Wikipedia:WikiProject Deletion sorting/Sportspeople

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Sportspeople

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The result was Already moved back to draft. Black Kite (talk) 14:57, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Reza Safaei (volleyball player)

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This article doesn't cite any source. Lynndonald (talk) 06:33, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Speedy delete db-r2 I moved it back to draft two minutes before this AFD was opened. Article creator has a long history of unsourced edits. Captain Calm (talk) 06:39, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Eddie891 ^Talk _Work 14:13, 20 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Nikolaos Okekuoyen

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Non-notable athlete, page was copy-and-paste-moved into mainspace by one of the primary authors, bypassing WP:AFC process. It had been declined already by at least one AFC reviewer as non-notable. Fails WP:NATHLETE. See this old edit for some of the AFC commentary. davidwr/(talk)/(contribs) 01:20, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - Had tagged with WP:CSD#G6 previously from Draft:Nikos Okekuoyen, even if it weren't a copy-paste move, it would be a WP:CSD#A7 — IVORK _Talk 01:23, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I've requested a history merge, so that draft may turn into a redirect shortly. davidwr/(talk)/(contribs) 02:07, 13 November 2020 (UTC) Update: History has been merged. davidwr/(talk)/(contribs) 03:46, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per nom.--SirEdimon ^Dimmi!!! 04:34, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Non notable basketball player. Would need better sources if notability was assumed, which it isn't. ~EDDY ^{(talk/contribs)}~ 23:41, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. No indication from the sole keep vote how this individual meets any guideline. Editors are reminded that disagreements with established guidelines are best discussed at that guidelines talk page Fenix down (talk) 20:23, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Georgie Koutrouvelis

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Does not meet WP:GNG as the coverage is largely WP:ROUTINE and there isn't enough to build a biography from. There is no evidence that she has achieved enough coverage/importance as a footballer or as a physio to warrant an article.

[1] - routine announcement saying that she's signed to the squad
[2] - mentioned once
[3] - describes her as a veteran for Box Hill but no in-depth coverage
[4] - passing mention
[5] - this is her profile for the company that she works for as a physio Spiderone 20:04, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 20:26, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete, does not meet any Wikipedia guideline. Geschichte (talk) 12:12, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per nom. Fails notability guidelines.Less Unless (talk) 18:23, 14 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep - per WP:GNG and WP:SPORTBASIC. N:FOOTY and its essay is inadequate for players in top women's football (soccer) leagues around the world. Hmlarson (talk) 01:23, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. No indication from the sole keep vote how this individual meets any guideline. Editors are reminded that disagreements with established guidelines are best discussed at that guidelines talk page Fenix down (talk) 20:23, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Nicole Jones

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Lack of evidence of notability; looks to fail WP:GNG. I found plenty of passing mentions but nothing hugely substantial.

[6] - this shows she made 13 appearances
[7] - mentioned once
[8] - mentioned that she scored twice in a game that's below W-League level
[9] - passing mention
[10] - mentioned once
[11] - mentioned once

There were other sources but, again, she seems to always just be mentioned in passing. Spiderone 19:44, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 20:00, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete, does not meet any Wikipedia guideline. Geschichte (talk) 12:16, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete does not meet football inclusion criteria.John Pack Lambert (talk) 21:34, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete — fails to satisfy any known notability criteria for inclusion. Celestina007 (talk) 21:43, 14 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep - per WP:GNG and WP:SPORTBASIC. N:FOOTY and its essay is inadequate for players in top women's football (soccer) leagues around the world. Hmlarson (talk) 01:23, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. No indication from the sole keep vote how this individual meets any guideline. Editors are reminded that disagreements with established guidelines are best discussed at that guidelines talk page Fenix down (talk) 20:22, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Lisa Hartley

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Does not appear to pass WP:GNG or WP:BIO; not enough coverage found for 'Lisa Hartley' or 'Lisa Farrington'. She was playing as recently as 2016 but with no recorded appearances, see here. While playing for Central Coast Mariners in 2008, she gained a small amount of notability for being the first W-League player to be sent off [12] [13]. In my view, this isn't sufficient for GNG and it's not enough to build a biography from. Spiderone 19:15, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 20:00, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete, does not meet any Wikipedia guideline. Geschichte (talk) 12:16, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete: Does not meet any guidelines for inclusion or the BLP policy. Adding to two sources (mentioned above that do not advance notability) would not solve BLP issues.
Keep - per WP:GNG and WP:SPORTBASIC. N:FOOTY and its essay is inadequate for players in top women's football (soccer) leagues around the world. Hmlarson (talk) 01:22, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Fenix down (talk) 18:55, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Vitor Prada Maçaneiro

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Article about footballer who has only played semi-professionally except for two 2013 Campeonato Brasileiro Série B matches following an injury to the starting goalkeeper. There is plenty of routine Portuguese-language coverage consisting of transfer announcements and match reports, but no in-depth coverage (the article has a good sampling of the routine coverage available). Although the two Série B matches create a presumption of notability under WP:NFOOTBALL, there is a long-standing consensus that when an article comprehensively fails WP:GNG as this does, the presumption isn't valid. Jogurney (talk) 18:48, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - per nom, might scrape by on NFOOTBALL but fails GNG comprehensively, which is far more important. Giant Snowman 20:03, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - lacks WP:SIGCOV Spiderone 16:54, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Fenix down (talk) 18:53, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Leah Curtis (soccer)

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Does not appear to meet the notability requirements for footballers; her professional career was very brief and she only made two appearances, including one as a substitute. There do not appear to be any WP:RS providing WP:SIGCOV for WP:GNG. Spiderone 17:44, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete, does not meet any Wikipedia guidelines. Geschichte (talk) 18:50, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 18:57, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. JGHowes ^talk 02:55, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Navid Abdolmaleki

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He is not an athlete of the national team and has not participated in important international competitions. His page has been deleted several times in Persian Wikipedia. MohammadJarrari (talk) 18:26, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete According to the World Karate Federation database, Abdolmaleki has never competed at a WKF world or continental championship.[14] In terms of qualifying for the Tokyo Olympics, he is ranked in a tie for 351st in his division.[15] None of the references in the article nor anything I found in my search show significant independent coverage that would support a claim that WP:GNG is met. He does not appear to meet any WP notability criteria. Papaursa (talk) 01:21, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete according to Papaursa explainations. Mr-5 / (M ✉ / C🖋 ) 07:42, 14 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per Papaursa and nom Spiderone 11:37, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Non-notable athlete. Stefka Bulgaria (talk) 08:41, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Missvain (talk) 02:41, 12 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Liam Mulhall

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Relisting after Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Liam Mulhall was closed as "no consensus" and no real improvement has been made to the page.

Does not meet WP:RLN or WP:GNG as the subject has not played for a top-level rugby league club or represented his nation in a major tournament. The sources are mostly non-independent or merely mentions of him. There's a paywalled article that mentions him as a firefighter. The Everything Rugby League article is from a site that solicits article submissions so it doesn't qualify as an WP:RS.

As far as I can tell, the subject of the article is the only editor who's added any significant content, which isn't much. Ytoyoda (talk) 14:21, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete Wikipedia needs to start enforcing its policies against autobiographies.John Pack Lambert (talk) 13:47, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment - another really unhelpful comment, John, what does that actually mean? That Wikipedia policies only work when articles you don't like get deleted? Deus et lex (talk) 23:52, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep - This seems like a bit of an abuse of the AfD process when you relist so soon after the initial listing, along the lines of keep listing until you get your way. Seems like a case of WP:TOOSOON but I'd be prepared to keep given he's listed to coach the Delaware Black Foxes in the upcoming 2021 season and that's not far away. Deus et lex (talk) 23:52, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: I don't know that he's going to be notable for being the coach of an American Rugby League club that gets little to no independent coverage. And I don't think it's an abuse of AFD considering the subject has had almost 2 months to improve the article since the other AfD and hasn't made any effort to improve the notability claim beyond adding the aforementioned article and removing article issue templates. Again, I don't think it's encouraging when no one other than the article subject is willing to contribute to the article. Ytoyoda (talk) 18:17, 18 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: The fact that the club has an article means that there is a valid alternative to deletion which you are required to consider before nominating for deletion. And you also need to remember that Wikipedia is a work in progress - there is no time pressure to improve an article before it is deleted. 2 months is not a great deal of time. The previous AfD made no suggestion of ways to improve the article. Deus et lex (talk) 23:50, 18 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete Doesn't meet GNG- its all just names on a list from team listings connected to the subject, passing mentions and there are no less than three forum posts?! out of ten references; barely any of the refs appear to be reliable sources to start with. The closest to in depth in an RS we get is the AFR ref from 2019 "Liam Mulhall, 38, a fireman who served with the RAAF, said he had been diagnosed with total and permanent disability injuries by six specialists, including two psychiatrists, and told by medical specialists he could not work or be retrained for another job. Mr Mulhall said: "It took me seven months to find out whether they will accept a claim. Even though I have six specialists they kept adding more clauses, more loopholes, more forms, more questions." Mr Mulhall's claim was approved this month because of injuries caused when he was a fireman." That's it. Curdle (talk) 14:26, 18 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Barkeep49 (talk) 15:32, 21 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete he fails any relevant WP:SNG and has never been significantly covered by a non-independent source per WP:GNG. Non-notable league player, unfortunately. SportingFlyer T·C 16:06, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment - what about the valid alternatives to deletion? You haven't shown that they are inappropriate. Deus et lex (talk) 12:23, 26 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  - I have to show they're inappropriate when the article that was the suggested redirect was recently deleted? SportingFlyer T·C 11:57, 28 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Absorb Add these details in the Delaware Black Foxes article, as that page appears to have had player RLN applied to a club, where this player and coach of this club would fail notability but the club itself would not be constrained by those rules.Fleets (talk) 08:09, 28 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

That AfD discussion didn't even mention RLN. SportingFlyer T·C 11:56, 28 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I agree it should not have been deleted.Fleets (talk) 12:00, 28 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not agreeing with you. I'm saying that the other article was deleted for not having any reliable sources, and no reliable sources were available to add. It had nothing to do with the SNG. SportingFlyer T·C 13:18, 28 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

No worries, google came up with 743k pages, I'm sure you just missed those by mistake.Fleets (talk) 13:59, 28 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Not sure why I'm still engaging here, but not only did I get around 2,950 Google hits in my search for that article just now, but Google hits aren't what we use to determine notability. Removing the quotes brought up... a lot of articles about foxes, since the fox is the state animal of Delaware. SportingFlyer T·C 15:42, 28 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

To piggyback, those 2,950 are mostly match reports, social media links and stats, hits that do not establish notability. As far as I can tell, you're basically left with two very similar articles created after the Black Foxes article that appear to rely almost entirely on quotes from Mr. Mulhall and the club itself. Ytoyoda (talk) 14:20, 30 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Missvain (talk) 20:50, 4 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete I don't see significant independent coverage of him that would meet WP:GNG. I also see nothing that would show he meets WP:ANYBIO. Being a former semi-pro rugby player and coach do not meet any notability criteria. Perhaps a redirect to the team page on WP would be reasonable, if it hadn't been previously deleted. Papaursa (talk) 22:10, 11 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was keep. Ignoring SPAs, there is one delete !vote other than nom (who apparently !voted again below). Pretty clear case here. (non-admin closure) Smartyllama (talk) 17:07, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Jordan Chatman

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Reason Innosport99 (talk) 06:35, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Automated comment: This AfD was not correctly transcluded to the log (step 3). I have transcluded it to Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Log/2020 November 11. —^{cyberbot I}_{Talk to my owner:Online} 06:58, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep Passes WP:GNG with sources already in the article, for instance [16][17][18] - Alvaldi (talk) 08:44, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Speedy Keep no reason given for nomination.--User:Namiba 13:26, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep - clearly has WP:SIGCOV so I can't see why this is up for deletion Spiderone 15:01, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: it's up for deletion since the nominator claims he is the subject and wants it deleted. Geschichte (talk) 15:58, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep - Meets WP:GNG. Not sure why the creator’s request needs to be honored (whether he is the subject or not). As we all know, once you add to Wikipedia it isn’t your “property” anymore. I don’t see any WP:BLP concerns with the prose and the creator hasn’t given a reason other than “I don’t want it anymore.” If the concern is the birthdate, that could be removed though if you Google the subject it is widely available. Rikster2 (talk) 00:10, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete It’s my opinion that this article doesn’t meet the criteria for biographies of living persons because the subject does not pass the notability (people) criteria. For nobility (sports), the subject is a basketball player but he does not meet any of the criteria:

Basketball figures are presumed notable if they 1. Have appeared in one game as either a player or head coach in the original American Basketball Association, Liga ACB, EuroLeague, National Basketball Association, National Basketball League (Australia), National Basketball League (United States), Lega Basket Serie A, Women's National Basketball Association, Greek Basket League, or Israeli Basketball Premier League. 2. Were selected in the first two rounds of the NBA draft. 3. Have won an award, or led the league in a major statistical category, of the Continental Basketball Association or NBA G League. The subject meets none of this criteria--User:Innosport99 23:54, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Innosport99: The WP:NBASKETBALL guideline states it is used to help evaluate whether or not a sports person or sports league/organization (amateur or professional) is likely to meet the general notability guideline, and thus merit an article in Wikipedia. It further states failure to meet these criteria does not mean an article must be deleted as it still has to pass WP:GNG. The subject of the article passes WP:GNG as it has significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject. - Alvaldi (talk) 08:58, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

However the question here is should we still have the article in the face of the living subject of the article not wanting us to have an article on them.John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:04, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete Chatman was never so notable that we absolutely have to have an article on him. If he wants some privacy now that he has left public basketball play we should respect this desire.John Pack Lambert (talk) 14:34, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep As mentioned above, there are sufficient sources to meet GNG, and it's very possible I would have created the article if User:Innosport99 did not. If Innosport is indeed Chatman, we can remove some personal details like date of birth if he wishes, although this information is easily found online. There are no real grounds for deleting this though -- it doesn't defame him and is well sourced. ~EDDY ^{(talk/contribs)}~ 18:09, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete We could create articles about thousands of other collegiate turned small level pro athletes in a variety of sports. It was requested to be deleted and there is no good reason to this keep this article so favor I deletion.User:Watsonc779 (talk) 22:56, 12 November 2020 (UTC) — Watsonc779 (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. [reply]
Keep. Meets WP:GNG, per all above. Like Rikster said, nothing in the article is even remotely controversial, so there are no legitimate BLP concerns here. If things like his religion, names of his parents/girlfriend, etc. need to be removed, that is an editing issue, not a deletion issue. Ejgreen77 (talk) 05:19, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Hasn't played in any notable basketball leagues. There's no need for this article. SirAlbertEinstein (talk) 14:53, 14 November 2020 (UTC) — SirAlbertEinstein (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. [reply]
- Comment The closing admin should note that the user SirAlbertEinstein seems to have been created with the single purpose of posting a delete vote on this AFD. - Alvaldi (talk) 20:14, 14 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. As per all. Sabrebofr (talk) 12:13, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Fenix down (talk) 12:50, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Michael Kamure

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A biographical article that fails WP:GNG and WP:BIO; he has not played or managed at a level to pass WP:NFOOTY and all that comes up in a search are Wikipedia mirrors. Spiderone 11:54, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 19:34, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Fenix down (talk) 11:03, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Christian Dlopst

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Not relevant, never played on a professional level. XaviYuahanda (talk) 10:45, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Automated comment: This AfD was not correctly transcluded to the log (step 3). I have transcluded it to Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Log/2020 November 10. —^{cyberbot I}_{Talk to my owner:Online} 10:57, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 19:34, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete does not meet our insanely overbroad inclusion criteria for footballers.John Pack Lambert (talk) 14:19, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete, too low-tier player. Geschichte (talk) 11:54, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete: Fails GNG for football players Shahoodu (talk) 07:57, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Fenix down (talk) 08:53, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Stephen Onyango

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Footballer who fails GNG and NFOOTY. The player never player for NT or in Sweden, no sources support that. In fact, most of the article is a mess that's created by copypasting bits from other players' pages and then editing them (very sloppy, just look at edit histoty). --BlameRuiner (talk) 08:52, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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G3 Seems like a Hoax and one or two sites got duped! This also raises questions about Jeancy1988 who created this. Govvy (talk) 16:23, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - excellent work from BlameRuiner; looks to be a hoax although a fairly elaborate one Spiderone 17:23, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Speedly Delete non notable, fail all criteria

Lynndonald (talk) 17:27, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 19:33, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete as per non - No sources to support the notabilityShahoodu (talk) 07:55, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note Also, the photo of the player is fake, it's someone's head pasted on top of another player photo. Govvy (talk) 13:12, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- I figured the same, but coundn't find the source photos for either head or the shirt by reverse image search to prove it :) --BlameRuiner (talk) 14:20, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  - I recon the shirt bit is probably from one of the player profiles on http://www.maif.se/index.php but from a previous season as if you look at the shirts now, there are differences. [19] Govvy (talk) 15:46, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Fenix down (talk) 07:47, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Kristi Harvey

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Footballer who played only 3 games in a league which fails WP:FOOTYN in that it's not listed here, and also per precedence in this discussion, this discussion, this discussion and this discussion. Geschichte (talk) 06:03, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - appears to get more coverage now that she has switched sports but still not enough for WP:GNG; passing mentions like [20] [21] [22] [23] and then one in-depth source [24] which is not independent Spiderone 10:47, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 19:32, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Fenix down (talk) 07:47, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Ebony Weidenbach

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Footballer who played only 6 games in a league which fails WP:FOOTYN in that it's not listed here, and also per precedence in this discussion, this discussion, this discussion and this discussion. Geschichte (talk) 06:24, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - does not appear to pass WP:GNG; does get coverage but not in-depth [25] [26] [27] [28] [29] and not enough to build a biography from Spiderone 10:42, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 19:32, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. Doesn’t meet WP:GNG or WP:NFOOTBALL. Elms^super 05:48, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete does not meet our already overly broad inclusion criteria for footballers.John Pack Lambert (talk) 14:24, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Fenix down (talk) 07:48, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Daniela Di Bartolo

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Footballer who played only 10 games in a league which fails WP:FOOTYN in that it's not listed here, and also per precedence in this discussion, this discussion, this discussion and this discussion. Geschichte (talk) 06:23, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 19:32, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete does not meet our ludicously overbroad inclusion criteria for footballers.John Pack Lambert (talk) 14:20, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Weak delete - has one in-depth reference that could be used to expand the article in Adelaide Now but I couldn't find anything else Spiderone 10:09, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Fenix down (talk) 08:52, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Imran Chamkhanov

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Footballer whose claim to fame is 2 matches in the Moldovan league. Other appearances are in semi-pro or amateur leagues. Geschichte (talk) 08:08, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - Article about non-notable footballer with two league appearances in the Moldovan top division. There is only routine online coverage (transfer announcements, database entries) in English- or Russian-language sites. The presumption of notability in NFOOTBALL is not valid when GNG is so comprehensively failed. Jogurney (talk) 18:27, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - scraping by on NFOOTBALL is insufficient given lack of GNG/coverage. Giant Snowman 19:32, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per all of the above Spiderone 10:05, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. I think the argument about UNDUE weight is persuasive enough not to close as merge. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 01:14, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Kyle Gaedele

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Baseball player who never made it past the AA level (and even at the AA level, he only played 67 games) His great uncle Eddie Gaedel is quite famous in the baseball world as the smallest player ever to appear in a Major League Baseball game. (If you don't know the story, the article is a fun read) But of course, notability is not inherited and Kyle Gaedele does not meet the requirements of WP:NBASE. Pichpich (talk) 22:08, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete Fails WP:NBASE. Smattering of the traditional minor league baseball player coverage, but no indication that he's notable. SportingFlyer T·C 22:11, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - fails WP:GNG and WP:NBASE.Onel5969 ^{TT me} 22:48, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Merge any relevant, worthwhile, and referenced information into Eddie Gaedel (he already has a paragraph in that article so might have this one covered), Chicago Dogs, and Ottawa (independent pro baseball), as appropriate; and Delete or Redirect to Eddie Gaedel. It seems like there's information here that is suitable for these articles, although undeserving of a standalone article. ~EdGl talk 01:31, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I did consider the possibility of a merge but I feel that the paragraph about Kyle Gaedele in the Eddie Gaedel article is giving him undue importance. It's a fairly random connection. After all Eddie was never a true baseball player so using a baseball connection with his grandnephew is like connecting, say, a notable opera singer with a grandnephew who is a non-notable football player.

Delete - Fails GNG. - Bbny-wiki-editor (talk) 01:10, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 07:23, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Mitch Craft

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Came here from the WikiProject page. Craft fails WP:GNG, WP:GRIDIRON and WP:ACTOR. The only significant coverage I could find on his college career was about a suspension having to do with a crime he committed, he never played in the NFL, "Mitch Craft" "Rattlers" brings up no results in a non-Google search, and I also cannot find any coverage of his acting career, which IMDB notes has been mostly uncredited roles to this point. SportingFlyer T·C 21:05, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete. Fails WP:NGRIDIRON as he never appeared in a regular season game in one of the designated leagues. Further, the significant coverage I found relates to his suspension for an incident that occurred when he was a 20-year-old college student. E.g. this and this.For these reasons the article raises a WP:BLP1E concern. I also agree with the nom on the uncredited acting roles. Cbl62 (talk) 22:06, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Not a notable athlete, and his offense was fairly minor. Cullen³²⁸ Let's discuss it 01:34, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep Seen articles and/or figures on wiki with less credentials and by far less notable for sure. I can actually find many articles on google on this person. — Preceding unsigned comment added by ABeeez (talk • contribs) — ABeeez (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.

@ABeeez: If you have significant coverage of Craft from reliable, independent sources, please present it. Folks may change their mind if there is such coverage. Cbl62 (talk) 18:27, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note to closer: The ABeez account was created after this AfD was opened and its first edit was to vote "Keep" on this AfD. Cbl62 (talk) 18:31, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete per nom. WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS matters not at all. Clarityfiend (talk) 08:04, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep checks out with me. Plus more credited acting roles than uncredited. And if this page is deleted you have to delete examples) Anthony Shutt and London Crawford for the same reasoning. Signed, DSchemer. DSchemer (talk)DSchemer (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 16:18, 10 November 2020 (UTC)— DSchemer (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. [reply]

@DSchemer: If you believe the Shutt and Crawford should also be deleted, feel free to nominate them. However, the existence of those articles is not a valid reason to keep this one. See WP:Other stuff exists. Cbl62 (talk) 18:27, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Checkuser note: ABeeez and DSchemer are confirmed to be the same user per Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/ABeeez. Mz7 (talk) 19:50, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete Did not find any substantial WP:GNG sources for his gridiron career. WP:TOOSOON as an actor; mostly uncredited or unnamed background roles. Yosemiter (talk) 18:20, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. Fails WP:NGRIDIRON, WP:NCOLLATH, and WP:GNG, per all above. Ejgreen77 (talk) 05:04, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Fenix down (talk) 22:21, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Raymond Vincenti

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A biographical article on a person that does not appear to meet WP:GNG; no indication of significance or importance.

PROD was an article on a referee with no assertion or evidence of being able to meet WP:GNG

DePROD reason deprod - may be notable for refeering at world cup

Worth further discussion. A WP:BEFORE search revealed:

[30] - No results from ProQuest
[31] - passing mention
[32] - passing mention
[33] - passing mention

The French language article is even more brief than this one. Spiderone 20:10, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - no evidence of notability. Giant Snowman 20:30, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Fails GNG. Best Alexandermcnabb (talk) 15:23, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Spartaz ^Humbug! 10:36, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Ayron Schramm

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU and Germany are not a High Performance Union), only brief mentions and news of him joining/leaving sides so not enough significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 18:07, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Comment Sharks are a Super Rugby team, which falls under criterion 2 - how is this not notable? Gbawden (talk)

Gbawden, has never represented the Sharks in a notable competition. Has only represented the Sharks in the Vodacom Cup and Provincial Cup. Only appearances for the Sharks in Super Rugby and Currie Cup would make him notable. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:00, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete fails our notability guidelines for rugby players. Just being on a team does not make one notable, you have to compete in a competition that fits the notability requirements.John Pack Lambert (talk) 14:16, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:27, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - hasn't represented Sharks in a competition that would allow an NRU pass Spiderone 19:36, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. 78.26 _{(spin me / revolutions)} 16:21, 18 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Chris Coyle

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of the player signing for sides so not enough significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 18:09, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable rugby player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 14:18, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. Appears WP:TOOSOON at this time. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:26, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Spartaz ^Humbug! 10:36, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Chris Kunkel

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news on him joining sides so not enough significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 17:33, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable rugby player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 14:18, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:25, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per all of the above Spiderone 23:04, 18 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 22:41, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Matias Cima

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU and no appearances in the tournament anyway), only brief mentions and news of the player signing for sides so no significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 17:36, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable rugby player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 21:24, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:24, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 22:40, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Alex Elkins

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of the player signing for sides so no significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 17:39, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable rugby player lacking truly independent sourcing.John Pack Lambert (talk) 14:12, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:31, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 22:40, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Maka Tameilau

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of the player signing for sides so not enough significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 17:42, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable rugby player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 21:25, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:31, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 22:40, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Pita Moala

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of the player signing for sides so not enough significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 17:45, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable rugby player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:55, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:31, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 22:41, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Derrek Van Klein

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of the player signing for sides so not enough significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 17:48, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable rugby player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 14:22, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:31, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - I'm only seeing profiles/listings in the usual websites, no GNG coverage Spiderone 19:37, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 07:55, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Maximo de Achaval

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of the player signing for sides so not enough significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 17:55, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable rugby player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 21:30, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:30, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 22:41, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Chad Joseph

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of the player signing for sides so not enough significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 17:58, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable rugby player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 14:17, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:29, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 08:28, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Alec Barton

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of the player signing for sides so not enough significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 18:02, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable rugby player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 14:11, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:29, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 22:41, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Drew Gaffney (rugby union)

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of the player signing for sides so not enough significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 18:04, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable rugby player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 14:23, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:29, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was soft delete. Based on minimal participation, this uncontroversial nomination is treated as an expired PROD (a.k.a. "soft deletion"). Editors can request the article's undeletion. TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:08, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Aleksandr Beziazykov

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Fails WP:Bio, not enough reliable, indepth sources yet about him. Fram (talk) 14:22, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Fenix down (talk) 19:33, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Timur Khakimov

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Footballer who fails GNG and NFOOTY. Originally deleted in 2011. Recreated in 2016. As of 2020, the player still fails NFOOTY. BlameRuiner (talk) 12:28, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Automated comment: This AfD was not correctly transcluded to the log (step 3). I have transcluded it to Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Log/2020 November 9. —^{cyberbot I}_{Talk to my owner:Online} 12:54, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 14:49, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - still fails GNG and NFOOTY and with no real likelihood that they will pass it any time soon Spiderone 18:53, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 08:43, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Chris Saint

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of the player signing for sides so not enough significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 11:48, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Note to closer for soft deletion:? This nomination has had limited participation and falls within the standards set for lack of quorum. There are no previous AfD discussions, undeletions, or current redirects and no previous PRODs have been located. This nomination may be eligible for soft deletion at the end of its 7-day listing. --Cewbot (talk) 00:02, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Logs: 2019-10 ✍️ create

Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:15, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 02:15, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Spencer Jones (rugby union)

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of the player signing for sides so not enough significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 11:33, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Logs: 2019-02 ✍️ create

Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:17, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 02:11, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Kolby Francis

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of the player signing for sides so not enough significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 11:29, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:19, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. 78.26 _{(spin me / revolutions)} 16:18, 18 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Steven Ng

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of the player signing for sides so not enough significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 11:24, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Logs: 2019-10 ✍️ create

Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:19, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete fails GNG and NRU so deletion is only option Spiderone 11:37, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 02:11, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Martini Talapusi

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of the player signing for sides so not enough significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 11:19, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Note to closer for soft deletion:? This nomination has had limited participation and falls within the standards set for lack of quorum. There are no previous AfD discussions, undeletions, or current redirects and no previous PRODs have been located. This nomination may be eligible for soft deletion at the end of its 7-day listing. --Cewbot (talk) 00:02, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Logs: 2019-10 ✍️ create

Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:21, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. 78.26 _{(spin me / revolutions)} 16:20, 18 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Tira Patterson

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of the player signing for sides so not enough significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 11:53, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Note to closer for soft deletion:? This nomination has had limited participation and falls within the standards set for lack of quorum. There are no previous AfD discussions, undeletions, or current redirects and no previous PRODs have been located. This nomination may be eligible for soft deletion at the end of its 7-day listing. --Cewbot (talk) 00:03, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Logs: 2019-10 ✍️ create

Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:15, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. 78.26 _{(spin me / revolutions)} 16:20, 18 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Jack Evans (rugby union, born 1997)

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of the player joining sides so not enough significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 11:57, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Logs: 2019-02 ✍️ create

Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:14, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - does not meet any of the mentioned guidelines for inclusion Spiderone 12:04, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 08:29, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Alex Vorster

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of the player signing for sides so not enough significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 12:02, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Logs: 2019-10 ✍️ create

Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:13, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 08:35, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Alex Tucci

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of the player signing for sides so not enough significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 12:05, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Logs: 2019-10 ✍️ create

Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:14, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 02:12, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Ross Deacon

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of the player signing for teams so not enough significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 11:16, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Logs: 2019-09 ✍️ create

Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV / WP:GNG. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:21, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - does not satisfy any of the accepted guidelines for sportspeople Spiderone 22:43, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. 78.26 _{(spin me / revolutions)} 16:17, 18 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Amro Gouda

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so not enough significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 11:12, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Logs: 2019-10 ✍️ create

Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:22, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 02:13, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Marcus Walsh

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not have enough significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 11:07, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Logs: 2019-10 ✍️ create

Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:23, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - no WP:SIRS in Ireland or the US Spiderone 22:43, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 02:13, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

James Denise

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not have significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 11:03, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable rugby player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 17:00, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:23, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - does not meet NRU or GNG Spiderone 20:11, 18 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Eddie891 ^Talk _Work 01:58, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Anthony Parry

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news on him signing for sides for no significant coverage to qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 11:00, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Logs: 2019-10 ✍️ create

Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:24, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - does not meet any inclusion criteria Spiderone 11:36, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was speedy deleted per WP:G5. Sir Sputnik (talk) 00:26, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Gabriel Kunda Jr

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Footballer who fails GNG and NFOOTY. Alleged 14 caps for Zaragoza (from ogol.br source) do not check out. Page previously deleted at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Gabriel Kunda, Jr. --BlameRuiner (talk) 10:49, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete and SALT - no evidence of notability, fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 12:19, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete I was having a look on google, but other than some rumour news, I see no indication that this player even passes WP:GNG, Govvy (talk) 12:22, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep If you can clearly see news articles that say otherwise, i'm befuddled at the fact that the article meets criteria as him making his professional debut, but was nominated for deletion. vivalionel1 (talk) 17:47, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete and SALT - he made his debut but it was in the third tier of Spanish football, which is not fully professional (see WP:FPL). I am not seeing any evidence that he passes our general notability guidelines (WP:GNG) Spiderone 18:56, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

~~Keep~~ It's ludicrous to think he doesn't meet the critiria when the refrences and articles say he does, makes no sense why this article was nominated for deletion. (talk) 19:09, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Striking duplicate vote Spiderone 19:39, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was redirect to 1987–88 FC Basel season#Players. (non-admin closure) (t · c) buidhe 14:40, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Stephan Schaub

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Note: Also Fotios Karapetsas (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)
Two players for FC Basel who both have less than 90 minutes of professional football under their belt. Consensus is that 1–2 games are not enough if the coverage of the player is merely statisticsl, per numerous AFDs here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here and here, and I could have gone on further. Geschichte (talk) 20:31, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete both per nom, fail GNG which is far more important than scraping by on NFOOTBALL. Alternatively redirect to 1987–88 FC Basel season#Players. Giant Snowman 22:11, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect I was thinking delete but after GS comments I feel there is actually some merit in the redirect. Govvy (talk) 12:17, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
keep Both of these articles are correct, do not deleat. Both players were professional at that time. All I am trying to do with my edits, is increase the coverage of Swiss football on Wiki. If the two correct articles are kept they could be improved by somebody who knows more information about the two players. If the two articles are deleated we will never find out. Greetings from Switzerland --Huligan0 (talk) 01:11, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comment @Huligan0: Nothing wrong in your process or what you did, there is very little on the articles and the players. If you are able to find other information on them to improve the articles I could change my vote. You can always have them moved into your sandbox for now. You could always create a type of list article to show these players, I am sure there are a few more of them around to constitute a decent article. Govvy (talk) 11:30, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Answer Thanks for the positive imput :-) As suggested, I have copied both pages into my sandbox. But as far as I can see from the imputs to date, there is not going to be a decision, because there are not all that many inputs so far. Again, I just suggest that we keep the articles just in case that there are going to be improvements made from other users who know or find further information. Again, all I am trying to do with my edits, is to increase the coverage of Swiss football, especially the history of FC Basel. As far as I am concerned, these two players have contributed to the history of the club. I wish everybody a very nice Sunday --Huligan0 (talk) 23:18, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Redirect both per GiantSnowman and Govvy - no evidence that either player garnered significant coverage to pass WP:GNG during their extraordinarily brief careers Spiderone 07:59, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Missvain (talk) 00:53, 4 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Michael Reid (rugby union)

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of player signing for teams so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 20:54, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Oppose Seems to me to meet WP:GNG, as the sources are “substantial coverage”, viz. articles about Reid and not brief mentions. Moonraker (talk) 06:49, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don't believe any of the sources on the page or that I can find are 'substantial coverage', that are independent of the source/tournament. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:46, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Moonraker: Please provide evidence of substantial coverage in multiple independent reliable sources per the requirements of WP:GNG. Making claims of WP:SOURCESEXIST needs to be supported in the AfD. Minimal transactional coverage in WP:ROUTINE sources are not typically considered to meet WP:GNG. Of the five sources currently listed: #1 is a mention in a list (not substantial), #2 is a routine transaction report with two paragraphs about the teams he has played for (and is on USA-specific rubgy site, run by and written by a single editor), #3 is primary, #4 is the same source as #2 (so it does not meet the multiple requirement) and half of it is a copy-n-paste from the primary press release as well as it being transaction coverage, and #5 (which seems to be a website that no longer exists, so I highly doubt it would meet WP:RS) is also transaction coverage. Essentially, the only thing verifiable in the current article about the subject is that they were a member of certain clubs, nothing substantial. Yosemiter (talk) 17:39, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Yosemiter, the WP:GNG doesn’t say “multiple”, which is just as well, as the meaning would be debatable. It does use the plural “sources”, which seems to mean more than one, although hardly anyone seems to challenge notability if it comes from one major source. The word “typically” is vague, too. The question is simply whether there is significant coverage in reliable sources. If you are suggesting the sources here are not reliable, do please say more. Moonraker (talk) 21:02, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Moonraker: From GNG: "Sources" should be secondary sources, as those provide the most objective evidence of notability. There is no fixed number of sources required since sources vary in quality and depth of coverage, but multiple sources are generally expected. Yes, GNG is purposely meant to be slightly vague, but there is typically a consensus. Wikipedia is rarely explicit in its guidelines, that is why they are guidelines and not policies. I am simply explaining what is normally expected in an AfD for WP:BLP. Yosemiter (talk) 21:05, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

That’s fair enough, Yosemiter. What’s “generally expected” is clearly not essential, as made clear by “There is no fixed number of sources required...” I do not see any solid challenge to the reliability of the sources. You cannot dismiss a source because it is used twice, simply on the basis of a “multiple requirement” which is not there. Moonraker (talk) 21:12, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

None of the sources in the article though look to qualify it for WP:GNG, as stated by Yosemiter signing articles are just WP:ROUTINE and very often aren't independent. Having looked through them and done a google search I can find no sources that are secondary and reliable, and the coverage that is there is far and a way NOT significant. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 21:23, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Moonraker: Moonraker: You cannot dismiss a source because it is used twice. From GNG (continued): "Sources" should be secondary sources, as those provide the most objective evidence of notability. There is no fixed number of sources required since sources vary in quality and depth of coverage, but multiple sources are generally expected...Multiple publications from the same author or organization are usually regarded as a single source for the purposes of establishing notability. Yosemiter (talk) 21:33, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Moonraker: on a second note, I am fairly certain I did challenge the sources provided in my first comment. Doug Coil is the main editor of DJ Coil, and the rest are mostly his own family, which probably does not meet WP:RS per WP:CONTEXTMATTERS. He almost exclusively covers match results and transactions, which makes his page a good source for WP:V but not necessarily for WP:N. They do sometimes do player profiles, which would be more than ROUTINE, but I didn't see one here. I already talked about the other three listed sources: #1 mention, #3 primary, and #5 is the defunct site that was simply a copy-n-paste job of the primary press release as evidenced by the exact same statement in the DJCoil article. I have not otherwise done a WP:BEFORE, I am just pointing out the listed sources are probably not sufficient to meet WP:GNG. Yosemiter (talk) 23:56, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

This is my view as well Yosemiter, and hence why I have flagged large numbers of these articles for not qualifying for WP:GNG and WP:NRU, not just because they don't qualify for WP:NRU. Obviously all are on a case by case basis but I have been through the sources/searched for sources on all of them and the majority are from the same/similar sources as on this articfle. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:26, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete Now that I have done a more thorough source search, I am still not seeing anything other than transaction reports for this Michael Reid. Searches turned up very little in relation to the MLR member, although he was a bit mixed in with another Michael Reid that was in charge of Ulster Rugby for many years. If someone else can find better sources than those currently provided or that I could find in my own searches, then I would reconsider. Yosemiter (talk) 15:01, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Spartaz ^Humbug! 21:56, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete All of the sources presented are either not independent or not significant. In particular, all independent sources are clearly those that are disqualified under WP:SPORTCRIT Trivial coverage of a subject by secondary sources may be used to support content in an article, but it is not sufficient to establish notability. This includes listings in database sources with low, wide-sweeping generic standards of inclusion... Eggishorn (talk) (contrib)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, King of ♥ ♦ ♣ ♠ 01:13, 26 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete none of the sources available pass WP:GNG, which isn't a surprise given the other US based rugby players we've seen at AfD. SportingFlyer T·C 13:33, 28 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - there is no evidence to suggest that Reid meets NRU or the wider biographical notability guidelines at WP:BASIC Spiderone 08:04, 2 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 09:07, 24 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Josh Brown (rugby union)

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of player signing for teams so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 20:52, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Oppose Seems to me to meet WP:GNG, as the sources are “substantial coverage”, viz. articles about Brown and not brief mentions. But I would suggest adding a {{refimprove}} tag. Moonraker (talk) 06:52, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don't believe any of the sources on the page or that I can find are 'substantial coverage', that are independent of the source/tournament. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:46, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moonraker, as has been discussed here can you show which of the sources in the article provide enough significant coverage for it to pass WP:GNG or if there are other sources that you believe enough to allow it to pass WP:GNG can you provide them. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:33, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete no evidence of sources that actually show notability.John Pack Lambert (talk) 17:06, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Spartaz ^Humbug! 21:55, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete – Does not meet WP:GNG. All news sources I found were merely mentions or WP:ROUTINE transactions, primarily covered in less-than WP:RS sites. Yosemiter (talk) 18:08, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 20:42, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Jack McLean (American rugby player)

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of the player signing for teams so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 20:49, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Oppose Seems to me to meet WP:GNG, as the sources are “substantial coverage”, viz. articles about McLean and not brief mentions. Moonraker (talk) 06:53, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don't believe any of the sources on the page or that I can find are 'substantial coverage', that are independent of the source/tournament. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:46, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moonraker, as has been discussed here can you show which of the sources in the article provide enough significant coverage for it to pass WP:GNG or if there are other sources that you believe enough to allow it to pass WP:GNG can you provide them. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:34, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete – Coverage consists of a single WP:ROUTINE transaction with very little depth. The WP:COPYVIO from this article does not help either. Yosemiter (talk) 20:02, 18 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete since subject doesn't meet WP:NRU, or even WP:GNG. -The Gnome (talk) 14:12, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - sources do not establish notability Spiderone 20:22, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 20:43, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Matt Hughston

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news on the player signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 20:46, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Oppose Seems to me to meet WP:GNG, as the sources provide “substantial coverage”, viz. articles about Hughston and not brief mentions. Moonraker (talk) 06:55, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don't believe any of the sources on the page or that I can find are 'substantial coverage', that are independent of the source/tournament. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:47, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moonraker, as has been discussed here can you show which of the sources in the article provide enough significant coverage for it to pass WP:GNG or if there are other sources that you believe enough to allow it to pass WP:GNG can you provide them. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:34, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete the sourcing is not the type that passes GNG.John Pack Lambert (talk) 17:15, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete fails WP:GNG. The sources are not independent of the subject or its leagues, or are unreliable. SportingFlyer T·C 14:15, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - lack of quality sources available for GNG Spiderone 22:44, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Feel free to redirect of you wish. Missvain (talk) 00:53, 4 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Jake Turnbull

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 20:42, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Oppose Seems to me this article might be able to meet WP:GNG, as the sources are borderline “substantial coverage”. Better to add a refimprove tag here. Moonraker (talk) 06:58, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don't believe any of the sources on the page or that I can find are 'substantial coverage', that are independent of the source/tournament. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:47, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moonraker, as has been discussed here can you show which of the sources in the article provide enough significant coverage for it to pass WP:GNG or if there are other sources that you believe enough to allow it to pass WP:GNG can you provide them. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:35, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete there are not enough substantial sources to pass GNG.John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:52, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete None of the sources I've found are independent of the player's league or team, or are reliable (blog post). SportingFlyer T·C 14:14, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - does not appear to be able to meet GNG Spiderone 12:52, 22 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect No solid reason has been given to justify the deletion of this content while valid alternatives exist. If he is not worthy of a standalone article this can be redirected somewhere. duffbeerforme (talk) 13:38, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Duffbeerforme, please can you explain what the 'valid alternatives' would be, the player does not pass notability guidelines for rugby players at WP:NRU or general notability at WP:GNG. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 13:40, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Turnball is mentioned in 2016 Denver Stampede season, Old Glory DC, Denver Stampede, 2016 PRO Rugby season, 2018 Major League Rugby season, List of 2019–20 Major League Rugby transfers. Pick the best target and redirect there. duffbeerforme (talk) 13:46, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Not sure how suitable any of those redirects are, he has spent short periods of time at all of the clubs (none you could consider the main from his career), and the other two are just list pages. Would a redirect really be suitable? Rugbyfan22 (talk) 13:50, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

WHich in part is why stand alone articles are useful. All this content is verifiable. He has been covered in the press. Original research is not required to build this page. What seems to be a current push to delete suche verifiable content seems misguided. Why delete when you can cover in other ways. Played just one game? include in a list. Played for lots of teams? Redirect to a list for the most prominent team, mention the others. Pick the best alternative but no need to delete. duffbeerforme (talk) 14:00, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

If the person in question does not meet notability guidelines as per WP:GNG or WP:NRU then a article should not exist for that person and per Yosemiter below. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 14:19, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Same as my comment at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Dylan Taikato-Simpson, this is not a suitable redirect per WP:XY. Yosemiter (talk) 14:15, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Redirect to one of the articles duffbeerforme has suggested - he is spot on. Rugbyfan's claim that an article should not exist does not remove the requirement to consider alternatives to deletion if there is insufficient notability. Deus et lex (talk) 09:58, 27 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Deus et lex, as has been stated by myself and Yosemiter, redirects aren't suitable here due to WP:XY. There are no suitable redirects for this player as if in the very small chance someone was to search for Jake Turnbull, they may be looking for many different things. There is no stand out club from his career or season in which he won awards. Just because he is linked on the aforementioned pages does not mean there is a suitable redirect there. A more detailed discussion on this was held at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Dylan Taikato-Simpson. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:26, 27 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I don't agree. That policy does not stop a suitable redirect from being found and duffbeerforme has found several. You're just opposed to anything that would thwart your proposal to delete this article. Deus et lex (talk) 10:39, 27 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Deus et lex, Let's go through the suggested redirects then. 2016 Denver Stampede season (1 season American pro league, link is to him being signed and in the squad, not really a suitable redirect), Old Glory DC (no longer linked to this page, guessing the link was to him in the squad, only made 5 appearances for them), Denver Stampede (Link is to him being in the squad, team no longer exists), 2016 PRO Rugby season (link is for him receiving a yellow card in one match, and joining the short-lived competition), 2018 Major League Rugby season (Link again to him receiving a yellow card in a game), List of 2019–20 Major League Rugby transfers (no longer linked to this page, guessing link was his transfer from one side to another). None of these are suitable redirects. I'm not saying there isn't a suitable redirect out there, but no suitable one has been provided and if one cannot be found I don't see another option is the consensus is for the page to be deleted. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:56, 27 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Already !voted delete, but none of the possible redirects are appropriate here in my opinion per WP:XY. SportingFlyer T·C 13:32, 28 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. (I meant to delete, not relist) Missvain (talk) 00:52, 4 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Mo Katz

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for teams so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 20:39, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Oppose Seems to me to meet WP:GNG, as the sources are “substantial coverage”, viz. articles about Katz and not brief mentions. Article does need better referencing. Moonraker (talk) 07:00, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don't believe any of the sources on the page or that I can find are 'substantial coverage', that are independent of the source/tournament. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:48, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moonraker, as has been discussed here can you show which of the sources in the article provide enough significant coverage for it to pass WP:GNG or if there are other sources that you believe enough to allow it to pass WP:GNG can you provide them. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:35, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete the sourcing is not such that the article can pass GNG.John Pack Lambert (talk) 17:19, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete – Fails to meet WP:GNG. No news hits under "Mo Katz" or "Timothy Katz". He gets mentioned in a few lists and WP:ROUTINE transaction reports, and they are mostly of the WP:PRIMARY or non-WP:RS variety. Yosemiter (talk) 18:15, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete Fails WP:GNG pretty easily, sources aren't independent/reliable. SportingFlyer T·C 13:36, 28 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - only trivial/routine coverage available Spiderone 16:10, 28 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. King of ♥ ♦ ♣ ♠ 01:14, 26 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Kyle Rogers

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for teams so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 20:36, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Oppose Seems to me to meet WP:GNG, as the sources are “substantial coverage”, viz. articles about Rogers and not brief mentions. Starting to wonder if you are proposing the deletion of a whole squad, if so I do wonder what is going on here. Moonraker (talk) 06:44, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don't believe any of the sources on the page or that I can find are 'substantial coverage', that are independent of the source/tournament. Large numbers of articles were created under the basis that they passed WP:NRU (Major League Rugby was added with no discussion before being removed), and so pages have been created that are not notable. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:49, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moonraker, as has been discussed here can you show which of the sources in the article provide enough significant coverage for it to pass WP:GNG or if there are other sources that you believe enough to allow it to pass WP:GNG can you provide them. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:35, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete, there is no independent significant coverage there, and the level within the sport is too low. Geschichte (talk) 08:04, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete – Fails to meet WP:GNG. No news hits and only covered in WP:ROUTINE transactions or list-based mentions. Yosemiter (talk) 17:25, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - plenty of routine coverage which does not amount to passing GNG Spiderone 11:34, 25 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. King of ♥ ♦ ♣ ♠ 01:14, 26 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Cameron Troxler

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 20:33, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Oppose Seems to me to meet WP:GNG, as at least one source is “substantial coverage”, viz. an article about Troxler and not a brief mention. Moonraker (talk) 07:06, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don't believe any of the sources on the page or that I can find are 'substantial coverage', that are independent of the source/tournament. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:49, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moonraker, as has been discussed here can you show which of the sources in the article provide enough significant coverage for it to pass WP:GNG or if there are other sources that you believe enough to allow it to pass WP:GNG can you provide them. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:35, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete – No hits in reliable news sources for either Cameron or Cam Troxler. As far as I can see, the only media source that covers him is DJCoil Rugby (which I pointed out previously, is on the low end of WP:RS due to WP:RSCONTEXT; Doug Coil is essentially the only writer and editor for that website). Mr. Coil did at least appear to give the subject a full "profile" that would seem to make that single source less than WP:ROUTINE. However, outside of single paragraph added (which consists of his entire 2019 season summary: "Cam played 8 minutes in two matches"), it is copy-n-paste identical to the his routine transaction summary of clubs he once played for shown here. As there are no other independent reliable sources of significant depth, he currently fails WP:GNG. Yosemiter (talk) 19:07, 18 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete No indication of significant coverage. Does not qualify under WP:GNG or WP:NRU. Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 19:39, 24 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - no coverage for 'Cameron Troxler' or 'Cam Troxler' that would be enough for GNG Spiderone 21:41, 25 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Spartaz ^Humbug! 16:13, 9 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Jojo Tikoisuva

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for teams so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 20:30, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Oppose Article does need better referencing, but your attack seems to be on all Major League Rugby and not on individual articles. Moonraker (talk) 07:09, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don't believe any of the sources on the page or that I can find are 'substantial coverage', that are independent of the source/tournament. These players in my opinion do not qualify for WP:GNG along with WP:NRU as stated on my talk page. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:50, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moonraker, as has been discussed here can you show which of the sources in the article provide enough significant coverage for it to pass WP:GNG or if there are other sources that you believe enough to allow it to pass WP:GNG can you provide them. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:36, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Moonraker: Please refrain from casting aspersions about the nominator's intent unless you have evidence and keep your analysis to the article in question. "Artcle does need better referencing" is a WP:SOURCESEXIST argument, please show they exist. Thank you, Yosemiter (talk) 21:29, 18 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Yosemiter this is not a court, it is a discussion. The nominator has proposed a huge number of articles on rugby players for deletion and what links them all is that they have played in Major League Rugby. Moonraker (talk) 09:38, 20 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moonraker, Again, this was because these players don't qualify for WP:NRU AND WP:GNG. There is very little coverage of the league and the players in the league, and so I have AfD'd the ones that I believe don't qualify. There have be many that I have found that don't qualify for WP:NRU but there is enough coverage to qualify for WP:GNG. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 12:50, 20 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Weak Delete – This player actually does have one pretty good WP:GNG source Walker: For NOLA Gold's Jojo Tikoisuva, the game of rugby helped him beat the game of life in The Times-Picayune/The New Orleans Advocate. However, everything else is transaction WP:ROUTINE coverage with a basic synopsis listing clubs he has played with lacking depth or WP:RS. The player has made some lower tier national team appearances, if he is on a team that ever makes it to a larger stage, then the player may receive some significant coverage, but that would be WP:TOOSOON right now. Yosemiter (talk) 21:15, 18 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep the Times-Picayune is a major regional paper and a longish-article about this one person is exactly what we want to establish notability. The article could certainly stand improving but that is not a reason to delete in this case. Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 19:59, 24 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Eggishorn: While that source is the reason I put "weak" in my !vote, WP:42 does explicitly state We need multiple sources that discuss the topic directly and in detail. I would prefer at least one more article like the Times-Picayune feature in my opinion (or at least a couple more independent WP:RS sources with significant coverage where he may not be the main topic). Yosemiter (talk) 02:55, 26 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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@Yosemiter:, remember that WP:42 is just a handy essay. Its usage of "significant" is only a suggestion and not definitive. In this particular case, a major metropolitan daily devoting >700 words to a profile of a player in a non-major sport is ...more than a trivial mention by any reasonable interpretation. Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 04:39, 26 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Eggishorn: Agreed that the single source is significant depth of coverage, but even WP:GNG, which is guideline and not an essay, says multiple sources are generally expected. If the one single independent RS source of good depth convinces you this subject meets GNG, then I do not think anything I would argue here would change your mind. It is not like I think this subject fails GNG with flying colors, just that it is on the lower side of the subjective line since it lacks the multiple part. Yosemiter (talk) 06:20, 26 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete There has been one good source we've found, but it doesn't mean he passes WP:GNG as there's no additional secondary independent coverage here. We don't create biographies on the basis that a local newspaper wrote a feature story on someone. SportingFlyer T·C 13:31, 28 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - my understanding of WP:GNG is that you need to have more than one good source Spiderone 15:55, 6 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Missvain (talk) 01:50, 5 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Nick Feakes

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 20:27, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Oppose Seems to me to meet WP:GNG, as some sources amount to “substantial coverage” and not brief mentions. Moonraker (talk) 07:10, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don't believe any of the sources on the page or that I can find are 'substantial coverage', that are independent of the source/tournament. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:50, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moonraker, as has been discussed here can you show which of the sources in the article provide enough significant coverage for it to pass WP:GNG or if there are other sources that you believe enough to allow it to pass WP:GNG can you provide them. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:36, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Weak Delete – While I commend User:Hack's additions, the most significant depth articles are both from Chris Dutton of the The Canberra Times, and both are about the surprise that he found success in the US after he did not in Australia ("Canberra kids going to America for... rugby?" and " "Forgotten Canberra junior..."). The rest are WP:ROUTINE transaction coverage listing the clubs he has been a member of without depth or mentions in simple match recaps. He gets the most mentions as in a WP:PRIMARY coverage in a weekly award segment. Yosemiter (talk) 23:03, 18 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Weak keep - the Canberra Times mentions are sufficient independent sources to scrape over the line for notability. Deus et lex (talk) 10:20, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Deus et lex: Per WP:GNG: Multiple publications from the same author or organization are usually regarded as a single source for the purposes of establishing notability. I do agree that subject is very borderline though, and much better than many of the other MLR players currently up for deletion. Yosemiter (talk) 17:28, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep. No solid reason has been given to justify the deletion of this content while valid alternatives exist. If he is not worthy of a standalone article this can be redirected somewhere. duffbeerforme (talk) 13:36, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Duffbeerforme, please can you explain what the 'valid alternatives' would be, the player does not pass notability guidelines for rugby players at WP:NRU and whether or not he passes general notability guidelines at WP:GNG is certainly up for debate. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 13:44, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Feakes is mentioned in New Orleans Gold, List of 2018–19 Major League Rugby transfers, 2019 Major League Rugby season‎. Pick the best target and redirect there. duffbeerforme (talk) 13:48, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Is a redirect really suitable here, the player has only played a few games for NOLA Gold, and the other two are just list pages, its not as if he won player of the season or any awards in a that season either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 13:53, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

This is not a suitable redirect topic per WP:XY. Yosemiter (talk) 14:13, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

~~Keep~~ since subject comfortably passes criterion #1 of WP:NRU, which demands that the rugby union player must have played for a "high performance Union" at any time, while a footnote lists the countries whose unions are included in that category, amongst which is the U.S. Subject is a squad member of and has appeared playing for the New Orleans Gold who compete in the U.S. Major League Rugby. End of story. -The Gnome (talk) 19:09, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The Gnome, This is incorrect, High Performance Union's relate to national teams not club sides. The player hasn't represented any international side, henceforth #1 is irrelevant. The issue is over #2 which relates to professional rugby competition (which New Orleans Gold plays in Major League Rugby). Major League Rugby isn't listed here, therefore the player doesn't qualify for WP:NRU. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 19:32, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Rugbyfan22 is correct. I change my suggestion to Delete on account of subject failing indeed criterion #2 of WP:NRU. -The Gnome (talk) 20:23, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete the SMH article actually is the best coverage I've seen of any US based rugby player, but it's not enough to make him notable - it's just a feature article on a curiosity, that an Aussie could be playing rugby in the US. None of the other coverage is significant, which is in line with our consistent showing that Major League Rugby does not get enough secondary independent reliable coverage to have articles on all of its players, and he's done nothing else that has earned GNG-qualifying coverage. SportingFlyer T·C 13:27, 28 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 21:08, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Holden Yungert

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for teams so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 20:24, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep Seems to me to meet WP:GNG, as at least one source is “substantial coverage”, viz. an article about Yungert and not a brief mention. Moonraker (talk) 07:12, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don't believe any of the sources on the page or that I can find are 'substantial coverage', that are independent of the source/tournament. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:51, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moonraker, as has been discussed here can you show which of the sources in the article provide enough significant coverage for it to pass WP:GNG or if there are other sources that you believe enough to allow it to pass WP:GNG can you provide them. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:37, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete not even close to meeting out very broad standards for rugby players. One source that is more than a brief mention is never enough to pass GNG.John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:38, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete, there is no independent significant coverage there, and the level within the sport is too low. Geschichte (talk) 08:18, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Clearly fails WP:GNG. PJvanMill)talk( 16:48, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - the sourcing is insignificant in that there is nothing we can build a biography from Spiderone 22:46, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 08:18, 24 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Kevin O'Connor (rugby union)

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for teams so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 20:21, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep Seems to me to meet WP:GNG, as at least one source is “substantial coverage”, viz. an article about O’Connor and not a brief mention. Moonraker (talk) 07:13, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don't believe any of the sources on the page or that I can find are 'substantial coverage', that are independent of the source/tournament. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:51, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moonraker, as has been discussed here can you show which of the sources in the article provide enough significant coverage for it to pass WP:GNG or if there are other sources that you believe enough to allow it to pass WP:GNG can you provide them. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:37, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete the American Rugby News is not a reliable, independent source, so sourcing to that does not show notability.John Pack Lambert (talk) 17:09, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete The only source in this article that contributes at all to notability would be djcoilrugby.com, and that article (as with all of these djcoilrugby.com articles) consists of a one-sentence description of a player joining a team, and a short biography of the player. This is not enough to reach significant coverage. PJvanMill)talk( 17:02, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - I completely agree with PJ above; SIGCOV is not shown here Spiderone 15:04, 22 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Missvain (talk) 00:06, 5 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moni Tongaʻuiha

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 20:18, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep Seems to me to meet WP:GNG, as sources are “substantial coverage”, viz. including articles about him and not brief mentions. Moonraker (talk) 07:15, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don't believe any of the sources on the page or that I can find are 'substantial coverage', that are independent of the source/tournament. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:51, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moonraker, as has been discussed here can you show which of the sources in the article provide enough significant coverage for it to pass WP:GNG or if there are other sources that you believe enough to allow it to pass WP:GNG can you provide them. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:37, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comment Have found a previous AfD under a previous name can be found here. Also pinging @Yosemiter: and @Eggishorn: who were involved in that discussion. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 18:00, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- Not seeing anything new from my previous nomination under Moni Tongauiha or Tesimoni Tangauiha; just WP:PRIMARY or WP:ROUTINE. I also explained why DJCoilRugby is good for WP:V, but limited for WP:N, at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Michael Reid (rugby union) unless the article is more than just covering a transaction. The Americas Rugby News articles unfortunately do not have significant depth in any cite; all just list-based mentions with maybe two sentences added. You can put me in the delete camp right now, but based on his career trajectory, this player does seem to be on the way up and is possibly a WP:TOOSOON situation. Yosemiter (talk) 18:33, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - I would have to agree with Yosemiter that the sources establishing notability do not appear to exist (at least, not yet) Spiderone 11:33, 25 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Similar to the other MLR articles, there isn't a single secondary independent reliable source anywhere near this article. SportingFlyer T·C 13:29, 28 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 01:29, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

John Sullivan (rugby union)

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 20:16, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Oppose This is a very poor page, but it seems to me to meet WP:GNG, as at least one source is “substantial coverage”, viz. an article about him and not a brief mention. Other tags could be added. Moonraker (talk) 07:17, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don't believe any of the sources on the page or that I can find are 'substantial coverage', that are independent of the source/tournament. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:52, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moonraker, as has been discussed here can you show which of the sources in the article provide enough significant coverage for it to pass WP:GNG or if there are other sources that you believe enough to allow it to pass WP:GNG can you provide them. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:38, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete not enough substantial sources to pass GNG.John Pack Lambert (talk) 17:05, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - I'm sorry but all I'm seeing is WP:MILL coverage; ping me if WP:SIGCOV is indeed found somewhere Spiderone 22:39, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was soft delete. Based on minimal participation, this uncontroversial nomination is treated as an expired PROD (a.k.a. "soft deletion"). Editors can request the article's undeletion. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 01:28, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Devin Short

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 20:13, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete For the reasons mentioned above. Not at all notable. Hun ter 18:19, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was soft delete. Based on minimal participation, this uncontroversial nomination is treated as an expired PROD (a.k.a. "soft deletion"). Editors can request the article's undeletion. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 01:28, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Nikola Bursic

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU and Chile are not a High Performance Union), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 20:11, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable rugby player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 17:23, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was soft delete. Based on minimal participation, this uncontroversial nomination is treated as an expired PROD (a.k.a. "soft deletion"). Editors can request the article's undeletion. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 01:25, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Kevin Sullivan (rugby union)

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 20:07, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete these sources are not the level of substantial coverage we need to show notability.John Pack Lambert (talk) 17:10, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was soft delete. Based on minimal participation, this uncontroversial nomination is treated as an expired PROD (a.k.a. "soft deletion"). Editors can request the article's undeletion. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 01:25, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Cam Falcon

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 20:05, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Note to closer for soft deletion:? This nomination has had limited participation and falls within the standards set for lack of quorum. There are no previous AfD discussions, undeletions, or current redirects and no previous PRODs have been located. This nomination may be eligible for soft deletion at the end of its 7-day listing. --Cewbot (talk) 00:03, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Logs: 2019-10 ✍️ create

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The result was soft delete. Based on minimal participation, this uncontroversial nomination is treated as an expired PROD (a.k.a. "soft deletion"). Editors can request the article's undeletion. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 01:24, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Piceli Rinakama

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 20:01, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete for the above reasons. Hun ter 18:23, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was soft delete. Based on minimal participation, this uncontroversial nomination is treated as an expired PROD (a.k.a. "soft deletion"). Editors can request the article's undeletion. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 01:24, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Zach Stryffeler

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 19:55, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Note to closer for soft deletion:? This nomination has had limited participation and falls within the standards set for lack of quorum. There are no previous AfD discussions, undeletions, or current redirects and no previous PRODs have been located. This nomination may be eligible for soft deletion at the end of its 7-day listing. --Cewbot (talk) 00:03, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Logs: 2019-10 ✍️ create

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The result was delete. Eddie891 ^Talk _Work 18:32, 24 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Diego Maquieira

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and new of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 19:52, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Note to closer for soft deletion:? This nomination has had limited participation and falls within the standards set for lack of quorum. There are no previous AfD discussions, undeletions, or current redirects and no previous PRODs have been located. This nomination may be eligible for soft deletion at the end of its 7-day listing. --Cewbot (talk) 00:02, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Logs: 2019-07 ✍️ create

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Delete - a very well written article but unfortunately the subject doesn't pass GNG. As mentioned above, the sources provide nothing more than passing mentions and routine reports of signing for a new club Spiderone 12:54, 22 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Agree with Spiderone - this fails WP:GNG due to the fact he wasn't significantly covered in places and the other sources aren't reliable/independent. SportingFlyer T·C 15:46, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. JGHowes ^talk 18:27, 24 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Vetekina Malafu

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of the player signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 20:57, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Oppose Seems to me to meet WP:GNG, as at least one source is “substantial coverage”, viz. an article about Malafu. Moonraker (talk) 06:48, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don't believe any of the sources on the page or that I can find are 'substantial coverage', that are independent of the source/tournament. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:45, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moonraker, as has been discussed here can you show which of the sources in the article provide enough significant coverage for it to pass WP:GNG or if there are other sources that you believe enough to allow it to pass WP:GNG can you provide them. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:38, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
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Automated comment: This AfD was not correctly transcluded to the log (step 3). I have transcluded it to Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Log/2020 November 16. —^{cyberbot I}_{Talk to my owner:Online} 22:57, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete – All news sources I found are strictly mentions with no depth, frequently not even the subject of the one sentence where he is mentioned. Everything else is short statement transactions of the WP:ROUTINE variety. A synopsis of his career by Doug Coil when he signed to Old Glory is about as deep as it gets, and I have reservations about his website as he is the primary writer and editor per WP:RSCONTEXT. It would still only be a single source anyways. Yosemiter (talk) 22:08, 18 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete since subject fails WP:NRU. -The Gnome (talk) 14:05, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - does not meet NRU or GNG Spiderone 20:58, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Feel free to hash out a redirect now that he's red. Missvain (talk) 00:54, 4 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Dylan Taikato-Simpson

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby, Italian Super 10 and Romanian leagues are not notable leagues under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of the player signing for teams so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 21:01, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Oppose Seems to me to meet WP:GNG, as the sources are “substantial coverage”, viz. articles about Taikato-Simpson and not brief mentions. Moonraker (talk) 06:44, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don't believe any of the sources on the page or that I can find are 'substantial coverage', that are independent of the source/tournament. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:44, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moonraker, as has been discussed here can you show which of the sources in the article provide enough significant coverage for it to pass WP:GNG or if there are other sources that you believe enough to allow it to pass WP:GNG can you provide them. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:38, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete – Does not meet WP:GNG. Nothing but WP:ROUTINE transactions listing previous clubs lacking depth and brief mentions in match recaps. Yosemiter (talk) 16:32, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per Yosemiter and nom Spiderone 21:40, 22 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect No solid reason has been given to justify the deletion of this content while valid alternatives exist. If he is not worthy of a standalone article this can be redirected somewhere. duffbeerforme (talk) 13:39, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Duffbeerforme, please can you explain what the 'valid alternatives' would be, the player does not pass notability guidelines for rugby players at WP:NRU or general notability at WP:GNG. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 13:44, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Taikato-Simpson is mentioned in Old Glory DC, 2020 Major League Rugby season, List of 2019–20 Major League Rugby transfers. Pick the best target and redirect there. duffbeerforme (talk) 13:51, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Are any of those redirects really suitable though? He's played for multiple clubs for a short period of time making a small number of appearances at all of them. The other two are a list page and the season page where he didn't win any awards or scored most points/tries or similar. Not sure any are suitable. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 13:56, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Which in part is why stand alone articles are useful. All this content is verifiable. He has been covered in the press. Original research is not required to build this page. What seems to be a current push to delete suche verifiable content seems misguided. Why delete when you can cover in other ways. Played just one game? include in a list. Played for lots of teams? Redirect to a list for the most prominent team, mention the others. Pick the best alternative but no need to delete. duffbeerforme (talk) 14:01, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Duffbeerforme: WP:V does not equal WP:N. Redirects are only suitable if the subject is actually discussed or mentioned on that page. If there are multiple possible targets for redirection, then it is not suitable for redirect per WP:XY. Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate collection of stats or roster transactions, verifiable or not. The subject must have significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject. Yosemiter (talk) 14:11, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I never said WP:V equals WP:N. "The subject must have significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject." (Tell yhat to the advocates of wp:prof.) To have a standalone article it is best to The subject must have significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject. But the way you've said it seems to sufggest you think GNG overrides the SNGs. That is not the case. Directly qouting from the primary notability guide, "It meets either the general notability guideline below, or the criteria outlined in a subject-specific guideline listed in the box on the right;". Note Or'. It gives no precedence to gng. duffbeerforme (talk) 14:18, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The SNG for this person is WP:NRU as he is a rugby union player. He fails that notability, as mentioned in the nomination. He fails both WP:SNG and WP:GNG. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 14:23, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Your point being? Read what I'm actually saying. duffbeerforme (talk) 14:28, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

There is not suitable redirect for this player due to WP:XY and the person fails both WP:SNG and WP:GNG meaning he is not notable enough for a Wikipedia article. I'm not entirely sure what your other argument is as he's not an academic. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 14:30, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

He has played more games for Colorado Raptors than any other so a List of Raptors players article would be the best target. If it doesn't yet exist then a redirect to the team seem sensible pending the creation of a list article. duffbeerforme (talk) 14:47, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The page doesn't exist, plus there's no indication that statement will remain true as he's left the team and the team no longer exists. He could make more appearances for another team in the future. Readers searching for Dylan Taikato-Simpson could be searching for anything (such as his spell in Italy or playing for the Australian Barbarians) so WP:XY is in effect here. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 14:53, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Duffbeerforme: There actually is a current discussion at Wikipedia talk:Notability#SNG change about SNG vs GNG. But the short of it is: 8 out of 10 SNGs are written to in order meet GNG, including WP:NSPORTS (from NSPORTS: All information included in Wikipedia, including articles about sports, must be verifiable. In addition, the subjects of standalone articles should meet the General Notability Guideline). So yes, GNG outweighs the SNG for this subject right now. Yosemiter (talk) 14:32, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

An ongoing discussion May change things but hasn't yet. NSPORT says "The article should provide reliable sources showing that the subject meets the general notability guideline or the sport specific criteria set forth below." OR. No overriding there. duffbeerforme (talk) 14:42, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

This doesn't take away from the fact that the player does not meet WP:SNG (under WP:NRU in this case as he's a rugby union player), or WP:GNG, why should this page be kept if he doesn't meet any of these notability requirements? Rugbyfan22 (talk) 14:45, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Duffbeerforme: What I quoted is from Wikipedia:Notability (sports)#Applicable policies and guidelines and then further explained in Wikipedia:Notability (sports)#Basic criteria, which both expand on the brief intro you are pointing to. As to the ongoing discussion, it it mostly about making the phrasing in WP:N so SNGs should meet GNG, with some exceptions. No one is advocating for NSPORTS to be one of those exceptions, in fact, many think it should be more strict to GNG. Yosemiter (talk) 14:49, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Duffbeerforme: Also, you keep pointing to the OR in that sentence. This subject does NOT meet any of the SNGs, so GNG is the OR it needs to meet anyways. Yosemiter (talk) 16:03, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete there is no significant coverage of this player, and I strongly disagree any alternatives to deletion exist here, as there's no blurb on him anywhere else on this website. SportingFlyer T·C 13:25, 28 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 19:28, 25 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Tonata Lauti

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 17:14, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Note to closer for soft deletion:? This nomination has had limited participation and falls within the standards set for lack of quorum. There are no previous AfD discussions, undeletions, or current redirects and no previous PRODs have been located. This nomination may be eligible for soft deletion at the end of its 7-day listing. --Cewbot (talk) 00:03, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete due to lack of significant coverage required by WP:NBIO Edge3 (talk) 05:55, 21 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - independent sources covering Lauti are sorely lacking Spiderone 16:46, 24 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Sandstein 08:16, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Michael Baska

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him joining sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 17:08, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable rugby player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 17:17, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was soft delete. Based on minimal participation, this uncontroversial nomination is treated as an expired PROD (a.k.a. "soft deletion"). Editors can request the article's undeletion. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 19:28, 25 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Lance Williams (rugby union)

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 17:06, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Note to closer for soft deletion:? This nomination has had limited participation and falls within the standards set for lack of quorum. There are no previous AfD discussions, undeletions, or current redirects and no previous PRODs have been located. This nomination may be eligible for soft deletion at the end of its 7-day listing. --Cewbot (talk) 00:03, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - there's a nice article here that could be used but then everything else is just routine announcements like this. Spiderone 20:25, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 20:56, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Awara Elkington

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 17:03, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Note to closer for soft deletion:? This nomination has had limited participation and falls within the standards set for lack of quorum. There are no previous AfD discussions, undeletions, or current redirects and no previous PRODs have been located. This nomination may be eligible for soft deletion at the end of its 7-day listing. --Cewbot (talk) 00:03, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete I agree with the nominator that the sources are not enough to satisfy the GNG. There are currently three sources in the article: one is a data sheet, one is a fan bio, and one does not look very reliable (no author) and is also not very in-depth. PJvanMill)talk( 15:43, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete I agree with the above comments. I also performed a Google search and couldn't find any other sources than those already provided. Edge3 (talk) 05:52, 21 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - sources fail to establish notability Spiderone 12:55, 22 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. TheSandDoctor ^Talk 04:27, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Franco van den Berg

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 17:00, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete does not meet the notability guidelines for rugby players.John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:23, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete fails WP:GNG. SportingFlyer T·C 20:37, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - doesn't meet GNG or NRU Spiderone 22:24, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Arbitrarily0 ^(talk) 04:03, 25 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Derrick Broussard

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU and Philippines aren't a high performance union), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 16:21, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep Seems to me to meet WP:GNG, as at least one source is “substantial coverage”, viz. an article about Broussard and not a brief mention. Moonraker (talk) 07:25, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don't believe any of the sources on the page or that I can find are 'substantial coverage', that are independent of the source/tournament. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:53, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moonraker, as has been discussed here can you show which of the sources in the article provide enough significant coverage for it to pass WP:GNG or if there are other sources that you believe enough to allow it to pass WP:GNG can you provide them. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:39, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete Let's go through the sources: the sdlegion one is a dead link, american rugby news is a data sheet, so all that's left is two articles from djcoilrugby.com, which are mostly duplicates of each other, so really only one source. Now, this source is relatively long, but it is mostly a string of biographical facts, with little analysis. Furthermore, I think the reliability of this source could be called into question - I don't see much to suggest they do fact-checking or corrections, and the author isn't that clearly indicated. I conclude that the current sourcing is not enough for notability. PJvanMill)talk( 17:28, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per PJ above me Spiderone 19:35, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete: Barely found anything about him. Search results include 2 individuals bearing the same name. ASTIG😎 _{(ICE T • ICE CUBE)} 16:00, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. MER-C 19:50, 26 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Chris Turori

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so doesn't qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 16:18, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Oppose Seems to me to meet WP:GNG, as at least one source is “substantial coverage”, viz. an article about Turori and not a brief mention. Moonraker (talk) 07:24, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don't believe any of the sources on the page or that I can find are 'substantial coverage', that are independent of the source/tournament. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:53, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moonraker, as has been discussed here can you show which of the sources in the article provide enough significant coverage for it to pass WP:GNG or if there are other sources that you believe enough to allow it to pass WP:GNG can you provide them. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:39, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete – Does not meet WP:GNG; general WP:ROUTINE transaction coverage with very little depth outlining his previous clubs. He is capped in a lower level national team, but I can find no evidence he has appeared in any notable tournaments, or even with the team in any official matches. The closest source to meeting GNG is this in The San Diego Union-Tribune, but it is pretty basic and not enough to push this over the "multiple independent sources of significant depth" of GNG; it is mostly just an interview. Yosemiter (talk) 16:46, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - I agree with Yosemiter above Spiderone 11:55, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Fails WP:GNG, none of the coverage is either independent or significant. SportingFlyer T·C 18:06, 26 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. MER-C 19:48, 26 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Nathan Sylvia

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so doesn't qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 16:12, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Oppose Poor article but still seems to meet WP:GNG, as at least one source is “substantial coverage”, viz. an article about Sylvia and not a brief mention. Moonraker (talk) 07:22, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don't believe any of the sources on the page or that I can find are 'substantial coverage', that are independent of the source/tournament. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:52, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moonraker, as has been discussed here can you show which of the sources in the article provide enough significant coverage for it to pass WP:GNG or if there are other sources that you believe enough to allow it to pass WP:GNG can you provide them. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:39, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete American Rudby news directory listing of team squads are not the sort of things that adds to passing GNG.John Pack Lambert (talk) 17:22, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete It's pretty clear most players in this league do not meet GNG and this is no exception. SportingFlyer T·C 14:30, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - nothing more than listings and brief profiles on websites that exhaustively list every rugby player; no WP:GNG coverage Spiderone 08:04, 26 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 21:23, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Fakaʻosi Pifeleti

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 16:09, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Oppose Seems to me to meet WP:GNG, as at least one source is “substantial coverage”, viz. an article about Pifeleti and not a brief mention. Moonraker (talk) 07:21, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don't believe any of the sources on the page or that I can find are 'substantial coverage', that are independent of the source/tournament. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:52, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moonraker, as has been discussed here can you show which of the sources in the article provide enough significant coverage for it to pass WP:GNG or if there are other sources that you believe enough to allow it to pass WP:GNG can you provide them. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:40, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete does not meet the rugby criteria. The coverage does not meet GNG which requires substantial coverage in sources that are indepdent of the subject.John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:21, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - not sure what significant coverage is being referred to above. All I can see are passing mentions like this and this Spiderone 17:07, 22 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete fails WP:GNG pretty clearly, none of the coverage is significant, reliable, or not independent. SportingFlyer T·C 14:29, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. MER-C 19:51, 26 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Aaron Mitchell (rugby union)

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so doesn't qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 16:06, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Oppose Seems to me to meet WP:GNG, as at least one source is “substantial coverage”, viz. an article about Mitchell and not a brief mention. Moonraker (talk) 07:20, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don't believe any of the sources on the page or that I can find are 'substantial coverage', that are independent of the source/tournament. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:52, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moonraker, as has been discussed here can you show which of the sources in the article provide enough significant coverage for it to pass WP:GNG or if there are other sources that you believe enough to allow it to pass WP:GNG can you provide them. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:40, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete no evidence that this subject meets WP:GNG. (t · c) buidhe 14:32, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, King of ♥ ♦ ♣ ♠ 02:52, 18 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete There's no significant coverage - a blog post and non-independent team website stuff here. Easy delete for WP:GNG failure. SportingFlyer T·C 14:28, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - completely agree with the two delete votes above and nom Spiderone 21:40, 25 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was soft delete. Geschichte (talk) 07:47, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

William Rasileka

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU and appearance for Fiji 7s weren't in notable tournaments), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 16:54, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Logs: 2019-10 ✍️ create

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 07:45, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Eric Duechle

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so doesn't qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 16:44, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete per nom, rugby players in the US are not automatically notable. There are several articles in Category:Seattle Seawolves players that should probably go too. Reywas92^Talk 19:20, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hi @Reywas92:, AfD's have been listed for certain Seattle Seawolves players and you should be able to see them on list of Rugby union-related deletion discussions. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 19:47, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

That's a lot to comment on...prod ought to work on these too, but put me down as delete all. Reywas92^Talk 20:29, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Reywas92:, there has been dispute previously over whether or not Major League Rugby is notable under WP:NRU (it was previously added with no discussion hence why lots of pages have been created/survived this long) so didn't want to PROD them for that reason. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 21:14, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete This league does not give notability. I would suggest a mass deletion, but I have also seen those fail because of objections to one notable person admist a sea of non-notable people, so I understand why some go a different route. I do not think I have ever made a mass deletion nomination.John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:19, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for your comment @Johnpacklambert:, not sure how I'd go about doing a mass deletion, and given the previous contentious nature I thought a large number of AfD's would have to suffice. I've managed to go through all the teams and players now though so there shouldn't be anymore to clog up the deletion sorting lists. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 16:34, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was soft delete. Geschichte (talk) 07:48, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Riekert Hattingh

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 16:47, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Logs: 2019-06 ✍️ create

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 08:07, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Juan Pablo Aguirre

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 16:50, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable rugby player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 17:07, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per WP:NRU / WP:SIGCOV failure. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 04:29, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was soft delete. Geschichte (talk) 07:49, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Taylor Krumrei

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so doesn't qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 16:38, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Logs: 2019-10 ✍️ create

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The result was delete. czar 04:22, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keni Nasoqeqe

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 16:24, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable rugby player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 17:08, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - there is this which I can't access in my country. I don't think it would be enough anyway from what I can see of the preview of the source Spiderone 09:17, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. MBisanz ^talk 17:23, 28 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Save Totovosau

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not notable under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so doesn't qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 16:29, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep Seems to me to meet WP:GNG, as at least one source is “substantial coverage”, viz. an article about him and not a brief mention. Moonraker (talk) 07:27, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don't believe any of the sources on the page or that I can find are 'substantial coverage', that are independent of the source/tournament. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:53, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moonraker, as has been discussed here can you show which of the sources in the article provide enough significant coverage for it to pass WP:GNG or if there are other sources that you believe enough to allow it to pass WP:GNG can you provide them. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:40, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Weak delete - okay, so there's this but it's not enough for a GNG pass Spiderone 22:31, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, TheSandDoctor ^Talk 04:31, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete (copy-pasting at this point) The only source in this article that contributes at all to notability would be djcoilrugby.com, and that article (as with all of these djcoilrugby.com articles) consists of a one-sentence description of a player joining a team, and a short biography of the player. This is not enough to reach significant coverage. The source that Spiderone links to looks unreliable to me (no author name), and is also not very significant. PJvanMill)talk( 17:07, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete not much coverage, and what's there that exists is either unreliable or not independent. Fails WP:GNG. SportingFlyer T·C 14:27, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was soft delete. Geschichte (talk) 08:00, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Daniel Trierweiler

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 16:32, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Note to closer for soft deletion:? This nomination has had limited participation and falls within the standards set for lack of quorum. There are no previous AfD discussions, undeletions, or current redirects and no previous PRODs have been located. This nomination may be eligible for soft deletion at the end of its 7-day listing. --Cewbot (talk) 00:04, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Logs: 2019-10 ✍️ create

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The result was soft delete. Geschichte (talk) 07:51, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

John Hayden (rugby union)

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 16:35, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable rugby player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 17:03, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV failure. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 04:30, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was soft delete. Based on minimal participation, this uncontroversial nomination is treated as an expired PROD (a.k.a. "soft deletion"). Editors can request the article's undeletion. King of ♥ ♦ ♣ ♠ 02:52, 18 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Malacchi Esdale

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of signing for sides so doesn't qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 16:02, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Logs: 2019-10 ✍️ create

Delete - best source is this which is insufficient Spiderone 19:32, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was soft delete. Based on minimal participation, this uncontroversial nomination is treated as an expired PROD (a.k.a. "soft deletion"). Editors can request the article's undeletion. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 09:09, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Taylor Howden

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for teams so doesn't qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:58, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was soft delete. Based on minimal participation, this uncontroversial nomination is treated as an expired PROD (a.k.a. "soft deletion"). Editors can request the article's undeletion. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 09:08, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Cecil Garber

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby not a notable league under WP:NRU), only breif mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:54, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was soft delete. Geschichte (talk) 08:41, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Robert Meeson

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions or news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:51, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Logs: 2019-10 ✍️ create, 2007-02 ✗ deleted

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 08:41, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Valdemar Lee-Lo

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so doesn't qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:48, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - I agree. I couldn't find anything that suggests that he can pass GNG Spiderone 20:39, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was soft delete. Based on minimal participation, this uncontroversial nomination is treated as an expired PROD (a.k.a. "soft deletion"). Editors can request the article's undeletion. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 09:05, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Charlie Connolly

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby and Italian Super 10 are not notable leagues under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for teams so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:45, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Logs: 2019-10 ✍️ create

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The result was soft delete. Geschichte (talk) 08:29, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Mason Pedersen

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so doesn't qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:41, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Note to closer for soft deletion:? This nomination has had limited participation and falls within the standards set for lack of quorum. There are no previous AfD discussions, undeletions, or current redirects and no previous PRODs have been located. This nomination may be eligible for soft deletion at the end of its 7-day listing. --Cewbot (talk) 00:03, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Logs: 2019-10 ✍️ create

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 08:22, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

John Ryberg

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so doesn't qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:39, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable rugby player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 17:03, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per the above. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 04:56, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 20:55, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Mark Cox (darts player)

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Does not appear to meet WP:SPORTSPERSON or WP:MUSICBIO. – DarkGlow (✉) 15:41, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Comment - He has been in some documented pro darts competitions, so I will leave it to the experts on sports articles to determine if he is notable in that realm. However, in no way whatsoever does this guy deserve to be described as a working musician, and I will remove those unsupported claims from his article. DOOMSDAYER520 | TALK | CONTRIBS 03:41, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Ok, so music is out, but does he hit on NSPORTS?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ♠PMC♠ (talk) 09:05, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete - Darts doesn't have a SNG. Competing in the UK Open means nothing as anyone with a pulse can qualify for that event. Cox fails GNG. Dougal18 (talk) 17:00, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - Above, I avoided a vote because I was new to the guidelines for sports articles (my area is music). But after learning more about the requirements at WP:NSPORTS and investigating Mr. Cox's shortage of media notice beyond basic entries in directories of darts dudes, I will endorse Dougal18's vote and recommend deletion as well. DOOMSDAYER520 | TALK | CONTRIBS 16:19, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete No references to support this person's notability in this area.10Sany1? (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 13:20, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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He has participated in darts events, and won a Professional Darts Corporation Tour Card, which isn't easy to do. That alone means he should stay, and has played in majors, such as the UK Open. The rules need to be more stringent for darts players. Arguably on the same logic, most footballers' accounts should be deleted on the same opinion. Cox, amongst others, are professionals and have participated in televised events. That alone should keep him.JRRobinson (talk) 15:37, 18 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 07:54, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Kelepi Fifita

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so doesn't qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:24, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable rugby player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 17:07, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:00, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 07:53, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Luke White (rugby union)

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:27, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Note to closer for soft deletion:? This nomination has had limited participation and falls within the standards set for lack of quorum. There are no previous AfD discussions, undeletions, or current redirects and no previous PRODs have been located. This nomination may be eligible for soft deletion at the end of its 7-day listing. --Cewbot (talk) 00:04, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Logs: 2019-09 ✍️ create

Delete - fails NRU and only gets WP:MILL coverage Spiderone 19:47, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 04:59, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was withdrawn by nominator. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:34, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Ata Malifa

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so doesn't qualify for WP:GNG either. Hasn't actually played internationally as suggested in the article. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:34, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Logs: 2019-09 ✍️ create

Keep, I believe this person passes WP:NRU due to the four games they played for the U.S. national team, which is classified as a "high-performance" squad. Devonian Wombat (talk) 05:25, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hi @Devonian Wombat:, have just noticed this in the article. Having looked on all stats websites (such as itsrugby) he is not listed as having international caps, but he is listed in match reports for international games during the period suggested. I'm going to remove the Afd because of this. Thanks. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:32, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 07:53, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Blake Rogers

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so doesn't qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:22, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete did get interviewed on rugby by the New York Times once but that was just a brief mention/quote/interview and I can't find anything else. SportingFlyer T·C 19:20, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:00, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 08:22, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Chad Gough

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him signing for sides so does not qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:19, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete Even though he ran back a 100m try which made news in New Zealand, he still doesn't pass WP:GNG with no other qualifying sources I can find. SportingFlyer T·C 19:19, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - at best this is WP:BLP1E because of the 100m try mentioned above Spiderone 22:28, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:01, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. TheSandDoctor ^Talk 04:42, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Jacob Finau

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable rugby league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of him joining sides so doesn't qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:16, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable rugby player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:49, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete fails WP:NRU, WP:GNG. SportingFlyer T·C 21:17, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - does not meet NRU or GNG Spiderone 16:53, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. TheSandDoctor ^Talk 04:43, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Sione Fangaiuiha

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only brief mentions and news of signing for sides so player doesn't qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:12, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable rugby player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 17:24, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete fails WP:GNG, WP:NRU. Only blog/non-independent coverage at best. SportingFlyer T·C 21:18, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - falling short of GNG and NRU Spiderone 22:26, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 09:05, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Zinzan Elan-Puttick

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU) and only brief mentions and news of joining sides therefore not qualifying him for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:08, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete Great name, fails WP:GNG after a search - only mention I could find was a brief match report from the game the Austin newspaper covered. SportingFlyer T·C 21:16, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - let's be honest, if sources did exist, they shouldn't be that hard to find given this guy's unique name. I think it's quite clear that he doesn't pass GNG Spiderone 20:41, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:01, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 09:06, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moe Abdelmonem

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU) and no sources that offer anything but a brief mention or news of him joining a side, so doesn't qualify for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 15:03, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete per nom, can't find any GNG-qualifying coverage on him. SportingFlyer T·C 15:49, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:12, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 09:06, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Chris Schade

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), no sources to indicate that the player qualifies for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 14:57, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete Fails WP:NRU and could not find anything that would pass WP:GNG. SportingFlyer T·C 15:19, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:13, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Barkeep49 (talk) 01:55, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Kody O'Neil

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU), only sources only offer a brief mention or of the news of him signing for a team therefore not qualifying him for WP:GNG. Previous nomination keep was related to Major League Rugby being added to WP:NRU without any discussion. It is not classified as notable league and therefore the player doesn't qualify. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 14:53, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Comment - the previous discussion can be found here Spiderone 14:57, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete fails WP:GNG, and never actually passed the SNG in the first place. SportingFlyer T·C 15:16, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete a non-notable rugby player. The league does not confer automatic notability.John Pack Lambert (talk) 17:11, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - fails NRU and GNG Spiderone 18:19, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 08:08, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Jope Motokana

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (Major League Rugby is not a notable league under WP:NRU) and none of the sources give anything other than a brief mention or news of him joining a side, therefore not qualifying him for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 14:47, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete Fails WP:NRU and WP:GNG after a search. SportingFlyer T·C 15:52, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - doesn't meet relevant criteria Spiderone 09:14, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per failure of WP:NRU and WP:SIGCOV. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 05:13, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Fenix down (talk) 16:02, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Augusto Robles

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No evidence of being able to meet WP:GNG or WP:ANYBIO; even the most basic biographical information seems to be impossible to find. I found no meaningful hits in Google News or Google Books and nothing significant in ProQuest while searching 'Augusto Robles arbitro' or while searching 'Augusto Robles Moran'. When even his nationality is disputed, I can't see there being that much concrete information about him to expand this page with. There are no obvious redirect or merge targets. If anyone does find sources showing WP:SIGCOV (i.e. more than just being name checked in a match report or database listing), please let me know. Spiderone 12:56, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - no evidence of notability. Giant Snowman 16:35, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Barkeep49 (talk) 02:30, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Kellen Gordon

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Still fails both WP:GNG and WP:NRU. I nominated this a year ago, and it was kept on the mistaken belief that the US league fell under the rugby notability guidelines. It turns out the US league was added without discussion, and after a review it was correctly removed (disclosure: I was involved in the discussion.) The only identified sources now or at the prior AfD are press releases (including coverage from an advertising campaign, that's the best source and it doesn't meet GNG) or from sources that are closely tied to the subject, including the subject's former school and the subject's team, or are not independent, such as a US rugby blog, and nothing has changed in the year plus since the last AfD that would make him notable. SportingFlyer T·C 12:12, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete. As per nomination. Major League Rugby isn't a notable league under WP:NRU, no sources to suggest it qualifies for WP:GNG (actually more references to a footballer of a differing name). Rugbyfan22 (talk) 14:33, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - fails WP:GNG and any relevant SNG Spiderone 15:40, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per nom, rugby players in the US are not automatically notable. There are several articles in Category:Seattle Seawolves players that should probably go too. Reywas92^Talk 19:20, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete does not meet notability guidelines for rugby players.John Pack Lambert (talk) 15:44, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. MBisanz ^talk 23:53, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Pedro Carvalho (fighter)

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Subject is a mixed martial arts fighter. Subject fails WP:MMABIO notability guidelines ~~at the moment for he has only one fight under the top tier promoter where~~ subject needs to have at least 3 fights under top tier promotor to meet the criteria . Subject also fails GNG as the fight results are merely routine coverage. Cassiopeia^(talk) 23:43, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete He has no top tier MMA fights so he fails WP:NMMA. @Cassiopeia:, which of his fights do you believe are top tier? The closest reference that isn't obviously routine sports reporting is an interview with him about his upcoming Bellator title fight and even that doesn't bring him closer to meeting WP:GNG. Win or lose the Bellator fight won't add to his WP notability status. At best, right now it's WP:TOOSOON. Papaursa (talk) 01:04, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Papaursa My mistake. Not sure what did I see when I type the text above. Correct. The subject has NO tier one promotion fight. Thank you for checking. Stay safe and best. Cassiopeia^(talk) 09:27, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 22:14, 14 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Watcharapong Janngam

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According to the article, has only played in the 4th tier of Thai football so fails WP:NFOOTY. During a quick search, I could not find anything to suggest that he would pass WP:GNG. Spiderone 21:30, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Comment: has some in-depth coverage.[34][35] --Paul_012 (talk) 03:23, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per WP:NFOOTY failure. Number 5 7 13:55, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 16:35, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per the above. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 04:06, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete, fails WP:NFOOTBALL and WP:GNG, Alex-h (talk) 09:53, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 22:12, 14 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Narongsil Chotweang

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Does not appear to meet our notability guidelines; no professional appearances so fails WP:NFOOTY; also does not appear to have achieved the notability or significance required to pass WP:GNG. All that seems to come up is Transfermarkt and a load of inacessible/dead links when searching his name. Spiderone 20:24, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete per WP:NFOOTY failure. Number 5 7 13:56, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 16:34, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per the above. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 02:47, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was keep. Closing this as keep. Thanks everyone for assuming good faith and for your contributions to Wikipedia! Missvain (talk) 22:31, 22 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Borna Kapusta

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Unsourced and does not appear to meet WP:GNG. – DarkGlow (✉) 16:25, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep The page now is referenced. He won silver medal in Fiba u-19 world cup and now he play in first Croatian league. ~AndreaD'orrio ^{(talk/contribs)}~ 14:09, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep per the improvements to the article and his performance in a FIBA U19 team. ~EDDY ^{(talk/contribs)}~ 15:12, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep per discussion. Balle010 (talk) 04:32, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. MBisanz ^talk 23:51, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Juan Wagenpfeil

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (has represented Italy Sevens, but not at the level required to qualify him for WP:NRU), no sources indicate he qualifies for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 13:46, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - the coverage is entirely WP:MILL [36] [37] Spiderone 22:29, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Mojo Hand (talk) 15:43, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Francesco Bonavolontà

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (has represented Italy Sevens, but not at the level required to qualify him for WP:NRU), no sources indicate he qualifies for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 13:42, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable rugby player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:22, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - best source is this [38] which is painfully brief Spiderone 20:42, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per nom. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 06:38, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Sandstein 14:04, 22 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Diego Antl

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (has represented Italy Sevens, but not at the level required to qualify him for WP:NRU), no sources indicate he qualifies for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 13:40, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - falling short of GNG and NRU; just passing mentions in match reports Spiderone 22:27, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Comment from nominator, is this article eligible for soft deletion if required? There are no previous AfD's, PRODs or redirects as far as I'm aware. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 13:18, 22 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. MBisanz ^talk 23:50, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Gianmarco Vian

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (has represented Italy Sevens, but not at the level required to qualify him for WP:NRU), no sources indicate he passes WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 13:38, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - sources exist but it's all trivial mentions like these [39] [40] [41]. Nothing we can build a biography from Spiderone 22:28, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. MBisanz ^talk 23:50, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Mattia D'Anna

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (has represented Italy Sevens, but not at the level required to qualify for WP:NRU), no sources indicate he qualifies for WP:GNG either. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 13:34, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable rugby player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 17:17, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was soft delete. Based on minimal participation, this uncontroversial nomination is treated as an expired PROD (a.k.a. "soft deletion"). Editors can request the article's undeletion. JGHowes ^talk 01:43, 30 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Lorenzo Maria Bruno

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Player does not qualify for WP:NRU (has played Italy Sevens, but not at the level required to qualify for WP:NRU) and no sources to suggest he qualifies for WP:GNG. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 13:31, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Automated comment: This AfD was not correctly transcluded to the log (step 3). I have transcluded it to Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Log/2020 November 7. —^{cyberbot I}_{Talk to my owner:Online} 13:43, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - best source is this which is insufficient in my view Spiderone 09:15, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Comment from nominator, is this article eligible for soft deletion if required? There are no previous AfD's, PRODs or redirects as far as I'm aware. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 13:17, 22 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete looks like player doesn't qualify for either notability mentioned in nom. Balle010 (talk) 04:40, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Consensus is to delete, not sure about the logic of looking for exceptions to guidelines, that's exactly how they are not meant to work, they're not guidelines if people say x and y don't apply. Either way this is not the forum for this discussion. Fenix down (talk) 11:52, 14 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Katerina Bexis

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PROD (by Geschichte) was Footballer who has never played in a professional league. No international caps according to Soccerway.com

Removed with reason According to its article, this is the top-level national league. By insisting that it is not "professional", you are making the sexist argument that women can never be notable in this sport.

I could not find any effective references for Bexis. The best ones I found were [42] and [43]. I am unable to find evidence that suggests she could pass WP:GNG. Spiderone 10:57, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete, does not meet any Wikipedia guideline. Geschichte (talk) 11:55, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 15:24, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete as per nom - fails WP:GNG and NFOOTBALL Shahoodu (talk) 12:19, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: At some point in time, we need to revisit to see if W-League_(Australia) is an exception to NFootball. Bearian (talk) 17:16, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Then there would be a large number of exceptions, at least Norway, Sweden and Germany, maybe France, Spain, Italy... Geschichte (talk) 10:14, 14 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Even the keep argument demonstrates this is not notable Spartaz ^Humbug! 09:38, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Muhammad Mokaev

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Subject is a mixed martial arts fighter. Subject fails WP:MMABIO for a mma fighter needs at least 3 fights under tier one promoter such as UFC or Invicta. Subject has no tier one promotion fights and also fails WP:GNG as the fight info is merely trivial routine reports. Cassiopeia^(talk) 07:38, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete With only one professional fight, and that was for a minor organization, he's not close to meeting WP:NMMA. His junior amateur championships also don't meet any WP notability criteria. Junior martial artists are generally not considered notable and WP:MMANOT#Fighters starts with the statement "Amateur MMA fighters are not considered notable." The references all seem to be routine sports reporting with emphasis on his junior amateur MMA career. Papaursa (talk) 00:49, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep Mokaev is one of the most hotly anticipated amateurs to have joined the professional ranks. He is not longer an amateur and is funded by the prince of Bahrain. He now has had 3 professional fights and has won all of them. He has won all of his amateur fights. He wrestles for GB and has a lengthy article on the BBC. The reason why he has this as opposed to other MMA fighters is down his record of unbeaten amateur record and because he highly regarded in MMA circles. He is his 4th professional fight in a few weeks. He is hotly tipped to become a world champion in the professional ranks. Whilst the WP:NMAA criteria have strictly not been met, i feel Mokaev merits a stay of execution on account of his remarkable record, the articles in the media, the people in the Uk circles of MMA know him fairly well and he trains with Professional MMA fighters in the UFC and Bellator (Kane Mousah and Lerone Murphy). He has also trained in Sweden with Chimaev. This week he has been interviewed by CNN, and that too will soon be published.Rassmallai (talk) 01:37, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

— Rassmallai (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.

"Hotly tipped", "hotly anticipated" and "highly regarded" are WP:WEASEL ways of saying he might become notable but isn't yet. Notability is not inherited from people who train with him or sponsor him. Victories in minor organizations do not show notability. Interviews are not considered as meeting WP:GNG. Saying the MMA notability "have strictly not been met" is a gross understatement. Your argument seems to be a case of WP:ILIKEIT when the facts indicate it's definitely WP:TOOSOON. Papaursa (talk) 02:42, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. czar 22:56, 14 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Ricky Bandejas

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Subject is a mixed martial artist. Subject fails WP:MMABIO as a MMA fighter needs to have at least 3 fights under tier one promotion to pass WP:MMABIO notability requirement which subject fails to secure. Subject also fails GNG as the fight info/record is mainly trivial routine reports. Cassiopeia^(talk) 02:20, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete He has no top tier fights so he fails WP:NMMA. Winning a minor MMA title doesn't show WP notability and all of the coverage is either routine sports reporting or MMA databases. Papaursa (talk) 00:36, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete He fails WP:NMMA. The two criterions for notability of MMA player are (according to WP:NMMA):

1. Have fought at least three professional fights for a top-tier MMA organization, such as the UFC (see WP:MMATIER); or

2. Have fought for the highest title of a top-tier MMA organization

He fails both of the criterions because in his professional career, he has only fought in the CFFC (which isn't listed in the tier list) and the Bellator (in which all his fights were

after 2015, so after Bellator was knocked down to second tier). He has never fought in a top-tier organization. He fails notability. Lazman321 (talk) 17:46, 14 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Vanamonde (Talk) 01:41, 14 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

List of Gaelic footballers who died during their careers

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Delete: I don't think this is a defining characteristic of these people, actually it has just one entry. Their death is not what they are known for. ww2censor (talk) 23:37, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete this and other lists of athletes who died during their careers (see Sportspeople who died during their careers, which has about 6 more that should go under the Afd knife). Those who died from sports-related injuries are notable (e.g. Ray Chapman). Lots of people die before they retire; there's nothing special about that. Politicians who drop dead from stress, overwork, etc. aren't notable for that reason alone; those who are assassinated are. Clarityfiend (talk) 00:02, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete There's nothing special about this list, people die, and therefore there's zero reason to have it. Unless it was specifically about people who died sports-related injuries, but that doesn't seem to be what this is about. --Adamant1 (talk) 04:43, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete per all of the above Spiderone 10:24, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete in the context of there being issues with many of the the others at sportspeople who died during their careers.

I started it (without much thought) based on the existence of lists like American footballers and their accidental electrocutions, baseball players and their dune buggy crashes, Australian rules footballers falling in Las Vegas, basketball players and their personal watercraft accidents, assocation footballers and their encephalitis following an earthquake in Seram Island and the ice hockey players being hit by a snow grooming machine, then buried... I see upon further examination of these lists (or, rather, the causes of death - which I initially overlooked) that they seem to be excessive and unnecessary. What does the nominator mean when they say "actually it has just one entry"? --Gaois (talk) 02:28, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: at the time of the nomination there appeared to be just one entry but I may have missed the table containing 4 entries far down the page. No matter how many entries there are this is not a defining characteristic of these people. ww2censor (talk) 12:40, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I have no objection at all to deleting these lists. Like I said I just noticed the missing sport and didn't think much of it at the time. I was a bit tired and was just working from what already existed. Three of the six sources relate to an injury while playing (the "sports-related injuries" mentioned above) but since they are for one entry there is no need for a separate list. --Gaois (talk) 23:59, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comment If you are considering this article for deletion, there are a lot more lists like this included at Sportspeople who died during their careers that don't seem notable unless the athlete died as a result of playing a sport. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:34, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Probably those will go to AfD at some point also. --Adamant1 (talk) 01:58, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I already suggested this. Clarityfiend (talk) 06:14, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete per the above. Plenty of sportspeople have their careers cut short for a host of reasons. Nigej (talk) 19:19, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per nom. --KartikeyaS (talk) 17:50, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Fenix down (talk) 20:34, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Anna Šubrtová

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PROD removed without a reason being provided. Concern was a BLP with no assertion or evidence of meeting WP:GNG

I can see no evidence that she can pass WP:NFOOTY or GNG. Sources added recently are Facebook and Twitter which are not WP:RS. I would suggest delete or draftify. Spiderone 19:22, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 19:49, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep - just add {{more citations needed}} insted of deleting. ‎Rest ‎in pieces 17:04, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Since the subject is not notable, it should either be in the draft space or deleted until such time that she meets the notability criteria for footballers Spiderone 17:53, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete, not a professional league player and not an international player. Geschichte (talk) 11:10, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Fails to meet WP:NFOOTBALL. --KartikeyaS (talk) 17:54, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was redirect to List of Bolton Wanderers F.C. players (1–24 appearances). Fenix down (talk) 20:34, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Mickaël Kapriélian

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Footballer who played less than 1 game in a fully professional league. Other than that he played on the French tiers 3, 4, 5 and 6. Possible to redirect to 1999–2000 Bolton Wanderers F.C. season. Geschichte (talk) 19:01, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Redirect to List of Bolton Wanderers F.C. players (1–24 appearances), where he is already mentioned. Giant Snowman 19:48, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect per above and nom Spiderone 12:41, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Geschichte (talk) 20:12, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Ali Abdul-Jabbar

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Footballer who fails GNG and NFOOTY BlameRuiner (talk) 18:21, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Question - is he the captain of Al Quwa or assistant coach for Al Sinaat? He can't be both! Spiderone 18:38, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 19:46, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - fails all relevant criteria both as a footballer and assistant manager Spiderone 07:36, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Fenix down (talk) 20:34, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Rochelle Kuhar

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PROD was initially placed with Footballer who has never played in a professional league.

PROD removed with comment According to its article, this is the top-level national league. By insisting that it is not "professional", you are making the sexist argument that women can never be notable in this sport.

Taken to AfD but procedural keep as was bundled with another footballer with which the only thing they had in common was being Australian female footballers with 9 appearances.

This article is required to meet WP:GNG but I just can't find much in the way of coverage. A WP:BEFORE search led to this [44] but it's not sufficient. A lot of the coverage online is for an American restaurant owner with the exact same name. Spiderone 18:30, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete, does not meet any Wikipedia guideline. Geschichte (talk) 18:46, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 19:46, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was keep. Geschichte (talk) 10:20, 22 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Amel Melih

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Does not appear to meet GNG. – DarkGlow (✉) 15:59, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep - it's hard to decide notability for swimmers as there is no 'NSWIMMER'. I would say, however, that she is notable because of the fact that she has won 3 gold medals in the same continental championships and has broken several national records. She has hardly any coverage in English language sources but the French Wikipedia article does show some good coverage in French. [45] [46] [47] Spiderone 21:59, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep Concur with Spiderone, seems notable to me. Jeepday (talk) 18:18, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Barkeep49 (talk) 01:32, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep, notable swimmer. Sources: 1, 2, 3. SportsOlympic (talk) 12:15, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep Due to the medals and national records. Plus, the sources found by Spiderone and SportsOlympic. I think all of that should be enough. --Adamant1 (talk) 07:39, 22 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Fenix down (talk) 12:28, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Éder dos Santos

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A BLP on a retired footballer that played 26 minutes of professional football in the second tier of the Mexican pyramid 13 years ago and then never played again. There is strong consensus that articles that scrape through WP:NFOOTY by the skin of their teeth should at least meet some amount of WP:GNG. He is covered in some sources but they are largely focused on his more famous relatives and notability is not inherited as per WP:NOTINHERITED. Spiderone 10:27, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete per nom, scraping by on NFOOTBALL is insufficient when GNG is failed so comprehensively. Giant Snowman 10:54, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete: Fails WP:GNG based on one substitute appearance. No plausible redirects either to preserve content- he has many notable family members, so makes no sense to redirect to one of them. Joseph2302 (talk) 11:37, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - Non-notable footballer who comes from a notable footballing family. There is no online in-depth coverage in English- or Spanish-language sources. Jogurney (talk) 18:20, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Fenix down (talk) 12:28, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Zoe Palandri

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Contested PROD deprod - that consensus is for players who have retired with only one game not for still active players

My initial PROD was long standing consensus that one game (https://www.worldfootball.net/player_summary/zoe-palandri/) is not enough to be inherently notable, I can't see any sign that Palandri passes WP:GNG either

Starting an AfD to see whether one brief substitute appearance at the highest level is enough and also to discuss whether Palandri passes WP:GNG Spiderone 09:12, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete: Missing WP:SPORTCRIT and WP:SPORTBASIC also WP:TOOSOON in all likelihood. -- Roger editor (talk) 10:07, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Blocked for spamming, likely WP:UPE. MER-C 15:17, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 10:51, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete does not meet our absurdly broad inclusion criteria for footballers.John Pack Lambert (talk) 15:52, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete, does not meet any Wikipedia guideline. Geschichte (talk) 11:13, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Fenix down (talk) 12:28, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Tomasz Tchórz

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Football coach who fails GNG and NFOOTY. Never head-coached a senior team in fully-pro league. External links are equivalent of résumé and routine transfer reports. Recreated after PROD with new coaching position, but the old concerns still stand. BlameRuiner (talk) 08:02, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep: Meets WP:NFOOTBALL as this person represented professional leagues. In considering the WP:NFOOTBALL guidelines, which states that "Players who have played, and managers who have managed in a competitive game between two teams from fully-professional leagues, will generally be regarded as notable." -- Roger editor (talk) 09:49, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Blocked for spamming, likely WP:UPE. MER-C 14:56, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Question - does NFOOTY cover assistant managers? Spiderone 09:55, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

No, it doesn't. The manager (or head coach) manages, the assistant assists but he's not in charge. --BlameRuiner (talk) 10:18, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL (the latter only applies to players and managers, not assistants or other coaches). Giant Snowman 10:51, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Comment - definitely fails NFOOTY but may pass GNG. I am not familiar with the sources but found many [48] [49] [50] [51] [52] Does anyone know if any of these are reliable sources? Spiderone 18:17, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
delete rank-and-file assistant coach , no major leagues. Lembit Staan (talk) 21:03, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. Fails WP:NBIO, also promotional: "a plan to kick start a new era ". The sport-spam need to stop, what's next? Articles for stadium cleaners and vendors? --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 01:05, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. —Tom Morris (talk) 09:11, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Rhys Davies (footballer)

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Footballer who fails GNG and NFOOTY BlameRuiner (talk) 08:07, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete: Missing WP:NFOOTBALL, WP:GNG and WP:NFOOTY. -- Roger editor (talk) 10:17, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Blocked for spamming, likely WP:UPE. MER-C 15:16, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 10:50, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete/draftify - does not yet meet any inclusion criteria Spiderone 13:12, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete a non-notable footballer.John Pack Lambert (talk) 15:49, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - At the moment this he does not seem to meet notability requirements having not played for a club competing at a high enough level. Dunarc (talk) 23:45, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Doesn't meet any of the Standard Wikipedia article criteria fail NFOOTY — Preceding unsigned comment added by Lynndonald (talk • contribs)
Delete per above.--Ortizesp (talk) 06:33, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was keep. Pax:Vobiscum (talk) 20:32, 14 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don McEwen

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Non-notable collegiate athlete. Mostly dead sources or mere inclusion in athletic lists with no widely notable achievements. —Notorious4life talk 00:21, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Notorious4life: In the future, please make sure to notify article creators when you nominate an article for AfD. Cbl62 (talk) 10:50, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete as live sources are not able to be found establishing notability. Balle010 (talk) 05:48, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

What do you mean by "live sources"? For pre-Internet subjects, sources are typically not freely available by Internet. Our notability standards do not require that sources be available through free Internet searches. Such a practice, if adopted, would set a horrible precedent in favoring only current topics over historic ones. Cbl62 (talk) 10:41, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete a non-notable college athlete.John Pack Lambert (talk) 15:42, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep Subject won multiple national collegiate titles including a championship record and set a world record in the distance medley relay. The 2009 article giving coverage of his long-standing record indicates lasting notability. SFB 23:03, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. Passes both WP:NCOLLATH (as a two-time US national champion in the two-mile run) and WP:GNG (with significant coverage in multiple reliable sources). Cbl62 (talk) 10:39, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

A quick search of Newspapers.com turns up literally hundreds of examples of significant coverage. Examples includ: (1) McEwen Tops Standard In 5,000 Meters, The Ottawa Citizen, 7/21/48; (2) "More About Don McEwen", The Gazette (Montreal), 7/11/52; (3) Don McEwen Keeps Big 10 Harrier Title, Chicago Tribune, 11/18/50; (4) Don McEwen Romps To Win In Michigan AAU 2-Mile Run, The Ottawa Citizen, 1/30/50; (5) McEwen Sets NCAA Mark for 2-Mile Run: U-M Star Runs It in 9:01.9, Detroit Free Press, 6/18/50; (6) McEwen Tries Mile -- More Records Fall, The Windsor Star, 2/18/50. Cbl62 (talk) 11:10, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep meets WP:COLLATH as record holder and WP:GNG per Cbl62. Pichpich (talk) 16:25, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Fenix down (talk) 20:25, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hussam Mahdi

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A biographical article on a footballer that does not appear to satisfy either WP:NFOOTY or WP:GNG; there are no reliable sources showing anything that amounts to WP:SIGCOV Spiderone 19:58, 5 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 22:05, 5 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete a non-notable footballer.John Pack Lambert (talk) 15:44, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per the above. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 07:54, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Fenix down (talk) 23:33, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Ahmed Khaled

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Footballer who fails GNG and NFOOTY. Ne senior appearances beyond Iraqi league, which isn't fully pro. No detailed coverage, all provided references amount to trivial mentions and transfer updates. BlameRuiner (talk) 21:35, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Comment - why was the PROD removed? Spiderone 22:33, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Comment A well developed article for a player in a major league which fails our NFOOTY standards, I can't comment on GNG due to a language barrier but the article is well developed with a number of references, not all of which pass GNG (Facebook etc.) Would like to see more analysis on why all the sources fail GNG. SportingFlyer T·C 11:04, 5 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@SportingFlyer: - I took a random sample of sources, numbers 1, 5, 10 and 15 and tried to decipher them through Google Translate:

1 is a brief news article about transfer from Erbil to El-Mina, in my view this is WP:ROUTINE;

5 is an article about a club suffering financial difficulties, he does not appear to be mentioned;

10 is a brief match report which mentions he scored a goal;

15 is a profile of all players on the team, including the following about this player: "Ahmed Khaled: The heart of the Mina defense team played a big role and carried a heavy burden in front of Naft Al Wasat attack and defended fiercely for its goal to contribute to securing the victory."

Based on my above sample summary, I cannot see any significant coverage of this player. Giant Snowman 11:42, 5 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete - fails NFOOTBALL and also appears to fail GNG based on my sample survey of sources above. If anybody finds anything which is significant then please ping me so I can re-consider. Lots of little coverage in local media does not confer notability. Giant Snowman 11:44, 5 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete does not meet our ludicously low inclusion standards for footballers.John Pack Lambert (talk) 15:28, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - the coverage is entirely routine; in most references, Ahmed Khaled is barely even mentioned and those that do focus on him are just because he has signed for a new club or signed a new contract. Spiderone 10:27, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. The draftify votes are misguided, she won't become notable simply by playing, her club is not in a fullyprofessionalleague to satisfy nfooty. However, any editor who thinks they have found sources to satisfy gng can readily have the article restored to their draft space. Let me know if you want this done. Fenix down (talk) 23:33, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Gemma Font

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Sources in the article as well as this [53] all seem to indicate that she has not played a game of senior football yet. I also see no indication of being able to pass WP:GNG. At best, this seems like a case of WP:TOOSOON for Barcelona's third choice goalkeeper. Spiderone 18:24, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 22:14, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Draftify since she might debut in the near future. SportingFlyer T·C 11:05, 5 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Draftify per SportingFlyer.--SirEdimon ^Dimmi!!! 04:43, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Looking at the reference available, person is not notable in her profession
Delete This article was already deleted (via prod) for failing WP:NFOOTY. Number 5 7 13:47, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Draftify Seems to be the best choice per above, no need to fully delete if she makes an appearance, as it will just have to be recreated once again. Seacactus 13 (talk) 15:39, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Comment - draftify seems like a sensible option Spiderone 15:05, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Too many people are under the impression Font will be notable if she appears for Barcelona - she won't as she will still fail NFOOTBALL. Dougal18 (talk) 15:05, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Fenix down (talk) 14:38, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Kittiphon Laengthaisong

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Does not pass WP:GNG based on one possible appearance, which isn't recorded in Soccerway. There was some question marks about whether it was actually a different person making the appearance, see Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Football/Archive 130#Kittiphon Laengthaisong - notability, and nevertheless, one appearance mentioned in one source doesn't meet WP:GNG. Joseph2302 (talk) 13:45, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - long standing consensus that passing NFOOTY from one appearance (which in this case is disputed anyway) is insufficient when WP:GNG is so comprehensively failed Spiderone 13:58, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - does not appear to meet GNG or NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 13:58, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Comment, subject doesn't appear to meet WP:NSPORTS, per linked thread, which I started. Per WP:NEXIST, I'd be interested to hear the thoughts of Thai-speaking editors before I make an opinion on whether WP:GNG has been met. Hack (talk) 13:58, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- The Thai sources I've found are all match reports. --Paul_012 (talk) 15:49, 5 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was keep. BD2412 T 03:08, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Elvis José de Lima

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No references, not a notable footballer LeftiePete (talk) 21:37, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep - clearly meets WP:NFOOTY due to several appearances in different professional leagues in Brazil; news coverage is limited but here is one source that could be used [54] Spiderone 22:20, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Speedy keep per SKCRIT 2 or 3 - I have serious concerns about the conduct of the nominator and the nomination is clearly erroneous that I don't believe the nominator has even read the article, let alone undertaken WP:BEFORE. There are references in the article and they clearly show that this player is notable per WP:NFOOTBALL (reason) - the article simply needs improving, not deleting. Giant Snowman 22:22, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
~~Delete~~ This footballer is not a notable football player. A quick Google search confirms this statement. He’s hardly referenced anywhere. Finding one or two sources is clutching at straws.--LeftiePete (talk) 01:48, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Draftify. Maybe he passes NFOOTY, but so what? As written, he doesn't pass GNG. Improve it to several paragraphs then restore. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 04:21, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep I won't begin to promote WP:NFOOTY because I don't agree with it or its determining factors, but my belief is that this player deserves this article. He has enough sources that I have found by doing a WP:BEFORE that add up to the spirit of WP:GNG and Wikipedia itself, in my opinion. (Of note: I believe the countless women footballers who have been deleted deserve an article, as well.) The AfD process is not for clean-up of articles so I believe it should be kept. I also concur with GiantSnowman's concern about the conduct of the nominator. --Tsistunagiska (talk) 19:34, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Draftify due to lacking the sourcing to pass WP:GNG. I'm with Piotrus. Maybe passes WP:NFOOTY, but this is an encyclopedia, not a directory, and therefore the article should contain more then just his name, what team he plays for, and an infobox. There's zero reason the article can't be drafted and recreated when that extremely extremely low bar has been met. Also, while I agree the nominator has maybe made a few bad nominations, it doesn't mean they were in bad faith or that every nomination should be discounted off because of it. Even if they were in bad faith though, a lot of AfDs still go through the process when they were created by suckpuppets and the like. So, there's zero reason not to consider this on it's merits as an while it's here. --Adamant1 (talk) 21:57, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep Seems to be a decent amount of information in Portuguese. I've added a source which talks directly about him and didn't have time to parse the other results - lots of players named Élvis it seems, but a full name search + the name of the clubs he's been involved with brings up a number of results which likely get him past WP:GNG. SportingFlyer T·C 10:54, 5 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@SportingFlyer: There's so much information about him that this article is on the second page when you search his name on Google (sarcasm). And, no there aren't too many players named Élvis but that's beside the point - let's just discuss the alleged notability of Elvis José de Lima. Google news brings up no results. Google search results only show what teams he's played for in the past. Why is that enough for him to have a Wikipedia article?--LeftiePete (talk) 20:07, 5 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

You're not looking in the right place, then. I've run several searches specifically targeted in Portuguese and have found good coverage of him. Notability isn't based on where someone falls in Google results, especially footballers who share a name with a celebrity who receive all of their coverage in a foreign language. I've added an additional reference and updated the article a bit, but there's a lot more to add. SportingFlyer T·C 20:47, 5 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Weak keep - Article about professional footballer who made a handful of substitute's appearances in the 2006 Brasileiro A, before embarking on a journeyman's career with a fair amount of appearances in Brasileiro B and C, Pernambucano A and Paulista A1. There is plenty of online routine coverage in Portuguese, but not much that could be considered in-depth coverage (e.g., there is as much coverage of his daughter's birth as there is of his playing career in one of the sources). It is challenging finding online coverage of a person with a common nickname (e.g., Santa Cruz also had a defender named Elvis shortly before this one broke into the senior side). Jogurney (talk) 17:22, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was keep. Geschichte (talk) 19:43, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Rupert Cawthorne

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No sources, not a notable footballer LeftiePete (talk) 21:40, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep - meets WP:NFOOTY; also here is one source [55] Spiderone 22:13, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Speedy keep per SKCRIT 2 or 3 - I have serious concerns about the conduct of the nominator and the nomination is clearly erroneous that I don't believe the nominator has even read the article, let alone undertaken WP:BEFORE. There are references in the article and they clearly show that this player is notable per WP:NFOOTBALL (professional with multiple appearances) - the article simply needs improving, not deleting. Giant Snowman 22:22, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
~~Delete~~ GiantSnowman (talk · contribs) is basically harassing and stalking me. Anyway, the footballer has hardly any notability.--LeftiePete (talk) 01:49, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Struck !vote as that counts as double voting. LeftiePete, casting aspersions is something to be cautious about. If you are positive you have a case, then please take it to WP:ANI. This is not the venue. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 06:56, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep Having completed a WP:BEFORE search, the sources confirm that the subject meets the spirit of WP:GNG and Wikipedia itself. Having the article here is an improvement of Wikipedia and adheres to the five pillars that form the foundation of the project. --Tsistunagiska (talk) 19:53, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep Passes NFOOTY due to ~~international~~ league appearances. Eagleash (talk) 20:14, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep Passes NFOOTY and probably GNG, though my searches of newspapers of the period were a bit sparse. SportingFlyer T·C 11:13, 5 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

One of the best WP:HEYs I think I've ever seen. Easy keep. SportingFlyer T·C 15:31, 5 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was keep. Geschichte (talk) 19:42, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Rupert Sandilands

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No references, not a notable footballer LeftiePete (talk) 21:39, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep - meets WP:NFOOTY due to England caps; also [56] is a source. Not sure why you want to delete footballing Ruperts... Spiderone 22:15, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Speedy keep per SKCRIT 2 or 3 - I have serious concerns about the conduct of the nominator and the nomination is clearly erroneous that I don't believe the nominator has even read the article, let alone undertaken WP:BEFORE. There are references in the article and they clearly show that this player is notable per WP:NFOOTBALL (England international) - the article simply needs improving, not deleting. Giant Snowman 22:22, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
~~Delete~~ GiantSnowman (talk · contribs) do you always harass and stalk people on Wikipedia? Leave me alone. Anyway, the footballer nominated to be deleted has hardly any coverage and is not notable.--LeftiePete (talk) 01:51, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Struck !vote as that counts as double voting. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 06:50, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep Not sure how this came to be nominated, clearly passes WP:NFOOTY due to national team appearances. Eagleash (talk) 02:56, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep satisfies WP:NFOOTY. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 06:54, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep He played international football for his country. Consequently, he was notable, is notable and will always remain notable. Daemonickangaroo2018 (talk) 13:14, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep as above. It could do with an improvement tho tbh, maybe an expansion for its upcoming 10-year anniversary could be in order? I've added another ref with plenty of info on him. Crowsus (talk) 13:17, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep After a WP:BEFORE search, the subject meets the spirit of WP:GNG and Wikipedia, therefore should have an article. --Tsistunagiska (talk) 19:49, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep and easily - needs to be expanded, but news of his death was reported as far away as Canada. SportingFlyer T·C 11:15, 5 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep England international, obviously passes WP:NFOOTY guidance on notability. Muchclag (talk) 23:17, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Eddie891 ^Talk _Work 20:45, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Jermaine Palacios

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Non notable minor league baseball player Spanneraol (talk) 14:42, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete fails WP:GNG, coverage is routine and expected of a minor league baseball player. SportingFlyer T·C 14:53, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per above. Too bad the PROD didn't play out. – Muboshgu (talk) 16:42, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete he fails the notability guidelines due to the routine coverage and he didn't play in a major league. So, the lack of coverage isn't surprising. It sucks the PROD was removed. --Adamant1 (talk) 19:03, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per others.-- Yankees10 00:26, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. There is consensus based on the below discussion that the subject does not satisfy the notability requirements as laid out in WP:NFOOTY and lacks the significant coverage in reliable sources as is required by WP:GNG. TheSandDoctor ^Talk 14:19, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hue-man Cao

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Challenged PROD with appears to meet WP:NFOOTY. I think it's hard to discuss NFOOTY too much without going into the same old circular argument which always revolves around WP:FPL. Whilst her four substitute appearances and one start for Duisburg may give a presumption of notability, I can't find any significant coverage to pass WP:GNG. I have found some sources [57] [58] [59] but it's all just passing mentions really. Spiderone 11:02, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - given the level she played at she does not meet NFOOTBALL anyway, but more importantly she fails GNG. Giant Snowman 11:44, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete She seems to fail both the notability guidelines for football players and like GiantSnowman say's, more importantly she fails WP:GNG. --Adamant1 (talk) 18:53, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete a non-notable footballer.John Pack Lambert (talk) 15:36, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Eddie891 ^Talk _Work 20:47, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Cole Sturgeon

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Non-notable minor league baseball player. Fails WP:GNG Dmoore5556 (talk) 06:15, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete fails WP:GNG. Didn't quite make it to the bigs sadly, coverage is routine and expected of a minor league baseball player. If he gets another chance we can recreate it. SportingFlyer T·C 14:54, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete a non-notable minor league player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 14:23, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete I concur with SportingFlyer. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 14:41, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Pax:Vobiscum (talk) 10:37, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Nick Longhi

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Non-notable minor league baseball player. Fails WP:GNG Dmoore5556 (talk) 06:12, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete fails WP:GNG. Like the other noms coverage is routine and expected of a minor league baseball prospect, but he didn't quite make it (yet). SportingFlyer T·C 14:56, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete a non-notable minor league player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:04, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete I concur with SportingFlyer. We can always recreate it if he does make it to the MLB. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 14:43, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Pax:Vobiscum (talk) 13:29, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Kevin Lenik

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Non-notable minor league baseball player. Fails WP:GNG Dmoore5556 (talk) 06:06, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete some more coverage than the other ones currently up for deletion but still not enough to show he's more notable than a routine minor leaguer. SportingFlyer T·C 14:58, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete a non-notable minor league player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 15:48, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete I concur with SportingFlyer. We can always recreate if he does make it to the MLB. --TheSandDoctor ^Talk 14:43, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was keep. Missvain (talk) 01:35, 6 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Stetson Allie

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Non-notable minor league baseball player. Fails WP:GNG Dmoore5556 (talk) 06:00, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete coverage is routine or transactional or youth sports coverage. Non-notable minor leaguer. SportingFlyer T·C 14:57, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep You need to do some more WP:BEFORE. He's a notable bust with lots of coverage.[60][61][62] That's just a start, but I'm more focused on the election right now. – Muboshgu (talk) 01:21, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

While I admit those articles cover him decently, they are all prospect watches from the media market for the team that drafted him, and I can't find coverage from anywhere else. I don't think he's a "notable bust" but rather just a non-notable minor leaguer. SportingFlyer T·C 12:09, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
They are articles in reliable sources that cover him in significant depth. That's GNG. Arguments that WP:ITSLOCAL don't apply. – Muboshgu (talk) 17:40, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Still doesn't make him notable. He's a washed out prospect who only received coverage from the media market of the team that drafted him and the coverage is routine. Minor leaguers are rarely notable, and he does not appear to be. SportingFlyer T·C 18:32, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete there is no coverage that actually rises to the level of passing GNG.John Pack Lambert (talk) 17:25, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, TheSandDoctor ^Talk 14:44, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, 78.26 _{(spin me / revolutions)} 16:05, 18 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, MBisanz ^talk 17:28, 28 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep. Searching turns up several instances of meaningful media coverage.[63] [64] [65]. I don't see how these articles fail to constitute notability. Also, I think its not particularly civil to call him a "washed out prospect." Our job is to assess notability, not making judgments about the subject of the article. And, respectfully, I think the media coverage he has received makes him notable. And if that means other minor leaguers are notable, then so be it. DocFreeman24 (talk) 03:25, 2 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

None of those sources are sufficient in terms of WP:GNG. They're all blogs such as SportsNation. Almost every minor leaguer will receive at least some coverage, but that doesn't mean they're notable for Wikipedia purposes. SportingFlyer T·C 16:19, 2 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep Appears to meet GNG per above sources. I'm perfectly fine with having more articles on minor leaguers. ~EDDY ^{(talk/contribs)}~ 16:12, 2 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:59, 20 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Lee Matasi

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Fails WP:NSPORTS. Sportsfan 1234 (talk) 23:57, 2 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep I think there is notability here around the intersection of multiple areas, not just sports. Also the creation of the skate park. Balle010 (talk) 05:55, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Per WP:BIO1E. All the sources I can find are about Matasi's death (or the fact that the skatepark was named after him because he was murdered, which I count as still under the "event" of the murder). There's no significant reliable coverage outside of Matasi's death that I can see. Happy to change my vote if someone can find RS/sigcov. Samsmachado (talk) 23:02, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete Fails WP:NSPORTS. In the WP:VICTIM guideline, a victim notable for one event should only have an article if they played "a large role within a well-documented historic event." I don't think his death is a well-documented historical event and the information about this crime would be better served in an event article about his death, not a biography. Z1720 (talk) 19:59, 14 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Vanamonde (Talk) 20:09, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Chaz Dennis

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While there is, unfortunately, no notability guideline for bowlers, this individual clearly fails WP:SPORTBASIC. I will also note that the page still includes the American children category, despite the page's subject being 24. I just thought I'd point that out. KidAd talk 20:38, 2 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete very clearly a non-notable bowler.John Pack Lambert (talk) 14:18, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete: Per Nom. The "second youngest person" is not notable and the subject having "any recognition" tied to a single award would be just "one event". Otr500 (talk) 08:37, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was no consensus. Arbitrarily0 ^(talk) 04:03, 25 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Ernst Albihn

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Contested PROD with reasoning 1-His officiated 13 international matches were enough for notability as became BIO article such as football player which notable with play at least a international match (even friendly). 2- There are a lot articles in wikipedia as this article (with database sources or without newspaper sources

In my view, the subject does not pass WP:GNG. He gets some coverage [66] [67] but it's all trivial. Referees are not inherently notable for the matches that they have officiated. They need to have at least some coverage that focuses on them as an individual. Spiderone 19:18, 2 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete per nom, fails GNG. Giant Snowman 19:37, 2 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep since coverage does exist – a search in the newspaper archives at https://tidningar.kb.se/?q=%20%22ernst%20albihn%22 shows a bit of coverage; several obituaries in the larger newspapers, which may or may not be primary, some coverage of his death, but also a couple of articles about him including a piece in Expressen (not a despicable tabloid at the time) about "the best Swedish football referees through history" from 1951, where Albihn was ranked 4th. Most sources are not freely available, unfortunately, but I have added some info based on the sources I can access. I'll be able to read the locked newspaper sources from the library at work, but I don't know when I will next be there – not before this AfD closes anyway, I'm afraid. --bonadea contributions talk 15:55, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep, per bonadea. The best sources for persons who died in 1944 are often not easily accessible online; the articles about him in the newspaper archive are from the major Swedish newspapers. /Julle (talk) 03:31, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete because other (referee) articles exist is not a valid argument, and making a ranking of best Swedish referees is small change. David notMD (talk) 03:54, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I don't see anywhere in any of the Keep comments that anyone has made other stuff exists argument, User:David notM; the case being made is about sources existing. Nfitz (talk) 22:14, 21 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep Digging around, I can see other mentions in contemporary books. The sources added to this article since the AFD began, bring this to a level of keep. Nfitz (talk) 22:14, 21 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was no consensus. Pax:Vobiscum (talk) 09:30, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Brandon Pritzl

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Assistant college basketball coach who fails WP:NSPORTS. Prod recently removed with an invalid rationale. AleatoryPonderings (???) (!!!) 17:27, 2 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - associate head coaches are not head coaches. Fails WP:NSPORT.Onel5969 ^{TT me} 18:36, 2 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep Assistant coaches are kind of a mixed bag - some are notable while some are not. In this case, I think the sources [68] [69] [70] [71] indicate he meets GNG. ~EDDY ^{(talk/contribs)}~ 02:49, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete does not pass the notability guidelines for coaches.John Pack Lambert (talk) 14:10, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: This would benefit from more analysis of the sources presented. All of those opining for deletion have cited a secondary notability guideline, two of which simply redirect to the top of the guideline page, without being more specific, and none have addressed the sources presented and whether or not the subject meets the General notability guideline. Ultimately, if subjects meet the GNG, it is not necessary for them to also meet a SNG.
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Keep per the sources found by EDDY, of the three I could access all contained significant coverage of this individual, and Green Bay, Wisconsin is a large enough place for its local media to be reliable. Devonian Wombat (talk) 10:38, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Spartaz ^Humbug! 10:41, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Anil Chawan

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Footballer who fails GNG and NFOOTY. No senior appearances at fully-pro level BlameRuiner (talk) 06:49, 2 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep: Anil Chawan was registered into the ATK squad for the 2019-20 Indian Super League season, lead by coach Antonio Lopez Habas. He was part of the preseason and was on the bench in the very first match against Kerala Blasters FC away at Kochi, which makes him eligible as a notable person as per Wikipedia:NFOOTBALL.^[1] -SabyaC (talk) 07:01, 2 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep: He is a professional player who is registered for the 2020-21 Indian Super League season for SC East Bengal^[2] and I feel this Wikipedia article should not be deleted. -SabyaC (talk) 06:57, 2 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

References

^ "Kerala Blasters vs ATK". Indian Super League. Retrieved 1 November 2020.

^ "SC East Bengal Squad". Indian Super League. Retrieved 1 November 2020.

Keep: Anil Chawan also made 3 appearances in the de-facto National Cup tournament 2019 Durand Cup (since Super Cup did not take place in 2019-20 season) for ATK. -SabyaC (talk) 07:03, 2 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comment You can't vote three times like that. I have striked your comments for that. Govvy (talk) 11:39, 2 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Govvy, The above user is probably new and seems unaware of how to contribute to AfDs. He seems to have added "Keep" before his 3 bullet points, after looking at my vote. I suggest his comments be merged into one, rather than striking off. ChunnuBhai (talk) 08:08, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

He has been around since Feb 2017! :/ Govvy (talk) 14:47, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep: appearances in Durand Cup should get through the WP:NFOOTY criteria. ChunnuBhai (talk) 07:05, 2 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Draftify: Since the player hasn't appeared in fully-pro league. Otherwise the article is in a good position. If the player appears, then can be moved back to mainspace. Saha ❯❯❯ Stay safe 11:34, 2 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 12:28, 2 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete/draftify - does not meet the guidelines currently but could do soon so would recommend either deletion or draftifying Spiderone 14:30, 2 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: No clear consensus, Durand Cup reports seem to indicate he has featured in competitive matches involving two fully professional teams but not seeing that reflected in the discussion so might be mistaken.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Fenix down (talk) 22:40, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comment - his article says that the Durand Cup appearance was for ATK Reserves And Academy, which is not a team in a WP:FPL, so playing for that team would not meet NFOOTBALL. Certainly Soccerway doesn't list it. More importantly, GNG is not met. FYI @Fenix down:. Giant Snowman 17:21, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete fails WP:FOOTY and WP:GNG as per above.--Ortizesp (talk) 18:30, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. King of ♥ ♦ ♣ ♠ 04:33, 21 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Dean Trboyevich

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Ice hockey player who never made it to the NHL. His only claim to fame is actually that he was arrested for cross-checking an opponent in the head. The incident received a bit of coverage but imo not enough to really pass the general notability bar as the coverage was not really sustained. Pichpich (talk) 23:56, 1 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete per nomination. And we should not be reporting mere arrests or charges, but rather adjudications of guilt. There was no such adjudication here; the charges were dropped. Kablammo (talk) 13:04, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete a non-notable ice hockey player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 14:49, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep Player was a professional player in both the AHL and the now defunct IHL, which are/were professional hockey leagues in North America. A corollary here then is a more substantial review of other former player articles should be performed. In regards to the reporting of the arrest, it is correct no such adjudication was done, as the author i would welcome appropriate direction to better clarify this. However the incident is well known within hockey communities as one of the seminal incidents promoting the change of the professional game in style of play (I know this through anecdotal discussions). The reference to the Youtube video is one of the few instances that allow the incident to be reviewed and discussed. Liquid0nyx11 (talk) 19:20, 5 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- @Liquid0nyx11: Per WP:NHOCKEY, the minimum to presume notability for the AHL and IHL is 200 total games, and this player had 150 regular season and playoff games combined in those two leagues. This number was made via consensus for exactly what you asking: a substantial review of players in those leagues and the type of WP:GNG-worthy coverage they received. So for players less than that, then they just need to have the coverage sources to meet WP:GNG, which is certainly not impossible. It once was "in a fully pro league" and that led to a bunch of sub-stubs. And then it was 100, and many players still did not meet WP:GNG, especially defensemen such as the player in question on this AfD. Take a look at User talk:Dolovis and that page's archives for why this happened. Yosemiter (talk) 18:00, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete. Player fails to meet WP:NHOCKEY and I did not find enough information to satisfy WP:GNG beyond this one event mentioned above. Flibirigit (talk) 22:12, 20 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Black Kite (talk) 00:21, 20 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Andy Cobb

AfDs for this article:

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Fails WP:BIO. References seem to be press-releases. Little coverage. scope_creep^Talk 18:29, 1 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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I am unsure why this page is again in the AfD. An administrator already removed it from AfD once. This article meets the requirements and the notability and if it is found to not meet those then other pages within the same scope should be deleted such as Johnny Herrera(racing driver) as they have raced the same series and Cobb has more sources than Herrera. Cobb is a licensed World of Outlaws driver and that licensing can be located within the World of Outlaws administrative filings. World of Outlaws is the highest level of dirt sprint car racing one can reach. — Preceding unsigned comment added by RacingFan247 (talk • contribs) 19:54, 2 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete Lacks independent coverage to pass WP:NBIO. (including "This page has been added to search engine indexes" in an article is a good way to make one's WP:PROMO intentions known...) 1292simon (talk) 07:46, 5 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Can anyone advise on the comparison to the other racing pages such as Johnny Herrera (racing driver) that I continue to use as an example and the references of coverage he has? Almost 100 percent of racing coverage for sprint cars in America is what appears to be a press release layout. However sprint car and midget magazine along with speed sport news are independent sources and the primary sources of American sprint car and open wheel racing media. Secondly a video reel of the TV series showing the credits for his acting contributions can’t be used on here as a reference. Thirdly as for the section that was added referencing search engine indexes was added after reviewing the articles for creation section talking about indexing pages for search engines. This is my first article creation so I am trying to address everything I can prior to creating anymore. — Preceding unsigned comment added by RacingFan247 (talk • contribs) 21:11, 5 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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- "Other racing pages" are not relevant. WP:OTHERSTUFF. - The Bushranger _{One ping only} 23:04, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - fails WP:NACTOR, WP:NCREATIVE, everything under WP:NSPORTS and WP:GNG. I'm not seeing a single independent source that is anything more than transactional about his racing career. 75.174.138.211 (talk) 15:54, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(An outside article reference Has been added. — Preceding unsigned comment added by RacingFan247 (talk • contribs) 14:11, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

That is a blog dude and fails WP:SPIP. scope_creep^Talk 14:20, 12 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. We keep articles on sportspeople, and racing drivers, if they compete in a top-level competition for their sport, and WoO is the top level for sprint cars...except Cobb has never raced n WoO ompetition. - The Bushranger _{One ping only} 23:03, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I am not understanding how you can say Cobb has never competing in WoO competition. There is an article from the WoO that is about Cobb and Danny Lasoski competing in the WoO in 2014. He is also a current WoO driver as far as licensing from the WoO Dirtcar sanction is concerned. A copy of that license can be provided if someone wants it.

(post closing comment for future clarity) A license does not confer notability. - The Bushranger _{One ping only} 04:54, 20 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 22:08, 14 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Rod Taylor (American football)

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Doesn't look notable. Fails WP:NGRIDIRON, as he was suspended or injured, missing every potential game of his NFL career. He was on the XFL practice squad, so that doesn't really count for anything, either. Current sourcing either doesn't mention him, is brief transactional notices, or is tweets/blogs. Some briefish coverage here, and some more brief stuff here. Okay Bleacher Report piece, but it's mostly some scouting stuff and doesn't say a whole lot about him. This guy just doesn't seem to meet the notability requirements, although I'd say he's closer than some. Hog Farm _Bacon 21:07, 30 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep Meets GNG - he was highly recruited out of high school. In addition to the sources mentioned above, I was able to dig up [72] [73] [74] [75] [76] [77]. Decent amount of coverage for an offensive lineman. ~EDDY ^{(talk/contribs)}~ 20:48, 31 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete fails WP:NGRIDIRON and I don't think the coverage above is non-routine, reliable, or not-youth-sportsy enough to get him over the WP:GNG bar for an article. SportingFlyer T·C 23:04, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete, coverage of youth sports is more trivial in nature than of real sports. Geschichte (talk) 10:18, 14 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was no consensus. Sandstein 11:34, 6 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Shawn Occeus

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Does not meet the requirements of the notability guideline for basketball players. The only sources I can find besides his college-days bio (not really a third-party source) are stats websites and very short notes about his career. We don't have the sufficient significant coverage required by the general notability guideline. Pichpich (talk) 20:44, 29 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep Meets GNG per [78] [79] [80][81][82] [83] [84] [85] ~EDDY ^{(talk/contribs)}~ 14:44, 30 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Relisting comment: final relist
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Delete He meets none of the notability criteria for basketball players. The references given above and those in the article, while numerous, do not rise to the level of meeting WP:GNG. Most of them are routine sports reporting about games and appear in the local press (whether it's for high school, college, or the G-League) or from non-independent sources (like his college). Reports of transactions also are generally considered to be typical reporting and do not generally confer notability. Papaursa (talk) 03:32, 27 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- Sources that cover Occeus in reasonable depth, whether a reported transfer or his return from injury, are not what I would consider routine. Records of signings might be routine, but are not if they explain his previous career. Here is another source from his pro career: [86] ~EDDY ^{(talk/contribs)}~ 16:50, 27 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Looks like routine reporting of a game combined with an announcement of the league shutting down. Papaursa (talk) 18:07, 27 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete None of the sources presented qualify for GNG for different reasons. Several are local sources from his high school days which don't count because of WP:NYOUNGATH. The CBS Sports is a two sentence transactional blurb. The others are blogs or non-independent sources from his college career and the remainder are game reports from his minor league basketball career. There's no evidence here he's been covered significantly by any reliable, independent secondary sources that aren't local high school articles. SportingFlyer T·C 13:23, 28 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
First of all, there is no guideline called WP:NYOUNGATH, nor is there the precedent that youth sports coverage automatically counts less than usual GNG stuff. This is an argument you've used before and I don't think it works. Second, this this and this cover him in reasonable detail from his college days and are independent sources. ~EDDY ^{(talk/contribs)}~ 16:24, 28 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I apologise, I meant WP:YOUNGATH, which specifically disqualifies some of the coverage here. The Boston Herald is a game report, which are specifically considered WP:ROUTINE by WP:SPORTBASIC. The Local Headline News article looks like a neighbourhood paper. The WRBB Sports looks like a student radio station, so not independent. Still not close to GNG. SportingFlyer T·C 16:56, 28 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep Good improvements and new sources added in good faith to rescue the article, which does enough for me.--Concertmusic (talk) 15:43, 30 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

We generally assume editors are working in good faith (see WP:AGF). That doesn't mean the sources meet WP:GNG or that the article can't be deleted. Papaursa (talk) 14:06, 1 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Let me rephrase then - the improvements add reliable secondary sources to support the new material added. I have no issue with notability here either.--Concertmusic (talk) 14:19, 1 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Which sources specifically do you think are reliable, secondary, and significant? SportingFlyer T·C 15:31, 1 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

6, 7, and 8 in particular clear all of those bars for me, but even the short mentions on CBSSports count as reliable in my book. Maybe more to the point, this to me is a case where there are sources to support the information - and as is often the case, notability is open to interpretation. I think the article provides interesting knowledge, which I enjoyed reading.--Concertmusic (talk) 15:52, 1 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

If I've identified them correctly, one is a game report, which is specifically excluded by WP:SPORTBASIC. The short mentions on CBSSports are also transactional and considered routine - they're two sentences, that's not WP:SIGCOV at all. Finally, the student newspaper isn't independent enough of the subject. I think those are the sources you've mentioned, and none of them pass WP:GNG. Whether you enjoyed the article has no bearing on its notability. SportingFlyer T·C 16:00, 1 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The eighth source devotes several paragraphs to Occeus. Game reports don't count if it's just "Occeus scores 12 points and grabs 4 rebounds", but I'd consider that one significant. As I've mentioned, there are other sources that cover Occeus in detail as well. We do not need to discount his high school years, as GNG supersedes any notability guidelines. ~EDDY ^{(talk/contribs)}~ 20:30, 1 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

We've gone through this before, but WP:SPORTBASIC specifically excludes match reports, and WP:YOUNGATH specifically excludes routine high school sports coverage... and those exclusions clarify which sources are WP:GNG-qualifying sources. Your logic doesn't make sense, because it basically says "if a source exists, it counts towards GNG, even when other guidelines say those sources don't count towards GNG." SportingFlyer T·C 20:38, 1 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, and as I've explained before, Occeus is not a high school athlete, he is a professional basketball player. YOUNGATH applies to players while they are in high school, but is not a disqualification of sources from a person's high school period. Reasonable minds may differ as to what is considered "significant", but you are totally misreading the policy. ~EDDY ^{(talk/contribs)}~ 00:44, 2 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Consensus that notability is not met Nosebagbear (talk) 14:01, 23 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Prashant P

(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

Moved out of process for a second time after being restored to draftspace. The page has had multiple declines and in the last instance was rejected as lacking notability. Issues raised throughout have not been addressed. Lacks sourcing and search did not reveal any hits. Eagleash (talk) 18:42, 29 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
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Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
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Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: There are still no comments other than the nom
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Delete - sources fail to establish WP:GNG Spiderone 14:51, 22 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was keep. Pax:Vobiscum (talk) 10:04, 21 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Sam Colangelo

(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

Fails to meet notability at this stage with WP:NHOCKEY. Triggerbit (talk) 22:07, 28 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Comment : I personally think Colangelo is notable, but unfortunately he narrowly missed the first round, meaning criteria 5 is barely missed. If anyone can find other sources please add them. Eternal Shadow Talk 00:56, 29 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete: I can't see any basis to conclude that the subject is notable (and wouldn't mind Eternal Shadow setting forth his reasoning that he is), and anything beyond that is a CRYSTAL violation, so deletion is the only option. Ravenswing 05:31, 29 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep - He has enough coverage to meet GNG, which is not surprising for someone who was considered to have a good chance of being a first round pick. There are already two reliably sourced articles specifically about Colangelo in our article from the Boston Herald and the Boston Globe. I also found an article about him in The Athletic, and article at nhl.com, an article partially about him in the Chicago Sun Times, plus 7 paragraphs in this Hockey Writers article and an article about him here (as well as his own Hockey Writers article, although I think a lot of lower level prospects get this too). He also has an article about him in New England Hockey Journal, although since it is behind a paywall I can't see how extensive it is. And he got a small amount of coverage in the Hockey News here (plus a few one sentence updates elsewhere). — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rlendog (talk • contribs)

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Keep per new sources, particularly in light of WP:NEXIST. FOARP (talk) 14:01, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

comment still fails the basic hockey notability..which is the basis of his notability. Article hasn't been updated to note new sources Triggerbit (talk) 07:23, 13 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- The basis of his notability is GNG. The article can be updated with the additional sources if and when the article is kept. Rlendog (talk) 13:25, 16 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
weak keep: Not many sources available, QueerEcofeminist[they/them/their] 06:24, 20 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. Subject passes WP:GNG and has potential to be expanded. A poorly written article is not grounds for deletion itself. Flibirigit (talk) 22:18, 20 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. After nearly two weeks, a relist, sock blocks, and protection, a consensus to delete has emerged, so I think this is ripe for closure. Broadly, participants are not convinced that the subject meets our inclusion criteria, but there is also a minority of opinions that boil down to WP:TNT. By comparison, most of the non-sock keep votes are relatively weak. Few go beyond simply asserting the subject meets the GNG, and for the couple that actually analyze the Farsi sources, participants generally did not find them convincing as shown by some editors changing from keep to delete. Thanks to everyone who participated through comments and cleanup. — Wug·a·po·des 23:30, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Iman Farzin

(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

Not notable. It's a paid article and we deleted it several times in fawiki. ARASH PT talk 22:05, 27 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Also, we blocked the article author and his sockpuppets on fawiki. ARASH PT talk 22:09, 27 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Comment This article is inflated with some passing mentions but on the other hand he did attract some genuine third party coverage for his roles and his accusations of corruption have received significant coverage. I haven’t ploughed through all the refs but the latter ones look to me like they make him a GNG pass. Mccapra (talk) 05:12, 28 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep The article has about 30 secondary sources, including iranian major news agencies. The person is notable in Iranian football, plus he has been assigned for the Rio 2016 Olympics and FIBA Basketball World Cup 2019 and some other major International sport events. The reason that This article is being considered for deletion, is that I created the article for this person in farsi wikipedia, but the same user (Arash.pt) deleted that immediately and blocked my user account! He even deleted my comment in Administrators' noticeboard. I believe that some users in farsi wikipedia are trying to make that project exclusive, it's a kind of mafia there. --Sajjadimanian (talk) 10:48, 28 October 2020 (UTC) Sock Le v!v ich 23:59, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Weak keep - Comments I was wondering if there is some indication he is being suppressed by the Iranian government and that there maybe more issues surrounding this person. I highly doubt this is paid editing, I disagree with the assumption this is not-notable. Govvy (talk) 10:51, 28 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep meets the General notability guideline (Significant coverage and secondary sources Independent of the subject)--31.2.137.149 (talk) 11:10, 28 October 2020 (UTC) — 31.2.137.149 (talk) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. [reply]
Keep Solidly referenced to reliable sources—to the extent of passing WP:BLPSOURCES—and WP:ANYBIO. Furthermore, the nomination is flawed per WP:SKCRIT1 (and could be speedily closed): after all, what happens of fa-wp stays on fa-wp, and no Wikipedia project is bound by the actions (or otherwise) of a sister project. Secondly, paid editing is not yet a reason for deletion. Indeed, it is probably an argument to avoid in a discussion such as this. 2A02:C7F:BE04:700:3920:992F:79F9:176 (talk) 12:07, 28 October 2020 (UTC) — 2A02:C7F:BE04:700:3920:992F:79F9:176 (talk) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. [reply]
Comment can anybody with a knowledge of Farsi please comment on the claims made/sources present? Giant Snowman 14:19, 28 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@GiantSnowman: maybe post at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Iran? It seems semi-active at least. 2A02:C7F:BE04:700:3920:992F:79F9:176 (talk) 14:56, 28 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: Three votes from IPs and a sockpuppet in one day! You can find anything about anyone in Iranian news agencies. Let's check the sources:

3 sources (inn, tabnak, yjc) about an instagram post.
11 sources about his employment in the media department of the Iranian basketball federation!
4 sources just for his previous job as a freelance photographer!

This guy is just paying to have some pages in the Iranian websites and Wikipedia. Govvy said that he is suppressed by the Iranian government that is not true. Actually, he is supported by the Iranian government and all the media coverage is from governmental and extremist news websites. ARASH PT talk 15:58, 28 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(edit conflict) @Arash.pt: Just a reminder that accusations of sockpuppetry are considered WP:ASPERSIONS unless backed by diffs: An editor must not accuse another of misbehavior without evidence, especially when the accusations are... severe; you should withdraw those comments.

I have removed your other comment as a blatant BLP violations (per WP:BLPTALK: Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced and not related to making content choices should be removed, deleted, or oversighted, as appropriate).

I suggest you leave an analysis of the sources to others, as you seem rather invested in this article and its fa-wp background.

@Bishonen: May advise further. 2A02:C7F:BE04:700:3920:992F:79F9:176 (talk) 16:28, 28 October 2020 (UTC) — 2A02:C7F:BE04:700:3920:992F:79F9:176 (talk) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. [reply]

Speedy Keep except notability guidelines, the article meets WP:SKCRIT. Unfortunately nominator user is trying to show that the references are invaluable, and he/she even doesn’t know the difference between FIBA and the Iranian basketball federation. The article subject (Iman Farzin) participated at the Summer olympics (assigned by the International Olympic Committee) which is a very different issue than supporting by the Iranian government. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Arteshesorkh (talk • contribs) 16:17, 28 October 2020 (UTC) Sock Le v!v ich 23:59, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete Not notable on English WP but may well be on Farsi. Article's a Farsi mess, there are no English sources and Farsi ones are questionable. He's not an Olympic participant, let alone medallist. Arguments are virtually illegible in English here. I worry about 4/5 cites for every statement like 'He is a human being'. Best Alexandermcnabb (talk) 16:47, 28 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Weak keep' @Arash.pt: and Sajjadimanian what happens at fa-Wiki stays at fa-Wiki. It is slightly worrying that no English language sources at all are used in the article, but others have said that the sources in use seem to meet WP:RS. Mjroots (talk) 18:21, 28 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep The nominator user doesn't have any evidence to proofe that article is paid. Unfortunately in fa-wiki some editors event doesn't know about the notabilty guidlines , that's why this article with 30 references was speedy deleted in fa-wiki. I guess his Revelations about Carlos Queiroz and the Iran Football Federation could be the reason that some editors or some people are gainst him. by the way, article meets Wikipedia:Notability (people) and Wikipedia:Biographies of living persons, includes valuable secondary references and there is no reason to be deleted. --MHosseinafshar (talk) 09:54, 29 October 2020 (UTC) Sock Le v!v ich 23:59, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete We have been dealing with Article and paid editor behind for quiet some times, though I agree what happens in fawiki should remain on fawiki but when a person is not notable in his own language while he is not international person this should mean something, this article should be speedy deleted and sockpupets and paid editors should be blocked Mardetanha (talk) 16:27, 29 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comment No "!vote" from me, because I cannot read any cited source and don't trust machine translations. But a comment. He's in Category:Iranian photographers, presumably because the article describes him as a "freelance photographer,^[3][4][5][6]". Four sources, merely to demonstrate that he's a freelance photographer -- of what? Beach volleyball, restaurant interiors, weddings, automobile parts? We're not told. All we know of his photography is that four sources say he's a "freelance photographer" of something or other. And his photography is just one example of the way in which this article cites a lot of sources to say remarkably little. Is the article very undeveloped from the sources it cites, or are the sources perhaps very insubstantial? If the former, perhaps some of those people who've said "Keep" above would like to use these sources to say more about him. -- Hoary (talk) 22:29, 29 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep I checked all references. The article pass WP:GNG due to the Significant coverage by Iranian media. Even his statement on his social media has been covered and published by many of Iranian media and agencies. All sources meet WP:RS, ISNA, Fars News Agency, Mehr News Agency, 90 TV, Iran Varzeshi newspaper, Tabnak, Varzesh3 and others are Reliable, secondary and independent from subject. Hoary He is a sport photographer and journalist, member of Iran National Beach Soccer team, and assigned for the Rio 2016 Olympics by the IOC. Other sources are covering his assignment by FIBA. I believe that this article even could be speedy keeped and pass WP:SKCRIT, because some reasons of deletion mentioned by some editors seems frivolous or vexatious nominations (like someone said: you can find anything about anyone in Iranian news agencies)!!! --AgentBarsam (talk) 08:45, 30 October 2020 (UTC) Sock Le v!v ich 23:59, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- AgentBarsam, I was merely asking about his photography. Even now, the draft says nothing about this. If he's a sports photographer, then what has been said about his sports photography, who has said it, and where? Meanwhile, your comment immediately above is more bulky than the sum of all your other surviving contributions to en:Wikipedia. Something about this seems rather odd, but I can't quite put my finger on what it is. -- Hoary (talk) 13:24, 30 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - nobody has adequately explained the significance of the sources and I cannot see it myself (as a non-Farsi reader). Nothing appears notable; it appears overly promotional and I am concerned by the number of new editors who appeared from nowhere to try and defend the article. If people can properly assess the sources and confirm GNG is met, please ping me. Giant Snowman 11:18, 30 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Giant Dear Editor, I'll try to explain you about the sources, hope I can make it clear for you: Here Varzesh3 and Mehrnews and Farsnews and here and Here the subject of news is about him, that is about his assignment by FIBA and his participation at the Basketball World Cup. Also his interview about the corruption of Iran Football Federation here here and his revelations about Carlos Queiroz can be found here Tabnak, here at Iran Daily. Plus his assignment for the Rio 2016 Olympic (as the mainj subject of the news) here HERE. Other reliable references are about his job information, and some news. Let me know if anything is still unclear for you. Thanks --Sajjadimanian (talk) 15:00, 30 October 2020 (UTC) Sock Le v!v ich 23:59, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep Although no significant English sources, the fa references show WP:GNG. Whilst the article needs some work, that shouldn't be a consideration for deletion. Agree with Mjroots, what happens on fa-wiki should not spill over here. --John B123 (talk) 13:10, 1 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

what kind of weak argument is this ? there is no significant source in english and there is signifanct source in farsi, we happen to be expert in the Farsi, we can read it and we all are long term users very much familiar with notablity and other guid lines? still you what happens in fa should in spill over, enwiki doesn't belong to anyone, it so for all of us, it is not like we are outsiders coming to enwiki Mardetanha (talk) 12:37, 2 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Mardetanha You are not the only one who can read Farsi (Persian). Don't try to cheat english editors with your false information. If there is a strong mafia of editors in fa-wiki, don't bring it here. Keep your opinion for your self and don't expand it please. WP:GNG is very clear in english, and in Persian too, there is no need to explain it to others! --Sajjadimanian (talk) 13:49, 2 November 2020 (UTC) Sock Le v!v ich 23:59, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

intersting now we need insults coming from sockpupets whom were blocked from fawiki, spreading their paid agenda to enwiki, Mardetanha (talk) 14:56, 2 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I'm resisting the temptation to reach for the popcorn, but I suppose the best thing to do is keep this discussion on topic? Just a suggestion... Best Alexandermcnabb (talk) 15:20, 2 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Alexandermcnabb: Have to agree with you there, perhaps certain participants in this discussion need to read WP:ETIQ. --John B123 (talk) 16:18, 2 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep Firstly, it absolutely is not a requirement for an en.wiki article to have English language sources. Where they’re available that’s great, but where they’re not, we apply our sourcing policy as best we can to sources in other languages. Much of the current article is promotional fluff and can be cut out, e.g. that he’s a freelance photographer. It is still my view that refs 20-23 make him a WP:GNG pass. Ref 20 is to the website of the Football News Agency where Farzin is the subject of the article headline and the entire story is about his accusations. Ref 21 is the Itabnak website where Farzin’s accusations are again the subject of the news story. Ref 22 is to a similar piece in INN where again Farzin’s accusation are the headline and subject of the story. Ref 23 likewise in a piece by the Young Journalists Club. Nobody has put up an argument to show that these sources are not independent or not reliable. Were Farzin’s accusations just sour grapes? Maybe. But they seem to have been given pretty widespread coverage. The strongest case against the article I can see is that the subject may fail WP:BLP1E since in our terms the only genuinely notable thing about him is these accusations. There clearly are other sources for him dealing with other aspects of his career however, including multiple ones from the Mehr News Agency. So while the article can certainly be edited and stripped of refbombing there’s enough here of substance for me not to be comfortable with deletion. Mccapra (talk) 06:30, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

from what I can see from the sources he made some unsubstantiated accusation on his instagram that Iranian nation team coach is receiving bribe, this accusation didn't receive any attention, I dug it up, nothing found, none of the sources in the article are talking about him and discussing his importance or his role as photographer. Mardetanha (talk) 07:43, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

It is a straightforward untruth that “none of the sources in the article are talking about him”. They are, as anybody with moderately good eyesight can see for themselves. I agree that there is nothing to suggest that he is notable as a photographer. There may well be no substance to his allegations and the whole thing may have blown over very quickly, which would strengthen the case for considering this to fail BLP1E. Mccapra (talk) 11:11, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I think you are using machine translation and that is why what I understand is different from what you see is different, I didn't know this person before this AFD, couple of users in fawiki were offered some money to create article for him, we had a through discussion about this and result was he is not notable, now they have brought the team to enwiki, if he was notable I would be more than happy to have another more article about iranian person on enwiki but he is not, I read all sources, did more research on Farsi, Nothing, yes he was working for AFC and he was photographer, so what ? does anyone who travels to sport event is notable ? he throw some accusation to national coach team which didn't receive any media attention, anyhow I have said enough on this AFD Mardetanha (talk) 18:43, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

~~I added Refs 3,26,27,28 and 29 that shows his notability as an accredited sports photographer. --Sajjadimanian (talk) 14:25, 3 November 2020 (UTC)~~ Sock Le v!v ich 23:59, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

If someone doesn't know this person, it doesn't mean that he is not notable! Notability is regarded to WP:GNG and other guidelines, not on your personal knowledge. Also his accusation to Carolos Queiroz has a significant media coverage (refs. 22,23,24,25,26,27). Seems user Mardetanha is trying to abuse non-farsi speaking editors by providing wrong information to them. --Thedunker66 (talk) 14:00, 5 November 2020 (UTC) Sock Le v!v ich 23:59, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comment It's perhaps worth noting that some contributors to this discussion appear not entirely straightforward. For instance IP 2A02:C7F:BE04:700:3920:992F:79F9:176 seems to be an SPA [87]. Both the Football News Agency and Young Journalists Club of Iran are state bodies, are they not? Do we consider Iranian state media to be a reliable source (genuine question)? And what, if any, relevance does this gentleman have outside the borders of Iran (of interest to anybody reading or using enwiki) or, indeed, of enduring notability INSIDE the borders of Iran? Best Alexandermcnabb (talk) 07:02, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Alexandermcnabb: On the contrary, my edits here are an exception rather than the rule; my attendance was bought about by the highlighting of this case at AN/I. That in itself wouldn't have been sufficient for me to post—I don't think IP editing is usually particularly necessary and/or beneficial to AfD—but the outrageously poor—phenomenally outrageously poor, in fact—nomination statement (comprising as it did a litany of non-arguments, complaint and general assumptions) certainly needed addressing, particularly on account that it was made by a relatively inexperienced editor on this wiki (albeit one who is an admin on fa-wp, where one has to assume standards are rather different). HTH. 2A02:C7F:BE04:700:ED40:DFAB:9D73:1D7 (talk) 10:38, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Alexandermcnabb: on your question about state media and other media closely state-aligned in Iran: there certainly are topics where we would need to be very careful about relying on them, but not in this article. Setting aside the question of photography, this article has two essential parts. Firstly, the subject held a number of official sports positions. The fact that he held them is supported by ‘official’ sources. The fact that he held these positions is not in doubt or question, but they certainly don’t make him notable and if that’s all there was in this article I’d vote delete. The second part is his public claim of corruption in official Iranian sports, which gained some attention in ‘non-official’ media. So for me the issues with this article aren’t about the sources, they’re about 1. Whether the coverage of the claims, taken together with the other parts of the article, make him notable (I think they do) and 2. Whether the article is the product of paid editing. I’ve no idea; the fa.wiki editors seem convinced there is, but no evidence has been produced to support this claim. To me, given that the article subject is a press officer, he’d need to be pretty rubbish at his job if he needed to pay someone to create this. A question that hasn’t been raised in this discussion so far is who would benefit from the deletion of an article that contained allegations of corruption in Iranian football. Thanks Mccapra (talk) 19:14, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comment I added Refs 3,26,27,28 and 29 that shows his notability as an accredited sports photographer. --Sajjadimanian (talk) 14:28, 3 November 2020 (UTC) Sock Le v!v ich 23:59, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Sajjadimanian Your bio says you are the "Director of AFC Social media (Persian)". AFC being the Asian Football Confederation. Sorry, your candour is commendable, but you should be nowhere near this topic (and particularly not articles you have edited such as 2019 AFC Asian Cup - even more so as a new account created in October and active principally since this article was flagged as not notable - a number of your edits here are clearly COI and everything you have said in this discussion and every edit to this article you have made should be, to my understanding of COI editing, struck. Best Alexandermcnabb (talk) 15:48, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comment The more this goes on, the less it adds up to me. We're told we deleted it several times in fawiki and we had a through discussion about this, yet looking at the page,[88] the deletions were M7 (equivalent to en-WP:A7) i.e An article about a real person who does not show the importance of the subject. M7/A7 is not discussed and the criteria is that the article doesn't show notability, as opposed to an AfD where it is discussed and the criteria is the subject is not notable, whether it's demonstrated on the page or not. I'm also getting concerned about the repeated, unsubstantiated claims of sockpuppetry and paid editing. This seems to me to be in contravention of the Arbitration Committee's decisions listed at WP:ASPERSIONS. --John B123 (talk) 20:21, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

John, would you please check this page, these are CU blocks, I am really hopeful enwiki CU would also take a look at this IPs and accounts coming to this thread. Mardetanha (talk) 20:34, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I've made a request for this to be looked into, however, I still think investigating after the accusations have been publicly made is not the way it should work. --John B123 (talk) 21:18, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I take your point, John B123 but this has come to enwiki after a long history at fawiki and looked from the very start like a mess. Getting to the bottom of that mess was beyond me and many others, given that it's a Farsi speaking mess of considerable duration and seeming complexity! The Google translate of the Check User Mardetanha shared is, by the way, a delight - some gems including, "Please get rid of my bald head. I do not like to see notifications related to you on my email. Wikifa is full of sick edemas who want to make up for their personal shortcomings here." and "It is far from justice and politeness to see everyone with one eye and call them sick." In between enwiki editors trying to make sense of this, you have some irate fawiki users, some seeming SPA IPs, certainly a COI editor and a lot of fur flying. I admit, it's beyond me to work out what's going on - other than that something is most certainly going on. If it took some wild accusations to have someone more experienced with the right tools to look into it and unravel it, I'd tend towards the view that the end eclipsed the means. Best Alexandermcnabb (talk) 03:41, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Dear en-wiki editors, please be informed that users blocking is the way for some fa-wiki admins to stop people whom are against them. They accuse you by unsubstantiated claims of sockpuppetry and paid editing, because they don't have any other way to stop you. To be clear, If you behave against them, they will block your account and they don't let you contribute anymore. This is how they control fa-wiki. User Mardetanha is an admin in fa-wiki, but unfortunately he lies here, he said they deleted this article after a discussion, but as you can check, the article in fa-wiki was speedy deleted, and anyone who contributed in has been blocked. Fortunately I live in USA and I'm not afraid of them, the mafia of fa-wiki don't have any access to me, but they blocked my account there in fa-wiki for ever without any evidence. I hope one day some one from Wiki foundation investigate fa-wiki and that day, everyone will understand about the dark reality of administration in fa-wki. With respect to all true editors of farsi wikipedia.--Thedunker66 (talk) 11:14, 4 November 2020 (UTC) Sock Le v!v ich 23:59, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Yet another CU blocked account Mardetanha (talk) 12:34, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

losers usually trying to use dirtiest ways to pull down their enemies! here is not fa-wiki and you are not an administrator. you think anyone who is not agree with you is sockpuppetry or paid editor. you accuse anyone with unsubstantiated claims and you don't have any evidence. Sadly You are a liar and I'm sorry for fa-wiki because you are an administrator there ! by the way, WP:GNG is very clear, maybe you don't like to see! --Sajjadimanian (talk) 12:58, 4 November 2020 (UTC) Sock Le v!v ich 23:59, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note to closing admin: Of the current "Keep" !votes, one is the article creator, two are SPA IPs, (at least) two are sockpuppets CU-blocked on FA-wiki, and (at least) one appears to have been canvassed (did not edit EN-wiki until this AFD was filed). Softlavender (talk) 04:19, 5 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

So that just leaves me then..... Mccapra (talk) 05:16, 5 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Dear Softlavender, unsubstantiated claims are something usual in fa-wiki. there is no evidence, before investigations done, it is not fair to accuse someone. fa-wiki is another project and they (fa-wiki mafia) don't let independent editors to contribute there. If one editor (who lied here and everyone can see) has problem with the subject of article or anyone else, it's his problem, not the article! After all, WP:GNG is very very clear and I honestly believe this article certainly pass notability guidelines. --Sajjadimanian (talk) 10:18, 5 November 2020 (UTC) Sock Le v!v ich 23:59, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Sajjadimanian, since you are one of the users blocked for sockpuppetry on FA-wiki, your opinion does not carry much weight here. And you have a COI with this subject, since you are the "Director of the Asian Football Confederation (AFC) social media (Persian)" [89]. Your accusations of other editors only exacerbate your own problems. Softlavender (talk) 10:44, 5 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

First, they blocked my account in fa-wiki without any evidence, even without any investigations! Then, here is based on Notability Guidelines, not fa-wiki. An admin of fa-wiki who voted "delete" is a liar, he lies here in front of all involved editors ( we deleted it several times in fawiki and we had a through discussion about this, yet looking at the page,[90] the deletions were M7 (equivalent to en-WP:A7) i.e An article about a real person who does not show the importance of the subject This shows that fa-wiki admin Mardetanha is lying. I have nothing to say more, everything is clear and fortunately here is a different project than fa-wiki. --Sajjadimanian (talk) 12:12, 5 November 2020 (UTC) Sock Le v!v ich 23:59, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comment 2 new reliable sources from Etemad Newspaper added (refs. 25 and 26) regards.--Thedunker66 (talk) 09:42, 5 November 2020 (UTC) Sock Le v!v ich 23:59, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep the subject meets WP:GNG. --KartikeyaS (talk) 18:11, 5 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Relisting in hopes that more editors with an established enwiki editing history will weigh in. There has been some productive discussion about whether available sources satisfy GNG or not and further discussion of that type might help this to reach consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Barkeep49 (talk) 02:43, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

~~Keep: Meets WP:GNG, WP:BIO and WP:SIGCOV. - Roger editor (talk) 10:46, 6 November 2020 (UTC)~~[reply]
Blocked for spamming, likely WP:UPE. MER-C 15:12, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep The first references (1 to 9) shows that he was a sport photographer and interpreter; References "10,11,12,13,15,18,19,20,21 and 28" are clearly the main subject of reliable sources. References 32 and 33 are about him as the main subject in title, which is about his responsibility in Rio 2016 Summer Olympic Games. References 22,23,24,25,26,27,28,29,30,31 are about his revelation about the corruptions in Iran National football team; references 34,35,36 and 37 mentioned about his photo contest award in 2007; then Certainly pass WP:GNG and WP:BIO. All contents are very clear.--Thedunker66 (talk) 12:33, 8 November 2020 (UTC) Sock Le v!v ich 23:59, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
strong delete as per Mardetanha and the other native farsi speakers who can attest to the reliability, or rather lack of reliability of the sources and lack of coverage. Praxidicae (talk) 14:30, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
~~Keep~~ for reasons cited by User:Roger editor and User:Thedunker66. Meets WP:GNG. WP:Preserve and WP:Not paper. Further, we are here suffering from language-related Systemic bias at Wikipedia. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 16:23, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

User:Thedunker66 canvassing, User:Roger editor blocked and a number of concerns about other contributors to this AfD expressed above by Softlavender and now we are 'suffering from language-related Systemic bias' at enwiki? There's not one single English language source for this person and no consensus, it would appear, as to the reliability/relevance of any Farsi source. Why should this person be notable at enwiki? Why? He was apparently not even notable at fawiki... And his supporters here are a voluble, but deeply dodgy, lot. IMHO. Best Alexandermcnabb (talk) 16:41, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Your ad hominem argument about the voters, even if true, does not change the notability of the subject. I stand by my !vote. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 19:13, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

how is it ad hominem when both are literally blocked for it?!!? Praxidicae (talk) 02:21, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

7&6=thirteen To be honest, I liked your concern about language-related Systemic bias at Wikipedia, I do share this concert with you but the solution is not to create an article for those who are not notable but help those deserve, I did a lot of searching before coming to AFD, long before this article created, we have been dealing with these people. we should stand united in front of those who wanted to use Wikipedia to promote themselves. Mardetanha (talk) 13:37, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete per WP:Consensus. This article is a Dead letter. Opposing this is pointless. Like seeking recounts and filing lawsuits in the 2020 United States presidential election. It can be done; it will not change the outcome. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 20:43, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep Meets GNG, esp. later citations show SIGCOV in RS/IS. — Ad Meliora ^Talk∕_Contribs 11:06, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
DELETE with prejudice. I have been canvassed about this article by Iman Farzin personally on an external forum, and lied to. This person does not deserve a : vanity page. As moderator of the external forum, as soon has he reads my replies he will be banned, and out of principle I believe that his actions on this AFD (and previous ones) have been in bad faith. Timmccloud (talk) 16:53, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Followup: This AFD gets more and more unbelievable by the day. That external forum I told you about? He just tried to sockpuppet into the forum under a different name! That attempt failed btw. Did I mention DELETE with prejudice, or should I be requesting a SPD due to all the abuse and end this misery immediately? Timmccloud (talk) 19:02, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. Per Praxidicae and Timmccloud. The conduct surrounding this AfD, including voting by sockpuppets and IP with no or few prior edits, and the alleged personal canvassing by the subject on an external forum, is troubling, to say the least. Cbl62 (talk) 18:47, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete as per WP:SIGCOV, a subject must have received significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject; this is not the case here Spiderone 20:47, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete dubious notability, and was intended to be a promotional piece for the subject. -FASTILY 21:59, 9 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per prax. ProcrastinatingReader (talk) 05:02, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete The subject has held a number of jobs and has made certain allegations but these alone do not give the subject a pass of our notability standards so we rely on sources, which I can read sufficiently, courtesy of Chrome, to see there is no significant coverage, no in-depth coverage, of the man himself. --Malcolmxl5 (talk) 05:08, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete This has caused tremendous disruption across multiple Wikipedias. The sock vote stacking in this AfD is just one example of manipulation and blatent violations. Lady Justice is blindfolded and so should a vote be, but this level of disruption is beyond the pale. GNG is a guideline not a policy (I have no opinion if it passes GNG or not). Calling on WP:IAR (policy) specfically WP:COMMON-sense to put an end to the disruption. -- GreenC 14:12, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

FWIW, I have some sympathy with this POV. Article's not notable anyway and the whole thing's been a disruptive time suck for very little discernable return. Nobody on enwiki cares who he is - apparently nobody of integrity on fawiki does, either. Supporters so far have been bulked up by socks, canvassers and cutpurses/the great blocked in general. Best Alexandermcnabb (talk) 15:14, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I agree this has taken far more of everybody's time than the end result justifies and agree with the comments about the socks. However, I don't think that the "delete" side coming over from fa-wiki have covered themselves in glory either. --John B123 (talk) 16:12, 10 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Absolutely. I didn't mean to beatify through omission. Still believe delete is the way forward, but that very pattern of behaviour you refer to John B123 gives me pause to worry about that course. Actually, I pity the closer... Best Alexandermcnabb (talk) 03:27, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Alexandermcnabb, have to take my hat off to whoever is brave enough to trawl through all this and close it! --John B123 (talk) 08:10, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I saw this whole issue with this AfD a mile off and I posted about it to WP:AN a while back, it's odd all these delete votes, I don't think that the sources have truly gone through a review, people seem to be avoiding that because of the language barrier. However 37 sources in Farsi, is still 37 sources regardless of the language, the article is heavily over-sourced and that doesn't help. English sources seem to be flat. Yet I still don't see any evidence of paid editing here. All I see is shenanigans from both sides, one starting with the rather oddity of deleting what looks like a possibly valid article for the Farsi language wikipedia, the next coming over to the en.wiki and starting again. Govvy (talk) 11:42, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

There are a total of maybe 10 sources if we pair down the ones that are blatantly copied from the others and even less (around 2) if we remove the press releases. Most of the sources are literal gossip blurbs that were never substantiated about accusations against Carlos Queiroz, which is ironic considering our own article makes no mentions of those unsubstantiated claims. The accusations of language bias here are laughable, considering we have several native Farsi speakers and it appears that those casting aspersions aren't assuming good faith. And to allay all the ridiculous bad faith claims that us "delete voters" didn't do an adequate before, see source assess below:

Source	Independent?	Reliable?	Significant coverage?	Count source toward GNG?
Source assessment table:
https://play.fiba3x3.com/players/d4adb813-e19d-4d49-aa6a-664dda0a18f7		~ for primary info possibly	just a listing	✘ No
https://www.mehrnews.com/news/4950552/%D8%A7%D8%B2-%D8%B3%D9%82%D9%88%D8%B7-%D8%A8%D9%87-%D8%AF%D8%B3%D8%AA%D9%87-%D9%BE%D8%A7%DB%8C%DB%8C%D9%86-%D8%AA%D8%B1-%D8%AA%D8%A7-%D9%85%D8%AD%D8%B1%D9%88%D9%85%DB%8C%D8%AA-%D8%A7%D8%B2-%D8%B4%D8%B1%DA%A9%D8%AA-%D8%AF%D8%B1-%D8%AF%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%87-%D9%87%D8%A7%DB%8C-%D8%A2%DB%8C%D9%86%D8%AF%D9%87	it's independent in the context that it's not written by him/his affiliates but is likely partially a press release		it's a single mention of him by way of a quote	✘ No
https://www.tasnimnews.com/fa/news/1393/12/10/670898/%D9%81%DB%8C%D9%86%D8%A7%D9%84-%D8%B1%D9%82%D8%A7%D8%A8%D8%AA-%D9%87%D8%A7%DB%8C-%D8%AA%D9%86%DB%8C%D8%B3-%D8%AF%D8%A8%DB%8C/photo/9			it's a single photo that was taken or provided by him	✘ No
https://www.isna.ir/news/8712-11573/%D8%A8%D8%A7-%D8%A8%D8%B1%D8%AA%D8%B1%D9%8A-4-%D8%B9%D9%83%D8%A7%D8%B3-%D8%A7%D9%8A%D8%B3%D9%86%D8%A7-%D8%B9%DA%A9%D8%B3-%D9%87%D8%A7%D9%8A-%D8%A8%D8%B1%D8%AA%D8%B1-%D9%85%D8%B3%D8%A7%D8%A8%D9%82%D9%87-%D8%B9%DA%A9%D8%B3-%D9%85%D8%A7%D9%87-%D8%A8%D9%87%D9%85%D9%86-%D9%85%D8%B9%D8%B1%D9%81%D9%8A	its basically a press release	~ for primary information, that he was a contestant in a contest	a single name drop with a list of other people who were failed contestants in a contest	✘ No
http://www.doorbin.net/news/?p=121		i don't know what doorbin.net is but it isn't reliable	a single passing mention	✘ No
https://www.farsnews.ir/news/8808220796%20%20%20%20/%D8%B7%D9%84%D8%A7%D9%8A%D9%8A%E2%80%8C%D9%87%D8%A7%D9%8A-%D8%AC%D8%B4%D9%86%D9%88%D8%A7%D8%B1%D9%87-%DA%86%D9%87%D8%A7%D8%B1%D9%85-%D8%AF%D9%88%D8%B1%D8%A8%D9%8A%D9%86-%D9%85%D8%B9%D8%B1%D9%81%D9%8A-%D8%B4%D8%AF%D9%86%D8%AF	press release		just says he came in second or third place for a non-notable photography contest	✘ No
https://www.farsnews.ir/news/8708240524%20%20%20%20/%D8%A8%D8%B1%D8%AA%D8%B1%D9%8A%D9%86%E2%80%8C%D9%87%D8%A7%D9%8A-%D9%85%D8%B3%D8%A7%D8%A8%D9%82%D9%87-%D8%AF%D9%88%D8%B1%D8%A8%D9%8A%D9%86-%D8%AF%D8%A7%D8%AA-%D9%86%D8%AA-%D9%85%D8%B9%D8%B1%D9%81%D9%8A-%D8%B4%D8%AF%D9%86%D8%AF	more or less the same as the 5th source and others, it's a rehashed press release about coming in second place in a contest			✘ No
https://www.magiran.com/article/2356860			as far as I can tell this doesn't mention the subject	✘ No
https://www.magiran.com/article/2357005			in the context of this subject it meets none of IRS and is a single passing mention	✘ No
https://www.varzesh3.com/news/1610178/%D8%AD%D8%B6%D9%88%D8%B1-%D9%85%D8%AF%DB%8C%D8%B1-%D8%A7%DB%8C%D8%B1%D8%A7%D9%86%DB%8C-%D9%81%DB%8C%D8%A8%D8%A7-%D8%AF%D8%B1-%D9%87%D9%85%D8%A7%DB%8C%D8%B4-%D8%AC%D8%A7%D9%85%E2%80%8C%D8%AC%D9%87%D8%A7%D9%86%DB%8C-%D8%A8%D8%B3%DA%A9%D8%AA%D8%A8%D8%A7%D9%84			this is a quote of a quote by him	✘ No
https://www.mehrnews.com/news/4611634/%D8%AD%D8%B6%D9%88%D8%B1-%D9%85%D8%AF%DB%8C%D8%B1-%D8%A7%DB%8C%D8%B1%D8%A7%D9%86%DB%8C-%D9%81%DB%8C%D8%A8%D8%A7-%D8%AF%D8%B1-%D9%87%D9%85%D8%A7%DB%8C%D8%B4-%D9%85%D8%AF%DB%8C%D8%B1%D8%A7%D9%86-%D8%A7%D8%AC%D8%B1%D8%A7%DB%8C%DB%8C-%D8%AC%D8%A7%D9%85-%D8%AC%D9%87%D8%A7%D9%86%DB%8C-%D8%A8%D8%B3%DA%A9%D8%AA%D8%A8%D8%A7%D9%84	same as 10, almost word for word			✘ No
https://www.farsnews.ir/news/13960823001977/%D9%85%D8%AF%DB%8C%D8%B1-%D8%A7%D8%AC%D8%B1%D8%A7%DB%8C%DB%8C-%D9%BE%D8%AE%D8%B4-%D8%AA%D9%84%D9%88%DB%8C%D8%B2%DB%8C%D9%88%D9%86%DB%8C-%D9%81%DB%8C%D8%A8%D8%A7-%D8%AF%D8%B1-%D8%A7%DB%8C%D8%B1%D8%A7%D9%86-%D8%A7%D9%86%D8%AA%D8%AE%D8%A7%D8%A8-%D8%B4%D8%AF	press release about election as ED			✘ No
https://www.mehrnews.com/news/4146167/%D9%85%D8%AF%DB%8C%D8%B1-%D8%A7%D8%AC%D8%B1%D8%A7%DB%8C%DB%8C-%D9%BE%D8%AE%D8%B4-%D8%AA%D9%84%D9%88%DB%8C%D8%B2%DB%8C%D9%88%D9%86%DB%8C-FIBA-%D8%AF%D8%B1-%D8%A7%DB%8C%D8%B1%D8%A7%D9%86-%D8%A7%D9%86%D8%AA%D8%AE%D8%A7%D8%A8-%D8%B4%D8%AF	same as #12			✘ No
https://www.farsnews.ir/news/13970621001307/%D8%AC%D9%84%D8%B3%D9%87-%D9%81%D9%86%DB%8C-%D8%AF%DB%8C%D8%AF%D8%A7%D8%B1-%D8%AA%DB%8C%D9%85%E2%80%8C%D9%87%D8%A7%DB%8C-%D8%A8%D8%B3%DA%A9%D8%AA%D8%A8%D8%A7%D9%84-%D8%A7%DB%8C%D8%B1%D8%A7%D9%86-%D9%88-%D9%81%DB%8C%D9%84%DB%8C%D9%BE%DB%8C%D9%86-%D8%A8%D8%B1%DA%AF%D8%B2%D8%A7%D8%B1-%D8%B4%D8%AF	all it says is that he was present at a game, this is basically a press release			✘ No
http://www.mardom-news.com/news/104333/%D8%AD%D8%B6%D9%88%D8%B1-%D9%85%D8%AF%DB%8C%D8%B1-%D8%A7%DB%8C%D8%B1%D8%A7%D9%86%DB%8C-%D9%81%DB%8C%D8%A8%D8%A7-%D9%87%D9%85%D8%A7%DB%8C%D8%B4-%D8%AC%D8%A7%D9%85-%D8%AC%D9%87%D8%A7%D9%86%DB%8C-%D8%A8%D8%B3%DA%A9%D8%AA%D8%A8%D8%A7%D9%84	same as #10, 11			✘ No
http://www.fiba.basketball/news/U-S-basketball-players-become-stars-in-Iran-s-professional-league			press release, single quote	✘ No
https://www.farsnews.ir/news/13900615001054/%D8%B3%D9%88%D8%A1-%D8%AA%D9%81%D8%A7%D9%87%D9%85-%D8%A8%DB%8C%D9%86-%DA%A9%D9%86%D9%81%D8%AF%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%B3%DB%8C%D9%88%D9%86-%D9%81%D9%88%D8%AA%D8%A8%D8%A7%D9%84-%D8%A2%D8%B3%DB%8C%D8%A7-%D9%88-%D8%B5%D8%AF%D8%A7-%D9%88-%D8%B3%DB%8C%D9%85%D8%A7-%D8%A8%D8%B1%D8%B7%D8%B1%D9%81-%D8%B4%D8%AF			a single quote from an interview, says nothing about Farzin	✘ No
https://90tv.ir/news/%D8%A2%D8%AE%D8%B1%DB%8C%D9%86-%D9%86%D8%B8%D8%A7%D8%B1%D8%AA-%D9%85%D8%B3%D8%A6%D9%88%D9%84-%D8%A7%D8%AC%D8%B1%D8%A7%DB%8C%DB%8C-%D8%A7%DB%8C%D8%B1%D8%A7%D9%86%DB%8C-%D9%BE%D8%AE%D8%B4-%D8%AA%D9%84%D9%88%DB%8C%D8%B2%DB%8C%D9%88%D9%86%DB%8C-%D8%A7%DB%8C-%D8%A7%D9%81-%D8%B3%DB%8C	?	?	? 404, no idea	? Unknown
https://www.mehrnews.com/news/4893232/%D9%85%D8%AA%D9%87%D9%85-%D8%B4%D8%AF%D9%86-%D9%81%D8%AF%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%B3%DB%8C%D9%88%D9%86-%D9%81%D9%88%D8%AA%D8%A8%D8%A7%D9%84-%D8%A8%D9%87-%D8%B3%D9%86%D8%AF%D8%B3%D8%A7%D8%B2%DB%8C-%D8%B9%D8%AC%DB%8C%D8%A8-%D9%86%DB%8C%D8%B3%D8%AA	all quotes from an interview			✘ No
https://footballi.net/news/r/261865/%D8%A2%D8%AE%D8%B1%DB%8C%D9%86-%D9%86%D8%B8%D8%A7%D8%B1%D8%AA-%D9%85%D8%B3%D8%A6%D9%88%D9%84-%D8%A7%D8%AC%D8%B1%D8%A7%DB%8C%DB%8C-%D8%A7%DB%8C%D8%B1%D8%A7%D9%86%DB%8C-%D9%BE%D8%AE%D8%B4-%D8%AA%D9%84%D9%88%DB%8C%D8%B2%DB%8C%D9%88%D9%86%DB%8C-%D8%A7%DB%8C-%D8%A7%D9%81-%D8%B3%DB%8C			just basic quotes	✘ No
https://footballi.net/news/r/534495/%D9%86%D8%A7%D8%B8%D8%B1-%D8%B3%D8%A7%D8%A8%D9%82-%D8%A7%DB%8C-%D8%A7%D9%81-%D8%B3%DB%8C-%D9%85%D8%AA%D9%87%D9%85-%D8%B4%D8%AF%D9%86-%D9%81%D8%AF%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%B3%DB%8C%D9%88%D9%86-%D9%81%D9%88%D8%AA%D8%A8%D8%A7%D9%84-%D8%A8%D9%87-%D8%B3%D9%86%D8%AF%D8%B3%D8%A7%D8%B2%DB%8C-%D8%B9%D8%AC%DB%8C%D8%A8-%D9%86%DB%8C%D8%B3%D8%AA	see above			✘ No
https://www.tabnak.ir/fa/news/1011186/%D8%A7%D8%AA%D9%87%D8%A7%D9%85-%D8%A8%D8%B2%D8%B1%DA%AF-%D8%A8%D9%87-%DA%A9%DB%8C%E2%80%8C%D8%B1%D9%88%D8%B4-%D8%AF%D8%B9%D9%88%D8%AA-%D8%A8%D8%A7%D8%B2%DB%8C%DA%A9%D9%86-%D8%A8%D9%87-%D8%AA%DB%8C%D9%85%E2%80%8C%D9%85%D9%84%DB%8C-%D8%A8%D8%A7%D9%BE%D9%88%D9%84	just a quote from his instagram			✘ No
https://www.inn.ir/news/2289/%d8%aa%d9%87%d9%85%d8%aa-%d8%a8%d8%b2%d8%b1%da%af-%d8%a8%d9%87-%d8%b3%d8%b1%d9%85%d8%b1%d8%a8%db%8c-%d8%a7%d8%b3%d8%a8%d9%82-%d8%aa%db%8c%d9%85-%d9%85%d9%84%db%8c	it's just a quote from his instagram	~		✘ No
https://www.yjc.ir/fa/news/7537748/%D8%A7%D8%AA%D9%87%D8%A7%D9%85-%D8%B3%D9%86%DA%AF%DB%8C%D9%86-%D8%B9%D8%B6%D9%88-%D8%B3%D8%A7%D8%A8%D9%82-afc-%D8%A8%D9%87-%DA%A9%D8%A7%D8%B1%D9%84%D9%88%D8%B3-%DA%A9%DB%8C-%D8%B1%D9%88%D8%B4-%D8%B9%DA%A9%D8%B3	same as all the last 10 or so sources, it's just a quote of his instagram page	~	this is the equivalent of gossip - one guy alleges something on Instagram, nothing comes of it	✘ No
http://www.etemadnewspaper.ir/fa/Main/Page/1687/8/%D9%88%D8%B1%D8%B2%D8%B4			this is the exaact same as the one below this.	✘ No
http://www.etemadnewspaper.ir/fa/main/detail/157701/%D8%A8%D8%B1%D8%AE%D9%8A-%D8%A8%D8%A7%D8%B2%D9%8A%D9%83%D9%86%D8%A7%D9%86-%D8%A8%D8%A7-%D9%BE%D8%B1%D8%AF%D8%A7%D8%AE%D8%AA-%D9%BE%D9%88%D9%84-%D9%85%D9%84%D9%8A%E2%80%8C%D9%BE%D9%88%D8%B4-%D9%85%D9%8A%E2%80%8C%D8%B4%D8%AF%D9%86%D8%AF	like the last few sources, it's just the same gossip from an Ig post			✘ No
https://www.magiran.com/article/4110484			almost word for word the same as the last dozen or so sources	✘ No
http://www.armanmeli.ir/fa/news/main/300089/%D8%BA%DB%8C%D9%80%D9%80%D9%80%D8%B1-%D9%85%D8%AD%D8%B1%D9%85%D8%A7%D9%86%D9%80%D9%80%D9%80%D9%87	more insta gossip			✘ No
https://theworldnews.net/ir-news/thm-bzrg-bh-khyrwsh-d-wt-bzykhn-bh-tymmly-bpwl	just the same as 22, copied and even says as much at hte bottom			✘ No
http://www.shafaf.ir/fa/news/513354/%D8%A7%D8%AA%D9%87%D8%A7%D9%85-%D8%A8%D8%B2%D8%B1%DA%AF-%D8%A8%D9%87-%DA%A9%DB%8C%E2%80%8C%D8%B1%D9%88%D8%B4-%D8%AF%D8%B9%D9%88%D8%AA-%D8%A8%D8%A7%D8%B2%DB%8C%DA%A9%D9%86-%D8%A8%D9%87-%D8%AA%DB%8C%D9%85%E2%80%8C%D9%85%D9%84%DB%8C-%D8%A8%D8%A7%D9%BE%D9%88%D9%84			word for word the same as several others	✘ No
https://www.tarafdari.com/node/1773368			same as the rest	✘ No
https://www.farsnews.ir/news/13950521000774/%D9%81%D8%B1%D8%B2%DB%8C%D9%86-%D8%AA%D9%86%D9%87%D8%A7-%D9%86%D8%A7%D8%B8%D8%B1-%D8%A7%DB%8C%D8%B1%D8%A7%D9%86%DB%8C-%D8%AF%D8%B1-%D9%85%D8%B3%D8%A7%D8%A8%D9%82%D8%A7%D8%AA-%D8%A7%D9%84%D9%85%D9%BE%DB%8C%DA%A9-206	same as the first few dozen sources about him travelling to Switzerland - it's a press release			✘ No
http://www.iscanews.ir/news/871192/%D9%85%D8%AF%DB%8C%D8%B1-%D8%A7%D8%AC%D8%B1%D8%A7%DB%8C%DB%8C-%D9%BE%D8%AE%D8%B4-%D8%AA%D9%84%D9%88%DB%8C%D8%B2%DB%8C%D9%88%D9%86%DB%8C-%D9%81%DB%8C%D8%A8%D8%A7-%D8%AF%D8%B1-%D8%A7%DB%8C%D8%B1%D8%A7%D9%86-%D8%A7%D9%86%D8%AA%D8%AE%D8%A7%D8%A8-%D8%B4%D8%AF	press release, same as one of the first sources			✘ No
https://www.akkasee.com/news/1387/9016/%d8%aa%d9%82%d8%af%db%8c%d8%b1-%d8%a7%d8%b2-%d8%a8%d8%b1%d8%aa%d8%b1%db%8c%d9%86%e2%80%8c%d9%87%d8%a7%db%8c-%d8%b9%da%a9%d8%a7%d8%b3%db%8c-%d8%af%d8%b1-%d9%85%d8%b1%d8%a7%d8%b3%d9%85-%d8%af%d9%88%d8%b1%d8%a8%db%8c%d9%86-%d9%86%d8%aa/			press release, same as #6	✘ No
https://chiilick.com/%d8%aa%d9%82%d8%af%db%8c%d8%b1-%d8%a7%d8%b2-%d8%a8%d8%b1%d8%aa%d8%b1%db%8c%d9%86%e2%80%8c%d9%87%d8%a7%db%8c-%d8%b9%da%a9%d8%a7%d8%b3%db%8c-%d8%af%d8%b1-%d9%85%d8%b1%d8%a7%d8%b3%d9%85-%d8%af%d9%88/	same as 6 and 34			✘ No
https://www.magiran.com/article/1744447	same as 6, 34 and 35			✘ No
https://www.isna.ir/news/8708-14560.80563/%D9%85%D9%87%D8%AF%D9%8A-%D9%82%D8%A7%D8%B3%D9%85%D9%8A-%D8%B9%D9%83%D8%A7%D8%B3-%D8%A8%D8%B1%D8%AA%D8%B1-%D8%B3%D8%A7%D9%84-%D9%88-%D8%A2%D8%B1%D8%B4-%D8%AE%D8%A7%D9%85%D9%88%D8%B4%D9%8A-%D8%A8%D8%B1%DA%AF%D8%B2%D9%8A%D8%AF%D9%87-%D9%8A-%D8%B3%D9%88%D9%85-%D8%AC%D8%B4%D9%86%D9%88%D8%A7%D8%B1%D9%87-%D9%8A	same as 6, 34 and 36			✘ No
This table may not be a final or consensus view; it may summarize developing consensus, or reflect assessments of a single editor. Created using {{source assess table}}.

Praxidicae (talk) 13:34, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Fair enough, I thought I saw a weak keep last time, but I found it a bit hard to analyse the sources correctly. Then it felt like all hell went loose on here! Cheers. Govvy (talk) 13:56, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I also checked what Praxidicae posted here as a native speaker and I can confirm it is correct and the assessment was fair Mardetanha (talk) 13:59, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I have spent a lot of time this morning cleaning up this article, I've removed the accusations about Queiroz and the federation as they are unsubstantiated and only based on press releases, I've also removed nearly 20 sources because they were identical to the others. There's still more to go but my eyes are tired. Praxidicae (talk) 15:17, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

That is one hell of a lot of work to take us to what is increasingly looking like a dead cert "Delete"... Best Alexandermcnabb (talk) 15:32, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

It is, it was a colossal time sink but it appears its needed given the ridiculous accusations here and the fact that many keep voters did not look at the actual quality of sources instead of quantity. The remaining items are still all based on press releases and passing mentions. None of which qualify for an article. Praxidicae (talk) 15:43, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete - Clearly non-notable, a minor official -- if that. Beyond My Ken (talk) 20:30, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. I don't read Farsi; I haven't looked at the sources, but only at what the article says on its face. WP:REFBOMBING cannot cloud that, and even suggests that further searching is unnecessary - if the partisans can't find anything worth citing, it probably doesn't exist. As to the assertions of notability - words fail me. Translator for a beach soccer team? former employee of FFIRI? press officer? won 2nd prize in an insignificant photography competition? Gimme a break. Fails WP:NBIO and WP:GNG; this isn't quite WP:A7, but it's damclose to it. Narky Blert (talk) 21:27, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. JGHowes ^talk 02:08, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Angela Fimmano

(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

This footballer/soccer player has never played in a professional league, and only 24 matches in an amateur league. It was deprodded because there exists an interview with Fimmano, then a school student aged 17, but the interview unfortunately is not independent coverage, being a Q&A. Geschichte (talk) 19:39, 27 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Sportspeople-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 19:49, 27 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Women-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 19:49, 27 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Football-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 19:49, 27 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Australia-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 19:49, 27 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete - it was more a hopeful dePROD than anything else. After a lot of searching, I found these [91] [92] but neither of those are independent or hugely significant. Given that she has presumably retired, I can't see any other sources popping up. If anyone does find something, please ping me. Spiderone 20:50, 27 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- Weak keep - following User:Hack finding some offline sources, I think that there is just enough justification to keep the article Spiderone 11:18, 2 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football-related deletions. Spiderone 21:12, 27 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete - fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Giant Snowman 14:18, 28 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - She fails GNG and NFOOTBALL. Dougal18 (talk) 15:03, 28 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. According to its article, the W-league is the top league available to women in Australia. Either we need to keep its players per WP:NSPORT, or we need to scrap NSPORT as imposing a sexist double standard and consistently apply full-GNG-based standards to all athletes (not just the women). —David Eppstein (talk) 05:13, 29 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

This article doesn't pass WP:NFOOTY on either point 1 or 2. If we are using NFOOTY alone, then it will end up being deleted. What's more relevant is WP:GNG. If we can find evidence of GNG, and I don't think we're a million miles off that, then this can and should be kept. Spiderone 09:38, 29 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I fully support a discussion about presumed notability for athletes. I think it would be worth bringing up at WT:NSPORT. Jay eyem (talk) 17:49, 29 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep. Fully support the comments by Eppstein. Why impose biased criteria on women?--Ipigott (talk) 09:19, 29 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Do you folks have any further sources to suggest WP:SIGCOV other than the one that I have added to the article and the two that I have linked in this debate? Spiderone 09:35, 29 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep The nomination by Geschichte is false. The W-League is not an amateur league, it is a professional league (sources: [93], [94]). What it isn't is a "fully-professional" league, which is a term used mostly on Wikipedia based on the WP:FPL essay, and hardly seen mention of elsewhere, definitely not in wide consensus or use, as would be expected of a term used to assume notability. --SuperJew (talk) 16:55, 29 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Your source stems from 2017, several years after Fimmano's career ended, and explicitly states: "Previously, many players were considered amateur and received only reimbursement of expenses." As such the amateur sport of the time was similar to amateur theatre, church choirs and garage bands. You seem quite unfamiliar with Wikipedia's sports guidelines, where the expression "fully professional" has been used in several sports for years. Geschichte (talk) 17:39, 29 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Weak delete Based on the sources provided, I don't think this meets WP:GNG. The sources provided do not constitute significant coverage, as they are just Q&As with the player themselves, without going too in-depth. I did a search to find other sources and did not find any that constituted in-depth coverage. Whether or not the player played at a professional level, "fully-professional" or otherwise, they still need to pass GNG, and that has not been demonstrated here. Jay eyem (talk) 17:49, 29 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep - the nomination statement by User:Geschichte is false, as this is most definitely a professional, and not an amateur league. Two years ago the minimum salary was increased as per this. This means that none of the players are amateur. It doesn't mean it's fully-professional - but the claim it's amateur is 100% false. And if this is wrong, what else is wrong? Nfitz (talk) 22:29, 30 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Why is it relevant what happened two years ago? The player retired several years before that. Geschichte (talk) 22:48, 1 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The league has been professional for years. The date of the pay rise doesn't change the claim that they were amateur then as being 100% false. Please correct your error and stop making false claims. Nfitz (talk) 17:01, 2 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
It's probably worth correcting it to say something like "semi-professional", or at least noting that the league is not considered fully-professional since that's the benchmark typically used for presumed notability of footballers. Based on the link provided, I don't think "amateur" is an accurate descriptor when one is guaranteed a minimum of $10,000. Jay eyem (talk) 18:45, 2 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: There seems to be some sources added to the article but the keep votes in this discussion barely talk about them. Editors are reminded to keep there comments on the notability of this individual and avoid wider comments around notability guidelines.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Fenix down (talk) 20:23, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep The sources provided confirm notability. Yes, the sources are somewhat weak but it's enough to suffice WP:GNG and since WP:NFOOTY says "presumed notable" it should be kept. Even then WP:IAR is a thing and and should be used more frequently when improving the encyclopedia. If anyone here thinks that adding articles on women footballers isn't improving Wikipedia then you have more issues than simply adhering to policy. That is not pointing fingers because I don't know anyone here personally and you don't know me. That's just an observation based on the eyeball test. :)--Tsistunagiska (talk) 20:51, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep: The Adelaide Advertiser sources demonstrate notability. — Toughpigs (talk) 22:51, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Comment I am slightly concerned with the sources added for a couple of reasons. The main one being that the sources presented, The Advertiser and the Standard Messenger, are both tabloids, which typically are not considered to be reliable sources (especially since both are owned by Rupert Murdoch's News Corp, whose New York Post is notoriously unreliable). Is there an electronic version of these articles that is accessible? I did not find any, and that would better help determine whether GNG has been met, especially since the arguments they are supporting (being coached by David Beckham, receiving a scholarship, and being part of an advertising campaign) don't really demonstrate GNG. Not that an electronic source is necessary, but it would be helpful for these particular sources. Jay eyem (talk) 23:26, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment - News Corp sources are generally accepted as reliable by Wikipedia. The Advertiser is not on the list but the Australian has been raised and accepted. Deus et lex (talk) 22:03, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  - I find that a bit surprising given the Post's reputation and The Advertiser also being a tabloid. Is there a discussion about its notability somewhere? I do see that The Australian, being under News Corp, is accepted, although that appears to be a proper newspaper. Jay eyem (talk) 01:28, 7 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    - Unless the source is blacklisted then it can be used. I'm not sure if you are aware that "tabloid" has a slightly different meaning in Australia to some other countries. Deus et lex (talk) 02:20, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
      - I will admit to not knowing the regional differences when referring to the use of the word "tabloid", but the argument that a source is fine as long as it isn't blacklisted is false. There is a whole manner of arguments about what constitutes an acceptable source at WP:RS and WP:V. Evaluating that isn't my area of expertise, which is why I was hoping to see a discussion about this particular source, or to at least have a digital copy presented. The burden of proof is on those arguing that the source is reliable, and it is difficult to evaluate GNG with the flimsy evidence currently presented. Jay eyem (talk) 05:17, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
        I'm well aware of the WP:RS policy and what it means - your argument was that the Advertiser is a source in general that is unreliable (to which I assume you mean along the lines of something like the Daily Mail). My response to that is that there is nothing to suggest that: it's the main newspaper for Adelaide, the state capital, and there has generally not been issues raised with its reliability - issues raised about News Corp generally relate to political bias or opinion pieces, not the reliability of news articles. By all means deal with the individual articles and whether they have significant coverage, but don't go down some road to suggest that every article in the newspaper is unreliable because that simply isn't true. Deus et lex (talk) 11:06, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Comment. This player retired from the W-League (Australia) in 2012. As of 2013, an article in the Sydney Morning Herald quoted Melissa Barbieri, another player in the league as saying, "You'd find that every club has it's own way of running, there's a salary cap but there's no floor. You'll find that a player earns $10,000 in a team and another earns nothing." [95] So, as of 2013, it sounds like the W-League was not a fully professional league, even if it is one now. --Metropolitan90 (talk) 02:23, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

No Wikipedia policy or guideline uses "fully-professional" as its criterion for deciding the notability of a football athlete. WP:FOOTY states that "players who have played, and managers who have managed, in a competitive game between two teams from fully professional leagues will generally be regarded as notable". That does not preclude players not in "fully professional" leagues from being notable. It's determining factor is an essay, WP:FPL. Both the guideline and essay are extremely biased, historically and even currently, against the overwhelming majority of women footballers. I have asked how many women were involved in the writing of this essay on multiple occasions because I do believe that matters as only a small percentage of women's leagues and players are considered professional enough for inclusion in the eyes of the creators of this essay, as it currently stands. Nothing but silence from them but maybe they will respond one day. The essay also states it is "incomplete". That disqualifies it or anything it says as its factors for inclusion as a means to determine notability. --Tsistunagiska (talk) 13:54, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

As noted in Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Lauren Chilvers, there is nothing preventing women from contributing at WT:FPL or WT:NSPORT. AfD is not the place for this discussion. Jay eyem (talk) 16:57, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

delete after reading through the discussion Etc. Etc. it sounds like she was not pro at the time she played. Although, now the league she played for is pro. I don't think the notability guidelines athletes works retroactively though if they didn't play pro, they didn't play pro. Period. --Adamant1 (talk) 04:10, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The league was discontinued in 2004 and brought back in 2008 as a professional league. She played from 2008 to 2012. The question is whether the women's leagues are or are not considered professional if they are not paid like the men's leagues. --Tsistunagiska (talk) 13:30, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

From the discussion Etc. It sounded like the pay raise happened during or after she was playing though. Otherwise, I don't see why it would be a part of the discussion. Really, I don't see why it would be anyway. I'll look back over things and change my vote if it's error though and the pay raise thing gets clearly worked out. It doesn't seem like it has. But I could have read something wrong. Adamant1 (talk) 19:53, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

My comment was not to alter your views but simply counter them with further thought. Whether she was specifically paid or not shouldn't matter, you are correct, but that is precisely the argument of those at FPL who use NFOOTY as their basis for inclusion. Going on the sources for the Wikipedia article for the league, it was brought back in 2008 because of the need for a professional women's league in Australia. --Tsistunagiska (talk) 20:14, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep - sources in the article from the Advertiser (a metropolitan newspaper) ensure this article clearly meets WP:GNG. Deus et lex (talk) 22:00, 6 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep per WP:GNG. Hmlarson (talk) 18:02, 8 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus. Spartaz ^Humbug! 10:34, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Basma El Ghouate

(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

Non-notable athlete, without any notable records and doesn’t meet the Wikipedia criteria. also a page under title of same subject has been removed.Fatzaof (talk) 08:26, 25 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Automated comment: This AfD was not correctly transcluded to the log (step 3). I have transcluded it to Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Log/2020 October 25. —^{cyberbot I}_{Talk to my owner:Online} 08:41, 25 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Sportspeople-related deletion discussions. Roller26 (talk) 11:33, 25 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Cycling-related deletion discussions. Roller26 (talk) 11:33, 25 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of France-related deletion discussions. Roller26 (talk) 11:33, 25 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep Meets WP:NCYC: "Has competed in a UCI Women's team". SportsOlympic (talk) 22:41, 25 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete or draftity, the cycling stats page shows 4 starts in a Dubai Tour where she placed 37th among the youths, so a clear WP:TOOSOON in my eyes. Geschichte (talk) 18:14, 26 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Sandstein 15:03, 1 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Women-related deletion discussions. AleatoryPonderings (???) (!!!) 17:21, 1 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Amir Sarkhosh (biliard players)

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The result was delete. Keep votes have been refuted. Previous close was a script error Spartaz ^Humbug! 10:31, 19 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

AK Ikwuakor

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Former member of a relay team, achievements do not meet WP:NATH. Coverage is focussed on the relay team not the individual, or is not independent. 1292simon (talk) 22:45, 23 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep. The subject holds the Nigerian athletic record in 400-meter hurdles and has numerous other titles at individual and relay level—essentially fulfilling WP:NATH. Also, his business has quite a bit of independent and verifiable coverage as well, including a detailed article by Sports Illustrated. Momer313 (talk) 00:35, 30 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for your input as the creator of the article. Please be advised that non-individual events (such as relay) and records that are not world records do not fulfil WP:NATH. Cheers, 1292simon (talk) 21:10, 30 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. The subject would have to succeed in an actual competition, a prestigious regional competition such as the African Games or Commonwealth Games would have been enough. His Nigerian record in hurdles is not a good record in the athletics world, and we have thousands of national record holders ineligible for Wikipedia inclusion. Geschichte (talk) 11:38, 31 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. The subject is an very known athlete in African World. Wikipedia is full of articles of athletes at lower junior and high school levels. Article is needed to overwrite in a more neutral way.Montell 74 (talk) 13:20, 31 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Why is a relay runner who didn't compete on the African scene, known in the "African World"? This is so counter-intuituve that is has to be proven. He retired several years ago, so won't get any more coverage for athleticism. In addition, the claim that Wikipedia has written about a large number of high school athletes is just bull, and irrelevant anyway. Geschichte (talk) 22:02, 31 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete no evidence that GNG is met (t · c) buidhe 22:14, 17 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was redirect to 7th Chess Olympiad. Assertion of sources is not the same as providing sources Spartaz ^Humbug! 09:50, 15 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Arthur Baert

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I can't find any indepth sources about him, only chess databases like the ones already in the article. Fails WP:BIO. (Note; every country can send a team to the Chess Olympiad, no matter the level of the participants. Competing at the Chess Olympiad thus doesn't indicate that one is an international top player). Fram (talk) 13:07, 22 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - Does not appear to meet WP:BIO. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 19:49, 26 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep In my opinion, participants at the Chess Olympiad are all relevant. They are always the best players of a country and therefore have enough notability. Steak (talk) 10:10, 29 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- Not if chess gets little to no attention in their country at that time. Being one of the best in something which doesn't interest the public (or the media) means that you aren't notable, no matter how good you are. Notability isn't decided by "they should be notable", but by actual sources. Fram (talk) 10:26, 29 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Redirect to 7th Chess Olympiad, the only one he competed in and where he is listed as a participant. There isn't enough coverage to justify a standalone article. P-K3 (talk) 12:05, 30 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep According to Cornil's Championnats de Belgique d'Echecs (1901-2009), he competed in six Belgian championships from 1935 to 1959, tying for 2nd in 1949 and never finishing lower than a tie for 5th, and winning the tournament prize for most brilliant game in 1935 (as judged by world champion Max Euwe) while tying for fourth with Alberic O'Kelly, future grandmaster and correspondence world champion. Verhulst's Belgian Chess History gives 25 events he competed in from 1931 to 1970, citing local newspapers and magazines of the time as sources. Baert was from Antwerp (after the war, he was active in Turnhout – see e.g., [96], p. 10), winning the league championship of that city in 1970 and representing it or Belgium in several intercity/international matches besides the Olympiad mentioned in the current article. He was a doctor by profession. A leading Belgian player for 40 years can be expected to have significant coverage in local secondary sources such as the ones cited by Verhulst. In particular, I'd look to Wasnair and Jadoul's 300-page Histoire des maîtres Belges ([97], [98]), published in 1988, as a likely source of further information on Baert. Belgicapress gives 27 results for 'schaken' + "Dr. Baert" from 1930 to 1970, the last year covered in the database. Cobblet (talk) 06:50, 31 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep I am persuaded by Cobblet's points. It seems there will be plenty written about him in Belgian journals and other documents. Added to his Olympiad appearance and creditable placings at multiple national championships, this seems fine. Brittle heaven (talk) 16:38, 31 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete: participation to a Chess Olympiad is not notable per se, since the level of the participants varies greatly, many from not-so-strong chess playing nations are amateurs, club level players. He may have competed several times in the Belgian national championship, but never managed to win a title, and it's not a strong chess-playing nation. Sophia91 (talk) 20:04, 3 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Sandstein 07:21, 11 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Franz Rötzsch

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Darts player who has not won any major tournaments. I cannot find significant discussion of the individual in multiple reliable sources. ... discospinster _talk 15:07, 18 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete a non-notable darts player.John Pack Lambert (talk) 15:42, 19 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose He is now qualified for the 2020 European Championship (darts) which starts in a few days, so it may be worth waiting to see performance there. DLManiac (talk) 21:58, 25 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The 2020 European Championship page does not mention Rötzsch as one of the 32 competitors. Geschichte (talk) 19:36, 26 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Ah, you are correct. He was tied for 31st and lost out the tiebreaker. I'll retract.DLManiac (talk) 19:40, 26 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete per nom and comment of Geschichte.Paradise Chronicle (talk) 13:32, 4 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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[1] "Kerala Blasters vs ATK". Indian Super League. Retrieved 1 November 2020.

[2] "SC East Bengal Squad". Indian Super League. Retrieved 1 November 2020.

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