Template talk:Did you know

Landing craft during Zapad 2009 ... that the Russian and Belarussian military exercise Zapad 2009 (pictured) involved nuclear-capable ballistic missiles? ... that the Robyn Gigl novel By Way of Sorrow, which features a transgender lawyer as the protagonist, was described as "quietly groundbreaking" by The New York Times? ... that due to a 2024 heat wave in Southeast Asia, heat indices in the Philippines rose to dangerous levels, as high as 51 °C (124 °F)? ... that Hal Malchow consulted for every Democratic presidential nominee from 1988 through 2004? ... that before its inhabitants were evicted, Rosal was the largest of 49 townships in Strathnaver? ... that Mohammad Saifullah Ozaki, an academic in Japan born to a Hindu family in Bangladesh, became a leader in the Islamic State? ... that floods across New York City in September 2023 allowed a sea lion to escape her enclosure at the Central Park Zoo? ... that Dedie Rachim was the first active member of the Corruption Eradication Commission to be elected to public office? ... that a boot is the only monument in the United States dedicated to the traitor Benedict Arnold because it "was the only part of Arnold not to later turn traitor"?

This page is for nominations to appear in the "Did you know" section (reproduced on the right) on the Main Page.

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Using a DYK suggestion string (see below examples), list new suggestions in the candidate entries section below under the date the article was created or the expansion began (not the date you submit it here), with the newest dates at the top. Any user may nominate a DYK suggestion; self-nominations are permitted and encouraged. Thanks for participating and please remember to check back for comments on your nomination.

DYK criteria

Official criteria: DYK rules
Unofficial criteria: LaPella's unwritten rules

• DYK evaluation includes:

• Length - The Article should contain at least 1,500 characters in main body text (ignoring infoboxes, categories, references, lists, and tables). This is a mandatory minimum; in practice, articles having more than 1,500 characters of prose still may be rejected as too short, at the discretion of the selecting administrators.
• Verification - The DYK hook fact in the article needs an inline cite at the end of the sentence and the article in general should use inline, cited sources.
• Date - The new article should be no more than five days old and the expanded article should be expanded at least fivefold with new text within the last five days.

• Length

• DYK qualifying characters: To count the number of characters in a piece of text, you will need to use a JavaScript extension like User:Dr pda/prosesize.js (instructions on the talk page), a free website like this, or an external software program that has a character-counting feature. For example, if you are using Microsoft Word, select the text from the article page (or, in the case of "Did you know" nominations, this Talk page) – not the edit page containing Wikitext – then copy and paste it into a blank document. Click "Tools" ("Review" in Office 2007), then "Word Count", and note the "Characters (with spaces)" figure. Other word processing programs may have a similar feature. For Mac users, Apple has a Word counter widget available for Mac OS X 10.4 or later. Note: The character counts indicated on "Revision history" pages are not accurate for DYK purposes as they include categories, infoboxes and similar text in articles, and comments and signatures in hooks on this page.
• Lists: Proposed lists need 1,500+ characters of prose text. The listed items themselves are not counted as part the the 1,500 DYK qualifying characters

• Verification

• Suggested facts (the 'hook') should be:
  1. interesting to draw in a variety of readers,
  2. short and concise (fewer than about 200 characters, including spaces),
  3. neutral,
  4. definite facts that are mentioned in the article, and
  5. always cited in the article with an inline citation.
• Please note that hooks are subject without notice to copyediting as they move to the main page. The nature of the DYK process makes it impractical to consult users over every such edit. In particular, hooks will be shortened if they are deemed too long: the 200-character limit is an outside limit not a recommended length. Also, watch the suggestions page to ensure that no issues have been raised about your hook, because if you do not respond to issues raised your hook may not be featured at all.
• Articles on living individuals must be carefully checked to ensure that no unsourced or poorly sourced negative material is included. Articles and hooks which focus unduly on negative aspects of living individuals should be avoided.

• Other issues

• Pictures: Pictures accompanying the DYK hook should be:
  1. freely licensed suitably and freely (PD, GFDL, CC etc) licensed (NOT fair use) because the main page can only have freely licensed pictures;
  2. suitable, attractive, and interesting at a 100x100px-wide resolution;
  3. already in the article; and
  4. relevant to the article.

• Sounds: Sounds accompanying the DYK hook should have similar qualities to pictures, and should be formatted using {{DYK Listen|filename.ogg|Brief description}}

Sample DYK suggestion strings

Please use one of the strings below to post your DYK nomination, using the "author" and "nominator" fields to identify the users who should receive credit for their contributions if the hook is featured on the main page.

1. Nom without image: {{subst:NewDYKnom | article= | hook=... that ? | author= }}
2. Nom with image: {{subst:NewDYKnom | article= | hook=... that ? | author= | image= | caption= }}

   To include more than one new or expanded article in a single hook: |article2= |article3= |article4= | (etc)

   To include more than one author: |author2= |author3= | (etc)

   To include alternate hooks: |ALT1= |ALT2= | (etc)

   To add a comment: |comment=

   To add the article you reviewed: |reviewed=

Do not wikilink the article title, or the author username field; the template will wikilink them automatically. Do wikilink the article title in the hook field, however.
Do not add a section heading if you are using the template; the template will add one for you.
Do not include a signature (~~~~) after the template.
Do not use non-free images in your hook suggestion.

• When saving your suggestion, please add the name of the suggested article to your edit summary.
• Please check back for comments on your nomination. Responding to reasonable objections will help ensure that your article is listed.
• If you nominate someone else's article, you can use {{subst:DYKNom}} to notify them. Usage: {{subst:DYKNom|Article name|May 25}} Thanks, ~~~~

Symbols

If you want to confirm that an article is ready to be placed on a later update, or that there is an issue with the article or hook, you may use the following symbols (optional) to point the issues out:

---

• {{subst:DYKtick}}
• {{subst:DYKtickAGF}}
• {{subst:DYK?}}
• {{subst:DYK?no}}
• {{subst:DYKno}}
• {{subst:DYK?again}}

You may notify the nominator of problems with {{subst:DYKproblem|Article|header=yes|sig=yes}}

---

Please consider using {{subst:DYKproblem}} on the user's talk page, in case they do not notice if there is an issue.

Next update

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Backlogged?

This page often seems to be backlogged. If the DYK template has not been updated for substantially more than 6 hours, it may be useful to attract the attention of one of the administrators who regularly updates the template. See the page Wikipedia:Did you know/Admins for a list of administrators who have volunteered to help with this project.

Candidate entries

Articles created/expanded on December 16

Richard Hutton Davies

Template:DYKsuggestion at 22:39, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Guri Hjeltnes

Template:DYKsuggestion at 23:32, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Black-faced Antbird

Template:DYKsuggestion at 22:29, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Abram, Greater Manchester

Template:DYKsuggestion at 21:34, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Botan River

Template:DYKsuggestion at 20:58, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

You'll Never Eat Lunch in This Town Again

Template:DYKsuggestion at 19:41, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• Note: I count 210 characters including spaces in the hook, even after some pipelink trickery, so I'd be amenable to suggestions for a more concise version (or an alternative hook). The length of the page title itself doesn't help matters... --DeLarge (talk) 19:43, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• ALT 1: =... that Julia Phillips' autobiography You'll Never Eat Lunch in This Town Again was considered so scandalous that it took 14 months to approve its publication? SWik78 (talk • contribs) 19:48, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

SS Empire Advocate

Template:DYKsuggestion at 19:31, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

TouchWave

Template:DYKsuggestion at 18:19, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Uncle Daddy

Template:DYKsuggestion at 16:21, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• ALT1: ... that the young adult novel Uncle Daddy written by Ralph Fletcher was awarded a 2002 Christopher Medal in Books for Young People, ages 10–12 category?

Daniel Jubb

Template:DYKsuggestion at 16:15, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Harriet Holter

Template:DYKsuggestion at 16:27, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Herman Landon

Template:DYKsuggestion at 14:18, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Giant huntsman spider

Template:DYKsuggestion at 14:07, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• Reference used says"Probably the world's largest spider" Marcus (talk) 16:18, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• Article still needs a lot of cleanup. Many of the footnotes needed can probably come from the paper that is currently listed as an external link (it's sort of a primary source, but it should be acceptable for stuff like the physical description of the spider...maybe not the geographical distribution). —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 16:31, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Caririemys

Template:DYKsuggestion at 10:07, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Tore Pryser

Template:DYKsuggestion at 12:40, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Battle of Nitzanim

Template:DYKsuggestion at 09:20, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• ALT 1: =... that the majority of the prisoners of war captured by Egypt during the 1948 Arab–Israeli War were captured during the Battle of Nitzanim? - Mgm|^(talk) 12:29, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• Length and date of the article OK, but there is an issue with the hook, specifically regarding whether or not the source cited directly supports the hook. The relevant sentence in the article reads "The 105 prisoners captured at Nitzanim constituted the majority of POWs captured by Egypt during the entire war." It is referenced to footnote no 10, namely page 149 in the book of Yoav Gelber. A link to the googlebooks preview of the book is provided in the ref and here is page 149:[1]. The relevant passage there reads: "The Arab armies held 800 Jews as prisoners of war, mostly from Gush Etzion and the Old City of Jerusalem. They were interned in a camp near Mafraq. The rest were captured by the Egyptians, mostly at Nitzanim, and by the Syrians Hayarden." First, a relatively minor point: there is no mention here of the fact that Egypt captured 105 prisoners at Nitzanim. While the figure of 105 is not mentioned in the hook, it is mentioned in the sentence in the article supporting the hook, and it'be much preferable for the actual fact stated in this sentence to be referenced by an inline citation too. More importantly, it is unclear to me that the above passage actually supports the hook(s). Is it clear that the first sentence, talking about Arab armies capturing most of the prisoners of war at Gush Etzion and the Old City of Jerusalem, actually excludes Egypt? Egypt would seem to qualify as a part of the "Arab armies". Where Egypt is mentioned explicitly, the book says "The rest were captured by...", a key word here being The rest. I would like to have this point clarified and, in fact, would prefer a hook that is more directly supported by the text. Nsk92 (talk) 00:31, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

James M. Fail

Template:DYKsuggestion at 08:24, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Beloeil, Quebec

Template:DYKsuggestion at 07:03, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• Reference cited says "Canada's deadliest wreck occurred at Mont-Saint-Hilaire, Quebec". Marcus (talk) 14:20, 16 December 2008 (UTC)
  • This reference says Beloeil and, with more detail, says that the train left Saint-Hilaire heading for Beloeil and this bridge crosses the Richelieu River which separates Beloeil from Saint-Hilaire so I suppose they both have a claim for the site of the accident. DoubleBlue (talk) 18:34, 16 December 2008 (UTC)
    • As DoubleBlue said. It happened on the river between the two cities (well, between the two parishes, since neither were even close to cities at that time), and both make perfectly true claims to it. That one cite is more about this particular disaster being the worse in Canada; the cites at the end of the paragraph covers its exact location specifically. I also submit this piece of evidence, from Canada's national archive: Scene of the disaster at Beloeil bridge. Similarly, this one (the photography used) give the name of the photography at Saint-Hilaire bridge, but states the photography was taken in Beloeil [2]--Guillaume Hébert-Jodoin. McCord museum here similarly lean toward Beloeil.. (talk) 19:12, 16 December 2008 (UTC)
    • more sources, this one saying "between Beloeil and Saint-Hilaire" (virtual museum of Canada), and the Canadian Encyclopedia itself says "Beloeil Bridge". Will replace the current ref by some that make it clear the accident occured between both.--Guillaume Hébert-Jodoin (talk) 19:46, 16 December 2008 (UTC)
    • Alternative (and debate-proof) wording for the hook could be: "That the railway bridge between Beloeil, Quebec and Mont-Saint-Hilaire was the site of Canada's worst train disaster?"--Guillaume Hébert-Jodoin (talk) 19:28, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• ALT1: ... that the first seigneur of Beloeil, Quebec participated in the 1704 Raid on Deerfield?"
• ALT2: ... that although settlement of the city of Beloeil, Quebec began in 1725, its first place of worship was built only in 1772?

• I added (pictured) in the original hook. If either of the ALTs is chosen, the picture should probably not be taken. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 19:23, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Curtis Keeble

Template:DYKsuggestion at 03:31, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• The reference that is being cited for this hook says he followed the first 9 lessons of a language course. The article says he spoke no Russian at all and the hook says he didn't speak fluent Russian. That's three different meanings. - Mgm|^(talk) 09:45, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

  First nine lessons of a language course = not fluent russian; I'll standardise the article to say "fluent russian" and that should sort it. Ironholds (talk) 14:29, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Berijam Lake, Sálim Ali Centre for Ornithology and Natural History, and Grey-breasted Laughingthrush

• 

  ... that a study at Berijam Lake (pictured) by the Sálim Ali Centre for Ornithology and Natural History indicates that the near threatened Grey-breasted Laughingthrush has been adversely affected due to habitat degradation?

Berijam Lake by Nvvchar (talk · contribs) and Marcus334 (talk · contribs)

Grey-breasted Laughingthrush' by Shyamal (talk · contribs) and Marcus334 (talk · contribs)

Sálim Ali Centre for Ornithology and Natural History by Marcus334 (talk · contribs)

Marcus (talk) 03:22, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Note - I cleaned up the nom to make it less messy. \ / (⁂ | ※) 03:37, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

List of San Diego Padres managers

• ... that Roger Craig and Bud Black have the same record of 152 wins and 172 losses while managing the San Diego Padres? new article, self-nom by -- SRE.K.Annoyomous.L.24_[c] 03:17, 16 December 2008 (UTC).

Boy! What a Girl!

• ... that the 1947 race film Boy! What a Girl! was the only time African American comedian Tim Moore had a starring film role? (New article, self-nom) Ecoleetage (talk) 03:15, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

or

• ... drummer Gene Krupa was asked to be in the 1947 film Boy! What a Girl! when he stopped by to visit cast member Sid Catlett on the film's set? (New article, self-nom) Ecoleetage (talk) 03:15, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• Verified. Either hook works well. – RyanCross (talk) 04:09, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on December 15

Osmaston Hall

Template:DYKsuggestion at 22:24, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Shanty Hogan

Template:DYKsuggestion at 13:20, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Paul-Émile de Souza

Template:DYKsuggestion at 01:03, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

The boy Jones

Template:DYKsuggestion at 00:20, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• I'ved asked Hans to provide an alternative hook. Article length is okay. - Mgm|^(talk) 09:57, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Alt1: ... that "the boy Jones", having thrice been caught in Queen Victoria's palace, rejected an offer from a music hall and was caught loitering around Buckingham Palace again? --Hans Adler (talk) 10:13, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Xochitecatl

Template:DYKsuggestion at 23:00, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• The article suggests that there were several eruptions: this one, and one between 100 BC and 100 AC (which I assume didn't cause as long an abandonment). There's not an inline citation directly with the 150 AD one, and in any case, it would help if you could clarify the time course a little bit...the History section right now seems to jump around a bit. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 00:29, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

Tree House, Crawley

Template:DYKsuggestion at 22:14, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Kellogg Co. v. National Biscuit Co.

Template:DYKsuggestion at 20:44, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Wild Decembers

• ... that Irish writer Edna O'Brien had not set foot inside a church since the 1960s until she appeared as an extra in a drama adaptation of her own novel, Wild Decembers? (new article, self-nom) --➨Candlewicke  ^{:) Sign/Talk} 19:02, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Currently >1500 characters prose (quote isn't included in the count). --Rosiestep (talk) 23:16, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

I've added some more characters - mainly book burning as a form of religious condemnation for anyone who didn't realise. --➨Candlewicke  ^{:) Sign/Talk} 22:18, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Moscow Pride

• . Can't find anything wrong here. --➨Candlewicke  ^{:) Sign/Talk} 22:36, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• The "satanic" quote needs a specific inline citation immediately following. The entire hook seems inflammatory and the article doesn't really provide any counterpoint to Luzhkov's views specifically. Otto4711 (talk) 21:45, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Kłomino

• ... that Polish ghost town of Kłomino used to be a base of both the Wehrmacht and the Soviet Army? Self-nom by Tymek (talk) 18:16, 15 December 2008 (UTC)
• . Foreign language ref accepted in good faith. Otherwise nothing else seems wrong. --➨Candlewicke  ^{:) Sign/Talk} 22:42, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

John Wall (judge)

Template:DYKsuggestion at 17:44, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• . No bold article. --➨Candlewicke  ^{:) Sign/Talk} 22:51, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• Bolded. That's the great thing about this new subheading system...it used to be so much harder to figure out which article the person meant to be nominating! —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 23:01, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Puerto Rican Conure

Template:DYKsuggestion at 17:30, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• Everything seems fine. One reference not checked as it's only available offline; but it's not used for the hook. --Hans Adler (talk) 09:04, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Hussniya Jabara

Template:DYKsuggestion at 16:21, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• . Passes the requirements. --➨Candlewicke  ^{:) Sign/Talk} 22:46, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Anibal dos Santos

Template:DYKsuggestion at 12:10, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• . So he did. --➨Candlewicke  ^{:) Sign/Talk} 22:49, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Maryland Terrapins football: 1856–1946

Template:DYKsuggestion at 08:18, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• Alt hook: "... that legendary football coach Bear Bryant served as the Maryland Terrapins football coach for one year, and resigned after the university president reinstated a player Bryant had suspended?" Strikehold (talk) 22:00, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

December 2008 ice storm of New England and Upstate New York

Template:DYKsuggestion at 04:39, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• Hook is too long at 223 characters... though it is rather a long title. —97198 (talk) 12:42, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• ALT1: ... that at least four people were killed and more than 1,000,000 homes and businesses were left without power during the December 2008 ice storm of New England and Upstate New York? Same thing, but shorter. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 14:57, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Support ALT1 - I knew I forgot something. My first DYK - sorry about that. ~ Wadester16 (talk) 16:39, 15 December 2008 (UTC) See ALT 2 below. ~ Wadester16 (talk) 21:44, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

I think we should consider renaming the title to put it in line with North American ice storm of 1998 and January_2007_North_American_ice_storm. See here for a name-change discussion I started on the talk page. Also, while I just lived through this storm and appreciate how severe it was, it certainly wasn't the worst icce storm in 20 years ... so I endorse the removal of that from the lead-in text. Soap ^Talk/_{Contributions} 03:36, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

FWIW, here was my suggested hook before I realized it was already nominated: ... that the recent ice storm (damage pictured) in the Northeastern United States was the worst ice storm in 21 years in parts of Upstate New York? –Juliancolton ^{Happy Holidays} 14:24, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• ALT 2: ... that the recent ice storm (pictured) in the Northeastern United States was the worst in a decade, resulting in at least four deaths and more than 1,000,000 utility customers left without power?

I think including the number of deaths and places without power is vital for the hook. And I think noting that this was the worst storm in a decade is also important (note the piped link to 1998 ice storm). ~ Wadester16 (talk) 21:44, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Could you change that to "in over a decade", to clarify that it was more than a decade in some areas? –Juliancolton ^{Happy Holidays} 21:51, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Will break the character limit. Right now it's at 197. ~ Wadester16 (talk) 22:14, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Jordan Valley Unified Water Plan

Template:DYKsuggestion at 03:25, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Sid Bernstein

• ... that Sid Bernstein helped start the British Invasion by getting the Beatles to play at Carnegie Hall? (self-nom, Allthegoodmusic originally created the articleand contributed some information as well)ErikTheBikeMan (talk) 02:13, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Currently >1500 characters (lists aren't included in the count). --Rosiestep (talk) 23:23, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Adding content. ErikTheBikeMan (talk) 00:58, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

That should be good. ErikTheBikeMan (talk) 02:10, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Monica Loughman

• ... that the Irish ballerina Monica Loughman, aged 14, was the first Western European to dance for the State Theatre of Opera and Ballet in Perm, Russia? (new article, self-nom) --➨Candlewicke  ^{:) Sign/Talk} 02:08, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Toa Payoh ritual murders

Template:DYKsuggestion at 01:54, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• Alt1: ... that during the trial for the Toa Payoh ritual murders, Howard Cashin received death threats for defending the accused, Adrian Lim? Jappalang (talk) 01:54, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• Alt2: ... that for his child murders in Toa Payoh, Adrian Lim became the bogeyman of Singaporean children in the 1980s? Jappalang (talk) 01:54, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• Alt3: ... that through the use of needles and eggs, Adrian Lim, the mastermind of the Toa Payoh ritual murders, convinced women to offer him money and sex? Jappalang (talk) 01:54, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• Length, history verified, offline refs accepted in good faith. I think Alt1 is the best hook, followed by the original, and those are the two that I verified. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 07:14, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Grey-crowned Central American Squirrel Monkey, Black-crowned Central American Squirrel Monkey

Template:DYKsuggestion at 02:19, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Elinor Smith

Template:DYKsuggestion at 07:00, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• Alternate hook: ... that teenage aviatrix Elinor Smith, the "Flying Flapper of Freeport", had her pilot's licence suspended for 15 days for flying under New York City's four East River bridges in 1928? - Jmabel | Talk 03:21, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Henry Burns

... that Henry Burns, a member of the Louisiana House of Representatives, opened a popular Bossier City bakery after his oil and gas business failed in the late 1980s? Billy Hathorn (talk) 17:18, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Al Smith (basketball)

Template:DYKsuggestion at 01:15, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on December 14

Bayeux War Cemetery

Template:DYKsuggestion at 22:00, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Lobaria pulmonaria

Template:DYKsuggestion at 20:48, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Bhadu (festival)

Template:DYKsuggestion at 17:07, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

ALT1:... that Bhadu is the social festival of South Bengal? The festival starts from the first day of Bhadro, the fifth month in the Bengali calendar, and continues till the end of the month. Art LaPella (talk) 00:12, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

Red Ensign of Singapore

Template:DYKsuggestion at 13:30, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

United States House of Representatives special elections in Illinois, 2009

Template:DYKsuggestion at 08:35, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• We have to wait for WP:AFD to be resolved.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 08:36, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• If the AFD runs its full length then it will be 5 days and the article will not be eligible. The AFD may speedy-close however. Remove the {{subst:DYK?no}} if it does. davidwr/(talk)/(contribs)/(e-mail) 18:32, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• Looks like a possible SNOWball. In any case, I think we've been known in the past to let articles on AfD sit around for way past what would normally be expiration, and then if they pass AfD we've sometimes made an exception to put them in DYK even though they're more than 5 days old. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 18:38, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Destruction of sites associated with early Islam

Template:DYKsuggestion at 01:27, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

St George's Square

Template:DYKsuggestion at 19:43, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• ALT1: ... that the statue (pictured) of William Huskisson MP in the gardens of St George's Square, Pimlico, was described by Osbert Sitwell as "boredom rising from the bath"?

Andy Cohen (baseball)

Template:DYKsuggestion at 19:18, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Łucja Frey

Template:DYKsuggestion at 16:01, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Dick Whittington and His Cat

Template:DYKsuggestion at 16:00, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Kenneth Michael Trentadue

Template:DYKsuggestion at 15:40, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Lego Modular Houses Theme

Template:DYKsuggestion at 01:46, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• I'm not sure if that image can be used, I'd think it's a Derivative work? I don't think you can release that into the public domain. --Amalthea 03:45, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• I'm not sure if they count as derivative works, all the Images (with the exception of the Lego logo) at the article Lego are labeled as free images, and Commons has Commons:Lego and Commons:Category:LEGO aswell as the local cat Category:LEGO. Although, it may be a good idea to drop a line at Wikipedia:Media copyright questions to be sure. All the Best, --Mifter (talk) 22:00, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• I was going by this graph from commons:Derivative work (which I've linked incorrectly before). The Lego images in Commons:Lego are, as far as I can tell, all either pictures of sculptures in one of the LEGO theme parks, pictures of self-designed constructions, or pictures of the more basic building blocks, and none from a set that was sold. Cheers, Amalthea 02:01, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Oughtn't April 2007 not be linked? --➨Candlewicke  ^{:) Sign/Talk} 19:09, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

 Done and de-linked Mifter (talk) 22:00, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Hanan Porat

Template:DYKsuggestion at 15:41, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Huttonite

Template:DYKsuggestion at 01:18, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• Hook and article length and hook reference confirmed. I'd rather see a more intriguing hook though... -- Mgm|^(talk) 11:39, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Erik S. Kristensen

Template:DYKsuggestion at 00:56, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Johanna Wokalek

Template:DYKsuggestion at 22:54, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

• Alt1: ... that Johanna Wokalek portrayed Red Army Faction terrorist Gudrun Ensslin in the Golden Globe-nominated The Baader Meinhof Complex? --Amalthea 22:54, 14 December 2008 (UTC)
• Alt2: ... that Johanna Wokalek had to tonsure her hair for her role as the female Pope Joan? --Amalthea 22:54, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Ron Carey (labor leader)

Template:DYKsuggestion at 21:57, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Matchless G12

Template:DYKsuggestion Thruxton (talk) 20:22, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Terlinguachelys

Template:DYKsuggestion at 20:14, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

• With the genus being named after the place, this could be quite confusing to non-specialists. Any ideas for altering the hook? Article length confirmed. - Mgm|^(talk) 11:35, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

How about something like: ALT1 ... that the specific name of the 80-million year-old sea turtle Terlinguachelys was actually named after a school teacher?

or: ALT2 ... that a species of the 80-million year-old sea turtle Terlinguachelys was actually named after a school teacher? - Shrumster (talk) 12:33, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Berner Honiglebkuchen

Template:DYKsuggestion at 20:03, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

• I suggest "are recommended to be taken with". It is a matter of opinion, yes? :-D --BorgQueen (talk) 11:52, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

No objection, although who are we to gainsay bakers, the acknowledged arbiters of taste? :-)  Sandstein  23:20, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

New York Islanders seasons

Template:DYKsuggestion at 19:43, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Danebury

Template:DYKsuggestion at 19:09, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Jacques de Baerze

Template:DYKsuggestion at 18:24, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

See note 11 for the last bit. Johnbod (talk) 18:24, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Rosedale Park Historic District

Template:DYKsuggestion Cbl62 (talk) 17:44, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Robert Chandler (network executive)

Template:DYKsuggestion Alansohn (talk) 17:29, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Dick Kempthorn

Template:DYKsuggestion Cbl62 (talk) 17:01, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

HMAS Voyager (D04)

Template:DYKsuggestion at 11:13, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

SS Empire Adur

Template:DYKsuggestion at 08:54, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Mitsuyasu Maeno

Template:DYKsuggestion at 05:05, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Chet Allen

Template:DYKsuggestion at 20:15, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on December 13

Carl Krauch

Template:DYKsuggestion at 20:48, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Abil al-Qamh

Template:DYKsuggestion at 01:33, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Matthias Dolderer

Template:DYKsuggestion at 01:33, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Operation Board Games

Template:DYKsuggestion at 23:44, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Bruce Hilkene

Template:DYKsuggestion Cbl62 (talk) 17:01, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Tamil cinema and Dravidian politics

Template:DYKsuggestion at 01:03, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

• ALT1: ... that five out of seven Chief Ministers from Dravidian parties had direct link to Tamil cinema either as script writers or actors?

• Both hooks are supported and article length is good; I personally prefer the ALT since it's more tangible and less controversial. But the original is fine too, because the connection you're drawing between cinema and politics is clearly not your own synthesis, but a widely accepted relationship (AEB the several journal articles you cite). —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 00:09, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Basile Adjou Moumouni

Template:DYKsuggestion at 00:10, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

No. 410 Squadron RCAF

Template:DYKsuggestion at 23:30, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

• Might be worth linking to RAF Second Tactical Air Force... Shimgray | talk | 01:05, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

• Done so. TARTARUS ^talk 04:41, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

• ALT:... that 410 Squadron RCAF (logo pictured) was the setting for the television show Jetstream? TARTARUS ^talk 22:43, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Johnny Lawrence

Template:DYKsuggestion at 23:08, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

Julia's House

Template:DYKsuggestion at 22:57, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

Robert Corbet

Template:DYKsuggestion at 20:41, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

Lebanese Commando Regiment

Template:DYKsuggestion at 18:18, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

Non-free media can't be displayed on the Main Page. Manxruler (talk) 00:37, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Alright I have removed the image, can we process this without an image? thank you --Zaher1988 (talk) 19:11, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Holy Deadlock

Template:DYKsuggestion at 18:03, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

Manor House, 21 Soho Square

Template:DYKsuggestion at 17:29, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

Tommy Dunderdale

Template:DYKsuggestion at 17:18, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

Alt image: Image:Tommy Dunderdale2.jpg --Maxim_(talk) 17:18, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

• Five-fold expansionfrom 1064 to 5450 verified. Date of expansion fine. But the HOF cite says he was the first not the only Australian. If the hook were modified to say "first" instead of "only," it would pass. Cbl62 (talk) 06:41, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Actually, he is the only Australian player to be inducted. I've add that reference to the article. Maxim_(talk) 14:05, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

• With the additional citation, everything now checks out. Expansion, date and hook citation all OK. Cbl62 (talk) 16:29, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Brough Superior Golden Dream

Template:DYKsuggestion Thruxton (talk) 16:42, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

Royal Enfield Bullet

Template:DYKsuggestion Thruxton (talk) 14:41, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

• Can you add another reference to verify the hook? The home page for pandorapitstop.com states "Welcome to the website dedicated to the continuing adventures of the legendary Ms. Pitstop and her trusty Royal Enfield motorcycle. Follow her story as it unfolds in episodes written with tongue firmly in cheek." Or consider an Alt Hook. --Rosiestep (talk) 23:56, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• Good point - I've just updated the ref with the Royal Enfield web site - and the fact is endorsed Brown, Roland (1999) The History of British Bikes Thanks Thruxton (talk) 20:52, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Great Oil Sniffer Hoax

Template:DYKsuggestion at 14:37, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

• Sorry, but this is not a five-fold expansion. It's grown from about 4,200 characters to about 8,000. Needs to be five-fold to qualify for DYK. Cbl62 (talk) 06:24, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

I wrote the vast majority of this article in two runs. The only reason that it did not come into DYK the first time is that I was unaware that DYK existed. I think you'll agree that this article is perfect DYK material - encyclopedic, well referenced, and most of all, very funny. So in the spirit of "be bold" I ask a question: do you believe that slavishing following a guideline that you likely didn't even have input into is more important that putting quality articles in a place where readers will come across them? Maury Markowitz (talk) 13:35, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Man v. Food

Template:DYKsuggestion at 09:14, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

Kantō kubō

Template:DYKsuggestion at 05:54, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

Yuzuru Hiraga

Template:DYKsuggestion at 05:04, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

One Day of Life

... that the novel One Day of Life by Manlio Argueta was banned by the goverment of El Salvador for its portrayal of human rights violations by the government's paramilitary organization? --creation and self nom by Grsz¹¹ 01:15, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

James Whitfield Williamson

Template:DYKsuggestion at 22:06, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on December 12

Charles D'Arcy

• ... that Archbishop D'Arcy of Armagh was a member of the Senate of Southern Ireland? - new article self nominated by Strawless ^(talk) 21:50, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• Length, date, hook's ref verified. --Rosiestep (talk) 23:48, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

School head lice policy

Template:DYKsuggestion at 05:40, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• That is a really detailed article... no categories though... and I couldn't access the relevant reference... still, I'd take it on good faith alone... really interesting... --➨Candlewicke  ^{:) Sign/Talk} 19:16, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• I can look into adding some cats. But in the meantime, whoever reviews this article, please be aware that it was spun out from Head-louse infestation in this edit and therefore must be treated as an expansion, rather than a new article. My hunch is that it passes 5x expansion anyway, but I haven't had a chance to count yet so I'm just throwing that out there. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 20:00, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• Counted. Unfortunately, it's not a 5x expansion; the original text was 16k (see here, pasted to sandbox for counting) and the current revision of the new article is 19k. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 20:06, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Bearcat Murray

Template:DYKsuggestion at 04:12, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Olav Rytter

Template:DYKsuggestion at 14:06, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

730 (transport)

Template:DYKsuggestion Alansohn (talk) 21:39, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Henry Hatch

Template:DYKsuggestion Cbl62 (talk) 07:02, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

William Stevens

Template:DYKsuggestion at 14:16, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Sears, Roebuck & Co. v. Stiffel Co.

Template:DYKsuggestion at 17:01, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

• Hook is too long at 221 characters. —97198 (talk) 12:38, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• {ALT) *... that the Supreme Court of the United States ruled in Sears v. Stiffel that companies can make and sell exact copies of other companies' inventions, as long as they are not patented? -- offering a trimmed alternate hook. Alansohn (talk) 20:51, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Goode-Hall House

Template:DYKsuggestion at 00:17, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

Tomber la chemise

Template:DYKsuggestion at 20:32, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

• I just realized that hook is a bit long. Here are shorter versions of the same thing:
• ALT1: ... that the French song "Tomber la chemise" ("Take Off Your Shirt") has been parodied under titles such as "Solder la chemise" ("Sell Off Your Shirt") and "Monter le pantalon" ("Pull Up Your Pants")?
• ALT2. ... that parodies of the French reggae song "Tomber la chemise ("Take Off Your Shirt") include "Solder la chemise" ("Sell Off Your Shirt") and "Monter le pantalon" ("Pull Up Your Pants")? —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 15:43, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Fredrik Heffermehl

Template:DYKsuggestion at 22:15, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

• Length, date verified. Foreign-language hook reference accepted in good faith. --Rosiestep (talk) 23:43, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Ifield Friends Meeting House

Template:DYKsuggestion at 20:21, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

• I smell weasel wording. Is it the oldest or isn't it? If you're not sure, it's probably better to look for another hook. - Mgm|^(talk) 11:11, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Forgive me if I'm misinterpreting, but I thought that guideline/advice related to statements, usually opinions, which are vaguely attributed to unspecific groups of people. The statement here is a fact (it's not "the" oldest in the world), which is supported by several separate published sources (Gwynne 1990, Hudson 1987 and English Heritage/Images of England 2000-ish). Unfortunately none of them state exactly where it comes in the "oldness ranking". Anyway, I'm no expert on WP guidelines and policies, to my shame (!), so what does anybody else think? Hassocks5489 (tickets please!) 12:46, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• I don't have a problem with the wording. Of course, something else would be preferable, but if this is the best fact in the article then it should be passable; we've done lots of hooks like that before. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 14:56, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

←Thanks Politizer. The links with William Penn and Elizabeth Fry would be another possibility, but to be honest I can't find evidence of any strong association between the FMH and either of them. The comment here is about as much as any of the sources say; and regarding Penn, Warminghurst is not "nearby" (25 miles was a long way to travel in 1676)! :) Hassocks5489 (tickets please!) 22:25, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Daniel Hoevels

Template:DYKsuggestion at 19:21, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

• This was 6 days ago, which might be added - I don't think it'll make "In the news". Johnbod (talk) 23:41, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

• This one is likely to end up on AFD because of WP:ONEEVENT. Is there anything that can be added about his career besides this event? - Mgm|^(talk) 11:08, 15 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Also, article says he's German. Sources say he's Austrian. It's easy to make a mistake since Austrians speak German, but that issue should be addressed as well. - Mgm|^(talk) 11:13, 15 December 2008 (UTC)
    • Concerning his nationality, I found no German language sources indicating that he is Austrian, and since he works for a German theatre it seems logical to call him a "German" actor. (The accident happened in Austria.) Concerning ONEEVENT issues, he has given a single interview about the accident [3], in which he complained about the media attention. --Hans Adler (talk) 15:44, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Laogai Museum

Template:DYKsuggestion at 16:28, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

• ALT1: ... that the Laogai Museum, which showcases China's laogai prison system, was financed by the same company that once turned a Chinese dissident in to the authorities? —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 18:39, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Ministry of Human Rights

Template:DYKsuggestion at 15:10, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

M44 generator cluster

Template:DYKsuggestion at 11:20, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

Tiv Taam

• Is this somewhat ambiguous? It's not the store that's non-kosher it's the products it sells. Also, there's a switcharoo between "store" and "chain". How about: "... that Tiv Taam is the largest supermarket chain in Israel to sell non-kosher food?" --brewcrewer (yada, yada) 05:24, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, I guess that would work. Cheers, Nudve (talk) 05:37, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

just added "food" to the end. Should it be "products"? --brewcrewer (yada, yada) 05:42, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

I think it's clear enough as it is, but I wouldn't't object. -- Nudve (talk) 11:44, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Church of Caucasian Albania

Template:DYKsuggestion Cbl62 (talk) 08:18, 12 December 2008 (UTC) Template:DYKsuggestion Cbl62 (talk) 08:18, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

• ...

Caleb Bentley

Template:DYKsuggestion at 06:07, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

• alt 1 ... that silversmith Caleb Bentley was commissioned to make the cornerstone for the White House in 1792, and the cornerstone for the United States Capitol in 1793? --Aude (talk) 06:07, 12 December 2008 (UTC)
  

Great article by Aude, but I think Bentley's role in providing refuge to Pres. Madison when the British burned the White House would provide a catchier hook. I've made a couple suggestions below.Cbl62 (talk) 08:05, 12 December 2008 (UTC) Template:DYKsuggestion Cbl62 (talk) 07:37, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

Template:DYKsuggestion Cbl62 (talk) 08:05, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

• ...

Any of the hooks are fine with me. Go with what you think is most interesting to Wikipedia readers. --Aude (talk) 16:36, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

Scorched (film)

Template:DYKsuggestion at 00:12, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on December 11

German Socialist Workers Party in Poland - Left

Template:DYKsuggestion at 09:28, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• Two little questions... first of all, what happened after the guy's candidature was declared invalid—what was its effect on the party? Secondly, there are lots of redlinks... are any of these things that might have an article and just need to be dab'ed, or are they definitely redlinks? (I noticed that DSAP doesn't even seem to have an article on German wikipedia.) I'm not too familiar with this part of history, but I would imagine it would be desirable to delink all the names other than Heinrich Scheibler, since he seems to be the only one that's really significant (in comparison to the others). —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 15:32, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• The party went defunct soon thereafter, sometime around 1932, the core joined the Communist Party of Poland. I will expand the article in a day or two, if possible. --Soman (talk) 15:39, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• The article is expanded now, including the final phase of the party. --Soman (talk) 22:30, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Denzil Onslow (of Pyrford)

Template:DYKsuggestion at 04:05, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• The article says "was thought to be" the second, and the source seems to say even less... if I'm reading it correctly, it just says, "Thomas Onslow took an office of profit.... and, here's another example, Denzil Onslow did it too"— in the part I read, at least, it didn't explicity say he was only the second). Also, I replaced "MP" with "Member of Parliament" to be more clear for non-UK readers. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 18:46, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Hmmm. Well, the "trick" first became possible in 1707, when the "Place Act 1707" was passed. People had certainly had to leave their seats under the terms of that act before 1707, but they usually contested the following by-election. In the case of the Onslows, it was tactically advantageous to keep sending a member of the family to contest the Surrey seat (rather than Guildford, where it was easier to manipulate their interests), and the case of 1715 appears to be the first where someone accepted an office specifically because they wanted to get out of their own seat. The two Onslow appointments in 1715 and 1717 may not be absolutely the first, but they're within ten years after the passage of the Place Act, and they seem to be the best-documented as to motives for accepting the office. (Speaker Onslow, his nephew, says so in his memoirs.) I've beefed up the references a bit, including a link to Chafetz's recent paper; let me know what else I can do for you. Choess (talk) 21:12, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Monumento al Ahogado

Template:DYKsuggestion at 06:48, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

Verifying Spanish-language source (which I can read). Ecoleetage (talk) 01:29, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Philadelphia Phillies (NFL), National Football League (1902)

Template:DYKsuggestion at 04:40, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

• ALT1 (a triple) ... that the first attempt at a National Football League had only three teams: the Pittsburgh Stars, the Philadelphia Athletics and the Philadelphia Phillies? Be advised that Athletics was created on the 10th.

• "National Football League" might have to be lowercase because it's being used a verb. "National" can also be trimmed off.

• ALT2 ... that the Philadelphia Phillies used to own a football team with the same name?
• ALT3 ... that the Philadelphia Phillies was also the name of a football team in the first national football league? --brewcrewer (yada, yada) 18:01, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Lee Davis

Template:DYKsuggestion at 23:20, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Gal Oya Riots

Template:DYKsuggestion at 23:13, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

White Light (2008 film)

Template:DYKsuggestion at 19:50, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

• I'm not thrilled about this hook. If anyone can think of a better one let me know. (If I can dig up where I read Borsato provided much of the film's budget, that would make a better hook in my opinion). - Mgm|^(talk) 19:50, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

• I'm still working on properly formatting the references. - Mgm|^(talk) 19:50, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

• ALT1... that parts of the Dutch movie White Light were shot in Ugandese refugee camps?" - Mgm|^(talk) 19:50, 11 December 2008 (UTC)
• ALT2... that singer Marco Borsato was attacked during his acting debut on the Dutch film set White Light? -- Suntag ☼ 01:24, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

• I appreciate the thought Suntag, but technically this is not true. There is no evidence he was personally attacked or that he was anywhere near the incident when it happened. - Mgm|^(talk) 09:36, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

• ALT2 was a rewording of the original hook, which read "... that on the set of the Dutch film White Light, singer Marco Borsato's acting debut, was attacked?". You might want to strike the original hook as well. -- Suntag ☼ 18:55, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

• The original hook said the set was attacked. Yours said the singer was attacked. There's a difference in meaning between the two. - Mgm|^(talk) 20:46, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

• I've finished formatting the references. - Mgm|^(talk) 12:20, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Pueblo Community College

Template:DYKsuggestion at 15:42, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

• I always regret adopting a brusque tone, but "No, I didn't know...nor do I care enough as a casual reader of Wikipedia to click to read more about this incredibly boring and bureaucratic fact. It's like saying "Did you know John MacIntyre was born in 1981?" -- DYKs attempt to be interesting snippets of history, not random dates of random events in the lives of random institutes. Looking at this article, I'm not sure there is such an interesting fact yet -- but perhaps you could look for a cited example of an "interesting" snippet of history to include in the article text, and subsequently propose as an alternative "hook"? Sherurcij ^{(speaker for the dead)} 04:02, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

It seems fine to me. The article's eligible and the fact isn't wholly uninteresting. I did some work looking for facts myself, but the (accessible) reliable sources are very limited. I'd say it was good to go. PeterSymonds (talk) 18:56, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

M138 bomblet

Template:DYKsuggestion at 07:03, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

• I will be adding an image eventually, also, if needed because of an abundance of suggestions this article could probably be easily combined with M43 BZ cluster bomb (suggested below) with a new hook incorporating both articles. --IvoShandor (talk) 07:03, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Cal State Fullerton Titans football

Template:DYKsuggestion at 03:34, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Expiring noms

Articles created/expanded on December 10

Kainourgia Ego

Template:DYKsuggestion at 16:05, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• It would be really nice if we could get this on DYK on the 17th to coincide with the albums release :) Grk1011/Stephen (talk) 16:05, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Ozarka College

Template:DYKsuggestion at 20:44, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

• I always regret adopting a brusque tone, but "No, I didn't know...nor do I care enough as a casual reader of Wikipedia to click to read more about this incredibly boring and bureaucratic fact. It's like saying "Did you know John MacIntyre was born in 1981?" -- DYKs attempt to be interesting snippets of history, not random dates of random events in the lives of random institutes. Looking at this article, I'm not sure there is such an interesting fact yet -- but perhaps you could look for a cited example of an "interesting" snippet of history to include in the article text, and subsequently propose as an alternative "hook"? Sherurcij ^{(speaker for the dead)} 04:05, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

• ALT1: ... that women outnumber men 69% to 31% among students at Ozarka College in Melbourne, Arkansas? - Dravecky (talk) 08:47, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• I agree with Sherurcij, it is rather boring. The AltHook is not that interesting either.--Thomas.macmillan (talk) 21:43, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• My impression of how DYK works is that we generally don't reject a nomination outright just for having a boring hook, if the article is good otherwise—we try to find a better hook, or expand the article some more until there's something good to say. As one of the main within-Wikipedia purposes of DYK is to reward editors for creating new content, when we get an article that meets the article requirement we do whatever we can to get it on DYK. In this case, unfortunately, I can't see anything more interesting than the original hook... I'll have to look at it a bit. Also, by the way, this is not a new article; it was created on the 1st and 5x expansion began on the 7th (if you count it starting on the 9th, it wasn't a 5x expansion). I'm moving it down to the appropriate date, and if a hook isn't found soon it'll have to be removed because it's past expiring. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 22:01, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• It was created in userspace on Dec 1 and moved to the mainspace on Dec 10th, so wouldn't that be the date to start counting from? MBisanz ^talk 15:34, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• Oops, my bad, I didn't notice that it was moved. Putting back in the 10th. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 15:54, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

NYPD subway sodomy incident

Template:DYKsuggestion at 04:08, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

• Seems a bit like "fails ITN and tries to get on front page anyways", the hook isn't terribly interesting, the person and event are unnotable outside of New York (or perhaps the United States?). Sherurcij ^{(speaker for the dead)} 11:55, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

• ALT: that the NYPD subway sodomy incident is the second time in twelve years that officers in the New York City Police Department are charged with sodomizing someone they arrested.--brewcrewer (yada, yada) 14:40, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

• I was about to disagree with Sherurcij, but after looking at the article I have to agree with his/her comments. The incident happened two months ago, which means this isn't necessarily "news," but there was just a new development on Dec 9 (indictment of 3 officers). More crucially, though, the article doesn't discuss things like the impact and repercussions of the incident; it reads more like a news story detailing the events that happened, rather than discussing what effect the events had (and calling it a "scandal" implies that it had wide-ranging effects, such as causing new laws or policies to be made in police depts or lots of protests or something...none of that is mentioned in the article).— Preceding unsigned comment added by Politizer (talk • contribs)

• Point well taken. The article has now been moved to NYPD subway sodomy incident. New hook: ... that the NYPD subway sodomy incident is the second time in twelve years that officers in the New York City Police Department are charged with sodomizing someone they arrested?--brewcrewer (yada, yada) 18:44, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

• Hm. The new title is an improvement. I still have some concerns about the lack of discussion of the impact of this event, but we have taken plenty of DYKs in the past that I think had similar problems, so I don't know if that should keep this article off DYK. Another concern, though, is that (from what I can tell) the article doesn't claim that this is only the second time for an incident like this to happen...it says that this incident is similar to one 11-12 years ago, but doesn't say anything about the number of similar incidents in the intervening years. I'm about to look into the source; right now it's requiring a login (NYT sometimes does that and sometimes doesn't, I don't know why) and I'm having a hard time remembering my password :P. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 19:07, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

• The article does not contain a source that explicitly states that this is only the second time that charges were filed, and if this hook is used it would require us to take a tiny implicit jump. I purposefully chose the words "charged" in the hook. Although there's a good chance there were other complaints about officers sodomizing arestees, this incident and the Louima incident were the only ones in which criminal charges were filed. If there were other sodomy charges in the intervening years, the Times would surely mention it and it would be well known. Regarding the "impact", the incident is really a fresh issue and there really wouldn't be anything on record about consequential events.--brewcrewer (yada, yada) 20:08, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

• That's a good point...I guess it could go either way. Given the possibly controversial nature of this hook, I think it might be best for us to wait and see what some other reviewers have to say as well. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 20:12, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

• This article has multiple BLP issues, i would urge against posting it on DYK. --Soman (talk) 19:41, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• Could you clarify (here or at the article talk page) what those issues are? I understand that we have to be very careful in discussing negative or legal information about the individuals involved in this case, but from what I can tell the article doesn't explicitly pass judgment on any of the parties involved and everything it says is stuff from prominent and reliable sources. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 19:55, 15 December 2008 (UTC)
• Let me take some of that back...i just realized the statement about the officers' indictment is not currently sourced. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 19:56, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• Now sourced. The source was there but I forgot to add the citation. WP:BLP does not apply to sourced material that has received significant public attention. The article is written in the most WP:NPOV manner possible. --brewcrewer (yada, yada) 21:30, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• Now that the source is in, I don't see a BLP problem. Hopefully Soman can clarify his concerns. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 21:34, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• I think the very nature of event and the article makes it unsuitable for DYK inclusion. The article deals with an ongoing criminal investigation and legal case, the indictment is just a week old. Full names of both victim and accused are published (which should be a red flag for ethical reasons in itself), including a bio (containing material unrelated to the case) of the victim is featured. --Soman (talk) 07:54, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• Ironically, the nom right above this one, Rod Blagojevich federal fraud cases, has the same exact issues but nobody has a problem with that one. The names of the victim and the accused all over RS's. --brewcrewer (yada, yada) 14:28, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• I have not commented on that one, and non-commentary should not be understood as approval. That said, I think there are some stark differences here (although the Blagojevich case also is more ITN than DYK). Blagojevich was a public figure well before this scandal came to light, something neither the victim nor perpetrators of the NYPD case were. Also, the crimes involved are of a quite different nature, the Blagojevich case is undoubtably a political issue. Aside from ethical issues, neither the original hook nor the ALT hook contain any interesting facts for DYK inclusion. Whether the victim was an orphan is completly irrelevant, and says nothing about the case as such. 'Second time in 12 years' isn't really a pattern. --Soman (talk) 15:11, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• I agree that the first hook is a bit lame, but I think the second one is pretty good. "Pattern" really depends on the circumstances. Something insignificant like say, cops sleeping on the job, would not be considered a pattern if it happens twice in twelve years. But something extreme, like sodomizing an arestee and causing internal injuries is a pattern if it happens with the same police force in the same Brooklyn neighborhood. That being said, I think this whole issue is fascinating. The US is on the forefront regarding criminal defendant rights and New York City is considered a liberal city. Yet, you have two people arrested for minor crimes in the same Brooklyn neighborhood who are brutally sodomized causing internal injuries. --brewcrewer (yada, yada) 16:12, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

The Diothas

Template:DYKsuggestion at 06:25, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

• ...after...what? Sherurcij ^{(speaker for the dead)} 08:32, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

• ... after Looking Backward ... I can add this to the hook, but I thought leaving it out would make it more interesting. --Bruce1ee^talk 08:49, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

• There are some OR concerns in the article, which I have tagged where I can (and removed some outright speculation). —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 22:46, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

• The article creator has addressed these concerns. --Bruce1ee^talk 10:32, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• If you're referring to this edit...unfortunately, I still see a lot of literary interpretation in there (such as "an anticipation of the potentials of computers and computer graphics"—the only change was to remove "this could be regarded as," which is a copyediting edit and not a content edit) that isn't sourced to any outside sources, and thus could just be this one editor's interpretation of what the book means. I won't go back in and add the {{or}} tags, but now that they've been removed it'll be more difficult for future reviewers to spot those issues. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 15:29, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Didith Reyes

Template:DYKsuggestion at 01:29, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

ALT1: ... that the song Bakit Ako Mahihiya? gave Filipina Didith Reyes notoriety at the 1977 FAMAS Awards Night, when she accidentally exposed her breast while singing it?--23prootie (talk) 23:07, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

Wally Grout

Template:DYKsuggestion at 08:49, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

• Which country? --74.13.126.105 (talk) 19:26, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

• ALT1 ... that Australian Test cricketer Wally Grout told the then-Prime Minister of Australia Robert Menzies he'd lost his and his wife's vote when the latter called him "Grouty", a nickname he loathed? -- Mattinbgn\^talk 23:08, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

• Most of the information is sourced to the book My Country's Keeper, and I'm having a hard time telling what it is. Is it some sort of autobiography? —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 23:41, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

• Yep, it is a 1965 autobiography of Grout, with lots of funny stories. He was an Australian test cricketer known for his sense of humour. Cheers, Casliber (talk · contribs) 21:22, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Cyrille Pierre Théodore Laplace

Template:DYKsuggestion at 01:09, 11 December 2008 (UTC)
**ALT1: .. that in Tourane, the local government believed that Cyrille Pierre Théodore Laplace and his crew were hiding a large army in their ships hull?

• • ALT2: ... that although his crew were merely taking geological observations, the British Government believed Cyrille Pierre Théodore Laplace had claimed New Zealand for France?

Marky Cielo

ALT1: ... that the leading role in Boys Nxt Door, the first Philippine drama to air in South Korea, was played by StarStruck winner Marky Cielo?--23prootie (talk) 17:45, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

ALT2: ... that Filipino actor, Marky Cielo of StarStruck fame, was the most notable Igorot personality during the 2000s Philippine television era? --23prootie (talk) 17:09, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

ALT3: ... that Filipino actor of Igorot descent, Marky Cielo, is one of four recent Philippine young celebrities who had unexpected deaths, after Julie Vega, Rico Yan, and Miko Sotto?--23prootie (talk) 17:36, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

A serial killer on the loose, targeting young Filipino celebrities? Probably not. And 1985 is hardly "recent". Is there anything more interesting about Marky? Why not "the first notable Igorot ever to join a talent contest"? He won! --74.13.126.105 (talk) 16:37, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Everything interesting about Marky Cielo is already in his article besides the point of "did you know" is to expand the topic beyond his article and him being the winner simple goes around that. Any I have made a new one below although I still prefer the first one since it expands the topic more. Also, recent to me is the last 25 years (besides Julie was mentioned in a news report about him last Monday). Wait, you read her article, so the hook is a success?--23prootie (talk) 17:15, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

ALT4: ... that in 2007, Marky Cielo, a Filipino actor and reality show winner of Igorot descent, decided to shift from mainstream acting to voice acting for a while by trying the character Ichigo Kurosaki?--23prootie (talk) 19:59, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Is that Marky pic from his Friendster account really PD? --74.13.126.105 (talk) 19:13, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Yes it is, you could just ask him. (If you look at the site, its pretty obvious if its fake or not, and by the way if your asking, I didn't make it, it was made last September.--23prootie (talk) 19:54, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

How to ask??? He's dead! His estate may still have the copyright. --74.13.126.105 (talk) 20:01, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

I was sarcastic in case you didn't know. Anyway, it is located in his public photos so its probably for fan consumption, it's not as if it's a picture of his family, it's clearly work. And btw, you should probably check the other stars's account there just to confirm if their real, you know the ones who are still alive.--23prootie (talk) 20:29, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

I know that's him in the picture, but I am concerned about the copyright status of the pic. Freely available for public viewing doesn't mean freely available to use elsewhere, such as Wikipedia. Pls confirm PD status. I don't see any licence at the source. Who has the copyright? Friendster or Marky's estate? --74.14.20.196 (talk) 03:46, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

{{PD-Philippines}} doesn't apply here. Image removed from this page and is now tagged for deletion. howcheng {chat} 04:54, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

These 5 versions range from 214 to 306 characters. Art LaPella (talk) 04:34, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

Fixed the length of all versions. Julie Vega was featured in a 2002 drama anthology so she is "recent", hey I'm gonna try to find a free image of him.--23prootie (talk) 10:58, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

Friendster allows public photos to be taken from the site and be posted on others sites [[4]] so does that qualify as public domain?--23prootie (talk) 11:46, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

No, it does not. Please read public domain -- that means anyone can use it for any purpose and no copyrights whatsoever are attached to the image. Whoever took the photo still owns the copyright on it. howcheng {chat} 00:55, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

The image has been removed so this portion of the debate is nullified.--23prootie (talk) 20:04, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

M43 BZ cluster bomb

Template:DYKsuggestion at 17:57, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

• Just checking.... in the ref, it seems to be saying that it saw these symptoms in the cat on which the weapon was tested. Is there any specific mention of seeing these effects in humans? —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 06:46, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

M34 cluster bomb

Template:DYKsuggestion at 15:40, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

• It's hard for me to tell if the ref is saying that, or that this was specifically the first major weapon developed to deliver sarin (as opposed to other nerve agents). Maybe this should be obvious... I'm just checking. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 06:43, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Canarian Houbara

• ... that one of the factors threatening the Canarian Houbara is disturbance by truffle collectors? new article, self-nom by Maias (talk) 11:10, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

• Most of the source that verifies this fact is a Wikipedia mirror. The fact itself isn't from WP (basically, the source is a one-paragraph blurb, then "more details from Wikipedia"...the fact itself comes from the blurb at the beginning, not from the Wikipedia mirror), but I am disinclined to place a lot of trust in a source that uses Wikipedia as a source. If we don't trust WP to be a reliable source, then we shouldn't trust someone who trusts WP. (Sorry about all the confusing language here). It seems like a fact that should be widely reported, though, so can you find and add another source? —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 06:38, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• OK, I have modified the hook above. Maias (talk) 22:35, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Garden Gnome Liberationists

Template:DYKsuggestion Cbl62 (talk) 07:40, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

The hook is actually supported by a CNN story on the Garden Gnome Liberation Front! Cbl62 (talk) 07:40, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

• It's a great hook and I was really excited to verify it and say "who could say no to this?" .... but, looking at the article, it looks almost like a joke to me. The lead-in, especially, is really over the top...I don't know whether to call it {{in-universe}} or something else, but I think (unfortunately) that stuff all needs to be cleaned up before we can even look at the value of the rest of the article. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 07:59, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

• Kind of amusing but is obviously unencyclopedic in tone. Gatoclass (talk) 08:06, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

• Just "kind of amusing"? Cbl62 (talk) 08:11, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

Well, I didn't read all of it. Just enough to identify it as a prank. :) Gatoclass (talk) 10:24, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

I've now rid the article of the objectionable content, and I truly believe there's a legitimate article there about a phenomenon that has received widespread coverage in the mainstream media as well as motion pictures (Amelie) and video games.Cbl62 (talk) 10:43, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

Article is up for deletion \ / (⁂) 04:51, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Yes, but Politizer nominated it for AfD before I cleaned it up. Since then, the vote is 5-0 to keep, and even Politizer noted on the AfD page that "the article you are looking at now is very different from the article that I originally AfD'ed." Cbl62 (talk) 15:28, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

No problems then. I was just making a note so that no-one verifies an article with a prod template on it. I've struck my previous comment through. Good work! \ / (⁂) 22:43, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Personally, it seems to me it would make more sense to break the "garden gnome" section out of the gnome article and include all the info and shenanigans people get up to with garden gnomes there. Gatoclass (talk) 08:02, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

How about the creation of a single "garden gnome" article where the pertinent information from (1) gnome, (2) Travelling Gnome, (3) Travelling gnome prank, (4) Garden Gnome Liberation Front, and (5) Garden Gnome Liberationists is collected? Cbl62 (talk) 15:43, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, exactly :) Gatoclass (talk) 14:46, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

Garden Gnome Liberation Front has been boldly merged into Garden Gnome Liberationists (by an editor whom I hear is a total stud). I don't know anything about those other articles, though. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 17:08, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

Burnt House

This one's not ready to be reviewed yet, but it's such a good subject I'm putting it line so it isn't overlooked. If Bloger doesn't clean it up himself, I'll see what I can do. The basic facts are described in this article, this one], and Frommers. Cbl62 (talk) 06:28, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

First "physical" or "archaeological" evidence. Literary evidence, and other forms like the Arch of Titus is plentiful. Johnbod (talk) 17:06, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

This one is going to require more work than I thought to get it into decent shape. If someone wants to adopt it, work on it, and take over the nominator credit, please feel free. Otherwise, I think it has to be passed over. Cbl62 (talk) 06:10, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

No footnotes and in need of general cleanup; you may strike out this message if you're planning on adopting it, but in its current form it's not ready for DYK. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 15:18, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

St. Luke's Episcopal Church (Beacon, New York)

Template:DYKsuggestion at 16:30, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

• Length, history, and refs all verified...i'm just wondering if you have any other hook ideas. There seems to be tons of material in the article, and personally I (as someone who's totally naive in church architecture and related stuff) don't really understand the significance of the fact in this hook. (That's not to say that it's insignificant or uninteresting; I'm sure it is significant and interesting, but for the dumb people like me it might just go over our heads.) If there's not another good hook candidate we can go with this one, but I figured we might as well at least take a look. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 06:29, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Ah, this is one of my areas of interest. The following ALT struck me as a possibility (wording may need to be tightened):

• ... (ALT) that St. Luke's Episcopal Church in Beacon, New York, was built on land donated on the condition that at least $20,000 was spent on its construction? Hassocks5489 (tickets please!) 12:56, 16 December 2008 (UTC)
  • ALT2 ... that in the 1860s a Beacon, New York, parishioner donated 12 acres of land to his congregation, on the condition that at least $20,000 be spent building St. Luke's Episcopal Church? (Might be tighter, but not sure if it's interesting or not). —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 15:16, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Both of these hooks are fine. I preferred the first because it is rather unusual for an architect to go so far as to design non-structural, decorative aspects of the building like the altar cloth (which would usually be a matter for the clergy in charge). If you want to reword the first hook to make this clear, go ahead (although I couldn't make it sound encyclopedic enough for my tastes, but YMMV). Daniel Case (talk) 15:19, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• Ah, I see. I didn't realize that Withers was the architect specifically. How about:
• ALT3 ... that Frederick Clarke Withers, architect of the St. Luke's Episcopal Church (pictured), designed not only the structure of the building, but also the altar cloth? —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 15:26, 16 December 2008 (UTC)
• ALT4 ... that as the architect of the St. Luke's Episcopal Church (pictured) in Beacon, New York, Frederick Clarke Withers designed everything down to the altar cloth? —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 15:26, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

I added the city so we know where this is, and it's fine for me. Daniel Case (talk) 15:29, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on December 9

William Buchan, 3rd Baron Tweedsmuir

Template:DYKsuggestion at 13:19, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

• The article and the source doesn't say why he was barred from the club. Does anyone have any more information on this? —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 18:30, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Ooh, it's quite entertaining: "The fierce Calvinist Prime Minister of Canada, Mackenzie King, who thought John Tweedsmuir a libertine and the ethereal Lady Tweedsmuir no better than she should be, barred William Buchan from the only nightclub in Ottawa." (Obituary in Independent) I'll add that to the article. Should some mention be made in the hook? Perhaps by appending "[...], who disapproved of his parents?" to the end. Hassocks5489 (tickets please!) 13:08, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• ALT1 ... that William Buchan, 3rd Baron Tweedsmuir was once barred from a nightclub near Ottawa because Canadian prime minister Mackenzie King disapproved of his father? —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 15:25, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Looks good! I have wikilinked his father's name. Hassocks5489 (tickets please!) 17:47, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Henry Maundrell

Template:DYKsuggestion --Wetman (talk) 02:32, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

• Date and length of the article verified. However, sorry, but the hook suggested is pretty terrible and, IMO, unsalvageable. First, the hook refers not to a fact but to an unattributed statement of opinion. That is always a bad choice, especially for an article that is actually filled with interesting historical facts. Second, the hook seems to be some kind of a strange WP:ORish conflagration of two different sources. The bit about still being a good read seems to come from a long quote from the 1964 article of Mohamad Ali Hachicho (that occurs in the beginning of 3-d paragraph and, incidentally, is lacking an inline citation). However, the reason quoted in the hook for why it is still a good read, namely the "precise, factual information" is actually taken from a different reference, to the article of Daniel Howell. The phrase "precise, factual information" does occur in Howell's article (but not in Hachicho's), but even in Howell's article this phrase is used not as a contemporary (1964) reason for the interest in the book but rather to explain why at the time of the book's original publication Maundrell's friends found the book interesting: "Thus when Maundrell's diary, crammed with precise, factual information, began to circulate among his friends they quickly realized that here at last was one of the first factual accounts of the antiquities of the Middle East." Sorry, but this is just a terrible mess of a hook. I suggest to the nominator that you write a completely different purely factual hook for the article. Nsk92 (talk) 03:09, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

Huh? Suit yourself.--Wetman (talk) 03:33, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

ALT: ... that A Journey from Aleppo to Jerusalem at Easter A.D. 1697, based on the diary of Henry Maundrell, was translated into French, Dutch and German by 1792? - PKM (talk) 06:48, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

Better (although I think a more interesting hook could be given for this article). The ALT hook was just a little over the 200 character limit and I shortened it very slightly. However, the bit about him having been chaplain to the Levant Company in Syria still needs an in-line cotation in the sentence where it occurs in the article (which seems to be the opening sentence). Nsk92 (talk) 13:53, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

The ALT is easily verifiable if you remove the bit about having been chaplain (which I have done). Further reviewers can decide whether or not it's interesting. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 18:07, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

FYI the title page here give his title as "chaplain to the factory at Aleppo". - PKM (talk) 18:40, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Are we sure that's referring to the Levant factory in Aleppo, as opposed to some other factory? —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 15:07, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

WWE Tribute to the Troops

Template:DYKsuggestion at 01:01, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

• 1524 characters now, but very sparse. Do you think you can expand it more in the next day or two? —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 01:05, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

Yes I do. ayematthew ✡ 01:09, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

Still waiting on expansion; nudged creator. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 18:00, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

I added a bit more, I'm having a hard time finding anything else that's notable. Is this good now, it is over 1500 characters... ayematthew ✡ 18:12, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

The expansion looks good to me, I think the article is long enough. But I just noticed the hook fact is sourced to WWE's own website (actually, both sources used in the article are WWE). I imagine some reviewers will have a problem with that and some won't...but I wouldn't feel comfortable passing it unless we can first at least look for other sources. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 18:28, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Jan Pawel Pietrzak

Template:DYKsuggestion at 17:40, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

"Whom" is generally used of people. Is the skin color of the Marines involved relevant?--Wetman (talk) 23:43, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

If those are the only objections, I would use a rather than a . Art LaPella (talk) 07:16, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

African American has been removed from the article, so it can be removed from the hook, too. To some, like Pietrzak's mother, it is relevant, to some it is not. Now, it is up to the admins if they want to keep it. Tymek (talk) 04:39, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

This article is tagged with {{POV}}. Pls fix POV-related issues before posting on the main page. --74.13.126.105 (talk) 15:57, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

There is no active discussion about the tag. You would have to ask a person who tagged it, what is the problem. Tymek (talk) 18:34, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Indeed. A tag without explanation should be removed and should not impede DYKing of this article. I will copyedit it in a second.--_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk} 20:47, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Thank you Piotrus, I appreciate it. I do not want to remove the tag, since I am a creator of the article. Tymek (talk) 21:51, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

I've left a note on the talk page regarding the use of "African-American" to describe his wife in the lead-in. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 17:05, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

No one responded to me, so I BOLDly moved that term out of the lead-in. I'm not going to verify this hook, however, because for all I know I just created a factual error or some unintentional SYN, so I would prefer to have someone else checking my work. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 15:05, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on December 8

Vauclain compound

Template:DYKsuggestion at 19:37, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

• From what I can tell, the supporting ref for this (Sagle, LaWrence (1964). B&O Power. Medina, Ohio: Alvin F. Staufer. pp. 109, 115.) verifies that conventional locomotives were preferable to Vauclain compound, but doesn't explicitly claim (at least, not in the article) that almost all Vauclains were converted...if it does, could you make that more explicit in the article? Or find a second source to support that claim? —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 07:24, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Confédération générale du travail de Guadeloupe

Template:DYKsuggestion at 16:44, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

• Article size (not counting list) is only 800 characters; the minimum for passing is 1500. Is there anything that can be added to expand this? —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 07:21, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

I had counted the list of union affiliates when adding the DYK suggestion. I think http://www.combat-ouvrier.net/archives/CGTG.htm has some material that could be added to expand the history of CGTG in the article. --Soman (talk) 10:34, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

It looks like there's a lot of good stuff there. If you use that source to expand the article, you could also try to include relevant quotations (in the footnote) and English translations...it's not a requirement for DYK, but it makes things easier for non-Francophones to verify. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 15:40, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

2009 Orange Bowl

Template:DYKsuggestion JKBrooks85 (talk) 23:57, 8 December 2008 (UTC)

Pls do not say "will feature". Too CRYSTALBALL-ish. The two teams are scheduled to play the game, but no one knows if they will actually play the game till the game starts. --74.13.126.105 (talk) 20:17, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Okay... how about ... that the 2009 Orange Bowl, a college football Bowl Championship Series bowl game, is scheduled to feature the Virginia Tech Hokies and the Cincinnati Bearcats? JKBrooks85 (talk) 00:34, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

Better, but it would probably be best to have a hook focusing on something that has already happened—for example, has anything crazy happened with ticket sales, the team's preparation, etc? Or maybe it could mention something about this: "The game will feature two teams both ranked lower than the two teams playing in a non-BCS bowl, a first in BCS history." I dunno, that stuff seems to me to be the most interesting, but my judgment in these things is not good. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 06:01, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

So, two teams will play each other in a football game? We need something with more ooomph. Daniel Case (talk) 16:48, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

There's also a tag and a bare URL used as a ref at the moment. Hassocks5489 (tickets please!) 13:33, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

I don't think there's much of a problem with that, since there are plenty of good refs in the article; these two little instances would bar the article from GA, but not from DYK. I do have a problem, however, with the long descriptions given of each team's season leading up to the game, and have made a proposal at Talk that they be split off into the appropriate articles, with just short summaries here. Right now, this article is almost more about each team's season than about the one game specifically. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 14:59, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Articles created/expanded on December 7

WJBE

Template:DYKsuggestion at 17:54, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

• The hook fact is not the subject of the article, but rather is in a section of the article that starts "This station is unrelated to..." If this station were the subject of its own article that met the DYK length requirements, this could be a good hook, but I don't like the idea of featuring what's essentially a disambiguation note. --Orlady (talk) 21:32, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

• I agree; I went in to look for another hook but, to be honest, I feel the section about the other WJBE might be better off getting split into a separate article, with dablinks going between the two. I'm going to start a topic at the article talk page about a possible split, and we might want to keep this nom on hold until that is resolved (although if the article is split, it is likely that neither one of them will meet the length requirements anymore). —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 05:43, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

• Drat, and I had such hopes for this one. As I mentioned on Talk:WJBE, I don't currently have access to enough reliable sources to expand a "WJBE (defunct)" article much beyond the current couple of paragraphs. One technical question: if in the future I am able to expand on the current text and split this section off into a new article, would it count as a "new" article for DYK purposes? - Dravecky (talk) 06:06, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

• I don't know the "official" rule on this, but I have seen articles in DYK with content that had previously been in other WP articles. --Orlady (talk) 21:16, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

• According to "Unwritten" Rule F8, content that had previously been in other Wikipedia articles should be expanded fivefold with new content. As always, if F8 or any Unwritten Rule is no longer the consensus, I'll be happy to change it. Art LaPella (talk) 04:21, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• Thanks, Art. In this instance, the Knoxville radio station had a history under a variety of call letters, so the potential exists for a reasonable article -- if anyone ever bothered to document that history. --Orlady (talk) 14:45, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• ALT1 ... that Five Points, Alabama, radio station WJBE shares its name with a now-defunct AM radio station in Knoxville, Tennessee, once owned by James Brown? (trying to resuscitate this one). —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 15:20, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• Slight tweak to alt1 hook, changed "that had been owned" to "once owned". - Dravecky (talk) 04:07, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

DYKs for December holidays other than December 25, 2008 holidays

Note: As we did at Halloween, we are "breaking the rules" (including the unwritten ones) in that these articles were prepared in under 5 days but are being delayed. Post your DYK suggestions here on topics related to holidays of this season that are not listed at December 25 Holidays.

Suggestions:

New Year's Eve

History of Champagne

• Comment Since Champagne is a big part of New Years Eve celebrations, I've been working on several Champagne/sparkling wine related articles for DYK. My goal is to try and get one related hook on each set that runs throughout Dec. 31st (I'll have more suggestions coming over the next week or so). I would understand if there are constraints with other hooks needing to be featured. Normally wine articles don't fit into our DYK "theme days" like Halloween/Christmas, etc so I thought I would have fun with this one. :) Agne^Cheese/^Wine 06:49, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Template:DYKsuggestion at 03:34, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Classification of Champagne vineyards

Template:DYKsuggestion at 06:49, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

DYKs relevant to December 25, 2008 holidays

Note: As we did at Halloween, we are "breaking the rules" (including the unwritten ones) in that these articles were prepared in under 5 days but are being delayed. Post your DYK suggestions here on topics listed at December 25 Holidays, such as Christmas, Quaid-e-Azam's Day, The feast day of Anastasia of Sirmium, and Yule.

Suggestions:

Bog sie rodzi

• ... that Bog sie rodzi, a Polish Christmas carol, is regarded as the National Christmas hymn of Poland? Tymek (talk) 21:06, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Artificial Christmas tree

Template:DYKsuggestion at 15:49, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

I haven't really illustrated the article, but there are plenty of pictures out there that are usable, I may take a few too. There is also ample opportunity here for alternative hooks, if anyone has one, I just used what jumped right out. --IvoShandor (talk) 15:49, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

The Late Late Toy Show

• ... that presenter Pat Kenny tore up two tickets for The Late Late Toy Show live on air in 2008? (New article, self-nom) --➨Candlewicke  ^{:) Sign/Talk} 18:19, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• Article does not appear to be new, I don't see a move in the history or anything...is there something here that I don't know about (ie, a prior agreement to save this for Christmas or something...although I'm not how directly relevant is it)? —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 21:02, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Article is about a highly influential show that takes place around Christmas each year and features toys which viewers may wish to buy. The audience dress up in Christmas costumes, the set is Christmas themed and there is a general Christmas feel about it, so I'm sure it's relevant. When I created and expanded the article I intended it for such a Christamas DYK; however this section only seems to have recently sprung up and I've placed it here as soon as I noticed it... --➨Candlewicke  ^{:) Sign/Talk} 21:08, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

• Ok then...could you add a bit of that stuff (about the Christmas-themed set, and the audience's dressing up) to the lead-in? I think that would help make it clearer. As for the article history, while it's not new enough for a normal DYK, since you've created it specifically for the Christmas DYK I don't see a problem with using it, as long as no one else objects. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 21:19, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Christmas Common

Template:DYKsuggestion at 07:39, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• Expansion verified, offline ref accepted in good faith. The hook isn't super-interesting but I think it's the most interesting thing in the article yet. Article is 1600 characters...a bit sparse, but there's probably not much more that can be said so there's no point forcing anyone to squeeze more in. I think everything is acceptable as is. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 21:06, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Adoration of the Magi (tapestry), John Prideaux Lightfoot

Template:DYKsuggestion 21:10, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

• Both verified, with offline ref accepted in good faith (there are some online refs as well, but I didn't look at them; I imagine the offline ones are better). John Prideaux Lightfoot is barely 1500 characters, but it's got lots of refs and good stuff, so I'm fine with it. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 21:10, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Aluminum Christmas tree

Template:DYKsuggestion at 21:13, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

• In line with hook, intro says that they were popular until about the mid-1960s, but the History section says that they were popular into the 1970s. This could just be a wording problem, but if so the wording needs to be fixed. Nyttend (talk) 00:52, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

• Yeah a wording issue, I wrote that sentence before I had completed my research and forgot about it, thanks for the note on my talk page letting me know. --IvoShandor (talk) 01:43, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Berner Haselnusslebkuchen

Template:DYKsuggestion at 10:30, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

• For those who liked Tirggel below :-)  Sandstein  10:30, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

Good faith verification for the German-language source. And I'm gaining weight just by reading this article! LOL! Ecoleetage (talk) 12:48, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

Christmas Island National Park

Template:DYKsuggestion at 07:00, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

At the moment, this is no more than a statement of intent, as I have not yet reached the intended 5X expansion, so please don't review yet. (I will edit this statement once I have.) However, I would welcome comments on whether the topic of this article is considered suitable for the 'Christmas Special' DYK, or will it only be for topics that are really about Christmas? — BillC ^talk 07:00, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

• If you expand this I'd find it perfectly acceptable. - Mgm|^(talk) 23:17, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Star of Bethlehem (painting)

Template:DYKsuggestion at 04:32, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

• Verified, pearified. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 21:34, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

Happy Clucking Holidays

• ... that the 2002 album Happy Clucking Holidays consists of Christmas songs performed by Dirk Keysser clucking like a chicken? (New article, self-nom) Ecoleetage (talk) 16:59, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Wow, now this hook is interesting and caught my attention - had to listen to clips online after reading about it. ;-) The article is sufficiently long, fact referencing verified, and overall looks okay. Jamie^☆S93 21:32, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Tirggel

Template:DYKsuggestion at 10:02, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

• Fantastic article! I remember having these cookies for Christmas. Length, date, and hook verified. -- Suntag ☼ 13:51, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

Fantastic picture, too! You might want to crop off the Hans Waldmann pieces on the left so that people can read "St. Nikolaus" on the other rectangular pieces on the right when the image is displayed at 100x100px on DYK. Just for Christmas. :) --74.13.126.105 (talk) 18:17, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Love the article and picture since I'm a big fan of foodies--Caspian blue 00:19, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

Christmas on the River

Template:DYKsuggestion at 00:15, 8 December 2008 (UTC)

• Verified. "Floats on boats" would also be an acceptable wording. —Politizer ^talk/_contribs 04:17, 8 December 2008 (UTC)

I also suggest "floats on boats". Floats that are giant "balloons" filled with helium gas are quite common, and they float, too. --74.13.126.105 (talk) 18:26, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

I also agree with the suggestion; hook tweaked as such. Jamie^☆S93 21:38, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

'Twas the Night Before Christmas (1977 TV special)

• ... that Paul Lynde was responsible for Martha Raye being cast as his mother-in-law in the 1977 TV special 'Twas the Night Before Christmas? (New article, self-nom with offline hook reference) Ecoleetage (talk) 22:25, 7 December 2008 (UTC)

• Nice Christmas article! Offline reference accepted in good faith. – RyanCross (talk) 00:03, 8 December 2008 (UTC)

Any reason why the article isn't titled with a single quote-mark in front of it? It appears to be the special's official title, and there don't seem to be any technical restrictions relating to quotes, so I'm moving it over here. Jamie^☆S93 19:42, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

 Done. Thanks, Jamie^☆S93 19:44, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

Lynde and Raye are not famous enough to make the hook work and how casting was done is uninteresting. Is there a more interesting hook for this solid article, please? --74.13.126.105 (talk) 16:20, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Paul Lynde and Martha Raye are very famous in the U.S. -- both had very long and successful careers, with Lynde as a major TV star for two decades, winning two Emmy Awards, while Raye starred in numerous classic films and received an Honorary Oscar for her career achievements. Ecoleetage (talk) 17:14, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

When? Maybe I am too young to know. Or I simply live in the wrong country. --74.13.126.105 (talk) 17:31, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Paul Lynde and Martha Raye. :) Ecoleetage (talk) 17:38, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Sorry, I don't see any international appeal. --74.13.126.105 (talk) 17:47, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

IMO, for a hook like yours to work, you need some bigger stars. Maybe people like Sean Connery, Meryl Streep.... Right now, the hook is simply about two friends helping each other get jobs, which happens all the time, everywhere, in many occupations. --74.13.126.105 (talk) 18:05, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

The original hook has been confirmed and verified; I would ask that we retain the original offering and not the negative alt hooks. The IP editor's personal lack of familiarity with two major U.S. entertainers of the 20th century is not relevant -- and, in any event,DYK serves the purpose of bringing forth information and is not designed to recycle data on the too-obvious. Ecoleetage (talk) 18:50, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Then please use this hook when it's not bedtime in America. People who lack of familiarity with Lynde and Raye are everywhere outside the U.S. Please consider briefly describing who they are in the hook. --74.13.126.105 (talk) 19:32, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

• ALT:... that the 1977 U.S. television special 'Twas the Night Before Christmas, despite an Award of Excellence from the Film Advisory Board, had such unfavorable reviews and poor viewership that it was never broadcast again? --74.13.126.105 (talk) 16:29, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Too negative. Keep the original hook, please. Ecoleetage (talk) 17:14, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

• ALT2:... that the 1977 U.S. television special 'Twas the Night Before Christmas, despite such unfavorable reviews and poor viewership that it was never broadcast again, won an Award of Excellence from the Film Advisory Board? --74.13.126.105 (talk) 17:31, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Promoted entries

Queues

Queue 1

Bomb defusing, photographed by Lander

• ... that Olga Lander used a camera with a fixed 50 mm (2.0 in) focal length, requiring her to work close to the dangerous wartime subjects whom she photographed (example pictured)?
• ... that the antiseptic cream Boroline was marketed to appeal to nationalistic sentiments?
• ... that King Christian IX and Queen Louise of Denmark were the parents of a Danish king, a British queen, a Greek king, and a Russian empress?
• ... that John D. Rockefeller Jr., under the name "David's Father", secretly authorized the purchase of an $8,000 "antique"?
• ... that although Evgeniia Subbotina failed to escape her own exile in Siberia, she successfully aided the escapes of Catherine Breshkovsky, Yelizaveta Kovalskaya and Sofya Bogomolets?
• ... that an 18th-century hymn inspired the title of George W. Bush's 1999 autobiography?
• ... that Denpasar mayor I Gusti Ngurah Jaya Negara became active in politics after he was laid off from a bank due to the Asian financial crisis?
• ... that Israel's systematic destruction of trees and farmland in Gaza has been described as an ecocide?
• ... that Elizabeth Storie's doctor poured nitric acid into her mouth, causing her teeth to fall out?

Queue 2

Queue 3

Queue 4

Queue 5

Kendrick Lamar and Drake

• ... that the "beef" between Kendrick Lamar and Drake (both pictured) dates back to the 2013 song "Control"?
• ... that the Bluey special "The Sign" reminded a Sydney Morning Herald reporter of Australia's housing crisis?
• ... that the Lutheran St. Trinitatis in Wolfenbüttel, consecrated in 1719, is a Baroque church with a facade recalling that of a palace?
• ... that Joel Breman, who helped combat the 1976 Ebola virus outbreak in Zaire, was not expected to return alive by the pilots who dropped him there?
• ... that to mitigate religious violence in the city, Ambon mayor Marcus Jacob Papilaja made Muslim and Christian city employees mix?
• ... that the Vulcan Bridge, a bridge in Vulcan, West Virginia, was constructed after the mayor requested financial aid from the Soviet Union?
• ... that while going to the Strategion in Constantinople, Emperor Theodosius II was attacked with stones by a hungry mob?
• ... that during the "trial from hell" Matthew Charles Johnson and his co-accused hurled abuse at the judge and threw human excrement at a member of the jury?

Next update queue

5

Next next update queue

Galileo's middle finger

• ... that Galileo's middle finger (pictured) is considered a secular relic?
• ... that Richard Osman, who wrote "the biggest thing in fiction since Harry Potter", lost confidence in his writing ability after his experience with Boyz Unlimited?
• ... that Green Bay Packers player Travis Glover started at three separate positions along the offensive line during his college football career?
• ... that even though about 100,000 mines were laid in Le Touquet during World War II, making it "the most mined city in France", it was the first resort in northern France to open its beaches after the Liberation?
• ... that for his first recital as the organist of the restored Frauenkirche in Dresden, Samuel Kummer chose music by Bach, Brahms, and himself?
• ... that El Salvador was the first country to recognize Manchukuo, apart from Japan?
• ... that poet Peggy Pond Church became a strong pacifist and a member of the Society of Friends after the Manhattan Project used her home as a place to build nuclear weapons?
• ... that Bob Noel was the one responsible for dealing "with all the dirty laundry" of the Green Bay Packers?
• ... that a firearm blank goes off during The Days of '98 Show shootout, startling the audience?

See also

• User:AlexNewArtBot/GoodSearchResult – This is an automated list of promising new articles generated by AlexNewArtBot (talk · contribs · logs).