User talk:Jwy/Archives/2008/December

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Something has been nominated for a featured article review. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. Please leave your comments and help us to return the article to featured quality. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, articles are moved onto the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Remove" the article from featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. Reviewers' concerns are here. -- K. Annoyomous24[c] 06:13, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

Ada Lovelace

I don't understand your rationale for reverting. I changed "Early career" to "Career" because there were no subsequent sections about her life (she died in her 30s). You said "see bullet 4 in the Article title section"; bullet 4 is "The initial letter of a title is capitalized" etc. which has nothing to do with any of this, so presumably I'm actually supposed to be looking at some other list entirely. Emurphy42 (talk) 06:14, 15 October 2008 (UTC)


I don't support the suggested merge. See my comments at Talk:Faust (disambiguation). Cheers, (John User:Jwy talk) 18:58, 17 October 2008 (UTC)

I've cleaned up the page some. Are there particular Fausts that you would move over? (John User:Jwy talk) 15:29, 18 October 2008 (UTC)
the above moved here from User talk:Robertgreer
I made two very slight changes to Faust (disambiguation) and Works based on Faust; Goethe's, Marlowe's, Newman's and Kanso's works appeared in both (they're now just in the former) and there was an extraneous (disambiguation) after Saint Faustus (it's gone.) While I was at it I reversed the listing for Max Brand so that the blue link comes first; see the Faust (disambiguation) page, People section. Here follows a list of what I'd remove from Faust (disambiguation), indicated by strikethrough; and what I'd move from Works based on Faust to Faust (disambiguation), indicated by boldface (I apologize for its length.) — Robert Greer (talk) 13:13, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

Faust (disambiguation)

Based on the tale

The name may may refer to one of these notable works of art based on the tale:

See also


Fictitious characters


Works based on Faust



Classical Music


Contemporary Music


Prose fiction

Films and Screenplays



Capitalized short verbs

I think it is the standard with many English publishers (in practice, but not formalized—The Oxford Manual of Style does specifically formalize it, though). WP:ALBUMCAPS is where the guideline is, and Capitalization#How to capitalize discusses different ways to capitalize, too. — Twas Now ( talkcontribse-mail ) 17:47, 25 October 2008 (UTC)

Academy Awards

I am doing this lists because lots of the links are not correct so I am doing them by countries if you like them I ahve the links.

I will be doing other countries ASAP.

MPRP Straw Poll

Hi Jwy, the Main Page Redesign proposal is currently conducting a straw poll to select five new designs, before an RFC in which one will be chosen to go against the current main page. Your input would be hugely appreciated. PretzelsTalk! 22:41, 27 October 2008 (UTC)

AfD nomination of Chris Phoenix (producer)

Ambox warning pn.svg

I have nominated Chris Phoenix (producer), an article you created, for deletion. I do not think that this article satisfies Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion, and have explained why at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Chris Phoenix (producer). Your opinions on the matter are welcome at that same discussion page; also, you are welcome to edit the article to address these concerns. Thank you for your time. Cirt (talk) 21:45, 30 October 2008 (UTC)


True, thx. I'll cease. I've reverted my violating edit as I got caught up and forgot this wasn't a "vandalism" issue. Good Ol’factory (talk) 22:25, 2 November 2008 (UTC)

Archangel (disambiguation)

Not sure what an anonymous user is trying to accomplish on this page. His/her formatting skills ain't so good. What do you think? Please reply on your talk page, Lord Sesshomaru (talkedits) 04:51, 10 November 2008 (UTC)

Looked about a bit. IMDB has it released with two parts, so I reverted. An edit summary when its not clearly vandalism helps with those not used to things here. (John User:Jwy talk) 14:58, 10 November 2008 (UTC)

Re: TOCright

Help:Section#Floating_the_TOC. It's best to avoid floated table of contents if possible. Also, from personal experience, they don't always appear as they are intended on mobile devices. Gary King (talk) 15:18, 17 November 2008 (UTC)

Your edits to Spontaneous Cerebrospinal Fluid Leak

Thank you for your copyediting to this article. As someone who suffers from SCSFL I thank you for improving the article. Bstone (talk) 22:39, 24 November 2008 (UTC)

Sebald's Vertigo

OK for the copyright note. The fact is that I liked the Di Piero review very much, because it caught the subliminal themes of Sebald's book: so, I took the core of his article and paraphrased it, rewriting some of the passages. Evidently, this is not sufficient to satisfy Wikipedia's copyright policies...

So, I'm deleting that part (it's only the first section of the page) and replacing it with some short notes I took from the equivalent it.Wikipedia (in Italian) -- which I wrote myself anyway. The rest stays, as it's only a synthesised commentary of excerpts. OK? --Daubmir (talk) 19:50, 1 December 2008 (UTC)

Grazie, amico! I'll fix the disambiguation too... Sometimes someone writes exactly as we intended to write, but better. And we can't resist the temptation to use such writing because it so well expresses our feeling (more skilfully in fact that we could possibly do)! So... we paraphrase. W. G. Sebald himself did it with Thomas Bernhard, and it's only proper I should do it with Sebald too, no? Thanks for the advice, much appreciated. --Daubmir (talk) 20:19, 1 December 2008 (UTC)

Pete Townshend

Hi - re Pete Townshend. If people read the article carefully they will understand the detail of the case - but not everyone reads carefully. But the inclusion of the category heading would be seen by more people. And it unfairly brands him in a category he truly does not belong in.

The sole reason that Townshend appears on the list is because of an aberration in English law. He was not charged or convicted yet the law mandated that (if he accepted a caution) he HAD to be placed on a list of convicted offenders even though he was not even suspected of having been an offender (as defined by the law.) Only of downloading images - an act that the police eventually conceded he had not done. In the US Townshend could never be placed on such a list based on those circumstances. Lack of due process apart from anything else. It is probable that The European Court would also rule Townshend's inclusion on the list to be unlawful if he ever challenged it. Townshend made clear in interviews that he considered it more prudent to accept the unfair inclusion than to undergo the pain and public/media hoopla of a prolonged legal battle to clear his name. Davidpatrick 06:33, 29 December 2005 (UTC)

I do see your point. But I don't feel that it is the content of the Sex Offenders page that is wrong. If you read it - it seems pretty clear what it is. I wouldn't presume to change it simply to reflect that on one occasion (to my knowledge) someone was placed on such a list despite NOT having been convicted.
Also the page is not specifically a set of legal definitions. And there are differences in the law between countries anyway. No the key issue for me is that that page relates to people who have committed or been convicted of a specific crime. Townshend wasn't even charged with any such act or crime - let alone convicted. He found himself on an English list (not a US list) by "virtue" of an aberration in the law that meant that he HAD to be placed on a list with convicted sex offenders even though he wasn't one. Explaining that to people sounds like just a technicality. Though it is not. So I think to list Townshend in that category is just unfair given the lack of criminal charge or conviction. Davidpatrick 07:03, 29 December 2005 (UTC)

the Hurricanes

Sorry 'bout that John, just me being pedantic! be lucky, Lion King 23:24, 29 December 2005 (UTC)

Michael & JWs

I sympathize. I suspected the whole Michael/Jesus connection was vandalism until I had researched it more thoroughly. (It does sound odd, doesn't it?) TCC (talk) (contribs) 20:08, 30 December 2005 (UTC)

"White Album"

Good job, much better than my attempted "correction" of prior edit! Lion King 04:32, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

Good point, well made- have taken it on board! Best wishes, Lion King 04:45, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

Epic and Epic (disambiguation)

I redirected Epic (disambiguation) because it seemed redundant with the already-existing Epic disambig page. Your changes sound fine to me; I just wasn't sure what the main meaning of "Epic" was. æle 17:41, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

Hopefully you see my message up here... Yes I did notice that you had proposed a move to Epic. Just curious, how many (say out of every 10) of the "What links here" need to go to Epic poetry?--Commander Keane 10:12, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

A note for the Epic of Gilgamesh and the Neo-Assyrian Corpus

Maureen Kovacs work: The Epic of Gilgamesh.....I just was putting away books, cleaning them etc. and read her 1st Paragraph to: "A Note on the Translation" (pg { xiii-not numbered on page } of her 121 pg. c 1985, 1989 work). here is her quote near the beginning of the small paragraph:
" ... ...; I have tried to keep to a somewhat literal rendering of the Akkadian words, grammar, and images, without attempting to recast the poetry of the Akkadian into English poetry . Most of the differences..."...
Like I say, I was cleaning and filing some Egyptian books. This work I synchronized with Line Numbers with Parpola's SAACT Volume I.(The Epic of Gilgamesh); see also Text corpus,POS Tagging). Kovacs translation, will end up being a seminal analysis... (my opinion), and will be superseded by other good renditions. ..MichaelMcAnnisYumaARIZ///Mmcannis 17:55, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

bulk revert

No problem. Fortunately, we don't have to undo vandalism by hand, you can find instructions for reverting a page at Wikipedia:Revert.

Thanks for your help. Canderson7 (talk) 01:15, 1 January 2006 (UTC)

Ah, thanks! John (Jwy) 01:35, 1 January 2006 (UTC)

2005 in comics

The November 28 entry refers to the epic storyline, something which we don't seem to have an entry on, instead narrowing that idea into Epic poetry and Epic film. I've amended the link as best as I can in light of that fact. Steve block talk 05:22, 1 January 2006 (UTC)

Re: Joyce dates

Hey, thanks for commenting. I tend to agree that some dates are useful. The years of his birth, death and in which each of his books were published are linked in the intro. 1904 (the year in which Ulysses is set) is still linked, as well as 1891 (the year his first poem was published, as it was very political and relevant). The ones I removed seemed unimportant to me; for example, I didn't really see the point of having 1893 linked, as the only thing that is mentioned is the minor tidbit that his father was pensioned, or 1888, the year he entered Conglowes, as the 6-year old Joyce starting school had little connection to other events of the year. Obviously, feel free to add any back if you see a reason. Dharmabum420 20:50, 3 January 2006 (UTC)

Cool. I didn't look closely enough to see if you switched all the dates or not. (and I wish 1903 in my note was a typo, but. . .).John (Jwy) 21:31, 3 January 2006 (UTC)
Heh, no worries, I've made similar mistakes many times myself (transposing the actual date to July 16 instead of June 16 is the most frequent). Dharmabum420 00:06, 4 January 2006 (UTC)

Hey... the comma in June 16, 1904 is fine, according to the style sheet, and I tested it with a custom date setting and it worked. It's only when there's no day (eg. June, 1904) that it causes a problem, as far as I can tell. Dharmabum420 23:54, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

i forgot to login and then edited something on the persephone page, now im not sure about your concerns about my edits, the zeus part is a fact, you can see it on the Theseus page, where him and his best friend decide to marry daughters of Zeus. Then, in the book the king must die, theseus reaches a city called eleusis, where he is challenged bye Kerkyon the year-king, the name of the queen is Persephone. so if im wrong please correct me, but im pretty sure that there isnt anything that is completly false


Wolfgang Hildesheimer

Looks great, good work. SimonP 03:00, 9 January 2006 (UTC)

The Beatles

John, there's an American on The Beatles discussion page wanting to refer to them as "the" Beatles. As you have a better command of the lingo, unlike a Cockney oik like me, could you sort 'em out please? Best wishes, Lion King 20:19, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Dylan on Beatles

No problem with that John. I do feel however, that Dylan's influence on them must be stressed. by 1965 in the UK, they were about as cool as a Pop Tart! A lot of their fans had been lost to Dylan, The Stones and The Who. The kids Mums and Dads had started to like them (FATAL!) and even City Gents in Bowler (Derby) hats, thought them quite good! Dylan's influence on them as far as their lyrics were concerned, was paramount in them regaining their cred.

As far as "THE" is concerned, I feel that the answer may lie in Webster's Dictionary. Best wishes, Lion King 16:27, 30 January 2006 (UTC)

  • Excellent "wordsmithing", spot on! Lion King 19:56, 2 February 2006 (UTC)

The "Quarry Men".

Hi John. This one is down to the fact that they were unable to get the name across the bass drum as one word, in letters big enough to be seen. They were and still are, The "Quarrymen". Cheers, Lion King 14:06, 13 February 2006 (UTC)

{{Book reference}}→{{cite book}}

Are you a user of WP:AWB? If so, then you need to visit here. Copy the <pre> stuff into an XML file on your machine and load it into AWB: Adrian suggests a file-name (which I failed to spot :-).

Otherwise, you can apply to be registered for AWB here: it might well be myself who actually does the registration but even so you need to list your name there. In the meantime you need to look at the talk-page for {{cite book}} where the usage is explained. HTH HAND —Phil | Talk 16:04, 21 February 2006 (UTC)


Hmm... well, I guess the best page would be Epic poetry, but I don't mind having a link to just epic. Thanks! Flcelloguy (A note?) 19:16, 13 March 2006 (UTC)


Yeah, pretty impressive blowout in the end. I suspected for a long time that this was his motivation (he had all sorts of little signs) and suspected that before he got voted off he would do something revealing (since he clearly had no desire to try and argue his case), but didn't expect it quite this soon. The sooner, the better, in my mind. --Fastfission 16:17, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

The Beatles

Umm... what is this edit? It seems that you were trying to revert some vandalism, but instead reverted to a vandalised revision. M o P 16:03, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

I or popups got the wrong revision. Things were happening so quickly there that it looks like two of up were trying to revert at the same time. . . Thanks for catching it. John (Jwy) 16:07, 22 March 2006 (UTC)
Yeah, it looked like you were vandalising it. But you weren't, so all is well. :) M o P 16:20, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

This is a public computer terminal from a High School, therefore most of the messages from this IP will be vandalism and inappropriate. Just a heads up.—This unsigned comment was added by (talkcontribs) .

High School

This is a public computer terminal from a High School, therefore most of the messages from this IP will be vandalism and inappropriate. Just a heads up. —This unsigned comment was added by (talkcontribs) .

Discourse on Method

Hello there Jwy.

Thank you for taking an interest in the article. I started the article in May 2004, and not much of substance has happened to it since then. Today someone posted a finnish link, I got interested in looking at the other links and therefore I looked thru them.

I found that the Portuguese version was a featured article, so I decided to see if one could start improving this a bit. I added some text from the Portuguese version, some from the French, stole a picture from the finnish version, added more sections and some more text from the original text.

It is far from done, but I prefer to experiment my way forwards. Since very few others edit here, I thought I was alone :)

I think images can be a good way of illustrating and lightening up an article so I decided to add a picture of a cartesian coordinate system along the word "cartesian coordinates", and I thought a bit of basic calculus notation might be appropriate beside the calculus version.

Are you interested in improving content and layout to this article too? DanielDemaret 21:30, 26 March 2006 (UTC)

The dx/dy is out then. I destroyed some of my own editing and will try to revert. I hope you find the time to look later. DanielDemaret 21:39, 26 March 2006 (UTC)

Reverted now. Do you think that the sidebox is good or bad? I am thinking of expanding it later with more substance. Before that there is a lot of substance to add and to tie together in the text, and since it is midnight here, there is of course - sleep to consider.DanielDemaret 21:45, 26 March 2006 (UTC)

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dab notes

Hi John, thanks your comment on my talk -- I have replied there. --BrownHairedGirl (talkcontribs) 03:30, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

re: WP:MOSDAB#Redlinks

Was this the section you had in mind? Do include a redlink when another article links to the ambiguous article with none of the disambiguation options in mind. (A list of links to an article can be obtained using Special:What links here.) The rest of the section intimates that there needs to be a good reason for a redlink, and that's the philosophy I've been following. Is there a particular edit, or bunch of edits, that I've made that you have in mind? I'll 'calm down' in the interim. Cheers, Colonel Tom 13:57, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

And my apologies for not making this clear (I was coming back to re-edit my comment, but you replied before I could do so) - I would be happy to receive guidance / clarification. I'm feeling gnomish, and removing redundant blue links and some redlinks seemed/seems like a good idea. The last thing I want to do is create the need for 500 reverts, though. Colonel Tom

14:07, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

I would like clarification; I've been following this precept: Unlike a regular article page, don't wikilink any other words in the line, unless they may be essential to help the reader determine where they might find the information. (WP:MOSDAB#Individual entries) I thought the idea was, if the topic is mentioned in the initial bluelink, then there's no need for other bluelinks in the description. You've restored some bluelinks I removed while I tried to adhere to the above. I've been doing a lot of this kind of edit lately, and I hope they won't all have to be fixed. (I don't think so, of course, or I wouldn't have done it in the first place, but as I said before, I would appreciate advice / guidance.) The examples you quoted on my talkpage, Rafael Trujillo (disambiguation) and Ragnarok (disambiguation), don't seem to meet the above criteria for inclusion. I'm going to stop editing DAB pages for now; please advise how I should interpret the above. Cheers, Colonel Tom 14:35, 23 May 2006 (UTC)
Thanks, John. I've been looking for, but can't seem to find, a statement I've come across on wikipedia to the effect that removing these blue links reduces server load. That's the reason I've been cleaning them up. The basic philosophy, as I understand it, is that there's no point having blue links on a disambig page when those same blue links are found in the article(s) of the topics being disambiguated. eg, there's not much point having
as all those extra bluelinks are, or should be, in the articles, and the purpose of a disambig page is to steer you to the article in question. I assume this has been discussed before, but there may be merit in reopening the discussion. I do appreciate your comments, and your positive intentions in halting what may have been a runaway bot. No bot though, just me. :) Colonel Tom 00:19, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
Thanks. I agree completely; when the dab term is redlinked, keeping the most specific/appropriate bluelink in the description can be a very good idea. Like you, I want to make the encyclopedia better, not worse. I will certainly keep your guidance in mind. Cheers, Colonel Tom 00:36, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
re Ream, I also generally leave a bluelink per line, but didn't in this case because I didn't think caulk assisted in an understanding, as the word 'ream' isn't in that article. I thought the wiktionary link would suffice. Like you, I'm trying to apply MOSDAB, but if I don't get it right, Please feel free to revert (as I did to you, I realise after checking edit history). I really appreciate your 'discuss before reversion' approach, but if you think anything I've touched can be improved, or would benefit from a reversion, please hop in. BTW, do you agree with my above reasoning re caulk, or do you feel that the bluelink would improve the page? I'll certainly continue to consider these points in future. With thanks, Colonel Tom 22:26, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
I didn't feel strongly enough about Ream to change it. Since we are both MOSDABing, I'm mainly bouncing ideas off you about things in general rather than quibbling about individual pages. . . John (Jwy) 22:47, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
Understood. I'm finding it useful bouncing these ideas around. Colonel Tom 22:56, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

Another WP:MOSDAB discussion ...

I noted your edit to Red FM with interest. I utterly agree (not that you said as such) that my leaving the town/city and country did not go far enough in 'reducing' the content to meet MOSDAB. Looking at Dab:places, it suggests that there can be merit in leaving the country. I can, of course, see your reasoning behind changing Red FM (93.5 MHz) in Mumbai, India to Red FM (93.5 MHz) in Mumbai, rather than to Red FM (93.5 MHz) in India or Red FM (93.5 MHz), as it makes the most sense. You're not doubling up on the country, and you're including the city, which could be useful. However, even though the nowiki version is available on mouseover, the country is not immediately apparent.

It's my opinion that [[Red FM (India)|Red FM]] (93.5 MHz) in India (wiki: Red FM (93.5 MHz) in India) is preferable to [[Red FM (India)|Red FM]] (93.5 MHz) in Mumbai (wiki: Red FM (93.5 MHz) in Mumbai), simply because I assume that more people know of India than Mumbai (or Ireland/Cork, Australia/Adelaide etc), and that this would more effectively guide them to the station they're searching for. I didn't see the MOSDAB precept behind leaving the town but not country. I would be interested in your thoughts, and would like to add that I'm really finding it beneficial knowing that there's another editor out there looking at DAB pages who I can raise these finer points with. Cheers, Colonel Tom 10:58, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

The mindless answer would be "I'm just following orders," as in WP:MOSDAB#Piping. But I've read somewhere (and believe) that having the article links un-piped makes it easier to understand what is happening when you deal with the dab page and why you ended up on the page you do. For example [[CKYE-FM|Red-FM]] might be disorienting. The other thing is that the blue (and red) are easier to pick up, and if they include the useful dab information, navigation is quicker. You'll see (India) quicker than the India. John (Jwy) 14:45, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
You didn't answer the question I asked { :) }, but you have answered the question I should have asked. Yes, it makes sense; I agree. Red FM (India) (93.5 MHz) in Mumbai is preferable to Red FM (93.5 MHz) in Mumbai, India or Red FM (93.5 MHz) in India. Thanks, Colonel Tom 23:55, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

Faust Disambiguation

Wow, I must have had a colossal brain malfunction. For some reason I didn't notice the "Faust" link was already there, even though it clearly was. Thank you for cleaning up after me, sorry about that. Lemonsawdust 07:59, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

Hamilton-Burr duel

The Cheney/Burr shooting match is heating up again in the duel article. You took an interest last time, so I thought I might draw this to your attention. Rklawton 20:11, 23 June 2006 (UTC)


"I'd drop one myself, but thought I'd leave it to those of you who have been focussing on this article more."

You sound like a genuinely nice person, and you are more than welcome to "drop one" if you like. (Don´t drop it on my head though, because it hurts...) Come on in and join the nice people at The Beatles page. andreasegde 12:45, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

Uhhh... Undangle my participles? I´ll have to ask my girlfriend about that one. Sounds nice. See you around. andreasegde 13:39, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

Game (disambiguation)

Hi Jwy,

I'm glad to see that you've put considerable amount of effort into cleaning up the Game (disambiguation) page. It looks much better than it did before your edits. While making changes, it seems that you deleted the Big Game James entry from the page. Was this intentional? If so, would you mind explaining your rationale?

Neelix 21:45, 21 July 2006 (UTC)

dabbing 'epic'

I gripe all the time about people providing links to disambiguation pages, and then I go and do it myself :) Thank you! riana_dzastatce • 23:20, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

Uh-oh, dispatch Cardinal Ximinez and friends to Adelaide. (No worries, thanks for the note) John (Jwy) 00:20, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

Is this where I talk to JohnJwy? I can't quite get the hang of your editing comments. Please help?User: Bruno Monkus.Bruno Monkus 18:29, 6 August 2006 (UTC) Bruno Monkus 19:00, 6 August 2006 (UTC)John-regarding Linklater:the acting troupe was funded (over $800,000) by the Ford Foundation. Linklater's purpose was to experiment with her unique voice-training method in order to write about it. The troupe work enabled her not only to succeed with the method, write her first (and very famous) book about it, Freeing The Natural Voice,but it gave her exposure enough to be able to fund a permanent training ground in Lennox, Mass. Several of the American actors of the original troupe, and only them, were directly responsible for that grant, which enabled Linklater to move forward with her desires. Otherwise, the theater world may never have had the remarkable benefits of Linklater's genius. I do not think that the troupe's actions belong as a footnote or in a separate catagory, They were directly and signally involved in her success.


No, a lot of people think it is a UK/US thing, but the correct spelling is actually "humorous" in both variants. See [1] for a very full discussion on the subject. Thank you very much for caring enough about spelling and about regional variation to message me; they are both subjects dear to my heart. --Guinnog 15:14, 26 August 2006 (UTC)

Mountain View, California wireless Internet

Yes, I was asking in case the community thought the wireless format should be part of the article. User:David Jordan


Actually I don't know either. I was hoping someone else would choose the correct one. --Easyas12c 15:16, 28 August 2006 (UTC)


OK, that makes sense. The previous version "Kish, also kisshu or Kish" didn't, nor was it obvious why it was on the Quiche dab page in the first place. Shiroi Hane 20:30, 9 September 2006 (UTC)


Thank you for helping me write the Wikipeadia article for ‘Stylistics (linguistics)’.

I think that I got the hang of things – in the end.

I’ve now finished my contribution – give or take the odd minor correction.

I hope to be able to contribute to your project again. I did feel that this entry deserved a fuller explanation.

As for the biographical note, no, I did not write this (but my agent did). I just pasted it in.

I fully accept your guidelines and will, therefore, edit it to a form consistent with your standards and style.

I do feel, however, that a brief entry about my work and credentials should be available for scrutiny, but please feel free to edit accordingly.

Thanks again for all your assistance.

Brian Lamont

Little Black Sambo

Better to bring the citations up, no? Thanks for drawing this to my attention. BTW, please add your comments to the bottom, if I hadnt known how to use wikipedia as I do I would probably never have found it, SqueakBox 20:24, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

Cool, I do think the citations at the top will make for a better article, and I see now you have a message about message order at the top of your page, SqueakBox 20:34, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

We cant use other wikipedia articles for citation purposes, SqueakBox 21:14, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

Thanks John!

Thanks for your reply John. Upendra jariya 06:55, 20 February 2007 (UTC)


Your message on my talk page: Sorry, but I reverted back the note at the top of the article. If the article belongs at Noisettes, then let's WP:MOVE it there rather than complain about it at the top of the page. The variation of the name might even be interesting to note in the body of the article itself. But rather than say "due to a difficulty, we can't X," why not FIX X. If you want some help doing so, let us know.

I was not complaining a the top of the page I just wanted people to get the story straight. And I do not now how to WP:MOVE it, but if someone would do it or tell me how.--Migospia 08:00, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

Siemens Bribery Investigations

The discussion (rightfully) started by you goes on: -- 19:55, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Malone Dies

Agreed Low was too harsh, however that is only based on some knowledge of the author on my part. There is little or nothing to the article to promote it's notability. Perhaps you know enough to give more weight to the article and enable editor's to give it a "fairer" view of it's importance. :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 13:57, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

Something about Pattie?

Harrison's quote isn't a reliable source given how that sentence is written, "It is commonly believed that Harrison's inspiration for 'Something' was his wife at the time, Pattie Boyd," because it is not about George's belief, it asserts that it is commonly believed, i.e., not that George thought it was commonly believed. As I said in my edit summary, I think it can be reworded so that no fact tag is needed. I don't want to be a pain, but statements that begin "It is commonly believed that" are just bad. They are passive voice, which makes weak-sounding sentences, and despite asserting that a large group believes something, they are hard to cite because they are either not true (pretty common) or no single person's opinion, nor even multiple individuals' opinions, supports the claim. Such a statement needs to cite the results of a survey on the topic. It's better, in my view, to quote one person who is a reliable source—and George certainly qualifies—than to assert that a large group of people think something. Another issue with the sentence is using the present tense, "It is commonly believed." That's what a large group of people think today? I doubt it. The vasdt majority of people don't even think about it at all, and at least some of the people who like George and his music have been disabused of the notion if they even ever had it.

I think the article is better without the "commonly believed" comment. If some intro is needed that mentions what George was responding to, something less precise would be better:

Harrison responded to questions about the inspiration of the song by saying, "Everybody presumed I wrote ["Something"] about Pattie, ..."

John Cardinal 12:22, 1 April 2007 (UTC)


I just put information in the box that was already on the page. Someone else already made it into that. Hmwith 14:49, 7 April 2007 (UTC)

Many thanks

for the great improvement to Moore disambiguation. John Wheater 08:36, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

Seal of Harvard, Massachusetts

A tag has been placed on Seal of Harvard, Massachusetts, requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under the criteria for speedy deletion, because it is a very short article providing little or no context to the reader. Please see Wikipedia:Stub for our minimum information standards for short articles. Also please note that articles must be on notable subjects and should provide references to reliable sources that verify their content.

Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag yourself. If you plan to expand the article, you can request that administrators wait a while for you to add contextual material. To do this, affix the template {{hangon}} to the page and state your intention on the article's talk page. Feel free to leave a note on my talk page if you have any questions about this.

I marked this for speedy deletion because there seems to be no need for this page. The one line of information it contains is also posted at Harvard, Massachusetts. Fanra 17:14, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

Julie Revisited

Your recent revisions to Julie are confusing to me. As far as piping on the list I will concede that your points are valid, however, taking links out of the main definition for Julie itself does not seem appropriate to me because it is a relevant definition for all of the links in the disambiguation. I don't see why you re-added the multiple links on the list, my first instinct is to revert many of your revisions, as your explanation in the edit summary seems inadequate, but I want to give you time to respond first. - HammerHeadHuman (talk)(work) 19:34, 21 April 2007 (UTC)

  • Your edits here seem to contradict you edits here. Your edit summary on the earlier edit stated: "WP:MOSDAB - extra bluelinks make it tough to target the right entry." In the second edit you add additional bluelinks to the list; I tend to agree with your earlier decision. As for the other problems, I have created a page Julie (surname)renamed to Julie (given name) and moved relevant info to that location. - HammerHeadHuman (talk)(work) 21:09, 21 April 2007 (UTC)
  • "In the earlier edit, all the target articles were blue, so the extra bluelinks just confused the dab page." I see what you mean. Seems like we are both happy with the latest results; glad we could come to a consensus... Also, Julie looks much better now. Thanks for your civility, look forward to speaking with you again sometime. - HammerHeadHuman (talk)(work) 22:37, 21 April 2007 (UTC)
  • Hey there, today there has been an ongoing discussion in Talk:Julie (given name) between another user and me. Seems somewhat similar to our discussion over the past few days; just wondering if you wanted to chime in with an opinion or two... - HammerHeadHuman (talk)(work) 00:15, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

Nikki Flores

Nikki Flores already had an AfD and survived, so it's hardly a candidate for speedy deletion. Put it up for deletion at AfD is you so desire. -Phoenix 20:08, 28 April 2007 (UTC)

thanks for helping with Emmy Noether

Thanks for correcting and sourcing the Hilbert quote. [2] --Jtir 14:53, 6 May 2007 (UTC)


Thank you for helping me with the link. I've gotten rid of the trivia section and fitted information about the misquote back into the article, where it talks about Antiterra. Here's what I've come up with about the misquote, and my reasoning for the placement: Antiterra is a sort of doppelganger Earth, and thus has its own (doppelganger) literature, such as "Palace in Wonderland." Perhaps there would be alternates of Tolstoy's work as well. Allyson Hoffman 15:31, 8 May 2007 (UTC)


I am just wondering why you deleted the deities list on the article for Doonys. I had actually heard that many people wanted that list to be added in the first place and were very happy that it was finally there. And now it has been removed people are complaining. It is an important part of the storyline and so I wanted to know why you removed it? Rocket-Purse 10:19, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

= Sting (gamer) == + While I don't have enough information to say whether Sting (gamer) deserves an article

Reference to the arbitration, and a 'little guy' not getting screwed over by ICANN (which is unusual).

I'm of the opinion it shouldn't go into the dab page until his notability can be established within Wikipedia.

And how would you establish notability, if you can't start an article, and you'll get editted out for irrelevence within a different article?

~ender 2007-05-19 07:31:AM MST

The Epic whale

Thanks very much for pointing out the need for disambiguation for Epic on the Moby-Dick page. I'll try to do something about it as soon as I can, but I had planned on calling it a night when I saw that I had a new message. So, for now, the Sandman has the upper hand. I'm pretty sure I'll get to it tomorrow (oops—which is now today). It's just that there's soooo much work left to do on that page.... Take care! Scrawlspacer 05:06, 25 May 2007 (UTC)


User:Hairchrm/sha1 - Hairchrm 02:54, 29 May 2007 (UTC)


Even though you proved it's true by comparing the address of the bar and the address of the label headquarters, it can't be used? NIRVANA2764 21:26, 10 June 2007 (UTC)

Lisa Robertson

Sorry 'bout that..did not know the history about that subject being removed previously. --Mikecraig 01:23, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for fixing the part about Colby cheese. I didn't know how stupid it sounded until after I looked back.


I saw your note on Talk:Mixin about wanting an example. Over a year later and I just added one. :) Don't know if you still care but there you go. Cburnett 03:36, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

Taginfo removal

I didn't think moving all the templates around was quite in the purview of the close, but feel free to move them back up if you'd like to. That seemed to be the general direction in which the discussion was headed. Best, IronGargoyle 00:53, 16 July 2007 (UTC)


Err, I'm still pretty new at this. How can we get the "Mastermind (band)" links to belong to "Mastermind (band - USA)" instead? I couldn't see a way to preserve the "(band)" page since active bands exist in both USA and Japan. Thanks for any help!! Rcarlberg (talk) 17:21, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

Thanks -- "we learn by doing." Happy Thanksgiving! Rcarlberg (talk) 17:35, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

Question: you say "I think the best way to finalize all this is for you to put the string 'db-author' at the top of the Mastermind (band - Japan) page. This will get an admin to delete the new page" but it is not the new page that should be deleted -- it is the old "(band)" page, which has now been restored, and refers to the Japanese band with no disambiguation about the American band. Did I misunderstand something? Rcarlberg (talk) 17:44, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

Thanks, I added the tag to the top. I don't exactly see how to re-tag the old page, but as long as SOMEbody knows how... Rcarlberg (talk) 18:21, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

India (disambiguation)

Thanks for your response to my suggestion, now on the India disambiguation talk page. We have no further discussion/comments. What does it mean to us? I will be happy if this point is dicussed and suitable addition(s)/alterations are made where ever appropriate, as suggested by you. After modifications, this may also go in the article "India", as suggested. However, I wish to leave this task to seasoned contributers here and will be happy with whatever concensus is reached. I am too new to enter a prolonged debate. Will you kindly take it up till final stage. I will appreciate. Regards. Wiki dr mahmad (talk) 06:32, 12 December 2007 (UTC)


This page has got out of hand again (see my comment today) and I wonder if you feel like helping again. John Wheater (talk) 22:58, 13 December 2007 (UTC)

Sting etc.

Hi,noticed your comments at Talk:Gordon Matthew Thomas Sumner. Totally agree, what a mess. I made a post here: WP:AN#Stung, so it might be best to wait and see what happens. CIreland (talk) 05:51, 30 December 2007 (UTC)


This has apparently changed - the last time I looked at the autoformatting page, years weren't supposed to be linked. My mistake! Natalie (talk) 18:55, 1 January 2008 (UTC)

John Hogan

a quick note while I'm at work

The surname pages (such as Hogan (surname)) are not disambiguation pages per se; WikiProject Anthroponymy is working toward providing information on the origin and prevalence of surnames, turning the pages into articles with associated lists; look at Brooks (surname), for instance. As for chronological order, this is something that needs discussion, of course. I've done a couple to get a feeling for how difficult it is, what caveats there are and what utile outputs there are. The lists can be easily reordered via a pass through any spreadsheet program (i.e. take the list content, put it into Excel, reorder based on given name, put back into the page - one edit, major change, good edit summary needed). The utility I had intended was in the context of name origins and migrations, where having a timeline of notable names alongside their countries of origin is quite valuable; harking back to the Brooks (surname) case, the transmittal of the surname from England to North America in the mid-seventeenth century is completely obscured by an alphabetial list by given name, but might be quite obvious from a chronological list. I have not refactored the 'Brooks' page; I am going to look for content to add to the 'Hogan' page to bring the 'article' part up to the level of that in 'Brooks' case or better. Hope this helps to explain my edits a bit. --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 18:25, 11 January 2008 (UTC)

ah, P.S. I do consider a page like John Hogan to be a dab page and subject to WP:MOSDAB; after this page, I refrained from 'chronofying' other pages such as Patrick Hogan ... but I did for Michael Hogan. I am planning to go back and reorder those few pages that I have chronofied that shouldn't have been by the surname vs. dab page distinction. --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 18:29, 11 January 2008 (UTC)

AfD nomination of DOSF

Nuvola apps important.svg

An editor has nominated DOSF, an article on which you have worked or that you created, for deletion. We appreciate your contributions, but the nominator doesn't believe that the article satisfies Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion and has explained why in his/her nomination (see also "What Wikipedia is not").

Your opinions on whether the article meets inclusion criteria and what should be done with the article are welcome; please participate in the discussion by adding your comments at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/DOSF and please be sure to sign your comments with four tildes (~~~~).

You may also edit the article during the discussion to improve it but should not remove the articles for deletion template from the top of the article; such removal will not end the deletion debate. Thank you. BJBot (talk) 19:29, 11 January 2008 (UTC)

Name order - of dabs and surname/name articles

I have brought our exchange to the attention of WikiProject Anthroponymy at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Anthroponymy#Regarding the order of names on name pages. If you start the conversation in the DAB WikiProject, could you drop a link to that conversation on either my talk page or as a comment addition to the thread linked above? Thanks, User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 01:09, 12 January 2008 (UTC)

P.S. FYI: I was at one time a participant on the DAB WikiProject ... [3]. --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 01:12, 12 January 2008 (UTC)

Sophie Scholl's last words

Unfortunately I don't have any sources. I can check it out of course but I'm not sure how much information there is about it, since I'm not very familiar with this particular area of Sophie Scholl's story. I'll see what I can find. Dr.K. (talk) 00:22, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

I found two citations. I'll put them in. Let me know. Thanks. --Dr.K. (talk) 02:37, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

Burnout Paradise at Wikia

What's up! We have a new Burnout Paradise wiki at Wikia, and I wanted to invite you to share your knowledge with us on a whole wiki dedicated to the game. If you have any questions, feel free to leave me a message on my talk page. Cheers. JoeLay (talk) 00:14, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

Re: Shaq

No problem, John! :-) I can understand why you thought it was vandalism. Funeral 18:42, 26 January 2008 (UTC)


AbbeyRoadZebraCrossingRevisited.jpg Hi! I've seen you around on The Beatles' articles... Would you consider becoming a member of WikiProject The Beatles, a WikiProject which aims to expand and improve coverage of The Beatles on Wikipedia? Please feel free to join us.

--andreasegde (talk) 19:41, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

Abbey Road... You're not in this picture... yet!


As Wiki is case sensitive and the Superior Canal Dehiscence Syndrome (SCDS) page contains more up-to-date info and more links than the one on scd, I have put a redirect on the scd page so that those seeking info on this rare disease will find appropriate information regardless of how they type it. OK? Adrianocorno (talk) 10:51, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

Inter wiki link

Sorry about the delete of the interwiki link on Self Replicating Machines. I had no idea it was meaningfull and it didn't render anything in the article text. Is there any place I can find out more about them? I guess I should also keep in mind not to delete stuff I don't understand. I had thought it was vandalism actually. Bobprime (talk) 05:36, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

Short dab pages and primary target formatting

Thank you for the reminder about this as it had slipped my mind. When I raised the question of interpretation on the disambig project talk page, I wasn't expecting a style clarification to come out of it, so I've followed up there about copying the discussion over to MOS:DAB.

Your comment on my talk page pointed out that there is another opportunity for clarification. It seems after reviewing prior discussions, the use (actually, non-use) of bolding within the list is fairly straight forward (pending wider comment that could bring other points to light, but for the sake of this comment I'll assume that it doesn't for now). It also seems that primary topic style at the top of dab pages is well-defined. So that leaves, as your comment to me pointed out, the issue really here is when should the primary topic be set at the top of a dab page and when should it be included as part of the list? I'll raise that once the in-list bolding is finalized. Any thoughts? Gwguffey (talk) 19:37, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

Date format

I probably wasn't clear in my edit summary... I was referring to the practice of linking all dates and/or years in an article. I believe that was once the style, but since changed. According to MOS:UNLINKYEARS, it's not necessary to link solitary days, months, years, particularly if it doesn't have contextual meaning. At least that's my read of it. Alcarillo (talk) 16:08, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Herzog (name)

Cheers! Thanks for looking, too. --AndrewHowse (talk) 01:57, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Location of dab primary topics

I've started a discussion about clarifying the location of primary topics links on dab pages at Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style (disambiguation pages). It would be great if you would stop by and add your thoughts. Gwguffey (talk) 04:15, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

Repost of 1001 Albums You Must Hear Before You Die: 1970s

Why was this article deleted? Yet the articles for the 50's, 60's, and 80's were left intact.

Egoflames (talk) 19:46, 30 March 2008 (UTC)

Can you make sure the remaining articles are removed as well? Thanks in advance. Egoflames (talk) 02:45, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

Welles and Simpson

Hello. Regarding your changes to my disambiguation edits on the Welles "primary topic", and your reference to compliance with MOSDAB, see WP:MOSDAB#Linking_to_a_primary_topic for my line of thinking when I made the edits. I do a lot of work on the Disambiguation project and Anthroponymy project, so I've dealt with this consideration before and I try to make the best choice. In my opinion, Welles is a common surname, and the "primary topic". The same is true for Simpson. But your change is accurate if you believe that Welles is not a "primary" topic. Cheers, --Rosiestep (talk) 02:43, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

Ok, thanks. That makes sense. --Rosiestep (talk) 15:59, 10 April 2008 (UTC)


Heh. Maybe somebody else has come up with a better term for it. Wikiarchaeology maybe? How many times do we find articles that are lost due to bad spelling/wrong names/lack of useful redirects/etc.? --Esprqii (talk) 23:55, 10 April 2008 (UTC)


I do agree with the move, I tried to make the changes and managed to screw it up, apologies for that! Pennywisepeter (talk) 09:27, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Thanks mate, much appreciated. Pennywisepeter (talk) 14:51, 25 April 2008 (UTC)


We are having a dispute on User Talk:Lar please read my bullet pointed summary... did he behave this way with you in the whole Dick Cheney-Aaron Burr debate?--Dr who1975 (talk) 04:22, 9 May 2008 (UTC)

I am on a business trip and will only be able to review the duel this weekend - but will do so. (John User:Jwy talk) 14:16, 9 May 2008 (UTC)

Richard Yates (governor) birth year

Hi, I saw you had edited the Richard Yates article, including the transfer of the page to Richard Yates (governor). Now the wikipedia articles in different languages say that he was born in 1818 but Biographical Directory of the United States Congress claims he was born in 1815. Do you have any idea which year is correct or is it actually unclear when he was born? (talk) 15:37, 12 May 2008 (UTC)

You are correct. I simply transferred the date. I don't have any more information on the gentleman than the article. If you have a good source (hopefully the US Congress site is such a one!), I would suggest that is better than the un-sourced value we currently have - as long as we are sure there is not another Richard Yates born 3 years earlier than the other! Also, if you create a user id it would be easier to communicate - the talk page of your IP address is mainly used to complain about vandalism and you don't sound like you would be vandalizing! (John User:Jwy talk) 15:46, 12 May 2008 (UTC)
Yeah, I know this is a university proxy server and other people use the same IP address as well. The US Congress certainly says he was born in 1815 but there are other equally credible sites such as the National Governors Association (see for example the link to NGA website at de:Richard Yates senior) where the birth year is indeed 1818. (talk) 13:33, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

Perhaps you can assist

I'm considering moving "Vizard" to "Vizard (Bleach)" so that I can categorize the "Vizard" redirect with Category:Surnames (Steve Vizard's page suggests Vizard is a surname, and such categorization Harrisson isn't unheard of). The creation of Vizard (disambiguation) would be nice, mainly because I'd like to list the Vizard-related links on a dab:

Problem is, I don't know where or how to begin. Sorry if this is too confusing. I'll reiterate if needed. Please reply below, Lord Sesshomaru (talkedits) 06:57, 16 May 2008 (UTC)
Take a look at WP:MOVE. If that doesn't help, let me know what other help you need. (John User:Jwy talk) 14:05, 16 May 2008 (UTC)

Re: Talk pages for Bus stop and Silver City

I've been cleaning out old test edits / vandalism from talk pages. For example, the content of Talk:Silver City was SILVR CITY IS COOL. Cheers. --MZMcBride (talk) 02:37, 19 May 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for that

That was an awfully nice compliment you paid me in Abstract's usertalk space. I appreciate the positive feedback. Have a splendid day. :) - Arcayne (cast a spell) 16:05, 28 May 2008 (UTC)

Ultra: Consequences of Britain's policy of official secrecy


Re Ultra and your deletion:

(cur) (last) 23:44, 4 January 2008 Jwy (Talk | contribs) (39,174 bytes) (→Consequences of Britain's policy of official secrecy: Does have a whiff of original research to it so we at least need to get some references.) (undo)

Please reinstate this entry. It makes the important point that histories written pre-Ultra are deficient. It is important that Wiki users know of the deficiency which is hardly known nor commented upon in the wider world.

You won’t find an original research reference simply because it is my commentary, my reasoning, my original piece, if you wish.


BillMaddock (talk) 12:04, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

Split Category

see Category:Disambiguation pages in need of being split --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 10:42, 14 July 2008 (UTC)

responding to your input on my talk page
I was actually hoping that there could be a reduction in placement of 'to be split' article links on the main WP Anthroponymy page in favor of using this category and just referencing it. There is a lot of work-outcome and work-to-do content on the main page, which I think should be cleared to a subpage in order to present a more concise and crisp introduction to the WikiProject. However, I've not pushed for this as I have been off editing outside the WikiProject for a while ... I tend not to like bringing up major revisions that I can't actually do a major part of myself :-' --User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 02:08, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

D&D articles for Wikipedia 0.7

Hi there!  :)

As someone who's worked on D&D and/or RPG articles before, I'm inviting you to participate in our goal to both improve articles that have been selected to be placed in the next Wikipedia DVD release, as well as nominate more to be selected for this project. Please see the WikiProject D&D talk page for more details. :) BOZ (talk) 19:30, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

Hi, and thanks

For having time to visit my User Page, and your kind edit. Hope you visit our beautiful Philippines, in time.

--Florentino floro (talk) 08:17, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

Copyrights et al...

Thanks Jwy, appreciate your help. I'm such a drongo (Aussie slang) when it comes to writing stuff: moreover, I was never IT minded, nor especially good creatively -- but I love researching and Wikipedia is the place for me! Unfortunately, when I encounter particular good writing by others I get all excited and would very much like to post'em all over the world... and since I can't do it under their own name (precisely because of copyright reasons), I do it under mine, so to speak (not for glory, surely, since I don't get any acknowledgements -- but for "knowledge", yeah). I try modifying their work so that it may still be widely spread and made known to all & sundry: but it doesn't work, apparently - because I have to keep in my text those very beautiful concepts and wording I love so much, otherwise what's the use? So, gotta stop it. Pity, though: beauty is everywhere, but for a moment's touch.
I'll just have to go back to translating: small consolation, but still worth it -- more so for Wikipedia. Right? Ciao--Daubmir (talk) 11:04, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

Merry Christmas

--A NobodyMy talk 02:11, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

F Troooop

Hello homeboy glad to know at least nobodies wish good luck to others on wikipeedia, r u into old shows? sorry my keyboard sux, i am into these shows and know a lot, i think the first paragraph should say total of 66 shows if pilot made. Gilligan's island had a different pilot with ginger, mary ann, professor, i wonder if F troop, SCOURGE OF THE WEST, if that's the real pilot or there was a different one? Remember Mr. Ed? Pilot was with totally different people, it was called the Wonderful World of Wilbur Pope, wow. The original 1954 Sherlock Holms had pilot but it was made year beefore with different crew. I really hate when they cant include pilot towards the total number of show, especially if it was different than first episode.

I think f article needs to mention why original intro song was removed in secoond season?!
If you have questions on some old radio/shows, I am available. If you ever find out on f troop original pilot, let me know!
Sprechst du deutsch sehr gut? From deutschland? —Preceding unsigned comment added by KosovoLegacy (talkcontribs) 08:53, 27 December 2008 (UTC)