Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Enforcement

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See also: Logged AE sanctions

Important information

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Please use this page only to:

request administrative action against editors violating a remedy (not merely a principle) or an injunction in an Arbitration Committee decision, or a contentious topic restriction imposed by an administrator,
request contentious topic restrictions against previously alerted editors who engage in misconduct in a topic area designated as a contentious topic,
request page restrictions (e.g. revert restrictions) on pages that are being disrupted in topic areas designated as contentious topics, or
appeal arbitration enforcement actions (including contentious topic restrictions) to uninvolved administrators.

For all other problems, including content disagreements or the enforcement of community-imposed sanctions, please use the other fora described in the dispute resolution process. To appeal Arbitration Committee decisions, please use the clarification and amendment noticeboard.

Only autoconfirmed users may file enforcement requests here; requests filed by IPs or accounts less than four days old or with less than 10 edits will be removed. All users are welcome to comment on requests except where doing so would violate an active restriction (such as an extended-confirmed restriction). If you make an enforcement request or comment on a request, your own conduct may be examined as well, and you may be sanctioned for it. Enforcement requests and statements in response to them may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator. (Word Count Tool) Statements must be made in separate sections. Non-compliant contributions may be removed or shortened by administrators. Disruptive contributions such as personal attacks, or groundless or vexatious complaints, may result in blocks or other sanctions.

To make an enforcement request, click on the link above this box and supply all required information. Incomplete requests may be ignored. Requests reporting diffs older than one week may be declined as stale. To appeal a contentious topic restriction or other enforcement decision, please create a new section and use the template {{Arbitration enforcement appeal}}.

Appeals and administrator modifications of contentious topics restrictions

The Arbitration Committee procedures relating to modifications of contentious topic restrictions state the following:

All contentious topic restrictions (and logged warnings) may be appealed. Only the restricted editor may appeal an editor restriction. Any editor may appeal a page restriction.

The appeal process has three possible stages. An editor appealing a restriction may:

ask the administrator who first made the contentious topic restrictions (the "enforcing administrator") to reconsider their original decision;
request review at the arbitration enforcement noticeboard ("AE") or at the administrators' noticeboard ("AN"); and
submit a request for amendment ("ARCA"). If the editor is blocked, the appeal may be made by email.

Appeals submitted at AE or AN must be submitted using the applicable template.

A rough consensus of administrators at AE or editors at AN may specify a period of up to one year during which no appeals (other than an appeal to ARCA) may be submitted.

Changing or revoking a contentious topic restriction

An administrator may only modify or revoke a contentious topic restriction if a formal appeal is successful or if one of the following exceptions applies:

The administrator who originally imposed the contentious topic restriction (the "enforcing administrator") affirmatively consents to the change,^[a] or is no longer an administrator;^[b] or
The contentious topic restriction was imposed (or last renewed) more than a year ago and:
- the restriction was imposed by a single administrator, or
- the restriction was an indefinite block.

A formal appeal is successful only if one of the following agrees with revoking or changing the contentious topic restriction:

a clear consensus of uninvolved administrators at AE,
a clear consensus of uninvolved editors at AN,
a majority of the Arbitration Committee, acting through a motion at ARCA.

Any administrator who revokes or changes a contentious topic restriction out of process (i.e. without the above conditions being met) may, at the discretion of the Arbitration Committee, be desysopped.

Standard of review
On community review

Uninvolved administrators at the arbitration enforcement noticeboard ("AE") and uninvolved editors at the administrators' noticeboard ("AN") should revoke or modify a contentious topic restriction on appeal if:

the action was inconsistent with the contentious topics procedure or applicable policy (i.e. the action was out of process),
the action was not reasonably necessary to prevent damage or disruption when first imposed, or
the action is no longer reasonably necessary to prevent damage or disruption.

On Arbitration Committee review

Arbitrators hearing an appeal at a request for amendment ("ARCA") will generally overturn a contentious topic restriction only if:

the action was inconsistent with the contentious topics procedure or applicable policy (i.e. the action was out of process),
the action represents an unreasonable exercise of administrative enforcement discretion, or
compelling circumstances warrant the full Committee's action.

^ The administrator may indicate consent at any time before, during, or after imposition of the restriction.
^ This criterion does not apply if the original action was imposed as a result of rough consensus at the arbitration enforcement noticeboard, as there would be no single enforcing administrator.

Appeals and administrator modifications of non-contentious topics sanctions

The Arbitration Committee procedures relating to modifications and appeals state:

Appeals by sanctioned editors

Appeals may be made only by the editor under sanction and only for a currently active sanction. Requests for modification of page restrictions may be made by any editor. The process has three possible stages (see "Important notes" below). The editor may:

ask the enforcing administrator to reconsider their original decision;
request review at the arbitration enforcement noticeboard ("AE") or at the administrators’ noticeboard ("AN"); and
submit a request for amendment at the amendment requests page ("ARCA"). If the editor is blocked, the appeal may be made by email through Special:EmailUser/Arbitration Committee (or, if email access is revoked, to arbcom-enwikimedia.org).

Modifications by administrators

No administrator may modify or remove a sanction placed by another administrator without:

the explicit prior affirmative consent of the enforcing administrator; or
prior affirmative agreement for the modification at (a) AE or (b) AN or (c) ARCA (see "Important notes" below).

Administrators modifying sanctions out of process may at the discretion of the committee be desysopped.

Nothing in this section prevents an administrator from replacing an existing sanction issued by another administrator with a new sanction if fresh misconduct has taken place after the existing sanction was applied.

Administrators are free to modify sanctions placed by former administrators – that is, editors who do not have the administrator permission enabled (due to a temporary or permanent relinquishment or desysop) – without regard to the requirements of this section. If an administrator modifies a sanction placed by a former administrator, the administrator who made the modification becomes the "enforcing administrator". If a former administrator regains the tools, the provisions of this section again apply to their unmodified enforcement actions.

Important notes:

For a request to succeed, either

(i) the clear and substantial consensus of (a) uninvolved administrators at AE or (b) uninvolved editors at AN or

(ii) a passing motion of arbitrators at ARCA

is required. If consensus at AE or AN is unclear, the status quo prevails.

While asking the enforcing administrator and seeking reviews at AN or AE are not mandatory prior to seeking a decision from the committee, once the committee has reviewed a request, further substantive review at any forum is barred. The sole exception is editors under an active sanction who may still request an easing or removal of the sanction on the grounds that said sanction is no longer needed, but such requests may only be made once every six months, or whatever longer period the committee may specify.
These provisions apply only to contentious topic restrictions placed by administrators and to blocks placed by administrators to enforce arbitration case decisions. They do not apply to sanctions directly authorized by the committee, and enacted either by arbitrators or by arbitration clerks, or to special functionary blocks of whatever nature.
All actions designated as arbitration enforcement actions, including those alleged to be out of process or against existing policy, must first be appealed following arbitration enforcement procedures to establish if such enforcement is inappropriate before the action may be reversed or formally discussed at another venue.

Information for administrators processing requests

Thank you for participating in this area. AE works best if there are a variety of admins bringing their expertise to each case. There is no expectation to comment on every case, and the Arbitration Committee (ArbCom) thanks all admins for whatever time they can give.

A couple of reminders:

Before commenting, please familiarise yourself with the referenced ArbCom case. Please also read all the evidence (including diffs) presented in the AE request.
When a request widens to include editors beyond the initial request, these editors must be notified and the notifications recorded in the same way as for the initial editor against whom sanctions were requested. Where some part of the outcome is clear, a partial close may be implemented and noted as "Result concerning X".
Enforcement measures in arbitration cases should be construed liberally to protect Wikipedia and keep it running efficiently. Some of the behaviour described in an enforcement request might not be restricted by ArbCom. However, it may violate other Wikipedia policies and guidelines; you may use administrative discretion to resolve it.
More than one side in a dispute may have ArbCom conduct rulings applicable to them. Please ensure these are investigated.

Closing a thread:

Once an issue is resolved, enclose it between {{hat}} and {{hab}} tags. A bot should archive it in 7 days.
Please consider referring the case to ARCA if the outcome is a recommendation to do so or the issue regards administrator conduct.
You can use the templates {{uw-aeblock}} (for blocks) or {{AE sanction}} (for other contentious topic restrictions) to give notice of sanctions on user talk pages.
Please log sanctions in the Arbitration enforcement log.

Thanks again for helping. If you have any questions, please post on the talk page.

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Arbitration enforcement action appeal by Dlthewave

Procedural notes: The rules governing arbitration enforcement appeals are found here. According to the procedures, a "clear, substantial, and active consensus of uninvolved editors" is required to overturn an arbitration enforcement action.

To help determine any such consensus, involved editors may make brief statements in separate sections but should not edit the section for discussion among uninvolved editors. Editors are normally considered involved if they are in a current dispute with the sanctioning or sanctioned editor, or have taken part in disputes (if any) related to the contested enforcement action. Administrators having taken administrative actions are not normally considered involved for this reason alone (see WP:UNINVOLVED).

Appealing user: Dlthewave (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) – –dlthewave ☎ 17:33, 23 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Sanctions being appealed: Discussion Log

Logged warning by Sandstein
Deletion of User:Dlthewave/Whitewashing_of_firearms_articles by Goldenring

Administrators imposing the sanctions

Sandstein (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA)
GoldenRing (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA)

Notification of those administrators

Sandstein

Goldenring

Statement by Dlthewave

I feel that the closing statement "Springee, Trekphiler, RAF910 and Dlthewave are warned not to misuse Wikipedia as a forum for polemic statements unrelated to Wikipedia, or attacking or vilifying groups of editors, persons, or other entities.", which appears to be copy-and-pasted from WP:POLEMIC, is not an accurate assessment of consensus among the admins who participated in the discussion. Among other things, it implies that all four editors are equally at fault, which does not appear to be what the admins intended in their support for a logged warning. Although Goldenring did delete a page in my userspace under WP:POLEMIC, there was no discussion of my "attacking" or "vilifying" anyone and one admin even stated "Dlthewave is in fact engaged in appropriate editing and discussion." There was no proposal to issue a logged warning to Dlthewave. (As a sidenote, I also feel that issuing a polemic warning to the other three involved editors instead of a warning related to talk page conduct was entirely out of left field, but that is something for them to address in their own appeals if they choose to pursue them.)
I feel that Goldenring's deletion of a page in my userspace, User:Dlthewave/Whitewashing_of_firearms_articles, has a chilling effect on my ability to document and share what I view as a long-term pattern in the gun control/gun crime topic area. This documentation plays an essential role in addressing current problems that are, in my opinion, a continuation of that pattern. My intention is to demonstrate a pattern and not to attack the individual editors who have been involved in that pattern. This removal is especially concerning when the "opposing" attacks and accusations which I documented are allowed to remain in full view at WP:Firearms and other talk pages. I would be open to discussing ways to do this that would not be viewed as an attack page, since similar pages maintained by other editors have passed MfD.

Although this deletion may have been within Goldenring's editorial discretion, I would like it to be reviewed by other admins and preferably discussed by the community at Miscellany for Deletion. –dlthewave ☎ 17:33, 23 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I've opened a Deletion Review here as suggested. –dlthewave ☎ 21:53, 24 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Sandstein

After rereading User:Dlthewave/Whitewashing of firearms articles, I agree with the appellant that the page was not (quite) a violation of WP:POLEMIC because it did not name editors and did not make allegations of misconduct, except as implied in the title ("whitewashing"), but that alone probably doesn't merit a warning. Because that page was the reason for my warning, I am striking it and recommend that GoldenRing (talk · contribs) undelete the page. A case can perhaps be made for its deletion on grounds of copyright / attribution, but that's a matter for the deletion process. Sandstein 18:37, 23 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Per my comment here, I've also withdrawn the warning with respect to Springee. Clearly I should have read the enforcement request more carefully; sorry for that. I think that we should be more careful in the future as to whether or not to entertain enforcement requests directed at multiple editors. Sandstein 22:59, 23 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

In response to Bishonen, GoldenRing is correct that an action that has been labeled as an AE action may only be reviewed by way of the process described at WP:AC/DS#Appeals, that is, here at AE, or at AN or ARCA – but not at DRV. Bishonen, I recommend that you undo your temporary restoration of the page for the purpose of the DRV, or you may be desysopped for undoing an AE action out of process, as described at WP:AC/DS#Modifications by administrators. Any admin who acts on the currently ongoing DRV by overturning the deletion may likewise be desysopped. Sandstein 15:26, 25 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Springee

I'm clearly an involved editor. As I said before I think Dlthewave has a very strong POV on this topic and I frequently disagree with them. However, when push comes to shove, I don't think on good faith they viewed the page as a POLMIC. For what it's worth, I would support reverting Dlthewave's warning. Springee (talk) 19:12, 23 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by GoldenRing

I disagree with Sandstein above and stand by this action. Dlthewave has stated right here that the purpose of this page is to document long-term problematic editing and policy is clear that such material is allowed only for dispute resolution and when used in a timely manner. I don't see the practical difference between, "so-and-so said this" (which the appellant seems to admit would be disallowed) and "someone said this and here's a link showing who it was" which is what they've actually done. GoldenRing (talk) 21:01, 23 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Bishonen: I'm not sure why you've suggested deletion review here. AE actions cannot be overturned at deletion review, only at AE, AN or ARCA. Have you also not just unilaterally undone an AE action? GoldenRing (talk) 10:19, 25 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Dlthewave: I will reiterate here what I've said on the deletion review: if you wish to use this material for valid dispute resolution (probably either an ANI or arbitration case request) and can outline a reasonable timeline for doing so (either on-wiki or privately by email), then I will self-revert my enforcement action. GoldenRing (talk) 10:32, 25 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I would like to add, for what it's worth at this point, that I agree a formal warning to Dlthewave was not warranted. GoldenRing (talk) 12:07, 25 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Please note that I have requested clarification from the arbitration committee regarding my deletion at WP:ARCA. GoldenRing (talk) 16:02, 25 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Simonm223

Marginally involved. I just found out about the removal of DLThewave's excellent summary of the challenges faced to bring firearms into compliance with WP:N including the way that a wikiproject has tried to present their MOS suggestions as policy. I've said as much at another venue, but this is definitely not a violation of WP:POLEMIC and should be undeleted for the valuable resource it is. Simonm223 (talk) 15:03, 25 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by (involved editor 2)

Discussion among uninvolved editors about the appeal by Dlthewave

The matter of the deletion itself should be deferred to WP:DRV as that venue is much better equipped for such reviews. Whether or not the action itself was appropriate should be discussed here or in a more general manner at Wikipedia talk:Arbitration Committee (where Wikipedia talk:Arbitration Committee/Discretionary sanctions redirects). — Godsy^(TALK_CONT) 10:49, 25 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Result of the appeal by Dlthewave

This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.

I commented in the initial thread, so I'm not sure whether my response should appear in this section, or above with GoldenRing's and Sandstein's. The deletion of Dlthewave's userspace subpage was arguably appropriate under WP:POLEMIC, and within reasonable admin discretion on GoldenRing's part. While I'm not sure I would have done the same, I'm comfortable leaving the page deleted. That said, I don't think a formal warning to Dlthewave is warranted; there wasn't really any support for such a warning amongst uninvolved admins in the previous thread, and it seems like overkill. The proper response to a potentially polemical userspace subpage is to delete it, which has been done. There wasn't any convincing evidence of a pattern of behavior warranting a logged warning on Dlthewave's part, at least not that I saw.
Regarding the logged warnings, I do take Springee's point that they perhaps paint the remaining 3 editors with an overly broad brush. There are clearly gradations of concerning behavior, with Springee on the mild end and Trekphiler/RAF910 showing a much more sustained and problematic battleground attitude. I'll leave it up to other admins whether we should modify the warning to exclude Springee, but it is worth considering while we're here. MastCell ^Talk 21:19, 23 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Hmm. This is definitely a confusing situation. Reading the deleted page, it does seem borderline WP:POLEMIC so, perhaps, GoldenRing was right in deleting it. But, Dlthewave brings up a good point. If they do plan on making a future case then how else can they keep a record of the edits they see as forming a pattern? They could do it off-wiki of course, but isn't it better to be open about one's activities? While the deletion was within admin discretion perhaps, in cases of this nature, it is better to leave them as is with a note to the editor that they can't leave it sticking around for too long. Imo, the warning should be withdrawn. --regentspark (comment) 00:22, 24 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]
I'm not sure about deleting the whitewashing essay; I can't seem to make up my mind. Suggest dlthewave take it to Wikipedia:Deletion review. An admin should be asked to temporarily undelete the page for purposes of discussion as soon as the DR is opened. But I don't have any trouble agreeing with Sandstein, Springee, MastCell, and Regentspark that dlthewave's warning should be withdrawn and struck from the log, and Sandstein has already done so. Bishonen | talk 01:11, 24 February 2019 (UTC).[reply]

@Dlthewave:, I've temporarily undeleted your page for the deletion review. Bishonen | talk 22:01, 24 February 2019 (UTC).[reply]
Your deletion can't be overturned at Deletion review, GoldenRing? Are you sure? In that case, obviously I suggested it because I didn't know any better. A bit of bad luck that apparently nobody who did know saw my suggestion for Deletion review here at AE, some 20 hours before Dlthewave actually opened the deletion review. I'm not sure what should be the next step, considering there is quite a lot of discussion at the review already, and some disagreement about how to proceed. But whatever action is taken, rest assured I won't feel "undermined" by it, as somebody suggested there. I'm personally fine with whatever, although I want to apologize to Dlthewave for potentially complicating his situation. As for "Have you also not just unilaterally undone an AE action?", no, I haven't. If you're referring to my temporary undeletion of the page, for the deletion review only and with the front page covered by a template, per the instructions here, I can only ask you not to be so silly. If you're talking about my giving Dlthewave bad advice, well, I've explained how that came about (=ignorance on my part). Bishonen | talk 12:54, 25 February 2019 (UTC).[reply]

What an absolute joy you are to work with, Sandstein. It's a wonder more admins don't flock to help out at AE, where honest mistakes get met with immediate threats of desysopping. I do want to point out that there's a pretty clear consensus at DRV that the page doesn't violate WP:POLEMIC. @GoldenRing:, do I understand correctly that you are not going to recognize that consensus because it is being discussed on the Wrong Page^(TM)? If this is the case, then I suppose we should tell everyone at DRV their opinions are not wanted there, re-delete the page, and then have the exact same discussion here. Or alternately, GR could rescind the deletion.... --Floquenbeam (talk) 15:59, 25 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]
I not only agree that restoring the page for deletion review is not an abuse of process, but that deleting the page via AE would be an abuse of process. The way to remove userspace essays that are contrary to policy is MfD., and review of decisions there is at Deletion Review. DGG ( talk ) 06:53, 26 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

GoldenRing, do you intend to delete under AE every page in an area subject to DS (such as AP or PIA) that you think might arguably be the result of an action that violation an arb ruling,? DGG ( talk ) 17:16, 5 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

And I have just noticed, Sandstein, that your closing at the AE Discussion used the wording of the arb case "for polemic statements unrelated to Wikipedia, " but the entire discussion above about whether it violated POLEMIC is irrelevant, because the page is obviously related to WP. And the arb com wording continued " attacking or vilifying groups of editors, persons, or other entities. " I do not see any editors named on the page in question. It was discussing edits. (Of course the editors were implied, because the statements wee linked, but nothing about the editors is question is said on the page, only about the edits. DGG ( talk ) 17:16, 5 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

FeydHuxtable

No action taken. Sandstein 16:44, 27 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.

This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.
Requests may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.

Request concerning FeydHuxtable

User who is submitting this request for enforcement: Kingofaces43 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 19:47, 16 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

User against whom enforcement is requested: FeydHuxtable (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)
Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log

Sanction or remedy to be enforced

Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Genetically_modified_organisms#Casting_aspersions : An editor must not accuse another of misbehavior without evidence, especially when the accusations are repeated or severe. This especially applies to accusations of being paid by a company to promote a point of view (i.e., a shill) or similar associations and using that to attack or cast doubt over the editor in content disputes. . .
Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Genetically_modified_organisms#Discretionary_Sanctions: Standard discretionary sanctions are authorised for all pages relating to genetically modified organisms, commercially produced agricultural chemicals and the companies that produce them, broadly construed.

Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it

March 14 2019 GMO aspersions principle violation (more in comment)
March 21 2019 I don't trust you on insect decline at all.

Diffs of previous relevant sanctions, if any

Jan 29 2019 Warned for violating GMO aspersions principle and uncivil behavior.

If discretionary sanctions are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see WP:AC/DS#Awareness and alerts)

Alerted about discretionary sanctions in the area of conflict in the last twelve months, see the system log linked to above.[1]

Additional comments by editor filing complaint

Background

In the last AE concerning FeydHuxtable, they cast WP:ASPERSIONS in violation of the GMO/pesticide behavioral DS. Because disruptive editors frequently used things like shill gambits to cast doubt over editors in content disputes or further battleground behavior, a principle was passed in the GMO/pesticide case. Admins, please be sure to read that in the listed sanctions above. ArbCom specifically said this is a problem in this topic area and cannot be dismissed as non-sanctionable behavior when it continues. That especially goes for when editors have been notified of the DS, including trying to game the principle by not "exactly" calling someone a shill, etc.

There was also confusion in that last AE, so let me be clear that the talk page content did involve pesticides, and these were the types of edits that do involve pesticides as main cause for insect declines, the center of the underlying content dispute, being worked on at multiple articles. More on application of the DS here.

Current issues

After that, I'd been trying to work with that same battleground behavior I reported that absolutely did not let up. Feyd filed a declined ArbCom case request against me accusing me of pro-corporate POV editing and linking that to pesticides with absolutely no evidence. Arbs pointed out that it was largely meritless and that a motion for sanctions against Feyd could be considered. Feyd also said there, I'm not suggesting he's a shill. But one doesn't need CoI to make overly pro-corporate edits., and accused me of "weaponizing" the DS which is also clear gaming of the GMO/pesticide aspersions principle. Editors who bristle at the DS in this topic like that has usually are the ones that need to be removed in some fashion. Ironically, I was saying in the underlying dispute that pesticides were actually a cause of insect declines, but it seems like their battleground mentality kept leading to Feyd repeatedly painting me as some pro-pesticide or pro-corporate editor and encourages others.

I could go into more on gaming the 1RR restriction and dealing with a litany of WP:TENDENTIOUS behavior from them. For brevity unless asked, I'm going to stick to the blatant violation of the aspersions principle since that establishes the continued battleground mentality most succinctly. Due to being warned in the last AE and continuing it yet again in an ArbCom request of all places, I'm formally requesting either a topic-ban from topics where pesticides and insects are involved or else a one-way interaction ban in order to prevent future disruption and harassment. I have never run into Feyd before this, and I don't expect to see them outside this topic either, so either might work without future issues.

Feyd has made a very clear battleground mentality known here for this subject, so some sort of sanctions are needed to prevent additional disruption from them so the rest of us can actually get back to work on content since these issues above scuttle attempts at doing that. Kingofaces43 (talk) 19:47, 16 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Procedural comments

Sandstein, admins cannot override Arbcom and call a direct violation of the aspersions principle "frivolous". The case was declined, and arbs said to take to to the admin boards. Kingofaces43 (talk) 01:14, 17 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Just a note that Joe Roe did say it was fine to file this at AE too. Kingofaces43 (talk) 19:08, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Vanamonde, the aspersions principle was crafted to be very strict to prevent comments exactly like yours because some people would always waffle on it. Arbs at the declined case also mentioned that the evidence was lacking to justify the claims, violating the principle. The original GMO/pesticide case was started in part because ANI does not handle these violations well. It was meant to be explicit that such behavior is not tolerated anywhere where pesticides/GMOs come up because not removing it makes the environment toxic and disrupts content discussion (or dispute resolution), but instead encourages the battleground behavior I've been receiving here trying to paint me as also disruptive for following the DS and getting battleground behavior removed. We're reaching a point if admins keep ignoring that and contradicting ArbCom, this will become an ArbCom matter to discuss ways to further prevent what's happening in this discussion (including what it does to editors who report the violations). It shouldn't need to be though since this is supposed to be a cut and dry violation as we hammered out at the original case, so I'm only asking for the standard protection editors who are following the DS are supposed to get from that principle, which has so far failed. Kingofaces43 (talk) 19:08, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Vanamonde, my position is quite clear the the DS and related principles are supposed to be enforced with some things that are not really debatable here without ArbCom changing certain motions (that discussions on pesticides are covered by the DS, and no aspersions, especially of the nature mentioned here). Arbcom's wheelhouse is defining the scope and what behavior is severely disruptive to the subject, and this discussion is running directly into issues with some of that. There is nothing battleground about that (don't shoot the messenger afterall), and I've made it clear in my comments at Goldenring's talk page that I despise any sort of cry WP:INVOLVED tactic. As for the declined case, arbs did not consider the aspersions principle as that was not the focus of what Feyd filed. That's why we are here as recommended since AN is not particularly for DS requests.

My comments to Goldenring are about direct misrepresentations accusing me of trying to drag a DS topic into an unrelated conversation in order to win a content dispute. I have to call that out since it is accusing me of something blatantly false with any reasonable understanding of the topic (and already mentioned as a good faith mistake that can be fixed). Pesticides came up almost right away in edits that had to be proposed because reviews covered, and Feyd mentioned, environmental stressors causing insect decline. The page already had plenty mentions of insecticides too prior. Feyd had been calling it "Fringe POV pushing" at the time, but once we started discussing what reviews actually said, then they switched to a you're editing from a Fringe pro pesticide POV. That's when I knew I had to stick to the DS strictly, and Feyd has been egging on these misrepresentations I mostly try to ignore up to this day.

I'm the last person to say I'm immune to criticism, but there's been too much directed at me that's also way out of line in this admin discussion. In addition to the sniping I've been subject to by Feyd, both those create an illusion of battleground behavior when one simply sticks to the DS and related principles. If the tables were turned and I as a long-term editor in this topic was the one casting aspersions about a "pro-corporate editor", I would be quickly sanctioned not only for that, but also for trying to game the DS by claiming things mentioned here like the DS not applying, especially if I did it at an admin or ArbCom board, a related page not having pesticide in the title, etc. Please be mindful of that double standard I'm currently being placed in because I've been following the DS carefully, so while I have very reasonable frustration over the current situation, calling that battleground, frivolous, or otherwise is not appropriate here. All I can do here is be extremely clear on what we worked on at the original ArbCom case so I can get back to working on the topic without these disruptions. Kingofaces43 (talk) 00:32, 19 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

GoldenRing, I never called you WP:INVOLVED by acting at AE even before I fixed my typo that you would have seen before your post. I was saying an uninvolved admin should not be directly misrepresenting an editor as I explicitly told you that you were doing, and that it was fixable. Continuing down that path is what causes problems. We're at a point though that so many aspersions (shill-type or more general) have been cast about me and not been tamped down per the principle that I cannot address them with the current word limit outside of these procedural comments. I'm just asking the principle be enforced due to the explicit violations so I can go back to editing those articles again and work on fixing some of the underlying issues there (including some of Feyd's edits) without having to deal with the toxic behavior Feyd has been following me around with there and here already outlined at the declined case Feyd made. Kingofaces43 (talk) 19:08, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Later procedural comments

Admins, we're getting more problems in the topic again now. We already had two plain as day violations of the GMO/pesticide aspersions principle with the pro-pesticide pro-corporate comments and no action yet, essentially encouraging ignoring the DS remedies and pursuing battleground behavior in topics where pesticides are covered since it won't be enforced. I've added a new diff above, but Feyd continues to make their battleground behavior they've already indicated was centered around pesticides extremely clear. Their responses at these AE (mostly focused on me rather than their behavior), and now at a talk page explicitly saying I don't trust you on insect decline at all. as well as interjecting language about me being a denialist somehow for saying the insect declines are occurring[2] show a type of personal vendetta and attempt at a needlessly inflame the topic and blame the other editors approach that was supposed to be tamped down hard when it shows up in this DS area because of how it disrupts content discussion. I shouldn't need to go to ARCA with blatant stuff like that.

Couple that with the "factions" comment at the last AE, that diff summarizes the personal battleground behavior Feyd has been repeatedly directing towards me throughout the talk pages I've been trying to respond to as civilly as possible and stick to the DS despite all that. It should be clear to admins that Feyd's behavior isn't going to stop and will keep disrupting attempts to build content or follow consensus-building procedure. That's especially when it's like pulling teeth trying to encourage them to even start on proposing specific content like I did here. I didn't immediately run to AE when this all became clear, but there's a point where there's been enough disruption I've dealt with patiently that the DS were specifically crafted to protect us from. Kingofaces43 (talk) 22:27, 21 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@UninvitedCompany: a short response since I fee like I've overextended my extension, but the principle was crafted to make it clear making up such stuff about editors was not appropriate in any forum, and I'm getting really concerned admins are dismissing ArbCom on the seriousness of the principle crafted because editors and admins alike already weren't taking the problem seriously prior to the case. The principle specifically states actual evidence is required, not bald-faced aspersions. We already had one AE where editors had to be sanctioned for direct aspersions at a board like AE, so we can't say it's now ok to do that. Kingofaces43 (talk) 03:05, 26 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested

[3]

Discussion concerning FeydHuxtable

Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.

Statement by FeydHuxtable

I see King's just made an excellent talk page post concerning the subject of our dispute. IMO it's a different class to anything I've seen him post before. King had telegraphed he was going to launch this AE, so I already have diffs ready that hopefully demonstrates much of the above is not entirely accurate. (And possibly to make a case that King's the one who warrants a topic ban. In fairness Im unsure about this, my own conduct hasn't been perfect, it's hard to be objective when you're personally involved.) FeydHuxtable (talk) 21:30, 16 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Golden Ring
FWIW, IMO DS is now applicable to Insect Decline. I've no objection to a 2-way iban, though I agree with Sandstein it may not be needed. Other editors have started to weigh in strongly for the mainstream view. and I doubt even King will try to edit war against the emerging consensus. I don't think there's been much personal animosity in the dispute. That said, Im also not impressed with yesterdays edit to your talk. If this goes to round 4 I'd switch to supporting sanctions for King. Considering his past conduct, I can't see a trip to ANI ending well for him. That said, King also has many fine qualities, and IMO he doesn't quite yet warrant a sanction. ( I can post a more detailed diff rich expansion if you're interested in my take on this.) FeydHuxtable (talk) 13:55, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Tryptofish

I have a general concern, as opposed to a specific comment about this filing. @Sandstein: as a long-time watcher of AE complaints in the GMO area, it seems to me that you have a blind spot when it comes to GMOs. I'm not questioning your good faith by any means, but I think that this has become a problem in the way that you have been responding to these kinds of requests. --Tryptofish (talk) 18:44, 17 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Sandstein, thank you, yes, I'll go to your talk page soon. @All admins, if you have questions about whether or not insecticides fall within the scope of the GMO DS, perhaps the best way to resolve that would be for me to file a request for clarification to ArbCom. I was thinking about doing that, and will if you would like me to do so. --Tryptofish (talk) 19:31, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@GoldenRing: Thank you for clarifying that, as well as for saving me the trouble of filing a request for clarification, which I can see is now no longer useful. I was going from where you had just said here that I am still dubious that the content at the base of all this actually falls under the scope of GMO DS. I do understand your point that the content did not include explicit mention of pesticides. However, that content was summarizing source material that attributes a large percentage of the decline in insect populations to the agricultural use of pesticides (which are obviously "agricultural chemicals" as the words are used in "genetically modified organisms, agricultural chemicals, and the companies that produce them, broadly construed"). And in fact, there are GM crops that have been designed specifically for the purpose of changing how insecticides are used on those crops. Consequently, it is inescapably true that any dispute between editors about how to summarize that source material must necessarily get into what the sources say about agricultural chemicals. And therefore, it is inaccurate to claim that an editor who points that fact out is somehow "weaponizing" the GMO DS to be used outside of their intended scope. --Tryptofish (talk) 19:20, 19 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by (username)

Result concerning FeydHuxtable

This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.

This is a frivolous request. The alleged misconduct consists of filing an arbitration case request. If arbitrators find the request problematic, they or their clerks will take appropriate action. We should close this without action. Sandstein 20:57, 16 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Tryptofish: Your comment surprises me. I'm not aware of treating GMO issues that come to AE (which is not often the case) different from any other issues. Please contact me at my talk page to explain your concerns. Sandstein 10:46, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Editors are generally given more latitude with their language when filing requests for arbitration, because such requests necessarily involve allegations of misconduct. If every allegation was accurate, ARBCOM could be dissolved, because there would be nothing for them to examine. I do not see FeyHuxtable's comments straying beyond what is acceptable for an ARBCOM request. Furthermore, ARBCOM is able to impose sanctions (via motions) on editors filing vexatious requests. Only one arbitrator suggested such an action, and a motion was not even proposed. Even if I found merit to this request, I would hesitate to second-guess ARBCOM. Kingofaces: the request was not declined as "meritless". It was largely declined because other forms of dispute resolution had not been tried yet. AE is not a form of dispute resolution; nor have you brought evidence here from the original dispute. In conclusion, I see no basis for action here. Vanamonde (Talk) 02:17, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Kingofaces, your last comment is concerning, because your language suggests that any admin who disagrees with your interpretation of what happened is neglecting their duty, which itself smacks of a battleground mentality. You've also initiated or participated in discussions with six editors involved in the arbitration request or this one, essentially asking them why they didn't support your position in its entirety. We are not ignoring the evidence you've presented; we're judging it differently from you. Additionally, your comment is missing the point of what most of the arbs said. Most of them did not comment on the evidence at all; they recommended that other attempts at dispute resolution be attempted first. This isn't such an attempt, because you haven't brought forward any evidence from the initial dispute. Finally, since you ignored this point above; AE is not meant for policing the arbitration pages. The arbs and the clerks are more than capable of acting on any violations there themselves, and have done so in the past. This dispute needs to be examined in its entirety. I recommend that that happen at AN, but if you wish to present additional evidence here instead, please feel free. Vanamonde (Talk) 22:05, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with Sandstein and Vanamonde93 above - there is no basis for action in this particular request and the clerk team is capable of maintaining order at A/R/C without needing requests at AE. I'm also not particularly impressed with the claim that somehow having acted at AE makes me involved. However, stepping back a bit, there is clearly a dispute between these two that needs resolving. An interaction ban seems a good outcome to try; my only query is whether it can be done under GMO DS or whether we should send this back to the community at AN. I am still dubious that the content at the base of all this actually falls under the scope of GMO DS. @Sandstein and Vanamonde93: what say you? GoldenRing (talk) 10:05, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

An interaction ban is perhaps within scope of the DS, but I'm not seeing clear evidence that it is required - i.e., that the conflict between these two is disruptive to the work of other users. Sandstein 10:46, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@GoldenRing: I would hesitate to impose an interaction-ban here, because I do not think the behavioral issues have been explored in enough detail. Furthermore, behavioral and content-related issues tend to run together in some topics where reliable sources are not unanimous; this is one such situation. As such I think the community is better equipped to deal with this at the moment, and I think kicking this to AN would be the better option. Vanamonde (Talk) 17:15, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Tryptofish: I don't see any question over whether insecticides fall under GMO DS; they unquestionably do. My hesitation here is that the content that kicked all this off was a strict, quantitative description of insect population decline without any mention of pesticides. Since both parties now accept that DS covers the discussion, it's a moot point. GoldenRing (talk) 09:25, 19 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
I concur with Vanamonde93's first point above. Users editing arbitration committee case pages in accordance with arbitration policy are generally given wider latitude because the abitration process relies on statements that are straightforward, short, and blunt. I do not believe that the other comment in the original request (the one related to insect decline) rises, by itself, to a level where enforcement action is called for. Uninvited Company 19:01, 25 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Because discussion has ceased and nobody seems to want to take action, I am closing this as no action. Sandstein 16:44, 27 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Infobox RfC on Fermat's Last Theorem

In line with "request other administrative measures, such as revert restrictions, with respect to pages that are being disrupted in topic areas subject to discretionary sanctions", I'd like to request that the Talk:Fermat's Last Theorem page be explicitly placed under discretionary sanctions, specifically sanctions relevant to Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Civility in infobox discussions #Standard discretionary sanctions, and particularly the injunction by ArbCom, "All editors are reminded to maintain decorum and civility when engaged in discussions about infoboxes, and to not turn discussions about a single article's infobox into a discussion about infoboxes in general.", while the discussion about whether or not to include an infobox is taking place.

The earlier debate on that page was characterised by repeated personal attacks, and the current RfC is being turned into a battleground, along with snide remarks, sarcasm, and straw man arguments with the obvious intention of derailing the RfC. I'd like an uninvolved admin to impose whatever sanctions are needed to restore decorum, civility and productive debate to the RfC. Thanks in advance. --RexxS (talk) 10:30, 23 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Discussion concerning discretionary sanctions for Talk:Fermat's Last Theorem

Statement by Bishonen

@RexxS: your request for placing Talk:Fermat's Last Theorem seems reasonable and even-handed. Doing so wouldn't target any group, or any opinion in the RfC as far as I can see, so I could probably do it. I wouldn't feel comfortable, though, simply because you requested it, and you and I are friends. You have helped me and my pesky socks with endless requests that stem from my technical incompetence. Hopefully another admin will do it, and I'll add that I don't see any reason to confine the DS to the talkpage; they should apply to Fermat's Last Theorem as well, since it's perfectly possible to edit that in an incivil way. Bishonen | talk 20:17, 23 March 2019 (UTC).[reply]

Arbitration enforcement action appeal by Raymond3023

Appeal declined. TonyBallioni (talk) 21:20, 28 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.

Procedural notes: The rules governing arbitration enforcement appeals are found here. According to the procedures, a "clear, substantial, and active consensus of uninvolved editors" is required to overturn an arbitration enforcement action.

To help determine any such consensus, involved editors may make brief statements in separate sections but should not edit the section for discussion among uninvolved editors. Editors are normally considered involved if they are in a current dispute with the sanctioning or sanctioned editor, or have taken part in disputes (if any) related to the contested enforcement action. Administrators having taken administrative actions are not normally considered involved for this reason alone (see WP:UNINVOLVED).

Appealing user: Raymond3023 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) – Raymond3023 (talk) 17:42, 23 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Sanction being appealed: You are indefinitely banned from all edits and pages related to conflict between India and Pakistan, broadly construed. [4]

Administrator imposing the sanction: GoldenRing (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA)

Notification of that administrator: [5]

Statement by Raymond3023

I was sanctioned per this AE discussion in May 2018. I was also involved in mass ARCA appeals which were declined in June 2018.[6]

Since the topic ban I haven't engaged in any behavior for which I had been sanctioned. This is why I am now appealing the topic ban. Furthermore, I have not violated the topic ban. I pledge to continue to contribute in a productive manner. Raymond3023 (talk) 17:42, 23 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

In order to demonstrate the understanding of what the issues were or how they will be avoided in future, I am noting I was sanctioned for battleground conduct which I recognized and evidently rectified since there have been no further sanctions or warnings all this while. I reiterate what I said above that I will continue to contribute in such a productive manner. Raymond3023 (talk) 18:18, 26 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by GoldenRing

I don't have a strong view on this either way. I think I said at the time that appeals after six months should be granted on a showing of productive editing in other areas and I stick to that. For various RL reasons, I don't have time to go digging deep into this editor's history. That said, I don't view Ivanvector's stats as encouraging, and I don't think the appeal as it stands demonstrates a lot of understanding of what the problems were or how they will be avoided in future. GoldenRing (talk) 19:26, 25 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I certainly don't think these bans should be overturned on the basis of "time served." GoldenRing (talk) 16:08, 27 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Vanamonde

The mass topic ban last year was necessary essentially because a number of editors had shown themselves unable to work collaboratively in a contentious topic area. Were I evaluating an appeal of such a restriction, I would want to see evidence of collaborative editing in other topics. Raymond3023 has not violated his restriction that I am aware of; but he has also done precious little content related work at all. His last 500 edits go back to before his topic ban. As Ivanvector says, the majority of these edits are reverts, of vandalism or sockpuppet accounts; a number of the rest are edits to AfDs. What content work there is is mostly copy-editing or blanking promotional language. The appeal also does not acknowledge any behavioral problems. As such, if this were granted it would be for "time served", which I think is a bad idea for topic bans from contentious areas. Vanamonde (Talk) 17:37, 26 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by (involved editor 2)

Discussion among uninvolved editors about the appeal by Raymond3023

Of the user's last 500 article-space edits, 350 are reverts, including 29 which are explicitly WP:BANREVERT reverts. That's a lot of reverts. However, I don't see any obvious violations of the restriction, and don't recall seeing them involved in any significant dramaboard dust-ups in this topic (and there have been plenty). I support the request. Ivanvector (^Talk/_Edits) 17:07, 25 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Result of the appeal by Raymond3023

This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.

GoldenRing, your view? Sandstein 16:26, 25 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I would decline the appeal based on GoldenRing's concerns. Sandstein 18:12, 26 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I'd also decline, largely per Vanamonde. As this has been open for five days without attracting any support and it lacks the clear and substantial consensus of administrators at AE, I am closing this as declined. TonyBallioni (talk) 21:20, 28 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Joefromrandb

No action. TonyBallioni (talk) 21:14, 28 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.

This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.
Requests may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.

Request concerning Joefromrandb

User who is submitting this request for enforcement: Purplebackpack89 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 19:49, 23 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

User against whom enforcement is requested: Joefromrandb (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)
Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log

Sanction or remedy to be enforced: Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Joefromrandb and others#One-revert restriction (Joefromrandb restricted to 1RR)

Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it

Edit-warring on Big Time Rush (band) in violation of 1RR restriction

18:54, 23 March 2019 (UTC) "it's not an independent clause, and you obviously have no idea what you're talking about, but I'll leave it to others to fix; meanwhile fixing mid-sentence capitalization of definite articles beginning a band's name"
Consecutive edits made from 18:29, 23 March 2019 (UTC) to 18:34, 23 March 2019 (UTC)
1. 18:29, 23 March 2019 (UTC) "/* 2011–12: Elevate and film */ lc"
2. 18:31, 23 March 2019 (UTC) "/* 2013–14: 24/Seven */ lc"
3. 18:32, 23 March 2019 (UTC) "/* Public image */ lc"
4. 18:34, 23 March 2019 (UTC) "/* 2009–10: Formation and BTR */ nowhere does any of that MoS claptrap say to capitalize a dependent clause following a colon"
Consecutive edits made from 10:06, 23 March 2019 (UTC) to 10:12, 23 March 2019 (UTC)
1. 10:06, 23 March 2019 (UTC) "no, a dependent clause following a colon is lowercase"
2. 10:09, 23 March 2019 (UTC) "/* Public image */ lc"
3. 10:12, 23 March 2019 (UTC) "/* Public image */ lc"
05:47, 23 March 2019 (UTC) "/* 2009–10: Formation and BTR */ lc"

If discretionary sanctions are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see WP:AC/DS#Awareness and alerts): diff

Additional comments by editor filing complaint

Note that editor Joefromrandb is edit-warring with is not me, but User:Amaury p b p 20:00, 23 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

In addition, there are a number of personal attacks by Joe on other editors. Examples include here and here, among others. He is continuing past behavior of claiming any disagree with him is trolling. There was a finding that Joe's personal attacks were problematic, but no specific enforcement was given to them. p b p 16:19, 24 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Drmies: @Awilley: @Floquenbeam: This is not about me, this is about Joe and the ArbCom restrictions imposed on him. We either have rules or we don't. It shouldn't matter whether or not I filed this: this is a violation of Joe's ArbCom restrictions (I might add restrictions that were the result of a discussion I had no part in), and there should be enforcement. And I'm not really buying this whole "it's better" attitude: he still is incivil and dismissive of people who tell him to stop edit-warring, and he's merely gone from behaviors that would get 90% of editors blocked to behaviors that would get 50% of editors blocked. p b p 03:34, 26 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested: 1 2. (Note that related user warnings to this topic on Joe's own page have been dismissed as trolling by Joe).

Discussion concerning Joefromrandb

Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.

Statement by Joefromrandb

(Note: I am posting this at User talk:Floquenbeam and asking him to copy it to WP:AE. I have taken this unusual step for the sole purpose of continuing to, as I have for years, voluntarily refrain from any interaction with the filer of this report. It should not be taken as a slight against readers of this page by refusing to answer directly, nor should it been seen as an endorsement of the content by Floquenbeam.)

In short: mea culpa. I let my frustration get the better of me. I should have stopped after the first revert and left it to others to correct the errors I found. Going forward I will strive to do so in the future. I do feel the need to note that the complainant in the AN3 report was my counterpart in the edit war. That doesn't exonerate me, nor does it mitigate my culpability in edit-warring. Still, I have to say I find it outrageous for a user who performed three reverts within a period of several hours to show up at AN3 acting like the injured party. It's true, I broke WP:3RR and he did not. However, as far as both the spirit and the letter of Wikipedia's overall policy on edit-warring goes, he was every bit as guilty as I. Whatever the case, I acknowledge my part in this edit war, and pledge to strive to refrain from such behavior in the future. This is an isolated incident, occurring more than six months after I resumed editing following the ArbCom block. I don't see a new block being particularly productive, but of course, that's not for me to decide. Joefromrandb (talk) 23:48, 25 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by IJBall

I'm going to support a block in this case, based on edit warring, WP:NPA, this editor's long previous block log, and this editor's assuming bad faith and unwillingness to collaborate (based on their comments to Talk:Big Time Rush (band)). --IJBall (contribs • talk) 21:37, 23 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I just left a Level 3 WP:NPA warning at this user's talk page for this egregious edit against Geraldo Perez (who has been remarkably patient with this editor – maybe too much so). As far as I'm concerned, their behavior in this whole situation shows that they are clearly WP:NOTHERE to work in a collaborative manner. So I think an indef is fully in order in this case. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 07:46, 24 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
@Floquenbeam: There is no "settling old scores" on my account – I have never seen this editor before this. But what I have seen of them here is not good at all. Frankly, the project is not served by allowing long-term disruptive editors, no matter how "well meaning", to continue unabated. (This especially true about rigid "MOS warriors" – no single group of editors ends up causing more disruption than these.) And the behavior of this editor in situation has been to my mind egregious. On the "merits", the editor may have had a point on MOS:THEBAND (though I gather this MOS is itself controversial, and the result of a "compromise", and generally MOS's like that aren't worth the pixels they're made out of...), but was actually wrong on the header issue (Geraldo quoted chapter on verse on the general practice of how to handle headers after a daterange, but this editor not only ignored that but insulted Geraldo to boot). Frankly, I don't care what pbp's "motivations" were for filing this report – disruption is disruption. And if ARBCOM is simply going to ignore their own previous rulings, what is the purpose of ARBCOM at all?! --IJBall (contribs • talk) 15:42, 25 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Amaury

Support block per reasons by IJBall. Amaury (talk | contribs) 21:47, 23 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Floquenbeam: I hope this is correct and how replies are made to other users here, as I've never been here. Anyway, FWIW, if you haven't already, see this ANEW report which is what led here. Amaury (talk | contribs) 15:31, 25 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by RhinosF1

Looking at this from an uninvolved point, It's clear there's NPA issues and a breach of WP:1RR. The editors block log and previous ArbBlock shows he won't change so Support Indef. RhinosF1^(chat)_{(status)(contribs)} 08:49, 24 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Floq

I can't argue that a block of some kind isn't allowed here; that was certainly a 1RR violation. However, I recommend not blocking, mostly to prevent giving the emotional reward to the filing editor here. For reasons I can no longer recall, PBP and Joe have been at odds for years; eventually Joe stopped interacting, and PBP didn't. I've blocked them for such harassment in the past. PBP has nothing to do with this dispute, but saw an opportunity to get an old rival in trouble and jumped on it. I can't sanction them for reporting a clear AE violation, but this kind of behavior should not be rewarded. Considering that the dispute that led to the 1RR violation hasn't flared up again, I'd recommend only a warning/reminder to Joe this time. Ironically, I'd have likely not commented in Joe's favor at all at WP:ANEW, because the reporting editor there was not motivated by an old feud. But using AE to continue old unrelated feuds should really be slapped down hard; that is much more damaging to our culture than a 1RR violation. By now I'm probably "involved", and PBP certainly wouldn't value advice coming from me anyway, but if some uninvolved admin wants to make it clear to PBP that AE isn't for settling old grudges, that would be great too. --Floquenbeam (talk) 15:16, 25 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I thought I was clear before, but based on IJBall's comment, I just want to be safe and say it again: I'm not claiming IJBall or Amuary are feuding with anyone. I saw the now-closed ANEW report, that's what I was talking about; it's ironic that the ANEW report was closed in deference to this forum, since that report was filed for legit reasons, this one isn't. I disagree with the mindset of "disruption is disruption" without considering context. And finally, a lack of a block here would not be "ArbCom ignoring their own warnings"... ArbCom doesn't do anything here at AE, uninvolved admins do, and they exercise discretion. They may very well impose a block anyway, but if they do I want them to at least understand the background of this AE filing, and understand the behavior they're unintentionally encouraging. --Floquenbeam (talk) 15:53, 25 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Drmies

Not the first time we're here for Joefromrandb, and I hope it's not the last time--that its, I sure hope the admins here are not going to follow the advice of a user with 500 article edits and indef Joe. And Purplebackpack, why? what? This is not cool. I hope the patrolling admins show some leniency. I'm not going to be one of the admins below the line since I just don't know what to do here. I do think that Swarm is right and that we are having fewer problems with Joe's occasional outbursts. I recommend leniency. Drmies (talk) 01:06, 26 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by (username)

Result concerning Joefromrandb

This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.

I remember that RFC mentioned on the Beatles talk page, and basically at the end of the day, where a band that starts with "the" should have it capitalized or not all depends on several factors but there is certainly no one logical rule for all lower-case or all upper-case. As such, trying to conform all to that rule is a problem, and there's certainly no allowance for edit warring over that that would qualify here on the 1RR ban. That 1RR restriction is clearly broken here. --Masem (t) 20:16, 23 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
This was initially reported to AN3, where myself and another admin were leaning towards no action, on the condition that Joe drops the dispute and does not breach the 1RR again, which he agreed to. Perhaps by AE standards, such a voluntary resolution would not be considered to be enough, but it should add some context that this is a minor edit war over capitalization, that normally wouldn't even be actioned. FYI, as far as I can tell, the "The/the" issue has been settled from an MOS perspective, with WP:THEMUSIC agreeing with Joe's edits. MOS is not rigidly mandatory, but that's not a good defense when reverting MOS-compliance for no reason, particularly when the MOS guidance in question has settled a long-term dispute. So, Joe was right in terms of that specific issue, and while that's not an exonerating defense, it may be seen as a bit of mitigation. Also, Joe has a long-term history of incivility. When I look at this dispute, I don't get the impression that it hasn't improved. I get the impression that it is still not perfect, but is not on the level that would have led to the previous extended blocks. Anyway, even given the history, I'd be in favor of restraint and keeping the sanction proportional to the offense. Also, just a procedural note, Arbcom reserved the right to indef if necessary. It is not on the table here. Per Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Joefromrandb and others#Enforcement of restrictions, the 1RR violation here can be enforced with a block of up to one month, if we're feeling particularly draconian. ~Swarm~ {talk} 20:55, 24 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
I reviewed this just now as the matter is new to me. I think it is important that arbitration remedies are actually enforced as written. The fact that the subject user's conduct was serious enough to warrant a 1RR remedy from the committee indicates that a serious problem exists. To ignore the remedy undermines the work of the committee. Given the minor overall severity of the behavior that is the subject of this request, and the unusual circumstances of the request, I do not believe that a lengthy block is appropriate. I propose a 24 hour block. This would be enough to provide effective enforcement of the remedy and to provide a starting point for escalating sanctions should that become necessary. Uninvited Company 19:18, 25 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
I was on the fence but was pushed off by Floq's comment above (not wanting to reward forum shopping/score settling) and then shoved even further by Joefromrandb's statement. So I oppose a block, and think the best path forward is to just move on. ~Awilley (talk) 02:15, 26 March 2019 (UTC) Note: I just noticed that the filer was Purplebackpack89. That didn't influence my original statement in any way and wouldn't have even if I had noticed before commenting. I don't consider myself involved with PBP or have strong feelings in their direction, but I do recall consistently coming down on the opposing side of several AfDs they initiated, and I want to avoid the appearance of involved adminning. I almost moved my statement up out of this section but held back since I'm not favoring any boomerang warning, but if PBP objects to my participation here I will move it anyway. ~Awilley (talk) 02:34, 26 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
I also get the impression that Joe's civility has improved since his arbcom block expired six months ago. It's not perfect, but it's better, and his comment here in this discussion is positively zen. I too would go with no block, also because I share Floquenbeam's reluctance to reward the OP's use of AE to continue unrelated old feuds. Bishonen | talk 00:34, 27 March 2019 (UTC).[reply]
Probably technically sanctionable, but I would agree with no block, because (as has already been said above) I - and I suspect many other admins - am completely sick of people using AE to further petty feuds, especially when they're not involved in the situation at all. Black Kite (talk) 00:56, 27 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
I'm on the fence here. On the one hand, I largely agree with UninvitedCompany and have been considering a block between something symbolic and 24 hours. On the other hand, Joe's reaction here is exemplary and this would be the first block since his six month block expired in September (and as far as I know there hasn't been any drama in that time?). Like others, I'm deeply unimpressed with an uninvolved editor using this to further a prior dispute, but I don't think that should influence us either way on enforcing the remedy; if sanctions are justified, then we should apply them. Were this a DS area, I'd be considering at least a logged warning to the OP as well. GoldenRing (talk) 16:07, 27 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
I oppose a block. The situation seems to be improving, and I don't think this trivial violation over an utterly trivial matter is worth a block in any case, and should never have been brought to AE. DGG ( talk ) 17:56, 28 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
I'm closing this as no action. There isn't consensus amongst administrators (not required for AE, but it is a good thing to have) and this report has been open for days and a 24 hour block isn't exactly preventative at this point, and that seems to be the most people are considering. TonyBallioni (talk) 21:14, 28 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Thenabster126

This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.
Requests may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.

Request concerning Thenabster126

User who is submitting this request for enforcement: MrX (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 13:25, 28 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

User against whom enforcement is requested: Thenabster126 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)
Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log

Sanction or remedy to be enforced: WP:ARBAPDS

Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it

March 28, 2019 Restored previously reverted material without obtaining talk page consensus after first inserting it here, in violation of the editing restriction.

If discretionary sanctions are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see WP:AC/DS#Awareness and alerts)

Alerted about discretionary sanctions in the area of conflict in the last twelve months, see the system log linked to above.

Additional comments by editor filing complaint

@DGG: I'm taken aback by your dismissive response. This editor has a history of disruptive editing of which this is just another example. They have circumvented BRD and crossed a bright line established under Arbcom's direction and an admin's discretion. Over the past few days, numerous newly minted and newly activated editors have been adding unsourced content and original research to articles because of their apparent strong feelings about Barr's summary of the special counsel investigation. All this has taken place right under your collective admin noses and you do nothing, leaving the rest of us to politely follow the rules while blatant misinformation is added to highly visible articles.

This is discouraging, to say the least. - Mr X 🖋 18:26, 28 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested

[7]

Discussion concerning Thenabster126

Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.

Statement by Thenabster126

I wanted to add this attribution because the wording of the introduction of the article was not neutral. I thought that adding this attribution would answer the question of who investigated this. I acknowledge the mistake I made and apologize for breaching it.Thenabster126 (talk) 16:30, 28 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by Geogene

Nabster also made this edit on March 25th to the same content [8], which makes it look like their edits are less about clarity and more about casting doubt on Russian culpability. It is regrettable that the Wikipedia admin corps is no longer capable of enforcing editing norms. Geogene (talk) 18:36, 28 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Statement by (username)

Result concerning Thenabster126

This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.

Trivial violation. No action is needed. DGG ( talk ) 17:57, 28 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
We should let Coffee decide this, since they placed the edit notice. But, uh, they're blocked, so... I don't see much enforcement happening here. Sandstein 18:31, 28 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

[1] The administrator may indicate consent at any time before, during, or after imposition of the restriction.

[2] This criterion does not apply if the original action was imposed as a result of rough consensus at the arbitration enforcement noticeboard, as there would be no single enforcing administrator.

[a]

[b]

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