Wikipedia:Reference desk/Miscellaneous

Welcome to the miscellaneous section
of the Wikipedia reference desk.

skip to bottom

Select a section:

• Computing
• Entertainment
• Humanities
• Language
• Mathematics
• Science
• Miscellaneous
• Archives

Want a faster answer?

Main page: Help searching Wikipedia

   

How can I get my question answered?

• Select the section of the desk that best fits the general topic of your question (see the navigation column to the right).
• Post your question to only one section, providing a short header that gives the topic of your question.
• Type '~~~~' (that is, four tilde characters) at the end – this signs and dates your contribution so we know who wrote what and when.
• Don't post personal contact information – it will be removed. Any answers will be provided here.
• Please be as specific as possible, and include all relevant context – the usefulness of answers may depend on the context.
• Note:
  • We don't answer (and may remove) questions that require medical diagnosis or legal advice.
  • We don't answer requests for opinions, predictions or debate.
  • We don't do your homework for you, though we'll help you past the stuck point.
  • We don't conduct original research or provide a free source of ideas, but we'll help you find information you need.

Ready? Ask a new question!

How do I answer a question?

Main page: Wikipedia:Reference desk/Guidelines

• The best answers address the question directly, and back up facts with wikilinks and links to sources. Do not edit others' comments and do not give any medical or legal advice.

See also:

• Teahouse
• Help desk
• Village pump
• Help manual

August 3

Paper binding technique

I'm asking about the bound side that is not shown in this illustration

Any idea what is the paper binding technique used for binding notepads, sales invoices and post-it notes? The binding feels rubbery when separated from the stack of paper. The binding also makes individual pages easy tear off but is strong enough to hold the entire ream together. I can't find any wiki pictures showing the binding so I guess this one will have to do. --Lenticel ^(talk) 07:01, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

It appears to be just daubing on a glue called "padding compound", as explained by this how-to youtube video here. Clarityfiend (talk) 09:30, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

It is just glue. I've made pads similar to these before and it's a thick rubbery glue that is applied to one side of the stack of paper. It holds just enough of the edge to keep the papers from coming off when you don't want them too. But it's not so thin that it soaks into the fibers which would keep you from being able to cleanly pull a sheet off. The other three sides can then be trimmed to give a uniform appearance to the stack. Dismas|^(talk) 15:01, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Thanks guys. It's easier than I thought :) I assume that this padding compound is sold in bookstores and craft stores? --Lenticel ^(talk) 23:51, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

I would doubt that it would be in book stores (I've never seen it there) but craft stores should carry it. If you can't find it yourself, ask a local graphic designer, printing shop, or sign maker who may know someone locally who prints up note pads for people. There are plenty of companies online that will print up note pads for you, if that's all you need. Dismas|^(talk) 00:20, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Guinness Book Of Records

Inside the cover of the Guinness book of records it say's copyright ... eg.1955 is this the year it was published or the year it was released? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.45.238.81 (talk) 12:14, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

It means the year it was published. I'm not sure what you mean by "The year it was released"? --TammyMoet (talk) 12:18, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

In later years, it was regularly published many months before the start of the year on the cover, but that didn't apply to the first two editions. See Guinness World Records. Dbfirs 14:00, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Bruce Lee's Fighting Method: The Complete Edition

Is it possible for any person who does not have any prior experience in martial arts can benefit from "Bruce Lee's Fighting Method: The Complete Edition" book? I mean for any self defense purpose? Thank you--180.234.219.67 (talk) 13:53, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Condition of Roman roads in Britain—just before the industrial revolution.

Hello, again.

I've been doing some research concerning the roots of British industry, and I've run into some sharply conflicting information regarding 18th-Century logistics. Namely, how did Roman roads hold up in the intervening ages following the Fall of Britain, in 410?

For years on end, I simply couldn't stop hearing about how (unlike their civil law and much of the Latin language) Rome's luxurious, opulent architecture survived, nearly incorruptibly, for thirteen centuries following their departure. And, by extension, how the modern, British railroads and highways were simply laid down over the—still-serviceable—Roman streets.

Recently, though, I've heard many stories saying the opposite; to wit, by the pre-industrial age, the Roman roads north of London had all but completely disappeared, due to looting of materials, overgrowth of the forests, and total lack of maintenance. Furthermore, I've been told that places such as Liverpool, Manchester, and Leeds had to depend on elevated canals, built by Dissenters, to transport goods to London, before the advent of railways.

Clearly, both of these perspectives cannot be correct? By the 1750s, were Roman roads only functional in the London area? Is the notion that "standard gauge" (4' 8-1/2") was dictated by the width of Roman chariots an urban legend?

Please let me know at your earliest convenience. Thank You.Pine (talk) 23:59, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

I can't help with your main question, but the origin of standard gauge is comprehensively covered in that article. Rojomoke (talk) 04:37, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Did you see the article Roman roads in Britain? It has a list of them, maybe their articles have more info on the state of them during the centuries. There may be some truth in both perspectives, some roads surviving while others disappeared. Ssscienccce (talk) 07:58, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

A "Roman road" usually just means that a road follows the same path as the original Roman one (which itself may have followed an even older track). It doesn't necessarily mean that the actual Roman stones were still there. Adam Bishop (talk) 11:20, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

In the 1750s and earlier the main road from Manchester to London went through Poynton#Transport. In around 1750 it took 5 days, by 1830, after the road had been upgraded by a turnpike trust it went down to 1 day. IIRC correctly there's a book about the history of Poynton that claims that before the upgrade because the route through Poynton and further south was so frequently very muddy lots of the traffic instead went up the current A6 route through Disley then up the Goyt valley at Whaley Bridge to Buxton and on to London that way. Lots of this route follows the old roman road. You can see an old map here. So at least in this part of the world the Roman road was in better condition than a muddy main road. JMiall₰ 13:02, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

I also had a look at Roman roads in Britain and [Turnpike trusts]] and couldn't find anything definite for you. (A sort of opposite to the once-paved, famously straight Roman roads were the wandering drovers' roads, used for walking livestock to market.) You might find some harder facts within The Turnpike Road System in England: 1663-1840, which probably explains why the need for the new system arose. Very few books are about the decline of a system, in proportion to the rise of a new one. (I except civilisational moaning: Decline and Fall of the Roman and American Empires.)

I must correct you on one matter, though: not in England, nor any other country I imagine, is the canal network overhead. Aqueducts, including those built by the Romans, transport drinking water, not goods vehicles (barges), and these conduits may be disguised as natural flow anyway, e.g. the New River, built in 1613). It is true that some small portions of canals may be raised (e.g. most spectacularly the Pontcysyllte Aqueduct) but this is as much the exception as canals boring through mountains, which of course they also do from time to time. Both tunnels and aqueducts are expensive. Our best article here is the History of the British canal system. It doesn't say so, but I suspect you are correct that many of the canals were funded by Dissenters. These early industrialists were concentrated in the manufacturing towns and the coal-rich North of England, and canals were the motorways of the Industrial Revolution. Before they were built, goods had to move by packhorse or coastal vessels. My impression is that the new-built roads were primarily for the rapid conveyance of people, either on horseback or in carriages; goods went mainly by water, where that was an option. Once the railway came along in the nineteenth century, both inter-city roads and the canal network began to decline. BrainyBabe (talk) 20:45, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

So, it may very well be that the Dissenters—so as to escape persecution—had to set up their mines, homesteads, and factories far away from the Roman roads, and in the (then-remote) areas surrounding Liverpool, Manchester, and Leeds. i.e., the Roman roads still functioned far more adequately than the later, farm-to-market ones, but, to religious minorities, such would have very much seemed a double-edged sword.

At any rate, such points became mooted (along with so much else in this world) following the Industrial Revolution, and the advent of turnpikes and, later, railroads. Of course, by then, Liverpool, Manchester, and Leeds had grown from isolated settlements into major, commercial centers. Well, thanks for all the information. Now, I'm no longer lost on the Road to Canterbury! Pine (talk) 23:42, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Resolved

August 4

What's the copyright status of Microsoft's clip art?

The monthly newsletter of a voluntary organisation I'm part of typically contains some clip art, usually from Microsoft's own collection.

Somebody has asked a question I'm surprised I've never heard nor thought about before.

How legal is it to use such images in a publicly distributed newsletter? HiLo48 (talk) 05:50, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

That will depend on the licencing of the clip art package. See Clip_art#Image_Rights RudolfRed (talk) 06:15, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Sorry, but that link doesn't really help. My question is quite specifically about the clip art that Microsoft makes available with Office. Anyone? HiLo48 (talk) 06:28, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Actually it does. It tells you no one can possible answer your question since it will depend on the licencing of the particularly product you are referring to, and no one knows what that is. For someone who is always complaining about people not providing sufficient information to answer their questions, you should know particularly with the link RudolfRed has helpfully provided that 'clip art that Microsoft makes available with Office' is woefully lacking sufficient information to answer your question. There are probably at least 4 versions of Microsoft Office in common use, with several different editions in each version, and it could depend on how you acquired the product (e.g. is it volume licence or from MSDN or as an OEM product or as a student some versions of which forbid commercial use I believe) or could even vary from country to country, or due to other random things. Your best bet, as the link RudolfRed helpful provided implies, is to actually check the licence terms of the software you are referring to. Microsoft products are nothing if very willing to provide the licence terms. And when I search for Office help for 'licence' it finds a result which tells me how to find the licence terms for my version.

And if you don't believe me or the article that you should check the licence terms yourself, a quick search for me for 'microsoft clipart copyright' in either Google or Bing and probably most search engines finds [1] as the first search result which says:

“ Clip Art: Use of clip art and other media found on Office Online or provided by Microsoft product is governed by the Microsoft Office Online Service Agreement and the EULA (end user license agreement) for the product from which you obtained the media. ”

That page also links to [2] to find the licence terms for you product, but if this actually matters and considering you could be mistaken about what product you are actually using (including how it was acquired), I would strongly suggest you try to find the licence that comes with your specific product. If all else fails, while Microsoft as with many big companies can be difficult to reliably contact for end home users at times, I imagine they're more willing to do so for licence reasons even if their legal department apparently can't afford a spell checker ('offenseive') ('leagal'). (From their legal department page, you may have to do so via snail mail.)

Nil Einne (talk) 08:20, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

For Office Online, the relevant parts seems to be:

• You may copy and use the media elements in projects and documents. You may not (i) sell, license, or distribute copies of the media elements by themselves or as a product if the primary value of the product is the media elements; (ii) grant your customers rights to further license or distribute the media elements; (iii) license or distribute for commercial purposes media elements that include the representation of identifiable individuals, governments, logos, trademarks, or emblems or use these types of images in ways that could imply an endorsement or association with your product, entity or activity; or (iv) create obscene works using the media elements.
• Sample Media includes images, music, etc. customarily found in the "sample" folders within Microsoft operating systems. Sample Media may be used for personal use only. You may not sell, lease, or distribute Sample Art, or any materials you create that use Sample images, for any commercial purposes.

But like Nil Einne says, you really should check the specific agreement that came with your version. Ssscienccce (talk) 08:24, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

I honestly didn't think this would be such a difficult question. We all know that most people never read such formal agreements. We all also know that Microsoft's clip art IS used by amateur newsletter producers all over the world. (I'm not the newsletter editor here. Just following up from a question asked in discussion.) So this situation must arise quite frequently. I have never heard of a copyright case involving Microsoft's clip art. My guess is that Microsoft doesn't care. It's just happy to sell Office. HiLo48 (talk) 18:18, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

The "I don't think they care" approach is dangerous. All too often people with extensive portfolios of intellectual property will wait, in full knowledge of infringement, and then sue everyone in sight right before their rights expire in order to catch the maximum possible number of infringers in one go. With the ability to do "Search by Image" on Google and elsewhere, it's childishly easy to track down hundreds of copyright infringers very easily. SteveBaker (talk) 21:30, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

I agree with HiLo, this is not a difficult question. It seems fairly obvious to me that there are no copyright issues involved in using Microsoft's clip art. The clip art is right there in the software. By providing it, Microsoft are effectively saying "Go ahead, use it however you wish." --Viennese Waltz 08:35, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Well when you buy a Bluray or DVD or video tape, they provide you the movie, surprisingly if you try to upload the movie to the internet or do a public viewing they aren't particularly happy. And funnily enough Microsoft seems to have similar objections to uploading their software. And even before software keys, they didn't seem to like it of you bought one copy and installed it in multiple computers without paying for it. Anyway you could try going ahead and using the Microsoft content for obscene and pornographic purposes (which Microsoft seems to universally forbid) and then making a big deal of it and seeing if Microsoft agrees. Or make a Microsoft clipart compilation and sell it and tell Microsoft about it, to do the same. Nil Einne (talk) 20:03, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Your statement makes little sense. If you don't want a proper answer but just plan to use the stuff any way you wish regardless of what the licence provided to you actually says in the belief you will probably not be sued then why did you ask the question? There are of course plenty of people who for a variety of reasons can't just rely on the unlikelihood of being sued. If you want a proper answer, you will have to actually read the licence terms which most people never read. (Of course such terms can't overide anything you are guaranteed under local law, but it's unlikely many jurisdictions will allow you to do anything and everything you want with the clipart without the copyright holder allowing it.) Even if you didn't know this initially, the link by RudolfRed surely did tell you the the precise licence terms depends on the specific package involved which isn't exactly surprising (particularly considering you appeared to know software tends to have highly specific licences which most people never read). Incidently, Steve Baker's reply makes another interesting point. It isn't unknown for companies, including Microsoft, to screw up and provide content which they don't have enough rights to provide in the manner they do. If Microsoft provides you clipart which is actually copyrighted by someone else who did not licence the content to you or to Microsoft, your legal risk in such cases if the company decided to come after you would depend on the country you are in and other factors like how you used the content etc, but I think there is enough history to show you can't be sure you'll be fine, particularly if you're a big, prominent and significant target. Microsoft does provide indeminities in some cases which will protect you from such a risk, but of course the existance and nature of such indeminities will depend on your specific case and you'll have to actual read any agreement. Nil Einne (talk) 18:20, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Weird factory in Kirkenes

In Kirkenes, Norway, there is a weird factory or similar contraption on the top of a hill, near the harbour. It has two immensely large canisters both displaying the Shell logo. What is this factory? JIP | Talk 11:49, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

I'm not seeing the "immensely large canisters" on aerial views or Google street views; but if it's the industrial complex located at 69.7250°N 30.0342°E / 69.7250; 30.0342 and shown in background of the photos here and here, it's some sort of plant or shipment facility belonging to Sydvaranger Gruve, an iron-mining firm. Deor (talk) 14:08, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

A weird factory in Kirkenes.

This is the weird factory I'm talking about. JIP | Talk 18:12, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Yes, the building at the top of the hill is definitely part of the Sydvaranger complex. It would seem to be a facility for loading iron ore onto ships in the harbor (hence the conveyors leading from it). The iron ore is brought to the facility via the railroad track visible in the Google aerial view. Deor (talk) 19:10, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Longest day possible?

What's the longest amount of time that it is possible to spend in a single day of the week? Allowing for Daylight Savings Time if relevant (and the changeover days with the extra hour), and allowing any mode of transport. 81.158.82.154 (talk) 12:32, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

38 hours. Start at the Line Islands at 1000 GMT on Tuesday (0000 Wednesday local time), travel to Baker Island in 14 hours (0000 Wednesday GMT, 0000 Tuesday local time). Any plane should be capable of that journey, although I'm not sure if it can be done by boat; it has to be a minimum of 14 hours, or you'll go back to Tuesday. Then spend 24 hours on Baker Island (wear warm clothing and take a good book). See Time zone. Tevildo (talk) 13:43, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Hang on, those numbers look wrong. Recalculating. Tevildo (talk) 13:49, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

OK. Start at the Line Islands at 1000 GMT Tuesday (0000 Wednesday local time). Wait one hour, then travel to the Phoenix Islands in (say) 30 mins (1130 Tuesday GMT, 0030 Wednesday local). Travel to Fiji in (at least) one hour (1230 Tuesday GMT, 0030 Wednesday local). Spend 23.5 hours in Fiji (1159 Wednesday GMT, 2359 Wednesday local) - the last of which should be in your boat on the way back to Kiribati. Cross the International Date Line on the stroke of midnight (1200 Wednesday GMT, 0000 Wednesday local). Spend 24 hours on Baker Island, for a total of 3850 hours. Tevildo (talk) 14:20, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Nope. This approach doesn't work - you can't cross the International Date Line in literally zero time - your body has a certain size and you can't cross that distance in zero time - so at least a part of your body wouldn't experience the full amount of time in the same day...plus, I don't understand why 38 is the most (see below). To do this right, you have to fly westwards all around the earth within a little less than 48 hours. SteveBaker (talk) 14:33, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Sorry, it's because I can't do arithmetic. It should be 50, not 38 - we still should take advantage of the GMT+14 timezone. If an instantaneous crossing of the IDL is invalid, we can get 50 hours using your method of multiple Concordes - although we'll have to get to a runway from which a Concorde can take off, starting at the Line Islands. Perhaps a shorter-range supersonic carrier-launched plane could be used for the first leg. Tevildo (talk) 15:42, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Oh! Right. I'd forgotten about the +14 zone. Yeah - OK then by that trick we're up to 50 hours. Maybe not Concorde then. Well, if we can't walk there - then we'll still need a plane - to keep the distances small, we'd want to start in the Line Islands - loop tightly around the south pole and land somewhere close to 180 longitude. we have 48 hours to do it - but we'd need to be close to the pole within 12 hours to keep ahead of the earth's rotation without fancy supersonic aircraft. So we'd have a few thousand miles to cover in 12 hours - and something that can land on ice at the end. An LC-130 would do that with comparative ease. It has a range of 2300 miles - and at 320 mph - it could fly due south and with a couple of refuelling stops get us to the pole within 24 hours - giving us a leisurely 24 hours to hike in a circle outside the Amundsen-Scott South Pole Station. SteveBaker (talk) 19:22, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

I'd still like to avoid the poles (due to the lack of certainty with time zones discussed below) and end up on Baker Island, which is unambiguously at GMT-12. We need to circumnavigate in a westerly direction from the Line Islands to Baker Island in less than 22 hours - that shouldn't be too difficult. Tevildo (talk) 19:53, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Let's think about what "Wednesday" means. The start of "Wednesday" anywhere on earth is a bazillionth of a second after midnight at any point in the time-zone immediately on the western side of the International date line (IDL)...the end of Wednesday is a bazillionth of a second before midnight in the time-zone immediately on the eastern side. (A "bazillionth of a second" being here defined as an infinitely small amount of time). When you're just on the eastern side of the IDL on Wednesday just before midnight, your day changes from Wednesday to Thursday - but on the other side of the IDL, it was already Thursday and rolls into Friday. So from the point of view of someone who stays on the western side, you set out on your trip after midnight on Wednesday and arrived back just before midnight on Thursday - so if you time it just right, 48 hours will have elapsed while you're stuck in perpetual "hump day".

Now we just need a vehicle to get us around the earth faster than it's rotating...and for that we might get really fancy and use a number of reconditioned Concorde airliners pre-positioned at suitable locations (they could fly faster than the rotation of the earth)...but so long as you have some nice warm clothing - it would be much easier to just walk. So long as you're standing sufficiently close to one of the poles (within a few miles should suffice) - you'll be able to cross all 24 time zones in 48 hours on foot without much effort - leaving you plenty of time for sleeping, eating and erecting your tent to get warm.

Hence, I believe the answer is 48 hours. I wonder if anyone has ever done that? SteveBaker (talk) 14:33, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Unfortunately, while all the lines of longitude converge at the South Pole, for practical reasons the polar region operates on New Zealand time for a decent distance in all directions. So that approach is out. At the North Pole it might work, but the concept of a "time zone" is a bit fuzzier once you're in international waters. Andrew Gray (talk) 17:13, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Our article doesn't say that at all. It says that FOR CONVENIENCE the base at the south pole operates on New Zealand time - once you're outside of the base, your time zone depends entirely on your longitude. There are places such as the Mars rover mission contol at NASA that operate on Mars time - that doesn't change things once you're outside the scope of their offices. SteveBaker (talk) 19:03, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Is Mars time defined anywhere? I ask this because of my very longstanding objection to dating the Armstrong/Aldrin Moon landing as at a certain time on a certain date in July 1969, which date applies only to the Earth, a completely different celestial body. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 20:06, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

We have an article on timekeeping on Mars that describes various proposals. Gandalf61 (talk) 08:30, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Wow, thanks, Gandalf. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 12:08, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

See s:Around the World in Eighty Days/XXXVII.

—Wavelength (talk) 14:42, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

The trouble with these answers is that there is no (precise) international dateline. Our article says "The IDL on the map on this page and all other maps is an artificial construct of cartographers—the precise course of the line in international waters is arbitrary.". --ColinFine (talk) 18:39, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

I strongly disagree. That doesn't affect my answer in any way.

1. Any place that you, personally, decide is where the IDL is - allows you to spend 48 hours "in the same day".
2. "..in international waters" doesn't cover the antarctic where the line has an extremely precise definition at 180 degrees longitude.
3. The only reason that the position of the IDL is vague in international waters is that there is a solid definition of which islands and territories are in which time-zones (and therefore on which side of the line) - but the actual line itself isn't defined outside of the legal jurisdiction of those places. Since (for convenience) some places that are beyond the strict 180 longitude have the "wrong" timezone - the IDL has to wind around them - and the precise geometry of that is indeed poorly defined. But if you're on land, the definition of which day it is and what time it is will be perfectly well-defined.
4. The answer to the problem that I provide works just fine if you start in any place in the +12 time zone and end anywhere in the -12 zone...since both of those places can be on land - the issue of what happens in international waters doesn't matter.

Hence, my previous answer stands. Start somewhere just west of 180 degrees longitude, somewhere close to the south pole. Walk in a circle around the pole over a period of 48 hours and stop just east of 180 longitude and you'll have spent 48 hours in the same day. SteveBaker (talk) 18:59, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

If leap seconds aren't abolished and you wait an unknown time for the next one then you may get an extra second. PrimeHunter (talk) 14:17, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Good one! Any advance on 50 hours and one second?! Can we glean a few more nanoseconds from relativity? Get up nice and high out of the gravity well maybe? (You have to *really* like Wednesdays to want to do that!)  :-) SteveBaker (talk) 00:43, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Indirect cannibalism in Yorkshire?

How many ducks would a person need to eat in order to have entirely consumed a deceased hillwalker? Horatio Snickers (talk) 16:19, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

That premise doesn't work. You're not ingesting the victim's body, you're ingesting the duck, as whatever it has ingested (human or otherwise) has been broken down to basic molecules and then converted to molecules within the duck's tissue. For a somewhat parallel example, in the old days a farmer might plant a fishhead along with a seed or seedling, to provide fertilizer as the fish decomposes. If you eat the produce of that plant, you're not eating the fish, your eating whatever nature converted it to - namely, plant tissue. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 16:31, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

So we should be singing; "Then we shall all have eaten some of thy molecules in't duck's tissues", but it doesn't really scan ;-) Alansplodge (talk) 17:36, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Sounds a bit like The Third Policeman where a person and a bicycle ggradually exchange atoms till the bicycle is part human and the human is part bicycle. Dmcq (talk) 17:53, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

That happened in The Fly also, except it wasn't gradual. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 22:46, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

What things contribute to satisfaction with your life?

From a general psychological point of view, what factors or categories of things and your level of satisfaction in each determine if you are happy and satisfied with your life or if you are unhappy and dissatisfied with your life? Things like your relationship with your family, your occupation, your level of healthy exercise, and so on? This will help my self-improvement, so thank you. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.65.3.227 (talk) 18:07, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

As it says clearly at the top of this page "We don't answer requests for opinions, predictions or debate". AndyTheGrump (talk) 18:09, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

By "From a general psychological point of view" I meant that I don't want individualized or personal answers. I'm not asking "What specific things make YOU happy?". I meant "What do Psychologists say as a fact?". I assume that things like Family Relationship and Occupation would be categories in a psychologist's answer but I haven't been able to find such a list. I hope this clarifies the question. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.65.3.227 (talk) 19:15, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

There is a vast literature on this subject (despite the previous none-too-helpful replies). Happiness is our main article, Maslow's hierarchy of needs is one of the standard starting points, and Gross national happiness gives details on how various government agencies attempt to measure it. Tevildo (talk) 19:39, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

We don't help "This will help my self-improvement, so thank you" with your self improvement either. Consult with a professional. μηδείς (talk) 19:20, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for your help, Tevildo. Maslow's hierarchy of needs is exactly the kind of article I was looking for. You might not want to help anyone who posts a question here with a personal thing, Medeis, but the purpose of the Wikipedia Reference Desk is to answer all questions that are not prohibited, so I suggest you think about that before posting an unhelpful and or hostile response to an allowed question in the future. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.65.3.227 (talk) 20:09, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

File an ANI. μηδείς (talk) 20:40, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

The "Hierarchy of Needs" was the first thing that came to mind. As regards the OP lecturing others here, maybe he's under the impression that we get paid for this. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 22:42, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Simple answer, SEX. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.211.204.94 (talk) 23:44, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Beware of STD's, which could cut down on the satisfaction level. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 23:38, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

What is the recipe and cost to make a HOMEMADE Big-Mac™?

When I try to cut back on eating out, I start to miss the Big Mac™. Its taste is so priceless, I'd rather learn to make my own than to miss eating another one for that much longer.

(Then I suppose I'd substitute less healthy options for healthier ones: Iceberg lettuce for romaine, American Cheese for anything healthier, processed salt for sea salt, etc.)

But let's start with the original recipe.

If I made my own Big Mac™, how much would the ingredients cost altogether per burger (from your local grocery), and what is the price of a Big Mac™ at your local McDonald's®? --75.39.138.10 (talk) 20:58, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

(I can't answer your question - but I have to correct a serious misapprehension that you appear to have. Our Sea salt article says: "there is little or no health benefit to using sea salt over table salt, as both are primarily sodium chloride"...and Table salt says: "It is a misconception that sea salt has a lower sodium content than table salt, — they are both basically sodium chloride.". If anything, sea salt is less healthy because commercially produced salt has added iodine and sea salt has much less of it. To get the flavor of saltiness with reduced high blood pressure issues, What you want is potassium and magnesium salts - sometimes sold as "No Salt" or "Lo Salt".) SteveBaker (talk) 21:14, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Paging Jim Delligatti . . . to get a true taste of one you need to start with Monongahela River water and of course Heinz ketchup & pickles. If I was in your position I might just apply at McDonalds for a part-time seasonal position, nothing quite like going directly to the source and I hear every employee gets a meal of their choice on the house per shift.  :-) ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 21:37, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

The recent health craze around Sea Salt is a wonderful scam. It's the same stuff, of course, but there's always money in telling people that it's OK to do something they're not supposed to if only they do it in a more expensive way!

(There's a similar madness around honey. But at least that tastes better than ordinary sugars.) APL (talk) 11:55, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

If you think the taste is "priceless", I think you must have a serious addiction (but that is just an opinion, not medical advice). Probably the least healthy part of a Big Mac is the bread, with all its processed white flour, sugar, and god knows what else. It's the flour and sugar you're addicted to, not the meat, salad, pickles, ketchup (apart from the sugar content), or sesame seeds. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 21:42, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

The goal of fast food restaurants is the same as Tobacco or Beer companies, get them hooked. A recent Colbert Report guest author admitted that food companies spend millions/year to research & discover the "bliss point" of a food product so that a consumer literally can't stop ingesting it. ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 21:52, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Oh yeah, when the guest author revealed what food scientists working for the big manufactures told him on CR it made me think of that scene in the Matrix Reloaded where the Merovingian demonstrates causality with the woman eating cake. That would be the food induced "bliss point"/addiction the author might be describing on CR. ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 21:57, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

^{[citation needed]}, Jack. The "(processed) sugar is evil/raw sugar (or honey) is good!" crowd is almost as prevalent as the "processed, iodized salt is evil/sea salt is good!" crowd, and similarly poorly supported by data. If you dry pure sugarcane juice, you get a dark brown product that is somewhere north of 95% sucrose. Refining the sugar removes most of the 5% as molasses, and leaves behind (refined) white sugar: essentially pure sucrose. The various styles of brown, turbinado, or unrefined sugar all either interrupt the refining process a bit early to leave some of the molasses (and its color and flavor) in the product, or just add molasses to refined white sugar. (The latter option is much more common, as it allows easier production of a uniform product on an industrial scale.) The small fraction of molasses affects the flavor profile of the product, but it doesn't have any important nutritional influence.

Honey has similarly 'dirty' secrets. When produced by the bees, it starts out with most of its sweetness coming from good old sucrose, but the bees then secrete enzymes (invertases) which cleave the sucrose into glucose and fructose. Where else do you find that mixture of sucrose with enyzmatically produced fructose, and glucose? They are the same sweetness-producing ingredients in that most detested of the anti-health food demons: high fructose corn syrup. Again, honey has some additional components in small quantity that mostly affect the flavor profile, but the 'sweet stuff' is just as evil as HFCS.

Meanwhile, the original Atkins diet fad has morphed into an array of similarly faddish pronouncements by gurus peddling wheat-free or gluten-free diets, and the evils of refined flour. While a diet too rich in high-glycemic index foods (whether 'natural' or 'processed') isn't good for you – and I'm definitely not going to fight you on that – it's a bit of a step to conclude that it is the high-glycemic-index ingredients in the Big Mac which make it 'addictive'. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 15:20, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Sorry to not go on about the health of eating Big Macs. (by the way, you don't have to use the TM symbol here) The burger and fixings aren't anything all that different from a standard burger with the exception of the sauce. You can search for the recipe and come up with a plethora of people who think they've nailed it down. There are even books of so-called "top secret" recipes. You'd have to pick one that you think matches the taste and then figure out your cost for the ingredients. And as far as what a Big Mac costs at your local McD's... Well, I would think that you'd know that pretty well. After all, you've been buying them all this time. Since prices vary by location for not only ingredients but the cost of the burger as well (not all McD's charge the same for the same food), I don't see how we can be very exact in pricing this out for you. Dismas|^(talk) 23:54, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

I think you'll find that the Big Mac's distinctive taste comes from the sauce.

The sauce is very similar to Thousand Island dressing, so you might just try that and see if it does it for you. APL (talk) 11:55, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

At some risk of showing my age, in the 1970s the advertising for Big Macs consisted of an omnipresent TV/radio campaign stating simply: "Twoallbeefpattiesspecialsaucelettucecheesepicklesonionsonasesameseedbun", all run together exactly like that. It now takes up valuable brain space in everybody my age. Argh. It was viral before we had viral media. It's the sauce, which as noted above, is closely related to Thousand Island dressing, that gives it a distinctive taste, along with the thickness and consistency of the meat and the buns. Acroterion (talk) 12:10, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Yep. The keyword there being "special sauce", along with however they do the beef. Each hamburger chain seems to have a unique taste to their beef, which could be the meat itself or it could be the preparation. If you want a better taste than Thousand Island (which I find to be fairly gross), you could try a barbecue sauce. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 14:28, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

August 5

UK law

There are two separate things I'm interested in about UK law: On those 'cop shows' on TV you can see police arresting people who meet prostitutes on the street. Now I know in the UK it's not illegal to use prostitutes if they are willing and not in a brothel, so what is the crime? I know prostitutes aren't allowed to solicit in public, so in this instance they are breaking the law, but what would the client be arrested for? This is for if the client is walking, because I know there is some sort of 'curb crawling' law if driving. Side question: Is the curb crawling law just you can't drive too slowly on the road? Because there could be non-prostitute reasons why you would want to do that, although I can't think of any.

And my second question is that what is the minimum and maximum punishment of driving without a licence? I'm guessing that it must be more than driving without insurance, because driving without a licence means that you can't have insurance (usually). Really, what I'm trying to figure out is if the law says it's worse (in terms of severity of punishment) to not have a licence or to drink drive. The Wiki page on drink driving shows that it's 2 years having the licence taken away, and up to £5000 fine and 6 months in prison. But I don't know what the punishment for not having a licence to find out which is (legally) worse.

Thanks for any help you can provide 78.42.201.216 (talk) 00:54, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

As far as driving without a licence goes the minimum penalty seems to be 3-6 penalty points and a £1000 fine. This page seems to have a good amount of info on various driving offenses and their penalties in the UK. Biggs Pliff (talk) 02:29, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

And see kerb crawler. Rojomoke (talk) 03:59, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Great, thank you both! 78.42.201.216 (talk) 11:30, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

I presume you mean England and Wales but either way the aptly named Prostitution in the United Kingdom mentions the specific laws and the terminology used. For example in England and Wales, the client will likely be guilty of soliciting as well, if they try to solicit sexual services in a public place or street, including if they are in a vehicle. Nil Einne (talk) 17:04, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Beach on San Francisco (another question for my novel)

What's the most quiet beach in San Francisco. A place where you're never going to se a lot of people around? Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 15:17, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

San Francisco is in Northern California, with a cold, foggy climate that doesn't attract throngs of beachgoers. Here is the visitors' page for the City and County of San Francisco. If there's no relevant information there, you can write to them directly. -- Deborahjay (talk) 15:40, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Thanks Deborahjay,

I don't have Internet access so I cannot follow the link

I am looking for a beach to spend the day, but not swimming, but talking in the sand, playing football, etc. Does Ocean Beach works for that? Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 15:46, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

I would say Thornton State Beach, near the southern edge of the city, is the most deserted. It's under high cliffs and is officially closed to the public because of landslides, but a few people go there anyway. As Deborahjay says, none of the SF beaches tend to be very crowded, except on special occasions. But Ocean Beach will be fine for your purposes. Looie496 (talk) 15:50, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Here are three suggestions.

• From http://www.askalo.com, you can select http://sanfrancisco.askalo.com and then http://sanfrancisco.askalo.com/Other-Going-Out-Questions/510/ and then post your question there.
• You can post your question at http://www.experttravelanswers.com.
• You can post your question at voy:Wikivoyage:Tourist Office.

I am interested in knowing which of those is the most helpful.

—Wavelength (talk) 15:50, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Thank you both. And Wavelength, I cannot access those links :( Sorry.-. Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 16:04, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

On a few days almost every year, San Francisco experiences a strong easterly wind that blows the fog far offshore and brings sunshine real heat to the city (though the ocean water is still frigid). On those days, a trip to the beach can be appealing, but even then, if you walk far enough south, Thornton Beach will be quite empty. Marco polo (talk) 16:11, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Thanks!!! :) Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 16:16, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Skyscrapers in NYC (novel question)

Is it illegal to use the roof of a skyscraper in NYC to organize a romantic dinner? Do you have to pay for it or ask for some permission? Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 15:48, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Basically you're looking for a special kind of penthouse apartment, one with a terrace. They cost a fortune, so you would either need a lot of money or very good connections with very rich people. Looie496 (talk) 15:55, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

I meant roof. I don't know if that's the correct word, but I am trying to refer to the place where Peter Parker tried his webs for the first tim in Spiderman (starring Toby Macguire) and where most of the fights in movies are developed. Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 16:03, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Not every tall building in NYC has a penthouse apartment on its roof. However, almost every tall building in NYC is private property (the rest are government buildings that also restrict public access), and the roof is often off-limits even to tenants, mainly for liability reasons. So you would need special permission from the property owner, which would probably be impossible to obtain at many buildings, again for liability reasons, unless perhaps if you hired a lawyer to negotiate a (probably very expensive) contract, part of which would exempt the owner from liability for any harm that might come to you or any of your guests on the roof and would require you to obtain an insurance policy against any harm that your party might do to the building. The makers of the Superman movie certainly would have had to arrange such a contract. Another option would be to rent out a penthouse bar, of which there are a few in NYC. This, too, would be extremely expensive. I wouldn't be surprised if the cost for one evening was $500,000 or more. Marco polo (talk) 16:08, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Wao... thanks Marco polo, could you suggest one of those? (one that my character could rent-the price is not the most important thing, but not braking the laws) Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 16:13, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

I think the difficulty and cost of this is being far overestimated. I have attended two such dinners on buildings of about 40 stories. It was more of a stunt than a dinner, and the furnishings were not that nice, since they had to be weatherproof--basically quality patio furniture. I have had much nicer experiences in indoor luxury apartments on high floors but not outside. IN any case, I'd lop off a zero from the $500,000 rental, and expect the space to accommodate 100 guests. (Oops, I see that was a "pnthouse bar"--yes, far more expensive) You can google one-day manhattan penthouse rental. μηδείς (talk) 17:04, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Hi, μηδείς. This is the situation. The wealthy man in my story is trying to win the love of the girl (main character), but she (as he is a public figure, like what Tony DiNozzo did in NCIS for his back-then girlfriend Jean Benoit, somewhere in the 4th Season) refuses to go out for dinner in a luxurious restaurant in Manhattan, so he plans a special dinner -casual but romantic-, just the two of them at the roof top of a skycraper (have you seen Friends With Benefits (film)), the one where Mila takes Justin the first time he is in New York). So I wanted to know if that (what the artist wants to do) if possible. Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 17:53, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

I'm not able to find the clip at google and am not interested in watching any large part of the movie. But in concept it is very easily doable if you have the money or a friend who will lend you his pad. Funny thing is the book I recommended, El Manantial, is set in Manhattan and has three men involved in building skyscrapers vying for the love of one woman. It has plenty of scenes you would like. μηδείς (talk) 19:18, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Can you suggest any skycraper μηδείς?? Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 19:23, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

No. The problem is you want a nice penthouse in an impressive building with a good view. You are not likely to find the combination in one building. Skyscraper skyscrapers don't have penthouses. Nice residential buildings look ugly from the outside, since they are built cheap, and with a balcony on each floor. The best view is of Central Park looking south, but no impressive buildings will fit the requirements. The best would be to go with a made-up building like the Enright Building which would be on Central Park South. μηδείς (talk) 19:55, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

μηδείς, It doesn't have to be an impressive building or a penthouse... it could be even this one. The idea was making the dinner in a ugly bulding for a contrast stuff. Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 20:07, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

As a practical matter you can't really eat on a commercial skyscraper like the NY Times building, as it would be too windy. You have to be on a building intentionally built with a penthouse. μηδείς (talk) 20:15, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

I'm sure a story line could be constructed in which one pays off a building super for discreet access to a sufficiently tall roof. If you look on Google Earth you can see what rooftops are like in New York. Recent buildings tend to have pointy things or decorative elements, buildings from the 1950s and 1960s have flat tops, but all of them put their cooling towers up there, so many of them would have a hot, moist, potentially Legionella-laden breeze. Still, ten minutes looking at rooftops on Google Earth would provide a few candidates. There would probably be some ladder-climbing - both the guests and the wait staff would need to be agile. It being fiction, one could assume relatively little wind (or a sauce that holds things down). Acroterion (talk) 20:19, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

What about The Dakota Building or The San Remo building? After seeing this picture File:Snowedthedakota.JPG Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 20:26, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

The Dakota's kind of low and pointy. The four "two-tower" buildings on Central Park West are The San Remo, The Eldorado, The Beresford and The Majestic (New York City). 55 Central Park West, home of Dana Barrett and Zuul would work too. Acroterion (talk) 20:54, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

The Dakota is a rusting, dusty, faded run-down dump with no roof access. (The roof in the picture you linked to is on the opposite side from the Park and has no view of it.) Think of the building from Kubrik's The Shining with a 50 year maintenance backlog. Its' only actual benefits are name and location above the subways and near the Park. μηδείς (talk) 21:14, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

μηδείς and Acroterion. It is creepy! (about the hotel in The Shining) Doesn't Eldorado looks like San Remo?? I think I'll choose that one. Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 13:20, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

help

Is there a vehicle to simply comment on a Wikipedia post. I might be an expert on a topic and simply wish to make a pointed academic statement. Thank you — Preceding unsigned comment added by Pozzateef (talk • contribs) 17:43, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

I'm unclear on what you mean by "post". If you mean an article such as Earth or Time, then every article has a talk page (sometimes called a discussion page) which can be accessed by clicking on the word talk or discussion (depends on which Wikipedia skin you are using) at the top of the article. Examples would be Talk:Earth or Talk:Time. Comments concerning the article can be posted there. New topics should be put under their own heading to keep things organized.

If by "post" you mean a section here or on one of those talk pages, then you can just edit that particular section by clicking on the "edit" link to the right of the section header and providing your response. Dismas|^(talk) 19:29, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

But strictly, talk pages are for the purpose of discussing improvements to the relevant article, not for discussion about the subject of the article. The disctinction can get blurred, though. --ColinFine (talk) 21:19, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Wikipedia doesn't really have a place to discuss the topic of the article, only to discuss the article itself.

For example, if you think that Wikipedia has Barack Obama's birthday wrong, you could click on that article's "Discussion" or "Talk" tab, and discuss that issue. But if you think that Obama's public policy is wrong or shortsighted, there is no place on Wikipedia you could discuss that.

Same with scientific topics. If you think there's an error in the Cold Fusion article, feel free to discuss that on the talk page, but if you think that mainstream scientific consensus is wrong, Wikipedia is not the place to make that point. APL (talk) 22:29, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

The very best way to do that is not to loudly proclaim your expertise - because this is the Internet and the other editors of the article have no way to know whether you're telling use the truth or feeding them a line of BS. For that reason, you generally need to point out some kind of published (preferably peer-reviewed) paper or article that explains the point you're trying to make. If you have that - then you can take it to the Talk: page of the article and explain why you think the article need changing based on your reference. Using your expertise to 'translate' any difficult language or concepts into 'layman' form for the benefit of other editors is a good idea. SteveBaker (talk) 00:34, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Well, there is also the article feedback tool, unfortunately. Depending on the point you're looking to make, that may be an appropriate venue. As long as it's directly related to the content of the article, of course. Evanh2008 ^{(talk|contribs)} 18:57, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Camera shutter life

The display problem I earlier reported with my Olympus E-620 camera has only got worse, so I sent it to repairs. The repairs company said it will take until Friday next week and cost 300 € at the most. My question is not about the display, but about the camera itself. I have had the camera for about two years now and taken 75 thousand pictures with it. And I even bought the camera used, the previous owner had taken 9 thousand pictures with it. This makes 84 thousand. How much longer will the shutter last until I will start seeing defects in the pictures themselves? JIP | Talk 18:29, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

For their 'pro' level equipment, the big SLR manufacturers typically rate their shutters as good for a minimum of 100-150,000 actuations. They tend to get a bit cagier about their prosumer or amateur lines, but scuttlebutt usually says those shutters will be good for an absolute minimum of 50,000, and can often last significantly longer. (As you have already experienced.) If you look around online, you'll find a number of anecdotal reports from E-620 users who are still clicking away at 100,000+ shots: [3]. Then again, in this market segment, most users tend to be likely to upgrade or replace their camera body before they get to shutter counts that high, so the data may be a bit sparse. Maybe flip a coin? TenOfAllTrades(talk) 19:49, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

As noted above, most high-end consumer-grade DSLRs have 50,000 shot shutters, with pro and prosumer cameras in the 100,000 range. I would expect an outright failure of the shutter mechanism if/when it does fail, rather than image defects - the failure mode is probably a shutter stuck open, closed, or partway, or the mirror, which has more mass, might not move. Acroterion (talk) 20:25, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

I have read on the net that these are pessimistic estimates, to guarantee a minimum. I'm already well beyond the 50 thousand shot estimate, and the shutter is all OK so far. (It's just the display that has broken, it's being fixed now.) I've seen mentioned that some people have managed twice or even triple this many shots. One person even took his consumer-grade DSLR to Spitzbergen and Death Valley, and it worked fine. I'm not going to take mine to such extremes. In contrast to a failed display, a failed shutter or a failed mirror will render the camera unusable. But if the shutter or mirror fails, it can still be replaced, right? The only problem is that it's going to cost half the price of a new camera and take two-three weeks. If it happens during, or less than three weeks before, an important event, I'm kind of screwed. Is there any way of knowing that the shutter will fail soon, when it is finally on its last legs? JIP | Talk 18:28, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Most Visited Page

What's the most visited page in en.Wikipedia? Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 19:02, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Main Page. Looie496 (talk) 19:08, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

See http://stats.grok.se/en/latest/Main_Page.

—Wavelength (talk) 19:10, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

No, besides that one. It seems tricky, Main PAge comes by default :). Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 19:12, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Top visited pages from April are here. You can see more recent stats for a given page by inserting the title here. FlowerpotmaN·(t) 19:16, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Those can't be right, the most viewed page aside from main page is Mark Linn-Baker, number 33 is Aho–Corasick string matching algorithm. There are also no sexual articles until around the 70th place, seems unbelievable. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.214.48.186 (talk) 10:16, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

See also links at WP:POPULAR. Many of the top pages in stats are often obscure topics or misspelled titles. The usual theory is that a poorly configured piece of software somewhere keeps requesting the same page without human intervention. User:West.andrew.g/Popular pages is based on a recent week. The top articles on the current list which appear likely to actually be based on human interest are Facebook (always popular) and The Wolverine (film) (premiered July 24). This week the most read may be Peter Capaldi (stats) who caused controvercy at Wikipedia:In the news/Candidates#.5BClosed.5D Doctor Who. PrimeHunter (talk) 14:54, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Natural gas generator; price range with full install

Obviously no one can give me anything exact here, but I'm looking for a sort of baseline to think from. Maybe someone else has done this or is an electrician. I am looking to install a natural gas-powered generator here in New York, as we are having these storms with power outages now every year. This is for a house that has natural gas already for the stove/range. I only need enough to power a space heater and a few accessories in one room, like some lights, so 3,500 watts, according to what I've been reading, should be about sufficient. I would expect to buy on the low to middling range of units. Does anyone have an idea of what this would be expected to cost, with the unit itself, a transfer switch, whatever else is needed and full installation by an electrician? I know it's a broad question but I'm looking for some idea. I mean at this point I don't know whether I should be thinking $1,500. or $10,000.--108.27.62.131 (talk) 22:40, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

I did a google for "buy 3.5kw generator natural gas" and got a bunch of interesting options. It's pretty clear that if you want one that automatically starts up and kicks in without much hassle - then you're looking at around $1500 to $2000 - but if you're prepared to go and start the thing manually, then you can do it for under $1000. But I strongly suggest you try googling around it yourself - there are lot of options to choose from. SteveBaker (talk) 02:03, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

You will need a separate fuse box with only those circuits you want the generator to power. Rmhermen (talk) 22:24, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

August 6

Why pay bills on the 20th of the month?

When, and why, was the convention introduced that people paid their bills on the 20th of the month? Moriori (talk) 03:30, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

I've never heard of that convention. I'll guess that it's because folks got paid on the 15th of each month and paid the bills sometime after that. Can you point to an article or something that refers to this convention? RudolfRed (talk) 03:43, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

I've never heard of the convention either. Many companies will set due dates on the 1st or 15th which are also popular pay days. And if the payment is sent out on that day, the payment often arrives to the creditor within the grace period. Some will also set the pay date on the monthly anniversary of the debt being established. For instance, you buy a car on the 5th and your following payments are due on the 5th of the month from then on. But by no means have I ever heard of the 20th being a convention. Dismas|^(talk) 04:30, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

It might have been, sometime, somewhere, but companies that do billings and other such mailings seem to set their own rules. Larger companies might stagger them throughout the month so they can keep their clerks busy all the time instead of them getting buried one week and slow the other three. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 06:29, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Another bill paying question

The question above brought up the memory of a question I had about paying bills. My wife has a student loan that she's paying on. It's set up on auto payment and therefore gets withdrawn from our checking account on a specific date each month. It used to be withdrawn on something like the 10th of each month which was inconvenient since we mostly get paid on the 1st and 15th. She called the loan company and asked to get the payment date moved. They offered either the 14th or 17th. She said that those were the only two days that their "schedule was free". Their words, not hers. She didn't inquire any more as to what they meant and I wasn't about to ask her to call them back just to satisfy my curiosity. So, can someone tell me why they would only have certain days "free"? It's not like a dentist appointment where someone will be waiting for you. This is all handled electronically, right? Dismas|^(talk) 04:40, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

My (somewhat uneducated) guess is that it's a server issue. Hot Stop talk-contribs 04:44, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

My guess is that it's just someone being lazy and unhelpful on the other end of the line. --jpgordon^{::==( o )} 16:43, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

It's possible that the loan company runs their billing in batches, and doesn't run a batch every single night. If they run two batches per week, then that would fit with processing on 10th, 14th, and 17th, for instance. Neither the loan company which sends the bills, nor the banks which receive them, want to have to deal with seven small batches of bills every week from every single creditor.

Further, running just two batches each week means that – at least in principle – the creditor has a couple of days (instead of just a few hours) to sanity check bills and correct any really egregious errors. For less proactive creditors, it gives them a few days to fix any errors detected or reported in the last batch of bills before they send out the next one. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 18:21, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

You also have to consider customer service - people are much more likely to call in after they receive their bill (or haven't received their bill at the expected time), so by spreading out the bills over the month - even though the bills themselves may require little human involvement - they can spread the load on their call centers. Effovex (talk) 21:37, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Admiral Sir Sandy Woodward

Would he not automatically have been awarded the Queen Elizabeth II Diamond Jubilee Medal? Kittybrewster ☎ 07:14, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

It looks like he would have been one of the many recipients, yes. But whether he actually got one is something only a source could verify. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 20:16, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Please help me with this question about individuals in the workforce

Assess how to manage an individual’s expectations in respect to personal development. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Elliottp81 (talk • contribs) 07:18, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Exam question? Confidence? Getting up in the morning? Responsibility? Leadership? Promotion? Increase in wages? etc Kittybrewster ☎ 07:19, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Restaurant

Is there any other restaurant like this one that currently it isn't closed? Or an even better restaurant, it will help if they offer Asian Food. Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 13:39, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Does it have to be in NYC? Kittybrewster ☎ 13:41, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Hi, Kittybrewster . Preferably. It could be in San Francisco or in Los Ángeles. It also will help a lot if it were a notable restaurant. Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 13:44, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

What do you mean by "like"? In a skyscraper? Popular with celebrities? Good food (Italian or Asian)? With a live band? Astronaut (talk) 16:26, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Astronaut,

1. Good appearance
2. Good location
3. Popular
4. Frequented by celebrities
5. Good food (Asian, Italian or Greek).

All of them, yes :). The live band will help :) It doesn't have to meet every single point but the most of them. It has to be a place where people doesn't bother celebrities if they are having dinner. Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 16:37, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

I would try the restaurant reviews in a major newspaper: New York Times, San Francisco Chronicle, Los Angeles Times; or a restaurant review site like Zagat, Michelin Guide or a consumer review site like Tripadvisor. I saw 3 places I might be happy eating in, with just a few clicks on Tripadvisor. Astronaut (talk) 16:56, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Oh! I forgot something Astronaut, I can access only Wikipedia. My work has blocked everything on the Internet but Wikipedia (not even Commons, WikiQuote, etc). Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 16:58, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

If this is for a special night out, one thing I would suggest is check it out first if at all possible. Even if they're fully booked, just drop by to take a look at the menu, check out the atmosphere and ask some questions about booking a table.

I can't speak as to their popularity with celebrities, but the three I spotted on Tripadvisor in New York City got good reviews and were ranked #1 and #34 in NYC, and #3 in Brooklyn. Not that it is any kind of recommendation - I've not eaten at any of these - they were: Colicchio and Sons, 85 10th Ave (American & Italian cuisine, most items are around $30, website: here, look around inside on Google Maps); Buddakan New York, 75 9th Ave (Asian cuisine, most items are around $30, website: here); and The River Cafe, 1 Water St, Brooklyn (American, Seafood, International, Fusion cuisine, $100 for 3 courses, website: here, great view across the East River to Manhattan). Astronaut (talk) 17:29, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Thank you so much Astronaut . I'm actually not going to eat there. I live in Cuba. I was looking for a restaurant for a scene I am writting for my next novel, which is located in three different places: San Francisco, Dublin and New York. A wealth man takes his girlfriend to a rest to propose to her. Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 17:39, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Another place with a possibly more recognised name for your story, and also popular with celebrities and has a close association with Robert DeNiro, is Nobu New York. However, why does it have to be a real location? Why not make up a restaurant and fit your own requirements to it (you can do the same with rooftops as well). Astronaut (talk) 20:01, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Awesome, Astronaut. But for that I have to know about addresses in NYC and the best streets. I know about the 5th Avenue and 8th Ave... but I don't know what are the best locations for a restaurant... and of course... a cool name. Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 11:58, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

What is roof spread?

and what causes it? Kittybrewster ☎ 15:37, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

This refers to a problem on houses when the roof is slowly collapsing outwards - the top of the roof is lowering and the edges of the roof that should be resting on the tops of the outside walls are pushing outwards. You can sometimes see it as the ridge-line of the roof sagging in the middle.

It's generally caused by someone re-roofing the house with heavier tile than the roof structure was designed for - or something like that - but I believe it can also happen due to heavy snow loads or sufficient leaks in the roof causing the underlay to get soaked with water. Anything that adds a lot of weight to the roof is a likely candidate. Possibly there are also structural causes if the roof wasn't built correctly or something.

SteveBaker (talk) 16:19, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Collar beams are one preventive measure. These are pieces of structural lumber such as 2x4's (US measure) which are nailed between the rafters down below the roof peak on every pair or every other pair of rafters, depending on local building codes and practices, often at a suitable ceiling height in the attic if space permits, so that drywall can be nailed to them to make a ceiling in the attic if desired. In other houses, the floor joists in the attic may run parallel to and connect the rafter ends, preventing them from spreading apart. Trusses can be used to support the roof, and are like a latticework bridge in preventing sagging. Edison (talk) 00:36, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Something said about Leonardo da Vinci or one of those guys

I think I heard this in a documentary long ago. Somebody said that X (not sure if it's Leonardo da Vinci or some other famous guy) went every day for a month to work to sit and stare in front of a huge block of marble or some stone material. Then, eventually, after just sitting there and staring for so long, he began working on it, and finished it within hours/days (very quickly). Can you find that quote/reference/whatever? I've looked a long time for it.Lotsaeditz (talk) 17:52, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

The one staring at the block of marble was Michelangelo, full story here. And I stare at File:Vierge.jpg and wonder why NeverDoIng believes it to be a sculpture by Leonardo da Vinci. --Pp.paul.4 (talk) 20:16, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

For some reason, the Indonesia Wikipedia is claiming that that statue is Leonardo's Virgin of the Rocks at the Louvre. But that is a painting. Rmhermen (talk) 22:14, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Use of train stations in Seattle

If a person were taking a train from Santa Barbara to Seattle between 1952 and 1956, would s/he end up at the King Street Station of the Union Station? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.231.31.199 (talk) 18:01, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Could have been either. I don't think it was possible to do this without changing trains; the coastal/Salinas route ran to San Francisco (rather like US 101), and then you'd ferry over to Oakland and catch the Cascade to Portland. From there, UP trains went to Seattle Union Station while all the other lines went to (and beyond) King Street Station. --jpgordon^{::==( o )} 20:01, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

How would you explain to a 5 years old kid what pregnancy is? (novel question)

The Reference Desk does not answer requests for opinions
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.
What's the best explanation that a father can give to his 5 years old kid who asks what does that his mother is pregnant mean? - not storks stuffs- Miss Bono [zootalk] 18:31, 6 August 2013 (UTC) Why not stork stuff? Do you want a different lie? It means that his mother is getting ready to have a little brother or sister. You seriously need to give a more detailed question if you want a reasonable answer. --Onorem (talk) 18:35, 6 August 2013 (UTC)--Onorem (talk) 18:35, 6 August 2013 (UTC) The kid's mom is pregnant and the kid heard his father saying that word, and he asks: What's pregnat?. I don't want a lie, I just want a reasonable story to tell to a kid. I've recently heard that you cannot tell a lie to a child. Miss Bono [zootalk] 18:42, 6 August 2013 (UTC) It means she's going to have a baby. Do you want to also give an explanation for the process of becoming pregnant? What are you asking? You might not be able to tell a lie to a child, but it seems like you can tell a lie to a Miss Bono... --Onorem (talk) 18:50, 6 August 2013 (UTC) What do you mean by telling a lie to a Miss Bono? I don't get your point, I feel offended :'(. I want to give an explanation for the process because you cannot tell a kid (or anyone) an explanation on something without telling the first part of the process. (maybe you don't understand me because English is not my first language, please, be patient with me) Miss Bono [zootalk] 18:59, 6 August 2013 (UTC) Exactly. "It means she's going to have a baby" is a totally approriate response to the question. Dominus Vobisdu (talk) 18:57, 6 August 2013 (UTC) Yeah, and then the whys: How does a baby ended up in mommy's belly? Miss Bono [zootalk] 18:59, 6 August 2013 (UTC) "I've recently heard that you cannot tell a lie to a child." - I don't know who told you that...but they were not telling you the truth. You can tell a lie to a child. It happens quite often in my experience. --Onorem (talk) 19:05, 6 August 2013 (UTC) Onorem, I used the wrong verb, my bad... you must not tell a lie to a kid. Miss Bono [zootalk] 19:08, 6 August 2013 (UTC) My sister was born when I was six years old, and up until then, "your mother's going to have a baby" was just about the extent of the explanation I was given. A stork may have been mentioned, but I had my doubts about that. As to the "why," I'm not sure most kids are prone to ask that question in such a scenario. I also don't think it's correct that you can't lie to a kid (see Tooth Fairy, Santa Claus -- how many poor kids have been maliciously tricked into believing that those beings don't exist?). Evanh2008 (talk|contribs) 19:01, 6 August 2013 (UTC) I was 3 years old when my sister was born. I don't have the faintest recollection of how my parents told me of her birth. When my brother was born, I was 13. My mother (then married to a different man, we share the same mother but not the same father), simply told us that we were going to have a little brother or sister. It turned out to be a brother. When my sister herself told me she was pregnant, I initially thought she was joking. It took me close to ten minutes to realise she was being serious. My niece is now two years old and likes me very much. JIP | Talk 19:07, 6 August 2013 (UTC) "Mommy and daddy made it, and put it in their to grow." "How did they make it?" "Secret recipe". Dominus Vobisdu (talk) 19:12, 6 August 2013 (UTC) Isn't that cruel (the part of the secret recipe?) What about if the kid starts asking the same question at the kinder, or maybe even... Mommy and daddy made a baby in the kitchen in secret and he terrifies all of his friends. Miss Bono [zootalk] 19:19, 6 August 2013 (UTC) Who said anything about a kitchen? Also, how about the parents simply tell this kid not to take about this subject with other kids at school or with anyone else at any time? Futurist110 (talk) 20:19, 6 August 2013 (UTC) The OP agrees a focus on links and references would be more appropriate. μηδείς (talk) 19:51, 6 August 2013 (UTC) Actually, a simple answer or links inside Wikipedia would be better because if you give me external links I won't be able to follow them because of my poor Internet access. Miss Bono [zootalk] 19:54, 6 August 2013 (UTC) What about the father telling his five year old kid that a woman being pregnant means that she has a developing child living inside of her (in her uterus/belly area/tummy)? Would that work? Futurist110 (talk) 20:15, 6 August 2013 (UTC) As for the why, how about telling him that there is a way to do it but that he must wait until he is older to find out and must NEVER try it himself until he is an adult? Futurist110 (talk) 20:17, 6 August 2013 (UTC) Also, if this kid is into the details, you can say that internal body parts (without elaborating) from both males and females combine to make babies/children. This is accurate, since both the sperm and the eggs are inside people's bodies. Futurist110 (talk) 20:27, 6 August 2013 (UTC) (e/c) That is just asking for them to please go ahead and try it as soon as their plumbing is developed enough. Suggesting NOT X is equivalent in practical terms to suggesting X. But really, there's going to be at least 9 years before it's even possible for a 5-year-old, so there's no point in getting into instructions at all, one way or another, that far ahead. Kids are smart enough to know that there are zillions of things adults do that kids don't do, and they don't start to question that till they're a lot older than 5. -- Jack of Oz [pleasantries] 20:34, 6 August 2013 (UTC) Futurist110, so, the father should tell him: Look, mommy has a baby developing in her tummy. It got there because mommy and daddy internal parts combined to make it. So, pretty soon you will have a baby sister/brother? Miss Bono [zootalk] 20:32, 6 August 2013 (UTC) @ MissBono: Yes, this is what I would say. I would leave it at internal body parts and simply refuse to elaborate any further no matter what until this child is much older. However, it is worth pointing out that I did not have any children yet, and thus I do not have any actual experience in answering these types of questions for little children. Futurist110 (talk) 20:52, 6 August 2013 (UTC) No, not the mechanics. -- Jack of Oz [pleasantries] 20:34, 6 August 2013 (UTC) I didn't say very much mechanics at all here. Futurist110 (talk) 20:52, 6 August 2013 (UTC) What about the mommy and daddy love each other... story? Is there any movie or book that has some scene like that? Miss Bono [zootalk] 20:45, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Ms Bono, this kind of question cannot be answered definitively. It depends too much on people's opinions, individual circumstances and cultural expectations. As such it's not suitable for the Reference Desk. Rojomoke (talk) 20:47, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Ok, Rojomoke. Thanks for the answers given so far :) I will figure out something sooner or later. :) Miss Bono ^[zootalk] 20:53, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Feel free to think about what I said here as well, but please be careful due to my lack of experience in this regard (I don't have any children yet). Futurist110 (talk) 20:55, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

This does seem like an answerable question. There are definitely guides out there that give advice on how to discuss pregnancy and new babies with children. Miss Bono can't follow a link to them, but someone could definitely find some references and summarize what they have to say for her. I can't track down references right now because I'm at work (although luckily without as strict of a filter as her) 209.131.76.183 (talk) 11:42, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Cool Interactive Mapping Websites

I have recently found a website with a feature which allows one to determine the final borders of Israel and Palestine here -- http://www.ispeacepossible.com/map.htm. I also know of a cool website which allows one to draw United States Congressional district boundaries here -- http://gardow.com/davebradlee/redistricting/launchapp.html. Are there any other similar websites with features which allow you to play around with (and change/manipulate) maps, borders, and demographics? Thank you very much. Futurist110 (talk) 20:58, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

August 8

De-anting my flowers

I have some nice flowers growing in the garden, and would like to cut them and put them in a vase, but tiny ants seem to be the pollinators, which means any flowers I bring in are covered with ants. So, how can I get the ants off the flowers first, without destroying the flowers ? StuRat (talk) 11:17, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Nearly all the advice I can find is about peonies; not sure if this will work for less robust flowers. But anyway, the standard procedure seems to be (1) shake the flowers, checking manually all the ants are gone (2) submerge the flower heads in a bucket of lukewarm water for a few minutes. [4] [5]. There are also a number of methods for keeping ants away from plants while growing, such as a borax mixture surround, or homemake ant traps. [6] 184.147.136.32 (talk) 11:48, 8 August 2013 (UTC)