issue 43

The Wikipedia Library

Books & Bytes
Issue 43, March – April 2021

• New Library Card designs
• 1Lib1Ref May

Read the full newsletter

Sent by MediaWiki message delivery on behalf of The Wikipedia Library team --11:12, 10 May 2021 (UTC)

Orff

Hi Rhododendrites—I thought I'd let you know that the user who was causing trouble with the "O Fortuna" article has been indefinitely banned. If you're still interested, I'd love to help in any way, as I think you were making important progress. Though I must admit, I'm a bit lost on where everything was with the article. Aza24 (talk) 19:13, 10 May 2021 (UTC)

@Aza24: Thanks for the heads up, though at this point I don't know what there is to do. The popular culture AfD was closed as redirect to O Fortuna (Orff), but nobody at the classical music project seemed particularly enthused about that article's existence. If there's a rough consensus for a merge of the poem and the movement, Francis already took it upon himself to do that. I may be grumpy about how he did so, but at the end of the day it's done. Onward, I guess. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 01:26, 14 May 2021 (UTC)

This Month in GLAM: April 2021

This Month in GLAM – Volume XI, Issue IV, April 2021 Headlines Albania report: WikiGap 2021; Workshop “When State Security was engaged in Science”; Women in STEM; International Roma Day Edit-a-thon Australia report: A Wealth of Wiki Women Belgium report: Projects by Wikimedia Belgium Brazil report: Festa da Wiki-Lusofonia celebrates Wikipedia 20 Czech Republic report: WikiGap 2021 report DRCongo report: WMDRC - UG report: Wikipedia in library Estonia report: Finding new ways of making art visible + 360° panoramas of Estonian museums Finland report: Saami place names France report: Journée Wikimédia Culture et numérique 2021; French open content report Germany report: Northern Exposure for cultural heritage data India report: Proofread competition on Bengali Wikisource in collaboration with British Library Indonesia report: Wikisource Competition 2021; Museum Daerah Deli Serdang is now on Commons Italy report: A Wikipedian in residence at the Civic Museum of Modena: report Netherlands report: WikiVrijdagen with Atria and IHLIA, Wikimedians in Residence will increase the visibility of media art on Wikipedia, Wikimedia training: shared heritage, Papiamentu and Papiamento: Wikipedia is up and ready to go! New Zealand report: West Coast WikiCon and Performing Arts Aotearoa Serbia report: Great impact of cooperations Spain report: New partnerships Sweden report: More music; Enriching GLAM photos with SDC; Swedish GLAM survey Switzerland report: GLAMhack 2021 & more UK report: University of Edinburgh Library Wikimedia Community of Interest; Khalili Collections; British Library USA report: The Met, Smithsonian, and a busy Edit-a-thon season Wikipedia Library report: Fostering Connections: Wikimedia and Libraries Global Meetup Wikimedia and Libraries User Group report: Extended Date Time Format for Wikibase WMF GLAM report: Wikimedia Hackathon, Product Updates, and Office Hours Calendar: May's GLAM events Read this edition in full • Single-page To assist with preparing the newsletter, please visit the newsroom. Past editions may be viewed here.

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Pronoun categories

Hello, Rhododendrites,

I was just wondering how you anticipated these categories being used and whether they were your invention or had broad support on Wikipedia. Right now, they are empty categories and will be tagged CSD C1 tomorrow. Thought I'd give you a head's up. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:06, 14 May 2021 (UTC)

@Liz: Some context is here Wikipedia:Village_pump_(proposals)#Adding_Pronouns_to_Prominent_Figures. Is CSD automatic? I didn't realize that. :/ It seems like they might not be necessary, but I created them in order to be considered as a possible option in that thread... — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 01:20, 14 May 2021 (UTC)

Typically, CSD C1 is automatic except for a few exceptions (disambiguation categories, redirect categories, categories being discussed at CFD, etc.) but I'll put an empty category tag on them which will exempt them from deletion when they are empty. I'm counting on you to remove the tag if you discover that the categories aren't being used or are unnecessary, okay? Thanks. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 15:57, 14 May 2021 (UTC)

Sounds good. I'll give it a few days to see what folks think and then follow up with them. Thanks. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 16:02, 14 May 2021 (UTC)

May 2021

Regards! I request you to consider the template Indian name which says to use the person's name instead of the patronymic one while referring to them. As we did it at Disha Ravi. Glad to correct myself if I'm wrong. Thanks:) NinadMysuru (talk) 16:31, 14 May 2021 (UTC)

@NinadMysuru: thanks for the message. my mistake! I didn't see the hatnote. Fixed now. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 17:28, 14 May 2021 (UTC)

Thanks a lot sir/mam:) NinadMysuru (talk) 17:38, 14 May 2021 (UTC)

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May 19: ONLINE WikiWednesday Salon NYC

May 19, 7pm: ONLINE WikiWednesday Salon NYC

Welcome to Wikimedia New York City! You are invited to join the Wikimedia NYC community for our monthly "WikiWednesday" evening salon (7-8pm) and knowledge-sharing workshop. To join the meeting from your computer or smartphone, just visit this link. More information about how to connect is available on the meetup page. We look forward to seeing local Wikimedians, but would also like to invite folks from the greater New York metropolitan area (and beyond!) who might not typically be able to join us in person! If there's a project you'd like to share or a question you'd like answered, just let us know by adding it to the agenda or the talk page. Wednesday May 19 WikiWednesday Salon and Skill-Share NYC (optional RSVP on-wiki). 7:00pm - 8:00 pm online via Zoom (optional breakout rooms from 8:00-8:30)

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Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Northern flicker

An image created by you has been promoted to featured picture status Your image, File:Flicker hole in CP (31848).jpg, was nominated on Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates, gained a consensus of support, and has been promoted. If you would like to nominate an image, please do so at Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates. Thank you for your contribution! Armbrust The Homunculus 19:54, 18 May 2021 (UTC)

Request!

Good morning! I request you to see the page Hagalavadi. This is being vandalized for every now and then. Few editors are indiscriminately adding their own stuff. Please protect the page from future vandalism. Thanks. Msclrfl22 (talk) 02:22, 20 May 2021 (UTC)

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File:Pyrosoma atlanticum (12256).jpg scheduled for POTD

Hi Rhododendrites,

This is to let you know that the featured picture File:Pyrosoma atlanticum (12256).jpg, which you uploaded or nominated, has been selected as the English Wikipedia's picture of the day (POTD) for June 17, 2021. A preview of the POTD is displayed below and can be edited at Template:POTD/2021-06-17. If you have any concerns, please place a message at Wikipedia talk:Picture of the day. Thank you! Cwmhiraeth (talk) 10:44, 26 May 2021 (UTC)

Pyrosoma atlanticum is a species of deep-water colonial tunicate found in oceans around the world. The colony forms a hollow cylinder that can grow up to 60 cm (24 in) long. The constituent zooids, which may be pink, yellowish, or bluish, form a rigid tube; each zooid has a pair of luminescent organs which can be turned on and off, causing a rhythmic flashing. No neural pathway runs between the zooids, but each responds to the light produced by other individuals, and even to light from nearby colonies. This P. atlanticum colony was photographed in a tide pool in Pacific Grove, California.

Photograph credit: Rhododendrites

Recently featured:

• H.M.S. Pinafore
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cont. from Guy's talk

I confess to starting to feel a little burnt out with the "it must be my way; there's no good reason for anything else; you're all breaking the rules" on one end and "let people do what they want; there's no good reason for anything else; you're all just a bunch of destructive jerks" on the other and not enough nuance between. Anyway, I'm starting to repeat myself and create lots of notifications for Guy, so I'll shut up.

I agree with this 100%. And actually, I think our current guidelines are somewhere in the middle. I strongly agree that all signatures should link to a userpage or user talk page, that impersonating other editors should be impermissible and that the time-date stamp should be required. All of those things address problems that could, if not handled, become a disruption to this project.

And for what it's worth, I don't think you're behaving poorly in that thread. And I've never found you to be unreasonable. I just think that making the policy stricter is just the worst possible way to go about aligning policy and practice. In fact, I think the policy and practice are aligned pretty well, right now. ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants Tell me all about it. 19:37, 26 May 2021 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

		The Epic Barnstar
		Thank you for catching a massively important point of Governor Fielding L. Wright back in 2020. A rather embarrassing story of mine. I worked on the page real hard, but I did not directly call him a segregationist since I thought him defending the KKK, receiving support from segregationist groups, and being the vp of the Dixicrats was enough. The article even made it through the GA process without that mistake being noticed lmao. Thank you for catching that massive mistake. Sorry for taking so long to give you a barnstar. Jon698 (talk) 17:26, 30 May 2021 (UTC)

Thanks, Jon698. And thanks for all your hard work improving that article. I have to apologize as I remember that shortly thereafter you pinged me on Discord about African Americans in Alabama, which I planned to come back to but never did! It looks like it's been expanded a bit since then, drawing at least in part from your draft. Perhaps you were the IP working on it? (you can ask an admin to hide the IP if so FYI). — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 23:57, 30 May 2021 (UTC)

• @Rhododendrites: Oh I wasn't that IP and I have meant to get back to work on that article again. Jon698 (talk) 01:48, 31 May 2021 (UTC)

DYK Wild Bird Fund

Hello! Your submission of Wild Bird Fund at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and some issues with it may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) at your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know!

RfC

I'll take it here rather than my talk page since I'm open to discussion: based on my understanding, having an alternative option proposed early (or even late) in an RfC is acceptable. It's happened multiple times for RfCs I've been involved in, and I don't think there's anything disruptive about adding one documenting that the community does not want to address this at all.

I reverted that because my understanding of WP:TPO is that if you feel someone has inappropriately moved your comments, it is acceptable to restore them. I don't see a reason for "No option" not to be an option. If there's anything in particular you think should be changed about my presentation, I'm more than happy to change it, but I do think its important for the community to have the option to document that this is something it doesn't feel strongly about at all. TonyBallioni (talk) 02:58, 4 June 2021 (UTC)

@TonyBallioni: thanks for the message. Fair enough regarding TPO. The thing is, you didn't just add a "do nothing" option. You added an "option" that challenges the RfC itself in the most dismissive way, and which functionally is just a rejection of the three questions, which could be accomplished through the existing structure by just answering "no". I wouldn't have so strongly opposed if you just said "do nothing" or "status quo".

That said, I do think it's a terrible idea to go with the status quo. We have a problem that needs addressing. When a policy or guideline falls out of step with consensus, or when interpretations of said guideline have removed all meaning from it, that's an indication we should update it in some way. An RfC like this tries to find what, if anything, there is consensus for so that we can ensure that correspondence. We shouldn't have rules that anyone with sufficient defenders can just ignore while we use the same guideline to pressure new users and those who don't have the requisite advocates. I suppose a reason to leave the status quo is if you don't think this actually happens often enough to clarify one way or the other. Meh. I think what we'll see is people supporting your option when they really just don't want any enforceable guidelines about username/displayed name correspondence (i.e. another opportunity to say no/no to the first two questions). — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 03:26, 4 June 2021 (UTC)

I mean, I suppose my view is that this RfC is about something most editors don't care about at all. I really hate the idea of something becoming an established community guideline that can be enforced against people when most people will ignore the RfC establishing it simply because they don't care, even if it was posted at CENT and VPP. I really don't think that's fair.

My objective in giving a 4th option was to give a place for people who want to reject the idea of the RfC all together a place to voice that. I think rejecting the RfC should be a valid option (it is one I've proposed in the past that has achieved consensus), which is why I proposed it. I'm fine changing the header if you are concerned about that (perhaps something like Community takes no position or No consensus.) The intent honestly wasn't to be dismissive, but to give people an option to say "we do not want to establish any consensus at all on this."

Basically, the concern I have is that we could get a guideline that can be enforced for 20%+ of the edits people make that has no consensus in the community because people don't care enough to comment on it. Having an option that gives people a place to say "I really don't care either way" serves a purpose in preventing that. Like I said, I'm more than open to tweaks. TonyBallioni (talk) 03:34, 4 June 2021 (UTC)

I really hate the idea of something becoming an established community guideline that can be enforced against people when most people will ignore the RfC establishing it simply because they don't care But here it sounds like trying to circumvent [question 1 in particular] for fear that it will be shown to have strong consensus behind it... rather than just trying to form a consensus against that question.

I get that a "yes" to question 1 could have an effect on several users who might not see it coming, and that it would be ... irksome, at least ... to be told the signature you've been using for years needs to change. I don't actually expect Q1 to wind up with a yes, honestly (I've said this elsewhere), and I expect it to be most useful in ending some complaints about username-signature compliance. I suspect there will be a yes for Q2, though, but that just really just doesn't affect a ton of people and a whole lot of people have said it adds nontrivial confusion.

Ultimately, we do currently have a guideline which theoretically has strong community consensus behind it (just based on it being a guideline), so at least theoretically shouldn't just be ignored for absolutely any reason in some cases and enforced in others, right? I mean it uses language like "should" but in the context of PAG that's typically "do this unless there's a good reason not to" where "good reason not to" doesn't usually include "I just don't want to". If you think that, beyond blinking, huge-font, unreadable signatures, they shouldn't be something anyone should have to worry about, maybe after this closes it makes sense to propose cutting down the guideline and splitting some stuff off to essay status or somesuch. I just feel strongly that what we have doesn't work. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 03:59, 4 June 2021 (UTC)

I suppose my view is that it routinely being ignored is evidence there is no consensus for it and that no one ever bothered to update the page. I also oppose the existence of the username policy, though, and this seems very similar to that, so maybe it's just me being cranky over stuff that feels like it consumes a lot of community time for no reason.

Anyway, I'll move it back to discussion based on this. I still really don't like the existence of the RfC, but I guess to go back to my first point, guidelines without consensus are usually ignored, so regardless of the outcome, it'll be fine.

Sorry for any misunderstanding. If you want the most blunt version of my concern: I'm afraid we'll get a bunch of new users harassing old-timers over their signatures, and the newcomers eventually getting blocked for being annoying and overzealous. I think that's the most likely outcome of any closure of this RfC. I'm more than happy to let it run its course, though. TonyBallioni (talk) 04:07, 4 June 2021 (UTC)

Thanks. No one bothered to update the page, and we had a big ANI thread (not the first) about someone's signature not complying with those guidelines. Whichever way it goes, the goal is to try to find that consensus-guideline correspondence for the sake of consistency/fairness/relevance rather than to add new rules. I supposed worst case scenario is we trade one form of annoying complaint for another, but I hope that it would at least then be within the gray area of the guideline rather than in random dismissal of it. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 04:31, 4 June 2021 (UTC)

My gut is that what we have now is a guideline where no consensus exists to have it, but no consensus would exist to remove it and so we're stuck in a position where there's this guideline that administrators will not enforce unless it is obviously disruptive, but people don't know that if they're new. I agree that's not a great place to be in, but I'm not really sure any change to the words of the page will change that status quo. There really isn't a good way to deal with situations like this within the wiki system, unfortunately. I appreciate that you're trying, though (and I mean that sincerely.) TonyBallioni (talk) 04:36, 4 June 2021 (UTC)

I know what you mean. Maybe this will wind up being wheel-spinning. Hopefully not. Cheers. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 04:38, 4 June 2021 (UTC)

Signatures

As I posted at the RfC, it seems a compromise would be to work in the functionality provided by the unclutter Javascript script into "preferences" more easily (I'd love simplified signatures.) Is it worth starting a fourth question at the RfC on this or letting that play out first? It'd allow people who want simple signatures to display simple signatures, and people who like fun usernames to display their usernames, but I don't know how to add the unclutter script myself, and I only want the signature functionality. SportingFlyer T·C 19:44, 6 June 2021 (UTC)

@SportingFlyer: That sounds like what Enterprisey was talking about (User:Enterprisey/signature rfc drafting). It certainly seems like a conversation worth having. My issue with Unclutter is that the only options are (a) fully customized signatures, and (b) plain signatures. If someone likes customizable signatures and their only objection is when someone uses a name that doesn't correspond to their actual username, it probably wouldn't be worth it to enable such a script. And I suspect that, technically speaking, it would be difficult to turn a customized signature that uses a different name into the same kind of custom signature with the actual username. If you're looking to take it for a spin btw, instructions are here. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 04:24, 7 June 2021 (UTC)

...Now that I open the Unclutter page, however, I see there's more customization than I thought. Will have to take a closer look soon. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 04:24, 7 June 2021 (UTC)

Yup, Unclutter is a really great tool. I would be pushing it a lot harder in the current discussions if it weren't for Jorm's message about new editors. That convinced me we need something like Unclutter, but on by default, and on for logged-out editors and new editors - hence my proposal on that page. That proposal might also make Unclutter a lot faster and more efficient. Vaticidalprophet's response to it being mentioned was a preview of the sort of response that'll get, though, although honestly I think there's a chance people might like it a little more than the current proposals? Enterprisey (talk!) 05:11, 7 June 2021 (UTC)

I completely agree with this, and think it's a good compromise. It's clear there's an accessibility issue with signatures, but not for all users: giving people the option to display custom signatures, and turning that option off by default, makes a lot of sense. SportingFlyer T·C 10:51, 7 June 2021 (UTC)

Feedback request: Wikipedia proposals request for comment

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For your battles against dark forces

	Wikipedia Exorcist
	Awarded for exorcising 666 bytes worth of bad content from Wikipedia in this edit. Firefangledfeathers (talk) 19:43, 9 June 2021 (UTC)

@Firefangledfeathers: Thanks. Wasn't sure if that was a template you used there -- half expected the light/moon to be a wikiglobe. The power of cites compels you! The power of cites compels you! — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 20:16, 9 June 2021 (UTC)

"Power of cites" *claps* Firefangledfeathers (talk) 20:18, 9 June 2021 (UTC)

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This Month in GLAM: May 2021

This Month in GLAM – Volume XI, Issue V, May 2021 Headlines AfLIA Wikipedia in African Libraries report: A busy month at AfLIA Argentina report: Museum, Archives and Libraries on May Armenia report: Presence of Museums in Wiki Projects Australia report: Librarians unite across Australia and Aotearoa New Zealand for 1Lib1Ref Brazil report: Wiki Loves Bahia: 2021 is the year of Bahia on Wikipedia in Portuguese Côte d'Ivoire report: Glam-wiki 2021 29 May in Côte d'Ivoire India report: Collaboration continues with British Library Indonesia report: #1lib1ref in Indonesia; Online talk show with Wikimedia Nederland Italy report: Conference, webinar and projects Kosovo report: National Gallery of Kosovo Collection now on Wikidata Netherlands report: Over 15,000 images available from Elsinga Collection, 1.9 million records on slavery and slave trade digitally accessible New Zealand report: A busy month in Aotearoa North Macedonia report: GLAM activities of GLAM Macedonia Serbia report: A month in the sign of edit-a-thons Spain report: Viquiprojecte:Muixeranga Sweden report: Working with UN Human Rights; Aftermath to the fiddler competition; Music manuscripts from the 18th century; Digital visions; Should museums work with Wikipedia?; Wikidata project with museums has results Switzerland report: Strengthening GLAM Partnerships Uganda report: Wikipedia for Museums in Uganda UK report: British Library, Khalili Collections USA report: Hackathon outputs, data roundtripping and Asian American heritage Special story: Wikimedia Hackathon report: Upgrading GLAM tech tools and PAWS Wikisource report: Indic Wikisource community online gathering WMF GLAM report: Grants and conferences Wiki World Heritage User Group report: May's report Calendar: June's GLAM events Read this edition in full • Single-page To assist with preparing the newsletter, please visit the newsroom. Past editions may be viewed here.

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Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Brown-headed cowbird

An image created by you has been promoted to featured picture status Your image, File:Brown headed cowbird female in JBWR (25487).jpg, was nominated on Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates, gained a consensus of support, and has been promoted. If you would like to nominate an image, please do so at Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates. Thank you for your contribution! Armbrust The Homunculus 20:02, 12 June 2021 (UTC)

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June 16: ONLINE WikiWednesday Salon NYC

June 16, 7pm: ONLINE WikiWednesday Salon NYC

Welcome to Wikimedia New York City! You are invited to join the Wikimedia NYC community for our monthly "WikiWednesday" evening salon (7-8pm) and knowledge-sharing workshop. To join the meeting from your computer or smartphone, just visit this link. More information about how to connect is available on the meetup page. We look forward to seeing local Wikimedians, but would also like to invite folks from the greater New York metropolitan area (and beyond!) who might not typically be able to join us in person! If there's a project you'd like to share or a question you'd like answered, just let us know by adding it to the agenda or the talk page. Wednesday June 16 WikiWednesday Salon and Skill-Share NYC (optional RSVP on-wiki). 7:00pm - 8:00 pm online via Zoom (optional breakout rooms from 8:00-8:30)

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DYK for Wild Bird Fund

On 15 June 2021, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Wild Bird Fund, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that the Wild Bird Fund is New York City's first and only wildlife hospital (example treatment pictured)? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Wild Bird Fund. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page (here's how, Wild Bird Fund), and if they received a combined total of at least 416.7 views per hour (i.e., 5,000 views in 12 hours or 10,000 in 24), the hook may be added to the statistics page. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

— Maile (talk) 00:02, 15 June 2021 (UTC)

Editing news 2021 #2

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When newcomers had the Reply tool and tried to post on a talk page, they were more successful at posting a comment. (Source)

Earlier this year, the Editing team ran a large study of the Reply Tool. The main goal was to find out whether the Reply Tool helped newer editors communicate on wiki. The second goal was to see whether the comments that newer editors made using the tool needed to be reverted more frequently than comments newer editors made with the existing wikitext page editor.

The key results were:

• Newer editors who had automatic ("default on") access to the Reply tool were more likely to post a comment on a talk page.
• The comments that newer editors made with the Reply Tool were also less likely to be reverted than the comments that newer editors made with page editing.

These results give the Editing team confidence that the tool is helpful.

Looking ahead

The team is planning to make the Reply tool available to everyone as an opt-out preference in the coming months. This has already happened at the Arabic, Czech, and Hungarian Wikipedias.

The next step is to resolve a technical challenge. Then, they will deploy the Reply tool first to the Wikipedias that participated in the study. After that, they will deploy it, in stages, to the other Wikipedias and all WMF-hosted wikis.

You can turn on "Discussion Tools" in Beta Features now. After you get the Reply tool, you can change your preferences at any time in Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-editing-discussion.

–Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk)

00:27, 16 June 2021 (UTC)

A goat for you!

Your user page is a great guide for writing better articles! Thanks! Enjoyed the meeting yesterday and will be following your lead more closely. I use WikiEdu but I aspire to get a good article out of future classes.

sheridanford (talk) 11:46, 17 June 2021 (UTC)

@SheridanFord: Glad you could make the meeting last week, and thanks for the goat! :) I'd love to hear about any good articles that come out of your classes, and would be happy to share my experience having students go through the WP:GA process if you think it'd be helpful. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 19:56, 22 June 2021 (UTC)

@Rhododendrites: I'd love to take you up on that. I will probably use WikiEdu in the Spring 2022. I'll reach out if all goes as planned. sheridanford (talk) 17:10, 4 July 2021 (UTC)

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File:Helen Keller circa 1920 - restored.jpg scheduled for POTD

Hi Rhododendrites,

This is to let you know that the featured picture File:Helen Keller circa 1920 - restored.jpg, which you uploaded or nominated, has been selected as the English Wikipedia's picture of the day (POTD) for June 27, 2021. A preview of the POTD is displayed below and can be edited at Template:POTD/2021-06-27. If you have any concerns, please place a message at Wikipedia talk:Picture of the day. Thank you! Cwmhiraeth (talk) 10:56, 21 June 2021 (UTC)

Helen Keller (June 27, 1880 – June 1, 1968) was an American author, political activist, and lecturer. She lost her sight and hearing after a bout of illness at the age of nineteen months. When she was seven years old, she met her first teacher and life-long companion, Anne Sullivan, who taught her language skills, including reading and writing. After attending Radcliffe College at Harvard University, she became the first deafblind person to earn a Bachelor of Arts degree. She worked for the American Foundation for the Blind for many years, during which time she toured the United States and traveled to 35 countries around the world. This 1920 photograph depicts Keller examining a magnolia flower.

Photograph credit: Los Angeles Times; restored by Rhododendrites

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File:Jade vine (70200).jpg scheduled for POTD

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Strongylodon macrobotrys, the jade vine, is a species of leguminous perennial liana endemic to the Philippines. The woody stems can reach a length of up to 18 m (60 ft). A member of the family Fabaceae (the pea and bean family), the species has pendulous bunches of flowers which are followed by fleshy seed pods, and is pollinated by bats. This S. macrobotrys vine in bloom was photographed at the New York Botanical Garden.

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The Signpost: 27 June 2021

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Thank you for what you said on User talk:SlimVirgin - missing pictured on my talk, with music full of hope and reformation --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:54, 29 June 2021 (UTC)

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WikiCup 2021 July newsletter

The third round of the 2021 WikiCup has now come to an end. Each of the sixteen contestants who made it into the fourth round had at least 294 points, and our top six scorers all had over 600 points. They were:

• The Rambling Man, with 1825 points from 3 featured articles, 44 featured article reviews, 14 good articles, 30 good article reviews and 10 DYKs. In addition, he completed a 34-article good topic on the EFL Championship play-offs.
• Epicgenius, a New York specialist, with 1083 points from 2 featured article reviews, 18 good articles, 30 DYKs and plenty of bonus points.
• Bloom6132, with 869 points from 11 DYKs, all with bonus points, and 54 "In the news" items, mostly covering people who had recently died.
• Gog the Mild, with 817 points from 3 featured articles on historic battles in Europe, 5 featured article reviews and 3 good articles.
• Hog Farm, with 659 points from 2 featured articles and 2 good articles on American Civil War battles, 18 featured article reviews, 2 good articles, 6 good article reviews and 4 DYKs.
• BennyOnTheLoose, a snooker specialist and new to the Cup, with 647 points from a featured article, 2 featured article reviews, 6 good articles, 6 good article reviews and 3 DYKs.

In round three, contestants achieved 19 featured articles, 7 featured lists, 106 featured article reviews, 72 good articles, 1 good topic, 62 good article reviews, 165 DYKs and 96 ITN items. We enter the fourth round with scores reset to zero; any content promoted after the end of round 3 but before the start of round 4 can be claimed in round 4. Please also remember that you must claim your points within 14 days of "earning" them (one contestant in round 3 lost out because of this). When doing GARs, please make sure that you check that all the GA criteria are fully met.

If you are concerned that your nomination—whether it is at good article nominations, a featured process, or anything else—will not receive the necessary reviews, please list it on Wikipedia:WikiCup/Reviews Needed (remember to remove your listing when no longer required). Questions are welcome on Wikipedia talk:WikiCup, and the judges are reachable on their talk pages or by email. If you wish to start or stop receiving this newsletter, please feel free to add or remove yourself from Wikipedia:WikiCup/Newsletter/Send. Judges: Sturmvogel 66 (talk) and Cwmhiraeth Cwmhiraeth (talk) MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 09:30, 2 July 2021 (UTC)

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Featured picture scheduled for POTD

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R. J. Palacio (born July 13, 1963) is an American author and graphic designer. During her career, she has designed hundreds of book covers, including for both fiction and non-fiction works. She is also the author of several novels for children, including the best-selling Wonder, which has won several awards. Palacio is seen here signing a book at the 2019 BookCon convention in New York City.

Photograph credit: Rhododendrites

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Images of SoHo

I by no means want to impose, but if you are in or near New York might you snag an image or two of SoHo. I was looking around for an alternative to File:Cast Iron Grand Crosby jeh crop.jpg that captures the neighborhood's cast iron facades, but there are very few good images that fit the bill. Thank you so much for all your wonderful contributions. Filetime (talk) 02:33, 7 July 2021 (UTC)

@Filetime: Hm. First I've heard of any defining architectural features of SoHo. I mainly just think of it as a touristy and/or shopping area, so don't get there all that often, and admittedly its boundaries blur together to Nolita, Little Italy, Bowery, etc. I'll keep "cast iron facades" in mind if I find myself there in the future, though. :) — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 02:35, 10 July 2021 (UTC)

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This Month in GLAM: June 2021

This Month in GLAM – Volume XI, Issue VI, June 2021 Headlines AfLIA Wikipedia in African Libraries report: African Librarians Week 2021 Albania report: CEE Spring Campaign in Albania and Kosovo Argentina report: A course on opening cultural collections Belgium report: Edit-a-thons with Wiki Women Design Brazil report: A metadata roundtripping model for museums France report: European Archaeology Days; Edit-a-thon in Romanity Museum Guinea report: GLAM with Harmattan Guinée 15 June 2021 in Conakry Italy report: Festival and edit-a-thon dedicated to the world of archives Netherlands report: Training at Het Nieuwe Instituut in Rotterdam; training for Suriname and the Dutch Caribbean has concluded New Zealand report: Making artists visible Serbia report: Wikidata development and culture of Rudnik and Takovo region Spain report: Museums writing challenge and Viquimarató Carmelina Sánchez-Cutillas Sweden report: Free music; Kulturarv som gymnasiearbete; Statistics Sweden – now as open data; KTH library training Switzerland report: Diversity in GLAM Program Uganda report: Wikipedia for Museums in Uganda UK report: British Library and Khalili Collections Ukraine report: #1Lib1Ref in Ukrainian Wikipedia USA report: Meetup/CCCCWI; Vaccine Safety Wikipedia Edit-a-thon; WikiWednesday Salon; San Diego Wiknic; Black Lunch Table / Black visual artists Special story: Play, experiment and cross borders at Hack4OpenGLAM Structured Data on Wikimedia Commons report: OpenRefine starts Structured Data on Commons development and is searching for two developers WMF GLAM report: Conferences and Structured data modeling Calendar: July's GLAM events Read this edition in full • Single-page To assist with preparing the newsletter, please visit the newsroom. Past editions may be viewed here.

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July 14: Virtual Coney Island Meetup + NYC monthly collaboration

July 14, 7pm: Virtual Coney Island Meetup + NYC monthly collaboration

Welcome to Wikimedia New York City! You are invited to join the Wikimedia NYC community for our monthly online gathering (7-8pm) and knowledge-sharing workshop. To join the meeting from your computer or smartphone, just visit this link. More information about how to connect is available on the meetup page. Instead of our usual "WikiWednesday" Salon, we'll focus on the WikiProject NYC monthly collaboration and this month's subject of Coney Island. And rather than Zoom, we'll meet on a proximity chat virtual Coney Island beach and share over topical articles and collaborations. We look forward to seeing local Wikimedians, but would also like to invite folks from the greater New York metropolitan area (and beyond!) who might not typically be able to join us in person! Wednesday July 14 Virtual Coney Island Meetup (optional RSVP on-wiki). 7:00pm - 8:00 pm online via WikiConey on Gather

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Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style/Biography

Rhododendrites, you may be watching the Talk page of Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style/Biography, but in case you are not, please refer to the page for new information. Thank you for assisting me in improving the article. God bless and happy editing. MarydaleEd (talk) 22:45, 16 July 2021 (UTC)

Re: Woman

User:rhododenritesI Rhododenrites I have not been respectful enough of your intent. I have been absent. Forgive me. I have the deepest respect your opinions, and I think we both want what is best for the encyclopedia. You are amazing. I will even say this: you are magical. You are welcome, and you alone, to contradict the outcome I came to at Woman. Though I stand by my decision there, I also stand by your own feeling. You should do whatever you feel is best. I have read the arguments, I have assessed them, and I made a choice. I made it based on what I understood as carefully worded policy and presented argument. But I will defer to your greater experience, in the end. Absolutely. Know that. Ok? A loose necktie (talk) 07:01, 7 July 2021 (UTC)

@A loose necktie: Thanks for this very nice message, and sorry it took me a while to notice it (it looks like you accidentally left it on my user page, rather than user talk, so I didn't get a notification until someone else noticed it and let me know -- no harm, of course).

I don't think it would be a good idea for me to pursue that thread further. There was no appetite at WP:AN to overturn your closing statement. While I think it leaves MOS:PEOPLEGALLERY in an awkward place, consensus is clear on this matter, so I've moved on. Thanks again for your concern and follow-up, though. Cheers. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 23:41, 17 July 2021 (UTC)

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Failed proposals

WP:PROPOSAL doesn't address the case of what to do when (e.g.,) Wikipedia:BOLD, revert, discuss cycle is nominated for guideline status and is rejected. Maybe it should recommend placing the notice of rejection on the talk page? WhatamIdoing (talk) 19:20, 19 July 2021 (UTC)

@WhatamIdoing: That seems reasonable to me. There's a big difference between "this page is a failed proposal" and "there was a failed proposal about this page". Essay vs. explanatory supplement vs. information page is a whole other ball of wax. Fun fact: I don't remember the last time that idiom popped out, so looked up where it comes from. One theory is that it's a mistaken version of "whole bailiwick". Hm. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 04:07, 20 July 2021 (UTC)

We might need a different template/namespace-dependent change to the wording for that template. Something more like the prior AFD notices or failed FAC nominations would fit better on a talk page. WhatamIdoing (talk) 04:20, 20 July 2021 (UTC)

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The Signpost: 25 July 2021

• News and notes: Wikimania and a million other news stories

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Help

Hey i need your help please text me on +256760428583 (whatsapp) Kendoma (talk) 02:39, 29 July 2021 (UTC)

Hi Kendoma. What is this about? I don't have whatsapp and prefer to keep communications here on Wikipedia. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 16:53, 30 July 2021 (UTC)

Books & Bytes – Issue 45

The Wikipedia Library

Books & Bytes
Issue 45, May – June 2021

• Library design improvements continue
• New partnerships
• 1Lib1Ref update

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Feedback request: Biographies request for comment

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This Month in GLAM: July 2021

This Month in GLAM – Volume XI, Issue VII, July 2021 Headlines Albania report: Collaboration with the New Vision Organization in Tirana; Summer of Wikivoyage Campaign 2021 Australia report: Representation and erasure: opportunities and risks that Wikipedia presents for First Nations knowledges Brazil report: A wikicontest to celebrate and make visible the state of Bahia India report: Rabimas proofread contest ends on Bengali Wikisource New Zealand report: New Zealand holds its second Wikimedia conference, and a performing arts Wikiproject gathers steam Serbia report: New chances for GLAM success Sweden report: Photos of Childrens theatre UK report: A Thousand Images of Islam, British Library Updates USA report: Smithsonian Wiki Focus: Black Women in Food History; San Diego 73; Black Lunch Table Black artists WMF GLAM report: A conversation about depicts and Structured Data on Commons Calendar: August's GLAM events Read this edition in full • Single-page To assist with preparing the newsletter, please visit the newsroom. Past editions may be viewed here.

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Sat Aug 14: Wikimania Wiknic NYC

August 14, 12-5pm: Wikimania Wiknic NYC

Wikimania 2021 Welcome to Wikimedia New York City! You are invited to join the Wikimedia NYC community for a planned socially-distanced Wiknic ("the picnic anyone can edit") in Brooklyn's Prospect Park to coincide with the virtual Wikimania 2021. For this occasion, and to allow more space as desired, we have individually packed lunches provided by the chapter, and attendees are encouraged to RSVP at Eventbrite and give sandwich/entree orders. Saturday August 14 Wikimania Wiknic NYC (optional RSVP on-wiki). 12:00pm - 5:00 pm in a shaded grove in front of the Picnic House (Prospect Park, Brooklyn) Long Meadow of Prospect Park

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--Wikimedia New York City Team 18:48, 11 August 2021 (UTC)

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Feedback request: History and geography request for comment

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IRC cloak

@Dungodung, Snowolf, Az1568, and Fox: Hi GCs. I had a cloak on Freenode. Requested one on Libera. After some days/weeks of pending, it's been rejected. Don't know why or what to do. There's an IRC noticeboard, but no posts in a long time, so just pinging here to confirm that yes, it was me who requested a cloak. Thanks. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 19:30, 21 August 2021 (UTC)

Feedback request: Society, sports, and culture request for comment

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August 25: ONLINE WikiWednesday Salon NYC

August 25, 7pm: ONLINE WikiWednesday Salon NYC

Welcome to Wikimedia New York City! You are invited to join the Wikimedia NYC community for our monthly "WikiWednesday" evening salon (7-8pm) and knowledge-sharing workshop. To join the meeting from your computer or smartphone, just visit this link. More information about how to connect is available on the meetup page. We look forward to seeing local Wikimedians, but would also like to invite folks from the greater New York metropolitan area (and beyond!) who might not typically be able to join us in person! If there's a project you'd like to share or a question you'd like answered, just let us know by adding it to the agenda or the talk page. Wednesday August 25 WikiWednesday Salon and Skill-Share NYC (optional RSVP on-wiki). 7:00pm - 8:00 pm online via Zoom (optional breakout rooms from 8:00-8:30)

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--Wikimedia New York City Team 14:19, 24 August 2021 (UTC)

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Your GA nomination of Green Guerillas

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Your GA nomination of Green Guerillas

The article Green Guerillas you nominated as a good article has been placed on hold . The article is close to meeting the good article criteria, but there are some minor changes or clarifications needing to be addressed. If these are fixed within 7 days, the article will pass; otherwise it may fail. See Talk:Green Guerillas for issues which need to be addressed. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of GhostRiver -- GhostRiver (talk) 16:41, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

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The Signpost: 29 August 2021

• News and notes: Enough time left to vote! IP ban

• In the media: Vive la différence!

• Wikimedians of the year: Seven Wikimedians of the year

• Gallery: Our community in 20 graphs

• News from Wiki Education: Changing the face of Wikipedia

• Recent research: IP editors, inclusiveness and empathy, cyclones, and world heritage

• WikiProject report: WikiProject Days of the Year Interview

• Traffic report: Olympics, movies, and Afghanistan

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Precious anniversary

Precious

Five years!

--Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:54, 30 August 2021 (UTC)

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Your GA nomination of Abolitionist Place

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WikiCup 2021 September newsletter

The fourth round of the competition has finished with over 500 points being required to qualify for the final round. It was a hotly competitive round with two contestants, The Rambling Man and Epicgenius, each scoring over 3000 points, and six contestants scoring over 1000. All but one of the finalists achieved one or more FAs during the round, the exception being Bloom6132 who demonstrated that 61 "in the news" items produces an impressive number of points. Other contestants who made it to the final are Gog the Mild, Lee Vilenski, BennyOnTheLoose, Amakuru and Hog Farm. However, all their points are now swept away and everyone starts afresh in the final round.

Round 4 saw the achievement of 18 featured articles and 157 good articles. Bilorv scored for a 25-article good topic on Black Mirror but narrowly missed out on qualifying for the final round. There was enthusiasm for FARs, with 89 being performed, and there were 63 GARs and around 100 DYKs during the round. As we start round 5, we say goodbye to the eight competitors who didn't quite make it to the final round; thank you for the useful contributions you have made to the Cup and Wikipedia, and we hope you will join us again next year. For other contestants, remember that any content promoted after the end of round 4 but before the start of round 5 can be claimed in round 5. Remember too that you must claim your points within 14 days of "earning" them.

If you are concerned that your nomination, whether it be for a good article, a featured process, or anything else, will not receive the necessary reviews, please list it on Wikipedia:WikiCup/Reviews Needed (remember to remove your listing when no longer required). If you want to help out with the WikiCup, please do your bit to help keep down the review backlogs! Questions are welcome on Wikipedia talk:WikiCup, and the judges are reachable on their talk pages or by email. If you wish to start or stop receiving this newsletter, please feel free to add or remove your name from Wikipedia:WikiCup/Newsletter/Send. Sturmvogel 66 and Cwmhiraeth. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 13:02, 2 September 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Abolitionist Place

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Adminship reform

I really appreciate your comments re: creating alternative pathways to adminship. Would you be interested in creating some sort of separate brainstorming/discussion page to detail proposals? I'd be happy to contribute however possible. Thanks, GAB^gab 16:14, 4 September 2021 (UTC)

Feedback request: History and geography request for comment

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This Month in GLAM: August 2021

This Month in GLAM – Volume XI, Issue VIII, August 2021 Headlines Albania report: Wikipedia Pages Wanting Photos (WPWP) Campaign in Albania and Kosovo Australia report: How Australian libraries are turning to Wikipedia during the global pandemic Brazil report: Transbordados: WikidataCon's preconference for Latin America discusses GLAM and decolonization Côte d'Ivoire report: Glam-wiki 2021 10 Juillet en Côte d'Ivoire France report: Wikimedian in residence; Some projects for this autumn India report: Second proofread competition starts on Bengali Wikisource in collaboration with the British Library Italy report: Summer school in July and two new WiR in August Netherlands report: 50 cool new things you can now do with KB’s collection highlights, and New old photographs of Algeria, Mali and Morocco by Angeline van Achterberg New Zealand report: A Wikimedian at New Zealand Opera Serbia report: Villas and castles of Serbia Sweden report: History, history and future UK report: Khalili Collections reaches 30 articles USA report: Wiki salons and Kearny Mesa Special story: Hack4OpenGLAM is ready to start Structured Data on Wikimedia Commons report: OpenRefine starts SDC development WMF GLAM report: GLAM conversations and feedbacks for a better Wikimedia movement Calendar: September's GLAM events Read this edition in full • Single-page To assist with preparing the newsletter, please visit the newsroom. Past editions may be viewed here.

About This Month in GLAM · Subscribe/Unsubscribe · Global message delivery · Romaine 00:29, 12 September 2021 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Axxess (South Africa)

Just to let you know I've merged this into Afrihost#Services as a single sentence including two refs from the article and the one you posted in the AfD, feel free to take more from the Axxess (South Africa) page history under the redirect. – filelakeshoe (t / c) 🐱 09:47, 14 September 2021 (UTC)

Good faith alternative

You made the statement "I'm struggling to find a good faith alternative". Perhaps I can better explain why I find it insulting.

This is the way I took the series of events:

• Editor posted a section on my talk page entitled "Use of unreliable sources" which is, near as I can tell, is someone telling me how to use specific sources (which is in keeping with what was posted
• He then made some unflattering remarks about me and then changed the title to an accusation/label "User of unreliable sources", which is way different than the original and at least a personal remark that isn't necessary. To be blunt, his own user page has the note "I may, without notice, refactor comments to put like with like, correct indents, or retitle sections to reflect their contents more accurately." It is intellectually inconsistent to put such remarks in your own talk page and deny the same of others to do the same.
• I changed it back to the original, he reverted (clearly intending to keep those personal remarks/label me).
• I removed it with comments why, he reverted (again clearly intending to keep those personal remarks/label me).
• I removed it with the same comments why and was blocked.

To be somewhat blunt, I don't see a substantive difference between making the same remarks in the edit summary and removing it vs putting them on the page and removing it, but apparently there is a difference. Next time, I'll simply remove those remarks without comment. Hopefully that clarifies my intent. Buffs (talk) 21:49, 16 September 2021 (UTC)

@Buffs: Putting aside the other stuff, it seems like you have it backwards. He posted the typo "user of unreliable sources" first then corrected it. You reinstated the typo "user", not him. I guess the good faith alternative is just confusion? — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 01:57, 17 September 2021 (UTC)

I hate to say it, but you're clearly correct. My recollection was not accurate. I hereby rescind my objection. Clearly I'm wrong about the sequence of events. Next time I'll just delete an unproductive discussion (for this reason and many others). I'm not too big to admit I'm wrong. I think adding this to the ANI page will not help matters and will only inflame things and I'm going to let a sleeping dog lie. However, if queried, I will happily update remarks. Buffs (talk) 02:27, 17 September 2021 (UTC)

Well @Buffs:, it looks like you've worn out the usefulness of this this account now too. No way to make Admin after this screw-up.. When you come up with another account name, you might want to try not to wiki lawyer your way through disagreements so much. Seems to have a boomerang effect on you when you step out of line too far.69.161.77.13 (talk) 10:05, 17 September 2021 (UTC)