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August 3

70s or 80s made for tv debate forum

It was sponsored by a university if I remember correctly but not Ivy League or the Stanfords of the world. It was on local PBS stations about a decade ago but even then they were reruns. About an hour long and they had a large room with almost stadium like seating but low ceilings and wood paneling circling the center where "experts" from the law professions, corporations, retired CEOs, noted journalists etc. sat at a circular table as a moderator went around and sort of stirred the pot. The episodes I remember was something about crime prevention and then another about corporate ethics where they had some memorable exchanges about an inventor founding a company and then investors and "wall street" kind of moving in and taking it over and even pushing the founder out. The room was lit in a dark way sort of like inverted wall lamps and had a 70s or early 80s feel to it. Any one remember this series? ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 04:40, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Might be Firing Line RudolfRed (talk) 04:57, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Thanks RudolfRed, I am familiar with Buckley so I would have recognized him. The show I am thinking about showed the audience it was in a bowl seating type thing and the moderator actually walked around this crsecent moon shaped wood paneled table, I think even Rudy Guilianni was there and listed as US Attorney for S.D. NY so had to be late 80s or so. The moderator was not Geraldo Rivera or Phil Donahue but kind of had the mannerisms of them walking constantly from area to area switching the debate up, looking down in pensive thought, sitting on the table in front of guests occassionally but no big microphone. Almost certain he was a professor or aligned with a university so that rules out Buckley and Firing Line unless it was a guest host at a college lecture hall type series for 3-4 episodes. I keep visualizing the dark wood paneling as the border between the audience and guests or perhaps the structure of the crescent moon table they were sitting at and the audience seating was dark wood/brown dimly lit. ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 07:39, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

This sounds a little like the TV pilot series for The Moral Maze that we had in the UK. --TammyMoet (talk) 10:33, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

The BBC made a series very like this called 'Hypotheticals' in the 1990s - the basis being that the people on the panel all had experience of real life situations which they couldn't disclose in public, but if they were given a hypothetical situation they could demonstrate how they would make their decisions. Sam Blacketer (talk) 10:50, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Been doing a bit of digging and I think this New York Times article is what you're thinking about. If so then the format was developed as a generic one and used for various shows. Sam Blacketer (talk) 10:58, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

That article is it Sam Blacketer! Fred Friendly's series thats what I'm thinking of though I can't seem to find the specific 80s one I had in mind I did pull up a list of them and I'm pretty sure this is the right track, seems a lot of them are still purchase only. Kudos to you, and a big thanks! ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 11:35, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Resolved

Identifying science fiction novel

I read a novel somewhere around 1980. Its protagonist was an ordinary human who because of a mix-up won a lottery where the prize was a journey through other dimensions. An important plot point is that because of the dangers in your own world, to keep the balance of things a new danger is created especially for you when you travel to another dimension. I think that was called an X-eater (with X as the protagonist's name) and was mostly somewhat humanoid in appearance. The protagonist travels through several dimensions, leaving each one when the X-eater gets too close. Somewhere he picks up a travel companion, a female. At the end of the book it's strongly hinted that he returns to his own dimension, but he keeps on travelling.

There's a scene at the beginning of the book when the lottery representative has come to present the prize and the real winner appears. At first he is very angry and intends to take the prize but then he changes his mind, apparently amused by the thought of having a human meet the dangers of interdimensional travel. It is shown that the real winner is more powerful than humans are; I think there was something about lead dripping from his fingertips as he became angry. Sjö (talk) 08:24, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

I haven't read it (or even heard of it until now), but your description sounds a lot like Dimension of Miracles by the inimitable Robert Sheckley. Clarityfiend (talk) 09:37, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Yep, that must be the one. Thanks! Sjö (talk) 10:09, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Detroit bankrupty --> Chapter 9 bankruptcies in general - Can anybody here help?

Hello, I posted a question at an article's talk page's section (please see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Chapter_9,_Title_11,_United_States_Code#Notable_Bankruptcies ) (but neither get an answer there, nor later at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_United_States#Can_anybody_here_help.3F , nor again later at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portal_talk:United_States#Detroit_bankrupty_--.3E_Chapter_9_bankruptcies_in_general ). So I really hope that someone here finally could help me in finding out the names and data of the 600+ Chapter9bankruptcy-cases and so on. That would be nice, as I want to know it plus I really feel for that it's just a basic information missing from the (tabulary/list of the) Chapter9bankruptcies-article (how can the article contain the number 600+, if it is not able to give a source that not only mentions that number just by suggesting it but by really sourcing that suggestion by identifying that 600+ entries?). Thank you.46.142.39.141 (talk) 13:35, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Google scholar "legal" for the term chapter 9 bankruptcy here will answer most of this for you. ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 14:26, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

That's interesting, but as there are only 82 hits and because of about half of them seem to consider companies, hospital associations, school districts, etc., it seems to me they're only about 40 city/community-chapter9-bankruptcy cases - and some of them are even on the "selected list" of the chapter9-wiki-article yet; so even if both combined, I think there still are more than 500 unidentified cases. Maybe all the data is not yet in the net? As I wrote in the article's talk page, I wonder whether there isn't some sort of a federal department section that collects/records such data and could provide us just with a list of them? As I'm not from the U.S., I'm not so into it to guess which section or who is best to ask, so I thought someone of you could have a clue about that? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 46.142.39.141 (talk) 18:26, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Yes I see that now with the 82, the only thing that rivals Google scholar really is the Cornell Law school online library, if you don't mind paying some there is always WestLaw and you can go to the source I think for free to search of the U.S. Government's online court records but you will have to give a credit card to view cases and after so many views (a handful or something?) they will start charging you per page I think. ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 19:39, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Correct me if I'm wrong here but I thought when the article mentioned 600+ they meant all chapter 9's, including "authorities" or companies as you refer to them, hospital associations, school districts, etc. since all of these are technically government entities for the purposes of bankruptcy law. I don't think there has been 600+ citys/counties/towns that have declared. Part of the reason governments create authorities, school districts, hospital associations etc. is that they can raise their own bonds and be pretty much financially independent in that if Detroit goes bankrupt, its hospitals, schools and airport etc. don't and vice versa. Pittsburgh had a situation about a decade ago where an airline de-hubbed its airport and thus cut landing fees and passenger fee revenue by a ton so the airport was actually close to defaulting on its bonds and bankruptcy was considered for a time but since the airport was an "independent" authority it would not effect the city or schools or health department etc. It is quite common in the U.S. to have this kind of set up since the 1960's, the World Trade Centers in New York in the late 1960s were built with one of the first independent authorities to exist that was set up by New York state and New Jersey. Long story short a lot of these "chapter 9"s I had taken as the water authority or school district or regional county trash authority or transit authority etc. There are many famous cases of small and large cities going belly up but in 200 some years I seriously doubt there's anything approaching 600, but again I could be wrong about if that number only represents cities. ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 19:49, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

This is really easy: [1]. As for the actual list, it might be harder but it's not super difficult. AFAIK Westlaw and Lexis are not the best places to find this kind of statistical data, but maybe they have some product I'm unaware of. But the aggregate data is easy to find. Shadowjams (talk) 21:24, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

There have been 59 Chapter 9 filings since 2008, btw. Shadowjams (talk) 21:27, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Are Americans allowed to eat their own food? Are raw foods available?

Hi,

I'm writing from Europe. I read this article via an internet link:

http://www.psmag.com/health/a-fatter-phobia-8549/

I don't understand some of it. For example, where the writer talks about the McDonald's and the sit-down restaurant. A couple of questions:

1 - Why does the author say the sit-down restaurant will have more Calories than McDonald's? Do American restaurants typically not have soups, salads, steaks, vegetables, etc etc. Every single menu item would be similar to mcdonald's?

2 - Do Americans not have a choice to eat their own food? I don't really understand this at all. I can go to a store here and buy whatever ingredients I want and cook whatever I want. If I wanted to eat almost no calories (which I don't recommend) I would just put vegetables in soup, or eat it with a salad with olives. That is one extreme, in between that and something very unhealthy (eating a whole batch of cookies) I can cook whatever I want. This doesn't seem to be an option in the article. Why is this?

3 - the article says "individuals ... believed that body weight was 'controllable' (meaning that, with discipline and time, a person can lose excess fat)".

This seems to me very bizarre. It seems completely obvious to me that I, and anyone, can control their body weight by changing the amounts of food eaten.

But the article seems to talk about this as though it's a false belief. The only way I can think of for this is if Americans do not have much choice in what they eat.

Is this true? How can it be?

I find the article very hard to understand. 178.48.114.143 (talk) 13:52, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

It says at the top "You’re at the office, on a budget, it’s almost lunch time and — you’re starving." so only 1/2 hour or maybe hour which really only gives you 10-30 min to eat, its not that Americans can't cook or buy things from the store its that theres a reason America invented fast food, that reason of a quick in & out is the article's subject. ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 14:18, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

But why are you at the office without food, in this example, if a McDonald's will be the only option within your distance? Can't Americans buy food ahead of time? 178.48.114.143 (talk) 16:36, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

American eating habits are often a source of culture shock. Til Eulenspiegel /talk/ 16:46, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Is it true at all that Americans are fatter than Europeans? Or is it a myth? And a further question. Why would be fast food be a calorie bomb or unhealthy? You could go to something fast, like a salad bar-type of restaurant. 95.20.116.138 (talk) 17:30, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Of course there are plenty of US restaurants offering healthier 'fast food', but the bombardment of advertising from the big chains may make it seem otherwise... Til Eulenspiegel /talk/ 17:52, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

The article is clearly about those who eat certain foods from certain restaurants, if you re-read your title to this question it's pretty outlandish, like there is a possibility of no we aren't "allowed to eat" our own food and no there are "no raw foods available". This from a country that fed Europe in 1918 and 1945 and ships millions of tons of food to the world per year. The article is about those who eat certain foods from certain restaurants like an article about rainy days is about days that it rains not sunny days, or an article about Pittsburgh is about Pittsburgh and not Cleveland. I could google a million articles this instance that one could ask does that mean Cleveland is not allowed? Does that mean sunny days are not available? When writing an article like the one OP linked to the author doesn't have to preface it with every possible alternative in human history. A recent Modern Marvels cited that canned tuna is the #1 lunch item for Americans so obviously the article is about a minority of Americans. If you wish to raise a topic here at least be mindful of the Wikipedia pillar above policies of WP:COMMONSENSE. I think OP has some good questions but lets ease up on the vast general and absolute assumptions/inquires. Rainy day articles doesn't mean the sun doesn't exist or come out ever. ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 19:31, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

To respond to the "salad bar-type of restaurant" comment, we (speaking as an American) don't really have those. The closest that we have to that would be a grocery store that has salad items available to make your own salad. But those are not nearly as prevalent as fast food restaurants. And as for raw food, we have plenty. I can even get raw milk around here. But then I live in a more rural area than many people. It's not as easy to get in the bigger cities. Dismas|^(talk) 20:03, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

They're perhaps not as prevalent as they should be, but salad bar restaurants can be found in some parts of the US. Souplantations and Sweet Tomatoes are mostly in the South; I hadn't heard of Fresh Choice or Souper Salad, but they're linked from the Souplantation article. Seems ironic that these (relatively) healthy restaurants would be found mostly in such an unhealthy region, though. --BDD (talk) 20:45, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

What makes the South an "unhealthy region"? -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 21:14, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Higher obesity rates. Maybe it's something they ate. --BDD (talk) 21:16, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Being fat is almost always due to eating. HiLo48 (talk) 22:37, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

In the same way that people who breathe air almost always end up dying. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 22:40, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

I believe he's saying what and how much you eat can make you fat, in the same way that what and how much you breathe can kill you. In your own terms: people who become fat from eating become fat from eating certain foods, like too much McDonalds cheeseburgers, etc. etc. in the same way that people can die from breathing the wrong stuff, like air laced with asbestos, or cigarette smoke. --Jayron32 01:23, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Except it's rarely as simple as just the amount and type of food eaten. That's energy in. There's also energy out, which typically comes from exercise. I'm generalising, but people with weight issues usually need to redress the imbalance by (a) modifying their eating, AND (b) doing more exercise than they currently do, which for many people means doing some exercise instead of virtually none at all. Just talking about the food side of this equation is crazy. It's like saying the only exercise one ever needs to do is urination, defecation and sweating. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 04:47, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

I'm sorry, isn't the above completely obvious? How can this be a discussion. Do some people not realize that being fat is indicative only of overeating? (and medical issues which 'cause overeating'). I guess 0.2% of the population might eat less calories than they consume and somehow still gain weight but then again 0.2% of the population can subsist on sunshine alone too by that same token. It seems I've stumbled on some deeply ingrained marketing message, or something. I don't know what exactly. Could someone elaborate? How are the above posters debating the obvious, for example? 178.48.114.143 (talk) 03:31, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Sorry, what is your question you need help answering again? I'm having trouble telling if you are asking a genuine question in need of references to answer, or if you're trying to make some grand provocative statement but to mask your attempt at soapboxing by putting question marks rather than periods at the end of your sentences. Perhaps you could ask a simple question we could point you to answers to. --Jayron32 03:41, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Agreed Jayron32, see my 2nd post above for further reference. ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 08:07, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

To those who think that obesity is merely a question of how much food you eat, this article in today's Observer might help you understand why it's a question of what's in the food you eat rather than how much. --TammyMoet (talk) 10:02, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

See my comment above at 4:47, Tammy. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 10:04, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

A spin-off question on the cultural differences between Europe and the US: At practically every workplace I ever worked in Sweden there was a lunch room (or fika room) where you could sit down and eat food you've taken with you. They had a fridge, one or more microwaves and a coffee maker, all supplied by the employer. Are these unusual in the US? The article in the OP seems to suggest that your only option is to leave the office and go to a restaurant, and I can't recall any American movies or TV series where people eat in a lunch room (sometimes they eat in the cafeteria, but that's not the same thing as a lunch room). Sjö (talk) 07:11, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

It often depends on the size of the business. From my experience, there's not a lot of "let's all eat together" camaraderie unless there is a group heading out to eat. I've worked for four companies. (The following assumes that the worker didn't go out to eat.) The first had a break room for the workers on the factory floor but the office staff didn't eat there for various reasons both practical and cultural. Most all the office staff ate at their desks though there was a conference table in a common area which could have been used. The second only had a five office employees. Office workers ate at their desk, those in the machine shop ate at a makeshift table in the shop. No conference room available. The third had a public kitchen/breakroom but it was often closed due for a customer's use (kid's birthday parties, we sold teddy bears). And the last has a full fledged cafeteria that operates during the day (technically the largest restaurant in the state, from what I'm told). Office workers here at night either eat at their desk or in a breakroom. I couldn't find anything approaching a reliable source for this but what I've described seems to cover most situations here in the US. Most of the search results that I found seem to verify that, if not eating out, American office workers eat at their desks. Dismas|^(talk) 08:39, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

What's the difference between a cafeteria and a lunch room? It's not as if you can't eat food from home in a cafeteria. In fact, that's what some of my coworkers do every day. --50.125.66.85 (talk) 18:54, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

A cafeteria would have staff that prepare food for you, probably not employed directly by the company that has the cafeteria in the building. Like at a school. A lunch room may just have some tables or it may have things like a refrigerator, sink, microwave, and vending machines. Dismas|^(talk) 19:28, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

It varies depending on region. In some parts of the States, cafeteria & lunch room are synonymous terms for larger area where food has been prepared, you pick the items you want from the available dishes, pay & then go into the main dining area (which is typically large with multiple long tables). In others, a lunch room is just a small room with maybe a fridge & a microwave, plus a table & chairs to eat at; while cafeteria refers to the larger service-line area. — The Hand That Feeds You:^Bite 21:04, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

To go back to the original question: Americans tend to work longer hours & have fewer vacation days than in Europe. This has led to a culture of convenience, where it's more important to have meals be fast & easily obtained than for them to be healthy. Preparing food at home takes out of what leisure time we have, and typically we favor foods that are pre-made (frozen & reheatable) or just to eat out. — The Hand That Feeds You:^Bite 21:04, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

User interface design and cultural differences

There exist some potentially non-obvious/ambiguous user interfaces. Some examples:

1. volume knob on an amplifier increases volume if turned clockwise (why not counter-clockwise?)
2. scrolling in (horizontal or vertical) menus using the rotation of a knob (who says clockwise means up?)
3. using left/right arrows to navigate up/down (e.g. k9-mail which is always confusing me)

Perhaps there are more examples. I was wondering whether all of such interfaces are supposed to be natural for all users or whether there are perhaps differences between left/right-handed people, people writing from left-to-right/right-to-left, people driving on the left/right side of the street, or just people from different cultures? Also, is "what feels natural" only a question of getting used to or are there perhaps some physiological things playing a role as well? bamse (talk) 14:16, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

For 1 and 2, clock faces are numbered 1 to 12 in a clockwise direction (because the rotation of the Earth causes shadows to rotate clockwise in the northern hemisphere), so things other than time are taken to increase in the clockwise direction. For 2, combine this with the mathematical convention (perhaps based on rungs of a ladder) where positive is taken as up. If measurement of time and clocks had been developed in the southern hemisphere, then things might have been different. (In some branches of Mathematics, positive angles are measured in an anticlockwise direction. It's all just convention.) I don't know what you mean by 3, but perhaps someone else does? Is it just that right and up are both taken as the positive directions? Dbfirs 18:16, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

A good book on this topic is Norman, Donald A. (2002). The design of everyday things. Basic Books. ISBN 9780465067107. -- Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 18:34, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Interesting point about the clock. Thanks. I noticed "3" with the k9 email client, but it could also appear in other places. In k9 as in many other email clients you have the emails ordered in a list, line by line. If I go to the view of a single email, I can switch to previous/next using left/right arrow buttons. bamse (talk) 22:14, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

I am an older person. I recall the earliest media player software. It had similar controls to much other software at the time. Nor problem for me. Then came "skins". They were completely different, with controls that were different from software in any other field. They were apparently meant to appeal to the target teenage of the time. No idea if they did. I couldn't figure them out. Then these (to me) weird controls became standard. I had no choice. Annoyed the crap out of me. HiLo48 (talk) 22:42, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Not just you, see this classic hallofshame Quicktime review. Didn't stop them, though. Unilynx (talk) 13:18, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

narrative aorist - ancient greek

I read [2] that aorsit can be use as narrative aorist. I did not understand very well the explanation. Somebody can bring another example? From what I read narrative aorist describes an action that is a part of a long action - e.g I walk ; if I want to describes the step, I would be use narrative aorist? --132.64.30.55 (talk) 15:14, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

This question would be more likely to get an answer on the Language desk. Looie496 (talk) 22:55, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Basically, "narrative aorist" means just those uses of the aorist where it corresponds to an English simple past tense. Sequences of events in a narrative (as in "he got up, had breakfast, and then went to work") are the most typical kind of context for this. This type of use can be distinguished from some other, more marginal types of uses of the aorist where the English translation would be in a different tense (such as the "gnomic aorist") on the one hand, and from past tense situations where Greek would use the imperfect and English would use a past progressive (as in "John was reading the newspaper when suddenly the telephone rang") on the other hand. (But I agree that the Language desk would probably be a better forum for continuing this, if you have more questions.) Fut.Perf. ☼ 08:06, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Countries where Jews outnumber Muslims

I was interested to learn that in Monaco, Jews outnumber Muslims, and wondered in what other countries that is the case. Israel, of course, and the US, though I note it's not the case in Canada or the UK. This isn't surprising, given the religions' very different ideas on proselytization. Still, in what other countries do Jews outnumber Muslims? Do any US states have more Muslims than Jews. I would've thought Michigan, though our article says both religions made up 1% of that state's population in 2007. I also wonder how these surveys determine who is a Jew. Probably self-identification, but if these questions are phrased in terms of religion, atheist Jews may not be counted as Jews. --BDD (talk) 20:38, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

What about atheist Muslims? HiLo48 (talk) 22:09, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

I think that's a contradiction. According to us, a Muslim "is an adherent of Islam," which precludes atheism. While someone born into a Muslim family can certainly be an atheist, I don't think there's anything you can directly compare to Jewish atheism. --BDD (talk) 22:34, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Yes, I'm well aware of that. Maybe I was too subtle. It's your question. What exactly are you comparing? Surely it can really only be religious beliefs. Otherwise there's no point to a comparison. HiLo48 (talk) 23:08, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

According to the Association of Statisticians of American Religious Bodies and this report, Islam is the largest non-Christian group in 20 American states, mostly in the South and Midwest: Texas, Arkansas, Mississippi, Louisiana, Alabama, Georgia, Florida, North Carolina Virginia, West Virginia, Kentucky, Indiana, Illinois, Michigan, Wisconsin, Iowa, Nebraska, South Dakota, North Dakota and Wyoming. I assume that Jews are the largest non-Christian group in most other American states, although there may be a few states in which Buddhists or another non-Christian group come in second. John M Baker (talk) 22:44, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

A relevant concept is not "atheism" regarding the individual Jew or Moslem's belief, but whether or not they are affiliated with a congregation (synagogue/temple, mosque). How was this taken into account in the abovementioned survey? There are individuals who adhere to and identify with some of the tenets of either religion without attending worship services or paying dues to an organization. There are many self-identified Jews in America (and Israel, where I now live) of this sort; I'm not familiar with Muslim practice in the USA. Bearing in mind that much of both these religions involves codes of personal and interpersonal behavior and cultural practices - I vary from User:HiLo48's point above but agree that it would help if the OP would clarify whether religious affiliation vs. practice and self-identification are the query here.-- Deborahjay (talk) 05:48, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

According to the report: "The researchers define adherents to be those with an affiliation to a congregation including children, members and attendees who are not members, and believe that the adherent measure is the most complete and comparable across religious groups. Congregations are defined as groups of people who meet regularly at a pre-announced time and location." This would undercount the number of persons who identify as Jews, and to a lesser extent those who identify as Muslims. John M Baker (talk) 15:23, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

It would appear that the Jewish population of Brazil is larger than the Muslim population of that country, see Religion in Brazil. Latvia is another contender, although its so close as to be subject to the error margin of the census. Religion in Latvia. Thom2002 (talk) 20:15, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Paraguay appears to be another example. Warofdreams talk 12:53, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Chile as well. (see List of Chilean Jews and Islam in Chile) D Monack (talk) 03:06, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

And Mexico. --D Monack (talk) 03:08, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Titles Deprivation Act 1917

The title Titles Deprivation Act 1917 took away the titles for four Germans with British peer like the Duke of Cumberland and the Duke Albany but their heirs are allowed to petition for restoration of these titles. But does it mean that these titles can't be recreate it for another individual? Can Elizabeth II or parliament create Prince George as the Duke of Albany while the male heirs of Prince Leopold are still alive. --The Emperor's New Spy (talk) 21:49, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

• If the rightful Duke under British law was Friedrich Josias Carl Eduard Kyrill Harald, Prince of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha (1918-1998), there is the slight matter of him having borne arms against his cousin King George VI. According to de.wikipedia, after joining the German Army as an officer cadet in 1938, he served in the illegal invasions of Czechoslovakia, Poland, France, Yugoslavia and the Soviet Union. Returning to occupied France, he was then posted to occupied Denmark and in 1945 became a prisoner of the British. --Hors-la-loi 19:26, 4 August 2013 (UTC)
  • They aren't "rightful" dukes because their titles were taken away from them. There wasn't a second deprivation for involvement in WWII. Friedrich Josias didn't inherit his father's claim to Albany only his Saxon claim, his brother Johann Leopold inherited Charles Edward's claim since British law doesn't prohibit morganatic marriages. And your answer doesn't answer if the titles can be recreated for another individual ignoring the right all these individuals have to petition to have their titles restored,--The Emperor's New Spy (talk) 19:11, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

• There is nothing legally stopping a duplicate title being created - technically the Queen could create as many Dukes of Albany as she liked. In practice, however, she wouldn't create a duplicate title, and a suspended title would nowadays undoubtedly be treated in the same way as an existing title. It seems, however, that the Dukedom of Albany must be extinct in any event - the Saxe-Coburgs stopped applying for permission to marry under the Royal Marriages Act 1772, and so the current members of the male line are all illegitimate under British law and thus ineligible to succeed. (The Dukes of Cumberland and Teviotdale continued to do so, so that title is still extant but suspended, and so for all practical purposes unavailable for regrant.) Proteus (Talk) 12:41, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

August 4

Ruhollah Khomeini's appointment of senior officials and laws on school principals

Under Khomeini's leadership of Iran, did senior government positions and school principals just have to be Muslims, or did they specifically have to belong to the Usuli Twelver Shia Islamic school? Could Sunni Muslims, members of other Shia schools, or members of other Islamic denominations hold these posts? 108.0.244.168 (talk) 01:46, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

In theory, every Muslim man and woman could be; but in practice, only adherents of that Islamic school were allowed to. Sunni Muslims only in Sunni provinces could have intermediate posts. --Omidinist (talk) 03:52, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

So the article should state that only members of whatever school most of the people in a certain province could hold senior government positions? 108.0.244.168 (talk) 04:19, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Could you rephrase your question, please? Is it a question or suggestion? --Omidinist (talk) 10:18, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

It is both a suggestion and question. The section about senior government positions and requirement of Muslim school principals is too vague. Did the laws specify what denominations of Islam qualify for these jobs or not? 108.0.244.168 (talk) 19:53, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

No, it's not in the Law. That's why I said ' in theory, every Muslim man and woman could be.' Please read articles 11-14 of the Constitution here. Any discrimination against Sunnis is against the Law. Omidinist (talk) 03:51, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Is Del Mar a part of San Diego

Is Del Mar a part of San Diego (city, not county)? The article describes it as a separate town. For example, do Del Mar residents vote for San Diego major, does the San Diego population include Del Mar, etc.?

If Del Mar is a part of San Diego, since what year? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.88.21.128 (talk) 05:24, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Del Mar residents do not vote for San Diego major and are outside the city of San Diego, even though they are in the same county. But this article is about which Muslims could hold certain positions in Iran under Khomeini. It doesn't say whether it includes just one Islamic school or others. 108.0.244.168 (talk) 06:14, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

1st it's "mayor", 2nd 108.0.244.168 is correct about it being outside San Diego city but inside San Diego county (2 very separate governments), 3rd how did this become about Iran, wait I don't want to know. ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 15:22, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

That part must be in reference to the previous section, just above. The IP geolocates to southern California. It's like he's trying to response to two different comments at once, and that doesn't work. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 16:13, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Ah yes, doing the small screen today Bugs & never saw a combined response on here. Thanks. ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 18:32, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

The question was added immediately after the previous question, and without a header, so it looked like part of the previous thread, but it clearly wasn't. I did the right thing and created a separate header. But I apparently failed to notice that someone had already added a response about the Khomeini question after this Del mar question had started but before I added the separate header. A comedy of errors indeed. Or, Les Folies Refdesques. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 19:38, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Or a 3rd rate burglary a "whole Bay of Pigs thing, a bizarre" :-). ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 20:28, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

FYI, the lead of the Del Mar, California article was slightly in error; the rest of the article shows that it's a city, not a town. Nyttend (talk) 16:49, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

This nomenclature is relative. California is the most populous state in the USA with a number of cities having hundreds of thousands up to several million residents. So an urban (or suburban) municipality - perhaps organizationally a "city" - with a population of 4K inhabitants is rightly termed a "town" - even a "small town." -- Deborahjay (talk) 18:13, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

For municipalities in the USA, we go with the legal definition, which for Del Mar is a city; besides being more accurate, it enables us to avoid disputes about "this is too big for a village" or "this is too small for a city". Nyttend (talk) 14:10, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Some US states have a legal distinction between "city" and "town", but if I recall correctly, California does not. However some California cities/towns style themselves "town" on their signage, presumably for quaintness (see Los Altos Hills). --Trovatore (talk) 19:35, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

All good points Deborahjay & Nyttend however since all states (and nations) define what constitutes a city differently it really doesn't matter since a "town" that size in Iowa or Ireland would be anything from a burg, boro, city or hamlet etc. The important part is that the county and major core city have the same name so although Del Mar is in San Diego it isn't in San Diego, the county and city respectively. Town or city it is an equal to San Diego city legally. ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 18:36, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Do you good novomundane folks really spell borough as "boro"? Heavens above. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 19:38, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

lol, it's a Pennsyltucky thing n'at & dahn. Have seen it around other parts, New York City you have to be careful cause it's the county equivalent. But apologies since after 2007's "fair dinkum" at the airport I should be more aware of any creeping dialect. So yes borough, and thank you! :-) ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 19:56, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Sorry about getting into this section. Your question was originally in a section I started by mistake. That has now been fixed. 108.0.244.168 (talk) 20:08, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Jack, "boro" is uncommon officially, but you'll frequently see it in informal writing, and it sometimes appears in space-constricted places such as road signs or "Welcome to the Boro of ___" signs. Also note Washington Boro, Pennsylvania, which isn't a borough anymore; presumably "Boro" is still included to separate it from Washington, Pennsylvania at the other end of the state. Nyttend (talk) 14:10, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

I learn something new every day here. Thanks, Nyttend. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 19:30, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

There are many examples. Teterboro was a famous one, as Arthur Godfrey wrote a song about it. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 20:30, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Cousin marriages in Tonga

What are the laws concerning first cousin marriages in Tonga? Cousin marriage doesn't mention Oceania at all.--KAVEBEAR (talk) 07:09, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Don't know about Tonga specifically, but in many anthropological cultures, marriage with a "parallel" cousin (father's brother's child or mother's sister's child) is forbidden as incest, while a "cross" cousin (mother's brother's child or father's sister's child) is a preferred marriage partner. In fact, in many kinship terminologies, the same terms are used for one's parallel cousins as for one's brothers and sisters, while one's cross cousins are referred to by terms equivalent to "brother-in-law" and "sister-in-law". In such a society, cousin marriage without any further context is meaningless -- it all depends on which kind of cousin. AnonMoos (talk) 18:39, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Culturally Tongans like other Polynesians before European contact would not disfavor cousin marriages or even incest regardless of parallel or cross cousin marriages. I am just wondering if modern laws influenced by the western world has changed this and there are laws prohibiting such unions.--KAVEBEAR (talk) 02:51, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Mandatory school enrollment ((please help))

Is there a U.S. Federal or perhaps a Georgia State law in place that requires Public School Systems to accommodate and enroll ALL eligible children in their districts? I can't seem to find one, hoping you all can help. Thanks ˜˜˜˜ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Brandirum (talk • contribs) 07:13, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

I fixed your title to make it actually useful. As for laws, that would rather depend on why they refuse to enroll a student. If it's because of a disability, then the Americans with Disabilities Act might apply. If it's because of the race of the child, perhaps the Civil Rights Act of 1964 might apply. If they refuse to let a girl into an all-boys school, then maybe Title IX might be applicable. StuRat (talk) 07:26, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Thank you!! I am new to this. The reason for this is they are filled up due to accepting out of county students who CHOSE to for some reason or another come here and pay a tuition and now there are 14 children on the waiting list and there must be 22 before a new pre-k class will open instead of pulling a couple out of each class to make another class these 14 will just be left behind unless they can afford to go 17 miles to the nearest school which is out of county and be charged a tuition themselves.. Brandirum — Preceding unsigned comment added by Brandirum (talk • contribs) 08:35, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Perhaps pre-K is considered optional there. As a practical matter, I suggest you go to the press, who can shame them into doing the right thing a lot quicker and cheaper than a lawsuit can. StuRat (talk) 09:23, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Also, try getting the help of your Representative or local politicians - in the UK, Members of Parliament are usually quite good at sorting this sort of mess out. Alansplodge (talk) 19:53, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Publishing false information about companies other than for profit

Recently, here in Australia, we had an interesting case. An environmental activist [allegedly--seeWP:BLP -medeis] put out a fake press release. It stated that a major bank (ANZ) had withdrawn its' loan facility for a controversial coal mining company (Whitehaven Coal) due to "corporate responsibility concerns". This caused a temporary plunge (or "blip") in the company's share price. He was charged with "making a false or misleading statement" under the Corporations act. The case has yet to go to trial.

My question is this: I assume that the laws regarding this area are based around concerns about people manipulating the markets in order to profit thereby, e.g. pump and dump scams. Or the reverse - people shorting a stock, than spreading rumours of bad news in order to re-purchase the shares at a lower price.

In this case, [the accused] was not an employee or investor in Whitehaven Coal. He had no fiduciary duty to the company or its' shareholders. He did not stand to gain (financially) from any movements in the company's share price. Nor did he hack the Stock Exchange's web site so as to pretend that the news came from "the market". Have courts ever ruled as to whether this sort of "not for profit" rumour-spreading breaks any securities laws?

I could imagine other situations where this could occur. For example, a bitter ex-employee (who does not hold shares in his former employer) falsely defaming a company in order to "get back" at them (but gaining nothing, financially, for himself). Has this ever been tested in court as to whether this breaches the law?

(I'm asking about Securities / Corporations law, not laws covering libel or defamation. Many jurisdictions don't allow corporations to sue for libel. And I'm asking about the law here, not morals or ethics).

I'm curious about any Jurisdiction, not just Australia. Has this question ever arisen? 203.45.95.236 (talk) 11:50, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

I don't know about Australia, but in the United States the primary antifraud statute is Section 10(b) of the Securities Act of 1934 and Rule 10b-5, which apply only to transactions "in connection with the purchase or sale of any security." It's not immediately clear how the situation you describe would meet this test. The Supreme Court said in SEC v. Zandford that "the statute must not be construed so broadly as to convert every common-law fraud that happens to involve securities into a violation of § 10(b)." John M Baker (talk) 15:05, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

10b-5 is probably the primary law in the U.S., but I'm sure there are countless others that would apply too. Because you have some context with fiduciary duties, it's interesting to note that the insider trading definitions have expanded greatly since the 1980s, United States v. O'Hagan is probably a highwater mark in those terms. Shadowjams (talk) 16:55, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

• Please be careful not to violate WP:BLP. I have redacted the name of the accused as we have no article on the person and no proof of accusations is given here. μηδείς (talk) 17:48, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

The Yes Men are legendary culture jammers who have pulled many stunts like this. You might want to check their records, to see whether they've been sued or charged with an offence, and if so, what laws were invoked against them. BrainyBabe (talk) 20:12, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

I also can't speak about Australia, but in the UK laws on fraud and suchlike encompass statements which either makes you something (usually but not always money) or causes someone else to lose or risk losing theirs. So you don't personally have to benefit. Prokhorovka (talk) 21:44, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Average potty training age by country?

I would like to know what the average potty training age by country is. Is it later for children in the western world? How about China, Japan or Africa? Thanks --KuchenZimjah (talk) 16:14, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

The wiki article suggests that the average age for western children (two years) is older than eastern, specifically Vietnam (nine months). This article and others on the same webpage extend the same contention to India, China, and East Africa. The page also lists rather a lot of further reading material you may wish to check into. I hope this at least went some way towards answering your question. Biggs Pliff (talk) 01:11, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

My youngest cousin, now age two, was adopted at the age of several months from China; if I remember rightly, she was already potty trained before my uncle and aunt were able to take her home. Nyttend (talk) 03:43, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

That's gotta be wrong, unless the Chinese have some devlish mode of making kids use the potty before they can stand or walk. μηδείς (talk) 20:38, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Some of the Chinese use a bizarre device, a diaper with a hole in it, so the poop drops right out and they can just walk away. Google "Chinese diaper" and pick Image for examples. StuRat (talk) 22:24, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

See also Elimination communication. Infants and parents can apparently learn a way to avoid nappies/diapers. BrainyBabe (talk) 20:44, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

Mesoamerica

Was Mesoamerica more populated than Europe before 1492?--KAVEBEAR (talk) 16:23, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

You yourself raised a question in July where this was discussed at length. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Archives/Science/2013_July_13#Natives. Do you read answers to questions you post here? μηδείς (talk) 18:58, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

The short answer is almost certainly "no", even using the highest population estimates for Mesoamerica. Note, however, that Europe is around 5 times bigger than Mesoamerica. --Bowlhover (talk) 00:16, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

You understand how wrong a lot of the answers were. The Eurocentric approach to Native American history is to play down the population of the Native Americans to alleviate the guilt they have for eradicating a whole race of people from two continents to the point of extinction. Disease passed from Europeans to Native not because they were less populated people but because of the millennium of interactions that the Europeans had with large livestocks. Tenochitlan was one of the most populous area in the world and the population of the region was one of the most populous in the world. I just wanted some numbers/estimate range for each region. --KAVEBEAR (talk) 02:40, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

And how do you know the motivations of the "Eurocentric" researchers? Are you a mind reader? Can you make windows into men's souls? American researchers believed that the Americas had a low population not because of guilt, but because all the available evidence pointed in that direction. Disease wiped out entire societies before Europeans even arrived, so the first European settlers did indeed live in a sparsely populated land, and had no evidence that the population was higher before Columbus arrived. After several generations, not even Native Americans remembered the world that once existed. Archeological digs would not reveal the existence of Norte Chico or the Olmecs (civilizations where high population densities are expected) until relatively recent times. --Bowlhover (talk) 03:27, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

See [3], the problem lies with the varying degree of estimates made for the Americas by estimators with either high counting bias or a low-counting bias.--KAVEBEAR (talk) 02:45, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

It is 25 mill for Mesoamerica and 60 mill for Europe. What is that in term of population density?--KAVEBEAR (talk) 02:47, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Define the boundaries of Mesoamerica and of Europe, in contrast to North/South America and Asia respectively; without such boundaries we really can't say. Nyttend (talk) 03:42, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

The article "Central America" says that its area is 523,780 km² (202,233 sq mi), whereas our article on "Europe" says that its area is 10,180,000 km² (3,930,000 sq mi). Together with the population numbers you just mentioned, this would lead to population densities of 48 inhabitants per square kilometre (120/sq mi) and 5.9 inhabitants per square kilometre (15/sq mi), respectively. Gabbe (talk) 13:02, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

However, modern concepts of Central America are based on national borders, while Europe has rather arbitrary boundaries such as the Ural River. Current national boundaries obviously weren't observed in 1492, while our Europe article notes that the Europe-Asia boundary was substantially different in 1492 and that the Age of Discovery challenged the traditional culture-based boundaries of Europe; it would be hard to specify the continent's precise boundaries in the eyes of the Europeans of 1492. Unless, of course, you're asking about the 1492 population of the areas that are considered Europe and Mesoamerica in 2013; if so, please say that and you'll make our job a lot easier. Nyttend (talk) 13:59, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Mesoamerica as it is usually defined consists of central and southern Mexico, Belize, Guatemala, El Salvador, and western Honduras, so not all of Central America. 25 million is a very high estimate of its population in 1492, but its population probably was at least 10 million. It certainly had a higher population density than Europe as a whole, but that doesn't say much, since most of Mesoamerica is fertile and tropical, with a long growing season, and would thus be expected to support a larger population density than Europe, much of whose area is subarctic. A better comparison would be between Mesoamerica and a region like Italy, which had a higher population density, mainly because European technologies such as metals (for plows), livestock raising, and wind and water mills made its agriculture more productive, while wheeled transport made it possible to feed larger non-peasant populations. (Tenochtitlan's size was an exception in its region and highly dependent on nearby, intensive chinampa farming, whereas Italy had numerous cities that drew agricultural produce from a much larger hinterland.) Marco polo (talk) 14:59, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Finance

An organization received a bill in the month of June. A check, written and mailed in June, was not cashed until sometime in July. At the end of the fiscal year, June 30th, the check was not cashed by the receiver and was not included in the organization's bank statement. Should the billed amount (same as check amount) show as a liability on the organization's balance sheet? (A U.S. Organization) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.83.215.120 (talk) 18:24, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Hi, please always remember to "sign" your posts with ~~~~ so we may be able to see the user asking and their user page/talk page, a small but important point. Although this is asked somewhat as a hypothetical the conclusion one could draw from any answer would be borderline legal advice. We unfortunately do not give legal advice at Wikipedia thou other editors may respond to a more"with" limited "hypotheticals". ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 18:30, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

This sounds awfully like homework. If it is, we expect you to show what attempt you have made, and what help you need. --ColinFine (talk) 18:33, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Having come from the financial industry my 1st impression might be wrong, this may actually be homework as you observed ColinFine, then again ask Dennis Kozlowski or Martha Stewart about "creative accounting".Book keeping wasn't my side of the biz so I'll be quiet about caution & leave it with the above is the extent of my expertise on this one. ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 18:45, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

This is an accounting question, not a legal question, but it sure sounds like homework. Here are some questions for you to think about as you consider it: (1) Would it make sense for the entity to continue to record the liability after it has reduced its cash account by the amount of the payment, or to deduct the liability before it has made the deduction from its cash account? (2) Is the entity going to keep the amount of its check in its cash account? John M Baker (talk) 22:04, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

You can refer to Bank reconciliation. Sussexonian (talk) 18:40, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

August 5

Crime victims

Among foreign visitors to the US, who is more likely to be victimized by crime: males or females? How about amongst foreign visitors to the EU? I know that amongst Americans, males are more likely to be victimized by violent crime, and females by sexual assault. I don't know how well this generalizes to tourists. --50.125.66.85 (talk) 03:01, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Ed Freeman's wounds

Was Congressional Medal of Honor recipient Ed Freeman really wounded four times, as the Wikipedia article says (followed by an inline citation that doesn't confirm that assertion)? 202.155.85.18 (talk) 03:19, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

There's no mention of it in this interview. In fact, he states he was back at it the next morning. Also, the sentence was misleading in mentioning one "badly damaged Huey"; in the interview, he says "I went through three helicopters", so I've taken it all out. Clarityfiend (talk) 07:43, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Name of video art at Philadelphia Museum of Art

Hello. I recently had the pleasure of visiting the Philadelphia Museum of Art (wow!), but I can't recall the name of the piece or the artist's name of a video that was being shown there. It was this ten minute long, two piece collage/stop motion animation set up in the film/video room at the Museum. It was quite violent and featured a lot of hunting/American Revolution imagery. I've tried googling around, but couldn't find it. Any help would be appreciated! Thanks! 74.69.117.101 (talk) 03:32, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Quickest thing you could do is probably just call the museum; they'll know for sure. Phone and email contacts here. 184.147.136.32 (talk) 11:34, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

interconnection between airline and network

During the 1990s I've flown on several United Airlines domestic flights. On just about every one of them, I'd watch NBC Newsmagazine in the Air, NBC Sports Skybox, and quite a few programs which were on NBC at the time. What type of interconnection did United Airlines and NBC have?142.255.103.121 (talk) 04:56, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

I'm sure a google news search will find you some articles on that, but having flown several airlines before it is the name of the aviation game to lock in a supplier be it jet fuel (which some airlines supply themselves), peanuts or news feeds. Which party is the one giving away the loss leader would have to be answered by a news source on the subject but I would guess NBC gave it away to United as a way to increase viewership loyalty and probably promote cross content ("Hey and don't miss our companion coverage this Tuesday on Dateline, check local listings!") its basically free advertising for NBC product lines with the most captive audience humanly possible (what else are you really gonna do for 2-3-5 hours?). If my theory holds the airline would have disincentives to go out and get a normal cable lineup in that NBC is willing to pay a lot to monopolize that captive audience as United's "official news source". Similar to how companies vie to slap the NFL logo on their product and be advertised at the stadium, exclusivity/monopoly with a captive audience that is ready and willing to buy (be it at a stadium all pumped up or homesick on a trans-con for hours looking for a way to remind themselves of a better place). But again for a definitive answer a google news search might assist best if such articles exist. ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 05:12, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

These types of deals to provide inflight programming seem common. For example, see this press release in which United says they offer TV programming from "Australian Broadcasting Company, BBC, Deutsche Welle, NBC and TV5". 184.147.136.32 (talk) 11:41, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Alright. Does American Airlines have an interconnection with another network?142.255.103.121 (talk) 04:59, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

Monetary Policy In Australia

As an Aussie citizen looking to be enlightened, I was wondering, how monetary policy is being implemented currently (or over the recent years) in Australia? 220.233.20.37 (talk) 09:18, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

See: Reserve Bank of Australia, Open Market Operations and monetary policy. The long and short of it is, the Reserve Bank buys and sells securities, (largely government bonds) to alter the money supply and thus the interest rate. It attempts to set the interest rate to achieve its inflation target of 2-3% as well as maintain full employment.Do you have a more specific question? 203.206.240.247 (talk) 11:11, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Yes I do. Please see next topic over 220.233.20.37 (talk) 11:38, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Your next topic is about fiscal policy, which is implemented by the government, whereas this topic is about monetary policy, which is implemented by the Reserve Bank of Australia, which is independent of the government. If your question is how monetary policy has responded to recent economic and financial challenges (in concert with fiscal policy), you might refer to this article. Marco polo (talk) 14:43, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

We should probably have an article Four pillars policy on Australia's policy regarding consumer and retail banking services. Australia uses the banks, and the RBA to synchronise Australian monetary policy. However, as as been shown in recent years the four banks do have an independent monetary policy on Interest Rates which amounts to more than merely profit taking through oligopoly. In general, as a medium sized vulnerable economy, which has suffered coups d'etat regarding banking supply (Lang, etc.); Australia has a policy of national capital and government working together to ensure the viability of the banking system internationally. YMMV: it is the bourgeoisie we had to have. Fifelfoo (talk) 00:46, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Implemented Fiscal Policy In Australia Post GFC

What did Australia, Post GFC, hope to gain from implementing fiscal stimuli such as the first-time home buyers grants and stamp duty discounts? Also, were their hopes of the fiscal stimuli achieved? 220.233.20.37 (talk) 12:27, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Australia was the only country in the OECD that did not go into recession or experience major shifts in any other economic indicators. That was what the stimulus measures were aimed at, and they clearly succeeded. References for this are abundant. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 12:31, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Help with referencing? I just need to be pointed in the right direction! 220.233.20.37 (talk) 12:44, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

^^ Thanks heaps man. 220.233.20.37 (talk) 13:26, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Here's a story about the announcement of the Economic Stimulus Package in February 2009. And here's a 2013 assessment of the effectiveness of the package.

Btw, I was wrong about Australia being the only OECD country that avoided recession during the GFC. We were apparently one of only 3 advanced economies that managed to achieve this. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 23:50, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Names that end in -quist

How many family names are there that end in -quist?

• Renquist
• Lindquist
• _________?

Sneazy (talk) 16:15, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Blomquist 81.156.237.98 (talk) 16:18, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

And of course, Quist. "nickname for a thin man, from kvist ‘twig’." [4] Alansplodge (talk) 16:33, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

One more - Hillquist. Alansplodge (talk) 16:38, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

See https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special%3ASearch&search=*quist.

—Wavelength (talk) 17:05, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

It is very common in Sweden to compound two different nature words into a surname, such as renquist ("reindeer-twig"), lindquist ("linden-twig") or blomquist ("flower-twig"). See "Scandinavian family name etymology" and "Swedish name" for some more info. There are several dozen of them. Here are some more: Elmquist ("elm-twig"), Grönquist ("green-twig"), Hasselquist ("hazel-twig"), Ljungquist ("heather-twig"), Lundquist ("grove-twig"), Löfquist ("leaf-twig"), Malmquist ("ore-twig"), Palmquist ("palm-twig"), Pilquist ("willow-twig"), Ringquist ("ring-twig"), and Sundquist ("strait-twig"). Gabbe (talk) 17:50, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

• And don't forget Ventriloquist. I just had to say it before anyone else did, which was bound to happen sooner or later. Til Eulenspiegel /talk/ 19:47, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
  • Also Nyquist, which might get aliased as something else. --Trovatore (talk) 19:50, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Trawling through the Swedish Film Institute's database, there's also Ahlquist, Almquist, Apelquist, Bergquist, Billquist, Bjurquist, Björkquist, Boquist, Carlquist, Cederquist, Cronquist, Dahlquist, Edquist, Engquist, Enquist, Fallquist, Fernquist, Flodquist, Funkquist, Granquist, Hallquist, Hedquist, Hellquist, Holmquist, Kjellquist, Lagerquist, Landquist, Lejonquist, Liljequist, Nordquist, Rahmquist, Randquist, Rosenquist, Rundquist, Rönnquist, Sandquist, Sjöquist, Stjernquist, Strömquist, Söderquist, Thornquist, Thörnquist, Wingquist, Winquist, Yllequist, Zetterquist, and Ödquist. Gabbe (talk) 21:56, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

The famous Jewish actor, Sol Iloquist? μηδείς (talk) 00:42, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Known for his monologues and one-liners...? Til Eulenspiegel /talk/ 01:07, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

And of course, the party hasn't really started until Bob Utraquist shows up with both bread and wine... Gabbe (talk) 08:27, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

As commented above, 'quist' is just a fancier version of 'kvist' (the common contemporary spelling in Swedish), so for each of the examples above, there are also variants with the spelling 'kvist', such as Edkvist, Bergkvist, etc.. --Soman (talk) 17:30, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

There's also "-qvist", like Henrik Lundqvist. InedibleHulk (talk) 19:57, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Why are there more cats than seals?

1,510,000,000 vs 369,000,000! Horatio Snickers (talk) 20:19, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

For the same reason that there are more microbes than there are humans. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 20:28, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

I would assume that, under human cultivation and domestication, cats breed like rabbits for keeping as housepets or meat or fur. Sneazy (talk) 21:29, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Not enough Take-out curry restaurants?

Not to mention sockkittens and trollpussies. We have no way, given AGF, of calculating their real numbers. μηδείς (talk) 22:16, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

One way to think of it is that they're really all the same guy. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 23:33, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Yes, it's because cats are useful to humans, while seals are not (except perhaps dead and/or at Sea World). Historically, cats were useful to kill rodents which would otherwise endanger and contaminate the food stores, but they also found a way into people's hearts. (Seals may be cute, too, but do you really want to pet one ?) StuRat (talk) 22:12, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

In a recent National Geographic, the subject of Bacteriophages came up. The article said they are "by far the most abundant organism on earth". 1.5 million cats? Ha! The article says there are more than 1 trillion bacteriophages - just in one average human body. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 23:33, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

That's 1.5 billion cats. Still chicken feed, admittedly. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 23:41, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

D'oh! I even read it as 1.5 billion and typed 1.5 million. Still, a mere blip compared to microbes. The NG blurb (which was part of an article about explorations) stated that there are more phages on earth than there are stars in the heavens - literally: That all the stars in the known universe are outnumbered by phages. Don't know where they got their numbers from, but it's not hard to believe. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 00:15, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Comparing organisms of such vastly different scales is meaningless. Perhaps if you compared the number of viruses with the number of cat cells, you might get a more meaningful comparison, although cat cells are still far larger than a virus. StuRat (talk) 00:34, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Comparing cats with seals is likewise meaningless. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 01:01, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

I disagree. If you compare two mammals of a roughly similar size, and one is far more numerous than the other, then that does, indeed, require an explanation, whereas in the case of cats versus viruses no other explanation is needed than that they exist at a scale many orders of magnitude apart. Indeed, if the numbers did match in such a case, this would be astonishing. StuRat (talk) 08:31, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

It's the fault of those damned cat herders doing too good a job. Clarityfiend (talk) 13:20, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

You should fucking compare biomass. 163.202.48.126 (talk) 13:35, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

You should not fucking swear here. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 21:21, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Amagama akhe ngamasimba. μηδείς (talk) 21:36, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

What? 163.202.48.125 (talk) 12:03, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

August 6

Siaosi U. Tukuʻaho

Siaosi U. Tukuʻaho was a Tongan prime minster and father of Viliami Tungī Mailefihi. His Tongan article calls him "Siaosi U. Tukuʻaho's". What did the U stand for in Siaosi U. Tukuʻaho's name? --KAVEBEAR (talk) 04:16, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Kentucky Senate Election

Why is there a US senatorial election in Kentucky this year, this being at odds with the even-year norm? --Halcatalyst (talk) 04:33, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

The election itself is next year. They've just started campaigning already. Hot Stop talk-contribs 04:40, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

I can hardly believe that. Aren't they going to have a vote soon? --Halcatalyst (talk) 13:49, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

The primary election is May 20. Hot Stop talk-contribs 14:45, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Nowadays there seems to be constant campaigning. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 15:25, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

I live in Massachusetts. Next year's senate election will be our fourth in five years. Hot Stop talk-contribs 15:28, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

I can't believe they're campaigning so hard when the primary is nine months away. The Democrat is on the hustings too. I never heard of this happening in the states, as opposed to the presidential campaigns. --Halcatalyst (talk) 19:40, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

It's been getting worse over the last decade. Hell, political pundits are already speculating who the new Republican and Democrat Presidential candidates will be, and that election isn't until 2016. With the ability for groups to anonymously advertise on behalf of / against candidates, it has become an arms race of political ads. — The Hand That Feeds You:^Bite 21:20, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

And TV ratings. Fox News Channel has become the unofficial propaganda arm of the Republican Party, and that helps keep the pot stirred. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 21:53, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Owned by Murdoch. Yankee, go home!  :) -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 22:13, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

sarns

Does anyone know sarns as British paths, which are mentioned in Robert McFarlane's "The Old Ways"? Besides, one more question about the book: Is there any difference between holloways and shutes? The author says in another book "The Wild Places" that they are different names in different places referring to the same paths. But I can't figure out just why the author juxtaposes them in the second chapter of "The Old Ways". Your explanation would be much appreciated. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 1.202.187.153 (talk) 04:41, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Sarn seems to be a Welsh word for causeway or road, per Sarn Badrig and Sarn Helen. For holloways (hollow ways) see Sunken lane. Googling seems to show that Shute or Shute's Lane can be a name given to old sunken lanes (examples here and here). MacFarlane repeats his assertion here that shutes, bostels and grundles are all synonyms for holloways in different regions. - Karenjc 07:46, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Samoa was there ever a monarchy

Was Samoa ever a monarchy? Wikipedia's article claims it was until Malietoa Tanumafili II's death but the system of chiefs doesn't seem to resemble a monarchy considering how multiple chiefs live at the same time. You got sources calling Malietoa Tanumafili II a monarch and other calling him head of state (not mentioning any connection to monarchy) or just paramount chief. It seem really confusing. --KAVEBEAR (talk) 04:58, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Not all monarchies require one head of state to die before the next takes over. In particular, the article on Samoa says it was a Constitutional monarchy, which is one form of Monarchy that can have a fixed term for the head of state. RudolfRed (talk) 05:53, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

That doesn't seem to be the case and I read that part already and the BBC news article that cites that. From the article and base on my interpretation, it seems two paramount chiefs were chosen/elected as joint heads of state for life (can they be considered monarchs or non-monarchs) when Samoa gain independence from New Zealand and Malietoa Tanumafili II survived his co-head of state, and after he died the system became elective with only one head of state serving a fix term. To me this is really confusing because many sources call Malietoa Tanumafili II a monarch and not a monarch. How do the Samoan interpret the system between 1962 to 2007?--KAVEBEAR (talk) 06:51, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

::To see the Samoan take, you could look at what Samoan newspapers said. These are the results of a search of the Samoa Observer. Looks like they called him both "Head of State" and "His Highness". 184.147.136.32 (talk) 11:53, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Legal definitions of harassment in Australia

I'm looking for a rough legal definition of what constitutes "harassment" and/or "stalking" in Australia. Naturally I am not asking for legal advice as to whether any particular behaviour is harassment or stalking, merely a link to a reliable source the might provide a definition of the term in a legal context. Ideally the definition will cover circumstances other than just "workplace", "sexual" or "racial" harassment. 124.148.86.40 (talk) 09:55, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

There are eight jurisdictions in Australia that make their own laws. Which state/territory?
Sleigh (talk) 11:50, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Western Australia. 124.148.86.40 (talk) 12:11, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

The Criminal Code of WWestern Australia is available as a downloadable pdf here; once you download it you can do a search for harassment or stalking - at a quick glance, I can see both terms are used. 184.147.136.32 (talk) 13:00, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for that. Interestingly, the only reference to harassment appears to be "racial harassment" (Chapter XI — Racist harassment and incitement to racial hatred). Are there any Commonwealth laws that might define harassment other than racial, sexual or workplace?

Chapter XXXIIIB — Stalking does include definitions of "intimidate" and "pursue", which are sufficiently close to (what I was looking for as) "harassment" for my purposes. 124.148.86.40 (talk) 13:30, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

No problem! According to Criminal law of Australia, there are two federal criminal pieces of legislation. The Criminal Code Act 1995 is here and the Crimes Act 1914 here. 184.147.136.32 (talk) 13:41, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Neither of the Commonwealth Acts appear to define harassment either. Not to worry, I've got enough to go on now. Thanks 124.148.86.40 (talk) 13:57, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Sleigh, make that 9 jurisdictions (6 states, 2 self-governing internal territories, and the federal government). -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 21:17, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

UK oath and pledge of citizenship

Here's something I've been wondering: Say you apply for British citizenship, and thus have to take the oath to the monarch and pledge to the country. Would it then be illegal to join the Republic campaign or voting "Yes" in the Scottish Independence referendum, seeing as those actions are basically the diametrical opposite of bearing allegiance to the monarch and loyalty to the UK?--Newbiepedian (Hailing Frequencies) 12:16, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Swearing an oath of allegiance to her majesty is a point of contention to some. See [5] and [6] for two examples. Gabbe (talk) 12:54, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

See Oath of Allegiance (United Kingdom). However, in answer to the question "would it be illegal to either campaign for a republic or to campaign for Scottish Independence?" then you would have to identify a law that is broken if you do either of those things. There is no such law. (Compare perjury where you swear an oath to tell the truth in court, but then do not. The illegality lies in the fact that lying in court breaches the Perjury Act 1911 which states (paraphrasing) that if you lie while under oath in court you have committed a crime. The lying is the actus reus rather than the oath breaking). Valiantis (talk) 13:37, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

This isn't a new issue in Scotland. Under the later Stuarts, the violent dispute between Covenanters and the Crown included their refusal to take oaths of allegiance/loyalty, while a related oath of allegiance produced the Burgher/Anti-Burgher split in the Associate Presbyterian Church in the 1740s. Nyttend (talk) 18:11, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

It's no different from a civil/public servant who personally violently disagrees with the policies of the government in power. As long as he chooses to remain employed by that civil service, he has a duty to serve the government of the day to the best of his ability and put his own political positions to one side. But come election day, he has his democratic chance to vote them out. If a monarchy is abolished through a free and fair democratic process, that is an excellent demonstration of how a democracy is supposed to work. We had a referendum in Australia in 1999 on whether or not to become a republic. It didn't succeed, but before the vote the Queen of Australia said that this was entirely a matter for us Aussies, and whatever decision we made would be fine by her. The people who voted for change were not displaying any sort of lack of allegiance to the Queen; they simply wanted a system they believed was more appropriate for us. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 21:12, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Love the title you used for the Monarch. So often, people forget that her "Queen of the UK" title is not really relevant for many people. --Lgriot (talk) 08:15, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. The UK has about 46% of the combined population of the 16 Commonwealth Realms, so a CR citizen chosen at random has a better than even chance of being from some country other than the UK. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 08:37, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

The oath or affirmation taken by new subjects of Her Majesty states "I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth the Second, her Heirs and Successors, according to law" [7] (the same wording, incidentally, as the oath or affirmation taken by Members of Parliament). Someone who makes this pledge is not contradicting it if they honestly believe that Her Majesty's successors ought to be elected Presidents. The words 'according to law' are also significant: the law can be changed. It's also worth noting that the present plan proposed for Scottish independence involves Her Majesty remaining Queen of Scots. Sam Blacketer (talk) 10:42, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Original or early/mid 20th century Brazilian capital building/presidential office

Hi all, ok did the obligatory Google and even checked out the Portugese wikipedia for this though I don't know Portugese. What was the pre 1960 capital or legislative building for Brazil? What was the pre 1960 presidential residence? I know Rio was the capital until 1960 however I can't seem to find any information or images on those structures. Thanks in advance! ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 15:10, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Here are the buildings you are looking for: The legislative building was the pt:Palácio Tiradentes. The executive building was the pt:Palácio do Catete. Marco polo (talk) 15:29, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Thanks Marco polo, this answers it!

Resolved

^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 18:05, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Checking Google Images, it appears they both still exist, or at least there are recent photos. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 15:55, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Will check, thanks Bugs! ^{Market St.⧏} _{⧐ Diamond Way} 18:05, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Why is English the official language of the U.S.A?

I am not American, but from what I understand, a majority of immigrants to the U.S over the years were from German descent. So why is English the official language when independence was declared? --KuchenZimjah (talk) 17:18, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

It's not - see List of official languages by state - the USA does not have an official language. Here's a previous discussion on the German question. 184.147.136.32 (talk) 17:24, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

• English is not the official language, rather the de facto language. Also, when the United States was first formed Germans were not the largest ethnic group in the country. Tombo7791 (talk) 17:31, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Not clear to me that they are now, or ever have been. "German" tends to be the ethnic derivation most reported on the census, but that's because a lot of people put "American", and I suspect that most of the "Americans" have a large percentage of English ancestry (though very few will have 100%). --Trovatore (talk) 17:54, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

There was no point in the history of the United States when German speakers were more than a fairly small minority of the country's residents. Except for New York, the colonies that became the United States were founded by English speakers. A large majority of immigrants to all of the colonies (except maybe Pennsylvania) were English speakers. Even in Pennsylvania, the initial settlers were almost all English speakers, and, in most parts of the colony, German immigrants' children or grandchildren adopted English because that was the language of the majority. At the time of independence, an overwhelming percentage of residents were English speakers. This initial (English speaking) population multiplied rapidly through the 19th century. Each generation of German-speaking immigrants formed a minority in an English-speaking society. Almost invariably, the immigrants' children learned fluent English as children or young adults and in turn raised their children in English-speaking households. There was never a critical mass of German speakers to challenge English as the dominant language in the United States. Marco polo (talk) 18:13, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

I think you missed New Sweden and Louisiana, Florida, Texas, New Mexico, California. Rmhermen (talk) 22:36, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

None of which were part of the original 13 colonies / states. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 22:46, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

The statement was "colonies that became the United States", not the 13 colonies. Rmhermen (talk) 13:34, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

The 13 (British) colonies became the United States. The territories you named joined the United States. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 13:59, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

It's not the official language, as per that episode of QI! Lugnuts ^{Dick Laurent is dead} 18:14, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

The precursor of the United States was the Thirteen Colonies, which were British colonies. Their population was mainly composed of British settlers and black slaves, with a much smaller German population: "By 1776 about 85% of the white population was of English, Irish, Scottish or Welsh descent, with 9% of German origin and 4% Dutch." --50.47.84.246 (talk) 07:47, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Wards of Zimbabwe

Hi. I'm trying to complete the redlinks on this page, but I can't find even the basic info to verify if these places actually exist! I've looked on several Zimbabwean government websites, but there's little info about (it's almost as if it's run by a dictatorship...). Can anyone help in just sourcing the existance of these wards? I'm happy to start turning the redlinks blue once I have the base info. Thanks! Lugnuts ^{Dick Laurent is dead} 18:16, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

That is strange. I'm only finding numbered wards, not named ones. I'll leave the places I looked at in case it helps - at least the next searcher can avoid duplication. Citypopulation.de (numbered wards in Bulawayo and Harare), 2012 Census (via the UN) (numbers only), and Zimbabwe Electoral Commission (numbers only). There is also the official Zimbabwe Statistics office, but I couldn't even get that page to open. 184.147.136.32 (talk) 20:42, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for your help. Yes, I can't get that last page to open either. Lugnuts ^{Dick Laurent is dead} 06:59, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

It would be better to improve the Wards of Zimbabwe article rather than try to create hundreds of stubs which will very probably be deemed non-notable and proposed for deletion. For example, what significance do 'wards' have in that country? Are they just electoral districts used for sub-national elections (in which case they are certainly non notable)? Does each one have an assembly of some sort or a mayor/prefect? Do the boundaries change frequently and who fixes them? Is there a minimum/maximum population for a ward? All properly sourced of course. Sussexonian (talk) 07:35, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

All populated places are notable. Let me know how your AfD for Matshetshe goes. Lugnuts ^{Dick Laurent is dead} 09:13, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

August 7

Proposed Images

I have taken two low-quality photos (the cover and the inside) of a C4M leaflet that was put through my door. I'd like to upload these images to this article. I believe that they fall within the Fair Use category since the photo itself is mine, and C4M itself distributed this political leaflet widely across the country, free of charge. The leaflet illustrates part of the 'Campaigning' discussion in the article and does not have any images included in it (other than one of the C4M logos) that could upset any individual. Could someone advise on whether they think these images would be appropriate to upload? I am keen to put them up, but do NOT want to be banned for breaking Wiki rules. Thanks! Wander Woman (talk) 10:07, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Quoted by Jenova20 who doesn't know the answer relating to article Coalition for Marriage but would like to. Thanks ツ Jenova20 ^(email) 19:51, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

The best place for questions like this is WP:MCQ. RudolfRed (talk) 03:40, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. I'll try there ツ Jenova20 ^(email) 12:45, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

mundane and worldly

I get confused with the sentence: "Footpaths are mundane in the best sense of that word: 'worldly',open to all." I'm not sure what "that word" actually refers to,"worldly or "mundane". And is there any difference between the two synonyms? I would be much obliged by your explanation. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 114.251.216.209 (talk) 03:06, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

I'm certain that it refers to the word 'mundane'. I know of three definitions of 'mundane': ordinary/plain/boresome; the speaker must then know of another definition. It does not seem unreasonable to me, for a slightly different perspective of the word to lead to that definition. Something that is beyond ordinary is exclusive, and by extended logic, 'not open to all'. Plasmic Physics (talk) 03:44, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Dictionaries list a second, less-common meaning - of this world, as opposed to heavenly or spiritual - which is what the writer is apparently trying to say. I question whether that is a good choice of words though. Clarityfiend (talk) 03:49, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

The words "mundane" and "worldly" started out as synonyms, but their usage has come to mean "ordinary" and "wise" respectively. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 03:55, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Not so good sir on the latter word. To be wise, is to remove oneself from the worldly perspective, such as to become an insightful audience to one's own life. Plasmic Physics (talk) 04:05, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

'Wordly' is the very antonym to 'wise', to be worldly, is to follow along the common path without regard to things greater than oneself. It is often considered folly - to be shortsighted. Wisdom entails to think: why should I bear a grudge, what does it possibly profit and to whom? Worldliness entails to think, I shall bear a grudge because such is my want, or rather no thought upon the matter at all. Plasmic Physics (talk) 05:39, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Moreover, if you are instead implying the other definition of worldly - 'experienced', then neither does that equate with 'wise'. One can be an experienced fool, as much as it is possible to be an experienced in wisdom. Plasmic Physics (talk) 05:43, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Well, who should I believe? You? Or the author of that quote? ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 07:15, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Both, because I am not being contrary. Plasmic Physics (talk) 07:24, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Contrariwise, if it was so, it might be; and if it were so, it would be; but as it isn't, it ain't. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 10:55, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

That makes no sense, it's a non sequitur argument. Plasmic Physics (talk) 13:14, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Firstly, if it was contrary, then it will always remain so, chance does not play a factor. Secondly, even if 'might' was the correct word to use, it is contradictory to then also use 'would'. Thirdly, how does the self-evident conclusion relate? I don't really care for an elucidation on the above rather meaningless statement, however, I would still like to know why you think that I am contrary. Plasmic Physics (talk) 13:32, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Where did I say you were contrary? ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 13:58, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

So, what were you saying? Plasmic Physics (talk) 22:41, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Do the definitions given here help at all? --TammyMoet (talk) 08:25, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

To reenact the Civil War, while I have a 1/2 Asian background...

I don't hear anything about Asian immigrants having fought the Civil War because it was a few decades before Asian immigration to the U.S. took off.

Given that I'm 1/2 Korean, 1/4 White, 1/4 Jewish, I would look less the part than most other reenactors. Races can and do matter in Civil War reenactments for the sake of historical accuracy.

Would it be that I'd best reenact a Native American civil war soldier? (Since I could theoretically look that part?) If so, is it easy to start or do I have to succeed an audition? And what extra preparation would I need as a Native American heading into battle? (Wearing a feather/headdress behind my uniform hat, etc.?) And were Native American soldiers integrated into otherwise "normal" regiments?

If they weren't integrated into usual regiments, would it be acceptable to roleplay as a "runaway" who decided to abandon the tribal life to live the life of the white folk?

I'm not sure I could pass off as a "normal" soldier with my complexion, so I'll need potential solutions. Thanks. --75.39.128.83 (talk) 04:14, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

There were quite a few Civil War veterans of Asian ancestry. This article talks about an effort to give about 200 veterans posthumous citizenship. Hack (talk) 04:40, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Here's a Voice of America article about (apparently) those same 200. According to the article, at least five fought for the South, including the sons of Chang and Eng Bunker, the original Siamese twins. Thus, you can authentically participate on either side. Clarityfiend (talk) 06:38, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Military history of Asian Americans#19 century names a few more names. Clarityfiend (talk) 06:41, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

As for Native Americans, check out Thomas' Legion of Cherokee Indians and Highlanders. Clarityfiend (talk) 06:44, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Also see Native Americans in the American Civil War. Clarityfiend (talk) 06:53, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

There are quite a few re-enactor groups. Have you contacted any of them about this question? ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 07:16, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

I don't know what you look like, but if it's not too Asian, why not put on some makeup to make yourself more white? You're not an actor, and in an reenactment with dozens (hundreds?) of people, nobody's going to pay enough attention to you to notice that your skin color is wrong. --50.47.84.246 (talk) 07:41, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

The article Buffalo Soldier is interesting, particularly given the wide range of skin colours present in indigenous Africans. --TammyMoet (talk) 08:22, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

The OP seem quite enthusiastic and I would assume that would matter more than the colour of your skin. Astronaut (talk) 17:46, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

That's right. I think of opera singers like Leontyne Price, Grace Bumbry, Mattiwilda Dobbs, Jessye Norman and others, who sing in operas in roles where the skin colour of the occupant is never specified but is obviously assumed to be white (such as an 18th-century Italian Countess or the wife of a 19th-century German Field-Marshal). It doesn't faze anyone involved, including the audience.

Curiously, though, when white singers play black roles (such as in Otello or Porgy and Bess), they do make an attempt to look the part. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 22:21, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Coloring

Does anyone have any information about the practice of coloring in maritime commerce? Any clue will help me, and make thankful. --Omidinist (talk) 05:11, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

See "International maritime signal flags".

—Wavelength (talk) 05:18, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Thank you, but it's not what I'm looking for. You see, through this practice, custom charges at ports changed. It was used regularly by the agents of East India Companies. Omidinist (talk) 06:50, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

I can't tell exactly what it is you're looking for. Can you give us a better explanation? And, I'd suggest that if you're searching the web, you may do better by searching for "colouring", the UK spelling. HiLo48 (talk) 07:36, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

There was a (deceitful?) practice called colo(u)ring, by which mercantile ships could cause a reduction in the custom duties they paid at foreign seaports. What is this colo(u)ring? Omidinist (talk) 08:40, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Domestic (U.S.A.) only and not the term you're looking for, but avoiding a transport toll by misrepresenting the shipment content is the topic of the traditional song, "Rock Island Line". See the lyrics to the first verse. -- Deborahjay (talk) 10:36, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

A good hint, though. Thanks. More help, please. Omidinist (talk) 11:24, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

The OED has "to colour strangers' goods: to enter a foreign merchant's goods at the custom-house under a freeman's name, for the purpose of evading additional duties". That seems to accord with the usage in the heading of the last paragraph on this page, for example. Deor (talk) 12:49, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Great! Thank you very much, Deor. Omidinist (talk) 13:04, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Is Flag of convenience what you are looking for? Ships fly an Ensign (a flag usually flown from the stern) which sometimes referred to as flying the colours - though "colours" is usually a military term rather than a commercial term. Astronaut (talk) 17:42, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Helpful information. Thanks. But there's no mention of coloring in the whole article. Omidinist (talk) 18:37, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

False colors redirects to False flag. Sounds like the same sort of thing as in the Naval Warfare section, just in a peacetime context. Except raising your true colours before entering a commercial port would defeat the purpose. InedibleHulk (talk) 20:08, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

Not to be confused with True Colors InedibleHulk (talk) 20:14, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

Or any of these true colors. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 22:12, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Type of shredder allegedly used by Saddam Hussein

The article Saddam Hussein's alleged shredder mentions that it supposedly was a plastic shredder, but I heard some claim that it was a wood chipper. Should it be mentioned that this shredder that probably didn't exist may have been a wood chipper? 108.0.244.168 (talk) 09:12, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

The place to discuss this would be on the article talk page, but "I heard some claim" is not what we call a reliable source.--Shantavira|^{feed me} 09:44, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

He might have Saddam mixed up with the bad guy in Fargo. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 14:01, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

I can cite sources that claim it may have been a wood chipper. Here, it has been claimed to be a wood chipper. 108.0.244.168 (talk) 20:02, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Flin Flon: one city, two provinces

I always assumed Flin Flon (which is partly in Alberta and partly in Saskatchewan) was technically two cities because it's in two Canadian provinces, but the Wikipedia article is quite clear that it is just one entity. I only want to ask if this complicates its relationships with its provincial governments - not just by doubling the paperwork but in terms of conflicting policies or grants or laws and such? Do any provincial laws or anything make life different on either side for border? Hayttom 14:01, 7 August 2013 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Hayttom (talk • contribs)

You may be thinking of Lloydminster. Flin Flon is Manitoba/Saskatchewan, and much smaller. The Lloydminster article has much more detail on the situation. Mingmingla (talk) 14:37, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

If you think that's interesting, have a look at Beebe Plain, Vermont and Beebe Plain, Quebec: "Access to homes on Canusa Street is made through the Canadian border. U.S. citizens residing there have to report to their customs if traveling south, and to the Canadian customs if traveling elsewhere in Beebe." - I don't rightly know how it works nowadays, but when I was a kid you could go down that street and all the cars had Quebec plates on one side of the street, US plates on the other side, and everyone could cross freely into the other country. After 9/11 and subsequent increase in border security, it appears to have gotten a lot more complicated, with even a building that is cut by the border and which "Canadian citizens are not allowed to access [...] without reporting to the U.S. customs first, and then to the Canadian customs when going back." Effovex (talk) 02:27, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Lihyan

Hello,

what was the area of the kingdom Lihyan in 325 BC?

Was it just the region around Al-Ula or did it even extent to the Red Sea?

Greetings HeliosX (talk) 17:35, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Failed/Unsuccessful United States Historical Territorial Acquisition Attempts

I know that the United States of America successfully acquired many areas/territories throughout its history, but in which cases did the U.S. fail in attempting to acquire areas/territories which it (the U.S. President and/or a large part of the U.S. Congress) sought? Off of the top of my head, I can think of:

• The U.S. possibly being open to acquiring a part of (British) Canada during the War of 1812 if the U.S. would end up winning this war.
• The U.S. being open to acquiring the Baja California peninsula in the Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo, but ending up letting Mexico keep it.
• Maybe the All Mexico movement in the 1840s (U.S. President Polk opposed acquiring all of Mexico, but many members of the U.S. Congress might have supported doing this).
• The failed efforts of U.S. Presidents Polk and Pierce to acquire Cuba from Spain (such as with the Ostend Manifesto) in the late 1840s and in the early 1850s.
• The U.S. wanting to acquired much more of northern Mexico in the Gadsden Purchase, but ending up only purchasing a small amount of Mexican land.
• U.S. President Ulysses S. Grant's failed attempt to acquire the Dominican Republic in the early 1870s.
• The possibility that many members of the U.S. Senate supported annexing Cuba in 1898 (the Teller Amendment, which prohibited the U.S. from annexing Cuba, only narrowly passed in the U.S. Senate).

Which other cases of this am I missing here?

For the record, I am only talking about areas/territories which the U.S. wanted to permanently keep. Thank you very much. Futurist110 (talk) 20:44, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

There have been occasional disputes, such as Oregon boundary dispute, and the situations with Maine and Lake of the Woods in Minnesota. Do those fit your premise? ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 21:08, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Northern Oregon Territory could work here if at least one U.S. President and/or a large part of the U.S. Congress ever supported trying to acquire it. What is the story with the Lake of the Woods in Minnesota? As for Maine, I will need to read more about it--I know that it has a dispute with British Canada over its northern boundary until 1842 or so, but I am unsure if any U.S. President and/or a large part of the U.S. Congress ever tried to acquire more territory for Maine's northern areas. Also, I prefer that other cases which I am missing here discuss relatively large amounts of territory, not very small amounts of territory. Futurist110 (talk) 21:22, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

See Lake of the Woods. That is but one of many weird things about the US-Canadian border, including at least one still-disputed territory. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 23:15, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

I remember reading in The Presidents and the Prime Ministers by Lawrence Martin (ISBN 9780770107901) that the annexation of Canada in its entirety was seriously considered several times after Canada's independence in 1867. הסרפד (call me Hasirpad) 03:45, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

I previously read the Wikipedia article in regards to this topic, and I don't remember it saying that any U.S. President and/or any large part of the U.S. Congress ever made a serious effort to try annexing all of Canada after 1867. Futurist110 (talk) 04:27, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

The government never seriously considered it, but the army apparently had a hypothetical plan for it (War Plan Red). Adam Bishop (talk) 11:06, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Scottish vs. English vs. UK legal system in a bankruptcy or reorg situation (major)

RBC Group - a huge, systemically important bank, is legally domiciled in Edinburgh Scotland. If that huge bank got into financial trouble, what court (Scottish, English or "UK") would hear the case and administer it (i.e be in control of the resolution). I understand that despite the unification under the UK, Scotland never gave up its own independent legal system. If an individual in Scotland goes bankrupt, I believe only a Scottish (not English) court would preside. I also understand that 80% of RBC is in fact currently owned by the UK government. However, in in times of trouble the legal location is typically controlling for where the case is heard.

RBC gets into trouble - what regulator is in charge, what court is in charge, who bails them out, and who pays? That's the basic question. Are Scottish nationals in control of that, or is it really the English who would be in control?

A few short years ago RBC was the largest bank in the world and it remains easily in the top 20.

Rick (talk) 22:12, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

The main financial regulator for the whole of the UK is now the PRA, a part of the Bank of England (despite the name, it has UK-wide responsibilities). The bank would never be allowed to go bankrupt; jurisdiction for more plausible proceedings would depend on the issues involved. Bailouts would come from the UK, which is sometimes controlled by English, sometimes by Scottish politicians. Henry^Flower 23:51, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Rick I presume you are asking about Royal Bank of Scotland not Royal Bank of Canada. From memory RBS did own RBC years ago but there is no current relationship. Sussexonian (talk) 07:40, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Courts are not really as intimately involved in bank failures as they would be in a firm's or individuals bankruptcy. Banks don't go bankrupt. By their very nature, (modern) banks are public/private enterprises and fall under the administrative agencies of the state. They are reorganized, and only when the banking authorities decide. As long as the Bank of England or the Fed, and the Treasury departments and central governments behind these central banks decide to not reorganize a bank, decide to keep backing the bank with (the credible promise of) government money, the bank can keep on going. Forever - or as long as the state exists. For example, the big banks of the USA and China right now and Japan after its crisis are/were all "in financial trouble", "insolvent", "bankrupt", "zombies". Would have been shut down/ prosecuted / reorganized under earlier / nominally valid but not currently effective regulatory regimes. (An essential difference is that the big US banks are now run as control frauds for their managements' benefit, the Chinese banks as vehicles for disguised state fiscal policy, Japan perhaps somewhere in-between.)

The Banking Act 2009 seems to be the current UK legislation, and covers Scotland and the Royal Bank of Scotland. So the financial system seems unified in that regard. If Scotland were to become independent, who would back an insolvent bank's liabilities and to what extent might become a ticklish matter of negotiation between the two governments. United Kingdom banking law UK Financial Investments , Nationalisation of Northern Rock, 2008 United Kingdom bank rescue package, UK Asset Resolution and Banking (Special Provisions) Act 2008 may also help.John Z (talk) 08:26, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

August 8

Introduction to Thomas Clark

Could anyone introduce briefly to me Thomas Clark, who is the author of the prose-poem "In Praise of Walking"? Are there any other important works that he has written? Thank you! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 114.251.216.209 (talk) 07:31, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Here you go: Thomas A. Clark biographical note, Thomas A. Clark at the Scottish Poetry Library. He’s published at least seven books and Wikipedia has an article on his publishing company, Moschatel Press. 184.147.136.32 (talk) 11:36, 8 August 2013 (UTC)