User talk:Fram/Archive 41

Archive 35

←

Archive 39

Archive 40

Archive 41

Archive 42

Viera High School incident

I updated the article since you moved it to draft. Can you help me move them back to where they belong? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Madutter (talk • contribs) 19:02, 23 August 2023 (UTC)

Bryan Whyte (motivational speaker)

I can't see the problem about this article, except that it is about person from Uganda , who might be unknown to you but I provided multiple sources about his activity, which is remarkable for people of his age. Yes, he is not a lame soccer player or pseudo celebrity. He just works for his country and for its people. I read all the articles about him and there is a page in Wikipedia about the foundation he runs. This foundation helps thousands of people. I will reinstate the page and you ay contact me anytime to discuss it. --Drjmarkov (talk) 15:15, 28 March 2023 (UTC)-

Blank and redirect

Hi Fram, please do not blank and redirect my ship articles. We both want to improve Wikipedia, but we often disagree diametrically on how to do that. Although I often do not get my preferred outcome, I think these disagreements should go through the PROD/AfD process. That way other editors that have access to different databases than I do or to library resources I don't have, have a chance to improve an article, an outcome that I believe we both want. Thank you. Acad Ronin (talk) 04:23, 5 February 2023 (UTC)

@Acad Ronin: thank you for reaching out. I'll put the ones I believe to be problematic (as stand alone articles, I have no issue with the veracity) up for AfD (not all at once obviously). Some people complained at the AfDs that no alternatives like redirection where tried first, so it's a bit "damned if you do, damned if you don't" here, but I guess people will drop that specific complaint now. Fram (talk) 08:48, 6 February 2023 (UTC)

February 2023

Hi Fram. I just wanted to get your opinion on something. I read that the band Taproot has a new website for their merchandise (http://taprootmerch.com). On their official Facebook and Twitter pages they said it was their offical store. I tried to add the link to the Wikipedia article about them Taproot (band) under "External links" but someone named "Revirvlkodlaku" kept deleting it. Would you consider that link to be acceptable to add to the article? Thanks for your time. T Yorke (talk) 05:19, 5 February 2023 (UTC)

Even with confirmation that it is the official store, I don't believe such a link to be acceptable. External links should provide real information, not a shop. Fram (talk) 08:49, 6 February 2023 (UTC)

OK thanks. T Yorke (talk) 20:20, 6 February 2023 (UTC)

ANI notice

There is currently a discussion at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you.Ponyo^{bons mots} 19:34, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

• Link: Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents#Canvassing at an AfD.-- Ponyo^{bons mots} 19:34, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Educational organizations established in 1666

A tag has been placed on Category:Educational organizations established in 1666 indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:21, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

Travel Risk Estimator for Business Travelers

I saw you put that up for speedy deletion: thanks. It comes out of a sock farm that I'm trying to document at Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Dictations. Take care, Drmies (talk) 22:15, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

Thanks, I'll try to keep an eye out for them. Fram (talk) 08:01, 15 February 2023 (UTC)

About COVID articles in China

Hello, Fram. I want to remind you of some things about the COVID situation in China. First, Wikipedia is officially blocked in China since 2019 (before the pandemic), so wikipedia users in China just can't go from one neighborhood or town to the next, collect the necessary information and send it to wiki HQ. People there could not leave their own neighborhoods sometimes, much less travel between cities. It is also hard for journalists outside of China to go there due to cross-border travel restrictions. The Chinese government has such a complete control over the media that any independent source will have incomplete information on some localities and next to nothing on a few others. I am not trying to be a "government mouthpiece", I am just filling in information gaps. Please talk to users FIxer88 and Rethliopuks, who know more about this topic than me. I would like to start working on other topics.Ziping53 (talk) 16:15, 17 February 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1603 establishments in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1603 establishments in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:59, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1806 disestablishments in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1806 disestablishments in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 02:01, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1806 in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1806 in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 02:02, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1808 establishments in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1808 establishments in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 02:02, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1600s establishments in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1600s establishments in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 22:33, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1603 in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1603 in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 22:36, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1600s in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1600s in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 22:37, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1603 establishments in the Habsburg monarchy

A tag has been placed on Category:1603 establishments in the Habsburg monarchy indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 22:38, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1603 in the Habsburg monarchy

A tag has been placed on Category:1603 in the Habsburg monarchy indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 22:39, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1600s establishments in the Habsburg monarchy

A tag has been placed on Category:1600s establishments in the Habsburg monarchy indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 22:41, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1808 in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1808 in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 22:54, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

CSD C1 notices

Hello, Fram,

Most of these speedy deletion notifications are because of a change on ONE article (Starhemberg) that had a cascading effect...such is the house of cards that is the Wikipedia's hierarchical category structure. The date or location gets changed on one article and a dozen categories are suddenly emptied. I can omit you receiving these notices if you like but I think you prefer receiving them in case a category has been changed or emptied out of process. Still, I feel sheepish filling your talk page with CSD notices so just let me know if you would like to stop being notified.

Thank you and have a good week! Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 23:00, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

@Liz: thank you! I don't mind the notices, as they sometimes allow me to refill incorrectly emptied categories. For these "current country, older years" ones, I have mostly giving up arguing with the hardliners who only want the "older years, older country" combination and can't seem to accept that both approaches have their use and are correct depending on your point of view ("what happens in current geographic location X before it was established as such?" is of interest to many more readers than "what happened in no longer existing geographic entity in year X", but the latter is what the hardliners will only accept). Fram (talk) 08:45, 28 February 2023 (UTC)

Template

Sorry about that. Didn't notice you somehow were identified as the creator of the article. Clearly it was the UPE/COI editor. Onel5969 ^{TT me} 13:23, 2 March 2023 (UTC)

Fram undoes changes without consultation

Biography must not be abused to harm charity association.

Fram does not even write a word when undoes changes.

How do i stop the abuse of Fram ?

How do i file a complaint against Fram ? Johnvandeput (talk) 14:09, 2 March 2023 (UTC)

Please see WP:NPOV, WP:RS, and for all your messages WP:CANVASS. Going around posting to supposed opponents of people to get them to support you is not allowed on Wikpedia. And see WP:BRD: you made a bold change, were reverted, and then need to discuss it on the article talk page. You have not indicated why the Times article is incorrect. If you don't want the biography to discuss the charity, then everything about the charity should go. But wanting to keep the discussion of the charity when it is positive, but trying to remove it when it is negative, won't fly. Fram (talk) 14:12, 2 March 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1950 establishments in Angola

A tag has been placed on Category:1950 establishments in Angola indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:33, 5 March 2023 (UTC)

Hello, Fram,

I removed the single article that this category contained as it didn't say anywhere in its content that it was established in 1950. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:35, 5 March 2023 (UTC)

Keele World Affairs - deletion?

Hi, You've put this page down for euthanasia, saying: No evidence found of any notability. The KWA is ""Europe's Leading Series of Lecture Meetings on International Politics and World affairs". Isn't that notable? So why not leave it for a bit and seen how the site develops? Arrivisto (talk) 13:30, 6 March 2023 (UTC)

No, the KWA claims about itself that is the "leading series". Any organisation can make such claims about themselves, that doesn't give any indication of notability. Fram (talk) 15:17, 6 March 2023 (UTC)

Please let me know where I can find the (now-deleted) text of the Keele World Affairs page. If you look up "Keele World Affairs", you will see that its founder Owen Thomas Powell was honoured as "Founder and leader, Keele World Affairs Group, Staffordshire. For services to Adult Education". I propose in due course to restore this page, giving further 3rd-party evidence of notability. Arrivisto (talk) 12:21, 1 April 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1950 in Angola

A tag has been placed on Category:1950 in Angola indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 20:54, 6 March 2023 (UTC)

Deleted page

Hello! I’m confused to why you deleted my page? About the princess.Arberian2444 (talk) 15:06, 7 March 2023 (UTC)

She isn't notable, she is a very young child who hasn't done anything, but is worth a mention in the article of her father (where she was already included). The sources and awards you provided are not independent (and even then, former royal families or noble families congratulating one another with meaningless titles isn't an indication of notability either). It's not even clear if she, as a girl, is supposed to be the future head of the family (i.e. claimant to the throne), or whether they only accept male pretendents. Fram (talk) 15:09, 7 March 2023 (UTC)

I looked on other pages and I’ve seen princes/princess who have their own page and are younger than her and aren’t notable that’s why I was a little confused.Arberian2444 (talk) 15:11, 7 March 2023 (UTC)

Apart from truly notable ones (like the English prince Archie, or the heir to the actual throne in Luxembourg), we shouldn't have separate comparable pages. Fram (talk) 15:20, 7 March 2023 (UTC)

So would one be made for her once she’s older and inherits the “throne”? Thanks again!Arberian2444 (talk) 15:32, 7 March 2023 (UTC)

If she would then get more attention, probably yes. Most such claimants have an article, as most of them get written about by newspapers and magazines. Fram (talk) 15:57, 7 March 2023 (UTC)

UEFA Youth final

Hi, I was wondering why you want to delete this page but not the other finals pages? Every season of UEFA has a finals page, Champions, Europa, Europa Conference and Youth. thanks Tomrtn (talk) 16:20, 7 March 2023 (UTC)

Perhaps the others need deletion as well, I just saw this one when checking new pages and thought it better to redirect it. Fram (talk) 16:23, 7 March 2023 (UTC)

That's a lot of pages across quite a few football tournaments not only does UEFA pages have them but CONCACAF, OFC, AFC, CAF, CONMEBOL and FIFA tournaments have finals page also. Tomrtn (talk) 16:31, 7 March 2023 (UTC)

All youth tournaments? Or do you mean senior tournaments? Fram (talk) 16:35, 7 March 2023 (UTC)

all tournaments, this is a major tournament put on my UEFA.Tomrtn (talk) 16:36, 7 March 2023 (UTC)

All what? I don't see a page for e.g. a comparable Concacaf youth tournament final. Fram (talk) 16:37, 7 March 2023 (UTC)

Please don't change your comment after someone has replied to it. And no, this tournament is way, waaayyy less major than the senior UEFA tournaments. Fram (talk) 16:40, 7 March 2023 (UTC)

Mckenna Grace

Can you rev and protect the Mckenna Grace article? That new photo is a professional, studio photograph and thus DEFINITELY a copyright violation. AUSPOLLIE (talk) 20:39, 8 March 2023 (UTC)

The proper venue to request protection is WP:RFPP, and Fram is not an administrator.--Bbb23 (talk) 20:53, 8 March 2023 (UTC)

Church of Saint Athanasius (Metaxades, Evros)

Hi,

Thanks for spotting the copyright issues with Church of Saint Athanasius (Metaxades, Evros). I didn't delete the article because I could only determine that the architecture section was a problem and opted to remove the section and apply revdel instead. I did see in the source site that you gave that the page is Part B. I tried the link to Part A on that page but I get a page not found. I am not sure if that Part A may be relevant. If the remaining part of the article is still problematic with respect to copyright, please let me know what I missed and I will take care of it. Cheers. -- Whpq (talk) 19:48, 9 March 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1750s in the Austrian Netherlands

A tag has been placed on Category:1750s in the Austrian Netherlands indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:17, 10 March 2023 (UTC)

Nomination of VKG Royal Controller for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article VKG Royal Controller is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/VKG Royal Controller until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article until the discussion has finished.

John B123 (talk) 22:11, 11 March 2023 (UTC)

User:Dweisz94 has been reported at ANI

There is currently a discussion at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you.

This user has now been reported to ANI due to their persistent disruptive behaviour. I just thought I'd notify you of the discussion as you were involved in them at least once in the past, with them directing a personal attack toward you: Special:Diff/1143238219

AP 499D25 (talk) 01:41, 15 March 2023 (UTC)

Maria Krasna

Well spotted. I started on it in my sandbox a few weeks ago and couldn't find enough on her so left it. Just writing a monastery article I cleared it out of my sandbox and did a test to see if anybody would notice! ♦ Dr. Blofeld 14:16, 15 March 2023 (UTC)

Thanks. It could well be that there are sources in older newspapers, but for now she was the epitome of passing mentions :-) Fram (talk) 14:20, 15 March 2023 (UTC)

In Google Books there was a picture of her in a play in 1952, and she was supposed to have had a more notable stage career than film and TV but really couldn't find anything about her at all. Oh well, no big loss!♦ Dr. Blofeld 14:40, 15 March 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Educational organizations established in the 1280s

A tag has been placed on Category:Educational organizations established in the 1280s indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 03:44, 16 March 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Organizations established in 1289

A tag has been placed on Category:Organizations established in 1289 indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 05:23, 16 March 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Organizations established in 1481

A tag has been placed on Category:Organizations established in 1481 indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 05:24, 16 March 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Organizations established in 1482

A tag has been placed on Category:Organizations established in 1482 indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 05:24, 16 March 2023 (UTC)

Ethylene dimethacrylate

Please can you delete this draft?. My research says it is the same as an existing article. GRALISTAIR (talk) 14:41, 16 March 2023 (UTC)

You can tag it with {{Db-g7}}, indicating that you as the sole author wants to delete it. Fram (talk) 14:45, 16 March 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1270s in education

A tag has been placed on Category:1270s in education indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 20:29, 17 March 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1280s in education

A tag has been placed on Category:1280s in education indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 21:41, 17 March 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Libraries established in the 1480s

A tag has been placed on Category:Libraries established in the 1480s indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 22:05, 17 March 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Educational organizations established in the 1480s

A tag has been placed on Category:Educational organizations established in the 1480s indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 22:09, 17 March 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1810 in the Southern Netherlands

A tag has been placed on Category:1810 in the Southern Netherlands indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 22:42, 24 March 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1790s in the Southern Netherlands

A tag has been placed on Category:1790s in the Southern Netherlands indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 22:54, 24 March 2023 (UTC)

Viola Schitter page moved to draft.

Hi Fram, You recently moved Viola Schitter page from mainspace to draft for notability she's in forbes 30 under 30 and had many media coverage of her she's an austrian entrepreneur. Why you moved her page? Notsofurious (talk) 06:01, 25 March 2023 (UTC)

AfD of Challenger Tournaments

Can you tell me a bit more about the out come of this AfD? Why didn't you proceed with the merges? I believe it was seen as a to much a task, but maybe you have another explanation. Paradise Chronicle (talk) 20:07, 25 March 2023 (UTC)

Yes, too much work, too little time. There are hundreds of these... Fram (talk) 07:33, 27 March 2023 (UTC)

Redirecting pages

If you believe a page is about a non-notable subject, whether that is a school or anything else, simply turning it into a redirect is not the correct way to go about removing it from Wikipedia. The best thing is to propose an Afd and notify the creator and others. The fact that you or another editor behaved that way some time ago does not establish that the page is not notable. Moonraker (talk) 13:39, 30 March 2023 (UTC)

Why waste everyone's time? Why do you believe this school would survive such an AfD ("survive" as in not simply end up as a redirect again)? Redirecting articles on non-notable subjects to pages where they are mentioned is, contrary to what you claim, the perfect way of keepîng it useful for readers (as they get redirected to an article on a notable subject which also gives info on their search term) while at the same time adhering to the minimum standards of enwiki. Fram (talk) 13:43, 30 March 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion declined: Roxanne Clements

Hello Fram, and thanks for patrolling new pages! I am just letting you know that I declined the speedy deletion of Roxanne Clements, a page you tagged for speedy deletion, because of the following concern: The article makes a credible assertion of importance or significance, sufficient to pass A7. You may wish to review the Criteria for Speedy Deletion before tagging further pages. Thank you. Ivanvector (^Talk/_Edits) 14:59, 30 March 2023 (UTC)

No idea what that assertion was supposed to be (considering that the article linked to the SA Herald, but actually quoted another, local "Herald" newspaper), but I see you deleted it as G11, which has the same end result of course. Fram (talk) 15:07, 30 March 2023 (UTC)

Alfred Saxons football

Fram, I think you deleted the Alfred Saxons football article. I created this as a redirect back in 2010 and was involved the other day in cleaning up the name of a new article for the subject, initially titled Alfred University Football. I never got a chance to do a close inspection or expansion of article. It looked largely accurate, but low quality with poor citation style. At any rate, "Alfred Saxons football" is a useful and needed redirect and "Alfred University Football" is a fairly useless phrase with miscapitalization. Can we reswap the names so that "Alfred Saxons football" is the redirect and "Alfred University Football" is deleted? A quality article for "Alfred Saxons football" could also be created. Thanks, Jweiss11 (talk) 21:49, 30 March 2023 (UTC)

@Catfish Jim and the soapdish:, ah, I now see you deleted the article after Fram draftified it. Jweiss11 (talk) 21:51, 30 March 2023 (UTC)

Yes, it was one of a number of articles created by the starting editor using AI. They've all been deleted following discussion at WP:ANI Catfish Jim and the soapdish 05:17, 31 March 2023 (UTC)

Sledgehammers cracking nuts

If you consider that an edit has "weasel words", then please just edit them; don't throw the baby out with the bathwater! Arrivisto (talk) 13:32, 3 April 2023 (UTC)

Weasel words and WP:POV issues and sources not supporting these... There isn't much baby left, if there ever was any there. Fram (talk) 13:34, 3 April 2023 (UTC)

Your editing skirmishes seem to be in bad faith. Why have you deleted all reference to Prof. Gary Slapper, whose commentary on the law governing the disaster was generally considered to be crucial? The judge's direction to acquit is regarded in legal circles as one of the lowest-ever points of interference by a British Government into the operation of the criminal justice systems. Arrivisto (talk) 14:47, 3 April 2023 (UTC)

Again, you are making strong claims without actually providing the sources to back it up. "Regarded in legal circles", as evidenced by...? Fram (talk) 15:17, 3 April 2023 (UTC)

...and you are faling to recognise the question, let alone respond to it. Since when does one need to give citations on a talk page? Since when does one editor feel entitled, as you clearly do, to delete another editor's contribution on a talk page? No so much a sledgehammer as a wrecking ball. Poor show! Arrivisto (talk) 09:06, 4 April 2023 (UTC)

Your editing is clearly starting from a strong and unsupported POV. Making criminal accusations without sources is not more allowed on a talk page than in an article. Fram (talk) 09:40, 4 April 2023 (UTC)

"Problematic editor"

I saw (and !voted on) the WP:MFDs you started today. Do you think Masonthetrex127 and User:Darkmoons127 are the same person? They have similar usernames and similar edits. Joyous! Noise! 18:10, 4 April 2023 (UTC)

Certainly, and User:Dranorter127 as well. But they seem to have been used consecutively, so these changes of username are not the real problem (though not really a good look). It's just the large percentage of their edits and creations which are completely useless or baffling which makes them a problem. Fram (talk) 07:31, 5 April 2023 (UTC)

Boukari Laouali chaibou

Hello, first of all, I thank you very much for the arguments you have put forward, it shows your benevolence and your open-mindedness.

Then, you must know that this literary prize of Niger does not have a website, and therefore it cannot publish regularly the winners. You should also know that in Niger, the internet is not developed like in your country, this is a huge problem to the development of the country, there are only a few media that use websites to publish news, they are usually government news sites. Then, the prize we are talking about was not created by the government, but by people like you and me who try to reward writers whose works have been successful. One wonders if these articles are promotional, if it is 4 or 5 articles, one can assume that. But it is several articles, which are in line with the dates of release of the books. The first source, "afrik.com" is a very large media, recognized everywhere, and which moreover has an article on French Wikipedia. It can not demean itself to publish articles for money, I consider that the same for all other articles. Please read my message carefully and understand it.

Traduit avec DeepL (https://www.deepl.com/app/?utm_source=ios&utm_medium=app&utm_campaign=share-translation Wikipedien28 (talk) 19:44, 17 April 2023 (UTC)

Hi, I'm sorry but I'm not convinced. The largest literary prize, but it hasn't left any trace at all in previous years, and now it suddenly does. A literary prize for a work vulgarizing law? Published in France, with what is basically a publish-on-demand service (despite the claims in some of your sources that it is an important publisher?) A person who has more "news" sources than non-news sources, as if no one can actually be bothered to talk about him outside these interviews (even though he has made a huge impact, written two bestsellers, ...)? It all doesn't add up, and the relatoive absence of Niger on the Internet is to me noy sufficient to explain this. An article like this is so over the top that it is hard to take it seriously. I note that Spanish Wikipedia has already taken down the article there[1]. His bestseller has zero reviews on Amazon, and doesn't seem to appear in any bestselling lists. This is, by the looks of it, just a student who is good at self-promotion. Fram (talk) 08:57, 18 April 2023 (UTC)

Boukari Laouali Chaibou

Hello, how are you? I have just deleted the prize won since it is confusing and this is what mainly causes a problem since you feel that the source and price are not reliable. What do you think? Wikipedien28 (talk) 15:16, 18 April 2023 (UTC)

No, it was just the most obvious issue and indicates the quality of the sources, which seem to be written by or at the behest of the subject and not by real journalists (see e.g. also the claims about the publisher being important or famous ("eminente", "celèbre"), about the book being a bestseller, and so on). Fram (talk) 15:56, 18 April 2023 (UTC)

Speedy Deletion nomination of The Houlihans of Garrycastle.

"Before nominating a page for speedy deletion, consider whether it could be improved, reduced to a stub, merged or redirected elsewhere, reverted to a better previous revision, or handled in some other way" You can handle this another way, and at least speak on the talk page before doing this. It is not a "blatant hoax". FranzSebastianvH (talk) 15:34, 20 April 2023 (UTC)

As I can't find any references for the Houlihans of Garrycastle, it makes no sense to stubify, redirect, ... it. So no, there is no better way to deal with this. Fram (talk) 15:39, 20 April 2023 (UTC)

https://www.libraryireland.com/Pedigrees1/Meath.php FranzSebastianvH (talk) 15:55, 20 April 2023 (UTC)

If you look on the article talk page, where you should've been originally - talking to me about your issues with the article, I am still editing it and I have new references that fix your issue. Kindly remove this nomination. FranzSebastianvH (talk) 16:02, 20 April 2023 (UTC)

That source mentions Garrycastle twice, once with O'Lochain / O'Loughan (as "Chief of Gailenga", not as lord or chief of Garrycastle), and once with MacCochlain, Lord of Dealbhna-Eathra. So no, this doesn't help. Fram (talk) 16:51, 20 April 2023 (UTC)

The Delbhna bEthra have once formed a single kingdom with the Delbhna Nuadat until subjugated by the Uí Maine. Their chiefs took the surname Mac Cochláin, and their territory was what is now Garrycastle in County Offaly. Meaning they are the same thing.

The O'Lochan family divided in several branches. The one in question were at that point under the control of the Ó hUallacháin family.

https://www.libraryireland.com/names/irishclans/dealbhna.php

https://sites.rootsweb.com/~irlkik/ihm/suineill.htm#delbna FranzSebastianvH (talk) 17:05, 20 April 2023 (UTC)

https://electricscotland.com/webclans/cairney/80.htm FranzSebastianvH (talk) 17:08, 20 April 2023 (UTC)

It looks as if you are trying to do a lot of original research, connecting breadcrumbs which don't really match the conclusion you would like to draw. For example, in that last source, Electric Scotland, the rulers of Garrycastle were the McCoghlans. Nowhere on that page are the Houlihans mentioned, as far as I can see, and certainly not as lords of Garrycastle. But you present it here as evidence, just like all the sources before this. As I have had quite enough of checking all these sources just to come up empty-handed, I'll give you one final chance; present me a WP:RS calling the Houlihans the Lords (or equivalent) of Garrycastle. If you can't, then you have created at worst a hoax and at best a piece of unsupported WP:OR, and neither has a place on enwiki. Fram (talk) 18:56, 20 April 2023 (UTC)

New Page Patrol – May 2023 Backlog Drive

New Page Patrol | May 2023 Backlog Drive
On 1 May, a one-month backlog drive for New Page Patrol will begin. Barnstars will be awarded based on the number of redirects patrolled and for maintaining a streak throughout the drive. Article patrolling is not part of the drive. Sign up here! There is a possibility that the drive may not run if there are <20 registered participants. Participants will be notified if this is the case.
You're receiving this message because you are a new page patroller. To opt out of future mailings, please remove yourself here.

MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 17:12, 20 April 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1510s establishments in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1510s establishments in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:10, 2 May 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1530s establishments in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1530s establishments in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:11, 2 May 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1540s establishments in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1540s establishments in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:12, 2 May 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1550s establishments in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1550s establishments in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:12, 2 May 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1560s establishments in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1560s establishments in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:14, 2 May 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1570s establishments in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1570s establishments in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:14, 2 May 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1580s establishments in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1580s establishments in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:15, 2 May 2023 (UTC)

ITN recognition for Tori Bowie

{{{1}}}

What's the point? A fair question

Hi Fram,

• Short version: WP:BLP covers everything to with living people anywhere on en.wp
• Medium version: I think you raise a very valid issue here, both in terms in BLP tagging...
• Long version: could you possibly email me about this?

Pete AU aka Shirt58 (talk) 🦘 10:13, 9 May 2023 (UTC)

Thanks for the reply. Wrt the short version, yes, but that applies whether the cat is added or not of course. Wrt the long version, thanks, but I prefer to keep everything onwiki. Anyway, it was just a thought triggered by too many pointless taggings or edits (my most recent (?) deleted edit is also a revert of such a pointless tagging of a soon-to-be-deleted page). Fram (talk) 12:02, 9 May 2023 (UTC)

Ghia Microsport

Hi, thanks for the note on Ghia Microsport. I added six citations, now eight total, up from two, does that help with notability? Should I mention comparable entries for Bertone Genesis, Ferrari Pinin, etc in See Also along with Ford Indigo? It is a sin that the Ghia Focus concept doesn't have an entry, but I don't have as much info about it handy. I have a couple other magazine articles somewhere. Chadnibal (talk) 14:15, 11 May 2023 (UTC)

Thanks. The sources from Ford aren't independent, and the source for the auction (Motortrend) doesn't even mention the Microsport, and neither does Buckley (at least not by the name Microsport, and if it even can't be bothered to use the name, what good is it to establish notability?). The other sources are either not available to me, or of unclear reliability. Fram (talk) 14:26, 11 May 2023 (UTC)

I put the Microsport listing on Italian Coachbuilder site in External Links, not references, does it help establish notability? Can you help rework it as a reference if that's what is needed? That's https://www.carrozzieri-italiani.com/listing/ford-microsport/

Do all references have to be on the web to be valid? I thought book and magazine citations were acceptable. I think the Road and Track from when it came out and the book references (there are several others, mostly the same info) would be the strongest evidence.

Thanks, I've seen articles about the show that mentioned it before, can check again, they may have disappeared from the web in recent years but still be out at archive.org. I added the two you just mentioned last night, copied them from the Ford Indigo article which was at the same auction and didn't really read them in detail.

ref 4 https://www.carstyling.ru/en/car/1978_ford_microsport/

"1978 Ford Microsport (Ghia)". Car Styling (funny, I have a clipping from the 70s and a Russian site with the same name, wonder if they're related?). Retrieved 11 May 2023.

and ref 6, https://www.yumpu.com/en/document/read/17903007/still-going-strong-fords-youthful-spirited-fiesta-is- "Still going strong, Ford's youthful-spirited Fiesta is celebrating its 30th birthday". Ford News Release. Cologne, Germany. 25 August 2006. Retrieved 11 May 2023. are available on the web for you to look at.

I also posted to SAE/ISO colleagues to see if someone else can help fix the article. Chadnibal (talk) 15:24, 11 May 2023 (UTC)

No sources don't have to be on the web, but if the sources which I can check are dubious (as in, don't mention the Microsport at all), then I have no real reason to just accept the offline sources in good faith. And a Ford News Release does nothing to help establish the notability of a Ford prototype. Fram (talk) 15:35, 11 May 2023 (UTC)

I didn't include https://www.velocityjournal.com/journal/1983/ford/8249/index.html because there's no real text, but it's another listing. You didn't say anything about https://www.carrozzieri-italiani.com/listing/ford-microsport/ - what's the problem with that one?

I found https://archive.org/search?query=ghia+microsport&sin=TXT mentions Road & Track and a bunch of books. Can't find the article I remember seeing about the auction right now, need to get back to work.

Thanks much, you're really fast at replying to this stuff, amazing! Chadnibal (talk) 16:09, 11 May 2023 (UTC)

Carrozieri-italiani is a wiki, not a reliable site: "Carrozzieri-Italiani.com relies on thousend of users who help to populate the database. We do not guarantee the accuracy of the informations. Contact us if you want to contribute." Fram (talk) 16:15, 11 May 2023 (UTC)

I don't know what else to find that would make you happy at this point, sorry, maybe someone else can help establish notability. I found the Christie's listing on archive.org, but it just has the name and price, can't find the pictures that I'm sure were there at some point. We were wrong about Buckley, it wasn't one of the first two, it at least mentions "the Microsport (a truncated Fiesta-based sports coupé)." Chadnibal (talk) 17:17, 11 May 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of 2023 European Quidditch Cup Division 2

Hi Fram i saw your action on the page of 2023 European Quidditch Cup Division 2. The truth is i havent been making new pages that long, this really is about my 2nd or 3rd and well i have tried and failed with this one to create it as a draft. As the page is now it is indeed not right to be on the website but would it be okay for you if it just became a draft which i then at some point can put submit for review? Because the truth is that its just far from finished and i still need to do a lot on it like adding sources which i and a friend are still collecting. Matthijs1808 (talk) 09:43, 17 May 2023 (UTC)

It seems pointless to turn it into a draft, there are zero good sources about this, and the Division 1 article was draftified with the same issues and it was impossible to get it up to scratch either. Better to spend your time on the general Quidditch Cup article first, as that one doesn't have any independent sources either, instead of wasting time on hopeless cases. Fram (talk) 09:47, 17 May 2023 (UTC)

Im working on all, i just added the first independent article on the winner of D2. For D1 im also still busy. And the plan is to pour that same effort back into the main European Quidditch cup article as well. Matthijs1808 (talk) 09:48, 17 May 2023 (UTC)

While it is independent, I wouldn't call it reliable in any way, that's just a local news blog. Fram (talk) 09:53, 17 May 2023 (UTC)

Its a start, i have added a Dutch local source and have just also gotten a Austrian one. Matthijs1808 (talk) 09:57, 17 May 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1610s in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1610s in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:30, 18 May 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1620s in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1620s in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:31, 18 May 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1630s in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1630s in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:32, 18 May 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1640s in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1640s in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:34, 18 May 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1650s in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1650s in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:35, 18 May 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1660s in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1660s in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:36, 18 May 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1670s in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1670s in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:37, 18 May 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1680s in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1680s in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:39, 18 May 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1690s in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1690s in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:40, 18 May 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1289 in literature

A tag has been placed on Category:1289 in literature indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 16:14, 3 June 2023 (UTC)

About the Flatwoods monster revert

That was the official account for the anime division of the Yu-Gi-Oh! franchise. How is it unreliable? XBrain130 (talk) 04:10, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

The comparison to the Flatwoods monster came from a reply from a random Twitter user, not from the official account. Fram (talk) 07:30, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

That's... not what I was pointing at. I linked that tweet as a source of the character's name and appearance, which I thought was enough to make it verifiable. I wasn't even looking at the replies. XBrain130 (talk) 08:55, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

But the tweet just says "#Yu Kobayashi has been appointed as the voice actor for Mitsuko Hiramori, a new character from episode 6 of Go Rush🎊 Your comment just arrived 💨 Don't miss the 6th episode "Believe or not believe it is your problem" broadcast on 5/8 (Sun)" (Google translate). That the appearance matches Flatwoods Monster seems to be your WP:OR, not something stated by that official account. So if you based your edit on that tweet and not on the later comment, then it is not so much a WP:RS problem and more of an original research one, but it still has no place in the article. Fram (talk) 09:07, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

Even ignoring how her appearance objectively matches the Flatwoods monster's design to a T, its not "original research" either, she is explicitely referred to as a "3-meters alien" in the show, which according to the Japanese version of the article is a common alternate name for the creature in Japan. If you allow me to readd it with that additional detail, is that good enough? --XBrain130 (talk) 09:53, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

And I forgot to add, even her name is evidence, because "hiramori" is a direct translation of "flatwoods". --XBrain130 (talk) 09:55, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

Without an independent good source, it still looks like WP:UNDUE and WP:OR to me. Fram (talk) 10:20, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

If the work itself acknowledging it is not proof then what other source there can even be? --XBrain130 (talk) 10:49, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

You are misunderstanding what kind of source is needed here. You do not need a source that explicitly explains a certain reference—almost none of Wikipedia's pop-culture references would be properly sourced if that were the case; references are rarely explicitly explained by official sources and lots of them are just references in the form of visual design. The only source needed for a case like this is that the object of the reference actually exists, and the tweet provided is enough for that. Aberration (talk) 11:50, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

No, such sources are never enough. If no source outside Yu-gi-oh has remrked upon this, then it is WP:UNDUE to include it. And if one has to interpret the primary source to actually make the connection in the first place, then it is WP:OR to boot. That many of our pop culture and trivia articles don't actually follow his and are way too lax in their sourcing doesn't mean that such sources aren't needed, only that too many articles and editors don't actually follow our rules. Fram (talk) 12:07, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

Forget about WP:UNDUE, what I mean is MOS:POPCULT, which makes it very clear that such "cultural references" like the one we are discussing should only be included if they are covered in independent sources. Fram (talk) 12:11, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

The official Yu-Gi-Oh! Twitter account is an independent source for the subject of the Flatwoods monster. I've read through that policy, and it seems like a giant mess; it fails to realize how exactly popular culture is influenced. Like none of the Flatwoods' other sources seem to abide by that policy either, as they just mention that a particular character is based on the Flatwoods moonster. Aberration (talk) 13:36, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

Feel free to take this to the WP:RSN noticeboard if you don't believe me, but the official Yugioh twitter account is obviously not an independent source at all for a mention of a Yugioh character anywhere. And the policy is pretty clear, and tries to restrict the mention of "in popular culture" or "legacy" mentions to those that have received outside attention, i.e. someone reliable independent of the "tribute" needs to have given attention to this tribute. If not, then no matter how notable the tribute-giver is themselves (e.g. here Yugioh), it shouldn't be included. Fram (talk) 13:43, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

That's not how we define what an independent source is: An independent source is a source that has no vested interest in a given Wikipedia topic and therefore is commonly expected to cover the topic from a disinterested perspective.

Why would the official Yu-Gi-Oh! Twitter account have a vested interest in our Wikipedia articles about them and trivia about their characters? We wouldn't be able to use any kind of official Yu-Gi-Oh! sources if that were the case. "Vested interest" doesn't just mean they're related to the subject at hand, but they have some kind of gain from us documenting their reference to the Flatwoods monster. Aberration (talk) 14:15, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

There is so much wrong with this that I hardly know where to start. You are clearly not going to believe anything I say, so I'll take this to WP:RSN, please join the discussion there: WP:RSN#Independence of source. Fram (talk) 14:29, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

Important

Hello dear sir

How are you ?

can I ask that why you tagged my topic for Deletion .(United states of khorasan)

Please let me add more reference to that Topic .

Soon I will add more references Parwiz ahmadi (talk) 13:50, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

Please see WP:GNG and WP:RS. We need independent, reliable sources about subjects. When the best sources for the US Khorasan are things like their own website, Linkedin and Fcebook[2], then it isn't a suitable topic for a Wikipedia article. Fram (talk) 13:54, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

Hello dear Mr. Fram , You have delated an article by the name of United states of khorasan, but I Find New strong references for that article such as ( https://sangar.info/en/i/what-is-the-united-states-of-khorasan-special-interview) please let me re post that article with new references.

sincerely Parwiz ahmadi (talk) 16:48, 12 June 2023 (UTC)

Colorado lists

I will be happy to discuss the List of places in Colorado, the List of populated places in Colorado, and the List of populated places in Colorado by county with you. I split each of these lists into three sublists to improve access performance and provide for additional entries. This is rather common. The List of places in Colorado currently has 944,483 bytes, the List of populated places in Colorado has 765,437 bytes, and the List of populated places in Colorado by county has 786,703 bytes. The List of places in Colorado includes unpopulated geographic locations which the other two lists do not. These lists will expand as additional entries are added. Since this was fairly routine maintenance, I proceeded without asking concurrence. In the future, I will post similar changes for approval. Thank you,  Buaidh  talk e-mail 15:48, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

Why did you claim again, and again, and again, that you were just performing discussed moves when this wasn't even remotely true? I don't care so much about you doing maintenance (although the /02 naming and so on was exceptionally ill thought out), but in the discussion about them at ANI, you are showing a constant pattern of passive-agressive civility, making claims to and arguments from your authority and roles, and spouting your willingness to listen, help, follow consensus, and so on; but in reality you are not doing any of these things, you obfuscate, you reiterate false claims, you don't show any care about concerns people like the OP of that discussion had, and every criticism is taken as a personal attack, as vitriol, and so on. Even now, you come here, not about the things I actually asked you about, not about the false claims you made, but making new false or misleading claims (you didn't turn single lists into 3 sublists, you went from 2 sublists to 3 sublists). It doesn't look like a honest discussion is possible with you. Fram (talk) 15:55, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

I'm sorry you feel this way. Please feel free to e-mail me if you do not understand. Yours aye,  Buaidh  talk e-mail 15:58, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

I prefer to have all communication onwiki. Fram (talk) 07:03, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1780s disestablishments in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1780s disestablishments in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 20:22, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1770s disestablishments in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1770s disestablishments in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 20:24, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1770s establishments in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1770s establishments in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 20:26, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1700s establishments in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1700s establishments in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 20:27, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1710s establishments in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1710s establishments in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 20:31, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1720s establishments in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1720s establishments in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 20:31, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1730s establishments in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1730s establishments in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 20:32, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1740s establishments in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1740s establishments in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 20:33, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1801 in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1801 in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 21:35, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Category:Political websites by continent has been nominated for merging

Category:Political websites by continent has been nominated for merging. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:10, 9 June 2023 (UTC)

Important

Hello dear sir , You have delated an article by the name of United states of khorasan, but I Find New strong references for that article such as ( https://sangar.info/en/i/what-is-the-united-states-of-khorasan-special-interview) please let me re post that article with new references.

sincerely Parwiz ahmadi (talk) 12:33, 11 June 2023 (UTC)

I didn't delete the article, I just nominated it for deletion. The new source doesn't strike me as a reliable source, but others may disagree. You can always recreate the article in draft space, see WP:AFC for more information. Fram (talk) 08:00, 13 June 2023 (UTC)

Sangar News website is a very reliable source in Afghanistan and Taikistan. Parwiz ahmadi (talk) 11:23, 14 June 2023 (UTC)

Deletion Gish gallop

You've suddenly nominated for deletion 25 creations of mine today. Obviously I've struck a nerve but that isn't any excuse. Invasive Spices (talk) 14:45, 13 June 2023 (UTC)

What nerve would you have struck? I don't need an excuse for the nomination of these, but you probably need a good excuse for the creation of these, or at the very least some reassurances that you will be a lot more conservative and thoughtful when creating redirects if you don't want to end up with a restriction against creating them in the future. Fram (talk) 14:52, 13 June 2023 (UTC)

I don't need an excuse for the nomination of these You do actually. That's what RfD and Speedy deletion are. They're not your private swing set.

To say you don't speak for Wikipedia would be a grave understatement.

I can't be surprised you've made no attempt at a serious reply. Instead you've done the same again today. Either allow participation in the discussions Gish gallop or stop using RfD and SD. Invasive Spices (talk) 20:57, 14 June 2023 (UTC)

I can hardly stop anyone from participating in RfDs, so your complaint here is very unclear. Considering how many of your redirects have already been deleted (speedy or at RfD), I'm amazed that you don't see the issues many people have with the more extreme of your creations. Fram (talk) 07:40, 15 June 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of DDC Schweiz AG

I noticed you had taged one of my pages for speedy deletion, Ive been trying to bring out more company informations from Switzerland to wikipedia, Can you please give some tips on how to enhance this document and not have it deleted Sathish.thangarasa (talk) 11:39, 14 June 2023 (UTC)

I think Draft:DDC Schweiz AG has the answers to your questions. Basically, you need things liks newspapers or magazines which have given significant attention to the company, e.g. writing articles about them (not just repeating press releases or mentioning it briefly). What you had so far is mainly verification that the company exists, but not much else. Fram (talk) 12:49, 14 June 2023 (UTC)

Bilqees Khanum

I saw your speedy deletion nomination of Bilqees Khanum as a copyright infringement. In view of our recent contact, this time I checked very carefully. You are perfectly right about the copyright infringement, but it was not present in the original version of the article, but was added by an IP editor about a week later. I have reverted and revision deleted back to the pre-copyvio version. That deals with your speedy deletion nomination, but of course it still leaves AfD in progress. JBW (talk) 12:12, 16 June 2023 (UTC)

Thanks! Fram (talk) 12:15, 16 June 2023 (UTC)

New Pages Patrol newsletter June 2023

Hello Fram,

New Page Review queue April to June 2023

Backlog

Redirect drive: In response to an unusually high redirect backlog, we held a redirect backlog drive in May. The drive completed with 23851 reviews done in total, bringing the redirect backlog to 0 (momentarily). Congratulations to Hey man im josh who led with a staggering 4316 points, followed by Meena and Greyzxq with 2868 and 2546 points respectively. See this page for more details. The redirect queue is steadily rising again and is steadily approaching 4,000. Please continue to help out, even if it's only for a few or even one review a day.

Redirect autopatrol: All administrators without autopatrol have now been added to the redirect autopatrol list. If you see any users who consistently create significant amounts of good quality redirects, consider requesting redirect autopatrol for them here.

WMF work on PageTriage: The WMF Moderator Tools team, consisting of Sam, Jason and Susana, and also some patches from Jon, has been hard at work updating PageTriage. They are focusing their efforts on modernising the extension's code rather than on bug fixes or new features, though some user-facing work will be prioritised. This will help make sure that this extension is not deprecated, and is easier to work on in the future. In the next month or so, we will have an opt-in beta test where new page patrollers can help test the rewrite of Special:NewPagesFeed, to help find bugs. We will post more details at WT:NPPR when we are ready for beta testers.

Articles for Creation (AFC): All new page reviewers are now automatically approved for Articles for Creation draft reviewing (you do not need to apply at WT:AFCP like was required previously). To install the AFC helper script, visit Special:Preferences, visit the Gadgets tab, tick "Yet Another AFC Helper Script", then click "Save". To find drafts to review, visit Special:NewPagesFeed, and at the top left, tick "Articles for Creation". To review a draft, visit a submitted draft, click on the "More" menu, then click "Review (AFCH)". You can also comment on and submit drafts that are unsubmitted using the script.

You can review the AFC workflow at WP:AFCR. It is up to you if you also want to mark your AFC accepts as NPP reviewed (this is allowed but optional, depends if you would like a second set of eyes on your accept). Don't forget that draftspace is optional, so moves of drafts to mainspace (even if they are not ready) should not be reverted, except possibly if there is conflict of interest.

Pro tip: Did you know that visual artists such as painters have their own SNG? The most common part of this "creative professionals" criteria that applies to artists is WP:ARTIST 4b (solo exhibition, not group exhibition, at a major museum) or 4d (being represented within the permanent collections of two museums).

Reminders

• Newsletter feedback - please take this short poll about the newsletter.
• There is live chat with patrollers on the New Page Patrol Discord and #wikimedia-npp ^connect on IRC.
• Please add the project discussion page to your watchlist.
• To opt out of future mailings, please remove yourself here.

reviewing my article

Hello Mr. fram , As you are aware few days ago you nominate my article for seedy deletion, so I corrected it and added more reliable sources . I hope you review my article.

Draft:United states of khorasan Parwiz ahmadi (talk) 11:26, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Another reviewer has already declined it[3]. Fram (talk) 11:49, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

it was before the adding new sources, he himself resubmitted the article for reviewing. Parwiz ahmadi (talk) 12:01, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

I have no idea what you are talking about. Fram (talk) 12:09, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:African political websites

A tag has been placed on Category:African political websites indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 03:47, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of List of Student Housing at Florida State University

The article List of Student Housing at Florida State University has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

No indication of notability, we are not the housing website for the FSU. Information about notable aspects of the student housing (no need for the capitalization), e.g. registered buildings, famous architects, ... may be a good topic if enough info exists, but this list is just a directory.

While all constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, pages may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{proposed deletion/dated}} notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the page to address the issues raised. Removing {{proposed deletion/dated}} will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. Fram (talk) 07:26, 23 June 2023 (UTC)

The List of Student Housing at Florida State University is a more comprehensive and organized presentation of information in the article Florida State University student housing, which also has the Category:Lists of university and college buildings in the United States attached. Additionally, the list of Former Housing is not a directory. Perhaps these two articles should be merged?

Mgrē@sŏn (Talk) 12:48, 23 June 2023 (UTC)

A redirect to Florida State University student housing is fine by me. Fram (talk) 07:01, 26 June 2023 (UTC)

Please explain?

Hi Fram, very surprised to see an unexplained POV tag on the article Death and immortality in Middle-earth. Two obvious points, barring the already long list of WP:RS cited: a) Tolkien himself (quoted, attributed, and cited in the article) used the exact phrase, and b) multiple scholars in different disciplines (Tolkien studies, Medieval literature, Theology), cited in the article, have discussed the topic, in papers and indeed an entire book.

In addition, I personally have exactly no axe to grind - I'm neither a Christian nor a Pagan - so I'm frankly a bit mystified at the tag's sudden appearance. Do please explain, I'm sure we can quickly allay any concerns you may have. All the best, Chiswick Chap (talk) 11:05, 26 June 2023 (UTC)

THe liberal use of judgmental adjectives sprinkled throughout the article give a very non-neutral impression. The "monster" Gollem? Or the sad, weak proto-Hobbit Gollem manipulated by the immense power of the Ring and afterwards at length and terribly tortured (which he withstood for a long time) and torn between his "humanity", his guilt, his greed, and countless other emotions. A Nazgul is a monster, not Gollem. Denethor isn't really an evil character either, he became mad due to the influence of Sauron through the Palantir.

Gollum is universally described as a monster by scholars, but I'm happy to cite it for you. Chiswick Chap (talk) 12:15, 26 June 2023 (UTC)

"if he includes any illustration of Gollum , it should be noted that G. is not a monster , but a slimy little creature not larger than Bilbo ." Fram (talk) 12:26, 26 June 2023 (UTC)

Other elements also take the interpretation of one or two scholars and turn them into truth, e.g. "while in The Hobbit, the death of the dragon Smaug is the central event of the novel. " is not really a generally accepted these AFAIK. "The deaths of the afterwalkers" is perhaps not a NPOV title, but for some reason uses a comparisonone scholar made and turn it into a section title as if the characters are usually described as or commonly interpreted as "afterwalkers", even though it will probably confuse and bewilder most Tolkine readers. It again discusses the "monster" Gollum, quoting "Further, once he has rejected the land of the living and goes to dwell beneath a mountain, he knows "We are lost, lost... No name, no business, no Precious, nothing. Only empty. Only hungry; yes, we are hungry"." even though his refuge under the mountains came centuries before he lost the "Precious", mixing two completely separate events into one novel narrative to fit the thesis of this one scholar, not necessarily the actual writing or the ideas of many other scholars. Fram (talk) 12:04, 26 June 2023 (UTC)

OK, I'll tweak/emphasize the attributions, and will choose another term for the undead. Chiswick Chap (talk) 12:15, 26 June 2023 (UTC)

MIMINO Song Contests

Hello, Fram,

Thank you for tagging these articles for deletion. I suspected this series of contests was a hoax (or, at the least, a fantasy or an invention of an editor) but if I had known about Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/37th MIMINO Song Contest and they had already been discussed in an AFD, I would have deleted them myself. I was hoping that the draft creator could provide an explanation or evidence that they were real but they haven't so deletion was the right solution. Thank you. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 18:08, 26 June 2023 (UTC)

No problem! AGf and all that, giving someone a chance isn't a problem (certainly not in draft space), but as I did know the earlier attempts, for me enough was enough. It seems to be some facebook thing between some friends, but for some reason the creator is very adamant about it belonging on Wikipedia. Fram (talk) 07:36, 27 June 2023 (UTC)

ChatGPT and Wikipedia

Hi Fram, Your comment was valid on my ChatGPT and Wikipedia > https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Draft:ChatGPT_and_Wikipedia&action=history&dir=prev < article, e.g. at the end of it the quotation marks were indeed missing, so the ending did not appear to be NPOV. Taking into account your guidance and the templates of Maxeto0910 and Qcne, I have thoroughly revised the page to meet the encyclopaedic expectations of Wikipedia. Please, if you agree, move back the page from drafts to mainspace. Thank you, Szefato (talk) 01:51, 28 June 2023 (UTC)

Best to just post it for WP:AfC review and let someone uninvolved check it. Fram (talk) 07:09, 28 June 2023 (UTC)

Immigrants to New Zealand

Immigrants to New Zealand is about the country of New Zealand. The Colony of New Zealand was a distinct and different place, and should be in sperate categories.John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:08, 28 June 2023 (UTC)

Why? Everyone calls it New Zealand, the other cats are all about New Zealand, the articles talks constantly about New Zealand, there was a New Zealand Parliament created by the New Zealand Constitution Act 1852. Please don't let extreme pedantry get in the way of actual information and helpful categorization. Fram (talk) 16:10, 28 June 2023 (UTC)

"The Colony of New Zealand was a distinct and different place"? Er, what? Same place, different time. Fram (talk) 16:11, 28 June 2023 (UTC)

New pages patrol needs your help!

New pages awaiting review as of June 30th, 2023.

Hello Fram,

The New Page Patrol team is sending you this impromptu message to inform you of a steeply rising backlog of articles needing review. If you have any extra time to spare, please consider reviewing one or two articles each day to help lower the backlog. You can start reviewing by visiting Special:NewPagesFeed. Thank you very much for your help.

Reminders:

• There is live chat with patrollers on the New Page Patrol Discord.
• Please add the project discussion page to your watchlist.
• To opt out of future mailings, please remove yourself here.

Sent by Zippybonzo using MediaWiki message delivery at 06:58, 1 July 2023 (UTC)

A kitten for you!

Just to let you know I appreciate you because I know your nom was made in good faith!

Curbon7 (talk) 07:37, 3 July 2023 (UTC)

Nomination of Seroma (company) for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Seroma (company) is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Seroma (company) until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article until the discussion has finished.

Eastmain (talk • contribs) 22:44, 6 July 2023 (UTC)

So sorry about Dyer-Brody

I swear thought I was drafting in User:Jengod/Dyer-Brody. I usually start with what's called with a vomit draft and edit my way through it, with citations and NPOV and everything. I hope you'll take a look at User:Jengod#Work: Articles created 2023 and see that it's not my norm to publish vomit drafts. The treasonous carbuncle comment List of military families of the United States was out of line; I was losing my mind after having written Samuel Wilkeson Jr. (unbearably sad) and after creating Robert Johnson (Tennessee) (a different kind of tragedy). Thanks for reminding me to tap the brakes. jengod (talk) 16:52, 7 July 2023 (UTC)

Deprodding of Alexandru Sabalin

I have removed the {{proposed deletion/dated}} tag from Alexandru Sabalin, which you proposed for deletion, because its deletion has previously been contested or viewed as controversial. Proposed deletion is not for controversial deletions. For this reason, proposed deletion is disallowed on articles that have previously been de-prodded, even by the page's creator, or which have previously been listed on Wikipedia:Articles for deletion. If you still think the article should be deleted, please don't add the {{proposed deletion}} template back to the article, but feel free to list it at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion. Thanks! Andrei Anghelov (talk) 14:19, 3 August 2023 (UTC)

As far as I can tell, the page had never before been prodded or nominated for deletion, so your above message is incorrect. Fram (talk) 14:52, 3 August 2023 (UTC)

Mind glancing at another Dawoodi Bohra article?

I saw you tagged Aliasgar Kalimuddin as G4 plus the close paraphrase. Would you mind taking a glance at another article they created? It's Qasim Hakimuddin. I've also tagged it for close paraphrasing, but also have some concerns on the sourcing as they are all connected to Dawoodi Bohra. There's a feel of a walled garden around Dawoodi Bohra articles. and a few years ago there was a sock account that was pushing a lot of stuff in DB related articles. Can't decide if the account that's created those articles is a new Hmkwfrance sock or not. Comments would be appreciated - thank you! Ravensfire (talk) 15:55, 4 August 2023 (UTC)

Striking mention of sock - they've been around for quite a while with 2k+ edits. Jumped without looking. Ravensfire (talk) 15:59, 4 August 2023 (UTC)

August 2023

What was the page that I created that has been nominated for deletion and could lead to my being blocked? Jaiquiero (talk) 15:13, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

Some rapper died, and the article was presented as if the husband was the murderer, with all kinds of accusations about him. Per WP:BLPCRIME and WP:SUSPECT, such claims are only acceptable after a conviction, not simply based on what newspapers say. Fram (talk) 07:47, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

Draft:Echte Wagner Margarine

Hello Fram, I have moved page Draft:Echte Wagner to Draft:Echte Wagner Margarine: Problems are sorted out, sources added. And the revised title is Verifiable and has more visibility. Kindly spare some time to review. Regards RV (talk) 14:07, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

I still see no reliable source dating these to 1930, the best sources seem to indicate 1930s, and mid to late 1930s seems realistic. Something like "An intriguing aspect involves considering which of these visions have materialized since that time, in alignment with Erich Kästner's socially critical poems. This alignment consequently inspires the generation of personal futuristic imaginings for contemplation." is not really encyclopedic language. It would be best if you used the instructions in WP:AFC to get an independent reviewer for the article. Fram (talk) 14:10, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

Thanks RV (talk) 17:32, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

ICC Women's T20 Champions Trophy

On the official ICC article, they call this competition the Trophy not the Cup. Also I personally don't like the redirect because it has virtually nothing to do with the new tournament outside of saying it exists, I think it's very misleading. ILoveSport2006 (talk) 11:43, 10 August 2023 (UTC)

That's why I suggest merging the new article to the correct title. Fram (talk) 11:44, 10 August 2023 (UTC)

I tried, but all it did was redirect to Women's T20 Cricket. I am still new to Wikipedia so I didn't know how to change the redirect from Women's T20 Cricket to ICC Women's T20 Champions Trophy. Sorry if I sound like an idiot not knowing. ILoveSport2006 (talk) 11:49, 10 August 2023 (UTC)

I did it. I found out how to do it. ICC Women's T20 Champions Trophy ILoveSport2006 (talk) 11:59, 10 August 2023 (UTC)

Reason

Hello Fram,

Mister Paul Vaurie did reported my archive for zero reason happened around August 11, 2023 because significance issues whatever. I do apologize the inconvenience that Paul Vaurie did manipulate of my archives in case of the user don't mention about the bus routes history. I have no options or choices for now. Cool90630 (talk) 12:43, 11 August 2023 (UTC)

Are you sure that your grasp of the English language is sufficient to edit here? Perhaps another language version of Wikipedia would be better suited for you. Fram (talk) 12:58, 11 August 2023 (UTC)

Yes, I was typing in English. Cool90630 (talk) 13:54, 11 August 2023 (UTC)

I have no idea what "I do apologize the inconvenience that Paul Vaurie did manipulate of my archives in case of the user don't mention about the bus routes history." is supposed to mean. Fram (talk) 13:58, 11 August 2023 (UTC)

Let me phrase to you okay. Basically he did manipulate of my archives without warning. Eventually he doesn't allow for anybody to creating the wikipedia page of the former public transportation that are used to be back then discontinued with information that's how he did it. Cool90630 (talk) 14:34, 11 August 2023 (UTC)

Paul Vaurie did reported of OCTA, San Diego MTS, and Foothill Transit former bus routes of archive for deletion with significance reasons which is page curation as sample. Cool90630 (talk) 14:47, 11 August 2023 (UTC)

DYK?

It's not germane to the RfA, so I'll ask this here. I'm curious why you think DYK should be abolished? RoySmith (talk) 19:19, 11 August 2023 (UTC)

Even though it has seriously improved since the abysmal depths of 2012-2016 or thereabouts (when complete nonsense was posted on the main page week after week), it still is prone to produce very poor results and is the playground of some people (including some admins) who believe DYK is more important than enwiki, e.g. deliberately putting utter trivia in an article just so they can get a more clickbaity DYK hook. See e.g. my oppose at the previous RfC, and the whole situation surrounding this where the wider community had to interfere because the DYK admins saw no issue with the editor responsible for this, or a discussion like this one. Fram (talk) 07:30, 14 August 2023 (UTC)

Well, I agree with you that we should not be adding content specifically as DYK fodder. And I agree with you that articles or hooks should not refer to "today". I can't speak for what DYK was in the past, since I've only been involved with it for a year or so, but I think we've got a pretty good group of people now who are working hard to improve quality. RoySmith (talk) 15:53, 14 August 2023 (UTC)

I think part of the problem is that there's not enough pushback on nominations, and things like Template:Did you know nominations/Danny Beales where I suggested the nomination should be closed as unsuccessful just don't happen as often as they should. Ritchie333 ^{(talk) (cont)} 10:25, 16 August 2023 (UTC)

Well, from here it looks as if you wanted to post a DYK about an election candidate on the Main Page very shortly before the election, and were no longer interested afterwards. It certainly is part of the problem, but I don't see how this reflects good on you in any way. Fram (talk) 11:00, 16 August 2023 (UTC)

Category:11th-century establishments in Ukraine has been nominated for renaming

Category:11th-century establishments in Ukraine has been nominated for renaming. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. Nederlandse Leeuw (talk) 00:29, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

Guideline regarding Suchitra Mishra murder

Hi, can you please outline a guideline, about the things that shouldn't be there in article, so that it may not qualify for speedy delition from next time. Thank you.-Admantine123 (talk) 17:10, 16 August 2023 (UTC)

WP:BLP, especially WP:BLPCRIME. Basically, when someone isn't yet convicted (and certainly like here, when someone is acquitted), we shouln't write in any way as if they may be guilty anyway, even if we have sources which point that way. For non-notable suspects we don't even include their names in most cases, although here that doesn't apply. An article should never give the impression that X is guilty in the lead, then that X is guilty but just needs the process to be concluded in the body of the article, only to find out from the references that X has already been acquitted or otherwise found not guilty (no matter what we believe about their guilt). Fram (talk) 07:04, 17 August 2023 (UTC)

Thanks a lot, will work upon those areas. Actually suspect is notable politician in this case, with his own Wikipedia article.-Admantine123 (talk) 08:51, 17 August 2023 (UTC)

WP:ANI#Another Nigerian project dropping poor articles here.

I have responded. Check the admin discussion page. Ngozi osadebe (talk) 16:42, 20 August 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1800s disestablishments in Austria

A tag has been placed on Category:1800s disestablishments in Austria indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 21:00, 27 August 2023 (UTC)

Prod of Doombringer (comics)

I'm struggling to see how PROD'ing an article created by a longstanding contributor one day prior squares with PROD must only be used if no opposition to the deletion is expected. Just a reminder that that's still part of the policy, and if you don't think it should be, then feel free to start a discussion or BOLDly remove it and see what transpires. Cheers, Jclemens (talk) 23:31, 1 September 2023 (UTC)

BOZ has often created articles which have then be deleted or redirected, as they sometimes create them before checking for sufficient sourcing. They don't necessarily object. Longstanding editors are not more or less likely to object a priori, and Prod gives them a lightweight chance to object and improve without burdening the AfD page immediately. Fram (talk) 07:20, 4 September 2023 (UTC)

Oh well, I see you tried the same, about this same editor, with another admin in 2017 already, instead of perhaps being worried that after all these years, BOZ still creates subpar articles. I guess I'll just continue in the same way. Fram (talk) 08:07, 4 September 2023 (UTC)

JWB error rate

Re your followup here: this editor has been warned about his error rate when using WP:JWB multiple times over the past year. It is my opinion that his errors are primarily due to speed (and relative carelessness of focusing on speed rather than accuracy). Every time concerns are brought up to him, his speed increases rather than the other way around. His most recent JWB run hit a high of 67 edits per minute. At that pace, there's no way he's looking at the edit (which he claims to be doing, even at that rate). When confronted, he pseudo-sealions around the issue. He has been specifically reminded, and has acknowledged he knows, that users of semi-automated tools are responsible for every individual edit. You're an approved user as well, so I assume you're already aware of all of this. Do you have any thoughts, concerns, or previous similar experiences with him? At this point, since I have brought this up to him several times and so if it continues, I am going to formally request that he be removed from the checkpage. ButlerBlog (talk) 17:57, 4 September 2023 (UTC)

Good idea. I was going to report him to ANI if it happened again, as it has been going on for years indeed, and the responses are not encouraging (apparently I have to trawl through his recent edits to check if he makes the same mistakes again? What I did notice is him creating two poor redirects, but these are unrelated to these issues of course, except showing again a lack of care and thinking things through, and instead just jumping at the first thing they notice). Fram (talk) 18:18, 4 September 2023 (UTC)

The advice given to me was to take it to an admin first and if they chose not to pursue it, then take it to ANI. Any admin has the ability to remove him from the checkpage if they consider that the appropriate action. ButlerBlog (talk) 19:24, 4 September 2023 (UTC)

Yes, but I think he should be banned from any automated or semi-automated editing. Fram (talk) 19:29, 4 September 2023 (UTC)

Busy bee award

Halictus ligatus on cornflower

I wanted to make sure you are appreciated as a stalwart defender of en-wiki. Your love language is obviously high expectations and unstinting critique, delivered without fear or favor. Your tireless service defending what's been built here thus far clearly demonstrates your devotion to Wikipedia and your warm feeling for other members of the user community. Thank you for giving your love and volunteering your time. jengod (talk) 21:41, 4 September 2023 (UTC)

@Jengod: thank you, what a very nice message! Much appreciated! Fram (talk) 08:13, 5 September 2023 (UTC)

New page patrol October 2023 Backlog drive

New Page Patrol | October 2023 Backlog Drive
On 1 October, a one-month backlog drive for New Page Patrol will begin. Barnstars will be awarded based on the number of articles and redirects patrolled. Barnstars will also be granted for re-reviewing articles previously reviewed by other patrollers during the drive. Articles will earn 3x as many points compared to redirects. Interested in taking part? Sign up here.
You're receiving this message because you are a new page patroller. To opt-out of future mailings, please remove yourself here.

MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 09:13, 9 September 2023 (UTC)

Finding things to nominate again

Here you are again reminding everyone why you are https://archive.ph/78gkk one of Wikipedia's least wanted. Yes I did make the edits on September 7th that I made [4]. Yes a complaint was made about some of them. If this is the sort of thing in which you and your admin supporters wish to participate then clearly I am unable to stop you. Invasive Spices (talk) 20:04, 12 September 2023 (UTC)

Arastra

Where is Arastra? Thanks,  Buaidh  talk e-mail 15:31, 14 September 2023 (UTC)

• Here Fram (talk) 15:34, 14 September 2023 (UTC)

Thank you. Please see Silver Lake Basin: A Mining Chronicle. Mining town elevations were frequently exaggerated. Yours aye,  Buaidh  talk e-mail 18:45, 14 September 2023 (UTC)

Reforestation in Nigeria

Hello, Fram. Please help me retitle the article "Reforestation and Urbanization in Nigeria". I would prefer the articles topic to be " Reforestation in Nigeria". You moved it to draft space. I have improved it and will continue to contribute to it.. I will be grateful if you can move it to the Wikimedia main space as Reforestation in Nigeria. Ngozi osadebe (talk) 15:54, 14 September 2023 (UTC)

You can use the WP:AFC process. Fram (talk) 16:12, 14 September 2023 (UTC)

Precious anniversary

Precious

Four years!

--Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:37, 20 September 2023 (UTC)

Please don't move pages while they're tagged as in use

Just because I was editing other articles in the meantime while compiling sources for the articles I tagged as in use, doesn't mean I wasn't planning to get back around to them. I was actively editing Quatro, Scott & Powell while you moved it, so I created it anew over the deleted page. Please don't edit or move pages tagged as in use, that's the whole point of placing the template. It's not harming Wikipedia by having those articles there. They still had some content on them, and I do not want nor have to use the draftspace to compile them. Also, "no actual contents"? A chart table is not content? What? Ss112 11:36, 21 September 2023 (UTC)

Please don't post completely multiple unfinished pages in the mainspace. Either use draftspace or your sandboxes instead. "In use" is good to avoid edit conflicts, it is not a free get-out-of-jail card. And no, a chart table is not actual contents. Fram (talk) 11:53, 21 September 2023 (UTC)

A table is still content on the article, and I do not have to do that—I just said I do not want to work on them in my draftspace or userspace. I was actively working on them in the mainspace. They are not harming Wikipedia by still having some but not complete content on them and being tagged as in use. I don't see why you can't just leave them. In use implies a page is "not finished"—pages do not have to be finished to be in the mainspace. Ss112 12:01, 21 September 2023 (UTC)

Pages don't have to be finished, but a page with no text at all is useless. And that you don't want to work in draftspace or your user sandbox is really of no interest. Fram (talk) 12:21, 21 September 2023 (UTC)

I also said I don't have to. I'm an experienced editor, the articles will be "finished" with text and enough context if I tag them as in use. Ss112 12:22, 21 September 2023 (UTC)

No idea why you can't have the courtesy towards readers, NPP'ers, ... to start an article with at least something resembling text, even a simple sentence describing what it is. It's not as if some unreasonable effort is requested, just that you, as an "experienced editor", do the absolute basics. Fram (talk) 12:27, 21 September 2023 (UTC)

Fram, you're right. I forgot to do that this time. I'll do that next time. Thanks. Ss112 12:33, 21 September 2023 (UTC)

ANI

Now I gotta go grab a big bowl of popcorn.... - UtherSRG (talk) 16:33, 22 September 2023 (UTC)

I'm informing you I started a discussion on Victaullers' autopatrolled userright per some discussion at the ANI. Moneytrees🏝️(Talk) 20:46, 25 September 2023 (UTC)

Thank you. Fram (talk) 07:01, 26 September 2023 (UTC)

New pages patrol newsletter

Hello Fram,

New Page Review article queue, March to September 2023

Backlog update: At the time of this message, there are 11,300 articles and 15,600 redirects awaiting review. This is the highest backlog in a long time. Please help out by doing additional reviews!

October backlog elimination drive: A one-month backlog drive for October will start in one week! Barnstars will be awarded based on the number of articles and redirects patrolled. Articles will earn 4x as many points compared to redirects. You can sign up here.

PageTriage code upgrades: Upgrades to the PageTriage code, initiated by the NPP open letter in 2022 and actioned by the WMF Moderator Tools Team in 2023, are ongoing. More information can be found here. As part of this work, the Special:NewPagesFeed now has a new version in beta! The update leaves the NewPagesFeed appearance and function mostly identical to the old one, but updates the underlying code, making it easier to maintain and helping make sure the extension is not decommissioned due to maintenance issues in the future. You can try out the new Special:NewPagesFeed here - it will replace the current version soon.

Notability tip: Professors can meet WP:PROF #1 by having their academic papers be widely cited by their peers. When reviewing professor articles, it is a good idea to find their Google Scholar or Scopus profile and take a look at their h-index and number of citations. As a very rough rule of thumb, for most fields, articles on people with a h-index of twenty or more, a first-authored paper with more than a thousand citations, or multiple papers each with more than a hundred citations are likely to be kept at AfD.

Reviewing tip: If you would like like a second opinion on your reviews or simply want another new page reviewer by your side when patrolling, we recommend pair reviewing! This is where two reviewers use Discord voice chat and screen sharing to communicate with each other while reviewing the same article simultaneously. This is a great way to learn and transfer knowledge.

Reminders:

• You can access live chat with patrollers on the New Page Patrol Discord.
• Consider adding the project discussion page to your watchlist.
• To opt out of future mailings, please remove yourself here.

MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 16:45, 22 September 2023 (UTC)

Why was my article on "Anas Haloui" moved to Draft?

Greetings,

A couple of hours ago, I've published an article on the Moroccan boxer, Anas Haloui, which you have moved to drafts stating: "Needs complete rewrite to remove WP:POV promotional language, and the accompanying paid-for (mainly Indian) "articles" used as references." I have a couple of questions regarding that: (1) What promotional language are you referring to? I'm aware that the final paragraph includes a lot praise: "Haloui’s rapid rise to national – and international – recognition not only captivated the attention of sports media, but turned him into a source of inspiration for future generations". However, I cannot know which parts of my article sound like I'm boasting (2) Which of the sources that I've used are "accompanying paid-for (mainly Indian) "articles""? Do kindly advice so that I can replace them with other sources. I look forward to hearing back from you. Thank you for your time and patience. Best wish, Yara Elhawary ~~~~ Yara Elhawary (talk) 16:57, 25 September 2023 (UTC)

Looking at it again, I wonder if any of the sources are actually acceptable. All seem to be written by a PR bureau behind Haloui, with the same kind of phrases and praise for a promising but not that exceptional career so far (Belgian champion). There is zero reason why any Indian newspaper would be really interested in him, but these sites are well-known for posting anything if you are willing to pay. It's rather obvious that if none of the major Francophone Belgian newspapers and sites (RTBF, RL, DH-les sports, ...) have given him attention, the other sources are at least suspect. Fram (talk) 17:05, 25 September 2023 (UTC)

[5], [6], [7], [8] and [9] are all paid-for advertorials and all of them are junk. I'm pretty sure [10] is as well. The Sky News Belgium article is reliable but sources pretty much nothing. Which leaves an interview (primary source). There's nothing here. Black Kite (talk) 18:09, 25 September 2023 (UTC)

Thank you Fram and Black Kite for your kind response!

If I refrained from using the sources that Black Kite listed above, do I have a chance of publishing my article? That is, if I cited information from sources [1], [2], [3] and [4] only, does my article stand a chance of being published?

I have one last enquiry, if you don't mind Black Kite, is it possible if I continue to use information from [5]? The reason being there are details about where Haloui's passion for boxing emerged, and where he initiated his training that I feel add encyclopedic value to the article. Do kindly advise. Best wish, Yara Elhawary Yara Elhawary (talk) 12:54, 27 September 2023 (UTC) Yara Elhawary (talk) 12:53, 27 September 2023 (UTC)

No, and no. Sources like Newsatlantic and Borok Times are all clearly written by the same team behind the boxer and have nothing to do with actual journalism. Large portions of the same text appear in the NewsAtlantic and SkyNewsBelgium source as well. None of these are reliable, independent sources and none of them should be used in a potential article. Fram (talk) 14:43, 27 September 2023 (UTC)

Please leave The Axiological Asymmetry Argument For Antinatalism alone

Hello. Please leave the page be. The discussion to move an appropriate section to the new article has been had in Talk:Antinatalism. The name of the argument "the axiological asymmetry" is known in the literature, some of which is provided in the page. If you would like to discuss this more, I suggest to do it in the Talk page of the target page before making such drastic changes. Also, if you can, can you somehow restore the Talk:The Axiological Asymmetry Argument For Antinatalism to the state before its removal? Fantastiera (talk) 16:28, 27 September 2023 (UTC)

In the split discussion, no new name was suggested at all. You shouldn't simply invent one, like you did here. Feel free to confer with your antinatalism co-editors to come up with an acceptable title. Fram (talk) 16:31, 27 September 2023 (UTC)

Article is now at Benatar's asymmetry argument, which is a term actually in use to describe this. Fram (talk) 16:37, 27 September 2023 (UTC)

Literally the first two results from Google will give you the name of the argument:

• https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10677-021-10186-4 "Benatar claims that there is an axiological asymmetry between harms and benefits that explains four prevalent asymmetries"
• https://academic.oup.com/book/25806/chapter-abstract/193414324?redirectedFrom=fulltext "the chapter then argues that there is an axiological asymmetry between benefits and harms"

I would not like to guess what name would be pleasing to you, but it is an established name in the literature on the topic. Fantastiera (talk) 16:41, 27 September 2023 (UTC)

"I would not like to guess" right after I have said what name I put it at... Fram (talk) 17:06, 27 September 2023 (UTC)

PROD

Hi, and welcome back!! :)

I objected to your PROD of List of stars with Bayer designations because I believe the list serves a useful purpose.

Furthermore, I’d like to respectfully remind you that per WP:PROD, "PROD must only be used if no opposition to the deletion is expected."

Cheers, RadioactiveBoulevardier (talk) 20:39, 27 September 2023 (UTC)

To start with, you linked to the wrong article. And I don´t see why you "need" to remind me, unless you just disagree with Prods in principle. Why should I have expected opposition in this case and not in the many other Prods? Fram (talk) 20:46, 27 September 2023 (UTC)

I understood that language to mean that it’s like the minor edit button; you use it if you’re 99% sure there’s no possible reason anyone might object.

And you’re right that I linked the wrong article, lol. I was walking to the train station while I typed that. RadioactiveBoulevardier (talk) 00:09, 28 September 2023 (UTC)

Category:1506 establishments in the Habsburg Netherlands has been nominated for discussion

Category:1506 establishments in the Habsburg Netherlands has been nominated for possible deletion, merging, or renaming. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you.

This category is part of a larger nomination that you may also have authored. –Aidan721 (talk) 14:25, 28 September 2023 (UTC)

Category:1120s establishments in Germany has been nominated for merging

Category:1120s establishments in Germany has been nominated for merging. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. –Aidan721 (talk) 16:41, 28 September 2023 (UTC)

Category:1130s establishments in Germany has been nominated for merging

Category:1130s establishments in Germany has been nominated for merging. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. –Aidan721 (talk) 16:41, 28 September 2023 (UTC)

Category:1170s establishments in Germany has been nominated for merging

Category:1170s establishments in Germany has been nominated for merging. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. –Aidan721 (talk) 16:41, 28 September 2023 (UTC)

Category:1220s establishments in Germany has been nominated for merging

Category:1220s establishments in Germany has been nominated for merging. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. –Aidan721 (talk) 16:42, 28 September 2023 (UTC)

Category:1240s establishments in Germany has been nominated for merging

Category:1240s establishments in Germany has been nominated for merging. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. –Aidan721 (talk) 16:42, 28 September 2023 (UTC)

Deleting redirect in Eerdekens

Eerdekens is a surname and hence should be its own set index article. Although there is one notable person with the surname, there might be other unnotable. Hence,I think the page should not be a redirect but a set index article. Sarangem (talk) 07:03, 29 September 2023 (UTC)

That's not how it works, we don't create lists of non-notable people who happen to share the same surname. If you insist, we'll let WP:AFD decide if this should be a redirect or a set list, but in my opinion that's a total waste of time. We don't (or at the very least shouldn't) have any set indexes of surnames where only one entry actually has an article. Please see the policy Wikipedia:Criteria for speedy deletion#G14. Unnecessary disambiguation pages: "If a disambiguation page links to only one article and does not end in (disambiguation), it should be changed to a redirect, unless it is more appropriate to move the linked page to the title currently used for the disambiguation page. G14 also applies to pages that perform a disambiguation-like function (such as set index articles or lists)." Fram (talk)=

Draft:List of programmes broadcast by Star One

Hi there is "original programming" listed on that page as well not just reruns. I would request you to Move it back to mainspace per WP:DRAFTOBJECT.You can list it at AfD if you think that it's not notable. Warm Regards. Sid95Q (talk) 12:29, 29 September 2023 (UTC)

Please see Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of programs broadcast by STAR One. This list has been discussed at AfD before, it can be a redirect but not a separate list. Fram (talk) 12:34, 29 September 2023 (UTC)

IP range block

In case anyone is despairing or rejoicing about my absence, I am caught in an IP range block. I have contacted checkusers on Saturday to request to be ipblock exempt, but so far haven't received an answer. Fram (talk) 07:53, 3 October 2023 (UTC)

This user's request to have autoblock on their IP address lifted has been reviewed by an administrator, who accepted the request.

Fram (block log • active blocks • global blocks • contribs • deleted contribs • filter log • creation log • change block settings • unblock • checkuser (log))

208.127.128.0/18 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · filter log · WHOIS · RDNS · RBLs · block user · block log)

---

Block message:

This IP address has been blocked from editing Wikipedia.

• Blocking administrator: ST47 (talk • blocks)

---

Accept reason: Granted for one month. I'd be very happy to extend this IPBE grant to a year if you can give a more detailed explanation as to why you need to use a proxy. The tone of that last sentence is "inquiring" and absolutely not "passive aggressive" :). You are free to wait for the checkuser mailing list to respond or you can post your explanation here, email me, or post to WP:UTRS. I'm asking purely because I'm required by WP:IPBE to do so. In any case, you should be good to edit for the next month, so happy editing! Yamla (talk) 11:33, 6 October 2023 (UTC)

I contacted the checkusers mailing list as instructed, but no response of any kind after a week, so perhaps this will be more efficient? Fram (talk) 09:25, 6 October 2023 (UTC)

Yamla, thanks. I seem to have no impact on which IP is given to me by my ISP, recently I was at 130.41.192.0/19 which is globally locked, now I'm at the 208.127... range, with some luck I'll be at an unblocked address in a month. Restarting my computer didn't help. All very annoying. Fram (talk) 11:47, 6 October 2023 (UTC)

Yeah, gotta love it. And so many ISPs are now selling proxy services to spammers. :( --Yamla (talk) 11:50, 6 October 2023 (UTC)

Help with editing

Hi, I see that left me a message on my talkpage. I would have edited the article some more, but don't yet know how when translating other wikis. I was wondering if you could help out with editing as I am swamped with editing and would be very thankful for any help that I could get. Davidgoodheart (talk) 19:28, 6 October 2023 (UTC)

That article is in way too bad shape for me to help in a meaningful way, and I can't help with the translation either. Fram (talk) 07:15, 9 October 2023 (UTC)

Argia (caballito)

Hi, just a thanks. I had quickly made a page "Argia (caballito)" for the spanish site, and must have wrongly created on enwiki when i was in rush at end of day - thanks for move before too many bots jumped on and were all trying to change bits to english! Sjl197 (talk) 09:59, 10 October 2023 (UTC)

Science of Wood

Hello! I cannot understand the reasons for which you moved or deleted this article? The article is fairly satisfactory, but needs some editing according to my opinion, not to delete it!! Please kindly re-consider this. G-Lignum (talk) 17:52, 16 October 2023 (UTC)

It should be; Wood science (actually) G-Lignum (talk) 17:52, 16 October 2023 (UTC)

Comment

I'm not sure what I've done to you to deserve your ire. I've just engaged in a civil discussion with you because something was not clear to me. Now it is clearer to me. I'm sorry I don't have instant compliance with what you feel is proper. People have different perspectives and see things differently, that's normal humanity. Try to keep that in mind. Good day to you. 331dot (talk) 16:50, 20 October 2023 (UTC)

I thought admins had a better grasp of BLP, and at least after I had pointed to WP:SUSPECT I hoped things would be clearer. Instead you seemed to be looking at a different article, where the naming of the suspects was just a small part of the description of the case instead of the only thing on the bloody page. I thought my "sheesh" was pretty mild, but apparently we are not allowed to show any emotion here. That's, err, normal humanity. Try to keep that in mind. Fram (talk) 16:58, 20 October 2023 (UTC)

Concern regarding Draft:Marcus Rindshøj

Hello, Fram. This is a bot-delivered message letting you know that Draft:Marcus Rindshøj, a page you created, has not been edited in at least 5 months. Drafts that have not been edited for six months may be deleted, so if you wish to retain the page, please edit it again or request that it be moved to your userspace.

If the page has already been deleted, you can request it be undeleted so you can continue working on it.

Thank you for your submission to Wikipedia. FireflyBot (talk) 16:01, 22 October 2023 (UTC)

AfC notification: Draft:Mohan S. Gundeti has a new comment

I've left a comment on your Articles for Creation submission, which can be viewed at Draft:Mohan S. Gundeti. Thanks! Star Mississippi 23:42, 24 October 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1506 in the Habsburg Netherlands

A tag has been placed on Category:1506 in the Habsburg Netherlands indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:03, 27 October 2023 (UTC)

November Articles for creation backlog drive

Hello Fram:

WikiProject Articles for creation is holding a month long Backlog Drive!
The goal of this drive is to reduce the backlog of unreviewed drafts to less than 2 months outstanding reviews from the current 4+ months. Bonus points will be given for reviewing drafts that have been waiting more than 30 days. The drive is running from 1 November 2023 through 30 November 2023.

You may find Category:AfC pending submissions by age or other categories and sorting helpful.

Barnstars will be given out as awards at the end of the drive.

There is a backlog of over 1800 pages, so start reviewing drafts. We're looking forward to your help! MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 13:24, 31 October 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1893 disestablishments in Ireland

A tag has been placed on Category:1893 disestablishments in Ireland indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 22:05, 31 October 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1834 establishments in Wales

A tag has been placed on Category:1834 establishments in Wales indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:32, 3 November 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1500s in the Habsburg Netherlands

A tag has been placed on Category:1500s in the Habsburg Netherlands indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:33, 3 November 2023 (UTC)

This user's unblock request has been reviewed by an administrator, who accepted the request.

Fram (block log • active blocks • global blocks • contribs • deleted contribs • filter log • creation log • change block settings • unblock • checkuser (log))

---

Request reason:

ST47

Accept reason:

IPBE granted for a year. --jpgordon^{𝄢𝄆𝄐𝄇} 17:58, 6 November 2023 (UTC)

See above, section "IP range block", where I was IPBE for a month, which has now passed. I seem to be more permanently stuck on this range~, without much possibilities to influence this... Fram (talk) 11:56, 6 November 2023 (UTC)

BLP speedy deletion needed of Wikipedia:Equity lists/Sexual orientation

Can someone please speedy delete Wikipedia:Equity lists/Sexual orientation? I don't know who thought it was a good idea to post on enwiki a Wikidata-based list of (mostly) BLPs with their sexual orientation, but a) as the list is Listeria-generated, we can't remove or edit problematic entries on enwiki, and b) there are plenty of problematic entries, like

• Emil Rengle, description "Ii place pula" (he's Romanian, and this apparently is Romanian for "She likes dick", and has been the Wikidata English description since February 2022...
• Guy Friedman, sexual orientation given without a reference (here or at Wikidata)
• Lucy Hart, idem
• Magali Berdah, idem
• Margaret Wilson, idem (also in the description, Wikidata item has no references at all, and no other Wikipedias list this person
• Raúl Solís Galván, idem
• Alessandro Fullin, idem

and so on, and so on.

Others are "sourced" to unreliable webscrapers like [11] or supposedly list it somewhere here on a Facebook page

This is among the most sensitive data we can list, it should never be an auto-generated list from a badly curated other Wiki. Fram (talk) 17:51, 6 November 2023 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Mohan S. Gundeti has been accepted

Mohan S. Gundeti, which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created.

Congratulations, and thank you for helping expand the scope of Wikipedia! We hope you will continue making quality contributions.

The article has been assessed as Start-Class, which is recorded on its talk page. Most new articles start out as Stub-Class or Start-Class and then attain higher grades as they develop over time. You may like to take a look at the grading scheme to see how you can improve the article.

Since you have made at least 10 edits over more than four days, you can now create articles yourself without posting a request. However, you may continue submitting work to Articles for creation if you prefer.

If you have any questions, you are welcome to ask at the help desk. Once you have made at least 10 edits and had an account for at least four days, you will have the option to create articles yourself without posting a request to Articles for creation.

If you would like to help us improve this process, please consider .

Thanks again, and happy editing!

Tails Wx 19:44, 6 November 2023 (UTC)

Tak rajput

Why you deleted information Yashwardhan Kachhawaha (talk) 12:26, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

You seem to lack the necessary competence and language skills to edit productively at enwiki. Perhaps it would be better if you edited a Wikipedia version in another language? Fram (talk) 12:27, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

i will create in another language also Yashwardhan Kachhawaha (talk) 12:37, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

Tak rajputs moved to draftspace

Thanks for your contributions to Tak rajputs. Unfortunately, I do not think it is ready for publishing at this time because it needs more sources to establish notability and it has too many problems of language or grammar. I have converted your article to a draft which you can improve, undisturbed for a while.

Please see more information at Help:Unreviewed new page. When the article is ready for publication, please click on the "Submit your draft for review!" button at the top of the page OR move the page back. UtherSRG (talk) 12:48, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

Party Minister of the NSDAP Redirect

Hey, I noticed you redirected my Article to an entirely different webpage which included no information on the Party Minister Position. The Position still held power and was extremely important within Germany, just informing you I've reverted your edit, thank you! Kecesi (talk) 12:57, 13 November 2023 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for fixing Roger Abel. I intended to add disambiguation details to Roger Abel instead of Roger Abel (sports shooter), but with nearly 20 tabs open in my browser, I got a bit confused. Have a good day! – DreamRimmer (talk) 16:34, 15 November 2023 (UTC)

History merge

Hi, I noticed that you requested a history merge at Diabesity. I'm a bit confused what policy or guideline would recommend using a history merge in that case, because there was no concordance in content and no need for attribution. I can't find anything in Wikipedia:History_merging#When_to_request_a_histmerge that would be applicable in this situation. (t · c) buidhe 17:47, 16 November 2023 (UTC)

Well, I can't find anything in policy that would justify removing a correct redirect to get creator credit for an article either, and there recently was an ANI discussion about (among other things) exactly this. You could and should simply have copied your text to the existing page and changed the redirect into an article, just like nearly all editors have to do in that situation. Fram (talk) 18:13, 16 November 2023 (UTC)

See WP:DRAFTIFY: "The aim of moving an article to draft is to allow time and space for the draft's improvement until it is ready for mainspace. It is not intended as a backdoor route to deletion."

Okay, I have now checked WP:HISTMERGE, and how does the third bullet not nearly exactly apply? "The new page was originally a redirect and was overwritten by the "new" article". Fram (talk) 18:17, 16 November 2023 (UTC)

Well, I don't follow ANI so I don't know what gets discussed there and I can't find the thread you mentioned. I did not overwrite any page as I understand the term "overwrite", so I still don't see how it would apply. If there is a consensus about this matter, I believe it should be written down more clearly so that editors know what to expect. (t · c) buidhe 19:18, 16 November 2023 (UTC)

Thomas Jefferson Towles

You have marked this page for speedy deletion in error. Please remove the notice. 𝕱𝖎𝖈𝖆𝖎𝖆 (talk) 11:22, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

Your draft article, Draft:Marcus Rindshøj

Hello, Fram. It has been over six months since you last edited the Articles for Creation submission or Draft page you started, "Marcus Rindshøj".

In accordance with our policy that Wikipedia is not for the indefinite hosting of material deemed unsuitable for the encyclopedia mainspace, the draft has been deleted. When you plan on working on it further and you wish to retrieve it, you can request its undeletion. An administrator will, in most cases, restore the submission so you can continue to work on it.

Thanks for your submission to Wikipedia, and happy editing. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 16:36, 22 November 2023 (UTC)

If something is based on a single Reuters article, is it a rumor?

I understand your problem with the Q* article but I took out the word "rumored". This seems like the wrong way to describe reporting from an extremely solid source. Maybe there's another word that's applicable? Or maybe we just wait until Friday when more reporters are at work in the U.S.? ☆ Bri (talk) 18:04, 23 November 2023 (UTC)

No, if something in a Reuters article is based on an anonymous source, then it is a rumor or alleged. I'm a bit surprised that you have an issue with that word, but not with the WP:SYNTH of linking it to an algorithm with the same name, before that link has been made by reliable sources. Fram (talk) 08:24, 24 November 2023 (UTC)

I do have a problem with the SYNTH but I'm trying to keep a light touch. My New Year's resolution is to let new articles "be free". I haven't quite gotten to the point of taking them off my watchlist immediately like someone suggested. ☆ Bri (talk) 17:18, 24 November 2023 (UTC)

Creating an article on a somewhat polemic or current event, and then taking it off your watchlist, seems rather irresponsible. Of course, volunteers, no requirements, blah blah blah, but deliberately abandoning it and making sure that there is one less experienced editor watching it doesn't sound like a good resolution. Fram (talk) 17:25, 24 November 2023 (UTC)

Well, maybe it's a good thing I'm still watching it then. The rub is, I want to be able to quickly create stubs then let other people expand them. This seems like a model of interaction that should be encouraged, but I have a friend (a notable Wikipedian) who gets a lot of grief when he does it, and sometimes mass AfDs too, but the AfDs are usually unsuccessful, so I don't know what the community really thinks about this. The problem for me is I don't want my blood pressure to be positively correlated to my Wikipedia activity. ☆ Bri (talk) 18:34, 24 November 2023 (UTC)

Isie Smuts

Hi there, Fram, and thanks for taking an interest in Isie Smuts which I hope to be able to expand significantly. Please read the sources carefully before you delete them. My reason for covering Smuts is that she is specifically mentioned in Women's International Democratic Federation on the basis of the source you have questioned and apparently deleted. She is specifically mentioned as coming from South Africa and supporting the organization. I don't want to start an edit war but I would appreciate your restoring the reference.--Ipigott (talk) 15:54, 24 November 2023 (UTC)

Another Wikipedia article is not a good source. Please indicate where in the source that I removed she is even mentioned. Fram (talk) 15:58, 24 November 2023 (UTC)

The source I removed, Tacwoo, isn't even used in the Women's International Democratic Federation article, so I am more and more bewildered by your actions and post. Perhaps you meant to use a different reference? Instead of threatening to edit war, it would perhaps be better if you checked such things first. Fram (talk) 16:01, 24 November 2023 (UTC)

I am certainly not threatening to edit war, Fram. Quite the opposite. I do everything to avoid such confrontations and was not happy about making any further changes to the article until things had been sorted out. That's why I thought I should talk to you. On closer examination, it does indeed appear I may have cut and pasted the wrong source. If so, my apologies and thanks for alerting me. The source I intended to include was de Haan, Francisca (April 2012b). "A Brief Survey of Women's Rights from 1945 to 2009". UN Chronicle. 47 (1). New York, New York: United Nations Department of Global Communications: 56–59. doi:10.18356/c3b1585a-en. ISSN 1564-3913. OCLC 8200893373. Retrieved 9 December 2015.. I'll try to sort things out and also take care of the copyvio matter you have mentioned.--Ipigott (talk) 16:38, 24 November 2023 (UTC)

Thanks, but in the article you just continue with the same poor edits. I hope this is a one-off and not a habit across all your creations. Fram (talk) 17:10, 24 November 2023 (UTC)

ArbCom 2023 Elections voter message

Hello! Voting in the 2023 Arbitration Committee elections is now open until 23:59 (UTC) on Monday, 11 December 2023. All eligible users are allowed to vote. Users with alternate accounts may only vote once.

The Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Wikipedia arbitration process. It has the authority to impose binding solutions to disputes between editors, primarily for serious conduct disputes the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the authority to impose site bans, topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail.

If you wish to participate in the 2023 election, please review the candidates and submit your choices on the voting page. If you no longer wish to receive these messages, you may add {{NoACEMM}} to your user talk page. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 00:23, 28 November 2023 (UTC)

About Eastern Min Wikipedia and Hakka Wikipedia

No offense. Hello. I think these entries are still worth adding, and I will expand them based on the Chinese Wikipedia or the original language entries. Thanks! Ansony89 (talk) 11:02, 29 November 2023 (UTC)

Unless you have reliable, independent sources about them, they shouldn't be separate articles on enwiki. Fram (talk) 11:31, 29 November 2023 (UTC)

Ahmed Hishan

Thankful for your indepth insight and integrity. Advice me on how to move on with the article to remove it. Will do so. Existence Leesaaisath 21:12, 29 November 2023 (UTC)

Move

Hello @Fram I need your help to edit this page. I mostly revert vandalism/non-constructive edits, whether that is article creations, If this page (Yves_Kimenyi) can be improved, this should be solved through regular editing, rather than deletion and with referenced information is reliable and from verified sources like The New Times (Rwanda) Thanks Pfomma (talk) 13:25, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

But the information is often not sourced or "sourced" to sources which don't confirm the information. This is a WP:BLP, we need to be careful to get it right, e.g. not call someone a "former" professional player just because he is injured now. Take the sentence "As soon as he broke down after being stepped on by the Nigerian striker Peter Agblevor, who set his shoe teeth on him, he rushed to Ruhengeri Hospital[4] but did not delay because he was sent to Kigali.[5]" Neither source 4 or 5 are about the accident, that would be source 3: that source doesn't seem to indicate that he was transferred from Ruhengeri to Kigali (which I think is what is meant to be said), he didn't "break down", he broke his foot or leg, and so on. There is just too much wrong or dubious about this page (mixed with lots of correct info) to leave it in the mainspace for now. You can always ask for help at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Football, people there are knowledgeable and interested in the topic. Fram (talk) 13:43, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

I'm still updating the article since you moved it to draft. Reason you left( Sources which don't match content attached to (e.g. current sources 4 and 5), no indication that he is a "former" player). I will notify you when article is ready to be moved. Pfomma (talk) 13:48, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

Move

@Fram I updated the article since you moved it to draft. Unverified information, I've removed from page. Pfomma (talk) 13:55, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

Those non-Latin redirects

I went ahead and slapped a level 3 warning template on their creator's talk page since it was really freaking obvious what they were doing. Steel1943 (talk) 16:36, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

Thanks. Tes, basically abuse of mainspace redirects to make an anti-gay "joke"(?) on their userpage. Fram (talk) 16:40, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

FYI, creator got indeffed. Steel1943 (talk) 23:51, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

Category:1449 in Mongolia has been nominated for splitting

Category:1449 in Mongolia has been nominated for splitting. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. Mason (talk) 03:52, 16 December 2023 (UTC)

New pages patrol January 2024 Backlog drive

New Page Patrol | January 2024 Articles Backlog Drive
On 1 January 2024, a one-month backlog drive for New Page Patrol will begin. Barnstars will be awarded based on the number of articles patrolled. Barnstars will also be granted for re-reviewing articles previously reviewed by other patrollers during the drive. Each review will earn 1 point. Interested in taking part? Sign up here.
You're receiving this message because you are a new page patroller. To opt-out of future mailings, please remove yourself here.

MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 02:10, 20 December 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1960 establishments in Turkmenistan

A tag has been placed on Category:1960 establishments in Turkmenistan indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 18:58, 23 December 2023 (UTC)

Merry Christmas and a Prosperous 2024!

Hello Fram, may you be surrounded by peace, success and happiness on this seasonal occasion. Spread the WikiLove by wishing another user a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past, a good friend, or just some random person. Sending you heartfelt and warm greetings for Christmas and New Year 2024. Happy editing, – 𝙰𝚔𝚜𝚑𝚊𝚍𝚎𝚟™ 🗿 08:46, 25 December 2023 (UTC) Spread the love by adding {{subst:Seasonal Greetings}} to other user talk pages.

– 𝙰𝚔𝚜𝚑𝚊𝚍𝚎𝚟™ 🗿 08:46, 25 December 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1440s in Mongolia

A tag has been placed on Category:1440s in Mongolia indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:25, 29 December 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Years of the 15th century in Mongolia

A tag has been placed on Category:Years of the 15th century in Mongolia indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:38, 29 December 2023 (UTC)