Wikipedia:Reference desk/Humanities

Welcome to the humanities section
of the Wikipedia reference desk.

skip to bottom

Select a section:

• Computing
• Entertainment
• Humanities
• Language
• Mathematics
• Science
• Miscellaneous
• Archives

Want a faster answer?

Main page: Help searching Wikipedia

   

How can I get my question answered?

• Select the section of the desk that best fits the general topic of your question (see the navigation column to the right).
• Post your question to only one section, providing a short header that gives the topic of your question.
• Type '~~~~' (that is, four tilde characters) at the end – this signs and dates your contribution so we know who wrote what and when.
• Don't post personal contact information – it will be removed. Any answers will be provided here.
• Please be as specific as possible, and include all relevant context – the usefulness of answers may depend on the context.
• Note:
  • We don't answer (and may remove) questions that require medical diagnosis or legal advice.
  • We don't answer requests for opinions, predictions or debate.
  • We don't do your homework for you, though we'll help you past the stuck point.
  • We don't conduct original research or provide a free source of ideas, but we'll help you find information you need.

Ready? Ask a new question!

How do I answer a question?

Main page: Wikipedia:Reference desk/Guidelines

• The best answers address the question directly, and back up facts with wikilinks and links to sources. Do not edit others' comments and do not give any medical or legal advice.

See also:

• Teahouse
• Help desk
• Village pump
• Help manual

April 30

Modern Enid Blyton reprints

It's often said by (usually left-leaning) people that the editing of the reprints "doesn't change any of the plots".

Is that statement true?

For example, removing statements from The Famous Five that girls with short hair look like boys or that boys cannot wear pretty dresses are not neutral decisions. Paul Benjamin Austin (talk) 01:26, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

You're asking for a judgement call, but it sounds like you've already made up your mind. ApLundell (talk) 03:27, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

you may be interested in Are the days of Enid Blyton bashing over? which attempts a balanced overview. Alansplodge (talk) 12:52, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

To me, unfamiliar with the books, after looking at Alan's link, it looks like there is a sort of bowdlerization going on here, to be sure one with different concerns than Bowdler's, but still a similar process.

However I don't see any obvious way in which it affects the plot. That's not saying the changes are neutral, just that I don't see how they change the basic structure of the story. Unless boys not being able to wear pretty dresses is somehow a causal aspect of the narrative? I haven't read the books, so I suppose I can't rule that out, but intuitively it sounds unlikely. --Trovatore (talk) 22:37, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

I was thinking about it, and it seems to me that "doesn't change the plot" is remarkably narrow grounds on which to defend changes to a work, even one for children. Robert A. Heinlein is called the "master plotter", and he was great at it, but if his stories had only plot, I wouldn't have been interested in them.

So I was idly wondering whether any writer ever took on the challenge of writing two stories, with identical plots, that make directly opposite philosophical points. Probably too easy, stated that way. How about this: The plots should be exactly the same; character development and characterization can differ, but only subtly. And they should both be good stories that competently support their opposite theses, which should be interesting in themselves.

Anyone know of such an attempt? I can imagine Italo Calvino trying something like this; you might point to two chapters of If on a winter's night a traveler and claim they satisfy the conditions, but that's maybe a little too abstract. --Trovatore (talk) 00:12, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

You might like The Last Ringbearer. 173.228.123.121 (talk) 07:16, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

The Mousetrap murder mystery play by Agatha Christie reputedly changes its ending to keep audiences guessing throughout its run of 64 years (still counting). Blooteuth (talk) 18:55, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Thanks, these are interesting. I might be interested in reading the LOTR parody except first I'd have to read LOTR, and I've always found Tolkien a bit of a snooze.

Neither really sounds like quite what I had in mind. Changing the ending counts as changing the plot, so that one's out. Telling the story from a different character's perspective, a la Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are Dead, is also more of a change than I wanted to allow.

I meant, the same characters do the same things, except I suppose they can do different things that don't have a causal influence on later developments, but that should be kept to a minimum. Different information might be given about their background, though it shouldn't be contradictory between the two stories, just a different selection of facts. Different language can be chosen to explain why they do things. All of these differences should be kept as subtle as possible.

But in the end, it turns out that one of the stories is a defense of emotion as the source of value, and the other is an argument that there are no values but survival, which end reason should rigorously serve. Or something like that. --Trovatore (talk) 19:32, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Category:Parallel literature would probably be a place to look, but I don't know that anyone has actually created exactly that kind of experimental novel.

It nearly happens by accident. A lot of old sci-fi has very similar plot lines, but somehow it still manages to exactly illustrate whatever political point the author wanted to make. ApLundell (talk) 22:27, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

The Last Ringbearer isn't exactly parody, it's more like unusually good fanfic. It got crappy reviews from critics who took it in the wrong spirit, but I liked it a lot. The movie Rashomon might be closer to what you want, though. 173.228.123.121 (talk) 04:30, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Well, parody would be what to call it for copyright purposes — see The Wind Done Gone. I don't think Rashomon captures it either; again, the stories are supposed to be from the point of view of the same character(s). Everything happens the same, but little background details, choices of wording, stuff like that, when you add it all up, you find you have a completely opposite story. --Trovatore (talk) 04:37, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Confederacy at the end of the war: Southern independence vs the preservation of slavery

The Civil War was fought over slavery, this is an undeniable fact. It was direct and indirect cause to the war. The South began a war of independence/secession over the issue (state rights, tariffs, enter every Confederate apologist's excuse to skirt around slavery) of slavery. Let's establish that as the starting ground...My question is that how did the rationale for the war evolve over the course of the war in response to emancipation and the Union commandeering of slaves and the destruction of plantations? Did the anyone in the Confederacy ever considered emancipation for the sake of continuing the war with the North? Who were the notable Confederate dissidents against slavery/were there any abolitionist in the army or government of the Confederacy who were more in favor of Southern independence than the preservation of slavery. --96.41.155.253 (talk) 04:20, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

No, there was no consideration of abolition by the Confederate ruling class. Any who considered it were wise to keep quiet. Toward the end the South did grudgingly and half-heartedly consider arming slaves out of desperation (and even did organize a small unit or so, but too late for them to see combat), and I think the presumption -- or anyway, a presumption -- was these soldiers would be given freedom after the victory. Just those soldiers though; not a general emancipation. And I'm not even sure it was ever decided that they would indeed be freed.

Yeah there were a lot of southerners who had no use for slavery. Particularly hill country folk in the uplands and mountains of the Appalachians -- eastern Tennessee and so forth. But there wasn't any organized opposition to slavery among the lowland ruling classes. It was, essentially, illegal to advocate abolition in the South. And if not illegal, dangerous. Herostratus (talk) 04:56, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

West Virginia is an interesting case, with at least some Union sympathy combined with Union occupation leading it to split from Virginia. StuRat (talk) 14:53, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

96.41.155.253 -- Even before the fighting started, a few people pointed out that starting a war might not be the best way to preserve slavery, since it would probably change the line which fugitive slaves had to cross to attain freedom, from the Canadian border to the Ohio River -- and unless there was a quick or bloodless southern victory, there might be instability and turmoil which would shake up the status quo.

I doubt that there were prominent public abolitionists in the Confederacy, but towards the end of the war, some were in favor of drafting blacks as soldiers, which raised the possibility that it might be practically necessary to promise such soldiers their future freedom (as Herostratus has said)... AnonMoos (talk) 06:52, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

Link to the Confederate Constitution. Note that emancipation would have been unconstitutional. The CSA government of course didn't have the power to interfere in such an internal matter. The states had some additional powers under the CSA constitution, e.g. adjoining states could enter into navigation-related interstate compacts without congressional approval (Article I, Section 10, final sentence), but the bill of rights (Article I, Section 9), which explicitly bound the states, included (clause 4) a prohibition on laws "denying or impairing the right of property in negro slaves". This could have been amended, as the only unamendable section was (like under the US Constitution) the provision guaranteeing to each state its equal representation in the Senate, but still it's something that would have been much more complicated than any one state deciding to take the risk of emancipation. Nyttend backup (talk) 16:01, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

• Does John S. Mosby answer the OP's question? "In the letter, Mosby explained his reasons as to why he fought for the Confederacy, despite personally disapproving of slavery." --Jayron32 16:16, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

• He claimed to disapprove of slavery, but, according to our article, "during the war, he had kept a slave, Aaron Burton". This, along with him fighting for the Confederacy, suggests that he may have just found it politically convenient to make that claim, similar to a certain modern politician who claimed he "didn't inhale". StuRat (talk) 16:25, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

Cookbooks

Are cookbooks made by mostly female authors or people of both sexes who choose female names? 50.4.236.254 (talk) 12:28, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

Cookbooks are written by both male and female authors... but the male chefs usually author cookbooks in their own (male) names. Search "cookbooks" on Amazon and you quickly find hits for best selling cookbooks by male celebrity chefs like Gordon Ramsey, Bobby Flay, Geoffrey Zakarian and Alton Brown. They all want to capitalize on the name recognition that comes with their fame as chefs by selling cookbooks, and using a pseudonym (male or female) would defeat that goal. The same is true for female chefs. So.. I would say that if you see a female name as the author, it is probably written by a woman. Blueboar (talk) 13:10, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

Maybe unless it was written by Betty Crocker. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 15:36, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

My siblings and I learned to cook - as so quite probably many little boys and girls in Australia did with mum - from our mum's copy of The Margaret Fulton Cookbook. My mum's granddaughters and grandsons are learning to cook from the very same 1978 copy of that book.

--Shirt58 (talk) 10:59, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

And the mother of all cookbooks, Mrs Beeton's Book of Household Management of 1861. Alansplodge (talk) 13:32, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Our Category:English food writers shows a small majority of females, also Category:American cookbook writers. Alansplodge (talk) 13:39, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Schengen rules and refugees in Germany

When Germany allowed several hundred thousand refugees to enter their country, haven't they infringed common Schengen immigration rules? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Justpierrepit (talk • contribs) 14:08, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

Which Schengen are you talking about, and why do you think immigration violates the rules? ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 15:34, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

Schengen Agreement would be the logical deduction Bugs. AFAIK, all the nations of the Schengen Area have admitted significant numbers of migrants during the European refugee crisis. Alansplodge (talk) 16:16, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

An OP should explain what he's talking about. The reader shouldn't have to "deduce" it. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 18:50, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

For European users, the question is quite clear. You shouldn't feel obliged to respond to every single question on these desks. --62.178.231.82 (talk) 19:11, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

I don't, Mr. Drive-By, and the audience is not just Europe. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 19:38, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

No it isn't, Mr Baseball Bugs. But I frequently suppress my urge to make a snarky comment when a question makes no sense to me because I'm not American. Go thou and do likewise. --ColinFine (talk) 17:27, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

You should direct your complaint to the drive-by. There's no reason for any OP to just assume that everyone in the English-speaking world knows what he's referring to. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 18:23, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

_{WP:CIR here. Blooteuth (talk) 18:41, 1 May 2017 (UTC)}

I don't believe this is the case. Germany got the biggest share. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Justpierrepit (talk • contribs) 16:54, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

The Schengen agreement does not imply freedom of travelling for refugees registered by one of the member States. The politics regarding of Germany remains within such boundaries. An external view and comments as published by the Congress in the USA. --Askedonty (talk) 17:08, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

(EC) I feel you might be thinking about the Dublin Regulation, not the Schengen Agreement. If you speak German, here’s some Information regarding legal issues. In particular, according to Article 17 of the Dublin (III) Regulation, all member states are free to "derogate from the responsibility criteria, in particular on humanitarian and compassionate grounds."

Alansplodge: Many Germans felt that the other EU member states didn’t contribute their share, particularly the large ones like France and the UK. The border states (Italy and Greece in particular) will probably think that’s ironic, though. Cheers ✦ _hugarheimur 17:13, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

Agreed: the UK has claimed to be concentrating on taking migrants direct from refugee camps in the conflict area, although in terms of absolute numbers, it falls far short of Germany's effort. Alansplodge (talk) 17:29, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

According to the article linked above: "Four states – Germany, Sweden, Italy and France – received around two-thirds of the EU's asylum applications and granted almost two-thirds of protection status in 2014. Sweden, Hungary and Austria were among the top recipients of EU asylum applications per capita, when adjusted for their own populations, with 8.4 asylum seekers per 1,000 inhabitants in Sweden, 4.3 in Hungary and 3.2 in Austria."Clipname (talk) 17:32, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

What jurisdiction's license plate has the most possible combinations?

The regular vehicle registration plate, not the vanity kind. Sagittarian Milky Way (talk) 17:24, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

I start the bidding at 3 English letters and 4 numerals for some US states (over 100 million possible license plates per state) Sagittarian Milky Way (talk) 20:50, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

Category:Vehicle registration plates of the United States by state or territory would be the place for you to start your research. --Jayron32 11:14, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Off the top of my head, Ontario probably has the most in North America, with 4 letters and 3 numbers. Xenon54 (talk) 11:58, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Chinese license plates can have an English letter (excluding the letters O and I) followed by five numbers or letters, greatly increasing the number of possible combinations (if my calculations are correct, to 1,090,450,176 possible license plates for the whole country). However, whether all of the five are not numbers is dependent on provincial/city convention so in practice the possible combinations are less. Alcherin (talk) 18:11, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

License plates issued after 2007 have apparently been limited to 2 letters in the last five places, but any two of the last five places can still be letters. At any rate, this reduces the number of possible combinations below 1 billion. Alcherin (talk) 18:21, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Indian license plates are separated by province/equivalents rather than applying to the whole country. Following the provincial code, there's a 2 number code (and sometimes a letter as well) for the district - 117 district codes for Tamil Nadu. After than comes up to two letters and four numbers. That's potentially 790,920,000 combinations for the state of Tamil Nadu. Alcherin (talk) 18:35, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

In Ontario, standard plates have four letters and three numbers. Some classes of personal truck have a different length for their plates (two letters, five numbers). I'm not sure about I/O, but that would leave us with 331,776,000 for cars (24 x 24 x 24 x 10 x 10 x 10) and 57,600,000 for trucks (24 x 24 x 10 x 10 x 10 x 10 x 10) for 389,376,000 total (without vanities). Matt Deres (talk) 20:27, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

A letter position in a license plate should not be assumed to allow 24 different letters. Vehicle licensing authorities generally restrict letters that resemble numbers and letter combinations considered misleading or tasteless. Montana MVD bans a list of 4,212 plates[1], Maryland about 5000[2]. Thus plates such as PEN15, IOI101, OOO123, TITS4U are rarely allowed, or may attract collector interest if they occur. Here is a big list of plates that can't be bought in USA that comes with a warning that it may be offensive and not be suitable for all ages. Blooteuth (talk) 23:08, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

For sure, but taking ~30,000 away from 389 million is less than a percent of a percent. Matt Deres (talk) 23:40, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Why do Australians and Canadians and Americans use the dollar while the British use pounds and pennies?

Americans count their money by dollars and cents. For a fraction of a dollar, that may be represented by coins - penny, nickel, dime, quarter, half-dollar, and dollar coin. Australians and Canadian also have their own dollar. But British people have 2p and 5p coins and pounds? Why do Canadians and Americans name their coins while Australians and British people give their coins uncreative names? 50.4.236.254 (talk) 19:39, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

Define "creative". ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 19:50, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

You've obviously forgotten the British groat, sovereign, crown, florin, shilling (bob), and tanner. I agree that these modern decimal fractions have less interesting names. Dbfirs 19:54, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

It's not entirely true to say we don't have names for our modern coins. One pound is very often referred to as a "quid", and increasingly (IMO) a "squid". The 10p coin is sometimes referred to as a "2-bob coin" as this is what it was worth pre-decimalisation. DrChrissy ^(talk) 22:08, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

Australia wanted a decimal currency and 1000+ submissions were received for the new name. The prime minister wanted the name royal but the name dollar was chosen. Before 1966, Australia used the Australian pound and coins had the standard names: halfpenny, penny, threepence, sixpence, shilling and florin.
Sleigh (talk) 23:48, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

Also crown and half crown coins. Interestingly, the Australians went for a dollar equal to 10 shillings, while the UK retained the pound. A maths textbook we used at school which had been printed before the details of decimalisation had been finalised, used "pounds" and "cents". In the end, the new penny (worth 2.4 old pence) was adopted.

Before Decimal Day in the UK in 1971, there were also informal nicknames for coins; "tanner" for a sixpence, "bob" for a shilling and "half dollar" for a half crown. No nicknames for the new coinage seem to have caught on, except that the new halfpenny was known as a "tiddler" (in London at least) before it was withdrawn in 1984 and the 50 pence coin was briefly known as a "ten bob bit" until people began to forget how much ten shillings was. Alansplodge (talk) 13:28, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Canada also had a Canadian pound until 1858 - see also Canadian dollar and History of the Canada dollar. Why Canada switched to the dollar is a bit complex, but basically comes down to making it easier to trade with the US. Adam Bishop (talk) 00:47, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Pennies: The only things that start out 1 day's wages in 211BC and end up 0.004 2017 pounds. Sagittarian Milky Way (talk) 23:51, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Reserves in North America Indigenous peoples

Is there are list of reserves of Aboriginals in Canada and Native-Americans in USA? Donmust90 (talk) 19:43, 30 April 2017 (UTC)Donmust90Donmust90 (talk) 19:43, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

Are you referring to Indian reservations? That article has a map, which may help to answer part of your question. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 19:49, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

For Canada, see List of Indian reserves in Canada and for the USA List of Indian reservations in the United States. --Xuxl (talk) 20:50, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

national monuments to block mining

In S01E08 of The West Wing, Congress wants to approve a strip mine on a piece of federal land but the president, an environmentalist, disapproves but doesn't have enough votes to block it.

The solution revealed near the end of the episode was that the president could invoke the Antiquities Act to proclaim the said piece of federal land a national park and thus block the mine indirectly (in real life the Antiquities Act gives the president the power to proclaim national monuments instead but the tactic still works).

Has this tactic, or similar such maneuvers, ever been used in real life by a POTUS? ECS LIVA Z (talk) 19:50, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

Just a note: You'll have perhaps more chance of an answer if you include tate Governers doing this at the State level? The reality of such tactics, in real life, is the destructive "side effect" of encouraging landowners to shoot, shovel, and shut up, lest endangered species be discovered on their land. Destroy the endangered species before they are discovered, lest your land be "locked up". Eliyohub (talk) 14:10, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

National monument declarations by Presidents have definitely been controversial at times. See page 2 of [3] and [4] for some examples which sprung up with a quick google search. Others may have more to add. Eliyohub (talk) 14:19, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

This is based directly on Bill Clinton's creation of the Grand Staircase-Escalante National Monument in order to prevent its extensive coal deposits being mined; it was viewed as a payoff to China whose domestic coal industry would suffer due to increased competition with low-priced american coal. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Medeis (talk • contribs) 16:24, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

It might have been viewed as such by a small far-right-wing fringe, but that's not really the reason behind the creation of the monument except in the minds of some fever-swamp conspiracy theorists. The primary reason was the protection of such a huge swath of largely-undeveloped public land from development incompatible with conservation of the natural landscape and ecosystem. NorthBySouthBaranof (talk) 17:26, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Bernie sanders and Tony Blair equivalents

How many equivalents are there of Senator Bernie Sanders and how many equivalents of Tony Blair are there in the world? Donmust90 (talk) 19:56, 30 April 2017 (UTC)Donmust90Donmust90 (talk) 19:56, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

None, unless they have identical twins somewhere. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 19:59, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

I don't think you give the term "equivalent" its proper meaning. But the original question wasn't totoo clear, either. I assume that a "Bernie Sanders equivalent" is a relatively left-wing relatively successful relatively populist politician, while a "Tony Blair equivalent" is a politician with a boyish charm and popular appeal who moves a major political party to a more centrist position. --Stephan Schulz (talk) 20:17, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

One could portray them both in many other ways, both more positively and more negatively. The question is unanswerable until the OP tells us what his image of these people is.

(Btw, "to clear" is a verb. I think you wanted an adverb-adjective pair, "too clear".) -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 23:04, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

Of course I wanted to use the verb - the question is hard to clear because it is not clear enough. I'd never confuse "to" and "too", not even in peer reviewed papers. Thx ;-). --Stephan Schulz (talk) 05:40, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

I don't think Bernie Sanders has an identical twin, but he has an older brother Larry Sanders who moved to the UK in the 1960s and has served in some minor offices as a member of the UK Green Party. From what I gather, his politics are similar to Bernie's. Tony Blair might be more like Barack Obama or Hillary Clinton. 173.228.123.121 (talk) 07:13, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Blair's politics are more closely aligned to Bill Clinton. Compare New Democrats to New Labour. --Jayron32 11:11, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Hmm, ok, I thought of Obama's and H. Clinton's policies as similar to Bill Clinton's although maybe I've overlooked some fine points. Sanders is very far to the left of any of those three either way. 173.228.123.121 (talk) 03:32, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

Sorry for the confusion and misclarification. What I mean is that which politicians are considered as Bernie Sanders of this particular nation and as well as which politicians are considered as Tony Blair of this nation. For example, Jeremy Corbyn of Labour Party has been dubbed as British Bernie Sanders, Manuel Valls of Parti Socialiste has been dubbed as Tony Blair of France. Donmust90 (talk) 01:27, 2 May 2017 (UTC)Donmust90Donmust90 (talk) 01:27, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

I heard of Jean-Luc Mélenchon being described as a French Bernie Sanders in the context of last week's French election round (Mélenchon=Sanders, Macron=Clinton, Le Pen=Trump). 173.228.123.121 (talk) 04:35, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Yes, he even campaigned that way, with ads making those equivalences.John Z (talk) 03:47, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

Bloodiest day in history?

Hello. What was the 24 hour period in which the most people died violently in history? Google brings up several battles including Antietam, the first day on the Somme and Cannae, but I am not sure it was any of them. I suspect it was some battle on the Eastern Front during WW2 or something Chinese. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.136.45.110 (talk) 21:37, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

Battle of Borodino was at least one of the deadliest single day battles and possible the deadliest in history (guessing).--TMCk (talk) 21:55, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

I suspect the most violent deaths in a single day was not a battle but a natural disaster. I would suggest the 1556 Shaanxi earthquake with its 800,000 fatalities would be an excellent candidate for deadliest day in history. For war, the ~75,000 that died immediately from the atomic bombing at Hiroshima would be starting point for comparisons. Dragons flight (talk) 22:13, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

I suggest that "died violently" implies intent rather than natural disaster. Of course, it's up to the original poster to clarify what the question is. --76.71.6.254 (talk) 23:00, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

I disagree, died violently includes drowning, crushed in an earthquake, burnt in a fire and killed in a car crash but not by disease, old age or in childbirth.

So 23 January, 1556.
Sleigh (talk) 23:58, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

We have List of battles by casualties, but it doesn't indicate how long each battle / siege took. Reading the linked articles, should yield this information. LongHairedFop (talk) 12:21, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

The Bombing_of_Tokyo killed between 75,000 and 200,000 people in a single overnight raid. LongHairedFop (talk) 12:25, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

• List of battles and other violent events by death toll may be a good place to start. --Jayron32 12:29, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Cretaceous–Paleogene extinction event is the bloodiest day in the history of Earth. --IEditEncyclopedia (talk) 06:25, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

While that is good and creative answer, I think the number of people (per the original request) that died in that event was fairly low. --Stephan Schulz (talk) 06:51, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

I don't know how accurate or comprehensive this source is. But it lists 1556 Shaanxi earthquake as one of the deadliest days. And in terms of human violence, it lists Operation Meetinghouse, which took two days, so it's not completely clear how many perished on each day, nor the exact death toll. Eliyohub (talk) 17:27, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Eliyohub It was a single night, from the dropping of the first bomb to the last last bomb would have been just a few hours at most - more than 80% were dropped within 2 hours. The article is not clear about how long the fire continued after that, but it's pretty safe to assume that the vast majority of casualties were inflicted within 24 hours of the first bomb detonating. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 16:55, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

Why did these MPs resign?

Why did Sidney Schofield resign from Parliament in 1953, and why did Tom Williamson resign in 1948? DuncanHill (talk) 23:10, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

Schofield "insisted on resigning his seat because he did not like Westminster".[5] Clarityfiend (talk) 05:11, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Not referenced but List of Stewards of the Chiltern Hundreds lists Williamson as "Concentrating on work as General Secretary of the GMWU". MilborneOne (talk) 12:25, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Hawaiian female suffrage

I need help to find sources about female suffrage movement in the Territory of Hawaii, who leaders of the movement, particularly native or Asian suffrage leaders rather than the missionary descendants or white upper class. I know a Massachusetts women by the name of Almira Hollander Pitman had some effect on the movement when she visited with her part Hawaiian husband in the 1910s but nothing about the local movement itself.--KAVEBEAR (talk) 23:52, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

@KAVEBEAR: According to our article, Almira "Myra" Hollander married Benjamin K. F. Pitman in 1875. Her suffrage involvement is referenced with the following source:

• Susan Brownell Anthony; Matilda Joslyn Gage; Ida Husted Harper. History of woman suffrage. Vol. 6. p. 717.

I hope this helps.2606:A000:4C0C:E200:3CF4:5668:5FB:EC43 (talk) 18:00, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

I think I made those edits. I am aware of that source. Looking for additional ones I am not aware of.--KAVEBEAR (talk) 06:02, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Who was Mrs. John W. Dorsett?--KAVEBEAR (talk) 06:20, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

A very rich lady who lived in Hawaii and a strong supporter of women's suffrage. 209.149.113.5 (talk) 13:50, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

I was looking for a name other than that of her husband. Searching for her husband's name doesn't seem to even bring up anything.--KAVEBEAR (talk) 01:44, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

May 1

Which All Hallows was Knox offered?

Our article on John Knox says "On 2 February 1553 Cranmer was ordered to appoint Knox as vicar of Allhallows Church in London placing him under the authority of the Bishop of London, Nicholas Ridley. Knox returned to London in order to deliver a sermon before the King and the Court during Lent and he again refused to take the assigned post." Do we know which All Hallows church he was offered? DuncanHill (talk) 00:47, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Various biographies of Knox in Google Books say it is All Hallows, Bread Street (which is not listed in our All Hallows page!). Adam Bishop (talk) 01:05, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Thanks, I've added it to that page. A lot of All Hallowses aren't listed there either. Could be a fun project for someone! DuncanHill (talk) 01:50, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

I've added a few more. Alansplodge (talk) 08:32, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Social etiquette of coffee request

People often ask, "would you like a cup of coffee?" I've observed that in movies and TV shows, I often see that the answer is "yes". However, I am not sure whether the answerer says "yes" because he/she likes coffee or because it is only polite to say yes to an offer of hospitality. What happens if the answerer really hates coffee or is just not a coffee drinker? Does the answerer then say "no" as a reply to the question or say "yes" because of politeness? In other words, is offering a cup of coffee an act of hospitality and that refusal is not polite, or is this question asking whether the answerer would like a literal cup of coffee and the answerer is free to decline the offer because s/he hates coffee? 50.4.236.254 (talk) 03:50, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Assuming you're speaking about America (since it's a place that's featured on television in America and is not serving tea), "I'm fine, thanks" or "thanks but no" usually works. If you need to be a bit more formal, replacing "thanks" with the full "thank you," or even saying "I appreciate the offer but no, thank you" would be the way to go. If you are on good terms, following that by asking "may I have some water, though?" (assuming you are thirsty) should not cause a problem. The question is an act of hospitality but one that the guest is under no obligation to accept.

In some other cultures (Lebanon came up on a cursory search), there's the possibility that saying no might be insulting the host. Some of them, you need to politely turn down the offer once or twice to show that you're not greedy but still accept it on the second or third time to not insult the host. Ian.thomson (talk) 04:15, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Looking a bit more, I see that many Arab cultures (I suspect most of the Middle East) consider it an insult not to accept hospitality, such that one Muslim theologian said that accepting hospitality was more important] than fasting. Ian.thomson (talk) 04:37, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

I'd love a cup of coffee, but rather than coffee, could I have tomato juice ? And rather than adding sugar, could you add a celery stick ? And rather than cream, could you please add vodka ? StuRat (talk) 04:48, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Irish coffee. Hold the coffee. 04:51, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

On TV shows it's merely a conventionalism, maybe to make it look more "real" - and also to give them something to do while they're reciting the script. If you don't want coffee, you can say "No, thank you" and if you'd rather have something else, ask if they have soda or water or whatever. In the real world, they're trying to make you feel comfortable. Go with it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Baseball Bugs (talk • contribs) 04:56, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Not really an answer; but I rarely drink coffee, but I still talk of "going to coffee with somebody" or "having somebody round for coffee", even though I will almost certainly drink tea. I think that's mainly because of the hangover of "tea" as the name of a meal in England, so "have somebody round for tea" would be ambiguous. --ColinFine (talk) 17:35, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

There are many ways around this. As a non-coffee-drinker, I avoid the situation by generally being an asshole and thus obviate the need for dealing with the question. As a bit of a side-note, asking someone to 'come up for a coffee' is sometimes used as a polite euphemism for initiating intimacy. As seen in The Big Bang Theory and more clearly in Luke Cage. Similar to requesting 'a nightcap'. Matt Deres (talk) 23:49, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

• Here are some sources that may help you research this topic, from different cultures around the world: Croatia, India, Gulf States, Iraq, Ireland, During a job interview, an etiquette book from the 1990s. That should give you a good start. --Jayron32 13:14, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

U.S. General Aviation flight hours

There's been a pretty sharp decline in General Aviation flight hours since the recession started[6]. Where can I find the 2015 and 2016 data? I like to see whether the trend continued or not. ECS LIVA Z (talk) 05:56, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

I do not know whether or not those are figures affected by other factors as inheriting from system evolution: "The annual load factor declined from 2015 (83.8) to 2016 (83.4) because system capacity grew faster (3.9 percent increase in ASMs) than the growth in passenger travel (3.5 percent increase in RPMs)" [7]. Regarding safety the records are encouraging at any rate [8]. --Askedonty (talk) 15:18, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Oh I see my answer is not at all accurate, the data and the quote being about regular and scheduled airlines. Well the second article, at flyingmag.com, is suggesting the trend seems to be stable for 2015 regarding general aviation. From that article could be infered that even for 2015 precise data might be not available. Some data from the FAA is however available, it's here for year 2015, (none available for 2016). --Askedonty (talk) 20:31, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Hiding inside animal carcasses

I was fascinated by the recent question about the Saxon lord Childe sacrificing his horse in a vain attempt to save his own life. Han Solo had more luck rescuing Luke Skywalker with the carcass of a tauntaun. TV Tropes has a page on Carcass Sleeping Bag; unsurprisingly, it doesn't mention the folklore of Devon, but it does offer one historic example: the Mexican revolutionary Pancho Villa. Is this true? TV Tropes doesn't mention the scene in The Revenant in which Leo DiCaprio's character makes a similar choice; given that the film was loosely based on the survival of Hugh Glass, did it take the idea from The Empire Strikes Back (as suggested by this critic) or the real-life mountain man? Saving yourself with the carcass of an animal sounds like something the Spartans would have approved of, or Roman legionnaires. Are there verifiable historic examples of people who were put in the position of saying "And I thought they smelled bad...on the outside"? Carbon Caryatid (talk) 13:37, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

First, are you aware that, for much of humanity's prehistory, clothes were made of animal skins only? It must have smelled pretty bad each time, as the smell of a tannery tells us. --Lgriot (talk) 13:57, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Indeed, in the not that distant past, it was a staple of the great retreats from Moscow (1812) and Kabul thirty years later. — O Fortuna ^{semper crescis, aut decrescis} 14:02, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Isn't the internet a wonderful thing? I found crawlinginsideanimalstosurvive.blogspot which tells the story of Reverend Joseph Goiffon, who was sent on a journey from Pembina, North Dakota to Saint Paul, Minnesota in 1860. On the return journey, his party was delayed at Grand Forks and he decided to press on alone, but was caught in a snowstorm. When his horse died, he cut open the carcass and crawled inside. "When Father Goiffon was found he was still alive but one leg was badly frozen". This seems to be the only true story on the blog, but it does include a video of Bear Grylls climbing inside a dead camel. Alansplodge (talk) 14:25, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Isn't the internet rubbish? This more detailed account of Fr Goiffon's adventure says that he cut bits off his dead horse to eat, but was found next to the carcass, not inside. Alansplodge (talk) 14:33, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Jonah and the whale is an even older story. 173.228.123.121 (talk) 15:57, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Being swallowed doesn't count. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 20:32, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Thanks for all your efforts, but after 24 hours, that's a no. Wearing animal skins is hardly akin to crawling inside a carcass, and I understand that leather tanning goes back millenia, well pre-dating my request for "verifiable historic examples". Moscow and Kabul would indeed seem likely; perhaps Harry Flashman was there and can tell us more. The lost priest is a wonderful warning to wandering refugees seeking the frozen north. Somehow I thought this info-quest would have been more straight-forward. Carbon Caryatid (talk) 13:10, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

I did have a thorough search for examples from the Moscow and Kabul retreats. The nearest I came was that Napoleon is alleged to have used the frozen corpses of soldiers as chairs and a dead horse as a dining table (sorry, I've lost the reference for that), but nothing from Kabul. Alansplodge (talk) 16:53, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

Thanks Alansplodge. Carbon Caryatid (talk) 12:21, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

Here's what's described as a first-person account, from the Napoleonic period, of seeking shelter in the stomach of a horse, on p. 504. There's also a footnote on p. 511 referring to a similar episode. Whether these are verifiable and historical . . . you may want to judge for yourself. Herbivore (talk) 19:02, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

Viking (or Scandinavian) contact with Europe prior to the 8th century ?

The first known Viking raid took place in Lindisfarne in late 700s, and from there on, there are lots of history-related articles that tell of the vikings expeditions and endeavours. But prior to the raid on Lindisfarne, there is very little information to find about them.

What I wonder is that if they didn't known about the existence of Britain until late 700s, then what were their relationships to the rest of Europe prior to this? Surely they must have had dealings with those further south? Surely there was contact, and most likely trade? Especially the Danes, bordering modern-day Germany and being close to Belgium, France and Poland, must have had plenty of dealings with the rest of Europe. Those who hailed from Norway and Sweden had to cross the Baltic or travel the long way around, through Finland... So they may have been more isolated than the Danes.

But although viking raids may not have begun until the 700s, I am sure they were able to travel across the Baltic and such to trade and whatnot long before then. Of course, some might argue that there weren't vikings prior to this, since they'd consider the viking age to be roughly 8th to late 11th century. So whatever they may have been before that, let's just call them Scandinavians.

I guess my question is simply to what degree the Scandinavians, -prior to 700s- had contact with others and what knowledge they had of lands outside their own? Or were they largely isolated? Krikkert7 (talk) 20:29, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

See History of Scandinavia for one place to start. "Vikings" are a particular aspect of Scandinavian history, so basically by definition there are no Vikings before they start launching raids across the sea (and not all Scandinavians were Vikings). The Germanic tribes in Scandinavia were certainly known as far back as the Romans but they were pretty much isolated in the early medieval period when the Roman system broke down. Adam Bishop (talk) 21:28, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Before they were called Vikings, they were called Goths. The Ostrogoths i.e eastern Goths crossed the Baltic and were forced to migrate by the Huns. The Visigoths i.e. western Goths left Scandinavia and sacked Rome in AD 410.
Sleigh (talk) 22:21, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

A Scandinavian origin of the Goths is the traditional founding myth, but very much not the current state of the art. An Eastern Baltic origin of a core group is possible, but also a much later ethnogenesis in the Danube region in the 3rd century CE. --Stephan Schulz (talk) 12:04, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Sleigh -- In some early sources, there seems to be a lot of confusion between Goths, Geats, inhabitants of Götaland, and inhabitants of Gotland; and of course the original Germanic homeland was today's southern Norway, southern Sweden, Denmark, and northern Germany. However, it seems rather unlikely that there was a close connection between the Goths as known to history (speakers of Eastern Germanic languages who were in the Southwestern Ukraine / Moldova / Northeastern Romania area by 200 A.D.) with the Scandinavian Vikings of over 500 years later (speakers of Northern Germanic languages). Traditionally, Scandinavians who sailed west were known as Vikings, while those who went east across the Baltic were "Varangians"... AnonMoos (talk) 12:58, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Some other resources on Wikipedia, although they are kind of lacking in detail: Iron Age Scandinavia, Archaeology of Northern Europe. Adam Bishop (talk) 23:52, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Thanks for your replies. I'll have a look at all the links. 'History of Scandinavia' will certainly be of great interest to me. Krikkert7 (talk) 11:18, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

May 2

Left-Wing populism in Europe

Which left-wing parties are considered as left-wing populist parties in Europe? So far, in the books "The Explosion Populist" by John B. Budis and "The Optimistic Left" by Ruy Texeira mentioned that Podemos of Spain, Five-Star Movement of Italy, Socialist Party of the Netherlands and Syriza of Greece as left-wing populist parties. Donmust90 (talk) 01:24, 2 May 2017 (UTC)Donmust90Donmust90 (talk) 01:24, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Five-Star is not usually counted as left. Itsmejudith (talk) 07:45, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

• Podemos, Syriza and the Dutch Socialists are all members of the European United Left–Nordic Green Left. Most of the other parties in that group are also often described as populist, so that's probably a good place to start. (Although the situation can be complicated: Die Linke, the German Left party, is a radical anti-globalist party in West Germany, but an old-fashioned socialist party in East Germany - whether either or both of these are populist is debated). Five Star sits in the Eurosceptic populist Europe of Freedom and Direct Democracy group (a group otherwise made up largely of right wing parties like UKIP and a handful of other MEPs kicked out of far-right parties) and as Itsmejudith says, they aren't really left or right - they have a mishmash of policies. Smurrayinchester 08:57, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

More information and discussion on Left-wing populism#Europe. Alcherin (talk) 15:18, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Sinn Fein in Ireland is the populist left wing party. The two other left wing parties (Labour and the Social Democrats) don't like Sinn Fein for this reason.--83.136.45.110 (talk) 13:01, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

ISIS and the Yazidis

Somehow, I stumbled across the ISIS Wikipedia article and then found the Yazidi people. I was curious about the physical appearance of these people. I scrolled down the page to find any good pictures and noticed that these people, from my point of view at least, look indistinguishable from white people. How does ISIS tell the difference between the Yazidis and their own people anyway? Do the Yazidis have some sort of cultural marker that would make them a target of genocide? I'm trying to figure out how similar-looking humans have the ability to recognize each other and kill each other and not their own people. Yeah, I get that ISIS is against the religion of the Yazidi people, but still religion is not observable, because it is a belief system. And the clothes of the Yazidi children are modern. So, what does ISIS use to quickly identify and target the Yazidi people? 50.4.236.254 (talk) 03:30, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

For one thing, ISIS is purportedly a religious-political group, whereas the Yazidi are an ethno-religious group. 2606:A000:4C0C:E200:3CF4:5668:5FB:EC43 (talk) 04:03, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

I think the answer is that the Yazidis live together in their own villages, so if ISIS arrive in a Yazidi area they assume that most or all people there are Yazidis. The Yazidis could also be distinguished by their dress. Itsmejudith (talk) 07:44, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

They look like Mediterraneans, i.e. somewhat darker skinned like typical Middle Easterners. And keep in mind that Mediterraneans and Middle Easterners are gnerally "white" as in Caucasian. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 11:49, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

I kinda doubt ISIS is too bothered if they inadvertently kill some of "their own people" in their massacres. The very nature of their "operations" is, kill and die. Both are, in a sense, equally important. So who cares if, during an indiscriminate massacre, you happen to kill a few "fellow Sunnis"? They've certainly sent suicide bombers to their deaths merely in order to kill civilians who happened to be the wrong kind of Muslims. Eliyohub (talk) 14:01, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

I don't think this is a particular property of ISIS. Protestants and Catholics managed to identify each other sufficiently for crosswise atrocities during The Troubles, or during the Thirty Years' War, or during the St. Bartholomew's Day massacre. Nor did the various Arab tribes live in blissful harmony before ISIS, or even before Muhammed. And neither did the various Chinese of the Warring States period have trouble with identifying victims. Finding "others" to persecute or kill seems to be a universal human skill... --Stephan Schulz (talk) 14:40, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Indeed they have no problems with killing "their own people", because even Sunnis that aren't actively supporting ISIS are still targets for extortion. Identifying who is or isn't a Yazidi/Sunni doesn't matter in a sense because they can and will extort money through threats of violence if you aren't actively involved in ISIS. Alcherin (talk) 15:00, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

See also Genocide of Yazidis by ISIL#Sunni collaboration. Alcherin (talk) 15:08, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

"Kill them all, let God sort them out" goes back a long way. Adam Bishop (talk) 15:10, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

It's possible that people in ISIS controlled areas carry ID/documents that identify their ethnicity and/or religion. Yazidis could ditch their documents, but not having any documents may also get them killed. StuRat (talk) 15:43, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Suicides during, or as a result of, The Troubles

1) Besides the obvious case of Billy Giles, how many suicides are known to have occurred in connection with The Troubles? Logically, Giles was not alone (Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder does tend to cause some sufferers to kill themselves), so how common was this?

2) Is there somewhere I can find the whole text of Giles' four-page suicide note?

3) What was Giles' funeral like? What were his instructions in this respect? The UVF (or at least some of them) consider him KIA, but did he want a paramilitary funeral? Or did he ask for the paramilitaries to stay away? Logically, he would presumably have wanted the latter (he was haunted by having murdered his workmate in the supposed name of "God and Ulster"), but do any sources discuss this? Eliyohub (talk) 16:45, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

• This appears to have your answer for #1. --Jayron32 16:54, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

That's somewhat helpful, but it tells me nothing about any connection of these suicides in Northern Ireland to The Troubles, or lack of such connection. Have any sources analyzed this? Are there any other notable victims? Eliyohub (talk) 17:15, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

There are several useful-looking sources here. This Telegraph article discusses suicides among British Army personnel attributed to the Troubles, while this book mentions an estimate of 70 RUC or PSNI officers committing suicide (implying as a result of the Troubles, but apparently a total regardless of immediate cause). Warofdreams talk 00:34, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

Surprised no-one has so far mentioned the ten people who committed suicide in the 1981 Irish hunger strike. --Viennese Waltz 10:20, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

I have serious doubts that would, strictly speaking, meat the definition of Suicide, any more than a soldier risks death in battle. They were willing to die, but didn't intend to. Any given prisoner might or might not have been the one to die. They clearly hoped their demands would be met. Can anyone offer anything regarding the other two questions here - Billy Giles' funeral, and suicide note? Eliyohub (talk) 13:49, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

It certainly does meet the definition of suicide, which is the intentional killing of oneself. They could have saved their own lives at any time by ending the hunger strike, but chose not to do so. --Viennese Waltz 15:34, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

The suicide rate was lower in Northern Ireland than in England during the Troubles but since there's been a bit of peace people have started taking their own lives more. Just shows what a bit of normality is like. Dmcq (talk) 14:44, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

Which is why I included the aftermath too. Giles hung himself after his release from prison under the Good Friday Agreement. Ditto with Vietnam veterans - I gather that many committed suicide after the war had ended. Eliyohub (talk) 13:11, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

I think you question makes a wrong assumption. I would see it as that the Troubles protected him or the peace was bad for him and a lot of other potential suiciders, and that he died as a result of the peace rather than as a result of the Troubles. Without the peace he might still have been alive. It is what was good about the Troubles or is wrong with peace that should be looked at Dmcq (talk) 13:35, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

Who stole Carl Weiss' body from his grave?

Our article on Carl Weiss in the infobox states "Exhumed from Roselawn Cemetery in Baton Rouge; remains never returned". Our article says nothing about whom exhumed his body, why, and where it ended up. Who was the Ghoul? (Did something happen which was similar to what happened to the body of Eva Perón?). Who dug up Weiss' body? And where did it end up? Eliyohub (talk) 17:12, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

From the Find-a-Grave page cited by our article: "In 1991 Weiss's body was exumed from its grave to search for evidence that Weiss had not fired the fatal shot that killed the Governor but was never returned to Roselawn Cemetery. The current whereabouts of his remains is unknown." The New York Times ran several articles in 1991. On 27 June 1991 plans for the exhumation by "a team of experts" headed by forensic scientist James E. Starrs of George Washington University in Washington were announced. The purpose was to re-examine the trajectories of the 60 bullets that killed him, to determine if he was in a position to shoot Long (the opposing theory was that Long's bodyguards killed both Long and Weiss). Tissue samples were also to be taken to see if there was evidence of drug addition or brain tumor that might explain Weiss's actions. It was not announced who would finance this venture. The story of the actual exhumation was published on 21 October 1991. The remains went to a laboratory in Lafayette for autopsy (Weiss had been buried without being autopsied.) On 22 February 1992, the New York Times published an article reporting Starrs' findings, in which he claimed at a meeting of the Academy of Forensic Scientists in New Orleans that "there is significant scientific evidence to establish grave and persuasive doubts that Carl Austin Weiss was the person who killed Sen. Huey P. Long." Starrs wrote a book on the subject, A Voice for the Dead. In general, no important information was gleaned from the exhumation, and I find no report of the subsequent disposition of the remains. - Nunh-huh 17:17, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

The guy who worked on the remains was Douglas H. Ubelaker. He seems to still be around, so maybe someone could ask him. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 20:37, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Thanks for that, Bugs, I took your suggestion, emailed him, and got a prompt response. If you're curious, he replied that "some of the skeleton was kept by the Smithsonian, the rest was returned to Weiss' descendants". Eliyohub (talk) 05:26, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

Excellent. The article could be updated, as could the Findagrave entry. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 11:20, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

Laurie Lee picked up by a destroyer

Resolved

Do we know which destroyer picked Laurie Lee up from Castillo (Almuñécar) at the end of As I Walked Out One Midsummer Morning? DuncanHill (talk) 16:59, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Found it in the ODNB article on Lee. She was HMS Blanche. DuncanHill (talk) 18:01, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Kim Jong-un

I noticed in the many recent TV reports on North Korea that an older man in civilian clothes seemed to be always at the side of the country's leader, Kim Jong-un. Who is he, and what is his role and relationship to Kim Jong-un ? --Halcatalyst (talk) 17:44, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Can you link to such a report? It may make it easier for us to identify him. --Jayron32 17:50, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

I didn't read about it; sorry if that's what was implied. I merely saw him several times on TV news. --Halcatalyst (talk) 20:07, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Can you link us to any video or picture showing this person?--Jayron32 20:29, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Here's an excellent example: Kim Jong-un and friend. -- 00:58, 3 May 2017 Halcatalyst

I can't quite tell for sure, but could it be Choe Ryong-hae, long-time second in command, or Kim Yong-nam, titular head of state? --165.225.80.99 (talk) 08:23, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

I'll go for Choe, since he's not balding. Thanks. --Halcatalyst (talk) 03:49, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

Atlantic Award, Rockefeller

I've noticed mentions in several articles on poets and authors of the "Atlantic Award" or "Atlantic Award for Literature", apparently awarded by the Rockefeller Foundation. This award is not mentioned in our article on the foundation, neither can I find mention of it on their website. I would be grateful to learn more about this award. DuncanHill (talk) 21:08, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Could it be The Atlantic's Renewal Award, or Atlantic Book Award?→ Atlantic Awards in Literature; Rockefeller Foundation —107.15.152.93 (talk) 21:51, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Brilliant work, thank you. Your find led me to this article giving a review of the Awards and a list of the recipients. DuncanHill (talk) 21:59, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Made in USA or Imported

What is "Made in USA or Imported[9]" supposed to convey? Isn't everything in the USA either made in USA or imported?

This is like a real life example of this joke "these two books[10] contain the sum of all knowledge. ECS LIVA Z (talk) 23:29, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

I suggest that either Amazon hasn't been able to find out where this product is made, or the same product is manufactured in different countries and they don't know which version you'll be sent if you order it. On some food products if you look at the ingredients list and see things like "sugar and/or high-fructose corn syrup"; same idea, the manufacturer makes it both ways according to what supplies are available most cheaply at the time, and doesn't consider that you need to be told which one is in this specific package. --76.71.6.254 (talk) 22:24, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

ECS_LIVA_Z -- The joke as I heard it was an auto repair shop with the sign "We specialize in all makes and models, foreign and domestic"... AnonMoos (talk) 22:44, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

I've also heard "We loan up to $1000, or more." StuRat (talk) 12:20, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

That's a cousin to "within 30 days, if not sooner." ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 15:37, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

That's redundant, but at least both mean 30 days or less. Mine means $1000 or less or more, which means any amount at all. StuRat (talk) 20:50, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

The "foreign and domestic" is likewise a redundancy, but that could be a purposeful attention-getter. Like the $1000 could be the attention getter, to put a number in there to suggest an order of magnitude. The one you cited sounds like shorthand for "up to $1000, or even more under some circumstances." But that wordiness gets in the way of the sales pitch. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 23:11, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

Real conversation, short version:

Marketing: We want this product to do everything.

Engineering: Well, could you be a little more specific?.

Marketing: What's not specific about "everything"?

Other version about trying to get the company to focus its efforts better: "Can't we just focus on everything?" — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.228.123.121 (talk) 03:40, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

173.228.123.121 (talk) 03:38, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

How do humans fulfill their biological functions during wartime?

I have seen images of military camps before. The military is supposed to camp there, eat, sleep, and pee. But, doesn't the military have to maintain vigilance in case the other side decides to take advantage of the army's rest state? If the other side has alternating military forces that fight during the day and night, then won't that defeat the opponent that only fights during the day and sleeps at night, or vice versa? Anyway, how do militaries make sure that the camp is protected from the other side's military or the locals who may become violent against the opponent's military for invading their homeland? 50.4.236.254 (talk) 23:04, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

That's why they have guards on watch. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 23:16, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

e/c

E,g: Watchtower & Patrolling & Reconnaissance & Redoubt (more as "a temporary or supplementary fortification" than our article detail) & perimeter security systems, etc. 107.15.152.93 (talk) 23:21, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

And, of course, (electrified) fences and walls, manned gatehouses, boom barriers, barbed wire, objects placed in the road, searchlights, patrols with dogs, motion sensors, minefields... Alcherin (talk) 13:35, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

See 01 and 02 64.170.21.194 (talk) 23:22, 2 May 2017 (UTC)

Some thoughts:

1) Full-scale attacks at night weren't much of an option prior to the inventions of flares and later night vision equipment. Attacking in the dark would have only been possible then with a full moon, in areas with a light-colored surface (like a white sand). To attempt a full-scale attack in the dark would have resulted in killing many of your own people, having your horses break their legs by stepping in holes, etc. Also, a night attack may tend to favor the defenders, as they would be better hidden in darkness, in trenches and foxholes, than attackers out in the open. An exception is if the defenders lit fires to keep warm, etc.

2) Commando raids are a bit different. There the goal is to sneak in, hit the target, and retreat before the enemy can respond. Darkness can help here. (In the move The Alamo, one such raid destroyed an enemy cannon.)

3) It is important to have your soldiers be able to be ready at a moment's notice. See Minutemen for one example. This applies whether they are awake or asleep. So, you can bring your full forces to bear, if attacked, in short order, at any time of the night or day.

4) Having multiple shifts would also limit how many people you can attack with. StuRat (talk) 02:19, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

Gideon#Night_attack --Dweller (talk) Become old fashioned! 10:38, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

Also we have Night Attack at Târgovişte (1462), a failed night attack by Jacobite army on the eve of the Battle of Culloden (1745), a night amphibious cliff assault on the French camp at the start of the Battle of the Plains of Abraham (1759) and I'm sure there are many others. All you need is a bit of moonlight and some prior reconnaissance. Alansplodge (talk) 13:09, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

Also, In the old days, warfare actually had front lines. Rest camps were placed some distance in the rear... so those in the rest camp had some warning (given by the front line troops) if the enemy attacked. Blueboar (talk) 12:53, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

Yes. See front line and rear (military). --Jayron32 15:00, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

Well, in some instances. In others, the campaign consisted of a force marching into enemy territory and making camp each night. An outer line would be formed by outposts called pickets, who would withdraw when the enemy approached (known as "driving in the pickets"). Close protection was provided by sentries or guards as mentioned above. An example of a camp being destroyed by an enemy attack was the Battle of Isandlwana (1879), although that was in broad daylight. Alansplodge (talk) 16:41, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

The answer to the title question is "Usually not well." See for example Trench warfare. The OP's search for generic solutions to a small set of warfaring problems sounds as though we are being asked to help design a video game. For a view of real issues that takes account of different prevailing centuries see Military logistics. Note that real soldiers tend to defecate, there will be those who rape and pillage, or have infiltrated to spy for the enemy. Battlefield medicine is the art of treating war wounds such as these but perhaps not all at once. Blooteuth (talk) 15:49, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

Fighting during the day rather than at night also means that you don't have to invest heavily in infared/night vision equipment for both soldiers and vehicles for visibility, and it's easier for reservists called up from civilian life and morale in general to fight during the hours a human is normally awake, rather than having to adjust their sleep cycle. See also Night combat#Effects of night. Alcherin (talk) 16:26, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

This short description of military logistics may be useful for our discussion. Besides that provided by the State for the troops, for most of history, the average soldier was expected to provide for their own food. This meant they may have purchased it, but in reality, for many armies, they subsisted on looting: euphemistically called "foraging" (when stealing food) and "quartering" (when stealing accommodations), basically soldiers were expected to find their own food, and this often meant walking into someone's house and taking it. This is also sometimes known as "living off the land", again a nicer bit of euphemism than "stealing from the peasants". --Jayron32 16:34, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

"Quartering" was precisely why the Third Amendment to the United States Constitution was passed, which severely restricts the practice. As to "foraging", as Napoleon learned, relying on it seriously exposes you to the enemy resorting to scorched earth tactics. Napoleon's invasion of Russia failed partly due to not preparing for the weather. But the total reliance on "foraging" was a major undoing. Had the French army had its own logistics chain for the supply of food, scorched earth tactics would have hurt a lot less. Eliyohub (talk) 17:16, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

Also soldiers out foraging are not available for combat, susceptible to be captured or killed, and may turn neutral civilians solidly against their side. They might also find liquor and get drunk. Leaving poisoned or infected supplies around for them to steal is another possibility. StuRat (talk) 20:46, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

For that reason, the British Army supplied rations to their troops from early in the 18th century, combined with harsh penalties for looting; see British military rations during the French and Indian War. The downside is that armies cost more and need a better logistic "tail". Alansplodge (talk) 08:59, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

Perhaps, but note that the Quartering Acts were one of the major grievances of the American colonists against the British, hence the aforementioned amendment. So whilst looting may have been banned, "quartering" obviously went on. Our article on the acts elaborates on these laws. Eliyohub (talk) 05:30, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

Thanks, I'd never heard of that. A later version, still in use in the Second World War, was billeting where soldiers were foisted on local householders, but they were entitled to an allowance, at least in theory. My father was billeted with some nice people in Collumpton in 1939 and they corresponded for years afterwards. Alansplodge (talk) 11:11, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

May 4

No money = no marriage?

Q.1. There is a scene in Great Expectations (2012) where Herbert Pocket says he wants to marry so-and-so, but he doesn't have the money yet; that's why he intends to delay marriage. In the novel A Christmas Carol, by Charles Dickens, there is that girl who tells Ebenezer Scrooge that she's a "dowerless" girl. The same concept seems to flow: no money means no marriage. If that is the case, then how did the poor peasants get married?

Q.2. If one is living on a farm, then would one receive a sexual education by observing and manipulating farm animals? Or did people just think that if a male and a female were put together in the same house, then babies would appear inexplicably? 50.4.236.254 (talk) 03:03, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

I split your 2 questions for ease of comprehension. -- Jack of Oz ^{[pleasantries]} 03:23, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

According to Sex education, before formal sex education courses, about-to-be-married persons were typically told about this by their parents prior to their marriage, if they hadn't figured it out already from watching animals or walking in on another couple in the act. According to Dowry#Europe, the wealthy sometimes payed dowries for the poor as a form of charity, and from the looks of it, the dowry for a poor woman might not have been that much back then. Premarital sex mentions that in such times, marriage was expected to follow an out-of-wedlock pregnancy. So maybe the parents could be encouraged to relax their conditions on the dowry if you forced the issue? But that's just my speculation. Someguy1221 (talk) 03:38, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

On the other question it's not the absence of evidence which is the cause any of unwilling pregnancies, but rather a preference for not knowing. Thus all times there were ones who could definitely deliver information about the process, women who had themselves survived any series of childbearing years. --Askedonty (talk) 08:50, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

50.4.236.254 -- during the 19th century in England, most couples who aspired to live a middle-class lifestyle after their marriage had to have a middle-class family income already lined up (in one way or another), or it would not be realistic for them to get married in the first place. Dowry payments in the formal sense weren't too common outside aristocratic elites, but it was quite common for both the bride's family and the groom's family to make what contributions they reasonably could towards the couple's future expenses in setting up and running a new household (sometimes formalized as legal "settlements").
It was a little different for the lower classes, but Malthus wrote about the preventive check of delaying the age of marriage among those who can't afford it... AnonMoos (talk) 04:34, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

I guess there's no Wikipedia article on "preventive check(s)", though there probably should be... AnonMoos (talk) 04:42, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

I've redirected the term to Malthusianism. Rojomoke (talk) 09:23, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

The dowry was the property that the bride brought to the marriage, and was often subject to a legal agreement known as a marriage settlement. Sometimes this was known as a "portion". (Not strictly a reliable source, but a readable overview: The Regency Estate: How it was Apportioned.) Some of the portable items the bride brought are described under trousseau and hope chest. What the groom brought to the marriage could better be described as his prospects. A young man needed to have finished his apprenticeship, or the equivalent for those of the professional classes, and have established himself in the world, before responsible parents would consent to their daughter's marriage. So he needed a good job, first and foremost, or a share in an established company. He had to be able to "keep" a family (remember that children, once they started coming, might arrive with unpredictable frequency). The assumption (in many of the gradations of social class described by Dickens) is that respectable married women did not work outside the home, and did not need to earn money. As for "poor peasants", Herbert Pocket was first encountered as a "pale young gentleman", and although Scrooge's boyhood sweetheart was poor, I could read no inference of country life. Agricultural workers could, in theory, go to "the big house" (their employer, the squire) for help, or to the vicar. Feudalism was dead, but noblesse oblige. Carbon Caryatid (talk) 12:43, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

Did the ancient Chinese explore and map out Siberia (North Asia)?

Did any ancient Chinese explorer go to the greater Siberia region and make maps of it? What was his name? Did the ancient Korean and Japanese also explore and map out Siberia? 2607:FEA8:A760:324:ADB0:8DB4:AE65:6453 (talk) 12:16, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

How far back do you consider to be ancient? In the 2nd c. BC, Zhang Qian went to what is now Tajikistan and along the way ‘discovered’ tribes in Central Asia3 The Chinese knew of the Xirong (“western warlike people”) and Beidi (“northern barbarians”) peoples as early as the Shang Dynasty (1765-1122 BCE). During the same millennium, trade between from Badakhshan (Afghanistan/Pakistan) through Yarkland (Xinjiang) to China was common. So, it might be more accurate to ask when the Sredny Stog nomads explored what later became China.DOR (HK) (talk) 13:50, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

History of Siberia and Prehistory of Siberia are places you can go to help you research this. --Jayron32 14:11, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

Base on Chinese cosmology, they were aware of Lake Baikal and thought it was a Northern Sea where the Northern Dragon King lived. And according to the Lake Baikal article, the Chinese fought the Han-Xiongnu War up to its shores.. --KAVEBEAR (talk) 16:23, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

Not specific examples of explorers, but they definitely knew of, made military expeditions into and claimed parts of Siberia; see Han–Xiongnu War, and the Tang Dynasty Beiting Protectorate (zh) and Protectorate General to Pacify the North (zh). Sakhalin#History provides some information on Japanese exploration and colonization to their north, albeit in the 1600s. Korean kingdoms at various points in history also had loose control over some of eastern Siberia/Manchuria (e.g. Goguryeo, Balhae).

L. Monaco

Does anybody know when L. Monaco a 19th-century photographer on 702 Market Street, California was active from (i.e. specific year range)? Also what did the L stand for in his name?--KAVEBEAR (talk) 16:18, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

"Seventeen year old Louis Monaco arrived in California from his native Switzerland in 1859... In the late 1860s he became interested in photography and eventually established his first studio on C Street in Virginia City. He moved the studio to Eureka Nevada in 1871 and was soon acknowledged as one of the premiere photographers of that booming mining town. His younger brother, JB, newly arrived from the "old country" joined him there in 1875. The two brothers remained in Eureka through good times and bad until a severely declining Eureka economy prompted their move to San Francisco in 1888". They moved to 702 Market St after "approximately two years". [11] The same article goes on to say that Louis died in 1887, but that must be a typo for "1897". Alansplodge (talk) 16:28, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

I also found these pictures of the Monaco family in the ruins of 702 Market St following the 1906 San Francisco earthquake. Alansplodge (talk) 16:32, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

Thanks, so a photograph labeled "L. Monaco" with the Market Street address would most likely be from between 1890 and 1897, correct?--KAVEBEAR (talk) 23:02, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

Correct (most likely). Alansplodge (talk) 08:33, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

How did humans travel before knowledge about other languages became readily available?

If a human wants to travel from Point A, which is in the Middle East, to Point B, which is in China, and doesn't know a single thing about the culture or language, then how would he communicate with the locals who look like humans and seem to talk like humans? For example, Jews migrated from the Middle East to China and settled there and interbred with the natives and built synagogues. How long does it take for one group of people to learn a language of another group of people without bilingual dictionaries? 140.254.70.33 (talk) 18:11, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

The example of Lewis and Clark is instructive; they found a translator at one end of the journey who knew enough to translate the language with the next group of people. Then, they'd take someone from that group along to translate for the next group. At one point, a chain of translators as deep as 4-5 languages would get going. here we see the example of English -> French -> Hidatsa -> Shoshone and then back again. It was laborious, but it got the job done. --Jayron32 18:28, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

How did the translator know of European languages? Could people marry people from another tribe without a common language and the child will understand both parents' languages? 140.254.70.33 (talk) 18:34, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

Did you read the article i linked or are you just riffing on ideas in your head without actually looking at what I have provided? It actually lists a chain of translations from a specific example with specific people who each knew two languages well enough to translate from the last person in the chain to the next one. It's not complicated. --Jayron32 18:52, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

Some languages were known across a whole region as a lingua franca. Marco Polo for instance, is thought to have had a knowledge of Persian, which was understood at the court of the Yuan emperors. [12] Latin and Greek (and later French) were understood by educated people right across Europe, and Arabic across the Middle East and much of Africa. When Francis Xavier went to Japan in 1547, he just had to teach himself Japanese from scratch - see History of the Catholic Church in Japan. By the time William Adams arrived in Japan in 1600, he was saved from having to communicate with impromptu sign-language by a Christian convert at the Shogunal court who spoke Portuguese, which Adams had a working knowledge of. Alansplodge (talk) 19:44, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

Also there is often a genetic relationship between languages from the same family. A Romanian friend claimed to be able to understand spoken Spanish, despite having no knowledge of the language. Sadly, he found that Spaniards can't understand Romanian. Alansplodge (talk) 20:11, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

Given time one side could teach the other their language - or at least what was necessary for communication at first. It's not actually as difficult as it sounds, since many words can be learned by sight, actions and repetition. Any children born and raised in areas where the two sides met (particularly those of mixed birth) could also easily gain a working understanding of both languages. Alternatively pidgin/creole languages were be developed to allow basic trade-related communication between the two sides, for example Chinese Pidgin English and Macanese Patois. Merchants and sailors would spend plenty of time resting and resupplying after reaching foreign ports, after all. And finally as mentioned above knowledge of intermediate languages could aid communication - e.g. the Portuguese could use Arabic to communicate with Indians. Alcherin (talk) 20:56, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

See also Language contact. Alcherin (talk) 21:06, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

Are you the same person as the one who keeps on putting similar type questions here with the ip 50.4.236.254 ? Dmcq (talk) 22:21, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

Both IP's geolocate to the same spot in Ohio. The one in this section specifically goes to Ohio State U. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 22:43, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

The Romani people migrated from India to Europe.
Sleigh (talk) 04:19, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

Picture Post cover

I have just got hold of a copy of Three Plays by Laurie Lee. On the cover is a photograph of Lee writing. On the wall in thebackground is a Picture Post cover with a dark-haired woman in a blouse. I would like to know which issue the cover is from, and the story the picture accompanied, and the identity of the woman too if possible. You can see the picture here. Thank you, DuncanHill (talk) 23:28, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

If you google image "picture post magazine front covers", which I just did but have not examined the results yet, it's possible the cover is in there. If all else fails, it appears there's a pay site that has an archive of the magazine's pictures.[13] ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 00:35, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

It ran weekly from 1938 to 1957 so there's the best part of a thousand possibilities. Alansplodge (talk) 08:28, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

Google image search for "picture post" cover gives a more targeted selection than Bugs's suggestion, but I can't see that particular cover in the results. AndrewWTaylor (talk) 09:31, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

Government of North Korea powers on paper, regardless of practical reality

1. On paper, who is the most powerful official in North Korea? Is it Kim Jong-un as the chairman of the State Affairs Commission, or Kim Yong-nam as the President of the Presidium of the Supreme People's Assembly, or Pak Pong-ju as the Prime Minister of North Korea, or someone else? I'm ignoring the President, since I doubt that many government responsibilities, even on paper, are assigned to dead people.
2. On paper, do any Workers' Party officials have any governmental power? I understand that there's a lot of overlap between Party officeholders and government officeholders; I'm just talking about the governmental powers (if any) that on paper are assigned to Party offices. And again, ignoring the General Secretary of the Party, since he is dead. Nyttend (talk) 23:56, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

Corpses have been put on trial, complete with counsel appointed to represent them. The North Koreans are obviously doing an old practice in reverse. Eliyohub (talk) 05:32, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

May 5

ATOS work capability assessment

I think that means Atos rather than the all caps version. Apparently Prince Philip announced his retirement yesterday at age 95, but then was pronounced fit to work by this agency.[14] What's this supposed to mean and why did they check him? I doubt that he applied to go on the dole (some take the view that he's already on it), or that anyone that age would be turned down. Is this something normally only done on regular working stiffs who are trying to get benefits, or what? Thanks! 173.228.123.121 (talk) 01:05, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

Oh heh, nm. Apparently that article was something the Brits call "hiuma". I didn't figure it out at first. 173.228.123.121 (talk) 01:12, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

I like the bit about him volunteering to run a checkout at Greggs :-) Nyttend (talk) 05:31, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

The Rochdale Herald is a satirical website - and quite a funny one. Wymspen (talk) 07:53, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

Hiuma? A province of Poland? Alansplodge (talk) 08:39, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

Okay, the penny has dropped - "hiuma" equals "hoo-moor" for those who can't be bothered with yods. Alansplodge (talk) 11:05, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

From the Latin, Humira. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 11:21, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

BTW, the article you linked to does basically cover why the Atos joke came up, it also links to Work Capability Assessment which has more details. Note in particular that it says Atos only deals with Personal Independence Payment now, the normal WCA is carried out by Maximus Inc. Nil Einne (talk) 12:41, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

Yeah, I saw about WCA and Atos. Philip stepped down from his longtime ribbon-cutting duties at an advanced age, so I imagined that people might infer that he was gravely ill, and his going to get a physical exam from Atos in order to assure people he wasn't about to collapse. "Hiuma" is from a French movie whose name I'd forgotten (I thought it was called "Wit" but apparently not). 173.228.123.121 (talk) 19:19, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

Susanovo-Mythen Circle

Does anybody know what this is? It is related to Japanese history and culture. This man here: Alexander Slawik, was writing a book on it. The German version (translation may not be accurate) is: Susanowo-Mythenkreis und zur kulturhistori-schen Stellung des Izumo-Gebietes im alten Japan. What is it> I can't locate a Wikipedia article, or German article, or google books, web. The man who was collecting material on it, was an absolute expert on it, with over 60+ year of study (he died at age 97 and was still working), so I suspect it is probably extremly byzantine. Hope it is not too hard. I would like to known, so I can get an article on it. Any help is appreciated. scope_creep (talk) 13:44, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

"Susanowo" is Susanoo-no-Mikoto. "Mythenkreis" would be something like "myth cycle". DuncanHill (talk) 13:49, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

So, the sentence in German you quoted is "Susanovo myth-cycle and the cultural-historical position of the Izumo area in ancient Japan" DuncanHill (talk) 13:57, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

Thanks DuncanHill. I just found it, this second, after searching for about an hour. I'm glad there is an article on it. scope_creep (talk) 15:31, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

Price stipulation before capitalism

Were prices in the pre capitalist era also subject to markt forces? What has changed when societies became capitalist? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 31.177.98.121 (talk) 13:59, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

Some form of free market forces have existed for all of history. What we think of as the "capitalist era" represents a change in thinking of macroeconomics from wealth-as-control-of-resources (so-called mercantalism) to wealth-as-control-of-means-of-production (capitalism). That doesn't mean that markets didn't happen or that concepts like supply and demand determining prices didn't happen. What happened is that people started studying how such markets operate. They didn't invent those market forces, they just codified them. On the small scale, the price of goods has always been determined by "What you are willing to sell it for, and what I am willing to pay" Some industries have been protected by state monopoly and heavy regulation, but even in so-called capitalist societies, there are some of those too (i.e. health insurance and utilities in the U.S>). It isn't like Adam Smith woke up one day and invented the idea that people should sell goods in markets, and that prices fluctuate with supply and demand. --Jayron32 14:07, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

Re: 'On the small scale, the price of goods has always been determined by "What you are willing to sell it for, and what I am willing to pay" ' ... not always. As far back as the Code of Hammurabi there were attempts at price controls, even on a small scale, such as the fare to cross a river by ferry boat: (section 275:[15]). StuRat (talk) 21:08, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

31.177.98.121 -- Even in the most decentralized possible form of pre-modern trade — "silent barter", where the two parties don't recognize any common authority, don't talk to each other, and stay at a physical distance from each other — there's negotiation over prices... AnonMoos (talk) 15:14, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

See also: black market, which could be seen as proto-capitalism, and exists in virtually all economic systems. 107.15.152.93 (talk) 19:05, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

And, for an example of "What has changed when societies became capitalist?", see: Sprouts of capitalism perhaps. Although that article isn't particularly helpful, China's experimental endeavors in capitalism could provide insight into societal changes. 107.15.152.93 (talk) 19:20, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

"Airplane Egg" got burned by cargo cult?

I refer to this story: "PS I like the story about the cargo cult folks who saw airplanes during

  WWII for the first time. One crashed with a bomb on board. They tried to
  hatch the "airplane egg" by warming it in a fire. Another case of
  a group who didn't have a clue of the "real" physics of what they
  saw, and used a flawed analogy to interpret the data."

אילן שמעוני (talk) 19:51, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

This sounds like apocryphal mambo jumbo. Fake news. Aspro (talk) 20:21, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

The earliest version of this I can find to this story on line is from Niven & Barnes 1981 sci-fi adventure, Dream Park. It's then mentioned again verbatim in a 1994 google discussion group. See here.

Does Niven cites any source? אילן שמעוני (talk) 21:28, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

No. You can read what they wrote by searching the google result I linked to above, then search (ctrl-f) from the bottom up. (Otherwise you will hit "thatch" 11 times first. Personally, I think it's apocryphal. I don't see them getting a fire hot enough, or thinking it wouldn't kill the egg. μηδείς (talk) 21:36, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

American citizens with official titles of nobility or peerages

Are there any American citizens living with official titles of nobility or peerages (not titles used by royals or nobles of abolished monarchies)? And theoritically, can peers from current European monarchies settled in the US, gain US citizenship, pass down their titles to their children born in the US with US citizens hips and effectively form an American branch of that noble family.--96.41.155.253 (talk) 21:38, 5 May 2017 (UTC)