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See also: Logged AE sanctions

Important information

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Please use this page only to:

request administrative action against editors violating a remedy (not merely a principle) or an injunction in an Arbitration Committee decision, or a contentious topic restriction imposed by an administrator,
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Only autoconfirmed users may file enforcement requests here; requests filed by IPs or accounts less than four days old or with less than 10 edits will be removed. All users are welcome to comment on requests except where doing so would violate an active restriction (such as an extended-confirmed restriction). If you make an enforcement request or comment on a request, your own conduct may be examined as well, and you may be sanctioned for it. Enforcement requests and statements in response to them may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator. (Word Count Tool) Statements must be made in separate sections. Non-compliant contributions may be removed or shortened by administrators. Disruptive contributions such as personal attacks, or groundless or vexatious complaints, may result in blocks or other sanctions.

To make an enforcement request, click on the link above this box and supply all required information. Incomplete requests may be ignored. Requests reporting diffs older than one week may be declined as stale. To appeal a contentious topic restriction or other enforcement decision, please create a new section and use the template {{Arbitration enforcement appeal}}.

Appeals and administrator modifications of contentious topics restrictions

The Arbitration Committee procedures relating to modifications of contentious topic restrictions state the following:

All contentious topic restrictions (and logged warnings) may be appealed. Only the restricted editor may appeal an editor restriction. Any editor may appeal a page restriction.

The appeal process has three possible stages. An editor appealing a restriction may:

ask the administrator who first made the contentious topic restrictions (the "enforcing administrator") to reconsider their original decision;
request review at the arbitration enforcement noticeboard ("AE") or at the administrators' noticeboard ("AN"); and
submit a request for amendment ("ARCA"). If the editor is blocked, the appeal may be made by email.

Appeals submitted at AE or AN must be submitted using the applicable template.

A rough consensus of administrators at AE or editors at AN may specify a period of up to one year during which no appeals (other than an appeal to ARCA) may be submitted.

Changing or revoking a contentious topic restriction

An administrator may only modify or revoke a contentious topic restriction if a formal appeal is successful or if one of the following exceptions applies:

The administrator who originally imposed the contentious topic restriction (the "enforcing administrator") affirmatively consents to the change,^[a] or is no longer an administrator;^[b] or
The contentious topic restriction was imposed (or last renewed) more than a year ago and:
- the restriction was imposed by a single administrator, or
- the restriction was an indefinite block.

A formal appeal is successful only if one of the following agrees with revoking or changing the contentious topic restriction:

a clear consensus of uninvolved administrators at AE,
a clear consensus of uninvolved editors at AN,
a majority of the Arbitration Committee, acting through a motion at ARCA.

Any administrator who revokes or changes a contentious topic restriction out of process (i.e. without the above conditions being met) may, at the discretion of the Arbitration Committee, be desysopped.

Standard of review
On community review

Uninvolved administrators at the arbitration enforcement noticeboard ("AE") and uninvolved editors at the administrators' noticeboard ("AN") should revoke or modify a contentious topic restriction on appeal if:

the action was inconsistent with the contentious topics procedure or applicable policy (i.e. the action was out of process),
the action was not reasonably necessary to prevent damage or disruption when first imposed, or
the action is no longer reasonably necessary to prevent damage or disruption.

On Arbitration Committee review

Arbitrators hearing an appeal at a request for amendment ("ARCA") will generally overturn a contentious topic restriction only if:

the action was inconsistent with the contentious topics procedure or applicable policy (i.e. the action was out of process),
the action represents an unreasonable exercise of administrative enforcement discretion, or
compelling circumstances warrant the full Committee's action.

^ The administrator may indicate consent at any time before, during, or after imposition of the restriction.
^ This criterion does not apply if the original action was imposed as a result of rough consensus at the arbitration enforcement noticeboard, as there would be no single enforcing administrator.

Appeals and administrator modifications of non-contentious topics sanctions

The Arbitration Committee procedures relating to modifications and appeals state:

Appeals by sanctioned editors

Appeals may be made only by the editor under sanction and only for a currently active sanction. Requests for modification of page restrictions may be made by any editor. The process has three possible stages (see "Important notes" below). The editor may:

ask the enforcing administrator to reconsider their original decision;
request review at the arbitration enforcement noticeboard ("AE") or at the administrators’ noticeboard ("AN"); and
submit a request for amendment at the amendment requests page ("ARCA"). If the editor is blocked, the appeal may be made by email through Special:EmailUser/Arbitration Committee (or, if email access is revoked, to arbcom-enwikimedia.org).

Modifications by administrators

No administrator may modify or remove a sanction placed by another administrator without:

the explicit prior affirmative consent of the enforcing administrator; or
prior affirmative agreement for the modification at (a) AE or (b) AN or (c) ARCA (see "Important notes" below).

Administrators modifying sanctions out of process may at the discretion of the committee be desysopped.

Nothing in this section prevents an administrator from replacing an existing sanction issued by another administrator with a new sanction if fresh misconduct has taken place after the existing sanction was applied.

Administrators are free to modify sanctions placed by former administrators – that is, editors who do not have the administrator permission enabled (due to a temporary or permanent relinquishment or desysop) – without regard to the requirements of this section. If an administrator modifies a sanction placed by a former administrator, the administrator who made the modification becomes the "enforcing administrator". If a former administrator regains the tools, the provisions of this section again apply to their unmodified enforcement actions.

Important notes:

For a request to succeed, either

(i) the clear and substantial consensus of (a) uninvolved administrators at AE or (b) uninvolved editors at AN or

(ii) a passing motion of arbitrators at ARCA

is required. If consensus at AE or AN is unclear, the status quo prevails.

While asking the enforcing administrator and seeking reviews at AN or AE are not mandatory prior to seeking a decision from the committee, once the committee has reviewed a request, further substantive review at any forum is barred. The sole exception is editors under an active sanction who may still request an easing or removal of the sanction on the grounds that said sanction is no longer needed, but such requests may only be made once every six months, or whatever longer period the committee may specify.
These provisions apply only to contentious topic restrictions placed by administrators and to blocks placed by administrators to enforce arbitration case decisions. They do not apply to sanctions directly authorized by the committee, and enacted either by arbitrators or by arbitration clerks, or to special functionary blocks of whatever nature.
All actions designated as arbitration enforcement actions, including those alleged to be out of process or against existing policy, must first be appealed following arbitration enforcement procedures to establish if such enforcement is inappropriate before the action may be reversed or formally discussed at another venue.

Information for administrators processing requests

Thank you for participating in this area. AE works best if there are a variety of admins bringing their expertise to each case. There is no expectation to comment on every case, and the Arbitration Committee (ArbCom) thanks all admins for whatever time they can give.

A couple of reminders:

Before commenting, please familiarise yourself with the referenced ArbCom case. Please also read all the evidence (including diffs) presented in the AE request.
When a request widens to include editors beyond the initial request, these editors must be notified and the notifications recorded in the same way as for the initial editor against whom sanctions were requested. Where some part of the outcome is clear, a partial close may be implemented and noted as "Result concerning X".
Enforcement measures in arbitration cases should be construed liberally to protect Wikipedia and keep it running efficiently. Some of the behaviour described in an enforcement request might not be restricted by ArbCom. However, it may violate other Wikipedia policies and guidelines; you may use administrative discretion to resolve it.
More than one side in a dispute may have ArbCom conduct rulings applicable to them. Please ensure these are investigated.

Closing a thread:

Once an issue is resolved, enclose it between {{hat}} and {{hab}} tags. A bot should archive it in 7 days.
Please consider referring the case to ARCA if the outcome is a recommendation to do so or the issue regards administrator conduct.
You can use the templates {{uw-aeblock}} (for blocks) or {{AE sanction}} (for other contentious topic restrictions) to give notice of sanctions on user talk pages.
Please log sanctions in the Arbitration enforcement log.

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Srijanx22

Editors involved are reminded to refrain from edit warring. No other action taken. Seraphimblade ^{Talk to me} 15:06, 18 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.

This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.
Requests may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.

Request concerning Srijanx22

User who is submitting this request for enforcement: FDW777 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 10:39, 6 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

User against whom enforcement is requested: Srijanx22 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)
Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log

Sanction or remedy to be enforced: Wikipedia:Requests for arbitration/India-Pakistan#Standard discretionary sanctions

Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it

17:20, 03 July 2021 Changes the result and removes peer-reviewed journal claiming to "update with a modern scholarly source", while using a truncated quote that when quoted in full refers to a different battle. See here for the full passage
05:29, 05 July 2021 Blanks result field claiming there are concerns at talk page
14:07, 05 July 2021 Same as second diff
10:24, 06 July 2021 Same as second diff
14:40, 05 July 2021 Claims a peer-reviewed journal is a "low-quality source", and provides quotes that are nothing to do with the article

Diffs of previous relevant sanctions, if any

n/a

If discretionary sanctions are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see WP:AC/DS#Awareness and alerts)

Notified

Additional comments by editor filing complaint

@Cinderella157: has explained in depth at Talk:Battle of Saragarhi#Infobox that the subject of the article is the Battle of Saragarhi, quite obviously since that's the name of the article. This refers to a last stand battle where the 21 Sikh defenders fought to the death before being overwhelmed, and all 21 were killed and the attackers captured the outpost. There is no dispute whatsoever about the result, nor could there be since if all defenders are killed and an outpost captured, it's pretty cut and dried which side won and which side lost. The claimed dispute involves quotes such as "The officers and men bad now been under arms for 52 hours , and had actually been on their posts for 50 hours without a rest . The enemy who attacked Saragarhi and Fort Cavagoari were the Mamuzais , Ali Khels and Ali Sherzais", which is a quote that proves, well, absolutely nothing whatsoever.

@Rosguill: there is absolutely no academic dispute regarding the result of the Battle of Saragarhi. The result is almost a textbook example of you don't need to cite that the sky is blue (even though there is a citation). There was a battle involving 21 Indian soldiers versus thousands of Afghan tribesmen. The Indian soldiers were all killed defending an outpost, which was captured by the attackers. There can be no conceivable challenge to that result, how could anyone think it was anything other than an Afghan victory? The only way it has been challenged is by using quotes that refer to a totally different battle that occured several days later. The lead, infobox and text of the article all make it clear exactly which battle is being referred to, giving the exact date, and the respective strengths of each army. Also the use of terms such as "Pyrrhic victory" is specifically deprecated per WP:MILMOS#INFOBOX. FDW777 (talk) 17:29, 11 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested

[1]

Discussion concerning Srijanx22

Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.

Statement by Srijanx22

It is a no-brainer that Indian Defence Review is not more credible than Bloomsbury Publishing, not by a long shot. It was already agreed last year on WP:RSN that Indian Defence Review is not reliable for battles involving India.[2] And when [indiandefencereview.com/spotlights/rezang-la-stands-out/0/ the article in question] is written by an ex military man using the in-house publisher then it should be already obvious.

Overall, this is a content dispute but FWD777 is trying to make a WP:POINT after making 3 reverts in less than 24 hours to add back disputed parameter and providing superficial edit summaries. When that failed, he appears to be misusing this board for winning the content dispute. For a name, see this edit summary where he falsely claims that "Indian victory" is being added. I have already backed my edits on talk page, proving the fact that the multiple fights are all related to this subject as the article already says and I did it before this report was filed.[3] But FWD777 has misrepresented sources on the talk page and refused to read them carefully. This edit by him on talk page tells enough that he admits he is wrong about his claims. Srijanx22 (talk) 13:03, 6 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by (username)

Result concerning Srijanx22

This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.

Looking at the page history prior to the most recent dispute, I'm hard pressed to identify any stable status quo for the infobox result parameter: prior to the currernt edit war between "Afghan victory", "Indian victory" and blank, it was some variation of "British victory" or "Afghan Pyrrhic victory". Thus, while the edit warring by everyone involved was excessive and poor form, the ambiguity of the stable status quo is a mitigating factor, and at this point the page has been fully protected so I don't think further sanctions are necessary. As a side note, the RSN discussion Srijanx22 linked only has one editor opining about Indian Defense Review as far as I can tell, and falls short of establishing a consensus regarding that source's suitability. _signed,Rosguill ^talk 21:17, 8 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
FDW777, my sense is that it's pretty clear where the disagreement comes from; academic RS call the battle a pyrrhic victory for the Afghan forces, which can potentially be interpreted as either a victory or a defeat, particularly given that we have a consensus against including qualifiers like "pyrrhic", with the waters further muddied by what appears to be a tendency in popular Indian historiography to lionize the Battle at of Sargarhi, and to present it as a victory in the context of following battles. Now, as regards the content, I'm sympathetic to your arguments and believe you have made a stronger case. However, the edits in opposition to your position are not at this time, in my view, sufficiently disruptive or tendentious to justify sanctions. _signed,Rosguill ^talk 19:49, 11 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
I would tend to agree with Rosguill. No one looks great here, but I think the underlying issue is a content dispute, and hopefully that can be sorted out while the page is protected. If those involved can't come to agreement, utilize dispute resolution more and the revert button less. Seraphimblade ^{Talk to me} 04:49, 9 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
I agree that apart from some edit warring this looks like a content dispute, and the edit warring has been resolved without the use of discretionary sanctions. Hut 8.5 14:39, 18 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Popsmokes38

Popsmokes38 is indefinitely topic banned from biographies of living persons. Johnuniq (talk) 03:41, 25 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.

Request concerning Popsmokes38

User who is submitting this request for enforcement: FDW777 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 17:13, 16 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

User against whom enforcement is requested: Popsmokes38 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)
Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log

Sanction or remedy to be enforced: Wikipedia:Requests for arbitration/Editing of Biographies of Living Persons

Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it

13:59, 29 June 2021 At Bilawal Bhutto Zardari (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) adds a "Controversies" section that in addition to unreferenced negative commentary, cites several references that don't mention Bilawal Bhutto Zardari. You also have to wonder how the NSA having a recording of his mother talking about black bank accounts is of any direct relevance top an article about her son
14:03, 29 June 2021 At same article, adds text describing the bites by stray dogs as an insanely massive amount of cases
03:51, 5 July 2021 Changes use of surname to given name, claiming to have "fixed more spelling errors"
04:05, 5 July 2021 Edit warring to repeat erroneous name change
01:21, 14 July 2021 Restores badly referenced "Controversies" section
01:53, 15 July 2021 Restores badly referenced "Controversies" section
19:54, 15 July 2021 Restores badly referenced paragraph in "Controversies" section
14:38, 24 June 2021 At Nawaz Sharif (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views), adds "convicted criminal" mention in the opening sentence before even mentioning he's a three time PM of Pakistan
15:00, 24 June 2021 At same article, changes sentence in lead from Most of Sharif's wealth originates from his businesses in steel construction to Most of Sharif's wealth may originate from Money Laundering without a reference, and it's not mentioned in the body of the article either
13:16, 29 June 2021 Edit warring to repeat previous changes
13:21, 29 June 2021 Adds unreferenced claim of which is often a tactic used by money launderers so the money can't be traced back to them to try and insinuate criminal wrongdoing
02:56, 6 July 2021 Edit warring to repeat previous changes

Diffs of previous relevant sanctions, if any

n/a

If discretionary sanctions are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see WP:AC/DS#Awareness and alerts)

Notified

Additional comments by editor filing complaint

Editor has never posted to an article talk page or a user talk page. Could probably be indef blocked as a standard admin action if someone doesn't see the need to discuss for days.

Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested

Notified

Discussion concerning Popsmokes38

Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.

Statement by Popsmokes38

Statement by Peaceray

Popsmokes38 has edit warred, flagrantly violated BLP on Bilawal Bhutto Zardari by posting WP:OR statements unsubstantiated or partially substantiated by citations, & disregarded the MOS. Examples include: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, & 6. I asked Popsmokes38 twice to discuss on the talk page to no avail. On 6 July, FDW777 placed a discretionary sanctions alert here. This editor also called me a paid agent during a BLPVIO revert in this edit summary. Peaceray (talk) 05:14, 17 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by (username)

Result concerning Popsmokes38

This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.

Many of these edits took place before the editor was made aware of discretionary sanctions on 6 July. That said, several took place afterwards, and still consisted of edit warring to reinsert material already objected to on BLP grounds and entirely inappropriate for placement in a BLP. I am also very concerned by this editor's complete lack of talk page communication on these issues. Popsmokes38 has already been blocked 36 hours for BLP violations, but I believe that a BLP topic ban is also in order. Seraphimblade ^{Talk to me} 15:18, 18 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
I wouldn't object to an indef block, either. Seraphimblade ^{Talk to me} 16:22, 19 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Given the total, continuing lack of talk page engagement, I think that an indef block is appropriate, followed by a conditional unblock with restrictions imposed based on how they respond, bearing in mind that their edits thus far betray concerning attitudes vis-a-vis both BLP and India-Pakistan. _signed,Rosguill ^talk 20:09, 18 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
It's possible this person hasn't discovered talk pages yet, and may not have noticed such a short block. I think an indef from article space might be a good step, in case they discover article talk pages before they discover their own user talk. —valereee (talk) 15:19, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
I'd agree with the suggested indef block given the total lack of engagement and the fact this behaviour is continuing. They've been left 32 talk page messages, if they haven't noticed any of them then that's their fault. Hut 8.5 17:38, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Popsmokes38, created 2 March 2021, has 213 edits, all on articles (no talk page comments). This report with no response, combined with this 20 July 2021 edit, makes an indefinite block as an admin-action appropriate. Or, an AE sanction of an indefinite BLP topic ban could be applied. Let's bring this to a close so I'm happy for anyone to act as they believe is appropriate, or I will close with an indef BLP topic ban in around 24 hours. Johnuniq (talk) 02:14, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Arbitration enforcement action appeal by 3Kingdoms

Appeal declined. Johnuniq (talk) 02:26, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.

Appealing user: 3Kingdoms (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) – 3Kingdoms (talk) 01:47, 19 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Sanction being appealed: You are indefinitely topic banned from all pages and discussions related to the Arab–Israeli conflict, broadly construed.

      Topic ban on the subject of the Arab–Israeli conflict, imposed at
      [4], logged at
      [5]

Administrator imposing the sanction: Newslinger (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA)

Notification of that administrator: [6]

Statement by 3Kingdoms

I did not handle the discussion with another user in the correct manner and instead engaged in edit-warring. I know that for this topic there is a 1rr which I intend to follow to the letter. While disagree with the topic ban, I did myself no favors and accept the ban. I think over the last week since I have come back to editing that I have not edit warred or lost my cool and argued with someone. Thus I would like to have this topic ban repealed. If you feel that a total repeal is not possible at the moment could it at least be reduced from being broadly construed. 3Kingdoms (talk) 01:47, 19 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

To defend myself no I have not been edit-warring. In fact on repeated occasions for all I asked for a talk Page. Regarding McMeekin the issue was resvoled in my favor by another editor. The one has to deal with numerous nonaccount users users changing. Finally the person who wrote this has argued with me in the past before and has potential bias. Thank you. 3Kingdoms (talk) 14:21, 19 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Also I have to say it is a little funny that Aquillion's complaint is that I didn't break the 3rr and when I saw that I went past on a 1rr topic I repealed by myself without anyone requesting. 3RR is 3RR if you 2r than you didn't break it. Really don't see the point of their comments. As well if people feel that I should not have it repealed fully would it be possible for it to be downgraded to only applying to current events and persons on said topics, but allowed for Historical pages. Thanks 3Kingdoms (talk) 18:57, 19 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Never claimed it was an "entitlement" just that someone pointlessly brining it up who has argued with me in the past it pretty pointless. Also User:Nableezy complaining about "condescending" remarks is pretty rich. Also wanting to ban after you know not breaking the rules that warrant a sanction is pretty silly. Also I am not sure why GN mentioned an edit summary from before the topic ban, which I already admitted to being upset at said user and thus too head strong and have stopped doing said thing. Also I don't understand why you brought up AP2 when I not been editing pages like that since coming back. Finally I think it would be best for editors where there is potential for bad blood in the case of Aquillion and Nableezy that we follow the advice of Wiki and take a period of time avoiding to cool off. 3Kingdoms (talk) 00:15, 20 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Newslinger

Statement by Nableezy

You'd think that after all these edit-warring blocks and bans one would actually maybe read our policy on edit warring and not continue with the oh so misplaced condescending 3RR is 3RR if you 2r than (sic) you didn't break it. Really don't see the point of their comments. Until this user internalizes our policies on edit-warring he should be restricted from editing. IMO the correct restriction here is a site ban for persistent edit-warring and disruptive editing, but removing restrictions is rather the wrong direction to be taking. nableezy - 23:17, 19 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by (involved editor 2)

Discussion among uninvolved editors about the appeal by 3Kingdoms

For context, this topic ban was for revert-warring and 1RR violations. When 3Kingdoms previously appealed this topic ban (closed without prejudice due to being incomplete), they got banned for violating another 1RR restriction just a few days later, a ban that they just returned from a week ago. Also note that (while not in violation of the 1RR / 3RR), 3kingdoms is currently engaged in edit wars on Settler colonialism, David Stannard, and Sean McMeekin; on Settler colonialism, they had to self-revert to avoid a 1RR violation, and had another revert that was just a few minutes over the 1-day limit. They have generally revert-warred heavily since returning from their ban for a 1RR violation. --Aquillion (talk) 02:16, 19 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Result of the appeal by 3Kingdoms

This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.

I'm thinking that the TBAN should stay where it is. I took a look at 3Kingdoms's recent edit history based on Aquillion's comment, and Aquillion's right - 3Kingdoms is getting into minor edit wars in AP2 (another controversial topic area where DS are active). The attitude expressed in this edit summary also doesn't exactly fill me with confidence that they can follow our rules and expectations surrounding edit-warring. I think Dennis Brown had it right last time 3Kingdoms was here - the topic ban just moved the issues to a different area. If they can't behave well in other controversial topic areas, I'm not seeing a good reason to lift an existing ban from a controversial topic area. If folks really want to give them some rope, I could be persuaded to allow editing in this topic area subject to a 0RR restriction, but I don't have much confidence that it would work. GeneralNotability (talk) 02:54, 19 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
3RR is not an entitlement. The recent low-intensity edit warring, while not rising to the level of requiring sanctions in itself, leaves me disinclined to accept this appeal. _signed,Rosguill ^talk 22:24, 19 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Generally speaking, topic bans should remain in place until the editor can demonstrate their ability to edit productively in another topic area. This has not yet happened. – bradv^🍁 15:08, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
I'd be willing to give the ROPE with a 0RR restriction. Like GN I'm not sure it would work. —valereee (talk) 15:14, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Not yet. I would like to see a clean slate in other areas before lifting. CaptainEek ^{Edits Ho Cap'n!}⚓ 01:58, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

CutePeach

This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.
Requests may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.

Request concerning CutePeach

User who is submitting this request for enforcement: Bakkster Man (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 13:26, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

User against whom enforcement is requested: CutePeach (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)
Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log

Sanction or remedy to be enforced: Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/COVID-19#Discretionary sanctions

Wikipedia:General sanctions/COVID-19#Application notes Wikipedia:Requests for arbitration/Pseudoscience#Appropriate sources

Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it

20 July 2021 Added a proposed explanation of COVID-19 origins based on an unreviewed pre-print, which I selectively reverted, in addition to cleanup to other paragraphs.
21 July 2021 Re-added with no commit comment. Reverted again with clearer comment of policy concerns and reference to ArbCom sanctions in effect.
22 July 2021 Returned content with more context, but prior to receiving Talk page consensus.

Diffs of previous relevant sanctions, if any

None I'm aware of

If discretionary sanctions are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see WP:AC/DS#Awareness and alerts)

Alerted about discretionary sanctions in the area of conflict in the last twelve months, see the system log linked to above.
Participated in an arbitration request or enforcement procedure about the area of conflict in the last twelve months, on 21 June 2021.

Additional comments by editor filing complaint

Per COVID-19 GS (now included under DS): "Editors are reminded that the onus is on the editor seeking to include disputed content to achieve consensus for its inclusion. Any content or source removed in good faith and citing a credible policy-based rationale should not be reinstated without prior consensus on the article's talk page."

Per Pseudoscience ArbCom decision: "4a) Wikipedia:Verifiability and Wikipedia:Reliable sources require that information included in an article have been published in a reliable source which is identified and potentially available to the reader. What constitutes a reliable source varies with the topic of the article, but in the case of a scientific theory, there is a clear expectation that the sources for the theory itself are reputable textbooks or peer-reviewed journals. Scientific theories promulgated outside these media are not properly verifiable as scientific theories and should not be represented as such."

Editor appears to have violated both counts, despite explicit reminder of sanctions.

@Mr Ernie: I'll note that I went one step further, removing that entire paragraph for the same reason as above: the claims about the origin were entirely based on statements which had not been peer reviewed. The dispute is not merely over the WP:GEVAL rebuttal of an unreviewed claim (about which I would have agreed with you and self-reverted), but the initial claim itself. Bakkster Man (talk) 14:11, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Mr Ernie: I'm uncertain why you suggest I am imposing a "requirement, against consensus, that such material come from WP:MEDRS compliant sources". I have not mentioned MEDRS in this dispute a single time, because it does not apply as you rightly point out. I've referred specifically to the much lower threshold of merely being a peer-reviewed claim, rather than WP:PREPRINTS. I'm unaware of a consensus decision on this topic, and my current understanding of WP:ONUS means we should reach consensus on it prior to re-adding content sourced by it. Bakkster Man (talk) 15:34, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Regarding comments by Francesco espo. I reverted the change prior to even seeing that a Talk page comment had been made by CutePeach. While I do not believe my policy concerns were directly addressed by them on Talk, more importantly consensus had not yet been reached for the contentious addition which leads me to believe the correct course of action remained reverting until that consensus was reached. Bakkster Man (talk) 22:08, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@El C: Perhaps you can explain your aside more thoroughly? While I generally consider this noticeboard to avoid handling the content disputes themselves, I'm interested what role you consider a newspaper editorial to play in the discussion of reliable sourcing in an article about a scientific hypothesis. I'd appreciate any clarification you could provide in case my understanding of reliable sourcing policy is mistaken. Bakkster Man (talk) 13:03, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested

[7]

Discussion concerning CutePeach

Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.

Statement by CutePeach

Space reserved for response. CutePeach (talk) 03:04, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Valereee: I always prepare my edits in Evernote and the update I made to COVID-19 investigations was (mostly) prepared before this case was opened. Contrary to what RandomCanadian claims, the contribution was received well, though my deletion of some text was a mistake. CutePeach (talk) 03:04, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Valereee: I managed to read and write quite a lot today, so next I need to make some clarification requests and translate my statements from Tagalog to English. Please can you give me an idea of the expected close of this case? What is the average duration of AE cases? CutePeach (talk) 14:48, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@HighInBC: please see my note addressed to Valereee. Please note also that Shibbolethink has changed the text of his complaint since I saw it yesterday, and I haven’t even managed to read it in full. It is a very lengthy complaint, which he says he has been preparing for a long time. It would only be fair to give me time to formulate a response. CutePeach (talk) 03:04, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@CaptainEek: if you are familiar with my account, you will know I make most of my edits on weekends, and that includes writing a lot of notes for pages and edits I have yet to publish. I am a public health policy professional in a country with the highest rate of vaccine hesitancy in the world, due to the Dengvaxia controversy. This is my chief concern, but I now I can make time to reply. CutePeach (talk) 03:04, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Shibbolethink: You accuse me in your complaint of personal attacks. This is a very serious accusation which needs to be supported with evidence, so that I can either admit to it or counter it in the statement I am preparing. Please can you provide diffs to the WP:NPA violations you accuse me of? Please don’t include the time I questioned your WP:COMPETENCE for missciting papers here [8] as that was legitimate criticism, and not a personal attack. If it is found by an discerning admin that you had those papers mixed up to argue a point, and that you were continuing to argue that point countering the expert opinions given in reliable source - without providing a reliable source of your own - then my criticism should be considered legitimate, and your NPA accusations false. Please also don’t include the time I asked you to go back to China to learn how the government there works when you suggested checking the minutes of their lab, as that was in clear reference to your first visit to China, which you mentioned in your paper that you have asked me and everyone else to read. It was certainly not complimentary, for which I should apologise and not do again, but it was certainly not a personal attack. CutePeach (talk) 16:49, 25 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Colin:, ProcrastinatingReader used to be anti lab-leak and if you read here in this earlier AE, I directed extremely sharp words at him [9]. Since then, ProcrastinatingReader has obviously read some of the reliable sources describing the hypothesis in some detail, and as a good Wikipedian, he has come around to the fact that it should be covered neutrally. You will see in that AE, an editor was banned for the sin of not engaging in the BRD process with the WP:NOLABLEAK editors, quite simply because they are abusing it in their favor, which we clearly see here [10]. You seem to be completely unaware of the ploys some editors have gotten up to [11]. I have never proposed for the hypothesis and rationale to be covered as scientific theory and for that rationale to be presented as evidence, yet all the discussions I am forced to participate in are as if I am doing that. CutePeach (talk) 17:45, 25 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by ToBeFree

Procedural note: The cited text "Editors are reminded that the onus is on the editor seeking to include disputed content to achieve consensus for its inclusion. Any content or source removed in good faith and citing a credible policy-based rationale should not be reinstated without prior consensus on the article's talk page." is from Special:Diff/957951138 (Wikipedia:General sanctions/COVID-19; referring to AN-Archive 320#Proposal.) and has not been copied to WP:COVIDDS. WP:ONUS is part of the verifiability policy, not specific to these sanctions. ~ ToBeFree (talk) 13:42, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Tu-quoque-style arguments have a capability to distract from the topic and tend to be unhelpful. ~ ToBeFree (talk) 14:56, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
The requirement to follow relevant policies when editing in such controversial areas is not dependent on one's willingness to report others for violations. There are two sentences beginning with "If Bakkster Man" below that contain such a condition, unnecessarily. Complaining about editors' conduct with relevant diffs is fine; doing so to weaken, question, or distract from the report is not. If the reporter's conduct is questionable, this can be worded in a neutral way without a tu quoque accusation. ~ ToBeFree (talk) 15:49, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Mr Ernie

If Bakkster Man is going to report editors for allegedly failing to follow ONUS, then they should probably not also be doing the exact same thing. So let's just cut right to it - this is nothing more than an attempt to remove an editor with an opposing viewpoint from the topic area. Mr Ernie (talk) 14:05, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

You made those edits in discrete steps. So what's important? The process? Then you also didn't follow what you're reporting CutePeach for. The result? Well that's the same too since your version is currently what the article says for both the content CutePeach and me were concerned about. Mr Ernie (talk) 14:21, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Can you please link to the discussion where consensus dictated that only peer reviewed sources apply to the claims about the origin of COVID? From what I can find the latest RFC actually opposed that. Mr Ernie (talk) 14:25, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not exactly sure how tu-quoque is relevant here. I'm going by the text written under "Important Information" that's at the top of the page, saying If you make an enforcement request or comment on a request, your own conduct may be examined as well, and you may be sanctioned for it. If Bakkster Man is serious enough about the restrictions in place to report editors here, then they ought to follow them as well. Mr Ernie (talk) 15:38, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Selective enforcement of sanctions in controversial areas is a bit of a pet peeve of mine, especially between editors having different opinions on content. Bakkster Man is reverting on the grounds of sourcing claims which have been rejected by the community several times in several places, placing unnecessary burdens upon editors to gain some (already existing) consensus for inclusion. Mr Ernie (talk) 16:33, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@CaptainEek: re: Oh lableak, what problems thou dost cause...can anyone point me towards what the current consensus on covering it is? Or provide the key RfC's on the matter? It seems this dispute is emblematic of a deeper issue that lacks appropriate guidance. which is such a great question, and I'm really glad you asked it. There was a recent RFC which determined that it was fine to source content regarding disease and pandemic origin to normal RS (aka the normal RS policy applies). There is also a current AFD where there's overwhelming consensus that the lab leak hypothesis is a valid article. If you look closely you'll notice that a couple editors (who also happen to have commented here) take an opposite position to CutePeach. HighinBC refers to a "time sink" supposedly caused by CP, but a simple glance at the many COVID origin topics (in addition to this very filing) will reveal again those same names dropping walls of texts (in this filing alone more than 3000 words excluding the filer) of civil POV pushing about why this topic (despite overwhelming consensus) is a problem. So in essence here we have a very simple content dispute, that is, edit warring, reported by an editor who has also edit warred (1 2 3). The bottom line here is that the initial reversion by Bakkster Man here (which they followed up with 2 more reversions) is an invalid rationale for removal, as the normal RS policy applies because the content is sourced to two RS. The main issue is the requirement, against consensus, that such material come from WP:MEDRS compliant sources. I think that Bakkster Man should receive a sanction for editing against community consensus.

I think CutePeach should consider not posting a response here, as the same involved editors are openly collaborating about this filing with the same wall of text tactics that are deployed in the topic areas directly. This is a simple issue and quick look at the diffs reveals 2 editors in a minor edit war. As a final point, ToBeFree, can you please indicate your status as involved or uninvolved, given your comments in the discussion area here (the tu quoque comments), admin area here (the request for diffs which were never given and the block), talk pages, and user talk pages (the de facto topic ban) and recent admin actions? I will close by saying that we really ought not to succor weaponized content DS filings. Mr Ernie (talk) 03:02, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I'm (ironically) requesting an extension to the word limit. Mr Ernie (talk) 03:03, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

AE is a confusing and often Kafka-esque process even for experienced editors. CutePeach is a promising editor with only 4 months tenure here so far. There’s an overwhelming amount of words to respond to from editors loquacious both here and at the relevant article talk pages. CutePeach’s statement is sure to be picked through with a fine tooth comb so I am willing to cut them some slack for any delays.

Statement by Atsme

I agree with Mr Ernie for the most part, and I'll add that I'm not seeing any justification for removal of the material that was added in GF by CutePeach, aside from IDONTLIKEIT by the reverting editor. Did I overlook something? Tagging the material with ^{[citation needed]} or something similar instead of removing it would have been a better option, or better yet, taking the time to cite a better source, rather than bringing a case here. I consider such behavior the antithesis to collaboration. The article in question is not a BLP that requires immediate removal of material without any attempt to find a better source, or to at least discuss it amicably. The reverting editor should neither have first advantage, nor should we consider their revert automatically justified based on a technicality without first considering IAR, and CONTEXT which is paramount when determining a source's reliability. It has been argued that the lab leak hypothesis is politically motivated, and that possibly media "has fallen victim to a misinformation campaign" as stated in this BMJ article. Regardless of what side of the argument one is on, the hypothesis is notable, and so are the substantial views that have been published by reliable media. The sources used do not have to pass WP:MEDRS in this case, and I think the claim of unreliable needs closer scrutiny. Atsme 💬 📧 16:04, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by RandomCanadian

Beyond the rather mundane edit-warring, in clear violation of expected standards, especially in an area under DS, CP's persistent uncivility and WP:BATTLEGROUND mentality - evidenced both by their actions on articles and their recent ramblings on Tobias' talk page (where they accuse me, PaleoNeonate, and unspecified admins of conspiring to silence them... [12] [13]), as well as their refusal to follow the most basic content policies (AGF applies to behaviour not to article content: unsourced, poorly sourced or non-neutral and undue content must be challenged, as per WP:V and WP:NPOV, no matter what one thinks of the intentions of the editor who included it - what applies here is WP:ONUS).

Additionally, I note that CP is well aware of the issues with their editing, having notably been warned of it previously by Shibbolethink ([14]) Them continuing on this path despite this is evidence they are digging their own hole, and, unlike Jule Verne or Dante, their voyage into the abyss is unlikely to have any redeeming literary quality. A full, prolonged topic ban is likely in order. RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 17:26, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Talk of much ado about nothing, Francesco. I've already explained my edit here, and your take on it is not any less misleading than CP's. ToBeFree In the process of adding the diffs above (leave me a bit of time to find the most telling ones). Tell me, there's one remedy which I didn't think of until now: given CP's seemingly persistent interest in baselessly accusing editors "on the other side" of various kinds of misconduct - that's not the first time this kind of comment happened [diffs to come], I'm wondering whether an [indefinite] interaction ban could be an effective solution (in addition to or as an alternative to a fixed-term topic ban): it would at least be a honest attempt at reducing the toxicity in the topic area, since they'd now explicitly be prohibited from the kind of silly comments which make any collaboration with them very hard to imagine, like those they made on your talk page. RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 22:08, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@ToBeFree: I was going to add diffs, but in the time it took me to take care of what I was doing IRL, Shibbolethink seems to have done the leg-work, and I don't think duplication is necessary. If I can add one more, though, it would be what brought about the recent flare-up, which was this problematic restoration of basically the same content as the previously deleted, POVFORK draft under the same title. That, and the AE I had filed before this was an AE issue (link provided below by Shibboleth), which shows that the accusations and WP:ASPERSIONS started right from the beginning, as I was saying. Cheers, RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 23:00, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Dervorguilla: But that's not what CP is doing. They're not using run-of-the-mill reporting to support "Y said X". They've frequently linked to opinion pieces ([15], and, for example, back in April, they made a post full of newspapers sources to dispute statements sourced to academic journals such as those given here, and also the long ref-list after the statement in relevant articles. They repeated a very similar exercise in June, based notably on their own interpretation of a primary source and similar quoting of opinion and news writing... RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 23:41, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Dervorguilla: This is a very recent example of CP using an opinion piece to dispute more acceptable sources. RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 11:22, 23 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@DGG: One of CP's very first edits was to come on my talk page ([16]) and tell me how my "brinkmanship on the COVID-19 lab leak hypothesis is alarming", accusing me of censorship and so on so forth. That is not "experienced editors trying to push their less experienced opponents into doing something unreasonable" - that's CP being unreasonable right from the start, and they haven't stopped since (compare with the recent edits on Tobias' talk page). Their behaviour is nothing short of caustic, and unbearable. Getting frustrated when your favoured outcome is rejected might be understandable, but long-term uncivility, and routinely accusing others of "misbehaviour without reasonable cause in an attempt to besmirch their reputations" in particular, is unacceptable. I could just as easily accuse CP and others of being Russian trolls or something - disregarding the fact there is more concrete evidence of off-wiki canvassing. I haven't, because that is unbecoming of the behaviour one should have in polite society, and we shouldn't accept persistent infringements of such basic standards simply because "it's a heated debate". RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 11:39, 23 July 2021 (UTC) edited 21:53, 23 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

CP's latest edits at the investigation page are quite objectionable, if not sanctimonious. They make a post explaining their edits, claiming that "Editors are reminded that deleting content for WP:NPOV concerns is WP:POVDELETION" (which by the way, doesn't say that removing such material is prohibited, is just a supplement, and in no way overrides WP:ONUS), having previously gone on to do exactly that. As shown by the flurry of activity afterwards [17], that sparked a lot of improvement (by other editors). But CP's edits were done for the wrong reasons, were done in spite of previous conversations on the same subject, and they prove that they're a high-maintenance editor who is not contributing collaboratively in this area. RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 21:53, 23 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I was going to leave a note about the recent canvassing ([18] [19]), but that already appears to have been done by Shibbolethink. CP apparently having enough time to make a long post on their talk page, where they continue their similar, IDHT arguments, but not taking the time to engage here, despite multiple requests to do so, is also an intriguing way to go about this. RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 22:46, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Sgnpkd: What was said here (excuse the intervening diff) about such accusations of sealioning still holds: making unsubstantiated accusations is not unique to CP, I see. RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 23:27, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@ToBeFree: So CP, accusing others of censorship (on your talk page), is now the one threatening others unless they don't self-censor? Very ironic, as in "the rules of Wikipedia apply to others but not to me (or my viewpoint)", which seems a decent take on CP's attitude here. And also yet more evidence of the difficult environment which they are creating in this already messy enough topic. RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 17:48, 25 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Yet another long post by CP, where, notably, they directly accuse Shibbolethink of lying. I quote: The particular nature of this matter also puts the WP:LIE to point #19 in Shibbolethinks’s AE post, which should tell you something about the rest of his points.. That, and the fact they're using these article talk pages to continue arguing and accusing other editors, ex. from that same diff, certain bias editors who demand to go through the WP:BRD on every little comma and discuss their WP:SELFPUB opinions lest you get dragged to AE on trumped up charges of misconduct... That's all from me here, I think the point has been made and if this isn't enough evidence to warrant action then I don't think there will ever be enough. Cheers, RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 18:11, 25 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Francesco espo

RandomCanadian inserted a secondary source (Science Based Medicine) citing an unpublished preprint (Sørensen et al), and Bakkster Man did not object to it, as he wasn’t aware it was an unpublished preprint. When CutePeach pointed this out to defend her inclusion of secondary sources (MIT Technology Review) citing a preprint, Bakkster Man had already reverted her edit and opened this case. Mr Ernie then removed the Sørensen et al as undue [20], but Bakkster Man reinstate it as due [21], but then Bakkster Man realizing his mistake and delete the whole paragraph [22]. Bakkster Man reverted CutePeach seven seconds after she explained her inclusion on the talk page, so he couldn’t have possibly read it, and he made a fool of himself here. It is clear for all to see this was premeditated.Francesco espo (talk) 20:34, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

This is hilarious, RandomCanadian is in the house [23], but he still doesn’t realize the Science Based Medicine source he cited cites Sorensen et all (same as Deiglish's preprint). I wonder if ToBeFree knows what’s going on. I don’t think he does. DGG are you seeing this?Francesco espo (talk) 20:47, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Shibbolethink

I think Bakkster Man is frustrated with this editor's activity in general. The specific diffs he has offered don't encapsulate all of CutePeach's problematic behavior. See below ArbE I was preparing:

Diffs of problematic behavior by CutePeach

15:26, 21 July 2021 User escalates dispute about gain-of-function into dispute about all of COVID origins. As they have done before. Disrupting consensus-building to WP:WIN an argument, against a hard-won agreement among editors who rarely agree (pro-leak, anti-leak, moderates). (to paraphrase) "Why can't Shibbolethink just do what I want so I can move on?"
15:10, 21 July 2021 Long, rambling SOAPBOX about how "a group of editors have banded together to…Co-opt Wikipedia’s WP:MEDRS and WP:FRINGE policies to WP:CENSOR the COVID-19 lab leak hypothesis from Wikipedia” Repeating their WP:YESLABLEAK. Which is a straw man the size of Nicholas Cage’s Wicker Man tomb. We are the ones trapped inside. No one is trying to “remove” the lab leak theory from Wikipedia. Many editors are trying to contextualize it within the mainstream scientific view, namely that it's not as likely as a natural origin. This is exactly what WP:FRINGE, WP:RSUW tell us to do. I have not tried to “masquerade WP:NOLABLEAK as policy in numerous talk page discussions,” I and others have quoted it as a way to package WP:RSes together. This is in line with the consensus we have established in numerous talk page discussions. CutePeach wants to forego that consensus. E.g. "Please note also that Wikipedia may need to change its policy on the Daily Mail, which quotes a White House scientist on the matter". User also says this gem: “These discussion require editors like myself, who have actually read the sources to engage in the WP:BRD process, instead of giving the little time I have to create content.” How dare we ask users to engage in consensus building?
06:37, 20 July 2021 Editor removing mention of mainstream scientific view [24]. Contravening established consensus. Similar: [25] asserting individual minority opinions "outweigh all MEDRSs published on the subject to date"
03:10, 14 July 2021 “If you are going to promote your own literature as policy or guidance on Wikipedia, then you have to be able to demonstrate WP:COMPETENCE, which you have failed to do on this issue.” Again, a straw man in which I am incompetent.
08:39, 14 July 2021 “Regarding the Hakim paper, it is a case of WP:MISINTERPRETATION. Have you actually read the paper?” I gave exact quotes several paragraphs prior [26]. User exemplifies WP:IDHT, WP:SEALION.
07:48, 13 July 2021 “On your next trip to China, you might want to learn a bit more about how the Chinese government actually governs.” I then tell the user to please not implicate my “competence” and intelligence in their edits, as it is not AGF, something this user has been warned about before ([27] [28]). User then then tells me I am incompetent for accusing them of PA/ABF [29], creates an essay about it (Wikipedia:CRYNPA). I attempt to bridge divide by offering an olive branch [30]. User ignores and continues to accuse me of POV [31]. This is something I have tried to do before, failed before. This user will not listen, and is very convinced that the cabal is out to get them.
13:41, 14 July 2021 “We should not be presenting the WP:OPINIONs of scientists on either side as facts in Wikivoice.” Speaks for itself re: mainstream POVs. User is responding to admin (Johnuniq) asking for clarification on their extensive soapboxing (my interpretation). Admin still cannot figure out what user is asking [32]. A common occurrence.
08:45, 13 July 2021 User accuses me of intentionally using a non-RS that is a syndication [33], I retract the source again [34] (having already retracted it earlier, after mistakenly citing it [35]), user accuses me of intentionally using the source again [36], then beating a horse that is not only dead, it has been set on fire [37].
14:23, 4 July 2021 One of several instances in which user tries to get an admin to reverse a mopping action (in this case removal of BLPvio) that disagrees with their POV. They tie up a lot of admin/editor time with SOAPBOXes [38].
06:26, 30 June 2021 Months into nearly daily accusations of problematic sourcing, they say: "I do not think "WP:RS evidence" is a requisite policy for inclusion or exclusion."
06:29, 30 June 2021 User creates many CAPITAL_LETTERS redirects/essays to use more effectively as a bludgeon. (e.g. WP:MISINTERPRETING, WP:POVOMISSION, WP:CRYNPA, WP:POVDELETION). I'm actually not sure there is a policy against this, but it does feel pretty BATTLEGROUND-y and exemplifies how this editor escalates disputes and tries to change policy rather than striving for consensus or persuading others via discussion.
14:29, 23 June 2021 adversarial attitude, not AGF.
14:02, 23 June 2021 Casting WP:ASPERSIONS about a user “scheming” to edit in a way that “provokes” a response.
05:28, 20 June 2021 frequently requests citations for obvious summary, not synth, WP:SEALION. When presented with quotations, defaults to WP:IDHT.
05:07, 20 June 2021 alleges all virologists have a COI. A clear case of WP:FLAT. CPUSHing user's POV and trying to “neutralize” editors who disagree.
13:24, 19 June 2021 Frequently adds primary-sourced promotional material to drafts/articles to push user’s POV.
13:12, 19 June 2021 Brings content disputes to non-content dispute areas often. Casts WP:ASPERSIONS and cites ‘coordination of other editors’ as if there is a cabal.
12:56, 19 June 2021 Edit war brought on by user.
05:40, 6 June 2021 [39] [40] [41] [42] Frequently cites WP:FRINGE claims: “US government maintains the claim that the WIV was doing bioweapons research, which was perhaps for defensive purposes” for which there is no evidence. A case of WP:IDHT applies when user is challenged, or more simply, the user never admits being wrong. Simply changes the subject or emphatically declares their correctness.
12:56, 8 June 2021 Adversarial accusations against another editor for being “completely confused” about a topic and then becoming “a real expert with all the right sources” as if this somehow invalidates the user's argument.
09:38, 9 June 2021 WP:OR to push WP:FRINGE ideas and cite preferred primary sources instead of secondary sources in the scientific literature. Also WP:IDHT as the user asserts over and over again that certain scientists support their POV even when presented evidence to the contrary [43].

Summary of thoughts on CutePeach

In summary: CutePeach has engaged in tendentious editing, as shown by the following: A) USTHEM SOAPBOXing asserting “a campaign” exists against them/their opinions, B) General SOAPBOXing about COVID origins and how Wikipedia is not reflecting the “truth”, because of our reliance on policies that CutePeach disagrees with, C) casting ASPERSIONS in multiple directions in a pattern that appears targeted to discourage certain POVs from contributing, D) personal attacks against editors (including myself), belittling a lack of “competence” and intelligence, E) escalation of many disputes to an overall dispute about the topic and consistent BATTLEGROUNDing, F) a consistent, unrelenting argument that the mainstream scientific POV about COVID origins should not be included in our articles.

On a more personal note, dealing with this user has made me step back from Wiki, in an exact encapsulation of WP:QUIT/WP:RANDY/WP:CHEESE. The user has argued repeatedly that my PhD in Virology is a reason why I should not be trusted to edit these articles (see above). While many of the other pro-leak editors and anti-leak editors have come to consensus editing the new COVID-19 lab leak hypothesis article, this user has not. As I have described above, they, at some point, decided consensus was not the goal, and instead the goal was pushing their POV.

To make this abundantly clear: I have no problem with people who believe in the lab leak. I am happy to edit alongside such users. Several such editors and I have come to agreement in how to achieve consensus via compromise, working together. CutePeach appears emphatically...vitriolically...indignantly... not interested.

Recommend indef topic ban and short-term block.--Shibbolethink ^(♔ ^♕) 22:40, 22 July 2021 (UTC) (edited 17:23, 25 July 2021 (UTC))[reply]

Other notes

re: statement length

I apologize for the length of this. There are just so many diffs and long complex SOAPBOXes to explain. Please let me know if you would like my statement reduced further and I will do so immediately.--Shibbolethink ^(♔ ^♕) 22:40, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you, ToBeFree. I will keep monitoring, but likely will not respond to other comments unless directly requested to preserve the ability for others to add their thoughts and still maintain a readable ArbE case. I'm not saying others should do the same, I just feel bad about my really long comment :)--Shibbolethink ^(♔ ^♕) 23:01, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

FYI: editor was previously AE'd for similar behavior, before DS were in place, so dismissed.--Shibbolethink ^(♔ ^♕) 22:51, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

FYI: CutePeach is WP:CANVASsing, inviting editors selectively to this AE [44] [45] (without mentioning those notification here) and into discussions on talk pages based on whether or not their statements here are favorable [46]. This is not the first time I have warned this user about WP:CANVAS: [47].--Shibbolethink ^(♔ ^♕) 19:50, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@CutePeach: I have provided diffs above, which you've indicated do not qualify as PAs in your eyes. I believe they do, based on WP:CIRNOT: "Calling someone incompetent is a personal attack and is not helpful. Always refer to the contributions and not the contributor, and find ways to phrase things that do not put people on the defensive or attack their character or person." The biggest issue is the repeated use of such arguments on your part, even after being warned about this. It is unfortunate that we disagree. I leave it up to the reviewing admins.--Shibbolethink ^(♔ ^♕) 17:15, 25 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Dervorguilla

It looks like CutePeach may have been attempting to find an acceptable solution through a combination of adaptive editing and good-faith discussion. (See EDITCON flowchart.) Each of the 3 listed edits does seem responsive to the ongoing discussion, if less than perfectly so.

Also, it seems intuitive that in this article the added information was not "represented as" a scientific theory but as a hypothesis. ("A proposed explanation, supported by evidence, that serves as a starting point for investigation" — Black’s Law Dictionary.) MEDDEF likewise suggests that peer-reviewed sources may not be needed here:

… were invented by Dr Archibald Foster and released onto the market in 2015. This is not biomedical information, and it only requires ordinary RS

Dervorguilla (talk) 23:21, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@RandomCanadian: Here CutePeach is using ordinary news sources, though. (Not "opinion pieces".) –Dervorguilla (talk) 05:21, 23 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Novem Linguae

For months, I have noticed that CutePeach engages in WP:CPUSH on COVID origins talk pages. It is quite draining to read and deal with.
During a discussion with Shibbolethink, made this inappropriate edit to WP:NPA, then created the shortcuts WP:CRYPA and WP:CRYNPA to point to their new edits, then quoted these shortcuts in their discussion with Shibbolethink.[48] Adding to a policy without consensus, in order to immediately quote it in a heated discussion, seems inappropriate to me.
- This user later turned the redirect WP:CRYNPA into an essay, and it is live in the Wikipedia userspace. I doubt it enjoys wide community consensus and it should probably be userfied.
I find this user a bit abrasive to interact with.
- In one recent interaction, they told me If you are going to promote your own literature as policy or guidance on Wikipedia, then you have to be able to demonstrate WP:COMPETENCE, which you have failed to do on this issue.[49], basically calling me incompetent and also accusing me of promotion.
- They told Shibbolethink On your next trip to China, you might want to learn a bit more about how the Chinese government actually governs.[50].
This user posted in my userspace after I asked them not to. [51][52][53][54] The diff order is my 1st request (on talk page), their response ignoring it, my 2nd request (in edit summary), and their second response ignoring it.

I would support some kind of sanction. –Novem Linguae (talk) 03:43, 23 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by DGG

The basic problem is the persistent efforts by editors other than CutePeach to avoid covering the topic entirely, despite world wide major press coverage. As normal at WP, this had taken the form of attempts to find objections to the sourcing, even when the sources are such a would normally be accepted for topics of this nature. CP's reaction to this has sometime been a little unmeasured, ad worded more contentiously than I would have done. But in view of the nature of the utter rejection of the fundamental WP policy of WP:NPOV with which she has been contending, it's understandable, as a response to the specious arguments on the other side.

It's especially unfortunate that this AE request has been brought at the very time when the various editors involved have mostly been approaching consensus about how to handle the subject, guided by the RfC on the applicability of MEDRES. I see this as a last-ditch attempt to avoid covering what has become a major political question--or, that having failed, to avoid covering it properly. I'm not blaming the party who has brought this request, nor am I mentioning any other names. because they're by no means the only one involved, just as CP is by no means the only one who has been trying to get NPOV coverage. I think we should not escalate this, because the normal WP methods are working--even though they have been working with exceptional slowness and difficulty. I can not endorse everything CP has said, but I certainly do endorse her efforts. She perhaps needs at most a reminder that the answer to unfair tactics is not to indulge in rhetorical excesses. I would perhaps couple this with the usual and frequently necessary reminder to everyone not to personalize subject disputes at. And it is indeed a poor idea to try engage in altering the wording of basic policy during a subject dispute (it's been tried before at various times, and sometimes people have succeeded in getting away with it) --though the particular statement she added to NPA is one that I think should indeed be added--but it shouldn't have been suggested now.

There's a general pattern here I've been warning people against for many years. During a subject dispute, more experienced editors trying to push their less experienced opponents into doing something unreasonable, so one can then remove them on behavioral grounds. AE is a particularly effective place for the purpose. We shouldn't let it be used that way. A request to topic ban one's opponent in a debate should normally be rejected altogether. If one is editing and commented properly and effectively, one doesn't need it. DGG ( talk ) 06:13, 23 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Nil Einne

As I'm on wikibreak, hopefully I don't say something here which gets me blocked. Where is this seven seconds thing coming from? AFAICT Cutepeach posted on the talk page here at 13:01:30 [55] 2 minutes after making this edit at 12:59:31 [56]. Bakkster Man made this reply at 13:07:34 [57] followed by reverting Cutepeach's change at 13:08:07 [58]. Cutepeach then asked if Bakkster Man had read the reply where they first mentioned the seven seconds bit at 13:26:36 [59]. Maybe I misunderstood what was being referred to but I'm not seeing any overlap that was seven seconds. Cutepeach's first comment seems like it could be just a simple mistake, planning to type minutes but typing seconds instead or it's possible they just confused themselves and thought it was seconds when it was minutes. Either way Cutepeach's reply is long but not that long, it seems entirely plausible it was read in 6-7 minutes especially since Bakkster Man replied to it before reverting, so if that is what's being referred to, it doesn't seem an issue.

In any case, if there really is something that happened within seven seconds I missed, I'd also note that if person A leaves an explanation and person Z reverts within seven second of this explanation, per WP:AGF it's fine to think person Z didn't read the explanation, but not assign bad faith in this. If person A took several minutes to offer an explanation it's entirely plausible person Z checked for an explanation, found none and reverted. Neither editor really did any wrong here, it's just how rapid editing can play out. It's fine to ask person Z if they read the explanation, but hopefully person Z will see it themselves anyway and either way will consider whether to self-revert. If editor A left their explanation ~ the same they made the change, then probably person Z should have been a bit more careful and checked the talk page. (Well frankly this scenario doesn't really work with 7 seconds, but with something like 30 seconds it may.) However for a single instances it's a generally minor thing provided person Z does consider whether to self-revert when alerted to the explanation. Again, it's possible person Z will come across the explanation by themselves and do the same which reduces the criticism of themselves even more.

BTW, I initially suggested it's not possible to see seconds with diffs. This is incorrect and I apologise for any confusion. You can change time stamp format in the appearance option to show seconds hence my examples here. As no one had replied to this other than ToBeFree who alerted me directly (thanks!), I modified my post accordingly roughly 3 hours and 40 minutes after originally posting at 16:35. (Possibly you can get even finer granularity via the API, I'm not sure.)

Nil Einne (talk) Nil Einne (talk) 20:48, 23 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by My very best wishes

Commenting only on first 3 diffs provided by the filer, this seems to be just a content dispute. The info CutePeach is trying to include [60] arguably belongs to the page. This is page about COVID-19 lab leak hypothesis. Even if the hypothesis is wrong, we still need to list people who proposed or supported it. Yes, the edit by CutePeach is POVish and should be corrected. It is POVish because she is trying to frame it as a scientifically solid claim. But this is mostly a political, not a scientific controversy. Fortunately, such POVish version was corrected to the text that appears in the left part of this diff [61]. OK, so it now includes the following "In addition, Gorski criticises the startling claim that "the laws of physics mean that you cannot have four positively charged amino acids in a row". Having such criticism, let it be. Why revert? That would be my reaction. Other edits and overall behavior by CutePeach can be a lot more troubling. But if so, that had to be justified with diffs by the filer from the very beginning. My very best wishes (talk) 21:45, 23 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by PaleoNeonate

After having drafted a report I intended to avoid participating but to eventually present a TE/soapboxing case instead if necessary in the future. I was encouraged to still post so have revised it to be less redundant with other statements.

Background

The COVID-19 topic was recently upgraded from general sanctions to discretionary ones because of persistent disruption in the area. AN and FTN archives have a number of related threads. The lab leak story has been promoted by online groups and on Wikipedia by some regulars, but most notably by single purpose accounts. Some were confirmed to be sockpuppets, but others to also be meatpuppets, some coordinating as part of online campaigns to push their propaganda on Wikipedia, email canvassing also occurred. While some disruptive accounts were blocked or topic banned, waves of new SPAs continued to disrupt (the talk pages of the various articles are full of it with their archives). Some Twitter activist argued about creating LEAKGATE on Wikipedia and some editors were harassed.^[1] Some regulars believe that there's more to it and that Wikipedia tends toward censorship (although not too surprisingly as it is part of standard narratives).

Since I read a lot of sources about it lately, I can evaluate that there's not much to it but speculation, motivated reasoning, connecting dots and an unlikely hypothesis that some scientists now advocate to investigate. The media went havoc about it lately, with right-wing, including Fox News, transforming uncertainty statements like "more information is needed" into "yes" shows,^[2] and before that promoting a Bannon-promoted conspiracy theory supported by forged pseudoscientific claims and falsehoods.^[3]

But reliable sources confirm that there's no more evidence than before.^[4]^[5] We can agree that the topic is notable and everyone is recently waiting for a US intelligence report. To those who complain that it wasn't covered, it was covered by two articles, COVID-19 misinformation and Investigations into the origin of COVID-19 and per the above, are already a time sink for the community. Previous versions of COVID-19 lab leak hypothesis were unnecessary WP:POVFORKs, some were particularly bad with obvious source misrepresentation to promote a view as more plausible than the sources did.^[6] In that particular version were also shady primary papers published in dubious venues and pushed by editors with a conflict of interest.

As a reminder, Wikipedia is not to promote, but to document with proper context and analysis using independent reliable sources (the claims are not recited, but are written about from an independent view, the goal is also not false balance and "letting the reader choose for themself"). Now if AfD passes, we'll have one more article on it, but that will fortunately no longer be a POVFORK after TNT and rewriting by non-SPAs (but may also turn out to be another time sink for the community).

References

CutePeach

Unlike Bakkster's entry about a specific event I have a more general WP:TE case to present. This editor appeared on 16 March 2021 with their first edits already focused on the topic. They were suspected of being a campaign-sock (considering the others and SPA status), with the admission about Twitter we can AGF and suppose that it's more meatpuppetry. Still, it's a promotional account that appeared to know where to edit, seemed familiar with Wikipedia, uses a lot of WP:WL, had a grudge about specific editors already, then kept trying to make Wikipedia present the hypothesis as plausible, with a battleground attitude.

This includes the creation of an essay to soapbox the idea, which they have promoted at talk pages like here (arguing about "proponents of NOLABLEAK" as if there was a valid equivalence, or that the others are also motivated activists, despite the efforts by several to use the best sources available like MEDRS where possible). That very post, among others, still argues to present individual opinions and accuses others of misrepresentation without evidence. More can be read here where youtube videos are posted to suggest using one person's view.

The particular version of the leak hypothesis article they recently restored had problems and included unreliable, deprecated sources and problems with balance. This edit cited a deletion review but that was more about a potential draft. Fortunately, it was quickly rewritten by necessity per WP:TNT. They since complained about this rewrite and have tried to prevent the scientific consensus from being prominently mentioned (they have known about this consensus before but IDHT and quote mining from specific articles is used to suggest it may not be true despite all the other sources that mention it in various ways).

They went on to accuse editors of being long term disruptive censorship activists (permalink) (the latter also includes unrelated intervention and replies by someone else who also runs a website to promote it). I'm unsure, but since yesterday wondered if undisclosed COI is possible, so I left them a post explaining why there are areas I wouldn't edit myself.

I'll stop with this for now but will quote some of what I wrote at their talk page when they accused me directly: "what is more plausible RGW activism, a new editor who's obvious goal is to push an idea since the beginning, or someone who edited hundreds of pages for years? Those are aspects that are easy to assess. My account was created pre-pandemic, was not a sleeping account and has never been blocked, this hopefully means something." I wasn't aware of the WP:POINTy redirects mentioned here, but that too is obviously tendentious... —Paleo Neonate – 02:12, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Replies

Ernie: And CONSENSUS on a case by case basis, of course, IRT what sources to use. As for the rest of your narrative, I'm not really surprised. The other editors here are also not the focus of this case... —Paleo Neonate – 03:16, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Colins: Yes I admit that when only uncriticial primary material exists it can result in a lack of full coverage of the claims (by policy too, to avoid undue promotion). —Paleo Neonate – 17:58, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Yes a general comment in relation to common claims of silencing the opponent, if that was the direction to head in, despite the evidence of promotional accounts, we would also be saying that Wikipedia is for free speech and soapboxing, that evading blocks, ignoring the TOS, sealioning are not a problem at all... I also have the impression that some editors suggesting it are not the ones who had to spend a lot of time dealing with it at those particular talk pages recently. —Paleo Neonate – 18:08, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Colin

I have attempted to mediate on a couple of Covid19 articles, where I have seen problematic editing, mindsets and a lack of desire to seek consensus. I don't think I've been successful to any significant degree. While I may personally attribute that to the stubbornness of those involved on all sides, it may also be my failure. IMO there are flaws with editors/editing on all sides but we're here to discuss CutePeach, not to fire off "but you smell too" cheap arguments.

CutePeach in particular is overwhelming talk pages with soapboaxing. And while all editors have at times falling into the trap of trying to argue the science from primary sources, CutePeach is particularly prone to simply arguing what they feel is "the science" with other editors, rather than proposing (or writing) text and backing that up with reliable secondary sources. Edits to articles (such as those few listed at the very top here) fall into the style we often see on bad controversy topics, where editors attempt to argue the case in front of the readers. The first link is a particularly egregious example: "SARS-COV-2 was well adapted for human transmission from its early emergence...co authored a paper which included claims of possible genetic engineering, which they submitted to a journal, and were edited out in the peer review process". This hints to the readers that some scientists think covid was genetically engineered to be well adapted for human transmission, and at the same time hints at some conspiracy to cover it up. Both claims are outstanding and The World Should Know!

Despite the RFCs about MEDRS, there remains a lot of misinformation. Let's be clear. A claim on Wikipedia that covid was genetically engineered requires an academic secondary source of the first order, not some Norwegian "bourgeois magazine". The other two sources paywalled, hmm. We need to be extremely careful when discussing scientific controversy that it doesn't just become a mechanism for agenda editing to mislead. While I agree with DGG that at times editors have sought the "Wikipedia should say nothing" approach, which just leads to frustration and doesn't serve our readers, we also need to prevent Wikipedia becoming the Dail Mail, where any contentious or dubious statement by some scientists somewhere is offered credulously to our readers.

I entirely disagree with DGG's assessment that this AE is just a game play to remove an opponent. Cutepeach is an editor who's account has always been solely focussed on promoting the lab leak hypothesis on Wikipedia, and despite lots of editors attempting to explain how Wikipedia works, they aren't getting it. Cutepeach's talk page discussions belong on a social media forum and article writing belongs on a personal blog. -- Colin°^Talk 10:09, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

ProcrastinatingReader: Both you and DGG make arguments that view Cutepeach as a pawn in a game, or fighter in a battle for NPOV. DGG's claim (about removing an opponent) could be made about nearly all disputes where editors argue for sanctions, and is unprovable without some kind of editor-thought-MRI-scanner technology. You argue that Cutepeach's extreme position is a necessary balance for other editors with different views, view which you frame as pro-lab-leak and vice-versa, as though there are only two sides. The BBC once made that mistake, thinking "balance" on topics like global warming or MMR meant that for every expert you interviewed, you had to have some weirdo too. They eventually saw sense on that. NPOV isn't about balance as though there are two sides to every argument. There are many sides and but often one side is noisier than is warranted by their acceptance among reliable sources. WP:NPOV is "representing fairly, proportionately, and, as far as possible, without editorial bias, all the significant views that have been published by reliable sources on a topic." (my bold) A SPA editor who has a clear editorial bias, is pushing a minority and political agenda, and who after months of advice is still (a) pushing their agenda in articles with bad sources and (b) trying to convince others about the "science" with walls of text (see their talk 15:56 24th), is not helping NPOV at all. I suggest instead that editors tend more to take extreme "not give an inch" positions when there is persistent agenda-editing pushing a minority POV. The walls of argument on talk is also off-putting to other editors who may take a more unbiased view. -- Colin°^Talk 10:31, 25 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by ProcrastinatingReader

At this point I've reported several users who happen to have pro-lab-leak editing philosophies and none vice versa. The former group has historically been substantially more disruptive, although currently I think the latter is probably more of a problem, and better at it too since they tend to be more experienced users. It really isn't that difficult to edit neutrally, and just sum up reliable sources without bringing in your own personal philosophy on the issue and let the sources speak for themselves. Over half of the regulars in this topic area seem incapable of doing that, though. The behavioural issues stem as a result. Let's be realistic, nobody in 'the other group' will be sanctioned. I think that's relevant here because if you remove every editor on one side of the issue I don't know how we can reach NPOV in this topic area.

CutePeach is certainly a single purpose account.[62] Several of their comments have no basis in policy. They also make some where they are right. I don't think they are a net negative in this topic area at this time. Their volume of commentary is also not so great such that they're an undue burden on others' time. CutePeach has, in some cases, exercised with restraint, such as when their "COVID-19 cover-up" article was draftified; policy allows them to move it back and force others to hold a deletion discussion, although they chose not to do that, presumably believing it would be more collaborative not to. Personally, I think we need to put an end to the seeking of non-standard venues for discussions in this topic area, and that starts with no more damn MFDs, no more attempts to avoid building consensus in this topic area, and no more ignoring the outcomes of consensus discussions. The path to a stable article that follows our policies, if not through self-reflection, is through discussion. The most corrosive type of editor, thus, is one that is a hurdle in allowing those discussions to take place properly (through bludgeoning, for example, or through persistent long rambling arguments and derailing of discussions). CutePeach, in my experience and at this time, does not tick those boxes. As such, I don't see how the topic area is helped by sanctioning them. I think CutePeach's voice is necessary to reach NPOV in the topic area. My main concern is their misuse of primary sources, but I think that's something they can work on.

+1 to DGG's During a subject dispute, more experienced editors [try] to push their less experienced opponents into doing something unreasonable, so one can then remove them on behavioral grounds. AE is a particularly effective place for the purpose. Similarly, I wonder whether the 'opportunity to provide a statement' is just a trick, because almost anything an inexperienced editor will say in these circumstances will only make their case worse. But not responding can also be used against them, which makes it a bit of a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation. ProcrastinatingReader (talk) 10:40, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Colin: CutePeach is not a pawn or a fighter. I mean exactly what I said, the general point that it's effective to remove ideological opponents in this manner and AE admins need to, as always, scrutinise the evidence carefully and not just rely on the volume of editors supporting removing the editor. I haven't reviewed all the diffs, but I do think a couple of the ones I did are not fair representations of the situation, but there are also others that can be found that are more damning, so that's neither here nor there.

It's not that CutePeach himself/herself is necessary for NPOV, it's that at the present time only so many editors are active in this topic area, and almost every editor with an 'anti-lab-leak' view (to the best of my knowledge) has never/rarely added any reliably sourced content that contradicts their personal philosophy, and vice versa. There is absolutely reliably sourced encyclopaedic content that falls into that basket and can/should be added. The issue of SPAs has decreased compared to earlier this year, likely due to ECP and months of administrative action making clear that such disruption isn't tolerable, and as such I'm less concerned about minor annoyances from time to time. The main question for me is whether CutePeach's continued presence will lead to a better article, and at this time I personally think it will. This isn't an endorsement of all of their current behaviour, however I'm optimistic this AE will provide useful feedback to help them decrease the portions of their editing that are less productive, and perhaps they can provide such assurances. ProcrastinatingReader (talk) 10:48, 25 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Sgnpkd

I have been on wiki for more than ten years but this is my first time posting here. I personally think the amount of persistent hostilities from RandomCanadian and Shibolethink towards an editor who have opposing view is alarming. CutePeach might try to push an idea here but one also cannot help seeing a pattern as if there is a single purpose tendency to reject all other opinions added to these articles, and to censor even factual events. It is observed that users who made construtive updates to these articles, fully backed with reliable sources, usually have their edits reverted, redacted, even got the individual wordings changed or twisted to change the meaning towards a certain view. The fact that the adminitrators are not aware of this is concerning. I would support per WP:BOOMERANG for filing a case for "offences" that Mr Ernie has pointed out above, ie. the same thing that CutePeach was accused of. The users I mentioned who have posted here should also be scrutinised for WP:SEALION. Sgnpkd (talk) 18:17, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by 力

We seem to be waiting, though I'm not sure why. Two facts seem fairly clear.

CutePeach is an SPA who is fairly new to the project.
CutePeach has made several technical violations regarding sourcing guidelines and not waiting for consensus for controversial edits.

Beyond that, the diffs from Shibbolethink and Bakkster Man do not convince me that a block or topic-ban is necessary. Many of their diffs are simply opinions they don't like; the sea of all-caps policy links that are claimed to be violated are not actually violated. The accusations that they are promoting FRINGE views are particularly cynical; the pro-lab-leak views are considered fringe for no apparent reason other than that a few editors don't like them. If the US government, the head of the WHO, various pundits, and half the US public feel a lab leak is possible, it is surely not FRINGE to suggest as much.

I'm not as familiar with CutePeach, but have interacted with several of the "anti-lab-leak" editors who have commented here, and largely agree with DGG's view on them. That said, the behavior of other editors is off-topic here; either a new ARE or a request for a full ARBCOM case would be the place to discuss their behavior. User:力 (power~enwiki, π, ν) 18:51, 25 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Result concerning CutePeach

This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.

I'm primarily waiting for CutePeach's statement, as the diffs above ([63] [64] [65]) seem to show a case of edit warring disputed content back into the article without having gained consensus for doing so on the talk page, as would have been required per WP:ONUS. I expect CutePeach to respond here and wait for a result before continuing to edit the article in question, COVID-19 lab leak hypothesis. ~ ToBeFree (talk) 16:25, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
- RandomCanadian, as annoyingly unnecessary as that may seem to be, please provide specific diffs especially for intra-wiki conspiracy accusations, the previous warning and the "actions on articles". At the moment, the actual presented evidence at most justifies a partial block from editing the article (and perhaps its talk page as a kind of "topic block") for two weeks or so. ~ ToBeFree (talk) 17:47, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
- Francesco espo has been blocked for 72 hours following incivility on this arbitration page after a warning for personal attacks (Special:Diff/1034829179; Special:Permalink/1034972247#July_2021). ~ ToBeFree (talk) 22:01, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
- Regarding the length of the diff list, I personally don't object. Interestingly, the notice at the top says "except by permission of a reviewing administrator", so I guess here it is. CutePeach is similarly welcome to use up to 1500 words. ~ ToBeFree (talk) 22:47, 22 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
- I'm fine with waiting for a statement from CutePeach, even for a week or two, as long as they do not continue to edit in the discussed areas in the meantime. ~ ToBeFree (talk) 12:24, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
- Mr Ernie, regarding the question about comments in two sections and involvement: I didn't clerk at this noticeboard before, so I first assumed everyone including reviewers makes a comment in their section, and at the end the result appears in the section "Result". My first comment in this section here was consequently result-related. I then figured that further reviewing notes could better be added here as well. There is no review-disqualifying involvement, but I've been mediating disputes in this area multiple times (see also WP:ARBCOVID) and people used pings, and even discussions on my talk page with each other, to request my attention to several disputes. As I've been repeatedly asked for help from all sides of the conflict, I'm here. I guess this started with my page protections in this area. ~ ToBeFree (talk) 18:28, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
- ProcrastinatingReader, I'd say the legitimacy of any conclusion in such a discussion, and its defensibility against later concerns from any party, strongly depends on accused parties' ability to provide a statement in their own defense. It's okay if this opportunity is declined by an accused person for whatever reason, but it would be unjust not to have seriously, honestly offered enough time to provide such a statement. I understand the concern that such a statement can make one's situation worse than it was, but if it does, it would do so by revealing issues that exist, and have to be taken into account, independently of the statement. ~ ToBeFree (talk) 18:46, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
- CutePeach to Shibbolethink, Special:Diff/1035435158: "I strongly urge you withdraw your participation in WP:AE before I get around to making my statement, otherwise it may result in a WP:BOOMERANG for you, which is not what I want." – Interesting approach... ~ ToBeFree (talk) 17:42, 25 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
- With CutePeach continuing to edit in the area (Special:Diff/1035440468), I'll not longer wait for an extension of their AE statement before proposing a decision. I'll re-review the evidence as it stands now. ~ ToBeFree (talk) 18:05, 25 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
CutePeach I hate to ping you again as it appears you've been pinged here multiple times, but I'm concerned that you've been editing and haven't come in here yet. —valereee (talk) 18:41, 23 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@CutePeach, you're welcome to take as much time as you need (within reason) to respond; continuing to edit while not at least coming in here to say you needed that time was the problem. —valereee (talk) 12:28, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
I know it is generally a good idea to wait for the subject of an enforcement request to comment, however I believe they have been given ample time. They are certainly aware of the request and have carried on editing without taking advantage of the opportunity to post here. I think it is reasonable to continue without their input.
I believe the diffs provided by User:Shibbolethink demonstrate a pattern of disruptive activity in the topic that violates multiple policies and expected behaviors of editors working in contentious areas. I also think it is sinking an undue amount of time from editors responding in good faith to them. I feel a ban for CutePeach from the topic of COVID is justified. HighInBC ^{Need help? Just ask.} 02:07, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Response to CutePeach: I am happy to wait for your response. I am also happy to reconsider my current position if anything new is added here that puts it in a new light. HighInBC ^{Need help? Just ask.} 03:18, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Oh lableak, what problems thou dost cause...can anyone point me towards what the current consensus on covering it is? Or provide the key RfC's on the matter? It seems this dispute is emblematic of a deeper issue that lacks appropriate guidance.

To the issue at hand, @Cute Peach: I very highly recommend you say something in your defense, though you are of course not required. But I can't imagine it going well if you continue to ignore this thread. CaptainEek ^{Edits Ho Cap'n!}⚓ 02:14, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@CutePeach: bugger, autocorrect "fixed" the spelling of your name...the travails of tech. CaptainEek ^{Edits Ho Cap'n!}⚓ 02:16, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

As an aside: turning point? https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/07/23/china-is-stepping-up-its-deception-denial-investigations-covid-19/ El_C 07:43, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Bakkster Man, more on that here: User_talk:El_C#WaPo_op-eds. But briefly, I suppose I felt that the potential revelations on the matter by the editorial board of one of the US' Newspaper of record yesterday was worthy of an aside... El_C 13:39, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I support an indefinite topic ban from COVID 19 for CutePeach, in particular per Shibbolethink's diffs and Colin's incisive comments. Since CutePeach has asked for more time, I'm of course prepared to potentially reconsider in light of what they say later. Bishonen | tålk 11:10, 25 July 2021 (UTC).[reply]
I'm currently reviewing this AE request and expect to weigh in at some point. Noting I've observed that CutePeach is still as of today working on responses, I discourage others from rushing to judgement. – wbm1058 (talk) 19:01, 25 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

[1] The administrator may indicate consent at any time before, during, or after imposition of the restriction.

[2] This criterion does not apply if the original action was imposed as a result of rough consensus at the arbitration enforcement noticeboard, as there would be no single enforcing administrator.

[3] ttps://twitter.com/billybostickson/status/1362863053583253512

[4] ttps://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jul/14/covid-origins-australias-role-in-the-feedback-loop-promoting-the-wuhan-lab-leak-theory

[5] ttps://edition.cnn.com/2020/10/21/politics/coronavirus-lab-theory-yan-bannon-invs/index.html

[6] ttps://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jun/18/in-hunt-for-covids-origin-new-studies-point-away-from-lab-leak-theory

[7] ttps://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/may/27/did-covid-come-from-a-wuhan-lab-what-we-know-so-far

[8] Example that I wrote about: Special:Diff/1006494442

[a]

[b]

[1]

[2]

[3]

[4]

[5]

[6]

@@ Line 450: / Line 450: @@
 :*{{u|Bakkster Man}}, more on that here: [[User_talk:El_C#WaPo_op-eds]]. But briefly, I suppose I felt that the potential revelations on the matter by the editorial board of one of the US' [[Newspaper of record]] yesterday was worthy of an aside... [[User:El_C|El_C]] 13:39, 24 July 2021 (UTC)
 *I support an indefinite topic ban from COVID 19 for CutePeach, in particular per {{u|Shibbolethink}}'s diffs and {{u|Colin}}'s incisive comments. Since CutePeach has asked for more time, I'm of course prepared to potentially reconsider in light of what they say later. [[User:Bishonen|Bishonen]] &#124; [[User talk:Bishonen|tålk]] 11:10, 25 July 2021 (UTC).
+*I'm currently reviewing this AE request and expect to weigh in at some point. Noting I've observed that CutePeach is still as of today working on responses, I discourage others from rushing to judgement. – [[User:Wbm1058|wbm1058]] ([[User talk:Wbm1058|talk]]) 19:01, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

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