User talk:ClemRutter

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Talkback[edit]

Chat Oh

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Hello, ClemRutter. You have new messages at Wikipedia:Village pump (technical).
Message added 01:19, 16 June 2012 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

mabdul 01:19, 16 June 2012 (UTC)

Just what I was looking for. Thanks.--ClemRutter (talk) 13:26, 16 June 2012 (UTC)
I asked for a save&continue editing button: mabdul::: created the tool that you can find at User:Mabdul/saveandedit.js.You 'install' it by adding following line to your Special:MyPage/skin.js:
importScript('User:Mabdul/saveandedit.js'); //adding a new button next to the


Ok, great. If you need any improvements, changes or whatever, simply leave me a talkback. ;) mabdul 13:37, 16 June 2012 (UTC)
Oh... I saw it is not working at the moment with section edits... I will fix it and leaving you a talkback, until then you have to use the full edit button. ;-) ... mabdul 13:42, 16 June 2012 (UTC)
And the script works now without the 'section - edit - bug'. Don't forget to bypass your browser's cache again. mabdul 14:20, 16 June 2012 (UTC)

Presumably an accident[edit]

Re: this I presume you didn't mean to blank most of the page? DuncanHill (talk) 13:38, 16 June 2012 (UTC)

(edit conflict) nope, bug found in that script... mabdul 13:42, 16 June 2012 (UTC)
Spot on- I think that Mabduls script has a slight bug. I think I will leave it a bit before retrying.--ClemRutter (talk) 13:45, 16 June 2012 (UTC)
I'm developing the bug fix at the moment, as mentioned above: if you use the normal edit link at the top (and not the section links) this shouldn't happen. If everything works, you can use the improved script in a few minutes. mabdul 14:01, 16 June 2012 (UTC)

Doffer etc.[edit]

Doffer being used to remove wool from a small hand-carder

I can see a lot of room for confusion. I am up to three different weaving doffers. The person who replaces the bobbins or pirns, a roller that takes the fiber off the card, and in my own house (see picture to the right, taken yesterday) a simple implement my wife uses to take fiber off a hand-carder. I suppose in a way they all are used to remove fiber, spun or unspun, from a machine. Yes - adding British and US usages would be good. I can see the article on the human doffers growing quite large. Would you say the person is the dominant usage of the term? That is, Bobbin doffer should be moved over Doffer? I have no strong opinion. Aymatth2 (talk) 13:27, 29 June 2012 (UTC)

Right.The way forward- we make a mental not that this may have to be radically changed when we understand it fully- and with that mind set we continue and add information as we discover it. When we think we can make a definitve statement- we can contact eaxh other and come up with right words. As I have said- life is a bit hectic at the moment and it is hard to do much uninterrupted research- thanks for the response.

To doff- verb: to doff ones hat!

--ClemRutter (talk) 20:53, 1 July 2012 (UTC)

List of mills in Wigan[edit]

Hello again. I am gradually working through Atherton, Tyldesley and will try to add to the Leigh townships soon. I've added some of the very early mills and I have references to others for which I can't supply the exact locations. What to you think about an introductory note/paragraph before the table as a place to add the info? I hope what I've done meets with approval, its a rather daunting task. J3Mrs (talk) 15:30, 30 June 2012 (UTC).

Impressive. I am still working on Python scripts to make geoitags easier. Speak soon.--ClemRutter (talk) 20:55, 1 July 2012 (UTC)

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Hi Clem[edit]

We are having another party - Want to come? Its been a long time since Derby Victuallers (talk) 10:28, 30 August 2012 (UTC)

'Gibraltarpedia in an international and muli-cultural collaboration'
Please translate the text below into the language of your wiki

We would like to invite you to contribute to the GibraltarpediA project, the world's first WIkipedia City. The project needs writers, photographers, translators and others to help build the first wiki city which bridges Europe and Africa. We are going to transform Gibraltar and the surrounding areas in Morocco and Spain into areas rich with encyclopedic content immediately accessible using QR codes and NFC on plaques for visitors and local people.

There are prizes to reward contributors in the Gibraltarpedia Multilingual challenge for the best editors, photographs and cartographers... whoever you are. More at Gibraltarpedia.org

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Cirque de Navacelles[edit]

Hi!

You indicated: "I remain frustrated by the use of the ambiguous (cirque) term, to refer just to corries and cwms. The problem I have is that I annually pass the Cirque de Navacelles and the fr:Cirque du Bout de Monde, in Herault which are fluvial cirques in Kaarst landscape while I have many times visited the Cirque de Gavarnie which is a classic glacial cwm. ... The French link leads to a category giving other fluvial cirques, I really haven't the geology references in English needed to do this myself but will give all assistance. --"

Must confess I was unaware of the broader French usage, but looked at the French version of the cirque article and see they've prepared a significantly broader, more detailed article. Some of that material is worth bringing across to the English article. Unfortunately the references are not readily available electronically, but when I get a chance I'll look at the current French literature and see if there is an easily available reference that discusses the broader usage. If I find one, I'll be happy to revise the article.

Santé - Williamborg (Bill) 00:34, 6 September 2012 (UTC)

Not a whole lot on the topic that suggests nonglacial usage in the English language. All of the references to cirques found, so far, refer to glacially formed cirques. I did find an interesting quote in Geology letters that sets the tone (doi: 10.1130/0091-7613(1986)​14<1053:L>​2.0.CO;2 v. 14 no. 12 p. 1053-1054 by David A. Rothery; The Open University; Milton Keynes, MK7 6AA, England): "amphitheater is a better term than cirque, corrie, or cwm since, unlike them, it does not imply glacial origin." This suggests that in English the term cirque is closely associated with glacial processes.
I'll chat with a professional geologist who has worked on glaciers to see if he has any recommendations.
Skål - Williamborg (Bill) 02:26, 6 September 2012 (UTC)
Found a couple of references which support your usage and added a new section. Thoughts?
Skål - Williamborg (Bill) 01:05, 7 September 2012 (UTC)
And more

Noted your changes - and agree that slow movement is warranted.

This use of cirque is - I think - a relatively minor usage in English. But I'm mostly an inclusionist, so am good with adding the discussion since there are refereed technical articles that use the term cirque in the broader fashion.

I view the Wikipedia debate as a light version of what one sees in peer reviewed journal articles. Probably the biggest flaw with Wikipedia is that we have no established mechanism to assure that articles (and changes) get a peer review - however that is often offset for articles that are frequently read, so comments accrete and improvements occur. If we're lucky we'll get further debate here.

Cheers - Williamborg (Bill) 18:29, 7 September 2012 (UTC)

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GLAMcamp 15-16 September 2012[edit]

Hi there, if you think you may be able to attend the GLAMcamp this weekend, if would help us a lot if you registered via Eventbrite: [1] Many thanks! Daria Cybulska (WMUK) (talk) 14:59, 13 September 2012 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Richard Tylman (5th nomination)[edit]

Just a minor technical comment: if you oppose deletion in AfD, it is customary to say Keep rather than Oppose. Oppose could also mean "oppose keeping". --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 16:17, 15 September 2012 (UTC)

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Help needed[edit]

Hi! I stumbled upon one of your images on Commons. Could you please add some information and maybe a category or two? Here's the problem child: commons:File:2006SweepsSide.JPG. Thanks a bunch! :-)) --Hedwig in Washington (TALK) 03:25, 18 September 2012 (UTC)

Done.--ClemRutter (talk) 18:36, 18 September 2012 (UTC)

Richard Tylman[edit]

Could you please re-consider your statement that any future AfD would be my sixth. I have only made one previous AfD for this article,[2] the others were by three separate editors. The previous AfDs were however for a different article about a Richard Tylman who is a Canadian artist. My Afd had overwhelming support, and the article was deleted. I would reply on the RfC discussion thread, but prefer not to fill it with distractions. TFD (talk) 16:29, 19 September 2012 (UTC)

Yes- I see what you mean, so I have de-personalised it: though I do resent the time I am spending chasing around from page to page as the discussion is moved. No matter, the article is still in a dire state in spite of your best efforts to improve it. I have little time and a major Wiki backlog to clear but I'll try and step in later next week. I have stuck a Wikiproject Kent tag on it whicjh may attract a few more local editors. --ClemRutter (talk) 23:25, 19 September 2012 (UTC)

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Coordinates[edit]

Hi there! I have a quick question. Can I use the coordinates of a town as the coordinates of an institution in that town? For example, can I use the coordinates of Isfana as the coordinates of a high-school there? I enlarged this image and found the building. Is it possible to get the exact coordinates? Nataev (talk) 08:45, 29 September 2012 (UTC)

Yes. I describe how to do it on my user page. I have added a special bookmark to my Firefox browser. I put it on the bookmark tool bar. I call it '+'. Like you, I use Googe maps to find the building. I put it in the centre of the screen then press '+'. Up pops a notification box. Control-C to copy the location, move to the Wikipedia edit page and Control-V to write the location. It is as easy as that.
  • Preparing to Geotag files. On the bookmark tool bar, I have a bookmark called +, this contains javascript to extract WGS84 lat/log from a GoogleMap. The way it is done is to press Ctrl-D to open the bookmark dialogue. Change the name to +, change the location to Bookmarks/Toolbar.OK. Go to + on the Toolbar, Right click. Click Properties. Change the Location, paste in this code javascript:void(prompt('',%22{{location dec|%22 + gApplication.getMap().getCenter().lat().toFixed(4) + %22|%22 + gApplication.getMap().getCenter().lng().toFixed(4) + %22}}%22));
That gives the reference for Commons. You can edit it to work for en:Wikipedia. You need to edit the region.
javascript:void(prompt('',"{{coord|"%20+%20gApplication.getMap().getCenter().lat().toFixed(4)%20+%20"|"%20 +%20gApplication.getMap().getCenter().lng().toFixed(4)%20 +%20"|display=title|region:GB|format=dms}}"));
Here you are.
Thank you! But I'm at a loss honestly. It's rather complicated! I'll try though. Nataev (talk) 09:25, 29 September 2012 (UTC)
Figured it out! Thanks a lot! Nataev (talk) 10:16, 29 September 2012 (UTC)
Yes- doing Javascript extensions to the browser is a bit mind blowing- but once it is there you will use it hundreds of times or in my case thousands. Have fun.--ClemRutter (talk) 10:55, 29 September 2012 (UTC)

hello[edit]

we seem to be of a similar vintage on the project. i happen to agree with you re the dispute resolution silliness. it makes me sad that we're spending so much time and effort there instead of just being grownups. years ago (i don't remember how many actually) i mostly walked away from the project because i was sick of all the silliness. every time i come back and actually log in, i'm re-confronted with a new set of jihads about someone's private red tape. it's just astonishing. anyways, i suspect people will not take your comment too seriously or even acknowledge it, but i wanted to let you know i appreciate it. ... aa:talk 17:33, 2 October 2012 (UTC)

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Warehouses[edit]

An editor has started List of warehouses in Manchester. I have suggested merging it with Manchester cotton warehouses or maybe it should be the other way round. Any thoughts? J3Mrs (talk) 11:01, 9 October 2012 (UTC)

At the moment leave them as separate articles. The problem I have with list based pages is that there is no quality progression, and while Manchester cotton warehouses is short- it is now on focus and open to improvement. Adding to a list will terminate its development. Similarly it is good to see List of warehouses in Manchester but it only really covers the extant 19th/early 20th century warehouses and I suspect that when we bore a little deeper into the subject (from a commercial rather than an architecture perspective) the list will expand considerably- the author quotes 1,819 in 1815. In future, maybe we should revisit the decision, and other factors might seem more relevant. --ClemRutter (talk) 19:16, 9 October 2012 (UTC)

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Cottonopolis[edit]

Not all 1000+, just two parameters. Those warehouses that are listed in Manchester and pre-Edwardian. I'm planning to keep it as a list article - similar to the Grade I listed buildings in Greater Manchester and List of castles in Greater Manchester, which are both FL. It's a work in progress, I still need to write a decent introduction and find more photos. Stevo1000 (talk) 12:39, 10 October 2012 (UTC)

Riots vs Ethnic Violence[edit]

Can you take a look at this article and say whether it should be renamed? Even though it's a very important subject currently there's little interest in it. Thank you. Nataev (talk) 08:43, 12 October 2012 (UTC)

Ref[edit]

I noticed you started Harry S. Fairhurst :-). This [3] might be useful. J3Mrs (talk) 18:02, 7 November 2012 (UTC)

I was just on that page. I am doing this one for a bit of relaxation! --ClemRutter (talk) 18:29, 7 November 2012 (UTC)

30 articles[edit]

I agree with that a lot. We should have some system of allowing young authors to record their achievement. Victuallers (talk) 09:40, 12 November 2012 (UTC)

This Month in GLAM: October 2012[edit]

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Little Moreton Hall[edit]

May I ask a favour? I'm beginning to lose track of what still needs attention, so could I impose on you to provide a summary of what you think still needs to be addressed on the FAC page? George Ponderevo (talk) 04:37, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

Lime-ash floor[edit]

Nice work on getting something together on lime-ash floors. I've made a start on timber roof trusses with a view to explaining what an arch-braced truss is, but that article needs mucho work. And I discovered from my reading today that much of what's written elsewhere is virtually incomprehensible without good diagrams, which can take some time to get right. But it's something I'll try and persevere with over the next few weeks, as I think it would be a good addition to our architectural coverage regardless of what happens to Little Moreton Hall's FAC. George Ponderevo (talk) 06:03, 29 November 2012 (UTC)

That was achieved by just buying the Hartley reference sheet! Two pounds well spent. No roof trusses is an incredibly big job. Get that one right and you can set up in business as a consultant.
Hartwell (2001) Manchester p350 has some in the Glossary. I have a 1937 book called Specification in Detail-by Macey which provides info to architects-and has lots of diagrams. They are on pages 173-- 198, mainly. The English Heritage book isbn 1-902916-03-4 Timber is a case study of dating the roofs at Lincoln Cathedral. Yarwood 1963 has many beautiful line drawings including Eltham Palace with a false hammerbeam truss roof. Serious work.
I know svgs don't render but could you upload them anyway- as it would give me opportunity to extend them and use the elements in other diagrams. This will be particlarly important for articles on roof trusses. Just a few thoughts. --ClemRutter (talk) 10:28, 29 November 2012 (UTC)
I'm already uploading the roof truss diagrams in svg format. There are some strange little quirks popping up when they're rendered on Wikipedia, such as arrow heads not always aligning correctly, but I think I've now got something that works.I need to amend the King post truss image slightly as I see I've made a small error in it, and I've started on the Queen post truss, after which I'll have a bash at the arch-braced truss that started this off. Once the basic trusses are in place it should be easier to create others by modifying them, hopefully. I need to find some historical info on the development and use of each type of truss as well, as the text is very thin at present, so thanks for the pointers above. George Ponderevo (talk) 13:50, 29 November 2012 (UTC)
I am looking at [4] he did the queen post diagram on the page- and had some conversation about uploading a modified version- so may be willing to assist. --ClemRutter (talk) 14:39, 29 November 2012 (UTC)
They're all raster graphics though, and what I want is a consistently styled set of SVGs. I also think his diagrams are more geared towards builders (not unreasonably), and so contain too much extraneous detail for our purposes. George Ponderevo (talk) 15:45, 29 November 2012 (UTC)
I've now added a graphic for the Queen post truss, which is the kind of thing I was talking about, a consistently styled graphic. Arch-braced truss soon to follow hopefully, but please feel free to improve on my amateur efforts; George Ponderevo (talk) 07:21, 30 November 2012 (UTC)

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Edit summaries[edit]

Could you please avoid personal attacks, when making edit summaries as you did here, when you reversed an edit I had made restoring another editor's removal of invalid external links. TFD (talk) 13:42, 3 December 2012 (UTC)

I have copied this over to the Richard Tylman talk page where I had already posted some comments. --ClemRutter (talk) 14:46, 3 December 2012 (UTC)

Faversham[edit]

Thanks for the invite. I lived for a time in Folkestone, and have been to Canterbury, Whitstable and Chatham, but unfortunately not Faversham, and am now far away and unlikely to visit in the near future. I keep meaning to visit on holidays but get overruled and go to Barbados instead.

Regarding paywalls, WP:Questia#Expectations for use says, "Editors should not provide bare links to non-free Questia pages."

My opinion on this article has always been that there is too little information available. It would make more sense to start with an article about the mayors of Faversham, and a list of the mayors, then create individual articles where possible. In this case an editor wrote an article about himself, which was deleted then recreated the article about a person with the same name.

I also created an article about a mayor, Gilbert Cooper, a person I knew personally, who meets notability standards by several criteria. But I was surprised how little information I could find about him, although he had been one of the leading politicians and businessmen in Bermuda for a long time.

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Rochester sports[edit]

Clem, following your clean up of the external links there are a number of red links in Rochester, Kent#Sport. should they

  • Have articles written about them (no, I'm not offering)
  • Be removed
  • Have the external links reinstated?

I start from the POV that rugby is a group of 20yo savages beating each other up and soccer is an opiate for the masses, so I really don't think I'm qualified to judge! Regards, Martin of Sheffield (talk) 14:22, 14 December 2012 (UTC)

I don't think my views are quite so balanced. But the links are zapped, and an encouraging message left for future editors .. Sigh.--ClemRutter (talk) 16:48, 14 December 2012 (UTC)

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Hall house[edit]

Hi, ClemRutter, and many thanks for your note. I realized we were lacking this page nearly two years ago when I started Template:Architecture of England and have been meaning to get around to starting it since then, so I am afraid progress may be equally slow! Any help gratefully received. Moonraker (talk) 16:03, 15 December 2012 (UTC)

I see this is much improved, well done! Your plans are very good. Moonraker (talk) 02:10, 1 January 2013 (UTC)
The aim is now to take some of the given examples, C&P some details and use them to illustrate the points already made. Then the lede will need to be rewritten to reflect the changes. A section on the sociology of those in the vernacular zone in Brunskill's sixteen vernacular areas may then be appropriate. And this was a light distraction over the holiday period! Happy New Year. --ClemRutter (talk) 02:24, 1 January 2013 (UTC)

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Training the Trainers[edit]

Hi ClemRutter, we're looking to finalise numbers and I just wanted to confirm that you're still interested in attending the event on 23-24th February? Thanks, Richard Nevell (WMUK) (talk) 20:17, 8 February 2013 (UTC)

Yes, I am free and will be there if there is a place for me. --ClemRutter (talk) 22:54, 8 February 2013 (UTC)
Thanks. As 18 people have registered their interest and there's only space for 12 we're in the process of chasing up who can come and who would need accommodation (arranged by Wikimedia UK). Would you need accommodation? Richard Nevell (WMUK) (talk) 12:39, 11 February 2013 (UTC)
No, I will/would be coming in by train from Glossop.--ClemRutter (talk) 15:35, 11 February 2013 (UTC)

The details of the venue are now on the UK wiki. Richard Nevell (WMUK) (talk) 13:59, 12 February 2013 (UTC)

We've finalised the list of attendees and you're amongst the 12. See you there! Richard Nevell (WMUK) (talk) 11:35, 13 February 2013 (UTC)
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This Month in GLAM: January 2013[edit]

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Precious[edit]

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cotton mills
Thank you for quality articles on English cotton mills, and for ideas for spending an evening well, with consideration for English as a second language speakers, and Wikipedians auto-translating into minority languages, - you are an awesome Wikipedian!

--Gerda Arendt (talk) 18:54, 17 February 2013 (UTC)

A year ago, you were the 399th recipient of my PumpkinSky Prize, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:06, 17 February 2014 (UTC)

Wikimedia UK[edit]

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This Month in GLAM: February 2013[edit]

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re:Steam engine[edit]

I don't know where to begin with your cavalier revert: heat is NOT a useful output of a steam engine; the work that is done by a steam engine is force times distance or torque times angular rotation. The work done isn't necessarily dissipated at all, it can cause a weight to rise, or it can pump water for example.

And the working fluid in a steam engine; the fluid that does the work; pushes the piston is steam, not water!

There are so many things wrong with your revert. If you think this requires 'expert' knowledge then you very probably shouldn't be editing the article, or at least not that bit of the article.Teapeat (talk) 22:45, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

Sorry, not to explain further on your talk page- but real life intervened. My reference is Hills p167 et seq the chapter 9, 'The new theory of heat', and I find his description less than clear. The other reference is our Rankine Cycle. My degree is not in thermodynamics- a topic I barely touched. The text I wrote, that you rightfully ce'ed needs to be changed- but I found problems with your edit.
  • We are not describing the steam engine in this sentence but the subject is the Rankine Cycle, and this distinction is crucial to the text.
  • the ' flow of ... heat in an engine' sounds a little too much like 'calorific'
  • that the mathematical model in this case describes the process rather than the more cautious illustrates (I may be over cautious here)
  • your prose is fantastic, please have a look at all my contributions I am sure you could improve most of them stylistically but my worry is that some of the meaning is lost in the process.
Now to touch your comments
  • heat is NOT a useful output of a steam engine-- but it is one of the two outputs on the rankine model the other being work, we are talking of a closed system.
  • steam is water- the gaseous state of water- the cycle includes the condensation phase where gas becomes liquid
  • dissipated: maybe the wrong word, useful work is outside the closed loop- so must be considered as lost to the cycle (all be it the purpose of a steam engine it is a loss to Rankine)
  • There are so many things wrong with your revert... you very probably shouldn't be editing the article. Strange but I do agree on that-- I waited a long time for someone else to create the material-- then waited a little longer-- but there weren't any takers. So if you would like to consider the points above and see how you need to modify your edit, we can get it right.
I don't consider myself to be an expert but I have been formally trained in thermodynamics, but I don't believe in credentialism in Wikipedia, and this was quite a while ago. I've also designed cooling systems, which was also a while ago. And while I'm rusty, I'm not that rusty. What I'm saying is not that I'm right, but I may be more likely to be right!
OK, in this section we are describing both steam engines (in a slightly simplified sense) as well as the Rankine cycle. If we weren't referring to steam engines then it wouldn't and shouldn't be in the article.
Heat engines aren't usually analysed as closed systems, the heat source and cold sink are considered at the edge of the system, as is the mechanical output, and that's how the Rankine system is analysed- that's why there are arrows leading into and out of the cycle in the image, it's because it's not considered as a thermally closed cycle- although the fluid is closed cycle. (If it was a closed system, it would eventually grind to a halt because the hot source and cold sink would eventually be the same temperature, also you would have to model the thing that was being driven in the system- this is sometimes done, but it isn't being done in the diagram).
Even though nothing mechanically moves with the heat (there's no such thing as caloric!) Still, in thermodynamics heat usually is considered and said to flow, I draw your attention to Thermal conduction; heat flows from hot bodies to colder bodies, down thermal gradients, and since thermal gradients are easy to measure (you measure the temperatures at different places with a thermometer) it is unproblematic to do this. The physical mechanism at bottom is diffusion of heat, when something is hotter than something else more energy flows/diffuses down the gradient than up the gradient and you can calculate the net power flow in watts. Also if hot fluid is being pumped then heat is flowing with the fluid even without there being a gradient.
As regards he words, 'Illustrates' is subtly the wrong word; it really means to give an example of something, or to add a literal picture to a book, although it can also mean, in an obsolete usage, 'to shed light on', not as in explain, more as in actually physically shining a light on it!
'Dissipate' is definitely the wrong word. In thermodynamics and physics that means turned into heat, work done isn't dissipated.
Hope this helps.Teapeat (talk) 05:40, 27 March 2013 (UTC)
Thats perfect. Looking at the section as a whole, would it be worth adding some of the comments above to the Steam engine#Steam cycle subsection- or as a {{sfn}}. I am increasingly aware of the trust many readers are putting in WP. I have listened to some of my wobbly text being read out with authority as a lead to a program on Radio 4. I see this paragraph might be used as the entry point to the topic by some pretty serious guys- and giving them some links (as above) to heat flow and thermodynamics would be a good idea.
Moving on, I was up at Queen Street Mill on Thursday and got some stills and movie footage of the Tandem Compound, and its Barring Engine and Corliss valve gear which I am processing at the moment prior to an upload. Watch this space.-- Clem Rutter (talk) 09:34, 27 March 2013 (UTC)

southern hemisphere sundials[edit]

Clem, how are you, it has been a long time! I have spent time in South Sfrica recently and have taken some images for the Sundial article. Can I ask for youe advice; is it easy to load up the geo information (hoping I have it!)with the image. As a note twice I came across dials that were beautifully sited but not set for the area they were in. IOut of all the dials I found only one was "working", which may go some way to explaining the lack of need / interest in these types of "imported" dials. Edmund Patrickconfer 08:17, 30 March 2013 (UTC)

I found the Upload wizards to be a pain, so I use Commonist, and the browser applet to locate the position of the camera on Google Maps. I have detailed it at User:ClemRutter/Toolbox. I geotag the camera not the object-- but if the original location can be ascertained I would include details of it in the description. The (alleged) lack of popularity of dials in the southern hemispheres is usually connected to the equation of time- where the wildest variations occur during in the northern winter. (but I don't know).
I made a suggestion to my local community in 2009 that we place a allemmatic dial in a local hill top park. This week I got confirmation that funding had been found and the project will go ahead. There followed some rapid emails to ensure the contractors had my notes- and would set it right. We seem to be there.
Looking forward to seeing your backward images. -- Clem Rutter (talk) 13:55, 30 March 2013 (UTC)

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This Month in GLAM: March 2013[edit]

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Canal icons[edit]

Would you (and whoever else you think would be interested) please comment here? Useddenim (talk) 14:04, 10 April 2013 (UTC)

Lancashire Cotton Template[edit]

Hi. I wonder if the Associations category on the template should be changed to trade unions? Also, I have added two pages to the template.

I was trying not to frighten the horses, I wanted to establish and populate the section then allow the change to happen in a couple of months time.-- Clem Rutter (talk) 12:03, 11 April 2013 (UTC)

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Thank you[edit]

Hi Clem,
You wrote

Weavers' cottage is the place to look, particularly the references and Timmins in particular. A big topic, as you have flax, silk and wool and woollen with individual histories, vernacular traditions dependent on stone or wood- guilds, immigration, womens issues, technology.

Thank you for your message and your advice. I am simply not capable of expanding the Weavers' cottage and Weavers' windows articles beyond what they are. I hope you can do much better than I can.
--Shirt58 (talk) 10:31, 3 May 2013 (UTC)

This Month in GLAM: April 2013[edit]

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Bancroft Shed[edit]

Great work - please see Template:Did you know nominations/Bancroft Shed. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 14:32, 10 May 2013 (UTC)

DYK nomination of Bancroft Shed[edit]

Symbol question.svg Hello! Your submission of Bancroft Shed at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and some issues with it may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! Daemonic Kangaroo (talk) 06:40, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

It would be helpful if you could add some references. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 23:25, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

Kissing the shuttle[edit]

here you go: Template:Did you know nominations/Kissing the shuttle. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 23:18, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

UK Wikimedian of the Year 2013/Nominations[edit]

The Wikimedia UK AGM will be held in June, and nominations for the UK Wikimedian of the Year are currently open. If there is someone who you feel has made an important contribution to the UK Wikimedia movement in the last year please go ahead and nominate them here by 09:00 (BST) on Monday 20th May at the latest. Richard Nevell (WMUK) (talk) 13:27, 17 May 2013 (UTC)

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Jim Ramsbottom[edit]

Please could I use your picture of the defenses in the chatham dockyard page in my new book?[edit]

I've written a book and want to use your picture fro the chatham dockyard page. Would it be possible?(this one http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:ChathamDefences_1770(2).svg) I'll note you as a contibutor? I'd be very grateful(you'd get a free copy emailed to you should you wish to check) Kind regards Wearysoul §

Please could I use your picture of the defenses in the chatham dockyard page in my new book?[edit]

I've written a book and want to use your picture fro the chatham dockyard page. Would it be possible?(this one http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:ChathamDefences_1770(2).svg) I'll note you as a contibutor? I'd be very grateful(you'd get a free copy emailed to you should you wish to check) Kind regards Wearysoul § — Preceding unsigned comment added by Wearysoul (talkcontribs) 06:32, 25 May 2013 (UTC)

Sure. I regard it as a compliment. Are there are any simple changes you would like me to do. You can contact me directly by going to this page (email a user) -- Clem Rutter (talk) 09:11, 25 May 2013 (UTC)

May 2013[edit]

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DYK issues[edit]

Hi,

There are some concerns preventing two of your QSMM articles from appearing on DYK. Please could I ask you to take a look at (and watchlist):

and see if you can resolve them? Cheers, Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 19:33, 31 May 2013 (UTC)

I am working through the issues- though would appreciate other editors to get involved. I don't wish to fall into WP:OWN. I will comment on both template talk pages Sunday night. -- Clem Rutter (talk) 22:52, 31 May 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Bancroft Shed[edit]

 — Crisco 1492 (talk) 16:02, 4 June 2013 (UTC)

This Month in GLAM: May 2013[edit]

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One mill less[edit]

Providence Mill, Bradford destroyed by fire. Mjroots (talk) 16:19, 9 June 2013 (UTC)

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List of mills in Lancashire/Harle Syke[edit]

Now that you've created the template, I assume that this is no longer needed? If you like, I can merge the histories of the pages, or I can delete the article space one outright? J Milburn (talk) 21:20, 17 June 2013 (UTC)

Thanks, I was hanging on to it in case the Template solution was opposed or reverted. It seems to have been accepted now so I would be grateful if you merged the histories- it seems the correct thing to do.-- Clem Rutter (talk) 21:46, 17 June 2013 (UTC)
Done. J Milburn (talk) 18:51, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

DYK nomination of Kissing the shuttle[edit]

Symbol question.svg Hello! Your submission of Kissing the shuttle at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and some issues with it may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! AgneCheese/Wine 02:56, 22 June 2013 (UTC)

Institution of Civil Engineers editathon[edit]

Interested editors are invited to an editathon event at the Institution of Civil Engineers, in London, on 19 July 2013. See Wikipedia:GLAM/ICE. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 14:00, 25 June 2013 (UTC)

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DYK for Kissing the shuttle[edit]

The DYK project (nominate) 16:04, 3 July 2013 (UTC)

This Month in GLAM: June 2013[edit]

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UCB Logo/ Logo programming language[edit]

I replied on my talk page - see here.
--DancingPhilosopher (talk) 08:55, 10 July 2013 (UTC)

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Pont du Gard translation[edit]

I have responded to your removal with a suggestion we should both be able to live with: [5]

Digital sundial[edit]

This is how it works: "A digital sundial uses light and shadow to 'write' the time in numerals rather than marking time with position. One such design uses two parallel masks to screen sunlight into patterns appropriate for the time of day" (The text that you have deleted in the meantime.) I made a drawing of the sundial because I have no picture clear enough which I have the copyright. The drawing is, moreover, obvious than any photo. Please place the text and drawing back. This kind of sundial is the last kind of sundial invented. A more comprehensive and more scientific explanation is on the page dedicated to the digital sundial. Willy Leenders Flanders in Belgium e-mail: willy.leenders@pandora.be — Preceding unsigned comment added by Willy Leenders (talkcontribs) 18:02, 16 July 2013 (UTC)

Commons:WikiProject BSicon‎[edit]

You are invited to join Commons:Commons:WikiProject BSicon‎. Useddenim (talk) 20:56, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

Quarry Bank Mill[edit]

I started The Mill (television); Quarry Bank Mill will be getting increased attention and could do with some TLC. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 12:44, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Ouch it is awful, but I have limited internet access (8km - four afternoons a week) - see Le Truel in the Raspes de Tarn, contructing a straw bale house. Have you source material- I will see if I have anything extra on the hard drive. -- Clem Rutter (talk) 14:30, 8 August 2013 (UTC)bb

This Month in GLAM: July 2013[edit]

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This Month in GLAM: August 2013[edit]

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September 2013[edit]

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  • [fiber crop|vegetable fibre]]s include [[cotton]], [[linen]], [[jute]] and [[Cannabis sativa|hemp]]).[[Animal protein fibres]] include [[wool]] and [[silk]]). Man-made fibres (made by industrial processes) including [[nylon]],[[polyester]]) will be used in some hobbies and hand crafts and in the developed world.

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VisualEditor newsletter for September 19, 2013[edit]

VisualEditor has been updated twice in the last two weeks. As usual, what is now running on the English Wikipedia had a test run at Mediawiki during the previous week.

As announced, the toolbar was redesigned to be simpler, shorter, and to have the ability to have drop-down groups with descriptions. What you see now is the initial configuration and is expected to change in response to feedback from the English Wikipedia and other Wikipedias. The controls to add <u> (underline), <sub> (subscript), and <sup> (superscript), <s> (strikethrough) and <code> (computer code/monospace font) annotations to text are available to all users in the drop-down menu. At the moment, all but the most basic tools have been moved into a single drop-down menu, including the tools for inserting media, references, reference lists, and templates. The current location of all of the items in the toolbar is temporary, and your opinions about the best order are needed! Please offer suggestions at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback/Toolbar.

In an eagerly anticipated upgrade to the reference dialog, newly added references or reference groups no longer need the page to be saved before they can be re-used (bugs 51689 and 52000). The 'Use existing reference' button is now disabled on pages which don't yet have any references (bug 51848). The template parameter filter in the transclusion dialog now searches both parameter name and label (bug 51670).

In response to several requests, there are some new keyboard shortcuts. You can now set the block/paragraph formatting from the keyboard: Ctrl+0 sets a block as a regular paragraph; Ctrl+1 up to Ctrl+6 sets it as a Heading 1 ("Page title") to Heading 6 ("Sub-heading 4"); Ctrl+7 sets it as pre-formatted (bug 33512). Ctrl+2, which creates level 2 section headings, may be the most useful.

Some improvements were made to capitalization for links, so typing in "iPhone" will offer a link to "iPhone" as well as "IPhone" (bug 50452).

Copying and pasting within the same document should work better as of today's update, as should copying from VisualEditor into a third-party application (bug 53364, bug 52271, bug 52460). Work on copying and pasting between VisualEditor instances (for example, between two articles) and retaining formatting when copying from an external source into VisualEditor is progressing.

Major improvements to editing with input method editors (IMEs; mostly used for Indic and East Asian languages) are being deployed today. This is a complex change, so it may produce unexpected errors. On a related point, the names of languages listed in the "languages" (langlinks) panel in the Page settings dialog now display as RTL when appropriate (bug 53503).

Looking ahead: The help/'beta' menu will soon expose the build number next to the "Leave feedback" link, so users can give more specific reports about issues they encounter (bug 53050). This change will make it easier for developers to identify any cacheing issues, once it starts reporting the build number (currently, it says "Version false"). Also, inserting a link, reference or media file will put the cursor after the new content again (bug 53560). Next week’s update will likely improve how dropdowns and other selection menus behave when they do not fit on the screen, with things scrolling so the selected item is always in view.

If you are active at other Wikipedias, the next group of Wikipedias to have VisualEditor offered to all users is being finalized. About two dozen Wikipedias are on the list for Tuesday, September 24 for logged-in users only, and on Monday, September 30 for unregistered editors. You can help with translating the documentation. In several cases, most of the translation is already done, and it only needs to be copied over to the relevant Wikipedia. If you are interested in finding out whether a particular Wikipedia is currently on the list, you can leave a message for me at my talk page.

For other questions or suggestions, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting problem reports at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback and other ideas at Wikipedia talk:VisualEditor. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 21:39, 19 September 2013 (UTC)

Tindale, Cumbria[edit]

Hi Clem, I've uncommented the couple of paras that were hiding in this article since you first uploaded it two years ago. They're as well-sourced as anything else there and they explain the mystery of Rocket's missing thirty years quite nicely – I'd always wondered about those! Andy Dingley (talk) 10:32, 1 October 2013 (UTC)

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October 2013[edit]

Hello, I'm BracketBot. I have automatically detected that your edit to Broquiès may have broken the syntax by modifying 1 "()"s. If you have, don't worry: just edit the page again to fix it. If I misunderstood what happened, or if you have any questions, you can leave a message on my operator's talk page.

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  • and uses the valley to the east to zig-zag upwards through Vieux Broquies to the prominentary({{convert|350|m|ft}}- ({{convert|400|m|ft}}) where the main village is located. Here the road heads

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This Month in GLAM: September 2013[edit]

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Headlines
  • Belgium report: Europeana Fashion Fashion edit-a-thon; Wiki Loves Monuments
  • France report: Aerial pictures of Versailles; In Brief
  • Germany report: Reaching out for new partners
  • India report: Wiki Loves Monuments in India
  • Italy report: Italian Wikipedia takes libraries
  • Mexico report: Wiki Loves Monuments 2013; edit-a-thon in La Merced historical neighborhood
  • Netherlands report: Wiki Loves Monuments; ECNC photo competition; Europeana Fashion Edit-a-thon Antwerp; Fourth Dutch Wikipedian in Residence; Wiki loves libraries workshop; 10 years of CC licenses
  • Spain report: Amical projects: Catalan Culture; Wiki Loves Monuments
  • Sweden report: Sign language and case studies
  • Switzerland report: New cooperation with Botanical Garden; History of Alps update; OpenGLAM workshop at OKCon
  • UK report: The Morning After the Month Before
  • USA report: Wikipedia at the Metropolitan New York Library Council in New York
  • Wiki Loves Monuments report: The world's largest photography contest has struck again, but missed many countries
  • Open Access report: Thanks, OKCon, featured content, stats and a final
  • Calendar: October's GLAM events
Read this edition in fullSingle-page

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buried sundial[edit]

Found this through work related research, the first case I know of a sundial [1] being buried with a sacrificial victim, what did he do to upset time or its passage so much. Hope you find it interesting? Edmund Patrickconfer 05:40, 15 October 2013 (UTC)

VisualEditor newsletter on 16 October 2013[edit]

VisualEditor is still being updated every Thursday. As usual, what is now running on the English Wikipedia had a test run at Mediawiki during the previous week. If you haven't done so already, you can turn on VisualEditor by going to your preferences and choosing the item, "Enable VisualEditor. It will be available in the following namespaces: $1".

The reference dialog for all Wikipedias, especially the way it handles citation templates, is being redesigned. Please offer suggestions and opinions at mw:VisualEditor/Design/Reference Dialog. (Use your Wikipedia username/password to login there.) You can also drag and drop references (select the reference, then hover over the selected item until your cursor turns into the drag-and-drop tool). This also works for some templates, images, and other page elements (but not yet for text or floated items). References are now editable when they appear inside a media item's caption (bug 50459).

There were a number of miscellaneous fixes made: Firstly, there was a bug that meant that it was impossible to move the cursor using the keyboard away from a selected node (like a reference or template) once it had been selected (bug 54443). Several improvements have been made to scrollable windows, panels, and menus when they don't fit on the screen or when the selected item moves off-screen. Editing in the "slug" at the start of a page no longer shows up a chess pawn character ("♙") in some circumstances (bug 54791). Another bug meant that links with a final punctuation character in them broke extending them in some circumstances (bug 54332). The "page settings" dialog once again allows you to remove categories (bug 54727). There have been some problems with deployment scripts, including one that resulted in VisualEditor being broken for an hour or two at all Wikipedias (bug 54935). Finally, snowmen characters ("☃") no longer appear near newly added references, templates and other nodes (bug 54712).

Looking ahead: Development work right now is on rich copy-and-paste abilities, quicker addition of citation templates in references, setting media items' options (such as being able to put images on the left), switching into wikitext mode, and simplifying the toolbar. A significant amount of work is being done on other languages during this month. If you speak a language other than English, you can help with translating the documentation.

For other questions or suggestions, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting problem reports at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback and other ideas at Wikipedia talk:VisualEditor. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 18:40, 16 October 2013 (UTC)

Manchester meetup[edit]

Newsflash! The location of this weekend's Manchester meetup has been moved back to Wetherspoons on Princess Street - the Ducie Arms isn't open on Sundays! Can you believe that?! Bazonka (talk) 18:04, 17 October 2013 (UTC)

Books and Bytes: The Wikipedia Library Newsletter[edit]

Books and Bytes

Volume 1, Issue 1, October 2013

Eurasian Eagle-Owl Maurice van Bruggen.JPG

by The Interior (talk · contribs), Ocaasi (talk · contribs)

Greetings Wikipedia Library members! Welcome to the inaugural edition of Books and Bytes, TWL’s monthly newsletter. We're sending you the first edition of this opt-in newsletter, because you signed up, or applied for a free research account: HighBeam, Credo, Questia, JSTOR, or Cochrane. To receive future updates of Books and Bytes, please add your name to the subscriber's list. There's lots of news this month for the Wikipedia Library, including new accounts, upcoming events, and new ways to get involved...

New positions: Sign up to be a Wikipedia Visiting Scholar, or a Volunteer Wikipedia Librarian

Wikipedia Loves Libraries: Off to a roaring start this fall in the United States: 29 events are planned or have been hosted.

New subscription donations: Cochrane round 2; HighBeam round 8; Questia round 4... Can we partner with NY Times and Lexis-Nexis??

New ideas: OCLC innovations in the works; VisualEditor Reference Dialog Workshop; a photo contest idea emerges

News from the library world: Wikipedian joins the National Archives full time; the Getty Museum releases 4,500 images; CERN goes CC-BY

Announcing WikiProject Open: WikiProject Open kicked off in October, with several brainstorming and co-working sessions

New ways to get involved: Visiting scholar requirements; subject guides; room for library expansion and exploration

Read the full newsletter

Thanks for reading! All future newsletters will be opt-in only. Have an item for the next issue? Leave a note for the editor on the Suggestions page. --The Interior 21:29, 27 October 2013 (UTC)

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This Month in GLAM: October 2013[edit]

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Headlines
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Disambiguation link notification for November 14[edit]

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A Thousand Pardons[edit]

I just put in a request to fix my mistake. Hopefully, it will be corrected before the day is through.--Mr Fink (talk) 23:44, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

VisualEditor newsletter for November 2013[edit]

Since the last newsletter, the VisualEditor team has worked on some feature changes, major infrastructure improvements to make the system more stable, dependable and extensible, some minor toolbar improvements, and fixing bugs.

A new form parsing library for language characters in Parsoid caused the corruption of pages containing diacritics for about an hour two weeks ago. Relatively few pages at the English Wikipedia were affected, but this created immediate problems at some other Wikipedias, sometimes affecting several dozen pages. The development teams for Parsoid and VisualEditor apologize for the serious disruption and thank the people who reported this emergency at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback and on the public IRC channel, #mediawiki-visualeditor.

There have been dozens of changes since the last newsletter. Here are some of the highlights:

  • Accidental deletion of infoboxes and other items: You now need to press the Delete or ← Backspace key twice to delete a template, reference or image. The first time, the item becomes selected, and the second time, it is removed. The need to press the delete key twice should make it more obvious what you are doing and help avoid accidental removals of infoboxes and similar (bug 55336).
  • Switch from VisualEditor to the wikitext editor: A new feature lets you make a direct, one-way editing interface change, which will preserve your changes without needing to save the page and re-open it in the wikitext editor (bug 50687). It is available in a new menu in the action buttons by the Cancel button (where the "Page Settings" button used to be). Note that this new feature is not currently working in Firefox.
  • Categories and Languages are also now directly available in that menu. The category suggestions drop-down was appearing in the wrong place rather than below its input box, which is now fixed. An incompatibility between VisualEditor and the deployed Parsoid service that prevented editing categories and language links was fixed.
  • File:, Help: and Category: namespaces: VisualEditor was enabled for these namespaces the on all wikis (bug 55968), the Portal: and Viquiprojecte: namespaces on the Catalan Wikipedia (bug 56000), and the Portal: and Book: namespaces on the English Wikipedia (bug 56001).
  • Media item resizing: We improved how files are viewed in a few ways. First, inline media items can now be resized in the same way that has been possible with block ones (like thumbnails) before. When resizing a media item, you can see a live preview of how it will look as you drag it (bug 54298). While you are dragging an image to resize it, we now show a label with the current dimensions (bug 54297). Once you have resized it, we fetch a new, higher resolution image for the media item if necessary (bug 55697). Manual setting of media item sizes in their dialog is nearly complete and should be available next week. If you hold down the Shift key whilst resizing an image, it will now snap to a 10 pixel grid instead of the normal free-hand sizing. The media item resize label now is centered while resizing regardless of which tool you use to resize it.
  • Undo and redo: A number of improvements were made to the transactions system which make undoing and redoing more reliable during real-time collaboration (bug 53224).
  • Save dialogue: The save page was re-written to use the same code as all other dialogs (bug 48566), and in the process fixed a number of issues. The save dialog is re-accessible if it loses focus (bug 50722), or if you review a null edit (bug 53313); its checkboxes for minor edit, watch the page, and flagged revisions options now layout much more cleanly (bug 52175), and the tab order of the buttons is now closer to what users will expect (bug 51918). There was a bug in the save dialog that caused it to crash if there was an error in loading the page from Parsoid, which is now fixed.
  • Links to other articles or pages sometimes sent people to invalid pages. VisualEditor now keeps track of the context in which you loaded the page, which lets us fix up links in document to point to the correct place regardless of what entry point you launched the editor from—so the content of pages loaded through /wiki/Foobar?veaction=edit and /w/index.php?title=Foobar&veaction=edit both now have text links that work if triggered (bug 48915).
  • Toolbar links: A bug that caused the toolbar's menus to get shorter or even blank when scrolled down the page in Firefox is now fixed (bug 55343).
  • Numbered external links: VisualEditor now supports Parsoid's changed representation of numbered external links (bug 53505).
  • Removed empty templates: We also fixed an issue that meant that completely empty templates became impossible to interact with inside VisualEditor, as they didn't show up (bug 55810).
  • Mathematics formulae: If you would like to try the experimental LaTeX mathematics tool in VisualEditor, you will need to opt-in to Beta Features. This is currently available on Meta-wiki, Wikimedia Commons, and Mediawiki.org. It will be available on all other Wikimedia sites on 21 November.
  • Browser testing support: If you are interested in technical details, the browser tests were expanded to cover some basic cursor operations, which uncovered an issue in our testing framework that doesn't work with cursoring in Firefox; the Chrome tests continue to fail due to a bug with the welcome message for that part of the testing framework.
  • Load time: VisualEditor now uses content language when fetching Wikipedia:TemplateData information, so reducing bandwidth use, and users on multi-language or multi-script wikis now get TemplateData hinting for templates as they would expect (bug 50888).
  • Reuse of VisualEditor: Work on spinning out the user experience (UX) framework from VisualEditor into oojs-ui, which lets other teams at Wikimedia (like Flow) and gadget authors re-use VisualEditor UX components, is now complete and is being moved to a shared code repository.
  • Support for private wikis: If you maintain a private wiki at home or at work, VisualEditor now supports editing of private wikis, by forwarding the Cookie: HTTP header to Parsoid ($wgVisualEditorParsoidForwardCookies set to true) (bug 44483). (Most private wikis will also need to install Parsoid and node.js, as VisualEditor requires them.)

Looking ahead:

  • VisualEditor will be released to some of the smaller Wikipedias on 02 December 2013. If you are active at one or more smaller Wikipedias where VisualEditor is not yet generally available, please see the list at VisualEditor/Rollouts.
  • Public office hours on IRC to discuss VisualEditor with Product Manager James Forrester will be held on Monday, 2 December, at 1900 UTC and on Tuesday, 3 December, at 0100 UTC. Bring your questions. Logs will be posted on Meta after each office hour completes.
  • In terms of feature improvements, one of the major infrastructure projects affects how inserting characters works, both using your computer's built-in Unicode input systems and through a planned character inserter tool for VisualEditor. The forthcoming rich copying and pasting feature was extended and greater testing is currently being done. Work continues to support the improved reference dialog to quickly add citations based on local templates.

If you have questions or suggestions for future improvements, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting a note at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) 22:04, 20 November 2013 (UTC)

Happy Birthday[edit]

Ten years ago today (28 Nov 2003) I made my first edit to Wikipedia. Snettisham and the hidden gold-- and now a lot older I have spent the evening with Sundial which attracted me in 2004. Doesn't that entitle me to a gold bar on my bus pass?

Congrats on the first ten! Ready for your next decade on Wikipedia? The site will be hitting the big time soon. Nev1 (talk) 22:48, 28 November 2013 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for December 6[edit]

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The Wikipedia Library Survey[edit]

As a subscriber to one of The Wikipedia Library's programs, we'd like to hear your thoughts about future donations and project activities in this brief survey. Thanks and cheers, Ocaasi t | c 15:39, 9 December 2013 (UTC)

This Month in GLAM: November 2013[edit]

This month in GLAM logo.png




Headlines
  • Australia and New Zealand report: From East to West
  • Belgium report: Wiki Loves Monuments in Belgium and Luxembourg
  • France report: Mass uploads; Wiki Loves Monuments; Edit-a-thon; GLAM conference
  • Germany report: MS Wissenschaft; Science Gallery; Zugang gestalten; Science 2.0; OKFest 2014
  • Italy report: Libraries and librarians (but there are still shoes)
  • Mexico report: Wiki Loves Monuments 2013 award ceremony; Day of the Dead photo contest winners
  • Netherlands report: Edit-a-thon Amersfoort; Wikipedia seminar Oslo; Wikimedia Nederland Conference; Europeana Fashion
  • Spain report: Wiki Loves Monuments; Fundación Joaquín Díaz González; Wiki Party in Salamanca
  • Sweden report: Motorcycles, Norway and shoes
  • Switzerland report: Wiki Loves Monuments Awards Ceremony; Wikipedians in Residence; Image Donations
  • UK report: Open content at the BBC; edit-a-thons; photography
  • USA report: GLAM-Wiki Activities in Philadelphia and Vancouver, Washington
  • Open Access report: Open Access Button and Berlin 11 conference
  • Calendar: December's GLAM events


Read this edition in fullSingle-page

To assist with preparing the newsletter, please visit the newsroom. Past editions may be viewed here.

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Disambiguation link notification for December 13[edit]

Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. Wikipedia appreciates your help. We noticed though that when you edited Hannah Greg, you added links pointing to the disambiguation pages Caton and Lancaster (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver). Such links are almost always unintended, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of "Did you mean..." article titles. Read the FAQ • Join us at the DPL WikiProject.

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December 2013[edit]

Hello, I'm BracketBot. I have automatically detected that your edit to Cotton mill may have broken the syntax by modifying 1 "{}"s. If you have, don't worry: just edit the page again to fix it. If I misunderstood what happened, or if you have any questions, you can leave a message on my operator's talk page.

List of unpaired brackets remaining on the page:
  • Royton', ''Victoria County History, Lancs. V (1911), 112–15, note 32. URL accessed May 2, 2007).</ref><ref>[http://www.spinningtheweb.org.uk/journey.php?Title=NW+Cotton+towns+learning+journey&
  • were women, 24.2% were girls, 19% were men and 6.6% were boys.{sfn|Quayle|2006|pp=42–46,53}}

Thanks, BracketBot (talk) 00:28, 16 December 2013 (UTC)

VisualEditor newsletter • 19 December 2013[edit]

Since the last newsletter, the VisualEditor team has worked on some toolbar improvements, fixing bugs, and improving support for Indic languages as well as other languages with complex characters. The current focus is on improving the reference dialog and expanding the new character inserter tool.

There have been dozens of changes since the last newsletter. Here are some of the highlights:

  • Rich copying and pasting is now available. If you copy text from another website, then character formatting and some other HTML attributes are preserved. This means, for example, that if you copy a pre-formatted suggested citation from a source like this, then VisualEditor will preserve the formatting of the title in the citation. Keep in mind that copying the formatting may include formatting that you don't want (like section headings). If you want to paste plain, unformatted text onto a page, then use Control+ Shift+V or Command+ Shift+V (Mac).
  • Auto-numbered external links like [6] can now be edited just like any other link. However, they cannot be created in VisualEditor easily.
  • Several changes to the toolbar and dialogs have been made, and more are on the way. The toolbar has been simplified with a new drop-down text styles menu and an "insert" menu. Your feedback on the toolbar is wanted here. The transclusion/template dialog has been simplified. If you have enabled mathematical formula editing, then the menu item is now called the formula editor instead of LaTeX.
  • There is a new character inserter, which you can find in the new "insert" menu, with a capital Omega ("Ω"). It's a very basic set of characters. Your feedback on the character inserter is wanted here.
  • Saving the page should seem faster by several seconds now.
  • It is now possible to access VisualEditor by manually editing the URL, even if you are not logged in or have not opted in to VisualEditor normally.  To do so, append ?veaction=edit to the end of the page name.  For example, change https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Random to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Random?veaction=edit to open a random page in VisualEditor.  This is intended to support bug testing across multiple browsers, without requiring editors to login repeatedly.

Looking ahead: The transclusion dialog will see further changes in the coming weeks, with a simple mode for single templates and an advanced mode for more complex transclusions. The new character formatting menu on the toolbar will get an arrow to show that it is a drop-down menu. The reference dialog will be improved, and the Reference item will become a button in the main toolbar, rather than an item in the Insert menu.

If you have questions or suggestions for future improvements, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting a note at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 20:37, 19 December 2013 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for December 31[edit]

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Disambiguation link notification for January 7[edit]

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January 2014[edit]

Hello, I'm BracketBot. I have automatically detected that your edit to Philip Sidney Stott may have broken the syntax by modifying 1 "()"s. If you have, don't worry: just edit the page again to fix it. If I misunderstood what happened, or if you have any questions, you can leave a message on my operator's talk page.

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  • *Roy Mill (1906) demolished) {{sfn|Holden|2005|p=81}}

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This Month in GLAM: December 2013[edit]

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Headlines
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VisualEditor newsletter for Janaury 2014[edit]

Since the last newsletter, the VisualEditor team has worked mostly minor features and fixing bugs. A few significant bugs include working around a bug in CSSJanus that was wrongly flipping images used in some templates in right-to-left (RTL) environments (bug 50910) a major bug that meant inserting any template or other transclusion failed (bug 59002), a major but quickly resolved problem due to an unannounced change in MediaWiki core, which caused VisualEditor to crash on trying to save (bug 59867). This last bugs did not appear on any Wikipedia. Additionally, significant work has been done in the background to make VisualEditor work as an independent editing system.

As of today, VisualEditor is now available as an opt-out feature to all users at 149 active Wikipedias.

  • The character inserter tool in the "Insert" menu has a very basic set of characters. The character inserter is especially important for languages that use Latin and Cyrillic alphabets with unusual characters or frequent diacritics. Your feedback on the character inserter is requested. In addition to feedback from any interested editor, the developers would particularly like to hear from anyone who speaks any of the 50+ languages listed under Phase 5 at mw:VisualEditor/Rollouts, including Breton, Mongolian, Icelandic, Welsh, Afrikaans, Macedonian, and Azerbaijani.
  • meta:Office hours on IRC have been heavily attended recently. The next one will be held this coming Wednesday, 22 January at 23:00 UTC.
  • You can now edit some of the page settings in the "options" dialog – __NOTOC__ and __FORCETOC__ as selection (forced on, forced off, or default setting; bugs 56866 and 56867) and __NOEDITSECTION__ as a checkbox (bug 57166).
  • The automated browser tests were adjusted to speed them up and bind more correctly to list items in lists, and updated to a newer version of their ruby dependencies. You can monitor the automated browser tests' results (triggered every twelve hours) live on the server.
  • Wikipedia:VisualEditor/User guide was updated recently to show some new and upcoming features.

Looking ahead: The character formatting menu on the toolbar will get a drop-down indicator next Thursday. The reference and media items will be the first two listed in the Insert menu. The help menu will get a page listing the keyboard shortcuts. Looking further out, image handling will be improved, including support for alignment (left, right, and center) and better control over image size (including default and upright sizes). The developers are also working on support for editing redirects and image galleries.

Subscriptions to this newsletter are managed at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Newsletter. Please add or remove your name to change your subscription settings. If you have questions or suggestions for future improvements, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting a note at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) 20:02, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

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Disambiguation link notification for February 7[edit]

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Help please[edit]

Hi Clem. I have a bit of an issue with a new user and would appreciate some advice. He's a 16 yo lad from Tyneside and has been editing North Tyneside Steam Railway. He's been constructive - one of the good guys that we need to encourage. The problem is that he has copied the line history from an online publication almost word for word. It is a large edit, unless he had access to the source it would have been a lot of typing, see User talk:Stevie742. I'm not quite sure where to go on this. The head says to put in a request for admin assistance, but the heart warns that some admins tend to stomp over youngsters with a pair of hobnailed boots. Do you know of any sympathetic types that will handle him gently? Kind regards, Martin of Sheffield (talk) 16:53, 7 February 2014 (UTC)

I think we can fix this ourselves- as I understand it, all we need to do is to protect the text by sending an email to OTRS- at permissions-en@wikimedia.org. It is described in Wikipedia:Declaration of consent for all enquiries. I have never done it but I think that we do need to master the system as I can think of lots of other occasions when it would be helpful. The page is dismal so I am trying to sort out a simple explanation leaflet that is less frightening. I have mentioned these things at the Manchester Wikimeetups where everyone is sympathetic.
When I am trying to involve an organisation I usually talk to User:HJ Mitchell and I see from his user page he is an admin- and he does OTRS work, so he is probably the best bet if we cant fix it. Harry is waiting for a minor OP so maybe a little less available this month. For technical matters and mills I talk to Andy Mabbett.
Let me see what I can dream up this weekend- and we can get Stevie to trial the system. -- Clem Rutter (talk) 19:29, 7 February 2014 (UTC)
Thanks. I see what you mean about the page, considering we are trying to get people to help us it is a bit forbidding. Perhaps if it was acceptable to just send the box, as far as possible filled in, to Stevie or Ian we would be more likely to receive help. Anyhow, I await your "dreaming up". Thanks, Martin of Sheffield (talk) 15:04, 8 February 2014 (UTC)
I have being playing Dungeons and Dragons with all the OTRS pages! I have put together this page User:ClemRutter/Toolbox/OTRS with a more user friendly form and explanation, and sent the link to Harry for comments. If he clears it- then this should give you all the info you need to send to Stevie- I'll keep you posted when I get a reply. Feel free to add comments. -- Clem Rutter (talk) 12:23, 9 February 2014 (UTC)

Manchester Jewish Museum[edit]

I see that you have uploaded a large amount of Jewish history to the Manchester Jewish Museum. While interesting it is completely off topic so could I suggest it is removed and uploaded to a new and much more appropriate article History of Jewish settlement in Manchester which could be linked to the original article and probably to the History of Manchester article. J3Mrs (talk) 14:29, 9 February 2014 (UTC)

Fine go for it, or leave it a couple of weeks for me. I am just clearing down my backlog and coding up a python tool to handle lists of mills. This one had been in my sandbox for ages- as I said 'time to share'. In my memory I had been thinking that it should have been History of Jewish settlement in Manchester. I have been giving Naturism a serious haircut but haven't forgotten Cotton mill, I now have Giles and Goodall, Yorkshire Textile Mills 1770-1930 (0-11-300038-3) that will gives a slightly different perspective, excellent references. I have yet even to start reading it though. You will see above the OTRS discussion too... -- Clem Rutter (talk) 14:58, 9 February 2014 (UTC)
I'd rather you did it as it is your work and it only needs a reference section and reflist. J3Mrs (talk) 15:08, 9 February 2014 (UTC)
As you made the redirect, I did it. It's all yours except for an opening sentence. I hope that's ok. J3Mrs (talk) 18:23, 10 February 2014 (UTC)
Excellent. We will see if have an influx of new contributors!-- Clem Rutter (talk) 18:38, 10 February 2014 (UTC)
Somehow I doubt it but it would be good if there were. J3Mrs (talk) 18:41, 10 February 2014 (UTC)

This Month in GLAM: January 2014[edit]

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Headlines
  • France report: Public Domain Day; photographs
  • Germany report: WMDE-GLAM-Highlights in 2014
  • Netherlands report: New Years Reception; 550 years States General; Content donation University Museum; Wikipedians in Residence; OpenGLAM Benchmark Survey
  • Sweden report: Digitization; list creation
  • Switzerland report: The Wikipedians in Residence of the Swiss National Library have started their work
  • UK report: Voices from the BBC Archives plus Zoos, coins and Poets
  • USA report: GLAM-Wiki activities in the USA
  • Open Access report: Open Access Media Importer; Open Access File of the Day
  • Calendar: February's GLAM events
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VisualEditor Newsletter—February 2014[edit]

Since the last newsletter, the VisualEditor team has worked on some small changes to the user interface, such as moving the reference item to the top of the Insert menu, as well as some minor features and fixing bugs, especially for rich copying and pasting of references.

The biggest change was the addition of more features to the image dialog, including the ability to set alignment (left, right, center), framing options (thumbnail, frame, frameless, and none), adding alt text, and defining the size manually. There is still some work to be done here, including a quick way to set the default size.

Looking ahead: The link tool will tell you when you're linking to a disambiguation or redirect page. The warning about wikitext will hide itself after you remove the wikitext markup in that paragraph. Support for creating and editing redirects is in the pipeline. Looking further out, image handling will be improved, including default and upright sizes. The developers are also working on support for viewing and editing hidden HTML comments, some behavioral magic words like DISPLAYTITLE, and in-line language setting (dir="rtl").

If you have questions or suggestions for future improvements, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting a note at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) 04:20, 20 February 2014 (UTC)


Thank you for your help with http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Schools#Lincoln_Group_of_Schools[edit]

Thanks, Clem, for your help at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Schools#Lincoln_Group_of_Schools. Not sure if I was supposed to respond here, or on the original page. I did not create this page. I'm just responsible for fixing errors, etc. I do not wish to edit the page directly. I was hoping that I could talk through the errors with you (or another editor), and you would update the page in the way that is best, since you are a regular Wikipedia user. Thanks, Eric 74.102.85.132 (talk) 19:08, 27 February 2014 (UTC)

It doesn't work that way-I have a backlog of articles I want to create- and no-one I know is short of things they want to do. Working with volunteers is like herding cats. I advise others when I come across a cry for help- but 'I have no responsibility to others'. It always seems a shame that there is such a vast untapped pool of talent in the student body that we have failed to engage. I would suggest you report back to your linemamager saying: You have researched issue, and discovered that the task is achievable but it will involve investing resources- particularly time. Wikipedia editing is a bit like writing a MBA thesis, you need to understand the topic, write a draft and fully reference it. Wikipedia markup is easy secretarial task, but in providing the links it becomes necessary to write and research subsidiary stub articles which is time consuming. Done well, and written impartially it becomes a significant asset- and as such it is worth doing. Help is available to advise, on protocols and procedure but not to write copy.
At this point I need you to be logged on so I can direct this reply, and so you can see I have responded. -- Clem Rutter (talk) 11:32, 28 February 2014 (UTC)
I understand. I am tracking your responses. I do not have an account and wasn't planning on creating one. Should I create a new account? Also, I don't mind fixing the errors. However, I was advised not to edit the page as I am an employee of Lincoln Tech and therefore have a COI. Thanks, Eric 74.102.85.132 (talk) 15:55, 28 February 2014 (UTC)
Open an account- then we will open a subpage for you, you should copy the page from Lincoln Tech onto your subpage- and edit it there. We (Demiurge1000ElKevbo) will advise you on what is OK- and when everyone is happy a third party editor will transfer it over to main page. Wikipedia is very sensitive about conflict of interest- you have been right to bring this to everyones attention- caution is necessary. (edit conflict) I see you have an account- we can continue this discussion there. -- Clem Rutter (talk) 17:34, 28 February 2014 (UTC)


AFD[edit]

Hi mate. Any particular reason you added a "keep" vote to the nominator's rationale? I'm assuming it was a mistake rather than an effort to have the nominator "vote" against his own nomination, right? I've removed it for now but I'm happy to discuss it. Stalwart111 00:30, 6 March 2014 (UTC)

Yep not awake! -- Clem Rutter (talk) 00:55, 6 March 2014 (UTC)
All good! It seemed strange so I figured you wouldn't mind me changing it back. Have a strong cup of coffee and keep up the good work! Cheers, Stalwart111 05:25, 6 March 2014 (UTC)

This Month in GLAM: February 2014[edit]

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Headlines
  • France report: National Archives; Sèvres & mass uploads; Wikipedians in the European Parliament
  • Germany report: Claim open culture, again and again
  • India report: National Museum, New Delhi, India (January 2-5, 2014)
  • Netherlands report: Art and Feminism; Wikipedian in Residence; War memorials
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Subscribe/Unsubscribe · Global message delivery 14:47, 9 March 2014 (UTC)

This Month in GLAM: February 2014[edit]

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Headlines
  • France report: National Archives; Sèvres & mass uploads; Wikipedians in the European Parliament
  • Germany report: Claim open culture, again and again
  • India report: National Museum, New Delhi, India (January 2-5, 2014)
  • Netherlands report: Art and Feminism; Wikipedian in Residence; War memorials
Read this edition in fullSingle-page

To assist with preparing the newsletter, please visit the newsroom. Past editions may be viewed here.

Subscribe/Unsubscribe · Global message delivery 14:47, 9 March 2014 (UTC)


Ingleton People[edit]

Shouldn't the section on Mary Doyle be in the Thornton in Lonsdale article, rather than Ingleton's? I would have thought that Ingleton had more than enough to write about without poaching material that belongs to neighbouring parishes. Langcliffe (talk) 19:35, 16 March 2014 (UTC)

Hi, nice to chat, Wikipedia:WikiProject Yorkshire is running this collaborate to improve two articles scheme. I am just passing through- and thought it would be good to be involved in such a scheme- and there was on out side chance I could visit one the Leeds meet up. Since then you seem to be the only other person involved. There does seem to be a lot of published material to use as sources. So why pick on Reverend Sherlock- a vicar with High Bentham connections, Cornelius Sherlock who fixed the church- and probably a cousin and then the unfortunate Randall- all have strong Ingleton connections-- and the fluff about ACD is likely to bring in more links and interest to the article. But I haven't yet any other famous or notable folk that are easily accessible and well referenced. MOS style suggests there should be such a section.
We have two structural problems here- the article is about the settlement and the parish of Ingleton, so writing about the parish takes us to Ribblehead and beyond. I had to use Mapit to convince myself of the limits. Writing about the settlement, in this case includes land that is officially in Thornton- for instance: the Ingleton Waterfalls Trail, most of the Ingleton viaduct and half of the Ingleton Stations. Most hamlets surrounding the village will see Ingleton as part of their identity in a way that Ribblehead will not, as I understand it in 1885 they would use the Ingleton Stations if they wished to travel.
There seem to be very few folk working on Craven articles, and Thornton in Lonsdale is in a dire straight. ACD is mentioned in the lead but not the article- but with such lack of information that is not surprising.
I am a prolific content writer who never gets articles past a B- ( I call it lack of ability,) I am always happy to be corrected (saved). You have the advantage as being local to the area so will know far more than me and be able to find the books. Please do join in. -- Clem Rutter (talk) 20:43, 16 March 2014 (UTC)

VisualEditor newsletter—March 2014[edit]

Since the last newsletter, the VisualEditor team has mostly worked on changes to the template and image dialogs.

The biggest change in the last few weeks was the redesign of the template dialog. The template dialog now opens in a simplified mode that lists parameters and their descriptions. (The complex multi-item transclusion mode can be reached by clicking on "Show options" from inside the simplified template dialog.) Template parameters now have a bigger, auto-sizing input box for easier editing.  With today's update, searching for template parameters will become case-insensitive, and required template parameters will display an asterisk (*) next to their edit boxes. In addition to making it quicker and easier to see everything when you edit typical templates, this work was necessary to prepare for the forthcoming simplified citation dialog. The main priority in the coming weeks is building this new citation dialog, with the ultimate goal of providing autofill features for ISBNs, URLs, DOIs and other quick-fills. This will add a new button on the toolbar, with the citation templates available picked by each wiki's community. Concept drawings can be seen at mw:VisualEditor/Design/Reference Dialog. Please share your ideas about making referencing quick and easy with the designers.

  • The link tool now tells you when you're linking to a disambiguation or redirect page. Pages that exist, but are not indexed by the search engine, are treated like non-existent pages (bug 54361http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=54361).
  • Wikitext warnings will now hide when you remove wikitext from the paragraph you are editing.
  • The character inserter tool in the "Insert" menu has been slightly redesigned, to introduce larger buttons. Your suggestions for more significant changes to the special character inserter are still wanted.
  • The page options menu (three bars, next to the Cancel button) has expanded. You can create and edit redirect pages, set page options like __STATICREDIRECT__, __[NO]INDEX__ and __[NO]NEWEDITSECTION__, and more.  New keyboard shortcuts are listed there, and include undoing the last action, clearing formatting, and showing the shortcut help window. If you switch from VisualEditor to wikitext editing, your edit will now be tagged.
  • It is easier to edit images. There are more options and they are explained better. If you add new images to pages, they will also be default size.  You can now set image sizes to the default, if another size was previously specified. Full support for upright sizing systems, which more readily adapt image sizes to the reader's screen size, is planned.
  • VisualEditor adds fake blank lines so you can put your cursor there. These "slugs" are now smaller than normal blank lines, and are animated to be different from actual blank lines.
  • You can use the Ctrl+Alt+S or  Command+ Option+S shortcuts to open the save window, and you can preview your edit summary when checking your changes in the save window.
  • After community requests, VisualEditor has been deployed to the Interlingual Occidental Wikipedia, the Portuguese Wikibooks, and the French Wikiversity.
  • Any community can ask for custom icons for their language in the character formatting menu (bold, italic, etc.) by making a request on Bugzilla or by contacting Product Manager James Forrester.

The developers apologize for a regression bug with the deployment on 6 March 2014, which caused the incorrect removal of |upright size definitions on a handful of pages on the English Wikipedia, among others. The root cause was fixed, and the broken pages were fixed soon after.

Looking ahead:  Several template dialogs will become more compact. Looking further out, the developers are also working on support for viewing and editing hidden HTML comments. You will be able to see the Table of Contents change live as you edit the page, rather than it being hidden. In-line language setting (dir="rtl") may be offered to a few Wikipedias soon.

If you have questions or suggestions for future improvements, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting a note at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback or by joining the office hours on 19 April 2014 at 2000 UTC. Thank you! MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 22:44, 20 March 2014 (UTC)

Ingleton Parish SSSIs[edit]

Further to your last edit, there are four SSSIs in the Parish of Ingleton: Ingleborough, Whernside, Thornton and Twistleton Glens, and Salt Lake Quarry. See here for the boundaries. Langcliffe (talk) 13:12, 21 March 2014 (UTC)

Excellent rewrite on geology. I will give geography a bit of a break now- I just would like to leave a reference to Clapham Common so we can put a hat-note on a certain London Article. -- Clem Rutter (talk) 18:43, 21 March 2014 (UTC)


Reclining-Declining Sundials[edit]

Dear ClemRutter,

Sorry for the many edits and re-edits to the Reclining-Declining Sundials paragraph.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sundial#Reclining-declining_dials

But I think that I've now got the right formulas now for the gnomon angles at last. Where do I get them ? I derived them - not by any fancy means like rotation matrices or quaternions; but rather through good old-fashioned 3-D Euclidean geometry. By this I mean that I constructed physical models of the reclining-declining dial geometry using cardboard sheets for planes and strips of wire for optical paths and pertinent geometry lines/angles. I chose to do it this way as :

1) The results are far more concrete and convincing when this method is employed. This is particularly true in the reclining-declining dial case as there are many different formulas published for its hour angle and its gnomon angles.

2) The people who build these dials will generally come from a trades background. This means that they would generally have begun apprenticeships at 16 - 17 and their math level will be up to UK GCSE/O-level or French Brevet standard -- i.e. Euclidean geometry, basic trigonometry and basic algebra. My method is followable by people at this standard.

In due course I plan to submit a paper on this method - as well as the relevant diagrams (using Google SketchUp) for the vital geometrical relationships - to the North American Sundial Society.

The  s_o orientation switch integer for generalizing the hour angle formula over all dial declinations is the only 'novelty' added to the existing nomenclature. I find it handy when programming.

If you have any points to make on the actual formulas presented in Wiki by me or want to offer alternatives for discussion, please feel free.

Tamjk (talk) 10:52, 10 April 2014 (UTC)

I am enjoying the links personally but having difficulty in seeing how all this can be justified under WP:NOR. I would be inclined to keep the published sources (right or wrong) and include the improvements (unpublished corrections wrapped in a {{efn}} template that links to the {{notelist}} footnote. Rest assured I accept your maths as being superior.
What I was about to do was to change all the notation which I got from Waugh, Mayall & Mayall to the agreed symbols used by and recommended by the BSS- but that is also on hold while I sort out a useable python library.
It is interesting that fr:Cadran incliné-déclinant doesnt exist but all other types fr:Cadran déclinant have separate page- I haven't analysed which notation convention they are using- but I suspect that even there they are excluded most readers by using Greek letters which are not taught at brévet/ GCSE level.
Many thoughts - much to do -- Clem Rutter (talk) 11:34, 10 April 2014 (UTC)

Well, there's no original research here. Simply the same results via a more traditional and more workmanlike method. The hour angle formula is the same (bar using reclination angle instead of inclination) as those presented by Snyder and others :

http://dls-website.com/documents/SundialDesignConsiderations.pdf

The gnomon angle formulas are the same as those presented in the BSS Formulae webpage, at least the dial-plate angle (the "style height" in BSS parlance) once you allow for their defining inclination w.r.t. the rear horizontal rather than the front (i.e. sun side) horizontal.

http://www.sundialsoc.org.uk/Glossary/equations/equations-new.php

Unfortunately they have the substyle-noon angle wrong - but so did all of us originally.

Tamjk (talk) 16:10, 10 April 2014 (UTC)

Okay. I've now completed changing the Greek nomenclature to Roman. Tamjk (talk) 14:05, 18 April 2014 (UTC)

Queen Street Mill editathon[edit]

We're running another editathon, at Queen Street Mill in Burnley, England, on 10 May. Hope you can make it! Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 16:45, 10 April 2014 (UTC)

A reminder; this event is on Saturday. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 20:02, 8 May 2014 (UTC)

This Month in GLAM: March 2014[edit]

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Disambiguation link notification for April 17[edit]

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VisualEditor newsletter—April 2014[edit]

Since the last newsletter, the VisualEditor team has mostly worked on performance improvements, image settings, and preparation for a simplified citation template tool in its own menu.

  • In an oft-requested improvement, VisualEditor now displays red links (links to non-existent pages) in the proper color. Links to sister projects and external URLs are still the same blue as local links.
  • You can now open templates by double-clicking them or by selecting them and pressing  Return.  This also works for references, images, galleries, mathematical equations, and other "nodes".
  • VisualEditor has been disabled for pages that were created as translations of other pages using the Translate extension (common at Meta and MediaWiki.org). If a page has been marked for translation, you will see a warning if you try to edit it using VisualEditor.
  • When you try to edit protected pages with VisualEditor, the full protection notice and most recent log entry are displayed. Blocked users see the standard message for blocked users.
  • The developers fixed a bug that caused links on sub-pages to point to the wrong location.
  • The size-changing controls in the advanced settings section of the media or image dialog were simplified further. VisualEditor's media dialog supports more image display styles, like borderless images.
  • If there is not enough space on your screen to display all of the tabs (for instance, if your browser window is too narrow), the second edit tab will now fold into the drop-down menu (where the "Move" item is currently housed). On the English Wikipedia, this moves the "Edit beta" tab into the menu; on most projects, it moves the "Edit source" tab. This is only enabled in the default Vector skin, not for Monobook users. See this image for an example showing the "Edit source" and "View history" tabs after they moved into the drop-down menu.
  • After community requests, VisualEditor has been deployed as an opt-in feature at Meta and on the French Wikinews.
The drop-down menu is on the right, next to the search box.

Looking ahead:  A new, locally controlled menu of citation templates will put citations immediately in front of users. You will soon be able to see the Table of Contents while editing. Support for upright image sizes (preferred for accessibility) is being developed. In-line language setting (dir="rtl") will be offered as a Beta Feature soon. Looking further out, the developers are also working on support for viewing and editing hidden HTML comments. It will be possible to upload images to Commons from inside VisualEditor.

If you have questions or suggestions for future improvements, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting a note at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback or by joining the office hours on Monday, 19 May 2014 at 18:00 UTC. If you'd like to get this on your own page, subscribe at Wikipedia:VisualEditor#Newsletter for English Wikipedia only or at meta:VisualEditor/Newsletter for any project. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 20:23, 23 April 2014 (UTC)

TB[edit]

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Hello, ClemRutter. You have new messages at Trappedinburnley's talk page.
You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

Watermill[edit]

Hello, I have been thinking you'd removed the pic by accident. There are indeed no English references when it comes to this building. It is all in German if I remember right. I thought the pic spoke for itself and it presented an interesting architecture which would complete the overview on differently built watermills quite nicely. Obviously you are more committed to this topic and therefore understandably more demanding. I respect that. Thanks having straigthened this out for me. NordhornerII (talk)I am not a number! I am a Nordhorner. 19:12, 8 May 2014 (UTC)

This Month in GLAM: April 2014[edit]

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QSM[edit]

Gotchya!

Thanks for your contribution, yesterday. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 19:21, 11 May 2014 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for May 18[edit]

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Could use your help for an article I'm working on[edit]

Andy Mabbett referred me to you. In working on Judah Benjamin, I've set forth a section on the basis of Southern foreign policy, i.e. King Cotton, although Benjamin was never the most enthusiastic supporter of same. I need material to write a couple of well-chosen paragraphs on how it was that Britain's policy to avoid recognition and so forth had public support, even at the price (let's face it) of people's lives in the Cotton famine. I'd be grateful for your help on a few sources. I can email you if it would be helpful to send attachments.--Wehwalt (talk) 17:03, 18 May 2014 (UTC)

Glad to help if I can- I will find what I have . Some of the refs were included in Lancashire Cotton Famine and other basic ones are on User:ClemRutter/Citations. There is a well known schoolbook myth= that the cotton workers on SE Lancashire happily endured starvation to support their black brothers- but checking the sources reveal a) a more complex story b) few if any modern reliable references but even this I need to check.
Send me an email and I see I can be more precise. No promises.-- Clem Rutter (talk) 22:11, 18 May 2014 (UTC)

Images[edit]

You might enjoy browsing through these. I have added some as external links. J3Mrs (talk) 08:05, 21 May 2014 (UTC)

I don't know what to say! 130 images and each one contains enough information for several evenings of editing. Some will become a new article - and maybe two or more. -- Clem Rutter (talk) 18:53, 21 May 2014 (UTC)

VisualEditor newsletter—May 2014[edit]

VisualEditor-logo.svg

Did you know?

VisualEditor - Editing References - Cite Pulldown.png

The cite menu offers quick access to up to five citation templates.  If your wiki has enabled the "Cite" menu, press "Cite" and select the appropriate template from the menu.

Existing citations that use these templates can be edited either using the "Cite" tool or by selecting the reference and choosing the "Basic" item in the "Insert" menu.

Read the user guide for more information.

Since the last newsletter, the VisualEditor team has mostly worked on the new citation tool, improving performance, reducing technical debt, and other infrastructure needs.

The biggest change in the last few weeks is the new citation template menu, labeled "Cite". The new citation menu offers a locally configurable list of citation templates on the main toolbar. It adds or opens references using the simplified template dialog that was deployed last month. This tool is in addition to the "Basic" item in the "Insert" menu, and it is not displayed unless it has been configured for that wiki. To enable this tool on your wiki, see the instructions at VisualEditor/Citation tool.

Eventually, the VisualEditor team plans to add autofill features for these citations. When this long-awaited feature is created, you could add an ISBN, URL, DOI or other identifier to the citation tool, and VisualEditor would automatically fill in as much information for that source as possible. The concept drawings can be seen at mw:VisualEditor/Design/Reference Dialog, and your ideas about making referencing quick and easy are still wanted.

  • There is a new Beta Feature for setting content language and direction.  This allows editors who have opted in to use the "Language" tool in the "Insert" menu to add HTML span tags that label text with the language and as being left-to-right (LTR) or right-to-left (RTL), like this:  <span lang="en" dir="ltr">English</span>. This tool is most useful for pages whose text combines multiple languages with different directions, common on Right-to-Left wikis.
  • The tool for editing mathematics formulae in VisualEditor has been slightly updated and is now available to all users, as the "Formula" item in the "Insert" menu. It uses LaTeX like in the wikitext editor.
  • The layout of template dialogs has been changed, putting the label above the field.  Parameters are now called "fields", to avoid a technical term that many editors are unfamiliar with.
  • TemplateData has been expanded:  You can now add "suggested" parameters in TemplateData, and VisualEditor will display them in the template dialogs like required ones.  "Suggested" is recommended for parameters that are commonly used, but not actually required to make the template work.  There is also a new type for TemplateData parameters: wiki-file-name, for file names.  The template tool can now tell you if a parameter is marked as being obsolete.
  • Some templates that previously displayed strangely due to absolute CSS positioning hacks should now display correctly.
  • Several messages have changed: The notices shown when you save a page have been merged into those used in the wikitext editor, for consistency.  The message shown when you "<visualeditor-toolbar-cancel>" out of an edit is clearer. The beta dialog notice, which is shown the first time you open VisualEditor, will be hidden for logged-in users via a user preference rather than a cookie.  As a result of this change, the beta notice will show up one last time for all logged-in users on their next VisualEditor use after Thursday's upgrade.
  • Adding a category that is a redirect to another category prompts you to add the target category instead of the redirect.
  • In the "Media" dialog, it is no longer possible to set a redundant border for thumbnail and framed images.
  • There is a new Template Documentation Editor for TemplateData.  You can test it by editing a documentation subpage (not a template page) at Mediawiki.org: edit mw:Template:Sandbox/doc, and then click "Manage template documentation" above the wikitext edit box.  If your community would like to use this TemplateData editor at your project, please contact product manager James Forrester or file an enhancement request in Bugzilla.
  • There have been multiple small changes to the appearance:  External links are shown in the same light blue color as in MediaWiki.  This is a lighter shade of blue than the internal links.  The styling of the "Style text" (character formatting) drop-down menu has been synchronized with the recent font changes to the Vector skin.  VisualEditor dialogs, such as the "Save page" dialog, now use a "loading" animation of moving lines, rather than animated GIF images.  Other changes were made to the appearance upon opening a page in VisualEditor which should make the transition between reading and editing be smoother.
  • The developers merged in many minor fixes and improvements to MediaWiki interface integration (e.g., edit notices), and made VisualEditor handle Education Program pages better.
  • At the request of the community, VisualEditor has been deployed to Commons as an opt-in. It is currently available by default for 161 Wikipedia language editions and by opt-in through Beta Features at all others, as well as on several non-Wikipedia sites.

Looking ahead:  The toolbar from the PageTriage extension will no longer be visible inside VisualEditor. More buttons and icons will be accessible from the keyboard.  The "Keyboard shortcuts" link will be moved out of the "Page options" menu, into the "Help" menu. Support for upright image sizes (preferred for accessibility) and inline images is being developed. You will be able to see the Table of Contents while editing. Looking further out, the developers are also working on support for viewing and editing hidden HTML comments. VisualEditor will be available to all users on mobile devices and tablet computers. It will be possible to upload images to Commons from inside VisualEditor.

If you have questions or suggestions for future improvements, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting a note at mw:VisualEditor/Feedback or by joining the office hours on Thursday, 19 June 2014 at 10:00 UTC. If you'd like to get this newsletter on your own page (about once a month), please subscribe at w:en:Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Newsletter for English Wikipedia only or at meta:VisualEditor/Newsletter for any project. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) 22:16, 21 May 2014 (UTC)

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Disambiguation link notification for June 1[edit]

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Steaming process in Lancashire cotton mills[edit]

Can you identify a suitable photograph (or photographs) for Steaming process in Lancashire cotton mills, please? Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 14:04, 3 June 2014 (UTC)

Short answer no. My sources don't mention steaming as such just 'regulating humidity'. (Naismith 1895 Recent Cotton Mill construction, pp 84-104) discusses Heating, Ventilation and Humidity. Discussion always refers to injecting water vapour into the room- not releasing steam directly. They have a device called the Drosophore to do the work- or more to the point 'a device made by Mr Pye of Blackburn' that may be the culprit. illus 42-43, p 98-99. I would want to research this further before being definitive.
  • Roger Pye of Blackburn 8819c.JPG
  • Roger Pye of Blackburn 8820.JPG

Also a Lofthouse device. I suspect that there are excellent illustrations in the copies of the Textile Mercury locked in the QSM library -- Clem Rutter (talk) 18:50, 3 June 2014 (UTC)

Misleading reference[edit]

National Building Register:63764: [Mill 1] used in List of mills in Wakefield is not an English Heritage website. The template you have used is misleading as the information is published by Yorkshire Industrial Heritage. Can you correct it? J3Mrs (talk) 16:45, 7 June 2014 (UTC)

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This Month in GLAM: May 2014[edit]

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Headlines
  • Netherlands report: Libraries; Wikidata & DBpedia; Wikipedians in Residence; Open Culture Data
  • Norway report: 2 x GLAM edit-a-thons
  • Sweden report: Award, competitions and Coat of Arms
  • UK report: No trouble at t'mill; Assisting Metropolitan Police with image licensing enquiries; Wikimania is coming
  • USA report: New Edit-a-thons; GLAM at Wikiconference USA; Activities in New York City
  • Open Access report: WikiProject Open Access launched on the English Wikisource
  • Calendar: June's GLAM events
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Subscribe/Unsubscribe · Global message delivery · Romaine 00:28, 11 June 2014 (UTC)

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June 2014[edit]

Hello, I'm BracketBot. I have automatically detected that your edit to Thomas Hewes may have broken the syntax by modifying 1 "[]"s. If you have, don't worry: just edit the page again to fix it. If I misunderstood what happened, or if you have any questions, you can leave a message on my operator's talk page.

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  • He installed the [[Boulton and Watt]] steam engine and associated millwork in [[McConnel & Kennedy Mills|[McConnel and Kennedy's]] Old Mill, [[Ancoats]] in 1797.

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VisualEditor global newsletter—June 2014[edit]

VisualEditor-logo.svg
The character formatting menu

Did you know?

The character formatting menu, or "Style text" menu lets you set bold, italic, and other text styles. "Clear formatting" removes all text styles and removes links to other pages.

Do you think that clear formatting should remove links? Are there changes you would like to see for this menu? Share your opinion at MediaWiki.org.

The user guide has information about how to use VisualEditor.

The VisualEditor team is mostly working to fix bugs, improve performance, reduce technical debt, and other infrastructure needs. You can find on Mediawiki.org weekly updates detailing recent work.

  • They have moved the "Keyboard shortcuts" link out of the "Page options" menu, into the "Help" menu. Within dialog boxes, buttons are now more accessible (via the Tab key) from the keyboard.
  • You can now see the target of the link when you click on it, without having to open the inspector.
  • The team also expanded TemplateData: You can now add a parameter type  "date" for dates and times in the ISO 8601 format, and  "boolean" for values which are true or false. Also, templates that redirect to other templates (like {{citeweb}}{{cite web}}) now get the TemplateData of their target (bug 50964). You can test TemplateData by editing mw:Template:Sandbox/doc.
  • Category: and File: pages now display their contents correctly after saving an edit (bug 65349, bug 64239)
  • They have also improved reference editing: You should no longer be able to add empty citations with VisualEditor (bug 64715), as with references. When you edit a reference, you can now empty it and click the "use an existing reference" button to replace it with another reference instead. 
  • It is now possible to edit inline images with VisualEditor. Remember that inline images cannot display captions, so existing captions get removed. Many other bugs related to images were also fixed.
  • You can now add and edit {{DISPLAYTITLE}} and __DISAMBIG__ in the "Page options" menu, rounding out the full set of page options currently planned.
  • The tool to insert special characters is now wider and simpler.

Looking ahead[edit]

The VisualEditor team has posted a draft of their goals for the next fiscal year. You can read them and suggest changes on MediaWiki.org.

The team posts details about planned work on VisualEditor's roadmap. You will soon be able to drag-and-drop text as well as images. If you drag an image to a new place, it won't let you place it in the middle of a paragraph. All dialog boxes and windows will be simplified based on user testing and feedback. The VisualEditor team plans to add autofill features for citations. Your ideas about making referencing quick and easy are still wanted. Support for upright image sizes is being developed. The designers are also working on support for viewing and editing hidden HTML comments and adding rows and columns to tables.

Supporting your wiki[edit]

Please read VisualEditor/Citation tool for information on configuring the new citation template menu, labeled "Cite". This menu will not appear unless it has been configured on your wiki.

If you speak a language other than English, we need your help with translating the user guide. The guide is out of date or incomplete for many languages, and what's on your wiki may not be the most recent translation. Please contact me if you need help getting started with translation work on MediaWiki.org.

VisualEditor can be made available to most non-Wikipedia projects. If your community would like to test VisualEditor, please contact product manager James Forrester or file an enhancement request in Bugzilla.

Please share your questions, suggestions, or problems by posting a note at mw:VisualEditor/Feedback or by joining the office hours on Saturday, 19 July 2014 at 21:00 UTC (daytime for the Americas and Pacific Islands) or on Thursday, 14 August 2014 at 9:00 UTC (daytime for Europe, Middle East, Asia).

To change your subscription to this newsletter, please see the subscription pages on Meta or the English Wikipedia. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 04:59, 25 June 2014 (UTC)

This Month in GLAM: June 2014[edit]

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Headlines
  • Belgium report: Bouchout Declaration on Open Access to Biodiversity data; Virtual collaboration in the government
  • France report: Round table in Brussels; Video at Sèvres; 70th anniversary of the D-Day
  • Germany report: Exhibition photography
  • Mexico report: Edit-a-thon of Museo Soumaya; simulthaneous edit-a-thon in Argentina, Mexico and Spain about Spanish Exile; new cultural partner of Wikimedia México
  • Netherlands report: Music edit-a-thon; Library workshops; Videos, maps and Japanese art donations; Wiki Loves Earth
  • Sweden report: Wiki Loves Monuments is being prepared for Sweden
  • UK report: Free Culture; Image releases
  • USA report: A GLAM Day Out! in Philadelphia; Local History at the Local Library
  • Wikimania report: GLAM presentations at Wikimania
  • Open Access report: Open biodiversity data; Automated import of scholarly journal articles into Wikisource
  • Calendar: July's GLAM events
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Subscribe/Unsubscribe · Global message delivery · Romaine 22:46, 9 July 2014 (UTC)

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Barnstar[edit]

Photographer Barnstar.png The Photographer's Barnstar
The Historian magazine used one of your photos in their summer edition. Congratulations on a fine photo. Richard Nevell (WMUK) (talk) 13:23, 1 August 2014 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for August 4[edit]

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Textile printing
added links pointing to Preston, Jouy, Calico and Lancaster

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VisualEditor newsletter—July and August 2014[edit]

VisualEditor-logo.svg

The VisualEditor team is currently working mostly to fix bugs, improve performance, reduce technical debt, and other infrastructure needs. You can find on Mediawiki.org weekly updates detailing recent work.

Screenshot of VisualEditor's link tool
Dialog boxes in VisualEditor have been re-designed to use action words instead of icons. This has increased the number of items that need to be translated. The user guide is also being updated.

The biggest visible change since the last newsletter was to the dialog boxes. The design for each dialog box and window was simplified. The most commonly needed buttons are now at the top. Based on user feedback, the buttons are now labeled with simple words (like "Cancel" or "Done") instead of potentially confusing icons (like "<" or "X"). Many of the buttons to edit links, images, and other items now also show the linked page, image name, or other useful information when you click on them.

  • Hidden HTML comments (notes visible to editors, but not to readers) can now be read, edited, inserted, and removed. A small icon (a white exclamation mark on a dot) marks the location of each comments. You can click on the icon to see the comment.
  • You can now drag and drop text and templates as well as images. A new placement line makes it much easier to see where you are dropping the item. Images can no longer be dropped into the middle of paragraphs.
  • All references and footnotes (<ref> tags) are now made through the "Cite" menu, including the "Basic" (manual formatting) footnotes and the ability to re-use an existing citation, both of which were previously accessible only through the "Insert" menu. The "<visualeditor-dialogbutton-referencelist-tooltip>" is still added via the "Insert" menu.
  • When you add an image or other media file, you are now prompted to add an image caption immediately. You can also replace an image whilst keeping the original caption and other settings.
  • All tablet users visiting the mobile web version of Wikipedias will be able to opt-in to a version of VisualEditor from 14 August. You can test the new tool by choosing the beta version of the mobile view in the Settings menu.
  • The link tool has a new "Open" button that will open a linked page in another tab so you can make sure a link is the right one.
  • The "Cancel" button in the toolbar has been removed based on user testing. To cancel any edit, you can leave the page by clicking the Read tab, the back button in your browser, or closing the browser window without saving your changes.

Looking ahead[edit]

The team posts details about planned work on the VisualEditor roadmap. The VisualEditor team plans to add auto-fill features for citations soon. Your ideas about making referencing quick and easy are still wanted. Support for upright image sizes is being developed. The designers are also working on support for adding rows and columns to tables. Work to support Internet Explorer is ongoing.

Feedback opportunities[edit]

The Editing team will be making two presentations this weekend at Wikimania in London. The first is with product manager James Forrester and developer Trevor Parscal on Saturday at 16:30. The second is with developers Roan Kattouw and Trevor Parscal on Sunday at 12:30.

Please share your questions, suggestions, or problems by posting a note at the VisualEditor feedback page or by joining the office hours discussion on Thursday, 14 August 2014 at 09:00 UTC (daytime for Europe, Middle East and Asia) or on Thursday, 18 September 2014 at 16:00 UTC (daytime for the Americas; evening for Europe).

If you'd like to get this newsletter on your own page (about once a month), please subscribe at w:en:Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Newsletter for English Wikipedia only or at Meta for any project. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 18:13, 8 August 2014 (UTC)

This Month in GLAM: July 2014[edit]

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Headlines
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Subscribe/Unsubscribe · Global message delivery · Romaine 21:17, 13 August 2014 (UTC)

This Month in GLAM: August 2014[edit]

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Headlines
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Subscribe/Unsubscribe · Global message delivery · Romaine 13:16, 12 September 2014 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for September 15[edit]

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Judges' Lodgings references[edit]

Hi Clem. Can you help with the references please. I was trying to tidy up the references by adding some ISBN links. The edits ended up adding duplicate references numbers. What did I get wrong? Thanks

5istanbul (talk) 17:35, 20 September 2014 (UTC)

  1. ^ http://www.livescience.com/40227-bronze-age-sundial-grave.html


Cite error: There are <ref group=Mill> tags on this page, but the references will not show without a {{reflist|group=Mill}} template (see the help page).