October 18, 2013 (2013-10-18) (Friday)
Business and economy
- China's economy grew at a rate of 7.8 percent in the third quarter. (Reuters)
International relations
Law and crime
Politics and Elections
Science
- Asteroid 2013 TV135 is discovered with an approximately 1 in 63,000 chance of colliding with the earth in 2032. (CNN)
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October 17, 2013 (2013-10-17) (Thursday)
Armed conflict and attacks
Arts and culture
Business and economy
Disasters
Politics and elections
[Posted] End of US federal government shutdown
Nominator's comments: This is headline/front page news around the world. Open to blurb changes. I dated it today as Obama signed the bills just after midnight. --331dot (talk) 08:26, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment The emphasis is on the wrong thing here. What's important globally is that the US will now pay its bills, not that the government shutdown will cease. The rest of the world isn't bothered by a few American national parks being closed. But it would be if international financial obligations weren't met. HiLo48 (talk) 10:14, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment - That is an uninformed view. The shutdown involved far more than national parks, and its impacts extended to virtually every agency in the federal government. Those federal employees still on the job were technically working without pay. NorthBySouthBaranof (talk) 10:36, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment Not uninformed at all. Of course I knew that there were more impacts within the US, but to the rest of the world (Does that matter to you? China anyone?) the debt issue as far more important. The posts immediately below support my position. HiLo48 (talk) 21:06, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support - Major news event with worldwide impacts. I would support adding a mention that the debt ceiling was lifted. NorthBySouthBaranof (talk) 10:37, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support - Huge news. Agree with NorthBySouthBaranof that Debt ceiling should also be mentioned. -Zanhe (talk) 10:46, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- its certainly in the news, but link to the WP article on teh actual law that was passed yesterday.President Ted Cruz for 2016Lihaas (talk) 11:30, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- I'm posting this, and will tweak the blurb per comments. Jehochman Talk 11:46, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- What I posted is now the altblurb. Please make any suggestions for improvement. Jehochman Talk 12:01, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- JC, 2 supprots in 3 hours is not consensus whatsoever!"Lihaas (talk) 16:31, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Belated support I like the alt blurb that was posted. Ryan Vesey 16:33, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Oppose/Pull Except for policeman blocking access to public monuments and land at the White House's request, the government was in full swing, and there was no chance of default. Editors shouldn't be taking it upon themselves to post political items after two supports when it takes a hurricane that kills 100 people days to get posted. μηδείς (talk) 16:54, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- That is partisan sore-loser nonsense, to put it politely. Your side shut down the government for two weeks, saw public opinion turn radically against you, lost the political showdown and now are pretending it didn't happen or was insignificant. NorthBySouthBaranof (talk) 18:06, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- My side? Does that mean your side wins, nyah, nyah, nyah? Do you even realize how ironically childish your comment is? This political theater should never have been posted either way. μηδείς (talk) 18:33, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- The US not paying its bills is not "political theater", it was a very real possibility. Even if it was such, it is still front page news, and this is "in the news". Further, "blocking access to public monuments and land at the White House's request" is just a political statement, it was the OMB that gave the order. They could not guarantee the safety of the monuments themselves and visitors without personnel. 331dot (talk) 18:48, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Umm, yeah, the local politics are fascinating, but we all knew this would be resolved after the ransom period elapsed. Sadly it's just demonstrated that US politics are currently in a worse state than that of Italy, which is quite astonishing. Otherwise, the "deal" was 100% inevitable. Not one of the US politicians would have wanted to be responsible for it getting worse. The Rambling Man (talk) 18:08, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Your crystal ball is quite excellent. Mind helping me choose some lottery numbers? We didn't know anything of the sort. If Boehner hadn't decided to push forward without the majority of his caucus, or if Ted Cruz had tried to delay the vote last night, either of which conceivably could've happened, we'd be posting about the U.S. default right now. Lots of Tea Party politicians did want to default, we're just lucky none of them in the Senate used their power to make it happen. – Muboshgu (talk) 18:13, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Sure we did. Anyway, it's irrelevant now. There are many millions who view this intensely childish behaviour from the US politicians as sabre-rattling. It's pathetic, embarrassing and something even Berlusconi wouldn't have encouraged. Good news, Wikipedia posted the failure to agree, then the agreement, two for the price of one. Systemic bias is alive and kicking! The Rambling Man (talk) 18:18, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Should we not post news from the U.S. just because systemic bias exists? That makes no sense. This is major news, free from systemic bias, that impacts the world economy. – Muboshgu (talk) 19:48, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Indeed. The shutdown was front page news worldwide; the end of the shutdown was front page news worldwide(what's the name of this page again?)- and it's not like it was a short amount of time between them (a few hours or a couple days). The effect also was not limited to US territory (US overseas military cemeteries were closed, as one example) and potentially it would have affected the entire global economy had it gone on longer. There is no reason this shouldn't be posted, systemic bias or not. As for that, countering systemic bias should not be done by preventing valid stories from being posted. 331dot (talk) 19:57, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment. It should include the capitulation of the Tea Party on their demand that Obamacare be defunded. Count Iblis (talk) 16:59, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Pull per Medeis and Lihaas. Premature posting of "the bleeding obvious". The Rambling Man (talk) 17:02, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Post-posting support This is big news for financial markets, especially as the U.S. could've defaulted, despite Medeis' interpretation. Also, plenty more than just tha National Park Service closed, I suggest you read the article, and List of US federal government agencies and operations affected by the shutdown of 2013. – Muboshgu (talk) 17:12, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support - An event that's in the news all over the world, and which has significant economical and political ramifications. --GoldenMew (talk) 17:20, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Post-posting support, has long-term, worldwide ramifications. Abductive (reasoning) 20:20, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support - big news. --BabbaQ (talk) 20:41, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment. This isn't big news. It's part of a recurring pattern, all throughout Obama's Presidency. We'll another budget showdown next January. KyuuA4 (Talk:キュウ) 23:10, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Is that why it was the #1 headline around the world? Because it isn't big news? 331dot (talk) 23:26, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
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October 16, 2013 (2013-10-16) (Wednesday)
Armed conflict and attacks
- Syrian civil war:
- At least 21 civilians are killed when their minibus hits a land mine in southern Syrian town of Nawa, with opposition activists blaming the Syrian army. (Reuters), (BBC)
Business and economy
Disasters and accidents
Politics and elections
Law and crime
Science
- Divers in Russia recover a 570kg (1,255lb) portion of the Chelyabinsk meteor that landed on February 15, 2013. It is one of the largest meteorite fragments found to date. (BBC)
[Posted] Lao Airlines Flight 301
Nominator's comments: Deadliest aircrash of 2013 to date. Laos is a minority topic. --Mjroots (talk) 14:52, 16 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support. As stated by the nominator, deadliest crash so far this year; receiving much coverage. 331dot (talk) 15:29, 16 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment - According to this the plane was delayed due to a storm, which i would assume is Typhoon Nari since Nari has been affecting Thailand, Vietnam and Laos within the last 48 hours.Jason Rees (talk) 16:17, 16 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support worst crash for at least ten months. The Rambling Man (talk) 16:36, 16 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support - we always post fatal commercial airline crashes. -Zanhe (talk) 20:32, 16 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- not always, but thanks for your support. Mjroots (talk) 21:24, 16 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support per nominator. SeraV (talk) 23:29, 16 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment. Looks nearly ready, but a citation has been requested for the nationality of the remaining passengers. Espresso Addict (talk) 01:33, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support. I provided a citation for the nationality of the remaining passengers. GroveGuy (talk) 03:47, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support. World wide coverage, and commercial airline accidents are notable and rare in nature. ComputerJA (☎ • ✎) 04:13, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Needs Expansion article has two-sentence lead and two section of one sentence each. μηδείς (talk) 04:19, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Lede is of an appropriate length for the size of the article. There are no one sentence sections. Mjroots (talk) 07:12, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Posted King of ♥ ♦ ♣ ♠ 07:51, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
2013 Women's World Draughts Championship
Nominator's comments: I created the article on the 2013 Women's Draughts World Championship. I think if that article receives some more updating, and the article on the winner has more information added (the Russian Wikipedia article has some more information) then this can be posted. I know there is not a lot of information about the championship but since Draughts (Checkers) is not represented at all in ITN, I think this deserves some recognition on the Main Page. I will try to add more information to both articles but if anyone finds any information or feels like working on the articles feel free to do so. The more people who work on the articles the better chance this item has of being posted to ITN. Andise1 (talk) 06:59, 16 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Oppose Not ITN/R, both articles in the hook are stubs, significance/importance seems low. – Muboshgu (talk) 17:06, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Scientific evidence that Yasser Arafat may have been poisoned
Nominator's comments: peer-reviewed investigation into the death of a major political figure --—rybec 02:27, 16 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Uncertain. This is only stating that there is a possibility that he was poisoned, not an actual determination that he was. As I understand it, the issue is now figuring out how the polonium got there. I'd feel much better about posting this if they were making a definitive statement and not just saying something is possible. That said, this is getting a lot of news coverage. I'll need to think some more before deciding how I feel about posting this. 331dot (talk) 02:32, 16 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Oppose as too inconclusive. "These findings support the possibility of Arafat's poisoning with 210Po...However, on the basis of this forensic investigation, there was sufficient doubt to recommend the exhumation of his body in 2012. Three scientific teams are currently analysing body, shrine, and earth samples. Because of legal procedures, the date of publication of the detailed results of the exhumation analyses is unknown." Not the forensic team's fault—it has been nine years since Arafat's death. But I prefer to not run this in ITN unless we have it clearly established. Certainly that doesn't mean it shouldn't be included in the article though. NW (Talk) 04:31, 16 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Oppose the lack of hair loss and marrow death are significant, the other symptoms are generic, and the best the sources say is "possible". μηδείς (talk) 04:42, 16 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Oppose although Arafat was notable and his death influenced his people and his country, it is just never-ending story even if it will be established. It is highly possible that there will be counter-claims and other "scientific" evidence. Egeymi (talk) 14:58, 16 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
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October 15, 2013 (2013-10-15) (Tuesday)
Armed conflict and attacks
Arts and culture
Business and Economy
Disasters and accidents
Law and crime
Man Booker Prize
Nominator's comments: I'm not quite sure whether Man Booker or Catton should be bolded, so please feel free to change/tweak the blurb. --JuneGloom Talk 20:57, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Unless there's some longstanding precedence I'm unaware of it, I feel like The Luminaries should be bold. With that in mind, the article isn't close to main page material. Ryan Vesey 21:13, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- I agree, it would be a bit embarrassing. Ryan Vesey 00:49, 16 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Disagree, only the bolded link is held to ITN quality standards. The alternative opens up a whole new way to force the template to stagnate. - BanyanTree 19:21, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- I don't think all links should be held to a particularly high standard, but a few-sentence microstub linked in a way that many people will click on it is an embarrassment. If it were something unimportant it could just be unlinked, but in this case that's not a possibility. I'm opposed to it being eliminated altogether, as the prize is for the book, not the author. Espresso Addict (talk) 19:33, 17 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
[Posted] Philippines earthquake
--Küñall (talk) 01:06, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
There seems to be widespread damage; will be expanding the article. Küñall (talk) 01:09, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Patience Nothing I've seen yet indicates that this is ITN-worthy, but I'd like to see more news reports come in before supports and opposes start rolling in.
Sources are mentioning a possible Tsunami to follow, and it appears like major news sources like the New York Times and the BBC are waiting before they report. The blurb appears inaccurate, everything I've seen says 7.2. Ryan Vesey 01:23, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Scratch that, I misread. Sources are saying there is no risk of tsunami. With that in mind, if some of the major sources don't start mentioning this and the death count doesn't rise, this can be considered an oppose. Ryan Vesey 01:26, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Indeed, early reports I saw on Twitter said it was of 7.0 magnitude, but it was later revised. Sources say there is a death toll (as of now) of four people, and several buildings suffered structural damage. Küñall (talk) 01:28, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- The death toll now stands at 20[1], which I believe is at the lower end of what we would normally post for an earthquake. As usual, the magnitude means next to nothing. --Bongwarrior (talk) 05:10, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- BBC says over 30 dead (and then lists 32) - added the link into sources above. Support article in a decent shape - but could obviously be improved just from that source. EdwardLane (talk) 09:09, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Heh. Let's see if this gets to be posted at this state. There's a bigger disaster a month ago (300 deaths) but that was again ignored at ITN despite having an extensive article. Boohoo. Screw American+British bias. ITN now has American+British+Indian bias. lol. –HTD 10:49, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Death toll at 60+ plus now. Plus, it's the most powerful earthquake to strike the Philippines (and probably Southeast Asia) in a while. Might as well improve the article and list it at ITN, if only to combat systemic bias. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 11:02, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support when article improved. The BBC are now giving 73 deaths and considerable damage to historic buildings. The odd listing of aftershocks which appeared since I last looked needs summarising. Espresso Addict (talk) 11:46, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support due to increased death toll and damage to historic buildings. This shouldn't be posted with the current aftershocks format. The article also has no lead. Ryan Vesey 15:06, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- comment 93+ people reported killed and 167+ injured according to the article now. EdwardLane (talk) 15:30, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support - significant earthquake, article seems in good enough shape to post. Mjroots (talk) 16:15, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Blurb comment: When the blurb mentions "magnitude" it isn't clear what scale is being used. In the past I think we've used the Moment magnitude scale? SpencerT♦C 20:28, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Ready this is quite well updated now, and unopposed--it should go up ASAP. μηδείς (talk) 21:35, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support per Medeis. -Zanhe (talk) 23:07, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Posted -- tariqabjotu 00:12, 16 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
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October 14, 2013 (2013-10-14) (Monday)
Armed conflict and attacks
Business and Economy
Disasters and accidents
Law and crime
¬ laonikoss (talk) 20:11, 14 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Oppose, I find no precedent for the posting of the receipt of this award. He received the award four days ago, so you can also say it is a bit stale. This is the first I'm hearing of it, so it seems that major news organizations don't think it important, and it's certainly not "in the news". The NYT buried it in a short paragraph on an article about Snowden's father's arrival in Moscow. Ryan Vesey 20:50, 14 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Oppose per Ryan Vesey. I'm barely seeing any mentions of it at all. – Muboshgu (talk) 21:01, 14 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Oppose I saw it mentioned when i happened, but it is far too much attention to a small award. Almost funny he didn't get the Nobel. μηδείς (talk) 21:20, 14 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Oppose. I have seen some coverage of this, but this is an award with a specific niche and some political undertones. 331dot (talk) 21:45, 14 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- The award occurred on the 10 October. This is the same date as the Alice Munroe item, which is currently the last item on the template. This item is stale. --LukeSurl t c 11:36, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
support if it wasnt stale. We dont need blatant eurocentric bais to post what is sdeemed okey by them in the Skharov prize. If thats ITN (without dsicssion?),. then this should be too!Lihaas (talk) 16:29, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- This is hardly stale. We just have a surfeit of petty posts regarding non-notable prize winners. The prize recipients should all mature off the board faster than any of the serious news. μηδείς (talk) 04:45, 16 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's comments: In the same fashion as the other Nobel Prizes, this is also listed as ITNR.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 11:42, 14 October 2013 (UTC) --Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 11:40, 14 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support: This should be posted 100-percent.HotHat (talk) 11:48, 14 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- I would post this now, except Hansen's article is a mess. It needs copy editing, fact checking, and some references. Please work on that and post here when you think it may be ready. Jehochman Talk 12:18, 14 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Is there an article we could wikilink to that relates to their research? "Empirical analysis of asset prices" means very little to me. --LukeSurl t c 13:56, 14 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- It's difficult to find a suitable article to link to since there are different articles on Wikipedia pointing to some of the seminal works of these authors. However, most of their contributions are only extensions of the traditional CAPM, which appears to be the most appropriate solution for the wording in the blurb.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 15:36, 14 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Posting with link to CAPM, instead of the bios which will match what we did for the other Nobel's and sidestep the problem of bios that are not in particularly good condition. Jehochman Talk 15:49, 14 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- I removed the link to CAPM. Fama and French even had a famous paper in the early 1990s that took CAPM to task with regards to explaining stock valuations, and it isn't like Shiller's work was really just extensions of CAPM either. We really don't have a good article to link to, so let's just point people to the biographies and let them go from there if they are interested. NW (Talk) 04:42, 16 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
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October 13, 2013 (2013-10-13) (Sunday)
Armed conflicts and attacks
Arts and culture
Disasters and accidents
Law and crime
Politics and elections
Sports
[Posted] Madhya Pradesh stampede
Nominator's comments: Major disaster, worldwide coverage --Zanhe (talk) 03:35, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support - We have posted stampedes with fewer casualties in the past, and the article looks like it's in pretty good shape. --Bongwarrior (talk) 05:03, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support. Large death toll and coverage in several notable media outlets. Article is in great shape. ComputerJA (☎ • ✎) 07:27, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support received more coverage than the "big storm hits big country" damp squib which we posted. The Rambling Man (talk) 07:44, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Posting. --Tone 08:02, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Vo Nguyen Giap
Nominator's comments: Died a few days ago but wasnt nominated here. He did have a tate funeral today [3] which would make it recent enough and to post what wasnt. Lihaas ( talk) 18:51, 13 October 2013 (UTC) [reply]
- Aside from the fact no source is listed per the instructions on this page, this death was posted. 331dot (talk) 19:26, 13 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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October 12, 2013 (2013-10-12) (Saturday)
Disasters and accidents
Sports
LGBT-Nationalist clash in Russia
Nominator's comments: Looks like an interesting (and probably a newsworthy) event in Putin's efforts to distract the Russian society from more important issues, such as corruption. I started an article, but it defensibly some expansion. --Երևանցի talk 20:13, 13 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Oppose very difficult to say anything generous about this. Two groups looking for a fight. μηδείς (talk) 20:21, 13 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Oppose not notable and no significant coverage and impact. Egeymi (talk) 20:59, 13 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Oppose "... a demonstration of 15 to 20 activists." Just two posses fighting, no real significance so far, apparently. I do not know if we posted the homosexual propaganda law when it was adopted on the federal level, but it's something that could've been posted realistically at least. --hydrox (talk) 22:18, 13 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Compare 380 arrested in Moscow rioting. μηδείς (talk) 23:19, 13 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Indented line
[Posted] Oscar Hijuelos dies
--GroveGuy (talk) 07:49, 14 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Oppose a blurb, Weak support for RD, once the article is improved somewhat. This seems to be getting some coverage, even outside the US. 331dot (talk) 08:42, 14 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- I have done a small expansion. Espresso Addict (talk) 13:04, 14 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- That's sufficient for me. Thanks 331dot (talk) 18:28, 14 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support RD. The article is brief but has no major problems I noted. His death has received international coverage. Espresso Addict (talk) 10:48, 14 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support RD article is updated. μηδείς (talk) 15:59, 14 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support for RD Award-winning and untimely death. Also set a benchmark. --Somchai Sun (talk) 18:34, 14 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Marked Ready has unopposed support for RD and is updated. μηδείς (talk) 18:46, 14 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Any further objection to posting this? Espresso Addict (talk) 14:26, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- I have posted this, as no-one else has. Espresso Addict (talk) 18:13, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
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October 11, 2013 (2013-10-11) (Friday)
Armed conflict and attacks
Disasters and accidents
International relations
Law and crime
[Posted] Cyclone Phailin
Count Iblis (talk) 18:07, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Latest news: "As of 8 p.m. Friday, India time, Phailin had indeed officially reached Category 5 status, with an intensity of 918mb and sustained winds of 160 mph (260 kph). That ties the wind speed record set by the 1999 cyclone at its peak, currently the most intense storm ever to make landfall in India." According the latest news on CNN (as reported on t.v. not yet online), sustained wind speeds are expected to increase to 270 km/h before landfall. Count Iblis (talk) 18:07, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Wait Too premature to know. If it causes serious damage, then we can post. If it misses landfall, or weakens significantly and does little damage, we probably won't. – Muboshgu (talk) 18:13, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support alt blurb. This is in the news. We can update the blurb every 12 or 24 hours. It's very unusual to have such a large and powerful storm. Jehochman Talk 20:37, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment I don't believe the Saffir-Simpson Scale is used in the Indian Ocean, so while it's achieved the equivalence of Category 5 status, it's a bit odd to use "Category 5" in the blurb (as the alternative blurb currently does). -- tariqabjotu 20:46, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment - We could always call it a Very Severe cyclonic storm per the IMD which is the WMO warning agency for the region.Jason Rees (talk) 21:15, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Wait until there is significant damage to report (I hope there won't be, but that doesn't seem likely). --MASEM (t) 21:34, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support there's no question this will make landfall, and the article is well updated. People are looking for information now, not just death tolls afterward. The nomination for the last cyclone (that hit China killing 500) was ready the day before it hit but didn't go up till over half a week later. We don't need to botch this one. μηδείς (talk) 22:08, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Wait for it to make landfall. Hurricanes/cyclones can dramatically change course without warning and also change in intensity. There is no harm in waiting until this storm hits. 331dot (talk) 22:47, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- No Brainer but let it hit Its a category 5 cyclone which is rare and dangerous but lets wait till it hits. Changed alt blurb to say Super as that is the term used to classify Cat 5 storm -- Ashish-g55 02:13, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- I hate to be picky here but the word "super" is wrongly applied in this case. We call Category 5 typhoons super because they are called such by the JTWC who only use the term cyclone outside the Westenr PAcific. it is also worth noting that while the WMO warning agency for the region the IMD has a "Super Cyclonic Storm" category they have failed to use it to describe Phailyn instead opting for the more PR friendly "Very Severe cyclonic storm".Jason Rees (talk) 02:54, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- I see no problem with the objection. It's probably best to refer to verified air speeds, since rating numbers are largely meaningless to laymen anyway. They are to me. μηδείς (talk) 03:29, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Super is used for storms with wind speeds > 258 km/h. this storm has reached that speed so i see no reason not to call it super (as the storm stands right now) -- Ashish-g55 04:00, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- The reason we shouldnt be using is it hasnt been called a Super Cyclone or a Super Cyclonic Storm by either the US Joint Typhoon Warning Center or the WMO RSMC the Indian Meteorological Department to describe Phalin. While it is true that storms above 130 knots are called Super by the JTWC it is just the Western Pacific basin that label is applied too. Feel free to take a look through the logs we have kept for this system if you require further proof that this has not been reffered to as a Super Cyclone.Jason Rees (talk) 13:06, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Strong wait: if it causes a massive amount of deaths, post if; if it doesn't, don't. –HTD 03:39, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- The section is called In The News, not Last Week's News. This article got 45,000 hits yesterday--people are interested in reading it now. μηδείς (talk) 04:04, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- News is when something happens. Nothing has happened yet. This is like posting a blurb about the Super Bowl the moment the pre-game show (which is like half-a-day long) starts. –HTD 10:57, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- In short, you are successfully arguing that it doesn't need to be on the main page for people to find it? Resolute 04:40, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- ITN is not to reiterate a news ticker but to highlight articles of reasonably good quality about topics that are in the news, in hopes readers will read and possibly add to that. --MASEM (t) 06:01, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- @ Howard the Duck - damage has already occurred with this system within Thailand, Myanmar and the Andaman Islands - so while i dont mind waiting until the final landfall and the main impact zone it is not like posting the Super Bowl the moment the pre-game show starts.Jason Rees (talk) 13:06, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- That's not what any of the proposed blurbs are saying. Also, the article isn't saying any damages in Thailand or Myanmar; it just said it was an unnamed tropical depression when it passed through there, so you're right, it's not posting the Super Bowl when the pre-game show starts, it is posting the Super Bowl during the NFC Championship Game. –HTD 13:12, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Im trying to add the stuff on Thailand etc but i am having problems finding the bits, since there has been a lot of flooding there recently.Jason Rees (talk) 13:25, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Wikipedia is not a source. This includes hit counts. Let's wait until landfall. AlexTiefling (talk) 08:17, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- You're not seriously saying that hit counts from grok.se do not indictae reader interest, are you? μηδείς (talk) 15:53, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Wait per WP:CRYSTAL. Resolute 04:40, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support It has made landfall if I read [7] right, with lots of people evacuated (and a few killed) as result so far, Narayanese (talk) 16:21, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- per BBC cyclone has been classified as "Very Severe", changed alt blurb again -- Ashish-g55 16:35, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- The Landfall of Cyclone Phalin is occurring right now. Officially it made landfall at its peak intensity as a very severe cyclonic storm however unoffically per the JTWC it had started to weaken over the last few hours after it went underwent an eyewall replacement cycle but was not able to complete it.Jason Rees (talk) 16:39, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Marked Ready the "wait" until landfall criterion expressed above has been met and deaths are being reported. The article is updated. See http://www.accuweather.com/en/weather-news/phailin-on-course-to-devastate-1/18611884 for report of landfall and deaths. μηδείς (talk) 17:13, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Blurb--as the original blurb is now obsolete, I have replaced it with "Cyclone Phailin makes landfall in Gopalpur, India as a category 3 storm" (The highest sustained winds being 124mph per UPI). μηδείς (talk) 17:28, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Oppose big storm hits big country, we should wait for the consequences rather than post speculative "news". Wikipedia is not a primary news source. The Rambling Man (talk) 18:43, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- That contradicts the entire notion of ITN, which is to feature good articles (which this is) that are in the news (which this is). This is the worst storm to hit the world's second largest country in 14 years. That's far more than enough to justify posting when just about every storm (Sandy wasn't even a Hurricane when it hit) that hits gets posted. You are also ignoring the fact there's a strong consensus above, even among the "waits" to post this when it makes land fall. μηδείς (talk) 19:00, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- The vote counts for the waits are: 3 "wait until there is massive damage", 2 "wait until landfall" and Resolute's "Wait per WP:CRYSTAL" vote. Those 3 stipulations are quite different from each other. –HTD 19:33, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Medeis, I think it's pretty bleeding obvious that if this turns into something more than "big storm hits big country" then I'll re-assess my position, as I'm sure many others suggesting "wait" will do. Also, I'm entirely entitled to "ignore ... the [fact] there's a strong consensus above..." (even though that's tenuous at best, outright false at worst), this is my opinion, not a collation of those before me.
- Actually, TRM, if I recall the RfC on the topic properly, it was decided quite lopsidedly that you, among all editors, are not entitled to your opinion. I may be wrong, but I am fairly certain of that. μηδείς (talk) 20:20, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Eh? Everyone above is positing their opinion here. I did the same. Your suggestion that my opinion should somehow be governed by a consensus (imagined by you alone) is quite bizarre, back to the drawing board I think! The Rambling Man (talk) 20:22, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment I'm neutral on this. The storm is much weaker than was initially estimated, but at the same time, it resulted in the evacuation of 800,000 people. This might be a a significantly high number to post it without a significantly high death toll. Ryan Vesey 20:36, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Weak support posting with the blurb focused on the large evacuation; virtually any movement of such a large number of people due to a single event is noteworthy. 331dot (talk) 20:39, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Oppose large evacuations are notable, but in India doesn't seem to be that unusual. We already post too many storms. Ps, 7 fatalities from a monsoon in India??? Nergaal (talk) 22:25, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- If this is not posted then really Systemic bias could not get any worse... the storm is being called perhaps one of the strongest (if not the strongest) in the recorded history (NP). Deaths alone dont make things notable... We posted Hurricane Sandy, Colorado flooding, Calgary flooding and we dont want to post a Cyclone covering size of half the India. And if anyone wants to say this happens regularly then its been 14 years since a storm this large hit this part of India. Also nobody is saying post right away but after once the widespread damage has been confirmed then we should post it...-- Ashish-g55 22:59, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support Half a million people evacuated is good enough for me--whatever the (likely massive) effects ultimately are.--Johnsemlak (talk) 23:43, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- NOT ready with that blurb. and consensus without a casualty count that's whigh is dubious.
- oppose UNTIL damage/casualties are reported...and with a "significant" number. And "very severe is ague and sensational and category 3 is wrong per abjotuLihaas (talk) 00:59, 13 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support due to evacuation. Damage/casualties have been reported FYI. BTW, I'd consider this even to not common at all, not the strongest storm in recorded history, but still pretty darn rare. YE Pacific Hurricane 02:27, 13 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Blurb has nothing to do with if this is ready--feel free to suggest another if you like. Consensus is to post when this hits, which it has. Body count won't be know for days. μηδείς (talk) 01:39, 13 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- I'm posting a fixed up blurb. The evacuation was massive, which is good grounds to post. The fatalities stand at 5, and that number can (sadly) be increased as the news reports come in. If we wait for final figures, this will be stale news. Jehochman Talk 02:37, 13 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support Huge storm, huge damage, big evacuation...deaths currently at around 5 but likely to rise higher. This is unquestionably news. Somchai Sun (talk) 08:41, 13 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
[Posted] Peace Nobel
--Tone 09:09, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Usually we have special articles for this prize, like 2012 Nobel Peace Prize. If 2013 article is written, we can feature it. --Tone 09:09, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Ok, we do have 2013 Nobel Peace Prize, but it is just a starter. --Tone 09:34, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- [Uncalmness redacted] Perhaps good excuse to link to UNSC 2118? Which wasn't posted DESPITE consensus.Lihaas (talk) 10:27, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Calm down Lihaas doktorb wordsdeeds 11:34, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Just a little ranting. People do mentions such reactions here. ;) (Sports, death of bin laden, etc)Lihaas (talk) 14:14, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Death of Maria De Villota
Torqueing (talk) 09:44, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Oppose. I am not knowledgeable in auto racing, but from reading the article she doesn't seem to have been very important in her field. If this is being nominated because she died due to her injuries from her accident or otherwise died suddenly, then a blurb should be proposed(which I would probably oppose as well). 331dot (talk) 09:56, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support. I don't know much about the topic either, but this is the third-from-top story on the BBC at the moment, which I think cuts it. It seems like she was the top of here field if her field is restricted to women (that's not insignificant) and a major celebrity in Spain. Formerip (talk) 10:58, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Oppose. Reserve and test drivers (unless they have significant achievement in other series which she haven't) are nowhere as notable as those who compete regularly in the series as she only came into media attention last year because of her accident and I don't see anything that suggest that she is a major celebrity in her home country, compared to her compatriots Alonso, Contador and Nadal. Donnie Park (talk) 12:11, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- I don't know how much of her fame is down to her accident, but fame is fame. You could say the same thing about Malala Yousafzai, for example. Formerip (talk) 12:20, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- At least one of those tried to make a difference to help others, almost paid her life for trying and since then got nominated for a Nobel Prize and as with the former; at the age of 32, was she going to make a difference by just driving a F1 car in straight line. Donnie Park (talk) 01:48, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Oppose What a terribly tragic death. However, she was not a sufficiently notable as F1 driver for ITN. Per WP:ITND it is required that "[t]he deceased was widely regarded as a very important figure in his or her field." De Villota did not have before or after her accident enough top-class (F1) experience to be regarded as "very important figure" in top-class motor racing. --hydrox (talk) 12:34, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Oppose Unfortunately she and her death were not notable. Egeymi (talk) 14:10, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Oppose Almost half of the article's text (based on eyeballing) is about the accident that led to her death. Insufficient importance in her field for RD. – Muboshgu (talk) 14:20, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Info This is a recent death nomination, not a blurb in ITN. The current two up are Scott Carpenter and Ovadia Yosef who are both as notable as this lady. She was important in her field because she stood the best chance of becoming the first female F1 driver. Torqueing (talk) 17:02, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- "Stood the chance" of something vs. an original seven astronaut and the Chief Rabbi? Not in the same ballpark. – Muboshgu (talk) 17:08, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- An astronaut who was about the 7th person in space (4th American)? Where is the notability in that? And the chief rabbi of a *sect* of jews in a *country*? Please... If he was the chief rabbi of the world then that would be notable but he's not even the only chief rabbi in Israel. Torqueing (talk) 17:14, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- If you don't understand the significance of the Mercury 7, I can't help you. Not to make light of her death, but she didn't do anything. Being a "potential" something means you didn't do it. --12.41.124.5 (talk) 21:40, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Fair enough about Maria but the "Mercury 7" was nothing. The Russians did everything in space first apart from land a man on the moon. On top of that this guy was nothing apart from an astronaut of which there have been thousands. Even the Mercury 7 page is tiny with no mention of any significance whatsoever. Torqueing (talk) 22:49, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- While I can't speak much about all other stuff that exists, I would've been indeed happy to support the nomination if she had started even one F1 grand prix during her career. But as far as I can tell, she never entered an F1 grand prix. Although I agree that she was on the track to becoming one of the scarce breed of female F1 drivers (not the first one, though), I don't think we should equate potential to achieve with actually achieving it. And anyway, we still have Susie Wolff. Also, exactly the same WP:ITND criteria apply to Recent Deaths as to full blurbs, so Recent Deaths is not a way around those. --hydrox (talk) 18:44, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Oppose - not a notable death to the extent that it is of worldwide interest.--BabbaQ (talk) 23:08, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Support - She is #5 in trending news items for The Washington Times, behind "NFL", "Republican Party", "Barack Obama" and "Senate". While her career was nothing to write home about her death has attracted sufficient attention. - The Bushranger One ping only 19:42, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Which of the Recent Deaths criteria does she meet? 331dot (talk) 19:56, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- None of those items you listed were posted to ITN recently, either. SpencerT♦C 22:23, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- I'm not arguing WP:OTHERSTUFF, I'm pointing out that this isn't some "buried on page five" event in the regular news, but is considered by the searching public more important than, say, "Nobel Prize", and also refuting the "not of worldwide interest" argument above. - The Bushranger One ping only 07:54, 13 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Using IAR to justify that means that you need to explain how it is beneficial to ignore the rules in this situation. This person was trying to be an F1 driver; she was not actually one. There are many deaths covered in the news that many people read about that we don't post for various reasons. 331dot (talk) 08:18, 13 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
References
Nominators often include links to external websites and other references in discussions on this page. It is usually best to provide such links using the inline URL syntax [http://example.com] rather than using <ref></ref> tags, because that keeps all the relevant information in the same place as the nomination without having to jump to this section, and facilitates the archiving process.
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