*'''Oppose''' with regret. While some of the shows are iconic (in my view), he objectively doesn't really rise to the significance expected of the current ITN/RD criteria. It's noted that one of his shows was the "22nd most popular children's television show" isn't all that spectacular and I'm not seeing any awards. Article could use more references as well. [[User:The Rambling Man|The Rambling Man]] ([[User talk:The Rambling Man|talk]]) 14:18, 30 June 2016 (UTC)
*'''Oppose''' with regret. While some of the shows are iconic (in my view), he objectively doesn't really rise to the significance expected of the current ITN/RD criteria. It's noted that one of his shows was the "22nd most popular children's television show" isn't all that spectacular and I'm not seeing any awards. Article could use more references as well. [[User:The Rambling Man|The Rambling Man]] ([[User talk:The Rambling Man|talk]]) 14:18, 30 June 2016 (UTC)
*'''Support''' subject to quality. Massive cult following from millions of 60s and 70s kids. [[User:Mjroots|Windy Miller]] ([[User talk:Mjroots|cider]]) 15:27, 30 June 2016 (UTC)
*'''Support''' subject to quality. Massive cult following from millions of 60s and 70s kids. [[User:Mjroots|Windy Miller]] ([[User talk:Mjroots|cider]]) 15:27, 30 June 2016 (UTC)
*'''Support''', but of an IAR one this, but the article is OK, we've only got two RDs at the moment, and there is ''some'' coverage outside the UK (and a lot in it). [[User talk:LauraJamieson|Laura Jamieson (talk)]] 16:41, 30 June 2016 (UTC)
This candidates page is integrated with the daily pages of Portal:Current events. A light green header appears under each daily section – it includes transcluded Portal:Current events items for that day. You can discuss ITN candidates under the header.
Blurbs are one-sentence summaries of the news story.
Altblurbs, labelled alt1, alt2, etc., are alternative suggestions to cover the same story.
A target article, bolded in text, is the focus of the story. Each blurb must have at least one such article, but you may also link non-target articles.
Articles in the Ongoing line describe events getting continuous coverage.
The Recent deaths (RD) line includes any living thing whose death was recently announced. Consensus may decide to create a blurb for a recent death.
All articles linked in the ITN template must pass our standards of review. They should be up-to-date, demonstrate relevance via good sourcing and have at least an acceptable quality.
Nomination steps
Make sure the item you want to nominate has an article that meets our minimum requirements and contains reliable coverage of a current event you want to create a blurb about. We will not post about events described in an article that fails our quality standards.
Find the correct section below for the date of the event (not the date nominated). Do not add sections for new dates manually – a bot does that for us each day at midnight (UTC).
Create a level 4 header with the article name (==== Your article here ====). Add (RD) or (Ongoing) if appropriate.
Then paste the {{ITN candidate}} template with its parameters and fill them in. The news source should be reliable, support your nomination and be in the article. Write your blurb in simple present tense. Below the template, briefly explain why we should post that event. After that, save your edit. Your nomination is ready!
You may add {{ITN note}} to the target article's talk page to let editors know about your nomination.
The better your article's quality, the better it covers the event and the wider its perceived significance (see WP:ITNSIGNIF for details), the better your chances of getting the blurb posted.
When the article is ready, updated and there is consensus to post, you can mark the item as (Ready). Remove that wording if you feel the article fails any of these necessary criteria.
Admins should always separately verify whether these criteria are met before posting blurbs marked (Ready). For more guidance, check WP:ITN/A.
If satisfied, change the header to (Posted).
Where there is no consensus, or the article's quality remains poor, change the header to (Closed) or (Not posted).
Sometimes, editors ask to retract an already-posted nomination because of a fundamental error or because consensus changed. If you feel the community supports this, remove the item and mark the item as (Pulled).
Voicing an opinion on an item
Format your comment to contain "support" or "oppose", and include a rationale for your choice. In particular, address the notability of the event, the quality of the article, and whether it has been updated.
Pick an older item to review near the bottom of this page, before the eligibility runs out and the item scrolls off the page and gets abandoned in the archive, unused and forgotten.
Review an item even if it has already been reviewed by another user. You may be the first to spot a problem, or the first to confirm that an identified problem was fixed. Piling on the list of "support!" votes will help administrators see what is ready to be posted on the Main Page.
Tell about problems in articles if you see them. Be bold and fix them yourself if you know how, or tell others if it's not possible.
Add simple "support!" or "oppose!" votes without including your reasons. Similarly, curt replies such as "who?", "meh", or "duh!" are not helpful. A vote without reasoning means little for us, please elaborate yourself.
Oppose an item just because the event is only relating to a single country, or failing to relate to one. We post a lot of such content, so these comments are generally unproductive.
Accuse other editors of supporting, opposing or nominating due to a personal bias (such as ethnocentrism). We at ITN do not handle conflicts of interest.
Comment on a story without first reading the relevant article(s).
An Afghan National Security Forces convoy outside Kabul is attacked in a coordinated ambush including suicide bombers and heavy machine guns resulting in over 40 deaths. (BBC)
A 17-year-old Palestinian stabs and kills a sleeping 13-year-old Israeli and American citizen girl Hallel Yaffa Ariel in her bedroom. The assailant is fatally shot by security guards. Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu blamed "incitement-driven terrorists" while the U.S. State Department condemned the "outrageous terrorist attack." (AP via Post-Bulletin)(Reuters)(Fox)
The Governor of Puerto Rico authorizes the suspension of payments on the general obligation debt of that commonwealth, assuring a default on the $1.9 billion of debt payments due the following day.
Colombian, Italian, and U.S. police seize 11 tonnes of cocaine smuggled to various countries and arrest 33 people across Colombia and Italy after the discovery of seven laboratories in the Colombian jungle run by local organized criminal groups and 'Ndrangheta. (Reuters)
British home secretary Theresa May enters into the Tory leadership contest, saying that Article 50 of the EU Treaty should not be invoked before the end of this year, implying that formal Brexit negotiations with the EU institutions be put on hold until 2017 at the earliest. (Wall Street Journal)
Former Mayor of LondonBoris Johnson rules himself out of running in the Tory leadership contest, a move believed to be influenced by Michael Gove's announcement earlier in the day to run for the leadership. (BBC)
Bosnia and Herzegovina officially releases its first census report since the end of the Bosnian War after multiple delays, showing that the country had lost one fifth of its population from 4.4 million to 3.5 million between then and 2013. (Radio Free Europe/Radio Liberty)
RussianDefense MinisterSergey Shoygu dismisses 50 high-ranking Navy officers, including Baltic Fleet Commander Viktor Kravchuk and Chief of Staff Sergei Popov, following a month-long inspection that found incompetence, deficiencies in training, and misinformation regarding the state of the fleet. (UPI)(Reuters)
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Oppose with regret. While some of the shows are iconic (in my view), he objectively doesn't really rise to the significance expected of the current ITN/RD criteria. It's noted that one of his shows was the "22nd most popular children's television show" isn't all that spectacular and I'm not seeing any awards. Article could use more references as well. The Rambling Man (talk) 14:18, 30 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support, but of an IAR one this, but the article is OK, we've only got two RDs at the moment, and there is some coverage outside the UK (and a lot in it). Laura Jamieson (talk)16:41, 30 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose Unless there is something unique in the inaugration ceremony, we don't post this, instead only at the point of the confirmed election results (as Brandmeister noted). --MASEM (t) 14:12, 30 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
New Syrian Army rebels fail to capture the border town of Al-Bukamal from ISIL militants, with an ISIL affiliated news source claiming the group killed 40 rebels and captured 15 more in a counter-attack. (Reuters)
Toyota, which on Tuesday announced a recall of 1.43 million hybrids because of an airbag problem, today announces the recall of 2.87 million vehicles worldwide, produced between April 2006 and August 2015, because of a possible problem with their evaporative fuel emissions control unit. (Reuters)
The Lesedi La Rona diamond, the largest uncut diamond in the world, went on sale at an auction in Mayfair with it expected to sell at £52 million, or US$70 million. However, the diamond only managed to draw a high bid of US$61 million, falling short of the reserve price to sell it. (BBC)(CBC News)
The Vietnamese Ministry of Defense says eight bodies from a Coast Guard plane that crashed June 16, 2016, have been found. The search continues for the ninth crew member. The CASA C-212 Aviocar was on a search and rescue mission for the then-missing pilot of a crashed Su30-MK2 fighter jet; the pilot's body was found on the 17th. (AP)(Tuổi Trẻ)
Antoine Deltour and Raphael Halet, two whistleblowers who revealed the Luxembourg Leaks financial scandal, are found guilty of leaking the documents and are given a 12 and nine month suspended sentence and fined €1,500 and €1,000 respectively, while Edouard Perrin, the journalist who was given the leaks, is acquitted of all charges. (BBC)
Anthony Sawina faces five counts of second degree assault after he allegedly taunts and then shoots into a car at 5 Muslim men, injuring 2 in Dinkytown near the University of Minnesota Twin Cities campus. US representative Keith Ellison has called for a Department of Justice investigation into the incident. (Independent)
Volkswagen and the United States Justice Department agree on a $14.7 billion settlement for its emissions-cheating program. The breakdown: $10 billion to consumers to cover buybacks and fixes; $2 billion for green energy funds investment; and, $2.7 billion to offset diesel emissions. In addition, VW agrees on a settlement with 44 U.S. states, the District of Columbia, and Puerto Rico that will cost at least $600 million. As for Europe, Volkswagen says its diesel vehicles don't violate European Union emissions standards. (Reuters)(Nasdaq)
IKEA is to recall 27 million Malm chests of drawers in North America due to the danger they pose to children. Since 2014, at least three children have died when the drawers toppled over on them. (BBC)
One of the flight recorders of EgyptAir Flight 804 has been fully repaired in Paris after being found in the Mediterranean Sea and will now be sent to Egypt to be analyzed. (Euronews)
Three crew members are missing and one worker is injured following the head-on collision of two BNSF Railway freight trains near the American town of Panhandle, Texas. Officials, concerned that flames from box car fires could cause a fast-moving grass fire, order an evacuation of some nearby areas. (AP via MSN)
A huge explosion completely destroys a house and damages 24 others in Mississauga, Canada. At least one person is dead and 13 others are injured, according to Mississauga Fire and Emergency Services. Thousands of residents are forced to evacuate and many spend the night at a local community shelter. (CBC News)(CP24)
The European Parliament's first debate on the UK's vote to leave is marked by bitter exchanges as prominent pro-Brexit figure Nigel Farage is booed and heckled by members of the European Parliament and European Commission President Jean-Claude Juncker is heckled after saying that he is neither a robot nor a bureaucrat. (BBC)
Labour party leader Jeremy Corbyn refuses to resign after losing a vote of no confidence, with 80% of voting members of the Parliamentary Labour Party voting against him. Critics which include fellow MPs cite his failure to do more in the effort for the UK to remain in the EU as the main issue. (The Guardian)
Article needs updating Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Moore was a guitarist for Elvis Presley whose work is oft described as "pioneering" and "groundbreaking" in the early development of rock and roll, and he is a member of two music halls of fame. Article isn't great. --Bongwarrior (talk) 06:54, 29 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Comment – When you say "article quality too weak right now", does that refer to the seemingly indiscriminate tag bombing throughout? Other than that, I couldn't find much wrong with it. Also, while on the subject of music figures, I'm dismayed that no one nominated Bernie Worrell. I've been busy enough to where I didn't even learn of his death until this morning, otherwise I would have gladly done so. Earlier this year, Robert Stigwood was never nominated, even though someone of far less significance to 1970s music wound up being posted (I forget exactly who right this moment). RadioKAOS / Talk to me, Billy / Transmissions 21:34, 29 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
And by all means come here to nominate more RDs. That way you can be less disappointed, although I doubt either of the two individuals you mentioned would meet the current criteria. The Rambling Man (talk) 04:32, 30 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
P.S. What is indiscriminate about asking for citations throughout a poorly referenced article? Would you rather have one tag at the top of the article? The Rambling Man (talk) 04:33, 30 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
By golly, I had no idea Bernie Worrell had died, otherwise I surely would have nominated him. :( This is why we need the trial criteria. --WaltCip (talk) 12:55, 30 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
As far as I can recall, "Must be famous solely of their own accord rather than through association" is not an RD criteria, even not factoring in the trial. Or are we saying Nancy Reagan should not have been posted because she happens to be associated with the Gipper?--WaltCip (talk) 16:20, 30 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support once we have a few hours to get more details and expand the article. Even if this turns out to be some type of industrial accident (though all signs point to something more malicious), the death count (10 so far it looks like) and injured at a major airport is significant news. --MASEM (t) 20:19, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support - Very significant news story. It's unfortunate to see the situation deteriorating like this in Turkey; hopefully these incidents will become a rarity again. Kurtis(talk)21:20, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Renowned NFL defensive coordinator, including for 1985 Chicago Bears, and head coach for Eagles and Cardinals, spent 26 years in NFL. Compy90 (talk) 12:40, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support RD when improved The article lead is a bit paltry, but his most significant contribution (outside of Rex Ryan and Rob Ryan, his sons) is creating the 46 defense. Implemented on the 1985 Chicago Bears, they are considered by many to be the best defensive team in NFL history. – Muboshgu (talk) 17:14, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
In that case I would suggest you provide some context to who this individual is, both in the blurb and the nomination, and why she should be eligible for such a thing, alongside people like Mandela, Thatcher, Bowie etc. The Rambling Man (talk) 10:59, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for the explanation. They both mean absolutely nothing to me, and probably a good deal of other non-Americans, so the clarification is appreciated. The Rambling Man (talk) 11:12, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support RD, weak oppose on blurb in addition to her career record, she played a major role in growing Women's Basketball and was a major inspiration for women athletes. Although she was an important figure in her field and is notable enough for an RD once the article is ready, I'm not certain she had the global impact that warrants a blurb. ZettaComposer (talk) 12:01, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support RD. Article is in a dozen languages. Just because a lone voter here hasn't heard of her doesn't mean most women basketball supporters haven't. — Wyliepedia12:13, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
You missed the point. I didn't make such an assertion. I simply asked for help in understanding why this individual would be comparable to Nelson Mandela or Margaret Thatcher or David Bowie. The Rambling Man (talk) 12:48, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
@Sunshineisles2: Yes, the bar for a blurb is high; generally a blurb for the death of a notable person is reserved for world-transforming figures, those at the tip-top of their field. Summitt was very important to her field(the criteria for an RD listing) but was not the #1 or 2 important person in basketball. 331dot (talk) 17:05, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
@331dot: For the record, I do not support a blurb, but the threshold seems to be different for non-deaths -- for example, and keeping on the theme of basketball, does anyone outside the U.S. care who won the NBA finals? We should impose equally strict standards for all kinds of stories. That was my point -- it seems to me that much smaller stories than the deaths of David Bowie, Nelson Mandela, etc. are featured fairly frequently, but deaths are handled more rigorously. Just an observation.--Sunshineisles2 (talk) 17:10, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Deaths are handled differently, to avoid turning ITN into an obituary ticker. The NBA Finals are on the recurring items list, indicating they get posted upon an adequate update. Feel free to propose its removal from the list- though 'who cares outside the US' is discouraged as an objection(see "Please do not..." above); very little would be posted if global influence was required. 331dot (talk) 17:14, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Indeed, I was surprised that anyone would consider this individual for a blurb, so that's why i asked the question. It has nothing to do with other news blurbs at all, just the death ones which are rare as... The Rambling Man (talk) 17:39, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
No, it's a grotesque construction. I remember there being a discussion to attempt to remove it from Wikipedia completely, but I guess the outcome was to tolerate it. Thankfully we won't be seeing it on the main page any time soon... The Rambling Man (talk) 12:49, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support RD only on article improvements - I can't see a blurb appropriate for this, but importance for RD is fine. However, the article has a number of (likely new) CN tags, and the Records section absolutely needs sourcing (even if it is to the same record source). --MASEM (t) 13:39, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support RD. The article is so comprehensive that the occasional (and in some cases really unnecessary) citation tags do not dissuade me. Oppose blurb. Newyorkbrad (talk) 15:34, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support RD when improved, oppose blurb Top of her field, not a blurbed death though. I added a whole bunch of {{cn}} tags when I heard she was moved into hospice care a few days ago, those need to be resolved. – Muboshgu (talk) 15:39, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support RD May not have known much about her before today, but she was enough of a major/prominent figure within her own field that it seems entirely appropriate.--Sunshineisles2 (talk) 16:50, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support RD only. Clearly very important to her field, but does not warrant a blurb. I would stress that this is not a case of the female coach with the most wins; she has the most wins period. 331dot (talk) 16:52, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Comment Being eloquent is not part of our job as Wikipedia editors. Wikipedia is neither a memorial nor a place to express personal feelings or observations. --Crunch (talk) 18:48, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
@Crunch: I don't think the intent was to 'be eloquent', but to demonstrate the notability of this person better than Muboshgu, I, or anyone else is doing here. 331dot (talk) 19:07, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
@Crunch: Indeed, my point in posting Obama's Facebook post was to demonstrate Summitt's notability and impact on her field, very much within the RD realm. – Muboshgu (talk) 20:38, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Have you looked? It has 20 [citation needed] tags as a minimum. I think we need to start discounting your opinion I'm afraid if you believe this is of sufficient quality for the main page. It's becoming systemic. The Rambling Man (talk) 19:08, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
By all means improve the article, this is the part of Wikipedia where we discuss what features in the ITN section, so trivia like that belongs elsewhere. The Rambling Man (talk) 04:31, 29 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Post-posting support RD; Neutral on blurb, but oppose currently proposed blurb wording: "winningest" is colloquial, grammatically questionable, and not widely understood. Also, the NCAA may be the most important institution in U.S. college basketball (though not the only one), but college basketball is also played in Canada, the Philippines and probably a few more countries. Instead, I added an altblurb that I would consider acceptable. --PanchoS (talk) 14:46, 29 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
"Winningest" is an informal term that is to be avoided in formal language. It is considered common in the context of sports, so on the pages about sport figures/coaches, its fine since that sets the context to make its use acceptable, but on the front page, which is not sports-related, we should avoid such informal language. --MASEM (t) 16:33, 30 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Two men initially thought to have died when a camper was swept away in Greenbrier County are found alive, lowering the death toll from the disaster to 20 confirmed fatalities and three others missing and presumed dead. (AP via Fox News)
The Supreme Court of the United States strikes down a law that would have required abortion clinics in Texas to upgrade in order to meet new "hospital-like" standards. Supporters of abortion rights said that the proposed law would force nearly all abortion clinics in the state to shut down, while their opponents argued for women's health benefits. (CNN)
Peter Altmaier, German Chancellor Angela Merkel’s chief of staff, warns Britain of dire consequences of exit from the European Union, saying in a newspaper interview that UK leaders should not rule out the possibility of another referendum on the same issue. (Daily Mail)(Bloomberg)
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Futurist and best-selling author, known for his book Future Shock and later works about cultural changes, technology, and the digital and communications revolution. Light show (talk) 07:01, 30 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support for RD promptly. Important person and solid article. A few more references would be in order. I'm aware of the section tag but I'm not sure it is warranted so that is not a concern to me. Newyorkbrad (talk) 15:10, 30 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Orange tags and unreferenced paragraphs are to you a "solid" article? Whether or not you think the tag is warranted, someone did, so a discussion needs to resolve it. – Muboshgu (talk) 16:09, 30 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support on importance, oppose on quality The subject appears to meet RD criteria, but his article (orange tag, unsourced paragraphs) does not. – Muboshgu (talk) 16:11, 30 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Nominator's comments: As the BBC notes, this is "the first major abortion ruling since 2007." CNN has also called it as "the most significant decision from the Supreme Court on abortion in two decades." [5]Everymorning(talk)20:32, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose a shift in minor, inward-looking part of a large country, some of which appears to be amongst the backward-thinking in the world. Time to get with the program. The Rambling Man (talk) 20:36, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose - While this is a major decision regarding abortion, it is not the major decision that would end whatever debate there is, even though the decision falls more in favor of pro-choice. Since it affects only those states with laws that regulate facilities that call themselves abortion clinics, it won't have significant world-reaching impact. --MASEM (t) 20:40, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose posting an interpretation of law(not even US law, but Texas law) that resulted in the lowest court's ruling being upheld(the appeals court had reversed, leading it to SCOTUS). 331dot (talk) 20:41, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Support pending improvements Absolutely massive name in his field, but the article could use a few improvements. A list of awards would be helpful. EternalNomad (talk) 23:25, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, but I don't think you will have this objection about Robin Williams or any other English-speaking/Hollywood actor. I am quite sure there is systemic bias against European film (as was manifested in case of Pierre Brice). --Jenda H. (talk) 09:30, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
So much to say about this. 1) Just because someone does not object Hollywood actors does not mean they have a bias. Hollywood actors are simply usually more notable. That's the biased system, not a systemic bias. 2) That being said, I disagree with TRM's notion that Spencer is not notable enough. True, he was never as famous in the US as he was in Europe, but that should not speak against him. 3) I do agree however that this article needs more work in order to get posted. Zwerg Nase (talk) 09:34, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support. Italian actor very famous across Europe (article translated in 45 language; italian and german articles were viewed by +300.000 people each). --Holapaco77 (talk) 15:34, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Both articles updated One or both nominated events are listed on WP:ITN/R, so each occurrence is presumed to be important enough to post. Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article and update meet WP:ITNCRIT, not the significance.
Support in principle. I also strongly support a blurb mentioning Messi's retirement from the national team, as this is substantially bigger news in the media than the conclusion of the tournament.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 14:32, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Fighting in various remote villages in the Borno State of Nigeria kill at least one civilian and six Boko Haram militants. According to the Nigerian Army, they've rescued more than 5,000 hostages from the militants. (Al Jazeera)
Voters in Spain go to the polls for a general election six months after an inconclusive election. Polls indicate that no party will be in position to form a government. (AP)
Support, though I'd like to see quite a few more updates (retrospective on the construction phase, updated cost estimations, inauguration event, reactions, operating concept, contemporary role in shipping, estimations about future utilization), this is a major project, not quite comparable to the Gotthard Base Tunnel by extent, but of roughly comparable importance to the transportation industry. --PanchoS (talk) 14:06, 29 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support though I note the "Cargo volume" section has an OR tag on it and only sourced to the prosopal document for the expansion, which should be fixed up with more sources. --MASEM (t) 14:10, 29 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Strong oppose the article is not written as an accessible encyclopedic article, worst of all it has already been tagged with original research, I would suggest those who have already supported it without doing anything about this get to fixing it if they really care, right now this is going nowhere near the main page. The Rambling Man (talk) 20:37, 29 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Article updated The nominated event is listed on WP:ITN/R, so each occurrence is presumed to be important enough to post. Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article and update meet WP:ITNCRIT, not the significance.
Comment – obviously details are still emerging so I would not expect a completed section. But we need some text about the result, indeed this is particularly important given that the result is a hung parliament. The build-up in the article seems very good at a superficial glance, but the actual update that we're looking to post lets it down a bit. As a side point, yet again we have an election article nominated by someone who nominated an ITNR before ever having made a substantive edit, and indeed before the event could possibly have been updated. So we weren't judging notability (because we didn't need to, notability is automatic as it's on ITNR) we weren't judging quality (because it was literally impossible to, without an update or any results to go on). What on earth were we supposed to judge, and what on earth was BabbaQ supporting? StillWaitingForConnection (talk) 05:24, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Don't think insisting on article editors nominating their own articles would be a wise move. But spare us your spiteful, laconic comments which don't seem to contribute to a factual debate. Anyway, Impru20 is the one who deserves honour for the election's comprehensive coverage, not me. --PanchoS (talk) 07:36, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
I think you're missing the point. It's ITNR so all we have to review is the quality of the article and any update. If there is no such update when an article is nominated, expect a bunch of criticism as it's a complete waste of time. The Rambling Man (talk) 07:42, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Indeed. For normal ITN nominations I do not expect the nominator to have contributed or the article to be fully ready, because importance is part of the discussion and raising the discussion can help with improvements to the article. For ITNR, if an article is patently not ready to be nominated (for instance an election or sport result isn't known), then ideally it shouldn't be nominated at all. But at a bare minimum, if someone insists on nominating, they should have been actively involved in the prep work – this gives reviewers confidence that the work will be completed in a timely manner. StillWaitingForConnection (talk) 07:51, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
You may expect whatever you wish, but as long as these are just your personal expectations, there's no point in getting nasty. Disagree in regard to ITNR nominations in general, and this article in particular – it's preferable for a discussion to run at least half a day or so, and to do so it has to be nominated early enough. Now let's get back on topic. --PanchoS (talk) 08:34, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
If having a differing opinion makes someone "wrong", is the suggestion to do away with consensus and proscribe unwritten ITN rules instead? I'd like to think that the posting admin can a) read and b) ignore comments that don't apply to the nomination. @StillWaitingForConnection: If the proposal is to change ITN's subjective update requirement and have some minimum amount of prose for ITNR before nominating, feel free to start a discussion on WT:ITN. Fuebaey (talk) 15:34, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
It is not subjective to state – categorically – that a prerequisite to evaluating an update on a story for which there is a pre-consensus (ITNR), is that said news has happened. It is not an opinion to state that the minimum requirement for an update is that an update of some form exists.
But you know what? I will offer an opinion of direct relevance to this nomination. The nominator is directly responsible for harming ITN by ignoring both of the above obvious points with this nomination, and is far from alone in having done so in recent days. If this had been nominated after a tenable update were in place, it would have been up on the Main Page within a couple of hours of nomination, and certainly before now. Instead, people have spent their precious time looking through an article which couldn't possibly have been posted, because the event itself had not happened, and as a result they now do not have a clue when they should be looking at it. I don't have a clue – nobody has stated on this page whether it's worth having a second look. I've already wasted my time twice – once by looking at the article before the outcome was even known, the second after the result was known to see if there was an update, which there wasn't. I am not inclined to look again until I'm reasonably confident that a look at the article would actually be worthwhile, and am certain that I'm not alone. StillWaitingForConnection (talk) 22:27, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
You seem to be under the impression that ITN nominations are laudatory badges. I see nominations as a way to improve articles, while drawing attention to current news events. I prefer it when someone else nominates an item that interests me - if I get time I improve it, if not hopefully someone else will. Instead of placing the onus on someone else for a change, why don't you step up instead of writing a paragraph essay on something that had an infobox update at the time of nomination, a paragraph update by Ritchie333 and myself, and an expanded edit from the editor who wrote practically the entire article. Fuebaey (talk) 00:06, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
That assessment is both factually dishonest (none of what you reference had happened at time of nomination), entirely proves my point (in 24 hours there has been some work done, but relatively little because there was nothing to base an assessment on in the first place, notably the article has not been posted) and a personal attack on my decision to primarily focus on reviewing content. Bravo. I do however thank you for drawing attention to the fact that the article is now worth looking at. StillWaitingForConnection (talk) 00:43, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
That is untrue. The first revision was clearly made at 21:07 UTC 26th, a good half hour before this nom showed up. I did not state that the other diffs were made prior to that, else I would have placed "at the time of nomination" at the end of the sentence. My point was that these edits were made prior to your comment at 22:27 UTC 27th, showing that instead of reading an article and assessing it you chose to complain about something that wasn't relevant to this nom. I think that is more disruptive than what you're purporting to claim. I don't understand what the rest of your post is referring to. I also note that your comment below was made five minutes after I sourced the second paragraph and that "wins" hasn't been in the alt blurb for almost 10 hours. Fuebaey (talk) 01:34, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: Seems like once again a single participant, possibly two, have taken ITN hostage in an unconstructive, WP:POINTY way. More specifically, the timely promotion of one of the better election articles we've seen in the last months, a major event in a major country and unquestionably qualified per WP:ITN/R, with the proposed blurb being widely backed by WP:RS, has been obstructed. Not having it promoted to ITN in time, following a number of far more questionable ITN entries, has not only been unfair to the event, to Spain, and to the article. More importantly, it didn't exactly serve our project well. But it's not some individuals' questionable interventions what is at the core of the problem. Rather it is the fact that everybody else seems to be shying away from getting involved in a controversy. Promoting good cooperation doesn't mean avoiding conflict. If we don't collectively restore order soon, we might see further declining participation here, particularly of experienced participants, which would seriously jeopardize ITN. At the same time, our policies may always be refined. Some rules and procedures might have to be stricter, with some of the current proposals at WT:ITN being at least worth considering. But this is not the place for anyone to illustrate their WP:POINT. --PanchoS (talk) 11:58, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose no prose on the result, like StillWaitingForConnection, bemused as to the support of BabbaQ, perhaps he is unaware of the ITNR status of this kind of nomination. The Rambling Man (talk) 06:39, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support conditional on improvements after Brexit, this is the big story in Europe. However, the article does list the winner in the lead, and there is not enough about this in the body with good sources, so the nomination will need to wait until it is. Ritchie333(talk)(cont)09:08, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support The event here is the election (second election in six months), not simply the result (more or less status quo). The background, pre-election and campaign sections (20+ paragraphs) are more than enough prose for me. Kudos to Impru20 for expanding this. Fuebaey (talk) 15:34, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose. Large parts of the update are unsourced, and neither blurb seems postable without alteration. "Stalemate" implies that there will be no political breakthrough (strong statement to make), and "wins" does not seem to accurately reflect a situation in which the largest party is in a minority. To remedy this element, I would suggest that an alt blurb mentions the party which has won a plurality, and possibly a reference to the fact that it's a similar situation to the previous election. StillWaitingForConnection (talk) 00:43, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support When something is actually in the news, it is sensible to nominate it as this alerts editors to the issue. Readers will be reading the article regardless, as you can see in this case:
Graphs are unavailable due to technical issues. There is more info on Phabricator and on MediaWiki.org.
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Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Oppose Quality is poor. Not sure he meets the RD criteria because they're so subjective (and should be repealed) but they're still in place so... – Muboshgu (talk) 18:31, 26 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Comment Note that there's only one RD listed currently (Anton Yelchin). That person died on June 19 while this candidate died on June 21. The comments about staleness therefore don't seem appropriate. The other issues don't seem to make much sense either. It seems quite silly that ITN is so empty currently -- one RD and no ongoing events. It gives the impression that it's ITN which is dead. Andrew D. (talk) 23:29, 26 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Agreed, if the quality was better, under trial conditions it would almost certainly be posted because we're down to zero RDs (although many ITN users prefer to see it that way rather than include individuals like this). The Rambling Man (talk) 04:47, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
I'm not seeing a significant quality problem as there are plenty of citations and no cleanup tags. Some specifics are required to address this issue, please. Andrew D. (talk) 08:00, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Well if this individual is deemed to be notable under the current ITN criteria, the biography needs expansion, it's barely above stub quality, and I'm not seeing any major awards or attributions of him being significant in his field. His bio reads as "just another DJ". The Rambling Man (talk) 08:29, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
This article, this specific article, precisely why the trial criteria will not work. The article, stubby and parochial as it is, simply and utterly lacks the importance to be posted on the main page. Yet due to the limited scope, it will be impossible to improve the article's quality to any more than it already has, so technically under the trial criteria it's all ready to be posted to the main page. It's fully referenced. It even has a picture. Why would we endeavor to post articles of local radio personalities - not even a nationally syndicated one - amidst professors, politicians, and even athletes of exponentially more importance? And this has nothing to do with him being American, it's a simple question of why are we pushing to introduce criteria that will not improve Wikipedia in the long run? It's agitating. 128.227.174.125 (talk) 13:51, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
If the individual is simply a "local radio personality", perhaps he shouldn't have an article at all. If he's notable enough for an article, he's notable enough for the main page, see DYK and OTD for numerous examples every day like this. The Rambling Man (talk) 15:08, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
It seems that there are no significant quality issues but that this subject is being opposed because he wasn't a superstar. Opposing such subjects because of their level of fame might make sense if there was a surfeit of candidates but right now there is still only one RD entry on the main page and so it looks rather empty. I shall be supporting the trial criteria as it seems we need everything we can get and so shouldn't be raising unnecessary barriers. Andrew D. (talk) 07:45, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Five Indian paramilitary soldiers are killed and another 20 injured when suspected rebels ambush their convoy in the outskirts of Srinagar in the Indian portion of Kashmir. Two of the attackers are killed by return fire; the others escape. (AP via ABC News)
The Kanawha County sheriff's office reports the death toll is now 26—three more victims were found overnight. It is the third-deadliest flood in West Virginia history. (USA Today)
Two women and seven men of the Extra Young Ohangla band die and eight other band members survive after their boat sinks in Lake Victoria at Kenya's Lihunda beach. The 15-member band was headed to Ndeda Island. (Kenya Star)(The Standard)
Venezuelan opposition leaders say they have now secured enough signatures on a petition to move to the next stage in a recall referendum of PresidentNicolás Maduro. The process must now be validated by electoral officials. (BBC)
Article updated The nominated event is listed on WP:ITN/R, so each occurrence is presumed to be important enough to post. Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article and update meet WP:ITNCRIT, not the significance.
You know, it's not a massive honor to be the nominator of an article if the article is in substandard condition. Oppose until more prose is added.--WaltCip (talk) 14:20, 26 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Implying that Lihaas nominates articles because it's an "honour" is, in my opinion, quite rude - especially since it's apparent (to me anyway) that Lihass is doing this because he / she fits WP:HERE. Banedon (talk) 04:27, 27 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support – Major disaster with significant loss of life; deadliest non-hurricane flood event in the United States since 2010 and deadliest in West Virginia since 1985 (third deadliest on record in the state). ~ Cyclonebiskit (chat) 22:45, 25 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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Nominator's comments: Might get a bit wordy to merge these blurbs, but this is the biggest global stock market crash since the 2008 financial crisis. Seems notable by any metric. Smurrayinchester07:43, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Wait purely to give time for the scale and context of this to sink in before we discuss it. This has the makings of a story every bit as big as the referendum and Cameron's resignation, but is far behind those two in terms of editing, and unlike the other two is still a developing situation. StillWaitingForConnection (talk) 07:57, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose / Wait. Right now the shock is directly a response to the Brexit vote. As long as that remains true, I oppose posting an additional / merged blurb focusing on the markets. If and only if the market collapse takes on some sort of a longer-term life of its own (for example triggering disproportionate losses in unexpected places, bankruptcies of large firms, or things like that) would I think the markets deserve their own story. Dragons flight (talk) 08:28, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose / Wait per Dragons flight. Sterling has plunged, but then recovered about half its losses within an hour or two. If the markets do likewise, this is a much smaller story than if they maintain their losses. GoldenRing (talk) 11:50, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose for now. If this is sustained downturn or with domino effects, there's probably a separate story, but market instability after a significant global-economical event like brexit is nothing new and was expected. --MASEM (t) 12:21, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose / Wait – Developing. FTSE, after dropping 8 percent, closed down 5 percent. New York futures were down 2.8 percent an hour before opening bell. Sca (talk) 12:28, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
"Turmoil" seems a bit strong. NYSE was off a comparatively modest 2.7 percent on moderate volume at 16:40 (with three hours to go). Sca (talk) 16:45, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Yep. Like I said, this is all speculative response so far. A global crash is several days, or weeks (or months) in the making.--WaltCip (talk) 17:05, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Close? I've had a think about this, and came to the conclusion that if there is a sustained downturn as a result of Brexit, an article will eventually emerge. The falls were severe and the rallies were (by normal standards) huge, albeit not as large as the falls. It's simply too soon to say that this is a big story or indeed that it isn't. The only thing that can be said for sure is that if it gets worse, it will remain in the news, so we won't miss our opportunity to post. StillWaitingForConnection (talk) 23:05, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Consider a merge with the Brexit blurb, though a decent separate article about the economic ramifications would be helpful. --PanchoS (talk) 23:23, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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Support or merge with existing blurb. Have corrected the quote a bit - he has announced that he will resign, but he doesn't step down until the leadership contest to replace him is finished. Smurrayinchester07:33, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Comment. This is premature. He announced that he will stand down at some point to be decided (before October).... but not yet. Ghmyrtle (talk) 07:38, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support ALT1. I added this blurb to combine with the referendum result already posted. A major consequence of the vote. Mjroots (talk) 07:42, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Pull - can't believe I'm saying this (the bias is real), but I realized that in April this year we didn't post Ukraine PM Arseniy Yatsenyuk announcing that he will resign. Consensus then was that we should wait until he actually does resign, because actions speak louder than words. In the interest of consistency then, we should also not post David Cameron resigning until he actually does. Banedon (talk) 05:29, 25 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Believe it [7]. I can easily imagine "In June - he announced his resignation, saying he will formally do so In October. In November, he's still PM". Banedon (talk) 05:44, 25 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
There is a subtle difference here – the story which directly led to Cameron's announcement was posted. Hence the difference between something which nearly achieved consensus, and something which did achieve consensus. StillWaitingForConnection (talk) 06:22, 25 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
I suppose that's the optimistic way to look at it. The pessimistic way is to think the bias is real in all of us (including me, considering I supported merging the blurbs with nary a thought). Banedon (talk) 08:31, 25 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Come to think of it, for another country, we might have said "wait until the country actually leaves the EU to post"! Banedon (talk) 00:41, 28 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Reconsider, please. The Brexit referendum clearly remains the main event, Cameron's announced intention to resign being only of secondary notablility. Therefore, the results map is more relevant than Cameron's photo. --PanchoS (talk) 09:08, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
A map means little on the main page, especially given that we can't include a legend with it. It will just be a map of the UK (and Gibraltar) flecked with random yellow and blue patches (other problems with using a map - it's not proportional, so very remote areas like countryside and Scottish Highlands overrepresented while cities under represented; because it's a referendum not an election, a constituency-by-constituency map is misleading (since twice as many counting areas went leave as went remain, but leads in many of these were small); and because we can't show turnout, vote percentage is misleading too (a 50% Remain lead in East Renfrewshire contributed less to the final result than a 10% Leave lead in Cornwall). Cameron is an internationally recognizable face, and having him there brings attention to the hugeness of the story. Smurrayinchester09:57, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Please don't take it personal, but that's ridiculous. You're talking common sense? IMO, common sense would be that Cameron, who lost control amidst his own political gamble and was played off by Farage & Johnson, and who continues in office as a lame-duck caretaker, is not the more relevant image than a decent map depicting the results of a historic referendum that is in the news worldwide. Even that particular map is in the news more or less worldwide. --PanchoS (talk) 23:06, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Comment - Support Alternative blurb 1. "I will do everything I can as prime minister to steady the ship over the coming weeks and months، but I do not think it would be right for me to try to be the captain that steers our country to its next destination. This is not a decision I have taken lightly، but I do believe it is in the national interest to have a period of stability and then the new leadership required. There is no need for a precise timetable today، but in my view we should aim to have a new prime minister in place by the start of the Conservative Party conference in October." This is premature. He announced that he will stand down at some point to be decided... but not yet. Would suggest "announces he is to resign", & so actually the results map or even Nigel Farage's photo is more relevant than Cameron's photo, then. KhabarNegarTalk21:30, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Not at all, we're talking about the resignation of the most powerful (former) member of the EU, so it's fine. By October. Simple as that. We'll run another story when he's replaced. Cheers! The Rambling Man (talk) 21:32, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Re Farage. While I am not going to bother quantifying the level of influence UKIP alone (as opposed to Tory backbenchers) had in GE2015 to force Cameron to pledge this In/Out Referendum, there is no mistaking that the Centre-right/Right's three most prominent figures in the Leave campaign were Boris Johnson, Gove, and Farage, not Farage alone. CaradhrasAiguo (talk) 22:41, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
I think he announces his intention to resign by October, we should give news as they are, and not our understanding, his words was exactly equal to "announces his intention to resign by October". Regards, KhabarNegarTalk08:05, 25 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Keep in the face of the "pull" comment above. It's patently obvious that a small shift in the blurb to include Cameron's resignation is perfectly reasonable. The Rambling Man (talk) 06:33, 25 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Pope Francis's visit to Armenia this weekend may stress relations with Turkey. The Pope is seeking to avoid reigniting the diplomatic dispute that arose last year when he described the 1915 mass killings of Armenians as a genocide. The Vatican prefers the Armenian phrase "Medz Yeghern," which roughly translates as "the great evil or calamity." (Reuters), (PanARMENIAN.Net)(NBC News)
The United Nations announces that peacekeepers in the country will be sent home over a "lack of responsiveness" during an attack on a UN-run refugee camp last February in Malakal that killed at least 40 people. (Al Jazeera)
The United Nations Security Council condemns North Korea's most recent ballistic missile launches as a grave violation of the international ban, and urges all countries "to redouble their efforts" to fully implement the March sanctions. (Reuters)(AP)
An unidentified man who had been reported to have fired shots inside a theater has been shot dead by police in Viernheim, Germany. No other fatalities were reported. (BBC)
Solar Impulse 2, a plane powered only by the Sun, lands safely in Seville, Spain, shortly after 7.30 a.m. local time after a flight of just over 71 hours. The 15th leg of the round-the-world journey had been expected to take up to 90 hours. (Reuters)(Reuters²)
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Oppose on article quality. Lacks citations for many statements and also is written in an "unencyclopedic" style - what does "throw in with his older brother" mean for example? Needs to be re-written in standard English. 11:36, 25 June 2016 (UTC)
Can't support this – yet – due to article comprehensiveness. Leaning towards support on significance depending on how coverage goes. But for context, if this list can be relied upon, the deadliest tornado in the 21st century caused 162 deaths, and (again assuming the list can be relied upon) no other tornado in the 21st century has caused over 100 deaths. StillWaitingForConnection (talk) 22:55, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Weak support – article is a bit short for my personal tastes, but is well-written and referenced. This passes the significance bar given international coverage and the rarity of a tornado causing this many casualties. StillWaitingForConnection (talk) 01:58, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support with current article state, but that said, two things that would be helpful to add would be the strength of the torando if that is something known or estimated, and (if I understand correctly) that such torandoes in that part of the world are a rare event? --MASEM (t) 02:02, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
@Masem: It's iffy if we'll get an official rating on the tornado, I have no idea if Chinese meteorologists are trained to know the Enhanced Fujita Scale, but if it's of interest the damage pictures I've seen appear to be in the EF3 or EF4 range. Regarding rarity, I'm getting mixed signals on that from sources. Some say tornadoes in China are rare, others say they're common, especially in Jiangsu. In lieu of a coherent message at the moment, I opted to not include that detail. But what is universally considered uncommon is the destruction and loss of life. ~ Cyclonebiskit (chat) 03:47, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
That's why I'm not against posting this at the current state. I did see a wind speed number which I added to the article. --MASEM (t) 03:50, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support (longtime editor, shared network). It's now also on the front page of BaiduBaike. Probably the deadliest tornado in China's history. Tornadoes do occasionally happen in Eastern and Southern China, but deadly tornadoes (along with the massive hailstorm that accompanied this Yancheng tornado) are uncommon. 27.115.113.102 (talk) 03:19, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Former head of the UNGA just a few years ago and died amid graft scandals. Circumstances add a little more intrigue but he was also "top of his field" Lihaas (talk) 08:09, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
I don't wish to oppose but the UNGA has very little power and I doubt most people in the world could name who its head is. Perhaps he is important in his field, I don't know. 331dot (talk) 01:16, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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The POV tag appears to mainly be one editor complaining that the "Responses" section is heavily skewed in favour of "Remain", but failing to accept that is because the responses from notable people/businesses/countries have been mostly in favour. I suspect that tag could be removed without any major issue. Laura Jamieson (talk)09:43, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Frankly I can't see that situation being resolved quickly. The whole thing is, after all, controversial. But it would be ridiculous not to post this. As a tentative toe-in-the-water, how would people feel about IAR and bold an article with an orange POV tag, if it came to that? GoldenRing (talk) 12:26, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
It's not really as controversial as the editor who placed the tag is saying (who is presumably saying that the article is meant to sway people's votes). The article isn't POV in the sense that it backs one side or the other, it's purely weight of material. And also, surely, after the polls close, the second issue is somewhat irrelevant. Laura Jamieson (talk)13:56, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support very significant event for all of Europe. Added alt blurb for clarity. The voting is done by the people in Britain, not by some of its legislative bodies. That part is yet to come. w.carter-Talk10:41, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose Alt blurb. Citizens of the United Kingdom is meaningless and unnecessary. You can vote in the referendum if you are a British, Irish or Commonwealth citizen, but only if you register in advance. If you are a British citizen who lives outside of the UK you can vote only if you have been away for less than 15 years. Gibraltar is also included in the referendum as the only British territory also within Europe, but residents of, for example, Bermuda cannot vote although they are legally British citizens. See British nationality law. In short the franchise is complicated, and should be left out of the blurb. 143.167.27.58 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 11:33, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
I disagree, only that with out the "referrendum" language, the first blurb now is not clear if this was a choice by the citizens (or those registered to vote) or by the government. Stating that the citizens chose to stay/leave clarifies this without having to click through the blue link. While the term is nuanced as the IP outlines, the implication is still important. --MASEM (t) 13:57, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
There's not a whole lot of point in nominating this yet since the reaction to this vote will explode shortly after the results of the vote, which means it will need widespread editor attention before it can be safely posted.--WaltCip (talk) 12:12, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Actually, the blurb can be posted as soon as the result is known. This will be a fast moving story, but having it on MP means there will be a lot more eyes on it, thus helping the article's overall improvement. Mjroots (talk) 13:25, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
In theory, that's correct. However, in practice, we have always shied away from posting articles if they are not fully referenced and in otherwise good quality.--WaltCip (talk) 13:31, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support, once the result is called by WP:RS (don't necessarily have to wait until the official final result). Either way, this will be a hugely significant and consequential decision, and will be massively covered worldwide. Added an altblurb2 that promotes both the referendum and the actual consequences. We may use the "Brexit" moniker which by known is known across the world and, while colloquial, is non-partisan. We may also paraphrase or reword it, but I think we don't have to resort to the language of the bureaucracy but can use WP:COMMONNAME. --PanchoS (talk) 13:44, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
I'm not sure either of the altblurb2s is appropriate. The renegotiation already took place (although some parts only go into effect with a Remain vote) and voting Leave won't automatically trigger withdrawal (nor is it clear what form that withdrawal would take). Smurrayinchester13:59, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Well, I could take a photo of my polling station tonight when I go to vote. It would however be one of the most boring photos ever to appear on the main page. If only this were my polling station... Laura Jamieson (talk)13:54, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Added a map highlighting the UK within the EU. Happy to see it replaced by a better image, but this would still be much better than none, and better than one or the other flag. --PanchoS (talk) 14:01, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Cameron would be fine for "remain", unless somebody can cobble up a montage with Jeremy Corbyn and Nicola Sturgeon (as the leaders of the three most prominent UK political parties, the latter two of which are far strongly balanced towards "remain"). I would say Nigel Farage is perhaps a more suitable "leave" picture, although Boris has been strongly campaigning, Farage is far more associated with all things anti-EU, is leader of the most prominent straight "leave" party, and in terms of political careers, an MEP and MP are about equal. I don't think it is particularly POV to link him to leaving the EU. Ritchie333(talk)(cont)14:51, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support (wait) - Frankly I would have posted a blurb that said Britain was voting (without image, without result) now, but if blurb with the result is felt to be better, then I would say that the first admin on the block after the result is formally declared and a reliable source verifying it is put in the article gets to do it. Ritchie333(talk)(cont)14:44, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Er, how do you figure that? I can see nothing in the news giving any motive for the attack yet, and in any case, what's it got to do with UK politics? AlexTiefling (talk) 15:23, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
I will be watching coverage on my laptop, if I am awake and compos mentis enough to edit Wikipedia, and am quick enough on the copy and paste from BBC News, I'll do it, but I will happily bet some IP who doesn't care about getting {{cite news}} formatted just so will beat me to it. Ritchie333(talk)(cont)14:55, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose unless the article is cleaned up Okay, I was concerned about the tag on the article (doesn't that prevent it from getting through ITNC?) so I have had a proper look at it now, and there is a major problem with focus. Since it's not a good article, it's not particularly required to be focused beyond the basic NPOV policy, though it would be good if it was. I have trimmed out what seems to blatant WP:NOTNEWS but I feel like I'm using a sledgehammer to crack a nut ... anyway, as it is the article doesn't show Wikipedia in a good light, people have just lumped on news without any coherent editing structure to keep it in a manageable state. The "Responses" section is too long, and the list of "Debates", all of which are now in the past, needs restructuring. There is no way on earth I could do all that single handedly today - I wonder if we could do it as a team? Ritchie333(talk)(cont)15:18, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
@Ritchie333: There was an editathon about this in May and so you could try notifying the editors involved to see if they want to follow-up. If the result is close, as seems likely, then the aftermath could go on for some time as there might still be lots of uncertainty. If there's a majority for leave, then it might warrant an Ongoing entry. Anyway, my vote is in and we shall see soon enough ... Andrew D. (talk) 17:34, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Obvious support on significance. Will give a view on how the article's quality looks closer to the result – would be a waste of time to evaluate quality now because obviously it's going to change a lot in the next six to eight hours. StillWaitingForConnection (talk) 22:19, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Post an appropriate burb immediately. It is in the news right now, Sunderland has voted to leave by a much larger margin than expected causing the British Pound to nosedive. Count Iblis (talk) 23:34, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Comment - it is possible the result will be called by the news media (based on turnout figures showing the margin needed for victory) a few hours before the official announcement at 7am BST. Maybe some discussion would help now of whether to wait for the official announcement (best, IMO). Carcharoth (talk) 23:51, 23 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
I have no objection to posting a story acknowledging the referendum now. But the question I presume you're asking is when we should update that story to reflect the outcome, and that's very simple. We wait for the official result. StillWaitingForConnection (talk) 00:09, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
The official announcement that Hillary is elected president will be made on January 6th 2017 after a meeting held at 1:00 pm in the Chamber of the U.S. House of Representatives during which the electoral votes are counted. Count Iblis (talk) 00:11, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
The convoluted nature and speed of that process bears no relation to the straightforward nature and speed of this one. If you can't wait an hour or so from when you think you know to when you know you know, you're on the wrong site. StillWaitingForConnection (talk) 00:19, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support (wait) with preference for the original blurb. Notability is clear and straightforward regardless of the outcome, but there's no need to rush this before the results are confirmed. ~ Cyclonebiskit (chat) 01:27, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Obviously this was nominated way too early (I don't know why people insist on doing that) since we're still hours away from a final result. – Muboshgu (talk) 01:34, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
(They do it because they can't resist the lure of the shiny talk page credit. And because no-one will block them. They probably should be blocked because a premature nomination delays the emergence of consensus and is therefore disruptive to the ITN process). StillWaitingForConnection (talk) 02:01, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Query: Gibraltar is also voting, but as a district of the total vote. Gibraltar is not in the UK, it is a British colony which is part of the EU, instead of the Channel Islands which are colonies outside the EU. It's 40,000 people on a square-mile rock, but we must be fair and include them, especially seeing the international tiff that will happen should it be made to exit. '''tAD''' (talk) 03:14, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support, though would suggest we post only when Leave hits the mathematical winning line. Otherwise we are needlessly posting a blurb with caveats such as "projected" or "on-course to win" (or choosing to state something as a fact before it is a fact). Would prefer original blurb. StillWaitingForConnection (talk) 04:24, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Support Immediate Posting The first blurb looks good but any of the others will work. This is one of the most significant geopolitical events in decades and we need to get this up. It is impossible to imagine this will be a controversial ITN post. -Ad Orientem (talk) 04:27, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
We post the facts, as and when they happen. The reliable sources are using the word "projection", therefore if we post immediately we should also use it. The currently proposed blurbs will become valid in about 30 minutes. Or we could spend 30 minutes debating which needless caveats to use, by which time they will have become immediately redundant. StillWaitingForConnection (talk) 04:31, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
In that case either a) the election is bent or b) you don't know what you are talking about. BBC, ITV are basing their result on projected turnouts. How many people voted exactly, Lihaas? Don't bother to wait until the official results come out. 3142 (talk) 05:08, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Danger! Danger! High Voltage! I strongly advise a little caution here. For a start as has been noted some arguments are based on projected rather than announced or mathematically certain results so posting would be premature, The second point is more for posting admins: it is only an advisory referendum and not legally binding. A blurb along the "vote to leave" lines is valid but the posting admin needs to be very careful when taking it upon themselves to redraft the blurb. 3142 (talk) 04:56, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
There's still 4 results they're waiting for. The point to post is "Once every region is complete, the chief counting officer, Jenny Watson, who is chairwoman of the Electoral Commission, will announce the official referendum result from count HQ in Manchester." --MASEM (t) 05:34, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Best to post now, as by the time the official results are announced there will be other news to report about due to the fallout of the result that may make the present blurb inappropriate. At this time a blurb saying "EU in shock at Brexit vote result" looks already far more appropriate given the large number of reactions of EU parliament members. Count Iblis (talk) 05:49, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
I have already voted to support posting, however I strongly oppose the rewording to include the word advisory. The UK has voted to leave - that is a factually correct statement whether the UK goes on to leave or not. By putting in the word "advisory", Wikipedia would be seen as taking a political position on the matter. StillWaitingForConnection (talk) 06:05, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Posted original blurb. The chief counting officer have announced the result. The article have been updated with the result. -- KTC (talk) 06:30, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
More precisely he has said he intends to leave and wants a new PM to be in place by October. He will remain in charge for the next few months. Dragons flight (talk) 07:30, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
He said: "the British people have made a very clear decision to take a different path and as such I think the country requires fresh leadership to take it in this direction. I will do everthing I can as prime minister to steady the ship over the coming weeks and months. But I do not think it would be right for me to try to be the captain that steers our country to its next destination. This is not a decision I have taken lightly. But I do believe it’s in the national interest to have a period of stability and then the new leadership required. There is no need for a precise timetable today. But in my view we should aim to have a new prime minister in place by the start of the Conservative party conference in October." --PanchoS (talk) 07:54, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
United Kingdom and the European Union
Now someone please post an image for this historic event – for now either the map proposed above, or the resultsgeneric map to the right. Can't believe we still have the NBA finals featured, while the Brexit referendum is a global breaking news of rare magnitude.--PanchoS (talk) 07:54, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
As Cameron announced his resignation - which is definitely tied to the referendum - the blurb has been merged, and currently the image is of Cameron. So the question now becomes: Do we want the map, or do we want Cameron as the image? - Penwhale | dance in the air and follow his steps09:03, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Cameron. Unless it is our intention to specifically mention the difference between Scotland and England and Wales in the blurb, then the map proposed above is both far too detailed to represent the blurb, and far too small to meaningfully decipher anyway. Colours are wrong on the Europe map (though even if they were right I'd still prefer Cameron). StillWaitingForConnection (talk) 09:11, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
As stated above, I'm strongly in favor of the results map (as featured in the nomination box at the top), as the vote is the historic event here, while Cameron's resignation is secondary and only one of several consequences of the vote, with the British pound dropping, and further developments to be expected. --PanchoS (talk) 09:15, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
The issue is moot, further comment should go on the errors page, am collapsing 10 page discussion for convenience and archiving. μηδείς (talk) 17:59, 26 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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