Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents

Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents
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Persistent e-harrassment by Juicy Oranges

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Juicy Oranges (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

I told this user numerous times to stop harassing me on my talk, and yet he keeps ignoring it.[1]-[2]-[3]-[4]-[5] Even when another user reverted him,[6] he simply re-instated it again.[7]. He has a history of edit-warring on articles, and now he's edit-warring on my talk page. - LouisAragon (talk) 19:00, 29 May 2018 (UTC)

And now Oranges Juicy is harrassing the user (@Wikaviani:) who removed his unwanted stuff from my talk page.[8] - LouisAragon (talk) 19:07, 29 May 2018 (UTC)

This is in violation to WP:TALKO and this is a legitimate warning. The claim of harassment towards Wikaviani is false. --Juicy Oranges (talk) 19:10, 29 May 2018 (UTC)

Please see WP:REMOVED. On the user's talkpage, they have the right to remove comments as they see fit, unless it's a denied active block request. RickinBaltimore (talk) 19:16, 29 May 2018 (UTC)

All right I may have been wrong there but there is no way a TALKO warning can be likened to harassment. It just happens to have been done in error. Seems to me that editors can remove whatever they wish and claim WP:REMOVED. Personally I don't want any third party editors removing comments from my space. I would rather decide on how I wish to respond. --Juicy Oranges (talk) 19:20, 29 May 2018 (UTC)

ps. I just read your summary. It wasn't removed by the addressed editor but by another editor. He stated afterwards that he has been given the right to stalk the talk page but my point was that what I did where Wikaviani is concerned is not harassment. --Juicy Oranges (talk) 19:30, 29 May 2018 (UTC)

If I can point out at this stage that I have no further comments I wish to relate to Louis Aragon. Please note that the first comment was in response to a rude comment directed towards me in a revert summary, and from there on the editor provoked responses by addressing me within the summary. These comments were not to the effect of "I take your point" nor were they presented in the form of a thread. The mannerism is a clear civility issue. As for harassment, I expressly deny this. The method used for the final comment was such that Louis Aragon could not respond to unless he were to re-open a thread or head to my user talk. And so he has resorted to false accusations. Note that I never even touched his recent revert of me. --Juicy Oranges (talk) 19:08, 29 May 2018 (UTC)

Completely agree with LouisAragon, and i would add that Orange Juicy obviously shows an aggressive behavior with other users.---Wikaviani (talk) 19:22, 29 May 2018 (UTC)

Examples? Or is it proof by assertion? --Juicy Oranges (talk) 19:24, 29 May 2018 (UTC)

AND i inform you that users can allow other users to stalk their talk page so that my revert was by no mean a TALKO violation. For example, Oshwah (a veteran admin) allows experienced users to stalk his talk page. I would suggest you to moderate your aggressive behavior on this community encyclopedia.

You pointed that out to me after I reverted on TALKO principles. After that I never involved myself with you expect for the warning. --Juicy Oranges (talk) 19:32, 29 May 2018 (UTC)

By the way, this is the second time in the thread you mentioned "agressive behaviour". I invited you to provide examples and am still waiting. --Juicy Oranges (talk) 19:33, 29 May 2018 (UTC)

Examples ? just check LouisAragon's diffs. Since you confessed being wrong, it's ok for me. Now i think we're done here. Best regards.---Wikaviani (talk) 19:34, 29 May 2018 (UTC)

• Juicy Oranges, since you admitted having been in the wrong (better late than never, I suppose), I guess I shouldn't block you for these final pointy edits, but rest assured, you were indeed in the wrong, and you will be blocked if you keep posting there. A few hints--you are allowed to post notifications of threads on noticeboards if you file one involving the user. You are not allowed to make zero edits to leave remarks like you did in those last two diffs. Moreover, AE has nothing to do with talk page guidelines, so "I am NOT prohibited from implementing warnings or defending myself against outrageous claims. Got a problem? Go to AE" is simply false, in its entirety. Note to others: I have not looked into the user's other edits and problematic behavior; certainly there's some hostility there. Drmies (talk) 15:13, 30 May 2018 (UTC)

Sorry about long delay these past days. Basically here is the situation. The comments posted here along with the offending remarks of Louis Aragon's talk page were all spontaneous and occurred within a short time amid flared tempers. My admission of wrongdoing was specifically referring to the brief altercation with Wikivania, particularly afer he explained that he was asked to stalk Louis Aragon's talk page and so on. With regards Louis Aragon, I realise now that I violated policies with some of my actions at his talk. This has now been pointed out to me, but I am not vindicated in the action. I do know however to avoid this sort of thing in future. Before this case closes, I would like there to be an investigation into Louis Aragon's role in the entire affair. My finding here is that the summary box was created to explain the purpose of an edit whether that be addition or removal of anything. The summary box is not a tool for making remarks to other editors - for this we have talk pages, article and user. Obviously I too am guilty of using the summary box to address other editors but this has always been whilst working on the project whereby the editor I addressed is somehow in a position to respond, particularly if my summary comment falsely accused that editor of something. Lousin Aragon accused me of TEND and NOTHERE. I'm sorry but these are serious allegations, especially the latter which if true should have meant that I were banned after fewer than 100 edits. The former, incidentally, had been in response to me reverting an IP who undid the contributions of a confirmed account without explanation - in other words I was dealing with a behaviour issue. There was no TEND issue because despite having the article in question on my watchlist, I had never interfered with this part of the conflict on any side (which had been going on for a week) and my summary explained itself in no uncertain terms; it said the very words "rightly or wrongly" and I never reverted Louis Aragon afterwards either. So perhaps he would like to explain what he meant by TEND. From here on in, he used his summary as a launching pad for sarky comments. When I played him at his own game, he didn't like it and that is why we are here. Yet when he posted on my talk page, did I not blank it in a civilised manner? Everybody knows how to undo and that on one's user talk you don't even have to explain yourself. But when you use the summary to accuse someone of NOTHERE, it is downright insulting and provocative. Do you also realise that if I left it - and it was not seen through the history in the close vicinity that I replied - it could have looked like I were acceding to the false accusation. If I pinged him on my own talk page then this would have too remote for people to see that I did reply if only to challenge my accuser to demonstrate his claim. And what is more irritating is that the TEND and NOTHERE accusations are nothing more than a personal attack based on Louis Aragon's resentment of the fact that in February/March of 2017, we sat on opposing benches of a dispute and made some exchanges during this time. We interpreted a situation differently and along came the accusations. Now that conversation has dried up, I don't believe that I deserve to be criticised from summary boxes - I mean it is an online "hit from behind and run away" stratagem. If Louis Aragon wishes to revert anything I do anywhere, let him use the summary to explain the edit, and use whichever discussion page for when talking to me. How would Louis Aragon feel if when I removed his comment from my talk page I accused him of breaching 3RR, committing vandalism or of being a sock? The concept of being NOTHERE is the very same because to all intents and purposes a NOTHERE editor should be banned. As for the "aggressive behavour", Wikivania has already admitted this is a circular accusation made in reference to the same edits which prompted this report. I don't believe past actions from either of my two accounts have been agressive unless I have really forgotten something these past four years. So I pledge to avoid repeating this type of behaviour, and I would like Louis Aragon warned for misusing the summary boxes to make false accusations and for deliberate provocation. --Juicy Oranges (talk) 10:47, 3 June 2018 (UTC)

Too long, didn't read, and posting something this long when it is already established that there are conduct issues isn't helpful. On posting this reply, I now see that they pledge to avoid repeating this type of behavior, so please don't repeat it again with overlong posts. Robert McClenon (talk) 01:24, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

@Robert McClenon. As far as TLDR goes you have nothing to worry about. Apart from the fact that your username is not Drmies, you're not an administrator either and nor are you involved in the events which led to the report. On that note I reject your final premise of "don't repeat it again with overlong posts" because long posts do not violate any reglation, and I am not sure as to where you derive your "over"long from given you claimed TLDR. There is no part of the longer text that I can remove which would give the post to make sense. So in the end of the day if someone needs to write a long post then so be it. I've read other people's posts over twice the length of this one so the DR of TLDR is your choice, and remember nobody invited you to the thread and you know you didn't have to leave a remark. --Juicy Oranges (talk) 23:37, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

If you think you can ignore what people say to you when they're not admins, you're not going to last very long here. BTW everyone except those few topic banned and anyone who shouldn't be editing point blank are invited to all threads on ANI. They don't need anyone in particular to invite them. ANI is intended for the community, not for any particular individual so all posts should aim to be useful. If someone feels for good reason a post is not helpful, they are fully entitled to point that out without needing someone to invite them. Also you should stop worrying so much about "regulations", are start worrying more about how you can be a productive member of the community. I'm a master of long posts myself but sometimes they are clearly unhelpful. If you've made a clear cut mistake, e.g. continually posting on someone's talk page when you were asked not to, a long post is probably not going to improve your image since your best reply is an aknowledgment of your wrong doing, with a brief explanation if really needed of how it came about. It probably doesn't help that a quick check of your talk page suggests this is not the first instance you've been annoying someone on their talk page although maybe you weren't asked to stop in that instance. (Or you did when asked.) Nil Einne (talk) 08:17, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

The remark from Robert McClennon: 1) produces no input with regards the claimant's issue, and 2) merely suggests my post is "overlong" while admitting at the same time that he refuses to read it. Naturally I needed to point out that everything in the post needed to be stated, and if you do happen to read it, you'll see it is not actually a justification of my actions (I've accepted they were wrong), but it is an analysis of the surrounding events and in particular the conduct of the claimant. You appear to forget that there is such thing as BOOMERANG and this is the relevant thread for citing such concerns. Second thing: with regards the second editor you allude to that I annoyed (earlier instance), well snap, he pissed me off as well. You are talking about one extremely rude individual who does not know how to talk politely or interact with fellow editors on whom he does not agree on things and he can count his blessings that he has never been sanctioned nor - if I had my way - banned for breach of CIVIL. Sometimes on multiple occasions. A few appear to think that if a new editor is lacking in standard then it is fine to swear at them while they remain free to edit. I tell you if he ever spoke like that to me then I promise you he won't be editing today, and as for using this language on me in real life, well, let's not even go there - outcome will not be pleasant for him. Nevertheless, I should have pinged him. He did breach policy and appeared to be ignoring it. I've got better things to do that check on him to see if he has breached it again but if it should occur on a page that I am watching then it will be raised here along with the instance you referred to where he was in the wrong, not me. --Juicy Oranges (talk) 12:51, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

You now seem to be treading in the area of veiled threats. I strongly recommend against such a tact. Icarosaurvus (talk) 13:34, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

Point taken Icarosauvus. We'll meet half way. If nobody mentions rude editors with bad attitudes to me then I won't raise the subject either. No threats from me - and I don't do "veiled" as there is nothing slimy or creepy about me. I lead a clean life. --Juicy Oranges (talk) 19:17, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

"JO", do take care not to get typecast. Martinevans123 (talk) 13:43, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Inappropriate Wikipedia behaviour

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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On user BallenaBlanca.

There is ongoing litigation w the above editor related to a number of behavioural problems. The issue is overall with disruptive editing, Wikihounding and one-purpose, POV editing (I hope I am in the right place here). The editor in question claims in his personal page to be focused on medicine, still since approximately September 2017 his activity stands out for litigating on red hot controversial national issues nowadays at the very center of political life in Spain and media, often accompanied with misleading edit summaries. It really looks like WP:NOTHERE.

I had a first contact and numerous discussions in Catalan independence referendum, 2017, where the editor in question almost automatically reverts to extenuation edits that do not suit his views, even verified information, with content blanking. I got fed up in that article, and then I found he is jumping onto my area of interest doing highly controversial edits. Admittedly he has irritated me and my reply has not been at times the most level-headed. Thanks

• [9] Alteration of main information to conspicuously focus on fringe information], misleading edit summary, citing "consensus". [10] Check source here

• [11] Removal of supporting material, content blanking (references) and misleading edit summary

• [12] Removal of inconvenient WP:IJDLI depiction (check picture), is an artwork vetoed from article for being 'subjective'?]

• [13] Straight disruptive, POV editing] One of a series, browsing Basque articles to remove Basque and often add instead Spanish.

• [14] Idem, remove Basque and add Spanish

• [15] Idem, one-purpose ideological editing, on articles I have edited recently.

• [16] Idem, one-purpose ideological editing, on articles I have edited recently, remove Basque and add Spanish.

• [17] Idem, one-purpose ideological editing, on articles I have edited recently, remove Basque and add Spanish.

The editor in question has refused talk on his page. It has followed instead in my talk page.

Iñaki LL (talk) 21:56, 29 May 2018 (UTC)

Comment 1. For some time I am kindly asking Iñaki LL to stop personal attacks, to respect the Wikipedia policies and to comment on the topics of the pages and not on the users per WP:TALK#USE WP:TPYES, without success. See a few examples [18] [19] [20]

As we can see here in his message above, he are again judging my attitude and labelling me, also violating WP:AGF.

He is reverting me with edit summaries that are considered personal attacks, misleading, inappropriate, and uncivil per WP: SUMMARYNO. A few examples (and there are several more): [21], [22], [23], [24], [25], [26], [27], [28]

"The editor in question has refused talk on his page. It has followed instead in my talk page."

Iñaki LL left a message in my talk page, [29] that I removed per WP:HUSH. After this, I left a message in his talk page and we talked there. Again, I asked him to stop personal attacks User talk:Iñaki LL#You are committing personal attacks.

Maybe someone can explain me where I make personal attacks in these messages... ? User talk:Iñaki LL#You are committing personal attacks.

I will reply point by point to his objections (his text in italic):

• 1 [30] Alteration of main information to conspicuously focus on fringe information], misleading edit summary, citing "consensus". [31] Check source here

I do not understand the objections here, it is more detailed information and adjusted to the source, which explains "[El Ministerio del Interior ha decidido trasladar a la Fiscalía General del Estado las acusaciones contra la Policía Nacional y la Guardia Civil formuladas por la alcaldesa de Barcelona

Misleading edit summary, citing "consensus"? The content of the page was hardly discussed here Request for Comment (last comment 21:48, 18 October 2017) including this section on Violence and injuries. I restored the content to the version as it was at the end of this RfC. You can compare both texts:

- 23:50, 18 October 2017 "The Spanish Ministry of the Interior instructed the Spanish Attorney General to investigate whether the accusations of police sexual abuse against protesters made by Mayor of Barcelona Ada Colau, who had mentioned the councilor's statements, could be considered a legal offense of slander against Spanish Law enforcement organisations.[172]"

- 12:33, 20 January 2018 "The Spanish Ministry of the Interior instructed the Spanish Attorney General to investigate whether the accusations of police sexual abuse against protesters made by Mayor of Barcelona Ada Colau, who had mentioned the councilor's statements, could be considered a legal offense of slander against Spanish Law enforcement organisations.[208]"

(And in the meantime you can see again in this latest edit summary another one of the Iñaki's multiple and continuous accusations, in this case "POV", and violations of WP: SUMMARYNO)

• 2. [32] Removal of supporting material, content blanking (references) and misleading edit summary

This refer to the content that starts with "On 18 January 2018, the Spanish Home ..." In my edit summary I was referring to this user Edgarmm81 Edgarmm81 - legal threat I will not to extend in explanations here about how this user were continuosly violating WP:NOR WP:SYNTH, this is not the place. You can read more about this here Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017#Edits by Edgarmm81

• 3. [33] Removal of inconvenient WP:IJDLI depiction (check picture), is an artwork vetoed from article for being 'subjective'?]

This image has no place on a page about politics (may be fine on a page about art), it is a work of art that offers the author's own version, therefore a primary source and does not comply with WP: RS.

• 4. [34] Straight disruptive, POV editing] One of a series, browsing Basque articles to remove Basque and often add instead Spanish.

The accurate information is what I left after my edit in the page, Amaiur, that "Baztan in the autonomous region of Navarre in Spain". In fact, if you do a search on Navarra's own page, there is not a single link to Basque that I removed from Amaiur.

• 5. [35] Idem, remove Basque and add Spanish

No, what I did was to complete the information with more accurate and adjusted data, also adding information and a link to the Autonomous Community in the infobox, which only contained the population and the country, but not the Autonomous Community.

• 6. [36] Idem, one-purpose ideological editing, on articles I have edited recently.

Look at my edit summary “Unsourced. Please, feel free to re-add this information supported by a reliable source”. Unreferenced content can be deleted without further explanation. I think all of us know the WP:RS policy.

• 7. [37] Idem, one-purpose ideological editing, on articles I have edited recently, remove Basque and add Spanish.

Look at my edit summary “Adjusted nationality as per Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Biographies. The Constitution of Spain only admits one nation, which is the Spanish Nation.” There is no such thing as " Basque Spanish" nationality, it not exists and nobody uses it. This is an invented term that violates WP:NOR.

And I now add something that I did not write in this edit summary, which is that in this way duplicate information is simplified and avoided reiterations (see the following content: "He became the second elected Lehendakari (President of the Basque Country)") Also taking into account that the lead section must be a concise overview per MOS:LEAD.

• 8. [38] Idem, one-purpose ideological editing, on articles I have edited recently, remove Basque and add Spanish.

I am very happy that you put this example here so that everyone can see that you are even withdrawing the nationality from the infoboxes.

You can see more about this here Talk:Carles Puigdemont#Nationality

Best regards. --BallenaBlanca 🐳 ♂ (Talk) 00:49, 30 May 2018 (UTC)

Comment 2. I wonder if this can be considered as WP:CANVASS, since they are not cited nor involved here, just me, and they edit in the same line as Iñaki LL, [39] [40] [41]. If not, I apologize for my mistake. Best regards. --BallenaBlanca 🐳 ♂ (Talk) 02:00, 30 May 2018 (UTC)

I have been noticed about this discussion and I haven't followed all the events surrounding it, but I have seen the editions made by BallenaBlanca in order to promote certain agenda. Even when notified that his POV can be challenged with other articles about Kurdish, Flemish, Taiwanese or Sardinian people he has changed them all, making his editions point in one and only one purpose: trying to use the opinion of the Spanish Constitutional Court as the point to determine how an article in Wikipedia should be written, even for people from other countries and nationalities. I think that this attitude is utterly disruptive. Maybe this section is out of the scope from this Incident, but he is even trying to change all the "Basque Country" links to "Basque Autonomous Community", and we all know that they are not the same. It seems that this user is following a plan to deliverately promote certain views. -Theklan (talk) 09:24, 30 May 2018 (UTC)

Comment 4.@Theklan: you are saying “Even when notified that his POV can be challenged with other articles about Kurdish, Flemish, Taiwanese or Sardinian people he has changed them all, making his editions point in one and only one purpose”. I'm sure you're writing this in good faith, but it's obvious that you're confusing me with another user. Can you please provide diffs to prove this assertion? I have never edited on pages about Kurdish, Flemish, Taiwanese or Sardinian people.

I am always editing assuming good faith, including references and respecting the policies about verifiable sources WP:MEDRS WP:RS. See for example this 500 edit summaries.

I'm always listening the opinions of other users, editing collaboratively, using the specific talk pages, and arguing from a neutral point of view WP:NPOV. You can see here that 17% of my global contributions are in Talk pages and 73% in Main pages, while the rest in miscellaneous.

And if I'm wrong, I have no problem recognizing it. See for example this Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017#Last edit by BallenaBlanca and how I did the reversion myself (Restored previous version, trimmed primmary source per talk) and also the same in Operation Anubis (Reverting to revision of 17:06, 30 April 2018. Trimmed content supported by a primary source per WP:RS). This only an example, and obviously does not fit with a POV pushing editor.

About your last comment, once again, I repeat that my edits were intended to comply with Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Biographies#Context. I adjusted as stated on the main page on Basque Country (autonomous community). See the edit summaries [42] "(The Basque Country is officially the Basque Autonomous Community. See Basque Country (autonomous community))." Edited: By the way, "Basque Country" is a desambiguation page.

Best regards. --BallenaBlanca 🐳 ♂ (Talk) 12:51, 30 May 2018 (UTC)

First of all, the editor seems to have a lot of time, which I do not. The editor in question seems to know very well the rules and uses them against editors in the opposite spectrum of his POV, deceptively citing administrative/technical reasons ('adjusted', etc.). Looks like a bureaucracy really. Anyone knowing the topics, knows this editing is extremely controversial and contested, they are red hot national sensitive issues in Spain at this very moment, for which I have doubts over this account. He goes browsing the EN WP removing automatically Basque/Catalan for Spanish, and acknowledging only administrative realities, or citing the Spanish Constitution.

His reaction above is very telling about his attitude, he does have a lot of time to question the contribution of others, pushing the most restrictive interpretations according to his POV, there is always a pretext, in a way that the outcome of the edit is virtually a censorship of the relevant piece of information. It is highly disruptive, ultimately scaring away editors.

I had to leave the Catalan referendum article, and now he is coming over to Basque topics as some kind of rescuer of the WP. Anyway, I think the diffs I added above are revealing enough of his POV, one-purpose activity. Admittedly, at times he got bit on my nerves. One year-ago, a disruptive editor, User:Asilah1981, was finally banned after 2 and a half disrupting the WP (I went through all kind of tricks and attacks against me, eliciting improper reactions from mine), and this is looking not very different. Iñaki LL (talk) 13:39, 30 May 2018 (UTC)

Comment 6. Iñaki LL, with all of my respects, I will kindly make an observation. Maybe then the main problem is that, as you are saying yourself, you are losing your nerves. Arguing, reasoning or interpreting the conversations and messages of others with neutrality is very complicated, while not impossible, when one is not calm, centered nor focussed. Maybe that's the reason why, despite all my explanations, you continue to accuse me of bad faith, violating WP:AGF, with the accusation you added here that I am gaming the system (I cite your words, follow the link "Looks like a bureaucracy really"). I would suggest that you try to calm down, please, so that we can talk in a fluid, neutral and calm way.

What I am doing is respecting the rules and asking others to respect them too, as simple as that. They are the basis of Wikipedia, without them this would be chaos.

Best regards. --BallenaBlanca 🐳 ♂ (Talk) 15:00, 30 May 2018 (UTC)

I disagree. You are not respecting the rules, but making a sui generis interpretation of them to promote your POV in a disruptive way. You are also accusing others of not following the rules, and in the same talk pages you are not even accepting an argument over your bureaucratic attitude towards the subject, disregarding what external sources say, what common sense say and what the reader would expect fom a Wikipedia article.

About the changes in other nationalities (Quebécois, Flemish, Kurdish...): sorry, maybe it wans't you in the discussion who claimed that he/she was going to change them all. I have reviewed the conversation and I think it was Crystallizedcarbon who claimed it. -Theklan (talk) 18:39, 30 May 2018 (UTC)

• Catalan separatism is on my list. EEng 19:10, 30 May 2018 (UTC)

Clearly a case for dispute resolution rather than admin intervention. Perhaps inevitably the situation in Catalonia and Spain itself is being reflected by users from that country on wikipedia with a huge amount of passion for the subject, and dispute resolution seems to be the only sensible way forward, given this thread. ♫ RichardWeiss talk contribs 19:17, 30 May 2018 (UTC)

It is nothing about passion except what I pointed that I overreacted to the editor's controversial campaign and wikihounding, the sequence of edits are clear above. The editor in question, mild mannered but extremely aggressive in actions, shows a command of policies to censor other editors in highly sensitive issues, evading common sense and consensus seeking, besides having plenty of time, always pursuing the rule, if any, in its most restrictive and alienating interpretation, changing the edits of editors with a different POV. See also here (verified information), where a verified authoritative voice was automatically reverted by the editor ultimately "for being a primary source", when nothing more is being reported in the text than what that authoritative voice said.

The case of Navarre above (Amaiur) ("In fact, if you do a search on Navarra's own page, there is not a single link to Basque that I removed from Amaiur") is very revealing of the kind of self-entitled reasoning of the editor in question, incomprehensible, just self-entitlement, only what he says is good. He removes Basque, critical information (I do not know if this editor knows anything on the village, it seems that he does absolutely nothing if his edit is anything to go by) and adding Spain, with no nuance or further considerations other than that.

The disruptive POV pursuit is clearer in his way of migrating from one article to another, evading more easily detection. He claims to edits on "medical", although it clear looks more of a facade if his edits are anything to get by. I strongly believe a topic-ban applies, other than that, a warning temporary block, incremental if he continues his disruptive the WP or his hounding pursuit. Iñaki LL (talk) 21:41, 30 May 2018 (UTC)

Comment. It seems that I also have to apologize if I have time to edit in Wikipedia...

Your sense of "hounding pursuit" is very easy to explain.

The starting point was when this thread was opened on May 15, 2018 Talk:Carles Puigdemont#Nationality, page that I have been following for some time. My first intervention in this thread was on May 21, 2018 [43] You can enter my contributions and check dates, to see that before May 21, 2018, I had not done any edit correcting errors about nationalities (because they do not comply with Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Biographies#Context).

From there, I was interested in seeing how the situation was in other related pages. That was as simple as looking for categories, entering the lists and going checking pages one by one, correcting the irregularities (a great part has the correct data). As I have looked at several tens, it seems that I have coincided with you, for what I have been able to verify later with your multiple reversions of my edits, with misleading, inappropriate, and uncivil edit summaries violating WP:SUMMARYNO.

I'm not trying to upset you, your reactions depends on your personality. For example, I am very calm and I did not react violently to these edit summaries, although reasons were not lacking:

1. (Undid revision 842918300 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv contentious, one-purpose editing)
2. (Undid revision 842930922 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv one-purpose, contentious editing)
3. (Undid revision 842926502 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv contentious, one-purpose editing)
4. (Undid revision 842931726 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv one-purpose editing)
5. (Undid revision 842931555 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv campaigner)
6. (Undid revision 842931881 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv campaigner)
7. (Undid revision 843078112 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv systematic controversial editing)
8. (Undid revision 842927897 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv campaigner)
9. (Undid revision 842926603 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv contentious POV editor)
10. (Undid revision 842923344 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv POV editor)
11. (Undid revision 842925973 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv campaigner)
12. (Undid revision 842918401 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv campaigner)
13. (Undid revision 842927233 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv verified info by campaignerr)

On the contrary, have you noticed that I have not undone them? Except for a couple of pages a few days ago, in which we both undid edits, I have not touched the rest (easy to check it seeing the histories). If I were like you say that I am, I would have continued to revert, but I am waiting calmly to see how the open discussion in Talk Puigdemont is resolved.

In addition, a user left me this message in my UTP on 23 May, with a list of pages arbitrarily edited by a sockpuppet currently banned, who systematically introduced irregularities about nationalities violating Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Biographies#Context, among other things.

Linking here and there, I ended up reviewing a large number of articles.

P.S.: Note that the policy that you mentioned hounding says:

Correct use of an editor's history includes (but is not limited to) fixing unambiguous errors or violations of Wikipedia policy, or correcting related problems on multiple articles. In fact, such practices are recommended both for Recent changes patrol and WikiProject Spam.

About your bann suggestion and seeing that you still do not calm down, judging and accusing me more and moere, keep in mind that it could be applied WP:BOOMERANG.

Best regards. --BallenaBlanca 🐳 ♂ (Talk) 00:12, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

A topic ban would need to apply to both sides which is why dispute resolution would be much better. ♫ RichardWeiss talk contribs 06:07, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

If he feels there is a "POV pursuit" on my part, I am not responsible for it. I do not know what more can I do to get him to calm down, although I'm trying to ask him kindly.

It is easy to show that I am not following or harassing Iñaki LL and that the times we coincided in pages were fortuity.

I have taken the last contributions of Iñaki LL (I have eliminated the duplicates, that is, the pages in which he made several edits).

Let's see the RESULTS:

ARTICLES:

• May 27, 2018: 16 edits by Iñaki LL, reverting my only edit on those pages, except in Joseba Sarrionandia, in which I made 2 edits, and Carlos Garaikoetxea, in which I made 7 edits .
• May 25, 2018: 2 pages edited by Iñaki LL, one of them reverting my only edit in Étienne Polverel. I did 5 edits in Juan José Ibarretxe.
• May 23, 2018 to April 15, 2018: 38 pages edited by Iñaki LL. I made 0 edits in 35 of these pages, 1 edit in University of the Basque Country, 1 edit in José María Arizmendiarrieta, and 179 in Catalan independence referendum.

TALK PAGES:

• You can see how I am using the talk pages of articles in which I have edited several times, but I have not followed Iñaki LL to any other page.

And if you keep looking back, you'll see the same pattern (I'm not going to put more here to not collapse the page).

In conclusion: We have edited in a few same pages coincidentally, there is no bad faith on my part.

I paste here the results of the reports and the links so you can check it:

Articles

ARTICLES: May 27, 2018: 23:44, 27 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-33)‎ . . Arnaldo Otegi ‎ (Undid revision 842918300 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv contentious, one-purpose editing) (Tag: Undo) Found 1 edits by BallenaBlanca on Arnaldo Otegi (0.27% of the total edits made to the page) 23:41, 27 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-80)‎ . . Zarama (band) ‎ (Undid revision 842930922 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv one-purpose, contentious editing) (current) (Tag: Undo) [rollback] [vandalism] Found 1 edits by BallenaBlanca on Zarama (band) (5.0% of the total edits made to the page) 23:40, 27 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-14)‎ . . Jorge Oteiza ‎ (Undid revision 842926502 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv contentious, one-purpose editing) (current) (Tag: Undo) [rollback] [vandalism] Found 1 edits by BallenaBlanca on Jorge Oteiza (1.0% of the total edits made to the page) 23:39, 27 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-25)‎ . . BAP (Basque band) ‎ (Undid revision 842931726 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv one-purpose editing) (current) (Tag: Undo) [rollback] [vandalism] Found 1 edits by BallenaBlanca on BAP (Basque band) (2.22% of the total edits made to the page) 23:35, 27 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-46)‎ . . Betagarri ‎ (Undid revision 842931555 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv campaigner) (current) (Tag: Undo) [rollback] [vandalism] Found 1 edits by BallenaBlanca on Betagarri (1.61% of the total edits made to the page) 23:16, 27 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-75)‎ . . Negu Gorriak ‎ (Undid revision 842931881 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv campaigner) (current) (Tag: Undo) [rollback] [vandalism] Found 1 edits by BallenaBlanca on Negu Gorriak (0.74% of the total edits made to the page) 23:15, 27 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-65)‎ . . Nestor Basterretxea ‎ (Undid revision 843078112 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv systematic controversial editing) (current) (Tag: Undo) [rollback] [vandalism] Found 1 edits by BallenaBlanca on Nestor Basterretxea (1.61% of the total edits made to the page) 23:13, 27 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-45)‎ . . Joseba Sarrionandia ‎ (Undid revision 842927897 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv campaigner) (current) (Tag: Undo) [rollback] [vandalism] Found 2 edits by BallenaBlanca on Joseba Sarrionandia (1.61% of the total edits made to the page) 23:12, 27 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+5)‎ . . Delorean (band) ‎ (Undid revision 842926603 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv contentious POV editor) (current) (Tag: Undo) [rollback] [vandalism] Found 1 edits by BallenaBlanca on Delorean (band) (0.67% of the total edits made to the page) 23:11, 27 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-82)‎ . . Fermin Muguruza ‎ (Undid revision 842923344 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv POV editor) (current) (Tag: Undo) [rollback] [vandalism] Found 1 edits by BallenaBlanca on Fermin Muguruza (0.74% of the total edits made to the page) 23:10, 27 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+16)‎ . . José Antonio de Gaztañeta ‎ (Undid revision 842925973 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv campaigner) (Tag: Undo) Found 1 edits by BallenaBlanca on José Antonio de Gaztañeta (1.92% of the total edits made to the page) 23:10, 27 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+11)‎ . . Federico Krutwig ‎ (Undid revision 842918401 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv campaigner) (Tag: Undo) Found 1 edits by BallenaBlanca on Federico Krutwig (1.18% of the total edits made to the page) 23:08, 27 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+21)‎ . . Diego de Borica ‎ (Undid revision 842927233 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv verified info by campaignerr) (current) (Tag: Undo) [rollback] [vandalism] Found 1 edits by BallenaBlanca on Diego de Borica (1.04% of the total edits made to the page) 23:08, 27 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+10)‎ . . Pablo Sorozábal ‎ (Undid revision 842926050 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv campaigner) (current) (Tag: Undo) [rollback] [vandalism] Found 1 edits by BallenaBlanca on Pablo Sorozábal (1.27% of the total edits made to the page) 23:05, 27 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-100)‎ . . Kortatu ‎ (Undid revision 842930320 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv POV editing) (current) (Tag: Undo) [rollback] [vandalism] Found 1 edits by BallenaBlanca on Kortatu (1.11% of the total edits made to the page) 20:45, 27 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+25)‎ . . Carlos Garaikoetxea ‎ (Undid revision 843032492 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv to inclusive definition, critical national background) (Tag: Undo) Found 7 edits by BallenaBlanca on Carlos Garaikoetxea (5.51% of the total edits made to the page) May 25, 2018: 22:14, 25 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+94)‎ . . Étienne Polverel ‎ (Undid revision 842923556 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv one-purpose editing) (current) (Tag: Undo) [rollback] [vandalism] Found 1 edits by BallenaBlanca on Étienne Polverel (1.56% of the total edits made to the page) 22:13, 25 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-18)‎ . . Juan José Ibarretxe ‎ (Undid revision 842917331 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv removal of critical information / controversial editing) (Tag: Undo) Found 5 edits by BallenaBlanca on Juan José Ibarretxe (2.81% of the total edits made to the page) May 23, 2018 to April 15, 2018: 22:59, 23 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-43)‎ . . Altsasu incident (2016) ‎ (Undid revision 842634762 by Oraina (talk) Rv non existent category, also Spanish judicial truth still pending) (current) (Tag: Undo) [vandalism] Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Altsasu incident (2016) ‎ (0% of the total edits made to the page) 16:02, 23 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+46)‎ . . Basque Nationalist Party ‎ (Undid revision 842599191 by 112.64.68.70 (talk) Not grammar) (Tag: Undo) Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Basque Nationalist Party (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 16:02, 23 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+124)‎ . . Xirula ‎ (Undid revision 842570006 by Dbachmann (talk) Rv per WP:VER) (Tag: Undo) Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Xirula (0% of the total edits made to the page) 14:02, 22 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-18)‎ . . Reconquista ‎ (Undid revision 842419682 by 62.12.175.131 (talk) Rv to accurate, balanced version) (Tag: Undo) Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Reconquista (0% of the total edits made to the page) 23:09, 19 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+113)‎ . . Immigration to Europe ‎ (→‎Spain: Picture) (current) [vandalism] Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Immigration to Europe (0% of the total edits made to the page) 22:21, 19 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+122)‎ . . Syrian Civil War ‎ (→‎Ceasefire and escalation (April 2012 – December 2013): Picture) Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Syrian Civil War (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 22:13, 19 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+114)‎ . . 2018 Gaza border protests ‎ (→‎14 May: Picture) Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Gaza border protests (0% of the total edits made to the page) 12:07, 19 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+36)‎ . . Basque National Liberation Movement prisoners ‎ (→‎Recent developments: links) (current) (Tag: Visual edit) [vandalism] Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Basque National Liberation Movement prisoners (0% of the total edits made to the page) 15:37, 17 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (0)‎ . . m Battle of Toulouse (721) ‎[ https://tools.wmflabs.org/sigma/usersearch.py?name=BallenaBlanca&page=Battle+of+Toulouse&max=500&server=enwiki Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Battle of Toulouse (0.0% of the total edits made to the page)] 07:09, 17 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+669)‎ . . Basque Country (greater region) ‎ (Undid revision 841633490 by 174.71.219.114 (talk) Rv IP) (Tag: Undo) Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Basque Country (greater region) (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 12:02, 16 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+25)‎ . . Pamplona ‎ (English) Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Pamplona (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 00:55, 15 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+748)‎ . . José María Arizmendiarrieta ‎ (→‎Biography: Expanded) Found 1 edits by BallenaBlanca on José María Arizmendiarrieta (1.0% of the total edits made to the page) 23:43, 14 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-90)‎ . . Reconquista ‎ (Idem) Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Reconquista ‎ (Idem) (0% of the total edits made to the page) 13:01, 12 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-4)‎ . . Lemóniz Nuclear Power Plant ‎ (Idem) (current) [vandalism] Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Lemóniz Nuclear Power Plant (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 07:56, 10 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-2)‎ . . French Basque Country ‎ (Undid revision 840446672 by Jamez42 (talk) English language name) (Tag: Undo) Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on French Basque Country (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 21:02, 9 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+25)‎ . . Navarre ‎ (Undid revision 840405482 by 152.16.39.247 (talk) Rv unexplained change) (Tag: Undo) Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Navarre (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 20:58, 9 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-169)‎ . . San Sebastián ‎ (→‎Modern Age: Restored previous removed info, avoided redundancies, cleaned up) Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on San Sebastián (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 09:22, 9 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+173)‎ . . Gilbert du Motier, Marquis de Lafayette ‎ (Undid revision 840338018 by Wehwalt (talk) This is a fully free licensed picture, it is in Pasai Donibane for everyone to see, thanks) (Tag: Undo) Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Gilbert du Motier, Marquis de Lafayette (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 22:22, 8 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-4)‎ . . Alsasua fight ‎ (Fixed) (current) (Tag: New redirect) [vandalism] Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Alsasua fight (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 22:20, 8 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+37)‎ . . N Alsasua incident ‎ (Redirect) (current) (Tag: New redirect) [vandalism] Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on N Alsasua incident (0% of the total edits made to the page) 14:32, 8 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+5)‎ . . Lèse-majesté ‎ (Tweak) Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Lèse-majesté (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 22:44, 7 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+69)‎ . . La Manada sexual abuse case ‎ (Oops, links) (current) [vandalism] Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on La Manada sexual abuse case (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 23:55, 2 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+22)‎ . . Carmen Lamela ‎ (→‎Audiencia Nacional of Spain (National Court): Link, fixes) (current) [vandalism] Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Carmen Lamela (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 23:48, 2 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+142)‎ . . Alsasua – Altsasu ‎ (Link) (current) [vandalism] Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Alsasua – Altsasu (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 21:30, 2 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-4)‎ . . User:Iñaki LL/sandbox ‎ (current) [vandalism] Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on User:Iñaki LL/sandbox (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 23:27, 1 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+425)‎ . . Wikipedia:Requests for page protection ‎ (→‎Current requests for increase in protection level) Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Wikipedia:Requests for page protection (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 10:05, 29 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+293)‎ . . GAL (paramilitary group) ‎ (Undid revision 838698301 by Abedulanilla (talk) Rv unexplained change) (Tag: Undo) Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on User talk:Amorymeltzer (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 23:32, 23 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+67)‎ . . Olárizu ‎ (info) (current) (Tag: Visual edit) [vandalism] Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Olárizu (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 23:00, 22 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+2)‎ . . m Battle of Irún ‎ (→‎Notes) Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Battle of Irún (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 11:20, 21 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+265)‎ . . Crown of Aragon ‎ (Ref) Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Crown of Aragon (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 21:56, 20 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+376)‎ . . Catalan independence referendum, 2017 ‎ (Undid revision 837411460 by Crystallizedcarbon (talk) No, no and no, it is a reported statement of what a recognisable, authoritative document says) (Tag: Undo) [Catalan independence referendum, 2017 Found 179 edits by BallenaBlanca on Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (9.74% of the total edits made to the page)] 23:20, 18 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+21)‎ . . Charles Martel ‎ (→‎Background: Nuance) Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Charles Martel (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 11:38, 17 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+50)‎ . . Mimizan ‎ (→‎History: links, paragraph) (current) (Tag: Visual edit) [vandalism] Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Mimizan (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 15:16, 16 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+5)‎ . . Wikipedia:Help desk ‎ (→‎Redirect and rename issue) Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Wikipedia:Help desk (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 12:00, 16 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+15)‎ . . Ikurriña ‎ (Undid revision 836696508 by 150.241.162.243 (talk) Testa desegin) (current) (Tag: Undo) [vandalism] Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Ikurriña (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 23:25, 15 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-1)‎ . . University of the Basque Country ‎ (Wording, pragraphs) (Tag: Visual edit) Found 1 edits by BallenaBlanca on University of the Basque Country (0.4% of the total edits made to the page) 23:09, 15 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+46)‎ . . N UPV-EHU ‎ (←Redirected page to University of the Basque Country) (Tag: New redirect) Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on N UPV-EHU (NaN% of the total edits made to the page) 00:43, 13 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-16)‎ . . EH Bildu ‎ (Reverted 3 edits by 79.136.107.17 (talk): Misrepresentation of source. (TW)) (current) (Tag: Undo) [vandalism] Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on EH Bildu (0.0% of the total edits made to the page)

Talk pages

TALK PAGES: 23:49, 27 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+269)‎ . . Talk:Carles Puigdemont ‎ (→‎Nationality) Found 16 edits by BallenaBlanca on Talk:Carles Puigdemont (3.8% of the total edits made to the page) 21:27, 27 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+432)‎ . . Talk:Carlos Garaikoetxea ‎ (→‎Nationality) Found 9 edits by BallenaBlanca on Talk:Carlos Garaikoetxea (33.33% of the total edits made to the page) 23:05, 25 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+389)‎ . . Talk:Juan José Ibarretxe ‎ (→‎Nationality) Found 7 edits by BallenaBlanca on Talk:Juan José Ibarretxe (21.88% of the total edits made to the page) 09:44, 9 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+515)‎ . . Talk:Gilbert du Motier, Marquis de Lafayette ‎ (→‎Semi-protected edit request on 2 March 2018) Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Talk:Gilbert du Motier, Marquis de Lafayette (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 17:16, 2 May 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+269)‎ . . User talk:Amorymeltzer ‎ (→‎Removal of Page protection petition) Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on User talk:Amorymeltzer (0.0% of the total edits made to the page) 01:03, 26 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+635)‎ . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 ‎ (→‎Revert of authoritative document) Found 102 edits by BallenaBlanca on Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (9.24% of the total edits made to the page) 18:28, 16 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+130)‎ . . Talk:Basque Country (greater region) ‎ (→‎Edit warring in lead) Found 0 edits by BallenaBlanca on Talk:Basque Country (greater region) (0.0% of the total edits made to the page)

Best regards. --BallenaBlanca 🐳 ♂ (Talk) 15:33, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

More argumentation based on evidences, showing what Iñaki LL has omitted.

There are more problems with his accusations against me. When only part of the facts are exposed, a biased view is being given.

Iñaki LL said: "It is nothing about passion except what I pointed that I overreacted to the editor's controversial campaign and wikihounding, the sequence of edits are clear above. The editor in question, mild mannered but extremely aggressive in actions, shows a command of policies to censor other editors in highly sensitive issues, evading common sense and consensus seeking, besides having plenty of time, always pursuing the rule, if any, in its most restrictive and alienating interpretation, changing the edits of editors with a different POV. See also here (verified information), where a verified authoritative voice was automatically reverted by the editor ultimately "for being a primary source", when nothing more is being reported in the text than what that authoritative voice said."

I will develop the rest of the information that Iñaki LL has not mentioned and that can prevent you from seeing the facts with the necessary neutrality.

This is the edit that Iñaki LL refers to Revision as of 22:25, 20 April 2018 BallenaBlanca (Leaving aside other considerations, trim this content per WP:SPA. Before reinserting again, please reach consensus in the PD.), which was made by Edgarmm81 here: Revision as of 09:34, 20 April 2018) Edgarmm81 (→‎Press coverage and Internet)

I undid the edit and asked him to use the TP Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017/Archive 7#Revert of authoritative document. When I said "leaving aside other considerations" I meant that, besides having a behaviour compatible with WP:SPA [44], he did not listen to the multiple advices to use verifiable sources, complying with WP:NPOV, using the templates to format the references and taking care of the presentation and writing.

The source that Iñaki LL says is "a verified authoritative voice" does not comply WP:RS: it is a self submitted publication by a hacker / activist. A small extract from the discussion (by the way, opened by Iñaki LL himself) [45] (Notice that it is not me who is arguing this):

• First is that the statement that "claims pushed by Spain about Twitter bots & #Catalonia are false" is original research on a primary source as what the document criticized are the alleged methods used but does not make that claim.
• Second the phrase "UK Parliament 'fake news' committee publishes" is misleading, as this is not an official report. The committee is still ongoing and has opened a site where document submission is open. (see here) it lists all those contributions on that page. Since it is not subject to editorial control, so it would not qualify as a reliable source.
• Third the term US expert is also misleading. McGrath is just a young hacker and an activist that has developed some software tools for gathering data.

In fact, after an edit war motivated by the user who added it and another user indefinitely blocked for being a suck puppet [46] [47] [48] [49] [50] [51], who kept adding it without paying attention to the discussion, the information has not been added again.

This edits profile has been the general rule in the referendum page and the reason why I have done so many edits on that page (and its talk page), seeking neutrality, consensus, and trying to avoid vandalism and irregularities.

Best regards.--BallenaBlanca 🐳 ♂ (Talk) 20:34, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

Wow, that is a wall. Why are you bringing all these links? Thanks but I do not need them and do not think nobody requested them, my claim is much more simple. However, the link above ("fake news") seems to be right, so you are right on that link, I was wrong in choosing that diff. I remember now that it was actually discussed. A point for you. Your mild manner is not an issue, that is good, but it is not about the words, it is about your actions.

So going through articles you never have worked on, where I have been recently or not long ago, in my area of interest, exclusively to substitute 'Basque' for 'Spanish' (an ideological move and highly contentious in Spain, more so in certain politicians, needless to say), with a focus also in 'independence' matters (from above), after having a good number of scuffles and litigation with you in Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (for which I left the article) is just a coincidence. That has a name in the WP, for which came here. It does not look very constructive, it all seems more to elicit a reaction or tediousness.

You do not need to undo anything for Wikihounding. As for the rest, your history and mine are there for whomever to look at. I have been for 10 years on the WP, I had to put up with a disruptive editor, a sockpuppet, finally banned after two years and a half roaming freely through the WP, accusing me (etc...) of all kind of things. To whomever this refers. I have nothing more to say. I request a sanction on the grounds pointed above, based on breach of healthy editing environment. Iñaki LL (talk) 21:49, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

Thank you very much for acknowledging your error.

10 years? Really? And after 10 years in Wikipedia, you're surprised because an edit of yours is undone because it does not provide references? (neither verifiable nor unverifiable, no reference at all).

Neither you are taking into account that I invited you kindly to add the content again, supported by a reliable reference. Let's see the my edit summary in the link you just provided: Unsourced. Please, feel free to re-add this information supported by a reliable source.

Neither you are taking into account that I have not undone it, although that is what should be done. It is still the current version [52].

Also, please remember that Wikpedia is an open voluntary project and that the users can edit in the pages we want, and we do not need to justify or explain why we choose the topics or the articles we edit; we do not have obligations or a calendar of edits WP:CHOICE WP:VOLUNTEER. We only have to comply with (all) the policies, this is the basis of Wikipedia.

It seems that you think you are not obligated to comply with the rules and you can apply them arbitrarely, and that you edit letting yourself be carried away by emotions. This is a big problem for Wikipedia...

Best regards. --BallenaBlanca 🐳 ♂ (Talk) 22:34, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

I continue providing documented evidence.

Let's see now how Iñaki LL has also forgotten the facts? / made a mistake?, saying that I have been harassing him and that because of my behaviour he has had to stop editing on the referendum page.

He has said it twice in this thread (citing his words literally): “after having a good number of scuffles and litigation with you in Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (for which I left the article) "highly disruptive" "pushing the most restrictive interpretations according to his POV" "editing is extremely controversial" “I had to leave the Catalan referendum article, and now he is coming over to Basque topics”

Here we have the complete list of his edits on the referendum talk page:

• Found 94 edits by Iñaki LL on Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (8.51% of the total edits made to the page)

Edits by Iñaki LL on Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 - Detailed list

23:03, 25 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+635) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Revert of authoritative document */) 22:12, 25 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+974) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Edits by Edgarmm81 */) 21:15, 25 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+1,383) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Revert of authoritative document */) 20:42, 25 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+500) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Edits by Edgarmm81 */) 22:08, 24 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+0) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Revert of authoritative document */) 22:07, 24 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+15) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Revert of authoritative document */) 22:03, 24 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+1,602) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Revert of authoritative document */) 21:25, 24 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+609) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Edits by Edgarmm81 */) 19:33, 24 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+201) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Revert of authoritative document */) 19:28, 24 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+2,574) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Revert of authoritative document */) 22:10, 21 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+0) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (Typo) 19:59, 21 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+928) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 20:13, 20 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+654) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Reversion by Crystallizedcarbon */) 20:03, 17 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-2) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Reversion by Crystallizedcarbon */ Format) 20:02, 17 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-4) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Reversion by Crystallizedcarbon */) 20:01, 17 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+1,073) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Reversion by Crystallizedcarbon */) 21:29, 16 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+362) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Reversion 2 by Crystallizedcarbon */) 20:58, 16 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+9) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Reversion 2 by Crystallizedcarbon */) 20:58, 16 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+936) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Reversion 2 by Crystallizedcarbon */) 22:58, 14 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+273) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Reversion by Crystallizedcarbon */) 21:57, 12 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-8) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Reversion by Crystallizedcarbon */) 21:56, 12 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-1) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Reversion by Crystallizedcarbon */ Fixed) 21:55, 12 April 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+1,417) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Reversion by Crystallizedcarbon */) 10:18, 25 February 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+452) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Cyberattacks and disinformation are not the same thing */) 01:28, 25 February 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+3) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Cyberattacks and disinformation are not the same thing */) 01:27, 25 February 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+688) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Cyberattacks and disinformation are not the same thing */) 16:33, 23 February 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+884) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Cyberattacks and disinformation are not the same thing */) 00:53, 23 February 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+509) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Cyberattacks and disinformation are not the same thing */) 00:30, 23 February 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+1) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Cyberattacks and disinformation are not the same thing */) 00:28, 23 February 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+2) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Cyberattacks and disinformation are not the same thing */) 00:28, 23 February 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+2) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Cyberattacks and disinformation are not the same thing */) 00:27, 23 February 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+893) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Cyberattacks and disinformation are not the same thing */) 19:39, 21 January 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+6) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* PRESS COVERAGE */ Reply) 19:38, 21 January 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+19) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* PRESS COVERAGE */) 19:38, 21 January 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+580) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* PRESS COVERAGE */) 10:11, 20 January 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+98) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Mass removal of content */) 10:07, 20 January 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+766) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Mass removal of content */) 18:31, 14 January 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+87) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Consensus version altered */) 18:27, 14 January 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+802) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Consensus version altered */) 17:45, 14 January 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+963) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Mass removal of content */) 23:52, 11 January 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-13,906) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Mass removal of content */ Reply) 17:41, 11 January 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-27,124) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (Do add your information in the article, sourced and accurately) 17:39, 11 January 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-13,850) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Mass removal of content */ No and no, this is no wall, come here for discussion to fix specific problems) 09:14, 11 January 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+249) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Mass removal of content */) 08:14, 11 January 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+1) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Mass removal of content */) 08:13, 11 January 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+225) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Mass removal of content */) 08:01, 11 January 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+316) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Mass removal of content */) 20:41, 10 January 2018 (diff | hist) . . (-30) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Mass removal of content */ Fixed link) 20:39, 10 January 2018 (diff | hist) . . (+407) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Multiple voting */) 12:44, 30 December 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+26) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Misrepresentation of sources */ Sb added this in the wrong place, not belonging there, create section) 08:21, 28 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+270) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Apparent Misquote in article with no citation for support */) 20:35, 20 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (-6) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */ Thanks but no, do not alter the meaning of signed comments) 22:48, 19 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+307) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* "The Guardian" about fake news of violence */) 22:42, 19 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+514) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 21:58, 19 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+1,174) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 20:58, 19 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+323) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 20:32, 19 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (-58) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (Undid revision 806077687 by BallenaBlanca (talk) Rv unhelpful edit, by WP:TPO, like improductive and harmful personal edits, see also WP:NPA) 14:10, 19 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (-58) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (Removed userbox per WP:TPNO) 13:59, 19 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (-1) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */ Fixed link) 13:59, 19 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+2) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */ Fixed link) 13:57, 19 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+1,912) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 22:38, 18 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+391) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 22:06, 18 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+579) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 19:53, 18 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+458) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 22:23, 17 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+2) . . m Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 22:22, 17 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+1,748) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 14:54, 17 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+426) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 13:28, 17 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+282) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 13:15, 17 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+1) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 13:10, 17 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+1) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 13:09, 17 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+799) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 08:41, 17 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+263) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 08:36, 17 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+319) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */ Fixed comment) 08:32, 17 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+367) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 22:37, 16 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+3) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 22:36, 16 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+613) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 22:21, 16 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+707) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 22:01, 16 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+378) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 21:56, 16 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+576) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 21:35, 16 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+557) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 21:04, 16 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+646) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 20:36, 16 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (-1) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */ Spelling) 20:35, 16 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+1,808) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 17:38, 16 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+1,507) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 12:45, 16 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+708) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 10:25, 16 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+410) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Level of detail on the lead */) 18:45, 15 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+220) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Misrepresentation of sources */) 20:15, 14 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+237) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Supposed illegality of "approved law" */) 20:02, 14 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+788) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Supposed illegality of "approved law" */) 19:33, 14 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+267) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (Unsigned comment) 13:52, 14 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+1,139) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Misrepresentation of sources */) 09:52, 14 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+580) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Neglect to include Franco-Catalan electorate in referenda */) 22:21, 08 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+1,338) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Request for Comment */) 20:39, 08 October 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+869) . . Talk:Catalan independence referendum, 2017 (/* Request for Comment */)

If what he is saying is true, we would have to see how he was continually discussing with me until his last edit and leave because he could not stand it.

Well, we can verify that it is completely false. Checking his edits one by one in reverse chronological order, from the last one on April 25, 2018 to October 19, 2017 (I have skipped edits with minor changes such as (+0) (+15) (-2) (-4)... and I have not included all the edits because the list is very long, but with these is more than enough to get a clear idea) and seeing who he is answering to, we have the following results:

• The last time he was answering me was almost 6 months ago, on January 20, 2018.
• 18 Replying to Crystallizedcarbon
• 7 Replying to BallenaBlanca
• 3 Replying to Aljullu
• 3 Replying to Ymblanter
• 2 Removal of inaccurate content
• 2 Replying to Edgarmm81
• 2 Replying to BallenaBlanca and Crystallizedcarbon
• 1 To everyone (please WP:INDENT)
• 1 Voting

Detailed list with links for you can check it

Revision as of 01:03, 26 April 2018 Replying to Crystallizedcarbon Revision as of 00:12, 26 April 2018 Replying to Crystallizedcarbon Revision as of 23:15, 25 April 2018 Replying to Crystallizedcarbon Revision as of 22:42, 25 April 2018 Replying to Crystallizedcarbon Revision as of 00:03, 25 April 2018 Replying to Crystallizedcarbon Revision as of 00:03, 25 April 2018 Replying to Crystallizedcarbon Revision as of 23:25, 24 April 2018 Replying to Crystallizedcarbon Revision as of 21:33, 24 April 2018 To everyone (please WP:INDENT) Revision as of 21:28, 24 April 2018 Replying to Crystallizedcarbon Revision as of 21:59, 21 April 2018 Replying to Aljullu Revision as of 22:13, 20 April 2018 Replying to Crystallizedcarbon Revision as of 22:01, 17 April 2018 Replying to Aljullu Revision as of 23:29, 16 April 2018 Replying to Crystallizedcarbon Revision as of 22:58, 16 April 2018 Replying to Aljullu Revision as of 00:58, 15 April 2018 Replying to Crystallizedcarbon Revision as of 23:55, 12 April 2018 Replying to Crystallizedcarbon Revision as of 11:18, 25 February 2018 Replying to Crystallizedcarbon Revision as of 02:27, 25 February 2018 Replying to Crystallizedcarbon Revision as of 17:33, 23 February 2018 Replying to Crystallizedcarbon Revision as of 01:53, 23 February 2018 Replying to Edgarmm81 Revision as of 01:27, 23 February 2018 Replying to Crystallizedcarbon Revision as of 20:38, 21 January 2018 Replying to Edgarmm81 Revision as of 11:11, 20 January 2018 Replying to BallenaBlanca Revision as of 11:07, 20 January 2018 Replying to BallenaBlanca Revision as of 19:27, 14 January 2018 Replying to BallenaBlanca Revision as of 18:45, 14 January 2018 Replying to BallenaBlanca Revision as of 00:52, 12 January 2018 Replying to Edgarmm81 Revision as of 18:41, 11 January 2018 Removal of inaccurate content Revision as of 18:39, 11 January 2018 Removal of inaccurate content Revision as of 10:14, 11 January 2018 Replying to Ymblanter Revision as of 09:13, 11 January 2018 Replying to Ymblanter Revision as of 09:01, 11 January 2018 Replying to Ymblanter Revision as of 21:39, 10 January 2018 Replying to BallenaBlanca Revision as of 10:21, 28 October 2017 Voting Revision as of 00:48, 20 October 2017 Replying to BallenaBlanca Revision as of 23:58, 19 October 2017 Replying to Crystallizedcarbon Revision as of 22:58, 19 October 2017 Replying to BallenaBlanca Revision as of 15:57, 19 October 2017 Replying to Crystallizedcarbon Revision as of 00:38, 19 October 2017 Replying to Crystallizedcarbon and BallenaBlanca Revision as of 00:06, 19 October 2017 Replying to Crystallizedcarbon and BallenaBlanca

I think that the multiple false accusations of Iñaki LL towards me, with the aim of getting my ban are very serious and deserve WP: BOOMERANG.

Best regards. --BallenaBlanca 🐳 ♂ (Talk) 05:06, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

Sorry. Is my first time here. Is any administrator going to say something? -Theklan (talk) 06:58, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

I think you've all said too much, nobody wants to wade through all that. I would suggest you all get back to editing, and if a fellow editor's editing bothers you, then calmly and politely, and most importantly succinctly discuss the issues with them on their talk page, or the talk page of the article in dispute. Remember, ¡sucintamente! Fish+Karate 10:02, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

@Fish and karate: Thank you very much for your answer.

I will follow your kindly advice. I will go back to editing in the various topics in which I have interest and in which I can collaborate positively to improve this encyclopedia, expanding them when interesting or possible, and fixing the numerous errors detected and adjusting them to the Wikipedia policies.

Of course, as I am always doing,, I will continue talking with other users calmly and politely.

Best regards. --BallenaBlanca 🐳 ♂ (Talk) 12:17, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

...Wow, so much noise, no surprise one cannot gather conclusions from the maze above. @Fish and karate: Beautiful words are good, but actions speak louder than words. I came here for a solution to irregular activity with POV overtones, for which I added a list of approx. 8 diffs, and an short explanation for each (see above). For whatever is worth, here is another diff [53], a revert dismissing a balanced edit of mine, including a vague/misleading edit summary, see here Archive 4 discussion referred in the edit summary by the editor in question; see also the reference supporting my statement [54] (headline goes, "Violences policières en Catalogne : attention aux images trompeuses / La journée de dimanche a été marquée par les violences policières en Catalogne, mais certaines images-chocs ont été manipulées. Explications.") Check out my edit, check out BallenaBlanca's revert, go to Archive 4. Please do it. Iñaki LL (talk) 21:24, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

Iñaki LL, your 1st diff in your latest share illustrates perfectly how both you and Ballena are pushing different POVs, POVs that are entrenched in Spain right now. If you want something done, ask for mediation. Admins here aren't going to support either political viewpoint. ♫ RichardWeiss talk contribs 12:49, 3 June 2018 (UTC)

Did you really read it? My report is not about POV, clear, it is about irregular editing with POV overtones, I do not call into question his POV. My last diff and related links above are revealing enough. Do I really need to go through all the details again? Please go through it. Read what my edit says and what the reference says. That is not about POV, it is about an ungrounded, irregular revert, that ultimately discourages participation in the article. (I did not even bother to undo the revert, despite knowing that I was right, to skip further litigation on both the main space and talk) Iñaki LL (talk) 22:13, 3 June 2018 (UTC)

Another one here [55] (mass-removal of verified content). I doubt that youtube can be used altogether, but note that the editor has barred the whole paragraph. Twitter, as a platform, is not barred anywhere as a reliable source. Could this paragraph be improved in tone? Most probably, yes, but that is another thing.

Also [56] this and [57] this (sequence). Insisting on misrepresentation of sources (note edit summary, "adjusted to the source"). [58] Here El País article supporting the statement. Iñaki LL (talk) 07:36, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

You may think statements like "Spanish unionist media initiated a propaganda campaign to discredit the victims, deny the Spanish anti-riot policemen charges and giving rise to the idea that all pictures were actually "fake news"" are neutral but it reads to me like pro-Catalan propaganda stated as fact. Content has to abide by POV and notability and not just be verifiable. This fails on POV grounds and is therefore a content dispute, as are all the issues between you and Ballena, and content disputes can¡t be fixed here at ANI. You need dispute resolutio and to identify problematic content currently on wikipedia, not just past edit warring. Is there a problem with Catalan independence referendum, 2017 as it now is? etc ♫ RichardWeiss talk contribs 07:39, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

With re to mass removal of content, apart from the first paragraph (clearly biased), the rest of it is accurate. Tweaking the rest of it could have saved the edit; apart from the the wording, the facts stated are well founded and supported, and would have added no doubt to mutual understanding, trust and cooperative environment. That is implied in WP:PRESERVE. Twitter has also been used here, which does not detract from the information's accuracy, relevance and notability. Removing the whole edit just alienated editors, and did not add to a healthy environment, clear, but one of confrontation. As for the second diff, it is as straightforward disruptive editing as it gets (misrepresentation of sources, deceptive edit summary). Iñaki LL (talk) 16:48, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

Iñaki LL, you aren't helping your case by removing my comments here ♫ RichardWeiss talk contribs 07:47, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

Well, of course I did not intend to remove your edit, I just fixed my edit, but in the EDIT CONFLICT it seems to have removed your comment, so I should apologize for inadvertently removing it. Iñaki LL (talk) 16:48, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

CIR concerns: Unknown contributor123

Unknown contributor123 is a newcomer with only a month's tenure here on en.wiki. However, his talk page has amassed quite an impressive array of complaints. There are strings of PRODs: [59] [60] [61] as well as commensurate CSD and even AFD. Now these are not frivolous challenges: you can clearly see that every page questioned has since been deleted and shows as redlinked. There are also the declined drafts, and some articles which had to be moved out of mainspace. Two friendly plain-English warnings were issued by concerned editors: "slow down!" UC123 responds that he isn't much concerned about the need for others to clean up after him, and proclaims his intent to continue, full-steam ahead. Now, conversely, his contribution history indicates that he has successfully created about 11 new articles which have yet to be deleted. He seems to work in Argentine topic areas, obscure for en.wiki. I am skeptical that his relatively prolific prose output is wholly original. Google search fails to reveal obvious COPYVIO, but is it machine-translated? Cross-wiki? Not really sure. That may be superfluous if we conclude that the signal:noise ratio is just too low here. Thoughts? Comments? 2600:8800:1880:91E:5604:A6FF:FE38:4B26 (talk) 23:42, 30 May 2018 (UTC)

The first one I looked at - Luis Rubio - is a direct translation of es:Luis_Rubio_(humorista) from the Spanish wikipedia. Same for Manuel Pizarro Cenjor, which is a direct translation of es:Manuel Pizarro Cenjor. He is translating these without attribution which means they are copyright (or at least licensing) violations, see WP:TFOLWP. Those all need to be deleted and I'm sure there'll be a template somewhere which explains to the user why translation without attribution is a breach of licensing. I'll sort it now. Fish+Karate 09:49, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

Seems to be issues at Commons, too, looking at c:User_talk:Unknown_contributor123. Fish+Karate 10:05, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

I've deleted all the articles the user created, due to their lack of attribution; let's see what happens now. Fish+Karate 10:10, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

Fish & Karate, a breach of licensing is a copyright infringement. See WP:CCBYSA, section 7, first sentence: if you breach any terms, your rights vanish, so anything you've copied is a copyright infringement because you've copied something without permission. Nyttend (talk) 11:29, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

So one would need to place a link to the other language article with a "translated from" note?-- Dlohcierekim (talk) 11:38, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

Look at: w:Template:Copied and w:Template:Translated page. -- Alexf^(talk) 14:29, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

There's a couple of editors on my talk page asking me per WP:RIA to restore these deleted pages and add the attribution for each. I am happy to do this, even though it takes bloody ages, but would appreciate a second opinion on whether this is the right thing to do; my thoughts were that a copyvio is a copyvio is a copyvio, as Nyttend says. When you create a translation you are supposed to note that in the edit summary with a link to the source Wikipedia page, so the chain of attribution can be maintained. I did one page - Luis Rubio as a test for how to correctly do the attribution, it can be re-deleted if necessary. Fish+Karate 14:41, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

Attribution can absolutely be added after-the-fact; see WP:RIA. Normally, I would be all for preserving good content, but this content is...not...good. UC123 has had dozens of deleted articles: if we preserve these last few, will they just undergo AFD or PROD later on anyway and cause more work? And by deleting these machine-translated pages, is anything of value lost? How much work does it take to go to es.wiki and run something through Google Translate again? 2600:8800:1880:91E:5604:A6FF:FE38:4B26 (talk) 14:55, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

FYI: User has been blocked on Commons for prolific 100% copyvio uploads. 2600:8800:1880:91E:5604:A6FF:FE38:4B26 (talk) 15:58, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

Hello. I'm the user you're talking about. I have many articles that I want to create, however, most of them got deleted. Why? All of them should be in the Wikipedia. Thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Unknown contributor123 (talk • contribs) 01:44, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

That is very nice that you think they should be here, and thanks for your desire to contribute! However, you have been missing critical steps that are necessary from the standpoint of legality. As you may have read in the many, many warnings on your talk page, every single one of your contributions violates copyright in some way. At the very least, you must give credit to the editors of the Spanish Wikipedia who created the articles you're translating. If you could do that, we could keep some of your content. Other content, however, is not so great, such as all the photos you stole from the Internet and put on Wikimedia commons. You cannot take what is not yours and use it here. A huge amount of content on the Internet is copyrighted and not appropriately licensed for our use. We could be sued if we hosted it here. So that is why all your articles were deleted: the threats of lawsuits are too great to ignore and keep it around. Thanks. Spanish translation follows.

¡Es muy bueno que pienses que deberían estar aquí, y gracias por tu deseo de contribuir! Sin embargo, ha estado perdiendo pasos críticos que son necesarios desde el punto de vista de la legalidad. Como puede haber leído en las muchas, muchas advertencias en su página de discusión, cada una de sus contribuciones viola los derechos de autor de alguna manera. Por lo menos, debe dar crédito a los editores de Wikipedia en español que crearon los artículos que está traduciendo. Si pudieras hacer eso, podríamos conservar parte de tu contenido. Otro contenido, sin embargo, no es tan bueno, como todas las fotos que robó de Internet y puso en Commons de Wikimedia. No puedes tomar lo que no es tuyo y usarlo aquí. Una gran cantidad de contenido en Internet está protegido por derechos de autor y no tiene la licencia adecuada para nuestro uso. Podríamos ser demandados si lo organizamos aquí. Es por eso que todos sus artículos fueron eliminados: las amenazas de demandas son demasiado grandes como para ignorarlas y mantenerlas. Gracias. 2600:8800:1880:91E:5604:A6FF:FE38:4B26 (talk) 04:40, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

I shall be pursuing deletion, through WP:PROD and WP:AFD if necessary, for your surviving articles. Their quality is so poor that they simply make us look bad, rather than being useful to the project. 2600:8800:1880:91E:5604:A6FF:FE38:4B26 (talk) 05:13, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

I've restored about half of them (see a list on my talk page) as potentially ok. The rest are unsalvageable one sentence stubs that would get CSD'd or gibberish. Fish+Karate 09:40, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

Hello everyone. I'm very sorry for everything that I have done. It was not my intention to upload copyrighted stuff to Wikipedia. All I ever wanted is to make the Wikipedia the most complete encyclopedia. I repeat, I'm very sorry for everything. I saw recently that I have been blocked on Commons for uploading copyrighted stuff. Is there any way you can unblock me? I promise I won't be uploading Google images again. Thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Unknown contributor123 (talk • contribs) 23:09, 2 June 2018 (UTC)

@Unknown contributor123: Google does not actually have their own images. They link to images which other people own. It's lack of awareness of stuff like that that's causing trouble. Ian.thomson (talk) 00:30, 3 June 2018 (UTC)

Ref Desk again

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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I happened by Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Language where I noticed a series of problematic "contributions" from User:Baseball Bugs. This surprised me because we just [62] had an ANi that included considerable concerns with his Ref Desk activity. He does not understand WP:NOTAFORUM and refuses to consider advice to provide better quality answers or not answer at all. [63] and [64]. After I posted the last section he proposed a IBAN between us [65] which is as offtopic and inappropriate as his useless Ref Desk participation.

Anyone unfamiliar with his participation can peruse Special:Contributions/Baseball_Bugs for gems like [66] Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Language#Singular_or_plural_verb_in_"Shingles"_article? and Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Language#What_is_the_meaning_of_"soy"?

I therefore think we should revisit the idea of banning him from Ref Desk. Legacypac (talk) 22:03, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

I don't see anything actionable in any of these diffs. The whole "soy" thing *is* an Alex Jones conspiracy theory, and the rules on plurals are different in British English than in American English. I'm willing to take his word on Milo's marital status, I would much prefer not to know or look on that one. power~enwiki (π, ν) 22:22, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

• Oppose any ban. None of the links show anything even remotely problematic. They also do not display any WP:NOTAFORUM problems. How "Some theories turn up on Google, but nothing confirmed" is deemed a "gem" is difficult to understand. The ANI thread linked to was about posts at ANI - not the ref desks. It should be noted that Bugs gave a succinct answer and was thanked for it at Wikipedia:Reference desk/Language#Bieberbach etymology/meaning in German. This thread Wikipedia:Reference desk/Miscellaneous#500 Mile Race and this one Wikipedia:Reference desk/Miscellaneous#World's oldest warning label show Bugs giving reasonable answers to questions as well as finding links to items on the web to help with those answers. This thread Wikipedia:Reference desk/Entertainment#Draft: Don Peretz contains a suggestion to help an editor. As someone who regularly scans the ref desks I can say that Bugs has taken previous criticisms on board and has moderated past behaviors. I would suggest that others looking into this read posts at the ref desks thoroughly. MarnetteD|Talk 22:29, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

• Oppose per MarnetteD - I'm not seeing anything problematic and the "gem" was them finding nothing on Google ? ..... I would suggest withdrawing this. –Davey2010^Talk 22:34, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

BTW Bugs is on a self imposed ban from ANI which means he won't (in good faith) be able to respond to this thread. MarnetteD|Talk 22:35, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

Without expressing an opinion regarding these diffs, a point of clarification: Bugs is topic banned from ANI, but that topic ban enacted there has explicit exceptions for threads he starts or threads about him (i.e. commenting in this thread would not [and should not] be a problem). — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 22:51, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

• Oppose - There's nothing in he least actionable here, and I respectfully suggest to Legacypac that they drop the stick regarding Bugs. This request was completely unnecessary, and I agree with Davey2010 that it should be withdrawn and archived. Beyond My Ken (talk) 22:52, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

Bugs is on a community imposed ban from ANi, only self imposed when it was obviously going to pass. The last ANi had considerable support for a RefDesk ban from high profile editors and Admins but he continues to spend a considerable amount of time there giving substandard answers. I just picked a few quick examples of thousands available. I'd like to see others weigh in who were involved in the last discussion. If his ref desk participation has really improved (I don't think so) then great, but since if looks the same it this is worth some more eyes. Legacypac (talk) 23:01, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

You must know that's not the way it works. If there are "thousands" of examples of Bugs' disruptive activities on the RefDesk subsequent to the recent ANI, it should be easy for you to provide more than a handful of them, and hopefully ones which other editors find to be problematic. Claiming misbehavior without providing the necessary supporting evidence is WP:Casting aspersions, so the onus is entirely on you to provide that evidence, not on other editors to do your work for you. As Nick Thorne suggests below, failure to do so may well result in a BOOMERANG. Either provide the evidence, or withdraw the complaint, please. Beyond My Ken (talk) 23:50, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

• Oppose I'm sorry, but there simply is not any problem with the edits you are complaining about. Legacypac, this looks a bit like harassment. Please leave off this ridiculous not-picking about non-issues lest you find yourself on the receiving end of a boomerang. - Nick Thorne ^talk 23:45, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

You better read the harsh comments about Baseball Bugs in the last ANi and think again before you accuse me or harashment Nick. Legacypac (talk) 06:39, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

• Comment. I'm not seeing sufficient WP:DIFFs presented to support this at present. It looks like BB got a warning from Cullen328; perhaps he should weigh in. Softlavender (talk) 00:39, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

• Comment, part 2: In my mind the question is whether BB provides useful information at the Reference Desk. If it is adjudged that he does; then there is rationale to allow him to post there, and the question becomes whether his irrelevant comments at the Reference Desk outnumber and/or outweigh and/or neutralize whatever assistance he actually provides there. The onus is, however, on the filer (or others) to make this case rather than on ANI !voters to go on a goose-chase. Softlavender (talk) 00:46, 1 June 2018 (UTC)
• Oppose Yes, I have interacted with Bugs twice recently about what I saw as flippant or speculative answers at the Ref Desks, and we had a slightly unpleasant conversation on my talk page on May 20. I encourage other editors to let him know when he makes an inappropriate comment at the desks. But at this time, I do not see an ongoing pattern of behavior that requires a topic ban. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 01:19, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

User:Swarm and a number of others found BB's participation problematic but an even broader topic ban from all Wikipedia space did not pass. In my estimation, nothing has changed with how he treats the Ref Desk since that discussion so a revisit is worthwhile. If people see no issue, I'm not here to push hard. I just wanted to raise it since he blew off my comments on his talkpage Legacypac (talk) 06:39, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

• Comment Be careful about past ANI consensus. There has been ANI consensus to indef LegacyPac on at least one occasion. 207.38.146.86 (talk) 11:43, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

• This comment is just as improper as Legacypac's report, or even more so, as evidence is only asserted, not reported; Legacypac at least offered some evidence, only no one appears to agree that it is problematic. ANI cannot be a place where one floats trial balloons, vague accusations with little or no evidence, then waits to see who comes along to prop up the charges. We should perhaps start to consider such behavior as being sanctionable. Beyond My Ken (talk) 15:06, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

• Weakest possible oppose: In the past, I've been about as vocal as any RefDesk contributor about the daily violations of WP:NOTAFORUM of a couple of incessantly happy-go-lucky editors, and it is for this reason that I gave full support to the proposal to topic ban bugs from the desks (indeed, I think the closer of that discussion was in error when they failed to note that that consensus wanted Bugs banned from the desks in addition to ANI). But since then, I've noticed (at least in my own stops by the desks which are not terribly frequent at present) that Bugs is making an effort to conform themselves to the new expectations (I presume that the WP:VPP discussion on RefDesk reform a few months back, StuRat's banning, and Bugs' own close call with a ban last month have finally combined to convince them that patience is at an end for treating the RefDesks like Reddit or social media). I can't say that I do not still have concerns, and my !vote could switch back in a hurry, but the discussions cited above are not sufficient to convince me to abandon giving WP:ROPE just when Bugs is attempting to correct their approach. Snow ^{let's rap} 10:10, 3 June 2018 (UTC)

Interaction ban between Legacypac and Baseball Bugs proposed

So, in the previous discussion[67] Legacypac proposed a TBan for Baseball Bugs from "Wikipedia Space" (specifcially intended to keep him of the Ref Desks), which was closed as "no consensus" on 6 May 2018.

Legacypac then posts an extremely vague post on BBs user talk page[68] posting to a ref desk page where BBs ""contributions" from May 27-May 31 range from downright stupid to completely confusing. Please stop posting stupid misleading unresearched "answers" based on whatever nonsense pops into your head." BB correctly asked for diffs[69]. Legacypac refused to provide any twice[70], with rather circular reasoning: "that sou can't see the problem is exactly why you don't belong there". BB then proposed a voluntary interaction ban between them[71], which Legacypac above describes as "as offtopic and inappropriate as his useless Ref Desk participation."

And then Legacypac opens a section here, with diffs (not clear why they are needed for us but not for BB when he asked for them), and it gets universally rejected. And the conclusion Legacypac gets from this is to ping someone who supported him previously (which violates WP:CANVASS) and to reiterate that "nothing has changed with how he treats the Ref Desk since that discussion so a revisit is worthwhile" but that "he blew off my comments on his talkpage". Um, no, he didn't, he just wanted some indication of what Legacypac was actually complaining about, not some handwaving, and considering the responses here it was only logical that BB didn't know what you meant.

As BB wants an IBan with Legacypac, but Legacypac sees nothing wrong with his own approach here (at BBs talk page and in this ANI section) even though no one agrees that there is a problem with those diffs he provided (not "the problems you note are worrying but severe enough", but one comment after another noting "there simply is not any problem with the edits you are complaining about" or a variation thereof), I propose

Baseball Bugs and Legacypac are formally banned from interacting directly with each other, and from discussing each others edits (apart from reporting violations of the interaction ban). They are otherwise allowed to participate in the same threads, talk pages, articles... Fram (talk) 08:20, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

• I would support that. I stay away from the Reference Desks because nobody on there trying to be funny is actually funny, which makes it really depressing. Looking at it winds me up, unfailingly. IF it were up to me, the reference desks would all be deleted, but it's not up to me, and so I just avoid them. It seems Legacypac has the same issue, but not the same solution; if he can't stay away from looking at the reference desks, getting irritated by BB's nonsense and trying to get him banned for it, then a formal interaction ban will at least mitigate the overreaction we see here. Fish+Karate 09:55, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

User:Fram you need a lot more evidence then restating that there is less consensus with the current participants to do something about this users activity at Ref desk today then a few weeks ago with a different set of participants, even though nothing has changed with the behavior. We improved the Ref Desk by topic banning StuRat, so there is precedent. I have extremely limited unteraction with Baseball Bugs and a Tban would serve no purpose. As for diffs I referenced all his controbutions visable on the page between two dates and said exactly what is wrong with them. None of the contributions provided real answers. Imagine if all users that see a question just posted "I can't find anything on Google"? Anyway, let the ref desk carry on as a place where pointless banter rules the day and no Refs are required. Who cares. Legacypac (talk) 15:37, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

• I'm unarchiving and unclosing this. This was closed by Legacypac out of process, and archived by Jbhunley. Also, I support an interaction ban. Given this attempt to make the interaction ban disappear, I also support a topic ban on posting to ANI for Legacypac. NinjaRobotPirate (talk) 22:59, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

User:NinjaRobotPirate what a dumb thing to do. There were suggestions I withdraw the complaint - which I did! You reverse that withdrawal to try to get me topic banned from making a complaint I withdrew? What possible value is there in that? I'm done here and my respect for you just dropped a couple points. Legacypac (talk) 02:11, 2 June 2018 (UTC)

• I planned to comment here later during the day however to my surprise it wasn't here! (because it was rather quickly archived by Jbhunley),
  

Anyway Support IBAN - I respect both editors but due to the constant postings here I see no other viable option than an IBAN, I personally feel it would be better if LP were to be banned from creating ANI threads on BB (I can't say either party because BB doesn't create threads....). –Davey2010^Talk 23:10, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

You may not realize this is the only thread I've ever created about Baseball Bugs and I withdrew the complaint when a few other disagreed there is an issue. The last ANi on Baseball Bugs did result in a limited topic ban, but no consensus for the wider topic ban I proposed as an uninvolved editor. I'm still an uninvolved editor with no dispute involving Baseball Bugs or other interaction except in that last ANi thread I did not start. As an ANi regular you are in the same position as I am with many editors discussed here. Legacypac (talk) 02:21, 2 June 2018 (UTC)

• (edit conflict) @NinjaRobotPirate: There was no intent to 'disappear' it on my part. There was a closing statement of "No interest on this board in pursuing this issue at this time" by a well known and experienced editor who does NACs. I did fail to notice how short of a time it had been closed and would not have archived it if I had. No excuse for that much as there is no excuse for you accusing me of deliberately trying to "disappear" a thread. I will make sure to double check close time and statement to make sure it says what I think it says. Jbh ^Talk 23:23, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

• Thank you NinjaRobotPirate. The close seemed like an attempt by Legacypac to avoid the consequences of their opening the thread in the first place. I support the I-ban. There should also be some sort of stipulation for Legacypac regarding the opening of an AN/I thread without hard evidence of a problem. One suggestion is that future actions of the sort should come with a block of a brief duration. Hopefully, this would be a preventative measure against such an occurrence. MarnetteD|Talk 23:18, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

BTW the claim that "I can't find anything on google" is problematic is just ridiculous. It means that Bugs - or any other editor that uses the phrase - tried to find an answer to the question and was unsuccessful. There is no problem with posting that to any ref desk thread. MarnetteD|Talk 23:18, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

• Comment: It seems to me that there are two issues here: (1) Responses to Ref Desk questions which are not genuine, knowledgeable answers (by anyone) to those questions. (2) The fact that Legacypac's intrusion into the matter is not helpful either and is achieving the reverse effect: increased disruption. On the issue of item 2, I would suggest Legacypac voluntarily drop the stick here in regards to BB. On the issue of item 1, I would suggest that it be determined whether idle banter should be allowed at the Ref Desks or not. (It seems to be that it should be a scholarly Q&A devoted to helping the querants and nothing more, but I have never posted there.) Softlavender (talk) 23:20, 1 June 2018 (UTC)
• How about if everyone just goes home? Softlavender's idle-banter question should be raised some other time, without reference to any particular editor. EEng 00:26, 2 June 2018 (UTC)

• Oppose any serious ruling here The issues are borderline inane - the Ref desks have a long history of being less-than-serious on a regular basis, and trying to make them into some sort of "special discussion area for serious stuff only" is a substantial change to the way those desks have been used for the entire history of Wikipedia pretty much. Even Quora permits levity, and it is set up in a far more serious vein than the refdesks here were. I would note that the refdesks, in fact, get very few actual serious queries, and most of the queries are not of a scholarly nature at all. Collect (talk) 00:31, 2 June 2018 (UTC)

That's dubious reasoning, in my opinion. The fact that a small handful of problematic editors have habitually abused the patience of the community with such behaviours is not remotely a principled argument for not presently trying to do something to bring conduct in that space into line with well-established community consensus on appropriate behaviour as regards WP:WWIN, WP:TPG, and WP:DISRUPTION in general. And nobody is campaigning to eliminate levity from the RefDesks--that's very much a strawman argument. We all enjoy a chuckle or two now and again on this project, and the RefDesks certainly provide fruitful context, if any forum on the project does. What we are talking about are more substantial issues with editors who have a serious case of WP:IDHT with regard to what the community is telling them about WP:NOTAFORUM. Per my reasoning in my !vote on the OP's proposal, I don't think a ban for Bugs is advisable in this instance. But saying that we should not be trying to instill the basic level of procedural normalcy and decorum that is expected of every other project workspace flies quite in the face of the local consensus at the Desks and broader community concerns raised in central discussion spaces (here, WP:VPP) over the last year especially. Snow ^{let's rap} 10:25, 3 June 2018 (UTC)

• Oppose The proposed sanction may not be justified but that doesn't mean there's anything that justifies a BOOMERANG IBAN. Given the context of BB being an editor who was just banned from ANI, with multiple people asking for ref desk to be included in that, it's not that unreasonable a topic of discussion. Swarm ♠ 20:05, 3 June 2018 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Alabama gubernatorial election, 2018 behavior by IPs

There has been edit warring behavior by a couple of IPs over the last couple days, who I believe may be sockpuppets. I first noticed the disruptive behavior earlier with these two edits, both of which accuse an editor of pushing a political viewpoint, which does not appear to be the case (one edit was simple formatting, the other a change made with a source and explanation). Regardless of whether this IPs edits were correct or not, I placed a warning on their talk page for failure to assume good faith, which was apparent from the edit summaries. After I reverted those edits, a second IP started reverting. The second IP has made similar edits in the last couple days as well, as seen here on a different page. I am not sure that the two are connected, but the similar edit summaries makes me believe that they are. Not only did this edit remove sourced content but also, like the other IP, the edit summary was accusing the same editor of violating the NPOV policy, calling them a "Bell supporter" with no evidence to back that up. I do not want to get involved in an edit war or violate WP:3RR, but I am very concerned by the two IPs making accusations towards the editors whose edits they do not like.

The IPs are:

• 144.163.23.232
• 144.163.49.20

I am not sure what to do. As I said, I do not want to violate the three revert rule, and I cannot revert them again without doing so. I was not sure if I wanted to file an SPI because it is two IPs, and that is harder to monitor, but an edit war report would seem to be more difficult to prove since it is not one IP. I am concerned about the accusations that the two IP editors are making and do not know how to resolve the situation, especially given that the IP edit summaries have shown that this editor(s) have no interest in actually resolving a content dispute. If I am not doing this right, should have gone somewhere else, or did something else wrong, please let me know.

Tillerh11 (talk) 20:36, 3 June 2018 (UTC)

The IPs (which are most likely the same individual) should be blocked. GoodDay (talk) 20:39, 3 June 2018 (UTC)

If they are sockpuppets, I'd also suggest the page be protected to prevent the user(s) from hopping onto another IP to continue. P.S. - Tillerh11, don't be afraid to file a SPI. The behavior and similar IPs of the users are heavily indicative of sock or meatpuppetry.Nanophosis (talk) 20:47, 3 June 2018 (UTC)

@Nanophosis: My concern with filing a SPI was that I don't know how much good that will do, since as you said they can switch IPs again to evade a potential block. I have requested page protection. Tillerh11 (talk) 21:01, 3 June 2018 (UTC)

Tillerh11 I protected it for 1 week, since the primary is happening day after tomorrow. — Maile (talk) 21:19, 3 June 2018 (UTC)

WP:NOTHERE editor and his socks

JJ 25 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

Single purpose account, has caused massive disruption so far. Edit warring on dozens (and I literally mean dozens) of articles, in order to drag this non-European country into Europe.[72]-[73]-[74]-[75]-[76]-[77] Has abused tons of sock IP's as well, other than regular sock accounts.

Here's another one of his sock accounts; JJ 2626 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

And here are some of his sock IP's.

• 204.40.130.130 (talk · contribs · WHOIS)
• 204.40.194.137 (talk · contribs · WHOIS)
• 204.40.194.130 (talk · contribs · WHOIS)
• 204.40.130.135 (talk · contribs · WHOIS)
• 204.40.194.131 (talk · contribs · WHOIS)
• 204.40.194.136 (talk · contribs · WHOIS)
• 204.40.130.134 (talk · contribs · WHOIS)
• 204.40.130.133 (talk · contribs · WHOIS)
• 204.40.194.135 (talk · contribs · WHOIS)

Given how determined he is (has waited numerous times for page protections to wear off,[78] ignored numerous warnings on his talk pages[79]-[80]), I suggest performing a range block as well. - LouisAragon (talk) 21:14, 3 June 2018 (UTC)

User:Bbb23 has indeffed the three named accounts above per checkuser. For the IPs listed above, if a range block is needed I'd suggest Special:Contributions/204.40.128.0/17 for a month. All the edits from the range for the last couple of months look like they are the same person so there is not much risk of collateral. EdJohnston (talk) 02:55, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

Comment The reported editor does not fully understand all policies of editing Wikipedia and is definitively not discussing as they should (I reverted some of their edits myself), but I do not see any consensus that establishes that Armenia and Georgia should be categorically excluded from articles that list "European things" such as Politics of Europe, Central banks and currencies of Europe etc. Part of their territory is in Europe (similar like Russia), there is a consensus to list them in Europe#List of states and territories and they are members of Council of Europe. The POV formulation "drag this non-European country into Europe" makes this seem like a content dispute rather than vandalism, since the countries can be considered both European and Asian, and whether they are listed in a "European" lists is open for discussion. For instance, Armenia crisis: Protesters bring cities to standstill after vote 2 May 2018 is listed in category "Europe" by the BBC, so clearly the inclusion of Armenia in Politics of Europe is verifiable such as other edits of the user that were reverted because of their inability to back their contributions properly, so I don't really see basis for blocking this editor.--Concus Cretus (talk) 09:35, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

We are discussing his editorial pattern, which has been rampant so far. Lots of socking, lots of edit-warring, lots of single-purpose editing with a tunnel vision.[81] Zero intention to discuss his edits, zero intention to edit constructively. That's WP:NOTHERE in every sense of the definition, regardless of how "correct" or "incorrect" the content of some of his edits may or may not have been. Furthermore (though off-topic), in reference to your statement that "part of their territory is in Europe", you're mistaking recent political developments with the actual geographical context (because you're citing Wikipedia as a source, which is not allowed), as Armenia is geographically completely in Asia.

"Geographic Characteristics of the Republic of Armenia" (PDF). Marzes of the Republic of Armenia in Figures, 2002–2006. National Statistical Service of The Republic of Armenia. 2007. p. 6. Retrieved 15 January 2016. "Republic of Armenia is situated in south-western part of Asia. The country occupies the north-eastern part of Armenian plateau – between Caucasus and Nearest Asia".

With all due respect, but I do have to say its pretty endearing to see people defend "editors" who are clearly not here to build this encyclopedia. - LouisAragon (talk) 10:06, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

Your arguments around Armenia's "non-Europeanity" are WP:Original research and WP:Cherrypicking sources that suit your POV. It is a transcontinental country. Just the fact that you always reply something in discussion does not give credibility to the content to your edits. For instance, Georgia had formal recognition that it may apply for EU membership by the European Parliament; citing "Georgia, Moldova and Ukraine – like any other European state – have a European perspective" in reference to the Article 49 of the Treaty of Maastricht (as amended), that says that any "European state" can apply. Your unsubstantiated removals of these countries from for for example Politics of Europe is as much "vandalism" as the accused users's behavior. Just because they don't know how to properly respond to your POV-pushing WP:Wikilawyering does not mean they are wrong or need to be blocked.--Concus Cretus (talk) 11:27, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

FYI, I never disputed that Armenia "is" transcontintental. That's you making a strawman right there. Though its geographically fully in Asia, the Republic of Armenia is also part of the South Caucasus/Transcaucasus region. Due to that, and due to the recent political developments (i.e. Council of Europe, etc.), we "always" include Armenia in both Asia and Europe, at least category wise. Same goes for Georgia and Azerbaijan, but they are transcontinental by soil as well, unlike Armenia, as part of their territory lays in Europe. But this all has jack to do with the blocked sockmaster having a WP:NOTHERE editorial pattern, and which you, unacceptably, try to justify.

You are ignoring WP policies, and its becoming borderline disruptive in my opinion (WP:POINT). I don't have any intention to have a high tea with you @ ANI over the "Europeanness / non-Europeanness" of the Republic of Armenia. Consider this my final comment to you. Oh and btw, just a friendly advice; I highly suggest you go read a bit more about WP policies. All the best, - LouisAragon (talk) 12:47, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

• The sockmaster has just started another socking spree with his IP's.[82]. - LouisAragon (talk) 12:49, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

References

• Whether his Armenia-related edits are good or bad, this person should not be evading a block of his User:JJ 25 account using IPs, so I have gone ahead with a two-week block of Special:Contributions/204.40.128.0/17. EdJohnston (talk) 14:23, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

User with a severe competence in English problem and repeated false sock allegations.

ZH8000 (talk · contribs · count · logs · page moves · block log) has a major problem editing in English. There was a problem at Vignette (road tax) where ZH8000 misunderstood a contribution as claiming that the annual cost of the Swiss vignette was the most expensive in Europe and not the cost of transiting the country in spite of clearly stating the latter. His response on the talk page betrayed this. Making no further discussion and that his edit summaries continued to reference the original edit with eight reverts, this interpretation either did not change, or he never read the talk page or what he was reverting ([83], [84], [85], [86], [87], [88], [89])

There was consensus on the talk page which he appears to have accepted after a warning. This aspect can be regarded as settled.

However, an underlying problem has been revealed in that ZH8000 clearly does not have the necessary competence in English to edit the English Wikipedia. He has self identified as a native German speaking Swiss. I have not been here that long and I don't know how this would normally be handled so please bear with me and forgive me if this is the wrong place.

The article on Gun laws in Switzerland has become a mixture of good English, pidgin English and the plain unintelligible. Consider this nugget:

[Of ammunition that cannot be sold]

Ammunition with one or more floors to the release of substances which damage the health of people in the long run

I doubt many English speakers have the knowledge on such a specialist subject to unravel that or the other unintelligible English.

There are several others, but I'm trying to be brief. Just recently, this was added to AC power plugs and sockets

[Of disadvantages with multi-standard sockets]

Using appliances which require earthing, but socket does either not provide it, or the socket's earthing connects not with the one by the plug.

He subsequently provided a rewrite but it wasn't any more intelligible. His reaction is that anyone is free to improve the contribution but it is rather difficult if you can't figure out what it was trying to say in the first place. He has reverted a request for clarification here

It is worth adding that ZH8000 has a history (and three blocks) for battleground edit warring with others, mostly over his lack of understanding of how to present ideas in English.

Having made a false edit warring and socking allegation at WP:ANEW (Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/3RRArchive368#User:86.153.135.111 reported by User:ZH8000 (Result: Semi) (More than one user pointed out that there are three groups of dynamic IP addresses - the IP addresses are separated by at least three continents and he was at 5RR when he made it - no one else had exceeded 2RR), he has continued to repeat the allegation here. He clearly still does not understand the concept of dynamic IP addresses. This shows that ZH8000 is quick to quote policies to everyone else, but refuses to abide by them himself ([90], [91], [92], [93] - all within 3 1/2 hours. (I assume removal of gibberish and restoring removed maintenance tags is reverting vandalism).

I know the last bit should probably be at WP:ANEW but I wouldn't want to be accused of WP:FORUMSHOPPING. 81.156.46.74 (talk) 15:47, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

Comment Uhm. ZH8000 isn't a vandalizing editor. (Wikipedia:Vandalism). How do you know that his previous blocks are "mostly over his lack of understanding of how to present ideas in English"? --Miaow 16:18, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

By following his edit history. Also a look at the posts that ZH8000 has deleted from his talk page is highly revealing (he always deletes negative posts). 81.156.46.74 (talk) 16:23, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

If the only problem is that the user writes in somewhat confusing sentences (I wouldn't call these examples illegible, I'm not an expert in these subjects and I can mostly parse their meaning) but they otherwise contribute productively, the civil thing to do would be to just copyedit their contribs. I know we're not about to appoint someone to follow them around and clean up after them, but perhaps we can advise them to suggest changes on talk pages instead? Of course edit warring is intolerable, but if you're editing in good faith and presume that there's nothing wrong with your contributions, having several editors gang up on you is unpleasant. And then again if it's just a matter of them not wanting to collaborate then they'll be on their way out, but I don't think that's the case here. Not yet, anyway. Ivanvector (^Talk/_Edits) 16:30, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

I am in agreement with Ivanvector. --Miaow 16:39, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

Comment Well, it's one thing to write badly and quite another to write badly and refuse to acknowledge it. My stance is: Wikipedia is WP:NOTADEMOCRACY, there is no automatic right to participating in this online project, and if someone's editing efforts force others to do devote disproportional amount of time to correcting them while the editor refuses to acknowledge his weaknesses, then I see no point of continued participation of such an editor in the project. GF is not all. — kashmīrī ^TALK 18:35, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

Additionally, Google Translate should not be writing articles on en-Wiki. — kashmīrī ^TALK 18:37, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

It’s interesting that you say that, because I spoke a friend of mine who is a translator for the EU. He is not a great fan of machine translations. Given that ZH8000 generally has a passable proficiency in English, he states that the English being posted is fairly consistent with that generated by machine translations such as Google translate. TheVicarsCat (talk) 22:19, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

• Plus when he ran into resistance he reacted by generating this ungrounded socket allegation. EEng 18:48, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

• ... and failed to identify master socket :P — kashmīrī ^TALK 19:09, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

His edits are polarizing. He may have potential if he stays in contact with current events. EEng 19:10, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

...I propose to topic ban EENG from any more puns today, broadly construed. --Tarage (talk) 19:49, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

He may resist such a measure, regardless of capacitance. Jip Orlando (talk) 20:03, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

Watt? Ohmy! EEng 21:29, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

Let's stop this pun thread before it Hertz. Natureium (talk) 22:16, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

That's relative, but we do need a quantum of gravity in this thread. Kleuske (talk) 22:41, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

Putting the joking aside. There is a more serious issue here. I have little to add to the language issue apart from to observe that it wholly unreasonable for an editor to expect others to clear up after them.

However: the last part of the complaint should be taken seriously. A criticism from an admin (EdJohnston) was made about ZH8000 posting 3RR notices on user’s talk pages when he himself is deliberately flouting the rules. ZH8000 should receive a short block for the 4RR violation in under 4 hours (let alone 24 hours) as a timely reminder that the rules apply to him as well. In addition the IP should also receive the same block as he also made 4 reverts in much the same time period WP:BOOMERANG. TheVicarsCat (talk) 17:21, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

My mistake. It seems ‘my boomerang won,t come back’. I just saw 4 edits from the IP and wrongly assumed they were reverts. On looking more thoroughly, only three were reverts. One just added a clarify tag to the poor English, though the reason could have be better phrased (though it does appear to be apposite). TheVicarsCat (talk) 17:28, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

Blocks are used to prevent damage or disruption to Wikipedia, not to punish users. After the IP was reversed, I don't see any problems there. --Miaow 18:38, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

Uncooperative IP vandal

Been having issues with an IP sock puppet (yes, the same user with other IP addresses here, here, here, and here, as evidenced in the article's revision history). Rather than discussing revisions on the talk page, he or she instead chooses to vandalize, edit war, and disruptively remove sourced content without explanation other than falsely claiming to "legally represent" the topic of the article, thus hogging it. Would appreciate the help.  MegastarLV  (talk) 05:04, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

Someone familiar with WP:BLP policy should probably take a look at the article in question. For a start it cites four sources for the subject's date of birth - none of which are WP:RS. It also fails to demonstrate notability through third-party sources. 86.147.197.65 (talk) 06:02, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

Investigating... Damn... they're all from different ranges, and I'm willing to bet that they're very wide. ~Oshwah~^{(talk) (contribs)} 06:27, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

Yeah those IPs are all from different ranges, and they've been causing disruption onto the article over time by pushing ownership behaviors and making the page a battleground instead of an article. I've semi-protected it for one year - this will hopefully stop this behavior completely and push collaboration and discussion as their top priority. Cheers ;-) ~Oshwah~^{(talk) (contribs)} 06:55, 5 June 2018 (UTC)\

I wonder if you could explain how you know that the claim is false?--Auric talk 14:59, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

I've removed the disputed date of birth. As noted by IP 86.147.197.65, none of the sources provided meet WP:RS criteria for personal information in BLPs, nor do they meet the policy requirements of WP:DOB (e.g. "Wikipedia includes full names and dates of birth that have been widely published by reliable sources").--Jezebel's Ponyo^{bons mots} 16:36, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

User:Toni021 and UEFA European Championship

User:Toni021 appears to have no interest in actually collaborating on building an encyclopaedia, simply making unilateral changes to UEFA European Championship and making no effort to discuss their changes outside the medium of edit summaries. I've written directly to them to request that they start using Talk pages, but judging by their edit history, they have never used a Talk or User Talk page since they started editing here in November 2017. I'm willing to put this down to ignorance of those pages' existence, but six months is a long time to go without knowledge of article discussion pages. They are now becoming quite disruptive with their sole focus on the UEFA European Championship article and the status of Russia as the "official" successor to the record of the former Soviet Union. – PeeJay 06:40, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

PeeJay2K3 - This dispute on UEFA European Championship involves multiple editors and many of which are not following dispute resolution protocol and collaborating either. I've fully protected the article so that you all can take a step back and walk into that talk page together... ;-) ~Oshwah~^{(talk) (contribs)} 06:58, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

I've left a final warning for Toni021 as well, though - he's been edit-warring for a long time now to push various pointless or simply incorrect information into the article, and as PeeJay says has never used a talk page. Black Kite (talk) 08:45, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

Extreme hostility by User:Jasonbourne033

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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I am not involved in this exchange, but I became aware of the extreme hostility by user:Jasonbourne033 directed to user:Jim1138 for reverting his repeated vandalism at Mexican Drug War. In addition of his vandalism in that article, here is the hostile message Jasonbourne033 left on the Talk page of Jim1138: Diff: [94] I'll just leave this in your desk. Thank you, Rowan Forest (talk) 14:43, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

Jasonbourne033, I invite you to read WP:NPA and WP:CIVIL. Saying "fuck off, asshole" no matter who is "right" or "wrong" is ALWAYS unacceptable here. I was initially tempted to say you're WP:NOTHERE, but you seem to know how to edit constructively, you're just passionate and emotional about a certain topic. I'd suggest you redact your inflammatory personal attacks, apologize, and back away from editing about politics or anything else where you will be emotionally charged, or else I can foresee an indef block coming your way. Regards, Nanophosis (talk) 16:12, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

This particular edit gives me scant cause for hope. User as gone off-line.-- Dlohcierekim (talk) 16:18, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

"On a personal level, I would invite you to consider the fact that the media and the modern "US government" aren't reliable" indicates to me that the user already has their mind made up, and would be fundamentally unsuited for editing here, as I doubt no amount of linking to WP:OR is going to change their mind. That's just my opinion, though, and I wanted to give them the benefit of the doubt and AGF before I expressed it. Nanophosis (talk) 16:24, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

On an impersonal level, the dif ref'd above has a nice "NOTHERE" feel, You have thousands of edits in a bullshit internet site which everyone in the real world knows is leftist and (/therefore) unreliable. On a personal note, being a leftist, I've no problem with this. And all the deleting and blocking provides an outlet for my OCD.-- Dlohcierekim (talk) 16:36, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

Indeffed --NeilN ^{talk to me} 16:47, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Legal threat with BLP issues

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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50.250.34.61 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

This IP has been making tons of unsourced additions to BLPs, mainly around stating they are Irish-English. Their talkpage speaks for itself. Now they're making legal threats. Every single one of their edits has been reverted, a clear case of WP:NOTHERE. They've also used 68.118.252.226 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) to edit too. Appreciate if someone could block both of these accounts. Thanks. Lugnuts ^{Fire Walk with Me} 18:36, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

I hard blocked the 50.x as it is a static IP for 6 months. Feel free to adjust if needed. The other IP is dynamic. Hopefully this set a cookie block?-- Dlohcierekim (talk) 18:46, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

Thank you. Lugnuts ^{Fire Walk with Me} 19:20, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Reddit vandalism continues to plague article

For two years now the same vandalism has occurred on List of kaiju creatures as a result of a one-off mention on a YouTube show put on by Game Grumps. One of the many many Reddit articles on this can be found here and here as proof of this. The article in question has been protected due to this vandalism multiple times over the years and recently came off PC protection. User:KaijuFan4000 has continued with the nonsense and has repeatedly put the vandalism back into the article. The only reason this isn't at AIV is because of the explanation that was required. In any case, I'm asking for administrative assistance in this matter. This is not a content dispute. This is a vandalism problem that has been ongoing for years and continues to present itself repeatedly. --Majora (talk) 21:34, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

• Since the article is completely unsourced (literally - it has zero sources, and has never had any for the ten years it's existed), it's impossible to tell what is correct and what isn't anyway. I'd suggest the article is redirected back to kaiju, since it's not providing any useful service - and of course, this would immediately solve the vandalism problem. Black Kite (talk) 21:42, 5 June 2018 (UTC)
• I've blocked for 24 hours for adding unsourced content after warnings, but yeah, the problem is bigger than just this. Swarm ♠ 21:46, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

  TonyBallioni redirected it, and I fully agree with their decision. This has been ongoing for such a long time that hopefully this will stop it. Thank you --Majora (talk) 22:03, 5 June 2018 (UTC)