Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents

Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents
This page is for urgent incidents or chronic, intractable behavioral problems. Before posting: Read these tips for dealing with incivility If the issue concerns a specific user, try discussing it with them on their talk page Try dispute resolution Just want an admin? Contact a recently active admin directly. Be brief and include diffs demonstrating the problem Do not report breaches of personal information on this highly visible page – instead go to Requests for oversight. When starting a discussion about an editor, you must leave a notice on their talk page; pinging is not enough. You may use {{subst:ANI-notice}} ~~~~ to do so. Closed discussions are usually not archived for at least 24 hours. Routine matters might be archived more quickly; complex or controversial matters should remain longer. Sections inactive for 72 hours are archived automatically by Lowercase sigmabot III. Editors unable to edit here are sent to the /Non-autoconfirmed posts subpage. (archives, search)
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User:Street Scholar

I recently had a run-in with this user over the speedy deletion of some pages he'd worked on. I offered to restore two of them (without going through DRV), but his sexism and personal attacks quickly made the conversation turn. (See the conversation I removed here, as well as my comments (admittedly not the calmest I could have written) here.) Another user alerted me to the fact that he'd been warned for personal attacks in the past (which I had gleaned from his talk page), but I did not realize he had a similar incident report just a few weeks ago (see here). While this was amicably resolved, it seems that he did not learn from the incident. While a person's beliefs are his or her own business, attacking a person based on gender is a clear violation of WP:NPA, and requesting all womankind to respond to his attacks is using WP as a soapbox. I'm not sure if this should go to RfC, since the first attempt to resolve this was "successful". Any help would be greatly appreciated. -- Merope 18:29, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

I have encountered similar irreverence to wikipedia norms from this user before.I'm not sure how to link to this, but he made several uploads of images that were blatant copyvios (he put one in Mountain warfare here) which were speedily deleted. However, he had uploaded several such images from the same website that had a clear "All rights reserved" statement on it and, if an admin could assist me, then I can cite the records of the speedy deletions.This shows an irreverence for copyright rules on wikipedia. In addition, a mediated debate progresses on Cheema (see Talk:Cheema) where he continuously misrepresents sources and tries to push a POV without adequate WP:V. Most of the sources cited in the article are fabricated or misrepresented and, when confronted about this by a mediator here ignored the mediator completely and still continues with such tendentious editing (see mediator's assessment here). He has also made numerous veiled ethnic slurs on Talk:Cheema and further misrepresented the facts to try to bait users into argument here is an example. He remains unapologetic for these acts and continues on Talk:Cheema.Hkelkar 19:09, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

"I'm not sure if this should go to RfC, since the first attempt to resolve this was "successful"."

To be honest, I considered it closed at that time for that reason (assuming of course you were referring to the incident on my talk page and elsewhere). However, this doesn't appear to be the case! If the previous incident had been resolved successfully, then surely the same problem wouldn't have arisen again. While this user does have many good and invaluable edits among his contributions, it's also evident that he has displayed/aired these very offensive views on wikipedia throughout the history of his membership and is unlikely to change them. I would say that a firm message needs to be sent - the question of course is what that message would entail, which is a question I cannot answer. The eeasy way has been tried already. --Crimsone 22:22, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

he persists with his remarks even after he got admonished [1] [2]. He does not seem to have reformed at all.Hkelkar 17:17, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

In light of those attacks (and this edit), I've blocked him for 48h. I'll monitor his edits once the block expires. -- Merope 17:26, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

This user is thoroughly unpleasant and seems to want to push his distasteful view of women on anyone nearby. It doesn't help that he's insulting and demeaning to those who disagree with him. My own peace of mind (and civility of comments) has slid downward such that I doubt I can interact with him civilly, and that's even without having the gender his bile targets. Wikipedia doesn't need behaviour like this, and he's expressed that it is his God-given duty (literally, as he's excused his words on religious grounds) to not keep it to himself. — Saxifrage ✎ 17:28, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

He continues his behaviour on his Talk page even while blocked for it.[3] — Saxifrage ✎ 15:46, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, I noticed that, too. He's earned himself a week's block. After this, however, I'd like another admin to review his actions. I dislike being the only admin involved in this kind of dispute, particularly when I was one of those attacked. -- Merope 15:52, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

As another admin I endorse the current blocks. If you want I'll make any further blocks as an uninvolved admin. JoshuaZ 16:02, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

And yet more.[4] (Note the linked diff is over three contiguous diffs, to capture his whole edit including corrections.) The message doesn't appear to be getting through his convictions. — Saxifrage ✎ 15:29, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

After the latest one, which Merope has had to reply to, I have to say this is amazing. If RfCs were votes and worked like requests for adminship I'm sure he's be blocked in no time (referring to the RfA "gauntlet" that is, per the village pump). I rather suspect he may invite that RfC anyway, but I have to say that I doubt it'll change anything. Worth a try though/ Crimsone 23:08, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

Filing an RfC seems like too much work for this kind of situation: most people would agree that he's in the wrong, but I don't want to drag it out. *sigh* I think I'll just disengage and encourage others to do so as well. Any attacks after his block expires will just earn another block. -- Merope 20:47, 27 October 2006 (UTC)

Merope and Crimsone, you have already been a lot more patient with this user than I would have been, and the work of filing an RFC is really unnecessary in such a clear case. If they return to the misogynistic insults and contempt on return from this block, I suggest a month's block. Promptly. If that doesn't give them time enough to reflect, it'll be time to think of a community ban. Meanwhile, I agree about disengaging. Bishonen | talk 13:31, 29 October 2006 (UTC).

Absolutely Bishonen and Merope. (thanks by the way :)). Disengaging does seem the best course for now, pending any further notable event which can of course simply be recorded here for somebody else to see and deal with as appropriate, which if nothing else should further indicate consensus to this editor. --Crimsone 15:32, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Quick Question on Wikistalking

Where should I go to report a wikistalker? Senator Cooter has been reverting my edits on 6-7 pages and calling my edits vandalism after I removed one of his edits. I have warned him numerous times about civility, wikistalking and have asked him to leave me alone. I would spell it out in greater detail here, but I want to make sure I am in the right place. Thanks Jasper23 02:20, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Providing diffs wouldn't hurt. That is, the URL to the diff links in the user's contribution, or what you get when you compare two revisions in the history. -- Consumed Crustacean (talk) 02:22, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Thanks CC. I will also return with sock puppet accounts that user has just created. I have never learned to do diff links. Which edits should I include. There could be like 20 potential diffs. Jasper23 02:48, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Go to the History, or a user's contribs list. Find the edit you want to link to. Right-click on the word "last" in it, and select "Copy Link Location" or similar (however your browser expresses it). Your clipboard now contains the diff link you want. Present it enclosed in single square brackets--not double like a wikilink--to make a footnote in your text. Hope this helps, please ask if it doesn't. The reason people are always asking for diffs is that they're the only permanent links; other types of links will deteriorate and die as the page they're on is edited. Just include a few good examples (not 20 of them). Bishonen | talk 03:14, 28 October 2006 (UTC).

Help:Diff explains it quite nicely :) Cheers, Daniel.Bryant 01:28, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

User evading ban to add AfD notices on articles which are not nominated for deletion

User:Pokeant was banned for 48 hours for disrupting Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Here Comes the Squirtle Squad. He was slipping in articles not apart of the AfD into the AfD opening, removing other people's comments, and finally editing words in other people's comments.

Contributions: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/Pokeant Block log: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Log&type=block&page=User:Pokeant

Once he was blocked, he returned as User:Pokants, and continued to add AfDs onto articles not nominated for AfDs.

Pokant's contributions: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/Pokants

The two are obviously the same. this conversation on my talk page proves it.

Pokant has also voted again at the AfD (shown on this diff). He's already voted before as Pokeant.

--`/aksha 03:09, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

I've blocked the second account as a sockpuppet, and explained to him on his talk page why. Tagged as {{spa}} in the single AfD discussion he had time to add to. For the time being, I'll assume his AfD noms are incomplete due to a relative newness with the templates/process involved? I think this particular guy is more misguided than malicious. Luna Santin 03:21, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Regarding the AfD noms, this is basically what happened:

I nominated all the pokemon episodes for a group AfD (it actually turned out the Pokemon Collaboration Project was already trying to deal with them, but i didn't know). This was about four days ago. Since not all the pokemon episode articles are properly categorized, it turned out i had missed quite a few. This guy turned up today and slipped about 10 more articles in my group AfD nomination (slipping in as in he put them into the middle of my opening, making it seem like i'd nominated them in the first place.) I removed them, explaining that he shouldn't have slipped them in - because it's misleading. It made it look like as if i'd also nominated those 10 articles from the beginning, which wasn't the case at all.

But when he'd added those articles into the group AfD, he'd tagged them all as AfD. So i went and removed the AfD tags, since those articles aren't nominated at all. I decided not to add them into the group AfD, because it's already been about 4 days, so it's a bit unfair on the people who commented when the AfD started. And he...just kept on adding AfD tags back in on the basis that those articles should also be nominated together with my group nomination (note that he didn't actually try to create a new AfD nomination for them.)

And he's been stiring up some revert wars with people over at the pokemon project who're performing a bunch of merges (which i'd assume is what their project agreed to.) --`/aksha 04:20, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

This user (Pokeant) is one of a string of abusive sockpuppets established at this RFCU case.—Ryūlóng (竜龍) 20:46, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

User:Madkunt

Seems like a fairly offensive name, so as per WP:U, I am posting it here for Admin consideration. Cheers! -- moe.RON ^{Let's talk | done} 04:34, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

I've posted a note on their talk page and done a username block/wangi 04:44, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

User:Anarcho-capitalism

I recently stumbled upon the Wikipedia:Tendentious editing essay and realized how well User:Anarcho-capitalism fits the description of a "problem editor". This characteristic of a problem editor particularly struck me: "You challenge the reversion of your edits, demanding that others justify it. Wikipedia policy is quite clear here: the responsibility for justifying inclusion of any content rests firmly with the editor seeking to include it." Anarcho-capitalism is similarly demanding that I demonstrate, "one by one", why his edits are not worthy of inclusion before deleting them; until then, he believes, his contributions have a right to remain, even though he hasn't justified or discussed them at all. Besides this illogic of "true until proven false", Anarcho-capitalism has the audacity to say that "There is no rule on Wikipedia that says I have to discuss my edits before I make them." This is right after I made him aware of WP:CONSENSUS. He also seems to think that he has the prerogative to determine the controversiality of his own edits: "I do not believe they are controversial edits at all, so I see no need to do so."

Overall, this editor's rejection of WP:CONSENSUS and explicit rejection of formal mediation indicate that it is impossible to bring about a consensual resolution with him—plus, I and others have been trying to discuss things with him for months on the anarchism and anarcho-capitalism pages, yet he has made no, or only very minor, concessions. Likewise, an RfC would be futile, because he adamantly believes, despite all objections, that "[He hasn't] violated any Wikipedia rules," and that he does not have to discuss edits that he believes are uncontroversial. I therefore suggest that he be blocked as per Wikipedia:Disruptive editing, because he is tendentious (he is a single-issue editor, as you can deduce from his user page, with avowed partisan intentions; and he only cites sources that endorse the anarcho-capitalist POV, leaving others to rectify the massive imbalance), he abuses WP:V (he says, "I haven't violated any policies. I cite my additions." — that something is sourced does not automatically make it worthy of inclusion, however, nor does it preclude violation of WP:NPOV), and he preemptively rejects community input by explicitly refusing to discuss his edits in advance. At the very least, I would like him to be admonished by an administrator so that he will not continue to believe that he is operating within the parameters of Wikipedia policies and guidelines.

(To view the above quotations in their context, and my responses to them, see Talk:Anarcho-capitalism#Unilateral.2C controversial edits by User:Anarcho-capitalism)

-- WGee 06:35, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

There is no rule on Wikipedia that says one has to get permission from you, or anyone else, before they add cited information to an an article or remove uncited information, which is what I've done. You should focus your energies on questioning things that are not cited instead of being disruptive. And, don't tell stories that I refuse to discuss my edits. I asked you to tell me what specific problems you had with them. You wouldn't answer until you were pressed. Then, when you did answer, I told you my justifications on the discussion page.Anarcho-capitalism 08:08, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Please use dispute resolution. Whether this is RFC, where his actions will be examined by the community, and concensus may be reached regarding this and what to do about it, Arbitration, where a select group of users will implement binding solutions, or mediation (Committee or "Cabal") to try and reach a comprimise, this page is not the Wikipedia complaints department. Daniel.Bryant 11:03, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Gotta agree with WGee, this isn't a simple dispute, this is an editor who has consistently pushed his point of view and has no respect for Wikipedia or its policies. He started in breach of policy: "I received a message on an email list requesting people knowledge about anarcho-capitalism to work on this page." [5]. He's recently shown his attitude towards WP and its policies: "'Original research' or not, the theory is wrong." [6] and the classic "I dont know why you keep referencing Wikipedia. Wikipedia is garbage." [7]. His User page is a classic example of POV and unwillingness to see any other point of view - "ANARCHO-CAPITALISM EXPLAINED FOR STUPID ANARCHISTS (a work in progress)". Donnacha 12:12, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Wow, that is deep... I don't think I have ever directed any user to seek arbitration before - rather, I prefer RFC/Mediation, as the AC get angry if people send too much stuff their way :) - but I can't see this being solved on any level of DR to a satisfactory level other than arbitration. POV disputes are especially yucky, and this just makes it even harder to attempt anything other than arbitration. *shakes head in awe of this dispute and its' all-encompassing radius of gloom* Daniel.Bryant 12:26, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Well, I doubt User:Anarcho-capitalism is anymore biased than other users who work at the Anarchism article, or comment on the article's talk page. The links above from User:Donnachadelong are from a discussion on the Anarchism talk page, not from actual edits User:Anarcho-capitalism made to Wikipedia articles. In this case, [8], this user simply notes that the Labour Theory of Value is an out-of-date economic theory. That's not a bold statement at all. Intangible 15:57, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

'Sfunny how one of the people who agrees with him appears to slag the rest of us off. Virtually all left-wing editors have gone out of their way to allow a disputed reading of anarchism have a place in the article. However, POV-pushers like anarcho-capitalism and banned users like thewolfstar and Hogeye (and their many socks) insist on redefining the entire history of anarchism to make this disputed idea fit. Yes, we're biased, in that we have our own POV, but that's very different from pushing our POV onto the entire article. Donnacha 21:31, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Daniel, is there no course of punitive action that you are willing to carry out right now? — because his being blocked temporarily could allow a return to consensual editing. I understand that this is not the Wikipedia complaints department; I have actually followed Wikipedia's recommendations for "Dealing with disruptive crank editors." Since the editor has refused impartial dispute resolution in the form of mediation [9], which is step 4, I've carried out step 5 (seek administrator intervention) because he refuses to attempt to build a consensus. As I've attempted to demonstrate, he fits the definition of a disruptive editor quite well. It will probably be necessary to ultimately seek arbitration, but I do think that a temporary block is justified under policy; it would also cause an increase in productivity at the anarcho-capitalism and anarchism articles. -- WGee 17:09, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

IIRC the Arbitration Committee has the power to issue temporary injunctions. You could file a Request for Arbitration and include a plea that the user in question be temporarily prohibited from editing any disputed articles until the Arbitration is completed. —Psychonaut 17:22, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

WGee is just making a lot of noise. I haven't violated any policies, and in my opinion I have done some pretty good editing. I've added sources where there were none, took out some unsourced false information, and better explain some concepts. For some reason WGee thinks others need his permission before they make changes to an article.Anarcho-capitalism 01:25, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Having seen some of these issues surface at WP:FAR, this has been going on much too long; I'm glad all parties have at last read up on tenditious editing, and I wish you would both make an honest effort at mediation. The last time WGee approached WP:FAR about removing status of one of these articles, I encouraged him that dispute resolution would result in a better outcome for Wiki than seeking removal of featured article status; I haven't yet seen what looks like a sincere attempt to put forward a mediation case to resolve these issues, and two are tangoing. Sandy (Talk) 04:02, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

There appear to be several editors in this area that fit the classic definition of Single Issue. I'd agree with what WGee is alleging about AC but point out that there may be more to this than just one side. However AC's user page!!!! My goodness, what a screed... I've been involved in trying to help in this area in the past and it's a big mess. No surprise it tends to fester, really. ++Lar: t/c 04:14, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

WGee is claiming that I am required to discuss my edits before I make them, but that's not true. It's perfectly permissible for me to discuss them after I make them. I'm trying to discuss the edits on the discussion page but he refuses to participate, because he's upset that I didn't discuss FIRST. It's ridiculous. He's the one that's refusing to discuss. I've been trying to get him to discuss what problems he has with my edits but he won't do it. All he wants to do is threaten to report me to administrators, threaten an arbitration case, etc. He's trying to coerce me, with threats, into not reverting back when he deletes my edits. He simply refuses to allow others (or at least me) to make edits if they dont talk about them on the discussion page first. This is all obvious if you read the "Unilateral, controversial edits by User:Anarcho-capitalism" section at bottom part of the discussion page.Anarcho-capitalism 04:26, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

So open a mediation case. Sandy (Talk) 04:32, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Have you read my initial post? I've already proposed mediation, but Anarcho-capitalism has explicitly rejected it, twice. [10] [11] I appreciate your trying to help, but please ensure that you are up-to-date. -- WGee 06:01, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I have actually followed Wikipedia's recommendations for "dealing with disruptive crank editors" (including months of discussion), so please be careful when alleging that I've not made sincere attempts to resolve this dispute. It's important to note that this isn't a one-on-one dispute, either, as User:Donnachadelong (who has commented above) can attest: Anarcho-capitalism has exhausted the patience of many editors at the anarchism article, as well. -- WGee 06:16, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

To give you an idea of the nature of the disruptive behaviour, here is an example of the outrageous behaviour and personal attacks that I must face at the anarcho-capitalism article:

Honestly, WGee, I don't know what your problem is. The consensus seems to be that Anarcho-capitalism's edits are just fine. You are the one who is going against consensus. He has tried repeatedly to discuss what your problem is with his edits and you refuse to state one damned thing. You are acting irrationally - he's right. You are only here to cause trouble with this article because you don't agree with it's phiosophy. That much is clear. I suggest that you might benefit from psychiatric help, WGee. Jesus, you're only 16 years old and you're acting like a mean cynical old man. Get some help before it's too late. Doctors without suspenders 05:11, 29 October 2006 (UTC) [12]

Now you can understand why I'm so keen to seek binding administrative intervention to deal with this problem. Users such as Doctors without suspenders (whom I and others suspect is a sockpuppet of User:Lingeron, User:Thewolfstar, etc.) gain encouragement from fellow anarcho-capitalists like User:Anarcho-capitalism, who treat Wikipedia like a battleground. Well-intentioned users are deterred from important articles because of such acrimony. All in all, this situation is a shameful mess, and it will not improve unless the disruptive editors are blocked or banned in a timely manner. -- WGee 06:32, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

To be fair, User:Anarcho-capitalism started out reasonably open and interested in properly developing the articles. However, he's clearly picked up bad habits from the stream of banned users and socks on these articles. Donnacha 13:03, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

And this is Anarcho-capitalism's inflammatory and offensive response to that slew of personal attacks: "Well, that explains a lot." [13] This trollish behaviour is getting out of control. -- WGee 17:25, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

SLS Health AFD needs to close

The AFD debate for SLS Health has been open since October 19. Can someone close it please?

Done. Easy decision, for an AfD that fell through the cracks. Usually this happens because no-one who's already seen it wants to close it. Grandmasterka 07:08, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Good, good, but here's another one: the AfD debate for Seth Sabal, which started a day earlier at 18 Oct and swiftly generated heat and light, but which hasn't been touched since 20:20, 19 October 2006. -- Hoary 08:27, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

The backlog at WP:AFD/Old currently goes back to 17 Oct. --Sam Blanning^(talk) 15:00, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Yep. I do my bit, but I'm limited by this. Daniel.Bryant 01:26, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Improper language

Akhil Bharatiya Hindu Mahasabha

The above article is highly offensive

"62.193.106.87 09:30, 28 October 2006 (UTC)"

I don't see what you're getting at. I don't see anything offensive there.—Ryūlóng (竜龍) 09:39, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Well, not now. I just reverted it and warned the user for this. --Wasell 09:43, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

"It seems to me that you are acting in an uncivil manner" -- mmm, we should set up an "admin polite understatement of the month" award. -- Hoary 09:49, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Usually, these people are smart enough to vandalize, and then point out the flaws :P—Ryūlóng (竜龍) 10:27, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

The vandal, in this case, was 125.22.53.166 (talk • contribs • page moves • block user • block log). Who are you talking about? (Not me I hope! ;-) --Wasell 11:11, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

60.228.118.45

I'm hereby reporting the ip 60.228.118.45 for his unnecessary editing and vandalism, which can be found [14]. Most notably editing the Australian motto into something offensive.--SGGH 10:07, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

In future, please use admin intervention against vandalism for problems like this. Daniel.Bryant 01:21, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

User:KittenKlub refusing to sign vandal warnings

KittenKlub refuses to sign his posts when he gives vandal warnings. According to him, this is standard practice on the Dutch Wikipedia, and prevents vandals from retaliating. I see three problems with this: one, if he makes a mistake, the user will find it much more difficult to explain himself; two, it's discourteous, and arguably a failure of WP:AGF to assume that someone is going to vandalise your userpage if you give them your name; and three, user page vandalism isn't usually a big deal anyway. If a vandal is diverted to someone's userpage, that means he isn't vandalising the encyclopaedia.

After a brief exchange, which was then archived, KittenKlub refuses to sign based on the fact that it's a bad guideline and only a guideline anyway. For the reasons above, I disagree, but he is right that it's a guideline and currently it's just a matter of my opinion against his. If anyone feels the same way, please consider leaving him a message. --Sam Blanning^(talk) 14:15, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

"you should not make it too easy on them"...I'd definitely call that not assuming good faith. --InShaneee 17:13, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

I also don't think not signing warnings is a very good idea, but unltimately he's correct: it's a guideline, and a guideline cannot be enforced. Let's face it, we've made ourselves a community where ignoring all rules is standard practise, and from that we have to take the bad with the good. Andrew Lenahan - Starblind 19:42, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

I think this might be a bit of a different case; while it may be a guideline in the general sense, I think in the case of warnings it's assuming bad faith (especially from Kitten's statements), and almost harassment (in the sense that they're not making it easy for people to contest/explain their actions). --InShaneee 20:31, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

I don't want 'enforcement' as such, I'd just like someone to give him a third opinion. Guidelines may be only guidelines, but they tend to stem from policy - notability guidelines, for example, are extensions of WP:NOT, WP:V etc. In this case, both WP:AGF and WP:CIVIL are arguably being broken. There has to be a good reason to ignore guidelines apart from 'they're only guidelines'. --Sam Blanning^(talk) 23:19, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

I don't see why vandal warnings need to be signed. —Centrx→talk • 23:20, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

I agree with Centrx. I think it is good form to sign the vandal warning although I think it does open one to being vandalized and attacked. If the vandal wants to explain himself, he can do so on his own Talk Page. Besides, the identity of the warning's author is available in the edit history. So we're only talking about courtesy here not anything very substantive. Considering how many people do not leave warnings when reverting vandalism, we should be happy that KittenKlub is leaving a warning at all. I would advise that you leave him be and focus your energies elsewhere. --Richard 23:28, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

I always sign mine, but I don't think it's that big a deal that he doesn't do it. Vandalism warnings are basically a community action anyway, so unless he's leaving them in an abusive manner (i.e. for people that aren't actually vandals), his identity isn't really relevant. -Hit bull, win steak^(Moo!) 02:13, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

The least I'd like to see is five tildes (timestamp), whcih would make it easier for future warnings. Not signing it makes the job longer going into the history to see how long ago the warning was, especially when it may have been issued five or six months prior, in which case the IP could've been re-assigned and a next-level warning would not make sense. – Chacor 02:30, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I agree. People leaving warnings later need to know when the warning was given. While it's possible using the history, there's no need to make it that difficult. --bainer (talk) 03:15, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I'm not sure I'd say it's a "big deal", but I'd largely agree with SB here. It seems especially odd to do this, while explicitly asking on one's own page "Please sign your comments using four tildes". The Golden Rule, and all that. That it's policy to ignore guidelines (as well as policy to ignore policy) is ultimately a problem with that policy (and the dictat that underpins it being policy), but in this case one struggles to see how the imposition of signing warning even satisfies the side-condition of same. Doubtless we'll shortly be seeing a Wikipedia:Just a guideline essay (or guideline?): it's a depressingly familiar refrain. Alai 02:39, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I don't see why this was posted to WP:ANI. If all you wanted was more opinions on the matter, why did you not raise this on WP:VPP or as an WP:RFC? This certainly isn't an administrator-only issue. —Psychonaut 02:53, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Not an admin, but before this gets moved to a page not on my watchlist, I think people should always sign warnings (although like others I don't think this is an issue that deserves punitive action). If nothing else, an unsigned warning carries less weight. If an editor is unwilling to put their name to the complaint they're making, then it encourages (IMO) the recipient to ignore the warning. Also, I think retaliation is a red herring. The thing is, editors who are not savvy enough to figure out how to use the history to discover who posted the warning are likely to have adverse reactions (as noted above), and those who are savvy enough can still harrass the poster of the warning. Anchoress 03:01, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

This is about a specific user, not policy in general, so WP:VPP is not the right place, and this isn't serious enough for RfC - that's blatantly obvious by the fact that I wouldn't have a second certifier. It may not be an admin-only issue in the strict sense of what privileges your account has, but it's an adminstrative issue in the sense that it relates to a 'behind the scenes' matter. --Sam Blanning^(talk) 03:41, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

There are two reasons why I sign my vandal warnings is to provide a timestamp for other vandalwhackers so they can provide the appropriate level warning and to make it easier to get feedback. You can easily deal with the userpage vandalism by 1) revert, block, ignore or 2) semi-protection. MER-C 11:07, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Socks ahoy

An AfD on an expat's version of WP:NFT seems to be attracting a group of anonymous IPs (despite being claiming to be expats in Japan, half of them trace back outside the country) and one fairly dormant named editor (User:Crossfire), with few if any edits, with the same verbose style and claims of personally witnessing this, and ALL (including User:Crossfire) with the identical unwillingness/inability to leave signatures. I'm NOT willing to swallow that as a coincidence. And yes, I left the list at Open Proxies Reporting. This is really getting on my nerves. --Calton | Talk 14:24, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Closed as delete, and it had little to do with the SPAs — had only one of them were to provide a few reliable sources, I likely would have closed as no concsensus. Please feel free to review my closing comments. Hope they makes sense. El_C 11:49, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

User:Gavin06

This user has consintantly been uploading images, mostly relating to Elena Paparizou, which have no copyright tags. He (presuming the name reflects actual sex) has been warned multiple times on his talk but continues to do so. He has also been disruptive in addition of these images to articles. A good example would be this where he added the image Image:Helenapaparizounew1.jpg with no copyright status (I would presume fair use). I subsequently replaced it with properly fair use (with rationale) tagged Image:elenapaparizou.jpg (now PNG of same name) [15]. Then today, he uploaded an identical copy of the previous untagged image - again with no tag - to Image:Thegameoflove.jpg and replaced the properly tagged image in the article [16] (I have now speedied it). However, this is not a lone incident. There is an enourmas trail of "untagged images" left by OrphanBot and other users, all of which have been ignored (the ones that were tagged, were done by other users like this). I really think that a strong warning needs to be given (or a block from uploading, if that's possible). But without doubt, an admin should start watching his talk page (obviously no admin has noticed so far). Thanks - ^Рэд_хот^{(t • c • e)} 14:38, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

I've given him a warning; if he continues, I think he should be blocked for 24 hours, or at least have his ability to upload images removed for a longer period (if that's possible). It's a pity that users who repeatedly fail to provide adequate source and copyright information when uploading images, despite being asked to do so many times, often go unnoticed. Extraordinary Machine 14:56, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Yeah. I intended to report last month, but couldn't find the page to do it. Come to think of it, I can't remember how I found it today! Oh, I also strongly suspect the, now inactive, user, User:Gavinhoskins is him also (look at the contribs and the original versions of the images uploaded by the account, which also have not tags) - ^Рэд_хот^{(t • c • e)} 15:00, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Eastern University Page

The Page for Eastern University has been vandalized several times since yesterday. the IP address for one of them is on campus (I work there) and others are registered users including one that is the name on a non notable alumnus who added his name with a link to his Facebook page to the notable alumni section. I added a semi protection stub for the time being. --Ted-m 14:54, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

I also wanted to add "Shame on the Eastern University vandal. What a jerk for adding a Facebook link. When do you think would be a good time to unprotect this page?Ted-m Ted-m 16:37, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Why did you create a second username to post that? --InShaneee 17:02, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Cogito ergo sumo and right to vanish

Cogito ergo sumo (talk · contribs) after a lengthy revert war was blocked for a violation of 3rr and left in a huff. A few days later he resurfaced as Ex post factoid (talk · contribs) and continued his edit war. Subsequently a sock investigation was initiated. It was established that they both are E Pluribus Anthony (talk · contribs) and both accounts got blocked. After questioning by some if really a violation of WP:SOCK occured (see: User_talk:Kilo-Lima#Curious_blocks) the blocks were recinded as the accounts were used in sequence and not simultaniosly. Now the user wants to vanish the evidence of his revertwaring by excersising the "right to vanish" which is fine for his userpage, but not for the talkpage which includes a) evidence of his revertwaring including the denied unblock[17], also it includes evidence that he is User:142.150.134.58 see [18]

Therefore I suggest the history of the talkpage will stay visible - while I have nothing against blanking the page - in case a further incarnation of the user appears.

P.S. E Pluribus Anthony (talk · contribs) equally requested to have his user and talkpages removed thereby proving the connection.

See also User_talk:Tone#quote_from_meta for the discussion following the first deletion of the talkpage. Agathoclea 19:27, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

I would undelete User talk:E Pluribus Anthony as well. He was a very active editor and usually deleting talk pages like his are frowned upon. semper fi — Moe 19:42, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

I have reversed my recent deletion of this page. Another admin is of course free to review depending on how this thread goes. - BanyanTree 20:39, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Looking at Wikipedia:Requests_for_checkuser/Case/E_Pluribus_Anthony there are User talk:A the 0th and User talk:Lucky Mustard which equally "vanished" 17/18 May. Agathoclea 19:50, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Death threat against user

Just posted here. Newyorkbrad 20:40, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Already indef blocked. --InShaneee 20:44, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Thatcher131 blocked one minute after I posted. Thank you both. Newyorkbrad 20:48, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Heh. I tossed a warning at the talk page, but I guess it's too late. --Masamage 20:46, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Indef block pending explanation. It looks like Theresa deleted some subpages of his (for good reason). If he has a convincing apology/reason, I'll unblock. Thatcher131 21:00, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

He seems a little strange, but not particulaly threatening. Some kid I suppose. Theresa Knott | Taste the Korn 21:35, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

If you want to unblock him since you were the target, go ahead. I'll give him a second chance if he is willing to discuss the matter. Thatcher131 23:45, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

No I'm fine with you asking for an explanation first. Theresa Knott | Taste the Korn 08:50, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

• Please do not unblock anyone after a death threat, even if they say they're sorry or whatever. Even if you're okay with it, bringing them back gives them a chance to similarly harass and threaten others who might not be. I know the vast majority of them say they'd never really go through with it (etc) but that's no excuse to make it easy for the few who would. There's already been real-life murders on Myspace, and we don't need that here as well. Nobody should give their life for the privlege of editing a website. Andrew Lenahan - Starblind 15:52, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

• • I agree with Andrew. Certain edits are beyond the pale; death threats are one of those. If the person is truly contrite, they will create a new ID and edit properly from now on. If they revert to such behavior; they should be checkusered and permabanned on sight. -- Avi 16:03, 29 October 2006 (UTC)
    • I think it's high time we had a formal policy on Wikipedia specifically prohibiting death threats and excplicitly defining them as a bannable offense (our harassment policy mentions them in passing but is very vague). So I've started a very rough policy proposal at Wikipedia:Death threats. I welcome any additions, changes, or feedback. Andrew Lenahan - Starblind 19:02, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Steel359

[19]

User not only violated 3RR (I didn't, because only 3 of my edits there are reverts), but reverted and protected the article to his ideal version. - A Link to the Past (talk) 22:57, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

I have blocked Steel359 for three hours for edit warring on Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater. The protecting to his preferred version aside (that's territory for RFC and/or WP:RFAR), administrators should be expected to know better than to edit war on articles. He continued edit warring on the article after several users tried to contact him concerning his protection of the article, so I blocked to get him to discuss these instead of continuing this unproductive editing. Feel free to review this block, of course. Cowman109^Talk 00:57, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Support this block based on the evidence presented here. Protecting to a preferred version while in a content dispute is also not done. Hopefully just an aberration though. ++Lar: t/c 01:08, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

The block should be for 24 hours. I've never seen anyone blocked for less than 24 hours for 3RR before. - A Link to the Past (talk) 01:10, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Eight hour blocks are not uncommon. —Centrx→talk • 01:16, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Ditto Centrx. I see 8 hours used a lot for 3RR with experienced editors. Daniel.Bryant 01:19, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Also, having very obviously broken the spirit of 3RR, A Link to the Past should be very wary of asking for blocks of admins with whom he has been edit-warring, to be extended. Guy 19:17, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Supporting similarly to Lar, though Link has a point. I don't support changing the block length now that it's set, though. ~Kylu (u|t) 01:14, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

The blocker said he did three hours to try to get Steel to engage in discussion, but he doesn't seem to have been interested in discussing it. So I think the block should be increased. - A Link to the Past (talk) 01:23, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Steel359 (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) his block log has a good record, no previous blocks, and this block is in my view intended to get his attention and get him talking. Blocks are preventative, not punitive. If this block does the trick, why would a longer one be a good thing? I've given blocks as short as 15 minutes just to get people to stop and think about what they are doing. 3 hours seems right. Also, i'd rather we not establish the precedent of one of the parties to a dispute arguing about how long a block is for, thanks. ++Lar: t/c 01:27, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Admins should be blocked for longer than, say, a long-time regular user. They got the position, and if they violate a policy that could lead to a block, they s hould know better than to do such a thing. It's almost like special treatment to NOT block him for 24 hours. I got blocked for it, and my 3RR wasn't as nearly as bad as his 3RR. - A Link to the Past (talk) 01:43, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

All revert wars are bad. There is no such thing as "my reverts weren't as bad as his". Three hours is fine. Support block and block length. – Chacor 01:52, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

However, you've got quite a history. --InShaneee 01:53, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Blocks are not punitive; they are deterrent, preventive, and recording. In this case, the blocking administrator thinks that a 3-hour block will be sufficient to deter the user from future disruptive behavior. This could be because the blocking administrator has prior knowledge of the user, where otherwise he might give a default longer block, but that is not favoritism. —Centrx→talk • 01:56, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

InShaneee: I've been blocked twice before that blocked, and had them lifted. Also, what can be deterred? "Oh, three hours? Better take a nap/watch a movie/clean house!" - A Link to the Past (talk) 02:04, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

They can do whatever they like during the duration of thier block off-wiki. The point is to stop thier disruptive behavior on wiki. semper fi — Moe 03:10, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Cowman109 just directed me to this discussion. I filed a report at WP:AN3 before realizing that a three-hour block already was in place. Had I noticed Steel359's 3RR violation before I became involved in the American/British spelling dispute, I would have placed a 24-hour block myself. If anything, administrators should be held to a higher standard than other users. It's true that 3RR blocks aren't punitive, but Steel359 reverted the page six times in a 14-hour period (during which he protected the page to gain the upper hand in a content dispute). He could use a 24-hour break to cool down. —David Levy 02:38, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

If the initial block does not do the trick, I would support a longer block. I don't see any sign of discussion on Steel's talk page... so not sure how it would play out, let us wait and see. But again, I don't see a party to a 3rr (Link) having any standing to comment on who got how much blockage. ++Lar: t/c 03:24, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

It's my belief that any user in good standing (including one with involvement) is entitled to comment on an issue (with others taking all of the facts into account). I obviously was not entitled to issue a block myself, of course. —David Levy 12:43, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I think I'll take a break. I've been really moody for a while and I'm surprised it took so long for something like this to happen. Some important things in RL are coming up and I'd rather not be dealing with this at the same time. I don't intend to start a huge discussion on ANI when there are more suitable places, but I'm going to vent a little. The content dispute itself is about vgcharts - a site of videogame sales figures. This site (apparently) uses shipping figures to estimate a game's sales, and ALTTP has been removing these in good faith on the grounds that they're misleading. The text in the article makes it explicitely clear that they're estimates, so I'm not sure what the problem is. Also, when removing the sales info, ALTTP carelessly left sentence fragments lying around (see the third line here), and then later removed content unrelated to the dispute when reverting me [20]. As for the spelling, the article was almost totally rewritten during the process of taking it to FA. There was no conscious effort to change the style. But seeing as along the way it did change, I can't see why so much effort is being put into changing it from one version which isn't inconsistent to another version which also isn't inconsistent [21]. When I was reverted, I was pointed to the manual of style. The first bullet point there says: "Articles should use the same dialect throughout.". It was unconsciously changed from one to another as huge chunks of text were removed and new chunks were written (by me) from scratch, and the end product did use the same style throughout.
Like I said, sorry to moan about article stuff on ANI. I've been spending too much time on Wikipedia lately, and formal logic isn't going to revise itself, so this is quite a convenient point to take a break. I worked really hard on MGS3 to get it to FA, and suddenly people are parading in and making all these changes without a whisper on the talk page. And I'm going to stop there before someone accuses me of WP:OWN. -- Steel 10:04, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Steel, no. Just saying that it's an estimate does not cut it. Wouldn't you do the same if you saw a featured article saying "according to false information, Pocky & Rocky sold 800,000 copies"? Because that's what it is. I know the person who owns the site; on the forum that he posts on he's constantly plugging his site. It got so bad that VGCharts was banned from all sales discussions at NeoGAF. The owner of the web site, ioi, is not a professional by any definition of the word. In fact, I get review copies from various developers in the industry to review on a site I work on, so I am actually more connected to the industry than he is, because he has absolutely no connections. Just because you specify that the source is an unprofessional estimater does not make the numbers any less bogus. Additionally, just because I unintentionally reverted something, yes, but that could have easily been added back without reverting the VGCharts information back, so don't claim I did it when you did it as well. - A Link to the Past (talk) 19:42, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Firstly, your decision to take a break is a wise one. As I commented at WP:AN3, it was obvious to me that you were under a great deal of stress. (In our one prior interaction, you seemed quite reasonable.)

Regarding the dialect switch, I believe you when you say that this was unconscious, but that doesn't change the fact that it was improper. American spellings (such as "organization" and "humor") had been in use in the article since February 2005 (when the first dialect-specific spelling was introduced). You recently substituted British spellings, thereby creating inconsistency that remained until an anonymous user changed the heading "localization" to "localisation" a few days ago. When someone switched it back, you twice reverted (the first time with no explanation) on the basis that the article used British spellings.

Quoth the portions of the MoS to which I was referring:

"If an article is predominantly written in one type of English, aim to conform to that type rather than provoking conflict by changing to another. (Sometimes, this can happen quite innocently, so please do not be too quick to make accusations!)"

"Follow the dialect of the first contributor."

"If all else fails, consider following the spelling style preferred by the first major contributor (that is, not a stub) to the article."

I don't doubt that your conversion from American to British spellings was innocent, and I never ascribed malice; I simply restored the English variety originally used in the article. I've done the same thing with articles that were improperly changed from British English to American English.

In any event, I wish you the best of luck in your personal matters (and your wiki matters upon your return). —David Levy 12:43, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

The way I've always understood it is that the first contributor thing should be brought into play when there's an inconsistency. At the time you changed the style, there was no inconsistency, and so no need to revert to American spellings. Anyway, consider that my last message, I'm off now. -- Steel 13:34, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

The "first contributor" rule takes effect when there's a dispute regarding which variety of English to use and no other valid reason to select one in particular. Otherwise, we would be inviting users to deliberately change established articles to their preferred dialects (citing the fact that this results in "no inconsistency, and so no need to revert"), thereby sparking massive edit wars. The fact that the article existed in consistent British English for two days (as opposed to the 1 ½ years in which it was written in consistent American English) didn't somehow render that particular status quo sacrosanct. —David Levy 16:10, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

A message I received

[22]
If he'd said that about someone else he would probably be blocked (by me) by now. I really don't appreciate being talked about in that way and consider it exceptionally insulting. This isn't a "go and block him for me" request, but I'd be grateful if in my absence someone could remind him to AGF or something. -- Steel 13:34, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

A comment that was unnecessary and only served to inflame things, I'd support a strongly-worded warning. – Chacor 13:54, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Well, it is true that you did 3RR, plus protected a page you were deeply to keep it at your preferred version and was only blocked for three hours. I mean, it wasn't as if you violated a petty policy. - A Link to the Past (talk) 19:21, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Flowcube indef blocked as sockpuppet of Homeontherange

I've indefinitely blocked Flowcube (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · nuke contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) as a sockpuppet of Homeontherange (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · nuke contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log). I'm not very familiar with the case (see here), so if anyone who's more familiar with the case disagrees please don't hesitate to talk to me or reverse the block. Thanks! Snoutwood (talk) 00:08, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

There was never an arbitration case on user:Homeontherange. The page you referred to was a subpage created for the case application comments which got very long; when the case was rejected the subpage should have been too.

Homey's current status is in doubt. Fred Bauder has argued that he should be given the chance to register an account and edit peacefully; so long as he edits peacefully he should not be "outed" or blocked. Jayjg has argued that Homey has used up his supply of second chances. Thatcher131 01:30, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Should he be unblocked, then? Snoutwood (talk) 15:42, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

As I recall, it was "rejected" on the naive presumption that Homey had gone the way of the buffalo. Granted, the chips are a bit stale now, but somebody should toss them back on the table and pursue the fabled persona non grata dentata remedy. —freak(talk) 10:01, Oct. 29, 2006 (UTC)

If that's what happened, that's unfortunate. Whenever something's left in limbo like that it's hard to get going again. I don't feel particularly inclined to pursue arbitration myself, but I certainly can agree with your sentiments. Snoutwood (talk) 15:42, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Apparently per Fred Bauder's talk page, Homey, Fred, SlimVirgin and Jimbo are in negotiations regarding his status. I would probably leave things at status quo (neither unblock nor block any new suspected socks) until something is worked out and they let us know. Thatcher131 17:17, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Ah, I see that. Thanks a million for the help, I will follow that advice. Snoutwood (talk) 18:29, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I wish the arbcom would stop taking the easy way out of avoiding making a decision based on the usually faulty argument that the troublesome user has left the project, as they almost invariably come back and we have to start all over again. I seem to recall similar things having happened with Lir, Xed and Wik. User:Zoe|(talk) 19:31, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Or, to put it otherwise, that the decision is made regardless of the person having left. However, that does seem to be changing (cf. Giano's ArbCom case and the remedies regarding Kelly Martin after her leaving the project). I'd love to see that continue. Snoutwood (talk) 21:40, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Snoutwood, what was the evidence that Flowcube was Homeontherange? Feel free to e-mail me instead if it's sensitive. SlimVirgin ^(talk) 21:42, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Sorry, guess I didn't make that clear :) See Special:Undelete/User talk:Flowcube, particularly [23]. Snoutwood (talk) 21:53, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I can't quite see what it is. You mentioned the check user and RfAr pages; was it IP evidence or editing style or something else? Again, please e-mail anything that might be sensitive, if it's no trouble. SlimVirgin ^(talk) 22:05, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I was referring to Flowcube's most recent edit summary "FUCK OFF HOMEONTHERANGE IS BACK U WANKER", which you can see by scrolling down on the undelete page, as well as the contents of the entirely self-created talk page, which includes a number of sockpuppet templates in which Flowcube claims to be Homeontherange. Snoutwood (talk) 22:09, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Okay, thanks, Snoutwood. By all means keep it blocked because it's clearly a troublemaker, but in fairness possibly not Homeontherange. SlimVirgin ^(talk) 23:02, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Indeed so, in fact, the chances are probably fairly low. But agreed that either way it should remain blocked. Snoutwood (talk) 06:23, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

I have blocked the ip behind this, and several other prank accounts. Fred Bauder 23:08, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

We'll do a checkuser to be sure, but my own guess is that this is a troll who is just trying to stir the pot with respect to Homeontherange. It would be very odd for Homeontherange to do this sort of thing at the very same time that we are having a big conversation about his future status.

This example shows quite nicely why good users should never sockpuppet. And especially by users who have been involved in conflicts should never sockpuppet. Once you sockpuppet and get caught, you are an easy target for trolls to pretend to be you sockpuppeting again, just to make more people mad at you. I have no actual evidence that this is or is not homey, other than his denial and that it would seem rather a bit strange for him to do this at this time.--Jimbo Wales 01:30, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Ecm2006

User Ecm2006 (talk · contribs) apparently created EverTeam, which was db-speedied. Now the editor is speedying every competitor that can be found. I don't know if this is a concern or not. This is almost certainly related to the edits of 82.255.142.13 (talk · contribs), Cduudc (talk · contribs) and Ucddcu (talk · contribs). I think the editor is trying to make a point because they repeatedly fail to get their own article in. See the deletion log for Ever-Team and EverSuite. JonHarder 00:44, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

User advertising for job openings on his page User:DJ_BatWave

This nominally underage user had his phone number along with a request for band members. I removed it, naming WP:NOT. I'm not an admin, just FYI. Anchoress 03:28, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Considering the nature of the information, and the fact it contains specific personal information, I would suggest an admin speedy this. Daniel.Bryant 03:30, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

You mean speedy the whole userpage? The user is a contentious but prolific editor who hasn't ever been blocked (although I'm surprised at that because he's been monstrously uncivil several times lol), so it's not a socialising-only account. Anchoress 03:34, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

OK, I'll reword my statement: delete, and restore without personal info (which is exactly what was done [24]). Apologies for the misunderstanding - it's just that we don't want that kind of info floating around, even in the histories of pages. Daniel.Bryant 03:37, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I've deleted it and restored it without the personal info. If other admins want to revert my action, they can feel free to do so, but it only seemed logical to me. Alphachimp 03:40, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Holy anointing oil

Cannabis is repeatedly added to Holy anointing oil. I am now taking it off my watchlist. WAS 4.250 03:46, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I just reverted to the last version by WAS 4.250 but there seem to be cannibis references even in that version, so I'm a little bit confused as to what a good version of the article is supposed to look like. In any event, the last 4 references to cannibis were added by the same IP and there are no vandalism warnings (I would issue a "blatantvandal" now except that based on the above, as I said I'm not sure what exactly is vandalism here). Newyorkbrad 03:51, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

All "cannabis" references are now deleted and the vandal's been final-warned. Newyorkbrad 03:53, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Uh, no, the reference is back again. I have added {{fact}} to the cannabis reference and slapped an {{unsourced}} on the whole thing. User:Zoe|(talk) 19:34, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

People of Praise

There seems to be a small edit war going on within the People of Praise article. About a week or two back, D1xrfgf3, a new user who claims to be a former member of the group, made an edit putting the group in a darker light then previously. Danbold, whom I know via real life to be a member of the group, quickly cleaned up the article to his standards. Justinw, whom I know nothing about, but has been here since May 2004, made a small edit. D1xrfgf3 then made a small edit, reinserting charged material implying the group is a cult. 76.17.232.181, an anonymous IP whose only edits are to the POP article, and whose location seems to be somewhere in Minnesota, a location where a large part of the group lives, then reverted the previous edit.

I'm not a member of the group, but I do attend their school, and know many of them personally. I'm not going to say anything as to whether it is a cult or not right now, as I don't want to bias anyone either way. However, if you do want questions answered from someone with firsthand real life knowledge of the group who is willing to give NPOV answers, I'll answer at my talk page.

I'm not nearly as active as I used to be around here, just have a ton going on in real life - on an indefinite Wikibreak, checking in daily or so. So I'm gonna have to hand this issue off to someone else, but I think it may need administrator intervention. Thanks a lot for taking care of this. -Zapptastic (talk) 05:12, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Edit summaries are a contravene [sic] of US law...

...according to Prof02 (talk · contribs · count). I couldn't bear to let this remain on a secluded user talk subpage, so I copied it here. Basically, someone asked this guy to use edit summaries, and this was the response:

“ (1) Edit summaries. No court of law anywhere in the world, not even in the post-Orwellian world, would legitimize the doublespeak whereby the author of a work-in-progress could be considered to be his own ‘editor’ for the purpose of defining his rights vis-à-vis his own work.

If however, as the author of the work-in-progress in question, I am asked to provide ‘edit summaries’, I am in reality being asked to provide you and others, not with any ‘editorial’ details that might help anybody with anything, but rather give you a privileged insight into my creative process, disclose my work methodologies, organization of material, priorities given to certain aspects of the subject, the direction in which I am going with the article, etc., etc. No one has any right whatever to this information, and insistence that I divulge it constitutes an invasion of my privacy as the author. While such an invasion may not violate Wikipedia’s internal guidelines and policies, it is against the law of my country (which is also the country where Wikipedia was founded). By becoming a guest on this website and by using your facilities I did not, voluntarily or involuntarily, implicitly or explicitly, surrender the rights vested in me by the law of the land. Their infringement is an offence. Whatever Wikipedia guidelines might say, they do not supersede the law of the land, whether they are pressed ‘politely’ or ‘impolitely’.

--User talk:Prof02/Erich Heller#Ease of editing section break

”

This is just an example of what this user is ranting about. Maybe someone should Wikilawyerespond back - taking a look at his user talk page and that of the subpage, someone needs to explain that Wikipedia is not a US court of law and you have no right to edit Wikipedia etc. I didn't know where else to post this, and I guess that admins need to intervene in this case - most normal users will just get lawyered into the ground. He seems to think that Dispute Resolution means running a court case on his talk page, also. Cheers, Daniel.Bryant ^{[ T · C ]} 09:16, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

This user certainly has ... idiosyncrasies ... but you have cited to a post from a couple of months ago on an old subpage. I believe a scroll down his main talkpage indicates that several admins are already dealing with this matter. Newyorkbrad 09:40, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Now that's the most verbose way of saying "mind your own business" I've seen in quite some time. Rather touching, actually. —freak(talk) 09:45, Oct. 29, 2006 (UTC)

No, no, that is not at all what I was trying to say. Daniel, who is not an admin (though his day will arrive, and he performs a number of admin-type tasks), was posting here to point out a problem that admins should look at. My point was that admins were already engaged in the situation so that busy admins, seeing the post here and trying to prioritize, needn't give it urgent attention, instead of 10 people checking the userspace and finding the same thing I found.

This noticeboard has become a very unpleasant place to try to be helpful. Newyorkbrad 10:52, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

See below. —freak(talk) 19:40, Oct. 29, 2006 (UTC)

My apologies...I didn't see that there were admins who were trying to sort it out, other than the two who he wants desysopped. And don't worry NYBrad, I didn't interpret your comment hostile in the slightest - actually, quite civil compared to what you get other times from certain users :). Still, that makes for interesting reading (where, by "interesting", I mean "hilarious"). Cheers, Daniel.Bryant ^{[ T · C ]} 11:00, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I think freak was referring to Prof02's statement, not Newyorkbrad's statement :) --bainer (talk) 11:42, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

You are correct. —freak(talk) 19:40, Oct. 29, 2006 (UTC)

Ah ... I thought it followed ... Oh well, <Emily Litella>never mind.</Emily Litella> I comfort myself that DB was confused too. Newyorkbrad 03:44, 30 October 2006 (UTC).

And here I was thinking Anglius could never be topped :) Aecis ^{Dancing to electro-pop like a robot from 1984.} 11:48, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Funny he should mention Orwell. Oh the irony. I strongly recommend he read "Politics and the English Language." Antandrus (talk) 20:03, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

And, anyway, the original writer was wrong in his basic premises; in fact, there were many occasions when I was both writer and editor, long before Wikipedia existed; it occurred every time I was the editor of a publication and also wrote some of the material that appeared in it. *Dan T.* 20:14, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

The right to disappear (continued)

I feel it is my sworn duty to remind Wikipedians of this policy. Nothing personal, but if I ever want to pack it up on this website, I would appreciate it if you'd all delete my contributions. Thanks.KevinS0814 10:16, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I find it odd that this is your very first edit here, and that you would know about this page and that policy.—Ryūlóng (竜龍) 10:20, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

My other name got blocked,(but my contributions didnt). I'm not gonna get into the long story on how that happened, but lets just say I wish I could make those edits disappear!KevinS0814 10:24, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

By the way, your contributions cannot be deleted on whim - they are released under the GFDL license, and hence must fufill Wikipedia's deletion policy if the pages they are on are to be deleted. Daniel.Bryant ^{[ T · C ]} 10:25, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

The right to vanish includes deletion of pages in your user space (your user page, user talk page and any subpages), but not deletion of your contributions. However you may be able to have your username changed if you don't want it to be associated with the contributions you have made. --bainer (talk) 10:33, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

That would be the perfect {{nutshell}} statement for that proposal. Kudos to you, Thebainer - nicely summed up. Daniel.Bryant ^{[ T · C ]} 10:36, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Also note that the right to vanish is not really a proposal, nor even a policy. The page explaining it was started in late 2004 as a spin-off of the foundation:privacy policy. --bainer (talk) 11:40, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Well, that's exactly what I've done. I'm really ashamed of my previous contributions and would've felt better jumping out the window, but instead I changed my username.KevinS0814 10:42, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

For everyone's sake, don't jump out any window - it's not good for your health (I fell off a balcony once - I imagine a window would be just as painful...) :) Daniel.Bryant ^{[ T · C ]} 11:03, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

The only exception to are users talkpages, which are not autopmatically under that idea. see Wikipedia:User_page#How_do_I_delete_my_user_and_user_talk_pages.3F A sysop will then delete it after checking that the page does not contain evidence of policy violations that may need to be kept. If there has been no disruptive behavior meriting the retention of that personal information, then the sysop can delete the page straight away in order to eliminate general public distribution of the history containing the information. If the deletion occurs immediately, others may request undeletion if they feel there was in fact a need to retain the page. In such a case, the page should be undeleted and listed on Miscellany for deletion for a period of five days following the deletion of the user page. If a user page were deleted because a contributor left, it may be restored by a sysop if the contributor returns, particularly if the history contains evidence of policy violations. Agathoclea 22:15, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

User:Cloveious and violation of Wikipedia:Fair use criteria item #8

On Friday, I removed political party logos from 40th Canadian federal election because they were being used in a decorative manner when identifying the party by its name with a link to the party's article was sufficient [25]. Wikipedia:Fair use criteria item #8 forbids the use of logos in the manner in which they were being used on the article. Saturday, User:Cloveious reverted my removal with an edit summary of "Reverting, Party logos are an important identifier during a campaign" [26]. I reverted his re-insertion of the logos [27] and immediately left User:Cloveious a message on his talk page regarding the issue [28]. Later Saturday, [[User:Cloveious left me a message on my talk page [29] saying "I will revert what ever I see fit" and subsequently re-inserted the logos, yet again [30] with the edit summary "Reverting Durin's fear mongering campaign of non contribution".

Please note that the use of logos in the manner that User:Cloveious violates not just Wikipedia policy, but fair use law itself. If his treatment of this issue were legal, anyone could make a million t-shirts with any logo on it because it serves to identify whatever the logo represents. This isn't how fair use law works.

I am reverting User:Cloveious's actions again, and am seeking other admins to comment on his talk page and revert him if necessary. --Durin 13:21, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

OK, I'll issue a final warning. He does it again, he's blocked.--Doc 13:27, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Bring it on, you will only make me a martyr in the fight againts Durin's tirrany --Cloveious 01:00, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

• It is disappointing that despite being encouraged to do so [31], you have failed to engage in rational conversation regarding this issue, and have instead decided to willfully violate Wikipedia policy [32][33]. Given the willful violation and the presence of a final warning from another admin, I am temporarily blocking you. More discussion on this on your talk page in a minute. --Durin 04:36, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Impersonation

User:Anthony.cfc is, in my opinion, attempting to impersonate my Username (User:Anthony_cfc). Evidence for this is:

• User talk:Sj - if you look closely User:Anthony.cfc has linked to MY userpage to invite a response which clearly demonstrates impersonation.
• His userpage clearly makes up lies about me, as well as demonstrating a motive for impersonation (he seems to evy my userpage).

I have not bit the vandal, and I have remained civil in all my communication with User:Anthony.cfc, despite the fact I have seriously lost my patience.

In conclusion, this user has no intention of contributing to Wikipedia and has only created an account in order to brand me homosexual and a prik and similar mindless lies.

Please resolve this as you see fit. Cheers.

Anthonycfc (talk • email) 21:35, Sunday May 26 2024 (UTC)

I've blocked the account indefintely and deleted their userpage which was little more than an attack (claiming to be from the same place and a petty insult) --pgk 14:35, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

As an aside can you fix your signature. Including {{currenttime}} etc. is pretty useless as it updates the timestamp each time the page is changed so give no indication of when you really made your post. --pgk 14:36, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Ebionite pages may be bugged

I found evidence that the Talk:Ebionites and Talk:Ebionite Jewish Community pages may be bugged with some kind of Trojan Horse. In the Privacy log on my anti-virus software, I found the following: [34] , [35] , [36] , [37] , [38] , [39] , [40]. The last one is a redirect with source title=Talk:Ebionites&action=edit&section=5.

I believe that all of these originate from the same user, Nazirene, who is the owner of numerous websites promoting his own religious group. A stub created by this user to promote the group recently went through two AfDs resulting in deletion and page protection Ebionite Restoration Movement. Recently, this user has been complaining about censorhip on the Ebionites talk page Talk:Ebionites#Please Don't Fix and in a website linked to the talk page [41] that criticizes the editorial policies of Wikipedia.

I was tipped off to the problem by a warning message when I clicked on the talk pages and the edit history. If I'm wrong about all this, I apologize in advance, but it's better to be safe than sorry. Ovadyah 16:52, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

If it helps, I recovered these IPs from my connection log. I think these are all linked to this user: brotherofyeshua.com(66.94.237.68;66.94.237.82;66.94.237.85), thethreelies.com(68.142.212.90), ss.webring.com(69.90.135.88;69.90.135.89), hostingprod.com(66.94.237.82), visit.geocities.com(66.218.77.64), geo.yahoo.com(68.142.232.54). Ovadyah 17:07, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

The same funny-business is apparently going on with my user page User_talk:Ovadyah. I tried several other user pages, but I only see a warning on mine. Ovadyah 21:42, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Wikipedia pages cannot contain web bugs or trojans. Whatever it is that's happening to you, it's nothing to do with the contents of those pages. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 21:44, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Even so, it's odd that only certain pages are affected. I'll take your word for it, but I'll keep monitoring and testing. Ovadyah 02:22, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

It is possible to put a link on page for the purposes of getting peoples IPs, but that is about all. HighInBC ^{(Need help? Ask me)} 16:46, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

User:racism

saw the person recieve test4im on recent changes, looked at his contributions, and noticed he redirected idiot to jew. he also put {{hoax}} on the hindu article, which is why he got the warning.

links:racism (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · nuke contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 17:24, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Username blocked. --InShaneee 17:25, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/S. Jithesh (2nd nomination) sockpuppetry

Checkuser reveals that there is a lot of abusive sockpuppetry going on here. The following are all the same person:

• Nileena joseph (talk · contribs)
• Dr.khan (talk · contribs)
• Nooranadu mohan (talk · contribs)
• Joshygeorge (talk · contribs)
• Adv. P. R. Bijuchandran (talk · contribs)
• Meeracmusic (talk · contribs)

I hope an admin can look into this. Dmcdevit·t 17:50, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I cancelled the AfD, and Srikeit (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) has indef'd all the socks. Presumably the socket can ask for one and only one to be unblocked if they wish to play nicely. -Splash - tk 18:04, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Oddly, they do not appear to have collaborated on any other AfDs. -Splash - tk 18:09, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Pardon my language, but this is !@#!@# great. I had practically given up editing in articles related to Malayalam because of the sheer impossibility of getting nn articles deleted because of stray votes and "reverse-systemic bias". But stuff like this one and AfDs like this keeps me going.

I was active in the first AfD for Jitesh and a related one, but by the time I saw the second nomination, it was well on the way to keep and did not even bother to comment.

Many of us who work in the Malayalam articles "knew" that they were sockpuppets, but the way Checkuser terms are phrased, it was pretty difficult to get one done on mere suspicion. See User_talk:Ageo020/Archive_1#List_of_suspected_socks_of_User:S.Jithesh for some "new" users who appeared for the first AfD. Did Devapriya who voted in this Afd come clean ? User:Parayanali is another user who has showed a similar edit pattern (though he had made only two edits) Tintin (talk) 01:36, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

It seems she followed my AfD votes. See her AFD votes vis-a-vis my AFD votes. I find the coincidence eerie.Bakaman _Bakatalk 03:56, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

And she even voted exactly as you did, even though your opinion was often in the minority. Looking at her editing pattern, you would have got a barnstar in a couple of days :) Tintin (talk) 04:08, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Haha. Well luckily I'm not a sock though my POV is generally keep except in cases of cruft or nonsense. On India-related articles, I "vote keep first, work on later". Barnstar would have been nice.Bakaman _Bakatalk 04:16, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

User:70.141.125.22

70.141.125.22 (talk · contribs), an anonymous IP, keeps posting a dubious bunch of "trivia" to the Republic of Texas (group) article. This has been added by other users / anons earlier, and always removed by consensus. This time, the user included an attack on others who remove the section: "Anyone who removes this section is obviously little and knows nothing" *Dan T.* 17:57, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

sockpuppet/troll whatever

this user moves straight away (within 6 edits) to a RFA and makes replies like this --Charlesknight 18:21, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Blocked. Theresa Knott | Taste the Korn 19:45, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Vandal 193.251.135.126

Please block anon user [42] for blanking several article sections. Markussep 18:36, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

An unfair case

Hello! I recently made the following comments on the talk page of Chinese people and was blocked indefinitely. The reason given to me is a sock puppet case. Wikipedia:Requests for checkuser/Case/Snle. The computer I used is one at my university computer lab, which is shared by all students. I think the administrator's action is totally unfair. I took a look at the sock puppet case and didn't see many similarity among those blocked editors. Most of them are just temporary accounts people use for the purpose of not revealing IP address. The accused user SNLE was indefinitely blocked only for sock puppet. I don't think sock puppet is justifiable for indefinitely block, as indicated in the Wikipedia Sock Puppet page. Anyway, I think the administor is too arbitrary in making his decision in case of shared IP address. I wonder if some outsider could come and solve this case or at least ask the administrator to stop blocking people on unjustified bases. Thanks.User68732 19:19, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

" This disambiguation page contains too many unnecessary misleading information. According to Wiki's policy, a disambiguation page should be a simple list of the relevant links that make readers easy to navigate. There is a standard disambiguation page at Chinese page, where Chinese people are properly disambiguated.

• Chinese people, people of Chinese ethnicity
  • Zhonghua minzu, the supra-ethnic Chinese nationality
  • Han Chinese, the dominant ethnic group in China
  • Ethnic minorities in China
  • Overseas Chinese

I think this pagre should look something like this. Poepl 15:31, 29 October 2006 (UTC)"

User:Cerebral Warrior and the userpage saga

People keep reverting this editors userpage. While I don't think much of the content being reverted, agreement appears to have been reached (and concensus) on the users talk page, yet evern editors involved in that formal request to User:Cerebral Warrior.

It appears that there is an edit war of sorts on that page, where people come along and revert it, and others (myself included - twice at least lol) have reverted it back to the users version (as disagreeable as I find it), because there is a WP disclaimer at the top of the page, and it is for the editor to remove on request if required, not other editors. In my understanding, the only other people that should be taking direct action on an actual userpage are admins, pending refusal to comply with the rules or formal consensus requests (a formal request and apparent agreementof sorts being in evidence on this users talk).

Please could an uninvolved admin take a look at the situation and take appropriate action to put an end to ths issue before it escalates further? thanks, --Crimsone 19:20, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

The user's talk page suggests there has been some kind of agreement and things are cooling off. If that is the case, I am reluctant to stir things up. Tom Harrison ^Talk 20:03, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I don't agree that only admins should edit another person's userpage. All Wikipedia pages, including userpages, refeclect on Wikipedia's reputation IMO. We are here to write an encylopedia, not stir up hate or state our political opinions.If he wants to do that let him get a website - it's very easy nowdays. I believe that the userpage should go. I don't know if the consensus is with me on this, I will not act at the moment. However I urge those who are reverting the deleters to simply stop. No one has the right to say whatever they like on thier userpage, anything that inhibits conversation and compromise on articles is bad for wikipedia and hate speech does just that. Theresa Knott | Taste the Korn 20:14, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I'm with you on this. There are so many restictions on userpages already, we may as well do away with them. So let's phase them out. The next logical step in this process is to outlaw "Vanity pics". We are, indeed, here to write..not to advertise what a "cute kitty" or "bitchin car" I gotz duude. We have a firm concensus now against vanity articles, why not vanity images as well?--R.D.H. (Ghost In The Machine) 20:51, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Actually I meant - his userpage should go, not all of them. I think userpages can help bring a sense of community, but it's important to remember that they are given to wikipedians as a favor not a right. Theresa Knott | Taste the Korn 21:02, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Userpages only give the illusion of community and help create a false impression of what we're really here for. Policing them for inappropriate material is a drain on time and resources which could be better spent elsewhere. This isn't MySpace. But even if userpages stay, vanity pics need to go.--R.D.H. (Ghost In The Machine) 21:29, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

No problem. I should mention though that in this case, the disclaimer was added per the talk page agreement with an administrator. I happily accept what you say as the norm, but surely after administrator agreement, the both sides of the dispute should drop the issue usually? The thing is, as disagreeable as I find it, I can't bring myself to define what's currently there as hate speech. A fine line is being tread with it undoubtedly, but in the context of the disclaimer, it's not really reflecting directly on wikipedia so much either. I believe the agreement on the talk page was twofold in this respect.

Not that I'm intending to ask for views on the content that is (though undoubtedly a part of this situatition), but rather, on the disruption surrounding the issue--Crimsone 20:45, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

• I don't think such issues can (or should) cleanly be seperated from the nature of the dispute and its solution. Commenting on the dispute itself, users do not own their userpage, and anything divisive enough, no matter what disclaimers are on it, tends to go. --Improv 13:41, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Brittanica copyvio in a Wikipedia article's talk page history

Wissahickon Creek (talk · contribs) recently posted the entire contents of Brittanica's article on Alexander the Great at Talk:Alexander the Great. I've removed it as a massive copyvio, but should I also purge it from the talk page's history? —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 21:04, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

There are many edits to the talk page, and it's not terribly practical. We tend (for reasons unknown) to retain bad individual revisions in the history with infringing material. I guess there's WP:OVERSIGHT if you want the nuclear option.

Moving on, I am closer than this > < to disposing of Wissahickon Creek (talk · contribs) as obviously a sock, as obviously causing more trouble than good in his so-called mediation on that article, and now for illegally dumping copyrighted text into the project. Does anyone wish to save him from himself (and from me)? -Splash - tk 21:12, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

May I ask whose sock you suspect him to be? Just interested. He was certainly no newbie when he appeared on 22 October, of course, and his behaviour is certainly problematic. Fut.Perf. ☼ 21:19, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

It'd be pure speculation if I used names, and therefore unhelpful. As you say, he is certainly no newbie and, it strikes me, has a tendency to involve him/herself in such a way as to be irritating at best. First activity was to make a stream of (repeated, dead) proposals to transform RfA. That stopped when I called him on it. -Splash - tk 21:24, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Okay, fair enough - but if you're considering "disposing of" (=indef-blocking?) him, wouldn't you have to demonstrate he's actually an illegitimate sock? I.e. either of a banned user, or interacting with his puppetmaster in illegitimate ways. His behaviour otherwise may be unconstructive but in itself not really indef-bannable. Fut.Perf. ☼ 21:31, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

If it is a sockpuppet and it is being in any way disruptive, it should be blocked. —Centrx→talk • 21:35, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I am attempting to be circumspect. I think, with increasing certainty, that the user is either a)a sock of someone we already disposed of or b)is an account created to do annoying things whilst appearing to try to be helpful. In either case, my concern is that we are being trolled. Here ends my exercise in circumspection. -Splash - tk 21:42, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

The more I look into it, the more I see that pattern too. At least one similar case comes to mind. Fut.Perf. ☼ 21:55, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I have no opinion on W.C.'s sockness (although someone who edits an RfA and joins the Mediation Cabal among his first edits is obviously suspect), but I certainly agree that he's caused more trouble than good in his "mediation". —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 21:21, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Indeed. He's also been making controversial edits and pagemoves over at Template:Europe, and accusing other users of being "edit warriors". Another user brought his sockness to my attention a couple days ago. Khoikhoi 21:35, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I find a problem with the header of said editor's talk page: "This is the place to talk, discuss and question my authority." He seems to have picked up Wikipedia processes (and even elaborately decorated his userpage) in a span of less than a week, which is quite strange. Thoughts, anyone? --²¹⁰physicq (c) 21:48, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Wow, that note is really... something. And that was his second edit on WP! ([43]) Fut.Perf. ☼ 21:55, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Sean Black has given him a strong warning [44] which, incidently, I think sums this nonsense up pretty nicely. --W.marsh 21:56, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I'd be hesitant to call someone a sock when it is entirely unclear who he could be a sock of, but he definitely isn't your average "new" user (but he doesn't seem terribly experienced...). I've been trying to clean up the mediation case he... started and as a side checking his contributions, which are startling. Picking fights on WT:RFA, unilateral pagemoves of widely used templates, pasting a Britannica article verbatim, no concept of consensus, frequent refrains of NPOV vs POV (which he is apparently the ultimate authority on), and no understanding of mediation. I've been trying to at least enlighten him a bit as to what mediation and consensus are, but the whole process has been extremely frustrating and he keeps insisting upon his "NPOV" solution to a mediation... Blocking for disruption doesn't seem farfetched to me, but I'm clearly biased. --Keitei (talk) 21:58, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I've asked him on his talkpage to give an explanation of his "sockiness". If he doesn't give a satisfactory answer, I'd support a block. Fut.Perf. ☼ 22:01, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I don't think of him in terms of "sockiness." I would think in the mindset of "trollishness" instead, if either ruse can be sufficiently supported by concrete evidence. --²¹⁰physicq (c) 22:03, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Sockpuppetish-ness of a blatant copyright violator? I reccomend checking out WP:'T to see if its him. If it is, shoot on sight. 68.39.174.238 00:33, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

I hope it's not inappropriate for me to interject here, but in addition to W.Creek there seem to be other sockpuppet(s) involved in the mediation at Talk:Alexander the Great, and I'd really appreciate it if someone took a closer look. I am a participant in the debate, and reported one suspected puppeteer/puppet duo at WP:SSP. --Akhilleus (talk) 22:09, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I'm with Physicq210 ... In my view, if some identity is editing disruptively, (especially, editing trollishly) and gives the appearance of being a sock, it is not really necessary to determine exactly whose sock it is in order to justify a block. The disruption is enough. I have not reviewed the contrib history closely myself but if other well respected editors and admins say there is disruption, my first instinct is to trust them and support the block, should one ensue. (Certainly exploring whose sock it is may be useful to consider applying further blocks, but it is not necessary to block THAT identity) That's my view... Hope that helps. ++Lar: t/c 15:11, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Achaia Football Clubs Association

Many users at this discussion have come from the Greek Wikipedia to vote keep on Achaia Football Clubs Association. There have been many accusations of people being either meatpuppets or sockpuppets and it has gotten out of control. There have also been personal attacks on multiple users. It would help if an admin could sort this conflict out. T REX_speak 21:44, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I concur.Billy i.e.The Billster 22:27, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

See my vote on the almost deleted page to view my opinions on the subject. I will do more research, if necessary. If not necessary, please let me know.Billy i.e.The Billster 22:39, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Sorry guys, after reflecting on the matter I've had a change of heart. See:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Achaia_Football_Clubs_Association Billy i.e.The Billster 23:43, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I couldn't help noticing this, since I was interested in the subject exactly above. I think it is kinda unfair to treat a team like that, no matter how un-notable it may be. I'll go ahead and vote, but you must admit there's a huge fuss about nothing. I also noticed several accusations about sockpuppets of the other side... •NikoSilver• 23:15, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Suspected sock of banned user WikiWoo (talk · contribs) being uncivil

Brampton 2006 (talk · contribs) is being uncivil, disruptive and engaging in personal attacks while editing two pages: Brampton, Ontario and Brampton municipal election, 2006. His pattern of edits and accusations that other editors (namely me) are corrupt and deliberately trying to deprive the public of information with our edits reminds me of banned used WikiWoo aka WikiRoo (talk · contribs) aka WikiDoo (talk · contribs) aka GST2006 (talk · contribs) aka 216.154.134.91 (talk · contribs · WHOIS). Could an admin check into his behavior? Also, I plan on filing a checkuser request, but WikiWoo's talk page has been erased. Could someone make it available to me so I could find the diffs I need to file the reguest? Thanks. JChap2007 23:58, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Gwernol has taken care of this for me. JChap2007 04:26, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Sockpuppet

An indefinitely banned user by the name of Princesspickles2006 (talk, contribs) recently removed content from the Rescue Heroes article (diff); the recently created user name Princess kitty (talk, contribs) subsequently made an almost identical edit (diff). Shannernanner 00:01, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Bot misbehaving

Please shut down User:VoABot II. It identified me as a new user (I have over 15000 edits), and appears to be systematically reverting all edits to Hilda Toledano. Septentrionalis 00:33, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Done Theresa Knott | Taste the Korn 00:39, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

It is supposed to only revert likely socks (using a criterion). For some reason, it now seems to see to have counted some old users as very new and with few edits two times.Voice-of-All 00:56, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

BenBurch (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

Is recruiting people to vote in a 'deletion review'. Is this appropriate? --Tbeatty 00:43, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

It can be problematic if the recruiter is only enlisting people who agree with him. Usually that's fairly easily dealt with by assuring that those who voted in favor of the deletion are also contacted; maybe ask him to do that himself just for the sake of WP:AGF? Even if he doesn't comply, it's easy to do on one's own.

(I'm not an admin, so those who are, please correct me if I'm wrong!) --Masamage 01:11, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

He is only recruiting "friends" as far as I can tell.--Tbeatty 03:15, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

It should be noted that many who originally voted for deletion are part of an organized group with an admitted agenda, and that this matter (deletion review) is noted on their noticeboard, as was the original AfD, and the subsequent DRV. 'Conspiracy' Noticeboard Fairness And Accuracy For All 03:47, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

User:Grace Note and User:Gracenotes

Grace Note has been a long time contributer here and it appears we have another long time contributor named Gracenotes here too. I think having two users with this similar a name and being as active as both are, there could be reason for one of them to change thier username. Do you think we should ask either of them to change it? semper fi — Moe 00:50, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Has it been a problem yet? If not, I wouldn't worry too much, but you're right that it could be confusing. Rather than ask either to abandon their name, maybe we could ask them to make a note on their userpages of being different people. (Just like article disambiguation in the mainspace.) --Masamage 01:07, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

I left a message at User talk:Gracenotes. He probably ought to change his user name but doesn't absolutely need to; he could leave a note on his user page instead. I saw an edit by Gracenotes in my watchlist today and thought Grace Note had changed his username. --Idont Havaname (Talk) 01:14, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

All right. I've put this message on the top of my userpage:

This user's name is "Gracenotes". If you're looking for the user "Grace Note" go here.

If Grace Note wants to put something like that at the top of his userpage, he should feel free, or someone else could do it. Interesting, this is not an "Incident" per se. I really don't want to change my username, because it's in my e-mail adress, AIM name, Slashdot account, account on other Wikimedia things... so, the above should work. By the way, Idont Havaname, what edit did you see of mine? It's remarkable that out of this many active users you've "matched" just two. --Gracenotes ^T § 01:26, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Comment: Nice edit summary, Gracenotes. Classy. I almost heard film-noir music play. KillerChihuahua^?!? 01:29, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

There are several other pairs of well-known users on Wikipedia who have had similar user names: User:Essjay and User:Sj, User:RedWolf and User:Redwolf24, and User:RickK and User:RK. I think all of them, at some point or another, have posted messages at the top of their user pages saying that they're not the other one. The original AN/I post about Grace Note / Gracenotes came before my message did.

The edit I saw on my watchlist was to the Esperanza Members page. Most of the pages that I edit end up on my watchlist almost by default. --Idont Havaname (Talk) 05:13, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Ral315 felt a need to add a dablink so people wouldn't confuse him with Raul654 [45] Hbdragon88 22:58, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Disruptive continuous editing in... Malakas

Sorry, to post that here, but it's just over the top with this anon! He/she repeatedly reverts all involved users, introducing their own personal etymology theory, based on an amateur unofficial site, while removing the citations from acknowledged Greek dictionaries. The edits are obvious vandalism to any Greek speaker, but this is just one point. Here are the rest:

• He/she refuses to use talk, despite multiple requests: [46], [47], [48], [49]
• He/she uses multiple accounts/IP's, obviously the same user:
  • Kour40 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · nuke contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)
  • Soll313 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · nuke contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)
  • 70.121.189.173 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · filter log · WHOIS · RDNS · RBLs · http · block user · block log)
  • 66.162.30.194 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · filter log · WHOIS · RDNS · RBLs · http · block user · block log)
• He/she uses misleading edit summaries: [50], [51], [52], [53]
• He/she has developed WP:OWN syndrome, and admits being related to the site he keeps using as a 'reference': [54], [55], [56], [57]

Sorry for taking up your time with what appears to be a ...malakia of a debate, but can someone help relieve 5 or 6 users constantly reverting that obvious vandal? •NikoSilver• 01:10, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Sockpuppets on Talk:Alexander the Great

I'm expanding on a comment I made above. I believe several sockpuppets are participating in a mediation on Talk:Alexander the Great. In addition to the possible troll/sockpuppet Wissahickon Creek, we have:

• Mallaccaos/Apro. Already reported at WP:SSP, but no one seems to be home over there. Both users are clearly using the same IPs, and admit to this, and both advocate similar positions. For more, see Wikipedia:Suspected_sock_puppets/Mallaccaos.

• Takidis (talk ·  contribs), who I think is a sock of the banned user Cretanpride (talk ·  contribs). A Checkuser came back inconclusive, because Cretanpride's edits are too old. However, I think it's pretty clear just from looking at the contributions: Takidis has posted to Alexander the Great and Talk:Homosexuality in ancient Greece, taking positions similar to Cretanpride's. For instance, on Talk:Homosexuality in ancient Greece, Takidis argues that the views of Bruce Thornton, Mary Lefkowitz, Victor Davis Hanson and Robert Flaceliere must be included in the article; in the past, Cretanpride's socks have said similar things.

Could someone please investigate further? --Akhilleus (talk) 02:04, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Maybe the checkuser came back inconclusive because I am not Cretanpride and actually innocent. Akhilleus, just because certain editors oppose your views doesn't mean you have to find ways to get rid of them. Do I share similar views as Cretanpride on this issue? Sure, but then again the vast majority of Greeks do, and I am not the only one who opposes undue weight of homosexuality injected into Greco-Roman articles. Takidis 05:29, 30 October 2006 (UTC) — Possible single purpose account: Takidis (talk • contribs) has made few or no other contributions outside this topic.

Whether Takidis is Cretanpride or not (and he does take some extremely similar positions), he certainly appears to be a single-purpose account, which should be taken into consideration. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 05:59, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

It would be nice if you gave me a chance to edit on other articles before labeling me a single purpose account. I don't think this is fair. Also, as I noted above, it doesn't matter if Cretanpride and I share similar views on this subject because so do most Greeks and so do other editors who have posted. Takidis 06:16, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

I call 'em as I see 'em. Your first edit after creating your user page, on October 13, was about the issue of homosexuality and Alexander the Great.[58] Since then, you have edited only two articles unrelated to the issue of homosexuality in ancient Greece: Tarpon Springs, Florida and, tonight, a minor edit to Cyprus. That's several weeks of editing, with essentially all edits on a single topic. Sounds like a single-purpose account to me. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 06:23, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

You've ignored the fact that so far I have only edited on four articles total. You've also ignored the fact that I've added three paragraphs to Alexander the Great which have nothing to do with homosexuality. If it's anyone whose violated wiki policy it's those who have assumed bad faith against me by ignoring me and accusing me of sockpuppetry even after I went checkuser and even after I requested one, and we know who those are. Takidis 06:51, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

The paragraphs you added to Alexander the Great were about his relationships with women — a response to what you argued was the undue weight being placed on his relationships with men. That's absolutely related. You jumped right into the discussion at Talk:Homosexuality in ancient Greece with a long screed decrying the article's POV-ness and offensiveness to modern Greeks. You are correct that you have edited only four articles — and the vast majority of those edits have been to two articles with related debates. I'm not assuming bad faith here, just using my judgment as a fairly experienced Wikipedia editor and administrator. If other adminstrators disagree with my assessment, I will re-evaluate it. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 23:50, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

I'm mediator in this case. I was suggested to make a statement here that I'm not a sock of anyone. You may see very well this, just be checking with CheckUser. I have no relation whatsoever with anyone from that page. My simple purpose is to have an NPOV solution to that page. Thank you. Wissahickon Creek ^talk 07:43, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Wissahickon Creek's status as assistant mediator in this case is questioned by several editors. See here and [[#Requested block for User:Wissahickon Creek for disruption|here] on this page, and here at the Mediation Cabal's coordination page. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 23:50, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Neither all users supporting Cretanpride's arguments are Cretanpride's socks, nor is it permitted to WP:BITE new users simply because one doesn't agree with them. I support most of Cretanpride's argumentation (excluding ofcourse threats etc) and find it very sound and logical; am I Cretanpride? Also, Alexander the Great is one of the first articles a Greek would obviously visit in WP. Checkuser being inconclusive is one more argument. Takidis is an apparent fresh user, and his non-one-purposeness will definitely emerge in his following edits. I would appreciate if accusing users would have real evidence to his allegged sockiness to a permabanned user, which if not substantiated, constitutes a violation of both WP:NPA and WP:BITE. Otherwise please clear this new user's name. So, any "diffs", please? •NikoSilver• 11:57, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

I gave diffs in the initial post. Aside from this "fresh user"s familiarity with processes like Checkuser, there's also the small fact that he's edited two of Cretanpride's favorite articles. On Talk:Homosexuality in ancient Greece he insists that the views of Robert Flaceliere and Bruce Thornton must be included; in the past Cretanpride and his many socks have argued the same thing. Somehow I don't think there are many users that would start posting long passages from these particular scholars within a few weeks of joining WP; I doubt most new users even know that Flaceliere and Thornton exist. Takidis also insists that the views of Mary Lefkowitz and Victor Davis Hanson must be included in the article; thing is, these views come from blurbs on the back of Thornton's book, which a sock of Cretanpride has quoted before. (Diffs are above in the initial post of this thread.) The stuff about Vrissimtzis is also a continuation of argument that was already in process. (see, for instance, this diff and this diff). Takidis has added a few new wrinkles like the quote from David Cohen, but this is largely a rehash of material already posted by Cretanpride's socks. --Akhilleus (talk) 16:04, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

It sure is suspect - while I find the Apro - Malaccoas farfetched, the only thing that can be said of Takidis that if he's not Cretanpride he must be his clone, because he doesn't only imitate his pov, but also his editing style. Also, it's hard not to remember that C. is certainly still editing, and has edited less than a month ago the article Alexander the Greece through a sockpuppet.--Aldux 18:14, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Well, none of the above is conclusive. Anybody having enough patience to read the archives and edit history could see those things. As per his non-newbeeness, that doesn't necessarily make him CP either. Many legit users have dissappeared and reappeared under a different username. That may well be the case here, and it is not objectionable. Also, keep in mind that people may not wish to use their real username for such issues, in order not to be called 'homophobic'. I suggest we watch this user's edits (as we obviously already do) and try to find anything that really connects him to CP. Other than that, and until proven otherwise, and unless violating a policy, he cannot be "ignored" in talk-pages. So go ahead and block him for something, or I'll be seconding every single edit of his, as if it were mine. PS. Now-now, Aldux, what are our friends from FYROM going to say with your "slip-of-the-tongue..." ("...speaking the truth") in wikilinking G.A. above? :-) •NikoSilver• 21:14, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Mackensen, who performed several earlier checkusers on Cretanpride and his sockpuppets, has now confirmed that Takidis is another Cretanpride sockpuppet, and has blocked him. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 01:24, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

strange message

I got a message on my PDA phone stating that I edited something that I've never even heard of. Here is the link to the message I got: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:216.220.208.238&redirect=no

Just wanted to clear that up.

Thanks. You can reply to me at oldbluebox@tmail.com —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.241.233.201 (talk • contribs) .

That lists several messages. Best to register a username if you do not wish to be subjected to these. El_C 08:11, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

St Vincent's Hospital, Sydney

User:Bcplim has made, and reverted, a series of edits to St Vincent's Hospital, Sydney, one of which apparently includes personal details about a member of staff. See [59]. It might be prudent to remove the offending edit from the article's history. Thanks. Gimboid13 03:27, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Got it. El_C 08:08, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Sock invasion

• Ruth Celeste (talk · contribs)
• DannyCohen (talk · contribs)
• Ner Israel (talk · contribs)
• Rabbix (talk · contribs)
• DinaTamar (talk · contribs)
• Mary Anne Wilson (talk · contribs)

I don't think we need checkuser here, since these are all obvious. They're all editing the same things, they're echoing each other in AfD's, they're all pushing the same POV - namely labelling certain rabbis and rabbinical institutions as practicing/condoning child molestation in total violation of BLP, and promoting certain activists and organizations that advocate against "clergy abuse". I am asking for another sysop to review these users and to indefblock the whole lot for abusive sockpuppetry and coordinated POV pushing. - CrazyRussian talk/email 05:00, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Sprotected Yeshiva Ner Yisrael: Ner Israel Rabbinical College. El_C 08:06, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Adding CrankingCraig (talk · contribs). - crz crztalk 14:10, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

All indef blocked, I concur with Crz's conclusion. Obvious troll army. --Aguerriero (talk) 15:57, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Kittybrewster

Can someone please explain to Kittybrewster (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · nuke contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) that he cannot do cut and paste page moves. [(humorous) personal attack removed].—The preceding unsigned comment was added by 217.43.18.66 (talk)

Wikipedia:Requests_for_adminship/Saxifrage

I hope admins are keeping an eye on the trolling from the oppose vote that has spiralled out of control. – Chacor 10:17, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

User:Weixiang7326

That user, Weixiang7326 was adding factual inaccuracies and was edit was not nothing to it's source in the article, Windows Vista. Please block that user. Thank you. --210.213.86.46 11:28, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Adam Gawronski (talk · contribs) misrepresentation of real life Adam Gawronski

It has come to my attention that someone has created an account using my real life name (Adam Gawronski) and proceeded to vandilise the St Pius X College article with offensive edits. Although these have since been revereted, the username (and hence my real name) still exists in the history. As you can imagine, I do not wish to have these comments under my name as they can be used against me even though I am not at fault. It appears that the same has happened under the username Leonie Miller - St Pius X Administrator Extraordinaire (talk · contribs), which is in fact the real name of a staff member at the school. As these users are both 'joke' users, obviously created exclusively with the intention of vandalising the St Pius X College article I do not believe that prior warning is required / would have any effect. This type of vandalism and misrepresentation I consider cowardly and also borderline illegal.

I would request that both Leonie Miller - St Pius X Administrator Extraordinaire (talk · contribs) and Adam Gawronski (talk · contribs) have their names changed so they are not impersonating anyone then blocked (so that their names do not appear in the history of the article, as I gather that deleting history of an article / deleting evidence of specific posts is not permitted/possible). I will then request (in the appropriate section) to have my current username (Gawronski) changed to Adam Gawronski to protect my online identity.

Gawronski 23:51, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

This request should be directed to the Bureaucrats' noticeboard as only they have the power to change user names. Dragons flight 23:59, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/User:GabrielF/ConspiracyNoticeboard

User:NuclearUmpf has decided to make this AfD an attack page on the nominator and myself. I attempted to remove these comments. [60] I then attempted to remove these comments to the talk page Wikipedia_talk:Miscellany_for_deletion/User:GabrielF/ConspiracyNoticeboard and stated that I was going to start an AfD on his behavior. User:NuclearUmpf has restored these comments. I don't want to get in a long edit war with this user. Travb (talk) 11:58, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Me and this user has a past history, please ask Thatcher131 for information regarding the past, including harassment, edit warring, bating, off wiki contacting of people I have disputes with, and now voting to delete a noticeboard I am involved with. The AfD in question accuses the participants of votestacking, Travb's example is actually an article that the nominator added himself. Anyway please see the MfD page and please direct questiosn to Thatcher131, as they are familiar with every aspect of this and can give you a run down of this users history. Thank you. --NuclearZer0 12:01, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

I have posted on Thatcher131's page requesting assistance in the matter. User_talk:Thatcher131#Travb_again --NuclearZer0 12:03, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

IMO both of you need to stop, sit back and think about your actions. And probably both avoid that page, and each other, for a while. WP:RPA is not a guideline or policy, so it should only be used sparingly, and certainly not if there's been such a history of conflict. – Chacor 12:05, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Nuclear and I have some of the same interests (political articles), and I have actively avoided editing any articles which he has edited. The Afds, on the other hand, where everyone can "vote" does not disrupt Nuclear's editing. I had not mentioned Nuclear at all on this AfD, he began attacking me. I am not familar with AfDs, but long attacks on other users, I would think are not only irrelevant to the AfD, but against WP:NPA.

Thatcher131 is indeed familar with both of our history's, including NuclearUmpf own sordid history, which I won't go into here.

User:Chacor wrote: "probably both avoid that page, and each other, for a while" I agree, thanks for the great advice Charcor. If User:NuclearUmpf will avoid editing the page, so will I, despite his attacks still being on the page.

Anyway, I am now logging off now for several hours. I would appreciate an admin who has not been involved with either of us before, looking over the AfD. I would like these attack comments removed please. Travb (talk) 12:14, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Sorry but tell you that you are violating WP:AGF by calling a large group of editors to be votestackers, then to remove proof that you indeed do vote in the same manor, in an article you complained about the votestacking at, is far from a personal attack. Further pointing out the nominator's block 3 days before for vandalizing that page and disruption as well as WP:POINT violation, is certaintly relevant to the discussion. Your arguement that people who follow that noticeboard are votetacking is quite obsurd when faced with the fact that you have voted in a similar fashion. I would like to point out that he removed also a listing of who voted how on the article he was complaining about, showing his voting in step with the majority of editors on that noticeboard, however also showing that they did not all vote alike. The truth hurts I guess. --NuclearZer0 13:00, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Since you didn't seem to catch the message above, I'll reiterate: you're both in the wrong here, and you both need to start avoiding each other for a while before you both get yourselves blocked. --InShaneee 14:17, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

I do not think you understand, they posted on an MfD for a noticeboard I participate on. I cannot avoid this user if they are seeking me out. To threaten both of us makes little sense in this case. Should I not participate in MfD's for things I am a part of, that this user is aware I am a part of? Please do not make blanket comments, perhaps there needs to be a resolution here instead of admins saying simply play nice, its apparently that won't happen with them shadowing me. --NuclearZer0 15:02, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Consider this your last warning; language like that you just used is not acceptable. You two are antagonizing each other, and it needs to stop. --InShaneee 15:04, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Looking briefly at this current dispute, we have Travb refactoring comments on the MfD (not just Nuclear's) and deleting Nuclear's explanation of his !vote and replacing it with a simple signature. We also have NuclearUmpf personalizing his response to Travb rather than just focusing on the matter at hand. I would advise Travb not to refactor comments on XfDs (admins are generally not dummies about double votes) and especially not to refactor or edit comments made by someone with whom he is in frequent dispute. Nuclear should stick to the matter at hand and not discuss motivations or behaviors of other editors. (Fair to point out the nominator's history regarding the page; unhelpful to accuse Travb of violating AGF.)

Since you guys seem to generate the most friction over XfDs, I think the next step would be Wikipedia:Community probation banning both of you from all XfD discussions for some period of time (2 weeks, a month?). Nuclear's arbitration probation allows him to be banned from pages he disrupts, but I don't think it would be equitable to ban only Nuclear from XfD since this seems to be a mutual thing. (There's probably enough crap just in the AN/I archives to file a new RFAR, which neither of you wants; Nuclear for obvious reasons, but I doubt Travb would be treated like an innocent victim.) Thatcher131 15:04, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Thank you again Thatcher131, I appreciate you actually looking into the disputes to see what the issue is. I apologize for my accusation of AGF to Travb. But the truth is this constant bumping heads with him is starting to annoy me, and worse that fact that admins simply do not want to deal with it. I am tired of being poked and prodded and would prefer not to edit Wikipedia anonymously, but it seems this issue will keep coming up as long as Travb has a name to attach me to. I will start logging my interactions with him now on as I do not see an a RFAr too far off in the future and I feel I am being constantly baited and threatened by this user. --NuclearZer0 15:16, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Whats an xfD? I would be happy to abide by anything Thatcher wants, voluntarily.

User:NuclearUmpf makes a lot of accusations, which I will not waste anyone's time with responding here.

My only comment is that I find it ironic of User:NuclearUmpf reaccuring talking point, he always yells, "I am a victim" when a quick, casual look at his talk page and edit behavior shows that their are dozens of editors which he has or is currently butting heads with, not just me.

Again, I will volutnarily abide by anything that Thatcher says, with or without Nuclears cooperation.

But before I can, it would help if someone could explain what an Xfd is, because the XFD wikiarticle seems wildly off topic.

{5 minutes later} Found my answer: Wikipedia:Deletion_policy#Deletion_processes "Collectively, these processes, together with Articles for deletion, are sometimes referred to as the XfD processes." I won't edit any XfDs until November 30, 2006, one month from today, as Thatcher131 suggests.

I would appreciate an editor deleting Nuclear's irrelevant attacks on me and the nominator on the AfD. I ask Nuclear too do this as a courteousy, but he removed my message again from his talk page.[61] Travb (talk) 16:38, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

We were asked not to post on eachothers talk pages, please abide by that. --NuclearZer0 16:40, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

X is a common denominator for a variable, in this case X means any of the deletion type pages, MfD, AfD, CfD etc. --NuclearZer0 16:34, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

I also would like to complain about the behavior of NuclearZer0in this MfD. I have brought forth what I consider VERY serious charges, that a group of editors have been working together (in secret until they were discovered only days ago) to edit with a particular POV / agenda. I complied a list of editors, and how they voted. 3 editors listed, including Nuclear, inserted comments which many might consider not only trolling, but as vandalism, as the comments destroyed the formatting of the list.

Please see Example One (note that NU made two edits to his unhelpful comments) Example Two. Their actions and tone indicate that they're not taking this seriousely. What is the next step in the escalation process? I would like to have several POLITICALLY NEUTRAL Admins look into these serious charges. Thanks Fairness And Accuracy For All 07:50, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

Fiona Mont article

Could a kindly admin put this article on their watchlist. I have been an editor on the article but came across it by hitting the random button. It appears the last few days have seen numerous attempts by interested parties (indeed Fiona Mount appears to be editing the article herself) to edit the article to provide a more "favourable" view of events. I am particularly concerned with edits such as this, which wouls appear to me to be libelious.

--Charlesknight 13:37, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Someone claiming to be Graham Hesketh (Mont's husband) is involved as well. See User:213.160.120.156. --Guinnog 22:08, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

The Wedge (TV show) / User:Shaggy9872004

Persists in removing the 'criticism' section of The Wedge (TV show), requiring users to revert the article on at least a daily basis. Has never given a valid reason for doing so, and is aware that nobody agrees with their actions. Also fraudulently posed as a Wikipedia authority early on, threatening "Please do not move/edit. By order of Wikipedia. YOU WILL BE CAUGHT".

58.166.6.17 14:13, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Left a message on their Talk page, and will keep an eye out. Remember, you can always try to discuss with the editor or on the article Talk page before taking something here. --Aguerriero (talk) 14:45, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Vandalism-only account

Hi folks. I know this isn't normally the proper place to report vandalism, but WP:AIV is only for recent vandalism that needs immediate stopping, and I can't find any other place to report this. Apologies in advance, and I'd appreciate direction to the proper place for future reference. Anyway, my issue is with UB16 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · nuke contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log), an account whose sole purpose is to blatantly vandalise the Doug Flutie article. I warned him with {{bv-n}} on 21 October but he started up again (at a much slower rate) a couple of days later. Every single one of his edits is to Doug Flutie and every single one is vandalism. I seem to recall a precedent for blocking vandalism-only accounts, so I believe that's what needs to be done here. Powers ^T 14:18, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

That is a content dispute, not vandalism. Discuss it with the editor or on the article Talk page. --Aguerriero (talk) 14:37, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

If this and this represent a content dispute, I'm Ann Widdecombe. Blocked indefinitely. --Sam Blanning^(talk) 15:13, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

In the future, accounts that have vandalised over a period of time can generally be reported at AIV - basically, anything that merits an obvious block after cursory investigation can be reported there. There's no 'statute of limitations' on accounts in the same way that there is on IPs - we ask for recent warnings/vandalism on IPs as otherwise we might block unrelated people, but with accounts we know for certain it's the same guy. --Sam Blanning^(talk) 15:16, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Thanks! I would have posted some diffs as evidence, but it would basically have been a copy-and-paste of his contributions log. Powers ^T 16:00, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

They're back. [62] 24.155.148.144 00:53, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

Devon Werkheiser

• Just a heads up, if some people want to watchlist Devon Werkheiser, it's been the target of a really strange vandalism campaign the last few days where the vandals add information on his "death" (the guy is most certainly not dead) from a variety of causes. The anti-vandal bots and a few other users have been getting them so far, but I just thought I'd add it here. Thanks! -- Chabuk 15:16, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

User:66.91.213.98 and Samurai stubs

An IP user User:66.91.213.98 has put {{db-copyvio}} tags on a huge mess of samurai-related stubs, mostly with titles starting with A. From what I can tell, none of those articles are actually copied from the source ( [63]), but the text is, in many cases, derivative. I unfortunately can't finish the job of de-speedying all of those right now. Could someone pick this up? Also, some kind of process should probably be opened to discuss those articles: while each one is distinct from the source (and has been from the start), the number of these articles all with derived text from the same source is worrying. (All the articles in question were created by the same user, too, Darin Fidika (talk · contribs).) Mangojuice^talk 18:59, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

These articles need to be looked at for copyright violation - the source material is clearly cited within the copyvio tag. In all cases, the content of the text is identical with minor rewording. This has been discussed at great length at Lord Ameth's Talk page. The end result was a call to "take whatever actions we deem necessary", so I have gone through and looked at the original source material on the Samurai archives, and have included the direct links in the copyvio tag. The tags I put in should not be removed without first taking a look at the source - the only source - used for these areticles. The definition of copyright violation needs to be discussed, then, however taking a paragraph and changing a few words around but keeping the meaning and idea the same probably should constitute copyright infringement. If someone had noticed this issue 10 months ago, it would not have become such a large job. I was trying to help out all of us contributors by taking care of this. There are well over 100 articles copied from the source website with minor rewording. As has been brought up on the lordameth page, a simply reworded copy of an article probably constitutes copyright violation. Furthermore, that aside, it shows poor scholarship, as these articles can not be verified. "Encyclopedic content must be verifiable."

I'm in the process of removing all these speedy tags. May I suggest to User:66.91.213.98 (and I will do so on his/her talk page) that he/she do a global AFD nomination for these. I understand the copyright concerns, but I'm not going to unilaterally speedy-delete several dozen articles when the copyright violation is not perfectly clear. NawlinWiki 19:15, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Along with what Nawlin says and what is at the top of Wikipedia:Copyright problems, these aren't blatant copyright violations copied from a website with a clear copyright notice. Therefore, these are not a canidates for speedy deletion. WP:PRODing or taking these to WP:AfD would be the best solution. -- moe.RON ^{Let's talk | done} 19:21, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

A mass AfD has been started up now on the issue, in case anyone was curious. It's at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Abe Katsuyoshi. Mangojuice^talk 06:05, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

Reverted links to possible attack pages

I reverted a couple of links to what may have been attack pages against John Pugh, a Member of Parliament for Southport in the UK. (diff 1, diff 2) It's a contentious situation (from a user whom I know from other contexts), so I wanted to have an admin "check over my shoulder" to make sure I didn't jump too fast. Justin Eiler 19:07, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

It looks to me like you're well within the recommendations of WP:LIVING. Jkelly 22:17, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Requested block for User:Wissahickon Creek for disruption

Wissahickon Creek (talk · contribs) has not heeded warnings to cease disrupting Wikipedia, most recently with disruptive pagemoves despite having been asked not to move pages without proper discussion. He has also recently been warned about the scope of his contributions and has ignored advice here and on his talk page[64]. His behavior is consistently disruptive and he has shown a great capability to make discussions less productive, cf WT:RFA, Talk:Alexander the Great, Template talk:Countries of Europe. --Keitei (talk) 20:29, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

From the looks of things, he hasn't done much, or am I missing something? He only moved that page in question once, and has not done so since these warnings. Cowman109^Talk 22:41, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

I suggest you read this discussion. Aecis ^{Dancing to electro-pop like a robot from 1984.} 23:18, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Cowman, If you dig a little you'll see that none of his pagemoves have had consensus. His attitude and personal attacks on people make it particularly difficult for anyone to work with this editor. Someone should be keeping an eye on his behaviour for sure, but it hasn't gotten to the point of needing a block yet. pschemp | talk 23:21, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Imposters Mycroft.Holmz, Hemto

Mycroft.Holmz (talk · contribs), already blocked due to username, is in a content dispute with established account Mycroft.Holmes (talk · contribs). [65] [66] "Holmz" has another imposter sock Hemto (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · nuke contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log), obviously of me, Femto 20:33, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

• Blocked. --Ed (Edgar181) 20:36, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Need some assistance with a user who insists on pumping an article about a car

There is a user (User:Voritecorp) who has repeatedly moved the article HSV Holden to the top of the Wikipedia:Peer review list despite warnings on his Talk Page and in edit summaries. This behavior has occurred at least 5 times and has been reverted each time. I have not been involved in this edit warring but have noticed it happening via my watchlist. As far as I can tell it's not a violation of WP:3RR but it surely violates Wikipedia rules involving commercial promotion. Based on a Google search, Vorite Corporation appears to be related to the sale of cars.

I would like an admin to drop a note on his Talk Page explaining the issue and warning him that he can be blocked for continuing such behavior (if I am correct that this is blockable behavior).

--Richard 22:36, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

The username is disallowed as it is the name of a company that he has been active in promoting on wikipedia. As such that is advertising. Userblocked per username policy. pschemp | talk 23:15, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

User:Deathrocker insists on citing a mirror to make a point

I've tried very hard to communicate with him, however he refuses to reply to any message. On the Aiden article, he insists on citing Artistopia.com (a listed mirror) to verify a piece of negative criticism. I'm not against the criticism if it can be verified, but there are no sources to cite to support the criticism. User:Deathrocker has been very difficult in the matter and refuses to discuss. He would rather revert-without-comment any edit that gets in the way of his agenda. Please help. --EndlessVince 23:26, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Hmm. Deathrocker has violated his revert parole imposed at Wikipedia:Requests for arbitration/Deathrocker by reverting the disputed source 5 times in the last 6 days (he is limited to one revert per day and two per week). I could block him. But I am not inclined to do that because no one has discussed this issue on the article talk page. There's a right way and a wrong way to deal with this kind of content dispute. You're both going about it the wrong way, so I'm not going to drop the block hammer on him just yet. Bring it up on the article talk page, explain why it is a non-reliable source, and if he continues to revert, report it here or at Arbitration enforcement. Thatcher131 00:27, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

Can't see why posting on the articles talk would make a difference, sure it could get wider input, but the user has tried to bring this up directly and (without checking) he apparently has chosen to ignore it. As far as I am aware there is no rule which says "thou shalt use the article talk page rather than approaching an editor directly to resolve an issue", and if there were such a rule, I'd certainly ignore it as being ridiculous. --pgk 07:12, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

EndlessVince requested a source, so I provided one. Which he blanked because he "likes the band". I have made a compromise edit however,[67] putting a "cite" tag inplace of the mentioned source is it is somehow consider "disputable". - Deathrocker 02:08, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

You need to provide a reliable source if you wish to be afforded encyclopedic consideration. El_C 06:44, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

If he insists on a citation, the burden is on you to provide a reliable source for the edit, and it can be removed until you do. Plus you still violated your revert parole. Please be more careful. Thatcher131 06:49, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

User:Naconkantari Improper closing of an AfD with deletion without consensus

I strongly believe that this admin based his decision on his PERSONAL opinion of the article rather than the consensus of the editors involved in the AfD for Andy_Stephenson because that was what his ending comments say he did. I believe this was an abuse of administrator's powers because; 1. There was no consensus, not even close. 2. The rules do not allow for personal opinions in that role. 3. The article absolutely met WP:NOT and WP:BIO. Finally, this AfD was launched for political reasons because the subject of this article is an embarrassment for certain groups of American Ultra-conservatives. Please investigate this matter, especially as regard to whether the rules were followed by the closing admin. BenBurch 01:53, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

That's what the deletion review endorsing the deletion was supposed to deal with. In other words, there are many editors who don't agree with you. (As I believe I was one of them, I won't comment on the issue itself.) — Arthur Rubin | (talk) 01:59, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

(edit conflict) According to his closing comment at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Andy Stephenson, Naconkantari closed the AfD based on the guideline WP:BIO, not based on his personal opinion. "The rules", as you call them, actually allow for administrators to use discretion in closing AfDs, and indeed to close against the numbers if the policy based arguments are stronger on that side. AfD is not a majority vote. As for whether the closing admin followed the rules, the rules are that closing admins should call 'em as they see 'em. If you disagree with a closing, that's what WP:DRV is for. -GTBacchus^(talk) 02:04, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

I thought admins weren't better than regular users? - A Link to the Past (talk) 02:08, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

You're right, admins aren't "better". They are, however, trusted to do things like closing controversial AfDs with an understanding of the complementary roles of policy and consensus at Wikipedia. Naconkantari seems to me to be doing good work in that department. -GTBacchus^(talk) 02:23, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

They don't have any more rights, if that's what you mean? They have extra responsibilities, one of which is to exercise judgement and discretion when closing AFDs. Regards, Ben Aveling 02:14, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

That's not really an extra responsibility. An admin could easily have a no consensus result go in that admin's favor - technically, their input can be enough to cancel out enough keep or delete votes to make it a consensus. - A Link to the Past (talk) 02:16, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

That AFD was a pretty clear delete. The majority of the keep votes were done by blatant sockpuppets anyway. This really isn't the place to discuss this, though. Take this to RFC, not here. ANI is filled with enough improper stuff as it is. Cowman109^Talk 02:17, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

I counted all votes not from sockpuppets or those spammed - 24 delete, 21 keep. - A Link to the Past (talk) 02:22, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

The number of votes isn't really supossed to matter, the points made are, right? If the people voting Delete were making more logical sense than the Keeps, then the result was Delete (or vice versa).--KojiDude ^{(Contributions)} 02:29, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

Oi! Deletion Review is over here. This has no place on WP:AN/I. Thank you, that is all. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 02:31, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

This just came off of DRV. Aiee. —Cryptic 02:36, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

This has been deleted, been through deletion review and through a speedy delete of recreated material. Three different admins closed these three items. Move on. It's gone as it should be. --Tbeatty 02:38, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

Yes, take it to RFC if you want to complain about the administrators. Please, don't reply to this thread any further as this is not the place. Cowman109^Talk 02:42, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

Suspicious accounts

I don't know if this is the place to raise it (and if I should be leaving a message elsewhere, please point me to where I should be going), but I've just seen five accounts make edits to various porn star articles... in each instance the account is in the name of the porn star, and in each instance the link added is to the "biography" of the star at a website which has been pulled out of other pages as being linkspam. I have an extremely strong suspicion that the accounts in question were created strictly to try and lend undue credence to the links being added in an attempt to forestall their removal.

The linkspammed page is always a subpage at dv8.com that is specifically about the star in question.

The accounts in question are:

User:Holly Body, editing Holly Body

User:Jasmin St. Claire, editing Jasmin St. Claire

User:Hyapatia Lee, editing Hyapatia Lee

User:Katja Kean, editing Katja K (Katja Kean is an earlier pseudonym of the actress in question)

User:Sindee Coxx, editing Sindee Coxx

At the least I think these accounts, unless they can be shown to be the celebrity in question, should be blocked. I think it might also be useful to add dv8.com to the blacklist to prevent further attempts to spam that link. Tabercil 03:34, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

Very bizarre. They're obviously the same person, and all the porn actresses were born in 1970 or earlier. Anyone else notice that? Anyway, they're all username blocked. As to blacklisting the link, I think it takes a more widespread problem than this, but if the linkspamming comes back we can certainly look into that. Oh, and this is an appropriate place for something as weird as this. Grandmasterka 04:32, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

Request for Clarification

WP:TGS/WP:GUS/WP:UBM was suppose to be a solution for all the userbox wars and deletions. Let users do as they want in their userspace (WP:JOU). So, here's the question. Admin User:Centrx has deleted User:Royalguard11/userboxes/NDP, along with a ton of other boxes that used to appear on User:Rfrisbie/Userboxes/Political Parties. I thought that T1 didn't extend to userspace. Did policy get modified in the last few days? I'm getting half messages from admins. Some of these userfied userboxes have been here for months. All the sudden, the decision is to get rid of them all? I would like something more than "wikipedia is an encyclopedia", because I know that. I would just like to know if after months of userfying boxes that they aren't all going to get deleted anyways. Userfying was the solution, right? -Royalguard11(Talk·Desk) 04:38, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

It is regretful Centrx did not link to the pertinent discussion in his deletion edit summary. El_C 06:41, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

AOL vandal reverting User:Hu12's edits

Need some help with this, an AOL vandal has been repeatedly reverting many of User:Hu12's edits, and it's quite aggravating to me, as I'm sure it must be to him (ex. diffs: [68], [69], [70], [71]). It's quite likely the spammer is the same as had posted personal information on my userpage from AOL, and was noted as likely through a checkuser here to be the since banned User:EinsteinEdits. As both myself and Hu12 reverted and repeatedly warned this user for his linkspam, and this vandalism started soon after that (and I know, personally, that I haven't done anything that might antagonize anyone here recently), it seems obvious to me that it's the same person doing it. I had been liaising with User:Kylu on this problem (see some messages on her talk page regarding this situation here, however it appears she has gone on Wikibreak. So I figure it's high time I come here, and ask for others to keep an eye on this AOL vandal, and especially Hu12's contributions, since they seem to be getting reverted on a daily basis. Thanks. -- SonicAD (talk) 05:55, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

This appears to be a thebookstandard.com-related effort. El_C 06:30, 31 October 2006 (UTC)