Wikipedia:In the news/Candidates

This page provides a place to discuss new items for inclusion on In the news (ITN), a protected template on the Main Page (see past items in the ITN archives). Do not report errors in ITN items that are already on the Main Page here— discuss those at the relevant section of WP:ERRORS.

This candidates page is integrated with the daily pages of Portal:Current events. A light green header appears under each daily section - it includes transcluded Portal:Current events items for that day. You can discuss ITN candidates under the header.

Ebrahim Raisi A helicopter crash near Varzaqan, Iran, kills eight people, including President Ebrahim Raisi (pictured) and Foreign Minister Hossein Amir-Abdollahian. In boxing, Oleksandr Usyk defeats Tyson Fury to become the first undisputed heavyweight champion in twenty-four years. Protests over voting rights changes break out in the French territory of New Caledonia. Lee Hsien Loong steps down after nearly twenty years as Prime Minister of Singapore, and is succeeded by Lawrence Wong. Ongoing: Israel–Hamas war timeline Russian invasion of Ukraine timeline War in Sudan timeline Recent deaths: John Koerner Pat Buckley Katherine Porter Dabney Coleman Darren Dutchyshen Diane Deans view — page history — related changes — edit

Glossary Blurbs are one-sentence summaries of the news story. Altblurbs, labelled alt1, alt2, etc., are alternative suggestions to cover the same story. A target article, bolded in text, is the focus of the story. Each blurb must have at least one such article, but you may also link non-target articles. Articles in the Ongoing line describe events getting continuous coverage. The Recent deaths (RD) line includes any living thing whose death was recently announced. Consensus may decide to create a blurb for a recent death. All articles linked in the ITN template must pass our standards of review. They should be up-to-date, demonstrate relevance via good sourcing and have at least an acceptable quality. Nomination steps Make sure the item you want to nominate has an article that meets our minimum requirements and contains reliable coverage of a current event you want to create a blurb about. We will not post about events described in an article that fails our quality standards. Find the correct section below for the date of the event (not the date nominated). Do not add sections for new dates manually - a bot does that for us each day at midnight (UTC). Create a level 4 header with the article name (==== Your article here ====). Add (RD) or (Ongoing) if appropriate. Then paste the {{ITN candidate}} template with its parameters and fill them in. The news source should be reliable, support your nomination and be in the article. Write your blurb in simple present tense. Below the template, briefly explain why we should post that event. After that, save your edit. Your nomination is ready! You may add {{ITN note}} to the target article's talk page to let editors know about your nomination. The better your article's quality, the better it covers the event and the wider its perceived significance (see WP:ITNSIGNIF for details), the better your chances of getting the blurb posted. Headers When the article is ready, updated and there is consensus to post, you can mark the item as (Ready). Remove that wording if you feel the article fails any of these necessary criteria. Admins should always separately verify whether these criteria are met before posting blurbs marked (Ready). For more guidance, check WP:ITN/A. If satisfied, change the header to (Posted). Where there is no consensus, or the article's quality remains poor, change the header to (Closed) or (Not posted). Sometimes, editors ask to retract an already-posted nomination because of a fundamental error or because consensus changed. If you feel the community supports this, remove the item and mark the item as (Pulled). Voicing an opinion on an item Format your comment to contain "support" or "oppose", and include a rationale for your choice. In particular, address the notability of the event, the quality of the article, and whether it has been updated. Please do... Pick an older item to review near the bottom of this page, before the eligibility runs out and the item scrolls off the page and gets abandoned in the archive, unused and forgotten. Review an item even if it has already been reviewed by another user. You may be the first to spot a problem, or the first to confirm that an identified problem was fixed. Piling on the list of "support!" votes will help administrators see what is ready to be posted on the Main Page. Tell about problems in articles if you see them. Be bold and fix them yourself if you know how, or tell others if it's not possible. Please do not... Add simple "support!" or "oppose!" votes without including your reasons. Similarly, curt replies such as "who?", "meh", or "duh!" are not helpful. A vote without reasoning means little for us, please elaborate yourself. Oppose an item just because the event is only relating to a single country, or failing to relate to one. We post a lot of such content, so these comments are generally unproductive. Accuse other editors of supporting, opposing or nominating due to a personal bias (such as ethnocentrism). We at ITN do not handle conflicts of interest. Comment on a story without first reading the relevant article(s). Oppose a recurring item here because you disagree with the recurring items criteria. Discuss them here. Use ITN as a forum for your own political or personal beliefs. Such comments are irrelevant to the outcome and are potentially disruptive. Suggesting updates There are two places where you can request corrections to posted items: Anything that does not change the intent of the blurb (spelling, grammar, markup issues, updating death tolls etc.) should be discussed at WP:Errors. Discuss major changes in the blurb's intent or very complex updates as part of the current ITNC nomination.

February 15

Portal:Current events/2023 February 15

February 15, 2023 (2023-02-15) (Wednesday) Business and economy World Bank President David Malpass announces he will resign by the end of June. (AFP via RFI) The FTSE 100 Index, the main share index of the 100 most highly capitalized companies listed on the London Stock Exchange, ends its trading day at a record value of 8,003.65 points, surpassing the previous record value of 7,906.58 points recorded on February 3, 2023. (AFP via Deccan Herald) Disasters and accidents Gualaca bus crash At least 39 migrants are killed in Gualaca District, Chiriquí Province, Panama, when their bus, heading to the United States, falls off a cliff. (Reuters) 2022–23 South Pacific cyclone season Five people are killed by Cyclone Gabrielle in New Zealand. (AFP via RTÉ) Eleven people are killed and 73 others are missing and presumed dead after a boat carrying migrants sinks off the Libyan coast. (BBC News) At least 10 people are killed by avalanches in Tajikistan. (RFE/RL) Two people are killed after a Sikorsky UH-60 Black Hawk helicopter crashes in Madison County, Alabama, United States. (AP) International relations A United Nations report says that former Egyptian Army colonel Saif al-Adel has become the new leader of Islamic terrorist group al-Qaeda and is currently residing in Iran (AFP via France 24) Law and crime 2022 Buffalo shooting Payton Gendron receives ten life sentences without the possibility of parole for the mass shooting at a supermarket in Buffalo, New York, which killed ten people. (NBC News) One person is killed and three others injured after a mass shooting in a shopping mall in El Paso, Texas, United States. (Reuters) An investigation by a consortium of journalists uncovers a major disinformation campaign by an Israeli firm named Team Jorge, led by ex-Israeli special forces member Tal Hanan, which is alleged to have influenced more than 30 elections in several countries. (The Guardian) Politics and elections Nicola Sturgeon announces that she is resigning as First Minister of Scotland and Leader of the Scottish National Party once a new leader is elected. (The Washington Post) Kazakh President Kassym-Jomart Tokayev signs a law annulling many privileges of his predecessor Nursultan Nazarbayev, including lifetime financial support from the state, and the right to address the nation and propose ideas to officials, and also deprives Nazarbayev's immediate family of legal immunity. (RFE/RL)

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February 14

Portal:Current events/2023 February 14

February 14, 2023 (2023-02-14) (Tuesday) Armed conflicts and attacks High-altitude object events in 2023 2023 Romania and Moldova high-altitude objects The Romanian Air Force unsuccessfully attempts to intercept an unidentified flying object detected roughly 11,000 metres (6.8 mi) above southeastern Romania. (Reuters) Moldova temporarily closes its airspace after receiving reports of a "balloon-like object". (Reuters) 2022 Russian invasion of Ukraine Battle of Bakhmut Ukrainian forces blow up a bridge located between Bakhmut and Kostiantynivka as Russian troops and Wagner Group fighters advance on the city. (The Guardian) Syrian civil war Iranian involvement in the Syrian civil war United States Central Command says U.S. forces have shot down an Iranian UAV near a patrol base and oil field in Deir ez-Zor Governorate, Syria. (Newsweek) Insurgency in Khyber Pakhtunkhwa Three Pakistani Taliban members are killed by fellow militants who were trying to free them while being transported from Miranshah to Bannu, Pakistan by counter-terrorism officers. Four of the attackers are also killed in the ensuing shootout. (Tribune) Disasters and accidents 2022–23 South Pacific cyclone season A national state of emergency is declared in New Zealand for only the third time in the country's history as Cyclone Gabrielle affects the country. (AFP via RFI) (Al Jazeera) Twenty people are killed and 68 others injured in a head-on collision between a tour bus and an armoured cash-in-transit van in Makhado, Limpopo, South Africa. (BBC News) International relations China–Philippines relations Territorial disputes in the South China Sea Philippine president Bongbong Marcos summons Chinese ambassador Huang Xilian following a China Coast Guard vessel's alleged use of a laser weapon on a Philippine ship in the South China Sea. (The Guardian) Law and crime Phase-out of fossil fuel vehicles The European Parliament formally approves a law to ban the sale of new petrol and diesel vehicles in the European Union from 2035, citing the need to combat climate change in Europe and promote electric vehicles. (Reuters) Sri Lanka announces a ban on disposable cutlery, cocktail shakers, and artificial plants beginning in June, citing the risk of plastic pollution on its wildlife. (AFP via RFI) Politics and elections 2024 United States elections 2024 United States presidential election 2024 Republican Party presidential primaries Nikki Haley 2024 presidential campaign Former Governor of South Carolina and United States ambassador to the United Nations Nikki Haley officially announces her run for president in the upcoming 2024 election. She is the first major Republican challenger to former president Donald Trump. (CNN) 2024 United States Senate elections California senator Dianne Feinstein announces that she will not seek re-election in 2024 after thirty years in office. (Reuters)

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Toxic spill in Ohio, U.S.

Article: 2023 Ohio train derailment (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Large amounts of toxic chemicals are released from a train derailment in East Palestine, Ohio, leading to evacuations and health concerns in the town. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ A mass cleanup and evacuation occurs in East Palestine, Ohio, as health concerns erupt following the nearby derailment of a train that released large amounts of hazardous chemicals.
Alternative blurb II: ​ A train derails in East Palestine, Ohio, releasing hazardous chemicals that have caused evacuations, a massive cleanup, and health effects amongst nearby populations.
Alternative blurb III: ​ Residents in and near East Palestine, Ohio experience major health issues following the derailment of a train carrying hazardous chemicals nearby
Alternative blurb IV: ​ A controlled burn occurs in East Palestine, Ohio to combat the release of hazardous chemicals by a nearby train derailment, leading to further health and enviornmental concerns around the incident.
News source(s): NPR, ABC WaPo NYT CNN
Credits:

• Nominated by Knightoftheswords281 (talk · give credit)

Nominator's comments: This event was nominated twice before, and wasn't posted because in the first instance, people argued that it "was not important," and in the second instance, alleged that it was "stale." Both of these arguments are IMHO not true. This is a major even in the news, and even if the accident occured more than a week ago, the mass evacuations, release of toxic chemicals, investigations, and reactions/controversy over this are far from over, not to mention the possible natural disaster this can cause. Crusader1096 (message) 15:55, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

Support as nominator Crusader1096 (message) 15:56, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support Bizarrely, this derailment got little MSM attention when it happened, but it's getting more now. This is an even bigger story than the media is suggesting with significant long-term impact for the people in that area, and possibly with bigger spread than we expect. Posting this is a good way to overcome the bias of underreported stories. – Muboshgu (talk) 16:02, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

  Support per above Editor 5426387 (talk) 03:01, 15 February 2023 (UTC)

• Needs work (edit conflict) The nomination first cited sources from 10 days ago (now changed to 5 sources from Feb 12–14) and the identity of the nominator is confusing (synapticrelay/Knightoftheswords281/Crusader 1096?). There does seem to be fresh coverage such as What We Know About the Train Derailment in Ohio but this needs presenting more clearly so that we understand what's in the news now. Andrew🐉(talk) 16:13, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

  Fixed Crusader1096 (message) 23:39, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

Oppose If a story broke over a week ago, it can't be nominated unless something else occurs later on that is blurbable. Unfortunately, this is what we define as stale. Noah^Talk 16:12, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

The controlled burn was on the 6th, and that would arguably be just as blurbable. I think this feels like an ongoing, but the events have already been slowing down. GreatCaesarsGhost 16:21, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

That was also over a week ago now, which would also be stale. The time to blurb this was missed. Noah^Talk 16:38, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose as stale Story is not recent; derailment happened on February 3, the oldest current blurb in the template, the Chinese balloon that was shot down on February 4, is newer, so there's no place to post this. --Jayron32 16:14, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

  The news coverage has been a slow burn (pun intended) and I think WP:IAR applies here. – Muboshgu (talk) 16:23, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support - This is a textbook ongoing item.--⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 16:35, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose as Stale and on Notability. Even if this item is judged not to be stale, the impacts here are questionable at best. The article does not properly explain how many people were displaced and only suggests the evacuation orders were in place for a few days. The section on potential health impacts almost exclusively contains speculative and alleged items without any proper support. DarkSide830 (talk) 16:48, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

  Notability? According to this op-ed, people as far as 30 miles away have experienced symptoms of nausea, headache, teeth pain, vomiting, diarrhea, sinus congestion, and shortness of breath. People well outside the evacuation zone have left their homes because the waterways are polluted with chemical smells and dead fish. Also there have been a growing number of reports about people experiencing a burning sensation in their eyes, animals falling ill and a strong odor lingering in the town. – Muboshgu (talk) 18:10, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

  True or not, I don't see this substantiated in the target article, which again, I will note, seems to be mostly speculating. DarkSide830 (talk) 20:00, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support - Important incident that hadn't caught traction because the media and US gov have been ignoring it, but the forced control burning of hydrogen chloride will have devastating environmental consequences. If the Chinese spy balloons are worthy of a blurb, then this certainly is as well. Rockin (talk) (contribs) 16:49, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose as stale. The derailment occurred on February 3, so the topic should be listed in the subsection for that date. However, that date is more than a week ago, so there is no subsection on this page for that event. As such, this should be declined as stale. — Red-tailed hawk _(nest) 16:53, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• I would Support a blurb that represents the current state if issue (the massive cleanup, the residents being allowed back), which are aspects as a result if the derailment. The derailment itself was not as deadly as the stuff that potentially leaked. --Masem (t) 16:59, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• IAR support. The impacts of this incident, including environmental, legal, and health impacts, seem considerable, more than enough to meet our threshold. There is a Catch-22 with the timing on stories like this one; there is opposition to posting them as soon as they occur because their impact isn't fully known and so they don't receive much coverage; and there is opposition to posting them when they do receive coverage, because it's been long enough that they are "stale". I think that's silly; the story is significant, the article is decent, it's currently in the news, so we should post it. FWIW, we do explicitly allow for this situation with RDs, so it's not much of an IAR. Vanamonde (Talk) 17:03, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• IAR Support - The news about this has been released mysteriously slowly, and while in general I think our requirement for recency is important, I believe this case is unusual. This is a very serious environmental disaster, with widespread effects. GenevieveDEon (talk) 17:09, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

  There's nothing mysterious about the world press not running with news from a midwestern town of under 5,000 people. As a lawsuit mentioned in the article requests, the radius to determine if health effects even exist should be 30 miles. I could walk that, and I barely even walk anymore. InedibleHulk (talk) 01:59, 15 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose as stale. Yes more details have emerged, but fundamentally the event is older than the oldest blurb currently in ITN. The ongoing cleanup effort isn't suitable for a blurb (or ongoing), and it appears there have been no casualties. I'm not convinced this would be significant enough even if it had happened today - but that's completely moot for an event that is 11 days old. Modest Genius ^talk 17:13, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

  Also, the section heading is silly, sensationalist, and not supported by the article. Modest Genius ^talk 17:51, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support This is finally starting to get the RS coverage it deserves. We have a good article and it's in the news, and those are the requirements. Davey2116 (talk) 17:49, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

  They're not the only requirements. Quoting WP:ITN: "Any event that is older than the oldest entry in the current "In the News" box is considered stale. ... For purposes of determining timing and staleness, the date is considered when the event was first reported in reliable sources." That was on 3 Feb. Modest Genius ^talk 17:54, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

  Although I agree that is what the ITN page clearly states, we certainly aren't forced to adhere to rules if it serves encyclopedic interests. ⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 17:59, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support The article is in good shape, and many news sources are now covering it. 2607:9880:2D28:16:3D79:1744:D47C:52D5 (talk) 18:00, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose In addition to being stale, there are no deaths. What this comes down to is a bog-standard environmental release - which frequently happens around the world. Nfitz (talk) 18:18, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support This article is fine, and from my perspective of non-US (Swedish) this was just picked up in media in the last day or two so fresh in terms of news reporting. --Chrill (talk) 22:06, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

Oppose per above Editor 5426387 (talk) 18:29, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support as original nominator, I would like to argue the case that it is an ongoing event; obviously the train derailed on Feb. 3 but 1. it has until recently been under-reported (dare I say in some ways deliberately, in light of the reporter's arrest) and 2. The actual event being reported on here, the toxic chemical release, is ongoing and notable. Synapticrelay (talk) 18:43, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

  I agree. How can we ignore this? I could not believe that it was negated when it was first nominated? It is on-going story, highlighting the safety issues that were brought up in the rail strike back in December, and the human collateral damage that has occurred as a result. Jinig (talk) 20:00, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

  It was negated not just once, but twice.

  Also be sure to !vote if you want this to be nominated. Crusader1096 (message) 23:52, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

• Question/comment If this would not be blurbed (as the derailment occurred nearly 2 weeks ago), could this be considered to be posted as an ongoing news item instead? Vida0007 (talk) 18:56, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support I would argue this is akin to an RD in which the person dies but it is not significantly reported in the media until later. Kafoxe (talk) 19:06, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

  Remember, a person dying makes the same level of coverage more significant here, per WP:MINIMUMDEATHS. InedibleHulk (talk) 22:38, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose The concrete events are stale. Nausea, headache, teeth pain, vomiting, diarrhea, sinus congestion and shortness of breath, while psychologically irritating, are part of daily life. Strange smells and lethargic animals are a bit less common, but nothing compared to three UFOs. InedibleHulk (talk) 21:14, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose I have no seen authoritative sources mirroring the blurbs that say that this is the most dangerous/important/major environmental disaster of this type in the us. There seems to have been no deaths, therefore, and based o nthe recent dominance of really minor american news on this board, i vote to oppose this. this americano-centrism/US-defaultism needs to stop 5.44.170.26 (talk) 22:23, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

  Why does it have to be the most dangerous environmental disaster in the U.S. to be notable?--⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 23:09, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

• This is more of an ongoing event, and I would support it if this event was nominated that way. I tried to support this as a blurb some days ago before until I realized it is stale for ITN blurb. MarioJump83 (talk) 23:12, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support - Should not be regarded as stale, event is still ongoing and deserves more attention. As of today, severity of the environmental impacts is way more significant than the severity of train derailment itself. Whilst a freight derailment isn't exactly world headlines, one incident where it causes biohazardous, wide-spread water, air and ground contamination certainly is. Fengshuo2004 (talk) 23:13, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support I don't think it is stale, and it's a lot more based in reality than the superstition and pseudoscience surrounding the UFOs so far. Additionally the article and sources are in much better shape and are of use to those who are learning about the subject for the first time. Ludicrous (talk) 23:45, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• Question Can any of the alblurbs say which toxic/hazardous chemicals are feared to potentially have which effects on this town? InedibleHulk (talk) 00:00, 15 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support - I don't think it's stale at all, and if you Google "ohio train derailment" you'd see most of the news articles from big companies (at least at the time I'm writing this) were made within the past day. The only thing I would suggest slightly changing is the blurb, maybe something like...
• A freight train containing hazardous chemicals derails and explodes in East Palestine, Ohio, causing an evacuation of residents due to health concerns.

^^^^ or something along those lines phrogge 'sup? edits 02:50, 15 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support Event is not stale, still ongoing/developing with articles still being written hourly it seems. The environmental effects are significant with long term effects for the people in the area. Maxorca (talk) 03:43, 15 February 2023 (UTC)

(Posted) Cyclone Gabrielle

Article: Cyclone Gabrielle (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Cyclone Gabrielle causes widespread damage and flooding across New Zealand. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ New Zealand Prime Minister Chris Hipkins declares a national state of emergency, for only the third time in New Zealand history, over the impact of Cyclone Gabrielle.
Alternative blurb II: ​ A state of emergency has been declared in New Zealand after Cyclone Gabrielle causes widespread damage and flooding across the country.
News source(s): [1] [2]
Credits:

• Nominated by Turnagra (talk · give credit)
• Created by F (talk · give credit)
• Updated by HurricaneEdgar (talk · give credit), Jason Rees (talk · give credit) and Maple Doctor (talk · give credit)

Nominator's comments: One of the most damaging cyclones to hit New Zealand in living memory, with damage across most of the North Island and parts of the South. Also historic for the declaration of a national state of emergency, with the only other times being the 2019 terrorist attack and the early days of the Covid-19 pandemic. Have proposed February 14 as this was when the state of emergency was declared, but effects were being felt from late on February 12 local time. Turnagra (talk) 05:45, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support Article is of good quality and subject is notable enough. The Kip (talk) 05:50, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• Comment it was the 2010-11 Canterbury earthquakes where a national state of emergency was declared, not the 2019 shootings. Maple Doctor (talk) 06:49, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support Article looks good, story is being covered by news in a way that indicates this is a major story. Prefer initial blurb over altblurb as the altblurb is too wordy. --Jayron32 13:04, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support & Question Article looks good and it seems to be a pretty significant storm. As a question, have we put a gif as an image on the front page before for ITN? It's a good GIF; I just was unsure on what the previous precedence is. TartarTorte 14:20, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

  We have done gifs before, as long as they are prepared for a thumbnail-sized view Masem (t) 15:13, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

• Weak support original blurb. The article is in good shape, the state of emergency is unusual, and this is getting international media attention. However current reports show light damage (for a cyclone) and only one casualty, with the main effects being localised floods, power cuts and precautionary evacuations - hence only weak support. Modest Genius ^talk 14:25, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support - An incredibly unusual event, which would be sufficient to overcome the low death toll in terms of significance weighting. As a fellow New Zealander, thank you, Turnagra, for nominating this. --⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 14:29, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support though I would stick to the first blurb. Superlatives (3rd time in NZ history) are rather subject to the importance if the event and can be left out. --Masem (t) 15:15, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

Support per above. Crusader1096 (message) 15:34, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support with the first blurb. A national state of emergency is a big deal. GenevieveDEon (talk) 15:40, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• Vehement Wait. Just because an event is rare does not mean it is ITN worthy. I would presume this cyclone reaches notability after landfall, but assuming any lasting impact now outside of the trivia realm in regards to the state of emergency is clear CRYSTAL. DarkSide830 (talk) 16:38, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

  Sorry, not landfall. But point being made we should wait for a bit more impact here. The "3rd time x country has delclared a state of emergency" is trivia material. DarkSide830 (talk) 16:41, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

  My !vote is based on what we know now, which is the state of emergency, not measuring any future impacts. ⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 18:15, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support. The article is of sufficient quality for the main page and the topic is widely covered enough to warrant inclusion on the main page. — Red-tailed hawk _(nest) 16:54, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support. Article looks good to be blurbed, and this is quite significant considering that Gabrielle impacted NZ shortly after the 2023 North Island floods and this is the third time that a state of emergency was declared in NZ (and the first for a weather event). The original blurb looks better than the other, but I would suggest that another blurb should be made, something that goes like: A state of emergency has been declared in New Zealand after Cyclone Gabrielle causes widespread damage and flooding across the country. Vida0007 (talk) 19:02, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

Support This cyclone has been devastating to thousands, this should definitely be posted, Vriend1917 (talk) 19:16, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

• Posted Stephen 00:38, 15 February 2023 (UTC)

February 13

Portal:Current events/2023 February 13

February 13, 2023 (2023-02-13) (Monday) Disasters and accidents 2023 Turkey–Syria earthquake The death toll of the earthquake in Turkey and Syria surpasses 37,000. (Al Jazeera) At least twelve people are injured by an explosion at a construction site in Ottawa, Ontario, Canada. (CTV News Ottawa) Health and environment The Equatoguinean health ministry confirms an outbreak of the Marburg virus in the country, which has killed nine people within the last month. (AFP via ABS-CBN News) International relations Humanitarian response to the 2023 Turkey–Syria earthquake United Nations Secretary-General António Guterres agrees with Syrian president Bashar al-Assad to open two of the country's border crossings with Turkey for at least three months to permit access to humanitarian aid. (AFP via Manila Standard) Law and crime Blasphemy in Pakistan Lynching of Waris Police in Punjab, Pakistan, arrest 50 men for the lynching of a blasphemy suspect at a police station in Nankana Sahib District two days ago. (The Independent) Murder of Brigadier Nofriansyah Yosua Hutabarat Indonesian police general Ferdy Sambo is found guilty of killing his adjutant, Nofriansyah Yosua Hutabarat, and is sentenced to death. (Detik) 2023 Michigan State University shooting Three people are killed and five others injured in a mass shooting at Michigan State University in East Lansing, Michigan, United States. The shooter later commits suicide when approached by police. (CNN) Politics and elections Moldova–Russia relations 2023 Moldovan coup d'état plan President of Moldova Maia Sandu accuses the Russian government of planning a coup d'état attempt against her. (La Prensalatina)

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(Closed) 2023 Michigan State University shooting

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Article: 2023 Michigan State University shooting (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Three people are killed and five injured in a mass shooting on the campus of Michigan State University in East Lansing, Michigan. (Post)
News source(s): BBC
Credits:

• Nominated by Smackendorf (talk · give credit)
• Created by Knightoftheswords281 (talk · give credit)

 Smackendorf (talk) 14:59, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

• Beyond the injury that comes from having these stories continuously happen here in the States, there is the added insult of the rancorous discussion that results here on ITN/C from both sides whenever a mass shooting occurs. I wish that we could just blacklist these types of nominations forevermore since we seem incapable of handling it civilly here, but naturally, that is a fool's hope. Regardless, I for one will not tolerate any side-discussions that erupt into back-and-forth battles regarding the politics and prevalence of mass shootings in the U.S., and I will see to it that does not occur. --⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 15:03, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose - This doesn't rise to some of the (admittedly verbal) thresholds that we would normally see for mass shootings in the U.S. in terms of notability, even with all added extenuating circumstances such as being a shooting at a university, or one where the suspect remains at large. --⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 15:05, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose. Tragic for those affected, but mass shootings are sadly not unusual in the United States. If we posted in ITN every time three people were killed in a shooting that would be 15 blurbs already this year (per List of mass shootings in the United States in 2023) - and we're only 6 weeks in. Modest Genius ^talk 15:05, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose Most mass shootings in the US do not happen at a university, but while tragic the relatively low level of casualties means it does not meet the signifcance bar for me.-- Pawnkingthree (talk) 15:09, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose based in reports, appears to be a domestic, non terrorism related crime. Tragic, but we don't post such common domestic crimes. --Masem (t)•

Oppose Run of the mill mass shooting. Noah^Talk 15:10, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

Sad that we've reached the point where this can be a sentence. Crusader1096 (message) 15:29, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose I hate to sound callous, but three dead and five injured makes this comparatively minor in the grand scheme of US mass shootings. The Kip (talk) 15:27, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

Oppose as creator of article - Doesn't meet the 10+ death threshold or have a notable motive. Crusader1096 (message) 15:31, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose - Although I would say to Knightoftheswords281 that there is no minimum deaths criterion, nonetheless this is tragically a relatively commonplace event in the USA. GenevieveDEon (talk) 15:41, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

RD: Lalita Lajmi

Article: Lalita Lajmi (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Times of India
Credits:

• Nominated by Curbon7 (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Peejee123 (talk · give credit) and Jkaharper (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Indian painter. Close, just needs a little source work. Curbon7 (talk) 04:11, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

(Closed) Jakub Jankto

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Article: Jakub Jankto (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Czech professional footballer Jakub Jankto (pictured) becomes the first active senior international athlete in men's football to come out as gay. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ Czech professional footballer Jakub Jankto (pictured) comes out as gay, becoming the first active senior international athlete in men's football to do so.
News source(s): [3] [4]
Credits:

• Nominated by Oltrepier (talk · give credit)
• Created by Psychotic17 (talk · give credit)
• Updated by JellyfishReflector (talk · give credit), Profavi1 (talk · give credit) and Oltrepier (talk · give credit)

Nominator's comments: I think this bit of news is relevant not only because, generally speaking, very few people in men's football have come out publicly, but also because Jankto is arguably the highest-profile player to have ever done so while still being active, having already played in two of the "Top Five" leagues (Serie A and La Liga) and being a full international for the Czech Republic since 2017. Oltrepier (talk) 20:40, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Question As a comparison, did we post when Jason Collins or Carl Nassib came out? The Kip (talk) 20:47, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  @The Kip I've just checked it: Collins did got posted (only after an immensely long discussion, though), whereas Nassib did not make the cut. Oltrepier (talk) 21:06, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

Oppose important and also congrats man but I don't think that's for in the news 🍁🏳️‍🌈 DinoSoupCanada 🏳️‍🌈 🍁 (talk) 20:49, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose per previous consensus about athletes being the first in their sporting division to come out. Rockin (Talk) (Contribs) 20:55, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  @RockinJack18 Thank you for flagging that discussion, I wasn't aware of it at all.

  I'll just clarify that he's actually the first footballer actively involved in senior international football to come out, rather than in one specific division: I don't know if that would change anything, though... Oltrepier (talk) 21:20, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

Oppose Congrats to him, but I don’t believe that one semi-famous athlete coming out as a sexuality is as importantly as other things. Vriend1917 (talk) 21:01, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

Oppose good for him, still, per above. Editor 5426387 (talk) 21:09, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose Beyond the point of significance, this article is a stub. The good news there is a five-fold expansion for featuring via WP:DYK should be possible. – Muboshgu (talk) 21:14, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  @Muboshgu True! I was especially confused about the complete lack of information on his international career...

  Anyway, I guess it would just be better to try there, at this point. Thanks for the advice! Oltrepier (talk) 21:26, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

Alright, thank you all for the feedback! This was my first ever nomination, so I wasn't aware of those previous discussions on the topic: admittedly, I should have done my research better...

Plus, even though I mentioned a few other users in the lead template, I take full responsibility for the nomination, since I didn't ask any of them directly before doing this. I know it's probably not a big deal, but still, I wanted to clarify it. Oltrepier (talk) 21:37, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

RD: Guido Basso

Article: Guido Basso (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): https://jazz.fm/guido-basso-obituary-canadian-jazz-musician/
Credits:

• Nominated by Flibirigit (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Discospinster (talk · give credit) and 213.170.151.5 (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Noted Canadian jazz musician. Some citations still needed. Flibirigit (talk) 19:28, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

(Removed) Ongoing removal: 2022–2023 Peruvian protests

Article: 2022–2023 Peruvian protests (talk · history · tag)
Ongoing item removal (Post)

Nominator's comments: There have been no significant events noted in the article during the entire month of February, and only a single sentence about a single minor event on February 2, the last such date in the article. If no new updates cover events for over 11 days, then this probably isn't eligible for ongoing anymore. Jayron32 13:29, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Remove per OP. -Ad Orientem (talk) 14:20, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
• Remove Last update was on February 3 for a arrest update, after that was a bunch of disruptive editing and copy-edits and even a protection for the article. Remove per OP. Tails Wx 14:44, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

Remove said well by everyone in the replys. Vriend1917 (talk) 16:09, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Remove I really hate to vote this way, since the protests are still happening, but by WP guidelines the article hasn’t been updated enough to remain in ongoing. The Kip (talk) 16:19, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose Removal just because no major events are occuring, doesn't mean it's over. just like the Mahsa Amini protests, there are no current events, but they can come up at any time. Editor 5426387 (talk) 16:30, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

Criteria isn't whether the events are still occurring but whether the article is being updated. I hate to say it, but it's not. The Kip (talk) 17:12, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Removed. I checked the article a couple of days ago for that reason but decided not to nominate it yet. If there is new development, a blurb nomination is welcome. --Tone 17:20, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

RD: Zia Mohyeddin

Article: Zia Mohyeddin (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Zia Mohyeddin passes away at 91
Credits:

• Nominated by Fahads1982 (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Zia Mohyeddin, British-Pakistani actor (Lawrence of Arabia, Khartoum, Ashanti) and television broadcaster died at the age of 91 Fahads1982 (talk) 06:19, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Not ready – Multiple {{verification}} and {{citation needed}} tags in the article. Tails Wx 13:56, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

(Posted) Super Bowl

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Patrick Mahomes

Article: Super Bowl LVII (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ In American football, the Kansas City Chiefs (most valuable player Patrick Mahomes pictured) defeat the Philadelphia Eagles in the Super Bowl. (Post)
News source(s): Fox Sports
Credits:

• Nominated by 2600:1700:31BA:9410:25AB:5722:ACFE:E4D6 (talk · give credit)
• Updated by PCN02WPS (talk · give credit), Donnowin1 (talk · give credit) and Swagging (talk · give credit)

Article updated
The nominated event is listed on WP:ITN/R, so each occurrence is presumed to be important enough to post. Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article and update meet WP:ITNCRIT, not the significance.

 2600:1700:31BA:9410:25AB:5722:ACFE:E4D6 (talk) 03:11, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support – article is good on quality, ITNR item. DecafPotato (talk) 03:20, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support Article is already good quality. NW1223<Howl at me•My hunts> 03:21, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support The article even has a full recap in place. There are some empty stat tables but I assume this is waiting official box scoring. Yes, post-airing aspects like viewership etc will come later, but that won't affect the existing quality of the article. (Also we should include the MVP once announced). --Masem (t) 03:23, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
• Not Ready The tables at the bottom are largely unsourced. The starting lineup box is empty. -Ad Orientem (talk) 03:26, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

Tables are now properly sourced. Looks good to go. Support. -Ad Orientem (talk) 04:28, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

Support The article is good, ready to be posted. Still depressed over my loss though. Vriend1917 (talk) 03:30, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

Fuck the Eagles. Crusader1096 (message) 03:37, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

Appreciate the kind (and constructive) words! DarkSide830 (talk) 04:47, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• That holding call at the end was a load of garbage! BeanieFan11 (talk) 03:32, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
  • Also, support, seems to be high enough quality. BeanieFan11 (talk) 03:36, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

Support - ITNR, should probably be posted immediately. Articles mostly goood. Don't get people like @Ad Orientem who think that every article in ITN has to adhere 100% strictly to every minor-ass clause in the MOS before posting. Crusader1096 (message) 03:33, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

They should though, and the points raised are important. That said, the official box scores should be around for these to fill and source these Masem (t) 03:50, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support, some tables need filling-out but article is otherwise of good quality. The Kip (talk) 04:08, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support per above, good article and significant. Rockin (Talk) 04:19, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support - let's get this one up. @Ad Orientem: stats tables have been filled out and others (lineups, records) that may not have reporting as fast have been hidden. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 04:19, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  Like -Ad Orientem (talk) 04:30, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Posted Stephen 04:23, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  We gonna get the photo? The Kip (talk) 04:25, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  even if not, Mahomes being MVP should absolutely be there DecafPotato (talk) 04:31, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  I’d say no, the earthquake is still more prevalent for now (talk) 04:37, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  Also a bummer. InedibleHulk (talk) 04:40, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• (Post Posting) Pull Photo - While the SuperBowl win is clearly ITN, it would make more sense to have a picture from the earthquake, which has had now a week straight of media coverage over the SuperBowl MVP. Elijahandskip (talk) 04:44, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  Might be a better discussion for ERRORS. DarkSide830 (talk) 04:46, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

I don't think so actually. The picture was added with the posting, so this is similar to the post-posting pull !vote discussions that occur, just instead of pulled the event, it is for pulling the picture. Elijahandskip (talk) 04:47, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

Perhaps, but I given it's a multiple-blurbs issue and this thread could get shut down quickly I'm simply not sure discussing here is the best idea. Just my 2 cents though. DarkSide830 (talk) 04:49, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

Not technically an error per WP:ITNPICT: The picture should be for the uppermost blurb.—Bagumba (talk) 05:44, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

As you say, it had a week straight, time to stop binging on static misery. InedibleHulk (talk) 04:58, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

Not to sound callous, but if anything, the fact that the earthquake photo's been there a week is argument enough to go to the Mahomes photo. The Kip (talk) 05:19, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

The counter argument would be what is more notable/important? Mahomes or an extremely deadly earthquake with 35,000 deaths? The media is still having breaking news stories and updates about the earthquake. In retrospect, the earthquake is “the” natural disaster which had gained international attention since Hurricane Ian. In 2-3 days, Mahomes will just be a passing mention in a Super Bowl article, but there is a high chance the earthquake will still be a top story. Elijahandskip (talk) 07:38, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

The counterargument to that is that’s not how we do things here. Items are posted in chronological order, the earthquake happened a week ago and the Super Bowl happened today. We don’t consider perceived notability/importance. The Kip (talk) 08:01, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Post-posting support. I support posting the article, and I think that the photo is more than appropriate given that Mahomes was the MVP of the Super Bowl. — Red-tailed hawk _(nest) 04:58, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
• I support posting the blurb, but I think it should be second-slot below the earthquake, which should also probably have the picture slot. This is an opportunity to actually fight against Americentrism and systemic bias. Our ordinary processes would bump the story about the earthquake in Asia that killed tens of thousands and injured almost 100,000 (so far) in favor of the story about the Super Bowl, but we could WP:IAR that and do what's actually proper, respectful, and proportional from a global viewpoint. Levivich (talk) 05:20, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  That is not actual fighting, it's slacktivism. InedibleHulk (talk) 05:25, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  It's worse than that, it's affirmative slacktion. Levivich (talk) 05:28, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  Zoinks! Good luck packaging that craze. If you do get your way, at least change the earthquake picture; it's beginning to fade into wallpaper levels of impact. InedibleHulk (talk) 05:31, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  Yeah there is probably a newer/different earthquake picture than could be used. I hope I get my way. Great human suffering > sports and our main page shouldn't suggest the opposite, even if the sports news is more recent. Levivich (talk) 05:38, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  The Main Page isn't going to stop talking about how the earthquake keeps killing and wounding an evergrowing number of people, relax. It's just several pixels lower, in effective text. People will be bummed, no matter how happy others are with the Chiefs. InedibleHulk (talk) 05:42, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  WP:RGW...

  Super Bowl happened more recently by a week, therefore it's the most recent blurb. That's how it is. The Kip (talk) 06:53, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  ...fight against Americentrism and systemic bias: No, the order was determined per existing WP:ITNBLURB: Blurbs are posted in rough chronological order by the date when the event occurred.—Bagumba (talk) 05:39, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  I'm looking at the effect, not the rule. Levivich (talk) 05:48, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  No, it was a cherry-picked effect. The rule could just as equally bump an American-related blurb. The rule doesn't discriminate based on a blurb's topic. —Bagumba (talk) 06:24, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  How can you possibly call this a "cherry picked effect"? There is only one Main Page. There is only one cherry to pick. Look at the main page right now. Super Bowl, and picture of MVP, ahead of worst natural disaster on Earth in many years. That's the effect: the effect of "sports is more important than human suffering". It's not cherry-picked, it's a result of the Super Bowl happening a week after the earthquake, and us following chrono order and refusing to consider any other order. That's an Americentric effect because the outcome is that it appears like we're putting US news ahead of more important world news (it appears that way because that's what we're doing, even if we don't intend to do it, it's still the plain effect of our process: Super Bowl above earthquake). Honestly, read WP:SYSTEMICBIAS, it's talking about this exact thing (it even talks about ITN). It has nothing to do with intent, and effects cannot be "cherry picked" because effects aren't picked at all. One cannot cherry pick an outcome for pete's sake: we're talking the main page right now. Levivich (talk) 15:52, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  And by the way, that rules says rough chronological order, it doesn't say exact chronological order, so the rule doesn't even require this blurb to be on the top. Levivich (talk) 05:50, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  The next sentence says They are generally not sorted by any degree of importance or significance. You're ignoring all sorts of rules with this suggestion. It isn't up to ITN to editorialize by deciding which stories are more important than others. Plus there's already enough arguing about about what to post at all, let alone in what order. --Torsodog^Talk 06:20, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  Emphasis on the word generally, which means "not always". Levivich (talk) 15:37, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  Thanks for defining "generally" for me. Extremely helpful. The bottom line is this suggestion goes against multiple ITN guidelines no matter how pedantic you want to be. ITN isn't set up (nor should it be) to decide what story is more important than others. I'd love to see you speak to that instead of snarkily defining words everyone already knows. --Torsodog^Talk 16:09, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  OK I'd be happy to speak to that without snark:

  ITN is set up to allow for non-chronological order. WP:ITN says "generally not sorted by any degree of importance", which allows the possibility of sometimes--if rarely--sorting by a degree of importance. This is one of those times when we should do that.

  Even if ITN absolutely forbade sorting by order of importance (which it doesn't), the fifth pillar and WP:IAR would allow us to ignore that rules if we felt it would benefit the encyclopedia to do so.

  Here, it would benefit the encyclopedia to do so, because not doing so gives the unintended impression that we feel the Super Bowl is more important than the earthquake.

  ITN doesn't usually decide the relative importance of stories, but that doesn't mean it can't, in certain appropriate circumstances, do exactly that. Indeed, the plain language of WP:ITN ("generally") contemplates that we would do exactly that at least sometimes. This is one of those times. Levivich (talk) 16:13, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  No, rough was referring to events in the same day: There is usually no effort made to be more specific than the date, and admins will generally not research the exact minute when an event occurred to make sure that multiple events that occurred on the same date are strictly in order. —Bagumba (talk) 06:21, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  Emphasis on the word usually, which means "not always."

  Look guys, disagree with me if you want to, but don't tell me going out-of-chrono order is prohibited by a rule, because it plainly isn't. Levivich (talk) 15:38, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  The “loose chronological order” is regarding things happening in a short stretch, i.e. if an election happens on the same day as the Super Bowl admins don’t particularly care which one gets posted first and won’t go down to the to-the-minute details of whether the SB finished before the election was called or the other way around.

  There’s a chasm of difference when one event occurred a full week before the other, and your comments are absolutely reeking or WP:RGW. The Kip (talk) 15:45, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  The words generally not sorted by any degree of importance mean "sometimes sorted by some degree of importance". Levivich (talk) 15:47, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  All I can say is that that’s not just a stretch in logic, that’s a leap across the Grand Canyon. The Kip (talk) 15:58, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  You want the rules to only apply to American stories and non-American stories to get bumped up simply because they aren't American? ITN discussions are wild these days. --Torsodog^Talk 05:54, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  Chronological order is a thing. The Kip (talk) 06:10, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  Proportionality, relative importance, and appearances, are all also "things". Levivich (talk) 15:40, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  But chronological order is a thing that’s enshrined in how ITNR works. The rest… aren’t. The Kip (talk) 15:43, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  First, look at the language, it says "rough", "generally", "usually". So chrono order is not "enshrined", it's not inflexible. "How ITNR works" is that it allows for non-chrono order sometimes -- rarely -- but sometimes.

  Second, WP:IAR is enshrined in how Wikipedia works. "No firm rules" is the fifth pillar of Wikipedia.

  At the risk of sounding repetitive: disagree with me if you want, but don't claim there is a rule against this, because there isn't, and because even if there were such a rule, we have no firm rules anyway. Levivich (talk) 15:46, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  Please see the current talk page thread "food for thought" regarding story ordering (after the LeBron record had been posted). The consensus there is to avoid disrupting the order even for IAR reasons. Masem (t) 16:20, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  I saw the discussion; I do not see the consensus you see, I see a lack of consensus. Levivich (talk) 16:35, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  Lack of a clear consensus means revert to the status quo, which is to not re-order events because we feel like it. The Kip (talk) 17:33, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Regarding the picture, if we are regularly going to kick up a fuss about having an image of an athlete on the Main Page at the same time a disaster is in the news*, then we need to hash out a procedure for which we would make that determination. We can't do it on an IAR/ad hoc basis because not everyone here agrees that it's a worthy use of WP:IAR, which in my mind requires a near-unanimous consensus. If it's so important that we do this, we can come to an agreement on a small process to ad hoc the ITN template/image ordering based on what's in the news. By doing so, we can prevent future derailment of this type in ITN/C threads.--⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 13:18, 13 February 2023 (UTC) _{* - in the ITN sense, since the story is over a week old}

  The discussion I started last week on WT:ITN, regarding more serious blurbs over less serious ones, seemed to suggest that we should not try to seek determination of what is more important than others once posting has been set by consensus. The only rule that then remains is to try to keep the picture for 24 hr before moving onto the next one, which I know the quake one had been up for multiple days, so the replacement follows the consensus here. No playing favorites, for all purposes. Masem (t) 13:24, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

Oppose image pull - for God's sake, yes we get it, an earthquake occured in Turkey and Syria. Tens of thousands died. A true tragedy of magnitude. But my brethren in Christ, the Turko-Syrian earthquake should not remain front and center of ITN. This section is for recent news, not the biggest news, we shouldn't just ground ITN just because of a major disaster. We've already had a story pulled because people got mad and thought that by including it, we we're somehow being disrespectful to the victims. The earthquake is a tragedy, but we're not finna ground every single change to ITN because of it. But nah, we gotta "respect the victims" and "combat Americanism", or some bullshit like that. Listen, if you're that concerned about the earthquake, get off your ass and donate to a charity, or something else besides pulling or rearranging content on ITN (like @Levivich proposed). Crusader1096 (message) 15:35, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

I've done both and hope you do, too. Levivich (talk) 15:36, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

Cool. For all the issues charities have, I'm sure that was more helpful than altering the English Wikipedia's ITN section to try and place the tragedy as front and center. Crusader1096 (message) 15:56, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Weak Oppose This news is not reallt ITN-worthy, sure, some team won a football match, but this is English Wikipedia, not American Wikipedia. Article looks good, though. Editor 5426387 (talk) 16:34, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

The Super Bowl is a huge event in sports (and the biggest in all of American football) and is listed at ITNR as something that is always important enough to post if high enough quality. BeanieFan11 (talk) 16:40, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

I hope this is satire. The Kip (talk) 18:33, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

It doesn't matter what you think 5426387, since this is ITNR. --Rockstone^{Send me a message!} 18:36, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

(Closed) Killing of Brianna Ghey

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Article: Killing of Brianna Ghey (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Transgender teen Brianna Ghey is killed in Warrington, England (Post)
News source(s): Sky News, ITV News, BBC News, The Independent, The Guardian, The Telegraph, The Times
Credits:

• Created and nominated by Sideswipe9th (talk · give credit)

Nominator's comments: Recent killing of a transgender teen in the UK, that is currently being covered by all major UK news outlets. I think I've incorporated all of the currently known important facts. This is my first nomination though, so please forgive me if I've done something wrong. Sideswipe9th (talk) 00:25, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• I've amended this to a blurb nomination, since the target article is not an article on a single person. Banedon (talk) 01:28, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  Oh, I was under the impression from the template instructions that all recent death nominations, which I read as including killings, were to use the shorter blurbless version. Thanks for correcting that and writing a quick blurb, though one correction Warrington is about 180 miles away from London. Sideswipe9th (talk) 02:21, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose lots of people die unnatural deaths everyday. This needs some additional angle of notability. Banedon (talk) 01:30, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
• Obvious oppose The article gives no indication of why this is more important than anyone else being murdered. -- Kicking222 (talk) 01:34, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
• Comment Biographies of people whose names are in the titles of their Death articles are eligible for permanent inclusion on the main RD list, so should be for our downstream subset, too. InedibleHulk (talk) 01:50, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  Er, that's not true, particularly when there's question of the notability of the event to start with. Masem (t) 02:02, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  It's damn true. I was there for the RfCs and followup discussions. In this case, though, there's no biographical content beyond the basics, so you could discount it on that. InedibleHulk (talk) 02:11, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  If the death/killing/murder itself is notable, but it is agreed that the article may not be blurb worthy, I would agree that RD for the victim makes sense. But we have a double case of questions on the notability of the person and the event around them, and that would not make it appropriate for RD. Otherwise, I could pursue a number of local papers, pull out news coverage of the death of a non-notable person which would fail NOTNEWS, and suggest that name for RD. We need notability of the person or the event (or both) but absent either, that's a problem. Masem (t) 02:45, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose. Tragic, but the article does not substantiate significance. DarkSide830 (talk) 01:51, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose Why is there even an article on this?? (Yes, I understand there's a major debate in the UK regarding trans individuals, but unless this sparks a huge amount of public response, this appears to be a simple domestic crime we don't cover under NOTNEWS) --Masem (t) 02:01, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  With all due respect to the nom, this shouldn’t even be an article unless it becomes apparent it was a hate crime. The Kip (talk) 02:30, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  Should this be closed since I just nominated the article for deletion? Not sure whether ITN allows a discussion to continue or not in this circumstance. Noah^Talk 02:42, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  Probably. The Kip (talk) 02:50, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

February 12

Portal:Current events/2023 February 12

February 12, 2023 (2023-02-12) (Sunday) Armed conflicts and attacks High-altitude object events in 2023 2023 Lake Huron high-altitude object A United States Air Force F-16 Fighting Falcon shoots down an unidentified flying object over Lake Huron near the Canada–United States border. The Department of Defense describe the object as octagonal and flying at roughly 20,000 feet. (Forbes) The Pentagon holds a press briefing on the shootdowns with NORAD Commander Glen D. VanHerck stating it is currently unclear how the objects were "staying aloft", and "we're calling them objects, not balloons, for a reason". (Bharat Times) 2023 Shandong high-altitude object China says that it has detected an unidentified flying object over the Yellow Sea, and warns that it is prepared to shoot down the object. The Qingdao Marine Development Bureau issues an alert to fishermen in the waters to be "on alert" and "avoid risks". (South China Morning Post) Disasters and accidents 2022–23 South Pacific cyclone season Thousands of people are left without power as Cyclone Gabrielle makes landfall over North Island, New Zealand. The regions of Northland and Auckland are currently under a state of emergency. (BBC News) Law and crime Censorship in Cambodia Cambodian prime minister Hun Sen orders the closure of one of the country's last independent news outlets, The Voice of Democracy, saying that its publications have hurt him and his son Hun Manet. (Reuters) Politics and elections 2023 Cypriot presidential election In a run-off election, Nikos Christodoulides is elected as President of Cyprus, defeating Andreas Mavroyiannis. (Reuters) NATO secretary general Jens Stoltenberg announces that he will not extend his mandate to serve a fourth term and is expected to step down in October. (AFP via South China Morning Post) Science and technology Asteroid impact prediction Researchers at the Konkoly Observatory in Hungary discover 2023 CX1, a 1-metre (3.3-foot) asteroid predicted to fall harmlessly as a fireball over the English Channel at 03:00 UTC, making it the seventh asteroid to be discovered before impacting Earth. (JPL Center for NEO Studies) Sports 2022 NFL season The Kansas City Chiefs defeat the Philadelphia Eagles 38–35 in Super Bowl LVII, winning their third Super Bowl in franchise history. (CNBC) 2023 Turkey–Syria earthquake 2022–23 Süper Lig Gaziantep becomes the 2nd club (after Hatayspor) to withdraw from the top division of Turkish football due to the earthquake. (Turkish Football Federation)

---

RD: Billy Two Rivers

Article: Billy Two Rivers (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): CBC, Montreal Gazette
Credits:

• Nominated by Indefensible (talk · give credit)
• Created by GaryColemanFan (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Canadian professional wrestler - Indefensible (talk) 21:30, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Photo RD Old wrestler dies, sure, but also a 20-year career as a Mohawk political "force of nature" during some of their most high-profile and transformative years. InedibleHulk (talk) 22:24, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support Article looks like it is in order and well sourced. Looks ready to go on my end! Ornithoptera (talk) 23:04, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

RD: Greta Andersen

Article: Greta Andersen (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Swimming World
Credits:

• Nominated by Oceanh (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Danish swimmer, Olympic champion who also set several world records in marathon swimming. Oceanh (talk) 19:47, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Comment There is a big gap of content between 1969 and 2023 (54 years!). Is there anything that can be added? Curbon7 (talk) 00:38, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

Reply By going through available sources, I added a few things (instruction career until 1980 and beyond, and an ISHOF honor from 2015). As sportsperson, her major achievements obviously was in her younger days. Oceanh (talk) 11:02, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

RD: Ted Lerner

Article: Ted Lerner (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): [5]
Credits:

• Nominated by Muboshgu (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 – Muboshgu (talk) 17:01, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support Career section is a bit short all things considered, but it is sufficient for our purposes. Article is well-cited and holistic. Curbon7 (talk) 00:36, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

(Posted) RD: David Jude Jolicoeur

Article: David Jude Jolicoeur (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): NYT
Credits:

• Nominated by Mooonswimmer (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Article needs quite a bit of expansion, and the "Aliases" section might have to go. Mooonswimmer 23:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support. I think he's definitely notable enough to deserve a mention, and honestly, I can't believe his page was this skeletal until now... In fact, I've just added some more useful details and sources all across the article, although there might still be work to get done, especially for the "Biography" section. Oltrepier (talk) 18:26, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support: This article could certainly use some expansion, but I just added two references that took care of the two cite tags and maintenance templates in the article and it's fully sourced as it stands now. Doc Strange^MailboxLogbook 20:36, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
• Posted. Appears to be in a fine state, despite being a little short. Anarchyte (talk) 13:00, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• Keep drinking that Kool-Aid, folks I just read an encyclopedia entry which is heavily weighted towards his death, as if to suggest that we're saying he's notable for dying instead of notable for a music career, and which says ZERO about his life or career between 1991 and 2017. Considering the volume of traffic which comes through the main page, just who do you think you're fooling by saying this is worthy of a link simply because it happens to be formatted a certain way and happens to have citations neatly in place, no doubt the result of a moment-in-time Google search? Truly, the emperor wears no clothes. RadioKAOS / Talk to me, Billy / Transmissions 00:02, 15 February 2023 (UTC)

  I'd rather have an emperor with no clothes than a skeletal music bio; good job, Oltrepier and Strange! As for you, KAOS, fill it up if you can. Posting is not the end of our collective responsibility for history. InedibleHulk (talk) 00:11, 15 February 2023 (UTC)

Election in Cyprus

Nikos Christodoulides

Article: 2023 Cypriot presidential election (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Nikos Christodoulides is elected as President of Cyprus. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ Nikos Christodoulides is elected as President of Cyprus, defeating Andreas Mavroyiannis.
News source(s): Reuters
Credits:

• Nominated by BastianMAT (talk · give credit)

The nominated event is listed on WP:ITN/R, so each occurrence is presumed to be important enough to post. Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article and update meet WP:ITNCRIT, not the significance.

Nominator's comments: ITN/R. BastianMAT (talk) 17:58, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support Quality looks good enough. The Kip (talk) 19:06, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
• Comment The Campaign section is currently just a wall of text, can this be split up? Curbon7 (talk) 19:36, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

  Done like dinner. InedibleHulk (talk) 00:52, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support Article ticks all the boxes for me. ✨  4 🧚‍♂am KING  20:54, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support 🍁🏳️‍🌈 DinoSoupCanada 🏳️‍🌈 🍁 (talk) 23:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support looks fine to me. TomMasterReal^TALK 00:07, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support Article checks out! Ornithoptera (talk) 00:10, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support I've seen worse. InedibleHulk (talk) 02:36, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  Worse articles, I mean. Oppose changing the picture yet. Give the MVP till Monday night, at least. InedibleHulk (talk) 05:10, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support. The article quality is sufficient, and this is presumed notable per WP:INTR. — Red-tailed hawk _(nest) 05:00, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
• Comment I am missing some aftermath/reaction, when fixed, this will be good to go. --Tone 08:44, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

Support good shape, ready to be posted Vriend1917 (talk) 23:58, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Comment there is an unreferenced section (orange level tag) which needs to be addressed before posting, and the text in the 'results' section is simply a copy-paste of the lead. I'd like to see some non-duplicated prose there. Modest Genius ^talk 14:35, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

Another UFO shot down

Articles: 2023 Yukon high-altitude object (talk · history · tag) and 2023 Alaska high-altitude object (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Unidentified flying objects are shot down over Alaska, the Yukon and Lake Huron. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ NORAD downs three unidentified flying objects in Alaska, the Yukon and Lake Huron.
Alternative blurb II: ​ In the wake of a a Chinese balloon suspected of surveillance and espionage being shot down after overflying Canada and the United States, three unidentified flying objects are shot down over Alaska, the Yukon and Lake Huron.
News source(s): BBC; NYT; CNN; Reuters; Straits Times
Credits:

• Nominated by Andrew Davidson (talk · give credit)
• Created by DinoSoupCanada (talk · give credit)

Article updated

Nominator's comments: The Yukon craft seems similar in size to the Alaskan one but nothing has been recovered from either yet as Arctic conditions are making the work difficult. We've not heard much more about the balloon in South America either, that I've seen, so I suppose that's still out there. Perhaps we should update the first shootdown blurb? Or consolidate into an Ongoing item? Andrew🐉(talk) 08:59, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

• Strong oppose new blurb because this is like daily news now and therefore not significant, but neutral on updating the existing blurb as these are somewhat related, although I'm not sure whether or not RS are making the connection. The ⬡ Bestagon ^T/_C 09:29, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
  • This is a pretty terrible argument. You don't get to personally ordain that it is "not significant" just because there have been multiple incidents. It is literally in international news headlines. Master of Time (talk) 23:09, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

    This "pretty terrible argument" of not significant seems to be supported by the below consensus. And no, it isn't in the headlines internationally, at least not in the part of the world I live in. (Not that I require global significance or coverage to post, but I'm just replying to your point.) The ⬡ Bestagon ^T/_C 12:12, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

• Blip For completeness we should also mention the 2023 Montana radar incident but that just seems to have been a blip. On the other hand, there's the saying: "Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. The third time it’s enemy action." Andrew🐉(talk) 10:54, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
• Lasers Dr. Evil isn't happy until his plot involves a "LASER". And the news obliges with Mysterious green lasers over Hawaii. And a volcano is involved too! Don't look up! Andrew🐉(talk) 12:03, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

Oppose blurb per above but could possibly get behind moving to ongoing if a collective article for these events were created. Crusader1096 (message) 14:04, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose Seriously, en.wiki is not a newspaper and there's zero indication these events are important on their own or if there's even a pattern. This is stuff for Wikinews, not here. --Masem (t) 14:12, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

• ITN is currently leading with 2023 Monegasque general election. That's of so little importance that only 443 people read the article yesterday. That's not 443 thousand; it's just 443. The UFO shootdowns are more important because, as shooting incidents, they are a significant escalation in the hostility between the superpowers. Andrew🐉(talk) 15:04, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

  Elections of any nation are valid for ITN per ITNR, with this it's not even confirmed that the balloon is Chinese, so it's a bit rash to make that assumption. Even China claimed to have shot down a UFO. I say this isn't significant enough yet, unless/until more information comes out that warrants its significance. Rockin (Talk) 17:16, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

  First, the election, despite its irregularities, is ITNR. That’s just how it is, regardless of size of the country.

  Second, WP:CRYSTAL applies here. The Kip (talk) 17:52, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

  We do not care about viewership numbers. We are not like a newspaper that need to drive views to remain financially viable. ITN is more concerned with presenting a broad cross section of topics that happen to be in the news, which nearly every national-level general election is considered to be. Masem (t) 19:49, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

  Yeah, who gives a heck about Monaco and their stupid elections! I mean, c'mon man, it's absurd to compete these two incidents. Monaco's selections aren't sexy front-page news, but they are well more important. DarkSide830 (talk) 02:05, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose see above reasoning, this is more suited for Wikinews Ludicrous (talk) 14:36, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose Highly doubtful that either of these most recent incidents ring the WP:GNG/EVENT bell. Both should probably be merged with the main Chinese balloon article. Alternatively, if they cannot be definitievly linked to China and nothing further emerges that gives them a stronger claim to notability, they should be sent to AfD and deleted. -Ad Orientem (talk) 15:30, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

  Until we have identity of what was shot down, a merge would need to be really careful to point out that these were events closely related in time but nothing else, and not imply they were part of the Chinese balloon shoot down. Masem (t) 15:51, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

  I agree. In fact, I would hold off on any action with either page until we know a bit more. But what we have right now, doesn't establish encyclopedic notability. -Ad Orientem (talk) 16:10, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose new blurb per my above comment. Rockin (Talk) 17:17, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose per all above. No established significance beyond simply being literal UFOs. The Kip (talk) 17:40, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
• Update Here's what the pilots said on CNN which tends to confirm that these were not all balloons. Meanwhile, there's continuing activity on Wikipedia and we have a compilation now: List of high-altitude object events in 2023. Seven entries and counting... Andrew🐉(talk) 19:45, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

  I still fail to see exactly how this is front-page notable - with their identity as potential foreign surveillance objects not confirmed, for the moment it's just the same UFO sighting incidents of the last 50 years, but with an added shootdown. The Kip (talk) 20:02, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

  It's front page news on every major site: Al Jazeera; BBC; CBC; DW; NYT; you name it. What I'm not seeing on any of those pages is any mention of the Monaco election. ITN is in a bubble of its own. Andrew🐉(talk) 20:12, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

  It’s a good thing we aren’t a pure news site, then.

  There’s been plenty of front-page stories we haven’t covered here (quite a lot of sports news, for example) for one reason or another, because we run on different rules. The Kip (talk) 21:43, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

  We do not care about how many sources cover a topic, only that it is covered. ITN is not guided by frequency, popularity or readership, as to fight against systematic media bias. Masem (t) 23:32, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose per above Editor 5426387 (talk) 02:53, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
• Comment The blurb should mention the country/countries in which these events took place, in order for the item to be accessible to all readers. Chrisclear (talk) 20:58, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
• Comment The proposed blurb is written in passive voice and omits important pieces of information, such as who shot the "UFOs" and why the "UFOs" were shot. Chrisclear (talk) 20:58, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

• Please see MOS:PASSIVE which explains that "The most common uses of encyclopedic passive are to keep the focus on the subject instead of performing a news-style shift to dwelling on a non-notable party." Andrew🐉(talk) 21:29, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
  • In this case, the unnamed party who shot down the "UFOs" is both notable and relevant. The current proposed blurb is an incredibly vague sentence which fails to identify the shooter(s), and provides a half-hearted description of the location of these events. Chrisclear (talk) 22:08, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose Without an explanation of who or why the "UFOs" were shot, it's hard to see the significance of this item. Chrisclear (talk) 22:08, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
• Update There's been another shoot-down over Lake Huron today. This one was octagonal! Curiouser and curiouser... Andrew🐉(talk) 23:09, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

  I mean this in the politest possible terms, you don't need to post an update every few hours. The Kip (talk) 23:12, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support altering existing blurb to note that 3 other floating objects have been shot down in the following days. I see no need for a further blurb. Nfitz (talk) 00:09, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  Request Denied This would make them seem too Chinese. Maybe they are and maybe they aren't. Best to keep mysteries like these vague until the smoking gun stuff is leaked, dripped or declassified. InedibleHulk (talk) 00:19, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  I thought that it goes without saying, that the blurb would have to be written in a way to not imply that the new balloons are Chinese. Nfitz (talk) 01:22, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

  It can't be, though. Even if we debolded, unlinked or euphemized the Chinese balloon part, it's been up there for over a week. People have associated it and most can't so suddenly forget. Just by putting them together, you're putting them together. Since the three less identified objects have less identity, they'll naturally be tainted by the relatively characterized fourth, instead of spreading their lack of distinction. InedibleHulk (talk) 03:36, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

  Inference is up to the reader. Though given that officials in Washington and the Prime Minister of Canada are saying that the second two are also balloons, and may be linked to the first, then I don't see the harm in providing simply the information. The origin of the 4th is less clear - as is the method of flight. Nfitz (talk) 18:15, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

  WP:CRYSTAL, no confirmation anything but the balloon is Chinese. The Kip (talk) 00:43, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• What the fuck is the story here? Seriously? What's the significance of this? --⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 01:24, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  Matters of national security, sir, I'm going to have to ask you to mind yer language. InedibleHulk (talk) 01:33, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  These incidents obviously indicate an escalation in the level of tension between China, Russia and the USA. What seems to be happening is that NORAD was stung by the accusations of weakness in handling the first balloon. They have cranked up the sensitivity of their radars and are shooting down anything that moves in an "abundance of caution" – i.e. they are now trigger-happy. This is a dangerous state for nuclear superpowers as there have been many cases in the past where war was avoided only by keeping cool – see the list of nuclear close calls.

Now ITN clearly has a low bar for significance as, after the Monaco election, it's now leading with the Superbowl – an ephemeral entertainment with zero long-term significance. It made no difference to the world which team won last night but ITN has rushed to announce the result regardless.

Andrew🐉(talk) 09:40, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

Because the Super Bowl is a massive event as well as on ITNR, while the Monegasque elections are those of a sovereign state just like any other that we always post as per ITNR. Also, the idea that this is “clearly evident” of heightened tensions is a massive instance of WP:CRYSTAL when we still don’t even know what the UFOs were, let alone where they came from.

We get that you disagree with ITNR guidelines regarding elections and based on past behavior, especially sports - doesn’t make this any more notable. I’d love to hear how this, which is still thin on details besides “the US/Canada shot something down” has any more long-term significance than any of the events posted by consensus. The Kip (talk) 14:53, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• The rise in tension is clearly evident from reports such as Tensions Rise.... Q.E.D. Andrew🐉(talk) 09:17, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

  If the Times have no proof the UFOs are Chinese, it's not our job to associate them. Sometimes the media makes mountains out of molehills. The Kip (talk) 19:09, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

• Note I know votes =/= consensus, but worth noting to any viewing admins that it's currently at nine opposes + WaltCip's what I believe to be an oppose, with no supports outside the nom; may be best to close. The Kip (talk) 06:59, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
• Weak Support It's not every weekend that three UFOs are (publicly) shot down, but I'll admit, it could happen again next weekend. Or tomorrow. Or while I'm voting. InedibleHulk (talk) 07:12, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
• Wait to see how all of the merges play out. This might tie into the Chinese balloon incident, in which case, I don't know what's supposed to happen. Could even be ongoing, I suppose. ~Maplestrip/Mable (chat) 08:50, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
• Comment Bloomberg reports: US Hasn’t Ruled Out Alien Origins for Latest Objects Shot Down. Count Iblis (talk) 10:36, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  If it's an ET, then I'd rather get a reliable source that says so instead of peddling the sort of clickbait nonsense that The History Channel forcefeeds its viewers nowadays. ⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 13:59, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support combined blurb. I have proposed Alt Blurb II for consideration. ~ ONUnicorn^{(Talk|Contribs)}problem solving 14:30, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  That blurb us far too much in SYNTH territory to be used. Masem (t) 14:39, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

  I'm not entirely sure how it's WP:SYNTH - multiple RSs have quoted pentagon officials stating that after the Chinese spy balloon, they recalibrated their radar to more easily detect that type of threat, which is why these other objects were detected. ~ ONUnicorn^{(Talk|Contribs)}problem solving 21:44, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

  The blurb doesn't say a thing about recalibration, though, only suspicion of Chinese espionage. That's not so much a problem with the glaringly suspicious Chinese one. But it carries through to the "wake", and that's uncool. FYI, the radar was fixed (by NORAD, not the Pentagon) to pick up smaller objects than it previously had. Not "that type of threat". InedibleHulk (talk) 21:53, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose We blurbed the Chinese balloon but these subsequent objects have yet to be connected to that, and seem less significant. Pawnkingthree (talk) 01:11, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
• Comment - could we possibly bump/update the blurb to "Four/Several man-made high altitude objects are shot down over North American airspace."? The initial incident I feel was a tempest in a teapot, but the reoccuring nature of these is both in the news, and an uncommon occurrence even if they end up being some university/civilian experiment. - Floydian ^τ _¢ 02:19, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose' A curiosity. Not for the front page. doktorb _words^deeds 22:02, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

February 11

Portal:Current events/2023 February 11

February 11, 2023 (2023-02-11) (Saturday) Armed conflicts and attacks High-altitude object events in 2023 2023 Yukon high-altitude object Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau orders the takedown of an unidentified flying object over Yukon, which is later shot down by a United States Air Force F-22 Raptor using a AIM-9X Sidewinder. The Canadian Armed Forces have been deployed to collect and analyze the object. (CNN) Insurgency in Khyber Pakhtunkhwa A suicide bomber blows himself up near a security forces' vehicle in North Waziristan District, Pakistan, killing three soldiers and wounding 20 more. (News Drum) Syrian civil war At least ten civilians and a soldier are killed in a mass shooting by Islamic State gunmen at a truffle farm in Palmyra, Homs Governorate, Syria. (AFP via VOA) Internal conflict in Peru Seven police officers are killed and another is injured when their vehicle is ambushed in Valle de los Ríos Apurímac, Ene y Mantaro, Peru, in a suspected attack by remnants of Shining Path. (Infobae) Disasters and accidents A passenger van collides with another vehicle in Naawan, Misamis Oriental, Philippines, killing eight people who have attended a police training session. (Rappler) International relations Armenia–Turkey relations, Humanitarian response to the 2023 Turkey–Syria earthquake The Alican border crossing between Armenia and Turkey briefly reopens to allow the passage of humanitarian aid following the Turkey–Syria earthquake for the first time since 1988. (AFP via Al Arabiya) Law and crime Camp Evangelista shooting Four soldiers are killed and another is critically injured by a fellow soldier during a mass shooting at a barracks in Cagayan de Oro, Northern Mindanao, Philippines. The perpetrator is shot dead. (Rappler) Politics and elections Moldovan President Maia Sandu names pro-European Union academic Dorin Recean as the next Prime Minister of Moldova. (Politico) Sports 2022 FIFA Club World Cup In association football, Spanish club Real Madrid wins a record fifth FIFA Club World Cup title and eighth club world championship after defeating Saudi Arabian club Al Hilal 5–3 in the 2022 FIFA Club World Cup final at the Prince Moulay Abdellah Stadium in Rabat, Morocco. With eight goals, the match was the highest scoring final in Club World Cup history. (Reuters via The Guardian)

---

RD: Deniz Baykal

Article: Deniz Baykal (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Hurriyet Daily News
Credits:

• Nominated by Curbon7 (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Jkaharper (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Prominent Turkish politician. Prose appears holistic; source work is needed. Curbon7 (talk) 04:08, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

RD: Howard Bragman

Article: Howard Bragman (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Variety, Deadline
Credits:

• Nominated by Kacamata (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: American "PR guru". Star-class, fully sourced article. --Kacamata! ^Dimmi!!! 22:06, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

• Almost there Prose seems holistic enough, but there are several one or two sentence paras that should be condensed. There is also one CN tag. Curbon7 (talk)

RD: O Kuk-ryol

Article: O Kuk-ryol (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Sankei
Credits:

• Nominated by Joofjoof (talk · give credit)
• Updated by 94.75.96.58 (talk · give credit) and Jkaharper (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: North Korean general. Foreign obituary first appeared on this date. Joofjoof (talk) 23:16, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

• Comment: Needs some restructuring: info in lede not mentioned elsewhere (e.g. superdollar involvement) should be moved to the body section. Otherwise this is pretty close, given the relative paucity of information coming from North Korea. Spencer^T•C 22:05, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

RD: Robert Hébras

Article: Robert Hébras (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Le Monde
Credits:

• Nominated by The Kip (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Last living survivor of the Oradour-sur-Glane massacre, article needs significant work. Came as a slight shock to be reading the article for unrelated reasons only to find that he died just hours ago. The Kip (talk) 21:55, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

• Not yet ready Sadly, the article is still a stub. Curbon7 (talk) 00:32, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

(Closed) 2023 Ohio train derailment

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Article: 2023 Ohio train derailment (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ A freight train containing several tons of vinyl chloride derailed outside of East Palestine, Ohio, and caught fire, resulting in toxic gases covering the area and evacuations throughout the region. (Post)
News source(s): AP News, NYT
Credits:

• Nominated by synapticrelay (talk · give credit)

Nominator's comments: Train derailment causing an ongoing environmental, public health, and legal disaster with likely long-term effects. Synapticrelay (talk) 21:22, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

This happened last week and the media did a terrible job covering it, but regardless now the blurb should be on the current parts of the story. Masem (t) 21:26, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

Minus the arrests and lawsuits, unless we're breaking with that tradition of waiting for trials to finish. InedibleHulk (talk) 22:38, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

There was a hydrogen tanker that exploded near Columbus and melted the traffic lights on U.S. 23 a week or two ago. Don't really see how this is any more notable. Noah^Talk 22:51, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

Doctors are generally cool with us ingesting hydrogen, less so with those toxic gases. InedibleHulk (talk) 22:58, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

Oppose - per @Black Kite, @Evan224, and @AirshipJungleman29's arguments in the Lebron James nomination that 30 thousand people dying in the earthquake in Turkey and Syria means that ITN can never be updated again.

On a serious note, support. Notable, undercovered story that can have serious implications (e.g, potential acid rain from all the excess acid in the air caused by this incident). The media has done a horrendous job of covering this story. Crusader1096 (message) 00:06, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support This is an environmental disaster whose effects can last for weeks or months that a death from these impacts is possible during that time - especially when compared to Thathri land subsidence. To be noted, reports of animal deaths are already circulating. MarioJump83 (talk) 01:16, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

  I just realized that this is stale and not a notable disaster. Oppose MarioJump83 (talk) 10:23, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

• Nomination is stale This occurred on February 3rd. -Ad Orientem (talk) 02:06, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose Once again, this doesn’t seem notable enough to post. Also, it seems stale. Blaylockjam10 (talk) 08:20, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose As it's stale (feb 3rd) Redoct87 (talk) 10:45, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

RD/Blurb: Hans Modrow

Article: Hans Modrow (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination
Blurb:  Hans Modrow, last Chairman of the Council of Ministers of East Germany and a major transitional figure in the Peaceful Revolution, dies aged 95. (Post)
News source(s): Tagesschau, Der Spiegel
Credits:

• Nominated by CDE34RFV (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Last Chairman of the Council of Ministers (GDR), paved way for first free elections, in general he played a big part in steering East Germany towards the reunification. Could be blurb-worthy as well for named reasons, but definitely needs some expansion to even be posted in RD anyway. CDE34RFV (talk) 11:02, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support major historic figure, subject to some small issues being fixed, but overall good. Editor 5426387 (talk) 14:31, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose blurb I cannot see anything substantiated in the article that credits him regarding reunification - actions are described but not impact. Article is on the short side for someone to be seen as a great or transformative figure. --Masem (t) 14:37, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose blurb, Support RD Well sourced, prose ok, size ok, Grimes2 (talk) 14:52, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
• Old Man Dies The lead gives him a suspended sentence while the body says probation. The lead also attributes this sentence to a later conviction, unlike the body. Once that's clear, Photo RD. InedibleHulk (talk) 16:58, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose blurb, support RD Did not leave major impacts. MarioJump83 (talk) 00:46, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
• Comment Article has a couple CN tags. Curbon7 (talk) 05:54, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

(Closed as duplicate; see below) Collapse of Moldova's government

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Article: Natalia Gavrilița (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ "Prime Minister of Moldova Natalia Gavrilița resigns following the collapse of her pro-Western government amid rising Russian pressure." (Post)
News source(s): Politico;BBC; Reuters
Credits:

• Nominated by Mooonswimmer (talk · give credit)
• Created by Simeon (talk · give credit)

Nominator's comments: Article could use some expansion and substantial updates, including more context regarding her resignation and the last few months of her premiership (and her premiership in general). Sources mention economic turmoil, war in Ukraine/Russian pressure, lack of support for proposed reforms... A vote will be held next week to vote in the new head of government, named by the President of Moldova. Mooonswimmer 10:44, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

support more notable than nz. Followed the protests and day after condemning the missile over head.45.112.200.3 (talk) 11:56, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

• Duplicate of New PM in Moldova. Andrew🐉(talk) 11:57, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

(Closed) UFO shot down

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Article: 2023 Alaska high-altitude object incident (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ An unidentifed flying object is shot down off of Alaska (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ An unidentifed object over Alaska is shot down by the United States
News source(s): BBC;NYT
Credits:

• Nominated by Andrew Davidson (talk · give credit)
• Created by DinoSoupCanada (talk · give credit)

Article updated

Nominator's comments: Breaking news but this seems to be a different type of craft from the balloon. Andrew🐉(talk) 00:03, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

• Wait I'd rather not post a clickbait UFO headline on ITN, especially when we could find out what that object is within the next 24 hours. NorthernFalcon (talk) 00:18, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
• Comment The blurb should mention the country in which this event took place, in order for the item to be accessible to all readers. Chrisclear (talk) 00:51, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

  How many percent don't know what Alaska is? If it said the leader of Eswatini is elected a bigger percent of readers won't know where that is, is that okay because it's a country? London, Barcelona, Portland and Portland are not countries, do we have to say Xxxgyxxx spaceships land in London, England, United Kingdom, Europe, Barcelona, Catalonia, Spain, EU, Europe, Portland, Maine, United States, North America and Portland, Oregon, United States, North America in case someone doesn't know where those countries and semi-countrylike entity are? Sagittarian Milky Way (talk) 15:47, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

• Comment The proposed blurb is written in passive voice and omits important pieces of information, such as who shot the "UFO" and why the "UFO" was shot. Chrisclear (talk) 00:51, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

Wait As said by @NorthernFalcon, we should not use UFO, we definitely have to wait to see what the DOJ, or what Joe Biden will respond with. Vriend1917 (talk) 00:50, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose - article is a stub and subject is unlikely to meet on notability. - Indefensible (talk) 01:45, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

  Agree about the questionable notability. I will propose a merge to the 2023 Chinese balloon incident if it doesn't become clearly notable on its own. – Muboshgu (talk) 02:43, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

Wait per @NorthernFalcon and @Chrisclear There simply isn't enough information out to make a decision if this is newsworthy. Aure entuluva (talk) 02:15, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose. Let's be real, either it's another stupid balloon (aka nothingburger story) or the government won't give us any information anyway. DarkSide830 (talk) 02:22, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

Wait - per above Crusader1096 (message) 02:25, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

• Wait we do not know much information about the incident, so until we get more information, we'll have to wait. TomMasterReal^TALK 02:26, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
• Wait per above. We do not have much information on about this incident, or what the flying object is, and the article's a stub and needs time to expand once the information is available, as there are only 4 references as of this vote, and 3 paragraphs. I'll support once this is expanded and more information is accessible as time goes. Tails Wx 02:36, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
• Wait, on the off chance that it was Santa's sleigh or an actual UFO. Nsk92 (talk) 02:40, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

  Agree. Let's wait the NORAD Tracks Santa official announcement before posting. Alexcalamaro (talk) 08:16, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose Article is a stub with notability in reasonable doubt. If this turns into something we can revisit the matter, but for now this reminds me of an old commercial from the land of long ago..."where's the beef?" -Ad Orientem (talk) 03:34, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose The only means this could be something more significant is 1) that the object is confirmed to be another Chinese balloon, 2) the balloons collectively are part of a spy network and 3) that this causes irreputable hard to US/China diplomatic relations. That's unlikely to be known within the week. --Masem (t) 03:48, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
• Where’s the beef? I don't see an encyclopedia entry. I see a bunch of puffery built around a headline. I thought we're supposed to reflect enduring notability. RadioKAOS / Talk to me, Billy / Transmissions 04:38, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose - If it's China at it again, then we already have a blurb on that. If it isn't, then I don't see where the significance of this lies. The ⬡ Bestagon ^T/_C 06:04, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
• Wait, or maybe update the old blurb. Maybe this was the first salvo in our war against the extraterrestrials, since this 'is' technically a UFO. --Rockstone^{Send me a message!} 06:35, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
• Wait, based on news articles I've found, there is still not much information on the topic. If it happens to be aliens or something then it will definitely be notable haha. - azpineapple | talk 06:53, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose The article is rubbish. HiLo48 (talk) 07:01, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose on quality for now Article is too short and is still marked as a stub. However, if more significant developments about this event would come into light in the coming hours and days, I might change my vote. Vida0007 (talk) 09:35, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

• Wait per above Editor 5426387 (talk) 14:27, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose Right now there's simply a flurry of superstition and too little information. I don't think the article is very useful to prospective readers. Ludicrous (talk) 16:34, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

Merge it with the balloons for context, if it comes to something.45.112.200.3 (talk) 11:53, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

• My Balloons! Why didn't anyone tell me he had one of those...things? InedibleHulk (talk) 16:37, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose, Not a good story for ITN. Alex-h (talk) 17:15, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

February 10

Portal:Current events/2023 February 10

February 10, 2023 (2023-02-10) (Friday) Armed conflicts and attacks 2022 Russian invasion of Ukraine 2022–2023 Russian strikes against Ukrainian infrastructure, Moldova–Russia relations Moldova says that Russia has fired missiles over the country at targets inside Ukraine, condemning the missile flyover as a violation of its sovereignty, and also summons the Russian ambassador for an official explanation. (BBC News) Southern Ukraine campaign A Russian Navy drone boat strikes the Zatoka railway bridge on Highway H33 near Odesa. It is believed to be the first use of the naval weapon in the war by Russian forces. (The Telegraph) Israeli–Palestinian conflict 2023 Ramot Junction attack Three Israelis, two brothers aged six and eight years old and a 20-year-old man, are killed in a car-ramming attack in Ramot, Jerusalem. (Times of Israel) Balochistan conflict Two people are killed and three others are injured when a vehicle hits a roadside bomb in Kohlu District, Balochistan, Pakistan. (AP) Islamist insurgency in the Sahel At least ten soldiers are killed and thirteen others are injured in an ambush by jihadists in Tillabéri Region, Niger. Sixteen others remain missing. (AFP via The Punch) High-altitude object events in 2023 2023 Alaska high-altitude object The White House's spokesperson John Kirby announces that the United States Air Force shot down a high-altitude object over territorial waters in Alaska, just days after shooting down a Chinese balloon over the Atlantic Ocean. The object was ordered to be shot down by U.S. President Joe Biden because it posed "a reasonable threat to the safety of civilian flight". (The Hill) Disasters and accidents Great Yarmouth explosion A World War II-era bomb weighing around 250kg explodes while being defused in Great Yarmouth, Norfolk, England. No injuries are reported. (BBC News) Two people are killed and 20 others are injured in a building collapse in Damanhour, Beheira Governorate, Egypt. (AP) At least 35 people are injured when a bus overturns near Magdeburg, Saxony-Anhalt, Germany. (AP) Law and crime 2017–present Peruvian political crisis 2022–2023 Peruvian protests The Permanent Assembly of the Congress of Peru approves a motion to file criminal charges against former president Pedro Castillo. The charges include criminal organization, traffic of influences, and collusion. (europapress via La Nación) Crime in South Africa Two people, including South African rapper AKA, are shot dead outside a restaurant in Durban, KwaZulu-Natal. The assailants fled the scene on foot, according to police. (BBC News) A Hong Kong court awards an Indonesian domestic worker more than HK$860,000 (US$110,000) in damages for the abuse she received from her former employers, who were convicted and imprisoned in 2013. (AFP via The Straits Times) Politics and elections Moldovan prime minister Natalia Gavrilița resigns amid an economic crisis and the collateral effects of the ongoing war in neighboring Ukraine. (Reuters) Toronto mayor John Tory announces he will be resigning following revelations he had an extramarital affair with a staffer during the COVID-19 pandemic. (CBC) Sports 2023 Turkey–Syria earthquake 2022–23 Süper Lig Hatayspor withdraws from the top division of Turkish football due to the earthquake. (Reuters) 2023 Men's EuroHockey Indoor Club Cup The men's EuroHockey Indoor Club Cup, scheduled to be held from 17 to 19 February in Alanya, Turkey, is cancelled due to the impact of the earthquake. (La Libre) (European Hockey Federation)

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RD: Sergey Tereshchenko

Article: Sergey Tereshchenko (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): KazInform
Credits:

• Nominated by Curbon7 (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Agneta 92 (talk · give credit) and Jkaharper (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Former prime minister of Kazakhstan. Article is close, some light source work is needed. Curbon7 (talk) 04:05, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

RD: René-Samuel Sirat

Article: René-Samuel Sirat (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Times of Israel
Credits:

• Nominated by Curbon7 (talk · give credit)
• Created by Jmanlucas (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Jmanlucas (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Chief rabbi of France. Needs some source work. Curbon7 (talk) 04:00, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

RD: Marguerite Jauzelon

Article: Marguerite Jauzelon (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Clicanoo.re
Credits:

• Nominated by Curbon7 (talk · give credit)
• Created by Jmanlucas (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Jmanlucas (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: French WWII nurse. Needs some source work. Curbon7 (talk) 04:00, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

RD: AKA (rapper)

Article: AKA (rapper) (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): NY Times
Credits:

• Nominated by Ad Orientem (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: One of the most prominent rappers from South Africa murdered. Referencing needs some work. Ad Orientem (talk) 16:06, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

• Not yet ready Prose is satisfactory, but the Awards and nominations section is almost entirely unreferenced. Curbon7 (talk) 04:15, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

New PM in Moldova

Article: Dorin Recean (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Dorin Recean is appointed Prime Minister of Moldova after Natalia Gavrilița resigns. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ Following the resignation of Natalia Gavrilița, Dorin Recean is nominated Prime Minister of Moldova.
Alternative blurb II: ​ Dorin Recean is appointed Prime Minister of Moldova following the resignation of Natalia Gavrilița.
News source(s): Reuters
Credits:

• Nominated by BastianMAT (talk · give credit)

The nominated event is listed on WP:ITN/R, so each occurrence is presumed to be important enough to post. Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article and update meet WP:ITNCRIT, not the significance.

Nominator's comments: ITN/R as the head of government is Prime Minister in Moldova. BastianMAT (talk) 16:04, 10 February 2023 (UTC)

Not support yet appointed or nominated? Also, article needs a picture. QueensanditsCrazy (talk) 18:20, 10 February 2023 (UTC)

Dorin's article says "nominated to become Prime Minister of Moldova", so I think that's probably the right choice here. TheCorriynial (talk) 18:23, 10 February 2023 (UTC)

A picture, though preferred, is not a requirement for ITN posting. Curbon7 (talk) 18:23, 10 February 2023 (UTC)

Support Altblurb 1 Article of Dorin seems fine to me. And since generally leadership changes are posted, I can't see any reason not to post this one. TheCorriynial (talk) 18:17, 10 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support blurb or alt2 if we're going to be consistent with how we snubbed Jacinda Ardern last month. --⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 19:20, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
• My six sides are confused - The article's lead section says nominated, but the Career section says appointed. The ⬡ Bestagon ^T/_C 06:10, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
• Comment is there a difference between appointed and nominated? - azpineapple | talk 06:58, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

  Appointed means he will be PM. Nominated means that some people (probably his party) want him to be PM. The ⬡ Bestagon ^T/_C 07:40, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

  I see, in that case support alt2 or blurb because he is the PM-designate [6]. Cheers - azpineapple | ^T/_C 14:20, 11 February 2023 (UTC) _{(also i copied ur signature thingy i think it is very cool)}

• Comment A change of PM is a type of story that we usually post. I am still missing some more substantial updates. The best article at the moment on the topic seems to be Gavrilița Cabinet, but still needs updates. Recean's article has one-sentence update. --Tone 17:31, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support This is very obvious and shouldn't be snubbed. MarioJump83 (talk) 01:47, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
• So it seems that Recean is now set to be PM, so that would be signifcant enough to post (as ITN/R), but the proposed target needs significant work. The ⬡ Bestagon ^T/_C 12:09, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support alt1 – ArionEstar (talk) 09:37, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose Bolded article is wholly inadequate for the main page. There's literally nothing in there about the last 8.5 years of his life, between November 2014 and when he was selected as the new PM. There's also almost nothing in the article about the context for how he was selected as the PM. This could be posted if all of those people above supporting actually worked on making the article good enough for the main page. --Jayron32 13:32, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
• Not support yet The article should be improved. --Mhhossein ^talk 05:41, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

RD: Amjad Islam Amjad

Article: Amjad Islam Amjad (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Nation, DAWN
Credits:

• Nominated by Ainty Painty (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 Ainty Painty (talk) 14:14, 10 February 2023 (UTC)

• Not ready significant sourcing issues, lots of unsourced content. Tails Wx 14:43, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
• Comment I don't know where I would even possibly begin trying to source this one. The prose is also practically nonexistant. It will take a true Herculean effort to get this ready within 3 days. Curbon7 (talk) 06:04, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

February 9

Portal:Current events/2023 February 9

February 9, 2023 (2023-02-09) (Thursday) Armed conflicts and attacks 2022 Russian invasion of Ukraine 2022–2023 Russian strikes against Ukrainian infrastructure Russia launches drone and cruise missile strikes across the south and east of Ukraine with large explosions reported in the Dnipropetrovsk, Luhansk, Mykolaiv, and Zaporizhzhia oblasts. (The Guardian) Jihadist insurgency in Burkina Faso Médecins Sans Frontières (MSF) suspends its operations in north-west Burkina Faso following the killings of two of its Burkinabé aid workers near Dédougou. (Africanews) Disasters and accidents 2023 Turkey–Syria earthquake The death toll from the earthquakes in Turkey and Syria increases to 21,051. (AFP via RFI) Four people are killed and several houses and buildings are destroyed by a 5.1 magnitude earthquake in Papua, Indonesia. (Xinhua via The Star) Seven people are killed and nine others are injured in a gas explosion at a residential building in Novosibirsk, Russia. (AP) Four people are injured after a PAC 750-XL aircraft crashes in Jiwaka Province, Papua New Guinea. (The National) Health and environment Travel during the COVID-19 pandemic COVID-19 pandemic in South Korea South Korea resumes the issuance of short-term travel visas to Chinese citizens following a one-month suspension due to China's COVID-19 surge. (AFP via The Business Times) International relations Belarus–Poland relations Poland announces the closure of a major border crossing with Belarus "until further notice" amid heightened tensions between the two countries. There are currently only two checkpoints open between the two nations. (Reuters) Law and crime 2023 Turkey–Syria earthquake Three inmates are killed and 12 others are injured after soldiers open fire during a prison riot in Hatay Province, Turkey. The prisoners were demanding to see their families who were affected by the recent earthquake. (Gazete Duvar) The government of Nicaragua releases 222 political prisoners and sends them to the United States. (Reuters)

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RD: Jean-Maurice Dehousse

Article: Jean-Maurice Dehousse (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Le Soir
Credits:

• Nominated by Curbon7 (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Belgian MP and MEP. Needs prose work. Curbon7 (talk) 03:56, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

(Posted) RD: Marcos Alonso

Article: Marcos Alonso (footballer, born 1959) (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Reuters
Credits:

• Nominated by Indefensible (talk · give credit)
• Updated by 193.137.135.5 (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Spanish professional football player, coach, manager. Indefensible (talk) 08:00, 10 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support Article is well-cited and holistic. The lede could use some work, but it is sufficient for our purposes. Curbon7 (talk) 13:34, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support, Article is fine. Alex-h (talk) 17:02, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
• Posted Sam Walton (talk) 09:03, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

RD/Blurb: Burt Bacharach

Article: Burt Bacharach (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination
Blurb:  American songwriter Burt Bacharach dies at the age of 94. (Post)
News source(s): The Guardian
Credits:

• Nominated by Mooonswimmer (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 Mooonswimmer 15:19, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Weak oppose The article is really quite good, and its almost there, but there's some minor referencing work that needs to be handled; the "film and television" section is mostly unreferenced, and one vital cn tag in the personal life section. If those get fixed, this would be good to go for the main page. No need to ping me to change my vote, if those items are fixed, consider this a full support. --Jayron32 15:47, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  @Jayron32: The issues have been fixed. The reason why I'm pinging you is to see if your support is directed towards RD only, a blurb, or either or? 38.106.246.200 (talk) 20:30, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  RD only. There's nothing else to say than that he died. RD conveys that fine. --Jayron32 21:19, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

Support RD, Weak Oppose current Blurb right now. (While the Raindrops Keep Falling on My Head) Likely though, it will need editing. But his music writing career, writing #1 hits for Herb Alpert & The Tijuana Brass, The Carpenters, The four artists on That's What Friends Are For, Christopher Cross, B.J. Thomas, and not to mention writing most of Dionne Warwick's most popular songs, a big hit for Tom Jones (singer), and many more makes this an easy support for legacy. Blurb should probably include Grammy Wins, and or big hits he wrote. Maybe a Alt blurb, something like "American songwriter and Bacharach Sound creator, Burt Bacharach dies at the age of 94." TheCorriynial (talk) 19:11, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

Legacy doesn't matter here, because every person (or even animal for that matter) with an article is important enough to post, as the template states. The ⬡ Bestagon ^T/_C 16:06, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

Maybe blurb is meant by the author? Kirill C1 (talk) 17:46, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

Will strike, but I'm pretty sure there was no blurb proposal when I made this comment. The ⬡ Bestagon ^T/_C 06:00, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support subject to issues being fixed, but isn't Bacharach noteworthy enough for a blurb? Mjroots (talk) 18:04, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

@TheCorriynial: So you support the idea of him having a blurb in general, but your opposition is towards the proposed blurb listed. 38.106.246.200 (talk) 20:28, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support blurb Has won three Oscars, numerous Grammys, his songs have been recorded by over 1,000 artists (per his article), the Musical style section demonstrates the impact he had on music (Bacharach Sound), and one of the most influential composers of pop music in the 20th century. Definitely influential in his field. --38.106.246.200 (talk) 18:29, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  sigh

  "Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD." The Kip (talk) 18:38, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  People are already voting on a blurb, so I've changed the template to make that clear. Pawnkingthree (talk) 18:45, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  I believe this user is justifying why he merits a blurb not just an RD tag in general. --TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 18:58, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support RD and blurb Article's sourcing issues are fixed and I could get behind supporting a blurb because of the impact he had on pop music in the previous century. --TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 18:58, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
• Old Man Dies He had an impact on pop in the previous century, last week and now that he's dead. This event changes nothing beyond personal life. There's no story, just an obituary, and a Photo RD is a more fitting fan nod. InedibleHulk (talk) 20:38, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose Blurb. Not quite as transformative as most individuals who we would blurb. DarkSide830 (talk) 22:15, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support RD. On the level of quality, the article seems ready to post. All living people with articles who die are eligible for RD from a notability perspective, so I think posting this at RD is more than acceptable. — Red-tailed hawk _(nest) 23:06, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support RD, Oppose Blurb Death has received decent coverage. Influence on 20th century music I would say is probably to support RD. Oppose blurb only because I can't find much he was notable for other than music. Betty White, for example was an advocate for several causes apart from her acting career, and of course she was a major name in the entertainment industry for seven decades.--Estar8806 (talk) 00:15, 10 February 2023 (UTC)

  Bacharach industrially exploded 771 months ago, so he's only about five years short (and still across eight decades). InedibleHulk (talk) 01:27, 10 February 2023 (UTC)

• Weak oppose blurb I feel he's "famous" and certainly has a lot of famous works associated with him, but fame is not the same as being a major or transformative figure (eg we're in Carrie Fisher territory here). That said, there's some elements in the article that hint towards that and if his impact was better spelled out, I'd likely be willing to support. --Masem (t) 01:19, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
• Not Ready for RD Referencing as usual. In particular the discography sections need work. Neutral on blurb. But the article is not ready for now. -Ad Orientem (talk) 01:37, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support RD, Oppose Blurb "Old man dies of old age." His article will tell what he's famous for. HiLo48 (talk) 02:23, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
• Picture The subject's name is already distinctive and well-recognised and the proposed blurb text adds no value. The key difference is using the picture which we should do as we have one. We should use RD pictures more often to keep the ITN section looking fresh every day. A picture is worth a thousand words. Andrew🐉(talk) 09:15, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
• Comment I've added the "ready" tag, as it appears this has the support and quality to go to the main page. If an admin (not me, I am involved) could take care of that, that'd be awesome. Thanks in advance! --Jayron32 12:52, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
• Unsure if ready There are still a couple of CN tags in the prose, but this isn't that big a deal. More pressingly is that around half of the Honors and awards appears to be unsourced, including some major (RE: contentious) awards, and nearly the entire Discography is unsourced. Regardless, per Andrew above, this seems like an obvious candidate to use Photo RD for, which we haven't done in a while. Curbon7 (talk) 12:56, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
• Not ready per Curbon7, especially with the sparse sourcing for the Discography section. I would suggest looking to his discography article to remedy this issue. Aeromachinator (talk to me here) 15:39, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support RD, oppose blurb Article's in good shape for an RD; however, not quite as transformative/universally known as our traditional death blurb standards, nor did he die young/unusually. The Kip (talk) 15:43, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support RD and blurb. "a dominant force in American popular music for half a century",see variety

https://variety.com/2023/music/obituaries-people-news/burt-bacharach-dead-american-music-1235517943/.Kirill C1 (talk) 19:25, 10 February 2023 (UTC)

• Comment - He was transformative in the musical world, but not transformative enough. He had a legacy, but not enough of a legacy. He won awards, but not enough awards. Once again, the transient and vacillating nature of the "major figures" criterion plagues our process.--⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 20:05, 10 February 2023 (UTC)

  "He won awards, but not enough awards".He won three Academy Awards,2 Golden Globes, BAFTA, six Grammy Awards(and Lifetime Achievement Award), and one Emmy Award. Kirill C1 (talk) 10:34, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

  That's my point. That's not enough. For whatever reason, ITN has collectively decided that isn't enough to establish that someone is a major figure. ⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 16:27, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose blurb based on my very subjective "never heard of him" standard. Sandstein 11:17, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

  You must have heard Magic Moments. Kirill C1 (talk) 14:10, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose per above

Editor 5426387 (talk) 15:02, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support blurb Is there a better-known, or more important, popular music songwriter in the English-speaking world (not including figures also well-known as performers)? Bacharachwas absolutely transformative. He created a unique style of popular music that became much imitated and he composed a lot of songs that are incredibly well-known in the English-speaking world, songs that have united performers in rock, soul, R&B, country, jazz, easy listening, punk, disco, funk, Latin, garage rock, any major pop genre you can think of. Nat King Cole recorded a Bacharach song in 1952, The Beatles did in 1963. Isaac Hayes and Carpenters were both cutting his songs in 1970. If we don't blurb Bacharach, are we just not interested in blurbing anyone best known as a songwriter for other performers? Humbledaisy (talk) 15:55, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose blurb, support RD Transformative figure in his field (20th century Western pop music) and won a lot of awards, but his legacies, and in particular genres of Chamber pop and Shibuya-kei, has been all but left out in 21st century as the zeitgeist and musical styles keep changing. MarioJump83 (talk) 00:42, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
• Weak oppose blurb I feel like I may have used him as an example when suggesting which composers might warrant a blurb when a weaker suggestion was made in years past. Bacharach was unquestionably, truly, transformative in the field of pop music, over several decades. Why do I oppose, then? Because he was just one of the figures I thought of, and if it is busy at the top (Lloyd Webber, Williams, Vaughan Williams, Guthnadottir...), it is perhaps a field where no figure is so outstanding. If we'd have to blurb them all, it is better to blurb none and let RD show them. As an aside, I am leaning more and more to just RD'ing everyone, as was the intention when that line was introduced... Yes, ITN's primary purpose is to direct readers to articles we have when current news items prompt them to seek further, more comprehensive, information, and the life of a recently-deceased celebrity is certainly there. But all that needs is a name, no matter who it is, the story is the same - unless the death itself is a story, like e.g. Kobe, then it should be judged as any other news item. Kingsif (talk) 13:00, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

  "If we'd have to blurb them all, it is better to blurb none and let RD show them"it is better to blurb them all Kirill C1 (talk) 14:00, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

• Comment There is a rough consensus for RD-only, however, there are still referencing issues. Two or three cn-s in the main text I don't particularly mind, but the discography is completely unsourced and this is thus a no-go at the moment. --Tone 14:22, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

(Closed) Thathri Disaster 2023

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Article: Thathri Disaster 2023 (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ ​Thathri disaster has effected over 23 buildings and 21 residential houses. (Post)
News source(s): The Wire (India), The Economic Times, Outlook (Indian magazine), News18 Hindi
Credits:

• Created and nominated by TheChunky (talk · give credit)

Nominator's comments: The disaster is ongoing and may remain in the news for long time. ❯❯❯ Chunky aka Al Kashmiri (✍️) 06:53, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

Is this a request that this be placed as "ongoing", or that the event be covered as occurring on February 9? — Red-tailed hawk _(nest) 07:05, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

Red-tailed hawk This is an ongoing event as the geologists are yet to submit final report and effected families are still in rehabilitation centres, according to news. But I want a blurb. ❯❯❯ Chunky aka Al Kashmiri (✍️) 07:14, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

Noted. — Red-tailed hawk _(nest) 07:15, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Wait Is there any updates on the disaster? I'm also looking forward to deaths and damages from the disaster. I'm also concerned with the title of the article. It should be 2023 Thathri disaster. MarioJump83 (talk) 07:26, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  I am not looking forward to the deaths and damages from the disaster. They are expected to be terrible. — Red-tailed hawk _(nest) 07:29, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  MarioJump83, the title suggestion is good. There are no reported deaths, as per news sources, all the people were evacuated safely when the minor cracks in the building started developing in the beginning.❯❯❯ Chunky aka Al Kashmiri (✍️) 07:42, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  That's a very good news to hear. Hopefully everyone in Kashmir is safe. MarioJump83 (talk) 08:20, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose I have checked the article myself and it is good, but I have to apologize that the event itself was not that significant for blurb, as there were no deaths outside infrastructural collapses so far. MarioJump83 (talk) 08:20, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose per MJ83. The ⬡ Bestagon ^T/_C 12:31, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose. The blurb & nomination don't specify what type of 'disaster' this is. It turns out to be subsidence that has cracked several buildings, causing them to be evacuated, but no casualties. That's unfortunate for those affected, but I'm not convinced this is significant enough to even merit an article, let alone an ITN blurb. Modest Genius ^talk 13:03, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose this is effectively a slow moving earthquake, but giving the time for people to evacuate and/or make other preparations to minimize damage. Its in that "if a tree fell in a forest" category of news, that we should document it but its not ITN groundbreaking. --Masem (t) 13:13, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose per all of the above. What I'm reading in the sources I can find this in does not make it seem to me that this qualifies for ITN posting. --Jayron32 13:14, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

February 8

Portal:Current events/2023 February 8

February 8, 2023 (2023-02-08) (Wednesday) Business and economy Proposed acquisition of Activision Blizzard by Microsoft The UK Competition and Markets Authority provisionally concludes that the proposed acquisition of Activision Blizzard by Microsoft will likely lead to a substantial loss of competition in the console market and could strengthen Microsoft's position in cloud gaming. (CNBC) The Supreme Court of Nigeria postpones the demonetization of the old naira banknotes initially scheduled for January 31, then later rescheduled to February 11, citing a supply shortage of the redesigned banknotes. (CNN) International relations International presidential trips made by Volodymyr Zelenskyy 2023 visit by Volodymyr Zelenskyy to the United Kingdom Ukrainian president Volodymyr Zelenskyy visits the United Kingdom in his second trip outside Ukraine since the beginning of the Russian invasion, meeting with King Charles III and Prime Minister Rishi Sunak, and addressing Parliament at Westminster Hall. (Reuters) France–Ukraine relations, Germany–Ukraine relations Following his UK visit, Zelenskyy visits France to meet President Emmanuel Macron and German chancellor Olaf Scholz. (AFP via RFI) Law and crime Munster Technological University ransomware attack Munster Technological University in the Republic of Ireland confirms that the incident affecting its computers is a ransomware attack. (The Journal) Laval daycare attack Two children are killed and six others are injured when a bus crashes into a daycare centre in Laval, Quebec, Canada. The driver is arrested and charged with homicide and dangerous driving. (La Presse) A court in Minsk, Belarus, sentences Polish–Belarusian activist Andrzej Poczobut to eight years in prison for criticising president Alexander Lukashenko. (RFE/RL) Politics and elections Seoul Halloween crowd crush Lee Sang-min, the Minister of the Interior and Safety of South Korea, is impeached for his handling of the 2022 Seoul Halloween crowd crush. He is the first cabinet member of South Korea to be impeached. (AP) Science and technology A data center outage leaves Twitter users in the United States and Canada unable to send messages and receiving an error message informing them that they have "exceeded the daily limit for sending tweets". (Fortune)

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RD: Shirley Fulton

Article: Shirley Fulton (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The News & Observer
Credits:

• Updated and nominated by Cielquiparle (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: First black female judge in North Carolina Superior Court; also it's US Black History Month Cielquiparle (talk) 13:04, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

(Posted) RD: Ivan Silayev

Article: Ivan Silayev (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): RFE/RL
Credits:

• Nominated by Indefensible (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Prime Minister of the Soviet Union. - Indefensible (talk) 08:19, 10 February 2023 (UTC)

Support, though the final prime minister of the USSR may well be deserving of a blurb. — Red-tailed hawk _(nest) 08:23, 10 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support RD Quite well-cited and holistic. A few spots need a little work (a couple of Who tags, some extraneous info, and some pure red-links that should be inter-language links), but these are not relevant for our purposes. Curbon7 (talk) 13:29, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support Some red-links remain but I have found no {cn} tags. This looks good to go. Vida0007 (talk) 09:38, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

  WP:REDLINK. Redlinks are fine, obviously. Curbon7 (talk) 19:19, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

• Posted. Sam Walton (talk) 10:38, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

RD: Dennis Lotis

Article: Dennis Lotis (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): BBC
Credits:

• Nominated by Indefensible (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Jkaharper (talk · give credit) and Curbon7 (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: South African-British singer, actor. - Indefensible (talk) 08:11, 10 February 2023 (UTC)

• Comment One CN tag in the prose, and the Filmography section is entirely unreferenced. Curbon7 (talk) 13:22, 10 February 2023 (UTC)

  Support I've gone ahead and sourced the filmography and hid the one unsourced sentence. I think the article is just holistic enough, covering the major bits of his career. Curbon7 (talk) 06:02, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

RD: Igor Mangushev

Article: Igor Mangushev (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): BBC
Credits:

• Nominated by Red-tailed hawk (talk · give credit)
• Updated by CT55555 (talk · give credit) and Red-tailed hawk (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Russian military commander. — Red-tailed hawk _(nest) 17:36, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

• Weak Support Article is solidly sourced if a bit thin on length. But I believe it is adequate for RD, if barely. -Ad Orientem (talk) 17:56, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  @Ad Orientem: The article's been expanded a bit over 2X since your comment above. Is the length still an issue for you? — Red-tailed hawk _(nest) 03:40, 10 February 2023 (UTC)

Much improved. -Ad Orientem (talk) 03:52, 10 February 2023 (UTC)

• This article was just created today and might be notable mainly based on the circumstances of his death. Even the subject's native Russian language article was only started a few days ago. - Indefensible (talk) 01:05, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  The sourcing in the article covers both his pre-war activities (which were the subject of significant coverage by multiple independent reliable sources in and of themselves), as well as his activities during the war. His death is what alerted me to his existence, but there's more to the article than just his death (his death is suspicious, but he's probably notable even prior to the coverage of his death in my view). — Red-tailed hawk _(nest) 01:20, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  Much of his prior notability seems to be due to founding a paramilitary company which itself just had its article created today, however most of the supporting refs are in Russian so I cannot assess them. Usually I do not comment on notability for RD but seems like a gray area here. - Indefensible (talk) 01:28, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  @Indefensible: The article has been expanded a good bit, and it now better details the individual's pre-war activities. Does this address your concerns? — Red-tailed hawk _(nest) 22:32, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

  Sorry, going to abstain on this article. - Indefensible (talk) 01:45, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support I've been mulling over this one for several days, but I think it is sufficient. The article is well-cited, and it seems holistic enough for our purposes. Curbon7 (talk) 00:30, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

Chile wildfires

Wildfire formation captured by GOES-16

Article: 2023 Chile wildfires (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ A megadrought and heatwave cause forest fires and a state of emergency in Chile. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ Forest fires in Chile kill at least 26 people and injure more than 1,260 others.
News source(s): NASA; New Scientist; Reuters; Al Jazeera;Guardian
Credits:

• Nominated by Andrew Davidson (talk · give credit)
• Created by NaveenNkadalaveni (talk · give credit)

Article updated

Nominator's comments: This seems similar to equivalent events in the northern hemisphere and is breaking records. Andrew🐉(talk) 09:42, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support upon removal of orange tags. Anarchyte (talk) 10:30, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• As there appear to be at least 26 deaths, that should be added to blurb and that would definitely make this a ITN item (barring article quality). --Masem (t) 13:37, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support Article is a bit short, but well referenced, and probably is still long enough to justify sending readers to it. Reliable sources are covering the story in a way that shows that people are likely to have heard about it. Checks every box. --Jayron32 13:38, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support once expanded - At this point, there is not much about the wildfires themselves but about reactions and foreign aid. The ⬡ Bestagon ^T/_C 14:32, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support – Article looks to be of sufficient quality. "Megadrought" is currently not used in the article, so either the blurb needs to change or the article needs to be expanded. ~Maplestrip/Mable (chat) 14:54, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support as Ongoing, Weak Oppose Blurb. The fires have already been ongoing for some time to the point where a regular blurb may be inappropriate for this item. Ideally we should have blurbed this already and then moved to Ongoing, but at this point I would argue just a direct move to Ongoing would be more appropriate. DarkSide830 (talk) 17:23, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  Given that news sources are now heavily picking this up, and that the Turkey/Syria blurb will be ongoing if it falls off, I think just a normal blurb here us fine. Masem (t) 17:27, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  I guess it's fine. My concern really is where exactly this item falls on the list. Obviously this was nomed today, but the fires didn't just start. In theory this item could be more stale than the last blurb depending on where you think it should fall. I guess it's not an issue but I still think Ongoing is a better place for this item. DarkSide830 (talk) 17:34, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  Comment. Added an alt-blurb that I believe better focuses on the impacts of the event (still opposed to a blurb, but I would favor this one in the event this gets a blurb eventually). DarkSide830 (talk) 17:31, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support as Ongoing Like said by @DarkSide830, these have been going on for some time that where a blurb will probably be too little. Vriend1917 (talk) 21:05, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support The article is still on the short side but adequately referenced, with no outstanding concerns to be addressed. Schwede66 21:30, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Ongoing, If Anything Disasters like these are textbook news, but this is neither a beginning nor end, just this point in time. If blurbed later, the numbers will be higher, so blurbing now is objectively less [insert significant adjective]. I just hope somebody's prepared to keep it updated. InedibleHulk (talk) 00:42, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

Support, per above. Crusader1096 (message) 04:00, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support, but remove the "megadrought" claim as it doesn't appear in the article. —Mx. Granger (talk · contribs) 04:02, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• I got the megadrought aspect from the NASA report and they got it from the World Meteorological Organization. Other respectable sources use this term and it appears in the article too. Anyway, whatever you call it, the point is that the drought is a big one – "the longest in at least 1,000 years" – and is relevant and significant too. Andrew🐉(talk) 11:08, 10 February 2023 (UTC)

• Thanks for the response. I'm happy to support the original blurb (because the megadrought is mentioned in the article again) or the alt blurb. —Mx. Granger (talk · contribs) 18:46, 10 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support, per above. MarioJump83 (talk) 07:29, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
• Weak support altblurb. Wildfires in summer are a common occurrence, but this does seem more destructive than normal. The article is pretty basic, with half of the content being reaction statements, but does meet our minimum requirements. There does not appear to be any justification for saying 'megadrought' in the blurb. Modest Genius ^talk 13:08, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support altblurb. This is a pretty significant and destructive wildfire, I'd say that its pretty notable. - azpineapple | talk 15:04, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support as ongoing. Bedivere (talk) 15:08, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose on quality There isn’t enough info about the fires in the article. Blaylockjam10 (talk) 07:53, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support Major environmental event with considerable death toll. ArionEstar (talk) 01:30, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

(Posted) RD: Branka Veselinović

Article: Branka Veselinović (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Danas, b92
Credits:

• Updated and nominated by Vacant0 (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Serbian actress, died at age 104 --Vacant0 (talk) 09:31, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support. I came to nominate. Serbian actress who died at age 104, having acted until her death apparently. Article was created and well sourced by sadly vanished Ashleyyoursmile. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:26, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support Solid article, well referenced. Grimes2 (talk) 14:14, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support The article's organization is a little unorthodox, but not relevant for our purposes. What is relevant: the article is very well referenced and holistic. Curbon7 (talk) 14:22, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support Article in good shape. Accidentally nominated this article twice, my bad. --TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 00:59, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
• Posted Stephen 03:49, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

RD: Ahmet Eyüp Türkaslan

Article: Ahmet Eyüp Türkaslan (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Guardian
Credits:

• Nominated by Abcmaxx (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Turkish goalkeeper for Yeni Malatyaspor; victim of the recent earthquake. Article in good enough shape. Abcmaxx (talk) 08:22, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

• Not yet ready Article is very short, to the point that the paragraph about his death is a near equal length to the rest of the prose combined. Curbon7 (talk) 14:20, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

RD: Miroslav Blažević

Article: Miroslav Blažević ‎ (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Index.hr, Mehr News (English), The Guardian
Credits:

• Nominated by DragonFederal (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Croatian football manager --DragonFederal (talk) 07:25, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

• Needs lots of referencing work, otherwise the article is detailed. --Tone 09:47, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support: Just a few moments earlier I overlooked this section and nominated Ćiro myself. That said, this is one of the most notable figures in modern Croatian sports; The Guardian article sums it up and the article speaks for itself. The article needs more references but is adequate as-is for RD section IMO. -Vipz (talk) 22:09, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  The standards established by WP:ITNQUALITY require the article to be very well-referenced, which means entirely or almost entirely referenced with reliable sources; in this instance, significant chunks of the article are completely uncited. We do not assess for importance or notability for RD either; as the bottom of the yellow box states: "Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post". Curbon7 (talk) 02:39, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Not yet ready Closer than it was earlier in the week, but still significant sourcing issues. Curbon7 (talk) 04:09, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

(Pulled) LeBron James sets scoring record

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Articles: LeBron James (talk · history · tag) and List of National Basketball Association career scoring leaders (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ LeBron James (pictured) scores his 38,388th career point, surpassing Kareem Abdul-Jabbar to become the all-time leading scorer in the National Basketball Association. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ LeBron James (pictured) surpasses Kareem Abdul-Jabbar to become the all-time leading scorer in the National Basketball Association.
News source(s): NYT, NPR, BBC, The Guardian, Der Spiegel, Xinhua, Al Jazeera
Credits:

• Updated and nominated by Muboshgu (talk · give credit)
• Updated by RockinJack18 (talk · give credit) and Nintendoswitchfan (talk · give credit)

Nominator's comments: "The record had seemed to be set in stone, untouched for decades even by greats like Michael Jordan and Kobe Bryant." says NYT. – Muboshgu (talk) 05:18, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

• Very Slight Support as far as I can tell there hasn't been a precedent on these types of nominations. Cristiano breaking the goalscoring record wasn't posted but this is slightly different because we knew the true record. Anyways I think this is notable enough but I know that American sports are not as notable compared to the likes of real football and cricket so I am willing to change my mind on this. Jbvann05 05:35, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  We posted Magnus Carlsen earning the highest chess rating ever, so there’s some precedence. The Kip (talk) 18:08, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support probably the biggest record in basketball, likely won't be broken for decades. Also, LeBron James is a GA, and it has been updated. NorthernFalcon (talk) 05:39, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support. Probably snowball's chance in Heck this gets posted, but as NorthernFalcon notes, this is the biggest record in basketball. Also the NBA is the most prominent league of one of the most biggest sports in the world. DarkSide830 (talk) 05:45, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support - interesting hook and good opportunity to put a GA on the main page. Anarchyte (talk) 05:55, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

Support - notable basketball record, likely won't be broken for a while as @NorthernFalcon noted. Well written GA too. Also, you know that the folks who will be rushing to write oppose would happily slap Messi or Ronaldo's face on the main page with a lengthy blurb because "FoOtBaLl Is A dIfFeReNt BeAsT." Crusader1096 (message) 06:30, 8 February 2023

There IS a fundamental difference. Soccer is international. The NBA isn't. Significantly, this is the case for several sports Americans believe are more important than most international sports. This isn't necessarily an oppose vote from me. Just an observation of the problem facing us here. HiLo48 (talk) 09:03, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

While basketball isn't as popular as soccer, it has intl. popularity. In addition to the US, it's also popular in Europe & China. Blaylockjam10 (talk) 09:28, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

Why do people keep saying this? Whether it is internationally popular is irrelevant. "Please do not Oppose an item solely because the event is only relating to a single country, or failing to relate to one. This applies to a high percentage of the content we post and is generally unproductive." --Rockstone^{Send me a message!} 10:06, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

Why do people keep saying things that DON'T relate to what they're complaining about?????? I didn't oppose the nomination. I was simply describing the difficulty of evaluating this achievement in comparison to ITN level achievements outside the USA. A huge pile-on of Americans saying "This is great" is never going to convince non-Americans. Would Americans accept a record goal scoring achievement in Australian Football as ITN worthy? I'm really asking if there is any way of objectively evaluating an achievement like this? Or do we simply accept what a lot of excited Americans say? HiLo48 (talk) 10:15, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

Personally I'm not sure what else can be said about this nom. This is, unequivocally the most important record in the most imporyant league in one of the most globally prominent sports. You can disagree that it's notable, but what else CAN be said here? DarkSide830 (talk) 17:15, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

I DID NOT DISAGREE THAT IT IS NOTABLE!!!!!!!!!! HiLo48 (talk) 21:14, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

My comment was regarding the lack of a compelling argument that may appeal to the non-American editor. That is what I said before and my point is if that doesn't do it than you simply must not want this posted (I mean to be using "you" in a general rather than pointed sense). DarkSide830 (talk) 02:32, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

To my knowledge, Australian football doesn't have such a record – however, I would, of course, support a soccer equivalent. DecafPotato (talk) 18:41, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

IN AUSTRALIAN FOOTBALL THEY KICK GOALS, SO OF COURSE IT HAS SUCH A RECORD!!!!!! HiLo48 (talk) 21:14, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

I WOULDN'T MIND THAT RECORD!!!!!! Sagittarian Milky Way (talk) 22:03, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

We've had NBA stars and superstars from Argentina, Cameroon, Canada, China, Congo (Kinshasa not Brazzaville), Croatia, Dominican Republic, France, Germany, Greece, Nigeria, Serbia, Slovenia and Spain who generally had no connection to USA till they were strong enough to play in the NBA or almost. So many of the NBA stars are from overseas right now that we could we might not even be in the '24 Olympic final. Sagittarian Milky Way (talk) 22:01, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support That’s a very big record! -TenorTwelve (talk) 07:21, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Uhmm… Correct me if I'm wrong, but I seem to recall that there was an unwritten custom of not including (or not supporting) sports records. _-_Alsor (talk) 07:32, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  Whether that exists or not (first I've heard of it) it's consensus on a case-by-case basis that matters. Pawnkingthree (talk) 00:32, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support This is an outstanding achievement comparable to Magnus Carlsen's record-breaking FIDE chess rating, which we posted ten years ago.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 07:56, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Comment I've proposed an alternative blurb by linking to the List of National Basketball Association career scoring leaders and removing the record-breaking point (his tally is now up to 38,390, so the 38,388th point may be misleading).--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 08:04, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support LeBron broke an important record that's stood for decades in a major sport. Blaylockjam10 (talk) 08:06, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Weak oppose – It is only a single-sentence update to the article, which doesn't seem enough to me for a feature. It being a lovely GA does balance it out well, tho. ~Maplestrip/Mable (chat) 09:17, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  @Maplestrip: I added a few more sentences. Is that enough to get your support? Blaylockjam10 (talk) 17:58, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  Neutral – This is definitely better and more acceptable for the front page. The shortness of the update still doesn't excite me, but I have no problems with this having been posted. Thank you for your work, Blaylockjam :) ~Maplestrip/Mable (chat) 08:10, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose There are hundreds of books full of such stuff: Basketball Super Stats; Slam Dunk! Basketball Facts and Stats; The Best Book of Basketball Facts & Stats; Big-Time Basketball Records; The Greatest Basketball Records; Amazing Basketball Records and many more. There will always be someone in every national league for every sport who has scored the most points and so this record doesn't seem especially significant. As there has not been a significant update, policy WP:NOTSTATS applies. Andrew🐉(talk) 10:01, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  Daily reminder for all that this user’s previously stated his complete opposition to any sports stories in ITNR, so this vote can be taken with a grain of salt. The Kip (talk) 15:26, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  How incredibly rude. It is possible to disagree with someone without demeaning them. Curbon7 (talk) 16:43, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  What part of WP:NOTSTATS applies to this? I don't see how an ITN blurb is falls within Excessive listings of unexplained statistics. The blurb only mentions one stat and it's explained in context.  Bait30  ^{Talk 2 me pls?} 05:39, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  The policy page is not well-written but the overall idea is to keep Wikipedia looking like an encyclopedia, and not turning into another type of work such as a newspaper (WP:NOTNEWS), gossip column (WP:NOTGOSSIP) or statsbook (WP:NOTSTATS). For example, "Not every facet of a celebrity's life, personal details, matches played, or goals scored warrants inclusion". Andrew🐉(talk) 09:51, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose Records get broken all the time, and I believe we have not previously posted cumulative records in any sport. Black Kite (talk) 10:08, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  This Magnus Carlsen achievement was posted. It’s been awhile since I’ve seen something like this nominated & this record had stood for decades, so I don’t think “Records get broken all the time” is a compelling argument for this record.Blaylockjam10 (talk) 16:12, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  We have posted individuals breaking athletics world records, such as the marathon. I don't really see much difference. Pawnkingthree (talk) 02:41, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Forgive me for being oblivious, but this sounds very umm... miscellaneous. --Ouro (blah blah) 10:35, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose This is one sport out of very many sports, and I am not sure how significant this record is even within Basketball. The phrasing sure makes it sound like there are many other records (e.g. "most wins in a season") that would be comparable. Banedon (talk) 10:54, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  Wins are not personal stats in basketball. In the case of many other sports, no one statistic really is king, but the personal scoring record really stands above all other personal stats in basketball. DarkSide830 (talk) 17:20, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose Wikipedia isnt the Guiness book of World Records, and I fail to see how this is that significant in the long run.✨  4 🧚‍♂am KING  11:06, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  The significance is that it’s breaking a 40-year old record, previously thought to be unbreakable, in one of the world’s most popular sports (arguably second only to football/soccer). This isn’t something that happens every season, nor is it some more obscure sport with little global coverage. The Kip (talk) 18:07, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

Very Strong Support Accelerate! 5.44.170.26 (talk) 11:47, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose I didn't think sports records like this should be made WP:ITN. ✠ SunDawn ✠ (contact) 11:51, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose Again, our purpose here is to highlight quality updates. Career accumulation records are a poor fit for this, as only a negligible update would (and should) be made in the article. GreatCaesarsGhost 12:26, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  I think our purpose here is to highlight quality articles with updates. – Muboshgu (talk) 16:38, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  It isn't. The criteria repeated uses the word "substantial" and even quantifies this at a certain point. Significance is relevant, but improving the encyclopedia is always job one. GreatCaesarsGhost 17:33, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  That would eliminate the possibility of ever posting to ITN a GA with 75kb prose like this one, because the update of a few sentences is so small compared to the rest of the existing quality article. – Muboshgu (talk) 17:42, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  The size of the article is immaterial, but yes; an update of a few sentences would per se not qualify for ITN, no matter how good the existing article is. This is not a bug. Also, this is the substance of my initial vote, and needn't trigger a back and forth just because you disagree. GreatCaesarsGhost 19:05, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

• Weak oppose Individual records are always being set; this one is important, but I don't think that records of this nature are good fodder for ITN-type stories. --Jayron32 12:51, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose - Events like this one are more suitable for DYK than ITN in my opinion. The ⬡ Bestagon ^T/_C 13:03, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  Not a fan of the "toss to DYK" argument, but I understand your point. Curbon7 (talk) 14:25, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose These are records that will continually be broken. --Masem (t) 13:39, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  • Oppose per above Editor 5426387 (talk) 13:56, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  When, in another 40 years? – Muboshgu (talk) 16:39, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  This record was considered unbreakable and had stood for nearly 40 years, it’s downright absurd to use the “they’re always broken” argument for this. The Kip (talk) 16:39, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support Football is a different beast. Cheers. WimePocy 14:22, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  There it is. The Kip (talk) 15:27, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  @The Kip Read my !vote, please and thanks. :] Cheers. WimePocy 13:19, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose sporting trivia. Modest Genius ^talk 14:33, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2023/feb/08/lebron-james-tribute-scoring-record-kareem-abdul-jabbar

  https://www.cnn.com/2023/02/08/sport/lebron-james-nba-record-analysis-spt-intl/index.html Kirill C1 (talk) 17:14, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support per Muboshgu. Kirill C1 (talk) 15:14, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose per all above. Trivial. _-_Alsor (talk) 15:21, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support per nom. This would get posted if it was soccer, of course. The Kip (talk) 15:28, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

• It shouldn’t. Neither. _-_Alsor (talk) 18:41, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

• Conditional oppose – I think it could be posted, but it's only a one-sentence update in LeBron's article. DecafPotato (talk) 16:16, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  @DecafPotato: I added a few more sentences. Is that enough to get your support? Blaylockjam10 (talk) 18:05, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  Yeah, I think so – changing my vote to a support. DecafPotato (talk) 02:24, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose, sports trivia, not actual news. Sandstein 16:32, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  All the actual news stories on it disagree with you, but okay. – Muboshgu (talk) 16:38, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  BBC has posted multiple articles about it. Le Monde has it. I'm sure other international papers have covered it too. – Muboshgu (talk) 16:55, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  El Pais and la Repubblica too. The Kip (talk) 18:05, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

Support, Kareem's record stood ever since 1984, that is an almost 40 year old record being broken by Lebron. With basketball and the NBA gaining more and more popularity, we should nominate this article since this is something that millions of people care about. Kennyboy1999 (talk) 17:07, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support. Probably the most important individual record in all of basketball, and this is absolutely in the news. Placing this in a blurb is utterly reasonable, and the article quality is high enough to warrant posting. — Red-tailed hawk _(nest) 18:38, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Weak Support At first, I would've opposed this, seeing as how I don't believe sports records should be posted, but that was, to be fair, looking through the lens of someone who doesn't often watch sports with the exception of motorsports, considering basketball's popularity and how this has had solid media coverage, I move to weak support. Many insurmountable records I feel have been broken, and none were blurbed, but this is different, because of it's coverage in media. TheBlueSkyClub (talk) 18:55, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support Just because it's a sports record doesn't mean it's trivia. This is a record that has stood for nearly 40 years, and it is receiving widespread coverage. The article is good quality and has been sufficiently updated. Pawnkingthree (talk) 19:06, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Weak support This is the kind of thing a traditional encyclopedia would mention. (In fact, Britannica Online already does. I'm looking at the library version, so I don't have a link.) Relative to major disasters, it's a trivial thing. But relative to other sports news, it's pretty significant - arguably more significant than the typical NBA Finals result. Zagalejo (talk) 19:23, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
• Question Do you really want to put a sporting record, where it is clearly debatable whether it qualifies for ITN or not, above an event that has killed 12,000 people ... at least? Black Kite (talk) 21:12, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  Not to sound callous, but that’s not a concern for ITNR. The Super Bowl will be on there in mere days anyways, with the earthquake blurb likely still in it. The Kip (talk) 21:21, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

  Chronologically above, yes. Just like we put a damn floating robot over hundreds of dead and injured Muslims. Something relatively less tragic will have to "top" this soon enough, may as well be LeBron. InedibleHulk (talk) 05:10, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

Strong oppose Sports trivia? Really? Is that what we're posting on Wikipedia's ITN now? I also like how someone above me asked if we want to put a sporting record (that is clearly debatable whether it qualifies for ITN or not) right above an event that killed at least 12,000 people. Evan224 (talk) 23:21, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

If you'd care to read some of the many comments above you, this is clearly quite a lot more than mere sports trivia. This is receiving wide coverage from even non-American RSes such as Le Monde, BBC, El Pais, la Repubblica, etc. The Kip (talk) 23:23, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support High quality article. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 00:06, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support possibly not the most significant news at the moment (although admittedly I don't follow the sport and I live in a country where it doesn't have the same level of coverage as in the US), but it seems like an interesting achievement and more than mere trivia. It also gives an opportunity to get a high-quality article onto the Main Page and lets us include something positive to break up the constant procession of doom and gloom that seems to be all that is ever posted to ITN these days. 176.26.3.180 (talk) 00:50, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose Trivial, even if it is being covered by the news, not really worth mentioning as I can't really see it being news in general. Not blurbworthy in my opinion. Per Evan224. --2601:249:8E00:420:8C27:A3EB:37C:DB6 (talk) 00:52, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  Even if you “can’t see it being news in general,” it literally is as demonstrated by multiple RSes above, including those from abroad. The Kip (talk) 03:38, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose Records get broken all the time and per GreatCaesarsGhost. --TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 00:55, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  This record stood for roughly 40 years, but certainly, records just break all the time. Also, quoting below, it’s the special significance; storms, shootings, and elections all happen routinely too, but significance is used to determine whether to post them. The Kip (talk) 03:35, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose per above. records get broken a lot. TomMasterReal^TALK 01:52, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  Yes, and storms and shootings also happen a lot. But, like with those occurrences, when one of them does get posted, it's those that are significant. And it seems fairly obvious (to me) that this is a significant record that does not get broken a lot. DecafPotato (talk) 02:28, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  The only record that's relevant is this one, that we are discussing now, and it had stood for nearly 40 years. Pawnkingthree (talk) 02:38, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Support I was on the fence, but I'm firmly in the "post it" camp because 1) this is a record that stood for 40 years and will likely not be challenged for a very long time; 2) this is the biggest individual record in an incredibly popular league/sport; and 3) it has most certainly attained exceptional news coverage, and not just from sports publications. -- Kicking222 (talk) 02:34, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support The article is a GA and the record is a significant one, having stood for 40 years and god knows the next time it'll be broken. For the record, I am neither a basketball or a LeBron fan, but the widespread coverage and significance shows this is not some run-of-the-mill record. Curbon7 (talk) 02:41, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
• Support. This is the fall of a longstanding, 40-year record, for individual points in the NBA, the top league of one of the most popular sports in the world, so not just routine sports trivia as many are claiming. This is proven by the breadth of coverage. ITN has a longstanding tradition of posting new records taking into account factors such as the popularity of the sport and the length of the record.[7] [8][9]. Also, the Lebron James article is a GA. -- Patar knight - ^chat/_{contributions} 04:46, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
• Conditional Support If he blurb him for it now, we don't blurb him for it again whenever he dies, OK? InedibleHulk (talk) 05:02, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
• Posted -- tariqabjotu 06:12, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• @Tariqabjotu: Posted on the basis of what consensus? I make it 22 supports and 20 opposes, which doesn't sound like one to me. Black Kite (talk) 07:00, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  obligatory "it's WP:NOTAVOTE/WP:NOTDEMOCRACY". DecafPotato (talk) 07:08, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Correct, so the quality of comments is supposed to be assessed. It's obvious that a significant proportion of Support comments are not much more than "I love basketball and Le Bron is great." Most of the Oppose comments give reasons. Quite a range of them. I'm not convinced that they have been evaluated properly. HiLo48 (talk) 08:00, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• I agree, this is premature. MarioJump83 (talk) 08:40, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
• And a significant proportion of the opposes are not much more than "sports records get broken all the time" which I think is one of the weakest arguments I've ever seen at ITN.-- Pawnkingthree (talk) 13:36, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose Congratulations to LeBron James for breaking the all-time NBA record in nearly 40 years, but many records can be broken all the time, even if it is a long one, like in 2020 Cleveland Browns' win over the Steelers in the road playoff game, which is Browns' first since 1969 against the Dallas Cowboys, or Russell Westbrook breaking Oscar Robertson's triple-double record in May 10, 2021 (which was never nominated to the ITN by the way). I would wholeheartedly support this on DYK though. MarioJump83 (talk) 08:40, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
• Post-posting oppose. We don't post sporting trivia of this sort, particularly when it's the sort of record you can attain simply through playing more matches than anyone else. By this precedent we will be posting all sorts of similar records in NFL, NHL, football, cricket etc going forward, and we've never done that. I also question the consensus seen above, there seemed too much opposition for this to be a consensus to post. Nominate it at DYK instead.  — Amakuru (talk) 09:00, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  There seems to be a misunderstanding on what DYK is about. This is a well-established longstanding GA with a lot of detail, it is pretty much impossible for the subject to be expanded upon to the degree that a DYK feature would make sense. I'm sure this wouldn't be the most interesting fact for a DYK blurb about James either. The whole problem here is that the update to the article is fairly minor despite the news being fairly major; that's the exact opposite to what DYK is all about. ~Maplestrip/Mable (chat) 09:04, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

The phrase "particularly when it's the sort of record you can attain simply through playing more matches than anyone else" is very funny to me- like it's 1) so easy to play that many games and 2) the only requirement for scoring the most points. FWIW, the NBA all-time leader in games played is Robert Parish; he played in 200 more games than LeBron yet scored 15,000 fewer points. -- Kicking222 (talk) 10:05, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Comment I see a lot of opposes that are comparing this record to other trivial records, as if this is going to open up ITN to all sorts of sports records. The basketball career points record is the record in the NBA; there really aren't other records in the NBA worth posting. It would be like someone breaking Gretzky's goals record in the NHL, or someone breaking Sachin Tendulkar's centuries record, or if someone broke the all time touchdowns record in the NFL, or if someone broke the all-time goals record in soccer; these are the primary career statistic in each sport. You wouldn't see tributes and headlines on every global news site if someone broke the NBA assist record. NorthernFalcon (talk) 09:07, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

Again, there's a big difference not being considered there. Yes, an NBA record is like an NFL or NHL record. All three are domestic leagues. I don't know which level of soccer you're referring to but it wouldn't be the American domestic league, would it? It would be in major international competition. And Tendulkar's record was in international Test Cricket, something that's been going for nearly 150 years. It's another level. And I repeat, we almost certainly wouldn't post a new goal scoring record in the Australian Football League, the world's leading competition in that sport. There has been so many pointless, fan frenzy support comments here, I now definitely an Oppose. HiLo48 (talk) 09:38, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

Your reading of the !votes is, at best, curious. So many of the supports have said "This record stood for four decades, the article is a GA, and it's getting a huge amount of news coverage", while so many of the opposes have said "This is just trivia" (which it isn't) and "Records get broken all the time" (but records of this magnitude don't).

The NBA, NFL, and NHL are the highest levels of international competition in their respective sports, full-stop. If you listed the 500 best male basketball players ever, it would probably be Oscar Schmidt, a few Harlem Globetrotters, and 496 guys who played in the NBA at some point. LeBron scoring more points than anyone else in NBA history is unquestionably significant, and the media coverage backs that up. I'm indifferent about LeBron- my favorite players are Sabrina Ionescu and Elena Delle Donne- but I can see his breaking the record for the momentous (and newsworthy) achievement that it is. -- Kicking222 (talk) 09:57, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

See List of VFL/AFL players with international backgrounds. (You probably don't even know what those initials stand for.) HiLo48 (talk)

• Post-posting oppose While basketball is one of the most popular sports globally, this is one record in one league. If we didn't post CR7 breaking the global scoring record in football, the most popular sport by far, why are we posting a less-broad record in a less-popular sport? That's the neutral view. But I'll also ass a personal oppose thought, in that I think with team sports, team/franchise achievements should be considered for posting more than individual ones. Kingsif (talk) 11:48, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  I think prioritizing team achievements over individual achievements in team sports is an excellent point, and might need to be considered more in the future. ~Maplestrip/Mable (chat) 12:30, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Pull. With the post-posting opposes, there's now definitely no consensus to post this. Not to mention that having this bit of trivia sitting above the earthquake story - which is still the #1 story globally - is a little embarrassing IMO. Black Kite (talk) 12:05, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  Agreed, especially that this item went with an image, replacing that of the earthquake's damage. The ⬡ Bestagon ^T/_C 12:27, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  Another option is to move forward rather than back. By posting other pending items such as the fires in Chile or the elections in Monaco, the basketball stat will be pushed down and so be less prominent. Andrew🐉(talk) 12:28, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Reaffirming my oppose and asking an admin to pull this item. There definitely was no consensus in the first place, nevermind now with the post-posting opposes. The ⬡ Bestagon ^T/_C 12:26, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose per GreatCaesarsGhost. I always find the individual stats within team sports to be a bit trivial at the best of times. - SchroCat (talk) 12:51, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

Post-posting support - we put blurbs for Darts and Snooker tournaments - sports with minor followings, at best - but some here don't want to post that a many-decades-long record in basketball has been broken? QueensanditsCrazy (talk) 12:56, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

We'll post the NBA playoff winner too. that's the comparison to be made. Masem (t) 13:11, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Pull. How on Earth did this get posted? Regardless of what you think about the merits of the story, there's nothing close to a consensus here. Modest Genius ^talk 13:10, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
• Pull especially the image, if nothing else. Crass. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 13:26, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  @AirshipJungleman29: Sorry, I don't follow. How is the image in question crass? --Jayron32 13:29, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• (edit conflict)There's an earthquake with more than 17,000 deaths, 50,000 injured and god knows how many lives ruined just underneath, and the main thing we're focusing on is an overpaid sports star having done something mildly interesting. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 13:32, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• Is there any reason we couldn't change the order of the blurbs? Why is that such an insurmountable hurdle? Zagalejo (talk) 13:36, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

You can certainly express your opinion at the inappropriateness of the image in the template, although there's no rule that requires admins to not use an image for a blurb if an earthquake story is posted immediately below it, but to me the use of the adjective "overpaid" just screams "I hate". ⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 13:36, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

• (edit conflict) Pull and close. There's no consensus to post this. --⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 13:30, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  Pulled for the time being. I was not involved in the discussion but from what I see at the moment, there was substantial opposition after posting. Tone 13:38, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

  Thanks, Tone! I reiterate my request that this be closed. At this point, with as much participation as we've seen, this will likely never gain a consensus to post again. ⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 13:42, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

References

Nominators often include links to external websites and other references in discussions on this page. It is usually best to provide such links using the inline URL syntax [http://example.com] rather than using <ref></ref> tags, because that keeps all the relevant information in the same place as the nomination without having to jump to this section, and facilitates the archiving process.

For the times when <ref></ref> tags are being used, here are their contents: