Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Enforcement: Difference between revisions
EdJohnston (talk | contribs) →Wuerzele: Closed without action for now. Can be reopened by any party if Wuerzele returns to active editing and they still have concerns |
No edit summary |
||
Line 465: | Line 465: | ||
* I would like to see a response to Simon's terms of mentorship; otherwise I support The Wordsmith's idea. I hate to issue a TB unless the user is a complete basket case with wanton disregard for the community. --[[User:Laser_brain|<font color="purple">'''Laser brain'''</font>]] [[User_talk:Laser_brain|<font color="purple">(talk)</font>]] 00:56, 6 July 2016 (UTC) |
* I would like to see a response to Simon's terms of mentorship; otherwise I support The Wordsmith's idea. I hate to issue a TB unless the user is a complete basket case with wanton disregard for the community. --[[User:Laser_brain|<font color="purple">'''Laser brain'''</font>]] [[User_talk:Laser_brain|<font color="purple">(talk)</font>]] 00:56, 6 July 2016 (UTC) |
||
{{hab}} |
{{hab}} |
||
==Arbitration enforcement action appeal by Ranze== |
|||
<small>''Procedural notes: The rules governing arbitration enforcement appeals are found [[Wikipedia:Arbitration_Committee/Procedures#Enforcement|here]]. According to the procedures, a "clear, substantial, and active consensus of uninvolved editors" is required to overturn an arbitration enforcement action. <p>To help determine any such consensus, involved editors may make brief statements in separate sections but should not edit the section for discussion among uninvolved editors. Editors are normally considered involved if they are in a current dispute with the sanctioning or sanctioned editor, or have taken part in disputes (if any) related to the contested enforcement action. Administrators having taken administrative actions are not normally considered involved for this reason alone (see [[WP:UNINVOLVED]]).''</small> |
|||
; Appealing user : {{userlinks|Ranze}} – [[User:Ranze|Ranze]] ([[User talk:Ranze|talk]]) 06:41, 9 July 2016 (UTC) |
|||
; Sanction being appealed : [[Special:Diff/660280525|1 May 2015 Gamergate topic ban]]: |
|||
:I am imposing for an indefinite period the standard Gamergate topic ban, which prohibits you from editing "All edits about, and all pages related to, (a) GamerGate, (b) any gender-related dispute or controversy, (c) people associated with (a) or (b), all broadly construed." |
|||
Discussion related to (not sure about resulting in) this sanction was a 2 week overall block I received by {{ping|EdJohnston}} earlier the same day |
|||
:[[special:diff/660255380]] and [[Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Enforcement/Archive171#Ranze]] |
|||
This was for allegedly violating a topic ban I received from Gamaliel on April 4: |
|||
:[[special:diff/654927319]] |
|||
The cited reasons were redirecting [[Milo Y]] to [[Milo Yiannopoulous]] (presumably because he wrote some articles about Gamergate, as if that's all he does...) and [[special:diff/659243811]] where I admittedly did include information about the Calgary Expo expelling a group of women who had gamergate related information. |
|||
The reason I thought that was acceptable was because this was in no way connected to Zoe Quinn, which was the original concern of this whole GG topic ban thing. |
|||
According to [[Wikipedia:General sanctions/Gamergate]] there are no general Gamergate sanctions anymore they are superceded by specific ArbCom sanctions. {{ping|HJ Mitchell}} classified these as "obsolete" on 17 November 2015. It was demoted to historical status on 29 January 2015. So basically, when Gamaliel placed these sanctions on my in 2015 on April 4 / May 1, I did not take them seriously at the time because I was under the impression that Gamergate sanctions did not exist and he was trying to apply an undated policy. |
|||
In the message left to me, Gamliel claimed that "This sanction is imposed in my capacity as an uninvolved administrator under the authority of the Arbitration Committee's decision" linking to [[Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/GamerGate#Final_decision]]. The link given was not very specific and I was looking at the wrong section, got confused, and didn't get the further feedback I requested to explain the justification. I mostly just shrugged it off and strove not to edit the topic, go watch a bunch of TV, renew my love for pro wrestling, etc. |
|||
I'd like to know if such broad restrictions are still justified. I've left the Zoe Quinn article alone and that was the crux of what led up to this. Should I have such harsh and broad sanctions when I've stayed away and not reintroduced the pseudonym? |
|||
For those interested in what preceded the April 4 intervention by Gamaliel I believe that is covered beginning at [[Talk:Zoë_Quinn/Archive_2#Gamergate_Harassment_sub-section_under_Career]]. |
|||
It's coming back now... what had happened was on the talk page, I used [[template:cite tweet]] and the number of a tweet made by an account verified by reliable sources to belong to her. I introduced the tweet for discussion for its use as a potential source in the article, regarding the comments the tweet made about a prior career. |
|||
Given that what I posted has been redacted, I can't refresh my memory on the specific phrasing, though I expect admins have access to the redacted diffs to do so. |
|||
My thoughts on the potential inclusion of the restraining order (a primary source legal document) was that secondary sources (maybe also Breitbart) had brought up this restraining order. [[WP:BLPPRIMARY]] does allow for the referencing of primary sources if they support details established as notable by secondary sources so I didn't understand the problem with doing this. |
|||
I would very much like to make amends for anything I did wrong, if I did, but my requests for explanations about the specifics of it never got answered in detail enough for me to understand it, so I would like the opportunity to have this better explained to me so I can understand the rules I broke, apologize for doing so, and in knowing better the specifics, better avoid doing so in the future. [[User:Ranze|Ranze]] ([[User talk:Ranze|talk]]) 06:41, 9 July 2016 (UTC) |
|||
; Administrator imposing the sanction : {{admin|Gamaliel}} |
|||
; Notification of that administrator : ''The appealing editor is asked to notify the administrator who made the enforcement action of this appeal, and then to replace this text with a [[WP:DIFF|diff]] of that notification. The appeal may not be processed otherwise. If a block is appealed, the editor moving the appeal to this board should make the notification.'' |
|||
===Statement by Ranze=== |
|||
Best-case scenario I would like the sanction lifted altogether. Next-best, I would like it to be modified to only apply to Gamergate only, as in (a) but not (b) because "any gender-related dispute" is so vague that people can try to make anything relating to people seem like it falls under that. |
|||
I pinged Gamaliel but then realized on checking page the user is listed as retired so I would require a different administrator to modify or remove it. |
|||
Since it's been 14 months since this was put in place my memories on what led up to it aren't the clearest. As best I can recall I had brought up on Zoe Quinn's talk page a Breitbart article which I wanted to include as a reference which mentioned a modeling pseudonym, and this was construed as some kind of attack on her. |
|||
===Statement by Gamaliel=== |
|||
===Statement by (involved editor 1)=== |
|||
===Statement by (involved editor 2)=== |
|||
===Discussion among uninvolved editors about the appeal by Ranze === |
|||
===Result of the appeal by Ranze=== |
|||
:''This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.'' |
|||
<!-- When closing this request (once there is a consensus) use {{hat|Result}} / {{hab}} if at AE, or an archive/discussion box template if on AN, inform the user on their talk page and note it in the discretionary sanctions log below where their sanctions is logged. --> |
|||
* |
Revision as of 06:41, 9 July 2016
For appeals: create a new section and use the template {{Arbitration enforcement appeal}}
See also: Logged AE sanctions
Important information Please use this page only to:
For all other problems, including content disagreements or the enforcement of community-imposed sanctions, please use the other fora described in the dispute resolution process. To appeal Arbitration Committee decisions, please use the clarification and amendment noticeboard. Only autoconfirmed users may file enforcement requests here; requests filed by IPs or accounts less than four days old or with less than 10 edits will be removed. All users are welcome to comment on requests except where doing so would violate an active restriction (such as an extended-confirmed restriction). If you make an enforcement request or comment on a request, your own conduct may be examined as well, and you may be sanctioned for it. Enforcement requests and statements in response to them may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator. (Word Count Tool) Statements must be made in separate sections. Non-compliant contributions may be removed or shortened by administrators. Disruptive contributions such as personal attacks, or groundless or vexatious complaints, may result in blocks or other sanctions. To make an enforcement request, click on the link above this box and supply all required information. Incomplete requests may be ignored. Requests reporting diffs older than one week may be declined as stale. To appeal a contentious topic restriction or other enforcement decision, please create a new section and use the template {{Arbitration enforcement appeal}}.
|
Debresser
Jerusalem is placed under the following page-level restriction: As the results of Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Jerusalem regarding the article's lead represent the community's consensus at a well-attended discussion, a new request for comments must be undertaken and reach consensus prior to any changes being made to the article's lead section. This restriction does not in any way prohibit filing such an RfC, only requires that one be filed prior to such changes. Seraphimblade Talk to me 13:23, 4 July 2016 (UTC) |
---|
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it. |
Request concerning Debresser
There was a binding RFC on claims to Jerusalem being capital of Israel and Palestine and its location that was mandated by the Arbitration Committee (Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Jerusalem). That RFC resulted in the material currently in the lead of the Jerusalem article and per the Arbitration Committee is binding for three years. A user added material to the lead that violated that RFC, was reverted, which was also reverted. This was prior to any talk page discussion. I reverted that final revert and opened a talk page section detailing why (here, with the user I had reverted agreeing that the material shouldnt be included. Debresser then ignores the binding RFC and re-reverts, writing in the talk page Sourced, relevant, neutrally worded. The Rfc is expiring. The Rfc avoided the issue. All in all, ample reason to keep this addition. By the way, is there anything you think is wrong with the text, apart from bureaucratic arguments? When Debresser was reverted he or she posted to that users talkpage that their revert was "hothead revert" (here). Im not quite sure why this user thinks that binding means something other than all users have to follow this, but a reminder is surely in order.
Sorry Debresser, I guess an edit summary that says the RFC is expiring in a month, a comment on the talk page saying the edit should stand, a comment on the talk page of the person that reverted you calling their revert hotheaded, those things dont lead to the reasonable conclusion that a. you knew that you were prohibited from making said edit due to a binding revert, b. didnt care, and c. wouldnt self-revert. Silly me, where could I have possibly gotten that idea. You know what I find disruptive? Editors thinking the rules that apply to everybody else dont apply to them. Editors who knowingly revert against a consensus (thats what an RFC determines fyi). Basically, you. nableezy - 21:11, 8 June 2016 (UTC) @OID, I object to that edit on a number of grounds. However, the rule breaking is what is relevant on this board for a topic area that is covered under discretionary sanctions. Bright line rules only work if when somebody breaks them there isnt hand waving about well its only a technicality.
Discussion concerning DebresserStatements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator. Statement by DebresserNableezy seems to have a personal issue with me, because of the three editors who made this same edit,[2][3][4] I am the only one he is reporting. Nableezy has a huge POV in the I/P-conflict area, and we have conflicted on many articles already. He is now trying to fight his personal vendetta against me through the editors at WP:AE. I think that is fair reason to dismiss this report. Recently he engaged in an edit wat at Ancient synagogues in Palestine,[5][6][7] for which I decided not to report him. I am disappointed that he should repay me in this way. As to the actual matter at hand, I think Talk:Jerusalem#addition_to_the_lead is where the discussion is taking place, and where I have made my arguments, and have already stated, that I will not challenge the Rfc, which stands till July 9. At the same time, I think the issue will have to be re-visited in the near future, if only to avoid edit wars, blocks and a lot of bad blood, and the proposed edit is a very good NPOV candidate, summing up the issue well and along the same lines as the Rfc. In short, I think this report should boomerang back on Nableezy for the blatant personal motives behind this report, as well as his own recent WP:ARBPIA violations on "Ancient synagogues in Palestine".Debresser (talk) 23:36, 7 June 2016 (UTC) @EdJohnson The 9 July date comes from counting 3 years after the Rfc reached a conclusion. Debresser (talk) 09:51, 8 June 2016 (UTC) @Nableezy No need to say things you can't possibly know. I didn't refuse to revert. Somebody else reverted my edit even before I read your post on my talkpage. You continue with your bad faith assumptions, viewing Wikipedia as a battlefield, and me as the enemy. I find this attitude of yours disruptive. Debresser (talk) 21:01, 8 June 2016 (UTC) @GoldenRing I know it is not advised to antagonize editors here, but I don't understand what further "backing down" is needed, after I have already stated both here and on the talkpage that I will not challenge the status quo? You did read my posts here and on the talkpage, didn't you? Debresser (talk) 10:56, 10 June 2016 (UTC) @GoldenRing In view of the above, neither do I understand what you claim I am "doubling down on". Debresser (talk) 19:06, 12 June 2016 (UTC) @GoldenRing The Rfc specifically states that the consensus reached in it is binding only for a 3-year period. There is no rule on Wikipedia that an Rfc is needed to establish consensus, including to establish if there has been a change of consensus. A simple talkpage discussion, or even a bold edit that is accepted by the community, per definition can establish a new consensus. Debresser (talk) 11:35, 10 June 2016 (UTC) @User:Newyorkbrad Ha, ha. That's a good one. Debresser (talk) 04:35, 24 June 2016 (UTC) @Seraphimblade I don't think you are correct. See my comment above to GoldenRing, that there is no rule that an Rfc must be followed by an Rfc. Any way of establishing consensus is valid. The only exception could perhaps be, if such a stipulation were made specifically in the first Rfc, as in the current example provided by The Wordsmith below. Debresser (talk) 14:28, 28 June 2016 (UTC) Statement by OIDEd, dates from RFC's are always taken from the closure of an RFC as that is the point at which consensus has been determined by the closer. There would be no point in a fixed for 3 years consensus being valid until the actual consensus was determined. Saying that, it would still be up in a month anyway, so suggest close with trouts for everyone. Nableezy, if you have to rely on technical rule-breaking to revert an edit, rather than addressing the substance of the edit, it tends to get peoples backs up. 'Would this edit be controversial in a months time?' should be the question you ask yourself. Only in death does duty end (talk) 10:28, 8 June 2016 (UTC) Comment by GoldenRingI think Timoetheus has the right of it here; RfCs do not expire as such. Consensus can change, but the right way to go about changing consensus established in an RfC is a new RfC, not gung-ho edits to the article before the time limit established by the RfC has even expired and especially not in an article as contentious as this one. I suggest User:Debresser backs down and apologises and we let this lie; if not, sanctions are probably appropriate. GoldenRing (talk) 10:21, 10 June 2016 (UTC) @Debresser: Consensus is always binding. It doesn't expire. I read the three-year limit in that RfC as essentially the same as a moratorium on further discussion. But however you read it, the essential point is that it hasn't expired. Of course it doesn't take an RfC to establish consensus - but when one has been held, a change made without any discussion whatsoever doesn't cut it. Since you're doubling down on this, I can't see what else to recommend but sanctions. GoldenRing (talk) 21:35, 10 June 2016 (UTC) Statement by ZScarpiaConsensus-wise, where things will probably now turn ugly is that there are perceptions among some editors that consensus is established by carrying out a show of hands and that personal opinions, rather than the contents of reliable sources, establish what is factual and what is neutral. ← ZScarpia 17:35, 11 June 2016 (UTC) Statement by Sir JosephAn RFC is not consensus. Simple as that. It is a ruling that must be followed but when that ruling is sunsetted, then there is no obligation to follow that ruling. General Wiki rules and policies apply but you can't say that once there is a temporary RFC, or injunction, then any change requires a consensus or new RFC. Sir Joseph (talk) 15:46, 23 June 2016 (UTC) SDI think Debresser should be sanctioned based on this tit for tat edit:[8] --Supreme Deliciousness (talk) 02:50, 30 June 2016 (UTC) Statement by (username)Result concerning Debresser
|
Wuerzele
Closed without action for now. Any participant may reopen this at such time that User:Wuerzele returns to active editing if they still have concerns. EdJohnston (talk) 20:10, 7 July 2016 (UTC) |
---|
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it. |
Request concerning Wuerzele
Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Genetically_modified_organisms#Wuerzele_topic_banned Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Genetically_modified_organisms#Casting_aspersions Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Genetically_modified_organisms#Discretionary_Sanctions
Wuerzele was previously topic banned for extremely combative behavior, constantly sniping at editors, etc. while edit warring[13] The discretionary sanctions and the topic bans handed out by ArbCom specifically say all pages relating to genetically modified organisms, agricultural chemicals, etc. broadly construed including the companies that produce them. The discretionary sanctions were specifically reworded by ArbCom[14] to include the companies themselves to prevent prevent a case like this where topic banned editors still try to hang around related pages and continue additional behavior problems. In addition to the diff itself being in the topic ban page, the edit summary shows a return to the very sniping behavior that resulted in their ArbCom topic ban, "
EdJohnston, the WSJ source doesn't cover much detail, but other sources[17][18] regularly discuss things like seed choice, pesticide application, etc. as the core products of the decision making platform this company markets. There's really no way to say this doesn't relate to the topic ban in a broadly construed manner. The larger problem though is the continuation of sniping on multiple counts I mentioned above. Arbs specifically expanded the DS to company pages saying that they didn't need to expand the topic bans as DS would take care of editors that immediately jump into behavior that resulted in their bans again while testing the edge of their ban.[19] (read the arb opinions on topic bans) That's exactly what's happening here. Kingofaces43 (talk) 15:48, 23 June 2016 (UTC)
Discussion concerning WuerzeleStatements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator. Statement by WuerzeleStatement by TryptofishJust before I found this AE, I had seen the edit in question and reverted it. This is really a no-brainer: the page is about Monsanto, and it absolutely is within the scope of the topic ban. It's a pity, because Wuerzele has been doing a good job of obeying the sanctions until now. --Tryptofish (talk) 21:39, 22 June 2016 (UTC)
Please do not close this without a warning about civility and an instruction that companies are henceforth out of bounds. The fact that an editor has been inactive recently does not preclude a return shortly after this AE thread gets closed and archived. It would be a pity to have to come back here again because things had remained unclear. --Tryptofish (talk) 20:50, 4 July 2016 (UTC)
Statement by (username)Result concerning Wuerzele
|
Aaabbb11
Closing as the filing party filed this request in violation of a topic ban. If an editor who is not topic banned from the area wishes to request enforcement, they are welcome to do so. Filing party blocked 48 hours for topic ban violation. Seraphimblade Talk to me 15:22, 5 July 2016 (UTC) |
---|
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it. |
This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below. Request concerning Aaabbb11
(Disclaimer: I am current under a topic ban from 2011 over the FLG articles as documented here [21]. I have not edited WP in the years since, and currently I have no intention to edit the FLG articles or appeal the ban. I am writing this per WP:BANEX, where it refers to another user's conduct. I would be happy if an admin can clarify or notify me otherwise.) Aaabb11 is a single purpose account, whose sole major edits relates to editing the Falun Gong series of articles, often pushing a pro-FLG POV. As indicated by his edit counter, his most edited articles include Persecution of Falun Gong, Epoch Times, Kilgour-Matas report etc. [22]. Aaabbb11's edit patterns are counterproductive, disruptive, and indicated has a serious problem with WP:COMPETENCE and WP:NPOV, often pushing blatant POVs which even other non-involved editors question. His basic habits is to push the views of Gutmann, Kilgour/Matas et al on organ harvesting into basic China or communism related articles.
1) POV pushing on the China page: [23]. In spite of others questioning the amount of undue weight, Aaabbb11 has continued to edit war on the page, pushing Kilgour-Matas, and "genocide" allegations, and push personal attacks against users who reverted him.
2) Soapboxing with the Gao Rongrong page [30]. The page, as noted by three different editors at AFC, has questionable notability [31][32][33]. Nevertheless, the article was created by Aaabbb11 on June 16, yet even per the article itself, the sources mostly date from 2005, and even the Daily Mail article from 2012 only gave a two pictures and sentences. Note his rationale for creation of the article, which has little to do with WP policies and guidelines, but to "embarrass the PRC government", "highlight the stupidity of the torturers", promote the FLG mouthpiece Epoch Times as "having strong focus on human rights", and interestingly, directly admitting that there is a lack of coverage of of Gao Rongrong's case, all highlighting an issue of competence. Aaabbb11 also previously inserted the the disputed image of the deceased woman, plus FLG soapboxing, onto the page about the electroshock weapon and cattle prod, [34][35] and not to mention scrolling down his own talk page. 3) POV pushing on the Anti-communism page: [36].
4) Deletion of sourced material on the Epoch Times page: [42]
5) Attempts to change the article Persecution of Falun Gong to genocide, a position which is not supported by reliable sources. [47]. He also resorts to further soapboxing [48]. 6) Personal attacks, soapboxing etc.
Overall, Aaabbb11's edits are are littered with promotion and POV pushing for FLG, and his edits on the FLG related articles and Gutmann, Kilgour, Matas, et al. are filled with clear advocacy. Content disputes aside, Aaabbb11's editing patterns and behavior indicates that he's a clear single purpose account who is here to push views not consistent with scholarly studies on the subject. I request
Discussion concerning Aaabbb11Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator. Statement by Aaabbb11Current editors such as Zujine and TheBlueCanoe should be asked for their opinion. None of the 3 people making statements against me is a current editor of Falun Gong pages, so I don't think their opinion counts as much as current editors such as Zujine and TheBlueCanoe who are extremely knowledgeable, experienced and respected in my opinion. I'd also like to point out that I gave up editing the China page some time ago. I change what I'm doing as I learn more and get bored with what I'm doing. I made mistakes in the past but I learn from them. I don't enjoy the conflict that happens on some wikipedia articles. Some people find the truth very hard to accept but it should be on wikipedia as much as possible. The truth is shocking sometimes. I'd like to forget about some of the things I know. 00:41, 29 June 2016 The statements against me on 28 June by PPCP, Simon233 and STSC were made in less than 2 hours. It looks like collusion happening to me. Its probably time Happymonsoonday1 and Marvin 2009 were canvased for their opinions. They are current editors and have been editing longer than me. Aaabbb11 (talk) 05:34, 4 July 2016 (UTC) A little background about me. About 10 months ago I drove a road car on a racing track for the first time. It changed my life forever. I now own 2 lightweight track only racecars (Juno SSE and Ralt RT35) and have driven a total of 6 cars on 2 racetracks. I don't spend much time thinking about wikipedia now, mainly racecars. So the number of edits I make has probably dropped a lot. I find articles about race cars interesting. I don't watch TV. If I want to know something I google it and read the wiki article. Aaabbb11 (talk) 00:29, 5 July 2016 (UTC) Statement by simonm223For what it's worth, tendentious and probably paid full-time editors with substantial and persistent biases, like Aaabbb11 are the reason I don't edit wikipedia anymore. And frankly, I'm not likely to come back to Wikipedia if Aaabbb11 is gone, because the problem is systemic and persistent. But if any of you care about Wikipedia being anything other than a propaganda vehicle for whichever person has the most time and energy to burn fighting pointless battles you'll ban this user from ever editing anything even peripherally related to the Falun Gong or China. Simonm223 (talk) 17:42, 28 June 2016 (UTC) Statement by STSCAaabbb11's had indiscriminately inserted the image of Gao Rongrong in many articles (610 Office, Cattle prod, Electroshock weapon, Freedom of religion in China, Human rights in China, Anti-communism). When I complained about the inappropriate image inclusion [62], Aaabbb11 then deliberately posted 19 pieces of that image all over his/her talk page[63]. Just this disgraceful and disrespectful behaviour alone deserves a complete site ban. STSC (talk) 18:50, 28 June 2016 (UTC) Statement by RhoarkI've looked at the diffs and see no basis for complaint. The filer is topic banned from this area and has no connection to the issue at hand that would activate BANEX. STSC needs to stop dropping people hostile templates like he owns the place. Simonm223 should tell us more about how he was canvassed, since he doesn't edit anymore. Close this with no action. Rhoark (talk) 22:05, 28 June 2016 (UTC) Statement by TheBlueCanoeUser:Rhoark is correct. Both PCPP and STSC have been indefinitely banned from the Falun Gong topic area, and nothing in WP:BANEX justifies their filing or commenting on this complaint. Unless we want to set a precedent that would allow banned users to clog up the arbitration process to pursue ideological vendettas, it seems that this complaint needs to be thrown out. If any active users want to file a complaint against Aaabbb11, then they're welcome to do that—I won't protest.TheBlueCanoe 21:30, 3 July 2016 (UTC) Result concerning Aaabbb11
|
Monochrome Monitor
Monochrome Monitor agrees to a voluntary restriction and mentorship by Irondome. Given this, no further action is required at this time. Monochrome Monitor is warned that further disruption or failure to abide by the voluntary agreement is likely to result in a full topic ban. Seraphimblade Talk to me 21:18, 6 July 2016 (UTC) |
---|
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it. |
This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below. Request concerning Monochrome Monitor
Following a topic ban on Khazars Monochrome Monitor seemingly immediately continued with the same behavior that caused that ban, namely edit-warring and imposing his or her will through reverts. Additionally, the user has violated WP:BLP here (calling a living person a real-life loon[y]). Asked to remove that, the user declined.
Discussion concerning Monochrome MonitorStatements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator. Statement by Monochrome MonitorAlready covered on my talk page, thanks.
That ^^^ I did not realize that I violated 1RR, edjohnston was very nice and warned me, so I said I would self-revert. But Jonney already did. You're saying because someone reverted it before I could revert myself, it's a 1RR violation? [67] That is called a revert. I used my 1 revert for the day on it. I reverted nish's edit which I thought made unfair changes not mentioned on the talk page and misinterpreted a source. But that doesn't matter. This [68] is not a revert. You are telling me that because someone typed three characters weeks ago, and I deleted those three characters by writing what I had already proposed on the talk page, that's a revert, despite all the edits in between. That is completely insane. You're being vindictive and mean.--Monochrome_Monitor 00:07, 3 July 2016 (UTC) I did not say he was a "loony". I mentioned loonies with a hyperlink about him next to it. I'm really amazed how low you descend just to f*ck me over, suddenly caring about not offending a man who says turkey doesn't need to apologize for the armenian genocide, because they "committed no crime".[1]--Monochrome_Monitor 00:17, 3 July 2016 (UTC) More crap[Reply to Malik Shabazz] I discussed it with you, and you didn't make a compelling case at all. You did what you are doing now. Complaining about something you don't understand, pretending I removed categories that I actually added. I don't understand what is ideologically driven about changing "terrorism" to "war crimes" based on the date Israel was established and the jewish paramilitaries came together to become the IDF. State = war crimes. Non-state = terrorism. This is the definition wikipedia itself uses! It's not arbitrary at all,. Thus massacres committed by israel as a state I added "war crime", and massacres of the PLO during the lebanese civil war I added "terrorism". I have been ENTIRELY consistent except in one case- suicide bombings being labeled a war crime, they were in that category and I wasn't sure what to call it considering it has been called both, and its possible to have it be both in the case of state-sponsored terrorism. I'm trying to have a debate- you didn't debate me. You are being reactionary. You don't understand my edits. So, ask me about them. --Monochrome_Monitor 02:41, 3 July 2016 (UTC) "The entire spectrum of Zionist opinion believed, and still believes, that Eretz Yisrael extends to the east of the river jordan..." That's a gross generalization. The bible can say whatever it likes, it can say that the land of israel is from the nile to the euphrates- but that doesn't mean Jews believe it. Jordan has banned observant Jews from entering the country because they are afraid Jews will plant artifacts into the ground and claim the land as israeli.[2] That's how quickly this enters conspiracy theory territory.--Monochrome_Monitor 03:17, 3 July 2016 (UTC) You think that edit is inspired by "extreme ideology"? It is anti-extreme ideology.Only extreme religious zionists include parts of jordan into israel. Not "the entire spectrum". Hell, on one side of the spectrum of "zionists" they don't even think jerusalem is part of Israel.--Monochrome_Monitor 03:17, 3 July 2016 (UTC) The section you linked to- "please tell me...." I was asking you to tell me how the palestinian exodus is a war crime under the rome statue or terrorism. You never explained. But when I make the edits, I'm being an extremist, even if you never tell me what's wrong with them. You have to give me a bit more to work with. I've been TRYING to branch out, that's why I made the lede in zionism more nuetral today (for which I was reported) and that's why I started to populated the category "Israeli war crimes". --Monochrome_Monitor 03:25, 3 July 2016 (UTC) On "eretz israel" and how zionists interpret it. We are led to believe from our source that all zionists consider eretz israel to include parts of jordan. Here's a dictionary definition: [69] 1. the Holy Land; Israel Those are two different definitions....she's distorting the phrase. And, I think that's not just a regular untruth, but a dangerous one that leads to prejudice. --Monochrome_Monitor 03:34, 3 July 2016 (UTC) And another thing...[Reply to Nish] I did not call falk an antisemite. I said "he has antisemitic views". He thinks Israel was involved in 9/11. I believe that's an antisemitic view, don't you? They are not the same thing. An antisemite is one who hates Jews. An antisemitic view is a view characterized by antisemitism. Falk does not hate Jews. However he has some antisemitic views- saying "he's a respected scholar and here are his medals" is silly. The controversy is described in detail on his wikipedia page. And I stand by my statement about Atzmon. Regardless of your qualms about my editing practices, I DID NOT BREAK 1RR THIS TIME. Making an edit that "un-did" a three week old edit I didn't know existed is not a revert. And I know about state-sponsored terrorism. Israel has sponsored "terrorists". But that's difference from state terrorism, which is a more dubious concept. The IDF is not "sponsored" by Israel. It is Israel. Hence, saying a massacre by the IDF is terrorism is accusing Israel of state terrorism. It's a lot more reasonable to just call it a "war crime".--Monochrome_Monitor 17:46, 3 July 2016 (UTC) On the Armenian genocide, what I consider crazy about his views is his belief that no crime was committed. In contrast Israelis (except one azerbajani jerk) know that a crime was committed, a genocide was committed, but they don't call it that because they don't want to upset Turkey. What do I call them? Hypocritical moral cowards.--Monochrome_Monitor 18:06, 3 July 2016 (UTC) As for the reliable sources I removed, one I removed by accident which was a reliable source, for that I bear responsibility. The one I meant to remove (and did remove) was 972, which I don't consider a reliable source.--Monochrome_Monitor 18:01, 3 July 2016 (UTC) I'm sick of being dragged to AAE for diplomatic disputes... but I guess I have made people afraid to talk to me. Have I broken any rules? No. That being said, I have let my own emotions spiral out of control on some talk pages. I have gotten into conflicts with editors that could have been avoided if I discussed my thoughts first and not after the fact, when they had already formed their own conceptions about my intentions. But I stated my intentions clearly up above, and I'd like to be judged on that, rather than how other people feel about me.--Monochrome_Monitor 17:55, 3 July 2016 (UTC) References Hopefully the last section [reply to nableezy]Of course I know about the dispute, the dispute is why I made it, as a compromise. I changed the wording of the first sentence to my proposal on the talk page. But every change of wording that has some overlap with a change undone in the past cannot be considered a "revert" of someone else's edits made some time in the past. My first edit was an edit, my second was a revert. By your logic YOU violated 1RR by restoring content removed two years ago. This is a revert of this. This is a revert of this--Monochrome_Monitor 18:58, 3 July 2016 (UTC) I guess notSimon, you gave up on me a long time ago. You didn't respond to any of my comments on your talk page. Your emails have grown colder and eventually you ceased to respond to those too. Mere months ago you made glowing comments about my work on wikipedia. Most of my bans and offenses were before then. My edits have not changed- I've always made bold edits first and substantiated them later. The only difference is that when my bold edits are reverted, I expect the reverter to at least make the effort to address my concerns, and if they don't I continue to press for them. That's it. As for the Khazars, there was no "fiasco". I violated 3RR, that's it. If you want to make that into a cause for never speaking to me again, be my guest. At least have the decency to follow through with it and don't pitch in to my public humiliation after weeks of shunning me. As for Bolter, bless him, but the comparisons are ridiculous. When you took him under your wing you asked me to talk to him and give him advice, because I was your success story. I made the edit to Zionism against my usual POV as a compromise, this compromise was seen as an opportunity to make a radical change to the wording, which I reverted. And I get f*cked over it. I have been extremely careful in adhering to 1RR, and I did adhere to it. That's all I have to say.--Monochrome_Monitor 06:54, 4 July 2016 (UTC)
LastlyBefore sanctioning me, which you seem ready to do, can you at least establish that I actually broke 1RR? Because the first example as I noted was discussed on my talk page and should not be opportunistically used against me, and the second example I still don't think was a violation- the first edit was an edit, the second was a revert. I am learning, and that's why I have been trying not to break 1RR, and I believe I haven't. I've really been trying, and I want people to see that I'm editing in good faith, that's why I've been making these edits against my own POV. It would be unfair if after all of my genuine trespasses, I only get punished when I'm trying to atone for them. My POV in this area is not nuetral, but it's not extreme at all- I empathize strongly with "the other side". The people who get topic banned in ARPIA are some serious extremists, and there are many, many editors whose edits are far more controversial then mine, but they don't get into trouble because they get along better with other users. I alienated my greatest friend here, and that's entirely my fault. He's very non-confrontational and I thrive in the heat of debate, and I can cross the line of rhetoric into invective. But when I say he "gave up me", I mean he's stopped talking to me. I don't mean he's been advising me for ages and suddenly stopped. I've been mostly independent, and that was working for a while. As he once said (a little over three months ago),I'm still direct and still honest. I believe what changed is that I started to conflict with Nish, whom Simon respects very much. It's hard to ignore the damning comments, but please try and look at this from my perspective. --Monochrome_Monitor 16:56, 5 July 2016 (UTC)
Statement by Malik ShabazzPlease sanction Monochrome Monitor, who has repeatedly proven that she cannot edit with an NPOV. She is one of the most transparently ideologically driven editors I can recall from nearly ten years of editing, and she gets worse, instead of better, the longer she is here. Today, for example, she removed a sentence from Land of Israel because she didn't like it, writing "now that's just wrong". It didn't matter that the sentence is supported by a reliable source written by a reputable historian, given in-text attribution, and easily verifiable. Yesterday, she removed the categories related to war crimes and terrorism from Israeli articles and categories and added them to Palestinian articles and categories. When I called her on it, she initially made some noise about state actors and non-state actors. But she can't have it both ways—exempt Israel because it is a state, treat Palestine as a state when it suits her ideological drive, and deny it is a state when that suits her. (Here are a few diffs: [70][71][72][73]. See Monochrome Monitor's contribution history for dozens more. See User talk:Malik Shabazz#Please tell me... for the discussion.) Monochrome Monitor is also allergic to discussion. Despite the entreaties of her mentor, and others (including me), she refuses to start discussions about (for example) where categories about terrorism and war crimes are appropriate. Please. Enough is enough. — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk 01:58, 3 July 2016 (UTC) Statement by NishidaniThe evidence is a small sample of a persistent wrongheadedness over numerous pages. I have an informal undertaking with MM's mentor to be patient. I lost that patience on just one page, Khazars, and requested she be suspended for a month from just that page. She was suspended for six, which I though somewhat excessive, and told her so. She was upset, but we smoothed things over.
She got this from? Well, a wikipedia article, i.e. Definitions of terrorism. Wikipedia articles aren’t authoritative. We have, in contradiction to that article Iran and state-sponsored terrorism, for example. Malik was quite correct to complain of a rampage over cats. A moment’s notice, rather that causing just one more lengthy thread to debate MM’s subjective judgements, would have sufficed to show that the concept of state terrorism is widely debated and accepted in the relevant scholarship. I.e. here, here, ‘This foremost distinction between State and sub-State (or individual) terrorism is now a generally acceptable component of the debate on terrorism.' or here. She read a conclusion on a wiki article, drew an opinion from it, ignored any quality check in readily available reliable academic sources, and barged over several articles to alter them. The BLP violation may be piddling, but her mentors, people of loyalty, integrity and high intelligence, unlike myself, gave her the same advice as Nableezy and I did, and she refused to budge. The result, endless negotiationsa and hours wasted on researching the trivia that inform her judgements to show her how superficially sourced her information was for rushing to brand people antisemites. Despite those gentle remonstrations, she still has left unstruck those accusations against living public figures,Richard Falk and Gilad Atzmon, two Jews, are antisemites, and Erdogan is a loonie. (ps.) Erdogan doesn’t recognize the obvious, i.e. the Armenian genocide. True. But if he is a loonie for that, then what do we make of authoritative Israeli figures who repeat that israel has no intention of recognizing the Armenian genocide. I am strongly opposed to harsh measures generally, and if she merits a sanction it should be broadly on this topic area, but for no more than a month. She just has to get it into her head that endless drama, repeating the same behavior, and attritional attitudes that exhaust everyone's time and patience, including that of her mentors, will, the next time round, lead to less lenience. A last warning (of several) in shortNishidani (talk) 13:07, 3 July 2016 (UTC)
Statement by IrondomeThis statement may exceed 500 words. I would ask the reviewing administrator to indulge me. I will keep it as short as possible.
You take an immediate 2 month wikibreak from IP and articles related to Jewish-related topics. When returning, you submit all areas you are working on to me, on an ongoing basis. All edits apart from grammar, etc, are to be submitted to me before making them for approval. It may take a couple of days, but if you edit without my consent I will recommend an indef topic ban. It may take a few days for me to get back to you. Tough. You are going to learn patience. Certain behavioural issues will be discussed off wiki. That's all I have to say. Irondome (talk) 22:37, 12 June 2016 (UTC) I would strongly request that this be the main control mechanism that MM adheres to from now on, for a period of 2 months initially. If any edits of a controversial character infringing the above be made, then a 6 month IP and Jewish-related topic ban be immediately imposed upon notification of any such infringement to Administration. Monochrome Monitor I need you to accept this, urgently. Simon.
Result concerning Monochrome Monitor
|
Arbitration enforcement action appeal by Ranze
Procedural notes: The rules governing arbitration enforcement appeals are found here. According to the procedures, a "clear, substantial, and active consensus of uninvolved editors" is required to overturn an arbitration enforcement action.
To help determine any such consensus, involved editors may make brief statements in separate sections but should not edit the section for discussion among uninvolved editors. Editors are normally considered involved if they are in a current dispute with the sanctioning or sanctioned editor, or have taken part in disputes (if any) related to the contested enforcement action. Administrators having taken administrative actions are not normally considered involved for this reason alone (see WP:UNINVOLVED).
- Appealing user
- Ranze (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) – Ranze (talk) 06:41, 9 July 2016 (UTC)
- Sanction being appealed
- 1 May 2015 Gamergate topic ban:
- I am imposing for an indefinite period the standard Gamergate topic ban, which prohibits you from editing "All edits about, and all pages related to, (a) GamerGate, (b) any gender-related dispute or controversy, (c) people associated with (a) or (b), all broadly construed."
Discussion related to (not sure about resulting in) this sanction was a 2 week overall block I received by @EdJohnston: earlier the same day
This was for allegedly violating a topic ban I received from Gamaliel on April 4:
The cited reasons were redirecting Milo Y to Milo Yiannopoulous (presumably because he wrote some articles about Gamergate, as if that's all he does...) and special:diff/659243811 where I admittedly did include information about the Calgary Expo expelling a group of women who had gamergate related information. The reason I thought that was acceptable was because this was in no way connected to Zoe Quinn, which was the original concern of this whole GG topic ban thing. According to Wikipedia:General sanctions/Gamergate there are no general Gamergate sanctions anymore they are superceded by specific ArbCom sanctions. @HJ Mitchell: classified these as "obsolete" on 17 November 2015. It was demoted to historical status on 29 January 2015. So basically, when Gamaliel placed these sanctions on my in 2015 on April 4 / May 1, I did not take them seriously at the time because I was under the impression that Gamergate sanctions did not exist and he was trying to apply an undated policy. In the message left to me, Gamliel claimed that "This sanction is imposed in my capacity as an uninvolved administrator under the authority of the Arbitration Committee's decision" linking to Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/GamerGate#Final_decision. The link given was not very specific and I was looking at the wrong section, got confused, and didn't get the further feedback I requested to explain the justification. I mostly just shrugged it off and strove not to edit the topic, go watch a bunch of TV, renew my love for pro wrestling, etc. I'd like to know if such broad restrictions are still justified. I've left the Zoe Quinn article alone and that was the crux of what led up to this. Should I have such harsh and broad sanctions when I've stayed away and not reintroduced the pseudonym? For those interested in what preceded the April 4 intervention by Gamaliel I believe that is covered beginning at Talk:Zoë_Quinn/Archive_2#Gamergate_Harassment_sub-section_under_Career. It's coming back now... what had happened was on the talk page, I used template:cite tweet and the number of a tweet made by an account verified by reliable sources to belong to her. I introduced the tweet for discussion for its use as a potential source in the article, regarding the comments the tweet made about a prior career. Given that what I posted has been redacted, I can't refresh my memory on the specific phrasing, though I expect admins have access to the redacted diffs to do so. My thoughts on the potential inclusion of the restraining order (a primary source legal document) was that secondary sources (maybe also Breitbart) had brought up this restraining order. WP:BLPPRIMARY does allow for the referencing of primary sources if they support details established as notable by secondary sources so I didn't understand the problem with doing this. I would very much like to make amends for anything I did wrong, if I did, but my requests for explanations about the specifics of it never got answered in detail enough for me to understand it, so I would like the opportunity to have this better explained to me so I can understand the rules I broke, apologize for doing so, and in knowing better the specifics, better avoid doing so in the future. Ranze (talk) 06:41, 9 July 2016 (UTC)
- Administrator imposing the sanction
- Gamaliel (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA)
- Notification of that administrator
- The appealing editor is asked to notify the administrator who made the enforcement action of this appeal, and then to replace this text with a diff of that notification. The appeal may not be processed otherwise. If a block is appealed, the editor moving the appeal to this board should make the notification.
Statement by Ranze
Best-case scenario I would like the sanction lifted altogether. Next-best, I would like it to be modified to only apply to Gamergate only, as in (a) but not (b) because "any gender-related dispute" is so vague that people can try to make anything relating to people seem like it falls under that.
I pinged Gamaliel but then realized on checking page the user is listed as retired so I would require a different administrator to modify or remove it.
Since it's been 14 months since this was put in place my memories on what led up to it aren't the clearest. As best I can recall I had brought up on Zoe Quinn's talk page a Breitbart article which I wanted to include as a reference which mentioned a modeling pseudonym, and this was construed as some kind of attack on her.
Statement by Gamaliel
Statement by (involved editor 1)
Statement by (involved editor 2)
Discussion among uninvolved editors about the appeal by Ranze
Result of the appeal by Ranze
- This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.