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October 25

ATTENTION!! ANSWER QUICK PLZ!!

Hi I need help with this. Even if you don't agree with these questions please answer to the best of your ability:

Reasons why executives terms in office should be 7 years

Why executives should not serve more than one term.

Why justices should serve more than one term.

68.5.11.28 00:42, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Longer terms mean you can build up experience and become better at your job, while shorter terms don't allow for that so much. Shorter terms, however, can help stop people from thinking they run the place, because they remember better that they're temporary. --Masamage ♫ 00:48, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Six minutes! Is that quick enough for you? If so please say "thank you" or something. - hydnjo talk 01:12, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Judges have an indefinite term so that they remain largely independent from day-to-day politics. —Tamfang 22:38, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Re.: Verification - Arrests in CA Wildfires:

Two newspaper links.

• libertypost.org/cgi-bin/readart-cgi?Artnum=204313
• latimes.com/news/local/la-me-arson25oct25,0,1196901

Also Google: California Fires/ Arson Arrests' for more.

Someone requested verification. Due to a faulty Wi-Fi, and a rotten local ISP, bandwidth is a problem. Where I'm at, they think a computer is science fiction and/or witchcraft, given the way they handle a ISP. 65.173.104.140 02:08, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

• Great, but the appropriate place for these items is in the relevant article. The reference desks are for asking reference questions. --Sean 14:08, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Japanese movie

Hello! I am wondering about a movie that I saw a long time ago, but I don't remember all of it or the title (← that's what I'm trying to find). A girls parents are turned to pigs when they stop at an abandoned town and start to eat the food that is at a restaurant there. She is stuck there, working as a maid or something of the sort, because if she leaves, her parents will be eaten by the residents. The residents of the town are ghosts, I think. Some characters that I remember are: a woman who is like a vulture, a tall ghost like blog thing :), the girl, her pig parents, etc. This sounds made up, but it isn't ^_^ I do remember something about a spa there... oh well. Thanks for any help! Ciao --極地狼 ( 我是一头死的狼 ) 03:36, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

It is called Spirited Away. Good movie! Cheers,JetLover (Report a mistake) 03:41, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Excellent movie, in either language. After about three viewings you'll understand it better. :D --Masamage ♫ 05:13, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Haha yeah. Thanks for the info guys! --極地狼 ( 我是一头死的狼 ) 13:59, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Plastics Make it Possible

American television viewers would be familiar with that slogan created by the Plastics Council for an ad campaign years back. The campaign and others like it puzzle me. What was the council looking to achieve? How would giving plastics a positive image stimulate sales? It's not like plastics has a bad reputation. I could understand the coal industry's ad campaign to give coal a better image because contentious and very public political battles are inevitable but plastics?

75.36.40.106 04:46, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

This link is one release from a plastics manufacturer discussing some of the motivations behind the campaign. Its purpose is as a reinforcement of a largely positive image that consumers have of plastics. However, some concerns have been growing in recent years regarding possible health and environmental issues with using some of the components used in common food packaging, such as a persistent urban legend about plastic water bottles being unsafe and recent indications that plasticizers used in baby bottles and toys are likely to leach out. In my own household, we have largely replaced plastic storage containers with more inert and "safer" materials, and my spouse always scolds me if I'm caught reheating leftovers in any type of plastic container due to concerns of chemical leaching. Think of the campaign as a pre-emptive public relations move. Sonic Craze 05:00, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

For a little bit of background on the concerns in food packaging, see Bisphenol A. --Bennybp 05:31, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

I see it less as pre-emptive and more as reactive. Plastics aren't biodegradable on any human timescale. Factoring in roadside waste (which is the public's fault, not the plastic's, but...), landfills and difficulty of recycling, the fact is that plastics were indeed taking an image hit. Instead of the standard "paper or plastic" question at the grocery store, some would ask "cut down a tree or destroy the environment?" With eco-consciousness on the rise, plastic was becoming less popular. Negative image leads to two main things - decreased sales and increased legislation. An ad campaign that cost millions was probably seen as saving tens of millions by boosting sales and decreasing the likelihood of increased regulation. Of course, the industry spin would be "reinforcing an already positive image." That's advertising for you. 152.16.59.190 05:13, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Some other negatives of plastics are:

1) They are produced from petroleum, a nonrenewable resource which we should try to conserve. Paper and wood, by contrast, is made from a renewable resource (trees).

2) Plastic production produces air pollution, some of which contributes to global warming.

3) Plastic items tend to be disposable, while reusable items are better for the environment. StuRat 21:18, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

High-speed rotation

Why is it that when wheels or fans spin at high speeds, they look like they're going backwards? I can understand in general why the image appears to skip, but why doesn't it look like it's going forward? Is there a reason? --Masamage ♫ 05:19, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

When viewed on film or under AC-powered HID streetlamps, a rotating object may appear to spin backwards if it completes slightly less than one cycle (or slightly less than one even fraction of a cycle, if the object is composed of multiple symmetrical segments) between each frame or each power cycle. So say the wheel turns through 350 degrees each frame - that looks the same as if it were turning backwards 10 degrees each frame, and your brain tends to assume that it's made the smaller movement. FiggyBee 06:09, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

See Wagon-wheel effect and Temporal aliasing. --Anonymous, 08:24 UTC, October 25, 2007.

Also see stroboscope.

Atlant 13:23, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Hey, cool. Thanks, everyone! --Masamage ♫ 04:34, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Why don't dogs hyperventilate?

When dogs or other mammals are really interested in some scent, their rate of respiration increases dramatically- in fact, for all mammals that depend on smell, a really interesting scent makes them increase their rate of respiration. So what prevents them from hyperventilating when they encounter some really interesting scent? 71.112.129.232 05:26, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

I don't know if this is all the reason, but they have gigantic lungs, bigger than they need to, so I guess they're used to taking in a lot of air. There's some good information about their physiology in the dog article. --Masamage ♫ 06:00, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

If you watch a dog carefully when it is checking a really interesting scent it will seem to concentrate really hard but the amount of air it samples is quite small. Dogs sniff for scent, that is take in many small amounts of air, just enough to reach the smell sensors. If anything they are in more danger of suffocating. Put some trace of food on your fingers and watch closely when the dog investigates it. Richard Avery 06:21, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

• I think it's stranger that they don't hyperventilate when they pant for a long time. --Sean 14:13, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

I suspect that they aren't taking deep breaths - just really rapid shallow breaths. That means that they aren't actually exchanging much of the air in their lungs. If each 'pant' or 'sniff' only exchanged (say) 10% of the air in the lungs - then that would be no different from taking a deep "100%" breath ten times less frequently. All they need to do is to move the air in the mouth/nose out and replace it with fresh air - and that's a much smaller volume. SteveBaker 22:59, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

They don't hyperventilate because they don't actually move much air in or out of the lungs. The air is just moved back and forth, mostly in the throat and mouth only, cooling the dog by convection. Fresh oxygen doesn't make it all the way down to the lungs. They can hyperventilate when they are too hot, because many dogs try to compensate by breathing deeper instead of just faster.

One hell of a website!

C'mon people, Wikipedia is one hell of a fine website. Donate to Wikimedia! They've helped this IP with matter concerning the CA wildfires. 65.173.104.140 06:49, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

While true, there is the banner, this is not a question or what this page is used for and many people feel uncomfortable if they think they are being pressurised into donating. Smalled. Lanfear's Bane | t 08:05, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Speaking as someone who hates it when their ears pop and doesn't even like swimming to the bottom of the pool, I would be extremely uncomfortable being pressurised into donating. 38.112.225.84 14:06, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

OMG I nearly fell of my chair when I read that! Hyper Girl 14:35, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Then there is the low pressure sales technique ... place the customer in a room and evacuate the air until they agree to buy. :-) StuRat 21:24, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

To the moon, Alice! —Tamfang 01:25, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

The Adelie Penguin

Which Explorer is the Adelie Penguin named after and what was his nationality? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.233.83.26 (talk) 07:18, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

In 1830, French explorer Dumont d'Urville named them for his wife, Adélie. See Adelie Penguin--Tagishsimon (talk) 07:34, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

we learn something every day. I had assumed that the penguin was named for Adélie Land, but it seems D'Urville named both independently. —Tamfang 22:32, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

American Town Private Airfield.

Hi, A few months ago I remember reading about a town a think was in America where a lot of the houses owened aircraft and had hangers for them. Also the roads could be used as runways. I have not being able to find any reference. Can anybody help me?

Thanks,

Zsamana

You may be thinking of Jumbolair where celebs such as John Travolta live. Foxhill 09:27, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

See also, the first couple times you asked this question and you were directed to Airpark as there are many of these communities. Dismas|^(talk) 12:33, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Crow stealing chicken eggs

Hi fellow wikipedians, my sister keeps chickens, and a crow steals the eggs. This is a problem. We want some suggestions regarding how to stop the crow. Since we're in Australia, firearms, slingshots and archery type gear are out of the question. The chooks (chickens) have a large area fenced off, with no roof, and a small area with their shed (where they lay eggs) with a roof and a door. The crow lands in the main yard and walks into the chicken shed, rolls the eggs out (I'm sure it'd pick them up and carry them if they couldn't be rolled out) and carries them off. We can't lock the chooks in the roofed area because it's too small for them, we can't roof in the open area because it'd be too much trouble.

--Psud 09:07, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

"the cow lands" and "we can't roof in the open area" ... Does the cow come in by plane? DirkvdM 09:31, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure I wrote crow not cow --Psud 11:39, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

No wonder I thought is was a odd question indeed. :) DirkvdM 09:06, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Also, in what country would ' firearms, slingshots and archery type gear' be an option? DirkvdM 09:31, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

USA. Googled it and the general theme of suggestions originating from the US was "shoot it", the suggested weapons included shotguns, rifles, slingshots and bow & arrow. --Psud 11:39, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Airsoft weapons may discourage the crow. Depends how you are about shooting / killing animals. Lanfear's Bane | t 10:14, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

"The importation of airsoft (BB) firearms is restricted under the Customs (Prohibited Imports) Regulations 1956" according to [this]. Also I'd much rather not have to kill the bird. --Psud 11:42, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Here is a plan for a crow trap, a thing I never knew existed. Check your local laws, right? What you're supposed to do with the crows once you've trapped them, I don't know. Give them a stern talking-to? Tar and defeather them and run them out of town on a rail? Place them in a remedial program for egg-sucking vermin? Clip their flight feathers and let the dingoes do your dirty work for you? --Milkbreath 12:04, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

I wonder how far I'd have to move a crow to keep it from returning. Also, no need for dingoes (good thing too, none of those around here), the chooks would sort it out if it couldn't fly away. --Psud 12:09, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

What are the chooks doing while the crow is fumbling with an egg? I think you can forget about relocating crows. I just looked at an article from Smithsonian (Crows fly far and wide, but there's no place like home. By: Gilbert, Bil, Smithsonian, 00377333, Aug92, Vol. 23, Issue 5) that says crows will fly 80 miles from their roost to find food, and they migrate as much as 600 miles. Birds are pretty mobile. I can't link to the article because it's through a proxy.

I wonder if you could put a puppy in with the chickens and let it grow up there. Not a heeler, you know, maybe a spaniel. That sort of thing works with sheep-guarding dogs, I hear. --Milkbreath 12:50, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

The chooks will chase and peck at the crow if they see it, but the crow just waits until all the chickens are at the other end of the yard. A dog? I've heard of raising a puppy with various animals as a guard, even with ducks. So that'd probably work. --Psud 07:13, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Perhaps you should spray the crow with a water hose? ...With mildly annoying/aversive substances like alcohol? Perhaps one of those devices that shoots a pulse of air ("Sonic Blaster" was a toy by that name formerly available in the U.S.) might affect their behavior? Very loud noises? Rap music? George W. Bush speaking?

Atlant 13:27, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

I'm starting to think that the only two options that are likely to work are (1) roofing the chicken run with chicken wire; or (2) putting in enough decoy eggs to increase the effort required from the crow.

I don't think squirting the bird would work - it'd simply wait until there weren't any people watching it. -Psud 07:13, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

I don't know jack about "chooks", but why can't you just close the shed door or the entrance to the smaller pen when the chickens are out and about in the open-air pen? Chickenwire around the shed with a gate maybe? Also I've heard of these things called scarecrows, beats me if they work; I remember buying a fake owl for pigeons in AZ and it not being particularly effective. Finally, what about Australia precludes projectiles? Whack it with a boomerang or something if you are willing to kill it but just lack the means. 38.112.225.84 14:00, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

I don't believe a scarecrow would work - the crow's not scared even of real people. Can't leave the the small roofed area shut off because the various chickens lay at different times of day. --Psud 07:13, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Psud's problem is a tricky one. Anything that will freak a crow out will drive a chicken insane, and, from what I've seen poking around online, anything short of corvicide is only marginally effective, anyway. Any obstacle short of an impenetrable barrier will be circumvented by the wily crow. A hawk or owl decoy will actually attract crows, who hope to drive the predator off its kill or pick the carrion. I'm starting to think roofing the whole enclosure with chicken wire is the only thing to do. --Milkbreath 14:22, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Corvicide? Eek! Corvus cornix 21:48, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

• Sorry to be a typical American, but I'm shocked that you're not allowed to use a BB gun of some kind in an agricultural area. What if dingoes try to eat your baby? --Sean 14:19, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

In an agricultural area, I'd be able to use rifle or shotgun or bb gun, but I'm not in an agricultural area, I'm in the suburbs of the federal capital city (Canberra). --Psud 21:34, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

This document [1] list two kinds of crows as native but not protected species in South Australia so hunting them may not be out of the question. Good eating on a crow, so I hear (may be an acquired taste). Rmhermen 14:46, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

• Re-assess how much trouble covering the open area is. One large job versus years of futility and irritation?--hotclaws 15:31, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

When I was a kid my mum used to try and stop cockatoos from eating our walnuts by spraying them with a Super Soaker. --Candy-Panda 06:58, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

As for shooting at or otherwise trying to kill crows, the futility nothwithstanding, crows are extremely intelligent animals -- among the world's most intelligent. Please don't try to shoot them or otherwise wound or kill them. And in any case, scaring off a few, or wounding/killing a few is not likely to solve your problem. Sounds to me like a roofed enclosure, even if it is "too much trouble", is the way to go. ...can I say it once more? Crows are amazing creatures and although troublesome at times, don't deserve their historically negative image. On the contrary, they deserve our respect. If they are a problem, please find a solution other than killing, wounding, or traumatizing them. Thanks. Pfly 08:52, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

I don't know jack about chooks either, but maybe we should co-opt an editor from the "Place of Many Crows" to answer this question. -- JackofOz 03:41, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Covering the top will also have other advantages, like keeping out dogs that might kill all your chickens. If it helps, you might want to make the open area a bit smaller so that covering it becomes easier. StuRat 21:32, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

At the door of the shed, and also at the edge of the nesting boxes, place a plank on its edge. Birds and small mammals wont be able to roll the eggs out. Also, a proper rooster should attack large birds that frighten the hens. Polypipe Wrangler 06:36, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Right you are, Polypipe. A plank across the the door to the chook shed has stopped the crow rolling the eggs out, and seems to have deterred it from trying. A rooster would have worked, but would have annoyed the neighbours a bit much. --Psud 10:59, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Imaginary Friends

Do people who have imaginary friends actually think they're real and that people who question them are blind/liars, or do they just find solace in the concept of an imaginary friend and yell at others for the fun of it? Eggs.Shown 09:42, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

It depends on the person: If you have a younger sibling who probably hasn't attended school for that long, it'll be their imagination at work, and they'll think them real; however, older people, particularly those suffering depression or alienation may find this the only outlet to express their feelings. The Updater would like to talk to you! 10:10, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

You might want to have a look at the article on religion which details many, many imaginary friends. Lanfear's Bane | t 10:56, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Please try to respond to Ref Desk questions without insulting high percentages of your readership. --Masamage ♫ 04:38, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

I dunno. I'll have to ask my friend Harvey. Clarityfiend 08:59, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

There is more detail in the imaginary friend article. Dismas|^(talk) 17:26, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Work Placement

Hello all,

I was wondering whether News Corp. institutions accept work placement programs. Thx for ur help. The Updater would like to talk to you! 10:05, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

They do, but these are only advertised per-institution. For example, The Daily Telegraph (Sydney) has a program for accepting work placement/experience candidates but is not currently actively seeking people. Foxhill 11:18, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

movie stills

I have a movie in my computer and i was wondering whether it is possible to get movie stills from the movie or will i be intruding the copyrights of the movie? There is a 'print' button in that movie player to print the paused view.so is it possible to get the stills? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Arya237 (talk • contribs) 10:45, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

You might want to check the copyright at the start of the film first. It may forbid you from reproducing the film in part in any medium. Lanfear's Bane | t 10:51, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

• Yes, it would be possible, but you'd be violating copyright in 99.99% of the cases. - Mgm|^(talk) 11:00, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Do however read the article on fair use, it might be OK; do however read the Fair_use#Common_misunderstandings section too. Lanfear's Bane | t 11:16, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Way to be copyright paranoid, guys. A single still or two from a feature-length movie is almost certainly going to be fair use under U.S. law unless he is putting them on T-shirts and selling them. Anyway assuming you are talking about a DVD the easiest way to get the stills is to use a program that will easily capture them for you (I think VLC does this), otherwise you have to turn your video hardware acceleration down to zero and then you can take regular screen captures. --24.147.86.187 12:39, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

The main point to consider here is what you're going to do with the screen captures. Copyright law really only comes into effect once you start distributing the copied goods. Perhaps hanging a screen capture on your wall is officially a copyright violation, but this is where the boundaries between 'copying' and 'viewing' get really murky. Wikipedia itself uses screen caps in articles, under a strict fair use policy, so in many cases it does qualify as fair use. Also, the reference desk has this thing about not giving out legal advice, so if it's important, ask a real lawyer. risk 14:33, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

To grab a still from a movie in a player not using a dedicated software for it (loads of them around) you need to first turn off the hardware acceleration if you have it on. This is (in Windows) in Control panel>Display>Settings>Advanced>Troubleshoot>Hardware acceleration>None. You then press the print screen key and paste (or Ctrl-V) it in any 2d program (Photoshop, Paint). Unless you have the copyright on the movie you need to ask the owners for any commercial use of the image. Keria 23:31, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Ear gas

Is there a list of songs that either have been used or are recommended for use in driving people out of a barricaded position? I think that's the funniest thing in the world. My favorite is "These Boots Are Made for Walkin'". --Milkbreath 14:05, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Perhaps it is somewhere documented what music the United States used against Manuel Noriega? Me, I'd think George W. Bush speeches would be the ultimate torture for humans, even if not for crows. Unless Vogon poetry becomes available.

Atlant 15:45, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

There was a piece on NPR a week or two ago about the use of loud and repetitive music for the purposes of torturing terrorism suspects in US detention centers. The guy who recorded one of the pieces they use was talking about suing them over it...now, if only I could remember who that was! SteveBaker 22:42, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Here are three .gif images of an after-action report regarding the Noriega psyops. Apparently they were getting requests for tunes as messages for Noriega. Great stuff. Tony Fox (arf!) 22:57, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

One that I don't see listed, which was later used in a parody of the use of these songs in The Drew Carey Show, was "Panama" by Van Halen. In the show Carey is to be forced out of his home due to some imminent domain deal, if I remember correctly, and the characters in the house try to figure out the lyrics of the song. Dismas|^(talk) 23:04, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

The deal might have been imminent, but it was one of eminent domain. --LarryMac | Talk 14:47, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Actually, "Panama" is on the list, if you look at the 'P's - someone just missed the carriage return, so it's not on its own line. Tony Fox (arf!) 15:56, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Ah, so it is and that's why I missed it. I just scanned down the first word of each line. And yes, I meant "eminent"... Dismas|^(talk) 16:03, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Strange donation comment

On Tue, 10/23/2007 - 23:30 an anonymous user donated $500.00 to Wikimedia with the comment: "For tripling the number of Elephants in Africa!" What the hell did they mean by that? Weasly 15:07, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

See Wikipedia on The Colbert Report. --Richardrj ^{talk email} 15:11, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

also Wikipedia:Wikiality_and_Other_Tripling_Elephants -- Diletante 16:55, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Help to create a table with MS Word

Hi!, I really need help to create a table with MS Word XP (2002) that is wider than 22" (or with Adobe Acrobat Professional 6.0, but it has to be wider than 22"[and not with MS Excel]). It will not be for printing. I have searched for help on the web for hours, without being able to find anything useful. I feel very frustrated and am under a lot of stress. I will greatly appreciate any good help that I can receive. Thank you very, very much. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.70.65.132 (talk) 16:20, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

If it's not for printing, why does the physical width matter? Can't you just use a small font (and a large zoom factor if necessary)? AndrewWTaylor 16:38, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Incidentally, this thread gives a plausible explanation of the 22" limit AndrewWTaylor 16:45, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

If you elaborate a bit on why you need it and what you would be using it for, perhaps we can help you come up with a good alternative. As it is, the 22" width is hard-coded into Word and cannot be directly gotten around, but depending on what you want to use it for there may be indirect ways to get around it and achieve the same result. --24.147.86.187 17:08, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Yes— I have no idea why, but Word has a 22 inch maximum for page width and length. I don't have OpenOffice.org installed here at home, but you might try it. --— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 01:32, 27 October 2007 (UTC) fuck every one

tick dormancy at low temperatures?

At what low temperature do ticks become dormant? It seems that when the temperature drops below freezing the ticks wouldn't be able to move around. They are cold blooded, right? I walk in the woods (California, Sierra foothills) a lot and wonder when I am safe from these pests. I already know that ticks here are inactive (or at least much less active) during the hot, dry summer. Dry is the key. Now I'm trying to figure out when they are inactive during the rainy season. Probably scientists have learned what the cut off low temperature is for tick activity. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Annecallaway (talk • contribs) 17:26, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

I'm no tick expert, but I found a couple of papers online that shed some light on your cold tick. One says they call it quits at around four degrees Celsius. The other says they found ticks by flagging when it was two below Celsius with snow on the ground. They sample an area for ticks by dragging a large piece of cloth over the bushes, "flagging". There must be a zillion species of tick, and I wouldn't expect them to all behave the same, but maybe this gets you in the ballpark. Bottom line, the woods ain't never safe. --Milkbreath 02:55, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Just a thought: when it's colder, aren't you more likely to wear long pants and long sleeves? If so, isn't the problem of ticks rather mitigated? --24.147.86.187 03:22, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Not really. Ticks are quite good at getting inside your clothing; in fact, they prefer feeding spots just under the edges of clothing. --Carnildo 20:57, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Lockhead Martin and Boeing advertising campaigns

The plastics question was answered very well so I have a new similar question. What did either of these companies have to gain from advertising to the general public? By improving their image were they trying to garner political support for keeping manufacturing jobs tied to weapons projects alive?

63.199.245.117 20:08, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

There can be a lot of reasons to advertise, some of which are not necessarily specific in intent. I always read those ads—and it is worth paying attention to the limited types of publications they appear in (e.g. The Atlantic Monthly, not Entertainment Weekly)—as being about prestige. "We are an important and relevant company," always seems to be the message, which doesn't itself get them much except when it is used in conjunction with lobbying (e.g. if you are primed to think they are important, maybe you will treat them as such when you sit down to talk with them or about them). But I don't really know what they have in mind when they take out such ads; it would be interesting to see how exactly their PR strategy works. --24.147.86.187 00:01, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Shareholders. They want their stock price to rise and advertising to people who buy stocks and shares increases demand and pushes the price up. SteveBaker 13:32, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Please tell me

What are the 8th, 9th and 10th largest cities in Victoria, Australia? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 138.217.152.215 (talk) 22:26, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Depending how you count cities, there may not be 8 of them in Victoria. Unfortunately, I can't say off the top of my head the largest urban areas in Vic. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Steewi (talk • contribs) 01:52, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

The web site www.citypopulation.de has population statistics for many countries. For Australia it has tables of both "urban areas" and "local government areas" such as cities, and you can just pick out the ones in Victoria. See www.citypopulation.de/Australia-LGA.html --Anon, 01:55 UTC, October 26, 2007.

If you want the "urban area" definition, here is the ranked list for Victoria as of the 2001 census:

1. Melbourne

2. Geelong

3. Ballarat

4. Bendigo

5. Melton

6. Mildura

7. Warrnambool

8. Sunbury

9. Traralgon

10. Wangaratta

If you want the "local government areas" definition, here is the ranked list as of 2006:

1. Casey

2. Geelong

3. Brimbank

4. Monash

5. Boroondara

6. Hume

7. Knox

8. Whitehorse

9. Moreland

10. Kingston

Marco polo 02:10, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

I would not go by the LGA definition, as these are the names of city/shire councils - they are not places (you wouldn't say "I live in Whitehorse", you would say the actual suburb/city). Wikipedia has List of cities in Australia by population, although it lists the largest cities all over Australia, they do list also the state. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.208.110.207 (talk) 06:03, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

The trouble with our List of cities in Australia by population is that it only has the top 43 cities - and only 9 of those are in Victoria:

1. Melbourne 3,592,591
2. Geelong 160,991
3. Albury-Wodonga 96,288
4. Ballarat 85,197
5. Bendigo 81,939
6. Latrobe Valley (incl. Moe, Morwell, Traralgon) 73,476
7. Mildura 46,035
8. Shepparton 44,599
9. Warrnambool 30,392

With the last one on that list only having a population of 31 thousand, I wonder whether there actually are more than 9 cities in Victoria. (and what about "Latrobe Valley (incl. Moe, Morwell, Traralgon)" - is that considered a city?) That would explain the abrupt ending of that list of cities as just 43 places. I presume Australia is more like the UK in placing a larger lower limit on the size of a city. Here in the US, the term "city" refers to how the place is governed - not to how big it is. In the UK, to be a city you used to have to have a cathederal - so some very small places ended up being cities with other, much more populated places being 'towns'. I don't know how Australia sets the limits - but if it were "Any place with a population of 30,000 or more" - then those 9 places are it.

SteveBaker 13:28, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

There is no legal definition of "City" in Australia, as far as I can tell. FiggyBee 15:39, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Our article City seems to echo that. "In Australia and New Zealand, city is used to refer both to units of local government, and as a synonym for urban area. For instance the City of South Perth is part of the urban area known as Perth, commonly described as a city.". It goes on to say that in New Zealand and also in Germany, the lower size limit is 50,000 people - which seems reasonable. But the smallest city in the USA has just 350 inhabitants...so the meaning of the word has considerable 'wiggle room'! Anyway - this vagueness accounts for why our OP was unable to find the information for the 8th, 9th and 10th 'cities'. Mildura, Shepparton and Warrnambool all fall under the '50,000' rule - although Mildura is close enough that maybe the population hit 50,000 sometime after whatever day the data for List of cities in Australia by population was recorded. So it's perfectly possible that the correct answer to this question is "There are only seven cities in Victoria". SteveBaker 16:29, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Yes, it's a very fuzzy concept. I used to live in the City of Whitehorse (mentioned above). It has a clearly defined boundary, a Council, a Mayor, and all the usual bureaucracy. However, it's a part of what is usually referred to as "Melbourne", as are many other cities (City of Yarra, City of Stonnington, City of Boroondara, City of Darebin, ...). Melbourne itself includes the City of Melbourne, which takes in only the CBD and, since recently, the adjoining Docklands. The Lord Mayor of Melbourne by rights speaks for only the people who live in the City of Melbourne. However, I believe that in certain fora he is considered a representative of the greater Melbourne area, despite not being elected by the great majority of those people. So, most people would for normal purposes consider the greater Melbourne area to be a "city" - indeed, it's the capital city of Victoria - but that "city" contains many other cities, many of which are greater in population than Mildura, Shepparton, Warrnambool etc. This "cities-within-a-city" idea applies in most Australian state capitals, with the notable exception of Brisbane, which since 1924 has been governed by a single council, the Brisbane City Council, which has a budget greater than the state of Tasmania. This has lead to the oft-disputed claim that Brisbane is one of the largest cities in the world. It all depends on how you define your terms. For that reason, I'm not even going to hazard a more precise answer to the original question. -- JackofOz 23:21, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

October 26

why does the wind blow??

its a question that i can't be able to solve —Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.8.201.164 (talk) 01:01, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

For the same reason anything on Earth moves: because the Sun shines. The Sun heats some parts of the Earth more than others, hot air rises, and cool air blows in to displace it. Of course it's a lot more complicated than that, but the Sun is the ultimate source of energy. —Keenan Pepper 01:50, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

If you want more detail, read our article Wind and the articles linked to it. Marco polo 01:56, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Suppose there were no Sun. Something tells me that there would still be wind due to Earth's rotation, but I can't think how that would happen. The air would become very cold and still, wouldn't it? DirkvdM 09:27, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Were there no Sun, the planet would too become cold and probably die sooner or later (but then again - no sun means no planetary system). Wind is caused by changes in air pressure, which are caused by many, many diverse factors. I think. Cheers, Ouro (blah blah) 11:15, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

If the sun 'went away' and assuming there was some kind of very even heat source preventing the atmosphere from freezing - yet not creating any hot-spots, the Coriolis effect would keep the atmosphere churning around and thus create wind. Even if the earth stopped rotating (hence no more coriolis), the moon would exert tidal forces on the atmosphere (the same as it does with the ocean) - which would manifest itself as wind. It's really quite hard to imagine a planet with a gaseous atmosphere but no wind! But in the real world, by far the biggest effect is that the sun heats one side of the planet while the other side cools and the oceans change temperature very little while the land heats up and cools down rapidly. Because hot air is less dense than cold air you get pressure differences between the air over areas of the earth that are at different temperatures. Thus you get winds blowing between areas of different temperature. Once the air gets moving, things like coriolis prevent it being a nice simple air flow and the shape of the land and ocean (which heat and cool at different rates) add more complexity. When cold air moves in to replace warm air, that changes precipitation and also cools the land - which results in even more temperature variations. When warm air moves in over water, it causes evaporation and the air becomes humid. If humid air subsequently cools down (eg when the sun sets) - that creates clouds which will later reflect more sunlight back out into space than the land does. So now you get yet more temperature variations. The result of is this "chaotic" (in the mathematical sense of 'chaos theory') swirling pattern of winds that are impossible to predict on a small scale over periods of more than a few days. SteveBaker 12:44, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Bzzt on the first point (and only that one). The Coriolis effect does not create wind, it only affects its direction once something else creates it. --Anon, 19:16 UTC, October 26, 2007.

Yes, that's what I thought too. Take a planet that is so far from the Sun (or whichever star) that the incoming light is negligible and which has no moon and is completely 'dead' (no internal heat source). Wouldn't the air, if it ever moved at all, come to a complete standstill (relative to the surface of course)? DirkvdM 08:51, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

The air would not only come to a standstill, it would freeze solid! Unless it was helium, that is; in that case it would condense to liquid, and remain still. --Anon, 05:26 UTC, October 29.

Yes of course, silly me. But without any heat source, wouldn't the temperature drop to (close to) 0 K, and helium freeze too? The article says that would happen at 1.15 K, 66 atm. Oh, hold on, there's pressure too. With vacuum surrounding it, wouldn't there be a tiny layer of helium (and other gases) sitting on top the frozen (and probably perfectly flat) surface, even at (as close as possible to) 0 K? And who are we then to say that an atmosphere can not be, say. 1 mm thick? So would this atmosphere have any wind? DirkvdM 06:21, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

The Earth's surface would come into equilibrium with the cosmic microwave background radiation at 2.7 K. This is not "as close as possible to" 0 K, but it is below the boiling point of helium at 4.2 K, so there would be liquid helium and no gases to speak of. Read the short story A Pail of Air for a vivid and more-or-less accurate description of such an Earth. —Keenan Pepper 03:48, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Odd question :)

Hello again! I believe that this is *ahem* a weird question, but I remember seeing something on the Wikihate talk page about two templates (the first was "This user has given you the finger" & the second was "This user has given you a blank stare") that I'd like to track down again. They were funny to see :) Just thought some wikipedians here might remember seeing them. Thanks again! --極地狼 ( 我是一头死的狼 ) 02:33, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

I know User:The Hybrid/Finger. Cheers,JetLover (Report a mistake) 02:50, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

And I know User:The Hybrid/Blank. Cheers, Ouro (blah blah) 11:13, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Thanks guys! --極地狼 ( 我是一头死的狼 ) 19:06, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Handguns of the 1950s USA

I'm working on a work of fiction (of sorts) set in the mid 1950s (Eisenhower era). I need the make and model of two guns that would have been common at the time. The first should be relatively low stopping power but high accuracy, and the sort of thing that a cop might have (e.g. the equivalent of a Glock 9mm today). The other is a much larger gun, less accuracy but high stopping power, ideally intimidating looking, as much for show and noise as for actual killing (e.g. the equivalent of maybe a Desert Eagle or something even larger today).

Thanks for your help! I know someone out there will know this sort of stuff quite easily... --24.147.86.187 03:26, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Cops of that era would have invariably used the S&W Model 10. For a "flashy" looking gun you could go with a tricked-out M1911 or even a Colt Python if you need something powerful (although the Python wasn't first manufactured until 1955, and was never common). FiggyBee 03:41, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Thanks! Those both look perfect for the purpose. --24.147.86.187 13:48, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

If the character was a World War II veteran, he might have brought home a German gun. A Luger P08 pistol, maybe? Corvus cornix 17:14, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Or a Walther P38. But neither the Walther nor the Luger are a typical cop's gun, nor something powerful and intimidating looking. FiggyBee 17:34, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Transporting Blimps

How are blimps moved from venue to venue. Do they just fly them there, or do they deflate them load them on a truck and drive them?--ChesterMarcol 03:46, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

According to Goodyear, "when traveling cross-country the blimps fly wherever they go, and the crews try for an eight-hour day, or about 300 air miles." [2] Rockpocket 07:24, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

"they fly to wherever they go"? Good thing they don't end up somewhere else! (off to edit the blimp article ....) --LarryMac | Talk 14:44, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

The Helium is too expensive to just let it out into the air and repressurise with new gas each time. The equipment to suck the helium out and repressurize it into easy-to-transport cylinders would be cumbersome. They fly at around 35mph - but because they can do that in a dead straight line without traffic delays - when you consider the time and effort to properly deflate them and reinflate them (that's not just a simple gas bag - it has lots of internal equipment and there are several 'ballonets' inside that actually contain the gas, it's certainly faster to fly them where they need to go. SteveBaker 13:03, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

I saw the ground crew equipment for a Goodyear blimp years ago, and the trailer looked like it indeed had a pump for removing and storing the gas from the balloon. Edison 21:46, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

I certainly would expect that they would occasionally need to deflate the blimp, during maintenance cycles, when transporting it in bad weather, etc. StuRat 21:48, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Not a blimp, but in 2005 the Zeppellin NT airship had to be dismantled and trucked across Russia because of some problem getting flight clearance. 69.95.50.15 15:01, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Some Questions about U.S. Politics

Hi, I have a few questions about politics in the United States. I am from Australia, and am confused with how it works. I am unable to find much information on the Internet (it all assumes you know a bit about U.S. politics), so I appreciate any answers you could give me. Sorry if these questions are a bit obvious.

1. In the US, you not only register to vote, but also can register with a party. What effect does it have? Why is it neccessary - it's not like it binds you to vote for that party, does it? If you register with that party, does that mean you can only vote for members of that party in elections?

2. What exactly is the electoral college?

3. Which house (the upper house or lower house) is the president part of?

4. Why do I never see footage of George W. Bush speaking in parliament like the prime minister does in Australia? You never see Bush arguing or answering questions posed from the opposition in parliament - I only ever see him make scripted speeches in other places.

5. And finally, why are people so passionate for certain parties in the US? I see whenever key politicians make a public speech there are streamers, balloons and crazed fans. People in Australia may prefer a certain party/politician, but they aren't like people are in the US.

Thanks. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.208.110.207 (talk) 12:55, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Okay, here goes;

1) If you are a registered Democrat or Republican, you get to vote in Primary elections for candidates for that party.

2) The United States Electoral College is a group of representatives from each state who select the president. The article has much more detail.

3) Neither. The United States has a seperate executive and legislature, unlike the Westminster system used in Australia where the members of the executive are also members of the legislature.

4) because of 3.

5) Who knows? It's certainly getting more that way in Australia though. I'm sure that most Americans aren't quite as polarised as we see in the media though; it's always the partisan hacks that make the most noise, rather than the middle-of-the-roaders. FiggyBee 13:08, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Let me (as a Brit living in the US) have a shot at this one (it's good practice!):

1) I believe (and I'm not an American) that if you register with a party you also get to vote in the primaries to decide which of the guys in your party gets to stand for election. The final election vote is secret - so you could still vote for the other party's candidate if you wanted to.

2) The theory is that when you vote in the presidential election, all you are really doing is picking some guy in your area to become a part of the "electoral college" (which is nothing to do with a 'college' in the usual sense of the word). All of the people who are a part of the college then decide who gets to be president. (In theory they could pick someone other than the candidate you voted for!) What this does in practice is to change the system from simply counting the number of votes for each candidate (which would have lost the present president his first election by a significant margin) - to a system where each state gets some fixed number of seats in the electoral college. This means that some states have a disproportionately large number of electoral college seats and others disproportionately fewer. I have no clue why this might ever be considered a good idea...but that's how it is.

Originally it was supposed to be a mixture of national and state power. As a federation, power lies in both the people in general and in each of the states. The two houses of Congress address these two issues -- the Senate is state-based, with 2 senators per state regardless of that state's population; the House is population-based. The electoral college was intended to be a mixture of the two -- the population votes in general, but each state votes wholly for one or another candidate, based (hopefully) on the state's popular vote. James Madison explained this mixture of national and federal voting in one of the Federalist Papers. I'm not sure whether the electoral college still works the way Madison intended however. Pfly 08:49, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

3) The US system has four branches of government - the two houses, the judiciary and the president. The president is not a part of either house.

Not quite. We have 3 branches of government. The two bodies of legislature are part of the same branch(because they fundamentally have the same set of powers with a few minor differences when it comes to things like wars, treaties, and taxes) i kan reed 03:38, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

4) The president may (on occasion) speak in front of one or other house - but because he's not a part of either of them, there is no special requirement to do that. (I think the annual "State of the Union" address may be an exception to that).

5) Americans are nuts. Live with it.

SteveBaker 13:14, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

The House of Representatives and the Senate are usually considered as being two parts of the Legislature, rather than two seperate branches of government. Re the State of the Union Address being mandatory, Article II of the Constitution says "He shall from time to time give to the Congress information of the state of the union", but exactly how (and how often) he must do that is not specified; as Toby observes on The West Wing, he could buy them a newspaper subscription and that would probably qualify. FiggyBee 13:38, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

The State of the Union Address in the U.S. system is the nearest analog of the Speech from the Throne in the Westminster system: the chief of the executive branch (or her representative) addresses the legislative branch on policy issues. Of course, there is a big difference in that in the U.S. system the president and legislature may be adversaries, where in the Westminster system as it now exists in practice, the chief executive is a figurehead and it's the Parliament that determines which party forms a government (which in this sense corresponds to what the US calls an "administration"). The throne speech is actually written by the government and most of the time it can reasonably expect Parliament to carry out its program; not so with the State of the Union. --Anonymous, 16:39 UTC, October 26, 2007.

In certain states - Virginia being one - a voter is allowed to vote in a primary election of either party. i.e. a registered Democrat may vote in the Republican primary or vice-versa. I believe a non-affiliated voter may vote in either one as well. It looks like the 2008 Presidential primaries for both parties will occur on the same date, so a voter will need to select which ballot he will be voting upon arrival at the polling station. --LarryMac | Talk 14:40, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

The Westminster system does have a separate executive, since the Governor General is the head of state. So you don't see Michael Jeffery, or in my case Michaelle Jean, arguing in the legislature, but you do see them giving scripted boring speeches on occasion. But it's not quite the same because the US President has considerable more power than the Governors General (I don't know what the Australian GG does, but Canada's, while she legally has enormous US-president-type powers, in reality has none at all). Adam Bishop 14:43, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

The answer to question one varies a lot. From state to state and even sometimes the state parties change the rules. Some states may require registering, other don't but as far as I know everywhere you can only participate in the process for one party (In a primary you cannot vote for a Republican presidential candidate and then for a Democratic Senate candidate). Process rules change though - Michigan had a caucus in 2000, but a kind of primary in 2004 and, for 2008, the Michigan rescheduled its primary to a time not allow by the Democratic National Party and currently whatever delegates it chooses won't be seated at the National Convention. SteveBaker's answer to question one will not worl everywhere as there need not be any secrecy about which party you vote for (some places you have to take either the Democratic ballot or the Republican ballot, the votes may be on different days). If your state has a caucus even your choice of candidate within the party is public knowledge. Rmhermen 17:22, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Re: question number 1: In California, you can register as "Decline to State". This lets you choose which party's primary election you want to vote in. Even if you're not registered Republican, you can choose to take the Republican primary ballot. This is different from "Independent", in which you may only vote on non-partisan offices (judges, for example) and ballot measures in the primary. During the General Election, everybody votes on all of the issues and candidates, regardless of party. And re: Question 4: The Constitution of the Confederate States of America (Article 1, Section 6) called for the President's Cabinet to sit on the floor of the legislature so as to be available to answer questions by the representatives. But this has never been implemented in the US Constitution. Corvus cornix 17:18, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

The reason why a straight popular vote isn't used to determine the US President is that the states were originally thought of as countries, which were in a loose union like the European Union. In the EU, I assume a popular vote would have the same effect, with less populous nations like Ireland losing almost all political power to large nations like Germany. StuRat 22:02, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Comic Books and Law

I am working on my senior thesis, which relates to legal issues within comic books. The most prominent issue that I am working on is the Mutant Registration Acts. If anyone else could suggest topics to explore, or legal issues that would arise, it would be most appreciated. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 141.238.69.103 (talk) 14:29, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

What's the thesis for? It makes a big difference if it's a cultural or a legal study (or whatever). Anyway, I think the legal issue that ties pretty much all superhero comics together is the issue of vigilantism. All superheroes are essentially unlawful. For most, the situation is so dire that normal law cannot maintain order, and their actions are condoned. But I think every series has dealt with the issue of where the line is, and how far a superhero can go, before the government steps in. Specifically X-men has always shown the tension between government and superheroes. risk 15:23, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

I suppose some interesting parallels might be made to real-world governments that have attempted to register members of undesirable sub-groups of their population, and the results of such registrations. -FisherQueen (talk · contribs) 17:32, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

You might be interested in Alan Moore's comic Watchmen. It covers a lot of the same issues, quite in-depth as they are central to the storyline, regarding vigilantism and tension between superheroes and the government and might provide an interesting compare/conrast with those issues as covered in X-Men. Plus, it's just a good read period. Also, there is some content related to anonymity/privacy issues which could possibly be tied in. Anyways, sounds like it could be a very interesting paper, good luck. Azi Like a Fox 18:01, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Another legal issue that has been brought up in a recent story arc of X-Factor is the Endangered Species Act. The argument was that after M-Day where most of the mutants in the world lost their powers and left only a couple hundred remaining with powers, these mutants that were left were therefore endangered and entitled to government protection. The character that brought this up and wanted to have the remaining mutants rally in Washington, D.C. really just wanted to gather them together so that he could exterminate the remaining mutants but the point is still valid. Since there are so few mutants now (in universe of course) there is an argument to be made for classifying them as an endangered species. Dismas|^(talk) 20:09, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

For me the mutant registration act can be compared to other registration acts (most obviously Jews under the Nazis). In addition the 'mutant gene' is often used as an allegory for a number of other minority groups sometimes considered to be 'potentially harmful', for example, ethnic minorities, homosexuality, minority belief systems and so on. It also brings up issues of genetic normality and deviance (how different does one have to be before one is a mutant?), genetic manipulation, conformity and more. The legal aspects of the registration act would have to include scope, privacy, secrecy, medical privacy, restriction of movement, foreigners (do visiting mutants have to declare their genetic abnormality?).Steewi 02:36, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

For example, one of the issues that I am addressing are: 1. Does Superman require a warrant to use his x-ray vision when catching criminals? 2. Does a superhero have a right to a secret identity? 3. Is the MRA and SRA constitutional? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.24.210.17 (talk) 16:18, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

In Victoria, Australia, Workplace Safety acts (dont know exact name) require workers to keep themselves, other employees and the public safe. The power of the acts isnt circumscibed however, so if superman was at work he would be legally required to catch falling aircraft etc. Polypipe Wrangler 06:51, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Number of Amazon user accounts

How many people in the UK (or worldwide) hold accounts with Amazon? Thanks —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.96.27.149 (talk) 15:10, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

I don't have an answer to your question. However, I think it's worth pointing out that Amazon allows you to buy things without actually creating an account (i.e. by entering your details for a particular purchase only). That means that many conclusions you could have hoped to draw from knowing the number of accounts may not be representative of the truth. /85.194.44.18 09:01, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Rock Candy

Our article on Rock candy states: "It was also used in Thailand as money, for it was easily accessed and distributed. You could bet the candy on many things, and bet pieces or pounds." Can anyone verify this? It seems dubious to me that something so common could be used as currency. One may as well use leaves. Dismas|^(talk) 15:59, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Looks very dubious to me too. I'd move it to the talk page until someone provides a citation. — Matt Eason ^{(Talk • Contribs)} 17:12, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Writing Articles for Money and being an Admin

I have been on Wikipeodia for a long time now; i know i haven't edited much actively but I do read it every day; even got fired for it at work (now I work as a bartender); but anyway I got a MA in English and have been writtin a lot so I heard about people who does writing articles for money on Ebay and Wukapedia; I was worndering how 2 Get involved in that bag, I good writer and wont charge as much as the rest of them.

Plus I obivously have bin reading a lot about it and think I am ready to Run for a REquest for Adminship; how do I start campaigning? Haute Fuzze 16:40, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Well, writing articles for money is highly frowned upon and is certainly at odds with Adminship. Your post above, MA in English aside, also suggests that this is a bad idea. If you wish to pursue the latter, WP:RFA is an excellent starting point. — Lomn 16:53, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

If you are thinking of an request for adminship, campaigning is one thing you should not be doing, as it is not an election. There is the Wikipedia:Bounty board which permits one to edit for money, but the money goes to Wikipedia, not the editor. Rockpocket 18:09, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Editors are expected to have hundreds of good edits before they request adminship, you only have a handful. Admins also need to have a good understanding of wikipedia policies and procedures. You will need to improve your grammar and spelling signifigantly if you want to improve Wikipedia articles. -- Diletante 19:06, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

spelling signifigantly! :D FiggyBee 20:01, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Well I'm not editing for money so you get what you pay for. -- Diletante 21:32, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Rockpock:There is also the Wikipedia:Reward board, though the sums involved are rather small. Algebraist 21:09, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Well there you go, I never knew about that. Thats the great thing with WP, you never stop finding new things. Rockpocket 21:27, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Well, I'm not talkinga bout editting only for money; it is just something i'd do when requessted; I would mostly stil be editting for fun (not for profet). How much do you think i could charge? by the word or artile? Haute Fuzze 00:09, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

The question isn't how much you could charge; the question is who would be willing to pay? No one will pay for something unless they gain some value out of it; what value is there to someone to have a Wikipedia article written? The only way it would be worthwhile is if someone was paying to have articles written to achieve some off-Wiki aim: increasing sales by promoting a product, say, or making political gains by making one candidate look good or another bad. But any articles written in support of such an aim, and that would be effective in achieving it, would probably run afoul of neutral point of view policies pretty quickly. I really don't see a lot of future in it. - Eron ^Talk 00:20, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

I've blocked the user who asked the question, who was a trolling-only account, fyi. -FisherQueen (talk · contribs) 12:07, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Was that supposed to be funny or did he think he was being clever or? I don't get it... Vespine 00:38, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

He was just trolling trying to get people to react for his own amusement, unfortunately i took the bait and gave him a nice troll snack. -- Diletante —Preceding comment was added at 16:33, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Iran and the United States

Will someone please move this to the talk page?

The reference desk is not a place to debate controversial subjects. --Milkbreath 17:20, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

For reference, the question is here. He was asking if certain things he read somewhere were correct. I don't see what's wrong with that. DirkvdM 09:16, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Agreed - there are plenty of questions of fact posed in that post, and furthermore, I don't think it's appropriate to unilaterally remove a question on these grounds anyway. It should only be done if several editors object to the content of the question. I'm restoring it below, pending consensus not to do so. -Elmer Clark 04:24, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Problem is, I only notice this now because I search through the desk looking for my name, so I will skip the threads I have previously deemed not interesting enough for me. I suppose many others will do that too. Because the question has been gone for two days now, chances are that few will notice it anymore. For this reason we really have to clamp down on deletionists. I'm not saying that that was Milkbreath's intention, but this is a way for people to cripple discussions they don't like. So I have moved the question down as if it were a new question. See United States-Iran relations. And I deleted it here again, to avoid confusion. Alas, the questioneer may not (ever) return after having seen his question removed. DirkvdM 12:29, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Hi. It's me who did ask those questions two days back. I've got to admit that my post was quite long. But all I can say is that all I was asking was some clarifications. I was not calling for a debate but rather some facts about what was being said on the BBC website. I feel so dumb now. :( The person who deleted it could have at least told me nicely to reconsider my post rather than rudely deleted it. Anyway, thanks for telling me that I was not all that wrong after all. 132.206.33.111 14:57, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Also, if you look at the start of my post, I did put it clearly that people wanting to debate the issue have to go on the BBC website rather than doing it here. Anyway, this is going to be my last post here because I feel having been bitten. 132.206.33.111 15:23, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

You are right to complain that I didn't notify you. I offer no excuse for that, but I do apologize. I never bite. If I had wanted to bite, I would have answered instead of deleting. If you want to discuss this, we can open a new section on the talk page of this desk. I would hate to have anyone go away mad, and fortunately there is no need for that at Wikipedia. Editors are supposed to be bold, but we work by consensus (even though consensus sometimes comes after the fact). --Milkbreath 15:41, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Actually, the bold bit refers to the encyclopedia proper. There, it doesn't matter too much because if an erroneous deletion is restored, it has been but a little blip. But the ref desk is very essentially different. Not only is it more like a talk page, where one should in principle never edit someone else's posts, but even more importantly things happen very fast here. Questions disappear into the archives in a matter of days and as I explained above a question disappearing for even just a few hours can seriously cripple it. That's why I restored the question as a new one below.

This is why I object so strongly to the rampant unilateral deletionism. About half a year ago I warned that if it became common practice it would lead people to misunderstand the principle and result in problems like this one. I wonder how many questions are removed completely (so including the header) without anyone noticing. DirkvdM 12:23, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

The term "deletionism" only has meaning in this context as opposed to its opposite, "inclusionism". They both seem to refer to practices having to do with the encyclopedia proper, and, further, to define cabals. You use a term that presupposes an agenda, one you yourself subscribe to, on the part of another editor whose only motivation is to keep the desk in line with policy. That kind of thinking runs counter to Wikipedia's spirit and has even less place on the Reference desk than in the encyclopedia. Here, there is no question of "inclusionism" or "exclusionism". No subject is taboo, but an attempt to spark political debate here is. Take off your ism-colored glasses. This is not a chat room. In fact, this exchange belongs not here but on the talk page. --Milkbreath 13:57, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

I agree that the deletion was inappropriate, especially without consensus to do so. Inclusionism and deletionism still apply here in terms of being tolerant of as many posts as possible and being totally intolerant of any question which someone might interpret as violating some guideline somewhere. StuRat 22:19, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Applying the term deletionism here is indeed not quite right because the ref desk is essentially different from the encyclopedia proper. But deleting (without the ism) is even worse here, for the reasons I specified above. DirkvdM 09:46, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Chat

I have not been online for a few years but now that I am bac on, I wish to do some chatting, However due to several IT issues, too complex to go into now, I have no email. What I wish to do is go to a free, informal web site and just have a chat with some people. I do notwant to become a member ect. Do such websites still exist? Or are all of them topic specific, register to use, email password verification required ect. please help me. Thancs¬¬¬¬ —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.3.149.242 (talk) 20:32, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Were you in prison? I'm not trying to make a joke but for real, were you? Haute Fuzze 00:10, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

No, i have just had some mental and financial problems. can you help me chat? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.3.149.242 (talk) 00:13, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Try IRC. You'll need to download a client, but generally, those are free, and the chat channels cover any number of different topics (including Wikipedia). Chat rooms on websites nowadays, at least in my experience, are too overrun by spambots to be worthwhile -- I used to hit the yahoo chat rooms as little as five years ago, and it was a very different situation; you could have actual conversations with real people then. Now it seems impossible. Other people's mileage may vary... Deltopia 02:11, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Community Property

The present Wikipedia article 'Community Property' wrongly states that there are nine community property states in the US. There are ten; the article omits Wyoming.

Esquire

Are you sure? This page and this one don't list Wyoming. (Just so you know, the best place to discuss problems with articles is usually on their talk page - Community property's talk page is at Talk:Community property) — Matt Eason ^{(Talk • Contribs)} 21:03, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Question about relative age of religious texts

MY QUESTION IS SHORT and to the point. I heard that the QURAN was older than the Bible. If this is true can you tell me what was the specific dates of these two texts so I can find out which is older? In addition I was told that in Islam they believe that Judaism distorted the original text from as far back as Abraham and other prohets who were initially all Muslim is that true?

The modern standardised Qur'an was compiled in about 650. According to Bible#Canonization of the Old Testament and New Testament, the biblical canon was essentially established in the fourth century. Due to complications involving the apocrypha, however, the standard Protestant canon was not arrived at until the reformation, so I suppose it could (very speciously) be argued that the protestant bible is younger than the Qur'an. Algebraist 21:04, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

For your second question, Islam and Judaism might be of use. Algebraist 21:07, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Looking beyond the establishment of the biblical canon to the authorship of the various books contained in the Bible, it seems that the earliest books were written sometime between the 10th and 6th centuries B.C. - Eron ^Talk 21:12, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

generally speaking, Judaism came first, then Chrristianity, and the the islam, this is the order that the majority of the religions wisdow came to us from thier profets, who wrote what and when is still disputed to day. Interesting that they all use the same infoup until Abe, and therefore have the same God, yet such diversity.:-} —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.3.149.242 (talk) 21:32, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Terror Release

Can somebody please tell me when silent hill origins is going to be released on the psp in the UK as i have been looking on various sites (including this one), and find a range from october 26th (i haven't seen it in shops yet)- November 17th. Does anybody know the definate realease date for the UK pls?

Thanks in advance - Sci-figod2k7

amazon.co.uk says that it will be released on November 16. -Elmer Clark 04:30, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Are Sweeney Todd and Mackie Messer (Mack the Knife) One and the same?

Is he like Santa Claus/St Nickolas/Father Christmas? Same character-diferent countries/culture?

Very doubtful. Brecht's Mack the Knife was a gangster based on the highwayman Macheath from Gay's The Beggar's Opera, written in the early 18th century. Sweeney Todd was a barber and serial killer who first appears in a 19th century penny dreadful and was possibly based partly on fact, or possibly an early example of an urban legend. Mack the Knife's weapon of choice is a knife, whereas Sweeney Todd uses a straight razor - not the same thing. Gandalf61 21:03, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

The one was a thief, the other a murderer. STs victims ended up in pies that were judged very tasty.86.197.17.8 14:23, 27 October 2007 (UTC)md

The Bombay Bicycle Club

I have heard that there is an organization called the Bombay Bicycle Club that is a kind of secret society akin to Bohemian Grove, the Masons or the Illuminati. Is this true? If so what are the alleged origins of the Bombay Bicycle Club? 206.188.56.88 —Preceding comment was added at 21:05, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

According to their website, "The Bombay Bicycle Club is the oldest men's club in the World... founded during the War of the Roses by the British riding team of Bombay and sanctioned by Queen Mary. Although many directors and members of the club have had connections to the Masons and Knights Templar, these organizations have never been associated with the Bombay Bicycle Club." We don't have an article on it (yet): Bombay Bicycle Club (probably because its a bit of a challenge to find reliable sources establishing notability and verifiability) Rockpocket 21:32, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Did the British even have a riding team in Bombay back in 1487? A bicycle riding team? 206.188.56.24 23:49, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Well, as the British didn't get hold of Bombay until the 17th century, and the bicycle wasn't invented until 18th or 19th, I'd say someone is having a bit of fun. - Eron ^Talk 00:15, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Mary Magdalene, a disciple of Christ, about 45 A.D., came through Epheseus and converted the leaders of our Women's Club to Christianity. - methinks the historicity of the Bombay Bicycle Club is as accurate as that of E Clampus Vitus. Corvus cornix 01:42, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

mental Bloc/ copeing with PTSD

Hiya, about 6 years ago I was having a drinK in my local with some friends when i was ordered outside, as some one had a problem with me. Now I dont Know why, but i was unable to hit bacK, even though I was given ample oppertunity, such as "get up and fight liKe a man...ill give you a free shot...why wont you hit me?" yada yada yada, i got my arse KicKed, several of my friends were watching, I assume they did not want the same treatment, and so did not jump in, any how theyre not my friends any more. Now, what I would liKe to Know is firstly, why could I not fight bacK? As teenage boys we always used to joKe about what we would do if we got into a fight, but when it came to the crunch, i got "bitch slapped" for 2 or 3 hours, it was a whole nights entertainment for the drinKers. and no one did anything to help. So, the questions: why could I not protect my self? And also, 6 years on why i am still thinKing about it? How can I cope with this? It has changed my social life considerably, I can no longer feel comfortable in a pub or club and this irritates my friends who just dont understand. How can i picK up a girl in a club and have a meaningful relationship, if everytime i go near a pub or club i panic? Your help is greatly appreciated. ThanK you. Dough —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.3.149.242 (talk) 21:08, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Hey there. 1) Please do not double post. 2) Sounds like you could use a therapist, or at least someone more qualified than strangers on the internet. 3) What is up with your 'k' key? 161.222.160.8 23:36, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

It sounds like you went through a very serious and humiliating ordeal. Your pride was challenged, and your fear got the better of you. You had an image of yourself, and how you would deal with this kind of assault on your status, and the tension of the moment was greater than you'd imagined, so you were essentially taken by surprise. You hadn't expected your basic instincts to take hold of you like they did, so you were unable to overcome them. If your self-image gets shattered like that, it can permeate through the rest of your life. You weren't as 'cool' as you expected, so how can you be sure the rest of you pride is justified? I think that not acknowledging this blow to you self-esteem has meant that you haven't allowed yourself to cope with it fully.

You can rebuild your pride and your self image. Your decision to turn away from the friends that didn't help you is a very positive one, as it's an assertion of pride. You're asking questions here, which means you've acknowledged it as a problem that you need to work through. Again, a positive step. I think it would be good to seek some therapy. Any professional therapist will know exactly how to deal with this, and they can help you to get back on your feet in (I think) a relatively short time.

Finally, there are plenty of ways to start meaningful relationships without visiting bars and clubs. Birthday parties, the internet, work, social activities like theater. I read a study recently that showed that most relationships start in public transportation (this was in the Netherlands). The main ingredient to meeting someone is not going into a bar, it's self-confidence. Yours has taken a blow, and there's no shame in getting some professional help with that. risk 00:14, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

I'd like to add that the reason your friends didn't step in, was probably the same reason you couldn't fight back. Their basic instinctive response to the situation was far stringer than they'd expected. Their fear caught them by surprise. So they could not do what they would have wanted to do rationally. Just like you couldn't hit back, they couldn't step in. I said that blaming them was a positive step, but only initially. Forgiving them for not stepping in, means forgiving yourself for not being able to fight. So maybe that's a place to start. risk 00:20, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

than you, really and truelly, than you and sorry about my HIJ LMn ey, it is no longer part of my eyboard —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.3.149.242 (talk) 00:24, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Wow! Sounds exactly like the third incident in The Fall (novel). It's a turning point in Jean-Baptiste's life- by recognizing his preoccupation with the incident he realizes that his entire life had been based on a search for recognition and honor, and since the 2nd incident convinced him of his selfishness and dishonor he began a downward spiral of self-loathing! See a therapist, or read the book. --ffroth 00:48, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

This would be a good question for the Psychology desk, if we only had one. A.Z. 06:26, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

IMO, this particular question would be even better for an actual psychologist, if only I was one. Oh well, dunno, maybe you're a pacifist. 38.112.225.84 19:02, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

And the below question would be a good question for the skiing reference desk, if only we had one...just because we have the occasional question about psychology doesn't mean it needs its own devoted desk. -Elmer Clark 04:33, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

My theory is that the number of psychology-related questions would increase. A.Z. 04:34, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Perhaps, but again, why wouldn't that apply to skiing, or any other subject for which we made a reference desk, as well? -Elmer Clark 05:03, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

I don't know. It wouldn't harm anyone to run a test by creating a test desk for a few months. A.Z. 16:44, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Why would we create a desk that would explicitly invite questions that are against policy? As it says in the page header "Do not request regulated professional advice. If you want to ask advice that "offline" would only be given by a member of a licensed and regulated profession (medical, legal, veterinary, etc.), do not ask it here. Any such questions may be removed. See Wikipedia:Medical disclaimer and/or Wikipedia:Legal disclaimer. Ask a doctor, dentist, veterinarian or lawyer instead." Psychology is a licensed and regulated profession. - Eron ^Talk 16:59, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Many valid questions would be possible on such a Desk, like the differences between the theories of Freud and Jung. StuRat 01:33, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

That just sounds like change for the sake of change, and it would multiply the desks (which are already at about the limit of wieldiness). What about if I wished more people would ask questions about cats; should I create a Cat reference desk? I'm sure there are valid questions that could be asked, and having a cat reference desk would encourage more of them. But we're not trying to encourage people to think of questions to ask, we're trying to provide answers to people who already have a question... Aren't we? Skittle 09:47, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Ski Boots

Hi, I'm trying to buy a used pair of downhill ski boots and was wondering if someone could help me translate the sizings (I'm in the U.S. if that matters). A lot of the sizes given are in cm or something. So, I wear 10.5 +/- depending on brand, what would be the equivalent of that in ski boot jargon? Oh also maybe a ballpark figure for the appropriate length/size of the actual skis, am 5'10" male. Thanks. 38.112.225.84 22:19, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Both this table, and this table, suggests a US 10.5 (mens) is equivalent to 28.5cm on the mondopoint system. A ballpark figure on ski length depends on your height, weight and the type of ski you are interested in. However, you are probably looking at something between 180cm and 200cm. Rockpocket 22:55, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

(ec)The conversion for a US size 10.5 is going to be a 28-29cm ski boot, it will of course depend on the socks you wear while on the mountain. I have to urge you not to buy used boots though, in my experience the boots are the sngle most important piece of gear. You can adapt to skis that are too long or short and same with poles, but the boot has to fit or your experience will be miserable i.e. painful. Trust me, it is worth the extra money. As far as ski length goes, I am as tall as you and I ride a 170cm; but I am also quite thin and weight plays a large part in sizing skis. Your skill level will also play a part, generally higher skill allows for a longer, stiffer ski, which in turn means more speed and a larger turn radius when carving. Really the only way to find out is to try a bunch out and find what suits your style and skill. Most hills have a demo shop where you give them some money (usually something similar to their rental fee) and get to ride on a bunch of different brand new skis. Some have boots you can try out too. Good luck and have fun! 161.222.160.8 23:02, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Thanks to both, I'll definitely be taking into consideration your suggestion regarding boots 161.222. For the record, I'm low-intermediate skill (or was 4 years ago) and as sleek and trim as a jungle cat. 38.112.225.84 19:05, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Stumped

I am fairly good with pictures ,but I cannot figure out how to make a picture into a smaller form. If anyone could help me put it in a small box on my user page It would help out a lot.--DarkZorro 23:34, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

• Easy peasy :)

[[Image:NicePic.jpg|200px]] ie. 200 pixels wide

Or if you want a caption too...

[[Image:NicePic.jpg|200px|thumb|Caption here]] ---- WebHamster 23:50, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

You rock!--DarkZorro 23:51, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Who owns soccer teams?

I would like to know whether soccer teams are generally owned by a single person, or by a small group of people, or by a lot of people. A.Z. 23:49, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

That all depends, sometimes they are owned by a consortium, but mostly, they are owned by one person, who usually acts as the chairmen. There are some owners that stay out of the running completely, such as Roman Abramovich. Hope that helps! Ryan Postlethwaite 23:56, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

OK, thanks a lot! A.Z. 00:13, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

In the UK, some clubs are public limited companys and so are owned by many shareholders (e.g. Celtic F.C.), others are Privately held companies (e.g. Manchester United F.C.) often formed as a proxy for a single person or small consortium. Others are owned by Industrial and Provident Societies in the form of a Supporters' trust (e.g. A.F.C. Wimbledon) and, soon perhaps, one club will be owned by a website on behalf of its members [3] Rockpocket 01:42, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

In Spain, some major clubs such as Real Madrid or FC Barcelona are owned by tens of thousands of their supporters, or socios, which makes the election of the club President an intensely political affair, as the president gets to appoint the team manager and direct policy -- you may remember the last FC Barcelona presidential election when the successful candidate Joan Laporta promised to buy David Beckham, but couldn't follow through when Beckham went to Madrid so he bought Ronaldinho and installed Frank Rijkaard as coach instead. -- Arwel (talk) 08:22, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

October 27

Traditional crimes

Looking at this list.. are all of those things still illegal? Fornication? Bastardy? Mailing an obscene letter? Sodomy? Posession of "buglary tools"? Lying? Vagrancy? All of these laws seem hopelessly outdated and horrifyingly not-the-government's-business, especially from a libertarian perspective. Specifically about vagrancy, how can it be illegal to not work? The article says that there are some 30,000 violations each year.. are these people seriously arrested simply for having no income? What if you don't want to work? --ffroth 00:18, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

I imagine it depends on the jurisdiction. I do know that most places in the US do have a law regrading burglary tools. Some areas still have vagrancy laws on the books, though it has nothing to do (in practice) with not working and everything to do with sleeping in public spaces and/or trespassing on private property to find shelter regardless of what the law says (which is no income=vagrant, it is possible to have an income and not work). As far as fornication goes, check the article, Utah apparently still has a law for that. 161.222.160.8 01:10, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Well, let's see. What sort of fellow do I want to move in down the block? He should frequent prostitutes with the intention of getting them pregnant and fuck anything that will hold still when he can't afford one, spend part of his jobless day writing dirty letters, stand ready to burglarize my house when he's short of cash, and deny all that when asked. Yup, that's my ideal neighbor. --Milkbreath 01:35, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

So the important thing to note about the acts that you've enumerated is that they are all in the "not involving moral turpitude" part of the table. So the table isn't necessarily saying that these things are crimes. What it's saying is that, if you've been arrested or convicted for them some place that they are crimes, that fact will not by itself disqualify you from entering the United States on an I-94. (I am not a lawyer.) --Trovatore 02:32, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Many states still had and sometimes enforced sodomy laws until 2003, when a Supreme Court decision ruled that they were unconstitutional. -FisherQueen (talk · contribs) 02:35, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Whoops -- I missed that Ffroth had mentioned sodomy. That one is apparently on the "moral turpitude" side. Don't bother trying to figure it out. It's the government; it doesn't have to make sense.

I had to look up fornication and sodomy to be sure I knew what they meant back when the laws were made. Turns out I didn't know. Fornication had more to do with visiting prostitutes than taking your girlfriend to the hayloft, and sodomy wasn't only homosexual anal sex, it included bestiality and all sorts of turpitudinous stuff. --Milkbreath 02:54, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

I would be interested to know whether such a list could be successfully challenged on constitutional grounds. My guess is it would be difficult because the court might well find that aliens have no constitutionally protected interest in being allowed to enter the United States. Similarly, US citizens have a constitutional right to join a communist party, but I think alien communists can still be refused citizenship on that basis. --Trovatore 02:40, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

But it says "Crimes involving moral turpitude" and "Crimes not involving moral turpitude" .. both are crimes --ffroth 16:50, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

No, you're missing the point. Lots of things might be crimes somewhere. The list says, if you happen to get convicted of one of the acts on the right-hand part of the table, even though it's a crime according to the law where you were convicted, that fact alone will not prevent you from getting an I-94 visa waiver. --Trovatore 18:07, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

• As for how current they keep these things, when I was becoming a US citizen in 2003, I believe they asked me if I was an officer in the Third Reich. --Sean 22:56, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Surveying Number system

What is the name of the numbering system used in surveying townships. I know it goes like this

6 5 4 3 2  1
7  8  9 10 11
16 15 14 13 12
17 18 19 20 21
26 25 24 23 22
27 28 29 30 31
36 35 34 33 32

I think it starts with the letters "bou" and has a "ph" in the middle somwhere. It is something like bouphronic, or something like that.--ChesterMarcol 00:23, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

See Public Land Survey System and Boustrophedon. 161.222.160.8 01:09, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Just an observation: Oh...my...god. That method of reading text is so much more efficient than flicking eyes back to the edge of a page to read the next line. I once thought text should be written in no more than 5 or 6 word lines (like newspapers) so the eye is just continuously drawn downward instead of flicking back and forth. But this method is amazing. Wow! Many thanks to the OP for bringing up the issue and much love to the 2 unbelievably educated responders. I just found about Reference Desk about a week ago and I'm absolutely captivated.

Just for fun, I quote the first sentence of the above paragraph

Just an observation:  Oh...my...god. 
is text reading of method That 
so much more efficient than flicking 
of edge the to back eyes
a page to read the next 
                   line.

-- SGBailey 22:49, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Definitely. I'm trying to learn tachygraphy (that's how we call it in Brazil anyway, but the page is a redirect) and I decided to learn how to write the symbols backwards so I can alternate directions for each line, then I won't waste time going back to the edge of the page all the time. A.Z. 05:17, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Celebration of the 4 days that matter the most

During the equinoxes the sun spends an equal time above and below the horizon. About 12 hours day and 12 hours night. During the solstices every point on earth experiences either its shortest or longest exposure to the sun for the year. These 4 days are the most profound celestially of the 365 days that make up a year and yet they are all but forgotten in modern western culture. I'm not an historian but I do know that these days were absolutely revered in past cultures. Why are they not celebrated now? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Sappysap (talk • contribs) 00:35, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

They are still celebrated by many people, albeit in slightly bastardized forms. This is because the days of celebration were co-opted into modern religions and cultures as we moved away from a pagan sun worship to other deities. For example, Nowruz is celebrated on the vernal equinox, as is International Astrology Day, Ostara and Bahá'í Naw-Rúz. Autumnal Equinox Day (秋分の日/Shūbun no hi) and Vernal Equinox Day (春分の日 Shunbun no hi) are celebrated in Japan. See also Equinox#Cultural aspects, Winter solstice and Summer solstice#Cultural aspects. Rockpocket 01:17, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

In the Christian calendar, I believe that Easter co-opted the vernal equinox festival and Christmas took over the winter solstice. (Hang about, maybe it's actually the Feast of the Annunciation for the spring... well, it all gets a little muddled. Let's just say there is a fair bit of spring mythology around Easter.) Midsummer Day was the feast of St. John the Baptist (which doesn't seem to get much play anymore, unless you live here. The autumnal equinox was Michaelmas. - Eron ^Talk 01:28, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Of course, for those of us in the Southern Hemisphere, Easter now happens in autumn. -- JackofOz 03:32, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Oh yes, those quaint antipodeans with their backwards seasons... (Note: that's jealousy talking; you're heading into summer and I? Had frost on my windshield this morning.) - Eron ^Talk 03:36, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

You're welcome to summer, Eron. Give me cool/cold weather any time. -- JackofOz 00:07, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

I was just getting used to South African oranges when California's crop suddenly came into season this week. —Tamfang 02:10, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Those days were important to primitive cultures for a couple of reasons. Firstly, they gave you a relatively easy way to know where your calendar is compared to the true year (a non-trivial problem when you think about leap-years and such that those people had not yet come up with). Secondly in a mostly agricultural society, the seasons were important to telling you when to plant and when to harvest and such. In a modern society, those days have no special relevence - there is some mild degree of interest - but it's simply not important enough to warrant a major celebration.

Modern celebrations are set on days that various religious and political entities created in order to gain favor with the common people and to push their own agendas. So the spring equinox was typically celebrated in England on May 1st as "May Day" - a pagan holiday, Beltane, Green Man day...all sorts of traditional celebrations. Then, later the Church decided that this day must be the birthday of the Virgin Mary - presumably in order that they could 'steal' the celebration and steer people into treating the holiday as a religious day (the same thing happened with the Winter solstice and Xmas incidentally). Later, the May 1st holiday was co-opted by the communist/labor movement and used as 'Labor Day' - but then a subsequent conservative government didn't want the labor party getting free publicity - so they moved it from the actual May Day to the first Monday in May. In 1995, the holiday was moved by a week to celebrate VE day. So what happened to celebrating the Equinox? SteveBaker 15:59, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

The summer solstice, sometimes called Midsummer's Day (in contrast to the notion in some countries that it's the first say of summer), is a holiday in some countries, such as Sweden. See under Midsummer. --Anonymous, 03:30 UTC, October 28, 2007.

Raking

It's that time of the year again.. I say we shouldn't rake leaves b/c it makes good fertilizer and it makes grass less yellow looking. What's your take? --JDitto 03:35, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Removing the leaves means removing the nutrients, which will then have to be replaced artificially, so on that count you're right. But it's an aesthetic thing. If you want to leave it to nature to do things the way it's used to, then why have a lawn in the first place? Btw, a friend once experimented with leaving the garden in his new house in a newly built up area (so there was only bare ground) as it was. He hoped for many different natural flowers. Instead, he got one tall grass that covered almost the entire garden. DirkvdM 09:21, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

We did the same thing back when I was living in a shared house with some friends. The thing is, though, that the flowers aren't going to just sprout up immediately if they haven't been growing there before. So unless you feel like waiting several years or decades for your natural meadow, you'd better gather (or buy) some wildflower seeds and spread them around first. Oh, and you still need to mow it from time to time (with a scythe for example; a lawnmower literally won't cut it here), unless of course you happen to have some sheep around to do it for you. —Ilmari Karonen (talk) 21:40, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Rotting leaves produce nitrogen which can burn or damage the green stuff beneath. Raking is not just aesthetic. Leaves also compost much better when raked up and bagged or put in a heap.--hotclaws 09:37, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

WHAT?! They produce nitrogen?! I don't think so. Nitrogen is a gas and it's really non-reactive. Four-fifths of the air is nitrogen. It doesn't burn or damage anything! SteveBaker 15:38, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Decaying organic matter produces nitrogenous wastes (see mention in ammonia. See also fertilizer (ammonium nitrate). --Justanother 18:39, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Per Justanother, in the context of agriculture, 'nitrogen' is shorthand for nitrogen that has been fixed—converted from a form that's inert and utterly harmless (but also useless as plant food) into something bioavailable. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 18:43, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

I believe grass fertiliser contains a lot of nitrogen (in whatever form), so grass probably needs a lot of it. Which makes sense. Grass isn't stupid (never thought I'd hear myself say that). It grows on the ground, so leaves fall on it. So it has evolved to deal with that, probably even depend on it. DirkvdM 19:21, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Everything in moderation, as they say. A little nitrogenous fertilizer can be a good thing; a lot tends to 'burn' a lawn. A few leaves will provide valuable nutrients; a lot of leaves may kill the lawn by blocking light, restricting air circulation, and releasing toxic breakdown products. Remember that in the wild, grasses tend to grow best out in the open—not under the trees.

The exact amount of leaf cover that will help your lawn will depend on the local climate, the quality of the local soil, the type of grass, and the species of tree. (Evergreen trees like pine or spruce shed highly acidic needles which will kill grass.) TenOfAllTrades(talk) 19:42, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

It does make the ground very slippery though so raking pavements/streets makes sense. I guess with grass areas it looks nice to start with but then it will start looking 'messy' (since our idea of beauty is rarely nature in its entirety) so probably best to rake them once most of the leaves have fallen. ny156uk 10:04, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Is it just me or does it usually get chilly and crisp in like late september? Why are we a month late? --ffroth 17:39, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

I don't know where you are but here in Vermont we've had a very unusually warm fall, so a lot of our leaves are still on the trees in most of the state. Dismas|^(talk) 21:59, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

That's what Froth said too, isn't it? Note that it is tempting to attribute this to global warming, but a single warm fall can happen without that. A whole series of warm falls and other seasons, as we indeed experience, is a different matter - that is reason to assume it is caused by climate change. DirkvdM 12:33, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

What do you mean? Our pohutukawa is just starting to bloom! :p --antilived^{T | C | G} 05:16, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

I agree with the suggestion to compost the leaves first (I do this in my house's gutters :-) ). However, if you run them though a mulching mower first, you could possibly get by with leaving the leaf leavings on the grass. StuRat 01:06, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

arachnophobia

Hello, what are the various methods people use to cope with arachnophobia? Thanks! Cheers,JetLover (Report a mistake) 04:20, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

I run to my mom upstairs and tell her to squish it ForeverDEAD 04:58, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Gently place a glass behind it, touch it's 'nose', it turns and runs into the glass, tip it out of the window. Works every time! DON'T kill anything ever --212.139.103.15 06:03, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

This method is just wonderful for getting rid of spiders in a clean non-touch way, but it does not overcome arachnophobia. Why cope when you can cure? The constant avoidance of the phobia stimulant serves to re-enforce the fear. Phobias can best be overcome by discovering that the irrational fear (think tiny spiders here) has no basis. This dicovery can be achieved by gradual exposure to spiders until the anxiety diminishes. Having said that in my experience of treating phobics there are a number of factors that need to be taken into consideration, the motivation and personal determination of the individual being one of the most important. It can be done a a self-help project but it is easier to do with the help of an accreditted professional. 99% of phobias can be cured. Richard Avery 07:29, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Yep. Start off with a big cuddly soft-toy spider in bright, non-realistic colours. About as non-spidery as you could imagine and yet still be worthy of the name. When you can cope with that, you might go to a brightly coloured toy plastic spider, then a more realistic plastic spider, then to photos and videos of real spiders, then a trip to the zoo to see the spiders safely contained behind glass, then onto small, non-threatening live spiders at a distance - then closer - then bigger spiders. Each stage can take as little or as much time as is needed. Before you know it your pet red-knee'd tarantula will be sitting in the palm of your hand. SteveBaker 15:26, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Or, you could take some advice from America's professionals and confront your fears head on...on national T.V. [4]!!! Follow the steps seen in any of the listed videos to be cured by the end of the show. Azi Like a Fox 18:39, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Are we giving medical advice now? -- JackofOz 00:04, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

More like psychological advice. Does this have anything to do with the featured picture for today? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Cryo921 (talk • contribs) 01:46, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

oops forgot to sign my post Cryo921 01:51, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Llandloes

Does anyone have any general or specific geographical and historical information on Llandloes in the UK? 12.72.25.202 05:10, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Llanidloes?—eric 05:26, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

US military nomenclature

Can someone tell me the specfics of how we went from calling our weapons

• M1903 Springfield
• M1 Garand
• M16 Rifle

ForeverDEAD 05:14, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

If I got you right, it's the designation for the rifle, It goes on with each model. For example:

F-14 Tomcat

F-15 Eagle

F-16 Fighting Falcon Cheers,JetLover (Report a mistake) 05:17, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

I mean if you look at the weapons military designation their fundamentally different(except maybe m16 and m1) but the M1903 is named for its year along with the M1911 but the M16 and M1 garand arnt. How did we go from basically saying what year its adopted to the way the German army does it. ForeverDEAD 05:23, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

I don't know the history behind the change, but it looks like it happened around 1928–1929. The M1 Garand went from M1924 to T1E1 in 1929. Sometime after that, the Army switched from T to XM for development models. My best guess it that the Army adopted a new system; by then I'm sure they were adding more than one system a year.

The Army, Navy and Air Force use different nomenclature systems as well as using each others. The Joint Army-Navy Nomenclature System used by all the services for radio gear. There are also separate systems for aircraft, photographic equipment, optical equipment, comsec gear, airplane and rocket engines, missiles and nuclear weapons. This might make a good article in itself. --— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 07:36, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

I'm not sure what "the way the German army does it" means, as the Germans were still using year designations for small arms up to the end of WWII (eg StG44). FiggyBee 07:55, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

I refer you to the lyrics of Aircraft Salesman (A door in the foot.) from Captain Lockheed and the Starfighters:

Salesman: Well, that's ok. We can make some modifications. It'll cost a little extra, but it's worth it. Just look at the shape of this beauty. Look, I tell you what we'll do. We'l' redesign the plane, right? And instead of just calling it the F104, we'll call it the F104G.

Strauss: G?

Salesman: Yeah, eh, Herr Minister - G. G for Germany

Strauss: G. for Germany, eh....

Salesman: Yeah, ehm, G for Germany, Herr Minister, you know, it'll go well on the plane, we could do a logo around it and it would look very tastful up in the clouds. We could illuminate it a bit - so, that on dark days you would see it twinkling like a star.

Strauss: G for Germany..? Also G for Gott strafe England... (God punish England)- - this I am enjoying. (laughter) G for Germany!!

--Tagishsimon (talk) 14:44, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

What military base are theses from

I am from around Parkville maryland and every so often i see A10's fly right over my house. Can anyone tell me or give me an idea of which base they come from ForeverDEAD 06:04, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

The 104th Fighter Squadron of the 175th Wing of the Maryland Air National Guard operates A-10s out of Martin State Airport in Baltimore. FiggyBee 07:44, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Legal system of the US

I would like to know websites where I can learn about the legal system of the US. A.Z. 06:30, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

I mean the everyday aspects, and news, etc. A.Z. 06:45, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Slashdot :) If you have patriotic tendencies though, steer clear --ffroth 16:49, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Try Court TV. They have a website. --Justanother 18:31, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Well, you can start with several Wikipedia articles, such as Law of the United States, Common law, State court, State supreme court, United States federal courts, and U.S. state. These articles are not perfect (in fact the first two are rather incomplete) but will serve to give you a broad overview of how the whole system fits together.

Good sources for getting a taste of the raw flavor of the U.S. legal system would be TMZ.com and The Smoking Gun. These Web sites post a lot of legal documents from various celebrities' legal cases.

Finally, don't forget to visit the Web sites of the largest court systems, including uscourts.gov and courtinfo.ca.gov.

One example of the kinds of stuff that comes into the U.S. legal system is the Forms section of courtinfo.ca.gov. Besides standard forms for pleadings and subpoenas, there are also forms for divorces, temporary restraining orders, menacing dogs, emancipation of minors (when a child wants to "divorce" from his parents), and media requests to photograph/record/broadcast court proceedings. I especially love the section of the notice of menacing dog hearing form (Form MC-601) that says "DO NOT BRING THE DOG TO THE HEARING."--Coolcaesar 18:50, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Thanks to all of you! I liked The Smoking Gun, because it has the real documents, exactly the kind of thing I was looking for. I didn't check the other websites yet. A.Z. 03:05, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Barbed-Wire Fence

A chain link fence.

Why are some of the fences I see, like the one pictured (a chain-link fence with a few barbed-wire strands at the top), sometimes have the barbed-wire angled towards the inside of the fenced-off area. Wouldn't it be more logical for the barbed-wire to be fenced off towards the outside (like most fences of this kind I see), therefore preventing people to get in. Note that I have seen this in places even when there is no reason to keep people from escaping. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.208.110.207 (talk) 09:35, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

You have to fence within your perimeter. Overlapping another property without permission is not allowed.86.197.17.8 14:20, 27 October 2007 (UTC)DT

And if someone decides to enter the property they need to think how easily they can get out - particularly if they need to exit in a hurry! Getting in over a fence with the barbed wire leaning 'inwards' is much easier than getting out. Richard Avery 15:09, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

There are several institutions that would like to keep you in. Plasticup ^T/C 23:38, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Is it really true anyway that people have a harder time crossing the fence if they start from the concave side? I can imagine a strong person grabbing the top strand of barbed wire (between barbs), or the top of the bracket holding the wire, and using it to pull themselves up and over. On the convex side, they'd be more likely to rub against all the strands. --Anon, 03:40 UTC, October 28.

It is significantly easier on the convex side. On that side you can climb the fence near one of the barbed wire support posts, stand atop the fence with one foot on the top of the fence and the other on the barbed wire support and jump over. Unless it's a very high fence or you're landing on a hard surface other than grass, it's not that bad of a fall since you're ready for it. On the concave side, you'd have to climb the fence, then reach for the top strand which is behind you or directly above you. Your feet, if you're wearing shoes, don't have much purchase on the chain link and will likely slide out of the holes in the fence. At this point you have to pull yourself up and over when another barb will likely pierce your stomach as you try to pull your self over. Or if you are near one of the barbed wire supports, you still have to contend with getting over that top strand. It's possible to grab the support and use your feet to swing over the top strand. Then you can be in sort of a prone position and roll yourself over the strand but then you take the chance of tearing your leg up. So yeah, concave is harder. Dismas|^(talk) 04:20, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Thanks, glad to have that cleared up. --Anon, 07:10 UTC, Oct. 28.

Getting up early in the morning

What are the benefits of getting up early in the morning?Is late rising an indication of laziness and sloth? sumal 10:46, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

No, some people just have a different internal clock, and can't help but sleep in late. --Candy-Panda 12:17, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

One possible benefit is if you like to be outside doing work or hobbies, you can be out when the sun comes up or soon after and get more done. Many people aren't morning people though and don't mind sleeping in. Or they work non-standard hours, so getting up late is just a result of having worked late. For instance, those who work second shift in a factory or astronomers who would rather be awake at night rather than during the day. Dismas|^(talk) 16:16, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Having previously worked the first shift in a factory I'd have to say the feeling of "getting a head start on everybody else" is quite nice. -- DatRoot 17:05, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

The more melanin you have the more vitamin D you need, i.e. the more time you need to spend in the sun (of course, you ultimately don't need all that much to get adequate vitamin D levels, but still). So my point is one benefit is getting more sunshine. Of course your body also follows circadian rhythms (rhythms of the sun) so it's healthier to be awake when it's daylight, asleep when it's nighttime. Oh and by the way, I'm the worst in the world, I sleep the day away, am upp all night, and I miss the sun. Rfwoolf 17:13, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Ugh, speaking as someone who wakes up most mornings at five and is not a morning person, it can be hard to come up with any benefits. Beating the traffic affecting later risers is one positive, and watching the sun come up and seeing my city slowly come alive is kind of cool. Also, apparently you are granted access to some proverbial worm, for whatever that's worth. My job also has a 8PM to 6AM shift, which I much prefer despite its wrecking havoc on my circadian rhythm, after which I usually sleep until at least 3PM. So much do I hate waking up early. Azi Like a Fox 18:16, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

A strongly shifted circadian rythm can have psychological consequences. Part of this, I think is a continuing sense of isolation as nobody else is up, and you're very much left to yourself. Another factor is the lack of natural light, which does seem to affect us. Studies have shown that people who work at night are about 4 times more likely to commit suicide (of course there is a cause and effect trap there, as being poor may well be the cause of both having a night job and being unhappy). risk 22:09, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Catching the worm. Plasticup ^T/C 23:39, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Dawn is one of the prettiest times of the day. Pfly 09:03, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

For a photographer it is the prettiest time of day. DirkvdM 12:42, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

I just heard someone on tv (the subject was the end of summer time) saying that some people have a late circadian rhythm and that the standardised working hours wreak havoc on them. In the weekends they compensate by sleeping in until very late, but then on sunday the misery starts again. Such people supposedly are much more likely to be smokers or heavy drinkers. DirkvdM 12:42, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Wierd Sleep Disorder

Hey, I have a friend of mine who has a weird sleep disorder. Many times when he is sleeping, and if someone tells him something, like if you tell him that he's on fire, he will start acting like he's on fire for a bit. He will even start talking (can even have a conversation with him, he once said he didn't do his homework) and walking around sometimes, and almost threw a hat box at a bus driver and occasionally will start punching at things (if he thinks your his enemy), he even punched me in the nose and squeezed my arm and flipped me off. He can even have war flashbacks he never had (played to many ww2 video games). But when he wakes up, he doesn't remember any of it at all (or sometimes remember partial things) Now my question is, what is this called? I've been looking around and I can't find anything on it. So if someone knows, please tell me. And if no one knows, I suggest a page should be made about this.

President stickface 17:30, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Sounds like fun! The WWII thing doesn't sound too unusual- sometimes I dream in a particular game engine if I play that game too much.. like I dream in cartoon if I play TF2 or even the subtle hallmarks of the Source engine appear in my dreams if I play too much counter strike. I used to lucid dream a lot and I'd try to get a game started in the dream, but it was too hard to keep track of enemy AI (not to mention completely un-fun since you just control the enemy head to move right into your bullets) and I kept losing parts of the UI like the gun (it's easy to put yourself in a familiar environment like a CS map, but creating interactive objects is a different story for me- I had to settle with just pasting the image of a gun onto my visual field instead of actually holding one. I've never actually held a gun, that's probably why), and besides I don't get very restful sleep with my brain in full gear --ffroth 17:38, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Nice! I always wondered if anyone else ever dreamed in cartoon. I do occasionally and everyone seems to think me bizarre for it. 71.226.56.79 05:08, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Sounds like there may be elements of Jumping Frenchmen of Maine at play. 84.64.123.72 17:38, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

It's something relating to threshold consciousness, most likely. --24.147.86.187

I think it is something he need to see a doctor about. --— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 21:28, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

No,no, it's like he's in a hypnotic state when he's sleeping and the only times he wakes up is if you hit him really hard or something like that. He will do very odd things while he's sleeping. Here's a "few" examples: I once told him he was tazered, and then he started shaking violently, I even said he was a rockstar and he flipped me off. If someone were too start poking him and making machine gun sounds, he may even start acting like he's being shot. If you punch his leg, he would act like something happened to his leg (shot, blown off, injured). I even said that he was captured by nazi's and he started punching me (then I told him I was on his team, and I finally got him to shake my hand after awhile) I even heard that he started laughing very evil-like once (of course he could be faking this all and that would mean that he went through all this punishment to make us laugh). It's not like he's haveing dreams, it's like the people around him are creating the dreams for him and he's acting it out for them.

President stickface 00:38, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Sounds like your friend is highly suggestible. -- Diletante 16:25, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Odd speed limit sign

What does this sign mean...

that this doesn't?

On The Headrow in Leeds are a number of speed limit signs, but unlike any other speed limit sign I've seen in the UK, the signs consist of white rectangles with "Max Speed: 15". There's a photo of one of the signs in situ on flickr [5]. It's not a tram speed limit (they're diamond, and Leeds has no trams anyway), and as far as I know, no other form of transport gets dedicated speed limits in the UK (the Highway Code says nothing). There's no other info given explaining the signs, and the only seem to exist along the Headrow - nowhere else. I can't imagine it being a mistake either; the Highways Agency is usually pretty effective when it comes to keeping road signs standard, and it's not like speed limit signs are so rare that a sign printer is going to be genuinely unaware of what one looks like! Laïka 20:33, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Actually HGV vehicles are subject to different speed limits to other traffic, e.g. 60 on motorways and 40 on urban dual carriageways. I don't know in this instance but it could be an HGV limit. ---- WebHamster 20:47, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

The "Max speed" signs look like American "Speed limit" signs, so maybe there's some sort of international standardization effort being tested in the area? Just a guess though. Dismas|^(talk) 21:23, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Studying the linked photo, which is a little dark, I wondered if it was the maximum speed at which it was ok to drop litter? Look at the photo carefully. -- SGBailey 22:38, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

It's an advisory speed limit in a semi-pedestrianized area, see page 32 of this document Foxhill 23:08, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Many thanks. Advisory speed limit now has an article. Laïka 01:07, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

You see that style of sign in the grounds of hospitals, parks, places like that where you can drive - but you aren't on a regular public road. Generally, they are only used for very slow speeds where the limit is (presumably) not enforcable by the regular speeding laws. SteveBaker 02:31, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Whereas in North America, "not a public road" places generally use standard road signs whether enforceable or not, and advisory speed signs are routinely used on public roads for curves and ramps that are not safe at the normal speed limit. (They're black on yellow instead of black on white, and either placed below the yellow-diamond curve sign or marked with words like RAMP SPEED. Other variations are used for particularly dangerous curves.) --Anonymous, 0350 km/h, I mean 03:50 UTC, October 28, 2007.

On the North America bit, it may be of interest to note that while the black-on-yellow signs are advisory, the black-on-orange ones (such as those in construction zones) are mandatory and enforceable by speeding ticket. — Lomn 15:13, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Australian speed limit signs match those described by Lomn. Yellow and black ones are advisory, for areas such as tight corners, hazardous roads (such as dirt or gravel) and high-grade slopes. They are not legally enforceable, but will cause a headache on insurance claims when not followed. Steewi 03:13, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

You see them sometimes on roads that are tight, but would otherwise have a fairly quick speed limit on them. Like for instance slip roads onto dual-carriageways or motorways. As has already been established, it's an advisory or recommended speed limit that doesn't hold any legal risks if you disobey it (provided you do stick to the proper limit of that road). Unless of course, you end up in a hedge because the turn is too tight.

Safe to clean glass with metal?

Is it safe to clean glass kitchenware with a stainless steel metal scrubbing mesh? Will the metal mesh scratch or damage the glassware? Thanks. Acceptable 21:10, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

My box of Pyrex (good job I hardly ever throw boxes away!) says on the back: "Do not use: abrasives, scourers". This site also recommends against it, and the Pyrex website says "If scouring is necessary, use only plastic or nylon cleaning pads with nonabrasive cleansers". As pretty much all kitchen glassware is made of the same stuff as Pyrex (borosilicate glass), I'd imagine that it could damage any kitchen glassware. Laïka 23:00, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Steel and glass are of similar hardness. I found stuff online that puts them both in about the middle of the Mohs scale. Of course, steel can be very hard, too. I would expect stainless steel to scratch glass (and make a horrible noise doing it). --Milkbreath 01:23, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

I've cleaned off extremely encrusted food on glass baking dishes using metal scrubbing mesh. Rather than press down at full force I used a moderate force, circular motion, and high number of repetitions, and lots of soaking in soap and water to remove the encrusted food. I wasn't worried much about scuffing the dish up a little, which wasn't noticeable among the regular scraping the dish picks up from use. I would use the mesh as a last resort though. If you are worried about creating grooves where bacteria could potentially proliferate use a lower force and rub in different directions (think like sanding). If something is really stuck on there good perhaps soaking in an acid like vinegar or lemon juice might help? 71.226.56.79 05:22, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

The clocks go back tonight.. what about Big Ben?

What happens to Big Ben to account for the changing of the clocks? 82.12.214.93 22:08, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

There's a guy in the tower who winds the clock forwards/backwards at 2:00 - the lights go off for a few seconds while the clock is turned back.[6] Big Ben still requires a lot of manual maintenance: largely for traditional reasons, instead of being computerised. For example, the speed of Big Ben is controlled by placing pre-decimal penny coins on the counterweights. The man currently in charge of the clock is Ian Wentworth. Most other public clocks now have built in electronic systems which change the time automatically (of course, it's a little embarrassing if you then forget to program the correct date into your clocks...[7]). Laïka 22:31, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Of course, to be precise, Big Ben is the main bell, not the clock. AndrewWTaylor 23:39, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

I wonder if that distinction is becoming/has become obsolete (apart from quiz questions etc). True, Big Ben was a name originally applied only to the bell; but I would have thought it's become associated in the minds of the public with the clock and, indeed, with the entire structure. -- JackofOz 23:58, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Yes - but Andrew is correct - and just bcause others don't know about Big Ben (The Great Bell) is no excuse for it becoming obsolete - shall we forget the Holocaust for the same reason per se?? I don't think so. So, the clock itself may not have a name, but the tower it resides in is called The Clock Tower, often mistakenly called St. Stephen's Tower. 81.145.242.133 11:19, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

I did acknowledge Andrew was correct. However, names do regularly become attached to things via popular usage. Once that process happens - whether one likes it or agrees with it or not - there's no going back, really. It's not a question of excuses. When most people say "Big Ben", the fact is they're referring not to the bell but to the whole edifice - probably mainly because they see it from ground level or in a photo, and the actual bell isn't visible, but they know it's inside (or maybe not). I don't defend that, but neither do I condemn it. It's just a fact of life. I suppose it's a bit like the egg/eggshell thing - we refer to the runny contents as "egg" and we also refer to the whole thing including the shell as "egg". (Bit of an odd analogy, I guess. I'm just trying to keep pace with yours about the Holocaust.) :) -- JackofOz 11:47, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

OK. Let's agree to differ - and get back to basics - and call the whole edifice The Palace of Westminster, comprising The Houses of Parliament, themeselves comprising The House of Lords and The House of Commons, together with Parliament Hall et al, when viewed from whatever angle; the clock tower The Clock Tower; the clock The Clock; and the bell The Great Bell, (or Big Tom in past/common romantic parlance); all commonly, mistakenly, and inclusively referred to as Big Ben. And let's call the Holocaust a big Jewish Lie.81.145.242.133 12:01, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

The clocks do not go back today, but next weekend. Dude, don't scare me like that. I thought I was late for church when I read this. -FisherQueen (talk · contribs) 12:03, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

The clocks did in fact go back at two this morning. Are you perhaps in a different country from Big Ben? Algebraist 12:12, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Daylight_saving_time_around_the_world#In_2007--VectorPotential^Talk 12:20, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

You know, I double-checked by looking out of the window, and noticed that I am in a different country than Big Ben. Sorry for the error. Enjoy your clock-changing, English people! -FisherQueen (talk · contribs) 12:21, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the answers! And let's not be pedantic, as a Londoner I know Big Ben is the bell but our fondness for giving (nearly) every building in the city and unofficial name just gets the better of us. =P 82.12.214.93 20:21, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

CONVECTION OVEN RECIPE CONVERSION GUIDELINES FOR BAKING CAKES, PIES AND COOKING OTHER FOODS.

What are the CONVECTION OVEN BAKING TIMES for cakes, pies and other foods to use in conversion for recipes (and food packages) that only give baking times for conventional ovens? George 643 22:28, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Putting your search string into google gives over 1,000,000 hits. -- Flyguy649 ^talk 23:11, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

I wouldn't expect there to be a straight conversion factor. For some recipes, only the time may change, for others just the temp, for others both, and some recipes may simply not work in a convection oven (very sensitive recipes that can "fall", for example). StuRat 00:41, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Writing in ALL CAPS is considered rude because it constitutes shouting (drawing undue attention). I make it a point not to read questions in all caps. DirkvdM 12:46, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

October 28

Entheogenic Religions

Can anyone give me list of religions that use entheogens? I am specifically interested to know if there are any that use LSD or magic mushrooms. 206.188.56.88 00:00, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Have you looked at Entheogen? It lists several religions that use(d) them. -Elmer Clark 04:55, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

How do I tell the difference between Hard Paste and Soft Paste Porcelain ?

  Hi Volunteers, 

I have read wikipedia pages hundreds of times and find it most useful and so very interesting. > > I am a collector of all things ceramic especially German bisque and porcelains. I have over 400 figurines in my collection most of which are German / European bisque.

>What I would like to know is how can I tell the difference between my hard paste and soft paste porcelain figurines just by looking at / holding / feeling them? Some of the figurines I have feel very light, soft, smooth and warm to the touch, others feel heavier, slightly rougher and colder. I wonder if this is the difference or just the quality? > > I have read all the info I can find on how the two different porcelains are produced and what ingrediants are used, who first invented / used them etc, but I have been unable to find any reference as to how to tell which is which! No seems to have explained that.

>So how do I tell which is hard paste and soft paste when I am cataloging my collection? > > My great uncle was a fanatical collector he hoarded everything and anything! I loved visiting him he always gave me what are now antiques as a gift. When I was a child in the 1950s I seem to remember him telling me that "If you could clearly see your fingers through the bottom of an antique vase when held to the light then it was soft paste, if they were not so clear it was hard paste, if no fingers at all could be seen then it was china or pottery. > > Is this true? > > Pat 74.14.3.228 01:25, 28 October 2007 (UTC)—Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.14.3.228 (talk) 00:58, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Donation Music

What are some common, heart-warming music/songs often used by commercials asking the viewer to donate money towards a cause? For example, Angel by Sarah McLachlan.... Thanks. Acceptable 01:48, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

"Happy Xmas (War is Over)" and "Give Peace a Chance" by John Lennon. Dismas|^(talk) 01:56, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Yes! I've definitely heard Happy Xmas before. Thanks a lot Acceptable 02:00, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Most Featured Article

Which article is a featured article in the most wikipedias? Sseballos 01:50, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

There only is one Wikipedia. There are other WikiMedia Project however, such as Wikitionary and WikiQuotes. Acceptable 01:58, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Perhaps s/he means in different languages. Is there any way (other than manually) of cross referencing featured article lists between the different language Wikipedias? Rockpocket 02:02, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

I'm a he, and I mean articles in a different language wikipedia. Rockpuppet is right and I was wondering if there was anyway to cross reference this. I think an article has 3 FA's in different language wikipedias, but I'm not sure if an article has say, 5 or even 9. Sseballos 02:34, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

William Shakespeare has nine golden stars: Featured article on Afrikaans, Bosnian, English, French, Hebrew, Hungarian, Polish, Spanish, and Swedish Wikipedia. I don't claim this is the record though. ---Sluzzelin talk 10:06, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Moon has 10, and most Solar System articles have at least half-a-dozen or so FAs in various languages. Laïka 14:17, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Nice one! S. A. Andrée's Arctic balloon expedition of 1897 is interesting for existing on merely 7 wikipedias, 4 of which (over 50%!) present it as a featured article. (And it's also interesting for being interesting). ---Sluzzelin talk 14:33, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Thanks everyone! Sseballos 00:40, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Just found: Featured article in largest number of languages: Julius Caesar, featured in 8 languages but not English on Wikipedia:Wikipedia records. Looks like it needs updating. Rmhermen 21:54, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Moon—10 featured articles. --— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 02:06, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Gun in movie poster question

Strange question but what gun is Jodie Foster holding in the poster for The Brave One (2007 film)? I guessed it was a P226 but I could be wrong. --Blue387 01:57, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Looks like a Glock. --Milkbreath 02:11, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

With a metal on the top piece? I'm not a gun expert but I'm pretty sure Glocks are not like that—they're made out of polymer black or gray stuff. --24.147.86.187 02:25, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

The slide ("top piece") on Glocks is metal. FiggyBee 05:47, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

though with a flat black coating. —Tamfang 02:32, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

It's a Kahr 9mm of some sort, says the internet. Google "Kahr The Brave One" and you'll find tons of references. Here's a relatively reliable one. --24.147.86.187 02:21, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Hermit mathmatician

I thought about putting this on the math desk but it's not directly a math question. So before you wonder... That's why.

Every so often in various fictional works I hear/see references to some hermit who can barely read that is discovered to be a mathematical genius. I seem to recall this coming up in Good Will Hunting. Are these stories based on a real person? If so, whom? Dismas|^(talk) 03:57, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Autistic savant might be what you're looking for. -Elmer Clark 05:01, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, the guy in goodwill hunting was actually pretty good at many disciplines, not just math. Recall the scene at the bar where he teaches some preppy kid a history lesson! Brusegadi 06:29, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Ted Kaczynski.—eric 06:47, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

All three of you need to re-read the question. I'm not talking about a whole set of people with a medical condition, I'm asking about a single person. I'm not asking about Hunting himself, I just used that movie as an example. And I'm not talking about Kaczynski. He could read well enough to become a college professor. Dismas|^(talk) 08:14, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

The article on Good Will Hunting mentions Srinivasa Ramanujan, but he could read. ---Sluzzelin talk 09:43, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

It was such a brief mention in the movie, and I wasn't sure I had the right movie, that I didn't even think that the article here would mention it. I guess I had the "barely read" part wrong as I was just going from my swiss cheese memory. Thanks, Dismas|^(talk) 14:41, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Yes, Ramanujan was a well-educated Brahmin, and certainly does not fit the profile of a "hermit who can barely read". Although an illiterate hermit could have natural mathematical ability, it would be practically impossible for them to do original mathematical work in isolation. At best they might rediscover known results. Gandalf61 21:43, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Savants are not generally great mathematicians - they can be spookily good at arithmetic (but arithmetic has very little to do with mathematics) and they sometimes have prodigious memories for rote-learned facts - but that's not much use to a mathematician either. I don't think savants have that special spark of insight, innovation and drive towards discovery that a true mathematician needs. An inability to read would lock you out of all of the work of previous mathematicians - and no matter how smart you were, without being able to stand on the shoulders of the giants that came before, you'd spend your entire life rediscovering things that a genius like Newton took an entire lifetime to figure out - but that the rest of us learned in high school. Solving something like the proof of Fermat's last theorem required connecting together hugely complicated and disparate fields of mathematics that each, individually would be many lifetimes of work if you were working upwards from 1+1=2. SteveBaker 22:27, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

The big guy himself

Is there a name for believing that you are God (or a god)? --S.dedalus 06:53, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

GOD perhaps? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.139.103.15 (talk) 06:57, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Sometimes they call people who believe they are God schizophrenics... Brusegadi 06:59, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Ha ha, but I was thinking more in terms of Atheism, Agnosticism, Theism, Monism, Dualism, etc. There must be an equivocal term for someone who believes in a god, but just thinks they are s/he? I’m thinking in particular of the fictional religion in Stranger in a Strange Land by Heinlein. In fact the article links to a real religion somebody created inspired by the fictional one. --S.dedalus 07:15, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Autotheism? --Masamage ♫ 07:45, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Yes, and the autotheism link leads to self-deification (suitheism redirects there as well). God complex is close too. ---Sluzzelin talk 09:27, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Heinlein referenced Solipsism a lot in his later works, too; it's not quite a religion, but I (and I think he) found it fascinating anyway. Deltopia 11:51, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Thanks! autotheism is exactly what I was looking for. --S.dedalus 19:29, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

The best part is that I thought I was making a neologism. Thanks, Greek language! --Masamage ♫ 07:20, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Buildings and religious organizations

Hello dear friends. I have been searching for some time now about the percent of buildings (in terms of value) that are owned by religious organizations. It could be in the world, or in a major US city. The best I have found so far is an estimate of the habitable land owned by religious institutions (about 7% of the world's habitable land!) Does anyone know of any literature on this? Thanks, Brusegadi 06:28, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Advice for a single man

I am a single man in collage right now, and I have a big crush on a girl there, but I am somewhat shy. At present we are friends, but I was wondering if there there any signs to tell if she is interested in making this friendship into a romantic thing. I do not want to take any unessicary risks for fear that I may end up harming the friendship, so I was wondering if anyone could offer advice or suggestions on this. 75.6.216.51 09:04, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

I would start by slowly just showing your more interested, Say she looks cute and so on. Ask your friends to ask her about you. reminds me of middle schoolBirthday sig-leave some love 15:51, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Be the best you can be so you're worthy of her (although no man ever really quite gets there), and she'll notice. Also, I'll give you one of the great secrets known only to initiates into the mysteries of what-the-hell's-up-with-women: When you're in a group, see who she looks at when everybody starts laughing about something. If it's not you, there's your rival. If it is you, you're golden. OK, two secrets: She knew in the first ten seconds whether you had a shot. --Milkbreath 16:43, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Having been in this situation before on numerous occasions, I can say with confidence that, unless you are an extremely good actor, she already knows you like her. She probably already has a good idea of whether she would go out with you as well, so there is nothing to lose. If you are smart about how you show her your crush it will not ruin you friendship, even if she doesn’t reciprocate the feeling. In fact the girl will be flattered you like her so much. At some point your going to have to be bold :) and tell her how you feel about her (not necessarily directly though, and don’t overdo it). Good luck! --S.dedalus 19:26, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Or, for extra points, somehow make sure she finds a link to this question.142.33.70.60 19:40, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

United States-Iran relations

I have restored this question here because only one person seemed to think it should be deleted. See Iran and the United States above. DirkvdM 12:34, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Hi all. There is presently a discussion going on the BBC website regarding Iran's nuclear programme and the new sanctions imposed by the United States. You can join the debate by going here. Looking at the most recommeded comments, there are certain statements being made there that I want some clarifications.

1. Jim McDermott, Daventry, United Kingdom is saying that Iran is '- just maybe, possibly - wanting to acquire 3 or 4 of what Israel's got 200+ of, and the USA's got 7000+ of'. Has far has Iran reached in building a nuclear weapon? Has any Iranian leader said explicitly that they want to build nuclear weapons? In acquiring Nuclear power, does that mean that Iran will automatically build nuclear weapons? I know that the Iranian president was condemned, internationally, for calling for Israel to be 'wiped off the map'. But hadn't George W. Bush said that Iran is part of the axis of evil? Did anyone condemn this statement outside the Islamic world?

Quite a few people condemned that statement as "unwise", in that it did nothing to help the situations with those countries. Bush himself stopped using those terms a short time later, so was apparently convinced that saying so publicly was unwise. Note that this has nothing to do with whether the statement is true or not, and many still consider the governments of those nations (not the people) to be evil. StuRat 23:44, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

You have to put such utterances in the cultural context. It might just be a more macho way of talking that is more common there, but I don't know if that is the case. There is also the risk of incorrect translation. Again, I don't know because I don't speak the lingo, but he may very well have meant just the country, not the people (in which case I'm inclined to agree with him). Also, saying something like that it is nothing compared to actually invading a country.

As for the intentions to build nuclear weapons, that has to do with the refinement of the material with centrifuges that make it more concentrated and more fit for nuclear weapons. It's not the building of the nuclear plants that the protests are against, but the centrifuges (at least in the Netherlands). There is considerable irony in there were hardly any protests against Israel not signing the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty and building a huge amount of nuclear weapons and now Iran is heavily criticised for possibly creating the means to make some. If I were Iranian I'd be pretty pissed off too. DirkvdM 13:47, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

2. As far as I know, a country like France produces 80% of its electricity from nuclear reactors[8]. If developing countries such as Iran increase their economic power by relying on nuclear power, will that not reduce the problem of poverty so prevalent in those countries? Or is it just a case of 'do as I say, not as I do'? With the price of oil reaching 90 USD[9], is it not developed countries rather than developing countries that can rely more on petroleum to develop their economy?

That would be true if Iran didn't have lots of petroleum. Thus, petroleum is cheap there, it's not like in Europe and North America. I doubt if they can produced nuclear power much more cheaply, so don't expect electricity to become any less expensive inside a nuclear-powered Iran. The main economic benefit to Iran would be in leaving them with more petroleum to export at inflated prices, but I'd only expect that money to benefit the ruling class, not the poor. Also, Iran can get nuclear power without controlling the nuclear fuel cycle, which they only need if they want nuclear weapons. StuRat 23:55, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

That would be a valid reasoning if that oil would never run out and/or nuclear plants could be built quick and cheap. But the opposite is true. It costs billions to build one plant and it takes about a decade. So if they want to have that as an alternative, it makes sense to start building now. That said, I'd prefer if they built and developed solar cells, but that's a different issue. Btw, the the US and Russia also have lots of oil, so what do they want with nuclear plants? Note that Iran has hugely exaggerated its reserves so they could sell more. In other words, they are running out of oil faster than most countries. DirkvdM 13:47, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Iran can pump oil at a rate which would supply all their energy needs, while the US can't (mainly due to the larger energy use in the US because of a larger population and heavy industrialization). StuRat 19:45, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Like I said, they don't have near as much oil as they claim to have and they're running out of it faster than anyone else. So if nuclear energy is the alternative they choose (now why doesn't anyone contest that?) then they should start building now. The cost of fission power is largely in the building of the plant, so you have to spread that over a large period to be able to afford it. Btw, "you can't have that, because we need more of it" is a pretty lame excuse. DirkvdM 10:01, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

3. Paul Butler, Reading, United Kingdom is saying that 'Iran has caused the deaths of many USA and UK soldiers in Iraq..' and Peter, Phoenix, US is asking 'Where is the proof?'. So have there been any concrete proof that it is the government of Iran that is supporting financially and militarily the Iraqi insurgency? I though the violence going on in Iraq is mostly sectarian between between Iraqi Sunni and Shi'a factions. How much connection is there between the Iranian governement and al-Qaeda operations in Iraq?

None. Al-Qaeda is a Sunni terrorist group, not only committed to executing all Christians and Jews, but also all Shia (as well as any other religion or sect). Iran, being a Shiite country, only supports Shia terrorist groups, like Hamas, Hezbollah, and Shia terrorist groups within Iraq. StuRat 00:00, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

4. Julian, Houston is saying 'On behalf of Americans everywhere, I apologize for our government. We are trying our best to get them out before 2008, but things aren't going so well'. So if US Americans are dissatisfied with their leaders, can't there be any option to have an election before the time it is normally expected? For instance, here in Canada, in June 2004, we had a federal election, and due to the sponsorship scandal, less than 2 years later, we had another federal election since people were dissatisfied with the government at the time. Why no such flexibility exists in the USA? Does that mean that the parliamentary system is more democratic than the presidential system? Also, Iran is said to be a theocracy, which I agree since they based their politics on Islam. But I was wondering about something. QEII is at the head of the United Kingdom. I also note that QEII is the Supreme Governor of the Church of England. Doesn't that mean that the UK is a bit theocratic in one sence. So why is it that this theocratic aspect in Iran considered 'bad' and in the UK, it is considered to be OK?

PART A: Yes, it's easier to change leaders in a parliamentary system, but that could be either good or bad. It's not always good to throw the leaders out when the opinion polls go down. StuRat 00:12, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Another alternative is to let parliament deal with that. I'm not sure about this, but as I understand it, in the Netherlands the government often falls because of the dualism in the system - parliament and government are separate, so if the government goes against the will of enough members of parliament (including of the same parties), then they can sack the government. DirkvdM 13:47, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

PART B: If the Queen had the level of political power that the Guardian Council has in Iran, that would be correct. While she retains substantial powers "on paper", the reality is that Parliament could strip her of these powers whenever they wanted. It's quite the reverse in Iran, where the Guardian Council holds the real power. Nobody can get elected without their approval. StuRat 00:12, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Khomeini was welcomed as an alternative to the shah, but Iran being a pretty 'modern' (western) country, there is now growing dissatisfaction with religious rule. I've heard someone say that we can expect a peaceful regime change in the near future, but I've forgotten the details on that. DirkvdM 13:47, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

5. Steve Day is saying that 'How many countries has Iran attacked in the last century and how many has the United states of haliburton attacked?'. I guess he is thinking that Iran has never invaded any country in the last century and the USA has invaded quite a lot. How much is that true? Had Iran really not invaded any country in the last century? Wasn't the Persian Empire imperialistic in nature?

They prefer to use terrorism to undermine their enemies rather than direct attacks, as they have been too weak to guarantee victory in an all-out war. However, with nuclear weapons, that would no longer be the case, and their neighbors would either need to get nuclear weapons or fear an attack from Iran. StuRat 00:26, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Get real. Iran attacking who? And with what? If they attacked Israel with just a few nuclear bombs they would get wiped off the face of the Earth, and the US need not even chip in. Actually, it is much more likely that Israel will attack first if they really start building nuclear weapons. Israel is the military force in the region (excluding invading forces). If they attacked Iraq with nuclear weapons, the US would attack to protect 'their' oil , with similar results. (In other words, it would be the cold war all over again.) And who else would they attack? DirkvdM 13:47, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

In the long term, Iran is a Shia country surrounded by Sunni countries, so there is a great deal of potential conflict there. Iraq is likely to end up controlled by Shia, so another Iran-Iraq war might be less likely, but they still don't get along with other neighbors, like Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Quatar, the United Arab Emirates, and Oman. Some of those countries are rich and not well defended. In the past Iran wouldn't have attacked them for fear of US reprisals (possibly accompanied by the usual token force from Europe), but, once Iran has nuclear weapons, the US wouldn't risk a nuclear attack, so Iran would be free to invade. StuRat 19:56, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

The Sunni Shia issue originated more than a milennium ago, so in comparison US involvement in the region is a recent blip. Albeit a pretty large one. Maybe that will be the fuse that blows the whole thing up, but before that, were there any conflicts of such magnitude? The article doesn't seem to mention any at all. DirkvdM 10:01, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

6. xavier bloggz is saying that 'I think the sanctions of dumping the US dollar by Iran is really hurting the US and they don't like it, especially when so many more are going to do the same. They can hand it out, but they sure don't like when they get shafted, as they've done so many countries on this earth.' So is it the petroeuro used by Iran that is causing the recent fall in value of the USD on the world's foreign exchange markets? Is it not the cumulative force of the Iraq war and the economic powerhouse that China and India have gathered over the last decade that is causing that change in the USD value?

Iran dumping US dollars wouldn't have much effect, because they didn't have a very large percentage of the worldwide US dollar supply. I would blame the falling US dollar on trade imbalances, primarily with China. StuRat 00:31, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Another factor is that the US is living on borrowed money. The debts are huge, so the bubble may one day burst (not unlike the 1930s crash) and that is bound to have an effect on the trust people have in the USD and therefore its value on the market. So far, this has been countered by the fear in other countries that they themselves will also be adversely affected by such a crash (again, as in the 1930s). So they try to keep the US afloat, but that will only make the blow harder if (when?) it comes. DirkvdM 13:47, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

I thank you all in advance for your answers and comments.

132.206.33.81 16:56, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

These questions don't really belong here, as they are too much an invitation for a political debate (soapbox rule or something) rather than asking us to provide empirical evidence for or against statements made. In reply to the third question though, 90% of Iran's population are Shias, or Shia, or however you phrase it. To imagine that the Iranian government is not supporting the Shiites (right? Sunnis and Shiites) would require one to be a bit naive. Many of the other questions are answered in Iran (no, they have not invaded any country as of late), or in articles dealing with the form of government and democracy in USA (whether or not the people can call for the administration to be replaced). 81.93.102.185 13:58, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

As far as question 2 goes, Iran is an oil exporting country, so the high price of oil doesn't hurt them at all. It would be much more expensive for Iran to produce electricity from imported uranium than from local oil. FiggyBee 14:27, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Iran has been offered (on multiple occasions) the option of having nuclear power stations built and fuelled for them by outside governments (such as the Russians). If they truly wanted this nuclear refining capability solely for running power plants, that would have been an amazingly sweet deal. They didn't accept it - and that speaks volumes for their intentions for this material. So, they want the bomb - and given time, if left alone, they will have one. In cultures where deterrence is effective, that would be no great concern. But in a culture where suicide is considered a great and wonderful thing - allowing them to have nuclear weapons are a horrific risk. We can be pretty confident that the governments of USA/UK/France/S.Africa/Isreal/India/Pakistan would not set off a bomb if they were clearly aware that the response to that would be to leave their entire country a smoking radioactive ruin. But countries whose inhabitants believe that their god expects them to blow themselves up - or whose governments care nothing for their citizens (N.Korea for example) have much less to fear from retaliation. This is why it's a fairly terrifying prospect that Arab countries might obtain nuclear weapons even though we are far less concerned about the likes of India and Pakistan having them. Sadly, the technological genie is out of the bottle and one side or the other is going to be much worse off at the end of the day. SteveBaker 22:15, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Sweet deal? Personally I wouldn't care much for it. You don't have to be a raging nationalist to squirm a little at the idea of foreigners coming in and giving you the outputs from technology they won't trust you to run yourself.

That's not to say I believe Dr. Ahmedinejahd for one second when he claims Iran is not trying to get the bomb. I think they are. I probably would be, in their situation. And if they succeed it's not a happy scenario for the world. Nor does any attempt to stop them by force have any rosy outcome. I guess I'll just hope the diplomats can somehow accomplish something, and take what comfort I can from the historical fact that the worst disasters are usually the ones you never saw coming :-/ --Trovatore 22:32, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Hold on, a culture where suicide is considered a great and wonderful thing? What do you base that on? If that were the case, then why aren't muslim countries invading 'pagan' countries all over the world, slaughtering the infidels to get into heaven? Because they don't have the weapons for it? What does that matter if the goal is to get yourself killed? And don't give me terrorism, because that's just a teeny handful dealing out relative pinpricks (the one on 11-9-2001 just being a relatively big one). Isn't it much more terrifying that the most belligerent country of the last half century has half the world's arsenal of weapons of mass destruction? DirkvdM 14:26, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

What you seem to mis undersatnd, is what different countries would do if they had them, France, wont do anything, Israel will protect themselves, USA already has so many that they can tell every one else what to do, and Iran will attack Israel. I does not matter if they have 10 or 10, 000. If Iran had a history of, and inclination to love all thier neighbours, includeing and especially Israel, (who have done nothing to them) no one would have a problem. The solution, is to make every one, EVERYONE get rid of ALL thier Nukes and then hold hands and sing. lol but that is just not gonna happen.12.191.136.3 17:16, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

title of address

What is the proper title of address for a U.S. Army Warrant Officer that has an earned Doctorate and is not a medical doctor? Trombatromba 18:45, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

According to our article "Army Warrant Officers are officially addressed as either Mr. or Ms". However, someone with a doctorate should officially be referred to as "Dr.", so I would go with that to be on the safe side. Rockpocket 19:52, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

It seems relatively unlikely to come up. When someone with a doctorate or medical degree goes into the Army, my impression is, he's usually given some sort of courtesy commission, even if not one that places him into the chain of command as a practical matter. This is largely based on my extensive experience watching M*A*S*H, so if anyone has actual data points, please share. --Trovatore 19:59, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

When people join the army, they join as whatever they join as. The doctors in M*A*S*H are officers because they are army surgeons - had they been, for some reason, drafted as regular infantry, they would not have been given special rank. I agree though that it would be very unusual for someone with a PhD to join the army as a WO, and I doubt that a doctorate would change how they are addressed. For one thing, they're unlikely to go around informing every soldier they meet of their academic record. FiggyBee 20:55, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

In the U.S. Army, the only Soldier referred to as doctor is a practicing doctor. Warrant officers are properly referred to as mister or miss, and often colloquially as chief. --— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 21:14, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Concur with User:Gadget850. "Doctor" is only someone holding the MOS that entitles him to fix your broken or ill body. Lots of other officers hold advanced degrees; I've known a few doctors, but you always use their military title to address them. I've rarely heard a WO addressed as anything other than "Chief," but then, I am of lower rank; a general may call them "Mister" -- or "Buttnose" for all I know. :) Deltopia 21:40, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Summing up the previous answers, if you are addressing this person in a military context, you should call them mr/mrs/miss. In a civilian context, Dr is more appropriate, although many people with PhDs do not take the Dr title. Steewi 03:21, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

With regards to Talk:Jeff_Wayne#Date_of_Birth

Does anyone know when Jeff Wayne was actually born? So far the article has claimed that he was born in 1952, 1947, and most recently 1950. --VectorPotential^Talk 19:06, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

The 63-year-old, who was born in Queens, New York, and has spent most of his adult life in Britain, has also written numerous advertising jingles as well as the theme tune to ITV's original breakfast TV show Good Morning Britain. From [10], which is in the references, would indicate before any of those dates, i.e., 1944 / 1943 depending on date, and [11] cites it as 1 July, 1943. Lanfear's Bane | t 10:49, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

I found that last one too... on closer inspection though, it's plagarised from our article! Very poor form and I'm considering writing to the ABC about it. FiggyBee 17:54, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Teen Second Life

Where do you go in order to sign up? Does it cost any money? Is there any other info I should know about it? I looked it up on your article, but I can't find exactly what I'm looking for. Thanks in advance! --極地狼 ( 我是一头死的狼 ) 20:16, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

The article links to the website;[12] which prominently advertises a free basic account. --— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 21:17, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

October 29

Why is murder in Pakistan virtually non-existent?

List of countries by homicide rate lots of issues | leave me a message 00:42, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

There are probaly alot more murders then that. Most likely very few are reported and statistics have to go on by what is reported Birthday sig-leave some love 01:21, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

I agree with Birthday sig-leave some love. They are probably not reported because of lack of confidence in the police. Why bother if the cops can't or won't do anything? Also, the national government has little control over large sections of the country, in particular the tribal areas. Clarityfiend 07:14, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Agreed that the homicide rate in Pakistan is probably under-reported for all sorts of reasons, but to say that "the national government has little control over large sections of the country" is surely an exaggeration ? The Federally Administered Tribal Areas are only 3% of Pakistan by land area and only contain 2% of the country's population. Gandalf61 11:32, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Between questions of "What percentage of murders are reported by the general public to the local police?" - and "What percentage of murders that are reported to the local police are ever officially noted at central government level?" - and "Does central government answer truthfully when asked by the United Nations?" Between those things, I'd be very surprised if any of the bottom three countries are giving even remotely true figures. I'd bet good money that Japan is actually the lowest. SteveBaker 16:15, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Murders committed in tribal conflicts and/or by the Taliban may not be reported or may be classified as something other than murders. I wouldn't trust the numbers reported by Burma either (they must exclude monks and others murdered by the government). StuRat 19:27, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Establised users

Does anyone know the criteria to be an established user? (regarding locked pages).--DarkZorro 00:59, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Yes. Four days with the account. But that's for editing semi-protected pages. To edit protected pages, you need to be an administrator. See Wikipedia:User access levels#Signed-in users. A.Z. 01:07, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Hotel Housekeeping

For anyone that knows what can the average room attendant, front desk person or housekeeper make in a hotel. When looking at classifieds in my local paper i can never find the salary they pay you. I am thinking of getting a job in this field for a while.--logger 01:53, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

I would say that it can vary geatly. It depends on where you live, what you do at the hotel, and what kind of hotel it is. It could go from minimum wage at a small motel to a very good salary at a more upscale or fancy hotel. Grango242 01:59, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

You can also check Salary.com here to get a general idea of average salaries in your particular area. Josborne2382 02:08, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

I will check the website out. thank you for your time.--logger 02:17, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

No Problem, that is what we're here for! Good luck in your search! Josborne2382 02:30, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Trees

I have a cottonwood tree on my acreage with a circumference of 13 and one-half feet...I was wondering if anyone could give me an estimated age of the tree? 4.254.80.9 02:15, 29 October 2007 (UTC)Roger

The only real way I am aware of is to get a core and count the growth rings. See Tree#Oldest trees and the references for that section. --— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 10:16, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

There is a graph of age to diameter for cottonwoods at Yellowstone here on PDF page seven. You can see that the growth rate varies a lot by the tree's location. If you extrapolate even the lowest of the lines, though, your tree starts to look right venerable. Your county agricultural extension might have age-to-diameter data for local cottonwoods that grew in conditions similar to yours. --Milkbreath 11:18, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

• I can't resist linking this wonderful word: dendrochronology. --Sean 14:40, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Is this considered a *factual* error?

OK, I'm not sure exactly how to classify this question, but here goes...

For several weeks now, I've been trying to get Encyclopedia Britannica to change or remove a line from their Scottie Pippen article at EB.com. The line reads, "He was perhaps the only man on that list [50 Greatest Players in NBA History] to be considered the second-best player on his own team, but Pippen's future was likely to be bright even if Jordan followed through on his rumoured retirement." My argument was that there were several sets of teammates on the list besides Jordan and Pippen, and that people like Kevin McHale and James Worthy were also considered "second-fiddles" on their respective teams. (McHale to Larry Bird, Worthy to Magic Johnson, etc...)

Britannica responded that the statement was not a factual error, per se, apparently because the author uses the word "perhaps". Do they have a valid defense? The sentence is not simply an expression of the author's opinion, since he also uses the word "considered". Thus, I interpret it as a conclusion based on the opinions of other basketball fans and experts - a conclusion that is flawed, as anyone who does some research will see. Zagalejo^^^ 05:41, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

How can it be a factual error when it is not and can never be a fact, only an opinion? Clarityfiend 07:09, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

I'm not comparing my personal assessments of these players against Britannica's. I think you can reasonably conclude that McHale was never considered better than Bird by the general public, excluding perhaps individual games. McHale himself admitted such in interviews.

Again, the key word here is "considered". I don't care who actually was second-best, but I think one can make objective statements about who was considered second-best.

But more to the point, isn't unwise to say that Pippen was the only player considered second best on his team when there was more than one set of teammates on the 50 Greatest Players List? Indeed, as many as four players on the list (John Havlicek, Bob Cousy, Bill Russell, and Sam Jones) were on the same team at one point.Zagalejo^^^ 07:22, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Now that I think about it some more, it should be deleted simply because it is unverifiable and therefore unencyclopaedic. However, if you asked for a change on the basis of it being a factual error, that would have been the wrong argument to use, for the reason I noted before. Clarityfiend 07:52, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

OK, well, would it be a factual error to say that "Citizen Kane is perhaps the worst-reviewed movie of all time"? Zagalejo^^^ 07:57, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

You're making me think too hard this early in the morning, but now I'm coming around to your side. The original claim isn't really an opinion, it's a (qualified) statement of fact about an opinion. And it's plainly wrong. So, IMO you do have a valid argument. Clarityfiend 08:27, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Yes, it can be a fact, but as already pointed out it is a pretty loose fact because it contains the word 'perhaps'. How can it be considered valid, certain and verifiable if it contains a conditional word. Surely the Encyclopedia Brittanica is all about certain and verifiable facts, not possibilities and opinions. Having said that there are people who consider, for example, the Theory of Evolution as an opinion. Richard Avery 08:31, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Semantics and encyclopedics aside, if there is a defined set of 50 players, several of which were seen as second, third, or fourth fiddles in the shadow of their team's top-of-the-cream player, then the quoted sentence is entirely misleading, in any type of text. For "evidence" you could draw from the wonderful American tradition of Basketball statistics, or from NBA awards, polls and so forth. The way I read it, the category "to be considered the second-best player on his own team" also implies "not the best", including "third-best", "fourth-best" etc.), but even if not, it's too defined to allow the author to weasel his way out with precious reference to the word "perhaps". ---Sluzzelin talk 11:15, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

You have just found the reason why everyone reading and writing to this page uses Wikipedia. SteveBaker 15:53, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Indeed. :) Thanks for the replies, everyone. Zagalejo^^^ 18:42, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Sportsmen

In my youth, 50 or so years ago, to be a member of a UK cricket team, say for example, the MCC, (Middlesex Cricket Club), one had to be a) British and b) resident in Middlesex. This principle applied to many clubs, cricket and football. When and why was this policy abandoned?--212.139.103.15 07:02, 29 October 2007 (UTC)http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Miscellaneous&action=edit&section=59 Editing Wikipedia:Reference desk/Miscellaneous (section) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Our article on Northamptonshire County Cricket Club says "After the Second World War, Northamptonshire was quicker than many other counties to adapt to a more professional game. After more bad years in the late 1940s, it recruited widely and wisely from other counties", suggesting the culture changed sometime after the War. This is elaborted on in Rain Stops Play (2002) by Andrew Hignell (ISBN 0714651737):

"After the Second World War... many counties trawled outside their catchment area and scouted in other counties. But an approach to a young player living and/or born in another county could only be made after obtaining permission from that particular county club. To avoid poaching, most counties today have a lengthy list of registered players and no county is permitted to approach registered players. Those who are not registered,... born in a minor county, plus those born outside the UK but who hold British passports are "free game" for the talent scouts of the first class clubs"

Of course this (being written in 2002) was probably impacted by the Kolpak ruling, with regards to international players, but may still be accurate with regards to those born in the UK. Rockpocket 07:49, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the rapid response--212.139.103.15 11:13, 29 October 2007 (UTC)!

Stinky Chinese shops

Why some products in those Chinese shops that sell every kind of item at a low price (at expense of quality usually) smell so bad? --Taraborn 12:06, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Even assuming good faith this sounds prejudiced. I am not sure how you equate smell with product quality or nationality of goods. To the best of my knowledge these factors do not contribute to odour. You might want to read the article on odour or perhaps visit your local fish shop and take a few deep breaths. Lanfear's Bane | t 13:42, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

• Perhaps they were selling durian, which is an ... ahem ... acquired taste. --Sean 14:43, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

I've noticed that the brown paper towels (unbleached) you get is washrooms often have a nasty smell to them, as do paper bags for groceries, especially when they get wet. Perhaps they use the same type of paper in those Chinese shops. StuRat 19:14, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

The smell is usually to do with the food section. The array of spices and ingredients used in authentic Chinese (and other East Asian) cooking is quite different to those used in Western cooking. The smell can be somewhat offensive to people who haven't grown up with them. The smell of a food market in China is very offensive to many people when they first encounter them, but many people who grew up with them and moved to Western countries say that they miss the smell, because it reminds them of home. I'm told that the smell of lamb being roasted is quite offensive if you're not used to eating it. I think it smells great. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Steewi (talk • contribs) 03:33, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

I knew some people won't understand my question and will assume this is a "prejudiced" question (I'm sure I'm the least prejudiced person in the world, by the way). Unfortunately, I can't smarten other people, so we'll have to get over this. I'm not talking about food shops, I don't know how you call them (or whether they exist or not) in the US, but here (in Spain) they are called "Bazar + <insert Chinese-related name here>", e.g. "Bazar Hong Kong". Some of their items, for example some of their slippers, have a nasty smell. That is, perhaps, due to the bleaching or the material they use, who knows, that's why I asked. I was just curious because that smell is really characteristic of those shops, and I have never found that anywhere else.

PS:I like the smell of Chinese food. --Taraborn 10:31, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

shrinking old jeans?

Hi, Is it possible to shrink a jeans that is several months old by immersing it in hot water?. Adding vinegar will accelarate the process? Thank you —Preceding unsigned comment added by 131.220.149.186 (talk) 12:38, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Yes, but how much shrinkage you will get depends on if they have already shrunk in previous washes. If by "several months old", you mean you've been wearing them and washing them, then there probably isn't too much shrinkage left. Prewashed jeans seem to have relatively little shrinkage after purchase, too. StuRat 19:08, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Baseball rules

1) What and how does a "no decision" work?

2) Is catcher the hardest position to "play"?

3) How do the sports casters know what kind of a pitch a pitcher pitches when he throws the ball?

4) When was baseball invented? By whom? How did he (or she) think up the rules and game?

5) Why are Yankees so in the hole and bos red sox so on top now?

thank you for your help!

a red sox fan forever! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.184.181.51 (talk) 15:15, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

2. Pitchers usually play less innings than a catcher so does the catcher work harder or the pitcher (who needs to rest after a shorter time).

3. They watch where the pitch goes and how it breaks.

4. See History of baseball (and don't blame Abner) Rmhermen 15:38, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

1: A "no decision" is roughly a starting pitcher who does not get a win or a loss, and it's more easily explained in terms of what those are. A win is awarded to the pitcher who was the "pitcher of record" when his team took the lead for good. A loss, similarly, is awarded to the pitcher responsible for the run putting his team behind for good. A starting pitcher who earns neither a win nor a loss is said to have a "no decision", and relief pitchers (though they can also earn wins and losses) are generally not part of the "no decision" discussion.

2: Different positions require different skill sets. Rmhermen notes the pitcher/catcher distinction above, and similarly, center fielders and catchers are likely to be poor replacements for each other. While the catcher's posture is considered to be physically taxing (particularly on the knees), it's not clear that this would equate to the position being hard to play.

5: Such things are the purview of sports bar arguments; there is no objective answer. — Lomn 16:12, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

For number 3, the sportscasters, in this case usually the colour commentators, know because they are usually former players (and sometimes former pitchers) who know what each pitch looks like. Occasionally the cameras can pick up the pitcher's fingering on the ball before or as he is throwing it, which also helps distinguish what kind of pitch it is. Adam Bishop 17:17, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Long Island over 3000 square miles?

On the main page today, you listed 3 US islands over 3000 square miles in area. Your Long Island article lists Long Island as being over 3000 square miles in area. I think the area estimate in the Long Island article needs to be corrected. Can you claify this discrepancy? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.186.249.110 (talk) 16:18, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Questions of fact about the main page should be asked on the 'discussion' part of the main page in order that they may be corrected quickly. I suggest you do that - and also mention your problem on the List of islands of the United States by area discussion page. SteveBaker 16:23, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

(Actually, since this is somewhat urgent - I've added a complaint to those pages myself). SteveBaker 16:30, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

I believe the issue has been resolved. In addition to posting replies at both locations, I also left a thank-you note on the user's talk page thanking them for bringing the issue to our attention. --Kralizec! (talk) 18:29, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Pulpit Commentaries

I have a set of Pulpit Commentaries. They were published by Funk & Wagnalls Company and some were published by Wilcox & Follett co. of Chicago. The editors are Very Rev. H.D.M. Spence, D.D. and Rev. Joseph S. Exell; M.A.

I cannot find thier publication date. When did Funk & Wagnall purblish them. My Genesis volume says New Edition.

Please respond as soon as possible.

Mike Talley

—Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.96.225.72 (talk) 16:38, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

E-mail removed. Lanfear's Bane | t 16:48, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Black Flowers Anyone?

Are there any flowers that are truly black and not just a dark blue or purple? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.144.1.100 (talk) 16:50, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

According to this page they exist, but are rare. Of course, it depends how you choose define "truly black." Our article on Black Rose (symbolism) suggests there are no truly black roses. Rockpocket 18:03, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Grevillea scortechinii subsp. scortechinii — Black Grevillea.Polypipe Wrangler 09:46, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

HOW TO EXTEND A CATEGORY ?

Can anybody tell me how to extend a category for instance Category:Lists of scientists. I would like to add a group : Matematicians, where later one could add the names. When I have th page with Lists of scientins and push the button "Edit" there is no possibility of adding any new group. Krzysiulek 16:56, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Add your new category to an article. Click on the (red) category link at the foot of the article. Add the category you have just created to whatever you consider the parent category to be, by placing a category link in your new category page, exactly as you add categories to articles. That, in a nutshell, is it. And try asking these sorts of questions on the HelpDesk --Tagishsimon (talk) 16:57, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Category:Mathematicians already exists, btw. If you wanted make it a subcategory of Category:Scientists (which you shouldn't, because mathematicians are not (necessarily) scientists), you would go to Category:Mathematicians, edit it, and add Category:Scientists, like Tagishsimon said. FiggyBee 17:21, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Frankfurt

There is a square in Frankfurt where there are a number of statues, can anyone tell me the names of the people represented there. Specifically there is a stautue of a man who has a very large forked beard. I wish to know who he is, and any of the others. I am not sure exactly where this is in Frankfurt, but when I went there a few years ago for the city's birthday, there was a medieval fair in this particular square. Thanks12.191.136.2 17:15, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Is this the dude (http://www.flickr.com/photos/51243943@N00/383910676/)? If so there is text about who it is. The guy you mean may be Karl Der Große ? ny156uk 18:41, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Also known as Charlemagne (Karl the Great). Nice beard. --Tagishsimon (talk) 18:44, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

So why is he holding an ostrich egg with a leather strap around it ? :-) StuRat 19:00, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Globus cruciger Rmhermen 19:37, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

The strap makes the egg a little less likely to break, of course. —Tamfang 02:50, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

It also acts as a disguise so the ostrich won't recognise it and try to get it back. SaundersW 17:27, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Living in the States

I've never been. Can anyone who lives / has lived there tell me about some of the best cities to live in? I appreciate that the subject of "what are the best cities in your country" is a complex one, but draw on personal experience and reccomend me anyway. I am particularily keen on places that have areas of town with thriving music and art scenes that are generally safe and decent places to live (low-income, probably rented apartment or something similar). Portland, Chicago and New York particularly interest me because they're big cities on the coast and I'd go insane if I wasn't near a large body of water.

I am planning a short visit to the States, probably New York, for next year with some friends. This is really just getting a feel for the character of major US cities, the American way of life; I'm not about to rush off based on a decision made from Wikipedia. I would value personal opinions of the cities I mentioned greatly. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.141.145.45 (talk) 19:59, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Id suggesst Baltimore, Maryland, Great food people are nice have the most awesomest accents and the music and arts is good here. Its got a harbor near the national aqaurime and a science center with all boatds loads of other shops stores and historical landmarks. One downside is that its not what you would call "Safe" though. Dam i love baltimore ForeverDEAD 20:16, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

I am not sure that visiting New York City will give a feel for the typical U.S. major city but as a Midwesterner, we have a certain bias against the coasts. New York would fail the affordable housing issue as perhaps would L.A. Rmhermen 20:21, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

How about Seattle, San Francisco, Los Angeles, Boston, Miami, or Honolulu ? All have thriving music and/or arts (but of quite different types). BTW, what do you want a large body of water for ? If you are planning to swim in it, I'd go with Miami or Honolulu, as the water in the other cities mentioned is too cold. StuRat 20:26, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

People swim in L.A. (and the earlier mentioned Chicago) Rmhermen 20:32, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

I'm SF or LA just doesn't appeal to me in my mind, mostly because of the weather. I just want the sea nearby because otherwise I don't feel comfortable - I was born by the sea and I plan to die by the sea. Yes, I know - you don't need to tell me I'm COMPLETELY INSANE —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.141.145.45 (talk) 21:00, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Weather in San Francisco is very different from that in Los Angeles (and for that matter there's considerable variation within each region), although both generally have dry summers and wet winters. What is it about them that you don't like? —Tamfang 02:52, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

I'm assuming you mean Portland, Oregon, not Portland, Maine. The former is not particularly close to a large body of water, although the Columbia and Willamette Rivers do provide a fair amount of aquatic recreation opportunities. There's a nice "Bohemian" feel to many parts of the city. The latter Portland is right on the Atlantic Ocean, however I don't think it is particularly well-known for music and art. Down the road just a bit is Boston, but along with New York and Chicago, it does not meet the "low-income" guideline very well. North of Chicago, Milwaukee has an extensive art and music scene and is on the same large body of water as Chicago. Austin, Texas hosts the SXSW music conference each year, but fails on the water front. Philadelphia might be a good choice, with several great museums and the World Cafe (hmmm, not a great article there), but might be getting a bit expensive once again.

By the way, there's no single "American way of life" and what you experience in any given city will differ what you experience in another, and both of those will differ greatly from the experience of living in a small town. --LarryMac | Talk 20:30, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

But don't forget, Austin TX does have Lake_Travis . dr.ef.tymac 13:45, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Sorry, yeah, I meant Portland, OR. The East Coast cities are the most tempting - loads of large cities full of people, and the climate suits my tastes. I appreciate that major cities are comprised of a wealth of different cultures and lifestyles, the phrase just popped in there really. I'm interested in case examples of what particular things attract people to life in big cities and what negative aspects exist, too. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.141.145.45 (talk) 21:12, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Maybe consider one of the smaller cities in the northeast, for example New Haven, Connecticut. It has a lot of great neighborhoods, it is the home of a great live music venue (Toad's Place). It's got Yale University. It's an easy train ride to New York City, or a slightly longer trip to Boston. I lived in Connecticut for most of my adolescence and several years beyond that (albeit not in New Haven), and would move back in an instant if I could. --LarryMac | Talk 18:07, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

I think that New York would be the best city to live in. Philadelphia, Boston, Miami, Baltimore, and Chicago are all cities that I would recommend if New York doesn't suit you. I can't say anything about the west coast because I've never spent a lot of time there. Grango242 22:02, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

I've heard that in New York the difference between safe and unsafe is taking a wrong turn. Since I like to explore I didn't visit New York, despite passing right by it. That was the only time I didn't visit a place for reasons of safety, and I've traveled quite a lot. San Francisco was nice. Good cultural scene and some beautiful nature not too far away (by US standards). And is the Pacific big enough for you? :) Concerning the cultural variation in the US, New England is said to have a more European feel to it and Boston is known for its liberal attitude (in the positive broader sense of the word). Then again, I've never been there. Plan to one day, though. DirkvdM 10:21, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

NYC is actually fairly safe compared to other big American cities, although it really depends on the neighborhood. But there's no American city that doesn't have its shady areas. San Francisco has its "unsafe" neighborhoods, too. -- Mwalcoff 01:48, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Neither New York nor San Francisco is going to meet the affordable category. Los Angeles has parts that would, but not those close to the ocean. All things considered, Austin, Texas would be the best place for arts and affordability, but it isn't near an ocean. Houston might qualify, but the heat of summer may not meet your needs. If you don't mind extremely cold winters, Chicago may be your best bet. East Coast-wise, Washington, DC would be good, but within the District of Columbia, security may be a problem, although Georgetown is safe. Corvus cornix 17:58, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Being a mid- westerner i'm going to say that chicago and minneapolis both have pretty good art and music scenes. Minneapolis is a little more affordable than chicago but chicago has a much better public transportation system. Minnesotans are acutally "minnesota nice" too so it should be easy to get to know people in Minneapolis. Neither are by an ocean though so you probably wouldnt like either city. And safety, like any other city, really depends on what part of town you live in. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.183.232.161 (talk) 22:07, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Well, since you already know english obviously you might want to consider going to New York, but not in the manhattan area. The jobs pay good, but if your just starting out, you might want to move in the Queens area. Maybe someplace like sunnyside (were i grew up) or astoria, which are only a couple of train stops away from the city. Another place you might want to try is Florida, CLOSE to the Orlando area. You really don't want to live in Orlando, they have good jobs, but its really hard to find a decent house or apartment. Try an area around it instead.--Dlo2012 00:54, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

I've lived in Chicago, rural Tennessee, and Vermont. I'd personally suggest Burlington, Vermont going by your qualifications. It's right on Lake Champlain, it has a number of clubs and other venues for music, it's only of the more artistic places in the Northeast, if not the country, and it has a very low crime rate. Artists from the area include Woody Jackson and Stephen Huneck (hmm... we don't seem to have an article about him, so here's a link http://www.dogmt.com ) Dismas|^(talk) 03:35, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

I grew up thinking no one in their right mind would want to live in New York City. Then, by an unforeseen turn of events, I ended up living there for about five years. Now I think I'm lucky to have had this experience. Among the cities of the United States, New York City is in a class by itself. Even five years living there only scratches the surface. There are only a handful of cities in the world that are comparable in terms of energy, culture, vibrancy, and that strange sense of always turning a corner and seeing something world-famous. Of cities in which English is spoken, I'm not sure anything other than London compares. It's image of having a crime problem and being dirty and unsafe is, I think, somewhat of a holdover from the 1970s. Of course there are shady places and the occasional scarily crazy person, but I generally felt safer alone at night on the streets there than I do in downtown Seattle or Boston. Yes it can be expensive, crowded, and chaotically difficult, but if you like art, music, and culture, and the energy of big cities, no other US city comes close. The place is bursting with art and music. I routinely found myself wandering into inspiring artistic events and places. On a random visit to the (now gone) World Trade Center plaza I found there was a free, outdoor Phillip Glass recital going on. I went to a chamber music recital on a barge near where I lived to hear some John Zorn music to find Zorn himself was performing, along with, oddly enough, Milton Babbitt and other "avant garde" composers. At one point they engaged in a debate over the differences between "uptown music" and "downtown music" (Babbitt being uptown, Zorn downtown, while another musician described herself as a "crosstown composer"). The Metropolitan Museum of Art is by far the most enjoyable, inspiring, and (this last bit is key) comfortable art museum I've been to. For cutting edge art, the city is filled with galleries. I spent countless days randomly poking into one or another, discovering some of the most inventive artworks I've ever come across. Perhaps the city's artistic peak was in the 1970s, but it is still strong. I've long thought it somewhat equivalent to Paris around 1900-1910 in terms of art. The main challenge, perhaps, is finding housing you can afford. Compromises probably have to be made. Through a bit of luck and a friend's tip, my friends and I found a crazy, quite spacious, half-falling down, warehouse loft, run by shady landlords, in the now-gentrified, hip, and expensive DUMBO neighborhood of Brooklyn. At the time it was a kind of 19th century warehouse industrial wasteland, but very close to Manhattan with great subway access. In other words, the city is known for expensive housing, but with hard work and maybe some luck, it can be done. Myself, formerly uninterested in New York, now think it would be a shame to live life without spending some years living there. Five years was almost, but not quite enough. I'm happy to now live somewhere else (Seattle), but often think fondly of New York and miss the many many aspects of the city one cannot find anywhere else on the planet. Pfly 07:12, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Pfly's woven a very engaging description, but no matter where you live, there's always trade-offs to consider. Living in NYC is not going to be very special or rewarding if you spend half your day in a cubicle and the other half in a cramped and noisy apartment where you can barely sleep. You can do that in *any* US city.

Also, the 'crime problem' is alive and well. There are whole industries of crime that occur *only* in NY, and your exposure to it varies depending on such factors as your pecuniary resources, familiarity with the "machinery" in relevant neighborhoods, social standing and other things as well. Unless you are among the Sheltered Sons of Pure Opulence, living in the radiance of the absolute Best means living within the shadow of the absolute Worst. dr.ef.tymac 14:22, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Yes, I got a little carried away, sorry. A great place to live depends on so many factors, not only about the place but the person. Will a particular person like a particular city? "It depends". Anyway, since the OP said "the States" we've been mentioning only US cities. The Canadian cities of Toronto and Vancouver are both worth a mention, or at least a visit, if possible. Pfly 20:56, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

And if we are opening it up to Canada, I'd recommend checking out Halifax as well - it's on the water and nowhere near as insanely expensive as Vancouver. (Ottawa is also worth a look.) - Eron ^Talk 21:07, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Longest Article Title

I was just curious to the longest title of an English wikipedia article would be. I know of From each according to his ability, to each according to his need, and I was maybe thinking that this was the longest, but then again, maybe it wasn't. The title can include multiple words. Sseballos 21:41, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Wikipedia records, for all your record needs. Rockpocket 21:44, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

So that would then be Dante And Randal And Jay And Silent Bob And A Bunch Of New Characters And Lando, Take Part In A Whole Bunch Of Movie Parodies Including But Not Exclusive To, The Bad News Bears, The Last Starfighter, Indiana Jones And The Temple Of Doom, Plus A High Scho. The title should be even longer - it's incomplete because of technical limitations. DirkvdM 10:24, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

This is a question we get asked a lot; the longest proper titles (ie, ones that don't redirect,) are United States Senate Foreign Relations Subcommittee on International Development and Foreign Assistance, Economic Affairs, and International Environmental Protection and How Hedley Hopkins Did a Dare, robbed a grave, made a new friend who might not have really been there at all, and while he was at it committed a terrible sin which everyone was doing even though he didn't know it, but see also Most of the Remixes and When the Pawn. Laïka 13:32, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

In fact, see User:Interiot/Reports/LongTitles. Laïka 13:41, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

It's worth mentioning that the MediaWiki software (which is what Wikipedia runs on) doesn't allow more than 255 characters (some say it's 256 - I forget which) in the title of an article - so we aren't ever going to see any longer than Dante And Randal And Jay And Silent Bob And A Bunch Of New Characters And Lando, Take Part In A Whole Bunch Of Movie Parodies Including But Not Exclusive To, The Bad News Bears, The Last Starfighter, Indiana Jones And The Temple Of Doom, Plus A High Scho. SteveBaker 17:21, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Scrabble: The PC game

I have a copy of this game. All info I have is that it is a Hasbro product, and it has a artificial intelligence, will NOT allow players to "cheat" at all. 65.163.112.74 22:17, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Any cheat codes for the PC game, and why is Wikipedia NOT accepting any edits, except to the "History section" instead of where edits are supposed to go ? Maybe the tech boys need to look @ that. 65.163.112.74 22:20, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

MY copy has this shape shifting object in the top right corner of the screen that will insult you, most of the time, called "Maven". 65.163.112.74 22:26, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Very interesting and all, but where's the question? FiggyBee 15:21, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Cheat codes for the game ? 205.240.146.157 22:57, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Lurking deep in there is the question- 'why is Wikipedia not accepting any edits,except in the History section'.It doesn't specify whether it's the Scrabble article,Scrabble:The PC game article or all articles generally that have this glitch though... Lemon martini 10:54, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Wikitravel gone?

What happened? --Sobra23 22:33, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

What exactly is wikitravel? --PolarWolf ( grrr... ) 22:57, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

[13] --S.dedalus 23:14, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Not to mention Wikitravel.--Shantavira|^{feed me} 09:15, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

October 30

Wikipedia Reference Desk Stats

Does anybody know where/if the statistic of questions asked and answered are on Wikipedia reference desk? If you do know the stats please provide the link to them, if they are online. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.162.71.99 (talk) 02:14, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

I don't believe such stats are available. Sorry Rockpocket 02:16, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

If these stats are not compiled would experienced Wikipedia reference askers and answerers provide best estimates for amount of questions asked and answered for a day, week, or whatever time period you are most comfortable with. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.162.71.99 (talk) 02:19, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Sort of unfortunate that none of our statisticians seem interested in the Ref Desk. The graphs always have to be about edit count and page creation. bibliomaniac15 A straw poll on straw polls 02:21, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

I am in the midst of researching a paper on online answer sites, very little information on Wikipedia Reference desk... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.162.71.99 (talk) 02:25, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Perhaps, as an experiment, I will track the total number of questions, and those with good faith attempts at answers, on each desk for 4 consecutive weeks in October. I'll report the findings and analysis at User:Rockpocket/Ref desk stats and post a link on the talk page when I'm done. It may take me a few days. Rockpocket 02:31, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

I have already added it to my del.icio.us account. Anything you can do to help is much appreciated, I am going to go through the archives when I have a little more time. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.162.71.99 (talk) 02:33, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Estonian Translator

Can anyone help me find an Estonian-English translator? I dont mean a Dictionary or paying someone to translate but a machine. Joneleth 01:23, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Try googling "Free estonia translator" ForeverDEAD 01:49, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

I did and I can only find dictionaries that give me 68 interpretation suggestions at every word I type in or proffesional translation servics of humans. Joneleth 02:15, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Try the language reference desk. SteveBaker 17:17, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Important Question

What is the date of the english wikipedia site? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.121.130.41 (talk) 01:47, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

The English Wikipedia was launched at wikipedia.com on January 15, 2001. At that point, it was an English-language only site. Xn4 04:56, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

That would be "Wikipedia Day". January 15th 2001. SteveBaker 04:58, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

• Your question wasn't entirely clear. You didn't specify exactly what date you were looking for. I suspect you're asking for the date because you want to cite wikipedia. If that is the case, please follow the link. - Mgm|^(talk) 09:00, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Hey, Wikipedia day is one of the Wikipedia holidays. Tomorrow is one of them. Aren't we allowed to work here then? DirkvdM 10:34, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

No, no, no! Tim Starling Day is a day for Wikipedians everywhere to work twice as hard during the day - then in the evening to put on silly costumes and bum candy off their neighbours. During the night "The Great Parser Rewriter" will visit your pumpkin patch - but only if it's sincere. Well, something like that. SteveBaker 11:55, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

I wonder if he or she is asking time zone, UTC Wikipedia follows for its daily schedules? Rockpocket 19:13, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

girls

why do girls wear tights, the just seem uncomfortable to me Phat Carl 03:06, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

See Pantyhose#Advantages of pantyhose. —Keenan Pepper 03:54, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Wow, we've got an article for everything! --Psud 11:34, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

well, unless your gay or a girl i think you should understand why.--Dlo2012 00:56, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Bulk of articles on Volapük Wikipedia

What fraction of the articles on Vükiped (the Wikipedia in the constructed language Volapük) are geographic articles created by vo:Geban:SmeiraBot? I was surprised to see Volapük in the 100,000+ articles category, but it seems like they're mostly these automatically generated ones. Where did the text for these articles come from? —Keenan Pepper 04:00, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

All of the articles about US cities in English Wikipedia were initially auto-generated - they are gradually diverging from that initial state as people hand-edit them. Compare (for example) Cedar Hill, Tennessee and Cedar Hill, Missouri - both of which are obviously auto-generated because their wording is almost identical - but then look at Cedar Hill, Texas - which has had a bunch of hand-editing - but still bears a lot of the original auto-generated wording. Now look at the edit histories of those three articles - in each case, the first edit is by someone called 'Ram-Man' with an edit comment "(geography and demographics)". This is not a coincidence! In fact, the first five or six edits of almost every article about a US city are by the same set of 'bots over a period of a few months in late 2002. Unsuprisingly, the Vükiped articles on those three cities have exactly the same numbers for populations, etc as the English Wikipedia articles.

There are plenty of sources for that kind of thing out there - probably the US census data would be the starting point.

SteveBaker 04:47, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

• Ram-Man ran a bot program on the English Wikipedia that automatically added geographical articles based on US census data. I wouldn't be surprised if someone is running a copy of that bot in another language. - Mgm|^(talk) 08:58, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, but where is the actual text coming from? It's not machine translation, is it? Is there a giant Volapük-language geographical database? —Keenan Pepper 11:19, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

The RamBot articles had a very consistent wording - strings of text attached to statistics. Volapük has followed the same pattern, by the simple expedient of translating the text strings into Volapük. Compare Bronson, Florida with vu:Bronson (Florida). The translation required to predicate the thousands of articles amounts to a half page of text. --Tagishsimon (talk) 11:26, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Yeah - the bot isn't really writing the words, it's filling in some template with numbers from the statistical data. So it's given all of the words with gaps left in there for it to insert the numbers. Hence someone only had to translate the template once - and the articles could then be generated automatically from some gigantic table of numbers - which are probably downloaded from the US census office. SteveBaker 17:16, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

will someone change this article?

this isnt really a question but i'm too lazy to get a wikipeaid account and think that someone should fix the Minnetonka High School article that someone posted a rude, innapropriet comment on. If someone gets a chance, I would appreciate it being removed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.183.232.161 (talk) 05:25, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Done. You can usually fix something like that without an account. Zagalejo^^^ 05:29, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Also, getting an account would have taken you considerably less time than that it took you to type in your question here! SteveBaker 11:43, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

An island of 7 million consuming 1/4 of the world's diamonds?

The United States is the biggest consumer of diamonds in the world. The U.S. accounts for 35% of diamond sales, Hong Kong 26%, Belgium 15% (Antwerp is the world's diamond-trading centre), Japan 6%, and Israel 4%.

From our diamonds as an investment article. Explanations? 67.121.209.202 09:27, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

I imagine HK is a centre of the jewellery trade, and re-exports the diamonds it has imported. Also that it has a very active diamond-trading centre, despite puny Antwerp's claims. File under blinkered western viewpoint / inertia fails to recognise that what was true a century ago is no longer true. --Tagishsimon (talk) 09:31, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

The reason Antwerp has long been a centre for diamond trade is that a lot of Jews fled there over the centuries. Same for Amsterdam. Why specifically Jews were diamond traders, I don't know, but even though life in the Nether Regions was better for them, there were still serious restrictions to what businesses they were allowed to run. Just happens that some of those were good businesses to become filthy rich. And I suppose that had something to do with it. Especially money lending was considered to be a dirty business. Just happens it can also be very profitable. DirkvdM 10:47, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Away from the OP, what is the point of diamonds?? I mean, really, what is the point?? I must be absent a diamond gene or something but I really do not see the point in owning a ridiculously expensive stone that costs lives to mine, hours and hours to polish and set, and fortunes to purchase and own, when, if glittery pendants MUST be worn so as to impress the lower orders with one's external adornments, then equally attractive synthetic bauble-subtitutes can be worn such that the casual observer, sin loupe, cannot, nay absolutely cannot, tell the difference. And why Amsterdam??? A city bult on stinking foetid canals filled with vandalised bikes and decorated with graffiti, and its streets awash with legalised drugs and prostitution (all 3 genders). Dear me - it must be me. 81.145.241.236 23:50, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Theoretical Powers of the Queen in Australia

I often hear that the Queen of Australia (and also her representative - the Governer-General), although exercising little to no power in practise, actually do (theoretically) have a lot of power. What are these theoretical powers? Could the Queen (or the Governer-General) just make up and pass their own laws if they suddenly decide to break convention? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.208.110.207 (talk) 10:50, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

The powers of the GG are specified in the Constitution. They do not include making up new laws. FiggyBee 11:37, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

The Commonwealth governments that still operate under the Westminster system (loosely, a Parliament and Prime Minister under a Queen and/or Governor General) are constitutional monarchies. This means that the powers of the Queen are delineated by the Constitution; she cannot arbitrarily create or change law.

However, the Queen or Governor General often holds significant reserve powers, including the ability to dismiss Prime Ministers, dissolve (or refuse to dissolve) Parliament, and to refuse to grant Royal Assent to new legislation (effectively, a veto power). In practice, these powers are very seldom used, and only in accordance with long-established ritual and tradition. (To do otherwise has a nasty side effect of prompting what are known as constitutional crises.) A metaphor I've seen some Canadian scholars use describes the Governor General as keeper of the 'constitutional fire extinguishers': extraordinary powers intended for use only in dire emergency. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 13:35, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Also, the Governor-General is constitutionally Commander-in-Chief of the Armed Forces, and he could, theoretically, unilaterally mobilise the army to go and attack New Zealand, for instance. If he did so, though, I think the head of the army would just laugh in his face and go and tell the Prime Minister what the G-G is getting up to, and the G-G would be instantly dismissed. -- JackofOz 13:56, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Exactly. Ultimately, the one thing that prevents the GG from declaring himself Lord High Emperor is the same thing that prevents me declaring myself Lord High Emperor - no-one would play along. FiggyBee 14:37, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Unless you're in San Francisco, maybe. Algebraist 15:45, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

It's a bit different in the UK though. There is no written constitution - and the police and the armed forces swear allegience to the Queen - not to the government. So theoretically, there are no limits to her powers. (Except maybe Kryptonite) SteveBaker 17:11, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Check out Australian constitutional crisis of 1975. Had a big effect in Australia.Polypipe Wrangler 09:55, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Sharad Purnima in 1960

what was the date of Sharad Purnima in 1960? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 117.99.19.199 (talk) 11:22, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

If I understand this, it was 5 October. Sharad Purnima is celebrated on the full moon of Ashwin or September–October. The full moon in October 1960 was on the 5th,[14] and in September it was on the 5th. --— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 11:50, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Links for calendar of vikram samvat...

Can someone send me link for the calenders of vikram samwats......? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 117.99.19.199 (talk) 11:29, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Samvat (calendar eras) and Vikram era may be helpful. hydnjo talk 02:35, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Tangled telephone handset cords

At work this morning, my boss was grappling with his telephone receiver, which is attached to the base by one of those coiled plastic cord things (as shown on the left of this pic). He commented that they always seem to get into an awful tangle, and that he has to rotate the handset in his hand several times to straighten it out again — only for it to get twisted and tangled again immediately! I noticed the same thing happens to mine as well ... and having decided we couldn't work out why it happens (we're not spinning around on our chairs when on the phone), I decided to throw the question open to a wider audience. Does anybody know why this irritating thing happens...?! Hassocks5489 12:56, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

When you pick the phone up you may rotate the receiver once in you hand, or pass from hand to hand then set down again. All these half rotations add up to one big tightening tangle. If you look at where the cord joins the bottom of the handset you may be able to unplug and straighten the cord. It's one of my little semi-OCD bugbears too. Lanfear's Bane | t 13:21, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Not exactly on topic, but this post on boingboing throws some light on the matter. --Tagishsimon (talk) 13:23, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

I believe Lanfear's Bane has it right, and we have found a way to help prevent the cord tangling when you hang up. By putting a couple of ballpoint pens (hexagonal ones with separate lids) inside the coil, you hold the loop straight and stop it winding around itself. SaundersW 16:24, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

If you are looking for solutions, then there are cord detanglers: [15] and there are wireless headsets. --— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 16:27, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

(←Unindent...) Thanks for all the suggestions. We'll try the ballpoint pen trick tomorrow (plenty of those in the stationery cupboard!). Lanfear's Bane's point was useful: I unplugged the cord from the handset on my phone (which wasn't nearly as badly tangled as my boss's), and it snaked around for several seconds straightening itself out. A headset would be nice, but they're in short supply in the office — our client-facing colleagues get them, but we use our phones relatively little _{(not complaining!)} Hassocks5489 20:19, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

After losing a game

In a football, baseball, or basketball game, the losing team sits around for about five minutes after the game, looking dejected. Why do they sit around several minutes after losing instead of leaving? Bubba73 (talk), 13:44, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

There's no possible objective answer for this, but there are lots of possibilities. Congratulate the other team? Think about the game? Postpone the disappointment of trudging off the field/court? Avoid the stinky locker room? Tradition? Take your pick or invent your own reason. — Lomn 14:03, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

They are obviously not congratulating the other team - they are just sitting there. But one thing I considered is that they are showing respect for the other team. On the other hand, it may be to make a photo opertunity for the cameras. Bubba73 (talk), 14:39, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

This sounds likely - just walking out would be unsporting. FiggyBee 14:47, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

I watch poker a lot, and when someone loses, they get up and leave. Bubba73 (talk), 16:08, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

They are often waiting for their coach or captain, who is congratulating his counterpart or being restrained by security guards for trying to kill a referee or something. Teams do everything as a team, even slink away in disgrace. Often, the two teams will each form a line and file past each other saying "Good game" and "You watch out next time" and stuff like that, and they do that on command. --Milkbreath 15:27, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

There seems to be some stragglers just sitting there after just about all the rest of the team has left. Bubba73 (talk), 16:10, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

From my own experiences in major games the pressures leading into and through the game are considerable. The winners have the boost of adreneline to sustain them. The losers have given their all. My only need was to rest and recover for a time, and that meant squatting down where I was while I recovered my breath.86.219.165.15 15:58, 30 October 2007 (UTC)DT

Because when 'bad' things happen we often sit and reflect on them? Why do people who find out someone close to them has died often slump to the floor wherever they may be? Because they aren't thinking about X or Y they are fixed on one thought. Obviously losing at sport is nothing like the same feeling but ultimately the mind is thinking things through. You could also consider it to be 'learned behaviour' as certain sports have it and others don't. Certainly in England's Premier League the players will often be dejected on the pitch after big games and the supporters will be cheering their name/chanting for the team, such a thing may prove to be a huge boost to the dejected feeling the players feel. Poker-wise it is because only active players remain on the table. If the game continued after a sports-team lost then the players would leave, but at the end of the event there is no rush to leave the pitch. ny156uk 00:02, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Maybe just to postpone the tantrum that their coach is going to have after the game.--Dlo2012 00:58, 31 October 2007 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Dlo2012 (talk • contribs) 00:57, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

I've often wondered about this. In most competitions in life, the loser is expected to be happy for and congratulate the winner. You don't see the runner up in Miss America sit there and mope when they announce the winner. The funny thing is when the losers in a sporting event do go back to the locker room and talk to the media, they always talk about how great the other team was and how much they deserve to be champions. But they never acknowledge that on the field -- except in hockey. One thing I like about the NHL is how the players on the two teams line up and shake hands at the end of a playoff series. -- Mwalcoff 01:40, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

In rugby union, teams applaud each other off the field after the match (albeit sometimes rather halfheartedly). Often, in soccer, players will put in a huge effort towards the end of the game in an effort to win. If it is successful, your tiredness is forgotten in the adrenalin rush. However, if you lose the feeling of despair can be overwhelming and all your energy deserts you, hence the urge to collapse in a heap. Rockpocket 01:48, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

I have always thought that it was to demonstrate how 'dejected' they all feel after losing. I think it's a relatively recent phenomenon which was first seen after World Cups finals matches (soccer) by certain individuals who wanted to show the world by means of tears and prostration that they can hardly bear to go on with life. Who do they think they are kidding!!??Richard Avery 08:37, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

I've always thought the NFL particularly good about voluntary post-game sportsmanship. It's quite common to see two players on opposing teams meet at midfield and exchange words -- say, the quarterback and the safety who intercepted him, or the running back and the linebacker who have been smashing into each other all game. Unlike the coaches' handshake, or the NHL glove-bump thing (which I don't dislike, don't get me wrong), these are the sort of encounters that can easily be skipped, since they're neither mandatory nor traditionally expected, and they happen anyway. On the other hand, I find baseball rather lousy for codifying in the rules that teams may not congratulate each other or fraternize in any other way (Rule 3.09, available in PDF). There was a petition a few years back (maybe just after 9/11, but not sure) from New York and Boston schoolchildren asking the Yankees and Red Sox to shake hands after a series and dispel some of the irrational hatred that brews in that rivalry. The petition was rolling along pretty well, gaining media attention, until the commissioner quashed it by saying it was against the rules. Sportsmanship! Against the rules! Unbelievable. — Lomn 13:20, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Mortgage

How would one go about buying a house in the UK. I know how to buy a house, but more specifically the hard part is getting the deposit. Which is well nigh impossible for the average young person, earning minimum wage or there abouts. What I would like to know about is 100% Mortgages, how would one get one, and/or how would I as a low earner manage to get his/her own property. Secondly, surely the government should address this issue? Thanks 12.191.136.2 14:49, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

The government is attempting to address the issue, particularly through Housing associations, which provide part-buy, part-rent housing. But there is probably a limited ability to interfere with a market characterised by greater demand than supply. After the recent Northern Rock and the US sub-prime mortgage meltdowns, there's considerably less likelihood that 100% mortgages will be easily available, not least since such a mortgage represents an increased risk to the lender. And despite the general demand > supply argument, in the short term there must be some fear about the possibility of negative equity, which again mitigates against 100% mortgages. I recommend you try asking the question of building societies and housing associations. Good luck. --Tagishsimon (talk) 14:59, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Speak with a mortgage adviser who can help you understand what is within your budget. It may be that your financial outlook is best served by renting a property and investing the 'difference' (between rent and mortgage costs) into a medium-term investment until you can pull together a viable deposit/your wages begin to increase. Within the Uk we have a phobia about renting (referring to it as 'dead money') but it provides a large number of benefits over a mortgage such as... reduced risk, more attainable, stable costs (leases are commonly 1 or 2 years at a guaranteed price regardless of increases to interest rate), more flexibility etc. Anyhoo if you are in favour of home ownership then simply book an appointment with your local bank's branch mortgage advisor and they will be able to review what can be afforded. Additionally look online for mortgage calculators such as these from the bbc (http://www.bbc.co.uk/homes/property/mortgagecalculator.shtml). ny156uk 23:56, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Structure of The Indian Judicial system

I need to undersatnd the basic structure of the Indian judiciary (The Number of judges in various courts, their tenuer of work etc). Not much of information is available on the basics of Indian legal system. Kind interference from an authority would be of great help.

Regards Ritesh Pal —Preceding unsigned comment added by Myactmail (talk • contribs) 15:40, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

I'm not an authority on any aspect of India, but for a start try District Courts of India, High Courts of India, Indian law, and Law enforcement in India. Xn4 22:34, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

McDonalds "Go active" fitness watch without the manual... anybody know about this watch?

Recently purchased the aforementioned watch as second hand. It has 3 buttons - mode and reset on bottom and one stop button on top and a sensor (infrared?) on top right. Using the watch as a stop watch or as an exercise timer is quite intuitive. Without the manual, however, I could not change the time, set the alarm, measure heart rate or even change the date. I have tried several combinations of the 3 buttons and none of them changes anything. Please tell me how to change the settings?. Or do I need another device that communicates with the sensor which does all this?. Please have a look at the watch : http://img3.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/3bca6857b8.jpg If you have a manual and if you could post it on the web, I would be more than grateful. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 131.220.46.26 (talk) 16:20, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

If you pop the back cover it may show the original manufacturer. --— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 16:29, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Have you tried holding some of the buttons down rather than just pressing them? Lanfear's Bane | t 16:50, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Lanfear's Bane: Thank you very much for your suggestion. Based on it, I have changed the time and date settings. This must be the most unintuitive watch ever. Please allow me to post this small howto. This might be helpful to others who own such a watch.

To change time/calender: 1.Press reset for several seconds and the watch goes to settings and seconds display starts to blink. 2.Press st/sp button to increase the seconds. 3.Press mode to go to alter the next setting - let us say minutes. Minutes starts to blink and you can increase it by the st/sp button. 4. Repeat steps 2 and 3 to change date or anything you want. To change the alarm: press mode to go to alarm mode. Display shows AL above the time. change the alarm time as above. Press reset to exit settings mode (the watch is still in AL mode). Press st/sp to activate the alarm (you see a small bell and a chime above the seconds in normal mode. One would expect the alarm to work if it displays only the small bell, but it doesn't. Please ensure you see both the small bell and a chime or the alarm will not work).

I tried using the heart rate monitor in a similar vain but without sucess. I enter HR mode, do the same procedures, the heart starts to blink, I press my finger against the sensor but nothing happens. Anybody knows why?.

You are more than welcome, I used to have a Casio, back in the day, where you had to do roughly the same thing. As for the HRM, no clue I am afraid. Lanfear's Bane | t 21:18, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Largest ski area in Canada

What is the largest ski area in Canada.

Whistler Blackcomb in B.C. Canada. has the largest total ski area, however technically it is two mountains that have been integrated into one resort.

Lake Louise, Alberta, claims that they have the largest ski area in Canada?

FcaberFcaber 17:09, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Heisman Trophy Winners

Other than Steve Spurrier, has any Heisman Trophy winner made a career in coaching?70.153.86.51 21:18, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Pat Sullivan has, as did John David Crow for a time. Rockpocket 21:37, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Bruce Lee vs Jet Li

Suppose if Bruce Lee was to get into a fight (a street fight with the intent of killing one another) with Jet Li with the both of them in their respective primes, who would likely win? Since Jet Li came after Bruce, he was probably able to study Bruce's techniques and learn from them. However, Bruce, the "pound-for-pound strongest man in the world", possess a distinct physical advantage over Jet Li. Thanks. Acceptable 21:38, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Two words. Chuck Norris. Incomparable or incommensurable as the apples and oranges article states. Although we do know that Jet Li vs. Jet Li vs. Jet Li vs. Jet Li vs. Jet Li and so on and so forth makes for a reasonable movie. Lanfear's Bane | t 22:02, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

I think Bruce Lee would win, he is huge (muscularly), and has been practicing since he was very young. What a tragedy he died. Cheers,JetLover (Report a mistake) 22:29, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Do you even know anything about Bruce? Have a read of the article, there should be no doubt in your mind who would win after reading about Bruce's life and training. Don't get me wrong, I love Jet and his films, he's a really great guy, but Bruce is in a different league all together.Vespine 23:58, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Jet li would put up a good fight, but i think we all know who would be snapping whose neck in the end...--Dlo2012 01:00, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

The winner would be whoever landed the first blow. When you get two expert fighters (any style, with or without weapons) going at each other with intent to kill, the fight will almost never last more than one blow, and the first blow to land will kill or disable the person hit. --Carnildo 22:24, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

buying from the US

i've found a pair of shoes i like online, but they're only sold in the US and i live in the UK. it seems most US sites/shops won't ship outside of the US because of some banking verification thing, so my question is: is there a way to buy US products and have them shipped over here? is there a company that does this? thanks 81.96.160.171 22:27, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

the only thing i can think of is to get someone you know in the US to buy the shoes for you and then have them mail them to you Cryo921 03:12, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

I don't know what "banking verification thing" there would be. If you have a credit card, that should be all you need as far as banking goes. The problem most likely lies in the taxes and duties that the company who ships the shoes to you would have to pay. I used to work customer service at a gift company and we had a list of countries that we could not ship to because the taxes that the company had to pay in order to get them into whatever foreign country were too high. Even to ship something to Canada (I'm in the U.S.) was $40 just for the shipping. Dismas|^(talk) 03:18, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Can you find a pair on eBay.com (not eBay.co.uk)? If so, you can pay with PayPal and 99% of sellers will ship overseas. I've bought lots of stuff on the UK eBay and had them shipped over to the US. It's hard to believe things wouldn't work just as smoothly in the reverse direction...and with the dollar being spectacularly weak right now, there could hardly be a better time to do it. But shipping won't be cheap - sad, but inevitable. SteveBaker 03:47, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

October 31

Becoming a USSS Special Agent

Looking at the US Secret Service official website [16], the requirements to becoming a Special Agent (the kind that protects the President) seems fairly lax. A bachelor's degree and 3 years of police-related training (plus the 11+ week course). This led me to wonder, do the agents that protect the President have further levels of previous training? Obviously, when one is just starting off, the assignments and duties will be small. But suppose one reaches the highest level and is assigned and entrusted to protect the President, do these agents, for example, have former special forces training? Or is a special force background not required, as protective services is not as intense? Thanks. Acceptable 00:35, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

A bachelor's degree or 3 years of police-related training, actually. But I imagine the 11 week training course is hardly a walk in the park. And as you say, those protecting the President would be the most qualified and most experienced. FiggyBee 01:11, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

One of the requirements is to pass the background check, and I'm sure that isn't lax. Near the bottom of their website's home page we read that they recieve "11 weeks of intensive training" followed by "16 weeks of specialized instruction" - for a total of 27 weeks (right at six months) of not-your-ordinary-job training. All of that training is after being accepted, and I'm sure that applicants with more experience and training will have an edge over applicants who have only the minimum requirements. Basically, you're going to end up with some well-trained agents from the start, and that's before they really begin to learn their jobs. 152.16.59.190 02:28, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Remember that the Secret Service is part of the Treasury. Most agents will be tracking down kids trying to pass photocopies of $20 bills, not protecting high officials. (Er. was Treasury, now it's in Homeland Security) Rmhermen 18:29, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

The 11-week course is training at FLETC - fifty different federal agencies all send their agents for that course. Then they get specialized training back at their own agencies. (In all 80 different agencies send their officers for training there - that an idea of how many different kinds of federal agents we hav in the U.S.) Rmhermen 18:50, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

I would imagine that new hires in the Secret Service don't immediately begin on a Presidential security detail. ("Here's your gun, your badge, your parking pass, and your bulletproof vest. Try to stand between Dubya and the craziest looking guy in the room – not counting Dick Cheney – at all times. Coffeemaker is down the hall on your left; the photocopier passcode is 1-2-3-4. Good luck!")

My best interpretation of what I can dredge up from the 'net is that Secret Service Special Agents are part of classification 1811 (Criminal Investigating Series) of the General Schedule (GS) Classification System: [17]. The 1811 Series is described in this PDF. Classifications described within 1811 run from GS-5 (essentially a closely-supervised trainee) to GS-13 (responsible for extremely complex nationwide or international criminal investigations). I would expect that going from the lowest to the highest classifications would tend to require many years and extensive training (formal and on-the-job). If you're interested, it appears that the Secret Service is currently recruiting Criminal Investigators at the GS-5 through GS-9 levels, with the potential for eventual promotion as high as GS-13: [18]. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 21:25, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

diversity in basball

Anyone know where I can get a few articles on racial diversity in baseball? Numbers and percentages and whatnot are good too. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.101.53.151 (talk) 04:51, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

You can start with this, I suppose. Zagalejo^^^ 04:57, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Here's another article. Zagalejo^^^ 04:59, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Tax Question

Does anyone know ... are the premiums that one pays for Health Insurance tax-deductible in the United States, on one's federal income tax return? Thanks. (Joseph A. Spadaro 06:05, 31 October 2007 (UTC))

I think it's yes for work related monthly payments (the health insurance you get from work) but nothing for any others. you're best off checking with a tax attorney or the IRS. Cryo921 07:14, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Go to www.irs.gov and download Schedule A&B and the instructions for same. It appears that in 2006, medical expenses above 7.5% of AGI were deductible (for 1040 filers) on Schedule A. The instructions for Schedule A say that includes insurance premiums, with some restrictions. So if you have high premiums (or low AGI), or if you have other qualified medical expenses to eat up the 7.5%, then some or all of the premiums might be deductible. No warranty on this obviously; I'm not an accountant, just reading the documents on the site. --Trovatore 08:05, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

If you're self employed, insurance goes right off. But medical expenses need a 7.5% of income which I never meet despite shelling out a lot in medical expenses. I guess for not self employed, insurance would have to be the 7.5% or more. William Ortiz 19:53, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Your friendly annoying neighborhood park pigeon is tasty...

...or is it not? It has come to my attention that the common "flying rat" Feral Pigeon is supposed to be - in the words of the person I heard it from - "good eatun". I know historically people have enjoyed a smidgen of pigeon so I am curious as to whether the taste of the braised breast of this urban nuisance approaches that of their wild cousins. Additionally, other than being harried by enraged old ladies, urban birdwatchers, and various animal rights factions what danger might my pigeon-kebab hold? Toxins bioaccumulating within them due to their ... rather urban diet, perhaps? Protective laws rubber stamped by obviously misguided and deranged officials? And before anyone flips a lid and chastises me for murdering one of these defenseless feces machines, I have not actually committed the sin of pest control .... yet. Sifaka ^talk 05:54, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

I moved this question to the Miscellaneous desk because I posted it on the wrong refdesk page! Sifaka ^talk 06:56, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

...in addition to the scampering rat, quit tasty to street people, eaten raw or sometimes cooked over an open flame of newsprint or wood. Clem 06:15, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Apparently they are best when young: "tender young birds (squabs) were taken as a delicacy mainly in the breeding seasons of spring and late summer. They would often be roasted on a spit or baked. Older birds are tough and needed prolonged stewing before use in pigeon pie a dish mainly eaten by servants."[19]--Shantavira|^{feed me} 09:13, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

In public squares or such like they can be remarkably easy to catch - just scatter some grain on the ground, and as they croud about eating it, drop a cardboard box over them. DuncanHill 09:52, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

See also the recent discussion about eating gulls and pigeons on our Science Reference Desk. Feral pigeons are fat and their tameness makes them easy to catch but I'm not sure that their diet would make them very tasty. You would have to make sure they were cooked thoroughly to avoid any bacteria as they can carry diseases (just like rats). GaryReggae 11:03, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Smelly Colleague

Hi, me and a few of my friends at work are in a predicament....this girl always wears the same thing everyday and realy realy smells, not just a lil bit but loadz!! but i realy dont know what 2 do about it as i dnt want 2 hurt anyones feelings or ruin what is a nice working environment but me and some other people all agree that this realy isnt hygenic (soz cant spell) and it duz make ur day go a bit sower if u happen to be in close proxcimity 2 her has anyone got any ideas how 2 solve this as it is quite a delicate matter thanx x —Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.115.175.247 (talk) 09:58, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

There's probably no delicate way to break the news to the individual that her body odour is a problem. If the issue is causing problems, it is a management issue and should be dealt with by whoever deals with human relations within the company. I suggest you should take the matter up with your company management. --Tagishsimon (talk) 10:40, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

You could always drop her a subtle hint by putting a bar of soap or can of deodorant on her desk when she's out of the room, that way you avoid the embarassment of telling her but it will probably still hurt her feelings. On the flip side, it's probably better to break it to her like that as if you leave it, somebody less considerate might tell her in a more offensive way. A manager where I work used the bar of soap trick once and apparantly it worked. GaryReggae 11:07, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

If you're sure it's not just you, and you feel that she is an OK person but that most reasonable people won't tolerate her odor, and you like her and want her to thrive in life (which are three very big if's), sit down with her and flat out tell her. Tell her that you like her, you care about her, and you don't want to see people look down on her or talk smack about her, but you think that people are doing so because of her perfume/body odor (I'm not sure whether she is filthy or just poorly cologned, based on your original post). Be like a wikipedian -- be bold in addressing the problem, but be open to feedback. If she tells you that she's smelly because she can't afford laundry detergent and deodorant, you might have to offer to let her use your washing machine and/or buy her some product to help her out. You don't have to be afraid of hurting her feelings if you treat her with respect and your actions are geared around helping her out as a person. If you're lucky, you might make a friend. (If you're unlucky, she might tell you to get bent, and then you have to listen to her gripe, but if you have to buy nose plugs, you might as well get earplugs, too...) Good luck. Faithfully, Deltopia 13:26, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Maybe the problem goes deeper than that. Maybe she does not want companionship. I knew a girl at tech school who did not shave ynder her arms (yuck) but instead of repelling most guys it really turned them on. She wore the same clothes almost everyday but apparently did at least wash them every night. Instead of handing her a bar of soap or a stick of deodorant several guys started leaving here dresses and clothes and stuff. One guy even gave her an electric razor. After awhile she softened up and it turned out pretty nice. In fact she started looking hot so other girls got jealous and treated her bad so she went back to wearing the same clothes and letting the hair grow under her arms (yuck, yuck, yuck, yuck, Yuck!). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.100.9.205 (talk) 16:29, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Airsoft guns

After asking the crow/chicken question earlier, someone suggested an airsoft air rifle as a solution. A quick check showed me that they're illegal in Australia. So I was wondering whether there are any other countries out there which also ban them? --Psud 11:02, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

• See Air_gun#Legal_issues. --Sean 16:27, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

hd dvd

i have a ps3 and a samsung dvd recorder....does this mean i can play hd dvd's?? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.115.175.247 (talk) 11:11, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

The PS3 cannot (it's a Blu-ray player). Unless the Samsung advertises itself as an HD-DVD player, it cannot -- however, you've not given enough information to say. If it can, the HD-DVD logo will no doubt be plastered on the front somewhere. — Lomn 13:07, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Paul Bunyon's boomerang?

What is this thing? [20] [21] [22] Dismas|^(talk) 12:51, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Looks like aeroplane wings to me. Couldn't say for what sort of plane, though. --Tagishsimon (talk) 13:03, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

SteveBaker "inspects" windmill blades after being caught short

I was thinking it might be the blade from a power generating windmill - those are similar in size to an aircraft wing. SteveBaker 13:06, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

But not similar in shape to the object on the truck. Identifying that orange hazard symbol would be helpful, but I'm drawing a blank so far. FiggyBee 19:18, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

ipod video convertor?

anyone know a good free convertor to convert videos into ipod format? thanks. :) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 125.238.26.235 (talk) 13:04, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

See Video converter, although that article is a blatant advertisement for a particular product and there must be other things around that do the same. I use a program called ffmpegx, but that's just for Mac. Basically you want something that will convert formats like .mp4 and .avi into .mov format. I just got a new iPod and .mov seems to be the only format that plays on it. --Richardrj ^{talk email} 15:30, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

alaska green

what exactly are alaska's marijuana laws? I've heard that persons 21 and older can legally own up to one ounce with absolutely no legal repercussions whatsoever. Is this true? --MKnight9989 14:43, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

There does seem to have been a ruling on state law in 2003, but it was being appealed - not sure what the outcome was. I think the key point to make is that possession is still illegal under federal law, and the police in Alaska apparently continue to pursue stoners. Browse google for more. --14:50, 31 October 2007 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Tagishsimon (talk • contribs)

Legal advice? hmmm. DuncanHill 14:59, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

FFS. Please try to see the difference between legal advice and confirmation that yes, there is a law. It's like confirming that there is a law against murder. (More's the pity, sometimes.) --Tagishsimon (talk) 15:03, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

My tongue was in cheek - I have no objection to legal information being given out, however on the talk page there is a somewhat heated debate on this sort of thing. I'm sorry I didn't make it clear that I was being light hearted. DuncanHill 15:14, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Oops. My bad. --Tagishsimon (talk) 16:58, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

No bad at all - I should have been clearer, and remembered that I'm not the only one feeling stressed! DuncanHill 18:06, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Have you read Places that have decriminalized non-medical marijuana in the United States? Corvus cornix 16:15, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

It's interesting that that article does not mention the federal level. My assertion, above, was from a quick google search, and IINAL. Do we have an article on US federal law w.r.t. cannabis? Would it be useful to caveat that article with the Federal overlay? I seem to remember vaguely someone in CA getting busted by the feds for growing medical marijuana. --Tagishsimon (talk) 16:58, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Well, there's Legal history of marijuana in the United States. And yes, a doctor and her husband, a lawyer, in Sacramento were convicted on federal pot charges just last month in Sacramento, even though they were following California law on the growing and distribution of medical marijuana. Corvus cornix 17:27, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Bruce Lee II

Seeing the above question has prompted me to ask a question which has been a point of heated debate between my friends and I for quite a while now: If Bruce Lee and Mike Tyson/Mohammed Ali were to fight, both being in thier primes, who would win? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.191.136.3 (talk) 16:59, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

With respect, these sorts of questions are not really within the remit of a Reference Desk. Its impossible to know and therefore its impossible for anyone to provide your with a reliable or verifiable answer. Rockpocket 17:17, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

party pooper. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.191.136.3 (talk) 17:20, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Wouldn't it very much depend on the rules of the fight? Anyway, if you just want an straight answer without a heated debate, I'll simply announce it's Mohammed Ali.--Shantavira|^{feed me} 18:30, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Aw, I thought the vandalised version was just as valid an answer. :P FiggyBee 20:41, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Indeed, but I just can't let sleeping vandalism lie. I'm pretty good at mixing metaphors though. --LarryMac | Talk 20:44, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

UK automated text messaging on the cheap.

Can anyone help me with the following. I am the editor of a charitable magazine and we wish to set up an texting service whereby people can send short messages to be printed. At the moment it's simply a mobile phone with no credit, it picks everything up OK but that's about it.

What sort of software / hardware would be needed to send an automated text back saying something like 'thank you for submitting your text, your message will be printed in next month's issue'.

I have a feeling this is one of those simple ideas that is going to be way outside our non existent budget! I've seen lots of free texting websites and wonder if there is anything free or for a small subscription that may be useful to us. Thanks —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.144.30.22 (talk) 18:53, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Contact the service provider, give them your charitable organisation number and see if they will provide the service for free. Worth a try. How many times a month are you expecting to respond? If it's under 300 then an O2 pre-pay phone being topped up with £10 credit each month is given 300 free texts (at least I am in my pay-as-you-go phone) so that might be a good value alternative.ny156uk 19:57, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Moving far away. How do people do this?

I'm planning on moving somewhere to another state. It'll be about a 12 hour drive and I have so much stuff I will need to rent a U-haul truck. My main question is how exactly do people go and find a place to go to that's so far away? I'm hoping to find a detached home for rent and well I can't really visit and an airplane flight would take months in advance to schedule and going back and forth waiting through the whole airplane stuff would take all day.

So how do people do these long range moves, how do they find a good place from so far away? William Ortiz 19:54, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

There are a lot of web-based rental searches, such as apartments.com. I'm not sure about homes. Corvus cornix 20:24, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

I have done several long-distance moves in the United States. Unless you have very expensive furniture and gear, it may be cheaper to sell your belongings (via Craigslist, for example) in your present location and then buy new or used furniture in your new location than to transport everything. (Though you should steer clear of used upholstered furniture, which may carry bedbugs.) Gear that is worth transporting includes your clothes, your kitchen gear, camping gear, and maybe books. (Though this would be a good time to sell or otherwise dispose of books you won't need in the future.) Once you have pared down your belongings to the minimum that you need and is worth transporting, you may find that Amtrak Express Shipping is cheaper than a U-Haul rental, if Amtrak serves both your starting point and end point. You can rent a cargo (utility) van and move your stuff between your home and Amtrak at either end, and it will still probably be cheapter than U-Haul. If Amtrak Express is not an option, a mover or freight forwarder still might be cheaper than U-Haul. As for finding a place, that is harder. It helps to have friends to stay with for a week or two once you get there while you look. Failing that, you might try a cheap motel with weekly rates. In either case, you might need to put most of your stuff in storage and live out of a suitcase and/or backpack while you look for a place. Alternatively, you could fly to your destination for a weekend early in the month before you plan to move. You don't need to schedule flights months in advance unless you fly around a holiday. You will get low fares as long as you schedule the flight 2-3 weeks in advance. Here is how this could work: Say you want to move into your new place January 1. You could make a flight reservation now or even halfway through November for a visit to your destination the weekend of December 8-9. You could book a room for one or two nights at a motel at your destination and reserve a rental car at the airport for those two days. Meanwhile, you could research real estate agents online (or Craiglist listings, or wherever landlords advertise rentals where you want to live) and schedule several appointments over the course of your weekend. By the weekend of December 8-9 (roughly three weekends before you want to move), most of the rentals for January 1 will be on the market, but many or most will not yet have been filled, so your chances of finding something suitable would be good. Then you would have someplace that you could actually move into on January 1. If you want to move December 1, you could schedule flights, motel, and appointments for the weekend of November 10-11 right away. You might not get the best air fares, but it would not necessarily be too expensive. If you want to move before December 1, then you may just need to get rid of as much stuff as possible, send what you really need, drive there, check into a motel, put your stuff in storage, and look while you stay in the motel. Marco polo 20:38, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the info. I'm in the same situation and was planning on asking some of the same questions. (Although I am job-hunting in several cities, and researching housing in all of them, that is a difference.) What I also look at in addition to the apartment websites, is the online versions of the local newspapers. Most of them have classified ad sections that list homes and apartments. If you are in the U.S., you can find a list of just about every newspaper at NewsLink. — Michael J 22:02, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

For apartments, noise travels through the walls too easily and is unbearable. Also the smoke of tobacco and illicit drugs as well as bad cooking odors travel through the gaps between walls so I'd try for a detatched cottage.

As for job hunting, I did that out of college nationwide. I found that employers really were so picky they wouldn't hire anyone who was far away as they wanted in person interviews. Even if you somehow land the job, without a contract, who knows if the employer isn't going to then decide not to hire you or sack you shortly after you join. William Ortiz 22:32, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Pros/Cons of joining the army

Hi I'm eighteen, turning nineteen in a few months and I'm interested in joining the US army. Just wanted to hear an "unbiased" opinion here. I want to join as a linguist, and my recruiter says after the DLI I'll be an E4 specialist. What would happen after that? I understand I would be living at a fort, but when it's my turn to be shipped out to Iraq or afghanistan or whatever, what will I do there? Thanks--Goon Noot 20:10, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

There are some case profiles here (though, since these are provided by the Army, its obviously not a neutral source). There appears to be 3 different types of roles for linguists in the Army:

• Interrogators, who conduct debriefings and interrogations, translate foreign intelligence documents, and processes intelligence gathered
• Translator/Interpreters, versatile positions designed to meet the varied linguistic needs of the US Army. You may be doing anything that requires communication.
• Voice Interceptors, specialists in uses electronic means to detect, locate, and monitor foreign signals. They record and transcribe language transmissions, performs basic analysis and prepare intelligence reports.

It sounds obvious, but many people don't really give due to consideration that joining the army of a country at war is among the most hazardous jobs one can do! Before signing up give it a lot of thought, and good luck with whatever you choose! Rockpocket 20:39, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Well yes, but will I also be patrolling the streets of Baghdad or what?--Goon Noot 21:23, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Well, no-one can tell you that for sure until your report for duty (by which time you have already signed a contract!) When you join the Army your contract pretty much says you will go wherever you are told to do pretty much whomever you are told to (certain legal conventions notwithstanding, of course). By the time you are trained the US Army could have all but withdrawn from Iraq.... or it could have invaded Iran. I'm certain there are linguists in the US Army who patrol the streets of Baghdad at the moment, but the probability of you being asked to do that is difficult to judge. For one thing it probably depends on what language you specialize in. I'm sure an Arabic speaking linguist will be more likely to end up in Baghdad than a Korean speaking linguist, for example. If you wish to patrol the streets of an Iraqi city, I would suggest that a translator/interpreter is much more likely to do so than an interrogator or voice interceptors Rockpocket 21:47, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

I'm sure an Arabic or other Middle east language interpreter is likely to accompany fellow soldiers on patrol for liaison purposes with the locals. Acceptable 21:54, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

These Yahoo! Q&As may interest you also [23] [24] Rockpocket 22:12, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Precise digital Scales

Is there a name for the very accurate digital balances/scales found in laboratories? Or are they just called "Digital Balances". As well, how much does a good one usually cost? I would like to buy one to measure the weight of small postage stamps. Thanks. Acceptable 20:52, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Per our article weighing scale, the high precision ones seem to be called analytical balances. Algebraist 21:24, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

As for costs an analytical balance costs around £1000 (in the UK) and measure to 0.0001g Less accurate laboratory balances cost from £100 but these only measure to 0.1g which would be no good for you. One costing £200 - £300 would proboughly how much does a stamp weigh? Theresa Knott | The otter sank 21:35, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

I know a full sheet of ordinary paper masses in the neighbourhood of five grams; a stamp has an area roughly a hundredth of the area of a sheet of paper; from that I'd estimate a mass of about 50 milligrams per stamp. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 21:52, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Balances designed for extremely small masses (precision down to micrograms or better) are also often described as microgram balances or microbalances. The price of these instruments starts at five or ten times what you'd pay for a balance that's good to 1 or 0.1 milligrams. How precisely do you need to know the weight of your stamps? TenOfAllTrades(talk) 21:52, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

I think 2 decimal places is good enough. Acceptable 21:55, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Does Mikasuke=Miccosukee?

The State of Muskogee supposedly had a capital at Mikasuke, according to the Flordia Department of State: [25]. Is Mikasuke the same as the present day Miccosukee, Florida? --Filll 22:20, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

convertables

which convertable cars have 3 passenger seats in the rear? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.140.231.104 (talk) 22:33, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

The Saab 9-3 does, and various forums report that the Toyota Solara and Chrysler Sebring do as well (though it looks to me like the current Sebrings do not). It's probably not hard to dredge up others via a Google search of 5 seat convertible. — Lomn 22:50, 31 October 2007 (UTC)