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June 29

Obama on copyright reform

Does Barack Obama support the Public Domain Enhancement Act or other copyright reforms? NeonMerlin 00:24, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

His website doesn't say anything, other than, "Barack Obama believes we need to update and reform our copyright and patent systems to promote civic discourse, innovation and investment while ensuring that intellectual property owners are fairly treated."[1]. Which doesn't say a whole lot though it does indicate an interest (which, of course, is only part of the issue—without Congress' interest, nothing will happen, and copyright reform that is not in the interest of Big Media is not, and will probably never be, very popular in Congress, among either party). --98.217.8.46 (talk) 03:14, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

Non-staged professional wrestling?

Are there any professional wrestling federations out there who put on unrigged fights whose results are not predetermined beforehand? --90.242.108.208 (talk) 01:41, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

If you mean on the level of WWE, say, then no. It's all staged on that level, since it makes better television. Smaller wrestling groups, or UCF groups might put on genuine matches. However, in most cases, pro wrestling is fake. Watch olympic wrestling to see the real thing.--NeoNerd 13:35, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

You might also be interested in Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu, catch wrestling, and shooto. Also, while not being limited to wrestling techniques, PRIDE and the UFC have featured many fighters who were trained in various wrestling arts and have put these techniques to use on the mat. --noosphere 17:10, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

Airsoft gun laws in Maryland and in other States for minors

Hey, I was just wondering a few things:

Is it legal for an unaccompanied minor to carry an airsoft gun in the state of Maryland? What about Virginia? Or D.C.?

Thank you.

Sharpshot240 (talk) 03:47, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

I take it your question was sparked by recent news articles in the washington post and washington times. If not, you might find em interesting: [2] [3]. It's my understanding that no, there aren't any laws preventing minors from carrying airsoft equipment although I think you have to be 18 to purchase it. If not, I'm sure most stores will at least refuse to sell it to them without a parent present. But don't take my word for it: a distributor would probably be able to tell you definitively. -Shaggorama (talk) 01:49, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

When Canada is more conservative than the US

When was the last time Canada's government was more conservative than that of the United States at the same time? Will the Harper-Obama overlap be unprecedented in this respect? NeonMerlin 03:52, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

I'm not big on Canadian politics. Were the Progressive Conservatives really conservatives? If so, the last time the Canadians were more conservative was in 1993. Clinton was in charge in the US while Brian Mulroney and Kim Campbell were PMs. But, of course, I don't know either of their policies and am only going by their party to determine their political ideology. Paragon12321 (talk) 04:52, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

It's tough to compare the conservativeness or progressiveness of governments in different countries. If you get Stephen Harper and George W. Bush together, they might share similar philosophies about the role of government and free enterprise. But publicly, Harper supports policies to the "left" of even the Democrats in the U.S. For example, Harper officially supports Canada's single-payer health-care system, in which private insurance for "medically necessary" treatments is basically illegal. Only the most left-wing members of Congress in the U.S. would agree with him. Certainly, the Canadian political center has been to the left of the American one since the election of Pierre Trudeau in 1968. It's hard to see Joe Clark as more conservative than Jimmy Carter or Kim Campbell more conservative than Bill Clinton. You could consider Diefenbaker and Kennedy, although Kennedy was actually somewhat conservative in the traditional sense of the word in his short time in the White House. Certainly, FDR was far to the left economically of R.B. Bennett when he was elected, although Bennett belatedly embraced government intervention in the mid-'30s. -- Mwalcoff (talk) 11:45, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

I follow Canadian politics somewhat, and I don't think that it's clear that Harper's policies are more conservative than those advocated by Obama. (Mandatory single-payer health care is a good case in point.) Marco polo (talk) 00:28, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

Second choice

Can anyone think of a famous example in literature of someone settling for their second choice of love? Like, they couldn't win the heart of the one they truly love, so they settle for who's right there, someone who loves them greatly, even though the former is only settling for a less desired person. 96.233.60.132 (talk) 04:20, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

Are you referring to protagonists only? I'm sure there are several examples in fiction of peripheral characters settling for second best. Zain Ebrahim (talk) 12:24, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

The only example that springs readily to mind is Green Dolphin County, by Elizabeth Goudge, that was made into the movie Green Dolphin Street (1947). Marguerite and William love each other, but Marguerite’s sister Marianne also loves William. He has a habit of confusing their names, to both their displeasures. He has to get away from the law in (?)France and flees to New Zealand. Drunk one night, he writes to ask for his love (Marguerite) to join him, but again confuses the names and asks for Marianne by mistake. When she turns up in NZ, he realises his mistake. But she’s all he’s got, so they make do. -- JackofOz (talk) 12:58, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

Jacob and Leah (the first recorded bait and switch?), although he did get Rachel (and a few others) later. Clarityfiend (talk) 19:10, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

Hm, I'll have to check out "Green Dolphin County"; sounds interesting. And I had forgotten about Jacob and Leah. They're not quite what I had in mind, but thanks! Actually, (I think) I was thinking more along the lines of a Shakespearian love triangle, almost akin to the "Lovers" plot in "A Midsummer Night's Dream"; got any ideas? 96.233.60.132 (talk) 20:10, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

Pride and Prejudice's Mr Collins wanted Elizabeth Bennett, but had to settle for her friend Charlotte. I wouldn't call it love though. I don't think Mr Collins wanted to love anyone other than Lady Catherine de Burgh. Steewi (talk) 00:02, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

There are many examples of at least temporarily settling for whoever is there at the moment. That even goes back to those wild and crazy Old Testament stories, such as Lot settling for his daughters when he couldn't have his wife (and then claiming that they made him have sex with them). Is this question specifically referring to marrying and spending a whole life with the second choice? -- kainaw™ 00:31, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

Another good example from Austen is Mr Elton, who loves Emma but has to settle for someone less appealing. Your mention of Shakespeare prompts me to wonder if Orsino in Twelfth Night is an example of what you're looking for. But it's not a simple one: does he settle for Viola when he accepts Olivia is no longer available? Or does he already love Cesario (Viola's male persona) and is delighted to discover that "he" is actually female and single? Similarly problematic is Bertram at the end of All's Well That Ends Well: are any of his emotions really "love"? AndyJones (talk) 07:51, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

Mr. Elton didn't love Emma; he loved her position and wealth. Clarityfiend (talk) 16:34, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

I have the nagging feeling that this occurs in a Thomas Hardy novel to a main (or relatively main) character but I cannot think of which one it is. Does that jog anything for anyone, or is my mind playing tricks? User:Jwrosenzweig 08:50, 30 June 2008 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.112.32.67 (talk)

A Suitable Boy plays with this as a possibility. I won't spoil the ending for you. Itsmejudith (talk) 09:47, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

Hardy's Far from the Madding Crowd fits this to some extent, although not perfectly. Oak, a simple yet good-hearted farmer, originally appears to be the 'second choice' to two other possibilities, one dashing and exciting and the other older and financially secure. By the end Oak turns out to be by far the best option of the three. AlexiusHoratius (talk) 23:16, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

No, but I'm ready with a historical real-life one when there's a question on that. Julia Rossi (talk) 06:34, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

You can't always get what you want. Mick and Keith know how you feel. Plasticup ^T/C 12:26, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

Not me personally, Plasticup, W.B. Yeats! But your empathy is respected greatly. : )) Julia Rossi (talk) 13:35, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

Of Human Bondage is about precisely this topic. Most of the book is about the protagonist's obsession with a woman who treats him awfully. <SPOILER ALERT:> He eventually gives her up and in the end he is happy to marry someone else even though she inspires little passion in him. --D. Monack | talk 09:26, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Reichspropagandaleitung der NSDAP

In the English Wikipedia we have no page on the Reichspropagandaleitung der NSDAP. According to the German Wikipedia article, it operated between 1926 and 1945. I didn't succeed in reading that article and would like to know:

• How to represent its name in English;
• How it was related (if at all) to the governmental Ministry for Popular Enlightenment and Propaganda (founded in 1933);
• What is meant by the Central Propaganda Office of the Nazi Party referred to in that article as a "main branch" of the Ministry.

Thank you -- Deborahjay (talk) 13:40, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

Reichspropagandaleitung. Reich propaganda leadership, direction. The Nazi Party’s Central Propaganda Office, a subunit of the Propaganda Ministry. See Reichsminister(ium) für Volksaufklärung und Propaganda. Michael, R., & Doerr, K. (2002). Nazi-Deutsch/Nazi-German an English lexicon of the language of the Third Reich. OCLC 52723886

Perhaps most important for the success of the party's electoral efforts, however, was Hitler's creation of the Reich Propaganda Directorate ( Reichspropagandaleitung--RPL [in list of abbreviations as Propaganda Directorate of the NSDAP]) in early 1931. Goebbels had been directing Nazi propaganda since the previous year, but in 1931 his staff was expanded and his responsibility for National Socialist propaganda activities throughout the entire Reich formalized in the RPL. The RPL provided the Gauleiters with secret monthly reports on national political developments, propaganda techniques, and an outline of Nazi propaganda for the coming month. Beginning in April 1931, the RPL also distributed a monthly publication, Unser Wille und Weg (Our Will and Way), a journal for local Nazi functionaries that explained the party's position on key political and economic issues... Childers, T. (1983). The Nazi voter: the social foundations of fascism in Germany, 1919-1933. p. 194. OCLC 9576027

—eric 16:44, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

Gods incarnating as a human of the opposite gender

In Greek mythology there are many instances of a god incarnating as a human of the god's own gender. Are there any instances of them incarnating as humans of the opposite gender? If not, how about gods in Roman or other mythologies? -noosphere 17:02, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

In the Odyssey, Athena comes to earth in the form of a fisherman or something to talk to Telemachus. I don't think "incarnating" is the right word though. Greek gods already have flesh before they come down. Wrad (talk) 17:33, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

The purely Latin anecdote of Pomona and Vertumnus. The episode of Zeus and Callisto, where Zeus takes the guise of Artemis. Male artists and patrons of the 16th-18th centuries found the undercurrents of transvestitism and lesbianism as titillating as you do. --Wetman (talk) 19:25, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

Athena took the shape of Deiphobus... AnonMoos (talk) 23:03, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

And Mentor also, no? I imagine if I were better versed in more obscure tales Athena might appear as a man more often than these two famous occasions. User:Jwrosenzweig editing as 71.112.32.67 (talk) 08:47, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

Some aver that God is a woman (and possibly black), but She is said to have been incarnated as Jesus Christ, a male. -- JackofOz (talk) 00:01, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

Tiresias, at least in Ovid's telling of the tale of Narcissus, was famously the only person to have lived as both man and woman, and so was called in by Zeus and Hera to adjudicate their dispute over which sex obtained the most pleasure from the physical acts of love. Which suggests that any incarnation of Zeus as Artemis was more for decoration than functionality. :) - Nunh-huh 07:31, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

Not quite what the OP was asking for, but there's the story about Loki coming to Earth in the form of a horse and wooing a powerful stallion. Months later, he presents Odin with Sleipnir, with much ribbing from the other gods. — The Hand That Feeds You:^Bite 15:14, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

Cairo Geniza travel journals?

I have S.D. Goitein's A Mediterranean Society (Vol. I) and Letters of Medieval Jewish Traders. These books mention several series of letters that enable readers to chart the careers of certain merchants from the 10th-13th centuries. However, I don't remember reading anything about actual travel journals being found within the Cairo Geniza. Were such journals ever found in the Geniza? --Ghostexorcist (talk) 20:15, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

There are medieval Hebrew travel journals elsewhere (e.g. Benjamin of Tudela), but I'm not sure about the Cairo Geniza. You can search some of it here though. Adam Bishop (talk) 02:36, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

June 30

Freud in portuguese: "Arquitectura Animica"

I´m trying to help a friend translate a concept for a psychoanalysis peice he's writing. After a long attempt at trying to get a general understanding of the term and realizing that it must exist in english but that I just couldn´t put my finger on it, I started asking him etymological questions. The concept is "Arquitectura animica," and it was first used by Freud. Animica comes from animus which pertains to the soul or the soul's faculties. The idea (as best as I understand it) relates to concepts, assumptions about the world and manners of interpreting the world that are hard-wired into an individual´s psyche by their parent cultural and upbringing. I suggested "paradigm" and "ideology," but my friend didn't bite. If anyone can give a better translation, preferably (if possible) the phrase in common use by freudian translators into english, it would be much appreciated. --Shaggorama (talk) 01:03, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

If you can find out exactly where this is used in a Portuguese translation of Freud, then it should be easy to find what the term used in a good English translation is. Strawless (talk) 15:40, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

Our morals, ethics, etc. Illusion?

If we were tought from birth that killing each other is okay, and there is no stealing, just take and keep what you're strong eneough to hold onto, and if everyone did just that, would we not be stating that this is our God given morals? That it's the right thing to do?--THE WORLD'S MOST CURIOUS MAN (talk) 02:16, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

Probably, since it would be considered "natural behavior". Hard to tell. But it's nice to note that it has been suggested that our code of ethics evolved naturally. See evolutionary ethics. — Kieff | Talk 02:29, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

There are people who argue that anyway[4], against co-operation and for competition. People like God-put-me-here Robert Mugabe commonly use "God" to justify their behaviour or will to predominate, but I'd guess it gets lonely at the top of the heap with fear for your friend. Btw, do you mean to have a username all in caps for any particular reason? Julia Rossi (talk) 05:39, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

Given that morality and ethics are social norms rather than anything to do with nature - yes. Look across 'the wild' and you'll find plenty of animals fight to the death over mates, over food, over placement in the group. So yes we would consider it perfectly normal if we had never culturally decided it wasn't acceptable in general society. The more interseting question would be...would society ever have developed as much as it has in that world? Collabaration and the rule of law are doubtlessly huge factors in why we've developed so much. Without the security of a state that claims to protect you would you ever invest huge amounts in something that might be taken away from you by another? Is the incentive to work hard and toil still there when anybody is free to take the proceeds of your work? I suspect in the above universe while our ethics and morals wouldn't be offended (since they would be constructed in a world where that was the norm) our lives would be hugely different and (I believe) hugely less developed than they are today. 194.221.133.226 (talk) 11:07, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

Well, given that some form of the golden rule seems to exist in most religions, I think it could be argued that there is some natural basis for morality (check out tit for tat. Not to deny that cultural variance exists, but, in my view, biology does impose some restraints on where culture may go. Random Nonsense (talk) 20:12, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

We are social animals and not a bunch of free roaming loners in the wilderness. As social animals we need a social contract (embodied in religion / law / politics, ie. morals and ethics). If parts of it have been conveniently hardwired in the course of evolution is a moot point.

There can be no developed culture on the basis you specify as every culture is team work over many generations, requiring a smoothly operating frictionless society, requiring the absence of fear, requiring a trust in a secure future. --Cookatoo.ergo.ZooM (talk) 21:44, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

"Given that morality and ethics are social norms rather than anything to do with nature": that is of course the point of view of the person who wrote it. There are certainly other points if view, including the one that there are rules of behaviour imposed by God which are immutable. It's interesting that of all the societies in the world there has never been one that took the attitude suggested by the question asker. That might indicate that such a society is unfeasible, but it might also indicate a level of inbuilt morality. DJ Clayworth (talk) 15:56, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Dr. Friedlander

Can any user please let me have further information about a Dr. Friedlander who was a physician and taught at King's College Hospital Medical School - University of London in the late 1970s and early 1980s. Thank you. Simonschaim (talk) 08:58, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

Is this him?John Z (talk) 09:37, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

This seems to be the right person. Thank you. Simonschaim (talk) 14:36, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

Cultural differences between the West and the East

What will be the most significant cultural difference between the Western and the Asian civilization? --BorgQueen (talk) 17:50, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

This could provide the subject of a debate, but it couldn't have an answer at the Reference desk. --Wetman (talk) 18:13, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

Perhaps I should be more specific about the range of my question. Is there really a fundamental difference between the two civilizations, when it comes to the issue of equality between genders? I mean, the feminism movement is the product of the West, of course, but it appears to me that gender-based discriminations exist everywhere. --BorgQueen (talk) 18:21, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

You could have a look at Women in the People's Republic of China and at the bottom of that is a template "Women in Asia" that links to articles for other Asian countries. Fribbler (talk) 18:26, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

See Society of the Song Dynasty. --Ghostexorcist (talk) 18:38, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

To begin with, there is no single "Asian civilization". There are Chinese, Japanese, Indian, and various Southeast Asian and Southwest Asian civilizations, each of which underwent enormous cultural change over time. For that matter, it may not be very useful to speak of a single Western civilization. Within modern Western civilization, there are big differences between the United States and Europe and among individual European countries. Also, where does Western civilization end. Should we include Russia? It is very different from the rest of Western civilization. If not, then what about Greece, which like Russia is an heir to the civilization of the Byzantine Empire, and traditionally the place of origin of Western civilization. As for gender discrimination, that does seem to be virtually a geographic and historical constant, but different civilizations have varied in their treatment of women across history. For example, women in 9th-century China or 11th-century Japan probably had more freedom and power than their counterparts in Europe, even if the reverse is true today, at least in Japan. So it is impossible to generalize about Western versus "Asian" civilization, even on the question of gender relations. Marco polo (talk) 20:29, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

It's practically impossible to answer such a question - but how about monotheism?87.102.86.73 (talk) 17:30, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

That's an interesting point. The traditional religious beliefs in Asia tend to be polytheistic, unlike the Judeo-Christian monotheism. But then, polytheistic religions did exist in pre-Christian Europe... --BorgQueen (talk) 17:38, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

And the foundations of western civilisation (greece and rome) where polytheistic (Pre ~0 BC)

But I'd suggest that the differences go deeper than the adoption of a particular religion.87.102.86.73 (talk) 18:09, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

There's also the difference between latin/arabic scripts (alphabetical) and non-indian asian scripts eg chinese which are pictograms logograms.. That's a big difference many people will notice.87.102.86.73 (talk) 18:11, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

What was the original title of Dr. King's address at the March on Washington?

What was the original title of Dr. King's address at the March on Washington?

- thanks

The popular title appears to be I Have a Dream, though I'm not sure if Dr. King himself gave the speech another title. Spencer^T♦C 22:52, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

When and by whom was Kings address at the March on Washington first called the "I have a dream speech"?

When and by whom was Kings address at the March on Washington first called the "I have a dream speech"?

- Thanks —Preceding unsigned comment added by Chhange (talk • contribs) 19:59, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

Have a look at this google news search for the 1960's and I Have A Dream. Looks like the title was coined immediately. Fribbler (talk) 22:12, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

As far as the "original title" is concerned, some nice person in DC could take a peek at it in the Library of Congress, where it is often on prominent display. He copyrighted it about a month after giving the speech, and submitted the manuscript. --jpgordon^∇∆∇∆ 22:46, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

I believe the "original title" was "The Bounced Check," which makes sense if you read the whole speech. -- Mwalcoff (talk) 23:48, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

"The Bounced Check" is correct. The main theme of the speech is how blacks support the U.S. government time and time again only to receive in turn an insufficient funds check from the federal government. The "I Have a Dream" is only a small portion of the speech. In terms of propaganda, the I Have a Dream quotes are very eloquent and present a soon to be determined time when racial harmony reigns. The main speech is not complimentary to the U.S. Civil rights leaders comment about the misapprehensions concerning the speech among the general public.01:44, 2 July 2008 (UTC)75Janice (talk)75Janice75Janice (talk) 01:44, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

July 1

Can "Reform Sunni Islam" exist and can I create it?

Can "Reform Sunni Islam" exist and can I create it? I'm a Sunni Muslim that want to be like the non-Muslims. It like Reform Judaism. I'm creating a new sect of Islam that observes the ethical laws of Islam and does does moderation. For example, we accept playing music and not eating halal but eating halal will be rewarded. Read the blog: Reform Sunni Islam. I'm kind of a critic of fundamentalist Islam so I create a new sect to make Islam better. Can I create "Reform Sunni Islam"? Jet (talk) 06:11, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

I don't know much about the topic, but you might find Liberal movements within Islam interesting. --Allen (talk) 07:35, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

There is also Jaringan Islam Liberal in Indonesia, but the English-language part of their website www.islamlib.com seems to be down. You might be interested in the writings of Ziauddin Sardar. Itsmejudith (talk) 12:48, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

In case you're talking about creating a Wikipedia article on the topic, you should read Wikipedia:Your first article. In general, there's a conflict of interest in starting an article on a cause you're involved in. It's hard to gauge notability, remain neutral, and avoid original research in such cases. -- Coneslayer (talk) 12:56, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

Agreed. Jet, you do not need to start a new WP article on the subject. If you find information from reliable sources, add it to the Liberal movements within Islam article until it becomes too long. Itsmejudith (talk) 16:24, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

Can the "Reform Sunni Islam" sect of Islam (Sunni Islam) exist and can I create the sect?

I'm a Sunni Muslim that want to be like the non-Muslims. We Muslims live in a hard society. It like Reform Judaism but it's Islam. I'm creating a new sect of Islam that observes the ethical laws of Islam and does does moderation. For example, we accept playing music and not eating halal but eating halal will be rewarded. The Muslim women will not required to wear hijab. The Friday prayer will not be obligatory. Read the blog: Reform Sunni Islam. I'm kind of a critic of fundamentalist Islam so I create a new sect to make Islam better. We will not use Sharia but teach ethical laws. The women can be imams. Can I create "Reform Sunni Islam" sect of Islam? Jet (talk) 20:44, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

Am I correct in interpreting your question as:

How many people have to follow a Sunni "spinoff" for it to become known as a sect?,

or is it:

Would it be possible for there to be a liberal Sunni sect? Zain Ebrahim (talk) 22:05, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

No doubt your aim is honourable and time will show its success (or failure). Like a great man mentioned above, you have a dream. But, until this dream finds thousands of believers who follow you, Wikipedia is the wrong venue to publish it.

PS: On your user page you state that you have been Buddhist, are currently Sunni and want to convert to Judaism. It also states that you were an atheist and are an agnostic, mystic and Sufi, interested in Taoism and Bahá'í.

I do not wish to sound condescending, but as you are rather young, I feel you first need to find a well founded position in your personal beliefs. --Cookatoo.ergo.ZooM (talk) 22:28, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

---

There's Islam Hadhari... AnonMoos (talk) 23:20, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

You'd have a hard time convincing people that it is in fact Islam if one of the things you want to change are the obligatory prayers (note: all five daily prayers are obligatory, not just the Friday prayer). With one of the defining five pillars of Islam removed, how would you defend still calling it Islam? Zunaid©® 16:34, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

It is possible to be nominal in any religion, including Islam. This does not mean you need to create another sect. Nominalism usually means that you are an adherent to a religion by culture or upbringing, but not necessarily in belief or practice. Many may claim to be cultural Christians but do not go to church or follow the Bible's morality. Islam may be followed similarly. The question is, is it still Islam? A biblical Christian may recognize a nominal cultural Christian, but would not call them an adherent to Christianity (i.e. a "Christian" in the born-again biblical sense). Hope that makes sense. Kristamaranatha (talk) 02:59, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

looking for an unknown artist

i have a painting of a young boy wearing red knickers with white lace sitting on a chair thats carved out of a boulder —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.229.105.205 (talk) 20:45, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

Hm. Do you know what style the painting is in, or an estimated date for it? Spencer^T♦C 22:40, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

Is it this one: Bubbles (painting) by Millais? The rock is there. Julia Rossi (talk) 23:15, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

Buying Stock

How does one buy stocks without a brokerage firm?Elatanatari (talk) 21:58, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

Electronic trading, e.g. E-Trade. Clarityfiend (talk) 23:45, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

I mean other than that, with no middle man.Elatanatari (talk) 01:52, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Okay, how about Direct Investment Plans[5], where you can buy directly from the company? Hmmm...we don't seem to have an article about this. Clarityfiend (talk) 06:42, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Actually, we do: Dividend reinvestment plan. --D. Monack | talk 09:37, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

I think that DSPPs are more immediately relevant than DRIPs (this may have been mentioned in Clarityfriend's link which I can't access). Zain Ebrahim (talk) 12:34, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Thanks. Elatanatari (talk) 16:47, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

July 2

Album of the Year artwork licensing

Wouldn't the license of the artwork for Faith No More's Album of the Year technically be public domain, since the cover is a photo of Tomáš Garrigue Masaryk (who died 71 years ago) with the only modification being the words "album of the year" in a basic typeface in the lower right corner, or is there some other factor that I've missed out? — Balthazar ^(T|C) 00:06, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

The relevant date is the death of the photographer, not the subject of the photograph, so this image may still fall under copyright. --D. Monack | talk 09:40, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

unknown painting #2

baby angel putting a rose crown on a beautiful woman dressed in a white and blue gown {looks roman} —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.229.105.205 (talk) 01:50, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

any luck finding artist ? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bigskimarche (talk • contribs) 04:03, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

So, we're probably looking for a marian work? Can you give us any more detail, like where you saw it? When? Anything about the style of painting? 86.141.89.124 (talk) 01:07, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

looking for unknown artist

a little more detail on painting.it looks like an 18th or 19th century painting. young boy has a red suit with knickers and white lace collar and sleeves.his legs are crossed and his head is leaning on his left hand.the object hes sitting on looks like a crown carved out of rock.also he has flowers by his right knee.i just got this picture and not knowing who painted it is driving me nuts. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.229.105.205 (talk) 02:09, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

There are so many unknown artists.... But you might have more luck if you can upload a photo either here to the ref desk or to a photo sharing site.--Shantavira|^{feed me} 13:09, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

The Watchtower

Is there anyplace online I can find old issues of The Watchtower magazine or Awake! (and it's predecessors). Help is appreciated, thanks! Abeg92contribs 04:09, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Watchtower library serves as a kind of archive. I have noticed it available for free download but I am pretty sure that isn't legal. Also, the library is intended for use by witnesses. It contains the watchtower issues from 1980 to the present day (depending on which version you get) and the new world translation bible, and two volumes of the insight to the scriptures book. If in doubt pop down to your local kingdom hall, all material is free of charge. --Cameron* 09:28, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Older literature is hard to acquire. My family was active in the Witnesses since its founding with pastor Russell. My father ihheirited a treasure trove of very old Watchtowers and other publications in them. The Society is said to destroy such literature. I pored over my greatuncles' books as a child and teenager. The Society constantly revises its prophecies and beliefs b/c their predictions don't come true. Other religions may do the same. I do not know. When my father died, the collection was donated to the local Kingdom Hall. A few years later I heard that religious scholars were very interested in the works. I planned to donate to my alma mater, Columbia, b/c I did not want them going to some disreputable group just tearing the Witnesses down. No one could locate my collection. If you are interested, a lot of the early books have pyramid theology and use local train schedules. Christmas was an occasion to give people Witness books. Happy hunting. I would try major universities that research American religious history.75Janice (talk) 23:52, 2 July 2008 (UTC)75Janice75Janice (talk) 23:52, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Bcom 2003 Mumbai University syllabus

Where can I find the Mumbai University BCom syllabus for 2003? 05:08, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Mumbai University links to the university's website. If you can't find the syllabus on there, then perhaps you could email them. Itsmejudith (talk) 08:58, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

Characters troubled by visions of the future

I have a scenario in mind and I'm wondering if it has ever been portrayed in literature or film. In this scenario, a character is troubled by visions of nasty things happening to others in the future, and tries to do what he/she can to stop them from happening. Kind of like Minority Report, I guess, although without the law enforcement angle. If anyone can think of a film or novel in which such a scenario occurs, I'd be interested to hear about it. Please note, though, I'm primarily interested in highbrow literary fiction and art film, not hokey genre material. Many thanks. --Richardrj ^{talk email} 07:26, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

The Iliad, specifically the story of Cassandra is the archetypical case of trying to prevent prophecy. She saw the fall of Troy in visions, but was not believed. See Cassandra (metaphor) for different examples in literature, film and reality.

Less highbrow perhaps is Heroes season 1, which revolves around preventing the visions of Isaac Mendez. C mon (talk) 09:20, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

This is a pretty classic concept, really. You may want to check out articles on Precognition, Premonition, Vision (spirituality) and Precognitive dreams, and especially Category:Fictional characters with precognition, which will probably give you a pretty good idea of how common the idea is in fiction... well, actually, now that I look at the list more closely, the category is pretty heavily populated by comic book characters, which is a pretty clear case of systemic bias, but the concept has certainly popped up in all sorts of movies and books as well. (Another recent Dick adaptation, Next, dealt with precognition as well.) It's also a plot device in countless video games. -- Captain Disdain (talk) 10:34, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Maybe not quite on target, but the main character in Twelve Monkeys time-travels from the future to try to prevent the release of a deadly virus in our present/his past. Gandalf61 (talk) 10:37, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

I knew it, edit conflict but anyway, I guess the terms are premonition or precognition, even second sight (cassandra etc) or flash forward (eg tv series Lost) or even prolepsis,and I guess there are several examples in run of the mill horror movies, tv programmes etc but trying to think of good quality examples... Not quite on the mark(er) but I never miss the opportunity to mention the brilliant and poetic La Jetée. What is the nature of present and past anyway? And are they separate from memory and perception? Not all cultures have the same orientation in time as we do in the west: the Maori word for the past means front, whats in front of you, because it can be seen. The word for the future, muri, means behind, because its unseen. Kurt Vonnegut's "Slaughterhouse-Five", Martin Amis' novel "Times Arrow" play with the flow of time, so does Brian Aldiss novel "An Age" (pub as "Cryptozoic" in US) but they aren't really what you are after. Try "He can look ahead. See what's coming. He can - prethink. Let's call it that. He can see into the future. Probably he doesn't perceive it as the future." "No," Anita said thoughtfully. "It would seem like the present. He has a broader present. But his present lies ahead, not back. Our present is related to the past Only the past is certain, to us. To him, the future is certain. And he probably doesn't remember the past, any more than any animal remembers what happened." The Golden Man, by Philip K. Dick. Mhicaoidh (talk) 10:59, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Recent good fiction: "About Grace" Anthony Doerr sounds relevant and of course 'The Time Traveler's Wife" Audrey Niffenegger may or may not count!. Mhicaoidh (talk) 11:28, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Dune. Plasticup ^T/C 11:58, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

The compelling movie Miracle Mile uses a pay phone as the source of the premonition. --Sean 15:39, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

The Dead Zone? APL (talk) 20:44, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Perhaps an episode of Seeing Things? I had no idea the series had gone on that long or been seen in so many countries. Matt Deres (talk) 15:47, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

There's also another version of this archetype that's arguably just as common (or even more so) than the Cassandra variant: the self-fulfilling prophecy: where someone makes a prophecy, and people try to act on it to avoid it (or try to act on it to make it happen), only to have those very action be the thing that makes the prophecy come true. I.e., the prophecy causes itself. Examples abound, but most famously there is Oedipus, Macbeth, and my personal favorite is the myth of the death of Baldr in Norse mythology. Also: Professor Trelawneys vision in Harry Potter, which causes Voldemort to go after young Harry, which in turn causes his (first) downfall. They're everywhere! --Oskar 09:17, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

Kosher law

If say a Jew were to eat a pork flavored product which didn't have any pork in it, merely pork flavourings; for example, smoky bacon crisps, would they be breaking kosher law? I can't see how if there's no trace of pork and merely e-numbers --Thanks, Hadseys 10:33, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

All these E numbers come from somewhere, and that somewhere can be non-kosher. So it depends. It seems that artificial flavourings are subject to kosher certification: Here. Fribbler (talk) 10:38, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

If there is nothing which is not kosher in the product, there is no reason why not to eat it. In fact the Talmud (Hullin 109b) states that if one wants to eat something with the taste of pork, one can eat the brain of the shibutta fish which has such a taste. Simonschaim (talk) 12:48, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

In Wikipedese that's a shibuta. Fish brains! Yummy!--Shantavira|^{feed me} 13:06, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Eat them up, yum! -- Coneslayer (talk) 17:14, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Bacos are so far from real bacon that they're actually Kosher, I believe. -- Mwalcoff (talk) 23:52, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Falkland Islands Defence Force

In the wikipedia article about the Falkland Islands the Falkland Islands Defence Force is mentioned as being fully funded by the Islands government and totally made up of volunteers from the Island. Does this mean they are a separate force from the British military presence on the island? And if so, are they being commanded by the Islands government, the governor or the British military Commander? Any help on these questions would be much appreciated! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.101.134.43 (talk) 13:03, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

The Falkland Islands Defence Force is certainly a separate force and is commanded by its senior officer, ultimately controlled by the islands' Governor, who is advised by the Executive Council. Xn4 21:26, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

Strange Comic

Could someone inform me as to what comic this section is from? It's bamboozling me. Appreciated.

http://img108.imageshack.us/my.php?image=b3th9.png —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.110.191.16 (talk) 18:28, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Looks like Dream from The Sandman. --Fastfission (talk) 19:46, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Gun Politics in Israel

If I am a resident in Israel, am I allowed to carry a gun, like concealed carry? I couldn't find an article here about it. Spencer^T♦C 19:53, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

yes, but you need a permit - eg search 'gun law israel'87.102.86.73 (talk) 19:56, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Grampians

Are the Grampians really 1700 km2? They seem much larger. 124.168.41.16 (talk) 23:10, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Yes, I believe that's the area of the national park. The elevation changes can make them seem larger than they actually are. Spencer^T♦C 23:46, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

States

Why are the two Dakotas, the two Virginias, and the two Carolinas considered separate states? 124.168.41.16 (talk) 23:10, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

That's just the name of the state. The state can take the name of the region, for example The Dakotas is the region, but the North and South parts of the region are separate states. Same with The Carolinas. However, Virginia and West Virginia were once one big state, but in 1861, the Western part split and became West Virginia. See West_Virginia#Separation_from_Virginia for more about that. I hope this helps. Spencer^T♦C 23:51, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

According to our articles, there was originally a united Province of Carolina, but it was divided in the early 18th century, presumably for ease of administration. Dakota Territory was admitted to the union as two separate states for reasons of distance and perhaps to give the Republicans two extra seats in the Senate. West Virginia split from Virginia during the Civil War over the secession issue. -- Mwalcoff (talk) 00:00, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

July 3

Why do some athletes talk in third person

"X" has to do what's best for "x." I've heard it a number of times, and it makes little sense. I thought about asking in Languages, but decided over here was better, because it just doesn't sound normal.

I'm not saying these people suffer some mental disorder - though I guess it culd be the sign of one? But, there must be some psychological reason. Delusions of grandeur maybe, where the person thinks he's so important that he needs to say some things as though he's writing a press release? Or, is it simply trying to show false modesty. Perhaps they think, "If I say 'I' all the time, people will think I'm selfish, nd there's no 'I' in team. So, I'll go by my actual name when I talk."209.244.187.155 (talk) 01:33, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

It is just a way of speaking. It is no different than using "we" instead of "I" when speaking (often referred to as the "royal we"). If you are person who is written about often, you will see your name a lot in phrases such as, "Kainaw said that..." or "Kainaw is going to..." After reading those phrases over and over, it is not surprising that some people will begin speaking the same way. -- kainaw™ 01:58, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

Speaking about one's self in the third person may be "just a way of speaking" but it's not common. I don't buy your proposed explanation whatsoever—politicians don't talk like that despite being quoted constantly. (That is, not including Bob Dole, who was lampooned for speaking about himself in the third person.) --98.217.8.46 (talk) 02:01, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

It's probably just a form of "tough guy" tradition. Ever see Bull Durham? One baseball player explains to another how to talk to the press: "Learn your clichés. Study them. Know them. They're your friends. Write this down. 'We gotta play 'em one day at a time.'" "Boring." "Of course. That's the point. 'I'm just happy to be here and hope I can help the ballclub.'" "Jesus." "Write, write -- 'I just wanta give it my best shot and, Good Lord willing, things'll work out." --98.217.8.46 (talk) 02:00, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

Note that while looking into Bob Dole, I found that referring to yourself in the third person repeatedly has a name: Illeism. Weird. --98.217.8.46 (talk) 02:04, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

Some interviewers do the same thing. David Frost was notorious for it. At the end of a 20-minute interview with Joe Bloggs, he'd round it off with a question like "So, what does the future hold in store for Joe Bloggs?", as if he were asking a third party. I always yearned to become famous enough to be interviewed by him, just so that when he asked me this question, I could ejaculate "Well, why don't you bloody well go and ask him!". Btw, I'd argue that it's quite different from using the royal plural ("we are not amused"), which I see has latterly been renamed Majestic plural. That is an example of the use of the first person plural, whereas this question is about the use of the third person singular. -- JackofOz (talk) 02:15, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

Does it originate with psychology techniques? Channel jumping one night, I saw people (possibly therapists) talking to a young female with her in the third person and sometimes she answered that way or in the first. Ewwwish. Didn't stay to find out more. Julia Rossi (talk) 02:30, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

Is it because they understand that they are a brand name? Itsmejudith (talk) 10:32, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

Also odd is I've encountered academic papers that are coauthored by two people, when they cite a previous paper the pair coauthored they say "X and Y said Z" rather than "We said Z". When I asked one of the authors he said it was just some tradition he'd picked up.--droptone (talk) 12:17, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

That's sounds dreadful but it is also difficult to know how to word it if you coauthor a paper and want to refer to previous work that one of you did with different coauthors. You end up with locutions like "one of the present coauthors, Smith, in a paper written together with Patel and Johnson, argued that....". Itsmejudith (talk) 16:06, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

I may've been unclear. It was Smith and Johnson (for example) referring to another paper written by, the same, Smith and Johnson.--droptone (talk) 19:54, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

It's somewhat traditional to use passive voice and avoid any first person mentions in scientific papers. (Why? I'm not sure, but I think it has to do with the fact that science is supposed to be observer independent.) Thus you'll see the third person mentions of previous papers instead of using the first person pronouns, as there is no way to passive voice it. I think there is some truth in Itsmejudith's remarks too - while saying "we" may work with papers by just Smith & Johnson, how do you handle the case later in the paper when referencing Smith, Johnson & Patel? Or how about Smith and Patel (without Johnson)? For consistency sake, it makes sense to refer to all authors in the third person. (For what it's worth, in the context of scientific papers, I find third person/passive voice neither odd nor dreadful, and actually find first person pronouns harsh and jarring.) -- 128.104.112.147 (talk) 01:36, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

I would say speaking in the third person is a method of being distinct and attracting attention. One would expect a speaker to use "I", so not doing so would be out-of-the-ordinary. --Bowlhover (talk) 16:24, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

Artist Unknown

I have a painting signed by A. Bouvier and i cannot locate said artist on Wikipedia,google,ect. any help ? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bigskimarche (talk • contribs) 03:35, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

Augustus Jules Bouvier? Gwinva (talk) 03:43, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

+ there's also Armand Bouvier, Andre Bouvier, Arthur Bouvier and Agnes Rose Bouvier. Gwinva (talk) 04:02, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

Youth Perception of Human Security in Africa

Bold text —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.100.68.103 (talk) 09:38, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

Do you mean how do young people perceive human security in Africa? If so, are you interested in the views of African young people or young people in other parts of the world? Itsmejudith (talk) 16:02, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

Or perceptions vis-a-vis realities?--Wetman (talk) 20:13, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

China Government

Can China be considered both a republic and a communistic society? If so, is China more of a Communis society than a republic? tyvm DancingRobotek9 (talk) 19:31, 3 July 2008 (UTC)(UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by DancingRobotek9 (talk • contribs) 19:16, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

You may be confusing the terms republic and democracy. --Cookatoo.ergo.ZooM (talk) 19:38, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

no, i ment republic because China is known as the "People's Republic of China" and i was wondering if china was actually considered a republic rather than a communist society DancingRobotek9 (talk) 21:02, 3 July 2008 (UTC)—Preceding unsigned comment added by DancingRobotek9 (talk • contribs) 21:01, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

Republic means that it is not a monarchy (or a theocracy). It has no bearing on any political ideology of parties in government or any basic credo of the populace at large. The UK, e.g., is NOT a republic. --Cookatoo.ergo.ZooM (talk) 21:09, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

One thing is the organization and classification of a national government, its laws and economic theory, but another thing is the society of a country. To mix the two is very unwise. Flamarande (talk) 21:37, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

(1) Yes. (2) No. See Republic and Communism. Xn4 21:16, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

Can we have the diagram again? Please? 86.141.89.124 (talk) 00:35, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

Found it!

The democracy/republic chart

	Republics	Monarchies
Democratic	Italy, USA	Canada, Netherlands
Not democratic	Cuba, Turkmenistan	Saudi Arabia, Nepal

Mwalcoff 02:43, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

From the version here, although it's been posted several times. 86.141.89.124 (talk) 00:57, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

Free Medical Treatment in UK?

Does the UK give full free medical treatment to everybody? regardless of their condition? i was looking up some stuff about the NHS in Europe, and they said stuff about free treatment.

For example, if a person ended up in a horrible automobile accident, would the government pay for his surgeries and his treatments? cuz i know that surgeries and the stuff the hospital has to do to treat this guy could costs hundreds of thousands of dollars.

If it is free treatment, where does the money come from?

Thanks [: —Preceding unsigned comment added by RedHoTriCE (talk • contribs) 19:45, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

There is an article about this topic: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Healthcare_in_the_United_Kingdom u should search for topics before asking DancingRobotek9 (talk) 20:40, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

the reason i asked this question is because i heard from a friend who lived in the UK. I showed him that wikipedia article, and he claimed that he's known people who have gone through multiple surgeries because he was hit by a car. He lived, and didnt pay anything. Thats quite a lot of money, and im pretty sure general taxes dont cover mulitple surgeries for everybody. my question was to see if anybody knew exactly what was going on with the health care rule, because people get into automobile accidents everyday. if the government has to completely cover MRIs and mulitple surgeries every day, that cant be covered by "general taxation" (as the wikipedia page states) can it? I dont appreciate the cynical answer, DancingRobotek9. Obviously it is easier to type "UK health care" into the search bar than to log in and type up the question. —Preceding unsigned comment added by RedHoTriCE (talk • contribs) 20:56, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

The UK's National Health Service is, in essence, a lot like a big US HMO, albeit with no caps and no copay. Treatment is allocated strictly according to clinical need (where comparative clinical need is assessed using hideously complex and sometimes rather handwavey criteria). You never "max out" in the way you can in the US system. But the NHS has a finite budget; so the trusts and hospitals and departments that comprise it all have finite budgets. So if you need treatment they put you on a queue (which queue depends partially on your prognosis and the severity of your condition). Patients are removed from the queue and treated according to the available resources; sometimes the wait is too long and contributes to the patient's death. For stuff that's important but not time-critical (like hip replacement) you can wait a long time (months and months). Like all healthcare systems, treatment is rationed because resources are finite - but those resources are pooled and allocated on a clinical basis. Contrary to what many people believe, the UK spends less per capita on healthcare than the US does, and Britons live longer. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 21:14, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

To clarify that, the UK government spends less per capita on healthcare than the US government does. That ignores the amount spent by US corporations and private citizens. Algebraist 21:18, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

It's a greater disparity than I thought - according to the 2002 World Bank statistics shown here, US spend (indeed, government and private) was USD 4,271 per person per year, and the UK's (again government and private, although government is a much higher proportion) was USD 1,675 -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 21:35, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

As to "everybody", the answer is "no". British residents (essentially those who are part of the tax/ni system, whether they actually pay in or not) are eligible (I'm pretty sure British citizens who live abroad are not, and can't jet in from abroad and get expensive procedures). EU/EEA citizens (and residents too, I think) get treatment via the EHIC scheme if they fall ill when visiting the UK (but can't travel to the UK to seek treatment). Everyone else has to pay full price (but they won't deny treatment for urgent conditions based on inability to pay). -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 21:23, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

Additionally you may be interested in reading around QUALYs (quality of life years) and how NICE (National Institut of Clinical Excellent) use them. There are far more treatments available in the wider-healthcare sector than within the nhs. As you note it is - by and large - free at the point of entry. It is not free in all circumstances, and there are limiations of what is and isn't covered, but for the majority of people who are UK residents the treatment is covered by the state (which obviously is funded by the people). Contrary to a mildly popular myth National Insurance contributions are not kept separate and used purely for the nhs, the funding for the nhs comes from the central budget and its budget is not set by the amount brought in from National Insurance contributions. I think it may be Malaysia or Sri Lanka that have the medical-system funding setup that many nations are interested in copying/implementing - that is a hybrid of public (state) and private (individual) funding using quite a clever system (low-cost you pay for yourself, higher cost is state covered, you are required to put money into a pot and you can use that pot to pay for treatment but for high-cost surgery the government pay most/all of it - it's a bit complicated but supposedly works well). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.221.133.226 (talk) 10:13, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

To go back to the example in the original post, yes if you are a British citizen and you are involved in a serious vehicle accident all your treatment will be free. And emergency care is of good quality, no waiting if your symptoms are urgent. While you are in hospital you receive free care and meals, although the meals are usually not of excellent quality. If you had facial injuries you would be entitled to plastic surgery to repair them, although the final stages might not be offered, or there might be a long delay. Once out of hospital you would start to pay a fixed prescription charge for each item of medication. The main gaps in the free health coverage are in dental care and eye care. We pay from our taxes. Income tax and national insurance contributions are the ones people whinge about most, but everyone also pays VAT. Itsmejudith (talk) 15:35, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

Civil War Myths?

I remember back in one of my history classes, my teacher told me something like the North new the coordinates of the Southern troops for the Battle of Antietam because the North found a discarded cigar box with a map of the South's war plans wrapped around it. Now, I know my memory may have compromised the details, but I am sure there was some strange story about a discarded cigar box. Has anyone ever heard this story? Is it true or just a myth? I also remember something about a different battle started over a pair of shoes. Any validity to that? Thanks!--El aprendelenguas (talk) 20:49, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

I don't nothing about a war beginning over a pair of shoes but your teacher was almost assuredly talking about the Special Order 191. Flamarande (talk) 21:31, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

The 'shoe' battle is almost certainly Gettysburg. The Confederate infantry suposedly marched into the town of Gettysburg itself in search of a shoe factory, thus beginning one of the great battles of the Civil War. This is now considered to be a myth, first appearing in the memoirs of Henry Heth. Emma Dashwood (talk) 22:23, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

Robert E. Lee issued Special Order 191 for troop mevements shortly before the Battle of Antietam[6] September 9, 1862. It stated that he was dividing his army into three pieces, gave their routes of travel and timing of attacks. It was found 10 a.m. on September 13, 1862 by Union soldiers, in an envelope wrapped around 3 cigars. Soon it was in the hands of Union General George B. McClellan, and was of material help in the battle. Confederate General D.H. Hill was the only man known to smoke cigars and who might have had access to the orders. Hill said he never received the orders. Another theory is that an adjutant of Lee left them to be found as an act of treason. McClellan did not fully exploit this militaryt intelligence because he suspected it was a trick. The Wikipedia article on Special Order 191 also speculates the found orders might have been a copy sent to Hill by Thomas J. Jackson, butthat does not squarewith the orders being signed by Robert H. Chilton, Lee's adjutant. Edison (talk) 14:30, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

Provinces of Iran

Which provinces of Iran are Azeri, Arab, Turkmen and Baloch? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.64.53.53 (talk) 01:23, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

Perhaps you are looking for Azeri, Iranian Arabs, Turkmen, and Baloch. --omnipotence407 (talk) 03:58, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

Random spot in the world

If I wanted to pick a random spot in the world, could I just pick a random number between -90 and 90 for latitude and -180 to 180 for longitude? Or would that be biased in favor of polar latitudes? -- Mwalcoff (talk) 01:59, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

Yes, the result of your procedure would be biased. The right way to generate a uniform distribution in polar coordiantes (that is, on the surface of a sphere in 3 dimensions) is to generate a uniform distibution between -1 and 1 of the cosine of $\phi +\pi /2$, where $\phi$ is latitude; and to generate an independent uniform distribution between 0 and $2\pi$ of the longitude. In other words, you take a random number between -1 and 1; take arc-cosine of it (the result should be between 0 and $\pi$); subtract $\pi /2$; and convert to degrees. That's your latitude. Next you take another random number between 0 and $2\pi$, and convert to degrees. That's your longitude. Enjoy ;) --Dr Dima (talk) 03:00, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

By the way, there is Math Reference Desk where this question would have been appropriate. --Anonymous, 05:07 UTC, July 4, 2008.

I don't think so. It was formulated as a general interest / geography question, so it's probably more at home here. --Dr Dima (talk) 05:56, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

Doctor Dolittle's method was to open an atlas with his eyes shut and stick a pin into a random page. But perhaps that's biassed towards regions which have larger scale maps? Xn4 21:06, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

Have a globe levitate in the air in front of you. While blindfolded, spin it several different ways until you don't know which way "north" is facing. Then jab your finger somewhere on its surface. Wrad (talk) 21:10, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

You can do that with a floor fan that can blow upwards and an inflatable globe. Julia Rossi (talk) 09:16, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

July 4

Anarchist studies

I am currently writing a large amount of coursework on the subject "Do Anarchists Demand The Impossible?". I have already invested in 3 very useful books on the subject, but am now in want of a book by Errico Malatesta called At The Café. As a sixth form student, I am becoming more irritated by the amount of money I would have to spend to obtain all these books. So my question is this: Are there resources online that can provide me with similar information, or maybe something that can tell me whether the book I want can be found in a library? Any answers would be greatly appreciated. Alienpmk (talk) 08:45, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

Look up the ISBN (in this case ISBN 978-1904491064), go to Special:BookSources and you can check what libraries (or other free resources) have the book you're looking for. 194.171.56.13 (talk) 10:41, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

WorldCat is what I use to find out where books are kept in what libraries. Not sure of its international coverage, though. --98.217.8.46 (talk) 18:38, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

Most libraries in the UK have online catalogues you can search for books, and your library system will usually allow for books in the system to be sent to your local library cheaply or for free. It can even be worth asking if your library can get a book in for you; sometimes you'd be surprised. A quick google will generally turn up your local library catalogue. I'd do it for you, but I don't know which county you're in. Failing that, if there's a university library near you, you might want to look into accessing that. You usually can't search their library catalogue without being granted access, but a university with a few decent relevant departments will usually have the books you need. 86.141.89.124 (talk) 00:28, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

Plato's The Republic: Which Version?

I have recently developed an interest in Platonism and would like to read some of his works. Which translated version of The Republic, (which is where my interest mainly lies for the moment), is considered to be the best according to both readers and scholars? —Preceding unsigned comment added by RSFRuairi (talk • contribs) 16:34, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

I believe that Allan Bloom's translation is considered quite good. GreatManTheory (talk) 09:27, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

Russian culture painting

I'm trying to find an article on 'russian painting' specifically pre-communist stuff , possibly stuff that fits into the category 'Romanticism'.

I'm thinking of the type of painting that has an almost 'school book' style in comparison to western artists, eg

also the stylised works that fall into the 'golden age of illustration' category by Ivan Bilibin seem similar.

Is there a name for this style of work, links to get me started, books maybe etc.

Thanks.87.102.86.73 (talk) 20:45, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

Some of it's Russian Symbolism. See also Peredvizhniki and Mir iskusstva. Xn4 20:55, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

The Peredvizhniki link is useful, maybe there's no real link between the paintings I'm picking.. A 'super-real' (cartoonish) or 'kitsch' style eg .. Am I just picking Chocolate box art?87.102.86.73 (talk) 21:12, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

I shouldn't say so. 'Chocolate box art' isn't really a term in art, it lacks a clear meaning. It's often used to mean 'bland and inoffensive' with a suggestion of 'third rate', but very little Russian art is bland, and the pictures you've linked are good. I've always liked Nesterov's Vision of the Young Bartholomew. Xn4 21:47, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

Yes, I've never seen a saint portrayed like that anywhere else

Also the colour does seem very clear in general (and a lot more primary)... good restorations? (or no industrial revolution?) I'm sure post medieval western art is a lot less colourful?87.102.86.73 (talk) 23:36, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

Beauty in the eye of the beholder?

Err, very strange question. . . What do woman (and gay men) see in guys? (I think lesbians have very good taste. haha) So what is so attractive about the average man? --S.dedalus (talk) 23:40, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

Considering how you would go about answering the mirror question (what is so attractive about the average woman?) might be a useful exercise. Letting us know some of your answers to that might help us answer what it is you want to know. Right now, I'm struggling to work out what you're trying to find out :/ Apart from taste (sociology), preference, sexual drive, instinct, evolution, I don't really know what you're driving towards. Did you want a discussion of secondary sexual characteristics? Of fetishes? 86.141.89.124 (talk) 00:18, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

It's easy to see this guy’s hot. What about the ordinary Joe on the street?

(after ec. (We were thinking so much alike, I had to do this one, too.) The same things that men and lesbians see in women, though I am sure that "seeing" is not really what most of it is about. It is hard programming, for a start. After that, it is cultural, or even perhaps familial, in that what we find attractive in others is what we were taught from day 1 to find attractive. I am sure you are not looking for a list of physical attributes, or are you? ៛ Bielle (talk) 00:22, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

Bielle and the anon contributor have already touched on most of what I was thinking. Just to sympathize with the OP for a bit, it seems that Western culture has decided that young women are physically more attractive than any other kind of person, which is why it's a legitimate question to ask how men could be attractive at all. I don't know how we got to this point; maybe it's an off-shoot of the sexism that says women aren't good for anything besides looking good. To examine a time when young boys were the hot item, check out Athenian pederasty. Matt Deres (talk) 00:41, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

Sorry, I was a bit confusing there! Obviously there is a specific evolutionary reason for the sexes to find things attractive about each other. However I get the imprison that men and women choose their romantic interests in very different ways. Not being female myself, I find it hard to judge. I was hoping someone might enlighten me there. --S.dedalus (talk) 01:15, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

Ah, so rather than wanting to know what's so attractive about the average man, you want to know what is particularly attractive about the male romantic interests women and gay men choose? Or have I missed the point? 86.141.89.124 (talk) 01:21, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

Well, I think that if you could find an “average” woman (physically and mentally) ~85% of (sexually mature) guys would be at least somewhat attracted to her. If a similar “average man” could be found would this not be so for woman? And if yes/no, why? --S.dedalus (talk) 01:29, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

From When Harry Met Sally:

“Harry: No, what I'm saying is they all want to have sex with you.

Sally: They do not.

Harry: Do too.

Sally: How do you know?

Harry: Because no man can be friends with a woman that he finds attractive. He always wants to have sex with her.

Sally: So you're saying that a man can be friends with a woman he finds unattractive?

Harry: No, you pretty much want to nail 'em too.”

See what I mean. :) --S.dedalus (talk) 01:47, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

July 5

Latin text

Some years ago, I took GCSE Latin and I remember studying a text called (I think) Tres Feminas. It contained descriptions of three women, two of whom I barely remember. One of them was an old lady (perhaps the writer's grandmother or aunt?) who was a patron of the arts and very much the 'wild rich old lady' stereotype, in a positive way. I think the text was in the form of a letter. Can anyone help find this text, or more information on it? I've searched the title as I remember it, but I'm not having any luck. 86.141.89.124 (talk) 02:27, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

Assuming the title is "Tres Feminae", is it this letter by Pliny? Adam Bishop (talk) 05:16, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

Do animals and insects ponder existence?

My guess is no. Perhaps this shows the futility and meaningless pursuit of trying to figure it out at all. Because if we think we've discovered the whole ball of wax (math, how the universe began, studying consciousness, etc.), it may turn out that we're no more incisive than a gnat!--Sam Science (talk) 08:55, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

My guess is that if too many of them insects I mean, do food sharing and trading[7], honey bees [8], termites[9] they may develop groups that find themselves with free time to ponder. What then? Julia Rossi (talk) 09:06, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

Hitler condemned as war criminal?

Could Hitler been condemned as war criminal? If he was not condemned, is it right to suppose he could be inocent? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.59.92.109 (talk) 11:25, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

I'm not quite sure what you're asking here. Hitler was condemned as a war criminal, repeatedly. He was certainly not innocent.--NeoNerd 11:47, 5 July 2008 (UTC)